Why All New Mothers Need Mothering

We acknowledged the traditional custodians of the land we're recording on today.

I'm sure there were mothers in my group that were feeling the same things. I felt that I would just had the blinkers on because the mental chatter was so loud.

Hello, and welcome back to eat, sleep, shit, repeat, the Wildly I'm hinted podcast all about the man as that is motherhood and every little thing in between. I'm Kiri Cels and I am full of bases about sillies.

It's because you just had a banana, I do. I'm Kelly McCarron and we've got a ripper of an epp for you this week. So no, dilly darling, Shall I just kick things off with my peak and my pitch?

Go on your little foxy more on over there.

He just goes, oh, I thank good, as it's not moti to do peak and pit and I was like, oh shit, I've got so many pits but no peaks.

Well fine, I'm the most miserable person, but I always winch about things with a sense of humor.

Well, I would say that your peak is that your face is settled and your looking.

I am looking not too shabby.

So I decided to an at home die job, a box die if you will, many a hairdresser.

I'm staring at the repercussions of that right now.

It's not that bad.

Look, it's not that bad.

In your own words, it's not horrendous. It's not horrendous. Yes, I have a ginge tinge, a little bit overtoned, greenish at the back.

It's fine, it's fine. It's just hair.

Don't do the job.

It's just hair. So the peak is I guess that I'm still hot. Here, you are hot.

Let's just go into my pitz because they're quiet, they're all funny.

So can I just say that your period of hotness is running alongside my period of being.

She turned up in these very pregnant pants and I went, why do you let the pants to my house?

I was like, Kelly, they're the only pants have fit me right now. Okay, just fucking the stretchy fit.

Really currently leaning into the stereotype of black women having big asses.

Because Charlie's like, oh, I think it's it is tripled in, but it looks great.

There is nothing quite like a juicy a rump.

Yeah, I reckon, that's why it's a boy anyway, This is not about me, This is about you.

Bad roots. Number one in my pits. Number two in my pits is my child has started saying for fuck's sake?

So when did this happen?

The first time?

No, no, the first time it happened was a couple of weeks ago. I messaged my father, who has a huge problem with children swearing, and said, your grandson has a potty mouth. And my dad's response was, Luke should be proud of himself.

Does Luke have a body mouth?

This was part of the lull.

Lenny didn't learn it from Luke, who says, for fuck's sake all the time you do all the time for fox sake? This for sake that I hear and I'm like, oh no. So that was a few weeks ago. I told him that he wasn't supposed to say that. Then the other night, I'm getting cranky about something and I'm like, fux sake, and then he just starts giggling and repeating it and repeating it, repeating it. Luke can't help himself.

Of course he does. He's getting that positive reinforcement.

So I just, yeah, that's quite the pit because all I'm imagining now is him going to daycare, beautiful misreget being like, oh no, something's happened. And then I'm going for fact's sake, and oh dear me, and of course it's my.

Fault, of course, of course, of course.

Wait, so did we do your peek?

Oh?

Your peak is just that you're hot. No, so I'll just tell you another bitch, another pitch.

Three pits. We're so lucky.

This one's annoying. I've got to have another thing on my bloody brain. No, when I tell you that I hate medical stuff, yeah, more than the average person. I get proper panic attacks. People get it doesn't hurt. Oh no, shit, it doesn't hurt. I'm thinking about the pressure and feeling things like go into my veins and like all the anticipation.

Yuck, what do you mean? What are they gonna do?

I feel like someone that's okay with medical stuff would be like, that's foul.

What can you have that you're awake? That's like a procedure.

Well, it's not like operation or anything. But what they do is, I'm going to spell it out for you.

I'm already getting kind of here bebies antists.

Okay, well, you're gonna have to listen.

They're going to insert a catheter into the vein on my hands.

Yeah yeah, step one.

Hey, catheters then inflate a balloon in my elbow so that then they can feed something up through to the corotid artery in my neck.

Why why do you have a carotid artery in your neck?

Sweety, you do too. It's probably one of your nodules.

It's like, what are you see? Sorry?

Did you pass science?

I don't think so? Okay, got it?

Got it.

Crottid artery is a piece of our body that we need.

God, everyone has one. It's very important. We also have one in our leg.

Wow. Yeah, that's why. Like, if a shark bites you too high, you bleed out by the time you get to water.

Understood, Okay, crottid artery, So then where are we going from there?

So then the crottid artery, they inject like a die into my brain from the corodid diary, different dies, and this is why I need to be awake, because I need to do different things for them while they're having a look at my veins in my brain.

And I literally was like, I can't do that.

No, there's a one percent risk of stroke with this sort of a thing, and I'm like one percent, Like you know, that's fine. Yeah, Well there's a zero point five percent of the aneurysm bursting at the size that it is yea, so which is like I'm kind of like, ok, it's only.

A little bit bigger.

So yeah.

And also there's a chance that this might show that it's just a really dodgy looking vein not even.

Okay, So is that why they wanted to do it to rule yes out?

So I'm like, the way that my brain works is surely, because I will be in such a state of panic and anxiety, my blood pressure is going to be higher. Surely that like then ups my risk of a stroke by tenfold. So I was like, I'm just not doing it. I told my family. I told Luke that I'm I'm like, I'm sorry, I'm just.

Not doing it. I cannot do that.

And there's not another way, Like there's something.

This is it. I guess it's a peak.

Okay.

I found one.

Talking to Sandy, my bestie friend of the pod we've had her on. She's a nurse, and she was like, I don't understand why no one has spelled this out for you. She's like, they told you that they would sedate you, correct, like not put you to sleep, but sedate you.

I was like, yeah, oh so they will sedate you. Yeah, but not they'll give you like some valium or something.

No, well that's what I thought.

I was like, it'll just be stupid on valume, which is what I had with my laser eye surgery, doesn't do anything.

Yeah.

She's like, no, the anetheist is there. She said, I've had this sedation every single time with my egg collection because I don't want to put you on because obviously that's like a thing. Yeah, she goes, I do not remember a single thing. You're so out of it, I swear, And she said, if at any point you are aware. Yeah, you're in so much a state of like whatevs because you're so drugged. You will be fine. So you'll just be like doing what they say. You probably won't even remember it.

It will be fine.

Oh Okayhames, you just really need to go friends. Thank you, Sandy Peaky Is I've got really good friends.

Yes, we love it. So moving on to today's topic, It's something I'm very excited about given I have been a number two on the way post birth aftercare. Yes, something I've never really thought much about before, but something that definitely with this pregnancy has been top of mind.

Oh yes, and you're really thinking about it this time around. So let's chat first about your aftercare experience with Rue and what you will be doing the same I guess post birth this time, and what you'll be doing differently with the big baby that's.

Growing, big baby that we think maybe a boy, but we're not too sure. So with Rue, I went privately. I ended up having to get an emergency C section after a couple of days of laboring. Because I went privately, I was able to and also had a sea section. I was able to stay in the hospital for about a week, so at the end of that week, and while I was in hospital, I should say they were like breastfeeding classes. They were just like random classes that you.

Could go to run one of the classes. Yes, friends, she did.

She did, and I was like hey, yeah, And then when we interviewed her, I.

Was like, yes, that's where I know.

Who are you from?

I got my titty out in front of you.

At the time, like I didn't really think much. But we also put ruined nursery for like a few hours. I don't let you keep them in there for like nights on end, but we did like maybe a five hour stint where she was in the nursery on one of the nights so you could just get some get some sleep and get some rest. Then we were out on the Sunday, which was Mother's Day, and then on the Monday, Charlie's mum and dad arrived for a week.

Were just like my god, that sounds so nice.

It was really nice. And then after a week they left and it was just us. But I think a few weeks later I then joined my mother's group, and then that kind of became my support, my village, my people because I was very lucky with the Mother's group that I found, we were all very like minded.

You really leaned into it as well.

Yeah, but also I think it's just luck of being with people that are the same type of parent that you are, like non judge, going with the flow, not.

Afraid to like be vulnerable, vulnerable.

I think that was a big key, because you know, there were a couple of people who were like, everything's so great, and I was just like, is it you fuck?

I mean, fuck, nothing's bad, nothing at all even hurt.

Tell me, have you had sex yet?

How's your vision?

How is it good? So that was our first experience, which was really great. I think I actually realized probably how good that experience was with after we spoke to our upcoming person that we interviewed for this episode, Larissa. That was probably maybe the first time I really reflected on that whole journey and the help that we had this time around. Obviously things are going to be like quite different. We have a toddler, I am not working

Very hands on.

Yeah, and like yeah, I always kind of had that in my back pocket, like, you know, she's the best resource that we could have. So I had done a little bit of reading and you know, duelers have been something that has been popping up quite a lot in recent years, and I kind of floated the idea to Charlie. I just and I was quite nervous because, look, it's not a cheap thing to do.

It's also okay, I know that this isn't the right word, but it's a little bit woo woo when someone says, Duela, I think you automatically think free birthing, water birth at home. But it's like in a lake pushing your baby at yourself.

Yeah, it's not like that. It's also a luxury.

It is a.

Luxury, and I think free birthing and water birthing at home on one end of the scale.

How too, if you want to do that, by the way, how to you.

I still would like to be in a medical environment that just suits my personality. But I do really want like someone that's advocating for me, because in hindsight, when I'm looking back at my first berth, there are some things that I would have liked to have done in the moment, of course, to change it. It may not have had any effect on the outcome, but I'm like, oh, I wonder if that did. But I wasn't like in a great state of mind to be advocating for myself.

You're literally just like learning as you go with the.

First really, but as I said, like it is a bit of an investment. So we have already been paying for fucking private health for you know, since even before rue, So we've been paying for private health for like three and a half almost four years. It's not cheap monthly. It is in fact, robbery is what it is. Daylight hobbery, daylight robbery. And I was really nervous because, like, you know, just the way that everything is at the moment with

The depths of grief and you just don't know when those big swings are gonna come.

So he was almost like, obviously, I'm gonna be there for you and be supportive, but I would love that if we had someone else as well in case I can't be there fully.

And why are we both getting teary? You know, I'm not pregnant. What's my excuse? Ah?

So that was wonderful, Like that was really good. We're both on the same page with that. So I was like very relieved, and then I just kind of put it out to my Sydney group of girlfriends like, hey, did anyone use a Duela? Would they recommend one? And one of my girlfriends Bellau wrote back, yep key, I'll message you privately and I was like, oh my god, I have just won the jackpot. Here a f the jackpot. Anyway, she was lovely. She actually told me about a service

I would be looking for like an overbearing mother in law type.

Yeah, so you want someone to take care of me? Yeah, And they can then narrow it down and they give you a couple of options. You can meet with them and then make your decision and if you're not happy, I think you can go back again. But really, luckily, she said, gave me the name of her So she gave me she birth's the name of her dollar that she used who she loved. But then she was like, also,

So like, I think that's just like an added area that I'd like to explore for the second birth, like acupuncture, even just the way that Chinese.

Culture approach post birth aftercare. Another girlfriend of mine who moved back from the States, she got a dollar and she did like the five five rules. So it's five days in the bed, five days on the bed, five days near the bed. This gives you a solid two weeks of focused, intentional rest. So basically post birth, you are letting your body move back to where it needs to be, like the organs are moving, You're actually resting your body rather than just trying to be up and about.

Thing, having guess summer baby, so you don't need to worry so much about what bugs rubrings home. I know that will be actually with this winter. Shout out to anyone that's had a baby over the past.

You mins at home.

So many of like my audience on an insta each week, right and we're picking pits and it's like, I've got a baby, I've got a newborn, and I've got a toddler. We are literally and you've got to take them to hospital.

Like it's just sucks. It's awful. It is awful.

Good thing is they have really good immune systems. By the time they get to you know, like daycare or whatever, they're tough as not. But that's kind of where we've landed at the moment, and I'm feeling really good about that.

So because when you think about like, the public service is great, but you can't plan anything really like, no, you can't. You're not even generally guaranteed a midwife.

Yeah.

So my midwife that I saw too through my pregnancy with regularity, but then the midwife that was on duty on the day was someone completely.

Different and then I you know, their shift.

Changed, so they got a new one and then different ones would come to my house.

So yeah.

Yeah, it's just you don't really have that sort of relationship building, I guess.

Yeah, the continuity of care is like a really big yeah for sure, and just someone like in the birth just saying like knowing what to.

Ask or for what you want to have a specific plan this time, yes, so hopefully we want to have the.

Episode about back. Yeah you know that.

I'm sometimes like so can't be bothered to it, mat it's boring. I could talk about beebacks till the cows come home.

Yeah, yeah, till the cows come home.

Maybe because I'm like I would love to do it. I'm so jealousy you get chance to so proud of you.

Well, I'm just going to try for the good thing about it is I have zero expectations, so if it ends with a seat and I'll be happy either way. Like, my recovery from my sea was fine. I didn't mind it. I actually like even though it was an emergency cesarean.

It was still quite a nice experience, right, Yeah.

Because Rue was fine, So I'm really fine with however it turns out. But I also know that during my birth with Rue, there were just a couple of things that I didn't try and I just I think, like, you're scared, right because you've never done it before. So I went never been in that much pain before, and you you cannot explain the pain exactly. And I went to the hospital three times, which is not good, like they tell you to not go as much and labor home.

I don't know why you went home after that and.

Then came back, you know, like five hours later, and then it was just like give me the drugs. But I feel like if I had been in one space with someone like just coaching me along or saying let's try this, let's try this, like Charlie was doing that. Of course but it was just we were also like he's knew it it too. We didn't know. Like I'm like, this is the most pain I've ever found in my life. Surely this is it, you know. And then they're like no, and I'm like, well, fuck.

Yeah.

So I think there's just like small things like that. I never got into the bath, which I've wondered if I would have liked some water. I think I just got there and I was like, give me the drugs, like, and they gave me morphine and then in the morning it was like, we're inducing you. So had I been a little bit more of a steady mind, like maybe before they induced me, I.

Mean tried a few different things because you think about as soon as I don't know what the stats are, but induction increases chances of seeing indention.

Yeah, yeah, exactly. So it just kind of is like a trickle effect. Some people are fine. But in the end she was like flex her face was up. So I'm so happy with har everything turned out. I liked that I labored for ages because she was so awake when she was greater. She was like, oh, I've been bombing up and down for a couple of days, guys would never come.

Thank god, someone decided to yank me out exactly.

So yeah, I'm happy either way. I'm just keen to give it a shot, give it a go. Anyway, Enough about me. I know I'm not meant to say this, but when you do have your second, you're going to have I can only I can say that because we're very close friends. What would you do differently if you had another baby? When you have another baby?

Everything, And I wanted to put my notes in even though I'm not having another baby. Maybe, but I wanted to give advice basically to anyone that's playing along at home and similar to me, maybe in personality or like, because this obviously wouldn't work for someone like Key. But yeah, so yeah, I would do everything differently. Oh, I actually don't think there is one thing I would do the same.

Okay, talk me through these things.

So my list.

I would have maternityly, yes, of course, of course, of course, And even though then I start thinking, oh but maybe I could just do this or no, I would lean in to a proper maternity leave period where I do not have to think about anything. I would pre book this is like a personal Sydney thing. Sint John of God. So that is a private psychiatric hospital in Sydney with a mother and baby unit. Oh yeah, so that's the one that they wanted me to go to. That's the

You need to go to a sadboard, bitch, ma'am.

We're going to admit you.

We will be admitting you. I couldn't afford to be admitted.

Yeah, it was minimum thirty thousand dollars because my private health didn't cover it. I don't think I had private health at the time anyway. Now I have private health with psychiatric cover, so I would be able to go for like something like six hundred dollars for six weeks. They have art classes, you know how much I love my art. They have all of the help that you

Oh she'd be great.

She's so nurturing and caring. Yeah, she'd be such a good duela.

And she has more time, like maybe when all the kids are at school and she's not building a huge house and doing a million different things. Maybe she actually because she would just be wonderful. Yeah, and I would make sure Luke knew what to do this time around, Like he just didn't know what to do. He didn't did you do the birth in class? We didn't do any class, He didn't do any reading nothing. Yeah, well,

Yeah, I know I can get any video either, but I quite like that though. I've got a lot of videos of rubing pulled out of my belly which are pretty funny.

Yeah, they look so disgusting.

Yeah, I've got that that the nek but like, and I've got weird photos of that Luke or the nurse took of me, like crawling and vomiting at the same time, or just in agony, like a great but I want, like, I.

Just cannot imagine seeing that. What do you mean seeing you crawling in agony vomiting like I've.

Shown you before, you can't see the vomit.

I've never seen this, I just blocked it out. Yeah, maybe I.

Will get it out and I would save enough money and not worry about, like as we talk about later with Laurissa in the episode, things that don't really matter, Like I know, I would save my money to put towards having a night nurse a couple of nights a week.

Yeah, so I was guaranteed a bit of sleep.

Yeah. Yeah. I remember Zolie Foster Blake did an interview I think she did it maybe like Australian Birth Stories or something, and she said like that she was not in a good way, and they and I think Hamish was like going and filming something overseas and he was like, I'm going to get you a night nurse to come a couple of nights a week, and she said it was like life changing.

It's life. Even if your other night's awful, you know that you're going to have a few nights of sleep when you're in the depths of postpartum and you think, I genuinely don't know when I'm going to sleep again. Yeah, that's awful to be able to be like this night sucks balls, but I get to sleep on Thursday night.

Yeah.

It just I think that that will well, yeah, that would just change the mentality. So yeah, those are some of the things that I would do differently, but overall everything.

The thing is that to me says that you could do it again because you know what you need to do differently this time, which is everything.

Which is everything. Let's get into the interview with a profresh.

Yes please, I bloody love this interviews and I just love the idea of women being able to go somewhere. We're now going to talk to Larissa, who opened up home h o mb, a luxury postpartum facility to help

Exactly and how for many of us it is just that time when we've just become a mum, but we've never needed mothering and nurturing ourselves more.

Yeah, so welcome.

Larissa, thank you.

Can you start with your own postpartum period?

How much time have you got up. My first postpartum period was not great. It was very sort of earth shattering for me. It wasn't everything that I had the impression of or what I expected.

It was a really.

Big change for someone like me, you know, a typical personality in control, knew all the things, had all my you know, all my ducks in a row, and then this baby came along and I was like, well, what's going on? Why is it not doing what the book said?

The ducks were no longer in a row, The ducks are on drugs.

They were yeap, they were very much having their own party.

And then it was just.

A cascade of you know, self judgment, self doubt. But I kept the veil very well, so no one really had an idea what was going on internally. And my daughter just didn't sleep for five and a half months.

And then I just got to some.

Very very deep, dark places, and I knew that the thoughts weren't normal. So I reached out to my husband and then interestingly, we you didn't get anyone for me. We got a mothercraft nurse for my daughter, Valentina, because we thought if we sought her then I'll be fine.

What's a mother craft nurse?

They do a bit of everything, So my particular one was I had a nursing background Midwiffrey and a few other specialist areas, but they sort of do the whole sleep, eat, play and kind of bring it all together. So it wasn't just sleep, you know, it wasn't click of the fingers. And she slept through first night. It still took, you know, many months. I had to learn how to sleep again because I had completely lost my rhythm, and that took longer than having Valentina.

We don't often talk about that.

Actually, when you go without consistent good sleep for so long, even when you first have a baby, and people say, oh, just sleep when the baby sleeps, you can't because you're so used to not sleeping by that point, and you can be lying there so tired, like your bones are tired, but you still can't force yourself to sleep.

Yeah, all you want to do is sleep. And then I would find when I would sleep, I would almost wake up in that sleep paralysis. And I remember those stages and it was frightening because then I used to think, I'm holding the baby. Am I in a sleep paralysis?

Am I like?

And so it was actually horrible. It was a really, really horrible postpartum period for me. Twelve months later, we decided to have our second and I thought, oh, I don't want to I don't want to have that experience again. So I went to see a psychologist and through that process I was retrospectively diagnosed with postnatal depression and anxiety.

Do you think, because as you said, you were someone very atypical, very measured, with everything that you almost internalized more a lot of those feelings that you were having postpartum.

Yeah. Absolutely.

For whatever reason, I had a judgment upon myself that I needed to continue that sense of what at the time I deemed was successful, what was well put together, what was you know, I had all of these self imposed barometers in my head of what I needed to look like, and I just wanted to continue that regardless, you know.

I feel like societal expectations of us as well as women, you know, like that's kind of the undercurrent of motherhood. It's like, absolutely, do get your soul this picture of like a newborn, it's going to be so great, You'll take walk, so sleep, And when it's not like that, you're like, what am I doing wrong? Like why can't I do this?

Absolutely?

And you know, even when I did eventually get to a mother's group, and you know, that adds a whole other layer of things that happened for you mentally, I'm sure there were mothers in my group that were feeling the same things I felt, But I just had the blinkers on.

I didn't hear.

I didn't hear a lot that was going around me because the mental chatter.

Was so loud.

Can you talk to us about then, what you did differently with your second postpartum period.

It sounds so basic when I say it now, but I really just let go. I was just determined not to have a postpartum like I did, and I thought, I'm really just going to let this baby tell me what it needs and what it wants to do. And I know I'm going to be sleep deprived and I know I'm going to do these things, but I'm going to try and not eat chocolate biscuits all day and try and you know, feed myself differently this time.

And I'm just going to try and relax.

I'm not going to put any parameters on myself, you know, energetically.

I was just very different.

You know when Sebastian ended up sleeping through the night for the first time at like four weeks, and that was a bit of my permission slip to say, give myself a pat on the back, you know, to be like, oh, okay, maybe you're actually doing this okay, like you know, just putting one foot in front of the other. You know, we're seeing lots of women come through home that our first time moms are second time mom's a third time mums.

But they're acutely aware.

Of how fragile we are as women after birth. And that's something that society just doesn't understand, but other cultures are hundred percent.

They probably also know as a third, fourth, second time mom how important it is to put yourself first, and they also probably want to break from the other kids.

Yeah, that's a really big theme we're seeing. While it's the men load of I've got another child or another two kids at home.

There is that.

But I'm here and I'm just going to be grateful that I'm here, and I'm really going to absorb all the care and nurturing that I'm getting while I'm here.

But you know, the mental load is huge.

Shifting a narrative is really hard. But yeah, that second time round, I really just I really just thought, I'm just I'm going to put my hands up a bit. I'm just going to be like, Okay, I need to just take what comes, because I just I think my driving force was I did not want to go back into that anxiety and depression that kept me a mile away and was my driving force. So you know, whether that's healthy or not, I'm not quite sure.

But I got you there in the end, though.

It did. It absolutely did.

Yeah, So it was then that you decided to start working on the concert of Home.

I was yearning for a place such as now that I've created at the time, and I would google it and be like, surely there's somewhere I can go where I can just stay for a week, someone can like help me and guide me and like show me how.

To do this stuff.

Because breastfeeding for me did not come naturally, and it doesn't come naturally for a lot of women. It is very much a learned skill.

I didn't realize that until, like I knew that for some women it was really hard. But that was like I asked the audience like to talk about their own postpartum experiences and what they struggled with the most, and I'd say, like eighty percent it was breastfeeding that they wanted more help and more support with breastfeeding.

Yeap, it's huge.

In all the research that I did over you know, many years and then ended up surveying women all over Australia that sleep and breastfeeding were the two main actors of overwhelm self judgment, you know, and just real difficulty. So yeah, so end of twenty twenty one, I really started doing all the due diligence, so doing huge research, engaged a company out of Sydney to do that, and

And the people who conducted.

The survey they said, look, we do some pretty big stuff and the level of engagement that you have is nothing that we have ever seen.

And there were pages and pages of.

Women telling their stories and their experiences and it took me three days to go through and read them all. And you know what it was interesting.

It was women.

So we surveyed women from the age of eighteen up to sixty because I knew that women would still be hanging on to a lot of things. And I cannot tell you the women in their fifties and sixties that could tell me in detail their experiences still from maybe thirty years ago.

That's incredible.

Yeah, So you know, it was quite evident that there needed to be something like this, and then you know, I started the Wheels in Motion. The name's Amazing Home but spelt as in the womb, right.

I love it. It's so cute, it's so really clever.

It felt very significant in amongst all the other names that were put to me, that one was just a full body response.

Yes, yeah, so tell us about it.

So it is look, for lack of a better term, it's a postpartum hotel that feels very transactional because there's so much depth to what we do. And essentially you come in, you check in like a hotel. We have a four night minimum stay or your meal are included, all your beverages, we do all your laundry, so all the things are done. You don't need to think or worry about any of that. And it's very bespoke the stay to each.

Woman, So.

Everything that you receive is not cookie cutter. It's very bespoke to what you need because women need different things through their postpartum. No one's the same, no baby is the same. And yeah, you have your own suite, you have your own private room, but then we also have communal areas, which I started this and thought women would want their own space. You know, some women may not want to share their experiences, they may not want to be around anyone. So I had this idea that people,

Oh yeah, I'm like, is that at all?

Yeah, in that way.

Yeah, it can come in whatever form you want it to come in. But fundamentally, what we're trying to do is empower women back into that connection with themselves because I think the systems around us have very much unconsciously or consciously pulled.

Us away from what we know.

So we're constantly looking for these external things to solve everything. And no judgment on that, right, I did it, We all do it. But if we lean back into motherhood and people in society allow us to do that and not judge it, it feels a bit easier, it feels a bit calmer.

Yeah.

And I saw that you actually you can nominate someone to have like a subsidized stay.

Yeah, so part of the whole concept. It was really important for me for this to be accessible to every woman, not just people that could afford it.

So we are not for profit.

So I started a charity, so you know, we call for people to donate because it does go directly to women who can't afford it, that really need that help. And at the moment, ninety percent of the women that are staying with us are on either one hundred percent supported stays or fifty percent supported stays.

Like, the better our postpartum period, the better the transition back to work will be overall, and the better the long term implications are on us.

Absolutely, it's a benefit to everyone.

Women are huge contributors to our economy. Right If we have women back in the worst workforce and contributing to the social and economic fabric of this country, we will be better off, you know. And the way that we do that is we support women through one of the biggest transitions. I was talking to doctor Edna Lacabe, who is an incredible perinatal and fertility psychologist, and she said the main parts of transition in women's lives are menstruation, birth, motherhood,

That big corporates have.

You know, they employ lots of women, and you know, we're really trying to encourage them at the moment to have it as part of their employee benefit schemes. And you know, we're having some really really great conversations, but you know, the system is hard to It's an old system that's been there for a while.

They don't care about women.

No, And I talk to men a lot because it's they're in these positions. You know, there's not a lot of women unfortunately, who can make these decisions. So it's a conversation I'm having with men about caring for women. It's so cliche, but we have to get back that village. We just have to and the village of like whatever goes. You know, my non Na has passed away, but you know, a good Italian family and she will talk to me about literally raising her children in the village, you know,

Know how they care for him and a woman is a queen after she gives birth.

But you know, in Western society, we have this trophy culture of how good are you that you're pushing a pram on day three or you're back in the salon getting your hair done.

Or you know you're back at work.

You're back at work, right, I mean you're.

On emails in the hospital. You just pushed out a baby. Good for you?

And that was me right even second time round, although I let go and did all the things, I went back to work at seven weeks right because I still had those belief systems of like, oh, my clients will value the fact that I'm seven weeks postpartum and look at me, I'm.

Back at work.

We need to change things so that that isn't the automatic reaction. It's like, if that's what you want to be doing, great, amazing, You're doing.

It because you feel like you have to.

That's what we sort of need to change that cultural charrative about.

Absolutely, the judgment needs to stop because in my opinion, we are just having mental health be a part of what happens when you give birth, like it's just part of.

It, and that is dangerous.

The statistics were one in ten for postnatal depression and anxiety when I had Valentine or eleven years ago. We're now one in five. And you know, there's many schools of thought on that. Are we talking about it more? Is it just more well known now, all these sorts

Just letting the body heal even like that that time.

Yeah, and nourishing it from the inside out right. Nutrition plays such a huge role. We have an incredible naturopath and nutritionist vun Gary who works in our space, and I've learned so much about nourishing the body through food after postpardon. It is vital, It really really is, and

Thank you so much, Larisa. We really appreciate that.

We'll make sure that we link to the amazing service that you've got in our show notes and yeah, we just appreciate that you're doing something that's such good work.

Thank you so much.

I really appreciate you giving home a voice and hopefully letting a lot more women know that this is accessible and available.

That conversation with Larissa was so good and when I actually put it out to the shit is asking them a couple of questions about their own postpartum experience. Sixty four percent who responded to the questions, they said that they absolutely didn't enjoy that experience, Which is so.

Funny that the language around.

Postpartum is like the baby bubble, the chin master, blah blah blah. But it's like, universally people just need more support. People need partners, being given longer leave, food services, washing services, someone to take their toddler. And the biggest takeaway from the shit is in what support they really needed, As I mentioned with when we charted to Larisa, was that lactation support. So it's almost like we need several appointments booked in post berth and then you just cancel them

People seek the help after and they will often seek it after they've been struggling.

For a period and then it's like, oh, I can't get him for three more weeks.

I have to feed this baby every three hours fait three weekly.

It's like, I think I was so worried about what my vagina would look like. That was the one thing and I didn't even use it, but like that was the one appointment I had booked in for postber.

My god, that's right, you're yes, my vagina need to z oh whatever appointments exactly, But I'm thinking, like, in hindsight, would have been lovely to have a lactation consult booked in for the week that we get home.

Would have been lovely to have I don't know my psych appointment. I did have a psych appointment booked in actually, so that was good too.

A planner, and you are smart, but you will be even smarter this time around, exactly.

But you're so right having those appointments booked in just in case, in case, and hair appointments for.

Them, so people don't You're not wasting someone's time or wasting your own time at night. But also, just go, I have some recommendations for this episode.

Oh yes, go onkel so I'll run through them.

I will pop everything in the show notes though, so you can access the information easily. So if you contact Panda on thirteen hundred seven two six three oh six, they are amazing. If you have postpartum depression, your experience anxiety or depression during pregnancy.

So they were incredible with me.

Panda helped me through my pregnancy and then postpartum I had access to a free psychiatrist and psychologist.

That's so good. So is that a government funded thing? Yes? Oh wow, okay, I didn't even I didn't realize it was government funded.

So you just need to contact them and they will help you. Parent Lines so googled that and then the appropriate number for your state should come up. So when I Google, it just comes up with parent Line New South Wales. The shit that my sister has called them about. I've never actually called them. My sister has called them multiple times, but just about stuff like Evelyn Ate, something really that she shouldn't have won. So my sister called parent line to find out what she should do.

Yeah, and they.

Were like, actually, it just says that it's poisonous on the packet. It's not really, so don't worry.

I called them because you know those little packets that you get in like shoe boxes.

That was the same thing.

Shut up, okay, yes, okay, okay, do you want to say what it was?

Because I was like, if telling that story, it sounds like we should have called the ambulance, but she didn't know what to do, so she called parent Life.

Yeah, well the thing was open, like it had been ripped open a little bit and I found it on the floor and was crawling and I was like did she didn't she? But when I called, she was like what type of beads are they? And I explained and they were the non toxic ones that are made out of most of.

Them are non toxic, but they still have to put I.

Don't think because of that reason, they're like, this is a real bick hazard to kids because they fall out.

I find them all the time. I called parent You two did the exact same thing.

And it's not just about safety stuff, Like you can call them about sleep stuff, literally anything to do with kids, and that's at all ages.

Yeah, just call parent Line.

So good.

It's a free service as well.

The Gidget Foundation they do village groups for expectant moms and dads, so it's facilitated by experienced preinatal mental health clinicians and they'll actually like just offer really beautiful services, which like building your own village, having that support.

That's cool.

Mom for Mom offers weekly in home emotional support during that last trimester of pregnancy and the first year of a baby's life.

My friend in my mother's group did this. She had one, did you a lady. Yeah, she was just a grandma whose kids didn't have kids, and she just was like loved being a mom so much that she wanted to offer up her time and kind of like a mother's helpers.

Yeah, yeah, they want one, Yeah, you can get one. They had another one you can free.

I'm pretty sure it was free.

Good dear me.

So the support is given by trained volunteers who are mothers themselves. That one's Sydney based.

But yes, okay, if you have a Google.

The problem is because I'm in New South Wales. When I Google different things, it will only come up with New South Whales. Even when I put in Victoria, it will just direct me.

It's really annoying. Yeah that, but I did find Peach Trade.

That is a Queensland and Northern Territory community based mental health organization. They provide services for parents, partners and families who are impacted by mental health challenges in the period of pregnancy and early parents it There is the Sydney Concierge New Mum packages that you can buy new mums.

I did not know this.

I know.

So you can buy so many things that would be so helpful to a new mum from the service. Christmas tree and decorations decorated for you. Imagine if you had a baby in December and someone came over like this is just the first thing that's come up, and I'm like that is so handy. Someone will organize all your travel for you moving home. Someone will do your packing for you. The new mum packages, so number of hours a trained professional will come over and just help you with whatever you.

Need, washing, cooking, cooking after the.

Baby, taking the baby for a walk, whatever you need you can purchase someone however many amount of hours you can afford or whatnot.

That's what should be in your baby shower wishing well.

So there's playgroup Australia, so there's there should be one in every single state. It is a not for profit making sure that every child and family has access to a quality plagu grond so for that support. So even if they're not in like daycare or you're not part of a mother's group, they'll sort of like facilitate that. For yes, there's a few in our area, just for mums for dads as well.

Yeah, and it's so cool, like the stuff they have. They're like outdoor areas, play things that they set up like. They're actually awesome.

There's Mumma Tribe. I hate the name so much.

Come on, you love it.

I hate it.

I don't mind it. But what service they offer?

So you find someone you join and then you can find someone that lives near you that you might want to go to the gym with, or you just want to like go for a walk and grab a coffee and talk about sleep.

That's so nice for like a new parent that may have moved to a new area and they don't have any friends exactly, or if you're the first of her friends to have a kid and you don't have anyone else, have any like second friends.

Eighty five thousand people across forty five locations Australia wide. That's so they and they help. So you just say hey, I live here. They'll help you find someone that lives really close to you.

How good is that?

And then there's mum Space, which is mental health support for mums.

I've got one more to add, if that's okay, please do.

This was my biggest resource throughout the newborn stage and even now it's like whenever I'm asking myself a question or always gone here Raising Children dot net.

So this is Australia's parenting website. They cover from pregnancy, newborns, babies, toddler's preschool, school age, preteens, teens, grown ups, and they also go into autism and disability. They've just launched and launched an app raising healthy minds and it's so good. They're like this is where I read about. Like I was like, do I need to go to a different formula now Roou's older and I like went on to raising children and on there it was like there's no need. They're all the same, like.

All like basic information that you need.

Yeah, just basic information that you need from a reliable source. Like it's all been like moderated and it's all supported by the Australian Government and the Department of Social Services. So it's just really quick, easy, non like fluffy fluffy, straight to the point information love love. I loved using it.

The government funded that also just reminded me there's Trisilian and Karatani which government funded and they help the amount of people I had a bad experience with Karatani, but that wasn't their fault. No, No, they help so much with things like sleep. So the amount of people that suggested Karatani or Trisilian to me saying it just gave me so much confidence with like how to get my baby to go to sleep, and how to manage different

It's so good.

I can't believe how many good resources are actually out there, even just.

Like if you're struggling mentally cope dot com, dot au. There's so many suggestions and resources there that you can just like there's always something, yeah, And I wish that I'd known that more so, I really wish I'd had this list of resources when pregnant and pay it forward.

If you have a friend that might be expecting or in that newborn phase, you don't have to ask them any specific how are you going, Hey, I've just come across this amazing list of resources I wanted to share with you.

Yes, and they make sure that they're listening to the.

Well, I didn't want to lead with that, but yes, encourage them to.

Listen to the pod also, and why not ask on our Facebook page as well if you have any sort of question or want suggestions or advice or something. There might be a shitter that lives close to you that wants to go grab a coffee.

There might be a shitter.

That's gone through the exact sort of same thing, or might have a really good suggestion. I myself have found that group so helpful.

Yeah, it is so helpful. And there's always someone out there with either an answer to your question or wondering the same thing. Yeah, you know exactly. You can work it out together.

Well, thank you so much. We really appreciate everyone listening today. Please rate and review us. I know that thousands of people were listening per week, sometime even more.

We see the numbers, and yet we don't.

Have thousands of reviews.

How the math Saint math to please go and write a beautiful review. It honestly means the world, and it means that we get to keep doing the content that you're loving exactly.

You could just put best that's amazing, fab fab, say no more that would be said. This episode was produced by myself, Kirie Cells, and Kelley McCarran, with audio production by the Lovely Madeline Joanna. We will be back in your ears next week.

She is bye bye