94. Discipline, Guilt, and Self-Love: Unpacking the Complexities and Social pressures - podcast episode cover

94. Discipline, Guilt, and Self-Love: Unpacking the Complexities and Social pressures

Dennis Rox
Nov 05, 2023•2 hr 30 min•Ep. 94
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Episode description

What does it mean to be truly content and centered within oneself, despite external circumstances and internal struggles?

It's clear in this episode that while luxurious experiences can offer fleeting satisfaction, they are not the panacea for deeper fulfillment. Vemir highlights the importance of gratitude through genuine connections rather than possessions, echoing Viktor Frankl's sentiment that the search for pleasure often masks a lack of purpose. Despite the convenience and seductive allure of social media ads, Eldar confronts the fact that true joy cannot be purchased or cultivated through external validation.

What emerges is a direct message for self-care: one that prioritizes authentic fulfillment over the superficial chase for materialistic gains and superficial judgments. It's a call to action for the listeners to honor their own path to personal happiness, free from the shackles of guilt, and to embrace life's simple pleasures without constant self-reproach. Whether it's finding peace in a quiet moment, the tactile satisfaction of quality goods, or indeed, enjoying pancakes at your mother’s house, this episode challenges us to reflect on the liberation that comes with recognizing and committing to our internal compass for happiness and well-being.

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Transcript

Vemir [00:00:01]:
you know, whether I have a dollar or a $10 million, I have something it's hard to buy. I have good taste.

Mike [00:00:07]:
He experienced his lavish lifestyle sitting in Paris on Avenue Montaigne, eating fucking nice. Crock, madame. Crock, monsieur.

Eldar [00:00:15]:
What kind of words are these?

Mike [00:00:16]:
Wait a second.

Eldar [00:00:17]:
I didn't know you spoke French.

Mike [00:00:18]:
I do. A little poquito.

Eldar [00:00:19]:
The ultimate thing, we have to get to a point that realize that we are so empowered, we have the ability to control reality around the way we want it to be. So it's not a fucking. Just a random thought, right, that comes to you like, oh, shit, I'm guilty. Do I do this or do I not do this? No. You're calculated to do things constantly, from moment to moment, to know what exactly you want from reality. 2030 years. Your mom won't be here. Go enjoy the fucking pancakes.

Eldar [00:00:41]:
My mom won't be here. Right. 2030 years. Enjoy the fucking pancakes. What's the problem? And.

Vemir [00:00:54]:
But can you help me crystallize this? Like, for example, I know someone who is a very prolific musician. They've been doing 9 hours of practice a day. They were, like, six years old. That's just a thing. But it's like, not everything is an instrument. Like, people can be an instrument, right. You can also be the conductor, to use the analogy. It's like, I'm sure when we did that six hour podcast that flew by longer than the DMV.

Vemir [00:01:17]:
Why is that? Right. What makes Tarantino watch all of the movies, know, whatever example. I think these are passionate examples.

Eldar [00:01:27]:
Yeah. I think that the way to them is to really find out, really slow down enough to distinguish the difference between pain and pleasure for yourself as an individual. And when you have a clear distinction that, okay, doing this consistently hurts me, and doing this consistently gives me pleasure. When you have a clear distinction between the two, you will start gravitating towards more pleasure, and that's called self love. And sooner or later, you'll get stuck somewhere, and that's the reassess. Yeah. And then you'd be like, oh, shit, no. Being stuck in a way where it's good, you get stuck on the pleasure part.

Vemir [00:02:03]:
Where? In the flow. Oh, shit.

Eldar [00:02:05]:
I really like this coding for some people, right? The flow, yeah. Basketball for others, right. It's somewhere where we get stuck. Gaming for others. Right. Whatever it is, it could be writing music, whatever. But you have to get stuck. And when you get stuck, you're like, oh, shit, this is it.

Eldar [00:02:21]:
And then you keep doing it. But I think that because a lot of times our minds are so open, too open, right. To so many different experiences, we want to do this, do this, do this. It's a lot of distractions, right? It's harder. It's like, oh, yeah, I want to be a bodybuilder. I want to look nice. No, you don't, bro. You know what I mean? If it's taking you beating yourself up, guilt tripping yourself into going to the gym.

Eldar [00:02:42]:
No, you got to find a right. I guess not self love.

Vemir [00:02:46]:
Is that what you're saying?

DJ [00:02:47]:
No, you're just saying you would do it naturally.

Eldar [00:02:49]:
Yeah. I'm saying that if you really were about that life, you would be doing it without anybody reminding you of it, telling you about it, you beating yourself up over it, your mom doing you in.

Vemir [00:02:59]:
That's why that second option I said is actually more dangerous. The one that I said where it's like someone forcing you to do something, like your parents, that's more dangerous because you have to remap your entire identity to figure out what you really like. Whereas if you know what you like but you're not disciplined, you can work that muscle a little bit easier because you know who you are for sure. You're just weak.

Eldar [00:03:23]:
That's a good point. You see, for that person who's getting oppressed by the parents, by the peers, or whoever, they on the journey of finding courage to stand up for themselves, that's a different journey completely. It's to say, no. Yo, enough of oppressing me. I don't want to do this shit anymore. This is what they're on.

Vemir [00:03:39]:
But it might take them decades to even know that they were being oppressed.

Eldar [00:03:44]:
How many lifetimes we got?

Vemir [00:03:45]:
Come on.

Eldar [00:03:47]:
Your first time here? Come on, man.

Vemir [00:03:49]:
My friend and I have this joke here. He's like, yo, don't cross the street too fast. He's like, if I die, I'll be Rick Carter as a rose. What are you worried about? No fear of death.

Eldar [00:03:59]:
You wish as a rose, man, we far from that. You want that peace skunk or something? You're coming back. Yeah. You're coming back as many a devil or something. I don't know. No. Yeah. I think that for you at least, right? I think that's focus.

Eldar [00:04:16]:
And when you find that pleasure, feeling and state where you're really enjoying yourself truly and not lying to yourself, because a lot of people lie to themselves about this.

Vemir [00:04:24]:
About what?

Eldar [00:04:25]:
About what they like or what they don't like. Yeah. And then next thing you know, they're spending years of doing shit that they think they like, but they really don't because they've lied to themselves.

DJ [00:04:35]:
Feel like social media isn't amplifying that.

Eldar [00:04:38]:
Oh, yeah, big time, big time. Everybody's saying, yo, you got to grind. Make all this money. You can do this. You can do this. Course you can do that. Course. And you're like, yeah, that's fucking good.

Eldar [00:04:47]:
I really want to do this. You sit down, you start doing some shit, you're like, yo, I fucking can't do this. You can't find out why now you're like, yo, wait a second. I thought we wanted to get rich. No, you don't want to get rich. That's phony. That's bullshit. You following somebody else's nonsense.

Eldar [00:05:01]:
Most likely that parent. They're the parents. The social media influences. They're our parents. That's telling us what to do without really examining who we really are.

Vemir [00:05:10]:
Yes. Social proof is the larger authority.

Eldar [00:05:13]:
For now.

Vemir [00:05:14]:
For now?

Eldar [00:05:14]:
Yeah, for now.

Vemir [00:05:15]:
What do you mean by that? You can go against your parents these days easily. Most kids don't have their parents values. But if you go against your society's approval of you and what you're doing, or you're missing something, that's like a bigger judgment than your parents. Usually it was the other way. Right? Like, if your parents disapprove.

Eldar [00:05:38]:
Traditional families, probably, yeah, traditional families. And then Internet became the big parent.

DJ [00:05:43]:
Now it's okay.

Vemir [00:05:44]:
Word. Damn.

DJ [00:05:45]:
That's a good way of putting it.

Eldar [00:05:47]:
Shit.

Vemir [00:05:47]:
Yeah, I think it's true.

DJ [00:05:49]:
No, that's a big fact, bro.

Vemir [00:05:50]:
Yeah, that's big facts.

DJ [00:05:52]:
I'll be thinking about this shit all the time.

Eldar [00:05:54]:
Excuse me. Yeah.

DJ [00:05:55]:
The confirmation biases that be running wild with the algorithms, just showing people 100%. I hate that shit.

Eldar [00:06:02]:
I feel like I'm the biggest deviant on social media. Like I'm on x now. I'm talking shit, and I'm just fucking ripping everybody a new one. You know what I mean? I'm just talking shit. You know what I mean? People are running amok.

Mike [00:06:16]:
I can imagine.

DJ [00:06:17]:
Eldor, think about that, too.

Eldar [00:06:19]:
I'm on x, bro. That's the only social media I'm on, bro. And I had to take time to learn this shit, bro. How everything works. I can't wait for him to fucking come up with a non ad version. I'm ready to pay more, bro. I can't.

DJ [00:06:30]:
You got the paid version?

Eldar [00:06:31]:
I got the paid version.

DJ [00:06:32]:
How much is it?

Eldar [00:06:33]:
I'm paying like, eight or nine a month. Yeah, but I want to pay even more to not see ads at all. That's coming out soon. He already announced it today. He's like, yo, I'm sorry. If you pay more, there's going to be no ads. I can't wait for that. That shit is annoying.

Eldar [00:06:47]:
I can't believe people fucking experience that.

Mike [00:06:49]:
Yeah.

Vemir [00:06:50]:
Ads everywhere.

DJ [00:06:51]:
Ads everywhere, everywhere, everywhere. I pay for YouTube.

Eldar [00:06:55]:
YouTube.

Vemir [00:06:58]:
It is a bliss.

Eldar [00:06:59]:
I used to fucking wait.

Mike [00:07:00]:
Those fucking commercials.

Vemir [00:07:01]:
Actually, in life, you pay for your pay to play house, not to have ads around it. Right? Like, if you live on the parkway or something, in all McDonald's, you're, like, getting away from disgusting. It's weird, though. I thought about this for a while, because I used to work in real estate, AI based analytics and stuff, and they said you have to pay to be on the penthouse so you can see the horizon. They know what's good for you, and they make it expensive.

Eldar [00:07:29]:
Yeah.

Vemir [00:07:31]:
You used to want to see on the top of your castle because you could see the horizon and feel safe and see the land, but it's like, the penthouse is the most expensive one. You know what I mean? And then the lower shit or stuff, with no windows, bad views. Your space shouldn't be so expensive to have a nurturing environment. That's kind of weird to me.

Eldar [00:07:54]:
We got it all backwards right now.

Vemir [00:07:56]:
For sure. You want me to talk about me? What I'm kind of, like, struggling with? No, I don't feel like I'm losing anything by sharing.

Eldar [00:08:10]:
That's a good way to put it, yeah. Your ego might be losing, though.

Vemir [00:08:17]:
Yeah. I have to deal with that guy when I get home. He's waiting for me. But the point being is I think there's, like, an obsession about my timeline in my life also, and pick whatever themes. I think depression is an illusion, but it's real also. That's an interesting one. Yeah. I mean, if you realize when you're.

Eldar [00:08:51]:
On the fence, right?

Vemir [00:08:52]:
What's that?

Eldar [00:08:53]:
When you're on the fence, depression is real.

Vemir [00:08:55]:
Yeah. I feel like I want to kind of solve real problems in my life now, but I realized that my internal happiness is here right now. Like, I don't need a lot of stuff, but something one of you guys said last time was, like, if you were truly in that blissful state, you wouldn't even think about those other things you want to achieve in the world. And then you said, yeah, that's true. But Philip said, if you want to just do it to express yourself, that's good. But if you're thinking you're going to fulfill or get something out of society, that's a mistake. So I've been kind of reflecting on that stuff. I do have this nietzsche kind of thing in my head.

Vemir [00:09:39]:
Like this maxed out vamir that I want to see, and I kind of want to see if I can do it. Like, can you endure the pain of discipline? Whether it's physical? Can you be smart enough to navigate a professional world? Right.

Eldar [00:09:56]:
How much have you sent?

Vemir [00:09:58]:
Probably. I don't know. Why, am I paying for it or something?

Eldar [00:10:02]:
It sounds like you want to pay for it.

Vemir [00:10:04]:
No, I think I'm definitely said, endure.

DJ [00:10:07]:
Yeah.

Eldar [00:10:09]:
Imagine me always like, yo, it's a crazy prison, bro. I'm trying to stay away from that, bro. I'm just trying to be a good student. Okay, you see how scary that sounded?

Mike [00:10:18]:
But he's still conflicted about. I mean, we talked about this last time, and outside, he's still conflicted on what side he wants to be on in life.

Eldar [00:10:26]:
Yeah, I think that's why he's thinking.

Mike [00:10:27]:
That's why he's thinking about this stuff.

Eldar [00:10:29]:
He has a conundrum.

Vemir [00:10:30]:
I think there is a bit of freedom in the past couple of years where I feel like I can boldly go forth and the strength of judgment is not as strong as it was, things like that. But it's like, what are you judging? No, I'm saying, like, people's perception of me mattered a lot. Okay. Now it matters way less. It's not zero.

Mike [00:10:53]:
Yeah.

Vemir [00:10:53]:
It's like, what do I do? I want to learn everything. But then I think my drive every day to learn everything is impossible to reach.

Eldar [00:11:04]:
Yeah.

Vemir [00:11:04]:
You know what I mean?

Mike [00:11:05]:
Well, yeah, but you're learning for everything. It sounds very blind. You're hoping that you learn everything so you find something that you actually want to find instead of being calculated and searching that for that which you're looking for.

Vemir [00:11:17]:
Yeah, I think that's true. I think being too airy about it rather than embodying, like, I love this, and that's okay, that's enough. I also think it would be a shame if I died without learning about biology sufficiently. And there's so much beauty in the.

Mike [00:11:33]:
World for being honest in it.

Vemir [00:11:35]:
I don't know, I feel like it's a shame.

Mike [00:11:39]:
Are you going to find the answers that you're searching for in there?

Vemir [00:11:42]:
Probably the only path is like, meditation and spirituality to find those answers.

Mike [00:11:48]:
Why do you say that?

Vemir [00:11:50]:
The reason why is because I've been in luxury buildings. It's still wood and metal, you know, what? I mean, you can deconstruct or construct meaning for those things, right?

Mike [00:12:02]:
But there's some things that actually have meaning. Not like those metal beams.

Vemir [00:12:06]:
Right. So I'm trying to guess. I'm trying to integrate the things that I've learned, those things that I've read and stuff like that. But it's at this apex point where the days are cycling forward and I can't not pay attention anymore. You know what I mean?

Eldar [00:12:26]:
How old are you?

Vemir [00:12:27]:
27.

Eldar [00:12:28]:
Okay.

Vemir [00:12:28]:
I'm committed, like, never to lie to myself, even though it's painful.

Mike [00:12:35]:
You don't know that you're lying to yourself.

Vemir [00:12:37]:
Well, I'm going to keep trying. There's only way to find out. Right?

Eldar [00:12:39]:
Well, coming over here. And then we're going to put the magnifying glass on him. I will elderize him.

Mike [00:12:47]:
That's right.

Vemir [00:12:47]:
Absolutely. I think one piece of advice someone gave me is, vamir, you want to be this high flying guy? Start to iterate. Just see this. Don't make a big jump. Just go here. Right? So like my budy said, be a janitor at Google and then work your way up or something like that, right? The point being is I seem to.

Mike [00:13:07]:
Be.

Vemir [00:13:10]:
Scattered and I can give really good advice, like you said, or I'm really on point with something, or I had a great soccer game, or I have this intense knowledge about some nutritional advice or something. But other people seem to be employed. I'm not employed. I'm applying. I have great mentors. I have great value. So is it just patience and discipline? What is the secret sauce to vimeer? I remember points of my life where I felt very fulfilled, not overthinking, you know what I mean? And I feel like I graduated. Then a lot of shit happened.

Vemir [00:13:53]:
Covid happened, all the consequences. I got long. Covid, family stuff. We had death in the family and stuff. So I'm like, it's like another break. You didn't expect what happened when you graduated to happen. So it's like how to reconfigure because it's a new opening of. I feel like I see things differently from four years ago when we first met, whatever it is.

Vemir [00:14:20]:
So it's like, yeah, on this path of no bullshit, what else do I need to kill off? Because I actually feel like I do it in a reverse. I clear away all the stuff so that I can rise in a clean way. Most people, I think, try to add, I try to subtract.

Eldar [00:14:41]:
So what's wrong with the advice of being a janitor?

Vemir [00:14:45]:
Nothing. Probably my feeling that I'm leaving something on the table.

Eldar [00:14:50]:
Like what?

Vemir [00:14:51]:
I feel like I can get a good position, but I don't know what the water rises to right now.

Eldar [00:14:58]:
Yeah, but what's wrong with being a janitor at a school, for example?

Vemir [00:15:01]:
No, nothing. I just don't think my talents. He was saying it facetiously, like, you should start at the very bottom at a tech company.

Eldar [00:15:09]:
No. Yeah, but I think that there might be value there, and I'm not sure if you've seen that value of what? Of what he's trying to say.

Vemir [00:15:16]:
Yeah, I probably am. I'm missing something. Yeah, I probably think because I suffered so much better. In terms of what?

Eldar [00:15:26]:
Like rising and being like, hey, I deserve better.

Vemir [00:15:32]:
Sometimes I do feel like that you.

Eldar [00:15:35]:
Use the word deserve a lot.

Vemir [00:15:36]:
No.

Eldar [00:15:39]:
Sometimes in the combination of I. Okay, you don't have to say it out loud. Obviously, if you say it.

Vemir [00:15:49]:
No, the honesty there is like. I feel like some of it was my fault, some of it was not. And it was just like a lot of suffering. So where do I get my check for that? In a way.

Eldar [00:16:02]:
Oh, who's going to pay me for that?

Vemir [00:16:04]:
Yeah, sometimes shit just happens and you don't get anything back except wisdom.

Eldar [00:16:09]:
Give us example and we're going to see whether or not you're worthy of anything. What'd you do?

Vemir [00:16:17]:
No, I mean, it's nothing like sinister. I just lack of structure, I think.

Eldar [00:16:24]:
You're not saying anything.

Vemir [00:16:26]:
Yeah, I don't know what I'm. What I want to.

Eldar [00:16:29]:
I've done all this.

Mike [00:16:30]:
And he suffered a lot. Yeah, but where'd you suffer?

Eldar [00:16:32]:
Yeah, where'd you suffer? Where'd you suffer now for it or something?

Vemir [00:16:37]:
No, not paid monetarily, but you're saying.

Eldar [00:16:40]:
Almost like recognition or something. Or appreciation, right?

Vemir [00:16:44]:
Those words. That's a good question. I think one thing I definitely, way back is school. I really cared about doing well in school, but you realize when you're young and when you're older, the value of getting grades and stuff like that. So one thing I can tell you I'm aware of is that I feel cheated from the education system.

Eldar [00:17:07]:
Okay?

Vemir [00:17:08]:
That's easy money, straight down the line.

Eldar [00:17:10]:
Anger.

Vemir [00:17:11]:
Yeah. How much? But you shouldn't be angry because you didn't know better.

Eldar [00:17:16]:
No, I get it. No, you know how to justify it properly, but I get it. How much?

Vemir [00:17:21]:
How angry?

Eldar [00:17:22]:
No, how much money? Oh, I don't know.

Vemir [00:17:24]:
I cheated up. It was more time than imagine. If I was fully fueled mentally with the education man, it would be like another universe. That's pretty frustrating. Once I woke up to that and then I put a lot of career efforts into stuff that had bad leadership. I wasn't aware, so I learned the hard way a lot with those things, but it was good because I probably could have learned it faster. But the point being is like, okay, I've wisened up a little bit. How do I take advantage of that for my own benefit and for just natural evolution of vamir?

Eldar [00:18:07]:
In other sense, did you wisen up?

Vemir [00:18:10]:
I can spot bad leadership. I know how startup company structure works. I know sales a lot better. I know some systems are not set up for you to succeed, things like that. I know, like sometimes in startups people think really big and they're going to solve huge problems and then their scope is too big and their resources, stuff like that, like structural stuff and avoiding pitfalls.

Eldar [00:18:37]:
So how have you been using this knowledge in order to apply it for yourself now in order to succeed? What have you been doing?

Vemir [00:18:44]:
So going into startup interviews and stuff like that, I feel confident and a little bit more comfortable and aware. You can map that from dating also, like, I know what I want and what I don't want. When you're young and you don't know how to get what you want, you feel desperate, because if you knew how to get it, you wouldn't feel desperate, and if you got it, you wouldn't feel desperate. But I knew when I was much younger about dating specifically, I felt like I want romance, I want a beautiful woman, I have no idea how to do it. And that was very frustrating. Then you fuck up a lot, you learn whatever. So in the same way it's like now I feel comfortable with women. Mostly the same way when I go into these interviews.

Vemir [00:19:30]:
I used to be a nervous wreck when I was 19. Now I feel good. But this is a work in progress. Maybe I'll report back to you in a month and have clearer.

Eldar [00:19:41]:
Cool.

Vemir [00:19:41]:
Like.

Eldar [00:19:42]:
Yeah, because you haven't said anything.

Vemir [00:19:43]:
Nothing. Is it that circular shit again? Yeah, I don't want to do that. Okay, what are you asking? Because there's.

Eldar [00:19:53]:
At least the way I'm perceiving you and the way you're answering, it's almost like it's always around the bush, right, Mike? And always justifications.

Mike [00:20:02]:
Maybe it's because we're on air. Maybe because we're on air, maybe. No, because we had him like a.

Eldar [00:20:10]:
No, but I think that I'm pulling towards his, I guess maybe spiritual, intellectual side more where the one that's trying to fight the ego and tell him that this is good for him. He understands this. Right? Even it's on air. I think it's even better. It's hardest. But his ego on the other side is also defending it and justifying certain things and not being as vulnerable as he could in order to shine some more light on that area. Right. In order for us to give him non biased feedback.

Eldar [00:20:39]:
In order to really give it to him and be like, okay, cool. So you can go and reflect on that. He's dancing around it, which you're good.

Mike [00:20:47]:
At, but I think also part of it.

Eldar [00:20:48]:
But it's not here.

Mike [00:20:51]:
Know what it is?

Eldar [00:20:53]:
Well, that's what I'm saying. That's why I'm asking them questions. He doesn't have a real thing. Well, probably because he's smart enough to not to say it and get caught. The eagle gets caught, right? Yeah. Or he's fearful to get caught. I don't know. It's like a.

Mike [00:21:08]:
No, I think the easiest question. Right? Like, I've been thinking about this on my own. When you think about stuff like, hey, what am I. You told me this. You said, what are you angry at? What is causing you problem? What is causing you suffering? Yeah, those are specific things. It's not like vague, hey, I'm overweight. I'm suffering. Okay, let's talk about that.

Mike [00:21:26]:
I don't have a job. I'm suffering. Okay, let's talk about that. And I think being sensitive and acknowledging those pain points and then bringing them to light and saying, like, hey, I don't have this. I don't have that. It's angering me. Upset.

Vemir [00:21:41]:
Well, there's also stuff like, I feel like I'm focused on now. You want me to go into my whole past and introspect, okay, on air, it's not comfortable, but I can do it. I have no skeletons to hide.

Eldar [00:21:54]:
I don't think you will say anything that's going to be out of the ordinary of what we've discussed.

Vemir [00:21:58]:
The whole point is being like, I want to focus on. Not like when I got beat up in middle school. Let's talk about what I'm focusing on now. If you think it's.

Mike [00:22:10]:
The question is like, I don't have anything. Not happy now and what things leading.

Eldar [00:22:14]:
For you to know. Why are you on the fence? Right? You're saying, hey, I can't jump. I can't focus. I'm on the fence. I know the bliss, but I know depression and I'm on the fence. I don't know which way to jump? I don't have a focus. I'm all over the place. I can't advise this.

Eldar [00:22:29]:
There's a failure to start.

Vemir [00:22:30]:
It's actually an internal thing because I actually do think I'm internally happy because I know how to avoid a lot of issues and I've solved a lot of problems. The frustration is like Vermeer. You know, you love Europe, especially Paris, and you enjoy that environment and intellectual. So why don't you do.

Mike [00:22:54]:
What do you like about Paris?

Vemir [00:22:56]:
It's like an outdoor museum. It's gorgeous. And the conversations are fun. It's just like the aesthetic of it, the food.

Mike [00:23:01]:
You just like nice things.

Vemir [00:23:03]:
Yeah.

Mike [00:23:05]:
We finally got to the thing.

Vemir [00:23:07]:
But also, nature is free, right? Nature is more stunning than any city. Like Rio. I like it because of many things, but nature also the number one thing. Like, when I was in Rio, I saw the sunset on this metallic waves, and I thought, man, this is how my whole life should be. So why are you here exactly? Why am I not working every moment to become free like that, to be able to do exactly what I want to all the time, that kind of thing. Yeah, that's the question, is the main.

Eldar [00:23:41]:
I have the answer to that.

Mike [00:23:42]:
I have the answer, too.

Vemir [00:23:43]:
Yeah.

Eldar [00:23:43]:
That's a very simple thing. You're too smart for that. You can't buy that internally.

Vemir [00:23:51]:
I love your ego narrative. Every time you do it, it makes me laugh. I don't laugh, but I like it.

Eldar [00:23:56]:
Laugh. All right, good.

Vemir [00:23:57]:
Go ahead.

Eldar [00:23:57]:
Fun.

Vemir [00:23:57]:
I'm too smart for that. Good. Yeah.

Eldar [00:24:00]:
You know what I'm saying?

Mike [00:24:00]:
He knows that, you know, that shit is dead. It's a gig, bro.

Eldar [00:24:04]:
It's a gig. He's going to deplete it after a while, and he's going to be stuck.

Mike [00:24:07]:
At the same internally.

Eldar [00:24:09]:
He knows this. And to make that leap, to jump, it's fucking scary to do that. Go and test that theory, look what's going to happen. You come. Going to come back. You're going to come back.

Mike [00:24:17]:
Yeah, 100%.

Eldar [00:24:18]:
Because that's not the answer. You know it. Deep inside, you're too smart for that.

Vemir [00:24:21]:
Right.

Eldar [00:24:22]:
So to bring that, that's why Mike said, what do you like about Paris? And you said, a bunch of nothing.

Vemir [00:24:28]:
What did you want me to say? In that moment?

Eldar [00:24:30]:
We actually know exactly what you said. Exactly what you said. Because you were honest.

Mike [00:24:34]:
Yeah.

Eldar [00:24:36]:
Because then it gives us an idea of what we're working with. You know what I'm saying?

Vemir [00:24:40]:
Okay. But, okay, let's be honest. You're kind of saying this, to say, like, well, nothing's. All this extraneous bullshit is not meaningful. The cave. Cave shadows.

Eldar [00:24:51]:
You are under impression that that space, that environment, those people make you feel a certain type of way.

Vemir [00:24:57]:
Well, I enjoy it more than Hackensack, let's say. Yes, but it's not like I won't get depressed there. I haven't been depressed there.

Mike [00:25:09]:
Exactly.

Eldar [00:25:09]:
Of course, you know. That's why you don't go. Yeah.

Mike [00:25:12]:
People always. They grasp to their vacation straws because they remember that was the best day of their lives. Three days.

Eldar [00:25:17]:
Correct.

Mike [00:25:17]:
But 362 days of the year, when they're here in New Jersey, you got.

Eldar [00:25:20]:
To go home to your same hotel or your Airbnb, and you got to be by yourself, and you lay to yourself with your own thoughts, and you know this well enough. Yeah. And that's why you don't go. Yeah.

Vemir [00:25:31]:
No, you go for vacation.

Eldar [00:25:33]:
You don't go there to stay.

Vemir [00:25:34]:
I studied abroad. I worked there. Yes, but, you know, they're not happy.

Eldar [00:25:39]:
Yeah. The problem has to be solved here.

Mike [00:25:41]:
The problem is within you. Whatever is happening in the outside world, whatever beauty you're going to see is never going to be the beauty that you can harvest.

Eldar [00:25:49]:
And for you being, like I said, you open the can of worms you can't put back. For you to be as smart as you are, you can't go around telling people, justifying or tricking yourself that I am here because of this external, and therefore I'm happy.

Vemir [00:26:05]:
No way, Jose.

Eldar [00:26:06]:
No way.

Mike [00:26:07]:
No.

Eldar [00:26:07]:
You could only do it for a week or two, bro.

Vemir [00:26:09]:
Maybe a, um.

Eldar [00:26:12]:
No chance.

Vemir [00:26:13]:
I respect you guys because you're like, no bullshit, but we don't have a.

Eldar [00:26:17]:
Horse in a race, and you're presenting. It's like I said, if you leave, we don't care if you go, we don't care if you stay.

Vemir [00:26:23]:
I know you're a good person. You care about humans, but it's like. I know what you mean. You don't have any stake in.

Eldar [00:26:28]:
I'm trying to find out what the truth of the matter is of your condition. That is what's fascinating to me. That is what I'd like to find out. Because if you get to the truth and I get to the truth and we agree upon it, it just empowers me and empowers you, and this is great.

Vemir [00:26:40]:
Well, do you want me to tell people what people have criticized me for? Is that helpful? I don't know if they're right.

Eldar [00:26:46]:
I mean, if they were shooting in the right direction, I don't know those people. I don't know how credibility they have. What are the kind?

Mike [00:26:56]:
No, I think this thing, what he said is big because we had a conversation outside you had left already. Yeah, and that was a good talk. One thing that I was diagnosing him, let's just call it, is that he hasn't picked a side.

Eldar [00:27:09]:
Yeah.

Mike [00:27:10]:
He experienced his lavish lifestyle sitting in Paris on Avenue Montaigne, eating. Fucking nice crock. Madame. Croc, monsieur.

Eldar [00:27:18]:
What kind of words are these?

Mike [00:27:19]:
Wait a second.

Eldar [00:27:19]:
I didn't know you spoke French.

Mike [00:27:20]:
I do.

Eldar [00:27:21]:
A little pookie, man, that rolled off your fucking tongue. Like I've.

Vemir [00:27:25]:
I've never cooked once.

Eldar [00:27:27]:
Nothing came off your tongue because I've.

Mike [00:27:28]:
Been on those things that he's talking about. I know what he's talking about. Yeah, right.

Eldar [00:27:32]:
Yeah.

Mike [00:27:32]:
And I had the same conflict. I like nice things. I want to live that lifestyle. But I was never fulfilled. And I was chasing the same girls that he's chasing.

Vemir [00:27:41]:
Chasing, chasing. No, chased.

Eldar [00:27:45]:
Okay, leveled up. Come on, give him.

Vemir [00:27:46]:
Leveled up. No, he's not chasing him anymore.

Mike [00:27:50]:
But he's going to go back to it soon if Elder isn't.

Eldar [00:27:54]:
Listen, you know me, bro. Listen, we can have a theory, but then I'll say, okay, cool, I have my theory. You have your theory. Go test it out, see how it plays out. And then we'll go back. We'll come back and see how it goes. That's part of life.

Mike [00:28:08]:
Yeah. So he wants this lifestyle, this rich lifestyle. Lavish things, nice things, expensive things.

Eldar [00:28:15]:
Why are you reducing him like he's a fucking sauce?

Vemir [00:28:20]:
I never heard that before.

Eldar [00:28:22]:
That's because I've been watching fucking Bobby Flay, bro. Reduction, you know? Sauce reduction. Yeah. You're reducing him to this, like, fucking materialistic whore.

Mike [00:28:30]:
Well, look, because that also lives within him and he's trying to. This is the same conundrum that I was telling you that I was going through. It's like, yo, how can you be a philosopher and also live this materialistic lifestyle? Those two identities, they survive together. It's a very painful, which is exactly what he saw.

Vemir [00:28:48]:
You killed your material side.

Mike [00:28:50]:
I didn't. But the thing is, I realized what goes in the front of the priorities list. I realized what goes in the back. No, not spirituality.

Vemir [00:29:04]:
What is it?

Mike [00:29:05]:
Self development. Trying to understand my own conditions, trying to help myself. Examining, try to find my purpose. And then I live a very nice life, bro. I travel, I go to nice restaurants, I dress nice, I drive a best car.

Vemir [00:29:19]:
Right?

Mike [00:29:21]:
I'm not lacking anything.

Vemir [00:29:22]:
Nothing's missing.

Mike [00:29:23]:
But if you take those things away from me tomorrow, you're still not going to change my quality of life.

Vemir [00:29:27]:
So I have a question. Do you think that. And thank you for presenting that. Do you think life is putting me here so that I become happy and peaceful and then I'll be.

Mike [00:29:38]:
You might have good karma if you're here.

Eldar [00:29:40]:
Yeah. I don't know how he found his way here. Elderism, baby. Yeah.

Mike [00:29:46]:
I think life gives all of us opportunities to live a certain way.

Vemir [00:29:51]:
Because I do feel you could say in moments and hours, I do feel very grateful. I feel like actually what I need to work on is embodying more gratitude.

Mike [00:30:03]:
How do you know that your gratefulness is actually rooted in the truth or not an illusion of something else that we created in our heads?

Vemir [00:30:10]:
Because it's been proven like, my parents love me, love having me around. My friends and family value me. And my relationships are very solid. They're not perfect, obviously, but they're genuine.

Mike [00:30:25]:
How does that look? Like all the stuff you describe?

Vemir [00:30:27]:
Obviously, my mom made me. I went to go visit her in Montclair before I woke up. She made me muffins and went out in the rain and got me a coffee because last night I told her.

Mike [00:30:39]:
Does your mom know you? The person that we are getting to know here or not?

Vemir [00:30:42]:
Yeah, I tell everything. I don't hide any filters.

Mike [00:30:45]:
And you talk to her about all this stuff?

Vemir [00:30:47]:
All the shit that my darkest sides. I tell her she is very beautiful person. Sometimes I feel like the criticism of me that I take things for granted might be true. However, that's what carries me along and feels a sense of confidence and stability in life and that I am taken care of by life itself. But it's like that is a main criticism of me. That might be halfway true, which is actually my friends do tease me in that vamir needs to wear. Wearing Tom Ford and this kind of, you know. But it's like the real thing is.

Eldar [00:31:33]:
Like, I mean, listen, you did a really good job. I never knew this about you. What? Yeah, this side of you.

Vemir [00:31:38]:
What is this side?

Eldar [00:31:39]:
This side. The Tom Ford side.

Vemir [00:31:41]:
No, no, I just.

DJ [00:31:42]:
Nice things.

Eldar [00:31:43]:
Yeah, but I never knew this about you.

Vemir [00:31:45]:
How can I present this in a healthy way? It's like I just appreciate quality. It's the same as conversation.

Eldar [00:31:52]:
I think that it's not talking about. Right. You shift the priorities between them.

Vemir [00:31:56]:
If you're saying that I feel empty without, it's like, honestly, the side of me that whatever, I can describe it as this. The tension is like, I feel like I will appreciate a good meal or a nice car or I want to have the tactile experience of good things and have the freedom to select a furniture piece or appreciate good things when.

Eldar [00:32:22]:
You see them too.

Vemir [00:32:22]:
Right. Whether I have a dollar or a $10 million, I have something it's hard to buy. I have good taste. That's why I'm in this room. I like these conversations.

Mike [00:32:35]:
Yes.

Vemir [00:32:35]:
So there's nothing wrong with having good. It's. What do you got there?

Eldar [00:32:40]:
Yachty.

Vemir [00:32:41]:
Yachty. On the yachty. I got an old man, Casillo. I got this in Rio, actually. So the point being is, like, I'll say this about myself. I have good taste, but needing the things I think we can all recognize as wrong to think you are better than somebody else or that. All those ego concept things, I just like the, um.

Mike [00:33:08]:
Yeah, what's that guy, your favorite guy that said, viktor Frankl said, when a person is lacking a sense of purpose, they always seek pleasure.

Vemir [00:33:15]:
Yes.

Eldar [00:33:16]:
Oh, shit.

Vemir [00:33:17]:
And it's very true. When you're depressed or like Tony Soprano goes to eat the Gaba ghoul, you have to. You jerk off or something.

Eldar [00:33:24]:
You have to. Yeah.

Vemir [00:33:25]:
No, you don't have to.

Eldar [00:33:26]:
No. But that's the way to what we do. We relieve pain through the lowest hanging fruit.

Mike [00:33:34]:
Little quick.

Eldar [00:33:37]:
Washing of yourself or whatever.

Vemir [00:33:39]:
Clearing the pipes.

Mike [00:33:40]:
Exactly. Buying something, eating something, drinking something, buying something. There's a million ways to still go into pleasure mode, which is okay.

Vemir [00:33:49]:
You guys try to sit in that pain sometimes.

Eldar [00:33:51]:
No, I think you finally have to not sit in it. You have to understand that and embrace it and say, it's okay to do that. It's okay to jerk off. It's okay to go and buy the shit, but I'm buying it for this reason. To know that you are doing it for that. That I think is called self love.

Vemir [00:34:06]:
Not lying to yourself is self love.

Eldar [00:34:08]:
Okay, you go and say, you know what? I want to play video games and I'm going to play for 5 hours, and that's okay. Okay.

Vemir [00:34:14]:
So if we visualize this, then the ego is doing this flaring we call ego flare. But then you go here. That's your center. The farther away you get from your center, the bigger the ego. Fucking disillusion is this fucking crazy theory, right?

Eldar [00:34:29]:
The more pain you're in. And then you need to minimize that pain, and you have to go center and focus and do exactly what you like. Be it nice things, go shopping, for sure. But tell yourself, this is what I'm doing, and that's okay. It is okay to go shopping. It is okay to enjoy things that I enjoy and not discipline. Discipline will tell you otherwise. While you're fucking depressed, while you're confused, while you're not motivated, discipline will tell you, get your fucking shitty ass piece of shit ass up and go fucking do this fucking exercise.

Vemir [00:34:58]:
It doesn't work long term, though.

Eldar [00:35:00]:
It doesn't. It never does. That's why we against discipline. We pro self love.

Vemir [00:35:04]:
Oh, can I bring up something crazy?

Eldar [00:35:06]:
Sure. Did you see that? Yes, of course.

Vemir [00:35:09]:
You're excited about it when things are going well, don't you? Like, I don't know if you know what I'm talking about. In some path in your journey, you felt like, damn, things are going well. You almost feel guilty. You're like, everything was so fucking hard. It's so easy now.

Eldar [00:35:27]:
Yeah.

Vemir [00:35:27]:
And then the mind isn't even satisfied when it's all going well. And that's something you have to kill if you want to grow spiritually. I'm in this thing of, like, suffering and depression was so painful, and then you feel like, well, actually, you're in the same room. You're enjoying yourself in the same room. You don't feel like, that pain or that tension is there. Things are flowing a little bit nicely. And the key is to me to tap into that and stay with that flow and be okay with that new vibration or new. I'm enjoying this moment rather than feeling like you have to control it or life is pure suffering or something like that.

Vemir [00:36:08]:
What are your thoughts on that? Accepting that it doesn't have to be hard at all.

DJ [00:36:13]:
I just started having east. I mean, I've been having that thought, like, a lot recently. And you got to say, fuck that shit and enjoy it. Personal about being me because it makes sense, or else you wouldn't be, I don't know, thinking that you wouldn't have so much thought about the thing you're enjoying. And it's more reason to just say whatever. I don't know. That's where I'm at with it right now. Because every time it still pops in here and there.

DJ [00:36:48]:
But I'm more adamant about saying, fuck it. I'm doing it like playing video games.

Vemir [00:36:53]:
Because push ahead.

DJ [00:36:54]:
Yeah, I just push ahead. And I don't feel guilty about it. I'm just like. I acknowledge good shit.

Eldar [00:36:59]:
That's self love. And you feel good.

DJ [00:37:01]:
Yeah, I go right back to it. I'll think about it for like, five minutes.

Eldar [00:37:07]:
I think conscious effort to feel good is a good thing.

Vemir [00:37:11]:
Yeah.

DJ [00:37:11]:
Okay.

Eldar [00:37:12]:
It's very good.

DJ [00:37:12]:
Conscious effort.

Eldar [00:37:13]:
Yeah. Because you got to understand, DJ, after a while of a good thing, after you filled yourself, you're going to get up, you're going to go do all the shit. But now you're filled. Yeah.

DJ [00:37:26]:
Literally, I needed that hour break of video games to go study again.

Eldar [00:37:30]:
To go study again. To go wash dishes again.

DJ [00:37:33]:
That ass, bro. It'd be that little shit.

Eldar [00:37:37]:
You need to fill yourself.

DJ [00:37:38]:
No, cap, I did that shit when I did laundry today.

Vemir [00:37:41]:
No, it's facts, 100%.

Eldar [00:37:43]:
Yeah.

Vemir [00:37:45]:
That is machine mentality. We got to be 18 hours a day.

Eldar [00:37:48]:
People lost their minds, vermia. That's why I told you I'm on x. And I'm watching this shit, this grind that people is on. How do they live like this? This is why. That's why everybody's depressed on drugs and all this other shit that they're fucking. They're tripping, bro. Relax. Something wrong with it.

Eldar [00:38:04]:
And I think that you're going to be more productive long term from relaxing first and then doing work.

Vemir [00:38:12]:
Shit. It's true.

Eldar [00:38:14]:
It's true, bro.

Vemir [00:38:15]:
But you know what's funny? What you guys just said. I think relaxing and enjoying all the thoughts that come to you rather than filtering and judging them, is what's made me feel very healthy. Like those things that bite when you just let it pass and you do your meditation, you're like, it's okay for any thoughts to come in and out. They're not going to touch me in.

Eldar [00:38:37]:
A way that's right.

Vemir [00:38:38]:
Instead of doing this kind of. That helps me good. But it's like, what happens when all of us are feeling good? We're just going to sit here and.

Eldar [00:38:49]:
Be like, yeah, that's impossible. No, because we're constantly like this. So one day I'm down, Mike's helping me up. One day Mike's down, and I'll help him up. And then we're just constantly going.

Vemir [00:39:02]:
I have a trio of that with my buddies. Sorry. One's depressed, one's productive, one's happy. And then when we all meet, it's like, very funny. So you're saying you need to find your guys because everybody's going to be dip. Why do you go in dips and.

Eldar [00:39:21]:
Stuff if we got it all figured out? Well, no, the ultimate thing, we have to get to a point that realize that we are so empowered, we have the ability to control reality around us the way we want it to be. So it's not a fucking. Just a random thought. Right. That comes to you like, oh, shit, I'm guilty. Do I do this or do I not do this? No. You're calculated to do things constantly, from moment to moment, to know what exactly you want from reality.

Vemir [00:39:46]:
Special.

Eldar [00:39:47]:
Yeah. And if you're constantly doing that, you're constantly putting it out there. You stay there. You know what I mean?

Vemir [00:39:52]:
Yes.

Eldar [00:39:53]:
You stay there and sometimes for long periods of time until you fall again, and then you hopefully shorten the gaps between those falls and stuff like that. You keep coming back to that. It's being addicted to your own self empowerment and have the ability to be like, yo, I know myself. I know what I am. I know what I need to do. And that's how you keep fulfilling yourself and everything else external is just external. Then if you can help others, it's great. If you can't, then it's okay.

Vemir [00:40:17]:
Okay, not a big deal. So that means there's a tension, specifically.

Eldar [00:40:24]:
For me then, about you're in pain. 100%.

Vemir [00:40:28]:
Why do you say that so clearly? Because I'm asking the questions.

Eldar [00:40:32]:
Not that. Because you're asking the questions. Because the topic of the way you described it to him, it's almost right with those thoughts that are coming into you as to feeling either unsure or feel maybe even guilty for it. It's almost to say that it's foreign object to you.

Vemir [00:40:47]:
No, I think at this point in time, this past week, I have been thinking and you articulated it well. I'm just saying, like, my mind is always fighting for the king of the hill throne.

Eldar [00:40:56]:
I get it.

Vemir [00:40:56]:
And I am getting annoyed because I know he doesn't win or it doesn't lead anywhere. It's like the back end wisdom. I think it's the mind fighting for control when it's losing.

Eldar [00:41:09]:
Yeah.

Mike [00:41:09]:
It's the inability to slow down, to actually see what's important.

Vemir [00:41:12]:
That's hard for.

Eldar [00:41:15]:
Because he's developed a lot of attachments and a lot of nonstickle things that are not actually serving vamir.

Mike [00:41:21]:
No.

Vemir [00:41:22]:
You know what I'm saying?

Eldar [00:41:24]:
If we strip him down right now from this fucking intellectual fucking person, that he perceives himself or presents himself into the world. He's a fucking kid. Yeah.

Mike [00:41:31]:
He just wants to eat. He just wants to play and play video game, sexual hot girl.

Eldar [00:41:35]:
You know what I mean? Eat good food and play video games. Everybody talking about, what do you think we're doing? We're just not hiding behind the shit. We're not hiding behind the shit. We're having fucking fun. I'm here doing this podcast. Not because I'm making me rich or fucking famous. I'm enjoying myself here. You know what I mean?

Vemir [00:41:53]:
That's it. But your point is saying you believe strongly. I don't accept parts of me because I think it's wrong.

Eldar [00:42:01]:
Chase you away.

Vemir [00:42:02]:
Correct.

Eldar [00:42:03]:
Somebody chased you away from an idea of that you are enough. That Vermeer is enough, that you don't have to be this fucking guru, smart, intellectual person in order to be accepted by society.

Vemir [00:42:14]:
Yeah, I mean, I can tell you directly, I would feel very comfortable if every room I walked into, they would.

Mike [00:42:25]:
Give a round applause when you walked in.

Eldar [00:42:27]:
We can start doing that standing ovation.

Vemir [00:42:29]:
You guys stand up and down.

Eldar [00:42:31]:
We get up every time. Yeah.

Vemir [00:42:34]:
No, the point is, feeling like you can be fully yourself would be considered eccentric. And that's fun. It's just like sustaining it over time. That's what I was going to ask.

Mike [00:42:54]:
Sustaining it. How can being yourself and sustaining it, you're putting on an act to present to those people those 3 hours of entertainment.

Vemir [00:43:04]:
They don't work together because I feel like I've labeled AdHD, actually. Me, just like going with the flow of life. Like, I'll be with my dad for dinner and I came here and I enjoy that. I don't like structuring my day too much. Okay, but that's what I'm saying. That's not a responsible way to live life.

Mike [00:43:23]:
I don't structure my day. I have no schedule. I don't remember anything that I have to do. I constantly run late on things that need to get done. I'm the happiest I've ever been, okay?

Eldar [00:43:33]:
And he used to be a fucking control freak. This guy used to wake up at six in the morning, put on a suit and fucking tie, right, you know what I'm saying? And get fucking shit done. And what? He tested that theory and he didn't get to a place where he wanted to be because ultimately he said, yo, elder, I want to fall in love. I want to be in love. I'm like, okay, cool, let's break that down. And did you get there? No, it's like, okay, cool, I got to reinvent myself.

Mike [00:43:55]:
Crazy.

Eldar [00:43:56]:
Hold on.

DJ [00:43:56]:
I'm sorry. I did realize. Yeah, Mike, so you always be fly.

Eldar [00:43:59]:
As fuck fly and what? And what reason? No reason. He has a business, my man. Come on, man. Remember the shoes? Remember everything?

DJ [00:44:16]:
Yeah, the shoes.

Eldar [00:44:17]:
He was always in his phone working twenty four seven. And now he finally realized like, what the fuck is wrong with me? Why am I taking myself so seriously? He's saying that he's never been happier. And now the person he's presenting is more confident, more understanding. The person that you talk about, ADHD, he used to have that too. I mean, he probably still does a little bit, but he has a lot more control over it, probably.

Vemir [00:44:37]:
You don't feel bad for smoking cigs?

Eldar [00:44:40]:
There you go.

Mike [00:44:41]:
I just went on a bender, like this whole summer. I smoke cigarettes whole summer.

Vemir [00:44:45]:
Yeah. Well, why don't you feel bad?

Eldar [00:44:47]:
There you go.

Mike [00:44:48]:
You missed out podcast, man. It's pleasure for me.

Vemir [00:44:51]:
Okay.

Mike [00:44:52]:
And I don't beat myself up.

Eldar [00:44:53]:
We recognize that. We recognize here that there are certain things about life that it's okay to do consciously.

Vemir [00:44:59]:
Okay. By the way, Osho has a great thing about quitting smoking. He says, do it as much as you want. Do it slowly and more consciously. Make it a ritual.

Eldar [00:45:10]:
That's right.

Vemir [00:45:11]:
Take it out slowly.

Eldar [00:45:12]:
That's right.

Vemir [00:45:12]:
Have a corner for smoking. Yes. And he said, you'll over time, realize and things will fall. Yeah, but it's like this. Okay, I'll give you one of these things. He says he really wants to fall in love. Vamir wants the Mac. And this is what empowering means to me.

Vemir [00:45:28]:
Who is vmeer? Who am I? Who am I? Shout out, Dennis rocks.

Eldar [00:45:32]:
Yeah.

Vemir [00:45:35]:
I want freedom, Max. Freedom possible. Let's find out. You always say things, this is empowering. That's empowering. And I like that. And when we hit a really good point in the podcast, I feel like we say that's an empowering perspective.

Eldar [00:45:49]:
Yeah.

Vemir [00:45:49]:
But I think the deepest thing I can tell you is, like, I crave freedom. That's what I see in money, which is access to the things I want in terms of competence when it comes to women, or being able to surf when it comes to knowledge. Or you can expand your conversations or knowing significant people. I don't know, whatever. The whole world is full of vibrant and rich with opportunity and things to do and nature and just things to explore and pottery. Meditation might be the only pathway to mental freedom or the surefire way. But my question is, how do I max out my freedom? Let's tear away everything else about what I expect to life. How do I get the most freedom in life?

Eldar [00:46:40]:
Why do you want freedom?

Vemir [00:46:42]:
Because otherwise I feel constricted from what freedom is like. Freedom is a verb. Freedom is a noun. If you're free, then you wake up, you decide to do something, you do it. You want to drive this kind of car, you want to chop vegetables and make dinner at 03:00 you can. Right? Obviously we have to die in this physical form. I'm just saying. Is this even the right question? But he says I want to fall in love.

Mike [00:47:14]:
No, but I think the way you're describing freedom is not the way that I would describe it.

Vemir [00:47:18]:
I want to have freedom.

Mike [00:47:20]:
Control of paradoxical word.

Vemir [00:47:21]:
Okay.

Mike [00:47:22]:
Because when you have a purpose in life, when you're constantly doing what you love, I have the freedom to come here to work in the morning or not. I can go right now and never go back to the office. I could always work for the rest of my life remotely. But I come here because I love coming here, and that's my freedom to choose, right? So I'm not forced to be here. I love coming here. I enjoy. That is a freedom. It's a choice that I made that I'm free to make.

Eldar [00:47:51]:
Right?

Mike [00:47:51]:
Because I lined up, let's say you line up with a purpose, which is coming here to do what we.

Eldar [00:47:57]:
Yeah, but to a naked eye, they would think that you were tied up to him, maybe, right? Yeah.

Vemir [00:48:02]:
Nobody. I get his point. But I know what you're saying.

Mike [00:48:04]:
But that's what I'm saying is that I don't think you'll ever have freedom until you discover your purpose. Because then once you have your purpose, you'll be busy all the time, but you'll be completely free all the time, immersed, because you'll only be doing what you love. And how could you say you're not free?

Vemir [00:48:20]:
You won't feel like it's an obligation.

Eldar [00:48:21]:
Because ultimately you think about, I want to do what I want to do. Right, you said that. So what that means to me is like, hey, I want to do things that make me feel good. Duh. What do you think we after?

Vemir [00:48:32]:
Okay, very simple.

Eldar [00:48:34]:
I'm sorry, what do you think he's after? We're all after the same stuff when he's video gaming. Right? What is he after? He wants to be free in that space of time. He wants to be free of his fucking dishes or doing his homework or going to work. We want to be free.

Mike [00:48:51]:
The perception maybe that you have of reaching this freedom is you think it's through having x amount of money, dollars or just to say, like, yeah, I can go and get a private jet and fly tomorrow. Just because I woke up in the morning to Rio, just because I want to. That's not freedom. That's like pante. That's just like showing off. And that's not real freedom.

Eldar [00:49:14]:
I go to the gym because I want to, not because I have to, right. When I don't go to the gym, it's because I don't want to.

Vemir [00:49:21]:
When you don't go to the gym, it's because you don't want to.

Eldar [00:49:23]:
I don't want to.

Vemir [00:49:24]:
But if you don't feel like it for two months straight, then you don't.

Eldar [00:49:28]:
Feel like it for two months straight.

Vemir [00:49:29]:
You lose your progress.

Eldar [00:49:31]:
That's okay.

Mike [00:49:33]:
But the thing is, you're not seeing that. You may be not wanting to go to the gym, then there's something else that's in you that is not like you're living within you that you're not happy with. That's opportunity for you discover that.

Eldar [00:49:50]:
If.

Vemir [00:49:51]:
You stop being consistent in something, you should.

Mike [00:49:53]:
Well, doesn't necessarily mean. But in this example, I'm giving you.

Eldar [00:49:55]:
A thing where it could be that what's his name? Can you stop being consistent when going to your mom's place and eating muffins?

Vemir [00:50:02]:
No. What's the difference though?

Eldar [00:50:05]:
You know what I'm saying?

Vemir [00:50:06]:
There's not a lot of discomfort in going to visit mom. There's a lot of discomfort in going to the gym and failing. Right.

Eldar [00:50:12]:
Because you haven't discovered.

Mike [00:50:13]:
Because there's something.

Eldar [00:50:14]:
Yes. In the gym without discomfort when you do.

Vemir [00:50:18]:
But it's hard to progress.

Eldar [00:50:19]:
Well, that's why I'm trying.

Mike [00:50:20]:
No, because you're going to the gym. Because you are attached, potentially. My first thing came to mind. You're attached to a vanity image. A guy who fucks supermodels has to look like a certain type of way. So you have to go to the gym to force yourself, discipline yourself so you can get those chicks again. This is something you created in your head, external that you're living out.

Eldar [00:50:39]:
So you are under that assumption. This is what it's going to be. So what happens is, right, you jacked up, you finally, oh, summertime, that's it. Three months in a row, right. You got all jacked or whatever.

Vemir [00:50:50]:
Nothing happened.

Eldar [00:50:51]:
Nothing happened.

Vemir [00:50:52]:
Even if you fucked a girl or two, nothing happened.

Eldar [00:50:55]:
Nothing happened.

Vemir [00:50:56]:
You just.

Eldar [00:50:56]:
You're done, you put up your pants, you keep going and what happens? You still got to sleep with yourself.

Vemir [00:51:01]:
Yes.

Eldar [00:51:02]:
What happens? You go back to the gym?

Vemir [00:51:04]:
No, most of this is not sleeping well. I feel like, yeah, this is a common thing that people do, but that's not why I'm asking the question. Or is it? I don't know. Am I missing. I feel like sometimes I do things because I have this theory about what I think is the right thing to do. In life. Right. And I don't enjoy that.

Eldar [00:51:27]:
That's terrible.

Vemir [00:51:28]:
No, I don't smoke or something. Or like, I avoid so many things that I think is the wrong thing.

Eldar [00:51:36]:
You see you under an impression that they're wrong things to do.

Vemir [00:51:39]:
But I'll give you a if you.

Eldar [00:51:41]:
Actually enjoy a cigarette and it calms you down, you should smoke a cigarette.

Vemir [00:51:45]:
Why?

Eldar [00:51:46]:
Because it actually is what you need in that moment.

Vemir [00:51:48]:
Long term.

Eldar [00:51:49]:
You're not talking about long term.

Vemir [00:51:51]:
Long term. You're talking about humility.

Eldar [00:51:52]:
You and me both know that you only got this one moment right now.

Vemir [00:51:57]:
That's a temptation right there.

Mike [00:51:59]:
Not only that, the stress will kill you faster than a sick.

Eldar [00:52:03]:
Exactly. The long term stress. Right.

DJ [00:52:05]:
It's still going to be open, right?

Eldar [00:52:06]:
Yeah. If not, just put a fucking something onto it. The door.

Vemir [00:52:10]:
Put your keys in there. But I don't like this tension of the. I feel like the only way for vimir to advance to his highest level is to eliminate everything. You know what mean.

Eldar [00:52:24]:
Yeah.

Vemir [00:52:25]:
And I think that's wrong.

Mike [00:52:26]:
Yeah. Who put you on that assumption? Who are you to make that?

Vemir [00:52:29]:
Wait, are you saying that this is clearly.

Eldar [00:52:32]:
Yeah, of course. That's very painful.

Vemir [00:52:35]:
It sounds like it is painful, but then I have no desire. No, I have no excuses.

Mike [00:52:45]:
He's staying busy, so he's staying busy so nobody can call you out. You're not doing shit.

Vemir [00:52:53]:
Oh, that's interesting. That's an interesting one, right? No downtime so that no one can judge you or you don't judge yourself.

Mike [00:53:00]:
Like, y'all, I'm busy. I'm trying to figure shit out. Yeah, but if you're shooting in the dark, what's the point, right?

Eldar [00:53:05]:
You can trick yourself for only so long, guys. Only for so long. Because then you have to go and live life. And then when life presents itself in such a way where you're not happy with it, gig is up.

Mike [00:53:15]:
Yeah, you're good.

Eldar [00:53:20]:
You know what I'm saying? Life is life.

Mike [00:53:23]:
Yeah.

Eldar [00:53:25]:
And how you reflect on it and how it reflects back on you. You cannot trick that. If you're not happy, you're not happy. You could trick others. You can say, yeah, I'm really good. I'm doing really well, bro. Yeah, career, money, all that shit, bitches. You can't tell that to yourself because your negative self talk is the most accurate talk.

Vemir [00:53:43]:
Yeah, most accurate talk.

Eldar [00:53:45]:
Most accurate talk.

Vemir [00:53:47]:
That sounds like demons talking sometimes though, right?

Eldar [00:53:51]:
For the moment, yes. It could be because you've been so bad to yourself, so they ought to be bad to you back. Okay, cool. You want torture us?

Vemir [00:54:01]:
We'll torture you back. There you go.

Eldar [00:54:02]:
There are more thoughts, right? Lack of sleep, lack of this, lack of that. All these things coming in your head. Guilt trips and shit. Guiltying yourself.

Vemir [00:54:14]:
Kidding me?

Eldar [00:54:16]:
That's a hard life.

Vemir [00:54:19]:
So, I mean, it would be nice if you never felt guilty about anything you did.

Eldar [00:54:24]:
Yeah, that's a very good point. Start there. That's your self love journey right there. Try things that you enjoy and don't have guilt for them. Don't judge yourself in it. Say, hey, we're going to go enjoy this. And that's okay. And see how you fucking feel.

Eldar [00:54:40]:
See how you fucking feel.

Vemir [00:54:41]:
I've tried that before. It feels good.

Eldar [00:54:43]:
That feels good.

Vemir [00:54:44]:
You take away the cycle of guilt.

Eldar [00:54:47]:
Yeah.

Vemir [00:54:47]:
Kind of reveals to you that.

Eldar [00:54:50]:
Not so much.

Vemir [00:54:51]:
It's not that worry, but it's like, okay, let's say you've removed all guilt.

Eldar [00:55:01]:
If you get the most amount of pleasure, if you calm yourself finally down by giving yourself the things that you actually want, you'll finally get to a place where you're going to have to give back. And that's where work starts.

Vemir [00:55:14]:
Okay.

DJ [00:55:15]:
That's where work starts.

Eldar [00:55:17]:
That's where work starts.

Vemir [00:55:18]:
Right. When you feel so good, it's overflowing.

Eldar [00:55:22]:
It's overflowing.

Vemir [00:55:23]:
Other people are.

Eldar [00:55:24]:
Now you have to give back. And that's when your mind goes, okay, what should I do? I like this. Can I incorporate doing this with this? Yeah, I kind of like this. Next thing you know, you find yourself in a path where you actually should be doing and liking it because it.

Vemir [00:55:36]:
Comes from true abundance.

Eldar [00:55:38]:
That's right.

Vemir [00:55:39]:
Yeah.

Eldar [00:55:40]:
That's when you can't miss. Then you won't miss.

Vemir [00:55:43]:
Yeah.

Eldar [00:55:43]:
Otherwise.

Vemir [00:55:44]:
And that's what you're saying. Passion is.

Eldar [00:55:46]:
Yeah.

Vemir [00:55:49]:
So then I can ask you, as you can tell, there's been all this stress, suffering. When you're recalibrating into your passions, what do you do? You just let go of forgiveness.

Eldar [00:56:07]:
Yeah. Forgiveness.

Vemir [00:56:10]:
What does that mean? That's just a word.

Eldar [00:56:12]:
Yeah. So what happened, happened. You have to understand that it was an important part of your life, part of your process.

Vemir [00:56:18]:
Right.

Eldar [00:56:18]:
And that's behind. That's the truth of the matter is that's behind. So if you need to forgive those people that wronged you, the school, the society, the student loan.

Vemir [00:56:28]:
Ignorance.

Eldar [00:56:28]:
Yeah. Your own ignorance. Right. That's. Okay. You were presented at that moment with the knowledge base that you had and you made conclusive decisions that led you to this path. But that's all right. That's what you were working with.

Eldar [00:56:41]:
That vamir that's present today is not present back then. If he was, he wouldn't have made those same mistakes. But that's completely different. Forgive that last vemir. Embrace this one. That's it. That's how I would see it. Forgive yourself.

Eldar [00:56:55]:
That's what ultimately it is.

Vemir [00:56:57]:
Seems very simple, right? But again, you can use that to forgive yourself in advance.

Eldar [00:57:03]:
No, I'm telling you. Maybe it sounds spiritual or whatever, but we can probably break it down. Your negative self talk in a very logical sense. That will make sense of like, okay, I'm an idiot. We can do that too.

Vemir [00:57:14]:
I'm an idiot for believing negative self.

Eldar [00:57:16]:
Yes, that you believing that stuff from before. Okay, we can deduce it as well.

Vemir [00:57:27]:
Okay.

Eldar [00:57:29]:
I know. So, yeah, I think your path is for that. I think is to enjoy it. Bro, you have a lot of things to enjoy. You already said it. You have good friends. You have a good parents, right? You know yourself more. So go fucking have.

Eldar [00:57:49]:
Uh.

Vemir [00:57:50]:
I got back from the Middle east, like, July after my dad's birthday was July 4. The best day in four months was when I went to Ramapo for that hike. I went for, like, an eight hour hike with my boys.

Eldar [00:58:05]:
Lost yourself in it.

Vemir [00:58:06]:
My God.

Eldar [00:58:07]:
Yeah.

Vemir [00:58:07]:
Nothing else existed. I was fulfilled. All my efforts. Whatever. And it's weird because things come in again as reminders. You already knew that shit. You do. You already knew that.

Eldar [00:58:21]:
You do. You do enough thinking to have this embodied knowledge already inside of you. It's innate. So then when you come across it, right, it's almost like duh, deja vu.

Vemir [00:58:32]:
A lot of it is duh feeling.

Eldar [00:58:34]:
Yeah. It has to be that way. Because until your ego surrenders, it has to be a duh.

Vemir [00:58:42]:
So you're saying, like, you remember you said you had that golden nugget? He did that. I think you were like, he's not even seeing it in himself. Like you're saying the way I can pick apart things and why I'm so worried all this is coming from, like, just shift your path into abundance. Okay? That's what you're saying. To do good work, realize your power, realize what you can do and help others.

Eldar [00:59:05]:
Yeah. But first realize that you are at a deficit and fulfill yourself.

Vemir [00:59:09]:
A deficit of you're not happy. I mean, I can't say, like, I'm not happy or I'm happy. You know, when people ask me that question, I don't know what the fuck how to answer that question. Are you happy right now or like when? An hour ago? Over the past week? Six out of seven days? Yeah, it's a gotcha question, right? What do you think?

Eldar [00:59:31]:
Well, no, we can talk about certain things about your life, and you can give me actual real life examples as to where I could tell you, pinpoint to exactly where you're happy or you're not happy with the type of decision making that you're making.

Vemir [00:59:42]:
Okay.

Eldar [00:59:42]:
Within those, like you said, hey, I'm sitting at home and I'm thinking about the gym, and I'm beating myself up over it. I'll tell you, bro, that moment was unhappy.

Vemir [00:59:50]:
Of course.

Eldar [00:59:50]:
You know what I mean? And there might be an abundance of those types of things in your life, in your negative self talk where we can coin that. When you think this way, when the pattern of this continues for long periods of time, you fall into depression. You know what I'm saying? That is unhappiness.

Vemir [01:00:05]:
And it compounds.

Eldar [01:00:06]:
It compounds more and more and more and the days go by, right? You said, hey, I have this understanding of time now. I'm racing against myself in time, right? Like, this thing is racing against us. Your perception of time and understanding of that. This is where you're hurting yourself. So we would think about it, understand where and why, and then we understand that every time this comes to you, you have to think a different way about time because you're being negative to yourself. You're being hard on yourself when you shouldn't. And you quickly find out, like, yo. Oh, shit.

Vemir [01:00:45]:
For beating myself up so much. You never beat yourself up then.

Eldar [01:00:49]:
What do you mean? What the fuck? This guy said that, yeah, he was.

Vemir [01:00:52]:
Very hard on way less, right?

Eldar [01:00:54]:
Yeah.

Mike [01:00:55]:
Now way less, but I still do.

Eldar [01:00:56]:
Yeah. Most recently, we had an episode, I don't know, a couple of weeks ago, maybe a month ago, too. Remember when you were taking himself so seriously, where he was upholding a specific image about himself? And then when Tolly made a joke about something so irrelevant that wasn't even true about, like, he blew up on him. He was like, what the you. Why are you telling me that I'm doing this? I'm working on myself here and doing all this. Like, he had an episode. Like, yo, Mike, where'd that come from? And then we unpacked it and he realized that he's being a little bit too serious about the whole journey, that he's taking himself. Too serious.

Eldar [01:01:28]:
He wants to make sure. He wants to be perfect. Perfection. I'm like, yo, chill out now. I'm going to bet 1000 here. You know what I mean?

Vemir [01:01:34]:
Right?

Eldar [01:01:34]:
Do your best. So slowly, these types of things, through encounters, you see them for their face, for their true face. And you could clearly see that the person in that moment, if ruled by this thing, is not happy.

Vemir [01:01:46]:
Sorry, I'm a bit tired today.

Eldar [01:01:47]:
But see, it sounds like he just wants to sleep.

Vemir [01:01:51]:
Right?

Eldar [01:01:52]:
You have to go sleep. Well. Did you have plans after this?

Vemir [01:01:54]:
I was going to do work at home, you see?

Eldar [01:01:56]:
Why?

Vemir [01:01:57]:
Endless.

Eldar [01:01:58]:
You see?

Vemir [01:01:58]:
It's endless.

Eldar [01:01:59]:
You see you in the fucking pit. What work? Vermeer, you're tired, my man. You see, you're not listening to yourself. You just said I'm tired. Well, the only thing is, you got to go kick your feedback, put on the fucking Netflix show and fucking fall asleep to it. Yes or no.

Vemir [01:02:14]:
To me, it's always like, I got to overcome that weakness.

Mike [01:02:17]:
He's doing that thing.

Eldar [01:02:18]:
Yeah, self sabotage.

Vemir [01:02:20]:
I want to nap. I want to sleep.

Eldar [01:02:22]:
He's the guy who, after every day, he has to go over there and fucking whip himself.

Mike [01:02:28]:
Damn.

Eldar [01:02:31]:
Yeah. You're a piece of shit to yourself, bro. Yeah, think about that.

Vemir [01:02:34]:
That's what you meant.

Eldar [01:02:37]:
Of course.

Vemir [01:02:38]:
Stop being an asshole to the Vermeer. Yeah, it's funny, my mom said that. She said, stop being mean to my son.

Eldar [01:02:44]:
She's talking about. Wow.

Vemir [01:02:46]:
She said to me, stop being mean to my son.

Eldar [01:02:48]:
That's sick.

Vemir [01:02:49]:
That'sick.

Eldar [01:02:50]:
That'sick the way she phrased that.

Vemir [01:02:51]:
Yeah, dude, you see that'sick baller? That was when I was at my worst moment in life. I was going through something indescribable. She said, stop being mean to my son.

Eldar [01:03:06]:
Yeah, that's sick. She looked at you, right? And she said it.

Vemir [01:03:09]:
Yeah, that's sick.

Mike [01:03:10]:
This is great.

Eldar [01:03:11]:
That's great. That's love right there, bro.

Vemir [01:03:13]:
Yeah.

Eldar [01:03:14]:
You know what I'm saying?

Vemir [01:03:16]:
She and my dad never wavered on their faith in me. And I got so emotional thinking about that. Thinking, like, why do they have more faith in me than I have in myself? That's something I have been thinking about for years. Why do I need people's reinforcement of their belief in me?

Eldar [01:03:36]:
You wear it back to yourself.

Vemir [01:03:38]:
Sounds like why.

Eldar [01:03:39]:
That's why you need that. You need them because they're the only light.

Vemir [01:03:43]:
Why are they seeing?

Eldar [01:03:46]:
In the time when you're in the darkness, why are your light?

Vemir [01:03:49]:
Why are they.

Eldar [01:03:50]:
It's super necessary for you right now. It's a very important part of your life.

Vemir [01:03:54]:
It's me. I'm saying, like, no, you're right. I'm just saying, why can't it be me who recognizes?

Eldar [01:04:00]:
Because you're not there yet.

Vemir [01:04:02]:
Not yet. But I see how much they love me. If only I could see myself all the time. I see myself in glimpses and really positive. That's why I told you it's not 100%.

Eldar [01:04:13]:
When we sat down here and I gave you my genuine testimony about how I see you and how I view you, right? You're like, oh, shit. You almost were surprised. I'm like, this is my honest opinion here of you.

Vemir [01:04:25]:
I said, thanks for the company. You're like, it's not a compliment, but if you want to take it that way.

Eldar [01:04:28]:
That's what I'm saying. You know what I mean? So what does that tell me? You have a huge disparity.

Vemir [01:04:32]:
Yeah, that's interesting. I mean, that's a lot of room for growth there.

Eldar [01:04:38]:
Yeah.

Vemir [01:04:38]:
Do you have, like, actionable action items?

Eldar [01:04:41]:
I told you, go to sleep.

Mike [01:04:43]:
Go treat yourself.

Vemir [01:04:44]:
Smoke a cigarette. Go to sleep.

Mike [01:04:45]:
Right?

Eldar [01:04:47]:
Yeah. Kick your feedback. You know what I'm saying?

Vemir [01:04:51]:
But can't you just do that for weeks?

Eldar [01:04:55]:
You might need it for months.

Mike [01:04:56]:
Yeah, you may need it.

Vemir [01:04:57]:
No way.

Eldar [01:04:58]:
Yeah. Depends how depleted you are.

Mike [01:05:00]:
I'm like six months in right now, just straight chilling on the couch all day.

Eldar [01:05:04]:
Yeah.

Mike [01:05:04]:
I come here, I do my little bit of work, and then I'm sitting on the couch here enjoying, relaxing.

Eldar [01:05:08]:
Yeah.

Mike [01:05:08]:
He's thinking about stuff.

Eldar [01:05:10]:
Watching videos. Watching videos, talking, walking the dog.

Vemir [01:05:14]:
This is like rejuvenation for you.

Mike [01:05:16]:
Rejuvenation. But it's also slowing down. And then these ideas that come to me to make me question things that I believe in, question my life.

Vemir [01:05:26]:
And then you lean in and you do.

Mike [01:05:27]:
And then I lean in and I work on when there's something to work on.

Eldar [01:05:30]:
Yeah. And then he goes out into the world and practices.

Vemir [01:05:33]:
How do I accept the seasons of life like that?

Eldar [01:05:36]:
I mean, you don't respect it. It sounds like.

Vemir [01:05:39]:
I feel like I am trying to make up for lost time.

Eldar [01:05:43]:
What's the lost time? You're 27 years old, mom.

Vemir [01:05:46]:
Everybody says that. But it has no feeling to me.

Mike [01:05:48]:
You see, it's, again, coming from an ego place, thinking probably, who the fuck.

Eldar [01:05:53]:
You think you are?

Mike [01:05:54]:
Look at Archie. He's going in.

Eldar [01:05:55]:
You know what?

Vemir [01:05:56]:
It's the ego thing. When you're saying that my answer would have been an ego thing.

Eldar [01:06:01]:
Well, that's what I'm saying.

Vemir [01:06:01]:
Because it's like this, trying to prove you're everything.

Eldar [01:06:03]:
Yeah. I'm saying it for a reason. To touch you somewhere.

Vemir [01:06:07]:
It's like it. I don't know, like, it's not. It's not fully satisfying for me. But. Yeah, I think accepting that. I mean, it sounds so stupid, right? But accepting that you're human is important. You need rest. You need seasons, this kind of stuff.

Eldar [01:06:33]:
Yeah.

Mike [01:06:33]:
But also defining what it is to be human. And why are we here?

Eldar [01:06:39]:
Not to slave away, my man.

Vemir [01:06:41]:
Not to slave away. And not to be slothful.

Eldar [01:06:44]:
No. If you lay too much, you'll have back pain. You know what I'm saying? If you play too much, you'll have too much soreness. An injury we are here to enjoy.

Vemir [01:06:54]:
How do you get out of the trap?

Eldar [01:06:57]:
I mean, who sold you this fucking dream, my man? Elders, I'm trying to unsell it to you. That's the problem. That's why a lot of people have problems with this. Like, wait a minute, why?

Vemir [01:07:06]:
Because they're so attached to their untruths. I understand.

Mike [01:07:10]:
Because it's everywhere.

Eldar [01:07:11]:
I'm here promoting you for you even more than you promote to yourself.

Vemir [01:07:14]:
Isn't that crazy?

Eldar [01:07:15]:
Yeah. Your mom is doing the same thing.

Vemir [01:07:17]:
Right?

Eldar [01:07:17]:
You know what I'm saying?

Vemir [01:07:18]:
Absolutely. My dad.

Eldar [01:07:19]:
Yeah, exactly. The people that really care for you, right? They'll love you, will have that. I don't really care. I love you. I'm trying to figure out what the truth of the matter is. That's why I'm throwing it at you. You know what I mean? I wish you well, but I don't have an attachment towards Vimila like your mom does to succeed. That's why I'm just going to think about what's objectively true here.

Eldar [01:07:38]:
And objectively, it sounds like you're sleep deprived. You're trying to make decisions and think on sleep deprivation. You need to come tomorrow and watch UFC with us and fucking have fun and bet a little bit of money on fucking just for shits and giggles.

Vemir [01:07:50]:
That's who's fighting tomorrow.

Eldar [01:07:52]:
Some crazy fights tomorrow, man. And it's an early card. It starts at ten, the mid card is at twelve, and the main card starts at. You'll probably be by then.

Vemir [01:08:01]:
Midday.

Eldar [01:08:01]:
Midday. Because it's in Abu Dhabi.

Vemir [01:08:04]:
Holy cow.

Eldar [01:08:05]:
Yeah. And Dennis is going to be there, so you can finally say what's up.

Vemir [01:08:08]:
Where are you going?

Eldar [01:08:09]:
Toli's house.

Vemir [01:08:10]:
Where is it?

Eldar [01:08:11]:
Hawthorne. Yeah, totally. Ten minutes from here.

Vemir [01:08:15]:
Yeah. All right.

Eldar [01:08:16]:
Tolly is that guy that sits over there. He's sitting here. Last time.

Mike [01:08:22]:
Last time.

Vemir [01:08:22]:
Oh, yeah, totally.

Eldar [01:08:23]:
Totally.

Vemir [01:08:24]:
Is cool. Yeah, man. Thank you for the invite.

Eldar [01:08:28]:
For sure.

Vemir [01:08:29]:
Definitely. Maybe. I would love to.

Eldar [01:08:31]:
If you want to come through, text me. I'll give you the address. Come through. I'll be there. Since I'm going to try to be there. Ten. I don't want to miss anything. I just got to drive Catherine to the airport, and I'm free.

Eldar [01:08:41]:
As the birds and the bees appreciate you, and I'm going to do what I like. That's my freedom.

Vemir [01:08:45]:
Them.

Eldar [01:08:45]:
You know what I'm saying? I'm going to enjoy my friends, the company of theirs. I'm going to enjoy the fights. I'm going to enjoy the opinions and yelling and losing money or winning money, and it's going to be awesome.

Vemir [01:08:55]:
You know what's funny is every Saturday I have soccer at 07:00 a.m. Doesn't take discipline. Even if I go out to party at 04:00 a.m.. I go to bed, I wake up, 630. I got my outfit on. I play soccer. I love.

Eldar [01:09:10]:
It's big.

Mike [01:09:14]:
That's the thing that you should understand.

Vemir [01:09:16]:
Absolutely. That's self love. But it's like, why do people criticize me when I enjoy myself? Then they're like, oh, Vermeer indulges himself. Then they got this, like, you have Stockholm syndrome. They feel like you have to suffer.

Eldar [01:09:32]:
They're under the wrong impression. I mean, they're not here. They're not here to be challenged. And you're probably not challenging them enough to say, like, who the fuck you think you are? Like, what the fuck? If you're privileged to be 27 years old, to enjoy soccer, you know what I mean? On Saturday or whatever, that's great. That's awesome. To go enjoy pancakes at your mom's. That's great. What's wrong with that? Isn't that what life is about?

Vemir [01:09:56]:
It is what life is about.

Eldar [01:09:59]:
You know what I'm saying? In 2030 years, your mom won't be here. Go enjoy the fucking pancakes. My mom won't be here. Right? 2030 years, enjoy the fucking pancakes. What's the problem?

Vemir [01:10:08]:
I was thinking about that today. Like, I went for a walk today.

Eldar [01:10:11]:
Am I getting younger?

Vemir [01:10:12]:
And I thought to myself, like, this is it. You'll have 60 more years or you'll have 40 more years if you're in a career thing, right? There's no do over. It goes fast. And this realization, I went back to my mom's place. When she gave me a hug, I really felt it. And then I spent time with my brother. That moment is gone. That's a memory.

Vemir [01:10:37]:
I took my mom to a really upscale place for her birthday this year. And at the end, we were dressed up in suits and everything, and her dress. And she said to the waitress, like, hey, can you take a photo of us? So we take it, and she looks at it. She's like, oh, it's not good. I'm like, mom, come on, let's go. She's like, no, I want to take this photo correctly. So take the photo. And we got it right? She approved it.

Vemir [01:11:06]:
It's hard for mom to approve photo. And then she printed it out, and then she put in a frame, and she put it next to my grandparents. And this is only six months ago, but I looked back and I told mom, I said, oh, this is the way you're seeing it. This is a legacy moment. This is something you will be fond of for years. She's like, yes. That's why I want to get the picture right with me. She's way wiser than me in many of these respects.

Vemir [01:11:29]:
She realizes the tenderness of that and how maybe I'm young and I'm moving fast, and I'm thinking like. She's like, I know this is, like, an impressionable moment. This means the same amount to me as when I took my mom. She's saying this to me. She's saying, when she took her mom to that place, okay? And I was like, whoa, I didn't know.

Eldar [01:11:53]:
That's big.

Vemir [01:11:54]:
So there is a space that you recognize between me and my impact. Like, I'm almost a little bit hovering away from my own engagement in the world.

Mike [01:12:05]:
You're trying to fucking move the world, thinking about global shit where you should be thinking about your small world, and that's a huge impact.

Eldar [01:12:13]:
And you don't know the ripples of your effect into the world. Absolutely. You don't know.

Vemir [01:12:19]:
Dave Chappelle said, you can't make the whole world nice, but you can make, like, a corner really nice. Yeah, that's here, right? That's what you're doing?

Eldar [01:12:26]:
That's what I'm doing. I'm loving it.

Vemir [01:12:28]:
I'm trying to make my corner better.

Eldar [01:12:31]:
Yeah.

Vemir [01:12:32]:
And that ripple effect is you almost block it out because it's so scary how powerful it is.

Eldar [01:12:41]:
Yeah. To me, this is gravity. These are my roots. This is my freedom. I go somewhere else. I want to come home. I can't go for too long. I start feeling sick.

Eldar [01:12:54]:
I start feeling deprived. I want to come home.

Vemir [01:12:56]:
What is home? This is it, boys.

Eldar [01:13:00]:
Elderism. You know what I'm saying? My friends, my business, my dogs, mom and dad. My garden that I've created in my house, my home.

Vemir [01:13:16]:
This is all mine.

Eldar [01:13:17]:
This is all mine. You see these lights? Every time I do this podcast, I look at these lights. Me and Mike did them together. Maybe they're not perfect, but I love them. This is home.

Vemir [01:13:28]:
I get it.

Eldar [01:13:29]:
You know what I'm saying?

Vemir [01:13:30]:
And it's enough for you.

Eldar [01:13:31]:
You feel for. What do you mean? I have everything.

Vemir [01:13:33]:
Yeah.

Eldar [01:13:34]:
What do I don't have?

Vemir [01:13:37]:
You know what's funny is my perception of who I respected is different now. It used to be all these other things, but I feel like who I respect are people who enjoy their own lives. Isn't that funny? Yeah. I have someone who's very dear to my heart. He lives in Puerto Rico, and he was very prolific in the world, but he built essentially his own sanctuary, and it makes him a lot of money and he paints. He's a beautiful person. It looks like he's living an authentic life, studies Buddhism on his own. He reads.

Vemir [01:14:12]:
Nobody's fucking watching him to read, like, all the things we're talking about, right. And we get along like nothing else. So he's seeing something in me also. He's much older. Yeah.

Eldar [01:14:25]:
You have it, but you don't have it.

Vemir [01:14:28]:
No, I have it. You know what I'm saying? Not consistently.

Eldar [01:14:31]:
That's what I'm saying.

Vemir [01:14:32]:
And I don't know what that is, man. This is the main question.

Eldar [01:14:36]:
I think that if you. It's painful.

Vemir [01:14:38]:
The valleys and hills.

Eldar [01:14:39]:
Yeah. No, yeah. I think that as soon as you start getting small doses of self love, these little things that we talk about in your practical life, right? I think you start filling yourself up and you can be like, oh, shit.

Vemir [01:14:52]:
This is it in my practical life. Meaning, like everyday life, like those, okay, everyday life. That cup being filled every so often.

Eldar [01:15:05]:
Yeah. Like you said you were tired.

Vemir [01:15:06]:
Just go to bed, man.

Eldar [01:15:07]:
Go to bed. You want to watch Netflix?

Vemir [01:15:10]:
Watch that movie.

Eldar [01:15:11]:
Watch the Netflix. Watch that movie.

Vemir [01:15:12]:
Don't deprive.

Eldar [01:15:13]:
No, no. And then when you have the desire to go and do the work, go.

Vemir [01:15:18]:
Fucking do the work more than you.

Eldar [01:15:22]:
Know what I mean? And then you go like, oh, shit, this fucking work is easy. 6 hours, 8 hours. Where did time go? You immerse yourself.

Vemir [01:15:29]:
So why do people deprive themselves?

Eldar [01:15:32]:
Somebody sold them some bullshit, bro. That's why I'm here.

Vemir [01:15:36]:
Carrot on the top.

Eldar [01:15:37]:
Somebody sold them some bullshit. And nobody examined that. Nobody said, yo, what are you talking about? Million dollars. What are you talking about? This lavish vanity life that's going to make me happy. Nobody questioned that. They just said, okay, cool, I want to do it.

Vemir [01:15:50]:
And I know people who are.

Eldar [01:15:52]:
They raise their hands, and they're like, how do you do it? And they're like, discipline. And they're like, oh, shit, like that. Okay, cool. I understand. That makes sense. Yeah, discipline.

Vemir [01:16:02]:
Yeah.

Eldar [01:16:02]:
You see how lazy you are? Yeah, you lazy. See, you got to discipline yourself. Yeah. You write. You know what I mean? And then they're like, oh, shit. And then they got introduced to self guilt. Discipline ain't working. Self guilt comes in, and then your perpetual cycle of fucking yourself in the head constantly without really understanding what's really going on.

Eldar [01:16:20]:
This opponent is terrible. It's a prison that's alive and well, but for Mike, it's dead.

Vemir [01:16:28]:
Wow. Because I know people who are very wealthy and fulfilled also.

Mike [01:16:33]:
You know them just like you know yourself. You know yourself on the surface. We never know.

Vemir [01:16:41]:
This is a pinching thing. I don't think I know myself on the surface only, but I know what you're saying.

Mike [01:16:44]:
You know what I'm saying? At least you understand.

Vemir [01:16:46]:
I get what you're saying.

Eldar [01:16:48]:
We don't know people we don't know.

Mike [01:16:50]:
We barely know ourselves.

Vemir [01:16:52]:
That's my favorite lecture by Osho. I send it to you. A Buddha will always be misunderstood because he says even the ordinary communication, 100% is impossible. A wife and a husband. And he says, like, imagine coming from the valley of wisdom to someone who is never definitely miscute. So that reinforced me. Like you told me before, someone said you referred to all these spiritual texts because you don't know them yourself. And I'm like, that gave me a lot of confidence, that lecture.

Vemir [01:17:26]:
To think like it's okay to be misunderstood doesn't mean you're wrong. What did we say right before that? Oh, knowing yourself.

Mike [01:17:38]:
Yeah. We don't know those people.

Vemir [01:17:39]:
We don't know those people that are.

Mike [01:17:42]:
Wealthy that you said have their shit together. You don't know what kind of original they have, what they're fighting with, their kids.

Vemir [01:17:48]:
I think they're well intentioned people, maybe.

Eldar [01:17:50]:
What is that?

Mike [01:17:51]:
Yeah. Nice thing to hide behind.

Eldar [01:17:55]:
That's a nice thing.

Vemir [01:17:56]:
Yeah.

Eldar [01:17:56]:
I meant well, but this came out this way. What the fuck happened?

Vemir [01:17:59]:
Okay.

Eldar [01:18:00]:
Why?

Vemir [01:18:00]:
They're wrestling. You know what I'm saying? You're fighting for the higher. Sure, but you're saying, don't fight anymore.

Eldar [01:18:09]:
Why? It's too hard.

Vemir [01:18:12]:
That's why you say give up. Give up.

Eldar [01:18:14]:
I want to play video games.

Vemir [01:18:15]:
Drop the act. I love that shit.

Eldar [01:18:19]:
I want to play video games.

Vemir [01:18:20]:
Do you think anybody's naturally like David Goggins? Like a high roller?

Eldar [01:18:24]:
No chance.

Vemir [01:18:25]:
Nobody is relaxed and highly productive. That's wrong. That's not what asked. Saying you don't think anybody's.

Mike [01:18:34]:
Running? Not physically. He's running from something.

Eldar [01:18:39]:
He has to, he has to keep.

Vemir [01:18:40]:
Heard that a lot.

Mike [01:18:41]:
Yeah.

Eldar [01:18:45]:
He might have mental illness.

Vemir [01:18:46]:
Yeah, I think he's already said that about himself. He's got these demons.

Mike [01:18:52]:
Nothing can be healthy in a person which is not balanced.

Eldar [01:18:56]:
Yeah. Wow. Say that again. I'll put the shit on x.

Vemir [01:19:03]:
Nothing can be held within a person.

Mike [01:19:04]:
That is, nothing can be held within a person which is not bound.

Vemir [01:19:09]:
Okay, I'm going to ask you the question that I asked somebody last week. I'm an intense person. How does an intense person find.

Mike [01:19:16]:
Your intenseness is a direct correlation of your own insecurities. Insecurity lack some kind of patching, some hole.

Vemir [01:19:26]:
Why is intensity bad?

Mike [01:19:29]:
It's not bad. It's bad in the wrong hands.

Vemir [01:19:31]:
No, I'm saying I feel like I'm intense. Whatever I do, if I'm joyous, if I'm angry, intense. Maybe I'm autistic. I'm saying, like, how do you be a balanced person? My dad's always emphasizing in me balance. If you're an intense person, how do you become balanced?

Mike [01:19:53]:
What does intense person look like?

Vemir [01:19:56]:
You laugh really hard at that. Stand up. You go. When you want to work out. It's like now. 05:00 a.m. Until 07:00 a.m. Every day.

Vemir [01:20:06]:
The highest reaching. When you want to learn about a subject, it's 8 hours a day. Like 12 hours a day, 15 hours a day. You're just very intensely into whatever.

Mike [01:20:16]:
Yeah, but the thing is you would have to train your body. Where is the core of that intensity? Is it rooted in some kind of suffering?

Vemir [01:20:23]:
There's a lot of fuel in you.

Eldar [01:20:25]:
There's a lot of rage, my man.

Mike [01:20:27]:
Yeah. It's hard. You have to trace where it's coming from. If it's coming from a place of pain and suffering.

Eldar [01:20:34]:
You said anger.

Mike [01:20:35]:
Anger, yeah, anger.

Vemir [01:20:37]:
Yeah.

Mike [01:20:38]:
You would have to really trace it. If you can trace.

Vemir [01:20:40]:
I'm good or no, very good.

Eldar [01:20:42]:
Thank you.

Vemir [01:20:44]:
Yeah, very good.

Mike [01:20:47]:
I'm not saying that you like, yo, I only do this one day a week, 1 hour. That doesn't mean balance. You could play basketball 3 hours a day, once a week. That also could be balance.

Eldar [01:20:58]:
Right?

Mike [01:20:58]:
It just depends on the level of like, hey, is this enough? Am I overdoing it? Am I tired? But I'm still playing? Am I tired? Am I still studying? You're overdoing it. You're not being self love to your body, to resting, to process, to your mind. Then you start tired. You start fucking making bad mistakes on the court. Now you're beating yourself up or you fucking talking like blaz. I fucking suck. Like, I'm missing all these fucking shots. I'm doing these bad passes.

Mike [01:21:25]:
Now you're physically beat up. You're mentally talking shit to yourself, and that's not balanced. But you could have played for half that time, had a lot of fun, walked off the court, and then come.

Eldar [01:21:35]:
Back next week, would even start unpacking his soccer experiences.

Mike [01:21:38]:
Oh, yeah. No, not yet.

Eldar [01:21:39]:
We're going to have to go over there and see how he needs to go to sleep.

Vemir [01:21:44]:
I have good news. Last week, I scored a bicycle kick for the first time. And that pickup. I have been Friday nights just fantasizing. One day I'll score the bicycle kick. That was the ego thing. I fulfilled. Nice.

Vemir [01:21:55]:
And like, you know, Ronaldo Chop.

Mike [01:21:57]:
Yeah.

Vemir [01:21:58]:
Scored a goal like that. That was great. But that was one fleeting moment of beauty. Right? I just love soccer, man. Physically, it's fun.

Eldar [01:22:07]:
Yeah.

Vemir [01:22:11]:
You can't escape yourself either. Of course, the variables are there, too, but I just look forward to it.

Eldar [01:22:17]:
That's great.

Vemir [01:22:18]:
Awesome. That's great. I'm in the gray, for sure. Sometimes even when I come here, I feel, like, fully ready zoned in. I'm locked in. I had a good day or a good week. I feel good. Then sometimes I want to just listen or I have, like, question eldarism or have the wisdom in here.

Vemir [01:22:43]:
Yeah, it depends, though.

Eldar [01:22:47]:
Yeah.

Vemir [01:22:51]:
But that's what someone told me about discipline. It depends. It shouldn't depend on your moods, but you guys are really valuing how you feel about things. 100%. This is extremely valuable to you.

Eldar [01:23:05]:
Absolutely, 100%. Yeah. There's no bending this.

Vemir [01:23:08]:
No.

Eldar [01:23:10]:
If I can stay away from the discipline thing, I succeeded.

Vemir [01:23:15]:
But this is what I would think someone would do if they were doing, like, psychological warfare. Everybody else should relax, and then they would grind. You know what I mean?

Eldar [01:23:25]:
What do you mean?

Vemir [01:23:27]:
I think you genuinely enjoy your life, but other people are so competitive that if you want to be that competitive, you tell everybody else to relax, because then in the background, you're working so hard. Some people are addicted to work.

Eldar [01:23:41]:
Okay, sure.

Vemir [01:23:43]:
Are they fucked up?

Eldar [01:23:45]:
No. I mean, if you not in a relationship, then you're fine. If you're doing it on your own, like if you are addicted to work, right? And if you don't have a family or kids, right, that you have to go to and spend and give attention to or dogs and stuff like that, right? If you alone by yourself, where the fuck you want, not hurting nobody, right? Except yourself, that's fine. That's your right. You're hurting yourself. I don't care if you're going to go home right now and study for the next 4 hours. If you said or if you go.

Vemir [01:24:11]:
To sleep, that's your right.

Eldar [01:24:13]:
Yeah.

Vemir [01:24:14]:
Okay.

Eldar [01:24:14]:
Go do it. Who cares? You're not hurting. You don't have a kid to look after or whatever, maybe you have some kind of commitments. I don't know if you have a girlfriend who's waiting for you or whatever, but if not, then that's your right to hurt yourself. Now, if the debate is like whether or not you're smart or not, probably going to lean towards no, you're not very bright, but that's still your choice, right? Who am I to tell you otherwise?

Vemir [01:24:43]:
But what about the ripple effect?

Eldar [01:24:45]:
Of what?

Vemir [01:24:45]:
Like if you hurt yourself, you are.

Eldar [01:24:47]:
Hurting other people like your mom.

Vemir [01:24:51]:
I think nobody exists in a vacuum like that.

Eldar [01:24:54]:
Sure.

Vemir [01:24:54]:
That's why they want to legalize.

Eldar [01:24:56]:
Like you said, if you all. They really like work and stuff like that, then because you seem to be.

Vemir [01:25:01]:
Immersed in your work when you want to and it works.

Eldar [01:25:04]:
Yeah. And if those people don't understand it, I can argue that this is what you actually should be striving for towards as well. The times when I work, I'm immersed, I'd like to get immersed. The times that I don't want to work, I don't want to work. You know what I'm saying?

Vemir [01:25:20]:
Right.

Eldar [01:25:20]:
And those are fleeting moments and I still am trying to figure them out, balance.

Vemir [01:25:24]:
Why you don't.

Eldar [01:25:25]:
Of course, yeah.

Vemir [01:25:27]:
And you said it's shortening like you said. Yeah, that's from ten years ago or whatever.

Eldar [01:25:32]:
Yeah, for sure.

Vemir [01:25:34]:
Okay. All right. Let me digest this.

Eldar [01:25:37]:
Okay, sounds good. What's the final thoughts? We started with student and teacher.

Mike [01:25:42]:
Student debt.

Eldar [01:25:44]:
Student debt. Now we realize what it is.

Mike [01:25:46]:
Yeah.

Vemir [01:25:47]:
If you're going to be a good.

Eldar [01:25:48]:
Student, don't go into debt. Yeah.

Mike [01:25:51]:
So education should be free, should be.

Vemir [01:25:54]:
A basic human right. To me, I feel like, yeah, probably he's right.

Eldar [01:25:59]:
But then again, if it was actually understood for what it was, it probably would be.

Mike [01:26:06]:
Yeah.

Eldar [01:26:06]:
You know what I mean?

Mike [01:26:07]:
Because it's not. It has to be.

Eldar [01:26:08]:
And I think, how about this another thing. Education is free when it's education. You know what I'm saying?

Vemir [01:26:17]:
Yeah, right. Yeah. It's like those drop shipping guys who make their courses $3,000.

Eldar [01:26:24]:
Yeah.

Vemir [01:26:25]:
That's some guru shit behind that wall, right? You think so?

Eldar [01:26:31]:
No.

Vemir [01:26:37]:
I really like that. I'm going to listen back to the beginning of this, the student teacher thing. Yeah, it's great. Do you ever think about when you were young, the people that you asked for guru level advice, how are they looking at you?

Eldar [01:26:56]:
I remember a couple of things. I remember pestering Eckstein about something. I was following him, like his shadow or his tail about stuff, and he was giving me a lot, obviously answering a lot of questions. But there was times where he was so zoned in. In his process that. What's his name? When I would ask him, because I don't understand, to break it down to me, a couple of times he kind of disregarded me or ignored me.

Vemir [01:27:30]:
Really?

Eldar [01:27:30]:
Yeah, and that stuck with me. I was this pestering little thing, but in that moment, he himself was trying to get what he needed, and I was being selfish in that moment.

Vemir [01:27:43]:
Interesting.

Eldar [01:27:45]:
So that stuck with me. But, I mean, he did right by.

Vemir [01:27:47]:
Me, you know what I mean?

Eldar [01:27:50]:
He's the one who told me about. I'm like, hey, Paul, why aren't you teaching in Princeton, Yale? He's like, eldar, those kids will be all right, man. I'm like, yeah, but these people sleeping, it's like, you don't know how far the ripple effect of influencing one life is. And now I'm living it and I'm like, fucking shit. That's crazy. You know what saying?

Vemir [01:28:12]:
Like, he was right, but like this super long term, very subtle wisdom.

Mike [01:28:17]:
Oh, yeah.

Eldar [01:28:17]:
You know what I'm saying?

Vemir [01:28:18]:
And it worked on you.

Eldar [01:28:20]:
That's what I'm saying. I'm the fucking thing.

Mike [01:28:22]:
That's crazy.

Eldar [01:28:23]:
You understand? The philosophy professor, Byrne Community college, he was there for a long period. Yeah.

Vemir [01:28:35]:
That'S crazy.

Eldar [01:28:36]:
I was living his fucking reality that he understood and created and fucking implanted, and I'm. That, you understand, very effective. It's the truth. It's the truth.

Mike [01:28:49]:
You don't know.

Eldar [01:28:51]:
You fucking don't know. You know what I'm saying? That's why Mike was challenging us to say, affect your world, affect the world. Affect your world and you will affect the world.

Vemir [01:29:01]:
But that's like very close to that same ego mapping, which is like the ego wants. Yeah, the whole thing.

Eldar [01:29:09]:
The whole thing.

Vemir [01:29:09]:
But it's like you start from the center and they come out. Yeah, same literal thing.

Eldar [01:29:14]:
It is the same thing.

Vemir [01:29:15]:
Beautiful.

Eldar [01:29:16]:
It is.

Vemir [01:29:17]:
Thank you.

Eldar [01:29:18]:
Yeah, for sure. All right, guys, this was great.

Vemir [01:29:21]:
I'm going to take myself asleep.

Eldar [01:29:23]:
Yeah, there you go.

Mike [01:29:25]:
Guilt free.

Vemir [01:29:25]:
Guilt free sleep.

Eldar [01:29:26]:
Yeah.

Vemir [01:29:26]:
First time ever.

Eldar [01:29:28]:
Wow. In years. Bye.

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