Welcome back to another episode of Cutting the Distance podcast. I'm your host to day, Dirk Durham, and I've got a really special friend with me today Bradley Damn Rman here and Bradley messaged me on Instagram a few years ago and said, hey, would you like to go mountain lion hunting? And I said, boy would I. So we put together a plan and we come up here in the dead of winter and went cat hunting. And if you guys haven't watched it, it's on the Phelps YouTube channel.
The thumbnails a picture of me holding the big old mountain lion. We had a heck of a time with Jason Katz with dogs, and I've always said if you can spend five or ten days in the mountains with somebody and still like them at the end of that five or ten days, then that's a pretty special person. Immediately I found that with Bradley. He was easy to
be around. He is like we were old friends. He owns and operates a guiding business called Idaho Whitetail Guides, which is kind of a misnomer for the business because he runs a lot of mountain lion hunts. It runs a lot of bear hunts lots of elk hunts and deer hunts too, and maybe deer hunting would be maybe not even your biggest draw. Really, Probably some of your other stuff is a bigger draw, wouldn't you say?
Yeah, for sure, I would say elk probably the biggest one. It was. I had purchased the business and the name was Idaho Whitetael Guides, and then I had a lot of things added, you know, elk and bear and everything added throughout the years, and I just didn't go through the name change. I just kept it the same. But it's worked out.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, you us stay real busy ever fall. But anyway, thanks for coming on today. As i've I get to know Bradley a little bit more, I've known him and I know a lot of the same people you know through you know, it's a small world, and it seems like every time we get to talk and we know all these different people. And one thing I've always I've always heard about Bradley is what an elk hunting machine he is. And unfortunately he don't get to hunt much for himself, but he had an elk hunt
here a couple of years ago, two falls ago. You finally were able to get out for yourself. You normally guiding clients, you had an opportunity to go with your your father in law, and you guys went out and chased some big bulls around and you got a just a dandy, just a giant, an Idaho giant.
Yes, yes, that was well needed. Yeah, I really enjoy watching, you know, whether it's a first timer, you know, kill his first elk, you know, it's really fun. But every once in a while, you know, I got to get out there and do a little hunting for myself. And that was a good opportunity to spend time with my father in law. And heck, we're still talking even, you know, after that long.
Back to if you can spend some time in the mountains with somebody and still like him.
Yes, exactly, and we're still getting along. So that's good. That's good. No, that was a fun hunt and one on one I'll never forget for sure. Yeah, And luckily I would have probably killed just about any bowl. You know, I wasn't gonna be picky. I didn't have a lot of time, but I was fortunate enough to get a really nice public ground bowl.
So yeah, and you guys kind of videoed that and it's on outdoor of the Core YouTube channel.
Yes, yeah, you can watch it there. And I used kind of a go pro in my cell phone, so it ain't it ain't no dirt DRM video or anything of it. Yeah, it still gets the point out there.
Yeah, no, it was. That was good. I enjoyed watching it. You know what a lot of people don't know about Bradley is, Well, I'll tell you this right now. He's not ever gonna brag about himself, so I'm gonna brag abou him a little bit. He's the real deal. He's grown up right here in the heart of Elk Deer Bear Mountain, Lion country. Like we're at his place right now, and it's it's absolutely beautiful here. And he grew up
in the same house that he lives in. He went right out his back door as a kid, you know, with grandpa, with his dad, chasing chasing hound dogs for bears and cats. And how old were you when you first when you went out on your own and got your first bear with dogs.
I'll start with the lion hunt, just because I can remember that one. That okay, but the best I was about ten or eleven and my dad was working and we got two inches of fresh snow, and I begged my mom, you know, my poor mom. You know, I had this old yellow Yamaha three wheeler that got gave to me, you know, and I had I actually built a platform on the back of it to haul two dogs. Believe it or not, a three wheeler that sounds safe. Huh yeah, yeah, definitely definitely no helmets or anything like.
Oh yeah. Yeah.
Anyways, I begged mom, you know, to take the dogs out. So I actually didn't load him up. Then I just jumped on the four wheeler and I drove up the canyon here, up the drainage here by my house, and found a lion track and I knew it was fresh because the snow, you know, it snowed in the middle of the night. And so I come back and I got these two plot dogs that I had out here that you know, we're basically my dad's, but I kind of claimed them as mine, you know, but my dad
trained them and stuff. Baron Jack were the two dogs I grabbed and I went out there. I drove out there and this this three wheeler I got so real, peach, you know, I mean, I had this the throttle on it, you know, it broke, so I had to I just had to wire tied to a piece of stick, you know, and I was kind of pulling nut stick and driving. I had the two plot dogs on the back and anyways, and I know my mom was just worried to death
about me. You know, it's cold and everything else. But anyways, I got out there and uh put them on the track and they they went right out of hearing, you know, barking, and I was a little new nervious. You know, back then we don't have we didn't have near the logging roads and stuff like we do now, you know. So so I started going on foot, you know, behind the
dog tracks. I couldn't hear them anymore. And anyways, walk quite a ways and there was my first you know, I'd been to Lyon Trees with my dad and grandpa, like you said, but there I had my first lion treed by myself, with with my two dogs, my dad's dogs, whatever you want to say. I had it treed there. And I'll never forget that because that was a real special moment for me as a hound guy, you know. And I thought to my my first thoughts was nobody's gonna believe me, you know. So I went back and
got my mom and she bundled up. I just left the dogs. You know, we didn't have wolves to worry about that anither, you know, there wasn't wolves around here. So I just left the dog's tree and on the cat come back and drove all the way back here and got my mom and loaded her up, and I'm like, Mom, you gotta walk in. Nobody's gonna believe me. I got one tree and I hauled my poor mom. I'm all the way in there. So I had proof that I actually caught one, So that's awesome.
And then mom.
Yeah, and where I grew up, you know, my dad, he was pretty he's a lot. I'm nervous wreck, you know, with my kids out there on four wheelers and pickups and everything. But I actually was driving a pick up up the canyon here a way earlier, and I should have before I had the driver's license. Oh yeah, So I had. I had the hounds out and and hunt hunted a lot at a really young age. You know. I hunted with my dad and grandpa. But if if they weren't going, I my dad was fine with me
loading them up and going. And hounds are definitely a big passion of mine. I mean, I'm glad to have them, and it's it's a lot of fun and it's necessary. It's a good way to you know, manage the predators too. And I'm not a big killer. I let a lot of stuff go, you know, but I do manage him.
You know.
It's a good managing tool. And yeah, hounds are important.
Yeah. How many how many days a year do you hunt your dogs?
Oh? Man, I at least at least one hundred and fifty, probably pushing you know, one hundred and eighty, closer to two hundred days, depend on the year, depending on the year. But you know, I hunt. You know, I'll start hunting here at the end of the November here and I'll be hunting clear till March. You know, I'll go to a show or two, but other than that, I'll be hunting every day pretty much. And then you know, we have a I do every once in a while in
false the fall season. Even last fall, I I bear hunted. We have a good fall September season here. But that's always been a tough one for me because you got bugle and bulls or listening to the hounds. But I try to do both, you know, all all hunt a week or so sometimes if I'm lucky and September, you know, if the bugle is slow or something and one of my clients want to go on a bear hunt or something, I'll do that. And then but and then in the
spring and summer, you know, I'm hunting. I'm hunting from around April fifteenth or May first, somewhere right in there, you know, depending on what unit's open. I'm clear till the end of July.
Yeah.
So and I mean I don't miss too many days. Yeah in between so yeah, well they rack up pretty fast.
Yeah right, and your dogs show it. I mean they get hunted a lot. They're they're just they're they're in good shape. They know what to do. I had the pleasure to go and cat hunt with you, and then Phelps came out and we went bear hunting that time, and I really wanted Jason to get to shoot the bear, and the bear kept running over into into area the he couldn't hunt because he was a non resident, but I could since I was a resident because of licensing
and stuff hound hunting licensing. But anyway, that was funny because you know, yeah, Jason and I'm like, I'm I hope you get the bear, but in the end I got the bear. Yeah, so you got the red star. Yeah, that was pretty fun.
That was fun. I enjoyed meeting Jason and hunting with him as well. And you guys are a lot of fun fun to be around just at camp even Yep.
Yeah, we we even videoed that one, So if you guys check out the Phelps YouTube channel, that one's on there too. But the real reason I brought Bradley on today is I wanted to kind of go over some some common mistakes made by elk hunters. Every year, he has a lot of folks he brings hunting. Every year, he sees a lot of people come through the door.
He's been he's been guiding a lot of years, and you know, some of the things that people could do to help their success maybe before they get here and while they're here on hunting, whether whether you're on a guided hunter, a di y, I mean, this is all applicable stuff. So I kind of I thought, you know, I always have my ideas of mistakes people make, but that's usually I'm like looking inward at my own mistakes.
So as as someone that's taken lots of people hunting every year, you probably see a few things that like people that may not think about before they ever come hunting. And it'd be really good for our listeners to hear those those problems and and and mistakes and maybe find a way to avoid those before they come hunting.
Yes, yeah, for sure, that's important stuff. And I think UH the most common probably the number one thing it seems obvious on an elk cut, you know, And this definitely depends on the hunt you're going on. But we're
talking elk here is UH is being in shape. You know, I take a lot of and I and I'm careful when I say that because I do take a lot of older people and stuff and so so you don't have to be a elk shape guy, you know, I mean one hundred percent, you know, But any kind of exercise that you can do, you know, talk to your outfitter that you choose, you know, kind of figure out you know what kind of walk it, how many miles a day and try to every day just walk it
at home, you know, for a couple of months before your hunt. Any little bit helps helps up your odds and helps us as a guide, you know, because we can only go where you can go. And so that's probably the number one thing that I see is just people man, I should I should have exercised more, right, Yeah, I should have been a little more prepared physically for this hunt. I see that a lot, So it'd be number one.
Yeah. I talked about this before on another podcast earlier this year about getting ready for elk season and stuff.
And you know, no matter what your physical condition is, when you art getting in shape, like you know, you can do it, like maybe maybe get do an exercise for you is walking around the block at home once a day because you have a sedentary job, or maybe you just you don't get out much, and you know, you got to start somewhere, right, If you can walk around the block every day for a month and then make it two blocks three months, you know, you just
build upon that. By the time it's time to go up hunting, you're gonna have You're gonna feel better than just going from a sedentary you know, maybe a desk job or something to immediately jumping into the mountains, you know, maybe hiking roads and trails and off road or off trailing through some steep stuff, you know, And I always said, too, put put a backpack on, because you're probably gonna, you know, be wearing a backpack with you, you know, and man,
your your old shoulders in your back. If you're not used to carrying a backpack around, your shoulders and back kind of can get sore after day one and by the time the end of the hunt comes around, you're about into shape. Carrying a backpack seems like for me it is at least, But if I can, if I can start carrying backpack a month before season as I'm walking and doing my other exercise, you know, put a
little bit of weight in itto it. And if you're doing this for a two month spread, by the time elk season comes, maybe have forty pounds in your pack. And that way, when you get out here in the mountains, whether you're on a guided hunter of DIY, you know, your back and your shoulders feel pretty good. You're not going to be like, ah, this is I'm sore every morning when I get up and I put my pack on,
and it's difficult. Now your mind's off task. Your mind's thinking about your aching back or your legs that are they're sore instead of thinking about elk hunting.
Yes, you nailed it there, so yeah, definitely use it as an extentive to get in shape. You know, I'm going on this hunting trip.
Man.
Yeah, you don't have to be an elite elite athlete, which is awesome if you can get that way, but you know, getting better shape than you were before, and you know it'll help absolutely.
Yeah, just any little bit helps. Like I said, any little bit so very important that you take that serious. But and then I would say something that seems obvious, but I bump into it a lot. Is people show up here with their brand new boots still in the box. Yeah, I've ran out of band aids putting it on blisters. Oh yeah, guys, break your boots in. And I know this is most people probably do know this, but I see it a lot, again on depending on the hunt
you're on. If you're if you're going on a white tail hunt somewhere and you're going to be setting in a blind or a stand, you know, well, you you're probably not doing a lot of walking, so you know you could probably bring your boots brand new.
Men, but.
Put those boots on, break them in. However, you'd want to wear them a lot, you know before where you come on a hunt very important because you you don't want to go, you know, hunt the first day and then be kind of lamed up and sore and just kind of miserable the rest of the trip, you know, and and a lot of the places you might be going with an outfit or you know, there might not be a store real handy to go get a different pair, try a different pair or whatever. So make sure they're
gonna work for your feet. And that's uh, I just you it's just amazing how much I see that, you know, yeah, yeah.
Yeah, and yeah, and try to incorporate that in your exercise rou team. So yep, you know, two months before the hunt, you know, start breaking those boots in. You know, wear them every day on your hike, wear them around town, wear them shop, and wear them to work whatever where I'm doing chores in the yard, maybe mowing your lawn or whatever. But yeah, a blister, it's so funny to me, Like a blister, It's such a little thing. It's a little part of your body, but it can just wreck
your day. You can wreck your hunt by having that painful blister. Back there. It's like it'll stop you if they get really bad, they'll stop you in your tracks and you may have to take a couple of days off to try to heal up before he could walk anymore.
Yeah, for sure. Yeah, I've seen people just not go out. Yeah, you know, it's crippled. They've paid for a hunt and they're just like, I'm not I'm gonna hold back my feet or sore. I'm kind of miserable, you know. And I'll usually adjust for that, you know, as a guide, you know, I we're kind of We've got lots of places to hunt, so we're okay, well, he's pretty lamed up. We need to take him over here, maybe set him. You know, we'll work around it obviously, but you know,
it's just keep him in the moment. It's gonna put a damper on your hunt.
Yeah, yeah, and bring in another thing about that point, bring some I mean, Bradley said he've ran out of some band aids. But bring some of your own stuff to keep him in your pack. I like Luco tape. You can get it on Amazon. Luco tape. It's like a medical tape and this stuff, once you get it stuck on it almost won't come off. You have to like take it off, get it like soak in the bathtub to get this stuff to come off. And it's
great for blisters. It's not bulky, it's real thin. It almost looks like the tape that's on a rubber or that's on a band aid. But it's like super sticky, super tough. And you'll let's say you get a blister on day one, you put you start getting a hot spot. You put that over the hot spot and the blister and get it stuck on there and that thing may be on your foot at the end of the week, like it will stay on there really good. So highly recommend that stuff.
Yeah I'll have to get some of that and stick in these cabins.
Yeah yeah, yeah, hunters will be happy for it.
Yeah.
Okay, something else I see a lot and uh, it's not too big of an issue, but it's something to think about, in my opinion, choosing your hunting partner. Like now I'm talking about a guided hunt here. You know, so we sell two on one, we sell one on one hunts or two on one hunts, right, which a two on one is is two hunters and one guide. If you're not sure what that means. But uh, what I see a lot as a guide is I'll I'll get two buddies that'll that'll show up on a two
on one hunt. One of them is in shape and one of them is not. And so kind of you know, maybe if you can, you know, pair up with somebody that's similar condition that you're in, if that makes sense, because you know, it's a two on one hunt. So I'm hunting you both. A lot of times we're walking together in the morning, you know, in the evenings and stuff.
I'll set you in different spots, but cutting you know, you know, we're hiking, you know, in the timber and walking along ways, you know, and and uh, you know, one guy's like I can't go anymore, you know, and the other guy's like he's not even breaking a sweat, you know. So I ran into that issue a lot,
and I and I do understand. Like on the flip side of that is, you know, I get a lot of father son things, you know, just you know where, and a lot of times on those that Dad will just go without me, take him, get him an elk, you know. But it's something to think about, you know, or least be aware of it. You know that your partner could slow you down on the guid to two on one hunt.
Yeah, so I see it. Like another thing with hunting partners is before your hunt. And I think people kind of don't do this a lot because you'll talk to I talked to a lot of folks is they don't have a real good conversation with their partners. Get let's
get deep. Let's have a deep conversation with your hunting partner and find out what they're expectations of the hunt are and what are yours, because sometimes we kind of assume what the expectations of the hunt is and then when you get there, opinions or expectations collide and one person's like, yeah, dude, I just want to go hunt the mornings and come back and eat lunch and then go hunt the evenings, and one guy's like, I want
to hunt all day. And if you have two different mindsets like that, that can be a clash, and that can be a big deal and you might end up hating your buddy over the deal. I mean, so you have to iron out any of those little bumps before you ever go hunting.
Yeah, So.
You know, maybe the kind of style you use. You know, maybe your friend he's more spot in stock, you know, a minimalist when calling. Maybe you're very heavy on calling, you want to use your calls a lot. Those two people don't usually blend well when you hunt together because one is like, geez, I wish that guy would just quit calling, shut up, quit calling so much. The other guy's like, man, why don't you blowies? Call some We need to get these call He's out going. So those
two different mindsets are just really clash. So if you can iron out your all your expectations and your your thoughts of the hunt and stuff before you go, you can really kind of figure that out, and then you can explain to each other and like work that out before you ever get there, and then when you get there you know what to expect, and then you can make you know, you can make it easy for each other to have a good time.
Yes, right, yeah, those are good points for sure. I've definitely, uh, I've seen I've actually seen hunting partners show up, you know, laugh and having a good time, you know, the first couple of days, and then literally at the end of the week, drive back to Pennsylvania with a complete stranger that was here this week that was close to him. Yeah, that they were the hunting partners were so mad at each other by the end of the week that they didn't even ride home back home together.
Oh my god.
Yeah, so that's pretty that's pretty extreme. But it's kind of what you're saying. You know, they just clash too much, you know, they one guy wanted to hunt this way, the other guy wanted to hunt this way, and by the end of the week they were just not real happy with each other. So, yes, it's very important to think that through. Yeah, yeah, or at least at least be aware of it and talk about it.
Sure, stuff, and it may not be a complete deal killer. Let's say you guys are doing your DIY hunt and it turns out you want way different things out of the hunt. But that doesn't mean you can't go and camp together and enjoy each other's time in the evenings or whatever. Camp together and then say, okay, but you go this way, I'll go that way and i'll see you tonight and if I get one, or you help me pack it out. And if you get one, I'll help you pack it out. You know, there's ways it's
still you know, it's not a completely deal killer. You don't have to hunt maybe with each other side to side all the whole time. But you know, there's there's solutions to like if you if you enjoy your friend or maybe it's a relative and you want to make it hat work, there's ways of making it work and still go, but not clash as much.
Yes, absolutely, yeah, it's definitely, it's definitely you can definitely work it around, especially on it do it yourself. You know, a two on one guided hunt. You know you're kind of stuck, but I even can work around it some yeah, you know, as in like set somebody somewhere and then you know, hunt with the hunt with the other guy, you know, on foot, and then alternate the next day. I've done that, so there there's always ways around stuff.
But it's tough to think about for sure. Absolutely sure. Another thing we want to move on optics and shooting distance. That's when I first started outfitting our guidance hunts. You know that the scenery around here has changed. You know, there's more logging and stuff. You know, I hunted growing up. I hunted the timber a lot, you know, and you got a hundred yards shot and the timber was rare.
You know, it just really didn't happen around here, So I didn't really shoot that, you know, that far away. You know, I'd cite my gun in for one hundred yards and go. You know, what I see a lot a guided hunt is is uh, you know, they're not from around here. A lot of times they might be from back east or where wherever they're from. And how how uh how hard it is for some of these
guys to see stuff. I'll see ylk, you know, and and I can't get them to see them sometimes, you know, and I'm I'm like, you know, trying to explain as fast as I can. You know, you see that busted off snob over there on the ridge, and they're like right below it, a little bit to the right, and
they just can't see it. And so what I've learned is a lot of times, you know, they'll they'll buy an expensive hunt, you know, to go on and and and be dedicated in a plane ticket or whatever, or travel all the way out here, but they'll have a forty year old pair of binoculars with them, you know. So I think optics are are really important, especially and back to what I meant by timber. You know, things
change around here. We can see so much, you know, here in northern Idaho, or at least where I hunt, you can see so much further now, you know all the logging and stuff, log in and stuff. You can glass a thousand yards or two thousand yards now, So you don't want to have your chance on a guided hunt and the elk walk into the timber. And I've had it happen several times and never even laid eyes on it. And I and it's even when you're a guy.
That's a horrible feeling because you think you're looking they're like, well, I never seen it. You know, they're looking at you, and I'm like, I swear there was a nice five point there, I promise, And they're kind of looking at you funny. And you're like, okay, we're walking over there. I'm showing you tracks. We're walked into the timber right right.
But so I think, and I'm not saying you have to go spend a bunch of money on don't break yourself, you know, if it's in your budget, though, you know, by a decent pair of you know, ten by forty twos, even you know something something better than grandpa's old pair of binoculars.
Anyways, you know, yeah, you don't want grandpa's World War two binoculars.
That's right, I know.
And and I can say, you know, there's some pretty decent binoculars for two three hundred bucks. I mean, they're not the best, but they're they're better than twenty years ago. Yes, two or three hundred dollars binoculars. They've come a long ways, and you know, by the best optics that you could afford.
There you go for your budget.
And another thing, this is off topic a little bit, but same but but but relative to binoculars, there's nothing worse than being hunting and you look up on the hill and you see another hunter and they're eyeballing you with their rifle scope. They're they're pointing their gun at you and they're looking at you with their scope because they don't have binoculars. And that's a pretty irving feeling. And I feel pretty strongly about that. That's that's kind
of bs like. But binoculars, I think everybody can afford a pair of good enough that you can tell that you can scope out look through your bidos at a guy or an elk or a deer or something. There's no excuse to be throwing your rifle up and eyeballing people with your scope.
So no, absolutely not. Yeah I've had that happen a lot to me too.
Yeah.
Yes, have a pair of binoculars. Don't use your scope. Nobody wants a gun pointed at him, that's for sure. Yeah, distance, I think knowing your gun and knowing your bullets is extremely important. I don't. I see this a lot where either they brought old Grandpa's gun, you know, with a again not a very good scope, you know, and they
can only shoot a hundred yards, you know. And I'm not saying I'm a big line long distance shooter, and I know some people are into that, some ain't, but at least try to be able to shoot three hundred yards in my opinion, I mean that's going to up
your chances so much where I hunt anyways. Well, and another thing, I see a lot of people that will show up here with the most expensive scope you could think of, night Force whatever it might be, you know, expensive fancy scopes, a fancy gun, and me and the guys are like, hm, I want that guy, you know, won't come to find out. He's only good to about two hundred and fifty yards, He'll tell you, right, And I just I kind of shake my head at that. Well,
why do you got all this expensive gear? You know? But I think a practice in like if you're from back East or somewhere, you know, I know, it's hard to find a place to shoot. I know a lot of my guys have told me, well, we don't really have a spot to shoot three hundred, you know, and
so that could be a challenge. But practice further than you think you're going to shoot, know, practice shooting aways I think will up your elk hut a lot here where I'm hunting, because anymore, you know, it's we can take a four or five hundred yard shot easy anymore, you know. And if you can't shoot that far, your opportunity might walk into the brush and that might be your that might have been your only opportunity for that week. So practice practice, you know, shoot even if you're not.
You know, when you're practicing, you know who cares if you miss? You know, I mean, just shoot as far as you you possibly want, you know, further than what you think you're gonna shoot on the hunt anyways, right, and then that helps.
And I think if if you can't get those long ranges, if you can't get like that three hundred yard shot at your local range, or you know, maybe broaden your views a little bit, you know, search surrounding counties that like, well there's that one shooting range over here that they've
got a really nice one. You they maybe they hauled some competitions at them or whatever you may be, can reach out to a thousand, but maybe before your hunt go over there, just you may have to drive for an hour to get to a place to where you can shoot a distance. Or if that's just like I've looked, I can't find nothing I would recommend, so maybe you can shoot two hundred yards one hundred yards instead of shooting a large target, make your target very small, make
the aiming point very smaller your target. So instead of having a you know, a two feet by two feet big piece of paper to shoot at, maybe now we're shooting at a playing card, you know, and now you're
trying to shoot the diamond on the playing card. That's your aiming point, right, and you're not just going to sit on the bench at the at the range and just shoot that like because typically when you're hunting, that's not a shooting from a shooting benches is one hundred percent never going to happen when you're on an elk hunt or any kind of a unless you're shooting out
of your backyard. Right, So, shooting awkward positions, you know, stand up, lay on the ground, take a knee, you know, find yourself getting comfortable shooting those shots, getting those that muscle memory down. I don't I'm not a big bipod guy. But what I do instead of a bipod is I use my hunting pack. I've got a pretty decent sized hunting pack, and I get good at like pulling my pack off, throwing it on the ground, put getting my gun on it, laying down, finding the target, and then
executing the shot. So those little things will will help you immensely. Like getting on target, it's really hard to like sometimes find the animal and the scope, especially if it's it's moving or something. And like you alluded to, it's like the hunters like, I can't see it. I can't see it, you know. I've seen this with my wife and kids. Before you get them on something, they're like, I can't see it. In the scope. I can't see
in the scope. It's really tough. So just this weekend, I have my friend Lee out and he's new to deer hunting, and we did some some drills with Instead of using the rifle that he's gonna hunt with, we used a twenty two, which is a full size twenty two rifle with a full sized scope on it, and by you know, putting it up quickly, finding the target quickly in the scope and shooting and then just doing doing that from different positions, standing up, laying down, kneeling,
all these different finding Maybe we did this with Lee. We we there was a tree close by. Okay, let's pretend that's the deer over there. You need to get to that tree quickly and quietly and then find the target leaning against the tree, rest your rifle on it, take the shot. And that made that That helped him a lot. He's like, Wow, I'm just I'm starting I'm starting to get it, you know, I'm starting to feel
good about this. Then they have confidence in finding, finding the animal and the scope and then making that shot.
Yes, yeah, I'm glad you brought that up, because I that's a big issue you know with people just you know, a lot of a lot of my hunters will have the scope you know, turn zoomed way in, you know, and you know too, and you realize, shoot, they've got their their scope turned all the way up high power, you know, have that you know, turn turned down and then you got a little wider view to to look and find it in your scope. But yeah, just uh fiant in the scope as major. Yeah, I mean practice
and that's so easy to practice. Like Dirk said, you know, you can. There's lots of things I got, you know, we got ground squirrels around here, so my kids, you know,
and Amy and stuff. You know, that's you know, if you have if you you got an opportunity to hunt squirrels even you know, it's just good practice to getting your gun pulled up and getting on stuff, you know, because most of the time, as you know, they're not standing there forever, you know, so you've got to be quick and that could definitely cost you an ELK.
Yeah, absofinitely, absolutely So.
I was not telling your outfitter if you have any health issues. It's something I've learned on the fly.
Yeah, that's a good point.
It's something you might not think of, you know, something I didn't think about when I first started. And I'll just I'll tell you what happened to me right out of the gate, you know, when I owned the business. You know, i've guided, you know since ninety nine something like that. So but I've owned the business thirteen fourteen years or whatever. But the first year or two, anyways, I had a white tail hunter out here and I said them, you know, I was setting them and pop
up blinds and tree stands and stuff. I could tell right away this guy was extremely unpatient, which I don't judge because I'm not the most patient guy setting in a stand either, but he was getting a little frustrated setting the stand, not really seeing much. And this guy is probably i would say, around fifty early fifties something
like that. But anyways, I told him, I said, well, I uh, why don't we, you know, go for a walk and do a little spot and stock and I'll bring my rattling horns and grunt tube and we'll see if we can maybe rattle one in or just catch one out there. You know, he was losing patience. So anyways, I drove out somewhere and we started hiking, you know, and setting up and rattling and grunt calling and not
having any luck. So we just kept getting a little further further away, you know, and I just kept, you know, hunting. I didn't have no reason to be back right away. And we were walking through the timber there and he tapped me on the back of the shoulder and he says, Brad, and I could just see. I just looked at this guy's face, and I mean, he just not look right. He looks sick. And he says, I need you to go back to the pickup and get my back pack. I'm diabetic and I'm about to have a blackout.
Oh my god.
Well I'm you know, I don't even really know what that means at this point. And he's like, I need you to hurry. I said, the pickup's like two and a half miles away. He says, Brad, I need you to get my backpack immediately. And I ran. I about killed myself getting back to the truck, yeah, and getting this guy's backpack for him and getting getting back getting
getting it back out. Luckily for this guy, I got, I got his backpack out, and I can't remember he had some medicine or a candy bar or something whatever to help his diabetic. But he told me, you know, I've been a diabetic for like thirty five years, and he said that was the closest I ever was to blacken out. And and I don't know, I don't understand the diabetic real well, but what he told me was a blackout is you pass out and you never wake
up if you're a diabat diabetic. So I was like extremely close call, Like I was an eye opener for me. Another story is anybody that's hunted in September, at least around where I'm at Northern in Idaho, the bees can be mean. I've I've had guys out there that were allergic to bees and get stung and never had their Like I said, this is early on in my guidance career. You know this stuff I've learned. They never had their insulin shot or whatever EpiPen. Sorry, yeah, and with them,
you know, well that's a big problem. You know, we're we're out here a ways. You know, we're we're not getting back to the truck anytime soon, even if we're running, you know. And I've had some close calls like that where people it was pretty scary, so very important I mean, if you're not comfortable, you know a lot of times, well you know, there'll be five or six clients in a week and we're kind of all talking at night.
And if you're not comfortable blurting that out your health issues in front of everybody at camp when you know you're there the first night, just just pull your outfitter aside and tell him, hey, you know, just so you know what, you know, I've got a bad heart or you know, I'm allergic to this, and make sure you know you know that guy, you know, I don't think
you know, back to the to the deer hunt. I don't think he realized we were going to walk that far, and I never really told him, so that was maybe kind of my fault, and he knew better. He told me he should have had that stuff with him, right, but in his mind, we were just going to walk out there one hundred yards and sure and come back to the truck. So, you know, you can't leave it
all on your outfitter. If you if you know you need that EpiPen or whatever it might be, make sure you have it with you and your guide or your outfitter is aware of it.
Yeah, that's it. It's a really good point. Yeah, yeah, I would never think of that, but I don't have any life threatening issues right now, but I could see where that'd be really a big problem.
Yes, it is, for sure. It's yeah, we take that pretty serious. And I go over all that, you know, with everybody the night they go up, just because, like I said, I've learned this through through the years of guiding. But definitely definitely let your outfit or know or if you're doing it yourself, you know, make sure you have all the stuff you might need. Another thing, I see now, now this is a this don't I wouldn't say that
it's every hunt. Well obviously it's not every hunt, but if I see it more on my on, like my mountain lion hunts are even like a an archery l hunt that I'm going to the back hunt and hunting pretty hard and maybe even possibly staying a night out there too. You know, if you if you've if you've dreamed of going on an l count for our ten years or whatever, and it's been something your bucket list, deal, don't wait too long on pulling the trigger on that
I've guided. I don't know how many older guys that they did their best, and God bless them, you know, they they they finally got to a point in their life where they could afford it. I guess, you know, and show up and go on a hunt. But I don't know how many times I've heard these words. I should have done this twenty years ago. Man, I'm mad at myself. Yeah, why didn't I do this twenty years ago?
So if it's something you we only live once, right, you know, And if it's something you got, and I know for like me and my business, I can't speak for other outfitters, but like my wife, if it's you know, but this might be a do it yourself and you just figure it out. But like if you going with an outfitter, I know, like Amy's set up, especially with some of the younger people you know that have kids and a family, and we know how expensive it is to to live nowadays. But well, she'll set up payment
deals for him. It might be a two year deal right where they're making payments to pay for the hunt slowly, but figure out something if it's on your mind. Don't wait too long because time fly is man and we're not going to have our youth forever. Yeah.
Yeah, for sure, we're not. We're not getting any younger every year or so. No. Yeah, that's a good point.
I think if you if you book with an outfitter, you know, and you think you got a good, good outfit that you're going with, and you're something bugged you. You know, you're there for a week, something bugged you, something made you mad. Either the guy you know, maybe he wasn't working hard enough, or the outfitter said something to make make you mad, or the conditions where you were sleeping, whatever it might be, weren't that good eight
you know. And and this is easy for me to say because I'm the outfitter, but I think I highly suggest you just go to the outfitter and with your issue immediately, immediately and set down. And I know, for
me and my business, and I still do this. I'll have a group of guys in in for the week and and hunt them and I'll ask them at the end of the week, you know, is there anything that I could have done different or or maybe you know, put in the cabins or or had you know, different meals, or is there anything you can think of I could have did different. I'd love to hear it, you know,
and we appreciate that. You know. So you might have an issue that made you mad, But I think going to the outfitter and talking to them, they're more like more likely. I know, I am. I'm going to try to make it right. You know, this is our reputation on the line. I want to I want to make it right and whatever that might take all I know, I'll work with you if you come to me. I just don't I don't really think. I really don't. I don't really like the guy that you know goes and
just complains to other people. Right, Oh, this was horrible, and this was this, and that might be. I mean, I've heard horror stories. But I think if you have an issue, it's important to let your guide know because then they can work on it and maybe make a better hunt for the next guy's coming.
Sure. Yeah, Like, for instance, let's say the hot water tank wasn't working and you just don't know. You don't stay in the cabin. You gotta let them know. You don't want to sit there all week with cold showers, right, and then be mad that you had cold showers. They'd be like, the dang hot water tank wasn't working or the mattress was lumpy or something. You know, if there's something bugging you, like gee whizz, they don't have decaf coffee or some little things. Some little things go a
long way with people. You know, they they're not happy with it. And if you mentioned it in early and say, hey, do you think we could get some decaff or do you think we could get a different mattress? I can't sleep a wink. I'm sure you jump through a hoop to oh you didn't know. Let's fix that thing up and get you going right. Yeah, definitely. You want people to be comfortable, Yeah, you.
Know, we want want you to be comfortable and want you to have a good time. So yes, please let let them know, you know. Yeah, if they don't know, they don't know.
Or if it's your hunting partner. Let's say you're doing a DIY and you're hunting partner's doing something that's really great and non you don't stew on it all week, just say hey, man, can we have a talk. Say hey, you're picking your nose all the time, really bugging me.
Whatever it is, right, whatever it is, make it too much noise.
You're making too much noise. You can pick up your feet, you know, and if you do it with in a diplomatic way is to act like a hot head or something. Usually the other person's like, oh wow, they didn't know, and be happy to you know, work on it, and that way everybody's happy. And sometimes, you know, the person maybe this complaining should then say was there anything I'm doing this bugging you? And they may say, well, now that you bring it up, snore like a freaking grizzly bear. Okay,
I'm sorry. I'll try to work on that.
Yeah, I remember sleeping in a wall tent with you want tell Yeah it was kind of loud.
Yeah, dang it, Sorry about that.
I'm sorry about I've held a grudge every since.
That's surprise you'll talk to me.
No, But those are definitely good things to go over, you know. I mean, you book a hunt with somebody, These are things that you don't really think about until you're there, you know. So they're small things, but they add up, don't they for sure? Okay? Another thing I see hunters making a mistake, which is might sound kind of weird. And this all depends on the hunt you're going on, obviously, as I see hunters with too much gear believe it or not. Oh yeah, yeah, it's just
completely like, what the heck we got going here? I don't have room in my pickup for this time right right. Which you know most outfitters, I think almost probably all of them and I know I do, is we have a gear list. You know, we have a gear list. This is what you have to have. So if you book with an outfitter, make sure you get a gear list, and you know, and then I might recommend some stuff that you can bring or you don't have to, you know,
you know, just the basics. But and a lot of it depends you know where you're going obviously, you know if you're walking or camping or hiking in But my style of hunt, you know where I hunt. You know, a lot of times we hunt for two three hours in the morning and then stuff kind of dies down, then we kind of take a break. So what I see a lot of these hunters they show up with a fifty pound backpack loaded. I'm thinking, man, if we have to put a quarter on that thing, I'm really
going to be heavy. But yeah, they've got more gear and then they're in there than they'll ever use. And then by the end of the week they're we're hunting, and they're all that stuff staying in the pickup and they realize they didn't even need it. They brought it and it just set in the cabin or whatever, and they've lightened up a lot. Yeah, because you know, that's another thing that that's going to wear you down, is just having too much stuff on you. And nowadays, you know,
it's kind of normal. You know, even me. It's like I remember when I used to you know, grab a pocket knife, two extra bullets, and a gun and go, you know, pretty much. And now it's range finders and radios and cell phones and all this stuff. You know, it just adds up. Ye have the right gear, but don't have too much of it for the hunt you're going on. You just spend a lot of time researching and asking a lot of questions and figuring out what
you're going to need. Do I really need this? Probably not. I'm gonna leave it, you know, but I see that a lot where guys are just way over overpacked.
Yeah, that's a good good point.
Yeah, Oh, shooting sticks. So this is something I just thought i'd i'd bring up. So there there are say there's three or four guys, four or five guides, whatever I have here for the week. Honestly, it really I like shooting sticks. I think I think they're important because I see a lot of missus as a guide shooting miss But I definitely have better luck with shooting sticks.
But having the right shooting sticks are important to you know, if you're going to be setting somewhere and a pop up blind or whatever, you know, you might you know, choose your shooting stick a little different. I like ones that are adjustable, quick, you know, pull the trigger and just for the spot and stock, you know, like trigger sticks. Yeah, I like those the best for the style of Elkhun
I do with the rifle. But then I have a couple of guides that you know, they'll look at my clients and say, break those things in half and throw them over the bank because it's actually cost them, you know, they're fiddling around with their shooting stick, you know, and and and cost them milk. But I'm a firm I'm a firm believer in shooting sticks, but they need to be quick, you know, on the style elk kind I do. Like a lot of times I'll pack the trigger sticks
for the hunter. Oh and it works out good because I'll use it, you know, rest my binoculars on or something when i'm yeah, kind of spotting stuff, and then if I see something, I can throw it out in front of the client real quick and get their gun on it. But shooting sticks and the right ones are important for sure.
Yeah. Yeah. I always kind of go back and forth, like should I get some because my buddy Lee this week he's knew a deer hunting, and like, should I get some of the shooting sticks for him?
And should I not?
And like you say, they're kind of a pain in the butt to carry, And I'm thinking I'm gonna get some. I'm gonna think I'm gonna get some. Yeah, I think you'll like they're good. Yeah, yeah, I might even like him for.
Me, right, And again it goes back to having too much gear? How much stuff do you want to be fiddling around with too? But one man, Yeah, I know I like the Actually for some of my heavier guns, I like to arrest them if I can, you know, And uh, you know there's different kinds you can go
with and practice with them. Yeah, you know. I get guys here that we go out the first day of their hunt and we see something they can't even figure out how to unfold their shooting sticks or whatever they got right, and so kind of maybe something else you could maybe kind of practice with is getting those up quick and it's all time, right, I mean, we got sometimes you just don't have a lot of it on the hunting, so you don't want it to like like one of my guides, Travis always says it it's cost
me more ILK than messing around with their shooting sticks, you know.
Yeah.
But anyways, something to think about.
If people are looking to book with an outfitter, I thought I should ask you, so, what kind of questions should you ask an outfitter before you put your money down? So I feel like there's probably some questions you need to ask. You maybe need to do some checking. What do you what do you what do you recommend when you're vetting an outfitter?
Yes, that's the very important ask a lot of questions first of all. And don't be scared to If say you're at a trading show or something you've walked around and kind of looked at, don't be scared to ask questions. Don't be nervous. Just start somewhere, walk up to an outfitter and start somewhere. Just ask them questions. We're not gonna judge anybody, or at least I'm I know, I'm not on any questions they asked. Just just get the
conversation rolling. It'll go into place. But it might not be the first question I asked if I go up to somebody's an outfitter's booth or something. But one thing that you're gonna gonna walk and I think is important is references. Yea, and fairly recent references don't have references. Yeah, I huntred with them ten years ago, you know, right, you know, in the last year or two, get get some references. And I know that I when I'm at a show, I actually have a list of references, and
on my references, I actually have people. Obviously, obviously people are kind of of course, you're not going to put some guy that had a bad hunt on there and that and that is true, I mean, you know, to an extent. But why I think it's important to ask him is well, on my back to mine, it's I have people that killed stuff, and I actually have people that didn't kill stuff, right with me? I think that's important. Sure, you know, if your outfitter doesn't supply the guy you're
looking to go with. If he doesn't supply like references that that didn't kill maybe ask him, you know, like, hey, can I have a couple of guys's phone numbers that you know weren't successful with you?
Yeah?
You know. And and one thing I've learned in this business, in any business, I think you could probably agree, Dirk, is you're not going to make everybody happy, right, So one or two guys that complain about and out I wouldn't think too much in it, you know, right, because I think any outfitter that's been in business for a while is going to probably have a couple guys that can find something to complain about.
Right.
That's just how it is.
But it's really hard to make everyone happy out there. It is, as as hard as you try, you know, it's sometimes just like maybe it's a personality thing. Maybe it's maybe they expected way too much out of an outfitted hunt.
It's hard to say, right yep, So definitely check with that and that. If he doesn't have any references, I'd be a little leary, you know, maybe go on on. Like I said, when I'm at a trade show, I have him there, and I might not hand them out to everybody, But if I'm talking to him and I think they're pretty interested in book a hunt with me,
I'll say, why don't you take some references? And yes, And they might be some guys that have hunted with me, and I know they're gonna talk highly of me, but they might not even just be about me or my fan Well it would be too, but it might be something that I forget to tell you, Like you could ask them, you know, well, how how was the cabins you stayed in? How is the food right? You know, there's lots of questions that you could ask somebody on a reference and kind of you know, were you did
they run you into the ground? I mean, did you have how far did you walk? You know, there's a lot of things they can ask them, so so important references are important. And I know not every outfitter hands those out because I've been at shows where I've handed them out and I've had had them come back and say, by the way, you're the only outfitter that that handed me references.
Really like, oh, it feels like that'd be kind of standard, really.
And it would, I would think, But I've had them do that, and I'm sure most outfitters do or at least have them if the client ask, and they might not hand them out unless you ask too, because you know, I don't want fifty sixty people call and a guy so right, it could.
Be serious inquiries, Yes, exactly, sure.
Definitely ask again, lots of questions. How physical is the hunt I'm going to be? You know what kind of terrain out altitude? You know what am I looking at? Because I get a lot of guys here that, you know, maybe miscommunication and stuff on their and our mind. Even you know, I've learned, I'm learning I'm only human. But on I just didn't think it was going to be this hard, right, you know, I thought i'd be a little more of a challenge, you know, really get detailed on that for sure.
And and maybe you should tell the outfitter explain your expectations. This would Here's where a dream old would be to me. You know, I wake up every morning about nine am
to a five star breakfast. I sip coffee for a while as I look at the lake and enjoy a beautiful view, and then out ten week, get in the vehicle and drive around and look for animals and maybe take a shot or two, and then we get back early and I take a soak in the hot tub, and yeah, you know, isn't that that I mean, I'm being silly of here, But but you have to like find out, like tell the outfit or what your expectations are and he might just say, well, that's not really the kind of hot we do.
Yep, we don't.
This is more what we do. And you know, kind of like I feel like that whole expectations versus reality thing is what really throws people off sometimes. So if you don't tell them that your expectations, you may just go there thinking it's something it ain't right if you haven't asked the questions, and like you just assume all these things.
Yep, that happens a lot, you know. And I've told people, you know, several times, you know that we're detailed about that that I'm not sure I'm the guy you're looking for, right, you know, I'll recommend I'll recommend a few guys to Yeah, but I think you'd you would have a little more of an experience with what you want, you know, So yes, and and so important to know what you're getting into and if you're gonna like it or not? You know.
Another one is, uh, I hear, you know, I hear all the A lot of these guys that hunt with me have been hunting other with other outfitters and and different places and stuff. And and one I hear the hunter's complaining about not not necessarily my setup. I feel like I have a decent setup for sleeping. But make sure you're asking the outfitter. You know where am I sleeping at? You know, like, oh, you know am I? Now?
Now I know I wouldn't you know, might not bother some people, but I wouldn't want to show up on a guide to hunt and be stuck with five guys sleeping in the same tent or you know that I don't know right and that might not you know, I would if i'd at least want to know about it, you know, like who am I going to get stuck with? Am I going to be sleeping with the cook somewhere? You know, whatever it might be? You know, have that all ironed out, you know, so there's no when you
get there, it's all about hunting. There's no surprises, you.
Know, I mean, in a bunk house with eight beds and seven guys snoring.
Like yep, bulldogs.
Right, Yeah, so I'll need earplugs yeah, or maybe I don't want to. I don't want to do that, all right, Who knows.
I've like I said, I've heard horror stories of mice crawling on people and these old shocks have been in spiders and all kinds of you. Who knows. You know, just be aware where you're gonna be. And I think we movie might have touched on this a little bit, but uh, you know, ask ask your outfitter how how far you're going to be shooting? Very important, and like
we talked earlier, practice to what what they say? You know, if like I usually tell my hunters, I kind of I kind of expect or would like you to be able to shoot three hundred yards.
Yeah, so practice to four hundred Yeah, you know that way three hundreds of chip shot.
That's right. So definitely ask him that and then you'll have a little bit of an idea.
Mm hm.
You kind of already talked about this, but what style of hunt and is it gonna is it gonna fit you? You know like you were you were just kind of brought up, you know, definitely make sure you're gonna if you pull the trigger on a hunt, that you're going to be happy with it.
You know what you're getting into.
And I think if I'm if I'm walking around to trade show or something and trying to pick out and outfitter and I find one and I'm I'm asking him his I'm asking him a lot of questions, you know, But I think I'm really going to be trying to to to look at this guy and and and see is that is hunting really? This is it his passion or is this just a way to make really a living?
And you know, you know, and I might and you can you can tell by talking to somebody, you know, Oh yeah, really quick, bring up some hunts, like what kind of hunts do you like to to go on? What's your favorite hunt? You know? And and see if you see that spark in their eye, and I think that that is I think that I just feel like them guys are really gonna really gonna try harder, no
hunting better. You know, They're gonna they're just gonna be a better choice for you, if you can tell, because unfortunately, in this business there's there's what I call businessmen, you know, and I guess I'm one too, But you know, they're they're pushing numbers and and they might not they might not even hunt themselves really.
Right, they just have a crew, guys, they have a crew.
They might not guide even you know, so so definitely try to see what what you think there. Another good one is find out how many people are going to be in camp? Oh yeah, you know, And I know for me, I run a pretty small business. But I know if I go somewhere, I don't necessarily want to show up and there'll be twenty thirty people in camp for the week, right. You know that's a big red red flag to me of somebody just either And I
get you know, we have to as outfitters. We've got leases and there's a lot that goes into it, so we have to book a certain amount of hunters to make it, or we're allocated tags or whatever. But you don't want to go to somewhere where they're just flat being greedy and they're pumping as many you're just a number, right, We're pumping as many hunters a week as we can get to go. You know, keep that in mind, you know, right, And I'm not saying that you're necessarily going to have
a bad hunt. I would just keep that in mind, right, you know when you're looking.
Yeah, because some places, you know, they might have a like a gigantic vast area of you know that the lease or they're hunting on. It's just like you're never going to see be close to any but any of the other hunters all for a week. You know, you'll see them at breakfast and dinner, but that would be it. But other places maybe maybe you might be like, oh, the glassing across the hillside, though, there's old Joe from the breakfast.
Table that looking to me.
You know, if it was a place that had a lot of hunters in camp, probably better have a very vast area to to to take their clients into and not be stumbling over each other.
Yes, right exactly. And when you're and you're walking around on the show, same thing, make sure you're you're talking to the owner operator, you know, I mean and and again I'm not saying that you shouldn't go through a booking agency, but at least to be aware of that, like ask those questions like are you the owner, are
you the operator? Are you going to be there? Are you going to be guiding, because I've known lots of my hunters say, you know, they booked a hunt with a guy and he wasn't even there when they showed up, you know, and kind of caught him off surprise, you know. And and at least if you do go through a booking agent, you know, like I said, I don't personally use them because I run a small business and I want to be more personal. Sure, I want to talk to the people that are going to come with me
and stuff. But if you do go through a booking agent, at least you know, ask that booking agency, how can I contact the owner you know and get a little more detailed and personal with them? Sure, you know, and know you know, like okay, are you going to are you going to be there? Do you guide? You know? If they're not Again, if they're not guiding and not involved, you know, it'd probably be a little bit of a
red flag for me. Oh yeah, yeah sure. And then another another question you'd ask him is how much ground do you got to hunt? Yeah, if there's f I've guys in camp and you've only got eight hundred acres to hunt, well that you might want to stay clear of that you know and outfitters. I know, Like how my my business works is, I'm I've got my own outfitting area and I do all public ground hunts, you know.
But I'm the only outfitter in that area, and I have tons of ground and and you know, we're not going to run out of spots, you know, I'm confident of that. You know, I've got like six hundred square miles, you know, but not every outfitter. Some outfitters might have more or less, you know. So I think that's an important question to ask, you know, like how much ground
do we have to hunt? And if you don't have much ground to hunt, you know, I'm not saying you wouldn't be successful, but it's something to it would probably raise a little bit of a red flag. Yeah, I like breathing room, right, you know, Right, I can't find something, some something on this mountain. I want to go to another one, right, you know?
Absolutely?
How long has our guides been working for them? You know, that's that's an important one to ask, I think to an extent, so a lot of my guides have been I've been lucky. I've had some guides that have worked for me from day one. I mean they're excellent hunters, and I'm grateful for that, but I think it's important
to ask. I've been back East at at shows and I've had outfitters literally hiring guides from back East to come work for him and and Idaho, and I'm thinking, Holy cal that there's no way I'd run my business like that, right, So you want to you want to know who you're getting for a guide, you know, and uh, those are important and just because they're you know, guy's got to start start somewhere. I just trained one up
three years ago. Super good, young kid, does a great job, and the technology we got just because it's his first year, you know, I I kind of explained to him and I and I I put way points and stuff on his on X or base map or whatever he has, and and you know, tell him, you know, guide him through like this is how you need to hunt the hunters, you know. So he'll be just as we all kind of hunt the same style, so he'll be just as
successful usually, you know. But it's important to know who you're going to have for a guide and how experienced they are, for sure, Definitely a question i'd be asking.
Oh yeah, yeah, that's that's super important because you know, if and it might tell you something a little bit
about the outfit. If if they have a revolving door of guides coming and going, maybe there's something else going on too, right, But if they've got you know, guides that have been with them for a really long time, that means, you know something things are getting done right around there, and it's been a good experience probably for the hunters and the guides to keep coming back every year, and a good outfit to work for.
Absolutely. Yeah. And you know if you do, if you do find out you you're getting a newer guide. You know it's his first or second year iden. You know, try to dig into how long has he been a hunter? Yeah, you know, how long has he lived here in Idaho or wherever you're hunting? You know, some other things to think about.
Yeah, yeah, he could be a country first year guiding, but country boy has been hunting his whole life. And you know, you know these knows, these mountains like on the back of his hand, right yeah or maybe not?
Yeah exactly, maybe maybe not.
Yeah, it's important to get a good guide, that's for sure. Yeah. Well, thanks for coming on. That was really great. All those points you brought up on the biggest mistakes and the had a best vet an outfitter. Whether you're vetting an outfitter or maybe you're vetting a hunting partner, those are some really good things to think about and conversations to have. That way, you have a really good, a really good experience. Do you have any closing thoughts? Yeah, I think i'd it is is uh.
No matter if you're doing it, do it yourself or or guided hunt. Go in with a positive attitude, you know, go in You know you might not kill one, that's just reality, but go in there. I'm gonna have a good time no matter what happens, you know, I'm I'm gonna be positive. I'm gonna set a positive tone for the whole camp. Yeah. I love those kind of guys that they're just they're positive from the day they walk in till the day they walk out, and if they
don't kill kill one, they're still positive. We love those type of guys. Just it just really sets the tone for the whole camp for the week. And I love it.
Yeah, it sure does, you know, And and an attitude is so contagious, whether it's positive or negative. If you're if you're exuding positivity and and having a good time and people around you are gonna have that same vibe, they're all gonna start having that same Maybe they're like on the fence whether they want to be positive or not, right, it's easy for them to follow follow suit, like, oh yeah, that guy, he's kind of uplifting and cheering me up.
Now I'm positive too, But if you're kind of being a poo poo, you know, if you're having a bad attitude, then that's also really contagiousness. And it's actually really a lot easier to have a bad attitude than it is a good attitude. And my buddy Dan Stayton from Elk Shape, he always says there's only two things on elk hunting that you can control, and that's your attitude and your effort. And that's so true.
That is true.
I love that. Yeah.
Yeah, And like you said that, the negative attitudes are just as intelligents. But I mean I tell all my guides, no matter what happens, stay positive, and it really helps when the hunter, the actual hunter, is doing it. So yeah, that number one positive attitude.
Absolutely absolutely, And you know guided hunts, I mean they're just because you're going on a guided hunt doesn't mean it's any less of a hunt than a than a do it yourself for I feel like there's this attitude out there in the hunting world right now that oh it's a guided hunt. Oh oh you drew a tag. It wasn't over the counter do it yourself hunt. You know, some people kind of turn their nose up at that, and that's you know what, that's not right. You know,
the outfitted hunts is still a hunt. You have to show up, you have to work hard, you have to you know, you have a guide there helping you. You know. So we're all in this together. We shouldn't We shouldn't be trying to tear each other down. You know, as long as the method someone else chooses to hunt is is legal, and you know they're they're observing ethical standards, you know, we should support them. You know, we shouldn't run them down.
Yep, don't divide, don't divide.
We're all in this together. There's too many people trying to tear take away their hunting rights and take trying to tear down hunting as it is. We don't need to do it as as hunters, right yes, and thank you for bringing that up about a guided hunt. I appreciate that because yes, as a guide, you know, I'm still hunting with hunters you know that come with me.
Oh they're still they're good hunters. They hunt at home, they're just not real familiar and you can learn a lot. I mean, they can learn a lot if you're I take these kids up north here that you know, we're really wanting to get into calling and do it themselves. And they actually booked a couple hunts with me and it's worked out real good. They've learned a lot and they're out there calling in Elk now by themselves and stuff.
I mean, you're there with a good guide for a week and you're paying attention, you can learn a ton.
Yeah. So yeah, you have a seasoned guide that's been doing this a long time. You can learn a lot. And maybe maybe that's your goal is to someday do it do it yourself type hunt or maybe not, or or maybe you can go with an outfitter and they they can provide a hunt that you would never be able to do on your own. You know, maybe they own you know, a pack of hound dogs that are really well trained and they know the area very well. For me, I I can't own a pack of hound
dogs and train them. I just just I don't have the ability or do I have the space to do it, and then and then where to do it? You know, I can come with Bradley, we can go we can go chase cats, or we can go chase bears, and
it's going to be an experience of a lifetime. So you know, maybe it's just buck your buck checking off a bucket list thing, or or maybe maybe you've just never gone hunting before and you're intimidating just like you know, I don't know if I can do this by myself, and I want to go with a guide and learn everything he knows about elk hunting or deer hunting, whatever kind of hunt it is, and then next year I'll feel comfortable to do it myself. And that's a great,
great way. There's no shame in that game. That's a great way to do it. That's it's smart actually, So.
Yep, yeah, definitely, And yeah, i'd thank you for bringing the hounds up, you know, just before we go here. You know, if you have a chance, I feel like hounds are kind of misled a little.
Bit in a way.
You know, I know not everybody, but you know, I just encourage anybody to go with a Try to find somebody with hounds if they're willing to take you and and go out there and experience that. You know, there's a lot of hard work that goes into that. It's not just turn the dogs loose or pulling the trigger as you know Dirk Oh so yeah, or you know, like Dirk said, you know, you might not have the knowledge or or the space or you know, the time I am to raise a pack of dogs, but at
least experience, you know, especially before you judge it. You know, definitely try it out. I think just about anybody I ever took out for the first time with hounds, I pretty much hooked them. Oh yeah, it's fun.
Yeah. Well, on social media anytime, like on the Phelps page or even on my page or on our YouTube videos where we've gone hunting with you and it's like cound dog hunting for mountain lions or bears. Immediately immediately there'll be somebody naysayer but like, no, thanks, oh, that's the lazy man's way or whatever. And they they'll say
that about bear baiting too. And it blows my mind because to me, hunting with hound dogs or baiting that is like the opposite of the lazy man's way that takes so much time, discipline, effort that I don't have, Like I don't have time to deal to have dogs and train them in and all that like, and then it's not like I just show up and shoot something like we hunted all week, you know, and and you got to be in the cold, you got to be in the hot, you got to hike up in there
to the tree. I mean, there's more to it than that. It's it's in that baiting too. My buddy Cody Wilson went bear hunting left spring with him in in Wyoming and and baiting. And people will pooh pooh on that. They'll say, oh, that's the lazy man's way. If you've ever if you've never baited bears, especially legally where you have to do it for the law. You can't have it next to a stream you can't have but next to the road you get you have to do it right.
That is an astronomical amount of work and bait. And yes, it's crazy to me that people can sit there and run it down. They obviously have never done it right. They just see the maybe the fruits of people's success and maybe feel a little jealous or think, oh man, that's that must be nice or whatever. That's easy. It ain't easy, yep.
Definitely try it before you judge it.
Yep.
And it's definitely, I can promise you, not easy. I've got my whole life and dedicated to hounds, and I know exactly what it takes. And you know, the people that think it's easy, you know, go out and train a pack of dogs and catch your first cat and then we'll talk.
Yeah, I have a little different pit. Yeah. Well, man, I can't tell you how much I appreciate you coming on here and sharing all your knowledge and stuff with me. And and but I've been trying to get Bradley to go elk cunting with me, and we've been kind of talking about that and he said, you just wanted me to call it an elk for you, which that's true, But I want to really call one in for him really bad too. So I know one of these days we're going to probably put that together and hopefully we'll
get to film it share it with you guys. I think it'll be a probably a head of a lifetime really.
Oh man, I'll be I definitely want to do that and I'll look forward to that. And yeah, I'd love for the bugler to call me in a big six awesome, even a big spike. I'm not too fill you don't want you to have too much pressure. Perfect.
Perfect, We'll keep our expectations right, Yeah, I will talk it over again. Well, thanks again, appreciate it.
Thank you, Derek. I appreciate this.
Tell us where people can find you, okay, social and stuff.
Yeah, so I do have an Instagram page, you know, I'm I think three. Well, I started Instagram right about the time six seven months before you come about COVID year. So I'm not the greatest on it, you know, but I'm on there. You can look me up. We have a website Idaho whitetailguides dot com and there's a lot of information on there, and you know a way to contact us, and like I said, if you have any questions,
I'm I'm happy. You know, a lot of times my wife will take the calls and I might be out in the field hunting or something, but I will eventually get back to you. And even the do it yourselfers. Like I said, I if there's anything I could do to point you in the right direction or or any kind of information you might think you need from me.
Don't hesitate your call okay, yeah, great, you on Instagram your handles, I don't wait tail guides yep, okay, ye, all right, well thanks, I appreciate it.
Yep, thank you, dart huh