Exploring the Sexy Side of Psychedelics with Joe Moore Part 1

Psychedelics , mushrooms , I don't know , I don't even know what else I act like . I know this shit , I don't . But we're so excited and so happy to have an expert from Psychedelics Today . His name is Joe Moore and his company , psychedelics Today and Joe .

They believe that the psychedelics are going to totally disrupt the way that humanity approaches healing , wellness , and it's going to be a whole new paradigm shift in terms of pain , in terms of even , hopefully , sexual experience , because that's what we're going to talk about here Depending on , in relationships , how these things might be able to help us overcome some

of the things that we carry with us and don't realize it . So psychedelics today is the leading discussion and they have over 2.2 million annual learners . They have the largest global reach of any media platform in the psychedelics world . Thank you , joe Moore is a co-founder , so thank you , thank you , thank you for making time for us . We are so excited .

out and go . It just flake out and disappear .

It quickly cut from software to philosophy , which was far more interesting . I kept some minors and and kept working in the technology jobs that were available at school and also interning in my summers . Um , the psychedelics came in right here , so I'm going to kind of try to rapid fire this .

So , um , psychedelics were introduced to me as a topic that you could take seriously in a , in a book called Holographic Universe by a writer , Michael Talbot , um discussing a lot of edge cases and science that kind of lead you towards philosophy .

Um , my teacher was using it as a philosophy one on one book and there was some sections on LSD psychotherapy , particularly this one psychiatrist who um quite devoted to Stanislaw Graf out of a Prague at the time Soviet occupied Prague . He was doing LSD research substantially with people , um , with all sorts of traumas , addictions , and having great results .

Um and uh . Came to America , started doing it here , developed a prep work method that I've studied extensively as well and done a lot of Um yeah . So software was my career . It was kind of the easiest thing for me to jump into after school . You know , uh , if you don't want to go to grad school , philosophy , jobs are sparse .

You kind of fine tune for your purpose , um yeah , so LSD psychedelics require philosophy in a lot of ways , because you can really get ungrounded and if you don't have things you can hold on to , like , contemporary culture doesn't give us too much , we can really grasp and say , okay , this is real , it's like you know . Yeah .

Things that usually just get kind of jammed down your throat from a church where you actually have to like , think about it and come up with your own conclusions and what is something you can actually hold on to , you know , when you go into a really radical experience , because these things can get tested in those states .

So at the same time I'm studying philosophy , I'm exploring big experiences and doing work in software . So like kind of a disintegrated life to have to hide all that from my software world . They all know it's all over LinkedIn now , so they're all probably happy to know somebody that fled the coop and started doing drug media .

But you know my heart wasn't in it . I was spending as much time and money away from that as I could . You know , probably drinking to avoid having to deal with that stuff , because you can't do LSD every night , so you're like you know , but you can drink beers every night .

Or it could be stuff that's never happened to you , right ? So it could be having the experience of what the Big Bang was like , you know , not the dirty one , the natural one , and then I don't know if the dirtier one probably is .

If you're consuming psychedelics or most drugs too often , right , like I kind of hit a breaking point from too much coffee a few years ago . I was like , oh , I'm going to need some attention , and then I got my coffee in check , right . So it's like if you're doing LSD like two times a year , it's probably going to be fine , but there are risks , yeah .

So yeah , everybody is a good prefix here . Drugs are often illegal in the United States and many other places around the world , largely for racist reasons , as the DEA admitted somewhat recently in their museum in DC , right outside DC , and didn't slow them down arresting people at all .

But you know there was this paper published by Dr David Nut , who is the former UK drugs are was published in the Lancet , which is a top , top tier medical journal , and it was a chart . A drug harm scale chart , funded by the UK government published an amazing journal and it showed maybe 15 or 20 drugs harm to self , harm to others , in a graph .

The Economist published this , I think in 2009 as well , and it was LSD and psilocybin were two of the three safest drugs and then alcohol was by far the most harm to self and others . But it's not like , you know , chilling drinking right .

It's like how , how we do it when we're not doing it right and we know we're going to have a bad time and it might actually deteriorate our lives , right .

I feel like it's okay to say but and I'm , you know , I come from kind of Irish Catholic Scottish lineage . So it's kind of true when you , when I look back in time at like the harm it has done to my , you know , ancestors .

There's two compounds If you're detoxing from you could be in serious health risk and that's alcohol and benzodiazepines , like Sanix and some people would say that about heroin , but it's really opiates kind of only because your heart gets really weak in time and like the stress could be a problem , but that's more like lack of appropriate sleep and diet .

Heroin itself is actually really safe , but the way people use it not so much .

Anyway yeah we started doing that . I was doing this secretly from my job . It took me like probably at least a year to tell my family what I was doing and , of course , like , oh , you're going to lose your job if you do this , you shouldn't do that . And then what do we do with that ?

So it was right before the pandemic hit and I actually got laid off and I was like , oh , this is amazing timing . I've always wanted to get laid off and get a big check and I used it all to start the company and keep developing things . So we started as a podcast .

We wanted to hype that particular psychiatrist , stan Grof , his field of psychology he developed called Transpersonal Psychology , which is sort of spiritualized psychology , and then the breathwork method , holotropic breathwork . So those were our three pillars and , like preserve the memory and legacy of our teacher who's still with us , and we did all that in the podcast .

No intent of money , we started saying maybe we should cover our costs for this thing . So we started developing classes online , primarily for college kids who may or may not be having a hard time with use or exploring it , and a lot of college kids aren't as reckless as me and they wanted to have a safe approach and I'm like , okay , yeah , great .

Like let's give you some resources , let's tell you how to plan , let's how to plan the downsides too , like if something scary is going to happen , you have a good plan for that and then in the weeks and months after also have a plan . So , like you know , we don't really have plans for how we're going to do drugs in contemporary world , right ?

It's like oh , I'm just going to shove these powders in my nose and we'll figure it out later . It's like well what if you knew where you were going , you planned and you knew the drugs were safe . You knew who you were going to be with was safe and who you wanted to be with and yeah , like .

I think there needs to be a lot more planning in this stuff . So that's kind of what we developed . All of a sudden , doctors and therapists started showing up . I was embarrassed by the class at that point so we had to like hire clinicians and therapists to really beef it up and make it for them as well .

So we started doing navigating psychedelics for clinicians and therapists and this is all before I was full time , Wow . And then we shortly after that I think it was like a year and a half , two years ago we started a program called Vital .

It's our 12 month kind of professionally interested program where people who want to be either sitters or therapists or psychiatrists or yoga teachers that know how to do this stuff , Pilates instructors , etc . We actually have had a lot of sex educators come through our programs .

I learned far more about sex than I ever have just by like small interactions with those folks Like , oh my gosh , I'm super ignorant , Great and yeah . Vital came out after I was laid off and we wanted to compete head on with the biggest programs out there MAPS and CIS and Naropa , and these are kind of the top tier training programs that people perceive .

But we wanted an inclusive version . We wanted people who weren't clinicians involved , because clinicians are amazing but there's limitations to what clinicians can comfortably talk about or even fairly talk about Honestly , like you probably know , this as an attorney , former attorney , you might still be an attorney , but you know I am , but all I did was family law .

Even in like the early 1900s , late 1800s , before the drug war really ramped up , we could buy whatever we wanted over the counter from a safe supply . We could buy a codeine , we could buy cocaine , we could buy heroin , we could buy fascinating drugs , opium , alcohol mixtures like Lodinum .

There's like a really robust history of what we used to be able to buy over the counter and people largely didn't have much issue with it . And you can check this out in Carl Hart's book Drug Use for Grown-Ups . He's a former head of psychology at Columbia Amazing writer .

And so what ? So where are you going ? Why ? What do you ? What would your ideal be ? And then we could talk about more about the specifics . But you know , I want a world where everybody's fucking all the time .

They're partners , everybody's happy , we don't have time for war and people are full of love , right Seems to me , psychedelics can play into that right .

So right now people are buying it for somewhere between $3 to $10 and it can last somewhere between 8 to 12 hours .

So like the dollar per minute is outrageous and at scale I believe it's going to come down to 50 cents 10 cents ago , with a safe , confirmed dose right , which is even better than what we have today , because you don't really know your dosing today . There's a couple of companies working on addressing that , but yeah , it's a big deal .

So I'm going towards pleasure , I'm going towards peace , I'm going towards some sort of far more chilled out state than we're in as a species right now , because this is not okay and it's not going to keep working if we keep getting divided further and further .

And , yeah , like it breaks down the walls for good conversations , especially around sex and relating and families , and like , do you actually want to do the same thing your parents and grandparents did , or should you experiment with other modes of being that might be better for you and the other people involved in that system ? Right , for whatever reason .

I think I saw this on a sci-fi show years and years ago about , like it was kind of a group wedding thing . It was kind of like a cult , but it was like the obvious future cult and there was 12 to 20 people in these group marriages that would co-live and like , given kind of our economic trajectory , that could be an interesting evolution .

Like what if we could come up with and evolve social structures and governments that are happier and healthier ? And you know better generally . You know not putting people in jail for what they do in their bedroom . You know .

Always check your local laws and make sure your ticker is okay for it , but it's . It's an amphetamine , but it does not feel like you're taking a whole mess of Adderall or coffee or something . It's a lot more subdued generally and your fear response goes away .

So imagine if you could be with your 10 year partner and you could be unafraid of having conversations for the first time in your life .

You're just like , yeah , maybe I don't want to go talk to that cop and show them everything in my pockets right Like you're not going to have , you know ? Oh , let's just take all my clothes off and you could have that Usually that's not . Mdma alone , okay , and you know , running around a festival or whatever .

It was pretty well developed , but I think there's other communities that are learning from what they've helped to pioneer . And yeah , mdma for sure . You might not get the orgasm you want , but you get a lot of pleasure . And then Timothy Leary used to talk about LSD . He was so good with words , he's being a little ridiculous too .

He's like if a woman takes LSD and has sex with her partner , she can have 10,000 orgasms in one night , it's like . But also maybe their dosing was way higher than I'm used to , so I don't know . And it can get sloppy and weird , because your LSD is a pretty freaking weird drug and psychedelics are generally pretty weird .

But if you stick with it and it's a love scenario , not just like a you know a rando hookup from you know a swinger site and then like let's do LSD together , we just met , like that kind of that's probably a bad idea .

But if it's somebody you've known for three plus months or something you guys really trust each other , that then there could be some interesting stuff that could happen . Yeah , and it's Leary's kind of hedonic engineering idea is all about learning to get to know your nervous system . And how does my body work ? How does my nervous system actually work ?

And have you seen these homuncular representations of the human nervous system ? It's like these really weird kind of cartoon images of the human body with . Things are different sizes based on the density of nerves and feeling . So you'd have gigantic hands , gigantic tongue and lips , gigantic genitals , big ears , gigantic head .

Torso is tiny , like legs are tiny , generally speaking , and it's worth checking out homuncular representation or something so like getting to know how to treat your nervous system really well , especially in relation and insects like those things . Once you know how to do that , then you can repeat it and have different interesting novel experiences .

The one I'm hearing about the most the substance I'm hearing about the most right now in sex is one called two CB to Charlie Bravo and it's a derivative of mescaline and the way I like to describe it it's one of my favorites right now is bumper bowling . We put up the little inflatable lanes .

So , it's like tripping with the bumper lanes up is a way I like to put it . It comes on really , really really slow . Often I can't tell if I'm high or not , but then all of a sudden something happens . I'm like , yeah , of course I'm high , but yeah , people seem to really like that one and you can do some really interesting things with the nervous system .

A lot of your work is very nervous system focused , right .

And I think the only other question before we go is just , if people wanna experiment with stuff , do they need to have like a sober guide with them , or is that too complicated , in which case we'll tackle that next week .

So , yeah , I think , having a sober supervisor until you're comfortable enough to like jump into the bedroom and maybe just have somebody sober outside the bedroom , you know , perfect yeah .

If you haven't gotten it yet , read it and then , in fact , maybe we'll talk next time about how psychedelics can help us get much more intimate with our partner in all the different ways . So thanks , erin , for being here , and we will look forward to seeing all of y'all next week and come with us podcast . Big hugs and love . Bye .