Ep. 88: Elk Addicts Q&A

you ROX season as well. A lot of questions starting to roll in, So we're gonna jump right into the Q and A, which is brought to you by Pendleton Whiskey.

being a Washington resident definitely prepares you for this. As far as the high pressured from hunters, you know, we've got a lot of hunters out in the woods and not as many elk. The densities, you know, fairly low if you're in general over the counter areas, and so I got a lot of got a lot of familiarity with that, and then a lot of the spots I hunted in Idaho as I was kind of starting to go out of state and get that figured out, as well as some of the places I've got to hunt

in Washington and Oregon. You know, high wolf populations, high cougar populations, you know, seeing those on the ground have an effect. It does, honestly quiet the elk down a little bit. But I also am of the opinion that during the rut elk are going to be vocal. They may not bugle as much. They may be agle quieter, they may be agle less, they may be do more, you know, doing more of the bugling at night, but

they will still bugle. And you have to take advantage of those times of day or maybe that one or two beagles that they're going to give you the audible you know, Marco Polo game. They're they're letting you know where they're at. And so what what I like to do is I'm more more cautious and conscious of when I'm going to bugle. You know, It's like if you only had two or three bullets in your gun and that's all you could take with you, You're gonna take

a lot more. It's going to be more calculated when you're going to take a shot. The SHOT's got to be perfect right where. It's kind of the same way if you're in these high pressured areas, either by predator or hunting, is I'm I'm not going to bugle as much as I normally would if I thought I was in an area that you haven't had very many people through it, or I could get a response from a bowl.

So I'm I'm more calculated. I'm going to try to get to a spot, you know, early in the morning when I feel like I've got a better chance of getting a response before those elks start to move down into the timber, before they move off to their betting. I'm going to try to take advantage of those situations and use my my uh my bugles more sparingly. I also feel, you know, we we get accused of very

aggressive elk hunting systems. And this is another great reason why is if you are assuming that these elk are tight lipped in an area and you do get an answer like the only the only information I've got to go on that elk is where he just bugled from. And if I don't think I'm going to get another answer,

I need to be very aggressive. I need the number one always make sure the wind's right, but I need to close that distance and get to that elk very fast, because if he's not going to make another I might not know where he's going to be at in ten or fifteen minutes or what direction he's going to. So I typically aggressive, but I'm even more aggressive in these situations because I need to. I need to to get in there before the least amount of time has passed.

Gives me the best chance at getting to that that bowl's location. As far as cold calling, though, I'm I don't. I do very little cold calling. And when I say cold calling, I assume is cold calling. What I consider cold calling is not a lot of sign. I'm not just gonna pick a spot in the woods. In cold call, Now, what I would say what I do is warm calling, which I'll maybe assume this is what Justin's asking about.

Is there are there is some sign, there's some fresh you know, scot, there's fresh elk tracks, there's fresh rubs, whatever it may be. But maybe there's not an elk bigling around me. So I would consider that like warm calling. I'm not, like, you know, I'm not hearing beagles, but there's sign that the elk are being there. So I'll kind of say that's what he's assuming when he says cold calling, I just don't do it a lot. I

want to know that there's an elk around. I want to know that I'm working something that has a high likelihood that there's an elk with an earshot. A lot of my cold calling methods or warm calling methods, whatever you want to refer to it, as as I was growing up, I would do this a lot as I was trying to learn, and a lot of times what would happen is you'd maybe call on a spike that you know, a satellite that was way off or betting way off from the herd, but you wouldn't get a

whole lot of responses from the herd bowl. A lot of times, I also felt that like the best use of my time was to not sit in one location and try to try to lure a bowl to that I'm better off covering more ground with my feet and finding elk that are lukewarm or warm or even hot, willing to respond or find warmer sign you know, fresher elk cracks, fresher crap, you know, elk scent, you know, you can you physically smell that they're around you somewhere.

I prefer to use use my time to go do that. Now, if I was to warm call or cold call, I usually start more so it's more of a you know, iterative process. I will start with cow calls, like the lowest threat level cow calls, Hey, is there anything around? I will you know, louder cow calls, maybe louder sequences, and a lot of guys will overcall during these. I set my watch to every five or ten minutes, like

a cow call, you know, maybe a louder cow call. Now, if I'm not getting any responses or not starting to hear anything, I remember think, you know, these bulls will come in silent at times, so you're not always banking on hearing anything. But if I give it a half an hour and I don't have a better plan, I will typically you know, start to add bugles in at thirty thirty five, forty minutes, see if I get a

response there. And if I don't see anything by an hour, like that's as much patience as I have for a warm calling set up. I'm gonna move on. I'm gonna go find fresher sign. I'm gonna drop into the timber. I'm gonna do things that I feel put the advantage in my favor more so than sitting in a spot

calling elk. Now, with that said, I recognize that there are people that kill elk every year with warm calling you know, setups, or calling over wallows or what we would consider you know, calling over spots that elk have probability to go to. Me personally, I'm out there trying to find a bowl that's willing to be agle. Now that's my answer on that one, for what it's what

it's worth. Justin Stevens also asked a question on gutting versus gutless methods, the pros and the cons, and then what happens if you're solo hunting, so I will no longer gut an elk unless the situation is, you know, perfect. Last year, I did kill a bowl near my house, which was in a spot where I knew I could

get a side by side to it. I I elected to gut that elk, leave the guts out in the field because I was going to take it back to our our meat processing shed, our our our freezer are cooler, and we're going to take care of it, you know, a whole. So on that one, I did gut it, But ninety nine percent of the elk I kill nowadays, they're all going to be gutless it. I don't have to touch the guts. I don't have to deal with that. I don't have to deal with, you know, any of

the insides. I can get to everything on the outside, you know, he asks on if you're solo hunting, the biggest pro is that you don't have to move the entire elk as it as it, you know, as it died there. You're able to most of the time, I would say, there are a few cases, you know, if they get wedged under trees or logs or against something. No matter how they're laying, you'll be able to get off half of the meat from one side. That's gonna be a lot easier for you to move around to

get to the other side. So that's one of the biggest pros. There aren't a lot of cons anymore for me on on on, you know, gutting versus not gutting. There the gutless is has all the pros and none of the cons. By time I gut them, you know, people could argue that you let the animal cool down sooner. By time I've got the elk, I've already got a half off and quartered out, and I'm already onto the

other side. So the meat is cooling faster. Doing gutless, I don't have to worry about any you know, enters getting on any of the meat. It's cleaner. I don't leave any meat behind. I can get to the tenderloins, you know, blow the blow the spine and and you know, going in from the hip socket and kind of just going underneath of that. We get them out very clean, get them out whole, no damage.

take care of an animal when I'm doing gutless. But I've got this thing broke apart, you know, halfway by time I could get it. It's it's clean, very easy to do. I'm working in manageable pieces. I don't see any reason why not to do gutless. And the biggest pros if you're solo hunting, you're not moving near as much weight by yourself. You're able to at least get half of the elk, you know, taking care of before you got to try to roll it over. So it's usually a lot easier to get that thing in the

position to do the other half. There as a joke on here at the end. Is the Maverick truly the best diaphragm call on God's Green Earth? Or is it all a George Show's funded conspiracy. So I always have to give Dirk a little bit of a guff. This year, Dirk is getting just destroyed in the Pink versus the Maverick sales. So I do want to point that out. I'm not competitive at all, but he's just getting crushed.

And yeah, I don't know is George Show is What I always say is Dirk is able to rally like a lot of the junior high girls that they like to l hunt and I think he's got an ability to market to that group and that segment, and Dirk really gets them going. And sometimes you can put some pressure on the Pink. But no, the Maverick is yah. I mean it's it's seventh or eighth in the in the lineup. You know, everybody should try the Pink and

they all getting aside. It's a great call. It you know, it works, It works great for a lot of people. I tend to like a little bit lighter latex is why I like the Pink. But no the Maverick's great. It just really and I don't want to sound like a used car salesman where I'm telling people to buy lots of different calls. But it really does come down to the style of coller you are and what type

of call you prefer. But no, I would say the majority of what we make will fit the majority of the callers out there, in one one way or another. Next question from the Elk Addicts forum comes in from Gordy Doug. When Elk are in close and he says in parentheses, in some videos I see hunters talking, it seems to me you should be dead quiet. Does this affect your stock? So I would say yes and no. A lot of times we're trying to communicate with the caller.

We're trying to communicate with the camera guy what we see. I after doing this enough, you know what you can get away with.

and I'm I'm more so. I don't want to add turkey hunting in because we're all dead set on elk and we're getting excited for elk, But on the turkey calling side, I'm way more reserved.

and you can get away with a lot. Is the bulls coming in Now you put me in a situation where it's dead calm, I'm gonna probably tend to be more quiet. Are there situations where you won't bugle? Yes, there are situations. There aren't seasons or tags that I won't if the bulls are rudding or are bugling. My twenty twenty three Oregon hunt is a great, you know,

a great example of where I won't bugle. You know, for those that don't know, I had a great tag in organ bulls are very vocal, lots of line of pressure around. Everything's kind of working. But me and Dirk talk multiple times, and we run a very similar system that we have so much trust in our system we hardly unwaiver from it where we're unwavering. And this has worked enough times. If we run this plan enough times on enough bulls, it's eventually gonna pay off for us.

So last year in Oregon, I'm nine or ten days in, had lots of opportunity, lots of things going our way, but I just couldn't make anything work. I would get the wind right, move into one hundred and fifty yards, do everything like I was supposed to.

Same similar results, Like maybe you would get a bowl to pull your way a little bit and then take off, or maybe you would get a bowl to pull in, you know, or some cows to come your way, but just wasn't working out in my favor.

best our best option right now, bugle runaway. I'm like, all right, we're still chasing every bugle. So we're just grinding it out on the day that I ultimately kill MYLK. We're chasing beagles, we're dropping here, we're hunting hard, we're dropping, you know, tons of elevation, we're climbing tons of elevation. And finally I looked at Dave. I said, hey, this whole plan of us chasing every bugle and not calling isn't working out. Like I just I don't seem to

jive with that plan very well. I always somehow talk myself into calling or and it's just not working. Like at this point where we're dead tired, it's getting late in the evening. We stop at a spot, and so when I say won't bugle, I'm talking about like getting

the bull to commit to with an archery range. I will still always bugle to try to locate a bull, because what happens is, even though they may not come into the call, when you do get close, a lot of times they will answer a distant location beugle.

way that I'm gonna try to bugle. I don't have a bugle, toube I don't even I didn't even bring a diaphragm unless I think there was maybe some on my my bino harness, but I wasn't even thinking about using him. And we just let this bowl talk on his own. We we work up in there. We had, you know, at times I wanted to try to make a bugle to get that thing to answer, but he was biggling on his own enough times that we had

kind of pinpointed his location. And then as we moved in, we could spot some cows up ahead, and finally we were able to kind of spot his horns. He was bedded down at the edge of a meadow. And then from then we just we gotten a single file line. We put the biggest tree in between us and him that we thought would get to a shot distance, and we literally just walk in a single file line with his head behind this tree for us.

seem to want to be bothered with bugling. And as an elk hunter, that is more concerned, like, my ultimate priority is finding success, no matter if it is, you know, calling in a bigling bowl, or if it is being quiet, or if it is lucking into one as you're walking down the trail, like whatever it is, I'm always trying to stack those odds in my favor. And enough time had went by on this hunt and enough situations that really had me leaning towards don't bugle. It is going

to be your best success. And so there are times when I've ran the system enough times, the wind is swirlly enough that I don't want an elk to start to commit to my location. All of those things, there are situations where we won't bugle, and that was that was a good example of one that And as the first ball I've ever killed with my bow that I didn't call into archery range. How often do you bugle

on a hunt? So for those of us that maybe watch some of the videos we put together, it seems like we're bugling all the time, and we probably get a bit, you know, a bad rap that all we do is bugle. We're overcalling, We're we're educating the elk, And so I do want to I do want to talk about that a little bit. Similar to the first question. I bugle when i feel like I've got a good chance or good probability of uh uh, you know, a

good chance of getting a response. So I really limit limit my calling to where it's going to be good. But with that said, if I'm in in good elk sign and if I'm in a good area where I'm calling every two to three hundred yards. Now, to go back to the video, A lot of times, what are

you on a hunt? When we're going to edit it, there's not a lot you know, people don't want to just see you walking down a trail all the time, and so a lot of what you get is us bugling because there's some action involved or maybe a response involved. But in reality, you get to see a glimpse in about one percent of the time we're on the ground, and it just looks or it appears that we're always bugling. So on a hunt, I liked I liked the beagle as much as I feel gives me an advantage, and

that's hard to figure out. But anytime I get to a new finger ridge, anytime I get to an.

your bugle or just didn't want to respond. From there, we can get a bowl to respond in a different location. And so a lot of times I stick to a somewhat normal cadence too, three four hundred yards on a ridge line or in an area that an elk, because we have seen it enough on the ground that a

bowl will finally respond. So yeah, there are instances where if I've got really fresh signed on the ground, I may start with just allowed calcol and see if they bugle to that, if I'm not always ripping a bugle. It seems like that when you when you see some of our hunts and the way that we we teach some of this stuff. But in reality, we're just bugling enough to give us an advantage or to get the game started by by getting another bowl to respond. So

that's that's my answer on that one. So Kevin Hopman is the next question, is it better to sound like Doug Flutie than it is to sound lifelike? And so I have to explain Doug Flutie. It was a term that we dirt kind of coined a few years ago, where, uh, you know, Doug Fluteie is somebody that you can very easily tell is as a person blowing on an elk call. You know, whether it's one of the old school tubes that would you know, click up, click through the tones.

want to sound like the real thing. And I don't know if woodsmanship is the right word, but I want to be is as realistic sounding as possible.

it's right. I just like to, you know, for reasons and pride reasons, call as good as I can all the time, you know, as often as possible, and try to mimic the real thing. Sean Johnstone maybe talk about how barometric pressure plays a big part in Coasta Roosevelt hunting.

So I like it to be cold and crisp. I like to have clear days. Don't get me wrong. I've had some amazing rosevelt A hunting when it's just pouring down rain. You know, low pressure systems moved in, but it's typically, like I said, on that second or third day of it. They don't like to be in that transition and change. So for what that's worth, I like to be on you know, day two or three into high pressure if I can. If not, I'd like to

be day two or three into a low pressure. And ideally the hunting has never been as good during the switches, but it also is we're limited by days and time, so I'm still out there hunting and we've still managed to find success during those times.

the ability to take a day off. And then I would say high pressure after a couple of days of you know, consistent high pressure is going to be your best bet for elk in activity. So Zach gil is asking when hunting thicker timber, which growing up in southwest Washington really close to the coast is what I'm used to hunting thick timber with only a few parks and meadows the glass, how many miles do you hike hike in with no calls or random bugles do you go

before you're looking to move on? So it's a great question, Zach. A lot of these times, and not only pairs with audible. I'm I'm gathering as much information as I can so I will go look. My favorite place to look on these areas is is there a trail that seems to intersect a lot of these thick timber patches, or can I build a trail that goes through these thick timber patches. I'm just looking like, is there an area where like sign's better or worse? Was it closer to the truck

or is it better? The further I get in here, I will go to these fringes where the thick timber meets the parks and meadows. A lot of these fringe areas holds the majority of the elk or that's where they like to be. Is there sign there?

I will call as I move around that. But I will call occasionally, or if I run into some warm sign or some some hot sign, I will call to make sure that I'm not going to move forward and kind of run into or bump elk dirt or in front of me. So yeah, I'm I'm kind of always calling and letting out random location bugles before I look to move on. Now, as far as how long or how far do I hike in before I decide to move on, it really depends on how the terrain and

the area lays out. Is there easier ways to get to the areas that are coming up? Are there ways that you know, is there an easier way to get here? Like, I'm not going to overwork myself getting into an area if it's easier for somebody to come from the other way. There are times now if I'm spiking out or I'm already in there and committed, then the extra work. I will tend to gravitate that way, especially if the elk

you know, have me going that way. But there's you know, I don't know if you're looking for how many miles to hike in, some of my day hunts will be you know, maximum of seven to ten miles in and seven to ten miles out. We've did We've did a lot of you know, twelve to twenty mile days where it's a lot of you know, go in this way. I don't like to backtrack if possible. So I try to plan roots where I can go out this ridge. Maybe I have to drop across the canyon and come

back a different ridge system. It lets me cover more ground and in less time. As I'm as I'm trying to find elk, So I don't really have a minror of Max.

find elk, I'm not coming back anyways. So I'm I'm kind of pulling out all the stops as I go through here, and you know, before I move on to a different spot within the unit. Next question comes from Ross Sharp. He's here in Washington. He's asking a little a question. I know what he wants the answer to be, how do you tag your animal. So I he runs ELK crazy company. He's got a tag wallet that that you can put your tag in kind of zip it up and then attach it to the animal. Make sure

it doesn't doesn't fall off. For me, the major I think, aside from Washington now and and maybe Idaho, every state that I hunt now has like E tagging, So a lot of my tags And maybe I'm a dummy for for electing into that system, but I do like, you know, some of these systems. It's gonna it's ultimately gonna help poaching and whatnot. You have to document where your animal is killed, you know all that. I don't like it for for sharing information if that's what the fishing wail

life departments end up using it for. But I honestly I end up E tagging the majority of these states I've hunted, and then you know, tagging the animal. You know, so far, I've just I've been using just uh you know, the old school electrical tape. Still I haven't haven't lost anything. But you know, Ross Russ has a good little company there. You know, it gives back conservation. It's called a tag wallet.

If you still have physical tags, go check that out. Uh, next question comes from Warren Warren Joiner thick Idaho timber, also known as brushy rocky sholes, walking miles to find Elk. Are you calling the whole time as you're walking with cal calls and bugles are alternating and just sounding like ELK? Or are you trying to sneak up on them to surprise them with the bugle? So I would say my answer to that, Warren is a little bit of both.

So I would say one of the reasons I don't hunt, you know, the North Idaho timber anymore, is because I came from an area that's very, very similar. You know, big canyons, lots of timber. We log probably a little more active now than they did in North Idaho. But I just I don't I don't like not knowing what's ahead, and it seems like never ending timbers. So, as I just mentioned a lot of times, if you've got parks, you've got meadows, you've got spots you can get to.

But if everything looks the same for for a long ways out, I feel the best way for me to locate Elk is to continue calling as I move through the woods. I want to know that that bull's there. Before I just the chances of me walking and sneaking up on elk seems to be very very low. A lot of times they will pick up sound, they'll be looking your way. Now if I know they're there, I can definitely, like you know, move in on them. So if you if they're if they're locating or biggling on

their own. A lot of times I will go in there and sneak in because I may not want to make a peep prior to but if I get to an area of vegetation or terrain that just does not allow me to move any closer, I'm typically gonna call because I don't want to risk sneaking up on them or getting getting picked off. So I'm typically calling the

whole time as I'm walking. I will just you know, if I'm walking through or at a faster pace, I'll let a cow call out every here and you know, every now and then see if I get an answer, it would maybe calm down, you know, elk that may be suspect, you know, up ahead of you. But I do like to bugle because I like to know if I continue in this direction that there's elk around me,

and the way I like to look at. It is if if you imagine yourself, you know, on the topo map, and what you can see from your little circle, you're able to cover. Let's say, let's just say for conversation's sake, you can see one hundred yards around you. But if I bugle, I've now just touched hopefully every elk that's five hundred yards around me for an answer. So I think a lot of the listeners are probably starting to figure out that we don't We don't put our eggs

in a basket. Like I don't plan on coming back to a spot unless it's got action, it's got elk that are ready to play the game, it's got something that makes me want to come back. So a lot of times now I will hunt a spot and then come back maybe seven or eight days later, if I seen something that I like or it's like historically held elk and I think that maybe they move back in there, or maybe some hunting pressure later in the season has

brought them back. But a lot of times I will write a spot off because there's so many other good spots or good looking spots that I want to go check out within the unit. So I'm bugling I don't feel it can do any harm I've got, you know.

And the other thing is if you're assuming you can only see a hundred yards versus it you know, the area, the amount of area you're able to hunt, quote unquote is a whole lot bigger as you're bugling walking around than it is if you're just walking and using your your visual There are.

I may figure out which way the elk are going, try to make a plan, you know, either through on X or just by looking at at the terrain that's in front of me, and I may make a decision. I think these elk for this time of day are probably bedded down in there. They were here within the last twelve fourteen hours, you know, or whatever. It may be twenty four at the worst, I may elect to go try to track these things as far as I

can or getting close, and that has worked out. So I would say, you know, anywhere, not just necessarily you know, steep, timber, rocky, you know, hell holes, but anywhere that I cross fresh elk sign, I may elect to be quiet, you know, especially if the elk aren't biggling on their own, I'll just I'll be quiet, get on the tracks and go

try to tract those down. And I'm always assuming for the month of September even into the middle of October, that if I cross elk tracks, whether I can see a bull track or not, I'm assuming that there's always a bowl, you know, with those with with the elk tracks, until I prove otherwise. So that's uh, that's my opinion

on that. I'm always calling a little bit. I may call more sparingly in the Timber, but it just it increases my odds as I'm hunting to get an answer or to get the game started, versus relying on sneaking in on them if they're talking or if they're betted down or not talking. Uh. The last question I've got for you guys today, which is a little bit of a joke from one of my hunting partners, Tyson Drevnock, about my buddy Charlie Smith. Will Charlie Smith ever killing

elk again? I really hope so. Uh, I was joking with Charlie the other day the last elkie killed. I think he's on a seven year dry spell. The last elk we killed, we have a hunter together forever was a bowl I called in form in Idaho, which he actually it was his wife's turn to hunt, and somehow Charlie ended up being the shooter but called a nice little six point into him and.

I'm sure he'll kill an elk again. He might just have to draw another special tag or have me go call for him again. But Charlie will eventually kill an elk. I'm sure, but uh no. We really appreciate all these questions coming in from the Elk addicts. Once again, you have questions for me or my guests or Dirking his guests, feel free to email them to us at c T D at phelpsgame Calls dot com, or hit us up on social media. Send us a message and we'll do

our best to get him included here. Elk seasons right around the corner. We're we're practicing our calling. We're starting to get our bows set up, figuring out our arrow set up, our broad heads. Like everything is in in in full swing, and before you know it, you know, we're only two months, two and a half months out from everything needed to be dialed. It's time to start thinking about elk uh. It's it's it's by far my

favorite type of hunting. You're you're out there with a like, i say, an eight hundred pound you know, screaming giant. It's it's a lot of fun. Nothing quite gets your adrenaline up like archery el cunting, and I'm I'm so looking forward to it. But yeah, I keep sending your all cutting questions in I'm sure you're gonna get a healthy dose over the next two and a half months elk centric before you know, the white tail and mildeary

season gets here. We'll kind of switch gears there, but you're gonna get a whole heavy You're gonna get a heavy dose of elk hunting here for the next little bit.