Healing from Betrayal: Insights and Strategies with Dr. Debi Silber

Silber is the founder of the PBT Institute and is a holistic psychologist , a health mindset and personal development expert , and is a two-time number one international bestselling author . Her podcast from Betrayal to Breakthrough is also globally ranked within the top 1.5% of podcasts .

Her recent PhD study on how we experience betrayal made three groundbreaking discoveries that changes how long it takes to heal .

In addition to being on Fox , cbs , the Dr Oz Show , tedx twice and more , she's an award-winning speaker and coach dedicated to helping people move past their betrayals as well as any other blocks preventing them from the health , work , relationships , confidence and happiness they want most . Dr . Silber and happiness they want most . Dr .

Silber , thank you for joining me .

And then it happened again a few years later . This time it was my husband . So anybody who's been through that , you're shocked , you're devastated , blindsided . That's how I was . And so I got them out of the house . That was the deal breaker . I looked at the two experiences , thinking well , what's similar here ? Of course me , but what else ?

And I realized that I never even was like on my own to-do list , you know , it was always about everybody else . So here I was four kids , six dogs , a thriving business and I decided to go back for a PhD . Like there was no book on this , there was no program on this , so I decided to just get a whole PhD in it .

And then it was time to do a study . So I studied . It was in transpersonal psychology , the psychology of transformation and human potential . And then I had to do a study , so I studied betrayal and honestly I studied it just to get myself out of this jam , so I could be better for my kids and my clients , and I did not see this coming .

But that study made three groundbreaking discoveries which changed my health , my family , my work , my life .

I didn't want to assume it was the same for all my study participants , so I asked them if you've been through other traumas besides betrayal , does it feel different for you ? And every single one of them said oh my gosh , it's so different . And here's why Because it feels so intentional , we take it so personally .

So the whole entire self gets shattered and has to be rebuilt . Rejection , abandonment , belonging confidence , worthiness , trust they're shattered . Belonging confidence , worthiness , trust they're shattered .

So that type of healing needed its own name , because you're not only rebuilding your life , which is the invitation with all traumas , but you also have to rebuild yourself . So I coined a new term post-betrayal transformation the complete and total rebuild of your life and yourself after an experience with betrayal . So that betrayal is a different type of trauma .

That was the first discovery . Want me to go to the second one .

That's going to have a different impact than , let's say , your best friend sharing your secret , your coworker taking credit for your idea . They're both betrayals , but there's a different kind of level of cleanup left in the way , different level of magnitude . Does that make sense ?

It's like we think we know this person and then , without our awareness or consent , all of a sudden it's like what happened here . I was going along with the spoken or unspoken rules . Where'd you go ? So , absolutely it's a betrayal and it's that shock piece that lands on our body , our mind , our heart .

That's why it requires a very different way to heal and that's also why it leaves us with a lot of these symptoms of post betrayal syndrome . That was the second discovery . Want me to go through that one .

We've had , I think , over 95,000 people take it , and a few things about that . The first thing is we've all been taught time heals all wounds . Well , I have the proof that when it comes to betrayal , that's not true . It's not true . You can't count on time , you can't count on a new relationship to heal betrayal .

You need to intentionally and deliberately heal it because until and unless you do , it will follow you around in every relationship you have . So , and I'll mention the symptoms . But that's a really big misconception . And you know there's a question on the quiz that says is there anything else you'd like to share ?

And people write things like my betrayal happened 35 years ago and I'm unwilling to trust my betrayal happened 10 years ago . It feels like it happened yesterday . So we see , betrayal is this long lasting without intentionally healing it , this long lasting event that seeps into everything . You do so anyway , every few months .

I pulled the stats from the quiz , happy to share them . I would . Yeah , okay . So imagine 95,000 people men , women , just about every country's represented here . So and pay attention to these numbers because they're super high 78% then we're talking about 95,000 people . 78% constantly revisit their experience . 81% feel a loss of personal power .

94% deal with painful triggers and if you've ever had a trigger , they can take you right down . The most common physical symptoms 71% have low energy . 68% have sleep issues . 63% have extreme fatigue . Your adrenals have crashed . You wake up in the morning you're exhausted . You slept all night , it doesn't matter . 47% have weight changes .

So maybe in the beginning you can't hold food down . Later on you're emotionally eating . You're using food for comfort . 45% have a digestive issue . That could be anything Crohn's , ibs , diverticulitis , constipation , diarrhea , you name it . The most common mental symptoms 78% are overwhelmed . 70% are walking around in a state of disbelief . 64% are in shock .

62% can't concentrate . So imagine you can't concentrate . You're exhausted , you have a gut issue . You still have to work . You still have to raise your kids . You still have to do what you have to do . That's not even emotionally . Emotionally , 88% experience extreme sadness . 83% are very angry . You can go back and forth between those two all day long .

79% are stressed . Just a few more . Here's why I wrote the book Trust again this one got me . 84% have an inability to trust . 84% Think about how that will impact you . 67% are preventing themselves from forming deep relationships because they were afraid of being hurt again . 82% find it hard to move forward .

90% want to move forward , but they don't know how this is painful to listen to .

This could be from that partner who broke your heart in high school . So think about this . That person may not know care , remember . They may not even be alive . And here we are , decades later with symptoms because of something left unhealed . The good news is . You can heal from all of it . That's a discovery , yeah , you know .

The good news is you can heal from all of it . That's discovery , yeah , you know . And just to really show what like the extent of how long this stuff can can last , we have a person in our community woman in our community . She's in her mid-80s . She had a 70 plus year digestive issue from a family betrayal when she was a little kid .

So imagine a digestive issue for 70 plus years . Two weeks into our program she healed from a 70 plus year digestive issue .

For me , this was the most exciting , and what we learned was while we can stay stuck for years .

What we learn was while we can stay stuck for years , decades , 70 , you know , years more , a lifetime if we're going to fully heal and by fully heal I mean those symptoms of post betrayal syndrome like I just shared to this completely rebuilt place called post betrayal transformation .

We're going to go through five proven , predictable stages , and what's even more exciting about that is we know what happens physically , mentally and emotionally at every stage , and we know what's needed in order to move from one stage to the next . Healing has now become entirely predictable and I'm happy to share the stages if you want to hear them .

Oh , yes , please , okay , because that would have been really awkward if you said , no , hear them . Oh , yes , please , okay , cause that would have been really awkward if you said no .

And what can really help is talking about these issues with a therapist , because , regardless of whether you have a clinical mental health issue like depression or anxiety , or if you're just a human who lives in this world and is going through a hard time , therapy can give you the tools to approach your life in a very different way .

After being ghosted , therapy helped me handle challenging emotions and cultivate self-compassion . It was a game changer , and that's why I'm happy to tell you about today's sponsor , betterhelp . Betterhelp connects you with a licensed therapist , trained to listen and provide helpful , unbiased advice .

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So stage one is before it happens , and if you can imagine four legs of a table , the four legs being physical , mental , emotional and spiritual what I saw with everybody me too was a heavy lean on the physical and mental thinking and doing we're so good at that and kind of neglecting or ignoring the emotional and the spiritual feeling and being .

Well , if a table only has two legs , it's easy for that table to topple over . Right , that's us . Stage two shock , trauma , d-day , discovery day , like the day you get ghosted . Right , and this is the scariest out of all of the stages . Here's the shock , right here , and it's the breakdown of the body , the mind and the worldview .

So , right here , you've ignited the stress response . You're now headed for every single stress-related symptom , illness , condition , disease . Your mind is in a complete state of chaos and overwhelm . You cannot wrap your mind around what just happened . This makes no sense . How could this person be in my life today and yesterday and today ? Where are they ? Right ?

It's like that and your worldview is is completely shattered . Your worldview . Those are the rules that govern you , that prevent chaos . Trust this person . Go here , don't go there , don't do that . Do this Right and in one earth shattering moment we're serious of moments Every rule you've been holding to be real and true is no longer .

The bottom has bottomed out on you and a new bottom hasn't been formed yet . This is terrifying , but think about it . If the bottom were to bottom out on you , what would you do ? You grab hold of anyone or or anything right , In order to stay safe and stay alive . And that's stage three . Survival instincts emerge .

It's the most practical out of all of the stages . If you can't help me get out of my way , how do I survive this ? Who can I trust ? Here's the trap , though . Stage three by far is the most common place we get stuck is the most commonplace we get stuck .

And here's why , once we've figured out how to survive our experience because it feels so much better than the shock and trauma of where we just came from we think it's good . We're like okay , I got it . And because we don't know there's anywhere else to go , we don't know . There's a stage four or stage five , right , we don't know that .

So we plant roots here . We're not supposed to , but we don't know that . And then four things start to happen . The first thing is we start getting these small self-benefits . We get to be right . We get our story , we love our story . We get someone to blame , we get a target for our anger . We get sympathy from everyone .

We tell our story to on and on , and on some level we feel we're not getting much else . So we take this . And so we plant deeper roots . We're not supposed to , but we don't know .

And now , because we're here longer than we should be , the mind starts doing things , like you know , maybe you're not that great , maybe you deserved it , maybe this , maybe that right .

And so we plant deeper roots and now , because we're here longer than we should be , and these are the thoughts , we're thinking well , this is the energy we start putting out and , like energy attracts , like energy , right .

So now we start calling people and circumstances and even new relationships towards us to confirm Yep , this is where you belong , like right here is where you join that lame support group and you will actually sabotage your healing because you found your people .

This is where you go back to the betrayer who has no intention of changing , because you're afraid to be alone . You see , it gets worse , but I'll get you out of here because it feels so bad , but we don't know there's anywhere else to go . We're miserable , but we're like there's anywhere else to go .

We're miserable , but we're like I got to get through my day , right . So , right here we start numbing , avoiding , distracting . So , right here , we start using food , drugs , alcohol , you know , work , tv , whatever to avoid and distract ourselves from this painful place . So we do it for a day , a week , a month .

Now it's a habit a year , 10 years , 20 years and 70 years right yeah , someone 20 years later and say you know that emotional eating you're doing or that numbing whatever . Do you think that has anything to do with your betrayal ? They look at me like I'm crazy . It happened 20 years ago . What are you talking about ?

All they did was put themselves in stage three and stay there .

Anyway , if you're willing willingness is a big word right here willing to grieve the loss , let go of your story , let go of a bunch of different things , a few things you have to do , know , let go of your story , let go of a bunch of different things , a few things you have to do , you can move to stage four .

Stage four is finding and adjusting to a new normal . So here's where you acknowledge I can't undo what happened , but I control what I do with it . Right there , in that decision , you're turning down the stress response . You're not healing just yet , but at least you stopped the massive damage you were accumulating in stages two and stage three .

Stage four feels like if you've ever moved , if you've ever moved to a new house , office , condo , apartment , whatever , like all your stuff's not there , it's not cozy yet , but you're like we can do this , we got this , okay , it feels like that . But what's so interesting is , if you were to move , you do this . We got this , okay , it feels like that .

But what's so interesting is , if you were to move , you don't take everything with you , right Like you don't take those things that don't represent who you want to be once you're in this new space and what I found was if your friends weren't there for you , you're done with them right here . That lame support group you're done .

That betrayer who won't change you're done . And that's why people say to me all the time what the heck I've had these friends 10 , 20 , 30 years . Is it me ? Yes , it is . You're undergoing a transformation and if they don't rise , they don't come . So changing relationships really common as we move from stage three to stage four .

Anyway , when we settle into this new space , we make it cozy , we make it kind of mentally home . We move into the fifth , most beautiful stage , and this is healing , rebirth and a new worldview . The body starts to heal Self-love , self-care , eating well , exercise . We didn't have the bandwidth for that earlier , we were surviving , now we do .

Your mind is healing . We're making new rules , new boundaries , you know , based on everything we see so clearly now and we have a new worldview based on the road we just traveled and the four legs of the table . In the beginning , it was all about the physical and the mental .

By this point , we're solidly grounded because we're focused on the emotional and the spiritual too . Those are the five stages .

And it's so beautiful because I mean you even check off things like did this , this , this and you know exactly what you would have had to do in order to move to the next stage . And then and then you have like we have this milestones and market , this amazing sheet that really shows us this .

If you have not checked off all these things , you're just do this , this , this to get to the next stage . So so everybody knows they are fully and completely moving through the stages instead of just only addressing it from , let's say , one level .

Like we have so many people coming in with therapy , trauma at well-meaning therapists , but they don't know the five stages . So if anything is going to glue you to stage three , it's endlessly unpacking your story right , without a strategic plan to move forward . So the most well-meaning , you feel heard , you feel understood , you feel validated , but like that's it .

You know . So that's a stage three thing . So it has a role , but we just move everybody through the stages .

Can you share more about that ?

I use that analogy a lot . I look at trust like a brick wall where every opportunity someone has to show that they're trustworthy , that's like one brick in that brick wall , and I don't know of any other way a brick wall can be built , you know , except brick by brick , by brick , you know .

So it's like every opportunity someone has to show that they're trustworthy , that's a brick , another brick , another brick , another brick , and then all of a sudden they ghost you . Well then , that's the whole wall coming down , right ?

So if trust is that brick wall and they just shattered that brick wall , and then they come back , you're looking at this rubble of bricks Now . Now you don't have to do anything with it , you can walk away , totally fine .

But if that person , if you want to feel safe and trust that person , then that person , the one who shattered the brick wall , has to be a really good bricklayer and put the bricks up the same way the first time , brick by brick , by brick . Here's the mistake , though . I see so many people who've been ghosted , right , who've been betrayed .

The ghoster , the betrayer , doesn't really have much of an interest in doing the work to repair , and I don't even think trust can be repaired . It has to be rebuilt . They're really not interested in doing the work to rebuild . So the one who's been ghosted , the one who's been betrayed , is like fine , I'll do it . No , no , no , no .

That's why you don't feel safe , that's why you don't trust . That's not your job to do . Your job , if you wanted to , would be to be willing to watch that brick wall be rebuilt , but for you to rebuild what someone else destroyed , no .

Now you're rebuilding yourself , for sure , but when it comes to rebuilding an entirely new relationship that has so much to do with that other person .

But this is like for the person who realizes I just shattered the heart and the trust of the very person that loves me the most and that I love the most , and I'm disgusted with who I am and I want to become someone I'm proud of .

So it's so interesting because at first , when people were asking me to create that program , I was like I don't know , do I even want to be doing a program like this ? And and and I you know I'm meeting with the betrayers and I'll tell you it is one of my most . I look forward to those calls . I meet with them .

They meet with our coaches and everything , and have their own community and programs . But I meet with them every month and I love it because these are people who cause . I'm giving them the playbook this is what you say , this is what you do , this is what you never say , this is what you never do .

And they are listening so intently and they're really taking it in . And one of the biggest things that I see with them and this is to answer your question is a willingness . A willingness Same thing with the betrayed too . They have to be willing to let go of their story and rebuild themselves .

But for the betrayer , they have to be willing to let go of the habits , behaviors , everything that they've created . They have to be willing to change that . They have to be willing to look at who they've been . They have to be willing to really go into those dark places and say why did I do that ? What was I thinking ?

And here's the thing I see this with a lot of betrayers , they betrayed they're like oh well , they've been through . They make excuses for the betrayal . Well , they've been . You know they were traumatized , they had a . You know they had this going on , that going on . Well , so has the betrayed . But why did they not make those choices too ?

I'm not saying it's not a valid reason for them to get support around that , but that does not justify betrayal ever .

And what is left in the wake for the betrayed to move through is otherworldly , you know it's it's . When I look at betrayal , I think it is one of the hardest of the human experiences . I mean , I can only imagine like death of a child being worse .

You know , thankfully I've never been through that , but because think about it this was the person , or these were the people , who gave you a sense of safety and security .

So , if this is the person who gave you that sense of safety and security and they're the ones taking it away , you know and this is after years or decades of complete and total , 100% trust I mean what a violation , what a violation . And the beauty , though , is when I see someone moving through stage four and stage five .

I don't think I've seen stronger people , because they have intentionally and deliberately rebuilt themselves . It's so beautiful to watch because , when this happens , what they're doing is they're taking a look at every thought that comes in , every belief that they have , every choice they make , and they're assessing . That was the old me . Does this still work ?

No , I'm letting it go . If it looks and suits this new version of me , okay . If not . And that's the same opportunity for the betrayer , and that's why you know we have so many people going through a reclaim program for the betrayed , a rebuild program for the betrayer . They meet up again as two very different people . That's a 2.0 relationship .

So if you're allowing this , you're enabling both of you and preventing both of you from healing , from doing the deep work that's needed to heal . And I'll tell you , there were three groups in the study who did not heal . One , this was the group . They had their story , they were sticking with it . They didn't heal .

Number two this was the group , the second group , this was the group where they ran to the doctor , put them on a mood stabilizer , anti-anxiety medication . They were numbing may have made the day a bit easier to get through , not without a price . They didn't heal .

The third group this was the group where the betrayed , let's say the ghoster , doesn't have any consequences , very little consequences . You know the like , the , the , the person who was hurt , just tried to turn the other way , look the other way , whatever . And I saw two things .

And and it was usually out of financial fear , not wanting to break up a family , religious reasons , fear of change , whatever . But I saw two things a further deterioration of the relationship . And number two , that group had the most symptoms of post-betrayal syndrome . Your broken heart can't handle that , but we're so afraid of the death of the old .

That's the only way you birth the new , whether that's you know , and just to close the loop on my story , so everybody knows um , whether you rebuild yourself and move along and that's what I did with my family they weren't changing , but I was so that was the end .

Or , if the situation lends itself , if you're willing , if you want to , you rebuild something from the ground up new , with the person who hurt you , and that's what I did with my husband , so not long ago as to totally transform people . We married each other again new rings , new vows , new dress , and our four kids is a bridal party .

And for those of you now are thinking , oh , she sold out or whatever , look I get . You can imagine what I hear . It was by far , hands down , the hardest thing I've ever done , and the only reason why I was able to do that was because I moved into stage five and he did on his own as well .

So when we met up again , it was as two completely healed and changed people .

And we should all go listen to your podcast too , because it's so incredible . Read your books , join the programs , everything .

And so I put it in a program and it blew up , and then everyone wanted to work with me and I was like what do I do now ? But I wanted to get the five stages into everybody's hands coaches , doctors , therapists . So I created our certification program and then I was like , wait a second . I did the research . I know what works .

What would happen if we put everything that works under one roof , excluding everything else ? And that works under one roof , excluding everything else , and that's the PBT Institute . And it was so interesting because , especially with writing trust , again , I set the whole family down . I'm like you know this is , I don't know what's going to happen here .

I thought that the kids would be like , oh , come on , mom , they were . They were , you know , really behind it . My biggest supporter was my husband . Yeah , he's like you're going to help so many people and you're going to show them that people can change . And that's how I knew he was totally different .

Because if he and like many betrayers , if they're like no , no , no , don't , don't let the kids know , don't let our friends know , don't do that , then that's about them . That's not a person who's ready and willing to really , really change them .

This is someone else's weakness , this is someone else's unhealed whatever . This is someone else's issue . It's a great opportunity for us to always look and say what do I want for next time ? What am I maybe not realizing ? Am I not realizing how lovable , worthy , deserving I am ? We want to take a look to see what we can learn from the experience .

But what you don't want to do is just assume that it's about you , because it's not .

How can people connect with you ?

Your feedback helps spread a message of hope . And finally , be sure to remember when you're ghosted . You have more time to connect with yourself and with people who have stellar communication skills . You deserve the best .

And one last thing I enjoyed speaking with Dr Debi so much that I am well on my way to getting certified as a post betrayal transformation coach . I'm already a coach for people who've been ghosted , but I loved her steps and methodology and would love to incorporate it into my pre-existing work .

So stay tuned , as I will be giving you updates on new programs and memberships and things that I'm going to do once I finish the certification .