Lunch with Pippa Hudson and now Consumer Talk featuring Wendy Nola.
Welcome to Consumer Talk and to consumer journalist Wendy Nola, who is back with us in studio today. We're going to be discussing the ongoing issues with the new Irish visa application system. Unfortunately, we've seen a number of South Africans suffering huge frustration missing key life events and also, as you'll hear today, suffering pretty substantial financial losses as a result of sort of shifting goalposts, if I can
call it that. So we're going to devote quite a bit of time to that and to some of the case studies that have come our way. I also hope we'll have time to have some open line calls and maybe chat about the new Woolli's loyalty program and its rollout. We've had a few people complaining and commenting on that.
If you want to join any of those conversations or share your own experience, you're welcome to send a WhatsApp to seven two five six seven one five six seven or give us a call on two one four four six five six seven. Gosh, Wendy, right off the bat, Off the bat, messages are starting to stream in. There are a lot of people stuck in this position. Firstly, welcome back. Let me have you with us in a couple of days for you, oh yeah, but still love you to have you back with us. Let me start
by saying this nothing against Ireland. I was lucky enough to get to Ireland visit there with my son in late November twenty twenty two and it was the most wonderful experienced, the most beautiful place, wonderful people, all of that rich history. Even though it was late November, early December, it was very cold and very wet.
We just absolutely loved our trip there.
But Wendy, we were lucky enough to squeeze in that trip when it was still possible to do so without a visa as a South African traveling on a South
African passport, which was a huge appeal. It was a huge yeah, And it was I think literally just a few weeks or if maybe a month or two later, I'm sure listeners will remember we demolished Ireland in the rugby and almost the very next day, boom the news broke that South the Wood in future have to apply for a visa to visit the Emerald Isle, and unfortunately it has not been a smooth transition, certainly not if you look at the high number of complaints around the turnaround time for those visas.
Wendy No, exactly. So the biggest takeo from this discussion is going to be if you're planning to visit Ireland and you have a South African passport, you must not buy your ticket until you have your visa in hand in your passport, right because up until recently, the Irish government was advising, or what was making it mandatory for you to show proof of having purchased flight, your flight and your return flight and booked you accommodation if you
weren't staying with friends, proof of where you're going to be staying, in other words, and now very recently they have started saying what I've just said, Now, don't get your don't apply, sorry, don't book your ticket before you get your visa, which you know, it's great advice given what's happening with the delays, but it also means that you are now being forced to book last minute, and that's so much more expensive, as the case study will share proofs. So but so it's it's.
Important and I mean, as you'll hear, it's that the transition from the one to the other that has been so problematic for so many people. So as you said, originally, VFS, by the way, is the visa processing company that has been mandated by the Irish They do theas so up until fairly recently, VFS was saying expect six to eight weeks turn around and you must be able to provide proof of your flight InCom.
That was September, okay, then went from it went from six to eight to eight to twelve, and now it's the Irish government told me ninety days somebody who applied will get to her later. She said she was told twelve to fourteen weeks.
From application to receiving your.
Visam fly that far in advance. And it's yeah, so many people applied and then the goalpost moved and now they're stuck a huge financial.
And you imagine the anxiety now again, in fairness to say, we know many countries are taking a long time to process visa applications, Wendy, it's not a situation that's unique to the Irish government. And in some cases, like Canada, you can't even get an appointment to apply for more than a year and a half. I have a friend who was in that position who was told the first available appointment is over five hundred days away just to
get an appointment. So it's not to say that they're the only one experiencing this issue, but it is this issue of the shifting goalposts which has caused all of the problems for our listeners. As you've said, flights that have been booked that now can't be made because the visa hasn't arrived, or if you make the decision to wait until the visa's there, you have to pay that
last very expensive premium for the flights. Do you want to walk us through the first case study that we have today, which really very well demonstrates the terrible predicament that some of our applicants are finding themselves in.
Indeed, and this cases really touched my heart. One hundred and five days ago. It's a precise number, and it needs to be given the context here. One hundred and five days ago, in other words, more than ninety days. Seventy seven year old Philip Berman, who lives in Victoria West and the Northern Cape. He applied for a visa
to visit his family in Ireland. Bear in mind the trek he drove to George overnighted because it was late, then flew to Cape Town from George the next morning, then had to get an uber to the VFF officers and repeat the process, so that in itself carried a huge cost. Yes, he has family in Ireland, his son, daughter in law and their daughter, his granddaughter who's nine years old, and they have a particularly special and he
goes over fairly often. So he applied in March one hundred and five days ago, as I said, which was the advice. Then when he first made inquiries with VFS in September, which is when he booked his ticket, it was six to eight weeks okay, significantly less term okay. So he says, he's it tells me he's too old and to travel economy. So he saved and borrowed and paid a special twenty eight thousand rand to Lufthansa for premium economy seat.
And he did that well in advance, so at the September last care Yeah, so this is just just to clarify here.
Philip is one of those in this position of when he originally made inquiries, he was told six to eight weeks six to eight weeks turn around, and you have to supply proof of flights. So he went and booked the flights. Yes, that's the big yes, and then waited until the appropriate time to put in his application, which he did.
In March with in July.
Now, and important to note, Wendy, it wasn't only the cost of a basic visa application. He paid quite a few other extras as well.
He paid two thousand round the equivalent of for two thousand round for a multiple journey visa, plus another thousand round to VFS, which covered their service fee and the cost of kuruing his passport to Victoria West. And that's on top of the seven thousand round cost him to actually get there. That's nobody's fault.
But that was the BFS to make that and back.
Yes, okay, so his lasses will be huge financial and emotional, of course, but let's talk to him about how those rack up.
Philip is with us on the line, and Philip, I'm so sorry that you are going through this. I can just imagine the massive anxiety you must be facing because I know your flight is booked for the end of July, and that's suddenly very very close from now with no visa insight. Thank you for being willing to share your experience with us, and welcome.
To CAP Talk.
Thank you very much. And the strangest thing is I just put on my computer and checked. Everything hasn't changed. The application form stall seys Airline ticket it Stall says has twelve weeks.
As and you must have that, okay.
And it was updated yesterday the eighth of July seas at the bottom of the form.
Okay.
Gosh, that's so bad.
So what they are communicating off offline is not weighing up with what is being communicated online.
I must tell you, Philip, both Pippa and my eyes lit up when you said you've just checked, and we thought you were going to say and be.
On the list.
But it's not how many days to go until you need it, because it's not the departure date in your case, it's two days before.
Ye well, I have to be in joe Berg to catch the flight would live on so the twenty third, So it means I have to leave you out the twenty second of this month to George cats a flight from George to Jailberg. I'm staying with my brother and then catching the flight to Dublin the following day, the twenty fourth.
Okay, if you did luckily, let's hope it doesn't. You don't need to claim on this insurance this extra cost you paid. But you did pay Lufthans a little extra so that if you cancel for whatever reason, they will rEFInd you what you paid, which was twenty was it twenty eight thousand round Philippies. They will refine you manus five thousand runds, so you will get say, twenty three thousand round back from that flight, right.
Dirrect, Now I FI you know, as I've said, I'm saying Wendy knows I'm seventy seven years old. Who says I'm alive next year? That's number one. It's a school holidays. I found my daughter in law. She said I can come later in August because the school holidays last year, the twenty seventh of August. So I went onto the internet and went to lift answer and believe it or not, or Premier Economy on the later flights are all sold out.
I can get a flight on the thirteenth of August fifty four thousands Premier.
So that's almost double. That's twenty six thousand around double.
Sure, Philip, I mean so me talking substantial financial losses besides what you've already spent just putting through the visa application. The implication on the flight costs if you have to delay this trip are to say, the least substantial.
You've been in.
Regular I don't want to say regular communication because it's been a one way affair. Philip, I understand you have literally been mailing the Irish government on a daily basis, saying where's my visas? What sort of feedback if any?
Have?
You had nothing? It says, go to the portal. You go to the portal. I'll tell you the portal hasn't been updated since it confirmed on the twenty.
Seventh of March, when you applied it late.
They've received the application, no update. After all the emails and everything they say, they reply contact look at the portal, but nothing has been updated since the twenty third of March.
Okay, okay, So I just want to put pause and Philip, please stay with us because we still have one or two more questions for you. But I just want to put this in perspective. The number of messages streaming in on our WhatsApp line as we speak, and others that have come in since yesterday. Yesterday Wendy I heard from Colleen, who wrote in to say she had applied for an Irish visa on the twenty fourth of February. She was hoping to get to Dublin in time for the birth
of her daughter's first child in mid April. No sign of that visa ever arrived, so she had to move her flight booking. She did so again and again and again. In total, she has had to move her plane ticket five times. She then eventually canceled the trip entirely, at a cost of thousands of rands, and wrote to me to say, as we speak, it has been nineteen weeks of silence, no delivery from the Irish side. I'm hoping to receive my visa by the end of July and
to try to fly again. And this is really interesting to me, she says. By contrast, we applied last week Monday for a Shngen visa and it arrived in four days. And this is a very good question, she says, why if Ireland is part of the EU, why did they not join the very efficient Shangan system instead of launching their own private system that they're clearly ill prepared to administer.
It's an excellent question.
It's a very very good question that to the Irish government.
Here are a couple of other examples, Sarah writing and to say, my sister had a baby in Dublin in March. My mum was hoping to go over, had to cancel her trip and is ten thousand rand out of pocket. My stepdad has waited nine weeks for his visa with no joy, George saying, this Irish visa thing has been giving me sleepless nights for weeks. I applied two weeks ago for my visa, hoping to have it in time for the Box versus Ireland in Dublin on twenty two
November this year. I've needed to apply for a second passport so that I can continue my normal travels for business, whilst the Irish Visa office holds onto my passport for who knows how long, and I don't even know if I will get my visa.
That the other issue. We covered a case of this shortly after the visas became mandatory for South Africans. Do you remember somebody who had a trip to Botswana.
Yes, and the passport was stuck there.
Yes, and she had to cancel that she couldn't go on the trip because your passport was stuck in.
The Irish process.
And when she booked the Botswana trip, the visa Irish visa was not a thing. So yes, you were stuck for any other form of travel beyond our borders.
Yeah.
Guy is another one saying why are vfs still taking applications when they know the turnaround time is so long. We lost flights and accommodation. We had applied for our UK visas we were landing in London. That took three weeks to get to us. We then applied for the Irish visas and sadly had to get our passports back after waiting twelve weeks. We can do one better than that, Sadik saying, my brother in law has applied on the fourteenth of October for his visa to join his wife
in Ireland. Until now, every time we make contact with VFS Global they say the same thing, It is still in processing. It has been nearly a year and we have no further information. His daughter, who is also in Ireland, is giving birth to his grandson in less than a month. He would have liked to be there for the birth. Is there anything we can do? Unfortunately, there is nothing we can do.
I hate to say that in this I have to say at this point before we continue with Philip, that I, as I said, this case has really touched me and I've asked gone back to the Irish government to say, can you at least give some status feedback on when he can expect his name to appear on that lucky list, and I was told no, we cannot cannot comment on individual cases because of data privacy. Well, of course the data subjects as we are referred to as.
Are begging for all that for me to.
Be able to intervene on their part and at least get some much needed information, But unfortunately, so frustrating we are we can't get anything on individual cases at all at all.
I'm so sorry to to be able to have to say that to you, Sidika Wendy in fairness, I mean, there are so many of these stories. That's just a sample of a couple of those that have come through. Has there been any formal response from the Irish government that you're aware of as because we're not the only people complaining about this.
Yeah, there was a conference in Ireland a couple of weeks ago, there was a news conference Ireland's Minister of State for International Development and Diaspora and Neil Richmond. He took questions from South African journalists on this issue. He first explained that they had introduced the visa requirement because they'd seen one hundred percent increase in people entering Ireland from South Africa and Nigeria about a year ago and
claiming international protected status. I don't know whether I mean it occurs to me that probably more from the Nigerian side, I'm not sure, but he acknowledged that since the visa regime was introduced, there have been swamped applications leading to the current delays. He conceded that the human consequences of South African's not being able to visit family in Ireland on business trips and of business trips having to be canceled.
And he said, and this was just two weeks ago, his department had doubled its resources to handle visa applications both in Dublin and Pretoria. But Philip told me that he's really not seeing that in sort of output of number of visas being granted every week.
And the reason we can quite Philip on that is, as I've said, Philip has been communicating checking on a daily basis, and let's bring him back in at this point. Philip, thanks for waiting. You've been watching those figures online, watching them like a hawk every day, looking for the list of names of the lucky people who have been granted a visa. Tell us what you've observed about the number of applications that are being approved.
I can ami to me, it's an absolute disgrace. From the seventeenth of June. These are the dates have got Visus issue issue seventeenth of June to the twenty fourth of June, one hundred and fifty six, first of July to the eighth of July. Where they supposed to have trouble the amount of visas they gave out, it's gone to two one hundred and four. That means last week that only gave out two hundred and four visas.
Okay, so the weekly figure it's a week effect.
So that's that so called doubling of resources isn't results in a doubling of output.
I gave Wendy the link that was updated yesterday that excell July. She's got the link to prove these figures. I gave us one hundred percent carect.
So Philip, I mean, thank you for being willing to share that with us. And obviously you have been monitoring this with an eagle eye, so it's very helpful to hear what you've observed.
In terms of the.
Numbers that are being processed, We've got about now what not even a fortnight before you are setting off. All I can say is that I really really hope that everything will come through, Philip. I mean, besides the financial ask maybe just before we let you go, let's talk a little bit about the emotional toll that this has taken on you and I would imagine on your family on the other side as well of this not knowing being stuck in this limbo.
You know. Another thing is that I've noticed on all the people on Facebook, YouTube, whatever, everybody complain that they don't give you a date. If they say to me tomorrow, listen here, I can only do, We'll give you a visa on the tenth of September. They're at persecre work around it. I can't now fly a frame left answer and say left answer, can you change my ticket to
say the thirteenth of August. I haven't got a date because when it gets to the thirteenth of August, like other people that's written into you, they tell you sorry my visa, they don't give you a date. They don't even reply to your emails.
You can hear the stress and anxiety that that's causing. Philip.
I'm so so sorry that you are going through this, but thank you for being willing to share your experience with us.
Consumer Talk WhatsApp on seven s five six seven one five six seven two.
Well still it's just streaming.
In response to our conversation with Wendy Noda around the Irish visa delays, Lynn an interesting perspective are saying, I wish Durko would get involved with this debacle. I'm a travel agent. I am boycotting Ireland and Canada. Yeah, two of those are the two that are having the worst. I think to do something about delays.
I look at the Canadian situation because a number of travel agents have spoken to me about that.
It was, as I said, I had a friend who's got family in Canada that was trying to connect with them, was told five hundred and twenty four days. I think it was to get an appointment. So Linn, Yeah, of interesting. I'm sure you're not the only travel agent who's just saying, look, it's not safe.
You can't.
There's no predictability, I guess, and you need predictability when you're booking a very expensive overseas trip.
Something I just want to throw and I'm going to be investigating. Except really, but travel agents have told me don't arrive at any VFS office to apply for any visa more than fifteen minutes ahead of your book to appointment because they will charge you extra. Oh my gosh, yes, can you believe it? So just you can come back, you know, within fifteen minutes, but don't be super early.
Oh my goodness, I mean, really, what next?
What next?
Here's another one from Tessnasy's my partner and I went through this process in April getting to a wedding in Dublin. It is hugely distressing and frustrating. The emotional and financial toll of waiting with no word is awful. VFS and the Irish Embassy seem to have no control. Only the Department of Justice can approve applications and they only approve a certain number each day. Now, I mean, the question
is wendy. If they know that they can only approve a certain number each day, should they not be capping the number of applications that say something needs to.
Change or they need to improve their feedback, even if it's just bot driven, just to say you are likelihood that your visa will be based on our current application numbers, you know whatever.
I think it's Philip.
I was hoping you would say it on air, but or fair, He said to me. It's utterly cruel to do this to people, and I think the.
Word cruel is appropropriate.
Here with what we're seeing. I did so official words to get on the record from Ireland's Department of Justice. Sounds like the an odd department to be dealing with it with such a thing. But it's the full name is Justice, Home Affairs and Migration. That's the full name of the department. They don't offer much hope, you know. I ask them, what would you like to say to people who are begging and pleading for visas? Applicants are advice that unforeseen delays can arise which are outside of
the control of the visa desk. This is what I was told very recently. If an application has significantly exceeded the target processing times. It is possible that on initial assessment, the application has not met the criteria to be issued at VISA and further assessment or verification is required. In such instances, processing times will be longer than ninety days. Well that could be the case in Phillip's case, although well it could be likely. But the point is he
doesn't know. Nobody's telling him a thing, So how they communicate that. They don't say that, you just have to keep going onto that portal daily, weekly, whatever. The official advice is for short stay visas, applicants should apply up to ninety days in advance of their proposed travel dates, and that applicants should not book flights until they have received and validated their visa. How do you validate your visa? You get your visa and you think, yay, everything's on track.
I don't know what that means. I should have queried that. And then the statistic. Since July twenty twenty four, which is when the whole thing started, years ninety four percent of short stay visit visa applications have been processed within ninety days of receipt by the South African Visa desk, and I would guess that most of those were in the first half of the not the second.
Because it sounds like that there's been a real slowdown of later.
I think if they had to give us the figure for the last three months, although god you three months, because it's ninety days, the last six months, we'd see a very much left.
Yeah.
I mean, we had another case study from Judy in Heart Bay applied for their visas in May. They'd bought their tickets in January, paid for accommodation for a family trip with five people, so you can just imagine the costs involved, she.
Said, with visas alone, eighteen thousand, right and plus.
Yeah, and they applied in May, which was the timeframe they'd been told that, She said. We were told the process would be six to eight weeks, so applied in May. About two weeks or so after our submission, we were advised by VFS that the process was delayed and it could now take up to twelve to fourteen weeks. With this timeframe, we will miss our flights. And again she's been trying to communicate with them to say, what do
we do, you know, what avenues can we explore? You know, we and just no feedback.
And the work that I do, you can hold a supplier to account if they don't meet their own delivery promise. So she was within time, Well she's six to eight weeks. But even if they told her ninety days, then they move it and say, no, it's actually what's ninety days, it's how many weeks?
That's a month and that's three months, right, so that's approximately twelve weeks.
And now they've said no, it's actually twelve to fourteen weeks. So how do you do that to somebody once they've ever already applied, you know, and made plans accordingly. So she's sitting there, what time? What was the date that she's applied?
Played in May, so to June to July to August. There's still some time in hand in that case. But the point is, Wendy, it's the moving of the goalposts, and it is the changing conflicting information about you must have booked your flight versus please don't book your flight, compounded then by just no communication when anybody tries to follow up.
So again it's.
Very frustrating for Wendy and I to present a case where we really can't make a difference except to alert you to the fact that this is a major, major concern and if you are planning a trip to Ireland, do not be fooled into thinking it's a simple quick process and leave some bufferom, leave substantial bufferom in your timing.
You can't trust that you know the initial promise will be met because God's time later. Exactly.
Very interesting message just in from George who says I have just received some positive news.
From my travel agent.
She has mentioned that this issue is now at Parliament level in Ireland. Visas are apparently going to receive exponited attention, especially with the upcoming test between South Africa and Ireland. They know that there is going to be an increased need for visa issuing. I hope this is good news for some, but I can't guarantee everything. I, however, will be hanging on to those words. Thanks George for that small glimmer of hope. Bronwin saying we also lost fifty
thousand rand due to not getting our Irish visas. Surely vfs knew there was an issue. How could they still take our money? Isn't that theft? Yeah, it's a very tough one.
Again.
I'll circle back to what I said, Wendy, if they're aware that the processing capacity is capped at a certain number per day, to me, it's unconscionable to then take in more applications than you.
Know with the within the time frame.
That even alying for the fact that perhaps some applications will be rejected because they're not deemed valid applications.
It's always unconscionable to me.
That that you continue to operate as if you are processing normally.
Normally, and this story we're going to report back on, certainly on Phillip's case in the next two weeks.
This may be a case of wishful thinking.
But Trevor writing in to say, is there any priority for school tours? My friend's son is going on a multi city European tour. Will the Irish Consonate give special consideration for this?
As I said to you, now, I have to say I doubt that.
Yeah, I'd be surprised, I'm sorry to say, And we wouldn't know anyway anyway, because they're not communicating with anybody about that.
So specific cases.
Yeah, again, perhaps it's it's something for schools et cetera to take notive as well that if you are planning this kind of trip that requires multiple legs and a lot of wangling of visas and destinations, that perhaps this is one destination you need to leave it. But think about leaving off for the time being. As much as it pains me to say that, because I would what a beautiful country, and I so enjoyed visiting herself.
I have a strong Irish heritage, and you know it's just but I was planning to visit. But I think I'm going to wait until at least next year.
I'll consume it. Talk open line call one double four six oh five six seven.
My friend as also.
She had to cancel the Irish part of it. Fortunately she can do that. She had to play extra I think out of pocket about ten thousand.
But what they do say is what you would have preferred in this case, is that they rare the cancel of visa because then she can care. Then she can claim from a terrible insurance.
But that doesn't happen. I mean, she's gone, and she's still she got a shame in visa. She still has not received Irish vision, but obviously she canceled that part to cancel flight set to change flights, so it's quite a substantial amount of exceremoney.
That's an interesting point.
And she applied more than days ago. Anyways, thanks for that.
I mean, that's an interesting perspective. So you can't claim on the travel insurance because you haven't had a No, your visa hasn't been declined, and we should have actually.
Mentioned that it was prep and we didn't get there, So thank you for that. A travel agent did contact me last week to say, you think you covered, but you're only covered if your visa is denied. Yeah, if it just doesn't come in time, it's not covered in the policy, so you don't. I mean that Judy's family, Hot Bay Family eighteen thousand round. That's just no way to recover that. It really is put South Africans wanting to visit Island for whatever reason in a really really antenable situation.
I mean, it's I'm sitting here thinking, if the intention is to reduce the number of unwanted immigrants to the country, this is one way of doing it.
But you're taking with them.
The wanted one, the wanted tourist markets. Because who in their right mind is going to contemplate booking a trip to Ireland in the near future unless you are an absolutely die on springblight fan. I mean, who in their right mind would risk it right now? It's unfathomable.
Stakes are very very high.
Okay, oh Emmanuel, I'm so sorry, she said. In February, they told us it would take two to four weeks. They phoned yesterday to say it's ready, but unfortunately we've already missed our granddaughter's birthday, which was in April. This is Yeah, we didn't have a chance to really explore this deeply with Philip, but what I wanted to say, Wendy is it's not just the financial cost, the emotional toll of the anxiety of not knowing, the sleepless nights,
worrying what is it going to come in time? Should I be canceling? What do I do for the person who's waiting for the visa? Is hard enough for the family on the other side who are also trying to organize their lives and make plans and grandchildren who are waiting for granted to come and don't understand why they didn't.
In fact, thank you for mentioning that. Because there was a report in the Irish Times sometime in June and mid June where they interviewed South African immigrants who exactly that we're waiting for boyfriends, parents, etc. To come and visit, and so the agony is the same on the other side.
Oh starta to those who are caught in this terrible in between. I'm really really sorry for what you are going through and I hope, I.
Hope that they are able to scale up.
The resourcing on the Department of Justice side to process more decisions.
Well, certainly from he's not with the Department of Justice, but that minister. I quoted Neil Richmond, He's Islands Minister of State for International Development and Diaspora, when he spoke sort of on the side of that country to Dublin two three weeks ago to a number of South African
journalists who then wrote reports. He's I don't have in front of me, but he said that in his constituency and where he lives, there are a lot of South African immigrants who have shared their stories with them of their family not being able to come and business partners at whatever, and so he was very much alive to the human side of it him. So hopefully that will
if it's in parliament. You know that would certainly that kind of you know, hands on experience and exposure to what this is doing will help.
Will hopefully prompt some action on that side. Wendy, just in the last few minutes before before we wrap up, I want to just switch completely to a different topic, if I'm May. I came back from my holiday to find an email in my inbox from the Wooly CEO announcing the launch of the new loyalty program on the
first of July. And we've had a couple of emails from people who are a little bit confused about what it means for them because they've read the press releases saying it's going to be a teared system that if you spend X, you qualify for a certain package of vouchers and benefits, but if you spend X plus why you get more, et cetera. And it's a sort of
a sliding scale. But what that scale looks like hasn't been very well communicated, and I just wanted to take the moment to say, firsty to those who've been mailing in saying, from the perspective of hey, all of my existing coffee vouchers and the like disappeared. They are being reloaded. Yes, Vic, thanks for letting us know. Vix just mailed me because he was one of those. He said, hey, you know they disappeared in this process.
And it's something you've got used to in it very much a.
Nice to have, And there was a communication saying they wouldn't be valid for the last week of June while their transition to the new system, but they hadn't reappeared. Vix just mailed me to say thumbs up. The vouchers are back, which is great. But for those who want to read the finer detail of what you get on Witch Tier, it is actually there. It is in the terms and conditions sort of information. So if you click through, it takes a little bit of squirreling, is all I'm saying.
On the app and within the Woolli's app, within the Loyalty rewards section, you need to sort of whittle down through to the terms and conditions and there you will get a very clearly delineated explanation of what the three different reward levels are, what amount of spend qualifies you for which level, and what benefits come with Witch level. So there are three different reward levels. Just quickly to
run you through them. The basic level, which is called loyal is for those who spend up to twelve thousand round a year and you get access to various promos. You'll earn at least four vouchers per year, which is quite a substantial change from what used to be there, and a couple of opportunities to unlock the play and win games if you move up to the next level, which is Ambassador level, which is for those who spend
between twelve and thirty six thousand round a year. That goes up to sixteen vouchers per year, plays benefits, et cetera. And then the top tier, which is the VIP Reward level, is for those who spend over thirty six thousand round a year and that includes at least twenty four vouches per year early access to online promos are all kinds
of additional benefits. So those are the three scales. It's not to twelve thousand, twelve thousand to thirty six and over thirty six thousand round per year in spend, and it'll be on a rolling over the last twelve month spaces in which you can move between them.
Yeah, just what to say quickly, I did engage with Will with this morning and about the app being a bit wobbly, and they've said yes. This has been a huge undertaking, moving literally millions of customers from w rewards over to this new mad Difference. There was always a chance of a few hiccups along the way, and the app has been a bit unstable in the last week or two. The team is working very hard to get it into a good place and they're almost there.
Okay, so allows some more wiggle room for teething problems. But if you're having ongoings difficulties, it does sound like those few hiccups are being worked out. But if you are having substantial ongoing issues with loss of benefits that were there before, et cetera that you want to flag,
you're welcome to send us an email. And remember, if you want to raise a case with Wendy, the best way to do that is on her website, which is Wendynla dot co dot s A and that is spelled k n O W L E R Wendy Noola dot co dot SA. Fill out the contact form there. You're also welcome to send an email to consumer at NOLA dot co dot sed Wendy, thank you so much. A bit of a frustrating one for us not being able
to help more. But I hope that the public service of the educational aspect that this is what is happening, and you.
Need validating for all those others who are going through this there alone, and just airing the sort of magnitude of that problem.
And we'll try again next week Wednesday. Thanks so much, Wendy Nola