87. Balancing Empathy and Self-awareness in Conflicts

Mike [00:00:00]:
On this week's episode, you know, just because maybe we do in philosophy every day, or we think we're doing philosophy every day, or we try to do it every day, it doesn't make us any better than that person. Especially when we come onto his playing.

Phillip [00:00:10]:
Field and he goes, what's the matter? Like, they can't read? And I was like, yo, fuck you. And, like, I got. I got really angry, and I got in his face, and, like, I wanted to fight him. If this guy's gonna be around, I'm calling the tow truck company. Nobody's getting their car.

Mike [00:00:22]:
He was in this guy's face, and he takes off his sunglasses, like, hey, do you know who the fuck I am? So you're actually expressing anger towards that person, but you're really angry towards yourself, because that person is disgusting. But you not consciously understanding, like, hey, that person lives in me as well.

Eldar [00:00:38]:
Path to a good life is not an easy one.

Phillip [00:00:57]:
Oh, I was thinking of something.

Eldar [00:00:59]:
Okay.

Phillip [00:01:01]:
So I've been having interactions with people that have been very hostile, I guess confrontational, like, in person. So the first one that I had was with the dry cleaner guy. He knocked on my window, and he's foreign older guy, and I don't think he understands manners. I think he just kind of operates the way that he does. And he knocked on my window and was basically like, I can't do this. He was just frustrated with cleaning the thing. So I went back in. I was like, why are you treating me like this? I just want you to clean this right? And the lady was like, hey, he doesn't know better.

Phillip [00:01:49]:
He's just older. This is not an excuse. I'm a customer. I was like, here, charge my card. No favors, please. I just want you to clean this thing properly. This is altercation one, altercation two was with cat's friend, the guy that came out the jerk off. So I think I'm seeing, like, a lot of jerk off type guys get presented to me, and I feel like.

Phillip [00:02:12]:
Even though I feel like it's maybe justified, I feel like I have to learn how to troll better and not allow my anger to come to the surface. So I've been thinking about anger a lot, and I've been seeing a lot of these opportunities come up where I can basically.

Eldar [00:02:28]:
Make a choice, I guess.

Phillip [00:02:29]:
Yeah, I can make a choice, and I guess I don't almost know how to do it the other way. And I guess the third example would be jerk off text guy from this week, Jake whatever his name is. So I'm having all these things. And I think it's definitely a test of kind of where I'm at to say, like, hey, these opportunities or these people are going to come up from time to time. Am I going to let them upset me and boil my blood literally and have me get angry and react? Or am I going to be able to then take a breath and come off smarter and use my words, which I'm good at, opposed to just letting.

Eldar [00:03:05]:
My emotions come out. Yeah.

Phillip [00:03:07]:
So I would say I've been thinking about anger.

Eldar [00:03:13]:
Like, where it's coming from.

Phillip [00:03:14]:
Where it's coming from, and then I guess, how to harness it and then I guess use my words and troll more opposed to just being an emotional reacting person.

Eldar [00:03:25]:
Okay. Yeah.

Phillip [00:03:26]:
That's kind of where my thoughts were since probably last week.

Eldar [00:03:31]:
Okay.

Phillip [00:03:31]:
I don't know what topic we can do.

Eldar [00:03:33]:
Yeah, I think it's like a continuation almost. We were talking about last week with Mike and stuff. Also anger and stuff like that know comes out sometimes. His is more on, like, when people make jokes or whatever, but in your case, it's also the external, external world is doing something and then you'reacting a.

Eldar [00:03:51]:
Certain type of way. Yeah.

Phillip [00:03:55]:
I guess if somebody's treating somebody wrong, I think that's where mine stems from, whether it's the dry cleaning guy or treating me wrong, or I see somebody treating, say, like, cat's friend wrong, saying like, oh, can they read? Like they can't read. And this guy's insulting one of my friends guests or my guests, I don't like that. And if I'm very nice and cordial in the beginning and then you want to fight, I feel like I'm kind of leaning in and giving them what they want based off of their behavior, and then I'm kind of, like, lowering myself down to them and I don't like how that feels. Even though I feel like it's justified in the sense I feel like afterwards I'm like, I feel like I'm smarter than this and I'm better than this and I can handle the situation better. And I want to be able to not be as reactionary in the moment and apply the intelligence opposed to just being like, hey, the anger is justified. They did something wrong. And then afterwards I'm like, I don't.

Eldar [00:04:56]:
Like how I feel. Okay. Yeah.

Eldar [00:04:59]:
So why do you think you go there then? For justice?

Phillip [00:05:03]:
Yeah, I think there's definitely something there where I feel like there's a wrong and I have to write it.

Eldar [00:05:12]:
You just don't like the way you're writing it.

Eldar [00:05:15]:
Yeah.

Phillip [00:05:15]:
I don't like that. And I think it is overall justified. But I think I'm at a place now where I can do it even better and not put myself in these situations where I'm getting riled up.

Eldar [00:05:27]:
Okay.

Eldar [00:05:28]:
Do you find yourself maybe throughout the day or throughout when you're in these states when you're just kind of relaxing or whatever? Maybe a little bit. Something is bottling up slowly that if a situation like that presents itself, you are quickly to react like that? Or is it just random? Completely? What I'm saying is, are you almost feeling like you may be on edge throughout the day? Like, if you were to examine those specific situations with the cleaner or with the parking stuff, were you already kind of spent?

Phillip [00:05:59]:
I guess if I had to ask myself inside, if you're going to make somebody angry, I have to have anger inside.

Eldar [00:06:05]:
Right.

Phillip [00:06:06]:
It's not just going to come from nowhere. So I don't think on a day to day basis, I don't think I have it off of my routine. I think it's probably built up over time from just probably things that aren't relevant right now. Does that make sense? Like, from my past?

Eldar [00:06:21]:
Yeah, for sure.

Phillip [00:06:22]:
Because I think my current day to day schedule, like, coming in here now, we can joke with each other and we pretty much troll each other throughout the day. Those things don't get me mad because I like this environment. I think when it comes from a stranger and it comes from a mean place, that just hits me wrong.

Eldar [00:06:39]:
Why does that have to be hit you wrong? Are you not seeing it for what it is in that moment? Like, why can't you see it as, oh, this is a sick person?

Phillip [00:06:52]:
Yeah, I guess, like, the way that I look at, I guess each example is different. So I guess one with the business, I just expect when it's a service and I'm, like, a good customer. I've been going there for, like, seven years, and I understand for tailoring, I'm difficult. So if she's going to give me a hard time, I understand. But if I'm going in there and I'm paying for you to clean something and it's clearly not clean, and I have to ask you multiple times to send it back, it's like, you guys aren't doing a very good job at your service. So you're getting mad at me that you're not doing a good job at your job? That bothers me now. I guess my level of expectations should probably be a lot lower because this is a common thing that I have to take my stuff to them multiple times. They'll have to send it back two to three times to get it actually cleaned.

Eldar [00:07:41]:
Oh, wow.

Phillip [00:07:42]:
So I guess I have an expectation that it's going to maybe get cleaned this time for the first time. I just don't like wasting time with having to go back and forth multiple times. I'd rather them just charge me more money and I just get it done in one shot.

Eldar [00:07:55]:
Wow.

Phillip [00:07:55]:
So I allow this to bother me.

Mike [00:07:57]:
Wait, so they won't get it done until you go two, three times for.

Phillip [00:08:01]:
Most things this has happened, probably, I'd say three or four times. They don't get it out the first time.

Eldar [00:08:06]:
Sick. Yeah.

Mike [00:08:08]:
Do they know this trend or not?

Eldar [00:08:09]:
Wait, you're very neat guy. Usually. What kind of stains are you getting.

Eldar [00:08:15]:
That they can't get out?

Phillip [00:08:18]:
To me, it's like when I'm looking at it, it's maybe like you spill something on it or just something like pretty basic. It's like this kind of material and it's literally just like, and if you.

Eldar [00:08:30]:
Cleaned it yourself, you can do it, you can get it out.

Phillip [00:08:32]:
I probably could if I really scrubbed it and I put it in the washing machine. So this one I was just like, hey, I don't even want to deal with it. I'm just going to take it over there and spend $10 so I don't have to do it myself.

Eldar [00:08:44]:
Yeah.

Phillip [00:08:44]:
So I literally had to go back and forth twice. And the third time I'm like saying, hey, you guys still didn't get it yet. What are we doing?

Eldar [00:08:51]:
And this is a recurring thing and.

Phillip [00:08:53]:
This is a recurring thing. So this kind of stuff bothers me because it's professional. Now, the other route with the girl and the guest was that he was very rude to somebody that I just met. And it was like your wife's friend, that to me, I felt like I wanted to stick up for them just as like a person. And I didn't like how he was making like, I thought there was racial innuendos in it because she saw a black woman and he was saying she couldn't read. And to me, if you're going to make an illiterate joke attached to something like this, and she was pregnant, I was like that to me, just sparked me off because I didn't think he was just saying, I thought, it's a doctor. I don't think he's a total idiot. And I think he knew what he was saying and I think he was trying to round me up.

Eldar [00:09:38]:
And he did quickly for the public. What was the story? Real quick.

Phillip [00:09:42]:
So the story was that we had Catherine's friends. Catherine's friends. They asked where to park.

Eldar [00:09:50]:
Long story short, by your building.

Phillip [00:09:51]:
By my building. She took a picture of the place and said, hey, park across. They ended up parking in the actual lot, which was a customer's or a residence park. She wasn't comfortable parking there, but I guess Kat said, hey, park there. Whatever happened, there was a miscommunication. Right?

Eldar [00:10:11]:
Not on purpose.

Phillip [00:10:12]:
Not on purpose. Very innocently done. They stayed for an hour and a half. Let's say this guy chose to park behind the car and back them in when there was multiple spots open. Block them to block them in. He wanted to prove a point.

Eldar [00:10:26]:
Yeah.

Phillip [00:10:26]:
So what happened was, we went down there. Kat said, hey, this guy's backed in, our friend. Like, what should we do? So we went to the concierge and said, hey, can you ask him to come down? We had to wait, like, 15 or 20 minutes. I waited down with them. He obviously clearly wanted to make us wait.

Eldar [00:10:43]:
Yeah.

Phillip [00:10:43]:
Then he came downstairs. He had a grin on his face, right, Mike? Like, this guy was asking for a fight. And I asked him, I said, like, hey, is this your car? And he was like, yeah. So he kept walking. I'm walking next to him. I'm being nice and saying, hey, listen, it was a mistake. They're my guests. I take responsibility.

Phillip [00:10:58]:
And he goes, what's the matter? Like, they can't read. I was like, no, they saw the sign and just my fault. They thought we could park in here is next door. He's like, yeah, but what's the matter? They clearly can't read. He emphasized it again, and that one just set me off. And I was like, yo, fuck you. And I got really angry, and I got in his face, and I wanted to fight him. And then the girl, I don't know, cat's friends.

Phillip [00:11:28]:
Yeah, she's pregnant. She takes me over by my hand and takes me away from the guy because the guy's, like, pointing at me, and he's like, hey, if this guy's going to be around, I'm calling the tow truck company. Nobody's getting their car. Like, he's talking like this, right?

Eldar [00:11:41]:
Yeah.

Phillip [00:11:41]:
So I'm like, okay, fine. So I'm trying to be calm, and I'm trying to say, okay, I'll back away. And then I'm talking to the guy's wife, who happens to be in a picture.

Eldar [00:11:51]:
You actually know her?

Phillip [00:11:52]:
I know her. I know this woman. And I go, yo, this is a pregnant woman. What are you doing? And you can tell that she was trying to be genuine as a woman, but she was still being disingenuous, I think. And she's like, honey, honey, she's pregnant. Like, come on, just let's go. I think that she was still being a pisser and wasn't being genuine. So I guess eventually he moved the car and it was fine.

Phillip [00:12:16]:
But these situations, to me, rile me up, because I think it's like, you proved your point, and obviously there's a mistake, but what more do you want? I'm not a kiss the ring type guy. I don't do this.

Eldar [00:12:29]:
Yeah.

Phillip [00:12:30]:
I think there's only a certain level of apology that you deserve as a person when there's a mistake, we don't need to financially compensate one another. You're not a poor guy. You have money. You're doctor.

Eldar [00:12:39]:
65 years old. You're a doctor.

Phillip [00:12:40]:
Yeah. You backed in, right? You parked behind them. You want to make a point? Okay. You did.

Eldar [00:12:47]:
You made them wait.

Phillip [00:12:48]:
You made them wait. You made us wait. You were going to call the tow truck company. It's a pregnant girl just trying to get home.

Eldar [00:12:52]:
You threatened them.

Phillip [00:12:53]:
Threatened them. We made a mistake.

Eldar [00:12:54]:
Right?

Phillip [00:12:55]:
Now you're saying that they're illiterate twice. You want to obviously spark some type of type of altercation, and now I'm basically saying, I'm going to give that to you. What I'm saying is that in these situations, I feel like you do a really good job. I think of trolling them and making them feel stupid, and I'd rather make him feel really stupid. Opposed to allowing the emotion to just overtake the situation and just kind of give him the physical type of outburst. Yeah. I think where my emotional intelligence is at now and how I just allow it to just, I guess, kind of spray all over and I don't go to my head, and I guess I don't have enough experience to kind of go, like, the smart route and use my words, and I usually have went the other route and just said, hey.

Eldar [00:13:46]:
Listen, let's fucking go.

Phillip [00:13:48]:
And I'm not, like, a fight type guy. In that moment, I was very angry, and I would have definitely let the anger take over, and I probably would have regretted if I hurt the guy because he was older also.

Eldar [00:13:58]:
Yeah.

Phillip [00:13:58]:
So I probably wouldn't have liked that, though, for sure. So I'd like to definitely nip it in the butt now where I have examples of I didn't let it kind of overtake, where the cops got called on me or some weird shit happened. Some weird shit happened where I have to have charges pressed on me or some crazy stuff. So, yeah, I think now I have the ability to pull back, try to intellectualize it, understand where it's coming from, and say, hey, is it spillover from, like, years and years ago where it's something that's maybe lingering because I can't identify what it is on a day to day basis because I like my day to day routine.

Eldar [00:14:33]:
Yeah.

Phillip [00:14:33]:
So I guess I don't know exactly.

Eldar [00:14:35]:
Where it's coming from.

Eldar [00:14:37]:
You don't know where it's coming from. What would you like to know?

Phillip [00:14:40]:
What's the question around, um, I guess if you don't know where your anger is coming from, I guess, what are some things you can do to help identify it?

Eldar [00:14:51]:
All right, Mike, but you're saying you.

Mike [00:14:54]:
Don'T know where your anger is coming from, but in that case, you do know, right?

Eldar [00:14:58]:
I mean, you describe it pretty well. I mean, you clearly saw that there was injustice, right?

Eldar [00:15:01]:
Yeah.

Eldar [00:15:02]:
You wanted to stick up and he was annoying you and was pissing you off and stuff. He was rude and all this other things. So then you kind of went into your whole man thing, Mandingo, and let him have it, but you don't want to resort to that.

Eldar [00:15:17]:
Yeah.

Phillip [00:15:18]:
What I'm saying is that, okay, so I guess I know if there is an injustice, if somebody's getting treated improperly, whether it's myself or somebody else, I guess I do know where it's coming from. So, yeah, I guess the question is, how do you, in those moments, resort to trolling and using your words opposed to just, I guess, going, like, the physical route and wanting to fight somebody.

Eldar [00:15:40]:
Yeah. Okay.

Eldar [00:15:41]:
You would like to know how to do it. Yeah, I guess if you had a buffer time or a zone where imagine him coming out, saying all the things he did.

Eldar [00:15:51]:
Right.

Eldar [00:15:51]:
And then you can freeze him, freeze that situation.

Eldar [00:15:54]:
Right.

Eldar [00:15:54]:
Like, pause them, and then have the time to think, how to react.

Eldar [00:15:58]:
How would you react?

Eldar [00:16:00]:
You had time to think. Now you're not hot anymore.

Eldar [00:16:03]:
Like, their initial responses.

Eldar [00:16:05]:
So what would you say or what would you do?

Phillip [00:16:07]:
I think also being in the vicinity of the person, I think that clouds the judgment. I think it's really difficult. When I walked away and she was talking to me and I was like, okay, she's pregnant. Let me calm down. I don't want to upset her anymore. That took me out of the situation, and then I was able to then be less angry. So I know that's probably a good tactic. Like, if you're fighting with somebody to probably leave the room or leave the area with that person, I think that's probably a good tactic.

Phillip [00:16:42]:
But if I was next to him, I don't think that on the spot. It would be very difficult for me to have a very clear mind that didn't involve anger.

Eldar [00:16:50]:
Okay.

Eldar [00:16:51]:
All right. That's very honest. Yeah, obviously.

Eldar [00:16:56]:
Okay.

Eldar [00:16:57]:
What would you need in order to be able to get to that place where almost your mind pauses it for you, and then you choose exactly the right remedy in order to, like you said, have fun with it? Troll him.

Eldar [00:17:08]:
Right.

Eldar [00:17:08]:
Maybe some way make him feel stupid, but still get what you actually need and want in that moment.

Phillip [00:17:14]:
So where my mind goes is, like. So when we talk about me being on the phone and then learning how to do rebuttals and confront more, I feel like I don't have enough experience doing those things.

Eldar [00:17:27]:
On the fly?

Phillip [00:17:27]:
Yes, on the fly or really at all. So I think my confidence level in that is probably very low or just nonexistent because I don't have a lot of experience being able to just troll somebody when I'm angry and not allow that thing to take over.

Eldar [00:17:44]:
Okay.

Phillip [00:17:44]:
So I don't know if it's a matter of just, like, when these things come about, it's pretty much just being aware and just kind of, like, trying it, or if there's maybe a step before that of like, hey, anger is here. Of, okay, I'm going to resort to physical violence or just letting this anger turn in this way and then getting to the point where I control. Is there, like, an in between step that I can take that's realistic? And I think the example that we use at work is I'm then able to listen and I'm able to service the person. So is there an equivalent to, I guess, listening and servicing this person before I get to the point where I control? Is there, like, a step?

Eldar [00:18:22]:
Yeah, I think maybe it's a step. You can call it a step, but maybe it can be something, like, along the lines of just maybe awareness of what's going on, most importantly, yourself. I think it goes back to what we talked about last week with Mike, about taking yourself too seriously.

Phillip [00:18:38]:
Yeah.

Eldar [00:18:38]:
Okay. So as soon as you start taking yourself seriously, and then if the situation calls for being serious, because it sounds like a serious situation, so you go into the serious mode, and then the serious mode requires to be serious. And a lot of times, if you are serious, the other person is serious, and you guys have opposing sides. There's going to be a fight. There's going to be some kind of an explosion. You know what I mean? So I think one person, like you yourself, want to see the situation for what it is and not take it too serious.

Eldar [00:19:09]:
Too serious.

Eldar [00:19:10]:
But in order to do that, I think you have to carry yourself as.

Eldar [00:19:12]:
That in order to be that.

Phillip [00:19:15]:
So in those moments, I'm being serious. Like, in the morning, I have a level of expectation. I'm saying that this shirt thing is serious to me. You're causing me to basically, yeah, he's.

Eldar [00:19:28]:
Putting sticks in your process, but I'm.

Phillip [00:19:31]:
Putting a high value correct on getting this clean.

Eldar [00:19:36]:
Correct.

Phillip [00:19:36]:
Because I'm saying I value being clean and having this thing looked a certain way. And you're basically putting a wrench in my process.

Eldar [00:19:45]:
That's right. That's right.

Phillip [00:19:47]:
So that's one. And then the other one, there's an injustice. And I'm saying, like, hey, I don't know if I refer to myself as, like, an important person, but in this realm with a guest, I would say maybe I'm taking possession of this person like they're mine. And I feel like it's almost like a friend comfort. Yeah. I'm looking out for this person, and they're like an extension of me, and I don't like the way that they're being treated. So I don't know if that's an ego thing. That's like a care thing.

Phillip [00:20:15]:
I don't know.

Eldar [00:20:16]:
What?

Eldar [00:20:16]:
Well, I mean, it sounds like you were caring, obviously.

Phillip [00:20:18]:
Yeah, I think I was coming from a good place.

Eldar [00:20:20]:
Yeah.

Eldar [00:20:20]:
But nonetheless, you resorted to being serious.

Phillip [00:20:23]:
I was very serious.

Eldar [00:20:24]:
Very serious. Yeah, that's what I'm saying. That I think what you're trying to accomplish is to diffuse situations like that in a more non serious way.

Eldar [00:20:32]:
Right.

Eldar [00:20:32]:
Because ultimately you want to be steps ahead of the person who's fucking trying to muddy the water.

Phillip [00:20:38]:
Yeah. So it's basically saying, being aware of where I'm at and the gauge is serious versus just being relaxed. And it's kind of more of like, it can be a joke. And I think it'd probably be easier, obviously, for me to be in that relaxed, joking state than serious. So to me, it's, I guess, paying attention to going to the dry cleaner, going to a restaurant, the level of expectation I have attached to it and just ask myself what do I feel like when I'm going into these things? And I guess when there's a guest involved, I guess I feel responsible where you guys came over to the pool, we went to the rooftop, we had food. I feel responsible for what type of time we're going to have, and I want you guys to have a good time. And if you don't have a good time, I would feel responsible for that, and that would make me feel bad.

Eldar [00:21:26]:
Sure. However, yes, 100%. And I think it's very valid, and I think a lot of people experience this and they take ownership of the situations. However, we can't control all the variables in this world. It's just. I think it's impossible to do so. Did you know that Catherine was going to give miscommunicated directions for parking?

Eldar [00:21:46]:
You didn't.

Eldar [00:21:47]:
You didn't know that she was going to park behind this specific asshole who's going to do this specific action. You don't know these things, right? So I think that as you go about life, I think you have to leave a room for error, a margin of error where you can control 95% of the day, but there might be 5% where somebody's going to throw a wrench in your process.

Eldar [00:22:06]:
Right.

Eldar [00:22:07]:
And that's where you can be not so serious, I think. And that's very important to carry through because I think, like you said, hey, you guys are my friends, you guys are my guests. You come in here first time, I want to show you a good time. So anything in the realm of messing that up, you're going to take very serious, because you already compromised yourself by attaching yourself to the perfect experience.

Eldar [00:22:29]:
You know what I'm saying?

Eldar [00:22:30]:
You didn't give yourself a leeway to say, you know what? Maybe 5%, something's going to go wrong. I don't know. You can't control the pool water, how cold the water is in the pool. You know what I mean? That's not up to you. It's up to management, for example.

Phillip [00:22:43]:
Yeah.

Eldar [00:22:44]:
There are certain things out there, the variables that you can and cannot control, the ones that you did, you did very well in, and that's okay. But to try to look for perfection, I think, is to sell yourself short and to take away from your own experience and having fun, I think.

Eldar [00:22:59]:
Yeah.

Phillip [00:22:59]:
So you think, like, a common trait between all these examples is trying to be perfect or to achieve perfection?

Eldar [00:23:07]:
Yeah, I think so.

Eldar [00:23:09]:
I think you can try, like I said, but I think you have to be realistic with yourself. And the 5% margin of error is.

Eldar [00:23:16]:
That random guy, you know what I mean?

Eldar [00:23:19]:
Who's going to block you in the driveway and trying to fuck shit up for you.

Phillip [00:23:22]:
So is that the equivalent of even this guy Jake, too? It's like, I'd say for every hundred people that I get, I'll get maybe an Adam or you get a jake. Right. Like these people, whether they sign or they don't sign, it's just they're going to give me a very difficult time.

Eldar [00:23:36]:
They're going to try to and they're.

Phillip [00:23:37]:
Going to try to.

Eldar [00:23:38]:
And then you have the ability to then see where you stand based on practicing your awareness on them and taking it more gracefully.

Eldar [00:23:47]:
Right.

Eldar [00:23:47]:
Or more inviting, even as you can see, Tolly knows how to carry conversation with those types of individuals. He's having fun with it.

Phillip [00:23:54]:
Yeah.

Eldar [00:23:54]:
That's why he's enjoying himself a little bit more.

Phillip [00:23:56]:
Yeah. I would say that I'm learning to enjoy myself more on the regular, typical calls. Most people are decent people that we talk to.

Eldar [00:24:03]:
Yeah.

Phillip [00:24:04]:
I would say it's a very small minority of people that aren't very pleasant to speak to. But those examples are coming up and they're the ones that I remember well.

Eldar [00:24:15]:
Yeah. Because I think that they're still closely related to your previous life, if you want to call it a previous life. I'm giving you more credit than I should.

Phillip [00:24:23]:
I think you know what I'm saying. One more time.

Eldar [00:24:26]:
Sorry.

Eldar [00:24:27]:
They're closely related to how you are and how you used to be.

Phillip [00:24:30]:
So how I am and how I used to be.

Eldar [00:24:32]:
Like, these people think that they all that and they take themselves very seriously and you take yourself very seriously in your own realm.

Eldar [00:24:38]:
Right.

Eldar [00:24:39]:
So that's the clash that happens where you guys don't mesh and then there's a blow up, there's a fight.

Eldar [00:24:45]:
Yeah.

Phillip [00:24:45]:
Because I would say, like, jake definitely takes himself seriously. I take myself seriously. But then I also realized that I think I'm a better person than him overall, just like how I conduct myself. But that's probably tough to say in the same breath, because if we both have something that's causing us to clash like this, then at those moments, you are level. I'm equal at the same level for that moment. For those moments. And these are the moments that I'm talking about where I'm lowering myself to the doctored standard of how he's behaving and I can be aware of. I understand the dynamic between him and his wife.

Phillip [00:25:21]:
I was even saying to Mike, do you understand the quality of life that this woman has as a result of being married to this man? I don't even have to know them very personally. And I have empathy. I feel bad for her. I think he's not a nice guy, and I don't think that he shuts it off and turns it on, like, just for outside. I think he's this guy all the time. And I see how she reacts. So I have to almost come from a place of, like you said, these people are sick. I'm sick to a point, right? These people are sick.

Phillip [00:25:50]:
I was even sicker before. I'm starting to get healthier and now I have, like, 1ft in, 1ft out where I can see clearly on certain elements, and then there's other elements where I still have my foot in the water and I'm like, damn. There's a lot of this anger and quick to judge, snap judgments attached to maybe perfection or, like, levels of expectation that I feel kind of trapped in. And I don't like how I react in them. But I would say out of my day to day, like I was saying, they are probably 5% or 10% of what I'm dealing with. It's a small amount, but I'm still thinking about them a lot because they're OD experiences compared to all the other stuff I'm dealing with.

Eldar [00:26:29]:
For sure, they stand out.

Phillip [00:26:30]:
They stand out. They're in the minority. And I would say they were probably more of my day to day and I didn't know what was going on. Now I'm very aware of them. They're coming to the surface now. They're not coming up as much. My day to day is a lot cleaner. It's a lot more quality.

Phillip [00:26:44]:
But when these things do come up, I'm like, damn, this doesn't belong in my day to day. This feels weird.

Eldar [00:26:49]:
Well, it's good, but I'm still aware.

Phillip [00:26:51]:
Of this, but I'm still not able to deal with them. I think the way you want to. The proper way that I think that I'm capable of.

Eldar [00:26:58]:
Yeah, no, and I think that you are. Even, like I said, if there's a buffer zone of like, a timeout where everything's paused, if you sit down and think about what you need to be saying or how to say it, you come up with very good stuff, good rebuttals and good. Kind of like, what's the next steps? You do really well.

Phillip [00:27:14]:
Yeah, I guess timing is part of it, but also being separated by the situation.

Eldar [00:27:19]:
Correct.

Phillip [00:27:20]:
Like when you say, pause him, pause him, meaning he doesn't talk, he doesn't say anything. And I'm in my bubble and I can take a couple of minutes diffuse and chill. Yes.

Eldar [00:27:29]:
The key is to be able to do it on the fly.

Phillip [00:27:31]:
Yeah.

Eldar [00:27:32]:
And I think it's the same thing for you, Mike.

Eldar [00:27:34]:
Right.

Eldar [00:27:34]:
With the stuff with the girls and stuff. A lot of times, you know, what's the right thing to do? But because you get hammered so fast, you get a little lost, like, oh, yeah.

Phillip [00:27:45]:
So I would say, being realistic, we're not going to really have those kind of time frames. So I think it's a matter of, like you're saying, analyzing, kind of like where it is coming from. If it's coming from perfection, I have more control of that because it's not situational based. That's a mindset that I have that I'm carrying into every situation. So if it's perfection, if it's level expectation, attachment, that to me is something more so that I can grasp and I can hold on to versus saying, hey, there's a 5% buffer zone. I get that. I think that's a harder concept for me to say, hey, in the moment, things may go wrong and that's okay, and it's okay. But that, to me, is a harder concept to grasp and swallow, really, than to say, hey, I have a perfection complex and I can actually work on this thing and it's going to open up all these other situations for me to react better to.

Phillip [00:28:39]:
I look at this, I'm talking about it in the moment, but I think that I have a better shot at chipping away at that, even if it's a long game, than to go into a situation and say, hey, there's a 5% room for error. And if I just kind of allow this to happen, I still think I'm going to bring the anger into that situation.

Eldar [00:29:00]:
That's interesting.

Phillip [00:29:02]:
I think it's going to be harder for me to chip away at that because I'm not really grasping at anything. I think with the perfection, you want.

Eldar [00:29:09]:
To solve the bigger problem, which is the perfection.

Phillip [00:29:11]:
Yeah, like you're labeling something. It's an actual thing that I know for sure that I have. Level of expectation and perfection are all in the same boat. It's with tailoring, it's with maybe a certain experience going out, having a friend over. I want it to be great. I don't like average shit. I like when things are great.

Eldar [00:29:28]:
You like nice things?

Phillip [00:29:29]:
Like nice experiences, nice things. Yeah, I like.

Eldar [00:29:36]:
You like to be clean cut?

Phillip [00:29:37]:
Yeah, I like clean cut.

Eldar [00:29:40]:
You got pretty dirty with the lobsters today, though.

Eldar [00:29:42]:
I did.

Phillip [00:29:42]:
I got some stuff on my shirt.

Eldar [00:29:44]:
Is that bothering you?

Eldar [00:29:45]:
No.

Phillip [00:29:46]:
I actually didn't think about it.

Eldar [00:29:47]:
Yeah. Okay.

Eldar [00:29:47]:
You enjoyed the experience.

Phillip [00:29:48]:
I did enjoy the experience. So I think being with people to kind of point these things out also kind of diffuse it. Because if you guys are more like me, and you were saying that if you came at me and you were like, yo, you're just fucking dirty. And you were like, a guy like me, you'd be coming from a different place. You were, like, calling me out and calling me a pisser because you think I'm actually a dirty guy. You're coming from a place of, you don't care about this shit. You're pointing it out to try to just be like, yo, Philip, the stuff you're thinking about, it's like very small.

Eldar [00:30:20]:
Yeah.

Phillip [00:30:22]:
You have bigger fish to fry. See, I like the place that you're coming from because when you tell me it, I realize that you're not trying to just make fun of me from a mean spirited place. You're trying to point out what I'm talking about. What I'm thinking about is very small.

Eldar [00:30:35]:
Yeah, exactly.

Eldar [00:30:37]:
Because I, on the fly in that moment, already do a judgment call myself because I know what I mean. I value, I think, a state of mind as, you know, I value experiences and stuff like that. And I want to make sure that people do have a good time just like you. But I just don't think those things are rooted in things.

Eldar [00:30:54]:
Right.

Eldar [00:30:54]:
Perfection things.

Phillip [00:30:55]:
But you value, like, the way that you talk about your relationship, say, with Kat and I asked you, you value peace very highly. So I think the way that you come across, too, is that you want to kind of diffuse the things that don't cost peace in, say, me or somebody else in this example, talking about myself. So I think this thing is not bringing me peace. You see this clearly. And I think that it is right. The way that I think about finance my money in a day to day, the way that I think about my clothes and tailoring, these things are probably ultimately not bringing me peace.

Eldar [00:31:28]:
That's right.

Phillip [00:31:28]:
They're probably very detail oriented things that I feel like that I have to cover up with my insecurity or whatever they may be.

Eldar [00:31:34]:
Correct.

Phillip [00:31:34]:
Yeah, I understand these things. I'm not able to get rid of.

Eldar [00:31:38]:
These things completely, just like that overnight.

Phillip [00:31:40]:
I'm not able to do these things.

Eldar [00:31:41]:
Of course not.

Phillip [00:31:42]:
I'm open to the idea that they may not be serving me because I realize that I want to be at this place where there's peace.

Eldar [00:31:50]:
But you are aware that you have a mind and it could be very beautiful and very interesting.

Phillip [00:31:56]:
I understand this.

Eldar [00:31:57]:
You understand at times. At times, right. So sometimes you can bet on that, right. But a lot of times you bet.

Eldar [00:32:02]:
On the other side, you know what I'm saying?

Eldar [00:32:04]:
Where it's like, okay, I need to resort to my old stuff, my perfectionism, my insecurities. Like you said, my image, quote unquote, versus actually understanding that the most important thing, like you said, peace. And that it's in the mind. Your mind has the ability.

Phillip [00:32:19]:
I'm creating this, correct. Yeah.

Eldar [00:32:21]:
That's where you empower yourself to say, you know what? This, which I'm experiencing and those feelings that I'm getting from the things that I'm experiencing is actually in control of.

Eldar [00:32:29]:
Myself versus the external world.

Phillip [00:32:32]:
So, yeah, I think the way that we talked about this was, first, we started off with people pleasing was, like, the main identifier.

Eldar [00:32:41]:
Right.

Phillip [00:32:41]:
And I think a lot of people would agree that they probably know when they're doing something to get a reaction to somebody else. I think this can be a status thing. How you dress, what type of car you have, how you act, type of places you go, or just, like, in a conversation, maybe you don't want to be confrontational and you just want to be agreeable. This is also a form of people pleasing, for sure. So I think it can be in a low stakes situation in a conversation or a high stakes situation to try to get somebody to impress you and maybe get a girl or a business, whatever it may be. So I think we started with people pleasing. I understood that, and that was a very easy concept for me to get because it was like, oh, yeah, 100%, then it was okay. Taking that and then putting it into the mindset of, like, what do I actually want? As I'm getting to know myself more? Because if you're people pleasing, you're not getting what you want.

Phillip [00:33:31]:
You're giving the other person what they want. Right?

Eldar [00:33:34]:
Correct.

Phillip [00:33:35]:
So that was the first thing, before you continue.

Eldar [00:33:39]:
Okay.

Eldar [00:33:39]:
What came to mind? And me first, people pleasing should only be resorted to when you're extremely tired.

Phillip [00:33:46]:
So you just don't have the energy to be yourself.

Mike [00:33:49]:
Correct.

Eldar [00:33:50]:
When you really can't manipulate the reality to the way you want it to be.

Phillip [00:33:56]:
Okay.

Eldar [00:33:56]:
Yeah, whatever. Let this guy just ramble. You kind of just agree like that because you're tired. You don't have the energy right now in order to really open up a conversation and really get into something that's more meaningful and more along the lines of what you want it to be, you know, what I'm saying, that's how I see it. That's how I felt. Otherwise, I try to give the time and day to everybody, even though some people try to ramble through or try.

Eldar [00:34:21]:
To.

Eldar [00:34:24]:
They'Re fishing for people pleasing people to give them compliments and all this other stuff.

Eldar [00:34:29]:
Right.

Eldar [00:34:30]:
But ultimately, I'm always on the lookout for more of a genuine conversation. And like you said, maybe saying something a little bit, maybe offensive or controversial in order to spark a deeper conversation.

Eldar [00:34:41]:
Rather than just people pleasing.

Eldar [00:34:43]:
But I do find myself, like I said, if I'm really, really tired, I find myself sometimes like, yeah, I'll just kind of go along. And I'm not really paying attention or listening because I know that I'm tired and I can't give this person what I can really usually give.

Phillip [00:34:55]:
Yeah, I think that's what we did with Jake on the text message. So this guy was being offensive to us and then we trolled him back and then we gave him really something to think about. Right. I think there's that route and then the other route would just be like, hey, if we just said, like, all right, hey, fuck it. We don't have the energy to deal with this guy. We know he's not going to be a client. Just like. Okay, yeah, exactly.

Phillip [00:35:18]:
So I think, yeah, there's two different ways to go about it. But I would say that for the most part, you're usually very patient and engaging with anybody. We have fucking creatures walking in this place sometimes.

Eldar [00:35:32]:
This is not because. I don't know, I don't think it's because of maybe them. I think it's because I genuinely enjoy it. You know what I mean?

Phillip [00:35:39]:
I think you would have to. If you didn't, I don't think you'd be able to be genuine about it.

Eldar [00:35:44]:
Correct.

Phillip [00:35:45]:
Yeah. I don't think that you have a judgment towards anything. I think you look at everything from a situation to situation standpoint. And when you're talking to me, I feel like you're looking at my situation and you can kind of see what it is from your perspective and you can ask me questions based off of what you actually see. And you're coming from a place, if you're in a peaceful, good place, in a loving relationship, and if you see something that kind of stands out to you, you would see something that's causing me not peace, causing me stress.

Eldar [00:36:19]:
That's right.

Phillip [00:36:20]:
So I think it's easy for you.

Eldar [00:36:21]:
Coming to identify you winding up and getting too excited or whatever.

Phillip [00:36:26]:
Yeah. So I take it from like, if you're in the situation you're in and you're looking at me, I think it's probably easy for you to identify them. And usually when you talk to me, I feel like you're spot on with kind of what you say and I listen to what you say, but there's a level to it where I can hear it. But then that's why I'm asking with this stuff, to apply it right away. I wouldn't say impossible, but it's very difficult to just hear it, accept it, and all of a sudden change, like, boom, it's done. That's why I was asking what kind of steps is there? So I think the step is identifying what the big issue is. It's not just anger. It's attached to the perfection and level of expectation, which I would say is a majority of the stuff that I do.

Phillip [00:37:11]:
It's tailoring, it's experiences. It's going to do a lot of these things. Now I got rid of a lot of the, like, oh, I have to go to the restaurant. I have to have this type of image and do this. But it's still attached to clothes. It's still attached to. Maybe if I have people over, it's still lingering.

Eldar [00:37:25]:
Yeah.

Phillip [00:37:25]:
I think we had this example with Mike, with Rolex and the restaurant and stuff. I think me and Mike relate on a lot of these levels because I think when you have a certain way your mind works with something, there's definitely a connection, and it can linger even when you feel like you're beating it. In a lot of respects, I think it's still there at some point if you didn't tackle the thing as a whole.

Eldar [00:37:47]:
Yeah.

Phillip [00:37:47]:
So I think there's still remnants of what it is. And to me, that's almost like you didn't tackle the issue at all. So I think it feel defeating in a sense, where I think Mike felt a little this too, where that's what.

Mike [00:37:58]:
He'S telling you guys.

Phillip [00:37:59]:
You feel like you're kicking the whole bucket and you're like, oh, I got this done. And then somebody's pointing out this maybe 5% thing of like, yeah, oh, shit. I'm getting angry in these certain situations with the dry cleaner and this. It's like, but I kicked this already. Why is it a problem?

Eldar [00:38:10]:
It's like I'm leveled up.

Phillip [00:38:11]:
I didn't kick the perfection thing.

Eldar [00:38:13]:
That's right. But see, that's the thing. You're being honest with yourself, and I think that's why maybe you're having a little bit of a better time speaking about it and bringing it to light faster.

Phillip [00:38:23]:
But the anger is still there, though.

Eldar [00:38:25]:
Sure.

Phillip [00:38:27]:
And I think what this shows me is that all the stuff that you do and all the habits that you've accumulated on a year to year basis, they're so much deeper than you even think. Every time you think you kick them, there's like a whole nother layer there. And we're talking about these on a week to week, day to day basis, and we're actively pursuing these things and we're doing our business. I don't understand how somebody will try to uncover these things on their own without a day to day therapist or really good friends. And then the mindset of wanting to actually do this, I think it's crazy for somebody to have a realistic expectation to kick these things with, just, say, meditating.

Eldar [00:39:07]:
Listen, you know that quote on the t? It says, friends are a sheltering tree, Mike. Am I saying it correct?

Mike [00:39:18]:
Friendship is a sheltering tree.

Eldar [00:39:19]:
Yeah, friendship is a sheltering tree. And then I put the comma, did.

Eldar [00:39:23]:
The spin on it.

Eldar [00:39:24]:
If you have any.

Phillip [00:39:25]:
If you have any.

Eldar [00:39:25]:
If you have any. And that's what you're talking about.

Phillip [00:39:28]:
Yeah, definitely.

Eldar [00:39:29]:
Because ultimately, right, like you said, if you don't have a therapist who's kind of. You're really digging and asking you these types of questions. In order for you to bring out all the old demons that you're talking about right now, the fuck? Are you going to go around doing this yourself? It's very difficult.

Phillip [00:39:44]:
How do you do it yourself? And then even, let's say you have a profound experience. Most people, the way that they talk about this is like, they'd probably have to take a psychedelic experience or do ayahuasca smoke or have to be shown this.

Eldar [00:39:58]:
Right?

Eldar [00:39:59]:
Yeah.

Phillip [00:39:59]:
So I think let's take that on a day to day basis. Most people are not going to be doing this.

Eldar [00:40:03]:
Right.

Phillip [00:40:03]:
So if you don't have the friends, you don't have therapist, and you're not doing this, most people at work are not having these type of conversations.

Eldar [00:40:10]:
Yeah.

Phillip [00:40:11]:
So, yeah, I guess I'm just looking at all what we do on a day to day and how difficult it still is to kick these things and these habits.

Eldar [00:40:21]:
The path to a good life is not an easy one.

Phillip [00:40:24]:
Yeah, this is definitely a lot more difficult than I thought and to be true with. Okay, this is where I'm actually at.

Eldar [00:40:33]:
It's definitely humbling.

Eldar [00:40:35]:
Yeah, humility.

Phillip [00:40:36]:
Very humbling.

Eldar [00:40:37]:
Very humbling.

Phillip [00:40:37]:
And then also taking that quote of Tolly, where you have to have the mental before the money is. I'm somebody who definitely is not happy with where I am financially. Maybe that's a blessing and maybe it is.

Eldar [00:40:49]:
Maybe that's a blessing.

Phillip [00:40:50]:
Yeah, I'm good with my money. I would say like I'm very financially conservative where I can probably have a much better lifestyle. I know I can, but I don't allow myself to where maybe I punish myself or I'm too strict on myself at certain areas, but there's an element of like I don't trust that I'm able to make the money elsewhere because I have the capacity or the mindset to yet. So maybe it's my behavior is like I haven't got the mind in order to get the money the way that I feel like I want it. I don't want to be a guy like Jake or these other guys where I'm going to manipulate people and rip people up. I was never this person.

Eldar [00:41:30]:
If you're going to do it, you want to do it the right way.

Phillip [00:41:32]:
If I'm going to do it and I feel like I am doing it the right way. And I think having the patience to say like, hey, I'm adopting to mindset in order to get the money the way that I want it to.

Eldar [00:41:42]:
That's right.

Phillip [00:41:42]:
So I'm making more money, I'm doing well, but I feel like I have the capacity to make a lot of money.

Eldar [00:41:48]:
Sure.

Phillip [00:41:48]:
And this is important to me because I want to have a good life and be able to have great experiences all the time without having to think about money. Like on a budgetary day to day paycheck to paycheck nonsense. I don't like this. I think it's a very limiting belief system. And I have part of this now in me where I have budgets set in place for myself. I limit myself to certain experiences. When I talk to Mike, it's like, hey, I would love to just go get a hotel and just do whatever. Whenever I'm not able to take off work, I'm not able to just do these type of things.

Phillip [00:42:20]:
With the type of mindset I have. Could I say, hey, the money that I have, can I technically do it? Yes. Would it give me anxiety? Yeah, it wouldn't make me feel good.

Eldar [00:42:32]:
Yeah.

Eldar [00:42:32]:
At this point.

Phillip [00:42:33]:
So I'd be like, okay, I got my rainy day fun, I got my investments here and I could do this. It's not like a freeing feeling. It almost feels like I'm going against the stuff that I built and it's like two conflicting mindsets. And I like to feel free. I like to feel like I have this free flowing, fun type of mentality, but then I also have this other thing where it's like, holding you down. Hey, you got to relax. You got to put money here. You have to do this, this, and this, and then you can be happy.

Phillip [00:43:06]:
It's almost like the old way that people talk about, like, okay, when you're 65, then you retire, and then you can have fun, and it's like you don't have the energy. You don't have the life to do it.

Eldar [00:43:14]:
At that point, you're done.

Phillip [00:43:15]:
I'm fighting with that mentality, and then I'm fighting with the new one.

Eldar [00:43:18]:
It's like, hey, no, you're like, young.

Phillip [00:43:20]:
You have the energy now. Take care of your body and your mind. Why can't you have fun now also?

Eldar [00:43:25]:
That's right.

Phillip [00:43:25]:
As you're building it.

Eldar [00:43:26]:
Yeah.

Eldar [00:43:26]:
So you're trying to find that balance.

Phillip [00:43:28]:
I think there's definitely two conflicting things of trying to find that balance. And I'm, like, fighting against that thing. And I think perfection is built into this mindset also.

Eldar [00:43:37]:
Yeah.

Eldar [00:43:37]:
It's a good way to describe it. You see how well he put it?

Eldar [00:43:40]:
Very nice.

Eldar [00:43:42]:
It's like, maybe ignorant or the person in the cave discovered philosophy, right? Or saw the light, and he's like.

Eldar [00:43:51]:
Oh, shit, that feels good.

Eldar [00:43:53]:
But I'm used to this, the comfort zone. I know this. So it's fighting back and forth, trying to come out to the light, but it's scary. Maybe the light hurts a little bit at times, but wants to come out. Then the other side also tells you.

Mike [00:44:07]:
You can't unturn every stone. And also, you're not always ready. Unturned every stone. You're like, hey, I don't want to let go of this part of me. I want to be a Rolex guy. I'm not ready. I want to be a philosopher. But no, I still like my Rolexes.

Mike [00:44:20]:
I still like my fancy restaurants, my fancy trips.

Phillip [00:44:22]:
But you have the blueprint to that. See, you have the blueprints of the Rolex thing. You know what it is? There's certain level of, you know, you're going to do this route. If you're going to go to a certain restaurant, certain place, you're going to get a certain type of reaction. I think there's comfort in understanding the blueprint there. When you see that light at the new light, that philosophy light, you might say, like, okay, this feels good, but I don't know what to do. So when I'm saying to confront somebody on the phone and be able to challenge somebody, I don't know how to talk like this. So it's like, I understand.

Phillip [00:44:55]:
I can hear totally, or I can see examples of it, but I have to have a realistic expectation for myself to say, like, hey, this is a totally new way of thinking and being. I can't just expect myself to hear it once or twice, see the value and the truth in it, and just to kind of turn over a new leaf and be a new person, I think that's setting myself up for failure, for sure.

Eldar [00:45:18]:
And then more expectations, more attachments, then.

Phillip [00:45:21]:
It goes into being more perfect.

Eldar [00:45:24]:
That's what Mike found, trapped himself in.

Phillip [00:45:26]:
Yeah, I think that's a trap also.

Eldar [00:45:28]:
That is a trap.

Phillip [00:45:29]:
So just think you're going off of a thing that you see as a truth that we can all agree is a truth. We're going into reason, asking ourselves what is and being more aware of our situations. I think we can all agree there's truth in that, and this is the way that we want to go. But you also have these old behaviors, so there's comfort in the old behaviors. There's discomfort in the new ones, because we don't know how to basically do this yet because we haven't made it, I guess, a belief, and there's not enough experiences to have confidence in them. So I think it's not solidified. Exactly. So it's always easy to resort back to the old ones.

Phillip [00:46:06]:
So as you're basically coming up with a new belief, I'm literally fighting the old ones. Yeah, it's a contradictory state, almost contradictory state. And I think, just like the human condition, in order to create the new neural pathways in your brain, the way that it was described to me was there was this guy, I forgot his name. He was on Joe Rogan, and he was talking about your actual brain.

Eldar [00:46:31]:
I don't know if I'll do it.

Phillip [00:46:32]:
Justice, but he was describing it as the way that your brain is when you have a certain belief and condition. I guess it fills up like snow on, like, a ski path, where that ski path fills up and it fills to the brim, and he's like, in order to go down and create a new pathway, you're going to have to shovel out a whole new pathway in order for it to climb down. This is, I guess, a process that your brain does when you're younger, very easily, in order to come up with, like, okay, I want to learn a new language. I want to think of a new thing that I like. And these new pathways can be dug in very easily. Now, as an adult, you're shoveling out ice.

Eldar [00:47:17]:
Yes.

Phillip [00:47:17]:
No, all this ice and snow. But just think, I guess most people who are grown have certain beliefs and they're not trying to dig and create new ones. So I think when you think of it like this, I just was like, damn, I guess we're doing it now. But when you're shoveling, it's probably very easy to then put sand right back on it and resort back to the old one. Every time I go back to the old one, I'm shoveling all the sand back on top of what I dug out. And it's like this constant cycle of, like, I'm doing a little good, that I'm doing a little bad. And it's like, how do you get to the point where you're actually making a real divot and then making an impact? And I think it's literally, like, a little bit every day. Day.

Phillip [00:48:00]:
And then surrounding yourself around the right people and it's still difficult is what I'm saying.

Eldar [00:48:04]:
Yeah.

Phillip [00:48:05]:
Do you know what I mean?

Eldar [00:48:06]:
Oh, I get it, Phil. But give some optimism, bro, to the listeners.

Phillip [00:48:11]:
Yeah, well, this thing with anger, I feel like. I guess the way that I'm describing it is the way that I feel, and it feels like a never ending cycle of doing good and then still getting it piled.

Eldar [00:48:24]:
Okay, how about this then, question.

Eldar [00:48:25]:
Okay.

Eldar [00:48:27]:
You see how you very maybe sensitive or aware of doing good, you clearly see that throughout your day, throughout your week, throughout your month, and now year almost, right. You're doing good stuff and it's accumulating, right?

Phillip [00:48:39]:
Definitely.

Eldar [00:48:39]:
However, are you aware of the times.

Eldar [00:48:42]:
That you're actually still asleep?

Phillip [00:48:45]:
I would say probably no.

Eldar [00:48:48]:
You see, I'm not sure if you.

Eldar [00:48:51]:
Can be aware of the times you were asleep.

Phillip [00:48:53]:
Yeah, I'm saying no that you can't.

Eldar [00:48:56]:
That's what I'm saying.

Phillip [00:48:57]:
Yeah.

Eldar [00:48:58]:
So you don't know yet for how long you're still asleep.

Eldar [00:49:02]:
Okay.

Eldar [00:49:03]:
And I think that a lot of people probably underestimate, like you just said, how deep and how far it really.

Eldar [00:49:08]:
Goes of the sleeping part. Right.

Eldar [00:49:12]:
Like you said, hey, right now I'm doing good. But then you have some weird quirks, some weird habits that you resort to again when you by yourself, for example, when you're doing stuff with your family or something or your other friends or whatever, right. You still resort to habitual things that not necessarily are examined or correct. So you go back to sleeping.

Eldar [00:49:32]:
You understand?

Eldar [00:49:32]:
You can't be aware of that because you're sleeping. That moment is a sleeping moment. There's no fill up with awareness that's yet brought into that moment. Just like you had those angry instances that you mentioned.

Phillip [00:49:45]:
But, yeah, see, I'm noticing that.

Eldar [00:49:47]:
Even if noticing after.

Phillip [00:49:48]:
Yeah. Even if it's with us, like, the people that I'm growing with, I'm noticing these things after, so I'm sleeping in these moments. Those are your dreams I'm dreaming.

Eldar [00:49:56]:
Right.

Phillip [00:49:57]:
And then all of a sudden, I'm noticing it after.

Eldar [00:49:59]:
Yeah.

Eldar [00:49:59]:
And you're like, oh, shit, I remember that dream now.

Phillip [00:50:00]:
So this was happening. I don't know if you guys remember, with the girl, I was saying after, I would say I would be with a girl and it wouldn't be based off of love. I would then be with them. And then afterwards, I would feel bad.

Eldar [00:50:12]:
Yeah.

Phillip [00:50:13]:
And what happened was I wasn't being honest in the conversation.

Eldar [00:50:16]:
That's right.

Phillip [00:50:17]:
Then we had an example of, I met somebody recently. I was honest in the conversation. I was with them. I didn't feel bad after. But then I realized as a result of being honest, I got to know them a lot quicker. And I got to be honest and say, hey, this is not working out. I don't think we're a match.

Eldar [00:50:33]:
That's right. Right.

Eldar [00:50:34]:
Are you honest with that? And with the other person, too?

Phillip [00:50:37]:
And with the other person.

Eldar [00:50:38]:
That's right.

Phillip [00:50:38]:
So I think, as a result, there's no confusion. There's no confusion.

Eldar [00:50:42]:
There's no hurt feelings. You're just moving on.

Phillip [00:50:44]:
Yeah, that's it. I guess this came, too. As I'm thinking of the perfectional level of expectation, I think being honest with myself and asking myself, like, hey, what is really important to, like is looking and feeling a certain way. Very important. And right now I'm asking myself, and the answer is still yes. So I think that's also the difficult part. I do ask myself this.

Eldar [00:51:06]:
Yeah.

Phillip [00:51:07]:
I said with, um. I'm asking myself on a day to day basis, I have, like, the Tom Ford fragrance, right?

Eldar [00:51:13]:
Yeah.

Phillip [00:51:13]:
And I'm asking myself, do I need this fragrance on a day to day to spray it? Am I just liking the smell where it's just for me, or is it a status thing? I'm asking myself, and every day that I'm doing it, I genuinely like the smell.

Eldar [00:51:27]:
Okay?

Phillip [00:51:27]:
I like how I spray it and it smells good for me. I don't think that I'm doing it for anybody else, genuinely. I'm asking myself this. And I'm saying, hey, I think I just genuinely like the smell. And then I'm also asking myself, when I tailor my shorts or like a shirt in a certain way, am I doing it because I'm insecure or do I actually genuinely think that this looks better than if they weren't tailored and.

Eldar [00:51:50]:
Makes you feel better?

Phillip [00:51:50]:
And it makes me feel better. I'm asking myself this at this state where I'm at now. I'm saying that I like the way that I do it now, but I don't know if it's because I'm so in it that I can't genuinely ask myself my true self the question, because I am so in the insecurity.

Eldar [00:52:11]:
How about this question?

Phillip [00:52:11]:
Does that make sense?

Eldar [00:52:12]:
Yes.

Eldar [00:52:12]:
How about this question? If you got to a point where now you're tapping into your mind, your true self, right. And you're able to exercise it on more regular basis, let's just say, and not go to sleep, would you even.

Eldar [00:52:27]:
Care about this stuff?

Eldar [00:52:28]:
Would you have time?

Phillip [00:52:30]:
On a day to day basis I would say no.

Eldar [00:52:32]:
You know why?

Eldar [00:52:33]:
Because you'll be having too much fun.

Eldar [00:52:34]:
Yeah.

Phillip [00:52:34]:
On a day to day basis I would say no. But let's say this. The way that I look at clothes, let's say once or twice a year, I'll stock up on, I'll get my shorts and I'll realize, okay, I need new shorts like every season. Say like once or twice a year. So then I know, okay, winter going into necessity. So it's a necessity. So I'd say once or twice a year, if I know that I have to dedicate maybe like some hours of research and a couple of days here and there to have to go back and forth to a tailor in order to make it look good. I don't mind that.

Phillip [00:53:03]:
So let's say 365 days out of the year, if I have to take five or six days, give or take some hours per day, I don't mind that because then on a day to day basis, I don't have to think about it. And then I can like this thing.

Eldar [00:53:15]:
And I think that this is, that's not bad, right? Yeah, no, that's very good. I think you're talking about function now.

Phillip [00:53:20]:
Function.

Eldar [00:53:20]:
Okay.

Eldar [00:53:21]:
And that's like, function is, I think is Trump's looks. Anything else?

Phillip [00:53:26]:
Yeah.

Eldar [00:53:29]:
Even the things that you're buying, but you're buying function first and then price and all the looks later. You're winning because of the fact that the function will always win over.

Phillip [00:53:38]:
Yeah, always so I bought this because I liked the material. I thought it was quality, I thought the price point was good. I wasn't spending crazy amount of money and it wasn't super cheap. But I wear this on a day to day basis. I like how I feel on it and I like how it looks and there is function to it.

Eldar [00:53:54]:
Exactly.

Phillip [00:53:55]:
So I don't think it's me saying like, and it happens to look nice.

Eldar [00:53:59]:
Great, that's a bonus, right?

Phillip [00:54:00]:
It is a bonus.

Eldar [00:54:00]:
That's it. And it happens to be a good brand. That's a bonus. Sure, no problem. And if somebody esteems you for it, okay, that's a bonus. But that's not going to make you feel one way or the other.

Eldar [00:54:08]:
It shouldn't.

Phillip [00:54:10]:
Right. And I think where it is for me is that with these shorts, for instance, if they were a little baggier and I wore them, I don't feel comfortable in those.

Eldar [00:54:18]:
That's it.

Phillip [00:54:19]:
And I think for me, if I look at that as it is function, but it is also aesthetic, I think maybe that part is probably more the.

Eldar [00:54:31]:
Like. Because if you told me, like, hey, elder, actually, I'm wearing these particular shorts because they look nice, but my balls are a little bit, like, tight and I'm not comfortable, then I'm like, no, you're lying to yourself. You see? Like, you're not actually using this for function, you're actually using it for aesthetics first.

Phillip [00:54:44]:
Oh, see, I would get the tailoring. So my balls aren't tight.

Eldar [00:54:47]:
No, that's what I'm saying.

Phillip [00:54:49]:
But that would be an example of functionality, not aesthetic.

Eldar [00:54:52]:
Right. Good.

Phillip [00:54:52]:
Yeah. So I guess the way that I.

Eldar [00:54:54]:
Associate, and I think you should continue to do that, especially because it serves you as a person, right. Serving you, it's good. But then again, you have that thing where it's like if you have a little imperfection or ketchup or whatever fall on your shorts, then you become like anal about it and then you can get into the whole perfection thing again.

Eldar [00:55:15]:
And then it's like you can get.

Eldar [00:55:17]:
In trouble there into your head.

Phillip [00:55:20]:
So I guess the way that I look at the tailoring still is sometimes I don't know if I'm doing something out of functionality or it's like aesthetic and being vain or perfection. And I guess it's hard to label for myself which one is, because if you told me right now if I was tailoring it because my balls were tighten it and I want to loosen them up a little bit, I would say like, oh, maybe that's attached to look, and I want to look a certain way, but it is more function and how I feel. And I would feel uncomfortable if I just left it the way that it was. So that's not a bad thing.

Eldar [00:55:58]:
No, I actually think it's a good thing. Okay.

Eldar [00:56:00]:
I think you like things the way you like them.

Eldar [00:56:03]:
Right.

Eldar [00:56:03]:
And if in the process of getting the thing, thinking about the thing, going to do the thing, getting it done, you feel good. Yeah, you're good. You're golden. But if you're stressing out, right. You're going from one place to another, these people giving you a hard time, you're getting into fight here, you're wasting money there, and you're like, at the.

Eldar [00:56:22]:
End of the day, how are you feeling?

Eldar [00:56:25]:
If it's not serving you, then you got a problem.

Eldar [00:56:28]:
Yeah.

Eldar [00:56:29]:
You know what I'm saying? It's how you approach each thing that you do. I think, is it with grace, with fun, with light heartedness? Or is it with rigidness? Being tight and being too hard on yourself and a perfectionist.

Phillip [00:56:45]:
Yeah, I would say the process is definitely not like when I buy clothes, it's very miserable experience for me.

Eldar [00:56:52]:
Oh, wow.

Phillip [00:56:53]:
Because if I buy clothes online or I buy them in person, I know that buying the clothes is step one. The tailoring is everything. So I know that when I buy something, it's very rare that I buy something that's going to fit automatically. This jacket, I didn't have to tailor it.

Eldar [00:57:08]:
I love it.

Phillip [00:57:09]:
It fits, like, tapered and tailored. That's, like, unheard of for me. When I buy shorts and stuff, I usually always know I have to fix them. Sweatpants usually like to fix them. So I look at it as like, it's a big process and I don't enjoy the process because I always know that.

Eldar [00:57:26]:
See, that's why I think that the process might fall off the charts after you've learned how to exercise some other parts of yourself.

Phillip [00:57:33]:
What do you mean that it would.

Eldar [00:57:34]:
Fall off because of the fact that you're saying that the process is grueling.

Phillip [00:57:39]:
Yes.

Eldar [00:57:39]:
Right.

Eldar [00:57:40]:
Then I'm going to say that when you discover and actually start betting on your mind and having fun more outside of these things, this process will fall off, it will die out, it won't serve you anymore.

Phillip [00:57:51]:
So then it would just be a matter of finding clothes that are just going to be tapered and not having to then go get them tailored and just deal with it.

Eldar [00:57:59]:
Yeah. Correct. Okay.

Eldar [00:58:01]:
Because of the fact that you are describing the process, actually not an enjoyable one. Because if you did actually enjoy all the steps of the process, then I'll promote it. Absolutely. Go do it.

Phillip [00:58:11]:
So what about this example, say the person that I'm going to. So let's say by its very nature, tailoring is for a person who's very particular and wants something custom.

Eldar [00:58:21]:
Correct.

Phillip [00:58:21]:
If you're a tailor by nature, you're not going to get somebody who's like, oh, yeah, I just want this. You have to be, like, specific. You have to be probably very understand that you're specific. They want something specific.

Eldar [00:58:34]:
Correct.

Phillip [00:58:34]:
And they're probably not easy by nature.

Eldar [00:58:37]:
Correct.

Phillip [00:58:38]:
Because if you're going to take something off the rack, the tailor is going to be, like, an obsolete job.

Eldar [00:58:42]:
Correct.

Phillip [00:58:43]:
A tailor is meant for somebody who wants them, a suit, by its very nature, a specific way. Now, suits are obsolete. Now everybody, like, every girl wants their dress a certain way. Guy wants their maybe short or like, whatever, a certain way. So this is the business. So I think if you're a tailor and you're not expecting somebody to do in particular, I think it's going to be a very tough conversation. So I guess what I'm saying is that the woman that I go to, I think she's good at her job, but I always have to fight her tooth and nail to get what I want. Where I have to say, like, hey, I want this, like this.

Phillip [00:59:18]:
And she's like, I don't know if we can do this. And I'm like, hey, listen, my example is my jeans. I said I want to struggle to put them on, and I don't care if they're a little tighter. She's like, yeah, but this is not what we do. I'm like, but can you do it or not? She's like, yeah, I can do it. I always have to fight to get what I want. Eventually it's going to get there, but it's always like, I feel like I have to push the boundaries of what altering clothes are. And maybe it's just I have to find the right tailor where they're just going to.

Phillip [00:59:46]:
What about give me whatever I want?

Eldar [00:59:47]:
Yeah, maybe not the right tailor because it's probably going to be hard to find that particular person, but maybe their.

Eldar [00:59:52]:
Approach to the tailor where they're more patient with me. Yeah, right.

Eldar [00:59:56]:
Like, imagine you popped in and say, hey, your most difficult client is about to come in. Do you have time for me? Because you know how the process where.

Phillip [01:00:02]:
I control that portion of identifying myself.

Eldar [01:00:06]:
Correct.

Phillip [01:00:06]:
As the difficult person.

Eldar [01:00:07]:
Correct.

Phillip [01:00:07]:
And making a joke out of it.

Eldar [01:00:08]:
Correct. Yeah.

Eldar [01:00:11]:
You know her name. She knows you. Now it's having a relationship outside of.

Eldar [01:00:16]:
The relationship, calling it for what it.

Eldar [01:00:19]:
Is and calling it for what it is. And I think when two people understand this, right, I think sooner or later you'll get to a point where it's like, okay, cool. Either you're accepting of one another and understanding that means you create her or she creates you.

Eldar [01:00:31]:
Right.

Eldar [01:00:32]:
And then you have a relationship where you both understand each other because she also has needs. Right. Which you're probably in that moment where you're the one who's paying the money, so you don't really see her needs. Right. Maybe she's on a time crunch. Maybe she has too many clients right now. Maybe she's tired today. She didn't get enough sleep or whatever.

Eldar [01:00:49]:
Right.

Eldar [01:00:50]:
I think that if you leveled it and came from an approach where you also care about her being, then I think she can be a little bit more flexible with you as well.

Eldar [01:01:00]:
Yeah.

Phillip [01:01:00]:
So I guess what I'm hearing, too, is, like, there's an arrogance in my approach from the standpoint of get it done where I'm paying you. So I have a level of expectation for the service.

Eldar [01:01:11]:
Correct.

Phillip [01:01:12]:
And if you say anything back to me, it's like, how dare you?

Eldar [01:01:15]:
That's right.

Phillip [01:01:15]:
Say anything to me, my money speaks, so. My money speaks, so there is an arrogance in that. Correct.

Eldar [01:01:22]:
That's why you're not having a good time.

Phillip [01:01:23]:
That's why I'm not having a good time.

Eldar [01:01:24]:
That's right. It's a grueling experience.

Phillip [01:01:26]:
So coming from a more of a human element where I'm taking the money out of it.

Eldar [01:01:30]:
That's right.

Phillip [01:01:30]:
And it's just, hey, back in the bartering system era, where I'm giving you something, you're giving me something. Hey, I'm giving you a piece of my clothes, and in return, I'll give you a goat, whatever the fuck it is. But as we're doing this, we're having an interaction.

Eldar [01:01:46]:
That's right.

Phillip [01:01:46]:
And we have to create a bond, a relationship between both of us and how we talk to each other. And I think the way that we're talking is that I'm probably looking down on her because I'm giving the money and I'm the customer, and she's like a peasant.

Eldar [01:01:59]:
Yeah.

Phillip [01:02:00]:
That's probably how it's coming on.

Eldar [01:02:01]:
100%. However, she is not a peasant, and.

Eldar [01:02:05]:
She has a voice, and that's why.

Phillip [01:02:08]:
She'S fighting back and she is the talent. So she's not fighting and saying, hey, you're not a good customer. She's basically saying, I don't like the way that you're talking to me because you're being so particular, but you're not appreciating me.

Eldar [01:02:21]:
But you.

Phillip [01:02:22]:
Is that a possibility?

Eldar [01:02:23]:
100% that's a possibility. But also, she does have a voice in this thing, right? Because it's a theory of tailoring on how to tailor properly and stuff like that. But you guys disagree on those theories. You have your theory, like, hey, I want those pants to look this way. And in order to get them, you have to make this hole so tight that it's hard for me to put on. This is what you're trying to accomplish. You don't know each other on that level of specificity that she can appreciate that about you. Like, oh, I see what he's trying to accomplish.

Eldar [01:02:49]:
You know what I'm saying?

Eldar [01:02:51]:
She doesn't care about it because you don't know each other on that level.

Phillip [01:02:54]:
So how do you tighten that together?

Eldar [01:02:56]:
That's what I'm saying. I think that by being a little bit more considerate for the human. What does that look like? I just told you the example was right. You're a difficult customer. You already know this, right?

Eldar [01:03:08]:
Yes.

Eldar [01:03:08]:
So, because you know this, right, you require more time. If you require more time, you have to make sure before you go over there that the person has the time and energy for you. So I would set this up where, hey, will you have time this week to take me? You know who I am, you know what I do and what my requests are. When will you feel good?

Eldar [01:03:33]:
When is a good time like that.

Eldar [01:03:36]:
For example, then that person almost is like, okay, Phillips is going to come in at this time, and I'm mentally already prepared for his shenanigans.

Eldar [01:03:43]:
Right.

Eldar [01:03:43]:
That's already a good start.

Eldar [01:03:45]:
I think in that case, not just.

Eldar [01:03:47]:
To you randomly buying a piece of clothes, some shorts or whatever, and just running into the store. I'm like, yo, I'm ready to get this done, get it done.

Eldar [01:03:55]:
Now you see that it's a completely.

Eldar [01:03:58]:
Different interaction where you now consider them for whatever it is that you need to consider them, and they're going to feel good, and then they are going to give you the time and day to actually hear you out and really pay attention as to why you do what you do. And there in that type of relationship, I think both parties can learn from one another where you could be more open to her suggestions and she's going to be more open to your suggestions.

Phillip [01:04:23]:
So it's kind of like going in there and being like. It's like calling in there. There's like a language kind of barrier because she's asian and you don't get her directly. So there's a little bit of that. So I think the example here would be like, I buy the clothes. I go in there with the expectation of like, hey, I might get this done at a later date, but let me go in and just say, hey, listen, you're difficult clients here. I just got something new. Are you able to take me now or would it be better to come back? Because I know it's going to take a lot of energy out of you.

Phillip [01:04:55]:
So something like this.

Eldar [01:04:56]:
That's right.

Eldar [01:04:56]:
I think it's being honest and being straightforward about what's about to transpire will give the person a different type of. It's just a different approach and I think it works.

Eldar [01:05:07]:
Yeah.

Eldar [01:05:07]:
Okay.

Eldar [01:05:07]:
That's cool.

Eldar [01:05:08]:
That's just one example.

Eldar [01:05:10]:
You know what I mean?

Eldar [01:05:11]:
If I really zoomed in on the interaction of what's actually going on, I could probably have more suggestions. We would have to really dive deep into find out what the relationship is and what the expectations are and stuff like that. Yeah.

Phillip [01:05:22]:
For a few times a year. I think that's definitely a good start. This is not a day to day thing.

Eldar [01:05:27]:
That's what I'm saying.

Phillip [01:05:28]:
I do this a few times a year.

Eldar [01:05:29]:
That's what I'm saying.

Phillip [01:05:30]:
And then I don't think about it. But I know that, okay, winter is coming up. I'm probably going to buy one or two new things and I'm probably going to have to do this again. Hopefully not. But if I do, then maybe I can put this thing into place.

Eldar [01:05:42]:
And I think that as you develop this type of relationship, a small gift maybe, or card or whatever, for her, good work, hard work will pay big dividends.

Eldar [01:05:53]:
Yeah, I like that.

Eldar [01:05:54]:
You know what I'm saying? So you're now leveling because you also want to be like you're in the service too, right? And you want to be leveled properly as well here. Like this guy who just threw some numbers at you and said, hey, I'm better than you. Don't you understand that I make this money? Who do you think you are? He wanted you to change everything here and bend over backwards into a pretzel in order to appease him, right? You don't want to feel like he's shooting down at you, right? Looking down at you like you're not a human.

Phillip [01:06:19]:
Yes, that's a perfect example of me in that position.

Eldar [01:06:21]:
Correct.

Eldar [01:06:21]:
Yeah, correct. It's the same thing. You want to be heard because you have a voice. He's not hearing your Voice. It's the same thing. You want to have a level playing.

Eldar [01:06:32]:
Field on both sides.

Eldar [01:06:33]:
You know what I mean? So I think it's the same kind of phenomena where, like you said, sometimes we let the money and our power and authority speak. It's like ugly and it's ugly, and it's not the right thing.

Eldar [01:06:47]:
Yeah, I get that. Yeah.

Phillip [01:06:48]:
I guess that to look at it in that realm, I would have never thought that I was being arrogant, because I thought that the way that I was talking to her was nice. And I was even saying like, hey, I'll get you something like, do you like wine? I think I even asked one time, I'm like, okay, that.

Eldar [01:07:09]:
See, I think that you can mask that with just. I'm just going to do this because I want something done from me.

Phillip [01:07:16]:
Right. So it's like coming back on me. Yes. It's not saying like, hey, I genuinely.

Eldar [01:07:21]:
Care for your interest here. That's why coming in with the time thing, I told you, it's you genuinely asking a question. A person like, hey, will you have.

Eldar [01:07:28]:
Time for me today? Yeah.

Phillip [01:07:29]:
Because I'm generally saying, hey, I do maybe want this done today, but I'm willing to then not get it done today.

Eldar [01:07:36]:
And I realize I'm a difficult client.

Phillip [01:07:38]:
For the sake of your well being and my own, because I think we'll both have a more enjoyable experience of you're in a good state and I'm in a good state.

Eldar [01:07:46]:
Yes, correct.

Eldar [01:07:48]:
And we're ready for one another and to really hear each other out and really get to a place where we're really happy. And I think that you will be surprised, I think, to how these things will play out in your life and when they do happen the way you want them to happen, you're like, holy shit, this is amazing. And you can actually extract the proper energy from it and fill yourself versus taking away from yourself.

Eldar [01:08:08]:
Yeah, that's definitely a good one. You're good, man.

Eldar [01:08:13]:
Yeah, elderism owns all.

Eldar [01:08:15]:
Yeah, that was very good.

Phillip [01:08:16]:
Yeah, because these are examples that, again.

Eldar [01:08:21]:
I guess because you're that guy. Anyway, Philip, you're a good guy. You have that in you.

Phillip [01:08:26]:
But I also know that.

Eldar [01:08:28]:
But you get caught up. Yeah, see, but most people get caught.

Phillip [01:08:31]:
Up, but the getting caught up to me and we talked about it before, it's so powerful because on a day to day basis, let's say I'm not thinking about this, but it's kind of maybe dictating my behavior with the guy that I met. And there's anger built up. And this is just how I would deal with the situation normally, say like a high octane type of situation where it's not my normal day to day. I'm resorting to this behavior because I'm not analyzing what we just did in like 20, 30 minutes. I'm not able to analyze on my own in days. Even if I sit down and I think about it and I'm saying, hey, what's going on with tailoring? I'm just going to say, like, okay, I need a new thing. I need a new clothes. I'm going to go over here.

Eldar [01:09:14]:
You're rushing through.

Phillip [01:09:14]:
I'm just going to go through the same process again and again and again. Even if I'm tackling an issue like we're talking about in a day to day, unless I specifically narrow in on tailoring.

Eldar [01:09:26]:
Correct.

Phillip [01:09:26]:
And I come up with a new solution with somebody. And even when we did, then I still have to put this thing into practice. So to me, it's like, just imagine what we just did. I'm going to still have to put into practice. Probably still mess up multiple times before you. Probably still going to take months or years to figure out, right? Yeah.

Eldar [01:09:46]:
But I think that's the beauty about life, because like I said, when you get this shit right, Philip, you don't understand the amount of energy and good that is going to come your way from this small experience. As small as it sounds, you're explaining it to me as is a big part of your life.

Phillip [01:10:01]:
Oh, it's definitely a big stressor.

Eldar [01:10:03]:
It's a big stressor. That's what I'm saying. It's a gruesome experience.

Phillip [01:10:07]:
Yeah, I don't like it.

Eldar [01:10:08]:
You see, it's so deep and subconscious that you just roll through it and you don't even think about it.

Eldar [01:10:17]:
You're just kind of like, oh, fuck.

Eldar [01:10:19]:
You know what I'm saying? But it's there. It's taken away from you, and it's.

Phillip [01:10:24]:
Only a couple of times a year now.

Eldar [01:10:26]:
Yeah.

Phillip [01:10:30]:
I'm anticipating even if I have to do it once, and I'm like.

Eldar [01:10:34]:
Yeah, you don't want to deal with it. But I think with this type of energy, this type of approach, I think you'll see that you're going to be very conscious and aware of what's going on, going to be very interesting and that you're going to see things for what they are, because I'm inviting you to go into that shop and pay attention to her as a human being before you say, hey, take these fucking.

Eldar [01:10:56]:
Shorts and get it done.

Eldar [01:10:57]:
You know what I'm saying?

Phillip [01:10:58]:
Yeah.

Eldar [01:10:59]:
I think it's a profound thing.

Eldar [01:11:04]:
Because.

Eldar [01:11:05]:
You'Ll feel her out. You're not an idiot. Especially when we pay attention, we know what people feel and how they feel.

Phillip [01:11:10]:
Oh, no, I definitely can feel what she's feeling throughout the thing. And I fight her pushback, which is more like, hey, I want this. You want this? I want this.

Eldar [01:11:23]:
Yeah.

Phillip [01:11:23]:
It's like, all right, we're both not getting what we want.

Eldar [01:11:25]:
That's right.

Phillip [01:11:26]:
You're not having a relaxing day.

Eldar [01:11:27]:
There you go.

Phillip [01:11:27]:
I'm not getting the pants tight enough.

Eldar [01:11:29]:
That's right. That's what I'm saying. That I think that ultimately, Philip, if you examine these types of things, if you don't learn how to crack them and put them in your favor, as you learn philosophy and do change your life, sooner or later, these things that are hard, are they going to fall off? That's a natural process, I think, of elimination.

Eldar [01:11:49]:
Yeah, that's how I feel.

Eldar [01:11:53]:
So something's going to give. Either you find a new approach and you enjoy the process because you know.

Eldar [01:11:58]:
Better and you're smarter, or you won't have the time.

Eldar [01:12:02]:
A day for this. I'm done with this. I don't want to deal with this. Why would you want to keep putting yourself in the fire? Would be your question.

Eldar [01:12:10]:
Yeah.

Eldar [01:12:11]:
Unless you're an idiot and for a long time, you can't call yourself.

Phillip [01:12:15]:
Yeah. With this process, I know that I'd want to change because I do like functionality.

Eldar [01:12:20]:
There you go.

Phillip [01:12:21]:
And I do like how things look. But if I was uncomfortable in the clothes that I wore on a day to day basis, I wouldn't be able to stand up at my desk, walk around. I zoom around. I like to just be walking around and feel good. My clothes are really baggy. They're super tight, and I'd have to alter the way I walk. I did this with the shoes. I went back to all birds a lot of times, but now that the shoes are good and now they fit good, I'm like, okay, now they're good.

Phillip [01:12:48]:
If something's uncomfortable, it's going to have to alter the way I walk or the way that I feel on a day to day, I want to make that adjustment. So those things are important to me because I like to be comfortable and I like to have function where if I'm standing and my shoes are uncomfortable, that's something I'm going to think about in a day to day, and I'm not going to be able to go.

Eldar [01:13:09]:
Until I actually fix it.

Phillip [01:13:11]:
But when it involves another person, I do have to, I guess, be more considerate of that other person because it's a relationship.

Eldar [01:13:18]:
Correct.

Phillip [01:13:19]:
Yeah. I'm not looking at them as like, just my servant.

Eldar [01:13:21]:
Yes.

Phillip [01:13:21]:
And I think before, without thinking about it, I was probably by default, I was allowing the money to probably put them in that position without me labeling them. And I thought I was probably having more of like, an even relationship. And I didn't, I guess, realize I was probably looking down on them or talking down to them.

Eldar [01:13:39]:
That's right.

Phillip [01:13:43]:
Like you said, she probably felt as a result that she had to stick up for herself. And I was seeing it as she just didn't want to do what I was saying. But maybe presenting it a certain way could even the playing field more. And then it's like, okay, fine, maybe I have to make these pants tighter. No problem.

Eldar [01:13:59]:
Correct.

Eldar [01:13:59]:
Yeah, correct.

Eldar [01:14:00]:
Okay, I see that. Yeah.

Eldar [01:14:03]:
I think you'll be pleasantly surprised with.

Eldar [01:14:06]:
These types of outcomes.

Phillip [01:14:09]:
So it's being honest, being able to joke with yourself, being able to make fun of yourself a little more.

Eldar [01:14:13]:
Yeah.

Eldar [01:14:14]:
It's all those things.

Eldar [01:14:15]:
Right.

Eldar [01:14:16]:
You might come in and she might not have the time for you.

Eldar [01:14:18]:
Right.

Eldar [01:14:18]:
And that's okay. You expected that. You understood that.

Eldar [01:14:23]:
I can see that.

Eldar [01:14:24]:
You know what I mean? But ultimately, I think, yeah. It comes down to not taking yourself too seriously, because if you are, you'll take away from those moments and you'll.

Eldar [01:14:34]:
Go into these situations with an angry mindset.

Phillip [01:14:41]:
So would you say, like I was starting and asking about the anger. So you would say a common theme between all these examples that we're talking about, the tailoring, the confrontation, the guy with the dry cleaner, the guy on text message with Jake, it's taking yourself, I guess, too seriously and having a level of expectation for a certain type of outcome.

Eldar [01:15:03]:
That's correct.

Phillip [01:15:04]:
That would be a common.

Eldar [01:15:05]:
Yeah. And for that particular day, because I remember, I think you were a little bit on edge with everything.

Eldar [01:15:11]:
Right.

Eldar [01:15:11]:
Because of the fact that this is our first time coming to your place and you wanted to make it nice for us.

Phillip [01:15:15]:
Oh, yeah.

Eldar [01:15:16]:
You know what I mean? You talked about everything, like the pros, all the stuff and stuff. Make sure that this is good. Make sure this is good.

Phillip [01:15:22]:
Oh, yeah. If you guys aren't having a good time, like, damn, I want you guys.

Eldar [01:15:25]:
To have a great time, but you see the disparity between us having a good time and we're not so picky, or we're pretty easy going.

Phillip [01:15:31]:
Yeah, you are. You guys are definitely easy going.

Eldar [01:15:33]:
Yeah.

Eldar [01:15:33]:
So if there is a fucking wrench in our process, it's okay. We'll move around it. You know what I mean? We'll make the best out of what we have. But for you, you still don't believe that, even with the Tesla thing, right? That happened, like, when you got a little fender bender.

Phillip [01:15:47]:
Oh, yeah.

Eldar [01:15:47]:
Right.

Eldar [01:15:48]:
You made it a big deal in your head, but Mike's like, yo, it's not that serious, and it's not that serious. You still can't convince yourself of the fact that other people perceiving life and experiencing life differently than you are.

Phillip [01:15:59]:
Yeah, I would say, like, even down the shore, too, when I was describing Donovan's reef, and I was like, hey, this place is really chill. I took a girl there last year. It's, like, very for couples. And we went there, and it was like they turned it up, and it got crazy. I was like, oh, damn. I took these guys to, like, a jersey show. We ended up having a great time. Well, that's the thing, because you didn't give yourself.

Eldar [01:16:19]:
You felt a certain type of way, and you let that fester inside of you.

Eldar [01:16:23]:
Right.

Eldar [01:16:23]:
We weren't even feeling that.

Eldar [01:16:25]:
Right.

Eldar [01:16:26]:
You didn't give yourself the 5% or 10% room for error, that something might have changed, and that's okay. You know what I mean? We are okay with that. We didn't specify, Philip, we want to make sure that this works this way. And at this time, we weren't like that. It is what it is. If we make it, we make it. We don't make it.

Eldar [01:16:43]:
We don't make it. Yeah.

Eldar [01:16:47]:
But you still want to apply your old self and all the judgmental self that you judge yourself for towards the external world, which is us now.

Eldar [01:16:53]:
Right.

Phillip [01:16:54]:
And it's kind of funny if I'm actually looking back on maybe it's tough to pinpoint, let's say, whenever it happens, right. If you allow somebody to, I guess, condition you a certain way and you're allowing outside influence, it's usually somebody at some point had to basically convince you that this way of behavior works.

Eldar [01:17:19]:
Correct?

Phillip [01:17:20]:
And there had to be probably some sort of thing that's piercing your regular belief system of, like, I'm an easy going guy. All of a sudden, this person is saying, hey, you should be doing this a certain way. Maybe you got scolded or. I'm just thinking of how this mindset would come about.

Eldar [01:17:40]:
Yeah.

Phillip [01:17:40]:
It's like that person was sick. They brought a certain way about them, and where they said, like, hey, you're being a kid. You have to act a certain way.

Eldar [01:17:49]:
Correct.

Phillip [01:17:49]:
Then all of a sudden, you become buttoned up, and then you say, like.

Eldar [01:17:52]:
They stole the fun. They extinguish the fun.

Phillip [01:17:55]:
Yeah, they extinguish the fun. So then you become this rigid, and then all of a sudden, you basically expect everybody else is acting this way. Because that's your bubble.

Eldar [01:18:06]:
That's right.

Phillip [01:18:06]:
And I think that's the power of allowing the outside influence to basically come in. And that's where the people placement comes from.

Eldar [01:18:14]:
Extinguish your light.

Phillip [01:18:15]:
Yeah, it extinguishes the light. But then also, the way that we're describing my examples is I'm trying to make you guys happy. And I'm not even asking myself, okay, what genuinely makes me happy.

Eldar [01:18:26]:
That's right.

Phillip [01:18:27]:
I'm so concerned about what you guys are thinking.

Eldar [01:18:29]:
That's right.

Phillip [01:18:29]:
That I'm not even able to ask myself, like, hey, am I genuinely having fun? I'm just generally concerned about what you guys are thinking, but I'm not even able to then see if you guys are having fun or not.

Eldar [01:18:40]:
That's right.

Phillip [01:18:40]:
I'm automatically assuming that because it's not the way you standard pictured, perfect thing.

Eldar [01:18:47]:
That you created in your mind, that.

Phillip [01:18:48]:
I created in my mind, that you.

Eldar [01:18:49]:
Think that applies also in our mind.

Phillip [01:18:51]:
That I think that applies to you. How? That's where the sickness.

Eldar [01:18:54]:
Without even asking us.

Eldar [01:18:55]:
Yeah.

Eldar [01:18:56]:
You didn't say, eldar, like, I see this place to be this way. Do you want to see this place the same way, too? And yourself in it? Perfect way? If I said yes, Philip, of course. If anything less, I'm going to scold you.

Phillip [01:19:08]:
I'm assuming.

Eldar [01:19:09]:
You're assuming right. A lot of people do this.

Phillip [01:19:11]:
That's the sickness.

Eldar [01:19:12]:
That's the sickness.

Phillip [01:19:13]:
Yeah, but I'm just saying, do you think that's kind of where it can start of, like, you get scolded and without maybe kind of having the intelligence or the strength to challenge. Challenge and say, like, hey, what are you talking about? I'm seven years old.

Eldar [01:19:29]:
Leave me alone.

Phillip [01:19:30]:
Like, yo, I'm just playing. What the fuck is wrong with you?

Eldar [01:19:33]:
That's right.

Phillip [01:19:33]:
And all of a sudden, instead, you're just like, oh, yeah, you're the adult. You're right.

Eldar [01:19:37]:
That's right.

Phillip [01:19:37]:
You scare them straight. It takes a long time, though, right?

Eldar [01:19:41]:
If you notice, if you actually pay attention, a lot of kids will gravitate towards fun as much as possible, because it's an addictive thing. Okay? It's addicting to have fun and then to enjoy yourself, to yell, to scream and all those. Whatever the kids like to do.

Eldar [01:19:55]:
Yeah.

Eldar [01:19:55]:
The parents usually have to hammer them for long periods of time to hammer the font.

Phillip [01:20:01]:
You know who does a good job at this with Penny. Penny's 100%. I always say this. She's 100% herself, no matter what. Yeah, she'll make a mistake every once in a while, but she goes right back to having fun, and it doesn't matter.

Eldar [01:20:15]:
Doesn't matter.

Eldar [01:20:15]:
She got stuck. Yeah, she got stuck on.

Phillip [01:20:19]:
Right.

Eldar [01:20:20]:
She. That's just the way it is. And that's, like, she's setting a perfect example for Catherine. She's the perfect dog for her.

Eldar [01:20:27]:
Yeah.

Eldar [01:20:28]:
She doesn't care. No care in the world.

Phillip [01:20:31]:
And I do agree with this, but also, I think I was saying this to you guys, too. I find it difficult sometimes to kind of see what's right and what's wrong and where my conditioning is and where the insecurity stops, where the light starts. I think as you watch a bird or you watch a cat or you watch a dog, and I'm finding that anytime I see animals, like on my for you page on TikTok or even I see an animal, that, to me, is, I guess, like, the equalizer. Anytime you see somebody acting, like, in their natural state, you're observing them. I'm observing that, and I'm saying to myself, this is the true state. And in those moments when I'm observing that person, their true state, it kind of takes that conditioning, and it enables me to move the cloud apart and then see things for what they are in myself also. So, to me, anytime I see Penny and I'm seeing her do her stuff, I'm like, yeah, this is what having fun is. And I'm able to just kind of like.

Eldar [01:21:32]:
So the time when I asked you to count Penny's nippies and you said no because you were too serious.

Phillip [01:21:41]:
I don't know about the nipples and wieners and dog parts. I don't know about this. But, yes, in that moment, I said no, and I was.

Eldar [01:21:50]:
I'm not counting her nippies.

Phillip [01:21:51]:
I wasn't counting her nippies. I still don't know. In, like, a true, pure, non fog state if I want to count her nippies.

Eldar [01:21:57]:
All right, fine.

Phillip [01:21:58]:
I don't know.

Eldar [01:21:58]:
But, yes, it's a fascinating phenomenon.

Phillip [01:22:01]:
No, in that moment, yes, I was.

Eldar [01:22:03]:
She didn't have any nippies, and then now she has nippies. She went from a little girly to now a woman.

Phillip [01:22:08]:
You seem fascinated by this.

Eldar [01:22:09]:
I'm fascinated by this.

Phillip [01:22:11]:
I think me and cat are in the same position where we're like, yo, Eldor is like, in this nipple thing.

Eldar [01:22:17]:
Yes.

Phillip [01:22:17]:
Which is fine.

Eldar [01:22:18]:
Yeah.

Phillip [01:22:19]:
You're like Dora the explorer.

Eldar [01:22:20]:
Exactly.

Phillip [01:22:21]:
Liking this. This is cool.

Eldar [01:22:22]:
I never had a female dog either, so I don't know how this is how this works.

Eldar [01:22:26]:
Yeah.

Phillip [01:22:26]:
You're coming from, like, a dad perspective. I think you're genuinely curious.

Eldar [01:22:29]:
100%.

Phillip [01:22:30]:
I'm looking at it as, like, okay, it's a private part of a dog, and I don't want to further explore this.

Eldar [01:22:35]:
Yeah, no. You don't want to pull the hair back to see how I don't want to pull this.

Phillip [01:22:38]:
This game is like, I'll guess numbers, but I'm not pulling the hairs back to get more.

Eldar [01:22:43]:
To get more nippies. Yeah, get some more nippies out.

Eldar [01:22:45]:
All right.

Phillip [01:22:46]:
But, yes, I agree, though. In that moment when you were playing this game, I resorted to being more serious.

Eldar [01:22:51]:
No, of course.

Eldar [01:22:52]:
I know.

Phillip [01:22:53]:
But in the other examples, I think they're more easy to distinguish because I'm doing something that's genuinely bothering me. This is like you being curious, and I don't think it's, like, an example of something where it's like, on a day to day, I have to deal with this type of mindset.

Eldar [01:23:11]:
Well, that's why I throw these things in.

Phillip [01:23:13]:
They're silly examples. Yes, they're silly, and they should be easier for me to just kind of crack.

Eldar [01:23:19]:
Well, like you said, you use the word curious. It's very important to have that curiosity, I think. Right. And as you start unclouding, like you said, you start seeing things for what they are, the animals, and then the way they behave and pay attention to their behavior. You're actually curious as to, like, yo, why do they behave the way they do?

Eldar [01:23:34]:
You know what I mean?

Eldar [01:23:35]:
It's very interesting.

Eldar [01:23:36]:
Oh, no. That I agree with. Yeah.

Eldar [01:23:39]:
And then you hopefully, to keep applying that to the whole world, to the whole natural world, to see what's actually going on in my mind, in other people's minds, and everything else that's happening.

Phillip [01:23:48]:
So why is it easier to have more empathy for a dog or animals? Do you think they're more rooted in nature than human, which is more conditioned?

Eldar [01:23:56]:
Yeah. No, I think your association with people. And because you've seen and witnessed a lot of sinners, and they were human. You haven't witnessed too many sinners in animals.

Phillip [01:24:07]:
Like, if I start seeing bears rip.

Eldar [01:24:09]:
Apart, you won't even associate it because it's a natural order.

Eldar [01:24:15]:
Wait, say that again.

Eldar [01:24:16]:
If you see bears ripping apart other animals, right. You won't have an association because it's a natural order. This is what they do. Lions kill gazelles, right?

Phillip [01:24:26]:
Yeah. If I see a man kill another man, then that's not a natural order of things.

Eldar [01:24:33]:
Well, it's questionable, right? Because this is what we do as people, right? So I think maybe some people's minds haven't developed past having to resort to this type of action. You know what I mean? I'm not sure if you can call that unnatural either.

Eldar [01:24:48]:
You know what I'm saying?

Eldar [01:24:50]:
I think as you start seeing the world for things, for what they are, I think you've removed certain judgments that you previously had about the things that you did. Like that guy who's 65 years old, a doctor, right? To you, it's like, hey, you're 65. You're a doctor. This woman is pregnant. To you, these are all check marks where you should know better.

Phillip [01:25:12]:
Yes.

Eldar [01:25:13]:
Okay. There you go.

Eldar [01:25:14]:
Right?

Eldar [01:25:15]:
You should know better. What's wrong with you?

Phillip [01:25:17]:
Yes, you know what?

Eldar [01:25:18]:
I'm.

Phillip [01:25:18]:
Exactly what I'm thinking.

Eldar [01:25:19]:
Yes. That's exactly what you're thinking. However, you don't know his life. You don't know where he came from. You don't know what he just experienced.

Eldar [01:25:26]:
And the way he developed. Right?

Eldar [01:25:28]:
And therefore, actually, the natural order for this person is to live in revenge. He wanted to revenge somebody for what he thought was done to him on purpose. This is the way he acts and this is the way his mind works. You know what I'm saying? So at that moment, you couldn't see the fact that this person is a lower level human, let's just say, call it that, than to be able to rise above and do the right thing. You know what I'm saying? So it was expected in my eyes, the person who's going to do that, to block that is another car on purpose, to come out with that type of energy, that's a completely natural phenomenon in my mind.

Phillip [01:26:09]:
So the extreme example would be like, you're watching a lot of these documentaries on these serial killers or anything, right? Like the psychology of a serial killer. If I remember when I was younger and I would say, watch something, I'd be like, yo, this guy's fucked up. Then I don't know if they do the documentaries different or I just have a different mindset. Probably a combination of both. Now I'm watching these, and I can have more empathy or I guess, sympathy for these people, whatever you want to call it. Because I realize that mental illness, once you understand how sick these people are, you realize that their behavior is in line with their mental.

Eldar [01:26:42]:
There you go.

Phillip [01:26:43]:
And them committing these crimes. I understand, correct. That they're sick and they got treated a certain way. They weren't able to then control themselves, I guess, control themselves and learn from it. They just bask in this type of behavior and trauma, and now they have to actually put it onto other people.

Eldar [01:27:05]:
There you go.

Phillip [01:27:06]:
To then, I guess, live their life and feel some kind of release.

Eldar [01:27:09]:
See?

Phillip [01:27:09]:
Completely normal example.

Eldar [01:27:11]:
It's an extreme example. But you see, okay, the trajectory based on how he lived, based on what has been done to him.

Eldar [01:27:18]:
Yes.

Eldar [01:27:18]:
Right. He developed this illness, and this illness, the result speaks for itself.

Phillip [01:27:23]:
Exactly.

Eldar [01:27:23]:
You see the result, so natural order.

Phillip [01:27:26]:
So this guy. So looking at this guy, where he's not a killer, but he's probably one step away from it, in my mind, where he's not a good person, he probably does not treat his wife good. He probably does not treat his patients very well. And this guy is esteemed as, like, the certain type of guy, a certain type of status and money. He feels like he can get away with it. Kind of how maybe I am acting towards the seamstress or the tailor.

Eldar [01:27:51]:
That's right.

Phillip [01:27:52]:
Right.

Eldar [01:27:53]:
Correct.

Phillip [01:27:54]:
Again, I guess these people are coming into my life because there is part of me that is probably also acting this way where I'm not even aware of the correlation.

Eldar [01:28:02]:
Yeah, you probably are attracting them.

Phillip [01:28:04]:
Exactly. That's what I'm saying. So I am not liking that behavior in that person, but I have to identify that I'm doing it somewhere, probably. So this example will be, I'm doing it with the tailor, he's doing it to my guest. And I'm saying, like, hey, don't act like this. And I'm coming from a place of being better. But it's also like, if I understood that I'm doing it to somebody else, then it's probably easier to be the difference to come from a place of empathy.

Eldar [01:28:29]:
Correct.

Phillip [01:28:30]:
Versus looking down and saying, like, how dare you? Right.

Eldar [01:28:32]:
But because you're asleep, you can't distinguish the two.

Phillip [01:28:35]:
Right.

Eldar [01:28:35]:
You're asleep during the time when you're doing the injustice.

Phillip [01:28:38]:
But that's why the anger is coming out.

Eldar [01:28:39]:
Correct.

Phillip [01:28:40]:
So it's always easier to resort to anger when you're sleeping because you're not able to identify what the situation is.

Eldar [01:28:45]:
Why would you apply anger towards yourself if you're awake?

Eldar [01:28:48]:
Yeah, you wouldn't.

Phillip [01:28:50]:
You have more compassion.

Eldar [01:28:51]:
You'd be like, wait, what the fuck is wrong with me? I'm not doing that. I'm not going there.

Phillip [01:28:54]:
So somebody who lacks self love is somebody who's quick to anger, who is probably more prone to hurting themselves. Sleeping and hurting themselves.

Eldar [01:29:02]:
That's right.

Eldar [01:29:02]:
Yeah, 100%. But those who understand self love and understand what it entails and why they're preserving their peace, like you said.

Eldar [01:29:10]:
Right.

Eldar [01:29:10]:
They're more likely look for ways out on a better way so they can have more fun and prolong the fun childhood.

Eldar [01:29:16]:
Yeah.

Mike [01:29:17]:
I mean, I was there for the one interaction, and I also been, I guess, observing Phil.

Eldar [01:29:24]:
You could speak on his anger a little bit.

Mike [01:29:27]:
Well, no, I think I wouldn't like to ask him, but I remember, I don't know if this for everybody, but I think when you initially discovered philosophy, I think it's maybe a natural response to have anger towards a lot of things that you yourself do but you don't maybe recognize. So you try to move it as far away from yourself as possible. So you're actually expressing anger towards that person, but you're really angry towards yourself.

Eldar [01:29:51]:
Because it's not working out for you.

Mike [01:29:54]:
Because that person is disgusting. But you not consciously understanding, like, hey, that person, it lives in me as well.

Eldar [01:30:02]:
Yeah.

Eldar [01:30:02]:
You don't have the compassion on the understanding to see things for what they are in order to understand that it's okay.

Mike [01:30:09]:
Yeah.

Eldar [01:30:10]:
Him or sheem being, like you said, disgusting is a normal phenomenon for seeing things for.

Mike [01:30:18]:
I feel like that's a common thing. Obviously, I haven't had a lot of experience with people who've newly discovered philosophy, but even, like, Nate and I see that Phil is having it, and then you want to distance yourself from those.

Eldar [01:30:34]:
Things a lot.

Mike [01:30:37]:
Because you don't know how to actually look at it in a sober note, to see things, what they are, so you get disgusted by it. So I think that's an interesting part that happens.

Eldar [01:30:56]:
But, yeah, that whole interaction with that.

Mike [01:30:59]:
Guy, it was definitely funny. At first. I was like, what the hell is happening? Phil was, like, jabbing him, and that guy was saying stuff, too.

Eldar [01:31:09]:
But I saw Phil.

Mike [01:31:11]:
One thing he did say that stuck in my mind. It was a very funny moment. He was in this guy's face, and he takes off his sunglasses, like, hey, do you know who the fuck I am.

Eldar [01:31:22]:
That's good.

Mike [01:31:25]:
Phil said, yo, I'm up here. Who the fuck are you? And again, that's coming from anger, the arrogance, right? All those things.

Eldar [01:31:34]:
That comment is just because maybe we're.

Mike [01:31:39]:
Doing philosophy every day, or we think we're doing philosophy every day, or we try to do it every day doesn't make us any better than that person. Especially when we come onto his playing field. Actually, I would say maybe we're lower than that person for that moment. Probably because he tricked us in to playing a game in his arena, a dirty arena.

Eldar [01:31:57]:
He won. He won that moment.

Mike [01:31:59]:
He suckered us into it.

Phillip [01:32:00]:
Yeah, that's what I was saying. We're going down to his level in those moments. And that's what I didn't like. That's why I was asking, like, hey, with those anger moments, what do you do in those moments? So I don't resort to this and I'm able to troll more and use my words more. That was what I was originally saying from.

Mike [01:32:15]:
But I think in order to do that, you have to look at that. Hey, we're all people. That's why Tolly and I think you probably also feel the same way we have maybe in the beginning even more, you felt about this. Now you could come it around a little bit. Like, yo, you guys hang out with these weird people like these Tommy's olegs.

Eldar [01:32:34]:
Yeah, right. Yeah, he was a lot more closed off.

Mike [01:32:36]:
You were closed off. You don't have nothing to do with them. And totally is the same way. He don't really want to hang out with them.

Eldar [01:32:42]:
But it's part of philosophy, and genuinely.

Mike [01:32:47]:
Philosophy is that you treat everybody as humans. Because we're all humans. Tom may be bad at this or good at this. I'm good at this, I'm bad at this. We're all flawed, we're all imperfect. So to judge a person or to not give them the human consideration.

Eldar [01:33:05]:
I.

Mike [01:33:05]:
Don'T believe it's the right thing to do.

Eldar [01:33:08]:
Yeah, I agree.

Mike [01:33:09]:
But what happens is because you haven't.

Eldar [01:33:12]:
Bought into that, that's why you're putting.

Mike [01:33:14]:
Those people, these are not humans.

Eldar [01:33:17]:
These are other people.

Mike [01:33:18]:
But in the end of the day, they also can be humans. They also have places where they are compassionate and practicing philosophy and extending kindness. Just in this area, they're still sick, they're still asleep, just like you might be sick or asleep in another area. So I think if you start looking at it like, hey, I'm really bad at taking criticism, right? But I'm really good at being considerate. You might be really bad at being considerate, but you're really good at criticism, right? Yeah, we have different problems, but we all essentially have problems just in different areas. And that's what makes us human in a way. It makes us equal. We're not no better than anybody.

Eldar [01:33:59]:
Even.

Mike [01:33:59]:
If we are trying to make a conscious effort to better ourselves in a daily basis or daily, weekly, whatever. When we come down to that level, that is like, I'm not sure how you can say that we're better. I think going into those arenas and engaging in those kind of things, it shows us where we're really at.

Phillip [01:34:19]:
Well, that's why I said I notice after, and I don't like how I feel because you are going down to a level. I think we can all agree that when we're elevating our mind, we're all connecting on something deeper, like truth. We're all like, wow. We feel like we're all connecting on something deeper than, and we're elevating ourselves. And on a day to day basis, we all feel really good because I think we all have similar beliefs on how we should be treated here, and I think it's easy here.

Eldar [01:34:45]:
But on the outside, real practice is from. With the outside.

Phillip [01:34:48]:
Yeah, we're dealing with some pissers, and these guys are definitely know, providing a good challenge. This guy's definitely around this know, definitely slapping some stuff around, definitely rearranging stuff, like, not the way that I would do. Don't. I can definitely see this, but also to Mike's point, I have to look at this as he's sick in one arena and I'm sick in another arena. And there has to be a compassion versus, like, I'm doing this and I'm coming from a good place and I'm looking down on him because I don't think that right or wrong makes a right kind of, whatever you want to talk, he's coming from a wrong place. And that's why I was saying I want to come from a good place. And it's like, that was really difficult for me in the moment. I'm not equipped to come from that place yet.

Phillip [01:35:39]:
I haven't had experience with it because it's usually, hey, either the anger comes out and somebody angers me and I don't say anything and I bottle it up. And the people pleasing thing you don't want to confront. That was one areita. Now it's literally like, hey, I'm not taking any shit. Go fuck yourself. Yeah, it's like, okay, I can go that route too. But it's like, yeah, did he maybe deserve that behavior? Okay, yeah, maybe fine. But I'm asking myself, did I handle it the best possible way that I can handle it? And I'm saying still no.

Phillip [01:36:08]:
I don't think it's good to bottle up and say nothing. I don't think it's good to just be a pisser and just be angry.

Eldar [01:36:14]:
For sure.

Phillip [01:36:14]:
I think there's that happy medium of like, hey, come with compassion and empathy. If he's a Pisser, maybe come back with some jokes. If he's going to come at me, yeah, I'm going to defend myself. That to me is like the last resort.

Eldar [01:36:27]:
That's right.

Phillip [01:36:27]:
But I think we can all agree that. I think trolling and coming with jokes is going to help us feel better and it's going to make him look the stupidest and it's going to expose the situation without having to compromise my integrity.

Eldar [01:36:42]:
But I don't think the goal is to make a person feel stupid.

Eldar [01:36:46]:
Right? I don't think so.

Eldar [01:36:48]:
Even though it's going to result in that.

Phillip [01:36:51]:
I think that's the byproduct, correct?

Eldar [01:36:52]:
Yeah. But I think, for example, in this situation, when I was thinking about, right, when you had the exchange with him, you said, hey, she's pregnant. It was an honest mistake. And he goes, well, they can't read or something.

Phillip [01:37:08]:
Yeah, right.

Eldar [01:37:09]:
I'm thinking about how can you respond.

Eldar [01:37:12]:
Right the first time?

Phillip [01:37:15]:
I said, hey, listen, I take full response. I just let it kind of go over my head. I said, hey, it's my guest. No problem. I didn't even address that. He said this. I was just like, hey, it's my guess it was my problem.

Eldar [01:37:25]:
It could be something like, yeah, you probably even decide with him in that moment, right? Yeah, maybe. Probably pregnancy spells or something.

Eldar [01:37:32]:
Yeah.

Eldar [01:37:32]:
You know what I mean? Something along those lines.

Eldar [01:37:35]:
Right? Sure.

Phillip [01:37:35]:
So you can kind of just.

Eldar [01:37:36]:
And then if the guy goes, if.

Eldar [01:37:38]:
He continues to ramp up, right, you.

Eldar [01:37:42]:
Can almost then give him the gun and say, well, if you think that calling a tow truck is the right thing to do, then do it. She's pregnant. You know the situation. But if you think that it's the right thing to do, then do it.

Eldar [01:37:59]:
Yeah, give him the gun.

Eldar [01:38:01]:
Let him shoot himself. See, something tells me that in that moment, despite of how hot that person is, I'm not sure if he chooses to call the tow truck. Yeah, I'm really not sure.

Eldar [01:38:13]:
If you give him the gun, you.

Phillip [01:38:15]:
Have to be like a joker.

Eldar [01:38:17]:
You have to be a psycho. But at that point, you should be okay with the outcome of the tow truck.

Eldar [01:38:24]:
Let him be him, because where he's at. Oh, shit. Oh, shit.

Eldar [01:38:34]:
You know what I'm saying?

Eldar [01:38:36]:
I agree with that.

Eldar [01:38:37]:
I think that type of interaction is super necessary.

Eldar [01:38:41]:
Right.

Eldar [01:38:42]:
So, yes, the byproduct of it, like you said, is for him to really be out, to be like a stupid.

Mike [01:38:50]:
But ultimately.

Eldar [01:38:51]:
But ultimately, right.

Mike [01:38:52]:
That's not what you want.

Eldar [01:38:53]:
The justice, right. Is to teach him. Teach him and you give him.

Mike [01:38:58]:
And that is the most right thing to do, is to help a person. Why do you think we troll each other all the time? Not because we want to make sure they feel stupid. That's just like a byproduct. But we generally want to help each other. And I think extending that towards all.

Eldar [01:39:12]:
People is the point. Correct.

Mike [01:39:15]:
And if you're going to make the person look stupid, that's part of it too.

Eldar [01:39:18]:
That's part of it.

Mike [01:39:19]:
Because if all the stupidity makes you humble.

Eldar [01:39:21]:
Correct.

Mike [01:39:21]:
You realize your own ignorance.

Eldar [01:39:23]:
Yeah.

Eldar [01:39:24]:
Correct. But if they can't get that, if they don't understand that, then like I said, you give them the resort and give them the gun and like, all right, go hang yourself.

Eldar [01:39:32]:
Yeah.

Phillip [01:39:33]:
And even in that moment, he knew he wanted me to go away. But I don't think genuinely that to me was like an act. I think ultimately he realized he was. Deep down, I think he probably knew that he wasn't behaving properly with the pregnant woman.

Eldar [01:39:49]:
Yeah.

Phillip [01:39:49]:
Pregnant woman aside, I think he would have run a whole muck. Yeah, I think then it wouldn't have mattered.

Eldar [01:39:54]:
Yeah.

Eldar [01:39:54]:
It would have been a fight.

Phillip [01:39:55]:
But I think there are certain common things where if somebody's special needs or there's a pregnant woman, there's certain type of things where no matter what the situation, there's like written rules.

Eldar [01:40:05]:
You would think so. You would think so.

Phillip [01:40:06]:
Like, yo.

Eldar [01:40:07]:
Yeah, you would think so.

Phillip [01:40:08]:
A baby.

Eldar [01:40:10]:
You underestimate the ignorance, how far the ignorance goes.

Phillip [01:40:14]:
Yeah, I guess I don't.

Eldar [01:40:16]:
Especially when it comes to people and how fast they can ramp past common sense. With anger, the most common. With anger, most common sense.

Mike [01:40:25]:
And another thing that I thought about after that whole experience happened transpired.

Eldar [01:40:31]:
I was driving home and I think.

Mike [01:40:34]:
We spoke about this before, a while ago. Is your ability to see future shit. If you came out there and you saw this guy parked like this, you right away going to be like, yo, this guy is going to be an idiot. A complete idiot.

Eldar [01:40:45]:
Correct.

Mike [01:40:45]:
And what is a complete idiot going to do, he's going to do exactly what he did is to drag you into a stupid argument.

Eldar [01:40:52]:
Like you said, that fucking mentally ill person killed those people. But you realize what the mental illness caused. You're like, oh, shit. You went through that. That was inevitable. He parked the car the way he parked the car. His mouth is going to be the inevitable part.

Eldar [01:41:05]:
Exactly.

Mike [01:41:06]:
You could have said, oh, what happened?

Eldar [01:41:07]:
Your car broke down.

Mike [01:41:09]:
This is a BMW. Why did it break down over here or something? Or just troll him on something that kind of, like, before he can even come out and say, like, something ignorant, you already know what he's coming with.

Eldar [01:41:20]:
And your troll will land on him as, like, you're oblivious and stupid.

Mike [01:41:26]:
Yeah, you have to be yourself, stupid as hell. And basically, in a way, call yourself stupid, but know that what exactly you're doing. And that guy, he's going to feel like he won.

Phillip [01:41:35]:
He'll feel superior in that sense. Will he be driving off and be like, yo, this fucking idiot doesn't even know what he's saying. And meanwhile, I'm just letting him run. Angry muck.

Eldar [01:41:43]:
Correct.

Phillip [01:41:44]:
And so he just drives off.

Eldar [01:41:45]:
That's right.

Eldar [01:41:45]:
Yeah.

Phillip [01:41:46]:
So I'm getting what I want. He's getting what he wants. Just to feel.

Eldar [01:41:49]:
That's right.

Phillip [01:41:49]:
Like he's teaching me a lesson.

Eldar [01:41:52]:
Yeah, that's right. Correct.

Phillip [01:41:53]:
That's what he wanted, right?

Eldar [01:41:54]:
Yeah.

Phillip [01:41:55]:
That guy, in that moment, wanted to teach everybody a lesson.

Eldar [01:41:57]:
So there you go.

Eldar [01:41:58]:
Right? Yeah.

Eldar [01:41:59]:
So there you go.

Eldar [01:41:59]:
Okay.

Eldar [01:42:00]:
So if you knew that, right, you could have deduced that in those 20 minutes, right? Like, okay, what does this guy want to do? He comes up like, okay, cool. I get it.

Mike [01:42:07]:
What do you want to teach me?

Eldar [01:42:08]:
Yeah, honest mistake, bro. Yeah.

Eldar [01:42:11]:
Which lesson would you like for me to teach you?

Mike [01:42:13]:
Be like, listen. Yeah, exactly. What are you trying to prove here?

Eldar [01:42:17]:
Or they can't read. Yeah, you're probably right.

Eldar [01:42:20]:
They didn't go to school. Look at them. Yeah.

Eldar [01:42:23]:
Look at this kid going. You know what I'm saying?

Phillip [01:42:26]:
Like, talk like crazy.

Eldar [01:42:29]:
You're never inviting him to my house again.

Mike [01:42:32]:
Think about that.

Eldar [01:42:33]:
What's he going to say?

Mike [01:42:35]:
That's the ability. A lot of the times, the situation, you can see what's going to happen if you're paying attention. You can predict, like, that was a given that was going to transpire that way.

Eldar [01:42:45]:
Yes.

Mike [01:42:45]:
There was no other way it could have went.

Eldar [01:42:47]:
No.

Mike [01:42:47]:
If you're going to park like that, there's only one way this is going to continue.

Eldar [01:42:50]:
Yes. Anybody who does that is looking for.

Phillip [01:42:53]:
Something after like dessert and lobster shack and drinking. I'm in a relaxed state.

Eldar [01:42:57]:
I'm not ready to have a conversation for confrontation.

Mike [01:43:00]:
100% job.

Eldar [01:43:02]:
He set that up for confrontation.

Phillip [01:43:04]:
But just think of.

Eldar [01:43:05]:
He thrives in this shit.

Phillip [01:43:07]:
But, eldar, think of our whole day. We were together the whole day. Think of the pool rooftop.

Mike [01:43:12]:
No, for sure.

Phillip [01:43:13]:
The nice conversation. We even had a pisser come upstairs, and we were able to joke with him and just see right through.

Eldar [01:43:20]:
That's what I'm saying. That that should only show you that you should have done better.

Phillip [01:43:23]:
Yeah, because I was relaxed.

Eldar [01:43:25]:
He was chilling.

Eldar [01:43:26]:
You had a good time, but you.

Mike [01:43:28]:
Still have to be paying attention regardless.

Eldar [01:43:30]:
You got to pay attention.

Eldar [01:43:31]:
Yeah.

Mike [01:43:31]:
Because the time that you're going to get hit over the head, and the elder always, like, we always have this thing. I always tell them, like, hey, I'm relaxed. I have my guard down. I get hit over the head. It's those times you get hit over the head the most because you put your guard down in the wrong time.

Eldar [01:43:46]:
You asked me, like, you always have to think. I'm like, yeah, you can't stop thinking.

Phillip [01:43:50]:
Yeah, he bonked us when we weren't thinking.

Mike [01:43:53]:
But that's the thing. You shouldn't. Even if you're on this vacation, you're chilling. You have to have some awareness of what's happening. And it sounds like, no, you got.

Eldar [01:44:02]:
To understand that it's perfectly normal, too, because Philip is looking for a perfect experience.

Eldar [01:44:08]:
Yeah.

Eldar [01:44:08]:
So if the perfect experience is going to be, somebody's going to come and.

Eldar [01:44:14]:
Try to bust that mess that up. It's a fight.

Mike [01:44:18]:
Yeah, 100%.

Eldar [01:44:18]:
Like, yo, we just had a perfect day, bro. Are you crazy?

Phillip [01:44:21]:
That's where I was coming from.

Eldar [01:44:22]:
Yeah.

Eldar [01:44:23]:
You understand? Are you crazy?

Mike [01:44:24]:
Again, it's showing you your attachment to the perfect day and the stuff. Like, whatever happened that day, we could have went to a lobster place, said we ran out of lobsters. That's not going to fucking fuck shit up. Go somewhere else. The pool could have been too hot, could have been too cold. There's nothing that's going to fuck up our day because we already come in a mentality. We're already having fun. We're together.

Mike [01:44:44]:
We're talking shit. We're drinking. We're in a good spirit.

Eldar [01:44:47]:
Unless not talking, not drinking, and just thinking stuff to himself behind the scenes.

Eldar [01:44:52]:
Yeah.

Eldar [01:44:53]:
While we're having fun.

Eldar [01:44:54]:
Yeah.

Eldar [01:44:54]:
That's how he's looking around, making sure they're like, oh, they didn't clean that area right there.

Phillip [01:45:00]:
Once we're in the moment, and we're all good. I'm like, then it's done.

Eldar [01:45:04]:
You just rolling with it.

Phillip [01:45:05]:
To me, even with that guy, I knew that guy was a pisser, and I started asking him questions. I didn't want to hang out with him the whole day. Santa Claus.

Eldar [01:45:13]:
Yeah.

Phillip [01:45:14]:
I didn't want him to be around, but I knew that not even him can ruin the day because I knew eventually he was going to leave. I saw his wife recently, actually. But anyway, I knew that wasn't even going to ruin the day. So to me, I found me in a situation that really challenged me because it's end of the day, we're relaxing. We're all just like, joking around. And this is an unexpected thing, but now looking at it now, yes. My attachment to the perfect day, literally the last 5% of the day.

Eldar [01:45:45]:
There you go.

Phillip [01:45:45]:
Everything else is great.

Eldar [01:45:46]:
Yeah.

Phillip [01:45:47]:
And this one was the one that.

Mike [01:45:49]:
But I wonder, if you ask Phil what's the perfect day?

Eldar [01:45:51]:
He wouldn't be able to even answer it.

Mike [01:45:54]:
Yeah, probably because you're making this thing to me, that guy showing up, there was nothing bad about it. We trolled the fuck out of him. We let him yap. We laughed at him the whole time, and then he left. That's not perfect. I mean, that's what we love to do here all day.

Eldar [01:46:08]:
Yeah.

Eldar [01:46:08]:
So that is also perfect if you're ready for these types of interactions. You inviting them?

Eldar [01:46:14]:
Yeah.

Eldar [01:46:15]:
Like, oh, yeah, let's go.

Mike [01:46:16]:
That's why you guys make fun of me that I always have attract these weirdos. But I'm like, I'm not upset about it.

Eldar [01:46:21]:
To me, I'm able to have fun.

Mike [01:46:22]:
With these weirdos because I'm being myself.

Eldar [01:46:24]:
That's right.

Mike [01:46:24]:
I could joke with them. Sometimes. We have a serious conversation if they want to. If they want to, but we're going.

Eldar [01:46:29]:
To bring it to anybody who want it with banana clips.

Mike [01:46:32]:
I'm going to dictate the goal for me and for you, and I think, Elder, is that we dictate how we're going to engage. We come in there and have fun.

Eldar [01:46:39]:
Goal, the ultimate goal is to engage to what you want to be engaging and getting what you want out of that conversation.

Phillip [01:46:46]:
Well, I was saying I didn't. That's why I didn't like that interaction, because I thought that I can do better in the interaction.

Eldar [01:46:52]:
Yeah, correct.

Phillip [01:46:52]:
Whether I thought he deserved it, ultimately, I'm even looking at it now. If I hit him, I wouldn't even have felt bad. But I still think I can do better than how I did it.

Eldar [01:47:01]:
Yeah, for sure.

Mike [01:47:01]:
Of course. But I think knowing, because you already.

Eldar [01:47:05]:
Had glimpses of understanding that your mind is a very powerful thing. Yes. And you have the ability to choose.

Mike [01:47:10]:
But I think always you have to decide. You have to make a choice that how you want to engage.

Eldar [01:47:15]:
Right.

Mike [01:47:16]:
Like, most of the time, 90% of the time, 95, we engage with the humor, with the fun.

Eldar [01:47:22]:
Right.

Mike [01:47:23]:
But those times where we get serious, we blow shit up. That's when we don't make the choice. We're not empowered in our own shit.

Eldar [01:47:29]:
Mike, we talked about the switch.

Eldar [01:47:31]:
Yeah.

Eldar [01:47:31]:
The switch is a very tricky thing when you switch yourself on and switch yourself off. And we're very good at switching ourselves off.

Eldar [01:47:39]:
You know what I'm saying?

Mike [01:47:41]:
But that's because I think you haven't all the way decided, like, where you want to be. I'm not going to take anything seriously.

Eldar [01:47:47]:
That's right.

Mike [01:47:47]:
But, no, I want to take the Rolex stuff, the fancy restaurants, the car things. I want to be taken seriously.

Eldar [01:47:53]:
But the paradox of this whole thing is actually taking everything very seriously.

Mike [01:47:57]:
Well, yeah, I know that.

Eldar [01:47:59]:
Okay.

Mike [01:47:59]:
Yeah.

Phillip [01:48:00]:
So we have to look at it as a plus of saying, hey, I can do 90% of this without joking around. If I only have 5% or 10%. That's very good.

Eldar [01:48:08]:
Right.

Phillip [01:48:09]:
Compared to, like, if I was always a serious person about everything, about relationships, friendships, jobs. Now I'm saying, hey, I can be at my job. I can be having a good time and getting stuff done. Wow. I'm not taking this as seriously, but I'm actually being more productive. This is a new mindset.

Eldar [01:48:24]:
Yes.

Eldar [01:48:24]:
But ultimately, what I'm trying to say.

Eldar [01:48:26]:
Philip, is that the stuff that needs.

Eldar [01:48:28]:
To be taken seriously should be taken very seriously.

Phillip [01:48:32]:
So stuff has a place to be taken seriously.

Eldar [01:48:34]:
100%. 100%.

Eldar [01:48:37]:
Okay.

Eldar [01:48:38]:
And then there's a lot of shit that the world has told us that we should be taking seriously, and that stuff, it's not serious.

Mike [01:48:45]:
We have it other way around.

Eldar [01:48:46]:
We got it all backwards.

Eldar [01:48:47]:
Yeah.

Mike [01:48:47]:
We think 95% is serious.

Eldar [01:48:49]:
That's right.

Mike [01:48:49]:
But 95 and has to be reversed.

Eldar [01:48:52]:
Yeah. Right.

Eldar [01:48:53]:
Like you said in the beginning, you said, hey, you take your piece seriously.

Eldar [01:48:58]:
Right?

Eldar [01:48:58]:
I take my piece seriously.

Eldar [01:49:00]:
Right.

Eldar [01:49:00]:
This is what you need to be taking seriously, very seriously. These types of interactions, you have to take very seriously, okay. Protecting your humor, your fun, having fun, and not allowing the adults to tell us what to do. And being able to count pennies, nippies without being judged. You have to take that stuff seriously.

Eldar [01:49:18]:
Okay.

Phillip [01:49:18]:
So when you say take it seriously, there's a level of protection that you're saying like, hey, oh, I'm not getting swayed.

Eldar [01:49:25]:
I'm having fun.

Phillip [01:49:28]:
When you're saying to be serious about that, you're serious as your line of defense to protect your innocence and your fun from then getting taken over.

Eldar [01:49:38]:
Correct.

Phillip [01:49:38]:
So you're basically blocking the nonsense from coming in and changing your mindset and you're going right back into having fun. So the serious is the layer of protection of basically trolling the anger, trolling the outside and just saying like, hey, yeah, okay, go fuck yourself in a.

Eldar [01:49:54]:
Fun, pleasant, I am serious about that, which I'm preaching. Very serious.

Eldar [01:49:59]:
Okay.

Eldar [01:50:00]:
I believe it wholeheartedly and I love it.

Eldar [01:50:05]:
Yeah, I get it.

Mike [01:50:08]:
You protect the seriousness, but you use your fun.

Eldar [01:50:12]:
Yes.

Mike [01:50:13]:
You don't like, oh, no, we're not.

Eldar [01:50:15]:
Going to do this.

Mike [01:50:16]:
You more so protecting the serious with the humor, with the comedy. Like, yo, I want to continue being trolling. You want to have a serious conversation, I'm going to have a trolling conversation.

Eldar [01:50:25]:
With you, but I'm going to make.

Mike [01:50:26]:
You feel like you think we're serious.

Eldar [01:50:28]:
Okay.

Mike [01:50:28]:
But I'm going to protect actually my fun. You think we're having a serious conversation.

Eldar [01:50:32]:
And we're very serious about having this type of interaction.

Eldar [01:50:36]:
Yeah, we believe in it.

Phillip [01:50:42]:
No, I guess, yes, it does make sense.

Eldar [01:50:44]:
It's a paradoxical.

Eldar [01:50:46]:
It is.

Phillip [01:50:46]:
But it's very like, yeah, we're protecting.

Mike [01:50:49]:
But not with seriousness. We're protecting the seriousness with fun. So we're being serious, but we're having fun while doing it. We're not being serious while doing it.

Eldar [01:50:59]:
That's right.

Mike [01:51:00]:
But we are being serious in protecting our fun. Yeah. It's hard to explain.

Eldar [01:51:04]:
That's right.

Mike [01:51:05]:
We're very an example.

Eldar [01:51:06]:
We're very serious about protecting the fun. Yes, we're very serious about that. That means, like, we try our best not to take life too seriously or when people come in here and trying to be serious and stuff like that about shit that is not serious, we're going to be serious about our shit, which means fun. And the paradoxical thing is that we do it with fun is what he's trying to say.

Eldar [01:51:28]:
Yeah.

Phillip [01:51:28]:
So if somebody is basically trying to get at your fun and they're coming in with this serious approach, I'm going to then trying to dispel their seriousness with fun.

Eldar [01:51:40]:
That's right.

Phillip [01:51:41]:
To protect your fun.

Eldar [01:51:42]:
That's right. Understood. Yeah.

Eldar [01:51:44]:
And we're very serious about this process. Well, you witness it on a daily basis.

Phillip [01:51:49]:
Yeah. And I like it.

Eldar [01:51:50]:
You do like it. And I think you like this game.

Phillip [01:51:52]:
Yeah, I guess where I'm coming from also is that. And I keep saying it, it's difficult even when you're in this on a day to day basis where you are protecting your fun with fun, to then still be subjected to going to your old self, which is like the killer of the party guy, which I have that in me.

Eldar [01:52:13]:
Yes.

Eldar [01:52:14]:
So you probably maybe believe somewhere deep inside that teaching, the way you teach, has to be serious.

Eldar [01:52:22]:
Yes.

Eldar [01:52:23]:
Okay. Where I believe, and I 100% believe this, and I've seen this many times, that my humor, the ability to project fun out there through humor and stuff, through trolling and stuff, can actually teach the lesson.

Eldar [01:52:38]:
I believe this.

Eldar [01:52:40]:
Yeah, you've witnessed this, too.

Mike [01:52:42]:
When we do, when we make sarcastic jokes about you doing funny things or about me, that's exactly what it is. We're calling you out. You're trying to make us tell us a serious person and we're trolling you sarcastically and you obviously are feeling it and you're like, yo, wait, why the fuck am I doing this? You've experienced this on many occasions. I'm sure nothing just comes to mind at the moment.

Eldar [01:53:06]:
No, for sure. 100%.

Mike [01:53:07]:
But this is exactly. Happens all the time. When Tolly makes a serious statement, he's like, yo, we got to do this. We got to do this. And we're like, yo, calm down.

Eldar [01:53:16]:
Calm down.

Mike [01:53:16]:
We don't have to do anything. We just ate lunch a half an hour ago or whatever, right?

Eldar [01:53:20]:
Yeah.

Mike [01:53:20]:
Obviously that's not what's happening.

Eldar [01:53:22]:
But we're saying, like, yo, you're trying.

Mike [01:53:24]:
To ruin the parade. We're having fun.

Eldar [01:53:27]:
We get it.

Mike [01:53:28]:
You're hungry, but we're having too much fun right now. We'll eat.

Eldar [01:53:30]:
Yeah, we get that.

Eldar [01:53:34]:
It's a method, right? I think it's a method to trying to teach. We can also do the whole serious thing, too, if needed. I think if some people want to have a serious conversation without laughing, stuff like that, oh, we're ready. We can definitely do it.

Eldar [01:53:47]:
But it's not fun.

Eldar [01:53:48]:
No, it could be fun. It could still be fun. If you get to a point where you discover universal truth or objective truth and you're on the same page, I think it's still fun. It feels good. It feels good.

Mike [01:53:59]:
Yeah.

Eldar [01:54:00]:
Feels nice. But if you have the choice. If you have the choice in the matter, right. Wouldn't you want to engage in such a way where you have the most amount of fun. Yeah, probably that's what you're looking for.

Eldar [01:54:15]:
Yeah.

Eldar [01:54:16]:
That's what you're after. And I think that everybody's after that. Just a lot of people just don't.

Eldar [01:54:19]:
Have, I guess, the means or the.

Eldar [01:54:21]:
Understanding and string words together in such a way to explain what we're trying to say here. We're just trying to explain the experience with words.

Eldar [01:54:30]:
Yeah.

Eldar [01:54:33]:
And the agenda.

Phillip [01:54:34]:
Yeah, I guess it always comes back to extending the fun. You're taking it here. We want to extend it to these other.

Mike [01:54:41]:
Well, think about this example. Sorry to cut you off. Think about what just happened today with the donuts.

Eldar [01:54:45]:
Okay? Yeah, what happened?

Mike [01:54:48]:
This guy took everything so seriously. We all chilling and he disappears.

Phillip [01:54:52]:
He left early.

Mike [01:54:52]:
He's an extremely serious fucking guy on these fucking donuts.

Eldar [01:54:55]:
You understand this?

Mike [01:54:56]:
Chasing the fucking truck. And what do we do?

Eldar [01:54:58]:
We're chilling, talking, hanging out, and this guy just runs away. He didn't say, I have a meeting or anything like that.

Mike [01:55:03]:
He said, the cookie craving hit or.

Eldar [01:55:05]:
The donut craving hit, I'm out of here.

Mike [01:55:07]:
You understand? He just did that.

Eldar [01:55:09]:
And we pulled a prank on him. We hid the donuts. He came here slamming the doors left and right. You understand?

Mike [01:55:15]:
We extended our fund and we showed him that he's being at his expense. At his expense to show him how ridiculous it is.

Eldar [01:55:21]:
And then he still got his donuts, but not on the same umph anymore.

Eldar [01:55:26]:
No.

Mike [01:55:29]:
We talked about it. We laughed at it. We discussed like, yo, this is a ridiculous move.

Eldar [01:55:33]:
That's right.

Eldar [01:55:34]:
Right?

Mike [01:55:34]:
He's doing some weird, serious shit. I don't understand why he couldn't sell us on it.

Eldar [01:55:41]:
So he's like, fuck it, I'm to.

Mike [01:55:42]:
Going just do it myself, and what do we do? We extended our funds and we beat him. Played a prank on him.

Phillip [01:55:47]:
Yeah, that's very funny.

Mike [01:55:52]:
We're trying to show him that you're being stupid here. What are you doing? You're running out to go get donuts?

Phillip [01:55:59]:
Video of him picking up the box.

Eldar [01:56:02]:
Yeah.

Eldar [01:56:02]:
She's like, can you give me the checkbook? He picks up the box, he's like, wait, there's donuts here? The fuck?

Eldar [01:56:09]:
Yeah, sick. He's like, fuck the fuck.

Phillip [01:56:12]:
Me and Mike were having so much fun with it on the phone.

Eldar [01:56:16]:
I called Catherine, he was standing right there. I called Catherine, I'm like, babe, are you serious? I asked you to buy me cronut.

Phillip [01:56:23]:
I'm yelling at her, wait, where are you?

Eldar [01:56:26]:
I'm here already. You guys are driving, right? He's complains like fucking the guys. Phil probably left a donut on the table, in the middle table, and the people upstairs ate the donut. That's what we told them. I'm like, no way. No way this happened. So I'm calling Catherine in front of him, put her on speaker. And I'm yelling at Catherine on purpose, but Catherine already knows.

Mike [01:56:44]:
You understand how far we.

Eldar [01:56:45]:
I'm like, babe, are you serious? I asked you one thing. I asked you to give me a know. Why was it given? Why did you take it back? Why did you give it away? Where'd you put it? Yeah. She's like, babe, I didn't know. I left it at the office. I didn't take it.

Phillip [01:56:58]:
Did you tell Kat you were joking?

Mike [01:56:59]:
Well, she knew.

Eldar [01:57:01]:
So she's playing along.

Phillip [01:57:02]:
She's playing in on.

Eldar [01:57:03]:
She's playing in on it the whole know. And she sees that I'm scolding her for misplacing the donuts. You know what I mean? So he's getting his fix.

Phillip [01:57:12]:
So this makes it more real for him.

Eldar [01:57:14]:
Oh, yeah, it makes it more real for him. But that's what he wants. He wants justice here. He's upset. He's like, yo, what the fuck happened to the donuts? So I'm going to yell at her. He's like, yeah. In the background, he's happy that I'm doing it.

Phillip [01:57:24]:
And I was not understanding. I was in the phone, like, yo, I saw the girls downstairs, like, looking at the donuts. They probably thought it was for them.

Eldar [01:57:31]:
Yeah.

Phillip [01:57:31]:
So we had him running like his mind was all over.

Mike [01:57:33]:
We had him going 100 miles.

Eldar [01:57:35]:
I went to the kitchen again. He follows me to the kitchen again. You know what I mean? He's checking all the places I go to Tara's. I start doing the spiel to Terra. Like he's going behind me like a fucking puppy. It's crazy.

Mike [01:57:47]:
You understand?

Eldar [01:57:49]:
We went on a fucking journey.

Phillip [01:57:50]:
Now just think of how great our lunch was. I was saying, it's probably like our best group lunch. We're having a fun time, like at your house. The lobster is having good conversation. We're enjoying ourselves. And he cut that short for a donut?

Eldar [01:58:03]:
Yeah, he pulled the plug on it for a donut.

Eldar [01:58:06]:
Well, pranked.

Phillip [01:58:07]:
And we took the donut away from him.

Mike [01:58:08]:
From him, yes.

Eldar [01:58:10]:
But then when he ate it, he wasn't satisfied.

Eldar [01:58:12]:
No. Kicked us off. Yeah.

Phillip [01:58:14]:
We did really well today. That was good. We really did. That is a perfect example of fun.

Mike [01:58:20]:
Yeah, of course.

Eldar [01:58:21]:
That's right.

Phillip [01:58:22]:
So that's perfect.

Mike [01:58:23]:
He wanted to be serious.

Eldar [01:58:24]:
Yeah.

Mike [01:58:26]:
Not that he threw a wrench in.

Eldar [01:58:27]:
Our shit, but he threw a fit.

Mike [01:58:29]:
Like, what if he went away, disappeared to doing weird shit? That's us. Like, yo, what are you doing? And then we're like, okay, you're going to do this now? We're going to have.

Eldar [01:58:38]:
Who came up with that? Who came up to hide the donut?

Eldar [01:58:40]:
I did.

Mike [01:58:40]:
I told you to hit, right?

Eldar [01:58:42]:
Yeah.

Phillip [01:58:43]:
Wait, so wait, do you guys think this is a premeditated murder? Do you think that he drove by himself knowing that he wanted to come back and get the donut?

Eldar [01:58:51]:
No.

Mike [01:58:52]:
Or no, I don't think.

Eldar [01:58:53]:
Oh, my God.

Phillip [01:58:54]:
Because he drove by himself, right?

Eldar [01:58:57]:
That's crazy.

Mike [01:58:57]:
He also came to your house by himself, which is I thought was weird.

Phillip [01:59:00]:
No, elders, remember he said, hey, are we taking separate cars?

Eldar [01:59:04]:
And then he left.

Phillip [01:59:05]:
And then me and you went.

Mike [01:59:07]:
Yeah.

Phillip [01:59:08]:
He didn't have a meeting or anything?

Mike [01:59:09]:
No, he probably had a personal call.

Phillip [01:59:11]:
A personal call?

Eldar [01:59:12]:
That's what I would say.

Phillip [01:59:13]:
So you don't think the donuts is premeditated?

Eldar [01:59:15]:
No.

Phillip [01:59:16]:
You think he legit got a craving?

Mike [01:59:17]:
I think he got a craving.

Eldar [01:59:18]:
Okay.

Phillip [01:59:19]:
Yeah, but the point is his cravings are able to put a wrench in a beautiful.

Eldar [01:59:25]:
Well, that's the thing.

Eldar [01:59:26]:
Yeah, that's the thing.

Eldar [01:59:27]:
I think his stomach definitely dictates what's going on. Yeah, well, listen, that's his fun right now.

Eldar [01:59:32]:
Yeah. You have to respect it.

Mike [01:59:36]:
We got to enjoy ourselves, too, with.

Eldar [01:59:38]:
It because it was definitely a very funny thing, bro.

Phillip [01:59:40]:
The corn on the cob, though. Corn on the cob with the melted Butter and the sea salt.

Mike [01:59:44]:
Looks good, right?

Eldar [01:59:46]:
Holy shit.

Phillip [01:59:47]:
I feel like corn on the cob is like corn. Yeah, every once in a while.

Eldar [01:59:51]:
No, that corn was very good.

Phillip [01:59:53]:
But corn on the cob, to me, I had that so much as a kid, and then as I grew up, I didn't have it as much.

Eldar [01:59:59]:
And it's fucking great.

Phillip [02:00:00]:
Yeah, it's like, so good.

Eldar [02:00:02]:
It was very good.

Eldar [02:00:03]:
Yeah. Especially today.

Phillip [02:00:05]:
I definitely want to have corn in the cob more.

Eldar [02:00:08]:
All right, then. Yeah, noted.

Phillip [02:00:10]:
It's very good.

Eldar [02:00:12]:
All right, so, final thoughts?

Phillip [02:00:15]:
Final thoughts.

Eldar [02:00:16]:
I would say.

Eldar [02:00:18]:
It was very good.

Phillip [02:00:20]:
Yeah, I would say you had real life examples. Yeah, we definitely had real life examples. I would definitely say that. I guess you can feel like you're making progress, and I think you are, but I think also being realistic and realizing how deep your insecurity or your condition or your attachment is, that, to me, is like this ever going ever learning thing of. I think I'm kicking it, but I'm not. And it's like that 5% or 10%, it's like the apple, like it's rotting. Like the whole apple is rotting. You can't just cut off a little piece.

Phillip [02:01:02]:
I feel like it's just going to grow back. Are you actually taking care of the core of what is actually causing this thing, or you just maybe. Okay, yeah, I'm doing philosophy. I'm learning and I'm growing on a day to day basis. I feel good. All of a sudden, I'm in a real life situation with this stranger.

Eldar [02:01:19]:
I don't know how to behave.

Phillip [02:01:20]:
I don't know how to behave myself. Yeah. So what does that actually teach me? So that I'm saying, hey, all of a sudden all these things go out the window. And in a real life situation, let's say, that turned into a bad situation where all of a sudden charges get pressed against me and I had to go to jail. I don't know who said crazy situation. All of a sudden, all this good stuff I'm doing is thrown out the window from this momentary lapse of judgment and me not being, I guess, honest with myself and taking the situation so seriously, where I'm pushing all the good stuff, all that 90 plus percent of the good stuff that I'm learning, and I'm allowing the 5% or 10% of the seriousness to dictate. So again, I think philosophy is teaching me that as you think you're winning and you have all this stuff going, a situation is going to humble yourself.

Eldar [02:02:09]:
It was very good.

Phillip [02:02:10]:
I think, inherently in winning and when you think you're doing well, I think it's very easy to be arrogant and think you're better than other people.

Eldar [02:02:16]:
That's right.

Phillip [02:02:17]:
So I think anytime I'm doing that, whether it's making a sale or coming up with a new realization or finding out a new truth in that, it's good. But I think even though when you're doing good and you're coming from a place of compassion or kindness, you can have an ego as a result of these things. Also, because building up, because I think people do this with even religion or coming from a place of like, hey, I'm more spiritual than you, or I have more of an understanding of this thing that's inherently good. But just because you have a certain perception and I'm putting it on you or holding it over you a certain way, I'm finding that these good things can be. I guess it's a double edged sword. Yeah, it could cause negative behavior in yourself. So, again, it's just causing me to be more aware of all these things that we're doing and constantly being in a state of reevaluation and being humble. And every time I'm being humble, you're like, okay, I'm doing all these things that I like, and you're like, shit, I got to rehumble myself again.

Phillip [02:03:23]:
It's like this constant cycle of, like, I'm being humble. I'm going to go off on a tangent. I'm going to find an arrogant situation that I'm going to get pointed out to me, and then I have to rehumble myself again.

Eldar [02:03:34]:
That's right.

Phillip [02:03:34]:
So, to me, philosophy is a reexamination constantly of your behaviors to rehumble yourself. And when you're not coming from a humble place, you're going to be exposed. If you're open to being exposed.

Eldar [02:03:47]:
That's right.

Eldar [02:03:48]:
Aka get humbled or get fucked. Yeah, that's well put. Philip always breaks it down really well. That's true. That's true. You know, when you were saying that, the question came to my mind then, how is self development or the truths that we find along the way affect our previous bad habits? And he's saying that they can actually magnify them because it can grow. It can grow the ego and pride on the other side.

Mike [02:04:16]:
Yes. That's what I was trying to say about a lot of people. When they first discover philosophy, they think they're doing something good, and they start judging other people or having a certain opinion of other people because of the things that they used to do or they still do in certain areas, so they don't extend the compassion towards others like that. They're also learning, and we haven't figured everything out.

Eldar [02:04:42]:
No.

Eldar [02:04:43]:
Yeah. Would you say that based on that question, would you say that there is an order of which things need to be learned first?

Mike [02:04:56]:
Well, you talked about this a long time ago, remember?

Eldar [02:04:58]:
Yes.

Mike [02:04:59]:
You can't start learning advanced fucking philosophy without doing the basics.

Eldar [02:05:04]:
The basics?

Eldar [02:05:04]:
Yeah.

Mike [02:05:04]:
If you don't have respect, kindness, compassion, you can't think about fucking doing justice. That's such a fucking complicated fucking thing itself. What's just. What's not? Look at so many different angles. What's the right thing? Or something even more complicated than just right?

Phillip [02:05:20]:
Well, you said this with this guy Jake. This guy's meditating, and he hasn't even understood how to be truly kind and compassionate towards another person.

Eldar [02:05:27]:
That's right.

Phillip [02:05:28]:
He's just pissing around, being a total arrogant prick, and saying, oh, I'm meditating. He's just meditating. All this pain away, and then he's doing the right thing.

Mike [02:05:35]:
Yes, exactly.

Eldar [02:05:36]:
That's right.

Mike [02:05:39]:
No, for sure. I agree with you on that, that there's probably an order of how to learn things, but because life is not orderly. Orderly. We learn as we go. But I think it's also part of the process. It is part of the process. I don't know if you could ever do it unless you just let somebody out.

Eldar [02:06:01]:
But on the other hand, right, you can look at it as, look, is Philip saying that he falls, he gets up, he falls, he gets up, he falls, he gets up. You can look at it as like, wow, there's so many opportunities to get up. Well, there is.

Eldar [02:06:12]:
Yeah, right?

Eldar [02:06:13]:
There's so many opportunities.

Mike [02:06:14]:
There is a lot of out there.

Eldar [02:06:15]:
And actually have fun and play because there's going to be so many challenges or opportunities for me to get up to have more fun, fall again, have more fun again, and then keep going.

Phillip [02:06:29]:
Yeah, I look at that as like a chore. It's like a pain in the butt. You know what I mean? It's like, oh, I'm doing good. Why can't I just keep doing good? To me, it's like every time there's this down turn or like something to learn, I'm looking at it as like, it's like a pain in the butt. I just want to stay at good all the time. That's like an unrealistic expectation that I have, which is attached to probably perfection. Like, oh, I got the good.

Eldar [02:06:50]:
You apply that to that.

Phillip [02:06:51]:
So it's like, oh, I got the good, right? It's like, fuck, I got to go.

Eldar [02:06:54]:
Back down to the shit again.

Eldar [02:06:55]:
That's lack of self love.

Phillip [02:06:57]:
Yeah, it's like, I got to go back down the shit again. And you're enjoying the process more where you're like, hey, I can have humor. I can deal with fucking oshkosh bagash idiot. And I can have fun with it. And you can deal with fun with seriousness. Vice versa, however. And I'm looking at it as like, damn, I'm in this good place. I want to stay good.

Phillip [02:07:15]:
And then I got this person that I'm allowing to influence me. I'm not strong enough in my foundation. I'm not able to then communicate and maybe confront and challenge. And then I look at it as like, I got to go back down to this place. I don't look at it as an opportunity. I look at, as I'm getting dragged down into the muck, and I'm in this high place. But I think it's basically life saying, hey, you're at this place. You're at a good place, but now you're being arrogant in this good place, and now we have to humble you again.

Eldar [02:07:45]:
And I'm like, oh, you know what's the coolest thing, Philip, is when you'll learn one day to go to that place with him, but you don't feel any of the things that he or you feeling at this moment. You know what I'm talking about, Mike?

Mike [02:07:59]:
No, I didn't send it.

Eldar [02:08:00]:
Okay.

Eldar [02:08:01]:
It will be very cool for you to be able to go to that place with that guy.

Mike [02:08:06]:
Which place? The place that. The arrogant. That something.

Eldar [02:08:09]:
Where that guy. The parking guy. The angry place.

Eldar [02:08:12]:
Yeah, right.

Eldar [02:08:13]:
But you're not feeling the anger from him or from yourself, but you're in that place.

Mike [02:08:18]:
Oh, yeah. I mean, I have had this when I have certain conversations with certain people.

Eldar [02:08:23]:
You witnessed this on a basketball court, remember?

Eldar [02:08:25]:
Yeah.

Eldar [02:08:25]:
Remember what I was doing?

Mike [02:08:26]:
I saw that. Yeah, I remember that.

Eldar [02:08:28]:
These people take themselves very seriously, and sometimes they'll come out of their face.

Eldar [02:08:33]:
Right.

Eldar [02:08:33]:
Really almost to a point where they're ready to fight. I sometimes go down there showing that I'm ready to fight, but I'm not saying anything that's affecting me emotionally, or I'm not allowing whatever they're saying emotionally affect me. I'm actually having even more fun at that moment. It's the craziest experience.

Eldar [02:08:55]:
That's very fun. Right, Mike?

Mike [02:08:57]:
Yeah.

Eldar [02:08:58]:
Yeah.

Eldar [02:08:59]:
And those people who understand this, like Mike saw it and observed it. He sees that I'm being very serious, and I'm ready to fight you. But he sees that I'm cracking a.

Eldar [02:09:08]:
Smile inside because it's all an act. Yeah.

Eldar [02:09:13]:
I'm just joking. But that person is under the impression that this is serious.

Phillip [02:09:19]:
So it's like getting really good at acting.

Eldar [02:09:22]:
Yeah.

Eldar [02:09:24]:
Because then you know which to use in which situation.

Mike [02:09:26]:
But you don't even have to be good at acting, because those people where they're so committed to whatever they're trying to sell you could be a horrible actor, and they'll still go for it.

Eldar [02:09:34]:
They'll still buy it.

Mike [02:09:35]:
They'll take the bait. They'll still buy it because they're so attached to whatever they want to sell you or whatever they want to sell themselves. When he was saying, two things came.

Eldar [02:09:46]:
To mind is that with staying humble.

Mike [02:09:50]:
Is really adopting that mentality that Socrates says. I know that I know nothing. Yeah, that's a huge thing, I think.

Eldar [02:09:58]:
Huge.

Mike [02:10:00]:
We learn something and we think we know. Yes, but we maybe know fucking hundred more zeros than a one of actually what we know. Because I believe this is that life, the philosophy, never ends. You don't ever reach the place where you figure it out. And now you're just on cruise control.

Eldar [02:10:19]:
That's right.

Mike [02:10:20]:
You get fucking bombarded from different areas your whole life. You're going to have your own challenges against yourself, challenges with people you interact with, your girlfriend, your parents, your wife, your kids. It never ends. And I think adopting that mentality about philosophy, it keeps you humble, and it lets you know that, yeah, I'm on a journey, but you know that. How far? You haven't actually gone under impression you went so far, 100%, but you haven't even begun.

Eldar [02:10:47]:
Because it just never ends.

Mike [02:10:51]:
I don't know about enlightenment, but I.

Eldar [02:10:53]:
Think he wholeheartedly believed that fact also because he knew that as soon as he knew something, he knew that there's more to know.

Mike [02:11:02]:
There's more to know about that.

Eldar [02:11:03]:
You know what I'm saying? And more and more and more. And because he found out that he just unlocked this level, that level showed him that he just opened ten levels that he doesn't know about. And as he keeps progressing, he's like, oh, there's more. So he kept saying to himself, I know nothing. To keep himself humble and to keep going on this journey of learning to.

Mike [02:11:21]:
Not get your head thinking, like, oh, I figured something out because then you develop ego.

Eldar [02:11:27]:
You hurt yourself.

Eldar [02:11:28]:
You hurt yourself.

Mike [02:11:29]:
So I think that's a great thing. Yeah, I genuinely believe that. The philosophy train, it never ends. It's just a lifelong kind of.

Eldar [02:11:39]:
It's a. Well you can't exhaust.

Mike [02:11:40]:
Yeah, you said it. Yeah, you said it before. It's a well you cannot exhaust.

Eldar [02:11:44]:
It's unexhaustible. Well.

Mike [02:11:45]:
And if you look at it that way, you realize that there's no thing how far you've come or how far you didn't come. You just keep on going because you love it, you have fun with it, and it never ends. It never stops. Why would you want it to?

Eldar [02:11:58]:
No, you don't.

Eldar [02:11:59]:
You don't want it to. That's why you want to keep living and keep enjoying it. And even if you're ready, I think, to move on to the next place, I think that you come to that place now with a completely different attitude where you're like, all right, cool, I'm ready for the next stage.

Eldar [02:12:13]:
Yeah. You know what I'm saying?

Eldar [02:12:15]:
Whatever that may be, because you're not holding any kind of judgment upon what's next.

Phillip [02:12:20]:
So is life very similar to video games in the sense of levels? I think we're talking to my friend about this before of your age is like levels, but to me, it's not the proper association because you can be 60 and you can be on level two.

Mike [02:12:36]:
Well, that's actually the truth. You could be 60 on level two as we had a reference with your guy in the parking lot. But the point is, he's not on.

Eldar [02:12:43]:
The level, though, bro. But I think he's still trying to see if they're going to allow him to play. I don't think he grew enough height. When you go to the six flags and they're like, yo, you're too short. You can't get on this ride. I think that's the level he's on.

Eldar [02:12:54]:
Yeah.

Eldar [02:12:55]:
Stuck about going on the level.

Phillip [02:12:56]:
Oh, yeah. What I'm saying is that the way that we're talking about life is it is like a video game where there are levels where you have to have certain accomplishments to get to the next level. You could be stuck on level two thinking that you're almost at the end, but you didn't get the proper gear. The gear. You didn't get the proper guidance. You didn't go over the hill, like, the proper way. You keep dying and you keep getting frustrated and you're not looking at the whole thing and saying like, hey, what do I actually have to do to beat this level? Opposed to just like, I'm mostly just saying, okay, I'm going to resort back to this other thing and I'm just going to keep trying to do the level the same way. The same way.

Phillip [02:13:34]:
The same way. And I'm not looking at it as like, this whole game with opportunity. The way that you guys are describing it, to me, it's more of a game and it's more fun opposed to this serious thing. I think when you are serious, you're more prone to resorting back to the behavior that's not working for you because that's rooted in serious, unfun behavior.

Eldar [02:13:54]:
That's right.

Phillip [02:13:55]:
I think fun can uncrack serious cracks. Serious cracks, fun. But in a way that takes the light away.

Eldar [02:14:02]:
That's right.

Phillip [02:14:02]:
The funds, the way that we're describing it is it's going to shed light on the seriousness.

Eldar [02:14:07]:
That's right.

Phillip [02:14:07]:
And we can grow from this 100%. We can agree that the serious is not really helping us grow no, it's probably taking that away.

Eldar [02:14:16]:
Right. Right. That's.

Eldar [02:14:17]:
It's taking away from what we're trying to do because we understood that. I think through having fun, we grow.

Eldar [02:14:22]:
Yeah.

Eldar [02:14:23]:
The more fun we have, the more we grow. Have that ability to preserve that and then share it. Right. Because ultimately, what do you want to do? Right. We want to be in relationships.

Eldar [02:14:33]:
Right.

Eldar [02:14:34]:
We want to have more fun with the people that we're in relationships with. We're trying to infect and be infectious without fun.

Eldar [02:14:41]:
That's it.

Eldar [02:14:41]:
What do you think you're doing here? We're infecting you with our way of life.

Phillip [02:14:45]:
Yeah, we're having fun.

Eldar [02:14:46]:
We're having fun. And you're like, wait a second. I relate to this shit. I'm like, duh, bro.

Eldar [02:14:51]:
You know what I'm saying? Sure.

Eldar [02:14:52]:
You're 37 years old. I'm 38 years old. But we're trying to get back to being five. Just mucking around in the dirt.

Eldar [02:15:00]:
That's it.

Mike [02:15:00]:
With lobster juice everywhere.

Eldar [02:15:02]:
With lobster juice everywhere. Having experiences. Booty hole juice. The green booty hole juice from the lobster. You know what? One thing fucked me up, though, a little bit when I was eating the.

Eldar [02:15:14]:
Lobster, and I didn't have this experience.

Eldar [02:15:18]:
In a long time.

Eldar [02:15:19]:
I mean, maybe forever. I opened the claw, and the fucking claw is, like, stuck. Like this. Stuck.

Eldar [02:15:31]:
You know how most of the time you open it and it just comes out perfectly nice? This claw was, like, all bent out of shape.

Eldar [02:15:38]:
Oh, shit. Yeah.

Phillip [02:15:42]:
What do you mean? So what happened?

Eldar [02:15:43]:
Velocity was a little, you know. No, it was hot, bro. It was hot.

Eldar [02:15:49]:
It was boiling.

Eldar [02:15:51]:
Oh, he was suffering.

Eldar [02:15:52]:
Yeah, man.

Phillip [02:15:53]:
Oh, you mean like, what? He was hurt?

Eldar [02:15:55]:
Yeah, think about it.

Eldar [02:15:58]:
Yeah, that fucked me up a little bit.

Eldar [02:16:00]:
Yeah. Wait, what do you mean?

Eldar [02:16:07]:
If I throw you now in a.

Eldar [02:16:08]:
Boiling water, right, what's going to happen to your body?

Eldar [02:16:11]:
Going to scrinch up, shrivel up and shrivel up and get scared? I fucking saw that in a fucking thing.

Phillip [02:16:18]:
Oh, you mean the actual. It was, like, deformed.

Eldar [02:16:21]:
Yeah, it was deformed until, like, he.

Phillip [02:16:23]:
You know, because he was grabbing onto it so hard for his life.

Eldar [02:16:27]:
Yeah, that fucked me up a little bit.

Phillip [02:16:30]:
Damn. So you saw that in the.

Eldar [02:16:36]:
Know? Yeah, I didn't say anything.

Eldar [02:16:38]:
I fucking ate it, but I fucking.

Eldar [02:16:41]:
Was like, fucking shit.

Phillip [02:16:43]:
I had an experience. I don't know if it was exactly like this, but I was at. This is maybe three, four years ago. I was down at LBI. My friend bought the live lobster, and I didn't understand what you have to do.

Eldar [02:16:55]:
Yeah, they threw them in the boil, and it was throwing the boiling water.

Phillip [02:16:59]:
It was alive, and he cut it open while it was alive, and I heard the crunch, and I was like, oh.

Eldar [02:17:06]:
I was like, yo, did you just kill it? Yeah.

Phillip [02:17:09]:
I was like, oh, damn. If I knew he had to do this, I wouldn't have wanted it. He's like, you want to get lobsters? I was like, oh, yeah, fucking cool. He's like a foodie. Like, I like that. I just kind of went along with it. And I'll never forget, he was on the kitchen counter, and I was, like, sitting, like, say I was here, and he was, like, over in the corner, and I heard the crunch. I was like, yo, he just took this thing's life, so we and enjoy it, and I didn't like that crunch, and it was uncomfortable, and I was.

Eldar [02:17:34]:
Like, yo, you felt the same thing after.

Phillip [02:17:36]:
So, yeah, I think this was probably.

Eldar [02:17:37]:
This was it in the same 100%.

Phillip [02:17:39]:
Yeah, I didn't like it.

Eldar [02:17:40]:
You didn't like it?

Phillip [02:17:40]:
Yeah, I did not like it. But just think, if we're thinking about all the products that we get behind the scenes, somebody is doing this on a day to day basis.

Mike [02:17:51]:
Yeah, we got to go raw.

Phillip [02:17:55]:
But then also, I think I was watching, like, a Pierce Morgan interview, and he was asking a vegan about, uh, hey, where do you think you get all your avocados? It was like, some type of, like, he's like, do you know how many bees that you have to kill to get an avocado? Or, like, something like this. I don't know what the correlation was, but it's like, in order to get even vegetables, you're going to have to kill a lot of these things to preserve it and do it a certain way. And I think coming to pesticides and stuff.

Eldar [02:18:26]:
Yeah.

Phillip [02:18:26]:
I think coming to the realization that we're at the top of the food chain and that animals do this on a day to day basis, and we have to do this to survive. It's like one of those necessary evils, evils that you have to just kind of eat to then realize, like, yeah, what am I going to do? Just eat vegetables then? Also, vegetables require a lot of this energy and a lot of these things to have their lives taken away. Yeah, it's like, damn, this is what it is. So I'm saying, so we have the ability to think animals are doing this without thinking. And I think me observing the bear, me observing penny or the bird, we're getting to see these people do this. They don't have a guilty conscience about the lobster.

Eldar [02:19:07]:
No.

Phillip [02:19:08]:
To me, that's the big difference between us and then the animals. So we have this ability to think and reason, which can cause us sickness and depression when done wrong. But when done right, we can reach enlightenment at a different level.

Eldar [02:19:19]:
Yeah. Right? Yeah.

Phillip [02:19:22]:
Bears aren't having these conversations, like around campfire.

Eldar [02:19:25]:
No.

Phillip [02:19:25]:
They're going to try to kill the salmon, and then they just survive.

Eldar [02:19:28]:
Sex. Just survival.

Mike [02:19:31]:
But they might be already enlightened.

Eldar [02:19:33]:
They might be already enlightened. All right, so we did it.

Eldar [02:19:36]:
We did it. Go get it. Go get it. Bye.