On this week's episode,
Phillip [00:00:00]:
I'll go get a massage sometimes, and I'll tell them, like, yo, I want just more of my lower body.
Eldar [00:00:05]:
Is that the extremities?
Phillip [00:00:07]:
Or maybe because I'm like a horny nut and I still want it. Yeah, they spend a lot of time on the top, and I'm like, yo.
Eldar [00:00:12]:
That'S not what I asked for.
Phillip [00:00:13]:
I don't want it. Like, I say it every time, and then I'm like, yo, I got to the point where I'm like, yo, this is kind of like a language barrier, and I got to say it every turn.
Eldar [00:00:19]:
You turn on your back and you show them that the. The tent is pitched. Like, this is the area that I'm trying to get massage on.
Eldar [00:00:24]:
What the fuck?
Phillip [00:00:25]:
Seriously, how much more can you say?
Eldar [00:00:27]:
I have respect for this teacher. He assigned me this assignment. I'm being humble, I'm being receptive, and I want to succeed. Therefore, I might see my feet. Okay, sir, I will do this. What I'm saying is that there's some kind of dynamic here that can help people propel and do things that they usually would not do themselves or hold themselves accountable for.
Mike [00:00:46]:
If Dennis was here, he would say, it smells like discipline. No, this smells like discipline. I don't know.
Eldar [00:00:51]:
This has nothing to do with discipline.
Mike [00:00:53]:
So you don't respect yourself enough, but you're going to respect the other person.
Eldar [00:00:56]:
That's right.
Mike [00:00:56]:
That sounds bad.
Eldar [00:01:00]:
Yes.
Eldar [00:01:10]:
So, Mike, so you wanted to talk about that? I think it has a lot of depth, that topic that we talked about.
Eldar [00:01:16]:
Sure, yeah, sure.
Eldar [00:01:17]:
You want to introduce.
Eldar [00:01:18]:
No, no.
Eldar [00:01:19]:
Okay.
Mike [00:01:19]:
I don't know which one you're talking about.
Eldar [00:01:21]:
Okay.
Eldar [00:01:21]:
Which ones do we have?
Mike [00:01:22]:
We had so many.
Eldar [00:01:23]:
DJ, you probably know how we do this little thing, right? Obviously, the podcast is about a lot about, I guess, maybe self development, if you want to call it philosophy, and trying to figure shit out, figure out how we work, why we work, what we do, and the purpose, our purpose here in life. So we talk about different topics, right? Revolves around psychology, philosophy, and all the other good stuff, all that jazz.
DJ [00:01:48]:
Self enhancement.
Eldar [00:01:49]:
Yes, that's right. Me and Mike were walking, and we were talking about. Why did we start talking about?
Mike [00:01:57]:
Well, it was about a relationship thing that we wanted to have discussion about why people stay in relationships longer than they should.
Eldar [00:02:02]:
Well, first.
Eldar [00:02:03]:
Yeah, with that.
Phillip [00:02:03]:
And then.
Eldar [00:02:08]:
But I guess maybe we have to save that because the girls are.
Mike [00:02:11]:
Yeah, but that's how it started. And then we went to, why do people feel like they're not enough.
Eldar [00:02:17]:
Why people feel like they're not enough.
Eldar [00:02:19]:
Yeah, that's also tied to that topic. But I was talking about more.
Eldar [00:02:23]:
So about what we talked about last week, me and you, about teacher student relationship.
Mike [00:02:29]:
Oh, that one, yeah, that was the walk from earlier this week.
Eldar [00:02:32]:
Yeah. Okay.
Mike [00:02:33]:
Yeah, the teacher and student relationship.
Eldar [00:02:36]:
Okay.
Mike [00:02:36]:
Yeah, that's good.
Eldar [00:02:37]:
Okay.
Eldar [00:02:37]:
I guess the reason why we talked about it, DJ, so we wanted to unpack, I guess the dynamic that happens between a teacher and a student. In your case, you can relate it to the fact that you actually being mentored right now.
Eldar [00:02:52]:
You said right.
Eldar [00:02:53]:
In your field, DJ.
Eldar [00:02:55]:
Right.
Eldar [00:02:55]:
You said you have a mentor, right? Yeah. I think a lot of people understand the importance maybe of mentor, but we wanted to unpack it a little bit more and to see why it is important maybe to have a mentor, to have a teacher, maybe a guru even.
Eldar [00:03:09]:
Right.
Eldar [00:03:10]:
Whatever it is.
Eldar [00:03:11]:
Right.
Eldar [00:03:14]:
And a couple of gold nuggets that we found or came across is that in order to really benefit from someone who's a teacher or someone who has a knowledge base that you need in order to enhance yourself, you have to.
Eldar [00:03:32]:
Be able to be a good student.
Eldar [00:03:34]:
A good student. And why you have to be a good student is because by being a.
Eldar [00:03:41]:
Good student and being very receptive to.
Eldar [00:03:43]:
That knowledge, you can expedite your growth. And that relationship that you have with the teacher is actually a back and forth relationship where not only you benefit.
Eldar [00:03:54]:
But also the teacher that's teaching, you.
Eldar [00:03:56]:
Can benefit as well.
Eldar [00:03:58]:
Right.
Eldar [00:03:58]:
And I think that that whole dynamic.
Eldar [00:04:01]:
Is very interesting and if we can unpack that a little bit and to.
Eldar [00:04:04]:
Find out what are some things that we can do in our lives to improve ourselves and really maybe jump into a journey with a teacher and enjoy.
Eldar [00:04:15]:
That process and really level up.
Mike [00:04:17]:
Yeah. I think maybe a question should be why would somebody kind of want to have somebody that's going to be a teacher? What would bring them to this thing?
Eldar [00:04:26]:
Right.
Mike [00:04:26]:
Even though it sounds like it's pretty obvious, but I think it's still important.
Eldar [00:04:29]:
To give some examples of because this.
Mike [00:04:33]:
Is kind of how the conversation started. Me and you were given our own examples of working out and stuff.
Eldar [00:04:39]:
Yeah, let's talk about that.
Eldar [00:04:41]:
Yeah.
Mike [00:04:43]:
You were talking about the staying in shape thing. We constantly have this thing, like we.
Eldar [00:04:51]:
Work out for a good time, we.
Mike [00:04:53]:
Feel strong, and then something happens. Like either it's too much basketball and we stop working out, we get injured, we get sick, whatever, and we stop working out.
Eldar [00:05:00]:
Right.
Mike [00:05:01]:
Or it's too hard sometimes to stay on track right. Like summertime, you're probably a little bit more lenient. You're going out more, you're drinking more, chilling more, partying more, and it's harder to wake up in the morning on Saturday, maybe to go to the gym. So instead of, you're doing less of that stuff, and then we're just kind of discussing that our own kind of struggles with it, that the consistency, I guess we have those moments.
Eldar [00:05:26]:
Well, one thing that the reason why we have, I think, struggles with consistency is because we don't actually possess the knowledge that we need to possess in order to do it. We're not these people that understand, let's.
Eldar [00:05:38]:
Just say, our own body, the people.
Eldar [00:05:42]:
That actually study body, and I guess bodybuilders, let's just say people that actually know how much you need to recover, how much protein you need to eat, how much this, how much water you need to drink, and all these other facets that go into it.
Eldar [00:05:54]:
Right.
Eldar [00:05:55]:
Me and Michael, we're just casual people who go play, know, I guess run our bodies down to the ground, get really sore, and then we recover a day or two, and then we go again and kind of like an up and down situation.
Eldar [00:06:07]:
Right.
Eldar [00:06:07]:
And sometimes we're happy, and sometimes we're not. We're not really consistent about it, especially when we have injuries and everything else.
Eldar [00:06:14]:
Right.
Eldar [00:06:14]:
So we were more like, what if we surrender to a teacher? What if we surrender to a person who's maybe like a personal trainer or guru in this space and really be diligent about being a good student? How can we benefit from something like that? Because obviously, to learn the whole, what is it, physio, anatomy about the body, it's too much, right?
Mike [00:06:38]:
Yeah.
Eldar [00:06:38]:
Their nutrition is too much. Why would you want to do that if there's plenty of people out there? That's their talent, that's their bread and butter.
Eldar [00:06:46]:
Right.
Eldar [00:06:46]:
Why not surrender to them and really just be a good student and pay attention to what they're telling you in order to get to a place where you want to be, let's just say a little bit more jacked or a little bit have more endurance, more stamina, less injuries, more flexibility, whatever it is.
Eldar [00:07:03]:
Right. Yeah.
Mike [00:07:04]:
The important stuff that we kind of have an idea about, but we don't know where to start.
Eldar [00:07:08]:
We don't know where to start.
Mike [00:07:09]:
We're not good in maintaining it.
Eldar [00:07:11]:
Yeah.
Mike [00:07:12]:
That's obviously just one field is the exercise.
Eldar [00:07:17]:
That's the one that came to mind.
Eldar [00:07:19]:
Well, this could be in any.
Mike [00:07:20]:
But that's what I'm saying, I think this can be in anything where consistency. That's why I think that question I was trying to ask is, like, how.
Eldar [00:07:27]:
Do you know that you need to do this? Right?
Mike [00:07:30]:
Probably the one thing that's a common factor is that we've been going back and forth on this a long time about this workout routine, this basketball routine, constantly. We know icing is good. We don't ice consistently.
Eldar [00:07:42]:
We do or we don't. Right.
Mike [00:07:44]:
Then warming up. We do or we don't. Cooling down. We do or we don't. We out of the pool, then we stop going to the pool.
Eldar [00:07:50]:
Right.
Mike [00:07:50]:
Like all this stuff.
Eldar [00:07:52]:
So it's like, how do you come.
Mike [00:07:56]:
To the point that you surrender? I guess, like you said, how do we get to that point where we, like, yo, is it knowing that you've tried the same thing multiple times with not getting the desired result, or you have a goal that you can't achieve, but you keep trying and you can't sustain it? I think it's important to get into a mind state. Mind frame, right. Because it shouldn't be, like, a thing where. I don't think it should be a thing where you kind of just, like, open minded surrender. I think you may be finally ready to fire yourself and admit your own incompetence.
Eldar [00:08:34]:
Yeah.
Eldar [00:08:35]:
And I think that takes humility, which.
Eldar [00:08:38]:
Is, how do you cultivate that ability?
Eldar [00:08:41]:
And do you want to?
Eldar [00:08:42]:
Yeah.
Mike [00:08:42]:
And do you want to? Yeah, some people might not want to. I'm actually happy with this routine and.
Eldar [00:08:48]:
Feel, well, the reason why I was thinking about it in the first place is because I personally think that if we've been kind of hitting the same wall over and over and over again and we're getting the same result, but we clearly see that, hey, this is hard, at least for us.
Eldar [00:09:02]:
Right.
Eldar [00:09:02]:
However, we are also understanding that there's people out there that are professionals in their own fields, just like we are.
Eldar [00:09:08]:
Professionals in our own field. Right.
Eldar [00:09:10]:
Whatever it is that we do and people come to us for our services.
Eldar [00:09:12]:
Or whatever.
Eldar [00:09:15]:
It is easier then to almost leverage that individual, a teacher.
Eldar [00:09:19]:
Right.
Eldar [00:09:19]:
A mentor or a personal trainer, to get their knowledge. However, you need to be ready, like Mike said, and be in a certain.
Eldar [00:09:26]:
Mindset in order to be able to.
Eldar [00:09:28]:
Purely benefit from it and make it easier on yourself.
Eldar [00:09:31]:
Right.
Eldar [00:09:32]:
I think that comes from surrender and almost. I don't want to call it blind.
Eldar [00:09:38]:
Um, but a calculated trust. Calculated trust. Right.
Eldar [00:09:44]:
And I have an example.
Eldar [00:09:45]:
I told you my example with Andre, right.
Eldar [00:09:48]:
When I first met him, and I saw that he's like, hey, let's go work out together. And we went out to work out together, and he was doing all these things on the bars. I don't know if you remember, we used to go to Brendan park and do flips on, on monkey bars and stuff like that, and muscle ups and stuff like that. I was like, holy shit, this guy really knows his stuff. He knows how to do this. And without any of my own biases or whatever, I was like, yeah, I want to do this. So I was like, yeah, why don't you join me? And I would join him. And obviously I was a nobody.
Eldar [00:10:16]:
I didn't know how to do stuff. I was barely doing pull ups and stuff at the time or whatever, but I kind of came through and I said, I'm going to go under his.
Eldar [00:10:24]:
Wing, under his knowledge, his understanding, and follow him. It was hard, but I did it.
Eldar [00:10:31]:
I persevered. And then after some time, it took some time, right? But then I was able to do certain things that he was able to do, and I was proud of myself, right? Andre is rough around the edges the way he is, but I think nonetheless, because I gave him the opportunity to teach me, right. I think he was happy to teach me. And the results that I was receiving, we were both happy about it because he saw that he empowered me. Within that moment, I was able to perform and I was happy because I wanted to do this. So there was a dynamic where we kept coming back. I was coming back for him. I wanted to be a good student, right? I didn't want to fail him, and he probably didn't want to fail me because he was my teacher at that time.
Eldar [00:11:13]:
Right, exactly.
Eldar [00:11:13]:
And I think because of that relationship.
Eldar [00:11:15]:
That we went into, I saw success.
Eldar [00:11:19]:
In that specific field, right? So that's why I wanted to unpack that, because I think that when we do surrender, not blindly, but calculated surrender and start trusting an individual and really just hone in on that knowledge, right. I think something happens between that dynamic, in that dynamic between a student and a teacher where both people start caring.
Eldar [00:11:39]:
About one another, right.
Eldar [00:11:41]:
The student cares about the teacher because they want to make sure that they're a good student, right? They perform properly and follow the lead to be led somewhere. And obviously the teacher wants you to succeed, for a student to succeed and to graduate, right? So I think that there's a key.
Eldar [00:12:01]:
Element there where the humility, right?
Eldar [00:12:04]:
Respect. And then comes then consistent and repetitive things come easier. You know what I'm saying? But you have to tap into it so the question is how, if this is true, how do we actually surrender.
Eldar [00:12:23]:
To a teacher properly in order to.
Eldar [00:12:27]:
Really benefit from that, what we're trying.
Eldar [00:12:28]:
To learn, do you think a part.
Mike [00:12:31]:
Of it is you have to be fed up with your own kind of lack of success?
Eldar [00:12:34]:
You know, I thought about that, but no, I don't think so.
Eldar [00:12:38]:
I don't think so.
Eldar [00:12:40]:
I don't have to tell you about, like, I'm fed up with being too sore or this or this. I can find a different niche where I haven't tried or I haven't succeeded, but still find a teacher and still tap it into this type of mindset.
Eldar [00:12:54]:
To be able to learn and understand properly, follow someone.
Mike [00:12:58]:
Yeah, I'm just trying to think, how do you become humble? Consciously say, like, you know, I want.
Eldar [00:13:03]:
To be humble now to follow. Yeah.
Eldar [00:13:08]:
My question is, would be then do you need to be humble in general, or can you be humble in that specific area?
Eldar [00:13:15]:
Like, okay, cool.
Eldar [00:13:16]:
I don't know how to. I don't know code.
Eldar [00:13:18]:
Right? I don't know how to code.
Eldar [00:13:20]:
So somebody has to teach me. This is obvious in coding. I have to be humble because I have no idea what coding is.
Eldar [00:13:27]:
Right. You know what I'm saying?
Mike [00:13:29]:
No, yeah, of course.
Eldar [00:13:30]:
So obviously you can't be arrogant there because you don't know.
Mike [00:13:34]:
But the thing is, you might not know coding, but, you know, working out, and you may have some preconceived things that you understand or think you understand in this specific world.
Eldar [00:13:41]:
Right. Sure.
Eldar [00:13:42]:
Have your own biases, but then you have to talk about having no attachments to that.
Mike [00:13:45]:
See, that's what I'm trying to get to. How do you then go in and be like, actually, I don't know anything. I'm ready to be taught and everything. It's a hard stance to take.
Eldar [00:13:54]:
I think it's a great one.
Eldar [00:13:57]:
No, but the more I think about it, to me, at least, it's not.
Eldar [00:14:01]:
As hard as I previously thought it would be. But I think it's actually, well, to.
Mike [00:14:05]:
You it's not as hard.
Eldar [00:14:06]:
But as I understand it now, I almost don't care who the teacher is and how good they are at what they do, as long as they like what they do. You know what I mean? That's probably the most important thing. If that's what they want to do, I'd like to follow them. And I think I'll get to a place better than I would get there.
Eldar [00:14:23]:
By myself with their guidance.
Eldar [00:14:27]:
But I think it's my ability maybe to tap into that knowing what I.
Eldar [00:14:30]:
Know now about what we're discussing. Okay, so then you should share. How do you know that right now? I don't know. I have feelings.
Eldar [00:14:41]:
I need to put it into words.
Mike [00:14:43]:
Yeah, that's what I'm saying.
Eldar [00:14:44]:
Yeah.
Mike [00:14:45]:
Obviously for ourselves we can kind of.
Eldar [00:14:47]:
Discuss it, but I'd like to think.
Mike [00:14:49]:
About a way that we can for people who are listening and want to understand it so we can explain those because.
Eldar [00:14:57]:
Yeah, I think there's something that happens when you become a student.
Mike [00:15:02]:
You kind of like, especially with somebody new that you met, you give respect, right?
Eldar [00:15:07]:
Yeah.
Mike [00:15:07]:
You give respect because it's a new person you don't know and you're coming.
Eldar [00:15:11]:
In automatically like, hey, this person is.
Mike [00:15:13]:
Going to teach me something. So I think maybe the respect is a big thing or a factor there.
Eldar [00:15:19]:
I think something has to do with now that I'm thinking about genuine curiosity.
Mike [00:15:23]:
Genuine curiosity, too.
Eldar [00:15:25]:
To find out how this person operates, how this person teaches, how this person goes about doing this.
Eldar [00:15:31]:
Right.
Eldar [00:15:31]:
And really listening and paying attention.
Mike [00:15:33]:
And what sparked your genuine curiosity?
Phillip [00:15:35]:
It has to benefit you at some level, right?
Eldar [00:15:38]:
Yeah.
Phillip [00:15:39]:
You have to be in a situation where this thing is going to impact you and then you're getting the curiosity based off of something that can impact you or it's maybe something that maybe you aspire to be a teacher and you want the tools. There has to be something, to me that you'd be invested in or then I think it would be od for you to have just genuine curiosity for a topic that doesn't have anything to do with.
Eldar [00:16:01]:
For sure.
Phillip [00:16:02]:
You or your interest.
Eldar [00:16:02]:
Yeah, no, you want to have interest in it.
Eldar [00:16:05]:
Yeah, for sure.
Eldar [00:16:07]:
But what about curiosity towards an actual.
Eldar [00:16:09]:
Human being and their way?
Mike [00:16:12]:
Yeah, I definitely see that. I feel like that all the time.
Eldar [00:16:16]:
You know what I'm saying?
Mike [00:16:17]:
I'm curious to get to know people all the time.
Eldar [00:16:19]:
Yeah. How they think, why they do what they do.
Eldar [00:16:23]:
But imagine in an area where you.
Eldar [00:16:25]:
Want to be better at. Right.
Eldar [00:16:28]:
Putting that curiosity towards that.
Mike [00:16:30]:
And I guess part of the curiosity is your own desire to be better.
Eldar [00:16:35]:
Yeah.
Eldar [00:16:36]:
But also I think that if you're asking the right questions, I think the teacher almost gives more than they thought.
Eldar [00:16:43]:
They could give if you're genuinely showing.
Eldar [00:16:47]:
Them attention and interest in that specific field.
Mike [00:16:51]:
So then what I was thinking about then you probably require is vulnerability.
Eldar [00:16:55]:
Okay.
Mike [00:16:56]:
To be like, hey, I would probably say come in and be like, hey, I think I know something, but I still get sore, I still don't warm up, I still don't stretch. I still don't have a good this and that. These are the areas that I suffer with, struggle with, and being vulnerable like.
Eldar [00:17:12]:
That, I think that helps you to open yourself up.
Mike [00:17:17]:
So as a teacher, humble yourself, right, as well. And to share with that person, ask for help. I guess being vulnerable and opening up by your problems in a specific area.
Eldar [00:17:30]:
Does help you to become more humble.
Mike [00:17:33]:
And establish a relationship. Start to establish a relationship.
Eldar [00:17:37]:
I'm genuinely curious about this approach. And because I'm genuinely curious about this approach, I almost feel like I could get into anything and extract what is important to me in order for me to develop further. I feel like it doesn't matter who it really is as long as they know their shit.
Mike [00:17:53]:
As long as they know their shit.
Eldar [00:17:55]:
And as long as they're kind of like, impactful and they're happy doing it. You know what I mean? I don't think I need much if I'm genuinely curious, if I'm really about it, right, to figure this thing out for myself.
Eldar [00:18:08]:
Okay.
Eldar [00:18:09]:
I think I can ask the right.
Eldar [00:18:10]:
Questions in order to get there, in.
Eldar [00:18:13]:
Order to get the right help, but it's in my head right now.
Mike [00:18:15]:
Well, that's why we're trying to unpack it.
Eldar [00:18:17]:
What do you think, DJ?
Eldar [00:18:18]:
The importance of being a good student.
DJ [00:18:21]:
In order to really shit part of me. I'm thinking about me being right now. No, cap, like, damn, I'm messing up.
Eldar [00:18:29]:
There you go. You see? Look at that. You evaluating your own life and your own role as a student, right?
Eldar [00:18:36]:
Yeah.
Eldar [00:18:36]:
I was like, I got all this homework and I'm not doing it right.
DJ [00:18:39]:
Kind of.
Phillip [00:18:41]:
Yeah.
DJ [00:18:42]:
It's hard. Yeah. I haven't asked about certain things I.
Eldar [00:18:47]:
Don'T even know about or how to figure out because it's weird. Yeah, pretty much.
Mike [00:18:54]:
That's it.
DJ [00:18:54]:
That's it. Knowing when to ask for help.
Eldar [00:18:57]:
Pretty much, yeah.
Mike [00:18:57]:
See, the thing is also part of what. I'm not sure what I heard him say, but what I thought came to mind.
Eldar [00:19:05]:
If you're not in a place where.
Mike [00:19:08]:
You'Re, I guess not in a place yourself, like a good cup is full.
Eldar [00:19:12]:
Kind of thing, how can you be.
Mike [00:19:14]:
Curious about stuff genuinely? Can you be curious about stuff that's interesting when you don't have a baseline of things?
Eldar [00:19:21]:
Yeah, that does make sense.
Eldar [00:19:23]:
In order to be genuinely curious, to be able to fill something, a void.
Eldar [00:19:27]:
Right.
Eldar [00:19:27]:
With more knowledge, you have to actually fucking have something.
Mike [00:19:30]:
You have to have a good base of something, which is. That's just like, again, what is a base? What does that mean to have a good base, other than what we mean, you understand each other.
Eldar [00:19:42]:
It's almost like a submissive role. It's taking a submissive role.
Eldar [00:19:46]:
Right.
Eldar [00:19:46]:
In a body of knowledge that you.
Eldar [00:19:48]:
Don'T actually know about and letting the other person lead you to wherever they lead you.
Phillip [00:19:58]:
Well, yeah, let's say if you have judgment towards another person, I think that's going to prevent you from having genuine curiosity. I think if you have jealousy towards another person and you're insecure, it's going to prevent you. So I think for your cup to be at a certain level, I think it has to be being able to put aside, I guess, whatever preconceived differences you have of this individual or maybe how they look or conduct themselves to try to benefit from that thing that you're going to get. So to me, you have to put aside whatever maybe judgments, like I said, or maybe jealousy or whatever insecurities that you have. And that, to me, is the test of if you're humble or not. Humble or not. And then I think if you can be humble in that situation, then you can bypass those kind of prejudices or weaknesses that you have in yourself, and then from that point, you can be genuinely curious and then you can learn something.
Eldar [00:20:52]:
Okay.
Phillip [00:20:52]:
But I think if you go in with those prejudices or, like, judgments, I think that's going to prevent you from being genuinely curious. And then if you get the personal trainer and you pay all that money, I think most people go into this, they're not ready, but I think there's something deeper of why they're not ready either. They're not genuinely curious. They're coming from a depleted place and they think that they can just throw money towards this thing and fix it.
Eldar [00:21:15]:
And nothing comes out of it.
Phillip [00:21:16]:
But most people don't. That's how gyms operate, right. They're asking for all these gym memberships and they're banking on 90% of the people not using it. There's definitely something to this mindset when it comes to working out. Specifically, people think, okay, I have the membership, it feels good, but even though I'm not using it, it still feels like I have it.
Eldar [00:21:37]:
I'm doing something.
Phillip [00:21:38]:
It feels like I'm doing something. I think this is a common mindset.
Eldar [00:21:41]:
For a lot of people, and there's.
Phillip [00:21:43]:
Hurdles that people probably don't ask themselves, like, why am I not going? They're probably just like, okay, I'm accepting.
Eldar [00:21:48]:
Defeat and it is what it is. Yeah, but that's why we're here.
Eldar [00:21:53]:
That's why we're here. You're right.
Eldar [00:21:56]:
This is why we're here.
Eldar [00:21:57]:
So do we have any examples of, besides DJ's example of being a bad.
Eldar [00:22:01]:
Student for ourselves where we're like, oh, shit.
Eldar [00:22:08]:
Knowing what we know. Now, if curiosity is important, genuine attention is important here, right?
Eldar [00:22:15]:
Yeah.
Eldar [00:22:16]:
Without having your own, like you said, base, but more so, like, the capacity to be able to do that, because if you're genuinely curious, that's giving something to the other individual. You're fueling the teacher for them to teach you. If you're fueling them in that way.
Eldar [00:22:29]:
You will receive, you know what I'm saying?
Eldar [00:22:33]:
Yeah, but you have to be able to know how to do that properly. Like you guys say, your cup can be full. You have to have a base.
Eldar [00:22:43]:
Your cup has to be full.
Mike [00:22:44]:
You're saying cup has to be full.
Eldar [00:22:46]:
Well, no, what I'm saying is that can't be full.
Eldar [00:22:48]:
Right?
Eldar [00:22:48]:
It can't be full.
Mike [00:22:49]:
Oh, your plate can be full.
Eldar [00:22:50]:
Sure, fine, whichever one you want.
Mike [00:22:53]:
No, but that's two different things. If you overwhelm with stuff, your plate is full, you can't. Yeah, but if your cup is full.
Eldar [00:22:59]:
Yeah.
Eldar [00:23:00]:
That quote that they say when a.
Eldar [00:23:03]:
Cup is full, it's now spilling over.
Eldar [00:23:05]:
Right?
Mike [00:23:05]:
Spilling over.
Eldar [00:23:06]:
Spilling over.
Eldar [00:23:07]:
But it's paradoxical because it's spilling over, but you still need to keep filling it.
Eldar [00:23:10]:
Right.
Phillip [00:23:11]:
So I think what happens is if you don't take a stance on this and you don't get genuinely curious, I think how you get punished, naturally, is that you will then be subject to trial and error, the influence of somebody else, and you're going to learn something and get maybe a mentor, but it's going to be going down a path that you don't want. And I think relationships, to me, is one that comes to mind, where I was maybe looking at how maybe certain men approached women and dealt with women, and without me taking a firm stance and saying, I'm genuinely curious on what a loving relationship would look like, I was just like, I allow myself to be enamored by what I guess, playboy type relationship would look like. And without me even realizing it, I allowed myself to be influenced by somebody. It wasn't that I agreed or disagreed, it was just that I allowed myself to become enamored coming from a place of, I guess, insecurity and then not knowing what I wanted. So being indecisive and not knowing what you want, I think you're going to get something, or you're open to get something. And I feel like I got taught without me even necessarily wanting to be taught. And I think when you're not picking a stance, you're not being decisive. You can gravitate towards maybe certain types of people and then be taught things.
Eldar [00:24:36]:
Through trial and error.
Phillip [00:24:38]:
And now I got the lesson that I needed and I realized what I don't want as a result of paying attention to this. But I look at it now of, if you're going to have a teacher, I think it needs to be a conscious play. If you're just going to be allowing somebody like a celebrity or somebody who has a very enthusiastic or clever, charismatic personality, I feel like this is an indecisive, insecure person is prime bait for something like this.
DJ [00:25:07]:
Influencer.
Phillip [00:25:07]:
An influencer, yeah, exactly. Social media influencer would be the equivalent of a celebrity nowadays. So, yeah, I would say that, to me, is the danger of not getting to the point where you're genuinely curious and you're just thinking that, like, oh, I'm just in limbo and I'm kind of figuring it out. I think that could be a dangerous place.
Eldar [00:25:26]:
That is a dangerous place. You see, that's very important. So the role of being a good.
Eldar [00:25:30]:
Student and a proper student takes also effort.
Eldar [00:25:35]:
You can't just be this, like, oh, shit, like you said, these googly eyes where everything shiny is like, oh, yeah, take me there.
Phillip [00:25:44]:
That's the calculated part that you're talking about.
Eldar [00:25:46]:
Yes, that's the calculated trust that I'm talking about. Where I know where I want to go, right. And I would know what I want to extract from an individual.
Eldar [00:25:55]:
Yeah.
Eldar [00:25:56]:
If I'm coming to you to tell me about how to lift these weights and what to eat, don't tell me.
Eldar [00:26:01]:
About changing the oil in my car.
Phillip [00:26:03]:
And I think taking a firm stance on that when they're talking and they might do points one and two, and then they go to three. I think a lot of people would just accept number three, waste their time and money, where if you do know exactly what you want and the number three comes up, it's like, hey, listen, all due respect, I really just want to focus on one and two. You see, I'll go get a massage sometimes and I'll tell them, like, yo, I want just more of my lower body.
Eldar [00:26:28]:
Is that the extremities?
Phillip [00:26:30]:
Or maybe because I'm like a horny nut and I still want it. But anyways, they spend a lot of time on the top and I'm like.
Eldar [00:26:36]:
Yo, that's not what I asked for.
Phillip [00:26:37]:
I don't want that. I say it every time. And then I got to the point where I'm like, yo, this is kind of like a language barrier. And I got to say it every.
Eldar [00:26:43]:
Time you turn on your back and you show them that the tent is pitched, like, this is the area that I'm trying to get massage on. What the fuck?
Phillip [00:26:51]:
Seriously, how much more can you say? But the point is, how well do you know what you want? And then what are you willing to kind of risk? Or are you willing to risk the potential relationship? So he's talking about focus now, being nice and all this. How focused are you? And then how worried and concerned are you about your reputation and image with that person? And who are you willing to be to get what you want?
Eldar [00:27:20]:
So there you're becoming a reverse role of a teacher for the moment, because you're almost saying, hey, teaching the teacher.
Eldar [00:27:27]:
How to teach by understanding and sticking to the focus.
Phillip [00:27:31]:
And they have to be humble also and realize that you're paying them or in this situation, or you're willing to learn from them, and they have to be willing to learn from you also, which I think would make a great teacher.
Eldar [00:27:42]:
Yeah, see, that dynamic is.
Eldar [00:27:45]:
That's what I said.
Eldar [00:27:46]:
This dynamic is kind of interchangeable.
Phillip [00:27:49]:
Yeah, I think it'd have to be. To be truly successful.
Eldar [00:27:52]:
I think it would have to be.
Phillip [00:27:53]:
But duly going back and forth for both to learn.
Eldar [00:27:58]:
Yeah. So there you go.
Eldar [00:28:01]:
We identified another thing. In order to be a good student.
Eldar [00:28:05]:
You have to know the focus.
Eldar [00:28:09]:
And then if you do encounter a teacher who's kind of wishy washing all over the place.
Eldar [00:28:13]:
Right.
Eldar [00:28:13]:
Trying to get you in different areas, like who's not ironed out himself, you have to almost remind them of, hey, I want to keep going down this path. Please continue to teach me and get me there.
Mike [00:28:26]:
But then you have to know some shit too.
Eldar [00:28:30]:
Well, that's what he's saying.
Eldar [00:28:32]:
If not. If not, think about this. If not, he said, there's dangers there. It is better not to be a good student. You know why? Because you can find yourself in a fucking place, in a cult or something, right? Where you fucking came for one spiritual understanding or whatever. Next thing you fucking know, you're kissing.
Mike [00:28:49]:
Some fucking guy's feet and eating cocoa pebbles.
DJ [00:28:53]:
When do you know it's time to call quits? With a mentor, maybe.
Eldar [00:28:56]:
Very good. Very good question.
DJ [00:29:00]:
And I guess vice versa for the mentor. Maybe you aren't the right person for.
Eldar [00:29:04]:
Yeah, no, I think that one indicator is what Philip said is that if.
Eldar [00:29:10]:
You start feeling like the focus is.
Eldar [00:29:13]:
Shifting from what you actually originally came them for, that there is some kind of attention deficit that this teacher is experiencing, then you need to try to redirect it as soon as possible. If not, you'll find yourself fucking going some other path. So the focus has to be the focus, right. It's almost like, you know what that means? Maybe a strict teacher who's really about the curriculum.
Eldar [00:29:44]:
Very strict is also important, like, for.
Eldar [00:29:48]:
A person, like what I'm trying to say, right? Like, hey, I want to be a good student, right? I want to get to a place where I want to get to, right? This is my goals. This is what I want to do. Teach me. And the teacher can be strict with me because, hey, at this, right, you're about this, right? So show me. Prove it to me now. I, as a student, want to prove to you that I am about this life, that I'm going to endure the pains, the struggles, the inconsistencies, the doubts, the everything, right? That's how I want to be taught. In my example, for example, right. If I want to get serious about my body, my nutrition, or whatever it.
Eldar [00:30:19]:
Is, my health, then I want to.
Eldar [00:30:22]:
Be taught like that, with focus, someone who's on point.
Mike [00:30:29]:
So you can't cross that line where it's like, it's a friendly thing.
Eldar [00:30:33]:
Yes.
Mike [00:30:34]:
That's a dangerous line.
Eldar [00:30:36]:
Yes.
Eldar [00:30:36]:
Correct.
Mike [00:30:38]:
So it has to be somebody.
Eldar [00:30:40]:
It has to be professional. Someone who understands this boundary really well.
Eldar [00:30:45]:
And they say, okay, let's do it. Yeah.
Phillip [00:30:48]:
How easy is it for.
Eldar [00:30:49]:
I have just a guy.
Phillip [00:30:50]:
How easy is it for this to become a sexual thing? To me, it could be like a teacher student relationship, like man and female. If there's a personal trainer, you wouldn't.
Mike [00:31:00]:
Hire a male personal trainer. Let's just get that.
Phillip [00:31:02]:
Yeah. How many porn videos start with, like, oh, my God, a yoga trainer. It's like a thing and the yoga.
Eldar [00:31:07]:
Pants and the woman is not wearing the yoga pants.
Phillip [00:31:10]:
Yeah, come on. It is a thing, but, yeah. Male and female. Yeah. To have a woman trainer, like a physical trainer, that would be like, very.
Mike [00:31:21]:
You wouldn't go for a woman?
Phillip [00:31:23]:
I think that would be very difficult.
Eldar [00:31:24]:
Well, would that not test your own limits, then?
Phillip [00:31:27]:
I remember when I was younger, my mom used to take me to get haircuts and used to be only by women, and I loved it. I would look forward to it all the time. And as I got older, I realized.
Eldar [00:31:37]:
You were staring at the camel toes the whole time.
Phillip [00:31:40]:
I'm definitely going to go more towards a barber now. And now I do my own hair because I don't have that much anymore. It's fine. But when I did, then I realized, okay, I can't go these places because it's too distracting. And to have a professional relationship with somebody. I can't do it.
Eldar [00:31:56]:
You can't do it.
Phillip [00:31:57]:
It's very difficult.
Mike [00:31:58]:
You're a sexual deviant.
Phillip [00:31:59]:
Yeah. If I went to a gym and there was, like, a girl who, if you're a trainer, you're going to look a certain, like, obviously, most men are going to like this physically. And then to tell me, I'm going to have the level of focus and I'm just going to be able to say, like, okay, when that number three comes up, am I going to tell her to stop talking or am I just going to eat it all up? I'm going to be more likely to eat it all up and waste my time and money. Where if I had a guy who was more of like, a David Goggins type guy, like, ramming it down my throat and told me, like, yo, we're getting this.
Eldar [00:32:27]:
I'm being you with this.
Phillip [00:32:28]:
Yeah. And I'd be like, all, David, we're.
Eldar [00:32:31]:
Going to do it.
Eldar [00:32:32]:
Yeah. But then you're almost saying that I'm.
Phillip [00:32:35]:
A stupid ass student with a woman.
Eldar [00:32:37]:
100%.
Eldar [00:32:38]:
Okay, sure. That's your Achilles heel here.
Phillip [00:32:40]:
My Achilles heel would be the woman in this example.
Eldar [00:32:42]:
All right, fine.
Eldar [00:32:44]:
Let's take out the gender out of it and, like, sexual attraction out of learning.
Eldar [00:32:48]:
Sure.
Eldar [00:32:48]:
Because this can apply everywhere, even if you have a math tutor.
Eldar [00:32:52]:
Right. It had to be said. I mean.
DJ [00:32:56]:
When I was going to this psych lady, I was very attracted to her.
Eldar [00:33:00]:
Which lady?
Phillip [00:33:04]:
What do you call those things? What is outpatient? Okay.
Eldar [00:33:08]:
Therapy.
Eldar [00:33:09]:
Yeah.
Phillip [00:33:09]:
Therapy for physical therapy.
Eldar [00:33:11]:
Yeah.
DJ [00:33:11]:
For alcohol abuse.
Eldar [00:33:12]:
Okay.
DJ [00:33:15]:
It was so hard to focus.
Eldar [00:33:17]:
Yeah, because she was a bombshell. Was it motivating you more, though, to learn or.
Mike [00:33:23]:
No, I mean, you didn't come late to that class.
Phillip [00:33:27]:
This is what I think. It will get you through the door, and it will get you. Keep going. But why are you going?
DJ [00:33:32]:
Yeah, why are you going?
Eldar [00:33:34]:
This example is easy on the eye.
Eldar [00:33:35]:
Exactly.
Phillip [00:33:36]:
So in this example, you might be going into the environment where you can learn, but are you actually learning? Am I?
Eldar [00:33:42]:
You're thinking that you're curing your alcohol addiction. You're developing a sex addiction.
Mike [00:33:50]:
You'Re catching.
Eldar [00:33:50]:
A boner underneath the desk while she's talking.
Phillip [00:33:53]:
Right? Yeah. If you have an issue where maybe you need Viagra, and then you go, visit her and you're like, oh, I don't need it anymore. Then maybe she solves something. This doesn't sound like this type of situation. This sounds like he couldn't focus because.
Eldar [00:34:07]:
There'S a pretty woman at the end of the day. Obviously, let's remove the distraction out of this. The sexual distraction. It is relatable, for sure. It definitely contributes to being a bad student here. Yeah.
Phillip [00:34:20]:
Being quiet, but he definitely.
Eldar [00:34:22]:
He's naughty.
Phillip [00:34:23]:
Come on.
Mike [00:34:23]:
I wouldn't go with a girl trainer.
Eldar [00:34:26]:
Look at this fucking guy.
Phillip [00:34:27]:
Is this guy with a girl trainer?
Eldar [00:34:28]:
He's only making this conclusion because of this conversation, bro.
Mike [00:34:31]:
I'm a good fast learner student.
Eldar [00:34:33]:
You understand. He likes to socialize, like, yeah, talk about restaurants and shit. He's not doing all workouts.
Phillip [00:34:38]:
If he went in there, the phone would be done, the phone would be down. But the level of focus on the conversation of social activities, that will happen as a result. The amount of workout would be 10% of what the full workout.
Eldar [00:34:52]:
He would ask for her to do downward dog ten times easily. Like, can you show me how to.
Eldar [00:34:55]:
Do downward dog easily?
Phillip [00:34:58]:
A cat and cow Mike would wear. I can picture him wearing the spandex Pants as well, matching her energy with.
Eldar [00:35:06]:
A coconut in the midsection.
Eldar [00:35:12]:
All right.
Phillip [00:35:12]:
So, yeah, we're all in agreements here.
Eldar [00:35:13]:
This is if you throw us a fucking wrench.
Eldar [00:35:16]:
Yeah.
Eldar [00:35:17]:
Don't get yourself an opposite sex of whoever you're attracted to as your fucking teacher. Especially if you're single, right? Yes, especially, yes. But, yeah.
Eldar [00:35:28]:
See, having the ability to focus properly.
Eldar [00:35:32]:
And then making sure that you're with the right teacher and that they're sticking to the game plan is very important in order to avoid something like that. Maybe seek out a more strict individual to get you there. Here's where my doubt comes in.
Eldar [00:35:48]:
Right.
Eldar [00:35:48]:
Let's just say that. Okay, cool. This is coming where it's coming from, the arrogance part, probably. It's coming from the pride and all this other stuff where I'll come in, where I'll say, okay, cool, I surrender to this guy, and all of a sudden I'm doing shit that I already ruled out in my head that this is bad for me. Like, oh, this is too intense. You know what I mean? Do this. And I'm like, oh, I didn't want to do that. You know what I mean? It's too much on my body or whatever.
Eldar [00:36:16]:
Right. That's a dilemma. Right?
Eldar [00:36:19]:
Because here I am, I want to be a good student, but I have a conflict of interest here because my previous knowledge told me that you shouldn't be doing this heavy weight or whatever because of whatever it is that I read somewhere. And you can be in a conundrum where it's like you internally, you disagree with the teacher and his ways.
Eldar [00:36:37]:
Right.
Eldar [00:36:38]:
Without maybe even telling them, you become best.
Mike [00:36:41]:
Would you get into that relationship with that teacher if you didn't vet him first?
Eldar [00:36:46]:
Now that's a very good question. Who the fuck are you to vet anybody?
Eldar [00:36:50]:
I was assigned my mentor.
Eldar [00:36:53]:
That's a different conversation. No, this is good. No, this was good. This was good. That's also the point that you were assigned a mentor. That's an interesting detail. What do you mean, Mike?
DJ [00:37:03]:
Then I thought that's what you're saying.
Eldar [00:37:04]:
Mike is saying that you should be a person properly vetting. Who are you going to be receiving knowledge from? Okay, so now if you start vetting.
Eldar [00:37:13]:
This, this is a slippery slope here.
Eldar [00:37:15]:
Because now if you start vetting, right.
Eldar [00:37:16]:
You'Re vetting off of what?
Eldar [00:37:18]:
Your own body of knowledge. We just agreed that you don't know.
Eldar [00:37:21]:
Shit, that we should surrender.
Mike [00:37:22]:
You know shit about this subject. Sure, but you know shit about people.
Eldar [00:37:27]:
No, sure, I do know something about people. But again, I think that you won't be able to find a perfect teacher. I think you could become a perfect.
Eldar [00:37:36]:
Student, and then the teacher will follow accordingly.
Eldar [00:37:42]:
This is where Philip mentioned that you.
Eldar [00:37:44]:
Have to be a competent student, not.
Eldar [00:37:46]:
A blind student, but a competence, trusting student, but nonetheless have some competency in you. That's what I'm saying.
Eldar [00:37:53]:
Focus, maybe focus. But now how to do mean. Then we're going back into the arrogance, maybe. Oh, I don't want to do it this way.
Eldar [00:38:04]:
Fine. You know what? If you start doing it, you start feeling pain.
Eldar [00:38:08]:
You say, hey, sir, this hurts my back. No problem.
Eldar [00:38:12]:
You can obviously voice your pain.
Eldar [00:38:14]:
Don't go through pain. Right? But without trying, you say, hey, this.
Eldar [00:38:19]:
Is not the exercise for me. Somebody told me that this is not good for me or whatever. You can't do that.
Phillip [00:38:24]:
This is how I would judge it.
Eldar [00:38:26]:
I would say, how'd you jump over that? I would say that if he.
Phillip [00:38:34]:
Because it's a boy.
Eldar [00:38:35]:
This is very important for you, by the way.
Eldar [00:38:37]:
Right.
Eldar [00:38:37]:
Okay, fine.
Eldar [00:38:38]:
Very.
Phillip [00:38:39]:
So if I'm going into a place and I need, say, like a nutritionist or a trainer, and it's like, health focused, if they're not asking me specific questions that are related to me specifically and they start to give me general things, I will take that as they're not taking me seriously. And they don't have expertise, but again, in what they do. Sure, that would be like my baseline for me, like not knowing enough.
Eldar [00:39:03]:
But here's the problem here. Again, I'm going to show you a problem, okay? Yes. There's general knowledge that people can give you and it's like, it's a blanket thing and it's probably not going to work for us, for each individual.
Eldar [00:39:13]:
Right. However, we as people tend to overcomplicate things about ourselves.
Eldar [00:39:19]:
We're like, oh, we're very particular about this. We're very particular about this. You know what I mean? We think that we know all the shit about ourselves. So that can be also where you become so olic, for example.
Eldar [00:39:31]:
You know what I mean? How do you teach a person like that, right?
Eldar [00:39:34]:
Because there's so many different variables in his thing.
Phillip [00:39:38]:
But he's clearly not willing to be taught though.
Eldar [00:39:41]:
But that's what I'm saying. At the end of the day, I think that there has to be a level of like, you know what, I'm just going to give in into this process and see where it's going to get me. And I'm not going to tell you about me being nit picky about every little thing about me because at the end of the day, I'm not sure.
Eldar [00:39:57]:
If that individual's power lies in being.
Eldar [00:40:02]:
Really tailoring this fucking approach towards you.
Eldar [00:40:06]:
Who might be a fucking piss pig. Yeah.
Phillip [00:40:09]:
So I guess it's like how much experience do you have in doing this? Or are you talking about somebody that's going in completely blind?
Eldar [00:40:15]:
Because I think, no, I generally think that people should ask you like, hey, do you have any problems before we start this or whatever? Do you have any allergies? For sure, that kind of stuff.
Phillip [00:40:23]:
But I'm saying at our age now, we're not like 21, right? Being in our late 30s, like close to think we have a lot more life experience. Like if you said the same thing to me when I was just starting to work out at 1415, like 18 years old, then I think you can go in a little more blind. But I think you should allow yourself to say like, hey, when you say you know nothing, I think you've probably given yourself less amount of credit than you probably deserve in it. I think you definitely know some things more about your body specifically. Like if you actually asked yourself and you said, okay, I work out and I play basketball, and then I think you even said a day or two days later, I know that I'm sore and this is what I eat. And this is what I don't eat. I think, you know, the pattern of what happens, but I'm trying to interrupt.
Eldar [00:41:08]:
The pattern that is not working for me.
Phillip [00:41:10]:
Yeah, you know what I'm saying? But what I'm saying is, you know, your body, and I think to present those things, you know, this type of information. So if you're trying to get rid of this, I think if this guy's just coming in and trying to give you general stuff without trying to ask you exactly what's going on and ask you all the details, I think that's an easy one to bypass. I want somebody to ask me a lot of questions and know exactly what's going on with me so there's no information that I don't know about myself that he doesn't know, and then take it from there.
Eldar [00:41:43]:
The thing is, that's hard to find. Now, you're asking for a person to be genuinely curious about you. I think anybody who is is very good teacher probably, right?
Eldar [00:41:52]:
Yeah.
Eldar [00:41:53]:
But a lot of times we don't.
Eldar [00:41:54]:
See that in life.
Eldar [00:41:55]:
Everybody's busy, everybody's doing some shit and all this other stuff. So I almost feel like we need to create that individual by being good students. And by being good students is probably, like, what we're talking about here, discussing, but without having to be too complicated of a student too, by keep saying that, oh, this is the way I work. This is the way I learn. You know what I mean? Like, dictating your own rules of engagement. I think that general stuff should definitely be mentioned. If I'm allergic to peanuts, please don't fucking suggest peanuts in my diet. 100%.
Eldar [00:42:26]:
You know what I'm saying? We talked about this, right? General stuff. But then if I say, you know what? This paired with this, I'm not really sure, and then you're not really sure, and then you start putting them into a framework to not be able to create and flow the way they flow. It's to take away from their thing and not to be a good student. So I think there's a balance that you want to strike.
Phillip [00:42:48]:
But let's say in an example where let's say you're doing your due diligence and you're interviewing three different people, okay? There has to be some type of criteria that you enable within yourself to say, I don't like person one and two, but I like three. So I guess what's the extent that you allow yourself? What credentials or what amount of judgment do you allow yourself to have? That's within reason to make these type of decisions realistically, you're not just going to go with the first person, right? You're probably going to go with try out multiple people or at least interview with somebody. If I'm spending like a couple hundred dollars a month for somebody and I'm going to plunk this down and be consistent, if I'm making a commitment, I want to feel it out. If you're going on job interviews, you.
Eldar [00:43:37]:
Just take the first one. I think it's dangerous again, I think it's going to take you away from you being a good student again.
Eldar [00:43:43]:
Mike, help me out here.
Eldar [00:43:44]:
You know what I'm trying to say. I'm trying to get to or no.
Mike [00:43:47]:
I do know what you're saying, but I'm not sure.
Eldar [00:43:50]:
Yeah, I don't want to compromise trust and I don't want to compromise that genuine curiosity and wanting to learn and showing that without having to fucking install.
Eldar [00:43:59]:
My stupidity again in it.
Phillip [00:44:02]:
But isn't that setting so somebody like.
Mike [00:44:04]:
Myself, what you're saying is I want.
Eldar [00:44:07]:
To surrender, but I think you have.
Mike [00:44:09]:
To surrender to yourself. But you actually may have to become the teacher. You actually have to go and get educated. If you want something so specifically tailored, you actually have to take this seriously and become not a student, but a student of that and the teacher as well.
Phillip [00:44:25]:
Yeah, but elder, the way that you're describing it sounds like you're blindly trusting this person and you're saying like, I absolutely know nothing and that I'm going to allow this person to teach me. So you're inevitably setting yourself up for a trial and error situation where they might not be the person and they might lead you down the wrong path, but you're just going to kind of let them kind of, I guess, run the show and you're kind of just going with the flow. That's what it sounds like.
Eldar [00:44:54]:
All right, let's choose something that just came to my mind. Maybe we could choose an example, for example, right? Me and Mike started going to the pool and swim a little bit, right?
Eldar [00:45:02]:
Okay.
Eldar [00:45:03]:
I don't know shit about swimming. What if I went to look for a swimming coach?
Phillip [00:45:08]:
Okay, so you're going in like, I never swam. I don't never really focused on swimming. I literally don't know shit.
Eldar [00:45:14]:
Like what body of knowledge, what biases am I bringing here to tell this swim coach on how to operate on my body and me, aside from maybe like, hey, either I know how to swim or I don't know how to swim. Right? What am I bringing?
Phillip [00:45:27]:
So I think the expectation level going into that specific situation is like, even if this guy teaches me one small thing, it's a win because you know nothing. So I think it's easier to go and humble on that situation where you haven't been a swimmer, you don't know the technique of swimming. And I think it's easier to be genuinely curious when you have no basis and you have nothing. I think it's a lot more difficult when you have the knowledge of you did work out, you're in shape. You're not like an obese person. You know what I mean? You know how to eat, you know how to balance. You work out, you're in good shape. So to me, yeah.
Phillip [00:46:02]:
Something there.
Eldar [00:46:03]:
Yeah, sure.
Phillip [00:46:05]:
Now, you might not be able to replicate it because you haven't put actual focus on it, but if I told you to write everything down that you do, I bet you that plan would work for a lot of people without even maybe thinking about it.
Eldar [00:46:16]:
Maybe.
Phillip [00:46:17]:
But maybe now with the swimming example, it's different because you have no basis in swimming, and you're just like, yo, I want to try swimming now. This is cool.
Eldar [00:46:24]:
Yeah.
Phillip [00:46:25]:
Expectation level went from like, I want to have this, this, and this to be a tailor to like, yo, if he can teach me how to do one type of freestyle stroke, I feel great.
Eldar [00:46:34]:
This is what I'm saying.
Phillip [00:46:35]:
Yeah, no, I get that. That's different to me because you're going in with no basis of having done this thing and the expectation level goes low. My expectation level is higher with the working out because I've done it my whole life, and it's going to be, I guess, a lot more difficult to kind of chip away.
Eldar [00:46:51]:
You see, at that.
Eldar [00:46:54]:
Yeah.
Mike [00:46:55]:
I think that's created very hard to.
Eldar [00:46:58]:
Be a good student in something that.
Mike [00:47:00]:
You in this thing, because also part even, like, I'm thinking about you as part of your identity.
Eldar [00:47:05]:
Right.
Mike [00:47:05]:
Like, everything that you do, you try to have fun with it.
Eldar [00:47:08]:
Right.
Mike [00:47:08]:
Which is to be yourself. Now, you come in there, this strict guy, he's a tight ass. He's going to be Matt strict. You have to be a little bit out of your own self. You can't be.
Eldar [00:47:19]:
I want that, though. I feel like I want that.
Mike [00:47:22]:
You feel like you want that? But why would you want that if that's not who you actually are 99% of your life? Why would you want to put yourself in that situation?
Eldar [00:47:29]:
Because I think the learning part will be the fun part. I think that there's some kind of magic that happens when you surrender to being a good student. I can't voice it. Something tells me that if you go, it's a tight ass teacher, but you're really following through to the t and you're really trying and it's hard, but you're doing it right. I think that there's a magic moment. Something happens where there is a transformative point for both individuals, and that transformative moment is the fucking. Magic is the fucking.
Mike [00:48:05]:
I think that's when you no longer become the student. You're already like, maybe that moment.
Eldar [00:48:09]:
Well, no, but it's a journey. It's not the destination, right?
Mike [00:48:13]:
Yeah, for sure, but I know which magic moment you're talking about, but I think that I'm not sure if you need a personal trainer for the rest of your life, eventually the wheels got to come off, right?
Eldar [00:48:26]:
Well, it depends how serious you want to take something like that, right? Yeah, sooner or later. I don't need a fucking swim coach to tell me how to do that stroke. I'm already doing the stroke. So now I can do it by myself without him being there. That teacher disappears, and now I can do it myself as long as I want.
Phillip [00:48:41]:
So stick with that example. Now, when you learn that from the first one and then you go to the second coach, don't you think that you're going to have a different level of expectation of what you'd expect from a swimming coach?
Eldar [00:48:54]:
Now, if he's teaching me to do backwards swimming, for example, if one coach told me how to swim this way, but the other one's going to teach me the other way, then no, I think it's the same due diligence and same approach.
Phillip [00:49:10]:
So based off of you not having any, I guess, experience in the one particular act, you can go into each individual, like, each experience has an individual experience, like a clean experience, body of knowledge.
Mike [00:49:25]:
What are you saying? You have to say, you know what? I'm not going to lift weights. I'm not going to do calisthenics. I'm going to start something. I'm not going to play basketball. I'm going to do something completely different that I'm nothing about.
Eldar [00:49:34]:
Yeah.
Phillip [00:49:35]:
If you told me, like, hey, I'm going to do CrossFit and I never did crossFit or something like pilates or something like this, right? I'd be like, okay, I'm going to go in blindly because I have no idea what this is. I did Pilates maybe once or twice my whole life. So to me, any instructor would probably be teaching me something. My level of expectation be next to zero.
Eldar [00:49:53]:
Yeah.
Eldar [00:49:53]:
And I'm giving you example of the swimming thing is because of the fact that it's easier to surrender in that.
Phillip [00:49:58]:
Yeah, I think so.
Eldar [00:49:58]:
Right.
Eldar [00:49:59]:
The bigger challenge is for me to go and get myself a basketball coach.
Eldar [00:50:02]:
Yeah.
Eldar [00:50:03]:
A trainer. Give me a basketball trainer right now.
Phillip [00:50:05]:
That would be very difficult to me for my ego. Yeah.
Eldar [00:50:08]:
What? You know what time it is, DJ? I'm dunking on the. Yeah, yeah.
Phillip [00:50:16]:
Think about how humble. I don't know if any of them are, but, like, an NBA player. Right. For them to have, like, if you see a lot of these guys, like, shooting, like, for them to say, like, hey, I'm going to learn from this guy, and he's really good. You don't think in the back of their head they're like, yo, look at this guy versus me. I've seen these guys passing the ball, go up to them and just put their hand up. Obviously, maybe they're included in the package of the team buys them or whatever, and they're just on location. Okay, great.
Phillip [00:50:43]:
But what type of level does Luca donche save from some random guy throwing him the ball? Now, does all the other people have to tell him and say, hey, this guy's great? Or is he a good enough student to say, like, hey, I recognize something in this guy that's maybe non skill related, where it's, like, maybe some kind of characteristic that I'm drawn to or attitude or something like that. So to me, that's how I would look at it if I had to say, I know basketball, he knows basketball. Maybe at some degree, maybe we can go up and down on who's more educated and who's more skilled. But it's like, do we connect on something that's deeper than basketball, that can make this, like, a true relationship where I can go into it new because it's something like virtue or value based that has no kind of limit. So can that maybe even out the playing field on maybe an experience that basketball you have experience in?
Eldar [00:51:33]:
No.
Eldar [00:51:33]:
But again, to me, it's almost like I wouldn't go there to get a better skill set. I probably will get a better skill set if I did go to a coach.
Eldar [00:51:41]:
Right.
Eldar [00:51:42]:
But I would be going there to challenge myself to see whether or not I can pay attention to the damn coach.
Eldar [00:51:46]:
Right.
Eldar [00:51:46]:
And do it the right way.
Phillip [00:51:48]:
Yeah.
Eldar [00:51:49]:
Surrendering because it's easier to surrender to a swim coach. I've never swim before.
Eldar [00:51:54]:
Right.
Eldar [00:51:55]:
But it's harder.
Mike [00:51:56]:
Maybe the focus, I don't know. Maybe the focus is because you're focusing on a coach who's going to teach.
Eldar [00:52:03]:
You.
Mike [00:52:06]:
Certain exercises, but you're not focusing on actually the goal, which is to be healthy, to stay healthy for longevity.
Eldar [00:52:13]:
Right.
Mike [00:52:13]:
If you put that focus on, like, hey, how does that change your mindset? Like, yo, why am I doing this? To be healthy for a long term. Not to get stronger or to learn something new, but more so to live a healthier life, to feel better. Actually feel better.
Eldar [00:52:33]:
Right? Yeah.
Mike [00:52:33]:
I wonder if that changes the dynamic.
Eldar [00:52:36]:
Dynamic.
Mike [00:52:37]:
Whereas, like, I'm learning how to swim. To learn how to swim. No, I'm learning how to swim so that I can. When I'm 80 years old.
Eldar [00:52:43]:
No.
Eldar [00:52:43]:
Well, obviously you choose what you want.
Mike [00:52:45]:
To learn, but I think attaching yourself to something that's actually rooted in truth, like, I guess health is rooted in truth.
Eldar [00:52:51]:
Yeah. Right.
Mike [00:52:53]:
Be healthy and be in good health. I don't know how to say it, but I guess there's something different than I want to learn how to properly lift weights versus I want to learn how to be healthy.
Eldar [00:53:03]:
You're right.
Eldar [00:53:05]:
More of a broader thing, though, to be healthy.
Mike [00:53:07]:
But it's something that's more like, okay, it's more like a genuine thing.
Eldar [00:53:12]:
Right.
Eldar [00:53:12]:
Because I get it.
Phillip [00:53:15]:
I think you have a better chance to say, if you're saying I want to be healthy, I think there's a better chance to be open minded to that guy and overlook the technicalities of each individual exercise and say, like, okay, do you think that this guy just has a genuinely good outlook on health? And is he a healthy person? And then it's like, if he teaches me something that I maybe don't agree with or I'm not open to, it's like, I think he's overall a healthy person, and I think as a healthy person, he probably wants to see me be healthy as well. And there's a better chance that this is going to be a successful relationship.
Eldar [00:53:51]:
We get there together.
Phillip [00:53:52]:
That we get there together.
Eldar [00:53:53]:
Exactly.
Phillip [00:53:54]:
That's how I.
Eldar [00:53:55]:
Well, yeah, in that case, yeah. I almost remember the guy that we make fun of every time there.
Eldar [00:53:59]:
Nate.
Phillip [00:53:59]:
Oh, yeah, I've seen him.
Eldar [00:54:00]:
The happy guy.
Phillip [00:54:03]:
The guy that's always, like, overly happy.
Eldar [00:54:04]:
No, that's a different guy.
Eldar [00:54:05]:
Okay.
Eldar [00:54:06]:
Yeah, there's just one guy, older guy. And every time me and Mike come in, he just has all this energy, and he does these completely different exercises from anybody else's. He's using, like, those bands.
Phillip [00:54:15]:
Does he have the beer belly guy?
Mike [00:54:17]:
No, this guy, he's in sick shape.
Eldar [00:54:19]:
He's in sick shape. He's probably in his 50s.
Mike [00:54:21]:
He's in the best shape guy that you ever seen.
Eldar [00:54:23]:
Yeah. Yes.
Eldar [00:54:23]:
He outlast everybody.
Phillip [00:54:25]:
This is not the guy I'm thinking.
Eldar [00:54:26]:
Yeah. This is the guy you would go to.
Mike [00:54:29]:
This is the guy you call. You're a teacher.
Eldar [00:54:31]:
Yes.
Mike [00:54:32]:
You come up to him, ask him.
Eldar [00:54:33]:
To teach you, like, longevity shit, yeah, that kind of stuff.
Mike [00:54:37]:
He's doing crazy shit.
Eldar [00:54:38]:
Yeah.
Phillip [00:54:39]:
On that note, should we do some whiskey or.
Eldar [00:54:41]:
No.
Eldar [00:54:43]:
Listen, I'm still under the weather. I'm not trying to do all that.
Phillip [00:54:46]:
Doing any or.
Eldar [00:54:46]:
No, you're under the weather as well.
Mike [00:54:47]:
I'm under the weather because you just told me, like, you're not drinking now.
Phillip [00:54:53]:
I haven't had one in a while.
Eldar [00:54:54]:
We'll have one with DJ. Are you on the AA?
Phillip [00:54:58]:
No.
Eldar [00:55:01]:
Thanks. Set it up, Philip.
Mike [00:55:03]:
Damn, Philip. Little sippy sip.
Eldar [00:55:07]:
Yeah.
Eldar [00:55:09]:
So is there something here, guys, or what?
Mike [00:55:13]:
There's a lot of questions.
Eldar [00:55:15]:
I know what I'm talking about.
Mike [00:55:16]:
I understand what you're talking about, but I think, how do you get there? I still think that maybe you can't get a teacher. Maybe you need to learn if you want to immerse yourself in it.
Eldar [00:55:30]:
I don't want to immerse myself in it.
Mike [00:55:33]:
Maybe that's your ego speaking, who's responsible for your body and your health. Why is it not you? Why does somebody else have to teach.
Eldar [00:55:42]:
You how to be.
Eldar [00:55:42]:
No, I'm saying that I don't want to do the legwork, the research work.
Eldar [00:55:46]:
Right.
Eldar [00:55:47]:
I want to learn from somebody.
Mike [00:55:49]:
You're going to learn from somebody, but why can't the teacher be, like, for example, your own research that you do?
Eldar [00:55:55]:
I don't want to do my own research. Somebody else did it already.
Mike [00:55:59]:
Where'd you learn philosophy? How'd you get curious about philosophy?
Eldar [00:56:04]:
Did you learn from a teacher?
Mike [00:56:05]:
You learned from a teacher, but you also studied other works of art?
Eldar [00:56:09]:
Of course I learned from a teacher, and I had a damn good time doing it.
Mike [00:56:15]:
Yeah, I guess you got it because it was something new, though.
DJ [00:56:20]:
You just got to enjoy learning it, too.
Eldar [00:56:22]:
Yeah, you have to enjoy it.
DJ [00:56:23]:
You got to enjoy it.
Eldar [00:56:25]:
That's what I'm saying.
DJ [00:56:25]:
That high degree.
Eldar [00:56:26]:
Yeah, maybe a high.
Mike [00:56:27]:
I think maybe the expectation of having a perfect teacher, obviously, is not realistic.
Eldar [00:56:32]:
Obviously.
Eldar [00:56:32]:
Well, that's what Philip was saying. And I'm saying you have to stay away from that. Stay away from having expectation of a perfect teacher. Finding a perfect teacher. You're trying to find a perfect teacher. Assuming that you think that you know yourself, and now you're going to present this self to this teacher and be like, oh, are you compatible with this person that I'm presenting? And I think that's the wrong approach here.
DJ [00:56:53]:
I agree.
Eldar [00:56:54]:
You do agree?
DJ [00:56:54]:
I do agree.
Eldar [00:56:55]:
You do agree with that.
Mike [00:56:55]:
But do you not feel like, you know, the stuff that needs to be done, all the stuff that you think needs to be done? You don't believe that? Like, the stuff we talk about?
Eldar [00:57:03]:
No, what I'm saying is that I want to be skeptical about it because of the fact that if I did know, truly knew, I'd be there.
Mike [00:57:11]:
But the thing is. But you haven't done enough research on your own.
Eldar [00:57:16]:
But then you're saying on one hand, you're saying, you know, and you say you don't know. You need to do more research.
DJ [00:57:21]:
There's also things that.
Mike [00:57:22]:
The thing is, you know, because you've heard people say it, everybody's talking like, ice therapy. Ice therapy.
Eldar [00:57:27]:
Huge.
Mike [00:57:27]:
Everybody's.
Eldar [00:57:28]:
That's bullshit.
Eldar [00:57:29]:
Knowledge.
Eldar [00:57:30]:
Just because you heard people say it doesn't mean anything.
Mike [00:57:32]:
Well, yeah, but you've heard things. You've seen people say it could be a real thing.
Eldar [00:57:37]:
Like I said, I think that I can extract if I'm in a relationship with you. And now we have respect. And you gave me homework.
Eldar [00:57:44]:
Okay?
Eldar [00:57:45]:
You gave me homework. Hey, Eldar. Tonight. Tonight you're icing your feet for ten minutes. I don't need to know what the fuck is the science behind icing my feet is. I'm going to go and trust your knowledge behind icing those feet, and I'm just going to ice my feet.
Eldar [00:58:02]:
Yeah.
Eldar [00:58:03]:
This is what I'm talking about. Because I have respect for you. That's why I'm doing it. I'm not doing it because I understand the importance of it. No, you told me I'm going to respect that. You know what I'm saying?
Mike [00:58:17]:
I do know what you're saying. I do.
Eldar [00:58:19]:
That's why I want to make sure that I'm a good student to you, because you've assigned me homework. Gigi, you were going to say something.
Eldar [00:58:27]:
Sorry.
Eldar [00:58:28]:
Before Mike started yelling at me, I forgot.
Mike [00:58:31]:
Honestly, I don't know. Yeah, I don't know the answer, but my thing keeps saying, like, yo, are you. Are you a Doctor of your mind or. No, sometimes I am, but there's plenty.
Eldar [00:58:47]:
Of things that I'm not. Doctor of my mind.
Mike [00:58:49]:
I'm not a doctor. You're not a surgeon?
Eldar [00:58:50]:
Yeah, well, not a surgeon, but other things, too.
Mike [00:58:56]:
What about for your mind. I'm saying, are you a doctor of your own mind?
Eldar [00:59:02]:
Sometimes. But sometimes I'm bad to myself.
Eldar [00:59:04]:
Right.
Eldar [00:59:06]:
Sometimes I'm good, I have fun, I enjoy my time. Sometimes I get into things that are not fun. Sometimes I get bad sleep. That's not fun?
Mike [00:59:15]:
No, I'm talking about more mental.
Eldar [00:59:16]:
Well, that is mental. If I don't get enough sleep, I have anxiety.
Mike [00:59:19]:
No. Yeah, sure.
Eldar [00:59:21]:
If I have anxiety, I can't get enough sleep.
Mike [00:59:23]:
Is a physical thing.
Eldar [00:59:25]:
No, but it's mental that's connected.
Mike [00:59:26]:
It could be a mental thing. Not always, right?
DJ [00:59:28]:
Yeah, I just remember what I was going to say. The thing with mentors is between. I forgot what exactly you guys are talking about. But it's very key. I feel like with mentors you get unknown knowledge in a sense, or knowledge you can't really research on your own.
Eldar [00:59:48]:
Give me an example. You have an example.
Eldar [00:59:50]:
Mike's saying that, hey, bro, you can research.
Phillip [00:59:52]:
Yeah.
DJ [00:59:53]:
I mean, you could, but you can't really apply an application. It could be different versus whatever you researched. It just could be a slight difference. I ain't got a good example. I'm trying to think of a very easy, universal example right now.
Eldar [01:00:13]:
Well, think about it. Maybe get back to us.
DJ [01:00:15]:
Definitely. When I think of the example.
Eldar [01:00:18]:
Bring it back. Yeah.
Eldar [01:00:21]:
So I just think that you don't have to do so much work when it comes to this kind of thing where that knowledge could be passed on.
Mike [01:00:30]:
But why do you do so much work for your mind constantly thinking?
Eldar [01:00:35]:
Because I like it. I don't want to fucking learn the fucking anatomy of the body. I don't want to learn anatomy of the brain. I don't want to learn anatomy of this. I don't want to learn anatomy of how this fucking chair is made or how the car works. I don't want to.
Mike [01:00:47]:
But the thing is, you may not want to, but it may be. Can't just say, you know what? I don't want to do philosophy and I don't want to do self development anymore.
Eldar [01:00:52]:
Right?
Eldar [01:00:53]:
No, but I like it. I like it. I need it.
Eldar [01:00:55]:
Right?
Mike [01:00:56]:
Yeah, but you're not looking at. Because you look at it a certain way, it improves the quality of your life. It makes you happier, right?
Eldar [01:01:01]:
Yeah.
Mike [01:01:02]:
Why don't you look at your body as the same extension quality of life?
Eldar [01:01:06]:
That's what I'm saying. I haven't learned.
Mike [01:01:07]:
You haven't learned?
Eldar [01:01:09]:
You're saying that I have the capacity to learn? I'm telling you, yes, but I don't have the same drive see, I have the same drive to learn about learning.
Eldar [01:01:19]:
Right.
Eldar [01:01:19]:
What we're talking about here.
Eldar [01:01:21]:
Right.
Eldar [01:01:21]:
This is, to me, is fascinating. This I like for sure. Thank you. But certain things I think, that I think a teacher is necessary for, and I can extract that knowledge from a teacher.
Phillip [01:01:35]:
Fuck them keys.
Mike [01:01:39]:
Yeah.
Eldar [01:01:42]:
Why are you reluctant to this?
Mike [01:01:45]:
No, I'm just trying to give all.
Phillip [01:01:48]:
Puffing and puffing over.
Eldar [01:01:50]:
He's a tedious fucker.
Phillip [01:01:53]:
He's an emoji with the steam that comes up the nostrils.
Mike [01:01:57]:
I'm just trying to play all parts here because I'm trying to understand. Maybe we're trying to solve it one way, but it may be that actually it's our responsibility to become educated.
Eldar [01:02:05]:
So Mike is saying that, look, you know that icing your feet after basketball is important, right? I'm like, yes, but I don't do it. Why don't I do it right? I'm saying there's a reason why I don't do it consistently. Right. And I'm saying that if I introduce a teacher, right, and I have actual respect for this individual, he's going to assign me. Eldar, every time you do this, I need you to ice your feet. Okay, sir. I will do this.
Eldar [01:02:29]:
Right.
Eldar [01:02:30]:
I don't need to know the anatomy, why icing your feet is important or good and what it does for you. I'm doing it now because I have respect for this teacher. He assigned me this assignment. I'm being humble, I'm being receptive, and I want to succeed, therefore, I'm icing my feet.
Phillip [01:02:45]:
So you know about yourself that that's.
Eldar [01:02:49]:
My key, for example.
Phillip [01:02:50]:
Yeah. You're describing a specific thing for you. That's a motive, Vader, that another person involved. It's less likely for you to not hold yourself accountable when there's respect for another person. Like a teaching from another person. And there's mutual respect.
Eldar [01:03:05]:
Correct. What I'm saying is that there's some kind of dynamic here that can help people propel and do things that they usually would not do themselves or hold themselves accountable for.
Mike [01:03:16]:
If Dennis here, he would say, it smells like discipline. No, this smells like discipline. I don't know.
Eldar [01:03:23]:
This has nothing to do with discipline.
Eldar [01:03:25]:
Nothing.
Mike [01:03:26]:
No, because respect, you're respecting somebody else, so you don't respect yourself enough, but you're going to respect the other person.
Eldar [01:03:31]:
That's right.
Mike [01:03:32]:
That sounds bad.
Eldar [01:03:34]:
That's right.
DJ [01:03:35]:
Are we still off?
Eldar [01:03:36]:
Huh?
DJ [01:03:37]:
I think I was here for that last time. I think. Mike, I thought it was you who was off.
Eldar [01:03:43]:
Shit. DJ remembers it, of course.
Phillip [01:03:47]:
Wow.
Eldar [01:03:48]:
Yeah.
Mike [01:03:49]:
To me, logically, you saying that I don't get it.
Phillip [01:03:52]:
Well, no, I think the difference is that in the discipline scenario, you have to force yourself to do this thing. I think with this, you're surrendering and you're creating an environment where there's mutual respect. I think it's a very different.
Mike [01:04:04]:
Now say this to me. I don't respect myself enough to ice my feet, which I know is right for me, but if somebody else tells me I respect them enough.
Eldar [01:04:13]:
Only if you engage in a specific relationship. This is not just because you're going to elder, go ice your feet tonight. This is not what I'm talking about. Only if you get into an engagement in a relationship or a dynamic.
DJ [01:04:27]:
If it's something you already did, though, it's going to be definitely hard to stick to it. I guess Mike's trying to say, you're saying it doesn't make no sense to do it just because they're saying, why.
Mike [01:04:40]:
Would you not do.
DJ [01:04:42]:
You can do that.
Eldar [01:04:42]:
Correct.
Mike [01:04:43]:
Why would you not do something? Because you know it's right. But when somebody else tells you it's right, then all of a sudden you're going to do it because you're smart.
Phillip [01:04:49]:
Enough to realize that you can't do it yourself. So you're asking for help, I think asking for help and realizing that you're an idiot. Yeah, but that's the humbling part, without knowing the dynamic. So that is, to me, in any.
Mike [01:05:03]:
Situation, that's just not going to last long enough.
Eldar [01:05:07]:
Well, my concern is the other concern.
Phillip [01:05:09]:
But what do you want to get?
Eldar [01:05:10]:
The reason why I want the mentor in the first place is because I haven't been consistent with myself.
Mike [01:05:15]:
No, I get that.
DJ [01:05:17]:
Or the mentor might even teach you how to do it. Ice a certain way that you didn't even know about.
Eldar [01:05:21]:
Fuck that. It doesn't even matter. Doesn't even matter. The technique, right? It's the same technique. Put your feet in the water with ice, forget about it. That's the same shit that you already know that's right for you, but you haven't been doing it. But as soon as you get into a relationship, right, where another individual is affected and is involved, you're now esteeming that relationship because you're esteeming that. It's like cheating on your girlfriend or cheating on your wife, right?
Eldar [01:05:47]:
Yeah.
Eldar [01:05:48]:
You could do it if you want to, but you don't because you have respect for them.
Eldar [01:05:51]:
Right.
Eldar [01:05:51]:
And you have respect for yourself. It's that mutual understanding.
Eldar [01:05:56]:
Yeah. Okay.
Eldar [01:05:59]:
That propels you to be like, you know what? This is the right thing to do. I esteem this person. I look up to them. I'd like to do the right thing, and the right thing is theirs. To ice your feet. I think there's different type of energy there. You're almost on a mission with someone else.
Eldar [01:06:17]:
He's having a hard time.
Eldar [01:06:18]:
He is having a hard time. You're trying to break it down to him, but he's not buying it.
Mike [01:06:22]:
No. What are you guys saying is theoretically? I'm not sure, man.
Eldar [01:06:26]:
I'm not sure either. I'm just saying we started this is because we're talking about this dynamic that potentially, if we are good students in this dynamic, we can actually accomplish. We can use this energy, right? We can use this energy, this motivation, whatever you want to call it. I don't know what you want to call it. Respect or whatever, in order to propel ourselves to the next level and level up from this dynamic, from being a humble, good student, pay attention and do the homework, and then it'll get you past whatever hurdles. This is what we're trying to say.
Phillip [01:07:03]:
I think Mike's caught up. What seems like is. What's the difference?
Eldar [01:07:07]:
Why don't you learn yourself?
Phillip [01:07:08]:
Yeah, what's the difference between that and no? Are you still okay with the discipline part or no?
Mike [01:07:13]:
I just said it smells like discipline. I'm not stuck on it.
Eldar [01:07:15]:
If Dennis was here, Dennis would call us like, yo, this is discipline, bro.
Phillip [01:07:19]:
Okay, so we're over that.
Mike [01:07:20]:
What do you call the trainer? The respect still stays.
Eldar [01:07:24]:
Well, I'm not sure what stays. First of all, I haven't tried this. No, I want to try this. I want to see. I'm probably going to run into some problems there where. If I try this, right? But, yeah, that's a good question. What happens after you've.
Mike [01:07:36]:
Where do you draw the respect from to keep doing it if not from your own?
Phillip [01:07:42]:
Well, what's the expectation going in? Right. If you're saying, I want to get healthier and this person teaches you ten things, let's say when you leave that relationship, maybe one thing sticks.
Mike [01:07:53]:
Did you not respect Andre when you were doing the muscle up stuff and all those workouts?
Eldar [01:07:57]:
Yeah, to a degree.
Mike [01:07:58]:
But then when you stopped it, you stopped doing it, right?
Phillip [01:08:00]:
Yeah, but did you learn anything from that?
Eldar [01:08:02]:
I did. I did.
Phillip [01:08:03]:
Do you still take it with you now?
Eldar [01:08:05]:
Yes, I do.
Phillip [01:08:06]:
Knowledge?
Eldar [01:08:06]:
I do.
Phillip [01:08:06]:
So, to me, that's the win.
Eldar [01:08:07]:
That's the win. You're right.
Eldar [01:08:08]:
Yeah.
Eldar [01:08:09]:
And I could tell you what this knowledge is right now.
Phillip [01:08:10]:
So that's the win.
Eldar [01:08:12]:
I could tell you this knowledge right now, and it was the most important thing I took from him.
Phillip [01:08:16]:
Okay, so if you told me nothing, then I would say, then you lost.
Eldar [01:08:18]:
There you go.
Eldar [01:08:18]:
There you go.
Eldar [01:08:19]:
You see that and agree with for sure.
Mike [01:08:21]:
Definitely important. But if you have the knowledge and you're not doing anything, that's also. How do you guys value that?
Eldar [01:08:26]:
Who said you're not doing it?
Phillip [01:08:27]:
Yeah, but then that means in the.
Mike [01:08:28]:
Beginning, I'm not doing that.
Eldar [01:08:29]:
No, that's not the knowledge.
Phillip [01:08:31]:
But that means that in the beginning.
Eldar [01:08:32]:
Teach me to go to the gym.
Phillip [01:08:33]:
I know that this person's expectation level in the beginning would have had to been like, hey, when he teaches me whatever he's going to teach me, I'm going to do everything that he taught me and I'm going to do this even when he's not around. If that's your level of expectation, I think that's unrealistic and I don't think that should be what you're trying to get from it.
Eldar [01:08:50]:
No.
Phillip [01:08:50]:
If you're saying I'm trying to be a healthier person and I'm allowing this person who has a healthy lifestyle to influence me, if I leave with one healthy tip that I can put berries in my shaker like some dumb, I.
Eldar [01:09:02]:
Could give you an example. Okay, there you go, DJ. And I think this might tie to what you wanted, an example, a real life example where you learned something completely different than you actually thought in practice.
Eldar [01:09:12]:
Right?
Eldar [01:09:12]:
I was coming here to learn muscle ups and doing these things on the bar, but I've learned from him, actually. He said, eldar, sometimes I was motivated to do more. I'm used to coming and doing about an hour, maybe an hour, 15 hours and 30 minutes workouts myself. Before I met Andre, we came sometimes to the park and we did a workout only 30, 40 minutes long. And I'm like, andre, I still have energy. You know what I mean? Let's keep going. He goes, no. I'm like, why? He goes, we might get hurt.
Eldar [01:09:40]:
If we get hurt, we won't come back tomorrow, and you won't come back for next two weeks or a month. Guess what? You're going to lose everything. We'd rather come back tomorrow and be more consistent. That still stuck with me. Ten years later.
Phillip [01:09:51]:
I do 1520 minutes workouts now, where I used to do hour, hour and a half workouts. You see, when you get older, that's to me, such a powerful lesson of, you'd rather do something a couple of times per week consistently than to do one or two per week at a crazy amount of high energy. And then do you have the potential to get injured or overwork your muscles? You see, that's crazy smart.
Eldar [01:10:14]:
You see?
Eldar [01:10:14]:
Yeah.
Eldar [01:10:15]:
And that's what I've learned from him. And nonetheless, we still got gains. We still felt good, and we did more consistently. This is what I took from him. Aside from the little techniques about how to pull yourself up on the bar. Sure. I learned those, too.
Mike [01:10:28]:
But are you implementing that which I've learned from him?
Eldar [01:10:30]:
Well, of course.
Mike [01:10:31]:
But if you're not going to the gym, how are you implementing it?
Eldar [01:10:33]:
What are you talking about? When I'm not going to the gym, Mike?
Mike [01:10:36]:
No, I'm saying how many years I've.
Eldar [01:10:38]:
Been going to the gym.
Mike [01:10:39]:
Mike, you're saying you're going to gym consistently and working out.
Eldar [01:10:42]:
No.
Phillip [01:10:42]:
From that example, you'd have to say, is Eldar still doing hour and a half plus workout?
Eldar [01:10:46]:
No, I don't. When I do go, I go for 30 minutes.
Mike [01:10:50]:
Workouts is not the timing, it's the consistency.
Phillip [01:10:53]:
No, but from this specific example, it.
Mike [01:10:55]:
Would consist the time.
Eldar [01:10:57]:
No point, Mike.
Phillip [01:10:58]:
No. From this specific example, Eldar was going and saying, hey, Andre, I want to keep working out. And he's like, no, 30 or 40 minutes is good. If you told me that Eldar, no.
Mike [01:11:10]:
But he didn't just say 30 or 40 minutes is good. Just, okay, that's it. End the story. There's a reason why 30 or 40, it's good. It's because you can keep consistently coming back.
Eldar [01:11:18]:
No.
Eldar [01:11:19]:
He said the most important thing is not to get hurt.
Mike [01:11:20]:
Not get hurt coming back.
Eldar [01:11:23]:
No.
Phillip [01:11:23]:
So even if he goes once, I.
Eldar [01:11:25]:
Don'T remember getting hurt. My workouts after Andre, I don't.
Phillip [01:11:28]:
So even if he goes 30 or 40 minutes once or twice per week, it doesn't matter the amount. It means that he's not getting injured and he's allowing himself the opportunity to. Whether he goes or not doesn't matter.
Mike [01:11:42]:
What do you mean it doesn't matter?
Phillip [01:11:43]:
It doesn't matter because what's the point? He gained the knowledge to be able to have the opportunity to do this. Now he can teach it or he can take it for himself if he doesn't use it.
Mike [01:11:54]:
Potential is good.
Phillip [01:11:55]:
That's on him. He got the opportunity to get this knowledge.
Mike [01:11:59]:
I understand that he taught him a new way to work out, but if you don't go and work out the knowledge, is it not useless? Yeah, but he's saying no.
Eldar [01:12:08]:
When did I stop working out, Mike?
Mike [01:12:10]:
Well, I think we have an issue of consistency working out, Mike.
Eldar [01:12:13]:
When did we stop working out?
Mike [01:12:14]:
No, we haven't. But consistently, no, we don't have a consistent.
Eldar [01:12:17]:
What is your definition of consistently, Mike? I've been working out consistently all my life. What's your definition?
Mike [01:12:24]:
Yeah, I don't know, at least once or twice a week.
Eldar [01:12:28]:
You see that?
Mike [01:12:28]:
I would say consistent.
Eldar [01:12:29]:
You know what I'm saying? I've definitely been doing that.
Eldar [01:12:31]:
Yeah.
Eldar [01:12:32]:
Basketball is working out, gardening is working out, working out on bars, pull ups, working out. That's all. Working out. Yoga is working out. All that stuff is working out. Now, if I'm inconsistent because I got injured.
Mike [01:12:47]:
I'm not going to be like totally encounter.
Eldar [01:12:49]:
Yeah.
Eldar [01:12:49]:
You know what I'm saying?
Eldar [01:12:50]:
Yeah.
Phillip [01:12:50]:
I think the knowledge is the main thing that you get from this. And to me, the application afterwards is irrelevant for this specific example.
Mike [01:13:01]:
And I think that piece of knowledge.
Eldar [01:13:03]:
That piece of knowledge stayed with me till this day that made an impact out of all the things that I've learned.
Phillip [01:13:09]:
But see, to me, the way that I think the benefits are exponential from that, where they don't have to be specific to him having to work out consistently. Even if you say he didn't, let's.
Mike [01:13:20]:
Say he never worked out after that.
Eldar [01:13:22]:
Exactly.
Phillip [01:13:22]:
So let's go with that. So let's go. He never worked out after that. That knowledge that he got was that he went into a situation and that he got unexpected knowledge from that. To me, that tidbit can be applied to something else that maybe be more open to learning any other situation.
Eldar [01:13:37]:
Sure.
Phillip [01:13:38]:
So to me.
Mike [01:13:41]:
Patience is not patience everywhere. You could be patient with your girlfriend and not patient with your dog and not patient with your employees, but patient with your parents. Patience is not patience like universally.
Phillip [01:13:51]:
Yeah, but no.
Eldar [01:13:52]:
What do you mean? It should be universal.
Phillip [01:13:53]:
No, but let's say, no. Wouldn't in this example if somebody was even not that patient after this example of learning and saying, hey, I went in to learn like muscle ups, but what happened was I learned something else about working out a certain amount of time. I would take that and say, hey, you know what? If I go into other situations, I'm probably going to be more open to being patient to somebody else to say, hey, I might be going in to say, listen, about cooking, but maybe my mom teaches me about relationships without even trying. That's how I would look at this situation. So I think the power of this specific example is that you went in to get some body of knowledge about pull ups, but you got another body of knowledge that you took and that you still have to this day. To me, whether you apply that or not, I think it's in you and it can be applied to other things that you might not even know about. So I don't think the actual application of working out consistently is important in this example to gain something.
Eldar [01:14:54]:
Yeah, I think I did.
Phillip [01:14:55]:
Yeah, I think you did awesome.
Eldar [01:14:56]:
This example. I definitely did.
Phillip [01:14:58]:
I think you did.
Eldar [01:14:58]:
Awesome. That's what I said. I think that's an example for you, DJ, that you probably thought about that you might.
Mike [01:15:09]:
But that example, again, it's specific to the area. It's specific maybe to working out, but in other areas, it's not the case.
Eldar [01:15:15]:
Yeah, but if you want to apply.
Eldar [01:15:17]:
To other things, Mike, it's applicable 100% is.
Eldar [01:15:21]:
That's what I'm saying.
Mike [01:15:21]:
But if you're not applying it, then it's not helping you.
Eldar [01:15:24]:
Right.
Eldar [01:15:24]:
Well, if I really sit down and think hard, I could tell you that I'm applying it in many different areas of my life.
Mike [01:15:30]:
I agree with you for sure.
Eldar [01:15:32]:
So then what are you talking about? This knowledge not being applicable?
Phillip [01:15:34]:
Yeah, but do you think it's even important to have to apply this? Like, based off of what you told me, I think you getting that knowledge to me, that knowledge.
Eldar [01:15:44]:
And if it's the benefits to you, you should apply it and you do apply it.
Mike [01:15:48]:
No, but naturally.
Phillip [01:15:49]:
No, but I'm saying in this particular.
Mike [01:15:51]:
You could be just practicing philosophy and never leave your couch and have all the knowledge in the world. But if you don't put it into exercise, I'm not sure.
Phillip [01:16:01]:
Yeah, but going into it, he said he wanted to learn something, right?
Mike [01:16:04]:
No, we're not talking about this example now. We're just trying to understand the idea of you're getting knowledge about something.
Eldar [01:16:10]:
Right.
Mike [01:16:10]:
And is it important or not to apply it?
Phillip [01:16:13]:
That's a totally different conversation, though.
Mike [01:16:15]:
Well, that's the discrepancy that we're having.
Phillip [01:16:19]:
I think it's a totally different conversation.
Eldar [01:16:21]:
Well, I'm not sure. What issue were you having with this?
Eldar [01:16:24]:
I don't understand.
Phillip [01:16:25]:
He's saying that without the application of the knowledge, then you're my example wasn't.
Eldar [01:16:30]:
The actual application of the knowledge. So what's the issue?
Phillip [01:16:33]:
So I guess we're going in the extreme and saying, if this person gained the knowledge, I think that's impossible. And did nothing.
Eldar [01:16:38]:
I think that's impossible.
Eldar [01:16:38]:
Yeah.
Phillip [01:16:40]:
So it's almost like the example of when you know something? You can't unknow it.
Eldar [01:16:44]:
Yeah.
Eldar [01:16:45]:
You can't.
Eldar [01:16:45]:
With you.
Eldar [01:16:46]:
Yeah, it's with you.
Eldar [01:16:47]:
Yeah.
Phillip [01:16:47]:
So I agree too. I think that's almost like, you can't lose with this. You got it?
Eldar [01:16:52]:
Yeah.
Eldar [01:16:52]:
I've used his example of this knowledge, of taking it.
Phillip [01:16:55]:
I've heard you tell me this before.
Eldar [01:16:57]:
Also many times in different areas, too. Hey, don't clean your whole house in one day. Clean 10% of your house each day. You'll get to 100% in ten days. This is as easy as it gets.
Phillip [01:17:12]:
So what if Eldar then is able to become a teacher and say, he said that to me and opened up my mind without even having to think for me asking. And I was like, oh, shit, I didn't realize that. So almost he can become a teacher. So whether maybe he's applying it for himself and he's maybe not being consistent with it, I think he can then put himself in a position to then teach other people with the knowledge. So I still think it's beneficial there.
Mike [01:17:35]:
Yeah, for sure.
Eldar [01:17:36]:
I don't think knowledge solidifies by consistency, guys.
Phillip [01:17:40]:
I don't think so either.
Eldar [01:17:41]:
No, knowledge is knowledge outside of consistency.
Eldar [01:17:43]:
Yeah.
Phillip [01:17:44]:
Like, whether you apply it or not to me is not going to tell me if you want or not.
Eldar [01:17:48]:
No.
Eldar [01:17:49]:
Whether or not you benefit from applicable knowledge is a different conversation. Yeah, sure. You have a body of knowledge, but you never put it in practice. In reality, then you just don't benefit from that, from applying the knowledge. Does it mean that the knowledge is not knowledge?
Mike [01:18:03]:
No, it's definitely knowledge. But what's the point of knowledge if you're not applying it?
Eldar [01:18:08]:
I mean, I don't think there is a point. There's no point. What do you mean, join it?
Mike [01:18:16]:
Yeah, that's what I'm saying.
Eldar [01:18:17]:
I don't think knowledge is you have.
Phillip [01:18:19]:
It, you got something. It's like a gift. Like you got the thing.
Eldar [01:18:23]:
Yeah, what's the point of it? What other point of it?
Mike [01:18:26]:
If he's saying it's a gift, you're saying, what's the point?
Eldar [01:18:29]:
You're asking me, what's the point? I'm like, yeah, what's the point of it if it's not applied?
Mike [01:18:33]:
That's what I'm saying.
Eldar [01:18:34]:
I don't think knowledge itself is like, hey, I'm here. No, knowledge doesn't care about whether or not you use it or not.
Mike [01:18:44]:
So it doesn't matter if you have this knowledge, if you don't put it into practice, if you put into practice, doesn't matter.
Eldar [01:18:51]:
I don't think knowledge cares about being put into practice.
Mike [01:18:55]:
Knowledge does not care.
Eldar [01:18:55]:
But for you, as an individual, I.
Eldar [01:18:57]:
Think it's in your best interest to put it in your practice. But if you don't, then it's on you. It's not on the knowledge.
Mike [01:19:03]:
Oh, yeah, that's for sure. Knowledge is a separate end.
Phillip [01:19:05]:
You have to get the knowledge. Remember we talked about courage and the comedian, right? So if this guy wanted to be intelligent, he needed the knowledge to realize that. Okay, if comedian a versus comedian B, comedian a gathered all of his friends before he went on stage first and said, hey, guys, can I put on this act, like, in front of all you guys? He has the knowledge to realize that if I do my due diligence and I practice more when I go on stage, yeah, I'm going to be less likely to be nervous and miss. Now, guy two, he has no knowledge, and he goes on stage and he wings it.
Eldar [01:19:45]:
Right?
Phillip [01:19:46]:
So to me, having three who has.
Mike [01:19:48]:
The knowledge and doesn't go on the.
Phillip [01:19:50]:
Stage is a waste of talent. But you have knowledge.
Mike [01:19:55]:
To me, whether you apply itself is not valuable.
Eldar [01:20:00]:
You can't say that because.
Mike [01:20:01]:
No, if the person is not step one, practice.
Phillip [01:20:03]:
No, it's step one.
Mike [01:20:04]:
No, I agree. If the person is not put into practice, knowledge is not useful. Yes or no? That's the question I'm trying to.
Phillip [01:20:11]:
No, but you're saying it's knowledge away.
Eldar [01:20:13]:
Why do you want to make that statement in the first.
Mike [01:20:14]:
No, I'm asking that question.
Phillip [01:20:15]:
No, I'm saying you can't look at it as like, it's like a nothing. Because it's a step to, maybe they don't use it, or maybe eventually they do down the line. But from going from nothing to taking the action, we all agree that you have to have courage, and you have to almost be stupid and unintelligent to then take the action. So to me, it's like, if you get the knowledge, the next step, if you do take that action now, you have the knowledge there, and you can't unknow that knowledge. So to me, it's like looking at that knowledge, to me, it's like a step. It's like a step into the direction of, like, when you take that action, then you can be taking an intelligent action that doesn't have to rely on courage. That's how I look at the knowledge. So I don't look at the knowledge as like, if I'm not taking action, it's a bad thing.
Phillip [01:21:01]:
It's like it's like the thing that I have to gather in order to take the next actionable step with intelligence.
Eldar [01:21:09]:
Yeah.
Phillip [01:21:09]:
Now, when I do take the action, if I do choose to take it, I'm going to take it with intelligence and knowledge.
Eldar [01:21:16]:
Yeah.
Phillip [01:21:16]:
So I don't look at the knowledge without action as nothing.
Eldar [01:21:22]:
Well, it's nothing. It's just information. I told you. Hey, Philip, this is a sedimentary rock, right? You have this, like. Okay, this rock that looks like this is a sedimentary rock.
Eldar [01:21:35]:
Yeah.
Eldar [01:21:35]:
And you go about your life and never mention this ever again or never put this into.
Eldar [01:21:40]:
Right.
Eldar [01:21:41]:
Like, so what? It's just that.
Phillip [01:21:44]:
How many people go on Google and just look at a search and they gain knowledge?
Eldar [01:21:47]:
They just get information.
Phillip [01:21:48]:
And they get information.
Eldar [01:21:49]:
Exactly. What are we talking about?
Phillip [01:21:52]:
Yeah, sure.
Eldar [01:21:53]:
You know this. You know of this rock. You have this knowledge. But so what? You know what I mean? If one day you met a girl who's into rocks and you're like, yo, I know this sedimentary rock, and you finally put your knowledge into practice and fucking impress her.
Eldar [01:22:09]:
Swoon her.
Eldar [01:22:09]:
Yeah, swoosh her. Then it's like, you put that knowledge into practice. Cool.
Eldar [01:22:14]:
All right.
Eldar [01:22:15]:
Yeah. I don't understand. What's the point?
Mike [01:22:17]:
No, I don't remember. We already went off the track.
Phillip [01:22:19]:
No, you were saying that knowledge without action is like. It's invaluable. Yeah, no value.
Mike [01:22:27]:
But I'm not sure how we got to this point. Doesn't matter.
Phillip [01:22:33]:
No, I think knowledge is valuable without action, and I think gaining knowledge from.
Mike [01:22:39]:
How is it valuable without action? Even though I would like to get back to the topic, but.
Eldar [01:22:47]:
I don't know. I don't know.
Phillip [01:22:49]:
No, you just gave an example. You have it in your arsenal.
Eldar [01:22:52]:
I don't know, Mike. I don't know how knowledge is valuable without.
Eldar [01:22:54]:
Actually. I don't know.
Mike [01:22:55]:
Yeah, I don't know either. But he's saying it is the valuable.
Eldar [01:22:58]:
No, that's where I disagree with him there. But like I said, so what? It's just a body of knowledge. Yeah, maybe one day you pull it out.
DJ [01:23:06]:
No, I think that thing about knowledge, that is something you could still potentially pull out versus.
Mike [01:23:12]:
So what?
DJ [01:23:12]:
Yeah, but that's the thing you're saying.
Mike [01:23:14]:
Even if you.
DJ [01:23:15]:
But that's what I'm saying.
Mike [01:23:17]:
It's nothing. Yeah. A person. You have a potential to be a millionaire, but that doesn't mean anything.
Phillip [01:23:22]:
No, I'm talking about getting something from that example again, going back my example.
Eldar [01:23:27]:
I actually used the knowledge that I got and I practiced it. I continue to esteem it.
Eldar [01:23:31]:
Right.
Eldar [01:23:32]:
And I see the benefits of it.
Phillip [01:23:33]:
Yeah, but I'm saying in your example, even if you just got that knowledge and you left with an unexpected knowledge from something that to me you didn't know you were going to get, I think whether you apply that or not, irrelevant. I think the knowledge itself, in that example of you meeting with him, trying to do pull ups and then getting that 30, 40 minutes is a sufficient workout. I think that to me is like a lesson and knowledge, and you can take that to other places if you take it.
Mike [01:24:00]:
No, but see.
Phillip [01:24:03]:
Let'S even say if he doesn't take it to other places, he has that body of knowledge. And when the time comes, if he wants.
Mike [01:24:21]:
Give me a clippings of your fingernails. I never had it before. Those things, they don't carry any weight, they don't have any value.
Eldar [01:24:27]:
Like, so what?
Mike [01:24:27]:
Philip, I know a lot of you.
Phillip [01:24:30]:
I still think you got something from it.
Mike [01:24:32]:
Yeah, but learning, okay, there's knowledge is sure like the philosophy.
Eldar [01:24:36]:
I touched this today, at this time, it's 125. Always touch this. Now you know.
Eldar [01:24:43]:
So what?
Eldar [01:24:43]:
You know what I mean?
Phillip [01:24:44]:
Yeah, maybe. So what? But it is something.
Eldar [01:24:46]:
It's information.
Phillip [01:24:48]:
You got something from somebody that you didn't have.
Mike [01:24:51]:
We're definitely not debating that. They spoke words.
Phillip [01:24:54]:
Yes, he got something that he didn't have before me. Whether he uses it or not is irrelevant. Now, if he does apply it, then we can all agree that it's definitely going to be more sense. That's the obvious. But we're saying that the knowledge itself is nothing. I'm saying that it's something. Now, you might not be able to do much with it if you don't apply it, but he did get something that he didn't have before.
Mike [01:25:16]:
You definitely won't be able to do anything if you don't apply it, unless you just want to keep saying it in your head.
DJ [01:25:23]:
But you did get something at that point. What you're saying, Mike.
Mike [01:25:26]:
Sorry, DJ, I didn't hear you.
DJ [01:25:27]:
Doesn't it matter then what the individual thinks of what knowledge is then, if that's how you're saying it? Because I can't. Trying to understand why.
Eldar [01:25:36]:
Yeah, he might have more of a value on.
Phillip [01:25:38]:
You'd have to define knowledge. You have to define knowledge.
Eldar [01:25:41]:
Exactly.
Phillip [01:25:41]:
And then you have to say, what's my level of value on knowledge and what's his? And his is clearly not as high as mine, because without application, he's saying knowledge is like useless. I might as well just give him my fingernail.
Eldar [01:25:55]:
Knowledge of this fucking thing.
Phillip [01:25:57]:
And I'm saying if he gave you that kind of knowledge, it made you feel some kind of way, and it made you happy in that moment. That's important.
Eldar [01:26:04]:
Yes.
Eldar [01:26:06]:
I think that if that happened, as soon as you received that body of knowledge and made you feel a certain type of way, you got something out of it.
Phillip [01:26:14]:
Yeah, I feel like I got something.
Eldar [01:26:15]:
This is no longer just a piece of information like I just showed you. Hey, I just touched this.
Eldar [01:26:19]:
Yes.
Phillip [01:26:19]:
That's all I'm saying. This time I feel like I'm getting something when somebody teaches me something.
Eldar [01:26:23]:
Sure.
Phillip [01:26:23]:
Now, whether I apply it or not, that's on me. That's what I was saying. I think that's a different conversation. But if somebody's giving you knowledge, I think knowledge is a gift, and then what you do with it is on you. I look at knowledge differently.
Eldar [01:26:36]:
How do we get here? Yeah.
Mike [01:26:38]:
I don't know.
Eldar [01:26:39]:
You threw us in the conundrum, Mike.
Mike [01:26:41]:
Yeah, it's good I did, because Phil was saying some crazy stuff.
Eldar [01:26:43]:
Okay, fine. You had a problem with seeing.
Phillip [01:26:49]:
I'm trying to knowledge for knowledge.
Eldar [01:26:50]:
No, he had a problem with. Look, why can't you govern yourself?
Mike [01:26:55]:
Yes.
Eldar [01:26:57]:
I'm saying that there is something there in the dynamic of a teacher and student relationship that you can tap into, that the things that you usually don't do, procrastinate on and avoid, scared of can be accomplished through this dynamic. Yeah, this is what I'm trying to say.
Mike [01:27:15]:
This started with the respecting.
Eldar [01:27:17]:
Yes.
Mike [01:27:17]:
And then it went to knowledge, and then it went to discipline. Discipline, yeah, the respecting, that was the thing that was like, I wasn't sure if that's right. Should you respect somebody else's with the same overall, your own?
Eldar [01:27:34]:
Well, yeah, because like I said, a lot of times I think we behave in such a way where we're polite to ourselves. I mean, we're polite to others.
Eldar [01:27:45]:
Right.
Eldar [01:27:45]:
Externally, but we're bad internally to ourselves.
Mike [01:27:49]:
But how does that logically make sense?
Eldar [01:27:52]:
Because of what we esteem.
Mike [01:27:55]:
It's a value proposition, but it's a logical thing. Right?
Eldar [01:28:01]:
What do you mean? It's very logical. I just explained you the logic. Is it right or wrong? I'm not sure. I'm not sure.
Mike [01:28:09]:
Maybe that's the question.
Eldar [01:28:10]:
Yeah, it's definitely logical. This is what we do.
Mike [01:28:12]:
Yeah, it's logical. Maybe the question is right or wrong.
Eldar [01:28:15]:
Yeah.
Eldar [01:28:16]:
Is it right or wrong? Probably, yeah. It's probably not the best way to go about things, esteeming external things before esteeming yourself. But I think that the reason why we have to exteem external things first is because maybe because of our arrogance, that we need to get humble, we need to be taught, we need to be okay with the student dynamic. Well, of course. Because like I said, there's a body of knowledge that you just can't get.
Eldar [01:28:48]:
Right.
Eldar [01:28:48]:
Just like, just got. You just get right away and everywhere. Sometimes you have to go to the library. Sometimes you have to go to Google.
Eldar [01:28:56]:
Right.
Eldar [01:28:57]:
And that alone is a humbling experience as just going to the library.
Eldar [01:29:03]:
Right.
Eldar [01:29:03]:
Picking up a book and saying, oh, who's the author? Oh, the author wrote this. You still to a degree as a student of that body of knowledge that that person put in.
Eldar [01:29:12]:
That's for sure.
Eldar [01:29:13]:
So even your research, there's still a thing in the research. If you really think about the research process, there is a dynamic of a learner.
Mike [01:29:25]:
Well, 100%. You're not going to just all of a sudden be like, yo, I know all the answers.
Eldar [01:29:29]:
If you start inventing shit right here from this carpet or whatever, then I'm like, okay, cool. This guy is onto some shit. Crazy shit. You know what I mean? Like, you start giving me the answers from here to there to there. Oh, wow. Okay, cool.
Mike [01:29:40]:
But I could also tap into the universe.
Eldar [01:29:42]:
Well, yeah, sure.
Mike [01:29:43]:
Show us these tricks one day after.
Eldar [01:29:47]:
A couple of whiskeys, right?
Eldar [01:29:48]:
Whiskeys, yeah.
Eldar [01:29:49]:
Single malt.
Mike [01:29:50]:
Single, yeah.
Eldar [01:29:52]:
You know what I'm saying?
Mike [01:29:53]:
No, I know what you're saying. I'm just trying to think of the difference, of not saying I'm siding with one thing or another. I'm, in a way, playing the advocate.
Eldar [01:30:02]:
What problem are you having? That the fact that we sometimes are. We can use respect, tap into respect. Like I said, that dynamic of a student teacher relationship in order to level ourselves up. What's the problem with that?
Mike [01:30:17]:
The problem with it, you seem to.
Eldar [01:30:20]:
Have a problem with.
Mike [01:30:22]:
Yeah.
Eldar [01:30:23]:
Is it because you're deviant?
Mike [01:30:25]:
Maybe I'm deviant, but maybe it's that position. Maybe I'm arrogant, maybe I'm egotistical. Maybe it's a position of lack of my own power, knowing that I can go do it.
Eldar [01:30:34]:
Well, you know your example. You know how we always laugh about you, Mike? We start something, right? Give you guys example, right? Me and Mike will buy a fucking desk drawer together, right? And now we have to put this thing together. It's all broken apart. It's a thousand little fucking screws everywhere. And there's a booklet.
Eldar [01:30:54]:
Okay.
Eldar [01:30:54]:
The first thing I go to, right, I'm like, okay, let's open the book and go step by step. Mike's like, nah, let's do the fucking pieces. He starts fucking like modeling this bitch, right? And sure, sometimes we get to a place where we complete the shit, right? However, it's usually longer. It's usually a lot more cursing, you know what I mean? There's like some kind of a conundrum going on. Something breaks, you know what I mean? But we get there. Hold on 1 second. I'm giving you your props. I'll give you your props.
Eldar [01:31:22]:
I'll give you your flowers, you know what I mean? And he likes to maybe learn this way or experiment and stuff like that and go on this journey of cursing and fucking spitting at each other and not knowing what the fuck is going on. But he gets there, right? That's one way of getting there. But another way is more humble. Way to just say is to open the book and sit there and follow instructions. Because then you don't have to redo it. You don't have to waste 3 hours of your time or whatever it is, right. I guess it's what you value though, too. Maybe Mike values the journey of this conundrum for 3 hours versus somebody who can do the same thing in 30 minutes by following instructions.
Eldar [01:31:56]:
Let's just say, right? So there's also something there. It depends on what you like or what you want, right? But then you have to argue, do you really like it? You have to be honest with yourself. You rather do this thing in 30 minutes or you rather do this thing in 3 hours and trying to figure this thing out. Be honest.
Eldar [01:32:14]:
Right.
Eldar [01:32:15]:
Because if you're cursing and kicking things, you're probably not enjoying the process. But if you're smiling and being humble internally, like, oh, I didn't know this, then 3 hours might be a good journey.
Mike [01:32:27]:
You're saying I'll be kicking shit.
Eldar [01:32:28]:
I'm just saying, you know my example. Yeah, you know my example. I know you're the type to like to figure things out.
Mike [01:32:34]:
I definitely don't like the instructions. Yeah, but that's not because I don't like. Not because that is because I don't have the ability to read them and.
Eldar [01:32:43]:
They'Re always, why not? I think exactly what we're talking about, about the student dynamic relationship is to be able to focus and read the instructions of a teacher.
Mike [01:32:56]:
Yeah, no, it's possible. Lack of patience and lack of focus.
Eldar [01:32:59]:
Why?
Eldar [01:32:59]:
Right. Why?
Eldar [01:33:00]:
Where I'm saying that I think there's something there, I cannot yet put it all into fucking words and tell you all the benefits about it because I'm just thinking about it myself. But I think that dynamic, if done gracefully with a bowed head, get you places outside of your own ego, is what I'm trying to say.
Eldar [01:33:23]:
Right.
Eldar [01:33:23]:
If your ego is to tell you, fuck. Fuck this shit, I don't need instructions. You fucking cursing at yourself, you stressing out and stuff like that, I think that part can be skipped. I think I can get to a place where I figure out my own body but through kicking and screaming. But there's some guy out there right now who's a nut, right? Who's a nut about physiology.
Mike [01:33:45]:
How do you know that that's not going to be a kicking and screaming process too?
Eldar [01:33:49]:
I think that's what I'm saying. That it might be, but it might be alleviated because somebody else is with you, and there's dynamic there. There's something. There's gold in that dynamic, is what I'm trying to say.
Mike [01:34:01]:
Yeah.
Eldar [01:34:02]:
If taken seriously, if taken properly, taking, like Philip said, with focus, you want to make sure that the teacher doesn't stop fucking rambling about cars when you're trying to learn code, right? Start talking about traveling. No, I want to fucking learn code. Go back to code, right?
Eldar [01:34:18]:
Focus. Right?
Eldar [01:34:20]:
Obviously you want to have a competent teacher, right? Maybe a strict teacher in that matter. I've never thought that I would say this out loud after fucking thinking about this shit, but strict teachers might be onto something. I've hated strict teachers all my life. Same, you see? Yeah, we all have the same shit. We cut class, we got bad grades. This is misfits. This is a room of misfits. But there might be something there.
Eldar [01:34:51]:
So if I have my own kids, right, what do I teach them? Don't listen to them and be a misfit. Learn the hard way. Or do I tell them to, let's be humble and let's really pay attention to what's actually going on and give them the right reason to actually be humble. Or do I give them the choice?
Eldar [01:35:12]:
Right?
Mike [01:35:13]:
Now the question is, like, what you're saying with the teacher. You have to come in there, right? For example, if you come in there, you're allowed to ask questions. So you would like to be able to know what you're doing and how this thing works if you have a curiosity.
Eldar [01:35:28]:
But you have to be careful. You have to be careful because as Philip mentioned, you can start saying, like, hey, this is the way I work, and these are my prerequisites.
Mike [01:35:37]:
No, but if the guy tells you, like, hey, you got to put this fucking tiger balm on your toe at 11:00 p.m. And let it stay for 15 minutes and then wash it off with fucking vinegar. Be like, oh, okay, that's fine, but can you explain to me how that works? If you're curious about understanding, right. You're not going to tell your kids.
Eldar [01:35:56]:
Like, your kids, if you won't do.
Mike [01:35:58]:
This, go do that.
Eldar [01:35:59]:
No, you have to explain. No, I think that you should ask questions for sure. If you're genuinely curious.
Mike [01:36:05]:
That's what I'm saying.
Eldar [01:36:06]:
You should ask.
Mike [01:36:06]:
The curiosity should be there to understand what's happening in the process.
Eldar [01:36:10]:
But it shouldn't come from an arrogant place. It shouldn't come from an arrogant place where you're almost challenging. Challenging the individual that's teaching you.
Mike [01:36:19]:
No, 100%.
Eldar [01:36:20]:
You know what I'm saying?
Mike [01:36:21]:
I know what you're saying.
Eldar [01:36:22]:
Okay, cool. Because I can see myself how I can get into the dynamic, and next thing you know, the roles have switched.
Eldar [01:36:28]:
Yeah.
Mike [01:36:28]:
Like, the respect is gone.
Eldar [01:36:29]:
That's right. I think that's a dangerous place for a student.
Eldar [01:36:34]:
Yeah, danger.
Mike [01:36:35]:
But how do you. Yeah, I guess you can't predict everything. But I guess being respectful at all times, being conscious and aware in all the moments is super necessary in this kind of dynamic so that you don't break any lines that shouldn't be crossed.
Eldar [01:36:54]:
That's right.
Mike [01:36:55]:
Because it could become very dangerous.
Eldar [01:36:57]:
That's right.
Mike [01:36:57]:
The friendship line. Like, even me and you going now, if we go together to a trainer, that might be a recipe for disaster because we have fun. We don't take shit seriously. Now we're going to come in there where we need to be serious. We're going to mush the whole thing potentially.
Eldar [01:37:10]:
Well, no, it depends on what we want. We will set our own rules of engagement. That's what I'm saying. I think me and you are in this journey together where we're finding out that, hey, maybe this might be an option for us.
Mike [01:37:22]:
Yeah. But we also have to come in from a different door because our typical door. Having fun here. We have to be like, yo, we're going to be very serious. We're going to be very strict, very respectful and value this relationship the way we typically don't engage.
Eldar [01:37:37]:
If it's going to take us to be more serious in order to give respect. Absolutely.
Eldar [01:37:42]:
Yeah.
Mike [01:37:42]:
That's what I'm saying.
Eldar [01:37:44]:
That's what we're after. If we've come to an understanding that, guys, look, the truth of the matter is we realize that through respect for our teacher, whoever it's going to be in swimming or nutrition, whatever you guys want to do, code.
Eldar [01:37:58]:
Right.
Eldar [01:37:58]:
We realize that respect is the most important thing I have to respect. Therefore, I have to be careful with my fucking nonsense shenanigans that I usually do in order to break that respect. 100%.
Mike [01:38:09]:
Yeah, that's what I'm saying.
Eldar [01:38:10]:
100%.
Mike [01:38:11]:
And that's important to think about in advance.
Eldar [01:38:13]:
Yeah.
Mike [01:38:13]:
Which I think we're trying to do now, of course. But I think, yeah, that's how you protect the relationship.
Eldar [01:38:19]:
Yes.
Eldar [01:38:20]:
And I wouldn't want to go into a relationship any other ways without understanding.
Mike [01:38:23]:
But I also think this thing we're talking about extends. You can maybe analyze your relationship with your wife because you also have these things that you're not willing to cross. These certain lines. Boundaries.
Eldar [01:38:33]:
Correct.
Mike [01:38:33]:
That you're not willing to cross. There's funny, funny stuff.
Eldar [01:38:36]:
That's right.
Mike [01:38:36]:
But there are certain things that are very strict, very serious, and you're not going to allow that to cross over. Cross over. So then now it's like, open the floodgates to becomes a shit show. Yeah, that's interesting.
Eldar [01:38:53]:
That's only if you want to do it. And I'm not telling you that I'm over here, like, ready to jump, but something tells me that I want to fucking at least try it out.
Eldar [01:39:01]:
No.
Mike [01:39:02]:
Yeah.
Eldar [01:39:02]:
You know what I'm saying?
Mike [01:39:03]:
I agree with you for sure.
Eldar [01:39:04]:
And that's part of what we fucking do here anyway. We have the ability to choose what we want to fucking do. We want to have fun. We make jokes and laugh. We want to be serious. We can be serious. It's our choice. And I think that ultimately, to be an empowered human being is to choose which act to put on for which reasons and have really clear, defined goals for yourself.
Eldar [01:39:28]:
To say, this is where I want to go. I think this is where it's going to get me. Okay, cool. Let's do it. Oh, shit.
Eldar [01:39:34]:
It worked.
Eldar [01:39:35]:
And I got there. And then you reap the benefits of your fucking labor. You know what I'm saying? And obviously, I don't want the labor to be fucking labor still. I still want it to be from a place where you want to do it. And I think that in respect, like I said, there can be that thing I want to try that, I guess.
Mike [01:39:54]:
Because we're starting with already some knowledge or idea that we have some knowledge. It's a different mental conversation versus, like, I'm brand new.
Eldar [01:40:03]:
Like, oh, that's why I gave an example of swimming, Mike.
Eldar [01:40:06]:
Yes.
Eldar [01:40:06]:
That might be where we want to start. Let's pick fucking rock climbing. I don't know. Fucking paragliding for you then, bro. This guy, man, you got to be careful with him.
Mike [01:40:18]:
Golfer, apparently.
Eldar [01:40:19]:
Yeah.
Eldar [01:40:19]:
You have to be like, how about a tree cutter? Why don't you go cut trees? You know what I mean? Or something like that. Like something weird, like a marble expert or something. Yes. There you go.
Mike [01:40:30]:
No, in the workout world, in the.
Eldar [01:40:32]:
World where you want to, in the.
Mike [01:40:34]:
Fitness and health and nutrition, where would.
Eldar [01:40:37]:
You be completely new and completely enamored by, like, Moitai. He'd done that, too. He's a nut, bro. This guy's a nut.
Mike [01:40:46]:
Jiu jitsu.
Eldar [01:40:46]:
Yeah.
Mike [01:40:47]:
I never done.
DJ [01:40:48]:
What about boxing?
Mike [01:40:50]:
I did karate when I was young.
Eldar [01:40:51]:
But obviously that's a long time ago.
Mike [01:40:53]:
Yeah, boxing. Never did boxing, but I don't like to get punched in the face.
Phillip [01:40:58]:
You shadow box.
Eldar [01:41:00]:
Maybe you do. You don't know. Maybe that respect thing. Maybe you're like, okay, cool, I'm ready to get punched in the face.
Eldar [01:41:06]:
You don't know.
Mike [01:41:06]:
Yeah, I mean, whatever.
Eldar [01:41:09]:
You get the point.
Mike [01:41:10]:
I get the point.
Eldar [01:41:11]:
You understand my point where I'm going with that?
Mike [01:41:12]:
Yeah, but I was saying that the conversation when you're new at something, it's like, oh, okay, this is new. You don't have any comments. Versus like, oh, but I already did this. No, I don't do this exercise. It hurts me. I don't do this exercise. My shoulder, no good. Or, I used to do this exercise, but I used to do it different with my other guy.
Mike [01:41:31]:
You already have so much baggage. And your head, the mind, it's always pulling old shit.
Eldar [01:41:37]:
Correct.
Mike [01:41:37]:
Versus now you got something completely new, like, yo, you're just absorbing. You don't even have anything to compare or relate it to because it's new.
Eldar [01:41:44]:
That's right.
Mike [01:41:45]:
So it's like two different kind of completely different things. Here you're fighting a war against your own ignorance or, I mean, your own ego. And there you're kind of like, I'm a clean slate. What do you got? I want to know.
Eldar [01:41:56]:
That's right.
Mike [01:41:57]:
So maybe it is more difficult unless you constantly telling yourself, like, yo, when you're doing this thing with a trainer, you're like, yo, I don't know anything. I don't know anything.
Eldar [01:42:07]:
Hey.
Mike [01:42:07]:
Oh, new thought. No, I don't know anything. Reminding yourself that you don't know, that's the hard part. That's to remind yourself that you don't know. And I might be wrong about what are my perceived notions?
Eldar [01:42:17]:
Yes. Preconceived notions.
Eldar [01:42:18]:
Correct. Yeah, it's interesting. Okay, good.
Eldar [01:42:24]:
I'm glad that at least I got that out of you. Right, DJ? It's interesting or no?
Eldar [01:42:32]:
Yeah.
Eldar [01:42:34]:
And I think this can ultimately be practiced in a lot of things.
Eldar [01:42:37]:
Oh, yeah.
Mike [01:42:38]:
That's for sure. Anything that you have a desire to.
Eldar [01:42:42]:
Learn, to improve on.
Eldar [01:42:44]:
Yeah.
Eldar [01:42:49]:
All right. Anything else from this on?
Mike [01:42:52]:
This one?
Eldar [01:42:52]:
No.
Eldar [01:42:53]:
What do you think, Phil? Is there something. Is there some gold nuggets here in this dynamic, student teacher dynamic, are we completely shooting in the dark? Can we really propel and put rest to some of the things that we always wanted to do, finally, with the help from someone else, if we appoint them to be our teacher?
Eldar [01:43:19]:
Yeah.
Phillip [01:43:21]:
My example, like, my most recent one, would be, like, coming here.
Eldar [01:43:24]:
Okay?
Phillip [01:43:29]:
Coming to an office where there's a business element, but there's also a growth element, and saying, like, hey, you know what? I'm surrendering. Saying, I haven't done XYZ properly. I'm open to be taught a totally different way. Like, me on the phone, I'm learning how to listen more, slow down, have more conversations. But people are constantly humbling me, telling me, okay, you got to slow down. You're talking way too fast on a day to day basis. On other jobs, it's just like, hey, what are your results and what are you getting? This is now like, hey, we want.
Eldar [01:44:03]:
You to be happy.
Phillip [01:44:03]:
We want you to do it a certain type of way. Now, if you don't want, go ahead, do it the other way. But if you are open to learn.
Eldar [01:44:10]:
Because we ultimately want you to also be successful.
Phillip [01:44:12]:
You want to be successful, which.
Eldar [01:44:14]:
This is where you also want them to be successful.
Phillip [01:44:16]:
Now you're redefining what success is, which is like happiness and finance. So now there's both.
Eldar [01:44:22]:
Yes.
Phillip [01:44:22]:
So I think that's very important.
Mike [01:44:24]:
Oh, what's up? Wow, man.
Eldar [01:44:27]:
Two for two.
Mike [01:44:28]:
What's up with you? And you like, what's it called? Celebrity late. All right, I like it.
Eldar [01:44:33]:
What's up, baby? You would have weighed in on this Topic, man.
Mike [01:44:36]:
Yeah, we needed you. We needed vimeir.
Eldar [01:44:40]:
Yeah, vimeir. This was a big one, man. Sit down real quick.
Mike [01:44:46]:
Is the mic.
Vemir [01:44:47]:
So what's the big kahuna here?
Eldar [01:44:50]:
Yeah.
Eldar [01:44:50]:
So we were talking about. Me and Mike were walking, and we're talking about the dynamic between a student and a teacher. Okay. This is big, right?
Mike [01:45:05]:
He knows big.
Eldar [01:45:06]:
That's why this is big, right? To fast forward, a lot of the stuff that we spoke about just now, which was very interesting.
Eldar [01:45:13]:
Right.
Eldar [01:45:14]:
We've come to conclusion that there are certain things in our life that we want to accomplish, but we procrastinate, we talk bad to ourselves, we avoid it or whatever it is, even though we might know this knowledge that, hey, the example was, I need to ice my feet after every time I play basketball, but I don't fucking do it. But if you get a mentor or if you get a teacher who you're with and you have a dynamic, you have a relationship, right. You have respect with or the person that you admire.
Eldar [01:45:41]:
Right.
Eldar [01:45:42]:
They tell you the homework, hey, Eldar, every time you play basketball and you ice your feet and you actually have real respect for them, you will actually do it. So that advice will translate into real action versus you not doing it if you were just doing it on your own. So I'm saying that in this dynamic of respect between a student and a teacher, there's something there where we can accomplish certain things, level up things in our life that we been thinking about or wanting to level up on, but we don't because negative self talk, procrastination and ego arrogance, all those things.
Eldar [01:46:19]:
Right.
Eldar [01:46:19]:
So I think that there's something in a student teacher dynamic there where we can extract and find out what is it actually that's going to propel us to real action and real transformation and change.
Vemir [01:46:30]:
Great question.
Eldar [01:46:31]:
Great question.
Vemir [01:46:33]:
But then what is this other thing? I feel like some people, myself or friends or whatever, they have this fetish of self respect that I shouldn't have to have somebody tell me, oh, that's what he said. That's what he said. He said, why do we need this? Why is it such a harder gravitational pull?
Eldar [01:46:57]:
Yeah, he just said that some people.
Vemir [01:46:59]:
Hire trainers because they can't fucking get up.
Eldar [01:47:01]:
Yeah.
Eldar [01:47:02]:
Listen, I don't know.
Vemir [01:47:04]:
And if it gets you to your goal, does it matter?
Eldar [01:47:06]:
Does it matter? Yeah. At the end of the day, that's.
Vemir [01:47:08]:
An ego thing or it's a real thing. Like, if I was in a room with nobody watching, would I still read.
Eldar [01:47:15]:
Or do the push ups or whatever?
Vemir [01:47:17]:
Push ups, yeah. Why do you do it?
Eldar [01:47:20]:
So I just think that there are certain hard things in our life that we need to overcome. And I think that because our ego and our arrogance is at play, I think we can at least maybe employ a teacher.
Eldar [01:47:32]:
Right.
Eldar [01:47:33]:
And respect that dynamic. And through respect, we can propel and do the actions, obviously, only if we respect that teacher, obviously, because there's plenty of bad students out there.
Eldar [01:47:45]:
Right.
Eldar [01:47:45]:
The whole conversation was around. How do we become good students?
Vemir [01:47:48]:
Good students.
Eldar [01:47:49]:
Good students. So that dynamic can benefit us.
Vemir [01:47:53]:
I heard the higher spiritual or wise answer. There is also that the distance disappears. Everybody becomes each other's teachers. It's without hierarchy after a certain point.
Eldar [01:48:08]:
Yeah.
Vemir [01:48:09]:
And the most wise person doesn't see themselves as a beacon, but as a. Yeah. You know what I mean? Back and forth.
Eldar [01:48:17]:
Yeah.
Vemir [01:48:18]:
That you can always learn and more than you can always learn of. Like, it's not my knowledge, it's just life through me gave you the answer.
Eldar [01:48:27]:
Yeah.
Vemir [01:48:27]:
You're not taking ownership of wisdom.
Eldar [01:48:30]:
But this is like, no, for sure. We're talking about practice. He actually just talked about what you said. Hey, a lot of us have this thing about, hey, have self respect and kind of do it on your own. You can get this yourself or whatever. And then he asked the question, like, what does it matter?
Eldar [01:48:44]:
How do you get it?
Eldar [01:48:45]:
As long as you get it right through a teacher or through yourself. Yeah, but we're saying that, hey, sometimes it's hard to do it ourselves, certain things because of whatever reasons.
Eldar [01:48:54]:
Right.
Eldar [01:48:55]:
And I think employing a mentor, a teacher can be beneficial, but how to do it properly? And that's the key. How to be a really good student.
Eldar [01:49:03]:
Right.
Eldar [01:49:04]:
What are some of the criteria there in order to succeed in this endeavor? So I think it's a very interesting topic. And we definitely did 2 hours already of it.
Vemir [01:49:14]:
Oh my God.
Eldar [01:49:15]:
Yeah, I know. I was late.
Vemir [01:49:16]:
I wanted to come anyway.
Eldar [01:49:18]:
That's all good.
Mike [01:49:18]:
You just came from the russian restaurant.
Vemir [01:49:21]:
I look like I was a waiter there, right?
Eldar [01:49:23]:
Yeah.
Eldar [01:49:25]:
Tell us some personal shit.
Vemir [01:49:26]:
Are you unpacking more?
Eldar [01:49:28]:
Yeah, we'll unpack more of your shit.
Eldar [01:49:30]:
You know what I mean?
Eldar [01:49:30]:
Last time you came in, you gave us some good nuggets.
Vemir [01:49:33]:
Yeah.
Eldar [01:49:34]:
How you doing?
Vemir [01:49:35]:
Tell us, what are you struggling with? The one thing I definitely took from last time is like, you were like looking around the room and you're like, I don't know if he's going to get it. And then you went, Bamir, you might be a piece of shit.
Mike [01:49:47]:
And then you just paused.
Eldar [01:49:48]:
The way I was like, I thought.
Mike [01:49:50]:
About that for a day.
Vemir [01:49:51]:
I was like, what is he trying to say? You know what I mean?
Eldar [01:49:53]:
Alderism at its finest.
Vemir [01:49:54]:
Alderism at its finest.
Eldar [01:49:56]:
Yeah.
Vemir [01:49:56]:
So is the goal, like, to make you self conscious so you reflect? Why did you do that in that moment? Do you know.
Eldar [01:50:04]:
The only reason is because you might have been blind to your own side. That is that side that you've never acknowledged that exists because I just gave.
Vemir [01:50:13]:
Someone advice today about this. Like they don't know if they're a good person because they feel like a good person wouldn't think these dark thoughts that they're having. And I said, a great person has the capacity to do evil and do good, and they choose to do good. That's what a powerful person who's a good person does, in my opinion.
Eldar [01:50:35]:
Anyway.
Vemir [01:50:37]:
I do have some questions of like there was this podcast I saw. There's this valley that you go through where you don't have the outcome yet, but you're working on the results. And I feel like someone was telling me that I'm ahead, that mentally I'm already thinking about the result past that or whatever. And when it comes, people see it. But it's like this thing about optics. You shouldn't be frustrated if someone has a wrong perception of you, if you know what you know, the outcome is coming and what you know. So why do I get frustrated if people don't understand? But it's almost like you're holding a nice secret in there. Like if you're internally happy, but the external world doesn't.
Vemir [01:51:30]:
Like, the external world is reactive if they see you're jacked after six months, but you started working out and you developed the discipline actually in the first month or something. That's where the character development is. And then the results came after. I feel like part of this is relevant to me now because I know what people's reactions were going to be when I did this, that and other thing. I'm just focused on how do I, I think I said this last time, like make value of my time. And one thing is, like me looking for a job right now, looking for a new position is dependent on other people to give me a job. So there's a factor that's outside of my control now, which bothers you. It's just like you have to depend on a variable that is not in your control.
Vemir [01:52:25]:
You can influence it.
Eldar [01:52:26]:
Which bothers you.
Mike [01:52:27]:
I don't know.
Vemir [01:52:28]:
I feel like what actually bothers me.
Eldar [01:52:31]:
Is that people are missing out on you.
Vemir [01:52:34]:
Yeah, they're really missing something good they could have.
Eldar [01:52:39]:
Right, I agree, but the world might not see that.
Eldar [01:52:43]:
Yeah.
Eldar [01:52:43]:
You're saying only certain individuals see it.
Vemir [01:52:46]:
Yeah, but I towed this line of like I told you before, right, those people who are super spiritual, but.
Eldar [01:52:58]:
They.
Vemir [01:52:58]:
Don'T read the room or something like that. I don't want to be that kind of spiritual guy or like whatever, but I also don't want to be someone who's, like, blindly running towards stuff their father told them to do.
Eldar [01:53:09]:
Of course, I think that's impossible for you.
Vemir [01:53:11]:
At least now it's impossible.
Eldar [01:53:13]:
The worms are out.
Vemir [01:53:16]:
Can is open, baby. So now it's actually on me to be responsible. Like, I was thinking so deeply about the discipline conversation for, like, a month. You're saying discipline doesn't exist. It's still a lot of questions there.
Eldar [01:53:30]:
Like, I'm unpacking 40 things exist.
Mike [01:53:34]:
It exists. Very much so.
Eldar [01:53:35]:
Whether or not. Whether or not it's good, it's a different question. I think there's plenty of people that fucking employ discipline, right, to get certain things done. But where do they end up? Usually, right to beating yourself up over certain things and stuff like that. I think that you get a lot more, what do they say? A lot more done with honey than with vinegar. And what I'm saying by that is that self love is the honey. The discipline is the punishment part.
Vemir [01:54:01]:
So how do you. What's another word than discipline? Like, you want to be 200 pounds of muscle. It takes time and every day doing it consistently.
Eldar [01:54:10]:
But why do you brush your teeth.
Vemir [01:54:12]:
Every day or drink your coffee every day? And you don't work out every day? What's the difference there? Because it's hard, uncomfortable.
Eldar [01:54:19]:
It hurts.
Mike [01:54:19]:
The difference is it's painful. You don't have a good enough reason to work out or not work out. You think you do. Never really examined it. And the direction that your ship is sailing, it's like you don't know where. What did that guy say?
Eldar [01:54:35]:
How can you know? I really think it's just distractions. If you examine the individuals who are really about the life of whatever it is that they dedicate themselves to.
Eldar [01:54:46]:
I don't know.
Eldar [01:54:47]:
Einstein, for example, right? Look at his hair, look at his attire, right? He didn't care about that stuff.
Eldar [01:54:54]:
Why?
Eldar [01:54:54]:
Because he was so immersed into what he was immersed into, right. So my challenge to you is, like, you don't really want to do that. The idea of it is cool, but you're not a bodybuilder, like a bodybuilder would do, right? If a bodybuilder's really got that bodybuilder bug every day, he's there every day, but he wants to do it every single day. It's not a chore for him. It's a fucking lifestyle. Yeah.
Vemir [01:55:19]:
Someone told me, like, so that's not discipline.
Eldar [01:55:22]:
That's passion, right? I would ask myself, what do I fucking really like to do where I immerse myself and I lose track of time.
Vemir [01:55:33]:
We talked about this.
Eldar [01:55:34]:
Yeah, we talked about this, right? Games being one of them, right? Everybody gamed here, right? Where we're like, holy shit, holy shit. 8 hours pass, your mom's like, yo, you didn't shower, you didn't eat, you didn't do. Yeah, I lost track of time. Where the fuck time go? That's what I'm talking about. That's not discipline, that's self love.
93. The Transformative Power of Humility in the Learning Process
Oct 27, 2023•2 hr 56 min•Ep. 93
Episode description
How might the dynamic of learning change when one surrenders to being a good student?
In episode 93 of the Dennis Rox podcast, titled 'The Transformative Power of Humility in the Learning Process' the hosts Eldar and Mike, along with the guests, delved into the nuances of becoming a good student, the role of a mentor or teacher, and how to approach teaching and learning with genuine curiosity and respect. One significant aspect highlighted was the transformative moment that occurs when an individual surrenders to the learning process and becomes a diligent student. This dedication to learning, when guided by the right mentor, can expedite personal growth and lead to a healthier, more focused life. Throughout the episode, discussions emphasized the value of knowledge, the application of learning, and the need to approach self-improvement with an open and receptive mindset. The debate about whether knowledge without action holds value was also a crucial part of the conversation, with different perspectives being shared by the guests and hosts.
Eldar also passionately argued that when one is truly immersed in something they love, like gaming or a hobby, time seems to vanish — indicating that it's passion and self-love fueling their dedication, rather than just discipline. He advised listeners to find activities that captivate their attention and interest, drawing a parallel between losing oneself in a passion and the natural ease with which one can then approach learning and consistency. The hosts and guests conversed about this idea, emphasizing that when you're doing something you love, it doesn't feel burdensome, and the need for external discipline diminishes.
Ultimately, the episode served as a clarion call for listeners to lean into what they love. Rather than viewing discipline as a harsh measure, it's reframed as a tool that complements the natural inclination towards activities that spark joy and interest. This approach to passion over discipline was considered not just a pathway to enjoyment but as a cornerstone for consistent and sustained self-improvement.
Transcript
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