Dennis [00:00:00]:
On this week's episode.
Phillip [00:00:01]:
So you were in need of something, which would be an office, a space, somebody to maybe believe in you or.
Tommy [00:00:06]:
Give you an hypothetical, because I'm not in need of it. I asked.
Eldar [00:00:08]:
Whoa.
Mike [00:00:09]:
So get your shit straight, Phil. The thing is, your dreams, a lot of the times those dreams are desperate, you've never been accepted. So you make dreams that you can prove everybody wrong. That's exactly what happens.
Eldar [00:00:21]:
Crazy ass dream. What?
Phillip [00:00:23]:
Crazy?
Eldar [00:00:23]:
Without understanding the fucking process that it takes to get there?
Tommy [00:00:26]:
No, there's no such thing as a crazy ass dream.
Mike [00:00:29]:
But the arrogant weasel never wants to get caught.
Tommy [00:00:31]:
You're going to play this back in your cars, and you're going to be driving down route four one day, and you're going to say, damn, I dropped a ball.
Eldar [00:00:38]:
There's the world, and then there's elderism.
Mike [00:00:40]:
He is a doctor and he practiced radiology. And I'mike and I practice everything.
Phillip [00:00:44]:
I'm so hungry.
Eldar [00:00:57]:
How do I introduce this one? You know what? I'm gonna have to introduce it and.
Eldar [00:01:00]:
Hype it up without hyping it up.
Eldar [00:01:02]:
Because it's probably the most important topic.
Eldar [00:01:05]:
Of probably all of them for many different reasons. And I hope I remember them all.
Eldar [00:01:13]:
Because we haven't talked about them in a while. But the question of the day is, does inability to enjoy the process signal our arrogance? Our ego or attachment and pride. Okay, so again, one more time, does inability. Does our inability to enjoy the process signal our arrogance? Mike, maybe you could remind me why I came up with that title in the first place.
Tommy [00:01:39]:
That's the look of arrogance.
Mike [00:01:41]:
I think we're talking a lot about.
Eldar [00:01:43]:
Arrogance and ability to learn.
Eldar [00:01:45]:
Right.
Eldar [00:01:45]:
And then we talked about purpose and stuff like that. Focusing on the process.
Mike [00:01:52]:
Yeah, I don't remember how we came about. It's funny, I remember where we were. We're talking about this, but I don't remember what actually started the whole debacle.
Tommy [00:02:04]:
Can I read the definition of arrogance for you guys?
Eldar [00:02:06]:
Oh, yeah, absolutely.
Tommy [00:02:07]:
If anyone needs a refresher.
Eldar [00:02:08]:
Yes, sure.
Tommy [00:02:10]:
Arrogant. It means having or revealing an exaggerated sense of one's own importance or abilities. Having or revealing an exaggerated sense of one's own importance or inabilities. Say it's in line with, like, pretentious.
Eldar [00:02:27]:
Yeah.
Tommy [00:02:27]:
Synonym.
Eldar [00:02:28]:
Yeah.
Mike [00:02:29]:
I think we were talking about somebody and about people stepping on the rake. The same rake multiple times. I was telling you about my story with my uncle.
Eldar [00:02:38]:
Right?
Mike [00:02:38]:
That was one of those incidents.
Eldar [00:02:40]:
Yeah.
Mike [00:02:40]:
I don't think that was the main one. I don't remember who it was about, but it was about somebody that kind of kept doing the same thing and not being successful in their life, not being happy. The way I remember it, I don't know, vaguely.
Eldar [00:03:00]:
So I think.
Mike [00:03:03]:
That was that story. Blaming something else, or somebody else, rather.
Eldar [00:03:09]:
For the current circumstances of your life.
Mike [00:03:14]:
Because at one point you had the wrong impression of what's the right thing, what's actually happening.
Eldar [00:03:21]:
Okay, that's some of it, yeah.
Mike [00:03:23]:
I don't remember all of it.
Eldar [00:03:24]:
All right, so let's try kind of.
Eldar [00:03:26]:
I guess, break it down.
Eldar [00:03:28]:
Our inability to enjoy the process. What are we talking about when we're talking about enjoying the process? A lot of people talk about this, obviously. Hey, don't look for the destination as the goal.
Eldar [00:03:37]:
Right.
Eldar [00:03:38]:
Don't look at the gifts or the things or the prize that you're going to receive at the end.
Eldar [00:03:43]:
Right.
Eldar [00:03:44]:
Enjoy the process. Focus on the process. Focus on focusing.
Eldar [00:03:47]:
Right.
Eldar [00:03:48]:
What do the people talk about when.
Eldar [00:03:50]:
They talk about this?
Mike [00:03:53]:
Again, because words. I think the words themselves are very confusing.
Eldar [00:03:58]:
Okay, I got it.
Eldar [00:03:58]:
Sorry.
Eldar [00:03:59]:
It came. The reason why I think we came up with this in the first place is a lot of times we are attaching ourselves.
Eldar [00:04:07]:
We attach ourselves to the outcome. Okay?
Eldar [00:04:11]:
That means we really want the outcome to fall in love, to get a job, to ace the test, to get a car, to get something.
Eldar [00:04:19]:
You know what I mean? We attach ourselves so much.
Eldar [00:04:23]:
So what happens when we attach ourselves so much? We lose sight of what actually is needed in order to perform, in order to get that what we are talking about.
Eldar [00:04:32]:
Right.
Eldar [00:04:33]:
And because we've attached ourselves so much to the outcome, we're not humble enough to be able to focus on the process. And therefore, I think that the inability to enjoy the process can signal ignorance because the process is the grueling part.
Eldar [00:04:50]:
Of the whole journey. Another word I need to look up.
Tommy [00:04:55]:
Grueling.
Mike [00:04:56]:
But again, I guess what you're saying the process is the grueling part.
Eldar [00:05:01]:
No, it seems like. It seems like it to the person who has attached themselves to the outcome.
Eldar [00:05:06]:
Yeah.
Eldar [00:05:07]:
Okay. That's what I really want.
Phillip [00:05:09]:
This getting in my way of getting that correct.
Eldar [00:05:12]:
So what happens a lot of the times, I think, is that then we start focusing not on being, let's just say, grateful for the things that we.
Eldar [00:05:20]:
Already have, but we start focusing on.
Eldar [00:05:23]:
The negative things that we don't have.
Eldar [00:05:25]:
Right.
Eldar [00:05:26]:
And one of the things that we really can focus on all the time.
Eldar [00:05:29]:
Is our abilities to focus, to focus.
Eldar [00:05:32]:
On the task at hand. We no longer think that the task at hand, which is focusing is going.
Eldar [00:05:37]:
To get us to be happy because we've attached ourselves so hardly to the outcome, to the prize.
Eldar [00:05:45]:
So how does arrogance play into this part?
Tommy [00:05:47]:
Well, and a prize that maybe we kind of create an ideal out of.
Eldar [00:05:52]:
Yes. Wow.
Tommy [00:05:53]:
Tomorrow, moment of silence.
Mike [00:05:57]:
Recognize.
Eldar [00:05:57]:
Yes.
Eldar [00:05:58]:
Hold on.
Mike [00:05:58]:
What just happened?
Eldar [00:05:59]:
Tom. This might be Tom.
Eldar [00:06:01]:
Yes. This might be a Tom day.
Eldar [00:06:02]:
Today.
Phillip [00:06:02]:
This is Tom's best day.
Eldar [00:06:03]:
Should we say that what's today, August.
Eldar [00:06:05]:
11 can be Tom day?
Phillip [00:06:09]:
811 23 is Tom Day.
Eldar [00:06:11]:
Yeah.
Mike [00:06:11]:
811 23 is going forward.
Eldar [00:06:12]:
Yeah, Tom. This rarely happens.
Phillip [00:06:15]:
We go to harvest moon for lunch and we do the exact same thing.
Eldar [00:06:18]:
We did today every time in August, every year.
Phillip [00:06:21]:
The next day of beach.
Eldar [00:06:21]:
Put that in your thing.
Eldar [00:06:22]:
Yeah.
Mike [00:06:23]:
And the next day is a beach.
Phillip [00:06:24]:
And the next day is Rooney's and beach.
Eldar [00:06:26]:
Tom, this rarely happens when you actually.
Eldar [00:06:29]:
Pay attention to the point and you say something that's actually very closely tied to what we were talking about. You missed the mark completely with this one. But nonetheless, I have no idea what he said, but nonetheless it sounded good.
Mike [00:06:45]:
I think he said ideal. Something about ideal.
Eldar [00:06:48]:
Yeah, something. All right, Tom, go ahead. We'll give you the fucking light.
Tommy [00:06:52]:
I think there's a difference between saying I'm going to explore this thing and.
Eldar [00:06:57]:
I'm curious about it and I just.
Tommy [00:07:00]:
Want to write myself a million dollar.
Eldar [00:07:02]:
Check because that's going to lead to the best life.
Eldar [00:07:06]:
Okay.
Tommy [00:07:07]:
See one arrogant, kind of like, I need that money.
Eldar [00:07:10]:
Yeah, that's all me. Yeah.
Eldar [00:07:13]:
I think focusing right over focusing, especially on the end goal, almost telling us that it carries a certain level of.
Eldar [00:07:21]:
Confidence that is not backed by anything.
Eldar [00:07:23]:
Well, yeah, I think it's like, I want this. Who the fuck are you arrogance to want anything?
Mike [00:07:29]:
I think arrogance is built when you line up with what you believe is the truth, but it's actually not the truth. So your own goal, you think I'm going to line up with this idea of being a millionaire and it's going to make me happy. And that's an egotistical approach. That's an unexamined belief system. And because you line up with it, in a way, I think the arrogance develops. Yeah, as a byproduct of it.
Eldar [00:07:52]:
I think that's it.
Mike [00:07:53]:
Why for me, why that's always, I would say it's your punishment for believing.
Eldar [00:07:59]:
In a false truth and you get.
Mike [00:08:01]:
Cursed with this arrogance.
Eldar [00:08:02]:
Enough, Mike. You're talking about magic right now.
Mike [00:08:06]:
Yeah, I know, but I like magic, though.
Tommy [00:08:07]:
You do?
Eldar [00:08:08]:
You're talking about punishment. You're talking about like he looks like.
Phillip [00:08:11]:
A guy who, like, sources magic.
Eldar [00:08:13]:
I like to do sorcery on the side.
Mike [00:08:16]:
You want to call punishment? It's a byproduct if you believe in a false.
Eldar [00:08:21]:
Huh.
Phillip [00:08:21]:
I like the punishment thing, though. You don't buy that?
Eldar [00:08:25]:
I know exactly where Mike is coming from, but I think it's a lazy way to explain what's actually going on.
Mike [00:08:30]:
Yeah, well, I'm a little bit lazy today. It's Friday. All right, so, look, fine. You got to give me a little bit to warm up.
Eldar [00:08:35]:
All right, cool.
Eldar [00:08:36]:
Sounds good.
Eldar [00:08:36]:
That's why you're drinking this whiskey, which really is actually really good.
Mike [00:08:40]:
Really good.
Eldar [00:08:40]:
And we're not going to say what the brand is? No, not yet.
Phillip [00:08:43]:
I'll actually take some more, actually.
Eldar [00:08:45]:
Yeah, I'm not done. But the notes on this. Oh, my God, Philip.
Mike [00:08:49]:
Different notes are intense.
Katherine [00:08:51]:
Philip, we do have plans for tomorrow.
Eldar [00:08:54]:
I'm going to be excess.
Eldar [00:08:54]:
Tomorrow.
Mike [00:08:55]:
Tomorrow you're going to go nuts.
Eldar [00:08:56]:
Right?
Phillip [00:08:56]:
You know those.
Eldar [00:08:57]:
Tomorrow he's not picking up a phone.
Katherine [00:09:00]:
The $50 fee for not showing up at the restaurant that we want.
Eldar [00:09:04]:
Yes.
Eldar [00:09:04]:
You have to take the deposit right now from him?
Mike [00:09:06]:
From him? No, but he's good for it. He's not like, Tom.
Phillip [00:09:09]:
I'm a lanister. I always pay my debt.
Eldar [00:09:11]:
There you go.
Tommy [00:09:12]:
Well, I'm thinking about social media.
Mike [00:09:15]:
Hold on. We didn't finish the discussion about the punishment thing, although I didn't buy it.
Phillip [00:09:20]:
So you're saying take it one step further from the punishment, and it has to have.
Mike [00:09:23]:
It's not a punishment, it's a justice.
Eldar [00:09:25]:
Okay?
Mike [00:09:26]:
It's a normal byproduct. Like, if you believe in the false truth and you live by that false truth, and you go to it.
Eldar [00:09:32]:
See what he's saying? He says, believing in false truths births arrogance. I'd like to know that process. I like to know what actually goes in there.
Mike [00:09:41]:
Well, the arrogance.
Eldar [00:09:44]:
How and why?
Mike [00:09:46]:
I think maybe the arrogance builds because you're doing stuff, but you're not actually seeing the results of what you think. Like, you're doing stuff that you think is going to make you happy, okay, but it's not going to make you happy. And you're doing stuff which is not making you happy towards angles that's not going to make you happy. And you become arrogant because.
Eldar [00:10:05]:
Wait a second. I think you become angry.
Mike [00:10:07]:
Well, yeah, you become angry first. You become arrogant because you're angry.
Eldar [00:10:11]:
Wait.
Eldar [00:10:12]:
Now you're tying two a's together. You become arrogant because you're angry that.
Mike [00:10:17]:
You'Re not actually getting what you want and you're continuing to believe in this and you have to defend it.
Phillip [00:10:22]:
No, I would say arrogance is as a result of having anger inside. I don't think you're arrogant.
Eldar [00:10:28]:
No, I'm not sure about.
Mike [00:10:29]:
But arrogance and anger don't always go hand in hand.
Eldar [00:10:31]:
No, that's what I'm saying. I think you were onto something. But you said arrogance is being built. I actually think that probably anger is being built in this process. But I would call them when you're doing stuff, saying that, hey, I'm going to be doing this and I'm going to make me happy. You're doing the shit. It's not making you happy, it's making you angrier. That's annoying.
Mike [00:10:48]:
But I guess arrogance is a thing that you need to use in order to defend your truth, your false truth against others.
Eldar [00:10:56]:
Okay, 1 second.
Phillip [00:10:58]:
Yeah, I agree with that. I think arrogance is your defense mechanism. Anger is what you build up and what you build up and as a result of then having to protect this false thing that you're going after, which is saying that I'm going to make a million dollars because of XYZ, there's no truth in it. You're building up anger. You're building up anger. People are coming after you and saying like, oh, you're not doing this.
Eldar [00:11:18]:
Go fuck yourself.
Phillip [00:11:19]:
I'm going to believe in myself and no matter what, I'm going to get it. You're nothing. You're nothing. You're nothing. That to me is the arrogance. It's how the anger is displayed. It becomes your personality. Okay, does that make sense?
Eldar [00:11:31]:
Yeah, it's very interesting that you tying that like that. Then arrogance is almost like a cover up for anger that's inside.
Eldar [00:11:41]:
Yes.
Mike [00:11:43]:
My thought was about the arrogance. Arrogance is a thing that you have to. What happens is, right, you make this announcement to yourself and to others like, yo, I'm about to be a millionaire. Get ready.
Eldar [00:11:55]:
Yeah.
Mike [00:11:56]:
Now people can be like, okay, so what's up? Did you make it yet? Time passes. Now you're like, yo, you can't fold.
Phillip [00:12:01]:
I like it.
Mike [00:12:02]:
You can't be like, yo, no, I didn't make it yet. What do you do? You become arrogant. Be like, of course I did, bro. I'm fucking on the way. And you become arrogant. You have to defend with dishonesty, with this fucking arrogant sense that you have to defend your false truth because you cannot let people poke holes in your shit. That's how I thought about it just now.
Eldar [00:12:21]:
So would you say that the people that are arrogant in this, right, the ones that do have this attachments and this ego don't have the ability to enjoy the process.
Mike [00:12:30]:
I don't think it's possible to enjoy the process because if you never thought.
Eldar [00:12:35]:
About it, you don't think about the processes in depth about what you're going.
Mike [00:12:40]:
To do when you make that million. You imagine your life as a millionaire.
Eldar [00:12:43]:
That's right.
Mike [00:12:44]:
Or as a skinny person. All the shit you're going to do when you get there, but you don't think about the steps to going there. So that's just a natural result.
Phillip [00:12:50]:
I think you automatically will lose your anger and your sense of arrogance as a result of focusing on the process. That's my idea of it. Because I don't think somebody can be in the moment in the process giving this focus that you're referring to and then also, then just attach simultaneously to the end goal. I don't think you can do it.
Eldar [00:13:12]:
At the same time, I agree with you. Yeah, I agree with you.
Phillip [00:13:15]:
So one has to give.
Eldar [00:13:16]:
One has to give.
Eldar [00:13:17]:
It's either you're focused, right? Or are you boasting? Yeah, I don't think you can do both.
Phillip [00:13:23]:
And if you're living both, then you're a double.
Eldar [00:13:25]:
I'm still having a hard time to find out where arrogance actually is being born.
Mike [00:13:29]:
The arrogance is born by defending your belief system, which is flawed and you subconsciously know.
Eldar [00:13:36]:
Okay, how about this? Why do you have to defend your.
Eldar [00:13:38]:
Belief system in the first place?
Andrey [00:13:40]:
Because it's not.
Mike [00:13:41]:
Well, because who's able to handle criticism? And to be honest, it's very hard to say, hey, I started something, but I failed. Or actually the thing that I started out to do is not really that important. Or it's not really making me happy. And then if you do succeed, how arrogant are you that you prove to everybody that you succeed?
Tommy [00:13:58]:
Well, here's what I'm wondering.
Mike [00:13:59]:
It's like arrogance gets built up when you're trying to fuck revenge, fuck everybody. The people who are, who didn't believe in you and the people who didn't believe in you before you made it, and the people who didn't believe in you and now you did make it.
Tommy [00:14:11]:
I think it's definitely valid. I'm thinking about it in terms of like, for instance, what if I suddenly find in somebody else something that kind of triggers me into neglecting the process, which sometimes the process means let go.
Eldar [00:14:29]:
You know what I mean?
Tommy [00:14:31]:
So we like to think of the.
Eldar [00:14:32]:
Process as like, just do what you.
Tommy [00:14:36]:
Got to do, stay cool or whatever. But the idea is that there are some times where I feel personally. You've seen this for sure.
Eldar [00:14:45]:
Yeah. I was going to talk about your example.
Tommy [00:14:48]:
I'm like, guys, you're doing this thing to me.
Eldar [00:14:50]:
We're doing this thing to you. No, right.
Phillip [00:14:53]:
I'm saying this is an example.
Eldar [00:14:54]:
What's happening?
Mike [00:14:55]:
He's being arrogant, bro.
Eldar [00:14:56]:
You see what's happening here? Why an example?
Tommy [00:14:58]:
Right? I'm telling you, there are times when I come in here, right, and I'm like, happy little pupper. I've got something I'm complaining about. And I'm like, I've got this or that drama going on, right?
Eldar [00:15:11]:
Or you're boasting about it.
Tommy [00:15:14]:
And you guys are like, tom, you don't understand. You're just kind of, like, messed up. You've made a mistake, clearly. But I resist because I'm arrogant. I resist because I don't see this as a process thing. Now I'm diverted. I'm sidetracked by an idea that I have to be the exact opposite of this thing. Instead of dealing with the process, which is, this is right now, but the process can be.
Tommy [00:15:45]:
See, obviously the process can be a lot different depending on where you're at, what you're dealing with. For me now, a recent one was like, somebody kind of upset me one day. And now suddenly I was thinking, okay, this person is throwing off all my future possibilities. And that's arrogance. And what I realized from that, yes.
Mike [00:16:07]:
The arrogance is probably the way that Tom is describing it. The arrogance is building up because you're defending something that you believe in, and you're being attacked for your belief systems.
Eldar [00:16:22]:
Okay?
Phillip [00:16:23]:
I think an example from yesterday, where's.
Eldar [00:16:25]:
The arrogance being born?
Phillip [00:16:26]:
So I think when we were talking to Tom yesterday, I think I did mention, I think there was something where we were talking about yesterday, where we were talking about this being his office.
Eldar [00:16:37]:
Right?
Phillip [00:16:37]:
We were talking about writing, and then we were saying that. Okay, you were saying that you were going to offer this thing to him, and then he. No, like, I have my terms. I have to have my terms. And I said, that's like an arrogant thing.
Eldar [00:16:48]:
How can you have your. When you're asking. Yeah.
Phillip [00:16:52]:
So you were in need of something which would be an office, a space, somebody to maybe believe in you or give you an hypothetical.
Tommy [00:16:57]:
Because I'm not in need of it. I asked.
Eldar [00:16:59]:
Whoa.
Mike [00:17:00]:
So get your shit straight, Phil.
Eldar [00:17:01]:
Yeah, Phil, I asked about.
Tommy [00:17:05]:
It's a fair error because it's a fair one.
Eldar [00:17:09]:
Yeah.
Mike [00:17:09]:
It's a fair assumption.
Eldar [00:17:10]:
Sometimes you get things right, but this one you might get wrong.
Phillip [00:17:13]:
So you would say that he's not in need right now of this.
Eldar [00:17:16]:
He's always in need, Phil.
Phillip [00:17:18]:
So what would be a fair assessment of how to.
Eldar [00:17:20]:
He's a very desperate person, Phil.
Phillip [00:17:22]:
So how would I say this?
Eldar [00:17:22]:
He wants this.
Eldar [00:17:23]:
He's out of his mind. No, there's no way to.
Tommy [00:17:25]:
That drives the point.
Eldar [00:17:26]:
You understand? This arrogant little prick who's in need, right. Doesn't want to say, you know what?
Mike [00:17:34]:
Humble.
Eldar [00:17:35]:
Yeah. Too much pride.
Eldar [00:17:36]:
Why?
Eldar [00:17:37]:
Who the fuck does he think he is? Versus right. Trusting the process that those people who have. He's coming to.
Tommy [00:17:44]:
But he conceded, as you can remember, so it wouldn't even be a good way of looking into it. But as a hypothetical, you conceded.
Eldar [00:17:53]:
You lost. I bent.
Phillip [00:17:56]:
You bent the knee to the king.
Eldar [00:17:57]:
Yeah.
Eldar [00:17:57]:
With this time, King Lannister.
Tommy [00:17:59]:
No, we avoided that by collaborating.
Eldar [00:18:01]:
What's the collaboration?
Tommy [00:18:02]:
No, the collaboration is that he agreed to see things with some certain empathy and we allowed this to be a kind of working relationship instead of an ethical.
Phillip [00:18:11]:
You're allowing this to run amok.
Eldar [00:18:13]:
I think he missed the point completely and he didn't understand why I agreed in the first place. He gave me a very good argument. He said, eldar, if things are right.
Eldar [00:18:19]:
And they line up, I'm glowing.
Eldar [00:18:21]:
I'm going to be writing.
Phillip [00:18:22]:
I remember that.
Eldar [00:18:23]:
And I said, that's an example of.
Tommy [00:18:25]:
Me empathizing with him.
Eldar [00:18:26]:
I was going to make a glowing space for him.
Phillip [00:18:28]:
I remember that.
Eldar [00:18:28]:
Where every time he walks in, he's going to be feeling nice and he's going to be buzing.
Eldar [00:18:33]:
Yes.
Eldar [00:18:33]:
And I know that if he's feeling this way, I'll know. Every time he walks through that door, I'll know whether or not he's ready to fuck shit up or he should go home. It's a lot. I'll know right away.
Tommy [00:18:41]:
Think about. But I'll say this, that I did mention that that kind of work is kind of a struggle at times.
Eldar [00:18:50]:
So I take that into consideration. What's right.
Tommy [00:18:54]:
So for me, that process is important.
Eldar [00:18:57]:
That's not the same process we're talking about.
Phillip [00:18:59]:
So you don't think you were being very important. So you don't think based off of the opportunity that Eldar was giving you this space, that you don't think that.
Tommy [00:19:06]:
You setting your own choice for my own comfort, for my own wellness.
Eldar [00:19:10]:
See, I saw that as arrogant choice. 100%.
Eldar [00:19:14]:
Yeah, you saw it correctly.
Eldar [00:19:16]:
Yes, 100%. No questions.
Phillip [00:19:19]:
If I came to you and said, hey, I'm writing whether I'm struggling with it or not, or I'm doing well, I'm coming to you and saying, hey, this space is available. Oh, wow, that'd be a great space. I'd be around you guys, we're growing. We're talking about all these things on a day to day basis. We're in this kind of conducive environment to be an artist, to be a business person, whatever it may be. No payment, nothing. You just have this space. And then you're saying, hey, this is my process.
Tommy [00:19:44]:
Practice freely.
Eldar [00:19:45]:
Yeah.
Phillip [00:19:46]:
You want to practice freely and do your own process. And you did get that.
Eldar [00:19:52]:
He got that.
Phillip [00:19:53]:
So now to me, the pressure is then way on you than before, where it was like more of like. That's correct.
Eldar [00:19:58]:
Okay. Wiley gagging.
Phillip [00:20:00]:
Yeah, now it's just now wishy washy.
Eldar [00:20:02]:
Now, like the fire is burning. Oh, no, now it's game time.
Phillip [00:20:06]:
Yeah, now it's 100% game time.
Eldar [00:20:07]:
If I come through the way I.
Eldar [00:20:08]:
Come through now it's on him. And we're going to see whether or.
Eldar [00:20:12]:
Not the gig is going to be up. I like to see these types of.
Eldar [00:20:14]:
Things through because it shows who you are or not. Yeah.
Eldar [00:20:19]:
Whether you're really about what you're saying, you're about.
Eldar [00:20:21]:
Right, or you're just talking out of your ass again.
Tommy [00:20:26]:
Yeah, but there's something interesting in that. How could that be seen as Aries.
Phillip [00:20:31]:
Based off of your past and how they were explaining it to me. If I just met you and I didn't know your past, I would say that, yeah, you are negotiating based off of what you think is right for yourself, and I would say you were correct in that. But based off of everything else that they're saying from your past and not following through, I would say that the way that you were negotiating yesterday was coming from a place of arrogance.
Tommy [00:20:49]:
How is that arrogance?
Phillip [00:20:51]:
Because you, as the person who has not been the one that's followed through in the past, is then saying to somebody who is giving you the opportunity and coming from a place of success, and you're saying, hey, no, I haven't done this right in the past, but I'm going to do it right now. What you're saying to me is not correct. I don't believe in the plan that you have.
Tommy [00:21:10]:
For me, discount someone else's opinion.
Phillip [00:21:12]:
Discounting the person's views?
Eldar [00:21:14]:
Yes.
Tommy [00:21:15]:
Like, not taking in the point of view of another person could be arrogance, but I'm more important than what you're saying.
Phillip [00:21:21]:
No, but it's situational, though.
Eldar [00:21:23]:
More selfish.
Phillip [00:21:24]:
Yeah, but it's your situation based off of how they're describing it to me. I'm taking their word and saying, okay, you've asked for XYZ. You've maybe started.
Eldar [00:21:32]:
We weren't the ones coming to him with need. He's like, hey, I need this. This will help me. Who's asking who?
Eldar [00:21:39]:
Right?
Phillip [00:21:39]:
So that's what I'm saying.
Katherine [00:21:42]:
The moment required for him to humble.
Phillip [00:21:44]:
Himself a bit, and he couldn't, and it didn't. That's what I'm saying. That's where the arrogance came in.
Eldar [00:21:49]:
And that's what I'm saying.
Eldar [00:21:50]:
Right.
Eldar [00:21:50]:
And that's what I'm saying. That the question here is, does inability to enjoy the process signal arrogance?
Eldar [00:21:56]:
Yes.
Eldar [00:21:57]:
And the reason why I'm saying that is because if you can't focus on the process, something's holding you back from actually enjoying that inability to tap into that type of energy. What is that? And it's pointing to me as some kind of attachment. Ego, pride, arrogance.
Phillip [00:22:13]:
It's the idea of whoever you are.
Eldar [00:22:14]:
I have a confession.
Eldar [00:22:15]:
Want to be.
Tommy [00:22:16]:
Oh, I do have a confession about this.
Eldar [00:22:18]:
Is this one of those times where you're going to say nothing? Because that's exactly what I want to hear.
Eldar [00:22:22]:
No, I want to hear something.
Eldar [00:22:23]:
I don't want to hear anything.
Phillip [00:22:26]:
It's going to be a big.
Tommy [00:22:28]:
You're going to need the.
Phillip [00:22:28]:
Can you cue the.
Eldar [00:22:30]:
I got you.
Phillip [00:22:31]:
Is it an Oppenheimer?
Mike [00:22:32]:
But it's absolutely nothing. He's going to say absolutely nothing for five minutes. He's going to talk and say nothing.
Tommy [00:22:38]:
I've been thinking about fame and how I've always wanted fame and.
Eldar [00:22:43]:
Aha, here it comes. The prize that we talk about.
Eldar [00:22:48]:
Here it comes.
Tommy [00:22:49]:
And I had this crazy epiphany about.
Eldar [00:22:53]:
What that could mean because of my own arrogance.
Tommy [00:22:58]:
And this happened recently where somebody kind of did something that upset me. And I was finding myself in this kind of, like, mental competition with trying to outdo this person.
Eldar [00:23:13]:
And I realized basically how little I.
Tommy [00:23:17]:
Know about the other person. And I started thinking about how this is affecting my life and started thinking about all the people who I interacted with. And I was self conscious about everything I was doing.
Eldar [00:23:29]:
And then I was aware that this.
Tommy [00:23:35]:
Idea that I have that drives so many of my ideas that don't pan out, that end up as failures, is quite often because I wish to have.
Eldar [00:23:45]:
A lot of faint. I wish to have right attention. Okay.
Tommy [00:23:49]:
Now, the thing I realized, the epiphany.
Eldar [00:23:52]:
Was that this could be what that.
Tommy [00:23:56]:
Feels like when people are totally submerged. When you're totally submerged, right? Or like they know about your life. I was like, I asked myself, do I want this? And then what I asked myself is, how do I humble myself? And this was like a huge question because you could go completely left turn when you have these thoughts where you're like, I'm going to be better. And this is all about me coming out, being better than the other person or something like that. It was wild because I really had.
Eldar [00:24:31]:
To think about that.
Tommy [00:24:33]:
What does it mean to actually be humble? How do I get over this pride that I have right now, this arrogance? Because it really was about self importance. How am I going to let somebody embarrass me in the way they embarrass me? And how am I going to let.
Eldar [00:24:50]:
That person tell these lies when they.
Eldar [00:24:54]:
Are only a peasant and try to.
Tommy [00:24:57]:
Make me look bad and basically risk my future fame? That's kind of what it's about.
Eldar [00:25:03]:
Yeah.
Mike [00:25:04]:
Arrogance is what. It's just a prolonged, unthrecked ego. Based on what I'm hearing from him, everybody's been giving him the past his whole life saying, like, yo, tom, you're great. You're doing so well. You're doing all this, doing all that personally amps himself up.
Eldar [00:25:19]:
He's the one who's doing it. Most importantly, the driver is him.
Mike [00:25:22]:
But I think he learned that from maybe friends, parents, movies, bro movies, the.
Eldar [00:25:29]:
Stars and celebrities and stuff like that. It's an idea. It's some kind of ideology, right? That's why he's thinking about it. Wait a second. I see how there's pitfalls here. On one hand. On the other hand, how do I become more humble and be more person with humility?
Tommy [00:25:44]:
What's the process look like, in other words, for this conversation, to translate it to this? What does the process look like of.
Eldar [00:25:50]:
Doing that.
Tommy [00:25:54]:
Overcoming this thing?
Phillip [00:25:55]:
This focus is on the end.
Eldar [00:25:56]:
On the end.
Phillip [00:25:57]:
But fame and money and all these, it's all interchangeable. It's all about thinking of, like you said, your focus. Instead of the focus being on the focus and the day to day, you're literally thinking about, oh, how am I going to accept this when I got to be asking arrogance?
Tommy [00:26:13]:
Why do I even want.
Eldar [00:26:14]:
I know where it is. I know where it comes from. I've just figured it out. Arrogance is born from attaching yourself to that end goal and believing that you think you're right.
Eldar [00:26:26]:
I think it has to do with.
Katherine [00:26:28]:
Believing that you're right.
Eldar [00:26:29]:
Yes.
Katherine [00:26:30]:
Anything that comes along.
Eldar [00:26:31]:
But the attachment happens naturally. Yes, correct.
Phillip [00:26:38]:
With resistance.
Eldar [00:26:40]:
So believing, believing that you're actually right.
Eldar [00:26:44]:
That'S where it is.
Eldar [00:26:47]:
Believing that you're right.
Katherine [00:26:48]:
I think it leans stronger towards wanting to be right versus actually.
Eldar [00:26:54]:
But you have to have an attachment.
Mike [00:26:58]:
I think maybe think about you attached to being right.
Eldar [00:27:00]:
No. You're attached to the end goal of.
Eldar [00:27:04]:
Wanting to be famous. And you think that you're right about that. Right.
Tommy [00:27:09]:
Even in its most subtle form, like to be published, to be known, to be a movie star one day, to be extra.
Phillip [00:27:15]:
No, he thinks he's right. That that's what he thinks.
Tommy [00:27:17]:
Be noble, be moral, to be all these.
Eldar [00:27:19]:
No, he knows that he wants this, but he knows that he's right about.
Katherine [00:27:24]:
It, at least in his mind. In his mind, his own beliefs.
Eldar [00:27:28]:
Yeah.
Tommy [00:27:28]:
How could it be wrong?
Mike [00:27:29]:
I think it's opposite. I think he knows it's wrong.
Tommy [00:27:32]:
No, how could it be wrong to held up.
Mike [00:27:33]:
But he has to lie that it's right.
Eldar [00:27:35]:
Well, when he has to constantly trick.
Mike [00:27:38]:
Himself, you constantly have to trick yourself and others that you're right.
Eldar [00:27:41]:
No, but that's how much of it, the thing is, Mike, the belief system depends how much it rules you and how you act.
Eldar [00:27:46]:
You know what I'm saying?
Eldar [00:27:47]:
How do you act out of it?
Eldar [00:27:48]:
Right.
Eldar [00:27:49]:
He's looking upon everybody as peasants. We're peasants.
Mike [00:27:52]:
Well, I know that.
Eldar [00:27:52]:
Okay, good.
Eldar [00:27:53]:
So he's already famous, right? In his mind, he's walking around and acting as if, therefore he's adopted the belief system. Therefore he believes it's right, and therefore he's arrogant because of it.
Eldar [00:28:04]:
That's it.
Eldar [00:28:05]:
He attached himself to it because he has an attachment to it for whatever reason.
Eldar [00:28:09]:
Right.
Eldar [00:28:10]:
And then he actually believes that this.
Eldar [00:28:11]:
Is what it is. And if you try to challenge him, what happens? You're met with arrogance, which is the defense mechanism. Correct. Which is based on those beliefs. Yes.
Eldar [00:28:28]:
You have to have some kind of an attachment to the end goal.
Tommy [00:28:31]:
I mean, I found a reason.
Eldar [00:28:32]:
You don't do the fucking process. Because what the process does actually humbles you naturally.
Eldar [00:28:37]:
Right.
Eldar [00:28:38]:
You don't sit there and focus on the craft like you said earlier, Philip.
Eldar [00:28:41]:
Right.
Eldar [00:28:41]:
Because you can't do two at the same time.
Phillip [00:28:44]:
He's obsessed.
Tommy [00:28:45]:
He's so upset. You repeat that first part, you don't focus on the process.
Eldar [00:28:49]:
Yeah.
Eldar [00:28:49]:
Philip said, and I agree with him 100%, that it's impossible to focus on.
Eldar [00:28:54]:
Two things on the end goal and.
Eldar [00:28:57]:
Seeing yourself as this fucking famous guy and write.
Tommy [00:29:00]:
Yes.
Eldar [00:29:01]:
Because when you write, you actually are a writer.
Eldar [00:29:04]:
You're not a famous person.
Eldar [00:29:06]:
You're locked in a room.
Phillip [00:29:07]:
I heard you.
Eldar [00:29:07]:
And you're a writer. But you mean that process itself is.
Eldar [00:29:10]:
A humbling process, right or wrong.
Tommy [00:29:12]:
Oh, wow, that's really good because I didn't even think of that.
Eldar [00:29:15]:
Of course you didn't.
Tommy [00:29:16]:
But what I did think of.
Eldar [00:29:17]:
So you haven't wrote a. I did.
Tommy [00:29:19]:
Think of a kind of solution. And I mean, I thought about it in terms of a process. Absolutely.
Eldar [00:29:27]:
I don't know if you did, but that's very simple.
Tommy [00:29:30]:
It's very simply put.
Phillip [00:29:32]:
So I think if you are so attached to that end goal, you are preventing yourself from getting into the process at all. So then the result does make sense of then actually not writing. And then you become so obsessed with that where the conversation, like we were saying yesterday, is greater than the process where meaning, like going to a coffee shop or going to a restaurant or just discussing the fact of writing is actually feeling a sense of accomplishment based off of where your end goal is. So unless you are acting, he's not writing. So unless you're going to detach yourself from the end goal, which I think is an art, which I think that.
Mike [00:30:08]:
What we should have, what Tommy's doing, is definitely an art.
Eldar [00:30:10]:
Yeah, sure.
Mike [00:30:11]:
No, not a good one for you.
Phillip [00:30:13]:
But I think to do it effectively and say, hey, my end goal is to then say, like, hey, I want to become famous or I want to have a certain amount of money. And then letting that thing go and then focusing on the process with that thing in the background. That's the art.
Eldar [00:30:26]:
Sure. You don't have to let it go. That's another challenge. What you can do is you have to become realistic of what needs to get done right. And a lot of times the people who attach themselves and only are obsessive about the end goal, they don't have a realistic fucking outcome.
Phillip [00:30:40]:
Like day to day outcomes, day to day, like initiatives I'm going to map out, be done.
Eldar [00:30:45]:
Yeah. Okay. You know what I'm saying?
Eldar [00:30:46]:
What actually gets affected, you only think about what, what you want to do in that moment because you've attached yourself and you told yourself that this is what you want and you're right about it.
Eldar [00:30:57]:
Right.
Eldar [00:30:57]:
Like I said to you, even your sister, she wants to do this.
Eldar [00:31:00]:
Okay, cool.
Eldar [00:31:01]:
I hear you. What is going to be affected by this? What problems are you going to invite into your life, into other people's lives because of your decision?
Eldar [00:31:11]:
The attachment is there?
Eldar [00:31:13]:
I want to do this because of my reason. She's not thinking about the reasons that we're about to talk about.
Eldar [00:31:20]:
You understand? Yeah. And what you're going to meet, you're.
Eldar [00:31:24]:
Going to meet resistance.
Eldar [00:31:25]:
Resistance.
Eldar [00:31:25]:
You're going to meet anger, frustration, ego and maybe arrogance. Yeah, I know what is good for me. Who are you to tell me?
Eldar [00:31:34]:
Oh, yeah. You understand?
Eldar [00:31:36]:
Because the attachment has already happened, a conclusion has been already made. And that is what I'm saying. That if you don't have the ability to focus on the process and actually.
Eldar [00:31:48]:
Do the process, it is because of.
Eldar [00:31:51]:
Your ego, your attachment and your arrogance.
Mike [00:31:53]:
But the ability to focus on those.
Eldar [00:31:55]:
Things is the humbling experience is to see things for what they are and actually humble yourself and open yourself up to learning failing. Right.
Tommy [00:32:07]:
I'm thinking like a lot of the.
Eldar [00:32:08]:
Issues that we have have.
Tommy [00:32:12]:
A lot of the issues that we have have potential solutions that we don't know right away. And we maybe catastrophize, you know what I mean? We think irrationally when a lot of the issues that we have don't need excessive worrying right now.
Eldar [00:32:27]:
And check this.
Eldar [00:32:28]:
Correct, correct.
Eldar [00:32:30]:
Very important point here. What you're setting yourself up, you're going to say, okay, cool, let's just say this, right? I have $1 in my pocket. I have $1 in my pocket. And I am telling you, Mike, I want to be a millionaire.
Eldar [00:32:43]:
Okay?
Eldar [00:32:45]:
The gap between me having $1 in my pocket, right. No pot to piss in, right. No career, no job, no ideas, no nothing to me then telling you, hey, I want to be a millionaire. It's a huge fucking leap.
Mike [00:33:02]:
That's what. Arrogance.
Eldar [00:33:03]:
Huge fucking leap. Who the fuck are you to make a fucking statement or claim that you.
Eldar [00:33:10]:
Want to be a fucking millionaire when.
Eldar [00:33:12]:
You got a fucking dollar and you.
Tommy [00:33:14]:
Have nothing to show and would you praise me Please? Then kiss my feet.
Eldar [00:33:19]:
You understand?
Mike [00:33:20]:
Well, yeah, making that statement. No, what I'm saying, arrogance.
Eldar [00:33:23]:
What I'm saying is that the difference or disparity from one to another humongous.
Mike [00:33:32]:
It builds arrogance.
Eldar [00:33:33]:
So for you to make a statement of such, you're already arrogant.
Phillip [00:33:37]:
But the way that it's taught is that you're dream. You make it dream.
Eldar [00:33:42]:
Fucking idiot.
Phillip [00:33:42]:
So in that philosophy, it's almost that I need to be so unreasonably arrogant in order to believe this thing that has such a big gap in order for me to achieve it the way that it should be achieved in this world, which is I'm going to focus on the end goal. I'm going to dress this certain part, I'm going to talk a certain part. I'm going to do all these things.
Eldar [00:34:03]:
Cutthroat, lie.
Phillip [00:34:05]:
Cutthroat, lying, cheating. And then I'm going to get it and I'm going to hate who I become as a result of it. I'm going to be so miserable.
Eldar [00:34:11]:
That's right.
Phillip [00:34:11]:
And then I'm going to probably lose everything and have to go back to square one.
Eldar [00:34:14]:
That's right.
Eldar [00:34:14]:
100%.
Eldar [00:34:16]:
So that's the flaw.
Eldar [00:34:16]:
You understand?
Eldar [00:34:17]:
How the fuck can you make these types of statements, right?
Eldar [00:34:22]:
I'm going to be an author.
Eldar [00:34:24]:
What? What have you done? Who are you?
Mike [00:34:28]:
But where do you get this impression about yourself? Because that's what caused the arrogance.
Eldar [00:34:34]:
Right.
Mike [00:34:35]:
But where do you get the impression that you can be arrogant?
Eldar [00:34:37]:
Desire. Desire for what?
Mike [00:34:40]:
But what? Desire is driven by lack.
Eldar [00:34:42]:
No, correct.
Eldar [00:34:43]:
Or inability to see what's good. That dollar. Okay, I have a dollar, but I have ten friends.
Eldar [00:34:49]:
Well, you said my ten friends.
Eldar [00:34:51]:
I said desire. Desire because you don't have the ability to see for things, for what they are, which is be grateful, for example, for what you do have.
Phillip [00:34:59]:
But you said desire is driven by lack. Can desire be also driven by passion or.
Eldar [00:35:04]:
No, no.
Phillip [00:35:07]:
See, I have that association of. I guess maybe it's just a word association. Where I have sexual drive, like drive, like passion, associated with desire. Where I associate it with a positive thing, where I'm fueled by something that's.
Eldar [00:35:25]:
Like getting me going.
Eldar [00:35:28]:
You have to explain them more.
Mike [00:35:30]:
You have a desire that you have a desire to scorpion some girls.
Eldar [00:35:34]:
Yeah.
Phillip [00:35:35]:
I would say the probably easiest example is a sexual desire.
Eldar [00:35:38]:
Yeah.
Eldar [00:35:39]:
Because you're right now single.
Eldar [00:35:40]:
Sure.
Eldar [00:35:41]:
And you're not expressing yourself with anyone.
Phillip [00:35:45]:
All right, I'll see you guys tomorrow.
Eldar [00:35:48]:
Bye.
Eldar [00:35:51]:
You're lacking something, right. There's a void.
Phillip [00:35:54]:
But what if I am having sex and then I also still feel a desire?
Mike [00:35:59]:
But as you're lacking something else, then.
Eldar [00:36:00]:
You'Re lacking something else.
Mike [00:36:01]:
You may be having sex, but you want love. Exactly.
Eldar [00:36:04]:
There might be something that's.
Mike [00:36:06]:
You may be having sex, but you're still lacking love.
Eldar [00:36:08]:
Right.
Eldar [00:36:08]:
That's what I'm saying. After sex, do you just want to put your pants on and leave?
Mike [00:36:11]:
Or do you want to cuddle or make some shishkabobs?
Phillip [00:36:14]:
Oh, my God, I want to leave and maybe go.
Eldar [00:36:16]:
You want to leave?
Mike [00:36:17]:
Five guys leave.
Katherine [00:36:18]:
Because there is no connection beyond you.
Eldar [00:36:20]:
Understand? Because then you, up to the next thing you jizzed. You calm down, right? You got rid of the buzz. But then what else you need? You need nurture.
Mike [00:36:29]:
There's a void to touch you on.
Eldar [00:36:31]:
Your head and say that you're a good little hamster.
Phillip [00:36:33]:
A real estate nurture campaign. All right. You don't think there's any case where desire can be associated with something positive? It's usually coming from lack. Is that what you think?
Eldar [00:36:47]:
I have to examine.
Phillip [00:36:50]:
That's like a beauty definition. Like redefinition for me. That's like a big.
Mike [00:36:54]:
Yeah, that's interesting.
Eldar [00:36:56]:
Yeah.
Mike [00:36:56]:
I don't know.
Phillip [00:36:57]:
You think so too, Mike?
Mike [00:36:58]:
I'm not sure. No, I have to think about it.
Eldar [00:36:59]:
Listen, and I'm not saying that.
Eldar [00:37:02]:
Look, if you want to talk about.
Eldar [00:37:04]:
Radical stuff, try to develop a desire to help others. It's a little hard, right? It's like you understand what's happening.
Phillip [00:37:11]:
I'm so passionate about serving other people like that. Like that equation.
Eldar [00:37:16]:
Yeah.
Phillip [00:37:16]:
I'm not there yet.
Eldar [00:37:17]:
Okay. You know what I'm saying?
Phillip [00:37:19]:
I get it. I would assume that people would be passionate about service at some.
Mike [00:37:26]:
I think when your cup is full, then you can tie those two together.
Eldar [00:37:29]:
That's right. But because it's not. Most of the time, most of the time, individuals, I think, are functioning out of the lack.
Phillip [00:37:34]:
So we're talking like a self actualized person who's like the Nick Nolte in the movie. Hey, service is everything. I'm at the gas station. And why are you trying to teach him? Why are you here?
Eldar [00:37:46]:
Why are you here? Why are you pumping gas? If you're so smart, why are you pumping gas?
Eldar [00:37:49]:
Yeah.
Eldar [00:37:49]:
He goes, service is service. There's no greater good in the world than service to others.
Phillip [00:37:54]:
So reasonably in this example, Nick Nolte can have a desire to service people.
Tommy [00:37:58]:
At a high level.
Eldar [00:37:59]:
See, I'm not even sure if you call that a desire. I think it's probably a duty, and I think that's a different thing.
Phillip [00:38:05]:
So it's coming from more of like a peaceful place of evenness and balance versus like a up down.
Eldar [00:38:11]:
Because of the fact that he's probably desired less, he has the ability to focus on giving.
Tommy [00:38:18]:
This might sound strange, but I think also when you have a dream in mind that your dreams are valid and that if you are really trying to pursue those dreams, if you're.
Eldar [00:38:29]:
Tom, we just debunk this nonsense.
Tommy [00:38:30]:
If you're doing that, if you're really trying to pursue your dreams, Tom, what.
Eldar [00:38:34]:
I'm saying is this, in your case.
Tommy [00:38:37]:
I'll give you my thought, is that you'll do anything to overcome.
Mike [00:38:41]:
The thing is, your dreams, a lot of times those dreams are desperate. You've never been accepted. So you make dreams that you can prove everybody wrong. That's exactly what happened.
Eldar [00:38:52]:
That's exactly what's going on. Your book is about helping fucking others. Your book is about helping others. You're going to fucking finish this book when you're 120 years old. God damn it. Wait, I thought his book was about his life. Yeah, but it's a message that. Hold on.
Tommy [00:39:07]:
I disagree.
Phillip [00:39:07]:
There's an honest way of, can you recover, too? I didn't know the specifics of this.
Eldar [00:39:11]:
There's a good message there. Right, understood. But what the fuck? If you really are about that and the fucking message, right. The inherent message in his shit is good, why can't he focus?
Mike [00:39:21]:
Because he's focused on the fame.
Eldar [00:39:22]:
That's right. Well.
Mike [00:39:26]:
They cannot coexist.
Phillip [00:39:28]:
There we go.
Eldar [00:39:28]:
I agree with you. It's impossible.
Phillip [00:39:31]:
I think so.
Mike [00:39:31]:
And that's.
Eldar [00:39:32]:
Therefore, that's also a writer block.
Phillip [00:39:34]:
I understand.
Mike [00:39:35]:
Those two things cannot exist within you.
Eldar [00:39:37]:
Correct.
Mike [00:39:37]:
But one is stronger than the other.
Tommy [00:39:38]:
I don't have.
Eldar [00:39:39]:
Oh, yeah. And I'm not saying writing.
Tommy [00:39:40]:
I'm not saying that to be out.
Eldar [00:39:41]:
He's just talking, bro. All he's doing is talking.
Mike [00:39:44]:
Going to coffee shops all day, every day.
Eldar [00:39:46]:
Yes.
Mike [00:39:47]:
Six coffees a day. Fucking all over the Tristate area, pretending to write, trying to pick up chicks with this, like, oh, I'm a fucking writer.
Eldar [00:39:53]:
Long hair, artistic.
Mike [00:39:58]:
Ordering artist.
Eldar [00:39:59]:
Not here. Get that shit out of here.
Tommy [00:40:01]:
The whole thing began with Mike saying that people are often dreaming about things that their dreams are completely, like, not.
Eldar [00:40:11]:
He is fucking right. Yeah, but the reason why your dreams are under the wrong shit, the worst thing you can do against yourself, the.
Mike [00:40:19]:
Worst thing you can go against yourself.
Eldar [00:40:20]:
Is set yourself up for failure by creating a crazy ass dream. What?
Phillip [00:40:25]:
Crazy?
Eldar [00:40:25]:
Without understanding the fucking process that it takes to get there.
Tommy [00:40:28]:
No, there's no crazy ass dream.
Mike [00:40:31]:
It is a crazy dream. The thing is, what I just thought about is that if you have a dream, right, and your dreams don't line up with your current day to day actions and belief systems, who you actually are. Who you actually are, like, you want to help people, but you're a selfish prick. Yeah. Every day.
Eldar [00:40:46]:
Oh, my God.
Mike [00:40:47]:
I'm not saying you, but anytime I call him.
Eldar [00:40:50]:
Hey, bro, can you do me a favor? How much is the pay?
Tommy [00:40:53]:
I wonder if a self.
Eldar [00:40:55]:
Exactly how much?
Mike [00:40:57]:
How can you want to pretend to help others when you. On a daily basis?
Eldar [00:41:01]:
How much does it pay?
Mike [00:41:02]:
Even show that behavior?
Eldar [00:41:03]:
How much does it pay?
Eldar [00:41:04]:
Yeah.
Eldar [00:41:05]:
That's his first question.
Eldar [00:41:06]:
Yeah.
Eldar [00:41:06]:
Wants to help people.
Eldar [00:41:08]:
No, he wants to help himself.
Eldar [00:41:10]:
He should be saying, like, when do you need me? I'm coming right now.
Mike [00:41:14]:
Yeah.
Eldar [00:41:15]:
Know what I'm saying?
Mike [00:41:16]:
That's a hiding thing. He's hiding behind that, of course. But the famousness and thing is, that's.
Eldar [00:41:21]:
The driver who he is.
Phillip [00:41:22]:
But then that makes sense with what his behavior is.
Eldar [00:41:25]:
Well, obviously behavior is always a perfect indicator of what the fuck is going on.
Phillip [00:41:34]:
So it makes sense then based off of your attachment to fame, then all the conversations that I've seen so far with you, not even based off of the other stuff that they're saying, off of them knowing you for a long time, I would say that your behavior lines up with your sense of belief in what fame is and it prevents you from doing your day to day actions, which is the actual writing.
Eldar [00:41:56]:
That's right. Does that make sense?
Eldar [00:41:58]:
100%. Yeah, 100%. Because he's holding himself away from actually filling himself up with that energy and that glow that's going to propel him to do naturally.
Eldar [00:42:08]:
Good.
Phillip [00:42:08]:
So that's what I was doing.
Eldar [00:42:09]:
Process.
Phillip [00:42:10]:
Yeah, I was doing this with the money. I was saying that I need to have the result. I need to do this, and as a result, I'm having piss poor conversations with people on the phone.
Eldar [00:42:17]:
That's right.
Phillip [00:42:17]:
I'm not listening. Which if I actually listen, yes. Then I would actually be able to then achieve that goal, have more sales and do all this stuff. But instead I'm trying to hamhog these people and have control and coming from a place of arrogance and ego and selfishness. And selfishness and I'm not enjoying the process.
Eldar [00:42:33]:
Correct.
Phillip [00:42:34]:
And this is what I'm talking about for me, 100%.
Mike [00:42:37]:
It's a good indicator of what you actually need to work on.
Eldar [00:42:39]:
That's right. It is a good indicator. It's just a lot of times people, if you're not around the right crowd and people can point the stuff out, you can ride for a very long time. Funny when you do this.
Mike [00:42:51]:
That's why Tommy only comes around once in a while.
Eldar [00:42:53]:
Yes.
Mike [00:42:53]:
He only handles so much of our.
Phillip [00:42:55]:
Being a jerk off in Wall street is actually pretty cool to be a finance guy, make money and to spit on people on the phone, throw midgets around, just jerk off.
Tommy [00:43:06]:
Like, look at this fucking idiot.
Phillip [00:43:07]:
I just got them for a million. That's cool. You know what I mean?
Eldar [00:43:10]:
They lost their minds completely.
Phillip [00:43:11]:
Yeah, these guys lost their minds, but.
Mike [00:43:13]:
They'Re actually living out their truths. Or they actually are, which is probably a good thing. It's better to live out a dirty.
Tommy [00:43:18]:
Truth than I have to say.
Eldar [00:43:20]:
You don't have to defend your character.
Tommy [00:43:23]:
Arrogant wishes and your own dreams and things that you may not even know you are aware that you could be dreaming about because you don't allow yourself to think that those things that you want to do in the future are possible. So that's why I can't co sign anything.
Phillip [00:43:39]:
We're not saying dreaming is bad, what I'm saying. Yeah, but we're saying that your attachment.
Tommy [00:43:45]:
Putting a lot of negative connotation with the idea.
Mike [00:43:47]:
No, I think dreaming might be bad.
Tommy [00:43:48]:
No, that dreams are basically ideals and they shouldn't strive towards ideals.
Phillip [00:43:53]:
No, he didn't say that. He's saying that your attachment to fame is preventing you from realizing the scope of having a dollar, to being a millionaire or being where you're at, to being a famous writer. You're not allowing yourself to understand what the process is going to take basis.
Eldar [00:44:10]:
Plus the importance of the process in the first place. Because apparently it's a good thing that he's trying to fucking write out the message.
Eldar [00:44:17]:
Yes.
Eldar [00:44:17]:
So why can't he fucking sit down?
Eldar [00:44:19]:
Yeah, it's a good thing. Very good thing.
Eldar [00:44:23]:
So go do it.
Phillip [00:44:24]:
So good has to align with good. So you're having a bad thought, bad intention, bad mentality towards a good thing about you.
Tommy [00:44:30]:
When you say you towards me.
Eldar [00:44:32]:
Yes. Whoa, whoa.
Eldar [00:44:33]:
He's talking about the particular situation and the thing that you mentioned. Tom, you don't have to get offended about this.
Phillip [00:44:39]:
Yeah, because you're coming. But I gave you an example of me also. This is something I'm struggling with, also not singling you out.
Tommy [00:44:45]:
I'm hearing it as the general rule, not necessarily something that.
Phillip [00:44:48]:
Oh no, I think it is a.
Eldar [00:44:49]:
General rule, but it applies to you.
Phillip [00:44:52]:
Anybody who would have an end goal in mind and attach themselves to it, recent situation, it doesn't matter.
Eldar [00:44:57]:
It's arrogant and it's not focused.
Phillip [00:44:58]:
Mine is money, apply to now, but Tom, minus money.
Eldar [00:45:02]:
Right.
Phillip [00:45:02]:
So I'm in sales. So if I'm going to think about sales on a day to day basis, we've had this conversation with Mike, with Tolly, with Eldor, with me, and I'm saying I want to enjoy the process a lot more. I can make sales and do it the way that I've been doing by hammering it. But I'm unhappy. And what am I doing? I'm just hammering people. I'm not thinking about the process. What's the process for me? I have to listen, take a genuine interest in people, understand where they're coming from, and be smart. Instead of saying, hey, everybody's a sale, I have to think about how much money I make.
Phillip [00:45:30]:
And if I make a certain amount of money, I'll have a certain house and all this stuff. My head is in the clouds about what I want when. Then that in turn is preventing me from the process of actually enjoying listening to people. You opened up this, doing all this.
Eldar [00:45:45]:
Well said.
Phillip [00:45:47]:
So, Tom, same shit for you and.
Eldar [00:45:49]:
Anybody else who's struggling with a fucking thing that they're not happy about, something that's not working out for them.
Phillip [00:45:53]:
Yeah, you're in the same boat as me, Tom.
Eldar [00:45:57]:
This fucking topic is probably the most important topic that we've ever spoke about.
Eldar [00:46:01]:
I think it is.
Eldar [00:46:02]:
Does the inability to enjoy the process signal out arrogance or some kind of attachment or that's fucking giving birth to our ego and pride?
Phillip [00:46:11]:
Yeah. We're giving specific examples, me and you, of proving this 100% right.
Eldar [00:46:16]:
Yeah.
Phillip [00:46:17]:
You just have a problem with accepting it. I did too. But I'm saying that when you do accept it, there's definitely a humbling experience. But there's also a fight on a day to day basis and realizing that.
Eldar [00:46:29]:
I agree with you.
Phillip [00:46:30]:
Yeah, he doesn't agree, but I'm saying inside that way I have people around me like you guys saying, hey, we want you to be happy. We're going to hold you accountable. And I'm still saying, damn, I'm conscious of this. I'm focusing on doing the right thing. But the old thing is so conditioned in me that this is not like an overnight process.
Eldar [00:46:50]:
Yeah.
Eldar [00:46:51]:
And it hurts even doing it.
Phillip [00:46:52]:
Yeah, I was saying there's a physical hurt in it. So I think a realistic is like months and years over like hours and.
Eldar [00:46:58]:
Days, you see, versus saying that, you know what? Yeah, this is great and I'm just going to do it.
Eldar [00:47:03]:
No. Yeah.
Phillip [00:47:03]:
Realistic expectation process.
Eldar [00:47:05]:
Right. Months and years and you can get attached to this process, I think, and really harbor and harvest a lot of good energy through this process. If you allow yourself to be humble.
Eldar [00:47:15]:
A little bit, that's it.
Eldar [00:47:17]:
And then you're going to fucking kill it. Yeah, I think that's where the answer is.
Phillip [00:47:21]:
It's a slight shift in your mind and attachment, but it's a heavy, heavy focus on your day to day and being present versus being in the clouds.
Eldar [00:47:29]:
That's why I got excited. I agree on that when you said certain things, I got excited. I'm like, hey, I am going to create that room the way you want it to be because I want to promote only the best in you. And I'll know whether or not you're going to be the best when you come in here. I'll know it. Whether or not you're going to be pumped, you're going to be happy to go, because now you have a good space. Well, why did you cry?
Eldar [00:47:48]:
Because I was pumped.
Tommy [00:47:49]:
And because I am pumped about what I'm doing.
Eldar [00:47:51]:
And that's why I co signed, came in with the energy, and then when we started ruin the action, you started pulling back.
Tommy [00:47:58]:
Because I like it simple.
Eldar [00:47:59]:
Because the arrogance, I like it simple.
Eldar [00:48:01]:
Arrogance.
Eldar [00:48:02]:
If you like it simple, get your ass in there right now and sit down.
Mike [00:48:06]:
But the arrogant weasel never wants to get caught.
Eldar [00:48:08]:
That's right. The arrogant weasel never wants to get caught. The arrogant weasel never wants to get caught. I agree with you.
Mike [00:48:15]:
That's why he's.
Eldar [00:48:16]:
And I'm always out there trying to catch the arrogant weasel.
Eldar [00:48:18]:
That's right. Remember that.
Eldar [00:48:20]:
I'm out there catching the arrogant weasel. That's a good shirt, Mike.
Tommy [00:48:25]:
Look, this dreams thing, it has to be tabled. This whole dreams thing, we've got to discuss it next week because.
Mike [00:48:33]:
Yeah, no problem. We can discuss it whenever you want.
Tommy [00:48:35]:
The idea that people have these crazy, impossible dreams that aren't rational, most people's.
Mike [00:48:40]:
Dreams are very self centered.
Tommy [00:48:42]:
How do we know? How do you know what people's dreams are really are, really?
Mike [00:48:44]:
Because everybody's the same, bro. Everybody's living and thinking about the same nonsense.
Eldar [00:48:49]:
Yeah, I disagree.
Mike [00:48:50]:
99% of the people agree.
Eldar [00:48:53]:
Phil just looked at. Phil just proved that.
Tommy [00:48:57]:
He has a misconception of what I think of as my dreams, which I never said I want to be.
Mike [00:49:03]:
We know your dreams.
Eldar [00:49:04]:
An accomplished author, you just said, never said that, though.
Tommy [00:49:07]:
Many people, I'll say, strive towards that. But maybe that doesn't interest you. So that proves my point again, because you wouldn't think of a person wanting to become a famous, and it just surprises you to hear that. You take a sudden interest in it, because you hear, okay, there are people out there who are doing this, and it confirms exactly what you're trying to say, tom. But most people.
Eldar [00:49:31]:
Right.
Tommy [00:49:31]:
Wouldn't strive to be a famous.
Eldar [00:49:33]:
Tom.
Mike [00:49:33]:
You're not allowed to dream.
Eldar [00:49:35]:
If you feel like you got caught, Tom, it's because you did.
Mike [00:49:38]:
That's it.
Eldar [00:49:39]:
That's it, Tom.
Mike [00:49:40]:
You're not allowed to dream anymore. It's banned.
Tommy [00:49:42]:
I didn't get caught. I confess.
Eldar [00:49:44]:
What are you talking about?
Tommy [00:49:46]:
I came in, I put the gun down on the table, and I said, I just shot my old lady.
Eldar [00:49:51]:
Philip, if he feels like he got caught, it's because he got caught. The slippery weasel always wants to sliver away, right?
Tommy [00:49:57]:
I think the idea.
Eldar [00:49:58]:
You think so? No, I think he's going to play.
Phillip [00:50:01]:
Around what he does as a result.
Tommy [00:50:04]:
Dreams definitely having validity.
Eldar [00:50:05]:
You don't understand that. This is the path to his salvation.
Tommy [00:50:08]:
Guys, I think dreams have validity.
Eldar [00:50:11]:
Do you understand?
Mike [00:50:11]:
But he's resisting.
Phillip [00:50:13]:
There's a lot of resistance going on right now, but he definitely hurt us.
Tommy [00:50:16]:
Dreams are dreams. Some may be a little bit unreasonable, but that's it. Irrational thoughts are different than dreams.
Eldar [00:50:23]:
Why is he rambling right now?
Phillip [00:50:25]:
Yeah, but your dreams, you're bypassing the fact that it doesn't matter.
Tommy [00:50:29]:
They're not my dreams. We did not discuss my dreams. We did not. At any point, you said, you want.
Phillip [00:50:34]:
To discuss my dream or.
Eldar [00:50:35]:
No.
Tommy [00:50:38]:
I think subconsciously I believe that during this process I have to meet a very high standard where people actually do appreciate me and get to see my most authentic self, which obviously removes that self generated idea, which separates me, which does not allow me to have compassion at times. Which means. What does that mean? Compassion? Sometimes not saying anything anymore, accepting that another person's point of view is not going to be like your own. There are things we're unaware of sometimes.
Eldar [00:51:13]:
Tom, the more you talk, the bigger hole. The bigger hole you dig?
Tommy [00:51:18]:
I said my piece here. I said I did not discuss my dreams at any point in time and that I have these subconscious thoughts.
Eldar [00:51:26]:
You said you were not going to stay for a long time. We're still here.
Phillip [00:51:29]:
So what was your idea about being fame and being attached to fame? What was that about?
Tommy [00:51:34]:
Well, it had a little bit to do with what elder said.
Eldar [00:51:36]:
Got a little bit of drinks.
Tommy [00:51:38]:
People who. There are people.
Mike [00:51:39]:
What is that called? Contact.
Tommy [00:51:42]:
Like in movies.
Eldar [00:51:44]:
You thought you were not going to go there, but we went there. You didn't think you're going to get.
Mike [00:51:47]:
Caught, you can't come play checkers. Playing checkers?
Eldar [00:51:51]:
No.
Eldar [00:51:52]:
When people are playing chess and the rules are chess, you can't come bring your chessboard, checkers board. You know what I mean? They're going to look at you as.
Tommy [00:51:59]:
Come on, guys, history.
Mike [00:52:02]:
Tom, you got to understand.
Eldar [00:52:05]:
You'Re going.
Tommy [00:52:06]:
To play this back in your cars and you're going to be driving down route four one day and you're going to say, damn, I dropped a ball on this one.
Mike [00:52:15]:
We're happy for you if you succeed.
Tommy [00:52:17]:
But I know Denis has the magic remix this, and he's going to look like he's going to be making me sing for sure.
Mike [00:52:25]:
We know the path, Tom.
Tommy [00:52:27]:
But look, guys, I mean, dreams. I have to say that idea, look, we put a million dollars on it. We put a million dollars on it. I am the one who came up with this idea about the million bucks.
Mike [00:52:42]:
I also know.
Phillip [00:52:43]:
So there are people out there who.
Mike [00:52:44]:
Want a million dollars.
Tommy [00:52:46]:
You know what?
Phillip [00:52:46]:
I care for that.
Tommy [00:52:47]:
I don't really care so much for it.
Eldar [00:52:50]:
I don't care so much. Mike is going to take out that receipt, man.
Andrey [00:52:53]:
I know you're going to shot back.
Eldar [00:52:54]:
I got to tell you something.
Mike [00:52:55]:
Which guy though? I wasn't talking about anybody specific.
Tommy [00:52:58]:
I got to tell you something. I heard J. Cole speak on some YouTube video.
Eldar [00:53:05]:
Tom, I think we've lost you.
Eldar [00:53:07]:
No. Yeah.
Mike [00:53:08]:
And we're ready to move on to the next.
Eldar [00:53:09]:
But maybe it feels a little saucy.
Tommy [00:53:11]:
So I understand if it's a little hard.
Phillip [00:53:14]:
This is what I think a good topic would be. Understanding how to take that attachment to whatever the end goal is, whether it be fame, money, an idea of whatever you want, and remove yourself from it to allow yourself to then go into your day to day process, but still have that thing kind of on the back burner where it doesn't affect your day to day.
Eldar [00:53:36]:
Correct.
Phillip [00:53:36]:
That's me.
Eldar [00:53:37]:
Should be the next.
Eldar [00:53:39]:
Yeah.
Eldar [00:53:40]:
So if you're going to dream, if.
Eldar [00:53:41]:
You'Re a dreamer, dream for just a little bit, right.
Eldar [00:53:45]:
Or dream for a lot of it, but then stop and you have to focus on action, realistic action.
Mike [00:53:51]:
Instead of saying how you want to go from one to a million, ask how you can go from a million.
Eldar [00:53:56]:
That's right.
Mike [00:53:57]:
Making a statement always carries arrogance, pride, ego. Asking a question typically carries humility.
Tommy [00:54:04]:
Yeah. People might say, I'm going to get a million dollars and start from one, right?
Eldar [00:54:09]:
That's right.
Mike [00:54:10]:
My daddy gave me a million dollar loan.
Tommy [00:54:11]:
That might sound arrogant.
Eldar [00:54:12]:
Boy, just a little boy.
Eldar [00:54:13]:
So what?
Phillip [00:54:14]:
A lot of books, like, say, like thinking, grow rich, Napoleon Hill, like all those type of finance books, right. It's saying, hey, if you don't know how it's saying, think about the end goal, whatever you're going to be, and it's going to create that path for you. So if there is some truth to this, then it would be, understand whoever that you want to be, had that vision, but then take that thing down. Put it to the side and allow yourself to then focus on the process. What does that look like? And did you believe that there's.
Eldar [00:54:42]:
I think it's a healthy dose of.
Eldar [00:54:43]:
Reality to say, you know what, I.
Eldar [00:54:45]:
Want to be a millionaire, but I only have $1 in my pocket.
Eldar [00:54:48]:
Yeah.
Eldar [00:54:49]:
And that's the reality of it. I'd like to be there sometime, but I.
Tommy [00:54:52]:
Okay, hold on.
Eldar [00:54:52]:
$1.
Tommy [00:54:53]:
I want to add something to that.
Eldar [00:54:54]:
And that's the truth of the matter. There's a reason why I only have $1. It is because I am not a millionaire. The individual who has a million dollars.
Eldar [00:55:02]:
In his pocket has enough knowledge to have a million dollars in their pocket. Okay.
Eldar [00:55:07]:
A million dollars worth of knowledge. I don't have that.
Eldar [00:55:10]:
I only have $1.
Eldar [00:55:11]:
If people looked at it that way, Philip, I think it's going to be a lot more humbling, and like Mike.
Eldar [00:55:16]:
Said, then it's going to make you.
Eldar [00:55:19]:
Unforce you to say, you know what? How do I get $2?
Eldar [00:55:22]:
Yeah.
Phillip [00:55:23]:
And how do I get $5 then? To me, it's like fully examining that end thing and making sure that that does align with who you are and what you want to be or who you want to become.
Eldar [00:55:34]:
Right.
Phillip [00:55:34]:
Everything that's really important.
Eldar [00:55:36]:
The problem is a lot of people will just take the end goal and run with it and saying that, I'm going to do this, and that's it, without examining it. Huge problem, I think.
Eldar [00:55:44]:
Yeah.
Eldar [00:55:44]:
And I think that's why a lot of people start buzing in all the wrong directions. And when they finally ran out of their steam and their buzzing, they lost their energy.
Eldar [00:55:58]:
They start becoming angry.
Eldar [00:56:00]:
Who do they become angry at? Usually the world. They're going to say, oh, you weren't supportive of me.
Eldar [00:56:06]:
Right?
Eldar [00:56:06]:
Like this guy right here, coming over here, say, yo, guys, that's not supporting me.
Eldar [00:56:10]:
You guys are my friends.
Eldar [00:56:11]:
What's going on?
Phillip [00:56:13]:
He's not doing the work.
Eldar [00:56:14]:
Heard of that before Catherine tuned in, said some non pc stuff. You know what I mean? So what's happening is because your attachment was so big, and you didn't do.
Eldar [00:56:26]:
The actual work, right.
Eldar [00:56:28]:
You got to find somebody to blame, and your ego and your arrogance will not allow you. Your ego and your arrogance will not allow you.
Andrey [00:56:37]:
I see.
Eldar [00:56:38]:
To point the fucking finger at yourself, and that's where you commit a crime.
Eldar [00:56:43]:
Against yourself, and the gig is up. The gig?
Eldar [00:56:47]:
No, it's the gig. It is the gig.
Katherine [00:56:51]:
Correctly.
Tommy [00:56:52]:
Sorry, I let it run for a little while.
Eldar [00:56:54]:
There's the world, and then there's elderism. And there's warism as well.
Eldar [00:56:58]:
You know what I'm saying?
Eldar [00:56:59]:
And we fuck with warism as well. You know what I mean? And we got that from Warren. Shout out to war.
Eldar [00:57:05]:
The gig is up.
Eldar [00:57:06]:
Because there's such a thing as a gig, guys.
Eldar [00:57:09]:
No.
Eldar [00:57:10]:
Okay, what's the right way? The correct way is jig.
Mike [00:57:16]:
Wait, the right way is the jig.
Phillip [00:57:17]:
No, the right way is gig, guys.
Eldar [00:57:21]:
It's the jig. The saying is jig. Original saying is jig.
Tommy [00:57:24]:
Really?
Mike [00:57:26]:
The spin is, oh, I think the gig is up. Sounds right.
Eldar [00:57:29]:
Gig is like something that you're doing.
Phillip [00:57:31]:
What's a jig?
Eldar [00:57:32]:
Jig is like a thing. Jiggy, but jiggy.
Mike [00:57:35]:
Yeah, the jig is up.
Phillip [00:57:38]:
I thought a gig is the thing.
Mike [00:57:41]:
Warren is the jig. The gig is up.
Tommy [00:57:43]:
Yeah, the gig is up.
Eldar [00:57:45]:
I thought.
Eldar [00:57:45]:
That's right.
Mike [00:57:46]:
That's Warren's thing.
Eldar [00:57:47]:
Right.
Mike [00:57:47]:
That's right.
Tommy [00:57:48]:
But, guys, listen, I think we're missing a key component of the.
Eldar [00:57:52]:
We're not missing anything.
Mike [00:57:53]:
We're not missing anything.
Tommy [00:57:54]:
Missing a little bit more of running and pursuing.
Phillip [00:57:59]:
Reveal the foil. The jig is up.
Tommy [00:58:01]:
I think the arrogance is not to say that you desire, but how good is the gig?
Phillip [00:58:08]:
So much that that's why you.
Eldar [00:58:09]:
A little bit more correct. How good is the gig?
Phillip [00:58:12]:
I think it's great.
Eldar [00:58:13]:
Yeah.
Eldar [00:58:13]:
Good.
Tommy [00:58:15]:
So, listen, I think that the arrogance is not necessarily to say that I want to be wealthy or I want to make.
Eldar [00:58:22]:
I'm not saying that at all. We didn't say that.
Tommy [00:58:26]:
But there is something that sounds like, to me, a little bit more arrogant than to say, I want to make a million dollars, or I would like a million dollars, and that's to actually not provide reasons for why that money is important to you and to further say that that money is more important than other things that. Do you see where I'm going with this?
Eldar [00:58:51]:
No, Tom, what we're saying is that to make grandiose statements such as that one.
Eldar [00:58:55]:
Right.
Eldar [00:58:55]:
Without proper examination and follow through and thought process, it's a crime against yourself whether or not you want to about a million bucks. It's up to you, Tom. If you want to keep fueling your arrogance, your ego and your attachment, it's your choice, Tom. It's your choice. We're doing philosophy. We're trying to figure out what's actually going on. Where's the birth of ego is. Where's the birth of arrogance is.
Eldar [00:59:19]:
And we're trying to see whether or not we should steer clear away from it. If we do. It's our choice.
Eldar [00:59:24]:
If we're not, it's also our choice. It's your choice, Tom.
Eldar [00:59:27]:
You're not doing anything wrong.
Tommy [00:59:28]:
What I'm saying is, it's for you.
Eldar [00:59:30]:
To experience what you experience, and if you're experiencing some kind of distaste in.
Tommy [00:59:33]:
Your mouth, I explained my situation.
Eldar [00:59:36]:
That's your choice. Right, Philip?
Phillip [00:59:38]:
So this is the example for me would be, you can do this for a number of years. You can actually achieve whatever you say that you want. You can actually achieve fame. How many people achieve, just like I.
Eldar [00:59:48]:
Told you, you want to do your sales the way you do.
Tommy [00:59:50]:
You guys heard my confession, though. My confession was, I don't want it. I realized that that would make me uncomfortable.
Phillip [00:59:58]:
But it doesn't matter what it is. It can be whatever the thing is, whether it's money, whether it's fame, whether it's wanting to be a writer, it can be a genuine thing. It can be wanting to be something good, but it doesn't matter, because if you're so attached to this thing, you are preventing yourself from getting into the process and realizing having a genuine curiosity. Like Eldar said, if you have a dollar and you're trying to get a million, and you're so focused on a million, why would you be genuinely curious about getting $2?
Eldar [01:00:24]:
$2? Yeah, why?
Tommy [01:00:25]:
You wouldn't.
Phillip [01:00:26]:
Because you don't care. So you're so arrogant that you're saying, that's the thing.
Tommy [01:00:31]:
I'm disagreeing with this part. I think that someone with $1 who is desperate, someone who is in a very difficult situation, might have a drive to do anything to get out of that situation and will not stop until they make a million dollars. That's something I have to say. But I think that there's arrogance in that, saying that that money is not for you and that money is not for you and that money is not for you. Because I'm better.
Phillip [01:00:55]:
Yeah, we didn't say that.
Tommy [01:00:57]:
You can't achieve arrogance for the million.
Phillip [01:00:59]:
Yeah, but you can achieve that goal. I can get the million dollars, but I'm going to be miserable as a result of the process. What are you valuing what I'm saying to these guys? I'm saying, hey, I love working in this environment, but what the actual day to day of sales, what I've had in my past, is that I can achieve the numbers, but I'm not happy as a result of how I'm. At what cost. So we're saying, hey, change your mindset. Stop being attached to the result, have a conversation with these people and take a genuine interest in them, and you'll get all the other things, but don't be attached to that end thing. We're reevaluating my end goal mindset, and we're saying I choose happiness over the end goal.
Eldar [01:01:35]:
And he's in an environment where we actually promote this, and I chose humble. The thing that's only right here is that it's patience, that this kind of shit and this kind of actualization of a human being will take some time. It's not an overnight fucking success story. He knows how to do sales and get money a specific way, but he's realized that, look, he was honest with himself and us and say, yo, it doesn't feel so good, guys. We're like, okay, cool, Philip, let's figure out a different way where you feel good, but you still get the sale. He's like, great, let's do it. It's going to take some time.
Eldar [01:02:07]:
You know what?
Eldar [01:02:08]:
He cannot. He cannot, in this example, right. Have the same expectation of himself that he would before using the old technique. With the old technique, he can grind and do crazy shit and maybe get.
Eldar [01:02:20]:
Some good sales, but at what cost?
Eldar [01:02:22]:
This one is different. He has to relearn the process and slowly introduce this new identity into this process. And when he does, and actually, this.
Tommy [01:02:31]:
Is an example of doing right, it's.
Eldar [01:02:33]:
Going to click over.
Eldar [01:02:34]:
Exactly.
Tommy [01:02:34]:
Overdoing the immoral thing.
Eldar [01:02:36]:
That's right.
Tommy [01:02:37]:
Because. Yeah, because why? Because there are times when we, even as moral people, make mistakes.
Eldar [01:02:51]:
Okay, Tom, if you're lining yourself up.
Eldar [01:02:53]:
As a moral person, sure, you're a Mormon now.
Tommy [01:02:56]:
No, but I want to lean into it.
Phillip [01:02:59]:
Why?
Tommy [01:03:00]:
Because I realized how skewed this idea.
Phillip [01:03:03]:
Of fame could be.
Eldar [01:03:04]:
There's one thing you have to realize. Have you realized through this whole process of what pedestal you put yourself on, or.
Eldar [01:03:10]:
No?
Eldar [01:03:12]:
If you haven't, no.
Eldar [01:03:13]:
Hold on.
Tommy [01:03:14]:
Can we just bury this shit right away? You better cut this. No, I don't even like the conversation.
Eldar [01:03:24]:
Okay.
Phillip [01:03:25]:
I realize it's going to be important.
Mike [01:03:27]:
You don't want to be portrayed in a bad light.
Eldar [01:03:29]:
Maybe it's just one of the most exposure, probably the most important conversations for every single person.
Tommy [01:03:34]:
Oh, good. So what you're saying is I did my homework three weeks in advance.
Eldar [01:03:38]:
I think that you don't realize that the key to your success and fame is actually in this conversation. Yes or no, Philip?
Eldar [01:03:43]:
Bro?
Eldar [01:03:44]:
Philip, yes or no?
Tommy [01:03:45]:
What are we talking about?
Phillip [01:03:47]:
Listen, if that's literally giving him the version of him being a writer. If I was a writer.
Tommy [01:03:52]:
Wait 1 second.
Phillip [01:03:54]:
If we.
Tommy [01:03:55]:
That I have a choice and that my choice can result in happiness and that happiness will, I don't know, just be good for everybody.
Eldar [01:04:04]:
That's right. And then.
Tommy [01:04:06]:
Okay, that's cool.
Eldar [01:04:08]:
Yes. That's the whole point.
Eldar [01:04:09]:
What do you think we want for.
Eldar [01:04:11]:
Fucking from this shit? But we have to fucking undo ourselves, right?
Mike [01:04:16]:
We're trying to unfry you, kid.
Eldar [01:04:18]:
Yes.
Eldar [01:04:19]:
Because like we said, a lot of our fucking belief systems, ideologies, habits, bad habits, caused us to experience suffering that we don't even know where it fucking came from. Right, babe? Yeah. Therapy. Why therapy? Because you trying to figure this shit out. Because you've been doing it for so long and so wrong.
Katherine [01:04:38]:
The thing is, a lot of it, just because you think it or it's your belief doesn't make it good for you or doesn't make it right.
Eldar [01:04:48]:
That's right.
Katherine [01:04:49]:
So a lot of times you're chasing or. I'm not saying that anything that you want is wrong. I'm saying just in general, sometimes the idea of what you want, whatever goal sometimes doesn't align, but you can't see that. You're like, well, this is what I want, so it must be right.
Eldar [01:05:07]:
And we're not trying to take this away.
Katherine [01:05:09]:
No, absolutely not. But I'm saying, like therapy, we want.
Mike [01:05:11]:
Him to be happy and allows you.
Katherine [01:05:12]:
To kind of maybe just see things.
Eldar [01:05:13]:
A little bit clearer. Right.
Tommy [01:05:14]:
And I think for me, for example, just to share some of my experiences, having thoughts about creativity and how to approach it and how to express some things, because I'm finding that self expression isn't more important to me now, and it is always important to me, and I'm trying to use that as a kind of value. I've realized that there are times where I want things to be kind of very clear to me. I want things to be dead clear to me. And I want to know direction.
Eldar [01:05:46]:
Yeah.
Tommy [01:05:46]:
I want to know that I'm just comfortable in my own skin, but literally asking. I'm asking for it, but I want to know. I'm comfortable in my own skin, but no more pen. I'm not allowing myself to feel just uncomfortable sometimes, to not know, to just say, I don't know. I'm not allowing that.
Eldar [01:06:05]:
Yeah, sorry to hear that, Tom. Because hopefully one day you will, and you will have a direction.
Tommy [01:06:09]:
Because I don't necessarily like people telling me what to do about me.
Eldar [01:06:14]:
That's right.
Eldar [01:06:15]:
Yeah.
Eldar [01:06:15]:
That's right.
Phillip [01:06:16]:
So that's okay, but it's not exactly, like, comfortable.
Eldar [01:06:22]:
Until you recognize that the people that you're speaking to, at least maybe us or somebody else, have your best interests at heart, you won't be comfortable. Part of humility is trusting.
Eldar [01:06:35]:
Right?
Eldar [01:06:36]:
Trusting what? Maybe the people or maybe the fucking process.
Tommy [01:06:39]:
I feel like I've discovered this idea about being humble by just telling myself that my process is just continue doing what I'm doing.
Eldar [01:06:47]:
Okay, Tom?
Tommy [01:06:48]:
And so the idea is that I want you all, as my friends, to know that I'm humble because I want.
Mike [01:06:54]:
No, you want to pretend to be humble.
Tommy [01:06:57]:
No, I'm dead serious.
Mike [01:06:58]:
You have no idea what that requires to be humble.
Tommy [01:07:02]:
I just told you that. I figured it out the other way around.
Phillip [01:07:06]:
Treat you like you are coming from a humble place.
Mike [01:07:09]:
Yeah, we can if you want.
Eldar [01:07:11]:
No, that's not true. We could probably pretend.
Tommy [01:07:13]:
What I'm saying is that I feel that I want others to know that I'm humble.
Eldar [01:07:18]:
Why?
Tommy [01:07:18]:
Because I don't want to be pursuing arrogantly this fame that I have.
Mike [01:07:23]:
But you are. But your actions don't speak.
Tommy [01:07:27]:
My actions don't have to because they're already doing their thing.
Eldar [01:07:31]:
Yeah, if you're humble, you don't need to speak about it, bro. You're humble.
Katherine [01:07:37]:
You don't have to actually convince anyone of.
Tommy [01:07:40]:
No, yeah, I don't think I do.
Eldar [01:07:42]:
But you just fucking said it.
Eldar [01:07:44]:
What?
Tommy [01:07:44]:
I said what? I would like for you guys to know that I'm humble because it wouldn't have any conflict in terms of. The only conflict is creating yourself, creating an annoying project. Creating an arrogance.
Eldar [01:07:56]:
Yeah.
Tommy [01:07:57]:
Do I project myself as an arrogant person?
Eldar [01:07:59]:
Absolutely.
Eldar [01:08:00]:
Yeah.
Tommy [01:08:00]:
When and how?
Eldar [01:08:01]:
Yesterday.
Phillip [01:08:01]:
100%.
Eldar [01:08:02]:
Yeah.
Mike [01:08:03]:
All the time, Tommy. Yesterday included.
Tommy [01:08:06]:
There's a thing when you have a kind of personal love for something, you protect.
Eldar [01:08:11]:
Attachment. Attachment, yeah.
Phillip [01:08:13]:
But we get it. And we're not saying that you can't succeed and just get the thing that you're talking about. We're not saying dreams are bad. We're not saying your attachment to it's bad. We're saying that if you examine this thing and you want to be happy, it's going to be very, very hard to enjoy the process without being arrogant.
Eldar [01:08:28]:
That's the whole time we're all having that conversation. Yeah, do it. Fucking choice.
Phillip [01:08:34]:
You can definitely do it.
Eldar [01:08:35]:
Keep doing it, bro. We don't give a fuck.
Tommy [01:08:38]:
Just know talking about it yesterday was uncomfortable for me because, of course.
Eldar [01:08:48]:
I'm.
Tommy [01:08:48]:
Saying I don't have to do anything to change how I approach my work. And you do. I don't necessarily have to.
Mike [01:08:55]:
Came with a problem that you needed to change the approach. You need a dedicated place to work, certain kind of environment. You want a certain specific thing. Okay, so that's already coming.
Tommy [01:09:04]:
Now, take it from me, I'm going to say, here's a million dollars, but with this million dollars, you are going to achieve everything that you want. And you'll get everything that you want. But you have to sign away your soul to me. Let's just call me the devil here.
Eldar [01:09:20]:
Yeah, but a beggar, that's kind of what it's like. And we already agreed on this. Yeah, a beggar can't say like, oh, give me a dollar.
Phillip [01:09:26]:
I wanted five, but I wasn't a beggar yesterday.
Eldar [01:09:29]:
Do you know what I'm saying?
Phillip [01:09:30]:
Yeah, this was happening yesterday.
Eldar [01:09:31]:
Yeah, what's happening?
Phillip [01:09:35]:
You can't dictate the rules in this, okay?
Eldar [01:09:38]:
Who do you think you are?
Phillip [01:09:39]:
Yeah, what I'm saying, arrogant.
Tommy [01:09:42]:
Here's a pair of shoes, but you have to go and you have to do something. So on and so forth. You can't walk with these shoes.
Eldar [01:09:52]:
Your size ten. And we get in your own hometown.
Tommy [01:09:54]:
You know what I mean?
Eldar [01:09:56]:
You were born this way, Tom.
Tommy [01:09:58]:
I'm just saying you can't impose on another person rules who has their own way of approaching creativity.
Eldar [01:10:06]:
Of course you can. Of course you can. When you start involving yourself in other, you cannot.
Mike [01:10:10]:
But the thing is, you were making.
Eldar [01:10:14]:
Go out here, go out there and do whatever the fuck you want. That's what I'm saying. And I can't say a word about it. But when you come here and you say something that involves everybody here, you affecting everybody. So of course people can have a.
Eldar [01:10:28]:
Fucking say because this is not your space.
Tommy [01:10:32]:
But here's the thing, this is run up because we already spoke about this and we agreed about this. Yes, we came to an agreement, but.
Eldar [01:10:40]:
I'm just telling you that of course the people that own the place dissect.
Tommy [01:10:45]:
This because that's what's important. It's not a sense of arrogance that I was trying to, I actually wasn't trying at all, but it just came.
Phillip [01:10:53]:
Out naturally because it looked like arrogance. You can't help yourself. How this can be.
Eldar [01:10:59]:
He can't help himself.
Phillip [01:11:00]:
Yeah, you can't.
Tommy [01:11:01]:
I'm just saying that it's perceived in ways that. I don't want to be perceived, Tom.
Mike [01:11:07]:
But the thing is, we already know.
Eldar [01:11:09]:
That'S the way you come across. How can we perceive something?
Tommy [01:11:11]:
How are you going to help the person who sees it that way.
Phillip [01:11:14]:
Yeah, you're right. It's very difficult.
Eldar [01:11:16]:
It's very difficult.
Phillip [01:11:17]:
That's our. You have to accept the help.
Tommy [01:11:23]:
He sees it wrong, Phil.
Eldar [01:11:24]:
You see it wrong. We all see it. What?
Phillip [01:11:27]:
We all see it the same way, Tom.
Eldar [01:11:29]:
We saw, Tom.
Mike [01:11:30]:
There's a repeating.
Tommy [01:11:30]:
But like I said, I think it's very biased, and I think it's also just based on the way you perceive it.
Eldar [01:11:38]:
We're all seeing it the same way.
Mike [01:11:41]:
There's an ongoing thing, Tom.
Tommy [01:11:43]:
Well, look, I'll tell you right now, I feel better than I did yesterday discussing it, because it does make me quite angry that I can't just be respected for doing something that I enjoy doing to other people.
Mike [01:11:54]:
Who's saying you can't be respected?
Phillip [01:11:56]:
We want you to do that.
Eldar [01:11:57]:
Do whatever you want. Serious, Tom. Do whatever the.
Tommy [01:11:59]:
I know that you have an idea that this could potentially do something because we agreed, because I would not have taken a place in office.
Eldar [01:12:07]:
I do not believe anything that you're.
Tommy [01:12:09]:
Saying, because I know how I can make this decision. Whereas in the past, I'm willing and.
Eldar [01:12:15]:
I'm open to admit that I would.
Tommy [01:12:19]:
In fact sign up for things that I didn't really care about and I didn't have my heart in. And so that's that. But this is important because it's not coming from a place of arrogance, it's coming from a place of wanting to stay true to my values.
Eldar [01:12:34]:
The way you came across and the way you were dictating certain things, that's when you come as arrogant. You understand when you asking, that's not arrogant at all. But as soon as you're like, okay, cool, this is what we're giving you. And instead of saying, okay, cool, no.
Tommy [01:12:49]:
It wasn't giving, this is what we are taking from you. That's what I got.
Eldar [01:12:52]:
We're not taking.
Eldar [01:12:52]:
No.
Tommy [01:12:53]:
Yes, it was.
Mike [01:12:53]:
It was.
Eldar [01:12:54]:
What are you going to exchange?
Tommy [01:12:56]:
We're going to read this. It was a lot.
Phillip [01:13:01]:
We didn't want to read any of it.
Mike [01:13:03]:
He's gone, bro.
Eldar [01:13:04]:
He's gone.
Mike [01:13:05]:
Completely gone.
Tommy [01:13:06]:
You're hearing it now, bro.
Mike [01:13:07]:
We don't give a fuck if you do this or not, but if you come to us and ask for help.
Tommy [01:13:12]:
We reached an agreement. But don't try to say that that was not the original point of view.
Mike [01:13:18]:
Who came to who?
Phillip [01:13:19]:
That this has to happen.
Eldar [01:13:21]:
Who came to who did we call you?
Mike [01:13:24]:
It doesn't matter.
Tommy [01:13:26]:
That no longer matters because no problem.
Eldar [01:13:28]:
The podcast could be over here.
Tommy [01:13:30]:
Then I'm just saying.
Eldar [01:13:31]:
You said you don't want to talk.
Mike [01:13:32]:
About what happened because we put too.
Tommy [01:13:35]:
Much emphasis on outcomes.
Phillip [01:13:37]:
You did.
Tommy [01:13:38]:
So why is it important that I came to him if it was not necessarily that you have put your assumption.
Mike [01:13:45]:
That the outcome is that important. I don't even care about outcome. I just want to get the fact straight. You came here because you needed something.
Tommy [01:13:52]:
No, I didn't.
Mike [01:13:53]:
Not because we needed something from you.
Eldar [01:13:55]:
That's it.
Mike [01:13:56]:
And if you're assuming that role of asking for help.
Eldar [01:13:59]:
Wait.
Mike [01:13:59]:
You don't dictate by how you get.
Tommy [01:14:01]:
Talking about this place. Yeah, well, you do. You can make a choice, and you can make a choice about how you choose to. I don't know.
Mike [01:14:11]:
You can make a choice how you.
Tommy [01:14:13]:
Choose to call up your clients, or you can make a choice about whatever makes you.
Eldar [01:14:18]:
Tom, what did we do wrong?
Phillip [01:14:21]:
He didn't like how we spoke to him about his.
Mike [01:14:23]:
No, no, not at all. He does not like that. He's been caught.
Phillip [01:14:26]:
No, that's what I'm saying. He does not like he got caught.
Tommy [01:14:29]:
I can't be serious here with Penny in a diaper.
Phillip [01:14:32]:
He's holding on to the process. Now, if he said before, hey, I've wrote multiple books. I know my process. Why are you guys telling me this?
Eldar [01:14:42]:
Then we'd be like, yeah, no problem. Listen, you know why? We're accomplished writer.
Phillip [01:14:46]:
We're definitely in the wrong. Your guy's going to call us.
Eldar [01:14:50]:
We would be honored if you stayed here with us.
Phillip [01:14:52]:
Yeah, listen, what do you want?
Tommy [01:14:53]:
What do you need?
Mike [01:14:54]:
I can make your experience better.
Eldar [01:14:56]:
We will meet. That's what I end up doing anyway.
Eldar [01:14:58]:
Yeah.
Eldar [01:14:58]:
We're going to say, hey, you need.
Phillip [01:14:59]:
Three pizzas a day. You need to smell like you want a bunk bed.
Eldar [01:15:02]:
I'll fucking buy a bunk bed in there, bro. Between writing, I got you.
Phillip [01:15:08]:
But you're not coming from that place. You're coming from a place of, I want to achieve this thing. And you're so attached to it where you're sitting here making demands.
Tommy [01:15:16]:
Well, I mean, I think maybe Phil.
Eldar [01:15:17]:
I don't know.
Tommy [01:15:18]:
I don't know. That's the way you see it, but I wish you wouldn't because.
Phillip [01:15:23]:
But then you have to change the.
Tommy [01:15:24]:
Way that you're approaching a lot of words, like, it's personal to me. And there are people who practice differently, they work differently, different genres work differently. I wouldn't promise to finish pages, but I'm not ruling that out. At some point, there is a possibility of it, but also, there's just kind of this own idea, which, from my own personality, just kind of fits for me.
Mike [01:15:50]:
The arrogance is the thing.
Eldar [01:15:52]:
It's upholding the image as a profession, 100%.
Mike [01:15:55]:
It's upholding the image.
Phillip [01:15:57]:
We're seeing it right now.
Mike [01:15:58]:
We're seeing right now.
Eldar [01:15:59]:
Yeah.
Eldar [01:16:00]:
It has to fight for itself.
Mike [01:16:01]:
Yeah.
Tommy [01:16:02]:
You guys are really squirming your way through this one.
Mike [01:16:05]:
We didn't come to fuck around. We didn't come to fuck around.
Eldar [01:16:09]:
Yeah.
Phillip [01:16:09]:
This is definitely that. And I understand because it is that acceptance. And you cannot just all of a sudden turn on a switch and be humble if you're so attached to this thing, which is what we're saying, there you go. You can at the same time be humble and say, I get it. And then also, in the same breath, defend that thing which you are trying to then say, I want.
Tommy [01:16:29]:
I think about being humble. Thing is, how can I be humble? It was a question. And the other thing is that I realized that the important thing for me to do in order to avoid this overwhelming thought about being famous or anything like that, or having to be, in the process, appreciated, respected, or just be seen as, like, a great guy or something, that ideal is to just follow my own plan, which is to create a plan. The plan is to know what I'm doing, basically. And we were trying to give you pursue that. I do that. I am 100% on that front.
Eldar [01:17:04]:
That's okay.
Tommy [01:17:05]:
And I appreciate that.
Eldar [01:17:06]:
Yes.
Tommy [01:17:07]:
And I do see that. I want to acknowledge it.
Eldar [01:17:10]:
But the idea is that I do.
Tommy [01:17:12]:
Want to be seen more humbly, because I realize what it's like to be seen as aryan.
Phillip [01:17:19]:
See, but that's also ego, and that's also your status and your idea of what other people's think of you. You did not say one thing about writing yet.
Eldar [01:17:26]:
Hold on.
Tommy [01:17:26]:
That's about ego and status and writing.
Phillip [01:17:28]:
You want people to perceive you as a certain guy.
Tommy [01:17:30]:
I write. I have my own way of writing right now in a way that makes me feel comfortable.
Phillip [01:17:34]:
Then you don't need us.
Tommy [01:17:35]:
In a way that makes me.
Eldar [01:17:36]:
Exactly.
Phillip [01:17:37]:
So then he doesn't need us.
Eldar [01:17:38]:
No, of course not.
Tommy [01:17:39]:
And I said that yesterday as well.
Phillip [01:17:42]:
I don't need it. Then, yeah.
Mike [01:17:44]:
I can have the space again.
Phillip [01:17:45]:
It's your space.
Mike [01:17:47]:
Run around, build a little workout studio for myself. We'll do pilates in this pull up ball.
Katherine [01:17:52]:
I'm in.
Phillip [01:17:52]:
There we go.
Mike [01:17:53]:
Perfect.
Eldar [01:17:53]:
Done.
Mike [01:17:54]:
Thank you, Tom, for vacating yoga mats, stretching little kupacha sleeping area, drinking tea, small table, nice decor. And guys, maybe carpets on the walls.
Eldar [01:18:03]:
We will always remember the lamp.
Eldar [01:18:07]:
With.
Tommy [01:18:07]:
The situation that you've just generated. You've proved the point for yourself. What, that I don't need it?
Eldar [01:18:17]:
Yeah.
Eldar [01:18:18]:
Agree.
Tommy [01:18:18]:
I did not do that. I'm just saying, through your own bias, you allowed this to happen.
Eldar [01:18:24]:
But we've been known that.
Tommy [01:18:25]:
To precipitate.
Eldar [01:18:26]:
But we've been known that.
Tommy [01:18:27]:
But you've been known what?
Eldar [01:18:29]:
The fact that if you take away the space, I'll be okay.
Eldar [01:18:32]:
I don't care, 100%.
Eldar [01:18:35]:
You don't need the space to write.
Tommy [01:18:36]:
But that's what I'm saying.
Eldar [01:18:38]:
Can it help? Maybe we don't know. Maybe we don't know. You're saying, yes, it might help. We're open to that.
Tommy [01:18:45]:
I did approach and ask for the space.
Eldar [01:18:48]:
Oh, yeah.
Mike [01:18:48]:
Wait, what?
Phillip [01:18:49]:
Here he comes.
Tommy [01:18:50]:
I did.
Mike [01:18:51]:
But, Tom, how much have you drunk today? Can you walk the straight line and give me the ABC?
Phillip [01:18:55]:
Here he comes.
Eldar [01:18:56]:
Here he comes.
Phillip [01:18:56]:
Coming right around the bed. But the arrogance always comes around.
Eldar [01:18:59]:
Right?
Tommy [01:19:00]:
The arrogance thing is unreal.
Phillip [01:19:02]:
Here he comes.
Tommy [01:19:03]:
It's completely skewed.
Eldar [01:19:04]:
You guys have. How do you want me to catch him? Be nice to him.
Phillip [01:19:07]:
Yeah, be nice for now, and then.
Eldar [01:19:13]:
You'Re bad. Tom, we want you to have the space. We would be honored to have you here.
Eldar [01:19:20]:
Yes.
Phillip [01:19:20]:
I'd love to have you.
Eldar [01:19:21]:
Thank you.
Eldar [01:19:22]:
You know what I'm saying?
Mike [01:19:22]:
And the pilates dude is not that important to me.
Eldar [01:19:24]:
Oh, yeah. Listen, Tom, we would love to have you here. And I think that if you're saying that, look, this will help you thrive. We'd love that. I'd love to promote that. Okay. I had a very simple. After asking you first to write certain things and be productive, I made it very simple.
Eldar [01:19:39]:
I said, listen, if you could just take off your shoes and get in the zone before you start writing, that'd be great.
Tommy [01:19:44]:
I agree. To do kind of a weird and interesting thing, which is to take off my shoes.
Eldar [01:19:49]:
Yeah.
Tommy [01:19:49]:
Sign of faith in it.
Eldar [01:19:50]:
Yeah, exactly. And feel like you're at home, because we want to bring out, obviously, the humble part of you, the fact that you can come out there and actually write magic and do magic. Something beautiful.
Phillip [01:20:06]:
Tommy doodles.
Eldar [01:20:09]:
Whether or not that's going to come about, I'm not sure.
Tommy [01:20:11]:
Guys, I have to say, that has its own attachments with it. I have to let you know, because.
Eldar [01:20:15]:
At the end of the day.
Tommy [01:20:16]:
Check myself, Tom.
Eldar [01:20:17]:
Because at the end of the day, space or not, when you go in there and you close the door, you have to face yourself you have to face yourself. Mike's not going to motivate you to write. I'm not going to motivate you to write. Not Philip, nobody. It's going to be you versus you.
Tommy [01:20:34]:
Which I'm open to and ready for.
Eldar [01:20:36]:
Yeah, that's what I'm saying. So then show a little bit humility, Tom.
Tommy [01:20:42]:
The humility is right now, being here in this present moment.
Eldar [01:20:45]:
Well, I know it's hard for you, Tom, I know, but listen, this is part of growth. You told me a lie earlier. You said you're just going to stay.
Eldar [01:20:53]:
Here for a little while.
Eldar [01:20:55]:
It's been an hour and a half.
Tommy [01:20:57]:
That is a little while. I mean, it's not one of those four hour benders.
Eldar [01:21:01]:
What happened? You were yawning before, Tom. You were yawning before. You were a completely different person. Listen, like I said in the beginning of this podcast, if this is not the most important podcast for everybody in.
Eldar [01:21:12]:
This world, I don't know what it think. I think it holds a key for.
Eldar [01:21:17]:
Us to be able to really find out what it is to be happy. And part of it has to do.
Eldar [01:21:22]:
With lowering our ego and staying away from becoming arrogant and trusting the process.
Eldar [01:21:30]:
And focusing on the process, whatever the process may be. You want to write a book? No problem.
Eldar [01:21:36]:
No problem. You want to do this?
Eldar [01:21:38]:
No problem. Do it.
Eldar [01:21:39]:
Focusing on the process, doing the process.
Eldar [01:21:42]:
Following through with it, is the part of becoming humble. So let's say respecting it, right? Like respecting it.
Eldar [01:21:49]:
Yeah.
Phillip [01:21:49]:
So let's say there's an example of somebody who doesn't know. Let's say if I'm thinking about what I want, let's say if I took my, I want house here, I want to have this certain type of lifestyle, certain type of status. I have certain type of money attached to it. Let's say I remove that whole thing, and I'm saying that didn't bring me happiness. I'm back to square one. I don't know, whatever my new goal is going to be. So trusting the process would look like, watt, for somebody that does not have.
Mike [01:22:15]:
An end goal, getting obsessed about understanding and getting more knowledge.
Eldar [01:22:20]:
Yeah.
Phillip [01:22:21]:
Knowledge has to be the end goal, right? Or the process obsession.
Eldar [01:22:25]:
Yeah. I think that the person that actually finally succumbs to his own woes. Right, Tom? Woes.
Eldar [01:22:35]:
Because. Right.
Phillip [01:22:36]:
Like, if you're that person, right. With my woes, if you were so attached to something for like, 2030 plus years, I'm saying right now, I can honestly say now I'm going back and I'm saying, okay, I think deep down, I can envision myself having x, y, and z, but still, even that little remnant of having that. Philip, let me tell you something.
Eldar [01:22:56]:
Philip, listen. The attachment for 2030 years, Philip, something that's incorrect comes at the end of.
Eldar [01:23:06]:
It with some kind of a sickness.
Eldar [01:23:09]:
With some kind of a hurt and pain.
Eldar [01:23:11]:
Yeah.
Eldar [01:23:12]:
Something monumental shifting has to happen. Accident, illness, right? Life threatening situation happens that finally punches you in the gut and tells you.
Eldar [01:23:27]:
Yo, you were doing it wrong. You were doing it wrong.
Phillip [01:23:31]:
But now coming to humbles you for.
Eldar [01:23:33]:
That moment is to say, like, wait a second.
Eldar [01:23:35]:
What the fuck? Yeah.
Eldar [01:23:37]:
You know what I'm saying? You face it face to face that everything you thought was it is meaningless.
Phillip [01:23:43]:
But now you're in this, and I'm saying, now you're in this, and now you're saying this with, okay, that thing, whatever that was, you faced it, and you realize, like, oh, shit, this was nothing. I understand where my pain comes from. It's meaningless now. I'm kind of in this abyss or like, this kind of playing field where I know this is wrong and I faced it. But now, on the other side, I don't have a vision or I don't see what the next step is.
Eldar [01:24:09]:
You do. The vision starts already by understanding that the other stuff was wrong. And now you're getting glimpses of what is actually right. And all the stuff that you've neglected, all the opportunities that you've missed on, they start coming back to you.
Eldar [01:24:23]:
They're like, oh, shit.
Eldar [01:24:25]:
I didn't spend enough time with my family. Oh, shit. I could have helped these people. I didn't help them. Oh, shit.
Eldar [01:24:32]:
You start going back and trying to.
Eldar [01:24:34]:
Fix all the errors and all the problems and all the mistakes that you've done.
Phillip [01:24:37]:
But with current examples, correct? With current examples, yes. Not trying to fix the past.
Eldar [01:24:42]:
Right.
Eldar [01:24:43]:
Well, obviously, with current examples, whatever you can, wherever you can.
Phillip [01:24:47]:
Like, a work example would be like, I would try to contact current clients and then try to listen and do it with this type of process in this example.
Eldar [01:24:53]:
Okay, exactly right. But you go back and you're trying to amend things and trying to present your new self to the stuff that you fucked up on, and that's your almost, like, salvation.
Phillip [01:25:07]:
So the new thing, the new way of being, is taking your new sense of self, your new mindset and psychology, and saying, I have a genuine interest in wanting to then talk to these people, service these people. And now every opportunity, every time I have a phone call, it's an opportunity to take that new self and reaffirm and set a new foundation myself. That should be the example with Mike. That's the vision, right?
Eldar [01:25:28]:
That's right.
Eldar [01:25:29]:
Okay.
Eldar [01:25:29]:
Goes back to his family and tries.
Eldar [01:25:31]:
To present a new self and a new self every single time. You understand?
Phillip [01:25:36]:
So the example that we were using was people who are attached to say, if you're in sales, the result, making money, let's say, if you want to be where Tommy was talking about being a writer, being famous. So attaching yourself so heavy to the result that it prevents you from then focusing on the process, which would, ironically enough, enable you to then be famous, be rich, and do all those things. So is essentially being so arrogant and being ego preventing you from enjoying the process and I guess living in this state of attachment. So we were saying that, yes, for my example, I was saying yes for me for sales, which if I'm attaching myself to this end goal, I'm preventing myself from listening to the actual customer and just putting myself first. And then in states where I could be listening, I'm kind of like trying to overstep them and just kind of get what I want. So it's preventing me from being happy. It's then maybe allowing me to get the sale, maybe allowing me to get my goal of making money, but I'm bypassing the process and I'm unhappy as.
Eldar [01:26:50]:
A result of it.
Phillip [01:26:51]:
So we're saying that, I guess, can you do both at the same time? Can you be somebody who's going to focus on the process, be humble, and then also be attached to the end goal? And we're saying no. So I guess we want to understand what your idea of the process is in your day to day work, whether it be a relationship work, whatever it may be, and then your level of attachment to whatever your end goal is.
Eldar [01:27:14]:
If you do have one.
Eldar [01:27:15]:
Oh, that's well fucked.
Mike [01:27:17]:
Not bad, Phil.
Eldar [01:27:18]:
What do you think, Dre?
Eldar [01:27:20]:
We've been added for about, we've been wrestling with this topic for about an hour and 40 minutes now.
Mike [01:27:25]:
We needed a different mentally person to kind of give us.
Eldar [01:27:30]:
For sure, because you definitely have a different perspective coming from the field that you're coming from.
Eldar [01:27:35]:
Yeah.
Phillip [01:27:35]:
You're a more professional field, right. You're a doctor, correct?
Eldar [01:27:38]:
Yes.
Phillip [01:27:39]:
So you have a different approach than somebody who would be an artist, I would think. Right.
Eldar [01:27:45]:
You went through the whole process. You've accomplished something.
Eldar [01:27:50]:
You have a title, became a radiologist. Right.
Eldar [01:27:53]:
What do you think about this topic of the fact that those people who don't have the ability to actually focus on the process. The reason why they can't focus on the process, because there's a level of.
Eldar [01:28:03]:
Arrogance there that's holding them back from.
Andrey [01:28:06]:
Actually, I understand the premise in the question.
Eldar [01:28:09]:
Yeah. Okay.
Andrey [01:28:12]:
I think in radiology, it's a little bit of an unfair, it's nothing else. Like any medical field, which sound.
Eldar [01:28:22]:
Give me, what's the difference?
Andrey [01:28:24]:
Okay, so first of all, it would be in many respects. So one is your clients. They're not necessarily the patients, they're other doctors, because really they're seeing the patient and they're ordering the imaging study. The doctor is ordering, they're ordering for us. Our techs do the study and we're going to be interpreting it.
Eldar [01:28:43]:
Got it.
Andrey [01:28:44]:
So there's a problem with the patient and that they think imaging will help with either diagnosis or therapy or something like that.
Eldar [01:28:50]:
Got it.
Andrey [01:28:52]:
But in terms of what does the radiologist do, it's even more of an art than a science. So it's pretty easy to get lost.
Eldar [01:29:01]:
In it and not really worry about the outcome as much because there's so.
Phillip [01:29:08]:
Much attention to detail, is what you're saying in the process, where if you didn't focus on this, you'd be lost in the sauce.
Andrey [01:29:14]:
Pretty much, yes, there's attention to detail, but I'll give you an example. Okay, so you're using physics, right? You're using x ray beams, ultrasound, to arrive at an image. But in that image, you can actually see findings that then it's up to you to say, well, this is abnormal. How much emphasis or how, because you're creating a literature report for the other doctors. So how much emphasis am I going to place on this? Also, two findings can look exactly the same in two different patients, but based on whatever else is going on in their body, their history, you can say, well, maybe this actually looks kind of bad, but I'm going to downplay it, or, this looks almost normal, and I'm going to recommend other studies, or I'm going to even call the doctor and say, hey, I think this needs something more. So that's part of the reason why I like it.
Eldar [01:30:07]:
It's very academic.
Andrey [01:30:10]:
So you have to know all the terms of all the specialties to be able to relay the information.
Phillip [01:30:14]:
All right, so I'm going to stop you there. So those two decisions, to me, spark something where if you did have an attachment to some end goal, where if you wanted to be the best radiologist or whatever it may be, you can then be saying, I could be making certain decisions, and you can maybe be overlooking certain things in the process as a result of then wanting to be a certain thing, whether it be money or being a certain radiologist or having a certain type of status. So it seems like you're very into the process where you're not talking about the end goal, but somebody who maybe has the opposite approach and they're saying, hey, I want to be the best radiologist. If I can bypass this good result and say it's a bad one so I can get more tests. More tests is resulting in more money, more insurance. I get more than that. Can be somebody who's pushing the process aside and is coming as a result of arrogance versus process.
Eldar [01:31:04]:
Right? Yeah, it could.
Phillip [01:31:07]:
I'm just saying giving like an example.
Eldar [01:31:09]:
Given like a devil's advocate thing into his particular field.
Eldar [01:31:12]:
Exactly.
Eldar [01:31:12]:
If that's actually the case, but he.
Eldar [01:31:14]:
Has to speak on it. Yeah.
Phillip [01:31:16]:
So that would be somebody maybe, who doesn't value the process.
Eldar [01:31:19]:
Exactly.
Andrey [01:31:19]:
And like you said, ethics are a huge thing in medicine, but especially radiology, because it's very easy, especially in private practice in the US.
Eldar [01:31:27]:
I think she loves.
Eldar [01:31:38]:
You.
Eldar [01:31:39]:
Don't want to have like a serious relationship yet, not with her in general. Right. That word kind of scared you real quick.
Mike [01:31:47]:
She's single.
Eldar [01:31:48]:
Listen, cheers to that.
Katherine [01:31:49]:
She's looking for mates.
Eldar [01:31:50]:
Maybe one day.
Andrey [01:31:55]:
No, there's tons of situations every day where you see a finding and you're making a statistical probability of, well, how likely is this to be?
Eldar [01:32:05]:
For example, loves you, bro.
Andrey [01:32:06]:
There's comparison studies, right? Yeah, there's comparison studies and you might not check all of them because you don't have time. Yeah, depends on your field. So if you're working in private practice or teleradiology, the more you read, the more money you make. So you might say, well, you can, I don't know everything. There's always a judgment call where, based on this, I'm not going to look back five years ago how this CT looked or this MRI looked, but you can always take more time to go into the patient record. But like you said, the ethical issue is ego and. Well, I know, because if we've seen tens of thousands of studies, I know what this is, but you can never know. There's always like a 6% anomaly, 6% experienced radiologist.
Phillip [01:32:46]:
Yeah, you can lean on that. As somebody who's not ethical or arrogant, you can lean on that and you can say, hey, that there is a 6% chance. Now the other person is saying, there's a 94% chance. Hey, listen, we don't want to have to make you go jump through hoops and go order these extra tests, because I know this. But if you're then saying there's a 6% chance that you can be coming from two different angles, one can be, hey, I'm an overly cautious guy. I want to go for 100%.
Eldar [01:33:12]:
When do you go? When do you not?
Phillip [01:33:13]:
So when do you go? When do you not? And then the other guy who to me, is attached to the status, and the other thing would just be like, hey, I'm coming from a place of, we're definitely getting that test 100%. Because if I get more tests, then I become this, and then I have more insurance, I have more money, and then more people think that maybe I can brand myself as a guy who's overly cautious and I can maybe even put this guy to bed and I can get better reviews. This is just how I'm talking out loud. Maybe it's not how the practice goes, but that's where my head goes in terms of somebody, again, on topic, who's attached to the end goal, coming from a place of arrogance, or somebody who's then doing all their due diligence and focus so much on the process that the end goal is nonsense. It's nonexistent.
Eldar [01:33:57]:
Yeah.
Andrey [01:33:58]:
And also, I battle with this is you forget that there's a patient on the other side of that image.
Eldar [01:34:04]:
Sure.
Eldar [01:34:04]:
That's what I'm saying.
Andrey [01:34:05]:
Then you wonder, and you can't always be like, well, if this was my dad or my family member, what would I do? I try to think that as much as possible, but some of you just trying to grind through the list.
Eldar [01:34:15]:
There you go.
Eldar [01:34:16]:
Yeah.
Andrey [01:34:22]:
That's an ethical maybe. It's hard to relate in that sense, but enjoying the process in radiology, it's pretty cool because there's a visual image component where somebody. Some people have a better eye for certain findings. Some person can look at an image for ten minutes. They will not see the finding. They will keep missing it. And some people, they can read faster, and they will see that finding. But then the art is explaining to the clinician, to the patient, how likely is this to be significant and how can you help the person? Like you said, do they need another test? Do we upplay this and say, hey, and like you said, what is significant? If the person's 85 years old, they have a lung nodule or something in the prostate that probably will not kill them.
Andrey [01:35:13]:
So you have a lot of power. I think in most fields, you have.
Eldar [01:35:16]:
A lot of power.
Andrey [01:35:17]:
And even as a resident as a trainee. There's surgeons that are older surgeons coming to your zare, and they're going to say, do I need to take this patient to the operating room? And they will listen to you as a 27 year old resident, because many of them, they look at their studies, but they will take what you're saying into account. In sales, like you said, there's more of a defined end goal. There's a number either getting the client or selling this much.
Eldar [01:35:45]:
Sure.
Andrey [01:35:46]:
I think it's harder for you than in a field like, in a field like us. You're right. There is that motivation of more studies.
Eldar [01:35:53]:
Right.
Andrey [01:35:53]:
I will earn more money, but the.
Eldar [01:35:56]:
Ethical component is a big one. Huge. Yeah. Because the doctors are what.
Eldar [01:36:00]:
Right.
Eldar [01:36:01]:
What are they swearing for?
Eldar [01:36:02]:
Right.
Eldar [01:36:02]:
They're swearing into.
Phillip [01:36:04]:
They're talking about lives on the line.
Eldar [01:36:06]:
Yeah.
Phillip [01:36:06]:
We're talking about, like, hey, the lifeblood of your business, which is still, like, putting food on the table.
Eldar [01:36:11]:
Not necessarily if you're working with businesses. Right, too.
Phillip [01:36:14]:
But, yeah.
Eldar [01:36:14]:
You're not selling a make or break product. No. You in marketing. So you trying to make them make money. Right.
Phillip [01:36:21]:
But if they don't utilize us, their grandma's not going to die.
Eldar [01:36:24]:
Yeah, that's right. It's true. He's right about that.
Eldar [01:36:29]:
You might have more decision making, and.
Eldar [01:36:31]:
It'S harder for you because he has more power. However, what we're trying to do here, Dre, nonetheless, is still bring out probably an ethical situation here, too, because the crime is being committed against yourself.
Eldar [01:36:50]:
Right.
Eldar [01:36:52]:
If you're going out there in the phone, right. And you're bullying clients and ham hogging them into sales, right. Like, I don't know, give an example of going to a car dealership. Everybody knows, right, that you go to a car dealership, give a fuck about you.
Eldar [01:37:04]:
Right.
Eldar [01:37:05]:
All they want to do is just push down. Push, push cars. Push cars, push cars. They'll jack up the price on you. They don't care. They don't care whether or not you'll win or get a good deal. There's no morals or ethics there.
Eldar [01:37:16]:
Right.
Eldar [01:37:17]:
But what kind of people are they?
Eldar [01:37:19]:
Right.
Eldar [01:37:19]:
We all know that we call them sharks.
Eldar [01:37:22]:
Right. They're not necessarily good people. Right. Are they happy people?
Eldar [01:37:27]:
Have we met happy car salesmen? Maybe one.
Eldar [01:37:30]:
Right, JJ?
Mike [01:37:33]:
Yeah.
Eldar [01:37:34]:
You know what I'm saying? But mostly it's like, who are these people that I just want to take and not really give, right. Because they're so self centered around, I just got to get mine. My life's on the line. My quota is on the line. I need to get my commission.
Eldar [01:37:52]:
Right. So they're not talking about real ethics there.
Andrey [01:37:57]:
So what Philip was saying, ironically, if you're in the moment and you're not worried about the outcome, you actually build a better rapport. You listen to them more, and then you're more likely to get.
Phillip [01:38:07]:
And you're more likely to get to sale.
Eldar [01:38:08]:
That's right.
Phillip [01:38:09]:
Without thinking about the sale as your end goal. It is a paradox.
Eldar [01:38:13]:
It is a paradox.
Eldar [01:38:14]:
Yeah.
Eldar [01:38:14]:
100% paradox.
Phillip [01:38:16]:
But it's a complete mind shift.
Eldar [01:38:18]:
Yes.
Phillip [01:38:18]:
And it's a complete change of communication and the way of your day to day approach.
Eldar [01:38:22]:
100%.
Phillip [01:38:23]:
So you have to literally become a different person.
Eldar [01:38:26]:
That's right.
Eldar [01:38:28]:
Because, as he said, hey, doctors already are subjected to a very strict ethical standard.
Eldar [01:38:34]:
Right.
Eldar [01:38:35]:
Moral obligation to do the right thing. Because, yeah, sure, it's an image and there's a number, but at the end of that image and that number is a client is an actual human being that, depending on what you recommend, could potentially kill him.
Eldar [01:38:50]:
Right.
Eldar [01:38:52]:
Make him more sick.
Phillip [01:38:54]:
I think of, I don't know, like, a chef also comes to mind.
Eldar [01:38:58]:
Right?
Phillip [01:38:58]:
Like, somebody who goes to school, wants to be, like, a chef and is saying, I want to cook with the best ingredients, and I want to give to the best client, and I want to give them the best experience. And then you have a guy, like, I was reading about, like, panda Express, right? They're giving, like, a shitty ass product at mass. This guy's making, like, a shit ton of money.
Eldar [01:39:17]:
That's right.
Phillip [01:39:17]:
And I'm just saying that type of mindset is different where, yeah, maybe he could be doing a good thing, but overall, I think there's, like, a conundrum in you if you have this type of moral ethical dilemma and you're saying, I want to deliver a great product, or I can deliver a shitty product. I can make a lot of money.
Eldar [01:39:35]:
That panda express guy or whatever, right? I don't know who that is. The owner of it, right. He might have set that goal that we talked about. He wants to be a gazillionaire.
Eldar [01:39:44]:
Right?
Eldar [01:39:44]:
So he's poor off up until that, he becomes a gazillionaire. Right? So he's going to do and cut shortcuts and do whatever unethical shit that he needs to do in order to get there. He's not going to be thinking about the mom and pop experience, where it's, each ingredient is properly sourced and cared for and properly fried and all this other stuff.
Phillip [01:40:03]:
Yeah.
Andrey [01:40:04]:
Do you think there are any ethical billionaires self made, or do you think you have to step on some toes and do a lot of.
Eldar [01:40:11]:
Well, you know what? The more I watch and listen to Elon Musk, the more I see know he's getting it right in comparison to others. I'm not sure. Obviously, I would have to really zoom in on it, but I like what he think. When it comes to safety.
Andrey [01:40:29]:
You think it's possible, just not the most common, correct?
Eldar [01:40:32]:
No, absolutely not common. Absolutely not common. But I think Elon Musk is setting that standard. Well, at least for me, the only.
Phillip [01:40:39]:
One that I can speak on. And I did a good amount of research where, when my mind was kind of, like, out there, I did a deep dive on Steve Jobs, and I really enjoyed understanding who he was and where he came from. And for me, Steve Jobs was really cool because he was adopted, and he came from broken home. Somebody adopted him, and he started this company out of nowhere, and he didn't really have any technical ability. And he was so arrogant where he believed that he can create something that would change the world. And he understood that there were computers at the time, but they weren't being used for personal use. He had such a big ego where he knew that he had the vision in order to take this thing and then mass produce it, but he needed somebody to help him, so he got this guy, Steve Wozniak, who is more like the engineer guy. So, long story short, this guy, to me, based his whole life off of arrogance and everybody that he came across.
Phillip [01:41:34]:
He came across better than he kind of, like, shit on them. A lot of people talked down on him, but overall, he got the job done and he got to where I guess he wanted to get. But I guess if you asked him right now, honestly, I bet you he would say he didn't enjoy the whole process. That's my assessment. I like a guy like that where I don't think that he did. No, it's an example of a billionaire that didn't do it.
Eldar [01:42:05]:
Right.
Phillip [01:42:05]:
That's not happening. Because you were giving Elon Musk where.
Eldar [01:42:08]:
You said, yeah, I think he actually enjoys the process. I think he's into it. He's fucking like he's a brainiac. He loves it. And because he's so good at it, I think it just happens to be that he's a billionaire, not because he wanted to be a billionaire, because it's inevitable for him to be a billionaire, because of the way he handles himself and the way he does the things that he does.
Phillip [01:42:26]:
Yeah, I just think, I guess when you think about it, unless he's fucking.
Eldar [01:42:30]:
Making all the shit up and he's hiding behind want to save humanity and make the whole world a sustainable world, right, which is very hard to imagine.
Phillip [01:42:39]:
See, when I look at it from a stock perspective and a company perspective.
Eldar [01:42:43]:
And just like you don't give a fuck about stock price or stocks at.
Phillip [01:42:46]:
All, but when you look at it from the magnitude of how many people he has under him and what he does, I think at some level you have to have some kind of sense of arrogance and ego where if you were telling me right now that he is dead set on I want to create life on Mars, and as a result of having PayPal, selling PayPal, doing Tesla, and eventually maybe selling Tesla, then get people to live somewhere else, if that's your genuine interest and that's going to be your legacy and that's overall what your mission is, then I would buy into that and say, like, hey, maybe this guy was just meant to be a billionaire. But I think just in terms of how you live your life as a billionaire and how many people you affect and influence, I think there has to be some sort of level of arrogance and ego in order to allow you to then be in that position to oversee everybody else, I think maybe.
Eldar [01:43:42]:
No, you know what, it's different because.
Andrey [01:43:44]:
They'Re two different things.
Eldar [01:43:45]:
I think actually, if you spoke to him, if you sat him down and spoke to him, I think he has really good reasons as to why he does what he.
Phillip [01:43:52]:
No, no, that's what I'm saying.
Eldar [01:43:54]:
So it's not an arrogance or control thing where it's going to be my way or the highway. No, he's going to sit you down. He's going to listen to your argument as to why you shouldn't go on to Mars. He's going to give you all the reasons as to why and you won't be able to jump over his argument. So I think he's very that knowledgeable and truth based and he follows that.
Andrey [01:44:12]:
To the t. The arrogance and ego part is believing something that has this, no one would think it's possible or has a small probability. The arrogance is thinking, yeah, I can do that. I can do that. I can change the world.
Eldar [01:44:26]:
That I think you need to, baby.
Andrey [01:44:29]:
Become a billionaire, which I think is separate from do you need to step on a lot of toes? Like we know, like if you talk to people that know Arnold Schwarzenegger, they said, and even Warren Buffett, they said they stepped on a lot of toes to get where they are, which means screw people over, not be the most ethical person. You could be a very ethical person and have a huge ego like a surgeon. An ego is like, I can fix this person. I can save a life. Just to say that it's an ego.
Eldar [01:44:58]:
But you can.
Eldar [01:44:59]:
No, but you can be an ego, though.
Eldar [01:45:00]:
I don't understand if health is actually.
Andrey [01:45:02]:
The case, to believe and to think that you can do something difficult.
Phillip [01:45:08]:
Arrogance.
Andrey [01:45:08]:
I don't know. It depends.
Eldar [01:45:10]:
No, because if that's the fact, why is that an ego? Whereas the surgeon says, okay, cool, I know this problem. I've done it a thousand times. My success rate is 100%.
Katherine [01:45:19]:
Maybe he's trying to get at that. There's a lot of power trippers out there because they have so much power.
Eldar [01:45:24]:
No, sure. No, I think that it's hard not to. No, I think we probably have to have a discussion about the difference between confidence and arrogance. You know what I mean? Based on what he said. I just hear confidence in an individual who says, look, you don't know what you're talking about. I got this. I got a 100% track record here that I know how to fix this guy up. You know what I mean? I've done this.
Eldar [01:45:47]:
I know this 100%, and he does.
Eldar [01:45:49]:
It every single time. Right.
Eldar [01:45:51]:
I think that's confidence. That's not ego.
Andrey [01:45:53]:
I like that topic, difference between confidence and arrogance, because I never thought about that. That's a good topic, for sure.
Eldar [01:45:59]:
But I think those are two different things. Yeah.
Phillip [01:46:01]:
So what I was saying was, with Elon, if he's dead set on saying that my end goal is going to Mars and I want a better humanity, I think you can be coming from a good place.
Tommy [01:46:12]:
I just think when you look at.
Phillip [01:46:13]:
It from a number standpoint and the influence and all the stuff that he basically has to do in order to get to that point, I just think it would be really hard to then say you're not attached to some end goal, and then you can just be in the process and not having any arrogance at all. I just would find that hard to believe where even if you do have a pure end goal, to be detached from that and then to just kind of be a guy that's so good at the process. I've seen him in interviews.
Eldar [01:46:40]:
I think it's impossible not to. That's the thing I think that we spoke about earlier, that you cannot focus on the fact that you want to be a millionaire. In order to get there, you actually have to focus on becoming a millionaire. And not talk about being a millionaire. So I think that his process and his thinking and his understanding has to align with his actual. So he's too busy fucking figuring this thing out in order and not to focus on being arrogant about I'm going to get to Mars. He doesn't think about I'm going to get to Mars. No, he's thinking about how do I get to.
Eldar [01:47:14]:
So he's, and that's a humbling experience.
Phillip [01:47:16]:
So let's say we see him in an interview, and then he's talking about what I was asking about before, which is, like, when you have that thing, which is, let's say in his example be, let's go to Mars. So he's in an interview and he's saying, I'm going to go to Mars. On his day to day. He's not saying he's going to Mars. So he's not attached to going to Mars.
Eldar [01:47:32]:
No.
Phillip [01:47:32]:
He's literally so analytical, and he's calculating how to get there, how to land.
Eldar [01:47:36]:
On Mars, for example. Right. And all the intricacies that goes behind actually landing on Mars. I don't think he's thinking about, okay. I think he's talking about the processes already. The processes already. A long time ago, he gave himself a reason as to why he wants to get to Mars.
Eldar [01:47:51]:
Right?
Eldar [01:47:52]:
He calculated like, okay, cool. Based on the way the earth is, based on the ignorance of all the individuals and all the fossil fuels that we're burning and everything else, it sounds like Earth is not going to be able to take it anymore, guys. So we need to expand life and go somewhere else. I think he already bought in into that concept and understood that for himself. And now he's like, okay, how do we do it? And now he's stuck on that.
Phillip [01:48:13]:
So, yeah, I guess that was my question I was asking before. It's how to have such a big grandiose idea, a dream, whatever it may be, and then detach yourself from that thing and then enable yourself, then go day to day. And then your example, I think, was having a dollar and then saying, instead of going to a million, how do I get to two?
Eldar [01:48:31]:
That's right.
Phillip [01:48:32]:
And it's adapting that genuine curiosity for how to actually get this thing to start going.
Eldar [01:48:37]:
Right.
Eldar [01:48:38]:
Because even to $2, right, it sounds like it's insignificant because your grandiose idea is a million dollars.
Eldar [01:48:44]:
Right.
Eldar [01:48:44]:
But from one to two, it's 100% increase. That's an achievement.
Eldar [01:48:48]:
Right.
Eldar [01:48:48]:
But nobody thinks about that.
Phillip [01:48:49]:
So he's obsessed with the process.
Eldar [01:48:51]:
Correct. You believe I think so.
Eldar [01:48:52]:
Okay.
Eldar [01:48:52]:
I think so. I think he's really a brainiac. Okay. You know what I mean? And I think that's what allows him to be humble, like I said. And every time I hear him speak, right. He doesn't come across like he knows at all. He actually says, hey, we don't know. And this is a very difficult process, guys, but we want to figure it out.
Phillip [01:49:08]:
So in this example, I would say then, based off of what I know, off of Steve Jobs, I would say that he was also obsessed with the process. Based off of what he actually got done and what he actually.
Eldar [01:49:19]:
Possibly, possibly.
Eldar [01:49:21]:
But I also heard that Steve Jobs.
Eldar [01:49:22]:
Had a lot of regrets on his.
Phillip [01:49:24]:
Deathbed, and I think they were how he treated other people.
Eldar [01:49:28]:
Correct. Right.
Eldar [01:49:30]:
How did he get there?
Eldar [01:49:31]:
Right.
Phillip [01:49:33]:
But I hear similar things. Like, now I don't know if they're disgruntled employees at Twitter or whoever. He got fired. And now you can have a different approach on. Okay, he took Twitter.
Eldar [01:49:42]:
Right.
Phillip [01:49:42]:
And he said, we don't need 90% of the employees. We only need ten. He's able to succeed.
Eldar [01:49:49]:
Yeah. The thing is, I think he has really good reasons as to why he says what he says.
Eldar [01:49:53]:
Yeah.
Phillip [01:49:53]:
So what I'm saying is that it's not behind.
Eldar [01:49:55]:
Like, I'm just going to fucking fire everybody and fuck your. No, I think he sees and understands what and how he can utilize the 10% of the workforce in order to get to the same place of where 100 of them were doing.
Eldar [01:50:07]:
Yeah.
Phillip [01:50:07]:
So I'm not saying that that's a bad thing, but as a result of that, you're going to have disgruntled employees come out and disgruntle employee saying bad things.
Eldar [01:50:14]:
Yeah, but that's irrelevant.
Mike [01:50:16]:
I don't think you get behind it.
Eldar [01:50:17]:
Yeah.
Mike [01:50:18]:
You don't know if 90% of people are just not working lolly gagging.
Phillip [01:50:22]:
But what I'm saying Steve Jobs is a lot of the flak that he got was the interactions that he would have with business people or with other people that he worked with, that he was arrogant, but it got him to that next level. So what I'm saying is that was he so obsessed with the process that he would just maybe bypass, maybe make menial connections and conversations that maybe somebody would value as important where he would be. Like, maybe I'm able to see through you right away and that I don't need you and that you can look at me as arrogant, but maybe I'm so attached to the process that I don't need you.
Eldar [01:50:54]:
I think those individuals probably know the difference between when people are just fucking whining and complaining about stuff versus focusing on what they should be doing.
Eldar [01:51:02]:
Yeah.
Eldar [01:51:02]:
And I think they know how to distinguish the two really fast and they have no time for anything else.
Phillip [01:51:07]:
So I think these are hyper, hyper extreme examples of people who are maybe riding the border of arrogant but genius in the process.
Eldar [01:51:16]:
Right.
Phillip [01:51:16]:
Like, would this be examples of this?
Eldar [01:51:19]:
I think you have to be very careful, understand, actually what's arrogant and what's not. I think the perception might look like it's arrogant to very specific individuals.
Eldar [01:51:26]:
Yeah. You know what I'm saying?
Eldar [01:51:28]:
Because a genius might be at work on the other side, but comes across as an arrogant individual. You know what I'm saying?
Eldar [01:51:35]:
To you?
Eldar [01:51:35]:
Because you actually are not on the same frequency and understanding of what's actually happening in his brain and why he's doing what he's doing. He solved ten steps ahead of you before you even got to the first one.
Eldar [01:51:46]:
Yeah.
Eldar [01:51:48]:
You know what I mean?
Eldar [01:51:49]:
What do you call that?
Phillip [01:51:50]:
Yeah, I think that's really hard to make a judgment call unless you are actually with somebody on a day to day basis.
Eldar [01:51:57]:
Right. You have to understand that if there's a malicious intent.
Eldar [01:52:01]:
Yeah.
Eldar [01:52:01]:
Okay. If the individual is coming across to come across as boasting, as arrogant as like, yo, I know more shit than you, then yes. But I really don't think that these.
Eldar [01:52:10]:
Individuals are probably in that realm. For what?
Eldar [01:52:14]:
For what? They have it all.
Eldar [01:52:17]:
For what?
Eldar [01:52:18]:
They just really don't have no time.
Phillip [01:52:20]:
Well, the argument with most of these people is a power. So you are having a power over others. In most examples in the hedge fund space, financial space, it's more of a power trip.
Eldar [01:52:30]:
Yeah.
Eldar [01:52:30]:
But I think you'd see a lot of problems and internal issues if the display of power actually came out the way it usually should come out.
Eldar [01:52:40]:
Right.
Eldar [01:52:40]:
Power. If you want to have power over.
Eldar [01:52:42]:
People, your reputation should be like, you're a real asshole. You're a real asshole. You're really hard to work with, you.
Eldar [01:52:50]:
Know what I'm saying?
Eldar [01:52:51]:
If it's a power thing.
Phillip [01:52:52]:
Yeah, I don't know his story.
Eldar [01:52:54]:
I think these people actually got stuck on the passion that they have and the process that they do have.
Eldar [01:53:01]:
They got stuck, and anything that slows.
Eldar [01:53:04]:
Them down, they're hypersensitive, like you said, to any slowdowns. And if you're not lining up with what their thing is, then you go somewhere else.
Phillip [01:53:16]:
Yeah, I don't know. I don't know enough about Elon's but I guess with, again, my example with Steve Jobs, I guess I'm torn in understanding that, okay, I'm understanding other people's opinions of him, whether they were work people of him maybe stealing ideas, taking them for his own, and then marketing them. But then I'm looking at that as like, if I'm on his team or I'm in his mindset and I know what is right, maybe I'm coming across an idea I'm utilizing as my own, inspiring it to maybe make a bigger, better idea for myself and my company. Is that selfish? Is that arrogant?
Mike [01:53:49]:
Whatever it may be, it's hard to know that.
Phillip [01:53:51]:
Again, that's what.
Mike [01:53:52]:
Like, let's say Steve Jobs hiding behind the image of he wants to unite people. Sounds like a good cause. But how can you unite people but also sacrifice other people while stepping over toes being unethical? It doesn't work together. If you want to unite people, which is a good cause, you have to do it in a good method.
Phillip [01:54:08]:
But that's what I'm asking about.
Eldar [01:54:09]:
Right?
Phillip [01:54:10]:
I'm asking about the same thing with, say, twitter. If you're going to rebrand it, you're going to do all this stuff, you're going to, a lot of people upset. You're going to get rid of a lot of people, you're going to put a big brand on San Francisco, and you're going to make a whole big to do. So there is a level a lot of.
Mike [01:54:24]:
It's hard to call because he's a big troll.
Phillip [01:54:27]:
Right? But what I'm saying, you might think.
Mike [01:54:29]:
He'S doing something to be an asshole, but he's doing it to piss people off.
Phillip [01:54:32]:
So I'm only getting. You can only look at it as, like a. As an observer, unless you're working with him on a day to day basis. The way that I observe it, I see the stock and then I see the business, and then I see him as an individual in interviews, and I can only put two and two together. So if you are a troll and then you are somebody who's like, I.
Eldar [01:54:50]:
Don'T think Elon Musk is representative of stock. Yeah.
Mike [01:54:53]:
Also, Elon Musk, he bet on himself. He has no stock. He only has options, tranches. I think that if he reaches certain success in the company, only then. So how do you interpret that? He was confident that he's going to get his goal? Is that ego? Is that arrogance? Is that confidence?
Eldar [01:55:12]:
Which one is that common sense?
Phillip [01:55:14]:
But again, I think it's also understanding, again, when he's going to that Mars goal. And if he's saying that we have a problem here on Earth, and I want to be the guy to do this, and I know how that all the companies that I create.
Mike [01:55:29]:
No, the thing is, he didn't know how. I just actually, like a week ago, watched the SpaceX documentary.
Eldar [01:55:34]:
I don't know if you guys have seen it.
Mike [01:55:35]:
No, not yet.
Eldar [01:55:36]:
No.
Mike [01:55:37]:
It's very interesting. The problem with these rockets that goes to the space station and to all this stuff, they're very one time use. They're extremely expensive.
Eldar [01:55:49]:
Yes.
Eldar [01:55:50]:
And his thing reusable.
Mike [01:55:51]:
He wanted to use them. And he had multiple attempts at breaking through. Like, he failed multiple times. He investing his own money to get this contract from NASA, and he's constantly investing in money. He's trying to get the show off the ground. So he was actually trying to do it for a good cause that he believes in, and he's investing his time, his money, without any kind of guarantee.
Eldar [01:56:18]:
That it's going to be approved.
Eldar [01:56:21]:
Sleeping on the floor, apparently.
Mike [01:56:22]:
Yeah.
Phillip [01:56:23]:
So what I'm saying is that this guy can be somebody who's hyper, I guess, fixated on the process, where it.
Mike [01:56:35]:
Seems that way, that he's definitely about the process, because his thing about the prince principles, first theory.
Eldar [01:56:41]:
Yeah, that one.
Mike [01:56:42]:
Do you know this, how he did it, this rocket stuff is he broke down, like the thing from the bottom.
Eldar [01:56:50]:
Up of what it is to do.
Mike [01:56:52]:
Whatever they're doing, building the rocket ship, first principles theories, you get to the bottom, bottom, bottom, base level understanding of that specific subject. It's hard for me to explain it. I'm not a fucking scientist. But he's saying, go to the core and question every single thing that's already assumed about this process. Oh, rocket is going to be one time.
Eldar [01:57:11]:
Why?
Mike [01:57:12]:
Because this says so. But why does this say so? Go underneath that. Where is this? Keep challenging every single truth. So you get to the core where you cannot challenge anymore. Like you're saying you are human.
Phillip [01:57:23]:
So saying Elon would be a good.
Eldar [01:57:24]:
Philosophy guess based off of his way.
Phillip [01:57:28]:
Of thinking, of going and examining.
Mike [01:57:30]:
Yeah. That theory is, I think, from a different philosopher.
Eldar [01:57:34]:
I think it's from.
Eldar [01:57:35]:
Yeah, yeah.
Mike [01:57:36]:
First principle theory.
Eldar [01:57:37]:
Yeah, I think it's in there. Yeah.
Eldar [01:57:40]:
You have to keep questioning.
Eldar [01:57:41]:
Yeah.
Phillip [01:57:41]:
So also you have to look at, too, like, how the media perceives these type of people from the perceived. Now, where we as the individual, we have Twitter, we have TikTok, and we have more of a one on one, individual to individual basis, meaning we're not just subjected to CNBC, NBC, and all these other news networks giving us these examples. So when I read the biography, which I think Walter Isaacson did this biography on Steve Jobs, he was following Steve Jobs around and giving a lot of excerpts on what he did on a day to day. Now, I liked it because I thought that he was somebody who was really passionate guy and did like day to day, but he was perceived as, like an arrogant prick overall, mostly by the media. Maybe some in this book.
Eldar [01:58:27]:
I don't.
Mike [01:58:27]:
Yeah, exactly. Steve Jobs is a prick for sure.
Phillip [01:58:30]:
And what I would say with Elon Musk, I think that if he was also in this era where Steve Jobs was, I think that he would have the same level of scrutiny also.
Mike [01:58:39]:
But, yeah, I think anybody even like Steve Jobs, Elon Musk, every single person is going to people who fuck with him and people don't.
Eldar [01:58:46]:
Right.
Mike [01:58:47]:
But the truth is, how do you actually yourself know who this person is?
Eldar [01:58:51]:
No, I think that just generally speaking, I think that individuals at that level have to be misunderstood.
Eldar [01:58:59]:
Yeah.
Eldar [01:59:00]:
And the reason why they have to.
Eldar [01:59:01]:
Be understood is because of ego. Okay.
Phillip [01:59:04]:
Because, like, my ego? Not his.
Eldar [01:59:06]:
Not his. No, your ego.
Phillip [01:59:08]:
My interpretation. What he's doing.
Eldar [01:59:10]:
Correct. Because the stuff that he's doing doesn't make sense. That automatically is an attack on your understanding of how the world works and what it ought to be, because he's doing shit that's unexplainable to you. You can't understand it. Therefore you have to fight it. Your ego will fight it, especially if.
Mike [01:59:27]:
You'Re fighting it and you're fighting with your right. You know how you're going to react? Like, if you say, elon Musk is like, no, he's doing crazy shit and you're betting against the stock, you losing money, how are you going to say, actually, you know what? I lost a hundred million dollars. But he's right and he's succeeding. Good luck with know.
Eldar [01:59:43]:
Oh, no.
Phillip [01:59:43]:
I mean, like, Apple and Tesla are great stocks. No, I mean, I believe in them from a stock perspective, from this conversation.
Mike [01:59:52]:
But I'm saying the people who talk bad about him, a lot of outspoken people, they're against him because they are suffering losses, because he's succeeding. He's doing people wrong.
Eldar [02:00:04]:
Yeah.
Phillip [02:00:05]:
From their initial assessment, which was like, he's not a good guy and he's coming from a bad place. So this is, again, to me, like media understanding of who he is and then truly understanding who he is from a person to person on process basis, is what we're talking about.
Eldar [02:00:23]:
Yeah.
Mike [02:00:23]:
I don't know him personally, but the stuff that I saw. He has good reasons why he's doing what he's doing.
Phillip [02:00:29]:
I don't know enough about him or his interview.
Mike [02:00:31]:
I'm sure he has. I don't think he's doing it just.
Eldar [02:00:33]:
To be an arrogant prick.
Mike [02:00:35]:
Not a good digital character. You know what I'm saying?
Eldar [02:00:37]:
Soup. I'm not a soup doctor like you.
Eldar [02:00:41]:
So I really do think that.
Eldar [02:00:46]:
If.
Eldar [02:00:46]:
We don't have the ability to focus on the process, which is a very humbling, as we said.
Eldar [02:00:50]:
Right.
Eldar [02:00:53]:
The reason is because of our arrogance, our assumptions about the world that we've created, our tax.
Mike [02:00:59]:
But I guess arrogance. Oh, hi. Can arrogance be also a fear thing? I just thought about the example with my dad and about his stance on stop my nephew's thing. He's convinced, like, yo, we can't do nothing. But he's not saying, like, oh, man, we can't do nothing. He's, like, confidently telling me, like, arrogance, almost.
Eldar [02:01:21]:
So where's the fear? The fear is that I don't think arrogance has fear.
Mike [02:01:27]:
Maybe he's scared that he can't do.
Eldar [02:01:29]:
Anything, so therefore he uses arrogance to mask it.
Eldar [02:01:32]:
For what? How does that make sense? No, I guess not. No.
Eldar [02:01:35]:
I think arrogance is pointing into the direction of, like Dre said, like, you know something and you're very confident in that specific thing.
Mike [02:01:43]:
But is the arrogance a masking of the fear? Maybe that's what I meant to say.
Eldar [02:01:48]:
No. Okay.
Eldar [02:01:50]:
I don't think so. There's two.
Andrey [02:01:52]:
Enjoy the processes, though, that you have to distinguish.
Eldar [02:01:56]:
One is.
Andrey [02:01:58]:
One is actually genetic. It's completely genetics out of your control. Whereas when you're in the moment, you're not thinking about the future or past.
Eldar [02:02:05]:
The state of flow.
Eldar [02:02:06]:
Yeah.
Eldar [02:02:07]:
State of flow.
Eldar [02:02:07]:
Yeah.
Andrey [02:02:08]:
And that is almost all. You can work on it, but it's almost all genetic.
Eldar [02:02:12]:
Really?
Andrey [02:02:13]:
I believe so.
Eldar [02:02:14]:
Okay, cool. Because some people at a baseline are.
Andrey [02:02:22]:
Thinking about in the future is, like, anxiety, and thinking about the past is, like, solemn, like depression in a sense. But some people, they're able to get into a. Have you heard of someone being able to train for this?
Phillip [02:02:36]:
I don't believe.
Andrey [02:02:37]:
I think 90% of it is genetic or more.
Eldar [02:02:39]:
Okay, so there's two.
Andrey [02:02:41]:
Enjoy the process or trust the process.
Eldar [02:02:43]:
Right.
Andrey [02:02:44]:
One would be what I'm talking about the genetic part where some people outcome independence. They're in the state of flow. They're enjoying it for what it is, not for what it can do for them.
Eldar [02:02:55]:
Okay. And, you know, some people can do.
Andrey [02:02:58]:
That very easily, or some people can't.
Phillip [02:02:59]:
Do that at all.
Eldar [02:03:00]:
How about this? I'll throw this into you right before you continue.
Eldar [02:03:03]:
How about the people on social media?
Andrey [02:03:07]:
People on social media.
Eldar [02:03:08]:
Catherine, right now is growing through social media.
Eldar [02:03:11]:
Right.
Eldar [02:03:11]:
And she's in a state of focus.
Andrey [02:03:15]:
Well, smartest people.
Eldar [02:03:17]:
How many people can do this?
Andrey [02:03:18]:
The most disciplined people cannot get away from the design of the algorithm to get you addicted to the social media. That the most disciplined people cannot.
Eldar [02:03:30]:
Okay, very good. What I'm trying to say to you is that I'm trying to challenge your idea that it's genetic and some people have it and some people don't. I'm trying to say that all people have it on the level of, like, if you know what you like, you.
Eldar [02:03:41]:
Do a lot of it.
Andrey [02:03:43]:
So you're saying if there's enough dopamine release, you can be in a state of flow. I can see that. Some people cannot find the purpose or the thing that they have that they can put them.
Eldar [02:03:55]:
Thank you.
Andrey [02:03:56]:
But I do believe.
Eldar [02:03:57]:
Thank you.
Eldar [02:03:57]:
I don't think they can find their purpose.
Eldar [02:03:59]:
Right.
Eldar [02:03:59]:
Yeah. They can actually thrive and do this stuff for a very long period of time, but as soon as we introduce social media and the nonsense.
Eldar [02:04:06]:
Right.
Eldar [02:04:07]:
All of a sudden, they're like, oh, zoned in. This is great.
Andrey [02:04:11]:
That seems to work on almost anyone.
Mike [02:04:13]:
Thank you.
Andrey [02:04:14]:
Would you say that's a flow state? Because flow state, by definition, is enjoyable.
Eldar [02:04:19]:
But I would say it's productive. Why isn't it productive if you're helping yourself and you feel good about your life, if you're going about your life, stressing out. Stressing out all day long, she's bad. Bad. But then you grab the phone and you're like, kitty.
Andrey [02:04:37]:
But traditionally, the flow state, how people would define it, is the enjoy of it. But at the same time, it can be like, for example, dancing, playing chess, writing, doing something that is somehow productive. But it would be hard to argue that scrolling through Instagram or Twitter, if it's enjoyable, I'll give it. But I would argue, like, a hobby or a job or something, that you can always say it's productive.
Eldar [02:05:04]:
What I'm saying is that when you actually get into that focus, that it.
Andrey [02:05:07]:
Adds value to art or out to someone else.
Eldar [02:05:11]:
And the reason why it adds value is because each individual is very specific and has levels of stress.
Eldar [02:05:17]:
Right.
Andrey [02:05:18]:
So you're saying it helps the person destress, but what about.
Eldar [02:05:21]:
Correct.
Eldar [02:05:22]:
Right.
Eldar [02:05:22]:
That person who's doing a flow state, who's being productive, or creating something. What is he doing? He's obviously, I'm defining a flow state differently.
Andrey [02:05:30]:
The flow state I'm defining is like the surgeon, the poet, somebody that you.
Eldar [02:05:36]:
Want creation, you want creativity.
Andrey [02:05:38]:
Creation, creativity or an object or some sort of productivity. We all know what that means.
Eldar [02:05:42]:
What I'm saying is that, Dre, is that. I'm saying that those individuals that are into social media, right, for long periods of time, the reason why they're in that in a certain time is because they don't have the ability yet to de stress and get to a level of where they can have a stress free life to be able to tap into creativity. Yet they need social media in order to rescue them and give them a little like.
Andrey [02:06:10]:
But do you think everyone can find the other flow?
Mike [02:06:12]:
Do you think everyone can find the other?
Eldar [02:06:14]:
I think one day, yeah. It takes leveling up, obviously, you know what I'm saying?
Eldar [02:06:19]:
Right.
Eldar [02:06:20]:
And finding your power, your ability to actually thrive, like you said, and create in those higher levels. But it's maslow. Higher care of needs.
Eldar [02:06:29]:
I think first you need that safety. That's interesting. Yeah.
Eldar [02:06:37]:
That's what came to mind. Listen, if that's your flow state, gobbling down some pizza and actually ranking it properly, not like that fucking fortnite guy. Who the fuck that guy is?
Tommy [02:06:50]:
Fuck that guy.
Eldar [02:06:51]:
What the fuck is that guy talking about? Flopping?
Eldar [02:06:53]:
No.
Eldar [02:06:53]:
Flop, bro. That's the matter with him.
Phillip [02:06:55]:
By the way, flopping. No, flop is not a thing.
Eldar [02:06:57]:
It's not a thing. It's a made up fucking thing.
Phillip [02:06:58]:
It's a made up thing.
Mike [02:06:59]:
It's his own skill that he created.
Andrey [02:07:01]:
40, baby, Mike.
Eldar [02:07:02]:
40, baby.
Mike [02:07:03]:
40, baby.
Andrey [02:07:04]:
People are talking about flopping.
Eldar [02:07:05]:
The flop.
Phillip [02:07:06]:
That's totally for me. If I like cheese and the cheese is weighing down the dough and I want it to flop. Yeah, I want it to flop. It's actually not a bad thing.
Eldar [02:07:17]:
That's right.
Phillip [02:07:17]:
That's like saying you don't like a big ass, you like a small ass. It's like a totally subjective thing.
Eldar [02:07:22]:
It is very subjective. 100%.
Phillip [02:07:25]:
Yeah.
Eldar [02:07:26]:
Look, teach his own right. So what are we saying, guys? Are we fucking figuring this thing out? That the fact that the reason why if you want to fuck out there, dreaming big, saying all this fucking nonsense.
Eldar [02:07:38]:
But you don't have the ability to actually focus and do anything, you're arrogant. Yeah.
Phillip [02:07:43]:
I think the only way gig is up. Yeah, I agree with that.
Eldar [02:07:46]:
Not humble.
Phillip [02:07:47]:
When we're talking about me, we're talking about Tommy and other examples. I was definitely understanding it. And I think where I definitely got lost was where we're talking about somebody who was doing it at a very big scale from a moral and ethical standpoint. When we're talking about Steve Jobs and Elon Musk, I think I'm definitely confused on their level of interest, where they are in the process, and then what they are actually attached to, if anything. And I think it's. I don't know them personally, so I think it's a lot easier for me to understand Mike's and yours and Tommy's and you guys and say, okay, like, I understand. So, for me, I guess there's some confusion there. And I guess besides that, I think we definitely cracked it.
Phillip [02:08:28]:
But that was the one where it drew some kind of, like, I'm not sure on where.
Eldar [02:08:34]:
Mike, what are you thinking? Do we fucking crack this shit again, the question was very simple. Right, it's simple, but fucking big. Does our inability to enjoy the process is an indication of our arrogance?
Mike [02:08:50]:
Yeah, it.
Eldar [02:08:51]:
Wow.
Eldar [02:08:53]:
You said something very profound then.
Eldar [02:08:55]:
I did.
Eldar [02:08:56]:
Well, I mean, you confirmed it.
Mike [02:09:00]:
I thought that was a loaded question.
Eldar [02:09:01]:
It was a loaded question.
Mike [02:09:02]:
So how you say no, but you.
Eldar [02:09:04]:
Said it with confidence. You know what I'm saying? And I don't even hear that whiskey.
Mike [02:09:08]:
That we're not going to mention talking.
Eldar [02:09:10]:
If the whiskey did this to you.
Mike [02:09:13]:
You got to up the price by.
Eldar [02:09:14]:
Ten x, call us and give us a sick deal. Because if you just came up with the truth and you said that it was triggered by this whiskey that we drank.
Eldar [02:09:23]:
Yo, big sponsorship, we thought it was.
Eldar [02:09:26]:
Going to be ten grand a month. You said ten x, bro.
Mike [02:09:29]:
I think so.
Eldar [02:09:29]:
At least 100 x, because we're going to drink this.
Mike [02:09:32]:
But it also tastes very good because.
Eldar [02:09:34]:
Of what you just said.
Eldar [02:09:35]:
That is crazy.
Eldar [02:09:36]:
All right, guys, whatever works, baby. You're going to expand on that, or are you just going to leave it at that? I can give us something else or. No, the whiskey is going to be talking.
Eldar [02:09:46]:
We're not going to Pizzatown. Okay, fine.
Phillip [02:09:48]:
We're going somewhere else.
Eldar [02:09:49]:
All right.
Eldar [02:09:50]:
Yeah.
Mike [02:09:50]:
I think whatever way that you get to the truth, it doesn't matter as long as you get to the truth.
Andrey [02:09:56]:
That's what me and Mike disagree.
Eldar [02:09:59]:
I don't want to offend them by saying that in the air, bro. Me and Mike disagree so much.
Phillip [02:10:08]:
That guy knows that he just made a reservation to dinner tomorrow. He knows we're all going to the beach.
Eldar [02:10:13]:
He just wants to cut it short.
Phillip [02:10:15]:
He's cutting it way short.
Eldar [02:10:19]:
Mike didn't say anything just now. I don't understand what he said because I think the whiskey's talking. Whiskey's having a different effect. I don't know.
Katherine [02:10:27]:
But that is the shortest.
Eldar [02:10:29]:
You agree with him? Oh, you're just saying that.
Katherine [02:10:32]:
No, that's the shortest he's ever made.
Eldar [02:10:34]:
Good.
Eldar [02:10:35]:
Babe, what do you think about a question? What are you saying? I said I introduced the topic as the most important topic of all. Dennis Rock's podcast.
Katherine [02:10:44]:
No, I think.
Eldar [02:10:45]:
Does our inability to enjoy the process is an indication of our own arrogance?
Katherine [02:10:51]:
It can be.
Mike [02:10:53]:
I think it has to be.
Katherine [02:10:55]:
Get in the way of enjoying the process. But I think arrogance can definitely be one of them.
Eldar [02:10:59]:
How so? Why?
Katherine [02:11:01]:
Well, I think what we spoke about before, on not seeing something for what it is, or maybe when your values lie in the wrong thing. So it goes down to values. It goes down to. No, I guess values. Pride. I guess pride and ego kind of go hand in hand sometimes with arrogance, depending on how you see it.
Eldar [02:11:23]:
Why?
Eldar [02:11:23]:
Because does the process itself intrinsically carries.
Eldar [02:11:32]:
A requirement to be humble?
Phillip [02:11:35]:
Yes, I think so.
Eldar [02:11:36]:
Hold on 1 second. I give away the answer.
Phillip [02:11:39]:
I retract my answer.
Katherine [02:11:40]:
In general, like in life and just like any path, I think humility is.
Mike [02:11:46]:
The choice if you change.
Eldar [02:11:48]:
Listen, all I'm saying is that the process might be bigger than our ego. And that's the answer to a fucking no.
Mike [02:11:53]:
But I think if you change.
Katherine [02:11:55]:
Yes, that's a mic drop.
Eldar [02:11:57]:
Hold on a second. Let me write this down. This might be a t shirt.
Eldar [02:11:59]:
What did I say?
Katherine [02:12:00]:
I don't know. That was a mic drop, though.
Eldar [02:12:02]:
Fine, we can rewind the back. Rewind. I said the process might be bigger.
Eldar [02:12:06]:
Than our ego, right?
Eldar [02:12:08]:
Yeah.
Mike [02:12:10]:
Repeat the question one more time.
Eldar [02:12:13]:
Mike, you lost the question. Repeat it again. The process.
Mike [02:12:21]:
Repeat the question again.
Katherine [02:12:23]:
Repeat it. But back.
Eldar [02:12:24]:
I got. I got.
Eldar [02:12:25]:
I got it. The process carries something intrinsically.
Eldar [02:12:34]:
He's going to get confused.
Mike [02:12:36]:
He's changing it.
Eldar [02:12:37]:
That is bigger.
Mike [02:12:38]:
Affecting just.
Eldar [02:12:39]:
That is bigger than our ego.
Mike [02:12:40]:
That's good to know.
Eldar [02:12:41]:
That defeats our ego.
Eldar [02:12:43]:
I'll fix it later. Yeah. Process carries something intrinsically that is bigger than our ego. The process has something intrinsically in it that is bigger than our ego. Because our ego is always fucking flamboyant somewhere. We want to be millionaires. We want to do all this fucking shit.
Eldar [02:12:57]:
Do the fucking work.
Phillip [02:13:00]:
We agreed that being in the process is being in the moment, and you cannot be in your ego. Your ego is either valuing the past or projecting the future, and you're either going to have anxiety you're going to have arrogance. You cannot. So I think to your point, process is inherently humbling because you cannot have anything attached to anything that is the past or the future. You have to just be doing the thing that is and that thing, that is the thing that's going to get you from a dollar to $2, which is a genuine interest, a genuine curiosity for understanding and knowledge and service. And those things are inherently humbling.
Eldar [02:13:39]:
Humbling.
Mike [02:13:40]:
Using all the right words for sure. Can you repeat the question one more time? I had a thought, but it might.
Eldar [02:13:45]:
Be a dry thought. I'll say it again, Mike.
Eldar [02:13:47]:
Dinner.
Eldar [02:13:48]:
Dinner might be the most important I told you topic.
Mike [02:13:50]:
Yes, that's why when you said that, I had this thought and maybe you might understand me, maybe not.
Eldar [02:13:55]:
Fine.
Eldar [02:13:56]:
Because before you just said general stuff.
Mike [02:13:57]:
Again, fine.
Eldar [02:13:58]:
Does our inability to enjoy the process an indication of our arrogance?
Mike [02:14:03]:
Okay, so my bill.
Eldar [02:14:06]:
Enjoy the process an indication to our arrogance?
Mike [02:14:10]:
I think if you change the word arrogance with end goal and the process life, if you say it that way, oh my God.
Eldar [02:14:17]:
Does our inability to enjoy life is.
Eldar [02:14:22]:
An indication we're losing listeners right now.
Eldar [02:14:26]:
Because you repeated that question.
Mike [02:14:28]:
What do you mean arrogance?
Eldar [02:14:29]:
To what would you want?
Eldar [02:14:30]:
Beach. Beach.
Eldar [02:14:31]:
Beach dinner.
Mike [02:14:31]:
Beach reservation.
Phillip [02:14:32]:
Resi.
Mike [02:14:34]:
No, read it one more time.
Eldar [02:14:37]:
Does our inability to enjoy the process.
Eldar [02:14:40]:
Enjoy life of our arrogance, of our attachment to end goal.
Mike [02:14:46]:
So we so attached to end hole. End goal, we don't enjoy life.
Andrey [02:14:51]:
Every hole is a goal.
Phillip [02:14:52]:
Why is so so I guess you guys.
Mike [02:14:59]:
Go.
Eldar [02:15:02]:
This whiskey just went from ten x to 100 x.
Phillip [02:15:04]:
It's a platinum american Jordan holder, multiple cars. What's the Resi.
Eldar [02:15:09]:
What are you guys saying?
Mike [02:15:11]:
Does that not make any sense?
Eldar [02:15:12]:
Yeah.
Mike [02:15:14]:
If you're saying this is the biggest topic, yes, this is the exact reflection of life. If your life is only focused on end goal, you are not enjoying the process. That is exactly what the statement the question is asking.
Eldar [02:15:26]:
That is correct.
Mike [02:15:27]:
That's the most important topic.
Eldar [02:15:28]:
That is correct.
Mike [02:15:29]:
If you can't enjoy life, then this.
Eldar [02:15:31]:
Whole podcast, the gig is dead. We agree with that.
Katherine [02:15:34]:
Heather once told me, she says if you focus so hard on being happy, you're not going to be happy. You have to focus right now. What's making you feel good, what's healthy for you, whatever. And then you will get there in the end. But if you focus only on that, you're never going to be happy.
Eldar [02:15:50]:
That is why you have to go back to our podcast. A long time ago, we said to.
Eldar [02:15:53]:
Osley, right, drink your coffee, enjoy your coffee.
Mike [02:15:58]:
Time to go right.
Eldar [02:16:00]:
Enjoy your social media. Enjoy the things that you need to do in order to relieve some of your stress. Stop fucking putting guilt trips on yourself, saying that you're not productive.
Mike [02:16:11]:
The reason those things exist in the.
Eldar [02:16:13]:
First, why you're gravitating to them so effortlessly, you gravitate towards social media so effortlessly is because your dumb ass. Okay, I'm going to say this out loud. Your dumb ass is probably not enjoying yourself throughout the whole day. I'm sorry, but I'm not sorry.
Eldar [02:16:31]:
I'm not sorry, Mike.
Mike [02:16:33]:
I'm not even sure what's happening, but I'm definitely not sorry, either.
Eldar [02:16:36]:
Yeah, I'm not sorry. I'm not sorry, bro.
Eldar [02:16:38]:
You know what I'm saying?
Eldar [02:16:40]:
Why is she talking to you in that manner? You always get abused like that.
Mike [02:16:44]:
He's a sim, bro.
Eldar [02:16:46]:
She's yelling at you, bro.
Phillip [02:16:49]:
I think she might be school.
Eldar [02:16:50]:
Leave the kid alone. He's new.
Andrey [02:16:51]:
I think she was yelling at that ball.
Eldar [02:16:54]:
No, she's yelling at you. She's yelling at you to pick up the ball. Yeah. She knows what she wants, that she's going to get it whether you like it or not.
Andrey [02:17:03]:
Yeah, the consistency.
Eldar [02:17:05]:
What do you think?
Eldar [02:17:06]:
Come on, you know life.
Phillip [02:17:08]:
What happens to girls?
Tommy [02:17:09]:
Yeah, you're a doctor.
Phillip [02:17:10]:
You don't have to be a radiologist.
Eldar [02:17:11]:
To figure this one. Cut this one out, Dre. Our radiologist is very competent, and he knows the answer to these questions.
Phillip [02:17:19]:
What happens to girls that boys don't get?
Eldar [02:17:22]:
Oh, my God. All right, guys, final thoughts. Let's do this. Dre, what do you have? Do you have any final thoughts? Put the mic on your thing. Final thoughts on this?
Katherine [02:17:30]:
I said mine.
Eldar [02:17:31]:
Okay, cool.
Eldar [02:17:32]:
Sounds good. So we're going to opt you out.
Katherine [02:17:33]:
That was my final.
Eldar [02:17:34]:
No final thoughts for Catherine. Dre, do you have any final thoughts on this since we wrestled with the topic?
Andrey [02:17:40]:
I came in towards the end.
Eldar [02:17:42]:
Yeah, you did a little towards the end. Yeah.
Eldar [02:17:47]:
You're a lucky guy. Let's just say this.
Andrey [02:17:49]:
I think Mike didn't want to. The end part, the arrogance. I think Mike didn't like how that was phrased, so he created his own redefine. The initial.
Eldar [02:17:59]:
Why?
Eldar [02:17:59]:
Why do you think that is?
Mike [02:18:01]:
No, but I think I said the same thing in a different way to.
Andrey [02:18:06]:
Enjoy the process definition of our arrogance. I think the problem is maybe we want to define arrogance differently because of the confidence and arrogance thing. And then I think you didn't want to gripe with that exact question because you kind of redefined it.
Mike [02:18:24]:
No, I didn't redefine that. I just said the same thing the way I felt the same thing in a different, more impactful way.
Eldar [02:18:30]:
Problem with it, because you ask him.
Mike [02:18:34]:
That, he doesn't know the answers.
Tommy [02:18:39]:
Just when you thought the podcast was over.
Eldar [02:18:42]:
You'll take him to pizza later.
Eldar [02:18:44]:
Why?
Eldar [02:18:45]:
Why do you think he's feeling a certain type of way?
Andrey [02:18:46]:
I don't know his answers. I think the thing is, what me and Mike disagree on is he thinks there's universal truths and the truths of many different things in life. And I think there's mostly our truths. There are some truths in terms of physics, but I think that's where we disagree, and that's why we disagree in the moment.
Mike [02:19:06]:
He is a doctor, and he practiced radiology, and I'mike and I practice everything.
Phillip [02:19:15]:
It was really nice meeting everyone.
Eldar [02:19:16]:
Oh, my goodness. This guy is a guy.
Mike [02:19:21]:
Tomorrow.
Eldar [02:19:22]:
This guy's a toothpick. And I'm a.
Mike [02:19:28]:
You know, I got that from also. Peaceful warrior.
Eldar [02:19:32]:
Yeah.
Mike [02:19:32]:
He's like, you practice gymnastics.
Eldar [02:19:35]:
Wow.
Mike [02:19:37]:
He stunned him. I had to take him to school, bro.
Eldar [02:19:40]:
You have to.
Mike [02:19:40]:
We went to high school together. But, yeah, I got to take him back.
Eldar [02:19:43]:
He forgot who ran the school.
Mike [02:19:45]:
He did forget.
Eldar [02:19:46]:
You can't teach your father how to fuck.
Phillip [02:19:48]:
Principal Mike.
Eldar [02:19:49]:
Principal. Principal Mike. Rosie Ball. That's a stretch. Come to his office. Right?
Andrey [02:19:59]:
That's a bit of fan.
Mike [02:20:00]:
Me and Elder were running the school. You just didn't know.
Eldar [02:20:02]:
Yeah, you didn't know that, y'all. We ran that fucking shit.
Mike [02:20:05]:
We had a Mike and elder day. I can't remember.
Eldar [02:20:08]:
They dedicated. Farrell High School still has elder and Mike day. Did you know that when they sit down and they read our notebook that Tom Marr fucking framed? In the fucking gymnasium?
Mike [02:20:20]:
They hung up our jerseys in the gymnasium.
Eldar [02:20:23]:
Yes. They retired our shit. You understand? We taught them how to teach class.
Andrey [02:20:29]:
I think that's arrogant.
Eldar [02:20:30]:
They almost closed. You don't think we're just having fun? Or do you perceive it as arrogance because we're having too much fun? Short circuits. Yeah. All right, cool.
Eldar [02:20:45]:
Fine.
Eldar [02:20:46]:
Mike. Sometimes you can't have too much fun in public, Mike.
Phillip [02:20:49]:
You can't.
Eldar [02:20:49]:
You know what I'm saying? Because the public might perceive it. Like Philip. Philip's angry.
Phillip [02:20:53]:
I'm an angry guy.
Eldar [02:20:54]:
Steve Jobs already took a long nap a long time ago. He's still upset with very, very.
Mike [02:20:59]:
You understand? Yeah, no, I get it.
Eldar [02:21:02]:
You understand.
Mike [02:21:02]:
I'm not going to stop, though. Listen, just letting you know.
Eldar [02:21:05]:
All right, what are my final thoughts? I'll go then. Fine. Does our inability to enjoy the process.
Katherine [02:21:12]:
I can't, with this 50th time that.
Eldar [02:21:15]:
You'Ve been discussed, is it good?
Andrey [02:21:17]:
You have to say it a lot to let it too much.
Mike [02:21:19]:
Right.
Eldar [02:21:20]:
Thank you. See, that's a biological answer right there.
Mike [02:21:22]:
I guess that statement shows that we're living in a false truth, like we're living an illusionary life. Things that are not logically lining up.
Eldar [02:21:28]:
Listen, I'm going to say it like this, right? And this is a logical answer. This is nothing.
Phillip [02:21:37]:
Now, we definitely believe you.
Eldar [02:21:38]:
No, right. Now I'm deducing this. This is not an illogical fallacy.
Eldar [02:21:43]:
Right?
Eldar [02:21:43]:
Because the way I structure this question, it's a very simple way to read.
Phillip [02:21:48]:
It one more time for Kat.
Eldar [02:21:50]:
That's our inability. That's our inability to enjoy the process signal or indicate our arrogance. And you know what? When you enjoy something, like a process, logically, and when you enjoy something, it's impossible to be arrogant. You're just enjoying the process. You immerse yourself in it.
Mike [02:22:08]:
If Tolly was here, I would use a very good example.
Eldar [02:22:11]:
Whoa.
Mike [02:22:12]:
When he goes into turtle mode, he's in turtle mode. He's not arrogant at all.
Eldar [02:22:16]:
No, he's very turtle mode. Cooking his chicken.
Mike [02:22:18]:
When he's cooking. When he's doing.
Phillip [02:22:20]:
No, he pointed this out.
Eldar [02:22:21]:
Yeah.
Phillip [02:22:22]:
Hey, Philip, when I cook, I adopted this process from Bobby Schmee.
Eldar [02:22:27]:
Bobby Schmee.
Phillip [02:22:29]:
Gordon rams. I've done this in Gordon rams. And you did you exactly. Look at that.
Eldar [02:22:34]:
You see that? That's a very good point.
Eldar [02:22:37]:
Yeah.
Eldar [02:22:37]:
When we enjoy something, when we truly enjoy something, something happens to us, we become humble.
Mike [02:22:44]:
He asked like, yo, maybe I can make this better. Can I add more, soul? Can I add more? He wants to express himself very humble.
Eldar [02:22:53]:
Right.
Eldar [02:22:53]:
To his guests, in that sense.
Mike [02:22:55]:
Right?
Eldar [02:22:55]:
And we enjoy that process. And we're like, holy shit, that's love. You know what I mean? So where's the arrogance in that?
Eldar [02:23:01]:
There isn't any. He didn't say, like, sit down.
Eldar [02:23:05]:
He didn't control anything. He was really open to it and he was enjoying himself. And he keeps saying that, yeah, I'm enjoying myself. So I think that this is not only a loaded question, it's a tricky question, guys.
Eldar [02:23:16]:
The answer is in the pudding.
Phillip [02:23:17]:
How humble can you be?
Eldar [02:23:18]:
Is the question.
Katherine [02:23:19]:
That's not a thing.
Mike [02:23:21]:
Stop it. Depends how much humble pie you can handle bothering you.
Eldar [02:23:26]:
See this?
Eldar [02:23:27]:
The answer is, I'm over here trying to be a little arrogant. No, I'm confident in my shit. Listen, the truth of the matter is, if you're enjoying your shit, most likely you have no time to be arrogant and all the other stuff because you got stuck on and enjoying your process. If you're not enjoying your process, you're probably making certain conclusions, pointing fingers and blaming life and others for your misery.
Eldar [02:23:49]:
Sure.
Eldar [02:23:50]:
And therefore, arrogance will be a defense mechanism that you employ in order to.
Eldar [02:23:54]:
Defend your fucking stance because you're an idiot. That's well said.
Eldar [02:23:58]:
Maybe everything I say around here is well said. So I'm not going to take that as a compliment. I'm going to take that as a job. Babe, come on.
Eldar [02:24:06]:
It's obvious.
Eldar [02:24:08]:
That's a little bit of arrogance.
Tommy [02:24:10]:
Yeah.
Katherine [02:24:11]:
You followed that up completely with everything with that.
Eldar [02:24:14]:
Thank you, baby.
Eldar [02:24:14]:
Yes, for sure.
Eldar [02:24:16]:
But again, I think that the reason why I came up the way it did, to be honest with you guys and to be completely honest and humble, it's not because I deduced it or I really felt it.
Eldar [02:24:26]:
It's the whiskey we drink.
Eldar [02:24:28]:
I think it's one of the powerful whiskey.
Mike [02:24:30]:
Some powerful fucking whiskey.
Eldar [02:24:32]:
Loosen me up, guys. Through your conversations and through everything we talked about, 100%, you guys are contributing factor.
Phillip [02:24:37]:
I feel very loose right now, but.
Eldar [02:24:39]:
The whiskey fucking did it, too, guys.
Mike [02:24:40]:
Yeah.
Eldar [02:24:41]:
My lips a little bit dry.
Eldar [02:24:42]:
That means I'm a little bit thirsty. Same.
Eldar [02:24:44]:
Okay, cool. Doctor approved. Okay. You understand we have a radiologist here who said same. Therefore, I'm experiencing something normal symptoms from.
Phillip [02:24:52]:
A medical, biological perspective.
Eldar [02:24:54]:
Yes.
Eldar [02:24:54]:
So therefore, it's not only good, it's approved. So if you guys want to find.
Eldar [02:24:59]:
Out what it is, call me.
Phillip [02:25:02]:
No, we did an excellent, excellent.
Eldar [02:25:04]:
Thank you, guys.
Eldar [02:25:04]:
Anybody else?
Eldar [02:25:05]:
Oh, Philip. Do you have any final thoughts? I didn't want to skip you. You said a lot.
Phillip [02:25:09]:
I did.
Eldar [02:25:10]:
Would you want to keep it humble.
Mike [02:25:12]:
And just not anything you want to retract as well.
Eldar [02:25:14]:
Yeah, if you want to retract any of the nonsense that you said earlier.
Phillip [02:25:21]:
I think.
Mike [02:25:23]:
Or you could double down on the pizza comments. I think that would be the easiest.
Eldar [02:25:26]:
He's trying to set you up, bro. He's trying to throw you into that dumpster. The pizza dumpster.
Phillip [02:25:31]:
I'll definitely go pizza diving. But, yeah, I think when it was simple for me, it was keeping it to personal examples for me, and it was Tommy and all of us, and I think that's really the only way for me to truly understand it. I think when we're talking about hypotheticals and, like, third party information and understandings of other people, I think we can get caught up in it. And to me, it was like taking me away from the main point, which I was understanding. So the main point that I was humble, the main point that I was understanding was with me, with Tommy and all of us, and saying that you are getting away from the day to day and you are attaching yourself to whatever end goal it's going to be, which is, I want to be famous, I want to be rich, I want to do xyz, I want to have a house, car, all this stuff. You are taking yourself away from allowing yourself or giving yourself the opportunity to enjoy the experience. And for me, the way that would look on a day to day basis is taking a genuine interest in other people, not putting myself first and doing more listening. And that, to me, is a very humbling thing.
Phillip [02:26:34]:
But there's one thing to be humble, and there's also another thing to put it into practice and then allow that to kind of take shape and be like your new person. It's not just something that you do and say like, oh, I made a mistake, now I'm going to do this. It's not like I'm buying like a new apple, right? I'm literally changing my old behavior and then I'm replacing it with new things. As a person, this is like taking your guts out and then replacing it with new guts.
Eldar [02:27:03]:
Are you threatening his career?
Phillip [02:27:04]:
I'm threatening his career.
Eldar [02:27:05]:
Holy fucking shit.
Phillip [02:27:06]:
Yo, I'm so hungry.
Eldar [02:27:08]:
We had enough of these people, right? Why do they exist?
Eldar [02:27:11]:
Why do they exist?
Eldar [02:27:12]:
That's another question. Listen, this is going to segment to the next topic, and I think it should be gratitude, because that's another thing that I think gratitude and have the ability to actually be grateful and seeing things for what they are is to.
Eldar [02:27:23]:
Show you and remind us that there's.
Eldar [02:27:25]:
Enough that we already have.
Phillip [02:27:26]:
I think that's the daily reminder for when you are confused and then you are, in my experience or anybody else's experience, saying, hey, I'm struggling. I'm struggling with what I used to do, which is not right, which is doing the newly process focused, which is right. And then saying, oh, man, I'm gravitating towards going back to my old self in certain areas. And it's like, what am I actually thankful for? And I think that then pushes that old self even farther away.
Eldar [02:27:53]:
So you've been bottling this up for a while now.
Phillip [02:27:55]:
Yeah, I was angry guy.
Eldar [02:27:58]:
All right, well, listen, thank you. That was awesome. Let's finish on that, and let's now enjoy the look of how Archie is really enjoying himself on top of Uncle Mike. And if you had a video component of this, you would have really loved it. But first, the whiskey sponsor has to come in.
Phillip [02:28:12]:
Oh, my God. This is definitely one of the best.
Eldar [02:28:14]:
Whiskeys we ever had.
Eldar [02:28:14]:
Yes.
Eldar [02:28:15]:
All right, guys, good job.
Eldar [02:28:16]:
Thank you.
83. The Cost of Arrogance: Ethical Considerations in Business and Personal Ambitions
Aug 18, 2023•2 hr 28 min•Ep. 83
Episode description
During the episode, discussions included divining the roots of arrogance, the importance of humility in the pursuit of personal goals, and the intrinsic value found in enjoying life's process rather than simply aiming for outcomes. Guests like Katherine delved into healthy mindsets for happiness, while Phillip shared insights on changing old behaviors and adopting a more process-focused lifestyle. The conversations spanned various perspectives and experiences, from personal anecdotes to thoughts on individuals like Elon Musk and Steve Jobs. The episode wrapped up with poignant thoughts on gratitude as a tool to shift away from arrogance and towards a more fulfilled state of being.
Transcript
Transcript source: Provided by creator in RSS feed: download file