And we're back with another episode of Cutting the Distance podcast. I'm Dirk Durham and my co host Jason Phelps. Hey, we're in beautiful Idaho bear hunting and you know when we get together, we like to talk to turkey. Well, we're talking bears, I guess.
Yes, yeah, yeah, yeah, we just went from turkey camp to Idaho bear camp.
Yeah yeah.
Dirk's leading this episode. But I'm gonna bring up a point that it's been bothering me all day.
Okay, let's hear it.
So we're close to the Washington border, and Dirk has a nickname for us Washington folks that come over to Idaho and invade there for us, and I'm just curious. Let us know, his nickname for us is apple maggot.
Wait, wait, pump the brakes. It's not necessarily a my nickname.
I didn't.
I didn't coin the phrase. That's just a common term among Idaho natives who are resentful of some of the folks from Washington. And I kind of like to stick a stick a knife in your ribs with it every now and then, just to be funny, because because I know it's a I can get some debate out of you.
Oh, yeah, it's it's all good. I just I wanted to where you know, it was hard working Washingtonians here spending our money to keep Idah's fishing game rolling, and we get rewarded with being called apple maggot. So I just it really hurt my feelings that they can wanted to bring that up. No, I'm just kidding. I even found it up here. We were hunting somewhere. There's a rock that's painted go back to Washington. They see, We've seen that. So that was that was a nice little touch.
It's a real thing. There's the Donata is a restless here. They do not they're not appreciative of There's some you know, there's some bad actors in every group, right, some of your brothers from your must have made some people mad. I guess if you will.
Oh, it's a right. Sorry, I hijacked your episode the whole, in the whole intro, I just had to get that off my chest. That was really been eating at me all day.
Oh that's fine, that's good. I like it. I'm about to sneeze, so I hope I can hold it together here. But today we want to talk about what's in our packs. A pack dump, if you will. So we get this question a lot what's in your packs? And I've I've get you know, it seems like it's on people's minds a lot, and everything from just the little nitty gritty details to like food and everything else. And you know, we kind of take it for granted sometimes that will shoot.
Everybody knows what goes in the pack, but I think everybody's a little bit different. And I've listened to other people's pack dumps and it's like, huh, that's interesting. So we thought we talked about ours tonight. Anyway, I think we kind of kick things off with day packs. I do a lot of day hunting tripping. That's where you hunt from a base camp. You throw all your gear in your pack that you think you're gonna need for
the day. And I want to be I want to be self sufficient that way, whenever I go off chasing bugles somewhere, I have enough gear to get me through the day and possibly all night. So I want to have all the all the little things. So we'll kind of go into it here. That way, I have a good, safe day in a comfortable trip. One of the first things, first and foremost in my mind, in my in my pack is my kill kit, right which everybody has a little bit of different opinion on. I've got four different
things in mind most of the time. Sometimes there's a little bit more, but most of the time it's the same stuff. A sharp fixed blade knife, as much as I love those like havelons or outdoor edge the replaceable blades which a lot of times and I didn't put this on here, but I usually have one of those
in there too for cutting around the skull. But that heavy duty, sharp fixed blade knife that's gonna get you through that elk, you know you're gonna be if you want to cut the skull off, if you want to twist in the hip hip socket, or if you're trying to do some stuff around bone. It's really easy to snap one of those replaceable blade knives. Do what do you do? You carry a fixed blade or are you a replaceable blade?
So I went I went through the cycle right of you know, havelon's becoming popular, outdoor edges becoming popular, And I was always grew up with a fixed blade or like a folding locking, you know, single fix. I would consider that a fixed blade, even though it's not a folding pocket knife. You know, we you're growing up with a buck knife for an old timer. You know, we ran those, and then I went from there into the replaceable blades, which were awesome there and they were sharper.
Then you could get the the other ones. And then now the last ten years, I've went back to just a good solid, you know, drop point fixed blade with a very dirty handle, and I just found I can work faster. I only need if you know, if that knife is sharp going into the day, I can get an entire elk out of it without having to touch it up. And you know, you touch it up and you're ready to go on elk number two. See, I'm a fixed blade guy, know.
Yeah, yeah, And that was one of my second things. You mentioned, the sharpener to sharpen your knife. I keep a work sharp pocket knife sharpener in my in my pack and that way if I need to touch up my blade a little bit as I work through there and a little hit hint or a tip. If you can keep your blade off the bones and out of the hair as much as possible, which is really hard, it'll stay sharper longer.
Yeah.
But you know, those are replaceable blades. As awesome as they are. That you got pretty trendy when those things kind of came out to post the picture of your finger that you almost cut off. Yeah, during hunting season, there was a lot of those pictures. And every year during hunting season we see a lot of those, So you gotta be careful with them.
Yeah, I have them. I have have ones that I keep, and I've got actually the scalpel blade with the scalpel handles now, but I usually keep those back at camp. They're like in my camp tote. If I got to get back and work on a head or kape the head out or do something, you know, that's I've just reserved those for working in intricate places and mess them with the head when I get back.
Yeah, I agree, because a lot of times, like after you've broke down the elk and everything's in bags and you've got it skinned out, and the last thing you cut the head off, and now you have to cut all that hide off, that off that skull, whether you want to, Well, maybe you're gonna leave the cape and stuff attached to the head and then you can do
that back account. But if you're gonna do it like a euro or if you're just gonna sell the horns off, I guess you could you want to cut off some of that hair there too, But but it sure is nice to have one of those have laws to do that, because man, all you want to do is sharpen your knife. Stirs sharpening your knife again. At that point, you're like kind of tired and you just like want to be done.
Yeah, And with CWD kind of sweeping across the country and all these new rules and transport across so a lot of times, you know, Euro's the new you know, skull plate. You know, when I grew up, everything was hacked off at the skull plate and you put it on a plaque. If you wanted to keep it now, I would say ninety percent animals we bring home come home on a Euro. You can do what you want with later, you can you know, use it for decorations
or whatever. But in the process of us, you know, dealing with the brain matter and get you clean the head up. And so that's where that havelong comes in and and the scalpel you know from their parent company Havels come in. Where I'm just using a little teeny inch and a half long scalpel blade. I can get in the ice sockets. I can get ninety nine percent
that meat off before we boil the head. And it just makes that whole process of getting these things, you know, So I don't get a ticket for you know, transporting the head you know, across, just get them really cleaned up.
Yeah. Yeah, And a little and one more little takeaway from cutting your hiding and meat off your skull. If you're gonna do a euro, leave the jaw bone in the woods. It it's it's quite a bit of a wait once you separate the jaw bone and the you know, of course the hide and then the tongue as well, that you got six eight pounds of meat and bone there that you're going to lighten that load with. So yeah, definitely another thing's paracrd para cord, fifty feet of para cord.
Now I know for a fact Jason Phelps does not carry a para cord because he always has to borrow mine. And I think that's his game. He's like, well, why would I carry it?
Because Dirk has I agree, it's I think smarter and not work harder. So you got to carry that half a pound the para corder.
On half a pound. It's just a few ounces minimum. Yeah, but I'll tell you I've, especially being a solo hunter man, para cord is so handy. I've killed a couple of bowls and some really really steep places where I had to tie the horns off to keep them from sliding down the hill any further. Well, as I worked him up, it was really really helpful. And then as you get your quarters cut off, it sure is nice to have
that pair of cord to hang it. I mean you can you can make kind of a wigwam type set up with old logs and sticks and branches and lay your meat on top of that, but to keep it cool and just get it off the ground. But a lot of times you'll poke a hole in your bag when you you that because there's a lot of little sharp stobs. So it's nice to to tie your quarter up into a tree. Now, some people will make a meat pole, right, are you a meat pole guy or you a tire right to the tree guy?
One time we've ever made a meat poles when we couldn't pack the entire animal out right away, and we're in grizzly country, so we'll go up, you know, up high and get that that pole made as high as we can. But you know, we found leaning logs that you can walk out or you know, get the get the meat up fairly high, and you know there there is always a chance of getting a predator on it if it's too low, you know, a bear typically or
a black bear. But in grizzly country we typically go higher and build a meat pole, but very rarely do we do it usually. You know, I've been fortunate as of late, we've had enough people around. We usually you know, three or four guys we can typically one trip that thing out and just be done with it.
Yeah, yeah, that's awesome. And you don't have to have a large tree to tire a quarter too yet, you know, you get an eight or ten foot sapling you can put that. You can put that quarter right on there and it'll hang up there just fine. Or if you have one good good solitary, you can hang them things around. Though, be mindful when you hang them because as the sun goes goes through its course of the day, you'll want to try to put the meat on the shady side
of the tree. That way, you don't have the quarter sitting on the blaring sun. And then last, but not least, meat bags. Yep, there's a lot of good, really high quality meat bags out there, whether you're using the black Ovis meat sacks, or you're using the our Golly, or you're using the caribou Ga. I mean, the list goes on. You know. It seems like five six years ago there was like maybe one or two options out there, but now there's there's tons. But get the high quality ones.
Don't don't get those cheese cloth style.
Yeah. I don't want to list the brand, but like I know, growing up, we always grab like the Allen or like the they're all rolled up like a sock from Cabello's, the Alaskan fly bags, and they'll rip and tear, and then you got a hole big enough for flies the blow through.
And in fact, I've had flies blow right through those cheese cloth bags before you think, oh, yeah, my meat's good. And then no, the flies will get through those things. So and you buy the high quality ones. As soon as you get them home. Take them things, hose them off from the washing machine with some a little bit of soap, some bleach, some oxycleane, wash them a couple of times, hang them. You're good to go. You can use those things two, three, four times if you take care of them.
Yep. To add on to the kill cut. One thing that I would recommend, and maybe you have it in a different place, is you could attach your garbage bags at this point. Oh, whether you are a garbage bag packer or not, you know, a lot of times you use them to you know, if you're gonna carry a hideout or pack a hideout or keep your bag clean.
You know.
I there's two routes you can go the garbage bag er out. And you know, we always talk about the little luxuries that we pack or maybe we're willing to pack extra way. I pack a sixty five liters seat a summit. I believe it's like the big River dry bag. So it's basically a garbage sack, but one hundred times stronger.
Heavy duty.
Yeah, heavy duty. And that's my one thing because I'm you know, not to get too much into how we pack, but I'm a I'm a bag packer, right, I don't I don't you know, I got a load shelf on my pack. I can go between my bag and my frame. But I'm a guy that's always just found, you know, open the bag up, throw your meat in there in that sixty five liter dry bag. And then since you're packed down and it seems to ride a little bit
better for me. But so I would recommend most people there's always a you know, if you're packing a couple of garbage bags, you're probably four to six ounces max. And bags. And this is a little bit of a luxury item. The sixty five liter you know, see the Summit dry bag is like thirteen or fourteen ounces, I believe, But it's it's nice because I can put the meat in there. It can be on top of my puffy it can be on top of my clothes, you know, if we're spiking out, it could be on top of
my sleeping bag. And I know it's not gonna get like everything bloody. It's it's been bomb proof, waterproof, so we in my kill case. And usually I'm I'm the most unorganized guy when it comes to packs, but I'll usually take like my game bags, put it in the seat. The Summit dry bag, I'll put you know, all my
stuff in there. If I I do pack pair of cord occasionally, it's when I remember to put it in and I'll use it once and forget, but I'll try to roll everything up in that, you know, the same work sharp sharpen and then everything's kind of self contained in that one bag.
Oh yeah, that's a lot of awesome, awesome tip. And first the garbage bags, get the contractor bags. We've been around those wimpy, wimpy wimpy, the hefty bags, but the wimpy ones. And man, almost anything will make put a hole in those things. And how you got blood getting all over your pack. And now we're not saying you want to
leave the meat in that that sack. That's just for the transport from from uh from the kill site back to where you're gonna hang it while you're packing the rest of animal out and then when you get there, you want to pull it out and let it air out. Ye don't leave it in there.
Yeah, even even when we're breaking the animal down, Like, don't put it in the garbage bag until you're like absolutely ready to leave, you know, transport, and then as soon as you get to the vehicle or to your end destination, take it back out so it can you know, moisture, you know, letting nothing dry out as well as cool down are the two most important things. So yeah, get it out as quick as you can. But it is nice for the transport.
I have a question about your seat a summit. Is it well, can you fit a full quarter in there? Or is it a bone quarter?
It's it's a full full bone in quarter. As matter of fact, if you don't have a bone in, you'd probably be able to fit about a half of an elk in. It does stack pretty vertical, so you know you have to. You can't just put a big glob of meat. You almost kind of have to force it into it shape. But you can eventually shake down about half of an elk. I'm into that one sixty five liter bag.
Okay, that's awesome. Some miscellaneous stuff. I like to keep my pack three extra mavericks, you know, elk diaphragms. I keep those in a little in a little box inside my in my side of my pack. Now. I also keep three around my neck or on my bit of harness. That way I can get to them, you know, readily available. But who knows. I mean, I'm a little bit forgetful sometimes. What if I forget my diaphragms at back of the truck, or what if I lose them and when I'm taking
a nap or who knows. I mean, I've lost all sorts of stuff in the lids. So having those three extras in your in your pack is is great and I've gone a long time without using them, but man, when you need them, you really need it.
Yeah, if you happen to lose your your carrying case or you know, something happened, you'd at least still be in the game because you'd have to be able to dig into your pack and find one.
Mm hm and then in a battery charger charge my my devices, whether it's my in reach or it's my my phone, which I'm using my own X map all the time to navigate and chase bugles. So having that that anchor battery charger, that thing works great. And there's a bazillion different brands. That's just the one that I got fat Amazon or something.
I think Anchor. And then some people will say it depends on how long I'm going, And this is where you have to make because I've got some ten thousand and I don't remember the measurement. It's like ten thousand milli amp hours or something watts. Yeah, yeah, so there's like the ten thousand, like the twenty five thousand, six hundreds,
like the big block. But I usually just tend to throw that in, you know, cause you're gonna be able to charge your phone five or six times and it just yeah, it might be another little weight penalty, but it's not too bad. And I know that it's gonna get me a bunch of charges, especially on a spike out trip.
Yeah. Now, headlamps I carry two. One is none, two is one, right, because I mean, anything can happen. These headlamps are sometimes not built the best. I mean you can spend a lot of money for one and have a malfunction, and then extra batteries for those headlamps just to make sure. I've got stuck in the woods without a light before, and it sucks and one time it cost me I had to stay the whole night in the woods. Another time I got out, but it wasn't real fun.
Yep. So yeah, I mean simple, I don't want to you know, it seems very obvious, but make sure you don't have a headlamp that's double A and triple A like you want to. You know, if you can get your devices to share triple A batteries. That way you have to you know, you carry one extra set. Hopefully each headlamp's got fresh batteries. Another tip is these things can Yeah, there's locks on them, right, you hold the two buttons down and you'll get the blue blah blah
you know, beat beep. One thing that I'll do is just turn a battery backwards yep. In your headlamps. You can't like you need to have. Yeah, you need to have your lights when you need them. And one thing I do is I I do have two, but I carry a little like basically it's the little teeny one I think is a petzel. It takes one bat or two batteries, I think, yeah, and then my black diamond.
I've used that, and then I've used like a lead lenser, but those typically take like four triple A little brighter light, a little heavier light. That's like my primary, and then I've got this little emergency one is my backup and in a pinch. Now we always have our cell phones that that light is a light, but it's not gonna like let you navigate ahead or you know, miss cliffs.
It will get you buy in a pin. But I always kind of consider that as like worst case scenario, I could use my phone light to navigate my way out a little bit.
Yep. I also I'll have a little small led handheld light too, just because so I on a lot of real brushy country and a lot of times the brush can be chessed to wist high and with a headlamp, your headlamp illuminates that brush, but it doesn't show what's underneath the brush, so you can stumble around a lot. So having that little handheld I can I can hold it at waste level or a little lower, and it'll penetrate under that that first illuminated brush, and I can actually see the forest floor.
So here's another pro tip. A lot of people like to wear their headlamps on top of their bills, which is great until you're looking for blood, until you're hiking out, and so pro tip is that either put your headlamp on below your hat so now you get full use of the light as you look down and look up, or turn your hat backwards and be extra cool while
you're hiking around the woods. Yeah, rally style, I mean it seems dumb, but like you got big black spots as you're walking around with things on the top of your bill. So it's like, I feel like an idiot, but my headlamps always below my bill. I know, I look so dumb, but it's functional. I can look down and actually see my feet, and I can look up, especially when you're blood trailing, and you know you'll figure
it out because you can't see very well. But this way you're not always putting your head straight down and be able to see. You can actually use all the light.
Or if you have a hard hike out then a lot of times I'll pull my hat off from tid to wipe the sweat off my head, and you're pull constantly messing with your light then, so yeah, it's good to have it underneath there matches, and then some kind of a fire start, like a fire accelerant. I like the trioxane fire starter bars. Yep, those things are awesome. Those save my bacon that night that I didn't have
a light. It rained all night, snowed, and I have some of those triox and everything was soaking wet, but those things they got a fire going and it was amazing. Yeah, and there's lots of different ones. These are like military surplus grade stuff.
Probably to heat your MRIs up is what they're originally designed for.
Right, Yeah, I don't think you want to breathe the dust.
No, you don't really want to touch the dust. You don't want to breathe it later. You don't want to like get at the blow around. But yeah, it will light instantly white or dry.
Yeah, it's amazing first aid kit. Now this doesn't have ibuprofen in band aids, Barbie band aids for your booboos. This you want to have some serious stuff. You want to have some good bandages and some stuff to wrap the bandages with. You want to have a tourniquet that could be a complete entire podcast in itself, which we should do one of these days. But you want a very capable first aid kit and you want it readily available. You don't want it in the bottom of your pack.
You want that thing, right, maybe even having it attachment a bag on the outside of your pack. Because let's say if you ram your your fixed blade knife through your your thigh, well you're gonna have to stop the bleeding with one hand and your other hand's gonna try to have to get your turning it out. So if it's in the bottom of your pack. You're gonna really struggle and maybe even bleed out. So have that thing easily.
Let your partners know where it's at. That way, if there's a problem and you're incoherent, they'll know right where to go in case they don't have one.
I probably shouldn't talk about first aid kits.
You don't even have one, So it's like the pair of cord.
My first aid kit is a zip bloc baggy. It's got like two vico in in it from thirteen years ago to kill some pain. It's got some duct tape in it so I can close any wounds that I need to and U that's about it. That's it, and so might be profion and titland all that I can. That's about my skills. And I'm like, I know accidents happen, but I tried to be like very cautious. I don't, you know, like go into the crazy exposure and you know,
broken arms, broken legs. I try to keep everything very controlled, you know, when we're breaking down an animal, like very cautious with the knife and where it's going and if I make this cut, and so I try to overthink it.
But I know accidents still happen. So I am taking risks, and I don't advise that anyone does what I what I do, but you know, I feel I feel like my level of first aid capabilities, like I can fix everything with a band aid and a vico in and then this isn't a good option, but anything that's life threatening, like even if you were putting a tourniquin on, I'm still you may be able to prolong it, but like I'm still hitting the the SOS button on my garment
at that point. You know, it's like that's my my but it may not be fast enough. You may need to be able to stop it in a different way. So, right, not great advice. Do not follow my my my recommendations for first aid kids.
I would definitely not follow that recommendation. Phelps You're better than that. You need you need to take a first aid class.
I'm first Aid and CPR, sort to fight concussion certified and cardiac or.
Is that the kit that they issued you?
Well, they tell nowadays you have to have like all these you have to have all these certifications to coach basketball, and so it's like I just yeah, but no, I should do better. But that's that's where I'm at right now in my life.
All Right. Something else Luco tape that's for your blisters and for taping bandages and works great for just about anything.
Awesome I keep mine. There's a little my pack has this little like bag that's made for extra buckles and stuff that SIT's actually above your bladder, so you can always get to it very easily. And my lecotapes in there. Because what I found is I'm too lazy if it's in the bottom of my bag or I don't know where it's at, or I gotta So it's like very easy to get to and you need not to. It's in our bag, but as soon as you feel hotspot, you need to stop at that exact moment and take
care of that. And so it needs to be easy to get too. And it's it's a life savior. It can be used to fix your feet, fix you know whatever, you know, cover wounds, it's very sticky, repair coats, you know, puffy coats, get ripped. It does all kinds of great stuff. Repair a mountain goat horn when it breaks off after a fall. It does all kinds of good stuff.
Yeah, stairy pin or some kind of a water purifier if you don't want to carry a lot of water with you. I can usually carry like a three letter three liter bladder, but there's sometimes where I think I may run out of water, so I'll throw the stery pin in and I've got a analgene or something. But some people just have their sawyr water filtered and their thing, and they'll dip out of every little creek they come to, and whether they're day tripping or multi day hunting or not.
So yeah, I'm a I'm a sorry squeeze guy. I love that because I'm very impatient. And if we're honeting elk, I want to be honeing elk. And so if we're crossing the creek, we'll dip our dirty bags real quick, throw it in and we're gone, Like I'll filter it later. So I'm a you know, multiple bags, like I might have some little one leaders, might have some three leaders, and we'll just throw it in the top of her bag, carry the extra and then filter at a later point.
I hate strypin. If I know I'm in country with flowing water like Washington or somewhere you know it's got good flowing water, I'll bring a stereypin. But if I've got to start getting in the puddles and stuff, the stery pin doesn't me know good because I can't stand to look at the dirty buggy water and then deal with it.
Yeah, you don't want a stereopin in New Mexico.
No, you want to go filter. And so it's I use I've got them both. I've even got an old Catadye pump filter, you know, worst case, I've got multiple options, but I tend to go at the sawyer squeeze most time.
Okay, So then trekking poles. I made fun of trekking poles forever, like who's this hippie in their trekking poles? And then I actually use some. I'm like, it will change my life.
Man.
You can be on some gnarly steep, rugged stuff and it just gives you that extra little bit of contact with the ground and maybe keep you from slipping and sliding.
And I killed a bowl elk one time. If I wouldn't have had trekking poles, it was so snow it was snowy, and I if I wouldn't have trekking poles, I could have never made it down the hill because every time I take a step, I just started sliding, free sliding, but I could I could sink those trekking poles in step by step and work my way down and got down in there and killed this big bowl. So definitely a believer in those things. I've always got
a rain jacket with me. It may look beautiful and blue outside when you leave camp, but I don't know how many times i've I've left and within an hour or two things cloud up, especially like spring, bear Hunt and Wyoming. It can be a beautiful day and within a couple hours, within the hour, big clouds will roll in and you're getting rained on. So that kind of stuff will save your life. And with that, I'll also
have a puffy jacket. That way, you know, if it gets cold, I can keep that puffy jacket on, I can put my raincoat over it. I'm gonna be I'm gonna be good. I don't want to get hypothermia. Yep. Last, but not least, in the miscellaneous is the many in reach. Many these things are great. It's a it's a good it's like a safety safety harness or a safety rope, if you will. And also it's nice to be able to keep in touch with with home. Let's say you're
gone multiple days from home. It's it's nice to be able to keep keep in touch with your family and let them know you're safe and find out how things are going there, and and just it just gives you that little peace of mind. And sometimes that's the extra little thing you need to have, that staying power. It's like, Okay, everybody's fine at home. I checked in. I don't I don't feel bad for being gone or whatever. It's it'll keep you in the field longer and make you feel
a little safer too, for sure. All right, food, what are you eating? What are you eating? Like snickers? Are you packing sandwiches? What do you what do you got for food?
It just depends on I'm so all over the place with what I'm eating on any given certain years.
So okay, let me ask this, how do you start your day with? What? What do you start your day with?
So start my day like when I wake up with food and drink in the mountain, like at home or in the mountains day trip, day trip, I'm probably not gonna eat anything right off the bat. I don't like to start on on any food, so I won't eat anything in the morning. I did, you know, I live my life like that anyways, as you don't try to
eat until ten or eleven. So I usually not eat anything in the morning, which is easy for me, and then I'll go into In the last couple of years i've been doing it, you know, more of that keto carnivore type stuff. It's tough. It's a very tough diet, but you can when you're burning so much energy, like I will throw more carbs and so it might be like peanut m and m's, you know something that's that way.
I love sour patch kids, but those are probably the worst thing for me as I'm as I'm hiking around, you know, blood sugars up and down and all over the place. So I try to eat like nuts, you know, mixed nuts, salty mixed nuts, because you need to have you know, the world's trained your salts bad, like salts great while you're up there high in around the mountains. You know, pepperoni sticks, lawn dieger you know, like air
dried meats. You know, hard cheeses, parmesan cheese. You know, whether it's like you know, nut butters on a on a whole wheat bagel, you know, for for lunch. For me, I I'm not that big into it. So I'll just literally before I leave the trail head like smashed my pack of six bagels, right, make it about a third the size that it just was. Throw that in the pack, you know, Throw a bunch of individuals serving you know, nut butters, whether it's like Justin's nut butter, whatever you
can get. You know, I will look at like last year, I ate a lot of those like fit Crunch protein bars. I'm like, maybe it's a healthy option compared to a candy bar. And then at night we we you know, if if you're back at camp, we try to cook a warm meal. It's just one of those picked me ups, you know, burgers or steak or you know whatever. It may be, something that's a pretty hearty meal and kind
of gets you ready for the next day. You know, if I'm if I'm spiking out, you know, it's typically you know, a mountain house or a peak type meal. But you know, this year, I'm gonna there's there's some companies that are making some different stuff. I'm gonna try to try to come up with something I can do there that's a little a little different, a little more that keto carnivore style and try to try to stay a little bit more on pacees. So my energy levels
are you know, are all over the place. But when I am eating car like, I just shoot. I'll make this easier rather than say exacts, like I'm shooting for somewhere around three thousand calories. I've did this enough, I've been there enough, Like you can go through all these different foods. But if I could eat three thousand calories and mixed nuts and jerky and you know, lown Dieger
and and some hard cheeses like, I'd be fine. So as long as I'm getting about that three thousand calories, I can just mix and match however I need to to get there.
Yeah, I am. Now do you drink any like supplements or anything in the morning? Are you a coffee drinker? What do you drink it? For? Saying?
I love coffee, but I'm also like very lazy. I'd rather get that extra fifteen minutes to sleep, So I usually roll out. And if I'm doing like taking any supplements, it's usually like I believe it's it's companies called Element, but it's Element t on the and it's a it's it's similar to like liquid IV, but I feel it's saltier, it's maybe a little more healthy. It doesn't have as much sugar in it. So I'm using a lot of
that element just supplement. I use a lot of that just in my normal daily you know, the non flavored or these other you know, citrus salts or raspberry salts, what is what they call their flavors. And that's really the only supplement I go to, you know, in in the woods to just make sure I got electrolytes way up. Our good buddy Ryan Lampers, like you know, I love I love his stuff when I'm at home, his electrolytes. I believe it's e charge. I believe is what it is.
But I don't I need single serving packets and I need to check in it maybe has them now. But at home I take the big scoop. We're out in the mountains, like there's little element coming pre pre package. So that's that's kind of really the only supplementation I'm doing.
Yeah, I'll start out my morning with like a thirty two ounce nwjeene full of wilderness athlete. I'll make a superman if you will that's the energy focus and hydrate and recover. And I feel like when I do that, I kind of set a good I put the best foot forward for the day. I'm getting hydrated, it's got lots of vitamins, it's got a little bit of caffeine and give you a little boost that way. Don't need my coffee. If I'm kind of a coffee addict. If
I don't have it, I get a headache. So that kind of gets me through that, the withdrawals and not having coffee because I'm like you, I'm kind of lazy. I don't want to get up early and sit around sipping coffee. So I start out with that. And usually I don't use a breakfast at camp. Usually it's something for on the go, you know, of some kind of a power bar, not a power bar per se, but some kind of a bar or a I've even packed
boiled eggs before, just you know, for the morning. You know, get get a few hours into the hunt and you feel like eating, then I'll eat something. And then for lunchtime, you know, I'll have like like you say, nuts and dried fruit and pepperonis and jerky. But a lot of times, depending on where I'm at a lot of times if I'm hunting by myself, seems like when I'm hunting with other people, I don't take this time to do this. It seems like I don't I feel too selfish to
take the time to do it. But a lot of times I'll take it. I'll make a bagel sandwich and it'll have meat and cream, cheese and cheese and a bagel, and I'll make two of them, one for eating a lunchtime and one's for when I kill my elk, and I'll eat that after I kill my elk and I've recovered it, and I sit there, you know, eating that settled down, get ready to start doing a bunch of work. Or if I didn't kill one, I'll eat it for the hike out, you know. And sometimes it's a long,
ruling hike out. But it's always nice to have a little bit of something that's that's delicious and nutritious, packs a little bit of punch tooth. So we talked about water leads or our water leaders are, or like a camelback or a water bladder or something I like a three leter one. Some people don't like those. They like
water bottles, whatever's convenient for you. I don't like stopping and pulling my pack off and digging around and getting a water bottle if I'm if I'm hustling to a bowl and I'm getting caught in mouth and like I've just hiked a whole bunch, and if i can take it, just a couple of little SIPs to refresh my mouth so I can call again. That's that's worth everything for me. It's and three leaders is a lot of weight, but I'll I'll pack that all day, every day. So here's
a question. Do you carry a pistol? And if if you did, or if you don't. If you do carry one or did carry one, when would you carry it?
So I carry when I'm in grizzly country. Okay, it's one a pistol and all depending on how nervous I am or what area i think I'm going into, whether it's bear spray and a pistol, But that's really a grizzly country. I'm not as worried even if I've got a bow or you know, if I'm rifle hunting or Muslim or hunting. I'm not worried about black bears as much, even though I think they still maybe kill more people
or have more attacks on than grizzlies. But grizzly bear countryes just got to me, you know, has me on edge a little bit and such. Typically when I will pack the pistol and also bear spray.
Yeah, yeah, me too. A lot of times, I yeah, I won't pack a pistol at all or bear spray unless it's bona fide grizzly country. I'm I'm not too worried about the black bears, not too worried about wolves, mountain lions a little bit, but still I think they're more curious than anything. So now I will say it.
That's if I'm hunting with another person. If I'm by myself, a lot of times, I will carry a pistol just because if I get injured and I have to sit out there for a day or two before help arrives from my enreach message, I want to be able to fend off predators are going to come along and find some wounded guy that's covered in blood and ready to eat, right, So I will carry one if I'm by myself a
lot of times. And it kind of gives you a little peace of mind too, and you hear start hearing weird noises, you think, is that Sam's blatch.
Yeah, I'm gonna nobody think I'm gonna go wait crazy on this. I are good, buddy, John Davis. I think when we were in you know, we were in the Bob Marshall Deep and you know, he packed a just a forties semi automatic, you know, not what people would say, you know, could have issues or whatever. And he said he packs more for crazy people he might encounter than the Bears.
You know.
So there's like there that you know, that's another thing, Like, you know, crazy things happen up in the mountains. People go to the mountains for weird thing. You know. It's like he's like, I'm you know, and he's a I think he's the he's pretty high up in the sheriff department, thereat of you know, in his area, and it's like, you know, he's like, I'm more worried of you know, dealing with you know, whack jobs out there than it is you know the Bears.
Yeah, there's been several times you're reading the paper or the news where some person on drugs or some murder or something then turns up in a national forest somewhere and causes problems there. So yeah, you never know. You want to keep a bestel close by so that way makes you feel a little better out there. Okay, now let's talk about bivvy bivvy packs. What's in a bivy pack?
So I would I can assume for you and for me, it's going to be about the same kind of stuff plus all your sleep systems, cook systems, stuff like that. How big of a backpack do you normally would you normally use? Are you going in for like three or four days at a per trip?
Yeah, I mean we've went anywhere from three days that I've been ten days on one one trip, like ten days of zip blog bags with a food like it loaded up. I don't plan on coming out unless I absolutely have to or it's just not as good as it was at a different time. Yeah, everything stays exactly the same. Besides the number of bags of you know, the one gallons of bluck bags is how I set
my days of food up. And then I'm adding a sleep path, I'm adding a shelter, and I'm adding a my ground pad, sleeping bag, shelter, something to cook with, yeah, I mean jet boil As I mentioned earlier, it depends on what kind of crazy year I'm doing. Enough, I need to warm up water. It is nice to have a pick me up, you know here there. You know, it just depends. But yeah, I carry an MSR reactor. Now. You know, everybody calls the style jet boil, and that's
where we all kind of started. But those MSR reactors seem to be a little bit faster, a little more efficient, and can really just kind of get cranking. So yeah, for tents, it just depends. I've got I've got a Cafaro saw tooth, which is more of a teepee style with like a titanium stove. I've got to seek outside that uses cuban fiber that weighs under two pounds, with a center carbon fiber pole that sleeps four people. I've got a single man big agonies. I've got a three
man Hilleberg. So it really just depends on weather, wetness, you know, cold, who's all going you know, how much vegetable space, and so I try to make my decision based on that shelter. I have a Marmot fifteen degree helium and now I've got I've got a new stone Glacier fifteen degree down. I typically just grab that Stone Glacier. It's a little warmer now, you know, the Marmot's fifteen
years old, that Stone Glacier's brand new. They both kind of meet that Ean rating and those for those that don't know, it's a rating that actually it's not just that you're going to survive. So I don't want a sleeping bag that says I'm going to be comfortable or that I'm going to survive at fifteen. I want to sleep in big rating. This is I'm gonna be comfortable.
So both those are ian rated to fifteen degrees. It means if it's fifteen degrees, I'm still very warm and I'm not waking up freezing death versus some people's fifteen degrees means you can survive there and you're colder than heck at thirty. So those are two sleeping bags all grab. I do have a KAfari sleeping bag, but that's typically
my base camp. It's got synthetic fiber, so I don't worry as much asf I get wet around the truck or you know, if I'm in my you know, if I'm in my canvas cutter, sleeping at a trailhead or whatever, and then sleeping pad. I've kind of all over the place. I was a big agnes Q core guy forever because three or four inches off the ground, you know, they're a big puffy pad. But I had too many of them leak, and so now I'm back to a thermorest
X something something something. It's bulletproof. It is a little bit louder.
It's cracly, the weird little little pockets.
Yeah, it's got the reinforcement and it.
Almost reminds you like the packing material with the little air bubbles that you al they're like across the hexes.
No, no, no, no, that that's a I believe that's a different brand. This one's a solid pad, but it does have weird reinforcements and it's almost like the air's chambered in and routed in a certain way. But at first I didn't know if i'd like it because it does crunch like a potato chip bag at times. It's a little noisier. But I sleep great on it. It's got good our value, and so that's really my system.
It's it's pretty pretty simple. I went ultra light weight on everything that I've gotten, so I can literally go from you know, aside from adding about a pound and a half to two pounds of food per day, I can literally add those three items and within about six pounds be ready to go overnight.
Yeah. Nice. Do you carry a pillow?
I do. That's one of my other luxury items is a little seat to summit blow up pillow. And another pro tip on those is do not blow them up till they're completely blown up. You go about five eighths full and it's a perfect spot.
Yeah, yeah, test it. Okay, let's see what else here, and you're you're just gonna eat the probably the same kind of foods throughout the day, the same old like a bay or or your your nuts and berries and twigs. Yeah, nuts and berries and here's pepperonis and stuff.
Yeah, yeah, I don't change it up too much.
Right on, how big of a bag are you using for your for your multi day trips? Would you say, what would you recommend? You know, if somebody's like, you know, I want to get into that, And I don't know how big of a bag to buy because there's a lot of options in whether it's a thirty five hundred to fifty five hundred, seventy five hundred, like all these different numbers of cubic inches.
Yeah, I mean this is my recommendation. If you're going to just have one, if you got the luxury to have two, then I would go like three thousand, seven thousand. If you're gonna get one, I would definitely go five thousand plus. That gives you the ability to overnight put all of your extra clothing, all of your sleep gear, all of your food, all these things we've been talking about. So I'm a big PAC guy like some people like organization that I mentioned earlier, Like I'm the most unorganized
PAC guy. Like I literally shove everything into the bottom. You know, lights uff goes in the bottom, mid to heavyweight stuff goes in the middle. You know, food goes on top. I really just stuff my stuff. And so I'm a guy that wants a big single cylinder bag I run. I believe it's the Cavern by Kafaro. I think it's like seven thousand cubic inch plus. It's real tall. It's got like a snow collar that comes up so I can keep going vertical. It's got a spotting scope
pocket on one side, and that's all. That's literally the only pocket I've got on the thing. I don't even run a lid. I roll the snow collar down. So for me, that seven thousand cubic inch pack is my day pack. That seven thousand cubic inch pack is my ten day expedition pack. So don't I don't switch bags depending on the on the pursuit or the amount of time. In my opinion, you might save ten to you know, fifteen ounces, maybe you know a half a pound and
a pound on going to a smaller bag. But with the way the compression straps on that, I can literally make that pack perfectly flat for a day trip and it doesn't cost me hardly anything.
Yeah, I use like a it's a forty four mag by Kafaro, and I think, what is that thing? Is it like cubic kinches? I feel like it's bigger than that. But but man, when I get that thing loaded for three or four days, it's tight. It's really tight. So I would I would always recommend go on the high side. I've had a fifty five hundred pack before and it was it was good. I could fit stuff in there really well a lot more comfortably. It doesn't feel like
the thing's going to pop at any second. But and then my day pack, you know, a lot of times I'll run a separate pack for that. And I've used that Striker XL by Kafaru quite a lot in the last couple of years, and it's about two thousand, twenty two twenty three. It's it's packed to the gills though it's it's packed tight with all that stuff I listed, it's it's a tight pack. So I think that twenty five hundred to three thousand would be a good one
for a day pack. But like Jason said, if you don't have the luxury to have two different packs, I definitely get a big pack and then you can always just crunch them down for your day trips. And they're really versed all that way. So all right, Well, anything else you'd like to go over?
Tools? Real quick tool archery season. I've got an aland ranch set and with my thumb release, so I shoot a thumb release, so like my chest harness, which is something I also carry, I'll keep my aland wrenches and my my release on my left side. And I'm more nervous about my equipment not functioning than i am my
health so I will pack like floss. If I hadn't to do any like string repairs or bow repairs or like get a serving to stop running or whatever you would call that, I will carry like the real floss, not that stupid ribbon stuff that you get nowadays. Carry
carry some real floss. And then so that's kind of my archery tools in my ability to fix or tighten anything that's loose, you know, along with pitch and and some floss you can usually get by or maintain and then rifle season, you know, if I'm changing my kid out, usually I just got my Alan wrench, the one Allen
wrench to mess with my scope. I've usually got like a dime in my pay in case I need to turn something, you know, for god forbid, I needed to do something, you know, I wouldn't shoot it an animal, but I'd have the ability to change or take my scope apart if I need to, or my my knobs. I do carry a little teeny flat head like a little multi tool, and then it's got a reversible phillips
on one side. And that was more to help with taking care of camera gear, like if I need to get something done or you know, something on my headlamp is, you know, goofy, Like I had one of my black diamonds, had like a flathead screwdriver that would sometimes get too tight and I couldn't like get the neural to so I'd grab that little I have a little teeny screwdriver that goes in my waist pocket. Chapstick for me. I'm
I'm a Western Washington high humidity guy. As soon as I get over the top of the pass, like my lips fall apart. So I've always got like chapstick for
me in my pocket. Yeah, I think rangefinder, binoculars, you know, stuff but not necessarily in your pack, but on me at all times when I'm hunting rangefinder and I switch back and forth whether I'm rifle hunting, archery hunting, whether I'm going with like the RX five full draw or going with you know, something like the loopholds new what is it, tv R five thousand, not one of the exact model number, but they're.
The new rangefinders, a TVR five thou which is pretty badass.
That's awesome. So I know we weren't talking exactly about pack dump, but those are the things that are also like I just move those to my chest, my chest hardnesses. I'm hunting, and and you know, the tools are. Like I said, I probably focus more on the effectiveness of me being successful and my gear functioning than I do about my own health. So I do, you know, spend a little extra space and time on making sure I've got tools you know available.
Yeah. Yeah. I run one of those chest drigs too, like an FHF chest rig, And in my left pocket there's a I'll have Carmex in the tube because in hot weather, the chap sticks out the stuff that you can little you can turn the little wheel and it comes out more. Those things get hot and sometimes melt, and I don't like that gooey stuff all over my stuff. So the little Carmex tube that things that stuff works really good and it's good for chapped lips. I also
keep one of those headlamps I have referenced earlier. I keep one of those in my chest pocket. That way I don't have to dig for it. You know, there ain't nothing worse. And when you're trying to hike out it in the evening and have to stop and dig through your pack and find your find your headlamp if it's right there, readily available on your chest. It says like yep, right here.
And then yeah, I guess the other thing in my rifle. I just found this out because I was switching my packground because we're archery hunting here in Idaho right now. I have a couple I just throw a couple those little cardboard squeezes of like your three M ear protection.
It goes in my left chest pocket when I'm rifle hunting, just in case some man eats hearing protection or I lose my you know, I usually wear one of those I don't know, I call them timber cutter ear plugs, you know, these kind of strapp around your neck and got the hard orange, you know, so you can quickly put them in. But if I happen to lose them or didn't bring them on that hunt, I've got a couple sets of ear plugs I can hand out to people before we shoot. Yeah, yeah, that's a good idea,
that kind of. I can't think of anything else that's in or on my pack. Like I said, I usually take and replace like extra buckles or extra straps you know you carry perri cord. My pack does have I have two extra like scent straps that will. You know, I can compress from different angles with different buckles, So I do have a couple of buckles and straps in there. Yeah,
I think that's really everything in my pack. For most situations, I can't think, you know, if if I know, you know, the Idaho deer hunt me and Tyson went on and what was it twenty twenty one. Knew we were gonna need to be a building fires and we knew there were like beetle killed timber in the area needed to make firewood, so we brought like the wyoming saw the
little you know. So like there are times, depending on the hunt, we usually keep this sort of stuff at the truck or in our possible's tote, but you may reach in there as you're grabbing your cold weather tent and you're switching that out, you're grabbing the wyoming sauce. So you have the ability to to you know, adapt on a hunt where you know you're going to be
in twelve to eighteen inches of snow. Yeah, so there's things like that where you know you may grab a wyoming saw or whatever to deal with the situation.
Yeah, that's that's a great idea too, or to cut horns off. You know, some people don't want to back out at the skull. They just they don't want to skull cap it. So I don't typically carry the wyoming saw with me that I go back on the last trip with with the wyoming saw to cut the rack off if I were to do that. But yeah, just more than anything, just refine, you know, go through your stuff. Refine. You can put a lot of unnecessary crap in there.
And if you if you've been carrying it for a while and you haven't used it, maybe it needs to go. Of course, not not the first aid stuff, but if there's stuff that you just haven't seen the utility out of, then I'd pull it out. And you can get pretty bare bones with having some good quality stuff in there that they'll make your day comfortable.
So and do not forget your wind checker.
Oh wind checkers.
That's that's sitting on the side of my bino harness and it's probably the most important. I use that wind checker more than any other thing I've got on me at all times.
Yeah, so that's one thing I missed a lot of times. You'll have a second one in the pack because they wait nothing and they'll have the one I'm using actively. I don't know how many of them stupid things have lost, though it's easy to lose them, especially the ones they that aren't white, the ones that are.
Darker color ca the camera option. Yeah, where the heck did.
That thing go? So but yeah, anyway, well, thanks for chatting about that tonight. If any of our listeners have any questions about this kind of stuff, go ahead and email us at CTD at phelpsgame Calls dot com and if you want to call in with your question, I'll play your question and on the air and we'll answer it the best of our ability. And the number is
two zero eight two one seven seven zero one. Get about three minutes to put that message on there before it cuts you off, so I'll keep your message your question quick. So thanks everybody, and we'll catch you on the next one.
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