Welcome to Parenthood: Where Sleep is a Myth and Paid Leave a Fairy Tale

Considering having a kid, but you work a corporate job. Well, you might want to do a little research on the maternity or paternity leave. The United States is the only first world country without any guaranteed paid parental leave at the national level. We did research on the companies that are doing it best. And companies who are, let's just say.

say backing. I never thought about this stuff when I was younger in my career. The thought didn't even cross my mind. For all things Tune into this week's episode of Demoted.

Demoted. Hey daddy, hey daddy, hey daddy. Hey daddy, hey daddy, hey daddy, hey! Hey! Hey! There's a new corporate dad in town! Oh, his name is Ross. By the time Elizabeth is, though, it's going to be what? Oh, I don't know. You'll have probably already written like a million corporate bits about being a dad. Fishy's going to be in boarding school at this point.

Because she'll actually be a teenager, I think, by the time this episode releases. As we record this, he is actually at 9.27 this morning. He hit two weeks old. Aww. It was so funny when he turned 24 hours. I was like, damn, my son's growing up. He's growing up. Don't they change so much, like so fast? They do. He's already gained two pounds. God, huge. He stays eating. congratulations on having a kid thank you i'm so happy for you you are glowing you did so much work i actually saw

your child. You did. You met him. When A fresh baby. Young fish. I've never seen a baby that small and new and fresh. And the thing is, he's like objectively a big baby. And you let me hold him. Eight pounds, one ounce is what he came out at. Oh my gosh. And then do they kind of lose weight actually? They do lose weight pretty much immediately. Um, you know, that's just kind of how they roll. They're filled with.

fluid and whatever adjusting to living on earth yeah and then the big next milestone is they get back to birth weight which he has done and more

He's up a full pound from birth weight. Wow. Pound and two ounces, yeah. Okay, and what is it like being a dad? Well, first of all, high motorheads. High motorheads. We're back in the studio. I've missed you. I'm so happy to see you. I welcomed a son in this world. You welcomed a new employee. I welcomed a new employee. I also welcomed my nephew into the world. The demoted family is continuing to grow. Auntie Nat did come over. She brought some delicious food.

We did. We hung out for a bit. We hung out. I mean, I was so just happy to be in your space. I said to both of you two, you're both so calm and chill. We decided that's like how it has to be. Yeah. I don't know why I was expecting, not mayhem, just like. Yeah. I don't know. It seems like a crazy transition. It is a crazy transition. It is. I think you kind of having a kid, it's just,

It's game time. It's time to step up. It's like when you get on stage. You're so nervous. Everything's building up. Actually, it's the anticipation and the lead up that's worse. Yes, I feel like you were more stressed before. I was. You were freaking out. I actually lost five pounds immediately after.

that's so doing i'm serious like i was i like was going through this weird sort so i thought i was calm and i was like really trying to be calm and like i'm chill i'm doing all these things and i was feeling I pulled my back, which usually happens around stressful times, periods of high stress or transition. I noticed that my typical resting weight was up five pounds. I was doing all things equal.

that i that i normally do and i was like for some reason yeah working out eating the normal things i eat i was like why i was like man maybe this is age like this i hit 35 or i hit 36 and 36 is i guess for me when it all changed but no joke within about a week after

Little man was born. I went back to what my previous resting weight was when I do all the things I do. And it was 100% stress. Yeah. I was freaking out. I know. But Beck and I decided we're like, look, your kid becomes like your aura. You're like... Do you want to be stressed out and losing your mind? Or do you just choose that this is going to be a wild ride, he's going to shit everywhere, which he's doing? Which he's great at. Yep.

Put him in a bath for the first time. Put him in a nice, just like cute white towel with little ears on it. Shit the whole thing immediately. Good. I mean, he has to. Next bath, Becca's holding him. We're about to put him in the bath and then he just shit sprays everywhere. Right into the bath. Nope. right all over the floor all over the floor and back i'm like put him in the sink it's crazy and we're just like laughing and just like Holy shit, there's so much shit. I think also there's...

I mean, you can never anticipate what you'll be like as a parent. And obviously, there's a huge chance that you're like... I need to protect this thing. Obviously, you're protecting, but you are flinging the baby around, holding the baby like a football. You're handing the baby to me. You're so chill. I was shocked you trusted me with holding your three-day-old baby. I trust you with everything. I literally felt like I look at those photos and I still get nervous.

I'm like, what if I dropped him? Well, there's that one photo of you leaning back. We'll show the photo of Nat just leaning so far back. I thought you were going to break your own back. I would rather break my own back than let him stop sleeping. Like, babies, it's like,

Their head is what is, just as long as that's supported, they're pretty much fine. They're rubber. The neck is great. There's no neck support. Zero neck support. And that's what we're working on with Tummy Time, which he weirdly loves. Most kids don't love it. I put him face down on the ground. He'll sit there for 30 minutes like, ah. So happy. Hey! Ooh ha ha. And you just... Like, dude.

What are you saying? How do you feel like you have changed? And I know it's only been two weeks, but do you feel, I feel like you're more calm. I feel like you're. I mean maybe a little more playful like I think things were getting a little stressful and serious even with work and stuff yeah leading up to it it was a forced

Yeah. Like as forced as it comes. You've never taken a break. I've never like taken a true break. And this was the one time I said, like, I have no travel on the books. I had no, I turned down all the brand deals. I was like, Hey, like, I'm not going to be.

I don't want to have one piece of my mind elsewhere. And we were saying before, it feels unimportant. I think now everything does feel unimportant. It is the old adage. Like once it's yours, it changes everything. And like, it does and it doesn't like i still want to achieve and i still want to like do and be out there and all this stuff but i think in this period i was telling you right before we started recording it was like

Part of me started to go back to work in my head. I was like, no, no, no. Like, what are you doing? Yeah. Like, let's just be here. Let's do tummy time. Let's do tummy time and let me show you some high contrast cards. He's going to have to track fastballs. He's going to need to see when a curveball comes out of that pitcher's hand and hit it. He will. And if I don't start him now.

He's going to be like his dad. He's going to be an independent football guy. He's going to get to the lowest level of minor leagues and then flame out. And be a men's league star. Is that what he wants? No. And you got to be there, Coach P. I got to be there. And so I'm already Coach P with him. I'm already trying to put him in push-up position so he can try to do it. He's ripping out 80 push-ups a night, right? He's getting about maybe...

A fifth of a single push-up. Yeah, which is big. That's big. Which is big. Fires me up, though, when he starts to lift up his head and try to hold his head up. I'm like, come on, fishy. Oh, my God. Let's go, fish. Look at what that neck do, boy. And then he goes down. He's like, I'm hungry.

It's like, all right. Starving. Mom! Screaming. Starving. No, he just gets kind of cranky. How has sleep been? He sleeps. How has your sleep? I mean, everything I hear is like, it's terrible. No way. I mean, it's not a fluid nine. He has to be fed every three hours. Okay. And so we do...

We do feed him. And like, I mean, I don't feed him. I obviously can't feed him. I was going to say, Becca probably does most of the feeding, if not all. She does all the feeding. All. You know, we'll start doing the whole like pumping thing. soon if we want to bring other people in. Tune in to next episode on pumping. I'm learning so much shit. But it's great. Becca's a champ. She pushed him out in 35 minutes. Normally it takes an hour, one to four hours.

that's i mean of course becca does everything and of course i told everyone i was like i'm not gonna look i don't want to see anything and i like Only time I got curious right when I looked fishy came flying out in that moment. I was like holy shit There's an alien. But we've been super lucky. He's chill. He doesn't freak out. If he is crying, there's always a reason. He has different cries for different things. It's like hungry, tired, diaper.

And like, that's it. And I'm sure there's like a pain one, but he's like... Dude's being babied so hard he hasn't felt pain ever in his life. Oh, he's never felt pain. The only thing he truly hates is getting naked for diaper changes. Because he's embarrassed. Are you and Becca doing anything to support, like, the... Do you have a night nurse? Do you have, like, nanny? Yeah.

So I guess that's actually a good segue into what we're going to be talking about today. We are talking about mat leave, pat leave. And it's a huge thing. And there's a lot of folks who, you know, a lot of different companies, a lot of different policies. We did get a night nurse. And obviously that is a massive privilege. And what is a night nurse? She shows up at 10 p.m. and she leaves at 6 a.m.

Got it. So just to assist with you kind of sleeping a bit. Yep. So she sort of, you know, brings him into our room. We have like an office that we turned into a nursery, his room. And so she comes at 10. Becca has fed him basically right before she gets there, which gives us about four hours now of sleep.

We go to sleep. She's with him. What are they doing? She's basically trying to train him to be comfortable in a crib. Sort of expanding his sleep horizons. Babies still think they're in the womb. They still think they're suspended in water.

It's like he needs to learn that there's going to be something touching his back, right? And he sleeps. And I mean, her job right now is actually pretty easy. But when it's feeding time, she comes into our room, wakes us up. He, whatever, feeds for 20 minutes. And then she takes him back in the other room, changes his diaper, burps him, that type of thing. Yeah. And then, you know, one more feed, like, right at 5, 5 a.m. Mm-hmm.

sleep for three hours. How does it feel having someone come into your bedroom? You know, it's so funny. Dex, doggy doesn't love it. He growls every time because he's a good protectable. Dex is back. Dex is back. But she...

is so great. Like, I thought it was going to be weird. Yeah. But her demeanor is so just like... Calm, she's done this before. Maternal. Maternal. Yeah, like, come on in. Yeah. Like, I don't feel embarrassed that you see me like this. Hey, mom and dad. Yeah, like, yeah. And she's, you know, super quiet and she's like... She's done this for a lot of our friends.

so she So she's been through the whole gauntlet. What is the cost of a night nurse? I think we hear this term thrown around. Everyone's like, you got to get a night nurse, especially in Silicon Valley. You mentioned all your friends have them. It's like, Some people try to save for this because it's so helpful to get those even two nights a week sleep. Exactly. She's 55 an hour. Okay, great. So you can do the math, 55 an hour, two to five days a week.

I mean, I know nannies that are charging that now, I think more than that. So that doesn't seem, I thought, yeah, I was thinking it would be even more. Yeah. So I think if, I think the math is if you do five, it's 20, 200 bucks a week, which is not cheap, but like. You know, we're doing a couple days a week. If you do five nights a week. If you do five nights a week. Yeah, that makes sense.

But, you know, how productive do you want to be the next day? Like how much stuff do you want to get done? How much do you value your sleep? And like different babies are different, right? Some babies are wild. Yeah. Will not sleep. Will not sleep. And they're so clutch to have there. And they're also just. Like she comes and scrubs like nurse scrubs.

And she's so familiar with all this stuff. She has so much knowledge and ability to train and, like, remedy things. And she does a whole write-up every night. Of how it went. Oh, wow. All the stuff they did. All the stuff they did. I saw you guys using an app. What's the app? It's called NARA. N-A-R-A. It just sort of tracks feeds. left boob, right boob, diaper, wet, dirty, blowout, that type of stuff. Like certain milestones because it's just

It's good data to have, like when you go to the doctor. We went to the pediatrician two weeks yesterday. Are all parents tracking this these days? Like what's going on? The ones that I'm around are, we were like, nah, let's not do that. But it's actually so easy. It's like, click at this time, automatically logs the time, like diaper, dirty, click, done. It takes three seconds. I was like, all right, fine, I'm in. I was like laying out the food when I came over. I was like, was it liquid?

Was it just pee? Was it peer poo? Was it peer poo? What was it both? So you be tracking, you be night nursing. Be night nursing. You're also sleeping, which is great. You look great. You seem well rested. I feel great. And you have maybe a renewed...

sense or outlook on work and paternal leave and all these things that we're going to be talking about yeah i mean i think as like a quick aside i think one of the things i've struggled with for a long time is and like you're so good at this it's just like your content is authentic it's like what you want to talk about and i think for the longest time for me it's i've sort of been stuck in like Corporate bro needs to be the 25-year-old young AE in the marina.

Yeah. I was like, that's not me. No. Like, I'm married. I have a kid. Like, I don't party that hard anymore. Can I party hard? Yes. Does it take two weeks for me to recover? Also, yes. Like, I think this will open up a new sort of chapter of content type. So many people have followed me for so long. I have people who have been following me since 2013. And they've grown up too.

They've gotten married. They've had kids. They've been promoted. They don't see Corporate Bro as relatable anymore in a lot of ways. And so I think for me, it's sort of going to open up an opportunity to be a corporate dad in a lot of ways and sort of take the content to a more... we'll call it mature well and talk about what you're experiencing because it is hilarious like the content i see about new parents and just adjusting to this new reality, having a toddler, all these phases.

without showing your kid. I mean, we can talk about that in another episode. Yeah, I don't even know what we're going to do. I'm sure we'll show him at some point. But it's like, you know, there's always going to be people who are like, how dare you like put your kid on social and so forth. And it's like,

Right now, he's a potato. When he's older, I'm not going to force him to be on camera. I'm not going to put him on camera. I will play him. Yeah, exactly. I just do the shit that he's done. Precisely. But I think there's just so much funny shit that happens.

Yeah, and I'm excited for your next chapter. So this week, as we talked about, we're discussing kind of what companies are doing to support maternity and paternity leave, what mainly they're maybe not doing to support this. Which is what most of them are not doing. And to back it up, we have We've done some research. We have some stats. The United States, you'd be shocked. And if any of the parents are listening, you're not shocked at all.

And then also Ross did your own research with your followers. When was this conducted? I think this was like right in the heart of layoff season a year and a half ago you know i was like trying to pull all these companies like what are the severances people were getting and then i had some folks reach out like hey can you just like find out matleaf patley

Like what's the best company to work? Yeah. Like, like I just want to know if I'm getting screwed, if this is good, if this is bad. And so I just basically put out a survey, you know, asking things as like,

Do you have mat leave? Do you have pat leave? Do you have to be there for a certain amount of time? You're like tenure. Do you get paid your full base salary? Is it a percentage? All these things. And so I got about 200. 250 sort of responses and we'll talk about this but it ranged from you know zero to a lot. And also is different whether you're in the U.S. or not. Yep. The United States is the only first world country without any guaranteed parental leave.

At the national level. The Fed does not care. They do not care. We did some research before this podcast. Again, I'm not a parent, but that was crazy to me.

It's shocking that we saw all these testimonials of women who have to go back immediately and aren't given time and oh you now have a kid you have to support financially you can't afford it right you can take leave but it's unpaid so like okay well i kind of need money to afford food it's expensive to raise a cat it's expensive and like the US birth rates have been plummeting and people are like why

I could tell you why, because it's fucking expensive to raise a kid. It's difficult to raise a kid. The systems are not set up well for working folks to have kids.

It's just not. Yeah. But it is definitely a concern in the United States as birth rates continue to. What does the guarantee leave in a few of the notable countries? You're all notable, by the way, for all you out there in Bhutan listening to us. We actually have a lot of listeners in India, which I will share, 26 weeks at 100% pay. UK, 39 weeks at 30% pay. 39 weeks, wow.

Canada, 16 weeks at 49% pay. These are interesting. It's like I never considered that you would kind of cut the pay but extend the time. And then Bulgaria, 58.6 weeks at 90% pay. This was stand out the best so all you Bulgarian listeners 58.6 I did do a Bulgarian split squat this morning in honor of your incredible parental leave policies

So nine states currently offer paid family and medical leave. Nine states offer paid. Of course, we're in California. We're obviously going to get some of that. I just went through that process. There's two platforms, there's the SDI and EDD, and basically you go on there and say, hey,

My kid was born on this date, and you can backdate stuff. So Becca and I both went on there separately and said, hey, this is the last date we worked. This is how long we're going to take, and we're going to take the max. Fortunately for me, one of the companies I work with, I'm technically on payroll. Part of our agreement is that I'm on their payroll, but I get benefits through them.

So California will pay me up to a certain percent. Now, granted, I'm in a high income bracket, so they don't pay me as much as others. So I get the max there, which is, you know, I think $1,800 a week. up to three for three months. That's not bad. And it's certainly helpful for folks in California who need it more than I do. But my employer supplements the rest. So I get my full paycheck.

minus what California gives me. So my employer's not paying me as much, but I get the full amount as if I'm working there full-time right now. Okay. which is a great benefit to have. Do you want to share who your employer is? My employer is Bravado. Yes. Because I think that's kind of a cool thing that you do, a big part of your day-to-day. Yeah, yeah. And so, like, it's really cool that I'm able to make my full salary.

minus the California, and it also provides a benefit for them for me to submit. I could have done nothing and said, just let it go, and they would still pay the full amount, but they also get a tax. kick back from California by having me go through the actual California system interesting and it's a good look for them so benefits overall there's a lot of different types and leave and all these things we're talking about so there's

maternity leave paternity leave this is after you deliver your child there's fertility benefits that come before that a lot of companies are starting to offer especially in Silicon Valley we're seeing yeah

What other benefits? Is there anything I'm missing? Well, you nailed that. Some allow you to split up maternity and paternity leave. So like one parent will take the six months and then the other one will take the three months or whatever it is that they have so that you end up getting nine full.

months of someone at home. Some offer stipends for doulas, night nurses, these people to come help you before, during, and after. Some do require 10 years. You got to be at the company for six months or a year, whatever it is. Some of them do offer, whether it's formula or like even some offer stipends for surrogacy, things like that. And this is something I never really considered. The other piece being how much are they paying you? Are they paying you? A lot of folks listening are sales folks.

Are you getting 100% base and 100% commission? Or are you just getting 100% base? Are you getting 30% base? There was a wide range. So, you know, like LinkedIn, for example, you can take a month before having a child and then three months after. as well, which is interesting. A lot of times it's like you go on leave a week before. You sent me a photo, which was hilarious, of Becca in the delivery room on her laptop.

finishing up taxes. Meg and I were working on taxes in the delivery room. You guys were working up to the absolute buzzer, but then you stopped, which is good. Then we stopped. Thank God. I mean, tax day was coming up. You needed to get those in. We needed to get that done. Fishy kind of waited in there for a little too long. He was chilling and he got evicted.

so we knew when he was coming out yeah and any like standout companies I know you just mentioned LinkedIn I think Salesforce we've heard Salesforce has a great one I mean the joke is you go to Salesforce to have kids sorry Mark Sorry, Benny. No sorries needed. That's great. Yeah, no, it is great. It's like six months, which is crazy. Wow. I have some conflicting information. A lot of folks put it in there. And it also, again, depends whether you're Salesforce UK or Salesforce US.

but it can be up to six months and 80% of the base. And so like, You know, people will ask us, and one of the questions we got on here was like, what is the right amount of mat leave or pat leave? And I don't think there's a good answer, just that there should be some. You know, like, it is an enormous... burden to raise a child, especially in the early months.

Right? Like, you're trying to figure it out, especially if you've never done it before. You're recovering as the mom, first of all. It's a major surgery. Yeah. Effectively a major surgery that requires a lot of physical recovery. It's not like the baby's out, out, done. I'm out of here, back to Barry's boot camp. Let's go back, yeah. You know, as much as Becca would love that to be the case. But, you know, the lack of sleep, like the focus, you got to, like...

It is just, it's crazy to think that some companies, and I did get some companies on here, I'm not going to name and shame them, but they offer none. That to me is unacceptable. It's unacceptable. I completely agree. You know, Pat leave. A lot of these companies offer pat leave, which is great as well, you know, and they're, they're not all equal. And I think pat leave is insanely so, but somehow a bit tab, like some people think it's, Oh, you're the dad. You don't need to. Which is...

Which is like, yeah, it's like, feels so antiquated. It feels like the belief of the 1920s where it's like, dad takes his briefcase and goes back to work and comes home and mom's cooked dinner with her little apron on. Yes. You know, and I... You're seeing it more, I think, in tech, which is what we're primarily exposed to. Those companies do offer pad leave, but so many do not. And it's like, oh, yeah, I had my kid on Wednesday. I'm back in the office on Thursday. What?

No way. Like, there's so many things I get to do for Becca because I'm home. Like, she's got a baby in one arm. Like, hey, can you grab this? Hey, can you move? Like, you got to go downstairs to change our laundry.

She can't really go downstairs at the moment. I mean, she could, but she shouldn't. Doctors would say she shouldn't. And so there's tons of things I've got to support with around the house that like... if you're not on pat leave you can't carry her down the stairs i don't carry back down the stairs no no no she can walk down the stairs now but it's like she shouldn't be going back up and forth like she's now now we're two weeks out she can go up and down the stairs but she's only allowed to walk

three blocks right now oh my gosh and she tried to push it early and it didn't go well it hurt oh gosh so like but physically like you're you're just not there so like of course someone should be there to help out

And again, we're in the most privileged position of anybody. We work for ourselves and we can do whatever we want, but so many folks... you know, they're scared to even say they're pregnant because they're like, what is the company going to do to me? I know. One of my mentors who's a woman was telling me like I she's like I'm actually trying to have another kid but do not tell anyone right company like they can't know right and it's just I'm becoming more aware of

the sadness around you can't share this joyous thing because there's shame tied to it and oh my gosh you won't be able you won't be as good as your job like the more kids you have the more pulled away you are right less focused less focused There will be companies that are like, I won't hire you for this reason. I believe that is illegal.

Completely illegal. But that's true. They just are like, yeah, if your focus isn't 100% here, I don't want you. Which is also madness to me. I think if I could hire the perfect sales rep, there would be a sales rep who has a family. who has a need to perform. True. A desire to support their family and work for their family. It definitely opens up a whole new...

outlook on life and what you need to do to support people you love. I remember Simone, one of our first guests on Demoted, was saying, how his he wrote a book called the good enough job and his outlook on jobs and career has changed now that he just he actually just had a kid very like i think we were in like a group together we're like a parents group and he was saying i just the way i view my job monetarily has changed like i need to support this

Right. That's why I like my job is because I can make money to support.

Exactly. Here's a quote. This is U.S. Department of Labor. As of March of 2023, only 27% of civilian workers had access to paid family leave through their employer. and most rely on 12 weeks of unpaid leave offered under the FMLA. So you can take your 12 weeks of just not being paid if you want to. How gracious. So lucky. Like, so 27%, like that is still nothing. And I think we take that for granted in tech because it's like, that's a given. It should be.

I mean, rightfully so. The average amount of paternity leave given by U.S. companies is one week. Yeah, we'll see you next Monday. One week you were still blacked out. I don't even think you, after that one week. Yeah, every day in these first couple weeks is just a 24-hour day. Mm-hmm.

Like you just, you know, it's like you sleep for a few hours here, you sleep for a few hours there. Are you taking naps throughout the day? I'm not now. Now he's dialed. But like in the first week, it was, oh, I'm not worried about being up for three hours in the middle of the night. because I'm just going to sleep in the morning if I need to. When he goes to sleep, I'll just go back to sleep and it'll be great.

which is nice, but that's not a luxury people have. No. And so we have a couple of questions from listeners. I think we referenced one a bit earlier, but this first one submitted by new corporate mom. Can you share etiquette around maternity leave? Just got a new job. I'm so excited about, but I want to get pregnant in the next six-ish months. How soon is too soon to get pregnant? How many mat leaves is too many.

it's sad that people are asking this i know i i don't think you're obligated to tell anyone no and let's just start with you can get pregnant whenever you want yeah you can have a kid whenever you want yeah you can that's a beautiful thing do do what you want with your life yeah of course you can i mean i think it's like If you're working with people you like at a company you enjoy, you want to do right by them if you're going to be gone for a while.

You want to tee them up to be successful. It's a balance and there's sort of a nuance to it of how do you want to be received? Like, how are you going to set people up for when you're gone? And I, but I don't think you should feel shame. for wanting to have kids. No, and if your employer makes you feel ashamed.

a whole nother story. Yeah. It's like, if you want to do well in your job and you want to be working and like, you can do both, but it's like, take your time, get pregnant, go all in on that. And then, you know, come back. And if you have another kid later, like, so be it. So be it. I think, I think it can be hard. You know, if you're,

If you put on your founder's shoes for a second and you're like a four-person startup and you hire someone who's in a critical role and then they go on leave for four months, six months, that's tough. I get why an employer would be hesitant. in that situation but like the sales forces the Google's like no one gets a shit go there and have 10 kids if you want yeah so this next question is how important is the parental leave policy for choosing a job

How to find out or ask? Well, if you're a new corporate mom, it's very important. Yes. And I think it's so important to ask. Yeah. And also just do the research. Glassdoor, you know, these companies, indeed, they're posting things. They take pride in it. And I think companies that are hiding it or you can't find anything. Yeah. Safe to say it's not the best policy. A few policies, Amazon, 10 weeks for both parents, Facebook, six to eight weeks of maternity leave, like which...

Frankly, these are low. Very low. These are low in my opinion. Twitter, AKX, all new parents qualify for 20 weeks of paid time off. eBay. We're talking about eBay now. Okay. Mothers get 20 weeks of paid leave and other new parents get 12 weeks. So, you know, potentially I guess that could be, could be pat leave or. other other parent non-caring parent leave deloitte mothers get 17 weeks or 120 days and fathers get 11 weeks 80 days

So it ranges that like you should look into this. If you think you are going to be, you know, get pregnant or start a family and like some period of.

short to midterm luck. It just depends on the phase of life you're in. When I first started my job out of college, I couldn't have cared less about this. I'll travel across the country, I'll do whatever you want. I think now, obviously I'm not having a kid anytime soon, but just seeing, I mean, you go through it, my friends, getting into this phase of life. Yes, it's more important. Of course I'm going to ask. I just had a friend move.

companies because the fertility benefits were better totally and the company wasn't offering it that's a really expensive procedure yeah and companies that do yeah i'm gonna take that job of course and i think it doesn't really cost these companies that much these big companies in particular in fact it builds more loyalty and people are more likely to stay and like the cost of replacing someone is so high

like offer these benefits like offer these benefits i know of course it's easier said than done but i think we can speak to this question of how do you approach branch leave if you're self-employed you have bravado, which is kind of a slightly different position. How I look at this with my company, I have a company of three women full-time, myself included.

any benefits that I offer I also I get so I can't offer a lesser package to my employees because the three of us are For me as a self-employed person, I'm investing in the top package. my company because that's a cost that is worth it to me. I want to be able to go to any hospital. I want to be able to be covered if something happens.

the cost of living, getting more maybe liquidity in my paycheck to buy other things. I'd rather invest in these benefits as a business owner. Yeah. And I think like for us, I would still say when we're Other than the fact that we have these benefits, it's also just how do you negotiate when you go back to work, what you work on, you know? We really did plan ahead and say, hey, we are going to be fine if we don't work at all for the rest of the year.

we're going to be fine you kind of need to decide do i want to be working during this period do i not want to be this working i would tell you i would recommend if you can if you have the means to not work during that period and like They're only little tiny dumplings for so long. My mom has always told me, because she went back to work after having me, she said when you're a newborn, back then you had to make so many more sacrifices, but she's like, as a newborn.

they don't technically need you there. They're not like looking to mom for advice or needing your help with XYZ thing or navigating a school situation, helping through these more formative moments, I guess. And so she...

Her advice to me was, like, work while they're a newborn and then try to have some part-time workers stay home when they're in this more developmental stage, which obviously you haven't gotten to that stage yet, so it's different. Yeah, it just depends. I mean, like, I don't, you know, want to...

They're like as cute as they come right now. So freaking cute. When they just like eat and sleep and they don't have, you know, they don't even develop the ability to manipulate until something like nine, 10 months. So anything he does is just like survival and genuine, you know, like, and I don't really want to miss that. And like I said, I started writing some stuff this morning and we're kind of like slowly getting back into it. But when you're self-employed, it's just like.

Make a plan. Don't just kind of like free ball it and try to figure it out. You're going to be trying to free ball and figure out how to raise a kid. But you don't want to be stressed about the work part. as well so it's sort of just like set your set your parameters set your boundaries and just stick to that plan would you say assume it's going to be more demanding i think before you were saying you'd be back to work in a week yeah i mean not actually i admit like

And every kid is different. It's actually been much easier than I thought because he's a sleeper. Because he eats and sleeps. And he's kind of low-key excelling right now. I'm very proud of him already, clearly. But I know friends who have the opposite situation, a super colicky baby who just like cannot sleep and is just screaming and like inconsolable. But even in the desire to want to be.

more involved in parenting at this phase. I think you assumed that was a shock to you. Not a shock, but just... you're very much so like i want to be home like you're probably sitting here like oh i miss him kind of yeah i mean i'm like i'm glad to be back out and just like because i was You know, you're evaluating all these pieces of your life. You're like, what is important to me now? What do I want to do next? I also was sort of nervous about how do I get back into the flow.

They're so high performer, high speed. Yeah, I was just nervous to come back and sort of do this type of thing. Yeah, and ease in. And this is a great way to do it. It's like be around creative people, talking about whatever. It's low stakes. But I put on a suit. I wanted to put on a suit. Yeah.

it was just sitting there covered in plastic from dry cleaning despite talon saying the attire is sleep deprivation chic i know i was like i'm not i'm not sleep deprived i gotta dress up yeah i gotta just come out and i got So I got this watch for a little guy. So cute. Explain. Not cute. It's a gorgeous watch. Well, so I grew up reading the Tintin Comics Adventures of Tintin. And this is called a Moonwatch Tintin.

And so this was the watch I wanted to find and wear when he was born, which I did. And he'll get this watch one day. and so i'll have a little it's got a little red and white checkers around the outside it's an omega speed master which is they call it the first watch on the moon it says it under it actually was this type of watch was the first watch that was on the moon um but tin tin He also goes to the moon. And the red and white checkers is the same checkers that were on his spaceship.

And so I have a little Tintin spaceship that sits on his little like, I don't know what you call it. Nightstand. Nightstand type thing. I got this watch to represent him, and we're going to read Tintin when he's old enough to...

you know, have story time and all that. Digest a story. Yeah, and have that type of thing. Oh, that's great. I love that. So I went out and found this, and they don't really make Tintins. It's like I had to get a watch dealer to go out and find it for me. I was going to say, what's the search process?

He went far and wide. You can buy them secondhand. They don't make them anymore. They're kind of a collector's watch. This guy was awesome. He went all over. In fact, he found one. It got sent to him. He's like, look, man. This one's not it. He's like, this is not what I thought. This is not what I ordered. He's like, so just trust me here. I'm going to go find a better one.

Wow. His name's Bojung. If anyone needs to source a watch, this guy's a friggin' legend. He's in... Ross has all the guys. Shoot guy. Watch guy. I do. Restaurant guy. Soon you'll get, like, collector shoe guy. Yeah. This guy collects, this guy gets watches. He also collects quick aside music boxes.

Oh, wow. I'm like, of course there's a market for music boxes, like rare little music, like a little crank thing and plays music. One of my old boss's side hustles is selling baseball cards. Yeah. Do you collect baseball cards? I don't. My dad did. And so... My dad was a journalist and newspaper writer, but he wrote a story about this. I think it was for the Washington Post back then.

My grandma, his mom threw away like 250 grand of baseball cards. Like my dad had like the Babe Ruth. She's doing a clean out. She's cleaning it out. She's all one of these cardboard boxes full of baseball cards. It was like a quarter million dollars worth of baseball cards. Oh gosh.

Just tragic. Grandma, what are you doing? A tragedy. My dad collected this shit out of baseball cards. Let's get a deer demoted. Deer demoted. Let's do it. I work for a fairly large media company and I've been here for almost five years.

When I started with the company, I was able to move into a role I enjoy and the benefits seemed better, better healthcare coverage and more PTO. That is until I got pregnant and realized their maternity leave was not great. I recently told my company that I'm expecting we'll be taking maternity leave.

I was informed that I get six weeks paid with the option of an additional six weeks unpaid. If I get a C-section, they'll throw in two weeks at half pay, but I cannot take more than 12 weeks. My husband and I do okay, but I am the breadwinner, so six weeks at no pay would be hard slash stressful.

My husband also does not have a conventional job and his maternity leave is limited during this time of year, so we will have to put our little bud in daycare early. I recently learned that five years ago, our company didn't even have maternity leave. They went from zero to two weeks and then... Three years ago, it went to six weeks.

Now, I know many people do not even get maternity leave and I'm extremely fortunate, but for how large our company is, I'm a little fired up about the situation. I feel like I have done a lot here and there are growth opportunities for me, but I also don't want to stay at a company where I feel females slash growing families are not fully supported.

I would like to address this with someone in leadership, but I also do not want to overstep my manager. Any tips on how do you speak up on or advocate? Or should I just use my maternity leave and job hunt and get out? It's kind of going back to the question of

should you be asking these questions when you first start? Because you can make all these assumptions of like, oh, it's a great culture and I love the people and they're so supportive and then push comes to shove and you're like, wait, they actually don't support. families, maternity leave, all these things that are important to you that maybe weren't when you first started initially or you just weren't thinking about.

And I think your whole worldview can change so quickly, obviously. I mean, you and Becca were even, I think you talked about this on the pod, like, are we going to have a kid? Are we not? I don't know. Maybe. you did and it's like okay wow we have to kind of switch our thoughts around this right and it's so interesting it's just like like you said it's like I would have never thought to ask about this

Yeah, never. Like, enroll me, have a kid, like, hell no. No, never. I can barely take care of a freaking succulent. But I do think this is a hard situation. So what do you think about bringing it up to leadership? I think it can be done. I think it is just something that... It's not gonna happen overnight, but I think it's Like a lot of big issues, it's something you have to chip away at and slowly over time and kind of keep bringing it up without being aggressive.

One thing that I'll say is there's strength in numbers and I think aligning with the moms and the dads and the similar-minded people at your company is so important. I recently went on a brand trip and a lot of the... women at the brand I was working for were moms and they were talking about actually our policies aren't great and like they were able to kind of

commiserate on it, share with me, be like, yeah, we're working with the other women, we're going to try to say something, we're presenting something to leadership. That felt like a far stronger case, having multiple voices, saying something. Yeah, I think that's great. And similarly, do the research on the other company's competitors. folks in the space. This is not something oftentimes that a company will flip on.

immediately. Also depends on who's in leadership. Are there people who can empathize with the situation in leadership or not? I think the choice is yours on whether or not you leave. You have to decide. right because if you leave now like I would say for sure, stay through your mat leave, use that, get paid. And if you want to like look for jobs during that time, I mean, I would.

It's a hard situation, right? Because it's like, do I want to look for jobs while I'm trying to, in the first few weeks of my child's life? Probably not. So hard. Yeah. Probably not. But I do think it is worth bringing up with, like Nat said, other folks within the company, see if you can drum up support and bring it up in a... calm, thoughtful, you know. evidence-based way. I completely agree. It's

It's hard though. I would start the job search now. Yeah, and like you said, you don't want to overstep your manager. I mean, go to your manager first. I don't know, again, what are the relationships there? We just don't know what the relationships are internally. And again, it's all about tone. mg the cpo of doordash said on our podcast recently like So many times when you're feeling upset or something's happening or firing you up.

the last thing people think to do is talk to their manager when that should be the first thing you do. Yeah. They should be. Of course, I'm always blessed with a great manager, but I think managers, most of them, many of them want to support you. Yes. Want you to be happy.

I would hope for you. I wish you the best of luck and please keep us posted. Yeah. Let us know if you make any dents on that because if you have a strategy that ends up working, we're happy to share it on the pod so other folks can employ it as well. Here's how companies address parental leave. So, we're not going to pay you at all, but...

Yeah, I mean, take as much time as you need. Oh, you want to start a family. That's incredible. Feel free to do that anywhere but here. Oh, sorry. Yeah, no, you're looking at the UK benefits. If you just scroll down there, you'll see the US paid. Yeah, no, no, I know it's blank. Take all the time you need to recover. Assuming you have the kid on a Saturday, take that Sunday, maybe even Monday morning.

We'll see you on Monday afternoon. Congrats on that big promotion to CMO, Chief Mom Officer. We are so proud of you. Don't let the door hit you on the way out. Here is a company-branded edible arrangement. I know how much you love chocolate-covered berries. And if you could just hand your laptop to IT on your way out, have a good life. A couple weeks.

Why not a couple months? I mean, take as much time as you need. In fact, don't even bother coming back. Oh, your baby's so cute. Oh my gosh. If you could just make sure we covered everything in your job description here, we are going to backfill you. Of course, these are not how Demoted Productions LLC. runs. We have incredible benefits. They don't exist yet, but that's because we don't have employees and we don't make money. Yes. This is a passion project.

But... passion project so much passion in this project companies that do this truly it's like we're actually we're gonna do the backhanded kind of kiss kill kiss like yeah we're actually doing a lot like we're so supportive We got you. We love you. Yeah, we got you that binder with our company logo on it. Just think about the benefits. You got the lanyard, you got the binder, you got the wine opener. Like, hags, have a good summer. Yeah.

Hags dawg! You mentioned it takes you two weeks to recover. Anytime you go out now. Well, it does and it doesn't. It doesn't. It used to. Recently. That is until I found a little something called Z-Biotics. Ross and I discovered this completely independent of the pod. I think you texted it to me once. I think we were going out together and you were like, let's try this. Yeah.

I have been using it ever since. In fact, I brought you some to the recording today. We text each other as if it's some sort of secret deal because sometimes we run low, one of us, and the other's always there to support. I'm like, Ross, can you bring me a couple Z-biotics? I'm heading to a bachelorette trip this weekend. I got you, queen. He's going to be home with a newborn, so he's got me. So I don't need him at the moment. You don't need him currently, but what is Z-biotics?

So Z-Biotics is something called pre-alcohol. When you drink alcohol, it actually converts into this toxic byproduct in your gut. It's actually the buildup of this byproduct and not dehydration that's responsible for those tough days after drink.

Pre-alcohol produces an enzyme that breaks this byproduct down. And just remember to make pre-alcohol your first drink of the night. Always. Drink responsibly and you'll feel your best tomorrow. When I go on this bachelorette this weekend, one, I'm handing Z-biotics to all the girls. Two, we're ripping a shot of it before we go out. Yep. And three, then we'll have our margarita, right? You don't have to choose between having a great night or a good morning.

With pre-alcohol, you can actually have both. I never thought this was possible. Go to zbiotics.com slash demoted to learn more and get 15% off your first order when you use code demoted at checkout. Zbiotics is backed with 100% money back guarantee. And guys, companies don't do this if it doesn't work. Yeah. Right? They don't want to give you your money back. They'll refund it. No questions asked. So remember to head to zbiotics.com slash demoted and use code demoted at checkout for 15% off.

So, with baby fishing in the house, I can't exactly smoke. That would make sense. It does make sense. Yeah. I probably shouldn't be smoking in the house anyway, but... You're 36 years old, so maybe we should stop. Maybe we should stop. But I don't have to. Is that perhaps from the cornbreads organic THC gummies that they sent us? Actually, it is. And I actually bought a bunch too. So here's some. I brought this cornbread. These are the Blueberry Breeze THC gummies.

And they're awesome. And those hit great. They do. I actually used to. I couldn't figure it out for the longest time I was having allergies. Whenever I would have a THC product. oh really yes and I switched to these and I stopped getting allergies I'm not kidding. Oh my gosh. Yes. I don't know what's in the other stuff, if it's like synthetic or whatever it was. but I stopped, my nose would get all stuffy, and now my nose does not get stuffy.

It's probably because it's America's only USDA-approved organic THC gummy. Yes, and they have a one-to-one ratio of THC to CBD. Real THC, no synthetics. I think I'm not a doctor, but that might be what was making you. I genuinely believe that is the case. because I will have these a couple nights a week.

No problem at all. 100% legal hemp. Obviously, everything we promote is going to be 100% legal. Fast and free shipping. So if you're looking for a healthier way to relax and have a guilt-free good time, you've got to try cornbreads, THC, gummies. Right now, Demoted listeners can get 30% off their first order. Just head to cornbreadhemp.com slash demoted and use code demoted at checkout. That's cornbreadhemp.com slash demoted, code demoted. Cornbread hemp. Good life!

Good life. Let's do a little promoted demoted and we'll get people out of here. I don't want to hear about kids anymore. All the youth on this pod are like, this sucks. Promoter demoted holding babies. Here's the thing. I did not like holding babies up until I had one because I was scared I was going to break it.

Turns out you can manhandle those things. No, you can't. I'm so afraid. Yours is the only baby I've held of that age. Age being three days. I get it. And I was terrified. And it felt wrong. And then at one point... The baby's laying on my chest. I'm laying on your couch because I've overstayed my welcome by like three hours. I wasn't going anywhere. Becca's like, oh, I think he's choking on your hair. Oh, perfect.

great I killed the baby like of course I'm just in one relaxed position they're pretty resilient other than their heavy domes very heavy domes so I'm fully my cousin came over last night we were like do you want to hold him he was like no And that's fair. And that's fair. And I was like, totally fair. Because I was also, nah, no, I'm not. I'm going to go ahead and not do that. Baby scare me. You know what phase of baby I like when they're kind of

pudgy, I don't know how old this is, but like kind of heavy. A little toddler-y. Toddler-y, but not terrible twos, like crazy running around. Right, right, like about a year, a little year. Yeah. Kind of fat, like they can hold their neck up. Right. That's, I feel a little safer with.

Right. Far less breakable. But your baby's just like... I hold him like a football. And anything you put in his mouth. Upside down, face down, I hold his head in my hand, face like down, I mean his face like between my thumb and pointer finger. I wish I filmed it because you're swinging him around. It's just like... And you're also...

Yeah, you pat. Pat him on the back. Like, kind of hard. Yeah, that's what the nurses told me to do. I know, which scares me. I'm sitting there with, obviously, a full PhD medical background. I also have children of my own. I'm like, Ross, what are you doing there? Slow down. The nurse is tired. I was like, holy shit, what are you doing? And he's just like, squished face. He loves it. Makes him go silent. He's so happy. He loves it. Probably because dad's just.

beating your back. Once he gets that burp out, he's never been happier. Promoted, demoted, quickly turning off and on your Zoom camera when you take a bite of food. Talon might have seen me doing this on our demoted call. You did this, didn't you? I did this. I think it's like... so much better just no one needs to watch me eat on a call and i'm eating that's the only time i can eat so i'll turn off my camera to do it and mute

and then turn it back on. Do you agree? Or do you think that's... Yeah, it's hard because I'm like, it goes back to the jewel. We had the same question about turning it on and off for jeweling. Yes, jeweling. Well, there are a lot of people who do that. Yeah, like, well, when we're on calls, I don't care if you guys... I generally don't care if people are one-on-one is when it's kind of weird. If it's more than...

one-on-one with you, I would happily eat. Same, but we're an internal call. Right, but if it was like a little bit more formality, one-on-one, I wouldn't... But if there's like...

five people on the call if there's more than like if there's four or more I guess I would say yeah I'm okay with it because the box like someone's talking most people are looking there and if they want to happen to see me take a bite of a salad or something as long as you would leave your camera on yeah I don't I don't think I'd care I look good when I eat. I always said that.

I just don't want to see other people eat. I don't need them to see me. I'm turning the camera off. I'm not shoveling food in my face, but if it's an occasional bite of something, I don't really mind. As long as I'm not holding a burger. My dad recently told me someone brought a burger into the conference room and was just eating it on like a non...

lunch meeting and he was disgusted. Absolutely disgusted. I'm going to promote turning off and on your camera. I'll promote it too. I think it's sort of a feel thing, but if there's formality involved, I probably would. Just wait a few minutes. Promoter demoted calling someone zaddy. As a joke, I think it's hilarious. Not in a professional setting. We had this issue. We did have this issue on a write-in. Was she calling him baby daddy or something? She kept calling him baby daddy. Baby daddy.

That's weird. Yeah, I think it's funny as a joke. Calling someone zaddy, like, seriously is really scary. It's tough. It's tough. It's tough. It's so cringe. Like, I would just not do that. Like, please no. promoted by the whisper yelling. Oh, stop it right now.

I think Talon's bringing this up is because he's reading season two of SAD and there's so much stage direction of whisper yelling. Is there whisper yelling? There's a lot of whisper yelling. What does it mean? Like signaling someone to do something? It would be like, I'm on a phone call and then you're like talking about it. Gosh, stop it. Shut up. Shut up.

Anyway, yeah. I love whisper yelling. Or like when you're mad, it's like, Rosh, stop talking about it. I did this bit of my mom getting mad at me when I was a kid. That's like, Get over here right now. It's like, I can't raise my voice. The teeth are glued shut. Yeah, don't raise your voice, but you've got to make a point. You're clenched so tight. I'm promoting it.

I'll promote whisper yelling, clenched teeth yelling, everything in between. Promoter Demoted, I actually was asked this by my new hire who was curious about this. having open to work on your LinkedIn. This is a debate, a constant debate, even on LinkedIn. And Ross is the LinkedIn guy, so I put this on to ask you. Candidly,

I don't do it. Do you think it reads desperate? What's your reasoning? I think there's a piece of it that does. Okay. However, they have recently added a feature that allows you to be open to work just to recruiters. Okay, kind of a little more private. I like that. I don't need my network to see I'm open to work in terms of if I'm trying to leave my role. Open to work is kind of giving on a hinge profile, not looking for anything serious.

But like in the same way of like, it's a little cringe. It's like, why are you saying that? Maybe just don't share that with me. I'd be lying if I said I didn't feel like I don't care a lot, but it's not zero. When I see it, I'm like, uh.

Whereas just seeing a profile with a picture, and they're applying to the job, obviously they're open to work. That's the indicator you need. Do we need it in the profile picture? I like that they added for recruiters. Only recruiters would see it. I think that's great. Let's promote that. I'll promote that. I will absolutely promote that. Having your son learn to read before you. Fishy's gonna read so much better than us. Becca's a teacher.

I mean, Becca's an educator, of course he is. Becca's going to be bilingual with Spanish because Becca is going to read better than us. He's going to be like, but Auntie Natty doesn't read. Yeah. Auntie Natalie doesn't know how to read. Why should I? Auntie Natalie has something we call ADD. And we're going to say, that's why we don't want to bring her around here. She's a bad influence on you. He'll need it. He's going to need some of that like what not to do.

That he doesn't get from his dad already. I would love if he learned to read better than before you. He probably will learn to read better than me pretty quickly. I already know how to read, guys, even though I don't show it. Promoted or demoted this final one. Opening a credit card in your newborn child's name. Low-key hack. Start building credit. Low-key hack. No way. Yeah.

You're doing it? I have not done it. My parents did open a credit card for me when I was young, when I was not newborn. I think I was 12. Yes, same. Newborn is hilarious. Newborn is absolutely crazy work. This one's on him. That's crazy work. He's got a Costco membership. Exactly. Are you doing a passport?

We will do a passport. We just got a social security card in the mail, which is like now the Fed knows who he is. Well, so isn't that a crazy thing? Like obviously for our parents are like, oh, I stored the social security cards here. How am I supposed to hold this piece of paper for the rest of my life? Thankfully, we just took pictures of it and emailed it to ourselves. Of course, Becca has a drawer. Passports, social security, birth certificates, titles to our cars.

stuff like that. What would you do without her? I would be on the streets. You would. I'd be yelling at you from under a freeway. You really would. That's what I would be doing. And you'd be like, there he goes again. There he goes. So fishy Pomerantz, you can find his Amex gold. Run his credit. See if I don't rent an apartment under his name. Yeah, let's see. We'll see. Let's read a quick review from Apple Podcasts. It's good to read these reviews before...

We fully switch into a mom and dad show where we just talk about kids. So let's read these positive reviews. More corporate hotline, five star. My favorite episodes are the Scandalous Corporate Hotline Confessions. These make me LOL like no other more plays. Noted. We got another one coming up. And we got another one coming up. We got another one on the sketchy.

So thank you, Nicole NYC. We got to do those like from our stories. We'll do one of those in the next month or so. We definitely need to do that. All right. Quick shout out submitted by Kaylee the intern. I want to give a shout out to Lindsay F. She was a stellar boss last summer in my internship and introduced me to the pod. She was

Clearly a great boss if she introduced you to the pod. What's up, Lindsay F? We love you. Shout out to you. Shout out, Lindsay F. All right. As always, feel free to like, comment, subscribe. Hit us up on YouTube. Smash that subscribe button and then give it some maternity leave. Give it great benefits if you want to. Teach it to read. Freeze that IVF button. Freeze that like button.

Freeze the X and that like button if you would. Be so kind. Leave a review on Apple Podcasts, Spotify. Again, we are a mom and dad parent show similar to that of Miss Rachel. So that's kind of the direction we're heading. I would love to get Miss Rachel on this pod. She's way too big. but I would love to get her on the spot. Is she like a billionaire, would you say? She's not a billionaire, but last I saw, I think her brand is doing it like 25 mil a year. It's goals. That is goals.

And it's just like all YouTube. Oh, and I think she's actually just... Noah's Blippi, her competitor. You hate Blippi. Ugh. A buddy of mine from GSB, he is the general GM of all Blippi. Blippi LLC. Blippi LLC. They're doing about 50. That is crazy. And they just signed a deal with Netflix. Shit's going down. This is child content, which is... Like YouTube child kind of like... I still need to go look up the Snoop Dogg stuff.

Oh yeah, we did have a listener recommend Ross to watch, what is it called, Snoopy? It's like, I don't know, it's some Snoop Dogg children stuff where he takes pop songs and turns them into children and stuff. Anyway. Neither here nor there. Thank you guys for listening. Send us your favorite child YouTube show and tune in next week on Demoted.