Stick around. We have a great show today a legend who is in the rock'n'roll Hall of Fame. Felix cavalierly from the rascals is here, he's going to talk about the making of some of their biggest hits like groovin It's a beautiful morning, people got to be free. Plus, he's going to talk about playing with Ringo Starr the term Blue Eyed Soul and much much more don't go anywhere now, I just want to make sure I pronounced your name right, cuz I've heard it two ways. Is it capillary or is it just
Cavalera? No, it's
capillary. Have a lyric. Okay. That's about you know, just podcast. It all started because you know, John Sebastian, I don't know if you know who's an Italian. Yeah. Loving spoonful. Yeah, he pronounced my name correctly, and it screwed everybody up. But the American version is capillary. Yeah. Okay. Well,
welcome Felix capillary to my little podcast here. So hopefully you're not too leery about doing this. I think it's gonna be fun.
Where are you located? I don't even know. Yeah,
I'm in Scottsdale, Arizona. Oh, my
wife's from Scottsdale, Arizona. She'll be yes. She was born at the Mesa area in Scottsdale. Yeah.
Nashville, correct.
I'm in Nashville. Yeah. Yeah, right by my accent, right.
You're listening, obviously from New York. And you grew up? You went to Syracuse. That's kind of exciting. Yes. Oh, yeah. Is it true? You went there with Luke when Lou Reed was there? Did you guys ever have any same time? Musical interactions are
not musical, but you know, we know each other pretty well, for all those years. I mean, then he migrated to New York, and I moved back to New York. And, you know, so I saw him, you know, not too long before he passed. He he got a nice award from the I think it was the Long Island Hall of Fame.
Okay,
good guy. Good guy. Yeah,
yeah, you've got such an interesting background that you grew up a classical pianist and you went to Syracuse for pre med. But then you know, what changed your life it sounds like was was a discovering rock and roll. And it's, I heard you say that it was easier to play from classical, but it was that what you needed to learn was the soul part of it? Right. So how do you learn how to play with soul?
While you don't really learn how to play with soul, you know, I'm saying it's interesting, because I mean, there's really two answers to that. You know, the first answer is, you know, like, I hate to say it, but like sorrow and grieving and pain and stuff like that. That's where your soul contract comes from, like life. You know, I lost my mom freaked me out, you know, like, there's
your soul right there. But the other answer is, you know, when we had the band, when we had the rascals we would do a Beatle covers or stuff like that in the beginning. But it didn't sound like the Beatles. It sounded like us. You know what I'm saying? And it's just the same thing as my accent coloring my my conversation. It's just natural. Especially when you know, you grew up listening to what I listened to you see, I had a tremendous advantage of hearing Alan Freed in New York
City. You know, I went free brought it from Cleveland to New York. So I heard the very beginning of rock and roll. And the beginning of rock and roll was mostly sold music. Mm hmm. Yeah, definitely. Fantastic. Soul music great. The Greatest Singers you ever heard in your life? You know, I mean, and and to this day, I still don't know if we touch those those those voices?
Well, yeah, so they they say that your music is quote, unquote, Blue Eyed Soul? Are you offended by that term? Or do you
embrace check it out, man, you know? You know, not offended by anything, man. I mean, like I say, it's just funny, you know? Because that that that kind of nomenclature, it it started I think it really started with a righteous bronze. Okay, you know, rice. Never. You know, and and then it just became like an excuse, because, you know, it's such a mess now, man, I don't even want to talk about it. You know, I'm saying but in the old days, way before
you were born, my friend. They used to play soul on the radio and folk on the radio and pop on the radio and, you know, this punk on the radio on the same stations? Uh huh. And then they realize, wow, you know, we should probably sell more product to the fill in the blank. You know, and the demographic thing tickled and then Brian Okay, so we're just gonna play this Oh, and we're just gonna play this and and, you know, that's, that's not music. That's just that's business.
Right? Well, it's a funny story, though, to where you guys were like, we're recording next to Otis Redding. And he came into the studio and said, Oh, you guys are white like because when you just hear on the radio, you might think That was like congra, the term Blue Eyed Soul originated from because the people that sound like they're black singers are black music, and then they're white people.
Yeah, you know, I mean, Atlantic Records was a whole different environment from like, the, Colombia's and RCA and all that, you know, when you go to a studio in a big, you know, corporate structure. There's all these signs up recording, do not enter recording, do an identity, but Atlantic was like a big, big
family. You know, and I was so proud to be part of that family because, you know, you walked in and you know, this Otis Redding, man, you know, you certainly gonna welcome in your studio, you know, one day came, he knocked on the on the door while we were recording, because, you know, nobody's going to stop odors, right? Yeah. And he says, Oh, my God, they are white. Took off.
This is such an interesting time, though. Like, it just blows my mind. Because this was before I was born. But the whole segregation thing, like so how did that work? Is it just these artists got a pass? Because they're on a record label? Or how does that how does that work with the segregation thing? Does that is that was that I don't understand
these artists got to pass wet on stage or on the radio or like in the studio
and stuff? Did you have to segregate from black people and white people? Is it that segregated at those times or no?
The opposite? Yeah. I mean, I never saw that in a studio, anywhere. I saw that on the road everywhere. You know, because when I first started going on the road, I was I was, I mean, I was going with Joey D in the starlight who was an integrated group. Yeah, that was, that was my first real exposure to what we call segregation, because we couldn't stay in the same hotel, they wouldn't even put gas in our car.
So it's like that movie. GreenBook
it's exactly like that. And, you know, it's kind of shocking, because, you know, I mean, I went to school in a school of Pelham, New York. And I don't know if that Emmett Till, you know, situation that happened where he got killed down in, in I think Mississippi. One of the gentlemen who went down there and was killed was a fellow I went to school with by name and Mickey Schwerner. I saw that firsthand, I was kind of like, privy to. Wow, you mean, you actually went down and
killed? You know? So when I went down south and first time, and we were refused to stay in certain states, you know, kind of freaked me out. It was kind of weird,
huh? That would be very great. What else did you learn from being in Joey? D in the star letters? Because that was your first like, real pro gig, right? I mean, I know you played it.
Well, they were a lot older than me. So I learned that older guys do drugs.
And at that time, audits, weed and stuff like that. Okay. Yeah.
Don't get me wrong. I don't want to get joy and those guys in trouble because Joey did you know what I mean? But, you know, fans, they were older than they were men. I was boy. Okay. And I couldn't find like, I couldn't find my wife. I couldn't find my hotel room. After those guys got through it. I know. I'm in here somewhere. I don't know. You know? Yeah, it was it was it was wild days, man. You know, your kid coming in, you know, and you're coming into a man's world.
Yeah. And that's when you decided I don't want to go back to school. I don't want to go. I don't want to be a doctor anymore. I want to be a musician. This sounds like fun.
Not only sounds like fun. It was fun. It Yeah. You know, especially you know, when you're a sideman in a band, you know, and I've got a book coming out, I mentioned this in the book, you know, you have no pressure on you and your side, you just go, you know, you go to the show, people show up, they show up, they don't show up your problem. And I mean, just, you
know, you just go and play. It's it's really fun, especially if with you, if you're with a good bunch of guys, that you know, really love to play, you know, I enjoyed it.
Yeah, no, I think one of the highlights it's got to be Gordon, was no explain this to me. Was it the Beatles open for you guys? Are you open for the Beatles? Believe
it or not, believe it or not, they opened for Joey D's band in Europe and Scandinavia. Because they, Joe, Joey, you know, had a big hit, you know, and they had I think they also made a movie at the time, you know, whereas Beatles were known in Europe, but they weren't known in the states yet. They hadn't gotten over here yet that Ed Sullivan Show had not happened yet. He was about to happen. And everybody was to find out who they were. So yeah,
it was kind of enlightening. I mean, it was kind of a shocking thing to walk into a venue where everybody's totally hysterical. I mean, totally. I mean, if you could hear the music you were doing well, you know, it was what is this? Oh, that's the Beatles. You know, and you hit see these guys have long hair. And they're on a stage and they'll kind of dressed up, you know, their dad with suits, weird things like we used to
wear. Everybody wore weird things in those days, you know, but bottom line was that, you know, I've said it many times I listened, what I could hear, you know, I, I didn't hear anything special when they did American music. None of which was okay, you know, they were covered back when they did their music, which no one had ever heard. You had to just listen, you know, not only because of the crowd's reaction, which was going to hurt never heard anything like that, you know, but because it
was really, really good. It was really different, you know, was, you know, like, I want to hold your hand and love me do and what was that? That's so cool, man. You know, it was just cool. And Cool. Is is the words to describe. I don't know what that is. But I like it.
Yeah, no app. So did you try to befriend them at that point and be like, I need to get on these guys good side. And
well, you know, God took care of that for us. Because our manager when we started the rest was brought them to United States Sid Bernstein. So I got to know, you know, oh,
I guess you didn't you later in a plane and ring goes banned?
I did. Yeah. Yeah.
That's cool. Yeah, we'll talk about
your way, your way down the end of the
video, we come back and then you start there. I love this thing. How you start the rascals like your plan is, I'm going to get the best guys that I can songwriters and musicians. I love that strategy. And it worked. I mean, I think you did get some of the best musicians.
Yeah, I want to get you know, because when I heard the Beatles, I really considered them more of a singing group, you know, than a musical group. You know, uh, you know, not not that they were bad. But you know, there was nobody there. That was because, you know, I came from a classical background. And and I grew up like in a jazz world. You know, we used to go to the midpoint jazz, but so I heard guys that really played, you
know, what I mean? Played, like, you know, and I said, Man, how about if I put good singers and good players together? That should be a great, great combination. And so I found, you know, in New York City, I found, you know, people who, for the most part, had always been like, the kind of like the leader figure of their band. You know, because there's always usually one guy in a band or one person in a band that everybody looks at, you know, that's no, John
fogy. You know, I'm saying, that's, well, I had four of those.
How did you convince all those people to leave their other projects and come with you?
Well, they were together at the time three of them were with with it with an offshoot of Joey band, and Eddie was a little young, you know, they go with it. But the drummer, I had to find, you know, and I found him through a lady that I was seeing, you know, who, who, you know, I told her story so many times, but she said, Man, you guys get a good drummer, but he's not as good as guy I know. So what do you mean? What are you talking about? You're a bank teller. What the
hell do you know? She took me to see this gentleman by the name of Dino Donnelly, who is working at a place called a metropole, which was a place where you can look in the window and see the band. Okay, I heard him play two songs. I couldn't believe it. It was so fantastically entertaining, not only from a musical point of view, but he was a show he would put on a show, you know, he because in those days, that was a jazz club. And he learned from people that put on a show like Buddy
Rich Gene Krupa. Louie Bellson, these are drummers who lead bands, kind of like, you know, college, you know, they were like, they will like really like, flipping the sticks up in the air and catch it in time and playing and twirling and stitch and don't and plan their tail.
So I found guys, you know, and it's really interesting, because I found out that, you know, it's not always the best musicians that make an all star team, you know, mean, like a basketball team, you got to play together, you got to pass the ball, you know. And so I got very lucky finding, finding these guys.
Yeah, the chemistry, they're so great. And then so one of your first songs I didn't realize it actually wasn't you didn't you guys didn't write it. But good loving is a song written by someone else. But you guys made it your own hit pretty much. I mean, that's your version is the biggest version of that song. Well,
you know, in those days, the clubs were 21 and older. You know, they the owners, the proprietors, the, you know, people that hired you, they did not want any nuisance. They wanted songs that were on the radio, you know, that were proven, you know, like in their eyes to be what they call covers. And we all get Beatles did everybody did that, you know, it'd be because that's the way it was to work in a nightclub to work in a place at
a bar. So I would go out of my way, really out of my way to find obscure songs that were on the radio, and I would have to go and find the full Five to prove that it was Andre because a lot of these things run on its own. Good Levin wasn't a hit Mustang Sally. Nobody ever heard Mustang Sally, you know, heard it on the radio, you know. So I went up to nourish shell, which is a suburb town where I grew up, went into this neighborhood,
you know, and bought the 45. And I'd show that as a man, if you don't believe is this is this is really a song that's not a hit. And then we did our version of it. You know, and, and it's really interesting, because a lot of songs came out of that. You know, like, for example, good Levin is a perfect example. But you know, since we're on Atlantic, and Atlantic, recorded us in the club before we went into the studio, they heard all these songs that we did, and they gave him to Wilson Pickett.
I'm talking about Atlanta, 1000 dances and talking about Mustang. So the cop, cop, did you remember that? Wait a second. How about this? Oh, no, no, no, no. So that's when you start getting educated? You know? Ah, I get it. It's not the money. It's the money.
Yeah, you guys have now how does that work? Because then those days, artists kind of I mean, I think artists are probably still getting ripped off. But I mean, did you guys have a good contract and stuff? Because a lot of these songs are still played today?
Oh, you get a better contract and the people before us? Let's put it like that. Okay. Okay. Very fortunate. Our attorneys name was Stevens Weiss. He gave us a good deal. I mean, in that deal was a free studio time, which was unheard of. Hmm. At a major, you know, because, again, it was an eight track studio, there were no eight tracks, studios, everybody else, including Beatles stones, it had four. So
this was this was important. So we had free students Unlimited, we just go there as well, you keep making hits, you're here. And a contract was good. The problem is, you know, as as as it progressed, you know, how these these people, they go for better deals and stuff like that. So some of the people in the industry, were more aware of getting better royalty rates than us. You know, but to learn all that I mean, these these are things when you're, you know, kid coming into the music
business. You don't really know the music business, you know, the music, but you don't know the business. Yeah. So you have to find somebody that's going to give you advice correctly. Like, for example, you talk about Otis Redding know what his rating was way ahead of his time, in terms of his knowledge, of publishing, and producing, and ownership, so was Sam Cooke. So you learn from those guys. Well, I tried to learn from those guys, but they weren't they were gone. You know
what I mean? You don't want to know too much in the record business. It's a tough world. And those days, man, we Tommy James Book, you'll get it.
Okay. Yeah, that's definitely an interesting time. But so how can I be sure that's, that's such a classic song. And you say that it wouldn't have happened without, you know, the Beatles with yesterday or Michelle. And but now that song is about your relationship at the time, and you just yet weren't sure if that was the right relationship? And, I mean, yeah,
I was engaged to this young girl in a young girl was kind of my abuse. You know what I mean? Like, I wrote all those songs, you know, about her and, and then one day, I just said, wait too young to get married? I'm, what am I doing here? You know, well, let me let me slow down a little bit. I mean, my goodness, how can I be sure, you know, like, you know, and, you know, but the reason I say that about the Beatles is because, see, the radio stations have always been kind of locked
up. I mean, you know, they're more locked up than ever now, because it's all corporate, you know, but what I mean by that is like, they had to play the Beatles, you know. So when the Beatles came out with something that was like a three, quarter six, eight, you know, ballad with French connotations. Wow, there's a door that just opened up in hmm, yeah. We owe them so much. Seriously, not only they just opened doors constantly open doors. And then we walked in
Yeah, with a song groove in though that's like that was more based on your interest in at what does the Afro Cuban music that's what's that? What's called?
Well, yeah, I mean, basically, New York City is a hotbed of, you know, Latin music always has been I mean, and you know, if you take that, well, not now everybody knows about it. But I mean, in those days, if you take the time to go into a Latin, you know, concert, oh, my God, it's a whole orchestra. You know, here's a four piece band these guys these guys are playing in clubs with horn sections, and they're rockin man And you're talking about really good musicianship.
So you know, I mean, I became enamored with it, not only the music but the community. And, you know, it's a long story, but Latin music plays a major, major part in the metropolitan New York area.
Okay, I thought that was more like Florida. I didn't notice this New York as well. That's interesting. Now it's Florida. Yeah. Okay. Yeah.
I mean, it's all over the country. Now. You know, like I say, in those days, New York was very well represented. I mean, Uptown. I mean, seriously, if you want to hear some serious music, you know, like, you know, you go to one of these Latin concerts, you know, they're not messing around, man. They they're really good. Really, man. And they got like, three or four drummers? I mean, like, you know, and everybody's playing separately. Carlos Santana really capitalized on that, you know?
Wow. You know, that's amazing.
Nobody ever heard of it before, but to hear it.
Yeah. And you brought that in? That's a good one. I love that all the songs are so different, like, and then it's a beautiful morning, I just heard the story about how you wrote that that. I mean, it makes so much sense. You had a number one record, you're in love. And you were in Hawaii. Is that true? You're those three things and not?
Yeah. Well, Hawaii really accepted the rascals. We were huge there. And that's a whole story. You know what I'm saying? That's, I tried to outline that. That's just, it's just a stroke of luck. Very interesting. But stroke of luck. And so how could you not feel those emotions when you're out there? You got all that stuff happening? You know? I mean, I I was so happy I fell off a motorcycle almost broke my hand. In a while, those were great days, man. I mean, I can't begin to tell you is,
is it harder to write a song when you're when you're happy than when you're sad? Because I've heard that when you're sad. Sometimes you just want to write it, you know, get it out to be cathartic.
It's all the same. And you know, like, I mean, I feel that, you know, a lot of people have different ways of looking at the music. You know, John Lennon, really let you know, when he was going through changes, really. But I was looking on, I think it was Sunday morning. I think it was Sunday morning, CBS show and they were showing the New Orleans funeral processions. And they show you what happens is basically, you know, starts off as they call it, the first line,
which is grieving. And then the second line, when that kicks in, they're rocking. Because they look at life in a different way, as a happy world, especially afterwards, you know, I'm saying, so now we've had enough of this though. This, this so called Working our tail off. Now. We're free. Now we'll go to so that's how I approach music. I like it to be happy. I like it to be up. If you want to hit my problems, I'll tell you, but not on.
Okay, well, then. Yeah, so the song people got to be free. So is there a little bit of confusion on this? Because was it about the assassination of Martin Luther King? Or was it the assassination of Robert F. Kennedy. But I also heard a story that it was about some encounter you guys had with some rednecks in Florida?
Well, they're all true. Okay. Oh, that was really written because I was working for Robert Kennedy's campaign. And dating a young lady who was literally present at that horrible event out in Los Angeles. It just freaked me out, man. I mean, it really did. Because, you know, I'm, I'm sure it's the same today when someone gets involved with a with a candidate. You know, you really are really, really fervent, you know, we're really into I was really into like, what, come on,
we gotta make a change. But we got to get from, you know, here to here to here to here. And when that happened, it really just, it destroyed a lot of us. Really did. It was a big deal. And it is a big deal. Still is a big deal.
Yeah, that's a beautiful song. So then is it true that after the song came out, that the rascals would only perform a concert that featured an African American Act?
Yeah, there's really not a correlation between the song and that, that that was just an instance that happened. You know, basically, you know, we, we were on Atlantic Records, we were the first really white act on the red and black label. And so when we when we got a hit, it was a combination of the r&b stations and the pop stations. So basically, they played us on both on both stations. And so we had you know, that was our audience, so
to speak. And one day we were working and and and there was a group I think it was young Holt, tree or young hope limited. I think they had great and graduate some, and they came backstage. And it's just like, you know, Fifth Dimension fifth dimension, inner, inner r&b group, their pop group, you know, I'm saying, but then people like the young hope they never get to play for white people because they're black
band. They were black group. So he came back to me and he said, man, like, Thank you for letting us on here. We never get a chance to play for vitamins. And I says, Man, thank you for coming. We never get a chance to play for black ladies. Why don't we get together and make this happen all the time? Well, little did I know what I was saying. Easier said than done. Oh, boy, it cost a lot. You don't realize that? You know, not everybody's thinking that way. And believe me, they're not thinking
as weird for me to think about. Because I mean, as long as I've grown up, that's never been an issue, but back in, and that's in your lifetime, which is really even weirder to think that. It wasn't that long ago.
That only wasn't that long ago, but you don't see many MCs bills today. Think I don't think so? I don't think so. Maybe you see him there. But I don't know, man. You don't see too many. Where our country is right now. Hello. I don't know. You know, like I say, you know, the interesting thing is if you if you take classical music and say okay, we're going to start with classical you're not not that that was the beginning of music. But that's a place to start. You only drums that they had were
war drums. They were marching drums, Tiffany's, let's get ready to kill, kill, kill, kill, kill he had I mean, we got the shot cops keys, you know, we're at 12 and all that kind of stuff. And then you go to Africa. And you got rhythm, rhythm, rhythm, rhythm, rhythm, rhythm, rhythm, rhythm, sexy dance and loving. But what if you put the two of those together, you got music, you got the melody, you got the chord, you got one change, and you got
the rhythm. Now without rhythm today in music, there wouldn't be any hip hop. There wouldn't be nothing, it wouldn't be anything. So how do you separate those two things and say, Well, I only listen to this, oh, I only want to listen to it. That's where it is. See, I only want to listen to this because and a lot of reasons. You know, there's a lot of reasons. Some of them not so funny. You know, I'm saying, but it's ridiculous.
That's That's music is a marriage of those two, you know, things you think about, you know? And so for
making music so great as you have all these influences from it's very eclectic. There's I mean, groovin doesn't sound like you know, beautiful morning. I mean, the songs are all very different.
Again, you got to point to those guys over in England, man. Did you ever get to their records? Assign the same? See them? No. Way over here, man. You wanna you want to play you want to play on this field? Let me tell you something. Because, I mean, we'll never see anything like that. I mean, the way and they wrote songs. I mean, come on, Elton John's another one. You know, Billy Joel's these these guys. Come on. You know, I mean, it's just, it's, you know, it's it's amazing, you know?
Right. Yeah. Well, the Beatles, you know, Ed Sullivan, that was a big thing. But you guys did solve into what was your experience like that, because I had the drummer from Creedence Clearwater on here. And he was saying that all of it was like, he was hammered when they when they tried to meet with him. And he was just really drunk. And I didn't know that I know that he was. So what was your experience like but
Well, see, that was a whole different show. The reason is probably the last show of its kind, because, you know, when you do a TV show today, you get a union scale. You know, you get whatever the union goes, and you hear all these big stores complaining about that. But he had a budget. Let's say he got a $200,000 budget to do his television show. So he would pay the X, their normal fee. Unheard. So it was at what do you see the world that he came from? It was like a Walter
winch. And he was a columnist. And in those days, way back before my time, the columnist used to make the groups and the pop stars in the stars because of their publicity in the newspapers. That was a big thing. You get in the newspapers and people know you. Now we've got oh my god, we got 1000s outlets, but they weren't in those days. So he came up from that world. He knew all the, you know, all of the acts, especially like the comedians and stuff like that. So they gave him a show. Huge eight
o'clock. But he was he was an older man. You know, I mean, he was not like, you know, spring chicken, you know, and he was tough man. He was tough. So when, and I've said this many times when you did his show you rehearse for seven days. You're crazy. And you did a complete in studio with an audience not televised on Saturday night. And then Sunday night was the real deal. And it was chaotic. Think about it now. You know, now we
tape everything. Yeah. So let's say my app goes on and I'm a whatever you want to call it. And I've got two minutes. 15 seconds. Okay, fine. That means the introduction to me is going to be 15 seconds. So he would go on and do a 32nd intro now we're going to get those 15 seconds. You're going to get it from you. Well, Jack,
you offered you have to cut the song short. Oh,
they cut us off. But it's not just us. They cut everybody. I mean, in other words, like, that's what Jackie Mason gotten all that trouble for you. I don't know if you remember it was before your time. Yeah, comedy act. You can't interrupt the comedy act in the middle say, Well, I'm gonna, you know, you go, you have a form. You gotta cut they go like this cut. And he said, Yeah, cut. Are you gonna cut it? See, because, Ed, you know, he would look into the audience, you know, and now you got 15
second introduction. Oh, there's a Jackie O out there. You know, somebody and he start. Well, that goes 20 seconds right there now we're gonna get it from. So it was a madhouse, man. Oh, my God. You know, my buddy Eddie there. We used to live together, man. And you know, you're used to doing like a two and a half hour three hour show. And you come in and you're doing two minutes. You know what I mean? And all that tension back. He would go back and wreck our apartment. With all that extra
adrenaline, you know? It was wild,
though, right? I mean, that helped you guys get out there.
Oh, no doubt. No, it was huge. I mean, everybody watched that. That Milton Berle you know, and rich girl. Interesting days, man. I mean, you know, like, I've met so many really interesting people backstage. It's, it's so was really fun.
Yeah. What about August 6 1970, the festival for peace. You guys played that with Creedence Clearwater, Paul Simon John Sebastian Steppenwolf. Tom, do you have any memories of that show? That sounds amazing.
Wow. You know, there's an old saying in the music business, like, you know, the 60s if you remember, you're there, you know? Yeah, remember, like, you know, you remember some things, you know, but like I say, it's one of the many shows that you do. You know, kind of remember, it was fun. Because, you know, there weren't that many acts in those days. So when you got together, you know, like, we recently lost Ronnie Spector.
You know what I'm saying? Prior to that, Leslie West, we knew all these people, because there weren't that many of us. Uh huh. You know, and so it's kind of like a, it's kind of like a reunion when you get around these these folks, you know, and it's so interesting, because now, what is it 60 5060 years later, the only time we meet is on cruise ships. Things like that, you know, because there's not big shows like that anymore.
You know, you used to have a lot of people on the shows the the ticket price doesn't warrant it. You know what I mean? You can't have five or 6x on the show, because it will be a $500 $1,000 ticket. Yeah, you're not going to get that as a rule. You know. So, it's, it's, it's always interesting to work with your
peers. I mean, I got so many memories, you know, like Sly and the Family Stone, you know, and, and all these guys, you know, I mean, it was just like it was, I hate to keep using the fun word fun, but I really enjoyed every moment. It was a pleasure of working on the road in those days, you know, now it's, you know, it's very difficult. You know, we used to be able to go to some cities, and actually load our gear in the back of planes drive right on the runway. You don't want to try that.
A lot of these flying dates, so then they don't bring their own instruments, right. They just use the instruments of like this the drums at least they say like, because I was like, how do you bring your drums on the airplane? They're like, you just use the drums of the venue.
Try a Hammond organ.
Yeah, right. So they want
to thank me all the time for their patience. Because yeah, it's a different it's a different Well, I mean, it obviously is like when you get to the Billy Joel, and John's, and of course Bon Jovi and YouTube. I mean, they have semis. You know, being sure it's carrying all the gear. Well, you know, you have to be realistic you know, you know at what level you're at in the industry. I mean, when you have a $5 million stage, you know, and they have two of them. They got one of
these two. That's a lot of money. It's a different. It's a different tier, you know, and that's fine. You know, at least we're still here, you know, I'm saying,
yeah. So yeah, I mean, because the rascals, they broke up and it was it like the 19th. Or Eddie left, because he wanted he didn't want to travel or some. So then you guys stayed around for a couple albums. And that didn't work out. Then you did some solo albums and did some other stuff. But I want to hear about this band treasure. You had this band treasure. And it was with I did not know that you were in a band with Vincent from future kiss guitar player. Like, he's got a cult following.
There's a lot of people that are really interested in him. So how did you find him? And what was it like working with him at the time?
Well, I was I was doing an album in Bridgeport, Connecticut. And Connecticut is not exactly a hotbed for musicians, which is the reason that I, I moved down here. It's more of a place for executives, and you know, people that own record companies and stuff. And I was down in Bridgeport, and there was this gentleman who had a studio his name was Paul Leca, le K, who had a couple of big hits as a producer. And I needed a guitar
player. And he said with his kid around the block, you know, I this kid, his name wasn't Vinnie Vincent at the time. He came in and I said, this guy could play man. You know, when you when you see like, you know, like, it's like these guys. I don't know if you watch football, but I mean, these kids. Yeah, young guys that are like, they're just like that. Joe burrows and, you know, mahomes, and, wow, just these guys pretty good. Well, this guy was really good. I at that time
was on Epic Records. And, you know, I just I just like to make music man. I mean, it's. So I Boston was really hot at that time. I saw man, how about a guitar bass group, you know, and I asked him, I asked him to join, you know, and he did, and was treasurer. And it was very interesting. I don't know how much you know, about Vinnie
Vincent story. But I would suggest that, you know, you take a look into the I don't know about Wikipedia, because Wikipedia has got a mind of its own you got to be, but maybe do a little study, you realize that was quite an interesting person that I was dealt with. He lives down here now. And we stay in touch. And he you know, he's very thankful the fact that I brought him into the so called music world because when kiss heard him, they got home, you know? Yeah. And that's another
story. And then he went on, but he still is quite a guitar player. I mean, seriously, he's very, very, very, very talent. Yeah.
So in a way you kind of discovered him.
Well, I discovered him. Yeah, in a local, you know, area of Bridgeport, Connecticut. Yeah. And brought him in. Yeah, he was great, man. I mean, he's still easily very talented. He's had a difficult life. But he's, you know, who has, you know?
Yeah, no, that's too bad. Well, Oh, yeah. So now we got to talk about this. So 95, you get to join the Ringo Starr author band with I mean, for the people. You played with Randy Bachman of Bachman Turner, overdrive, Mark Farner of Grand Funk, who I had on the show, Billy Preston, John, and with all of the who, and also Zak Starkey, also drums in the who. And then you have some special guests, Joe Walsh, Steven Tyler slash and Stevie Nicks.
Hopefully you remember some of those shows, because that sounds amazing to work with, Oh,
I was awake by that, you know, I was I was. I came I came to, you know, course I remember. It was really fun. You know, because Ringo is such an interesting guy, man. He's, he's just a gym, you know, and he is a perfect example of, you know, people who still love to play, you know, obviously doesn't need any money. You know, I mean, he just goes out there, he loves it. And all of those guys, I mean, that John, it was not here anymore. Billy
Preston is not here anymore. You know, I became very good friends with Mark Farner, which was total opposite ends of the spectrum. You know, we just hit it off, you know, and that was fun. And, and I got a chance to get to Asia, which I always wanted to get to, and we were unable to get there because of internal strife in our band. You know, a lot of our guys didn't like to fly, you know, and so we didn't get a chance to see a lot of the world and I'm a Sagittarian and I like to
travel. So Angel, yeah, yeah, I really enjoyed I mean, work it was Ringo was was, you know, what you do is you each do each other's songs. You go around the circle, you know, it was really interesting because, you know, I say he's, he's a charming man. And he's a good I mean, like, for example, like when we had a day off, you want to go to the movies. You had to have the whole theater you couldn't have you couldn't go with people that we had the whole theater to
ourselves. That's it. Yeah. Well, especially after Georgian, and John, you know, I mean, you know, it's not worth taking a chance, you know, with all these crazies out there. So he goes by, we have the whole theater, it's, you know, and propriety is glad to do it. I don't know where they get paid or not. It's not my business, you know, all I know, is that they accommodated, you know, very interesting guy.
Did Ringo, tell you stories of The Beatles?
You know, basically, you know, here we are all these in quotes, all stars. It was just a ring your star? Oh, well, I tell you, there's only one star there, man. And it's Ringo Starr, because you know how you're talking in the dressing room, you get all these guys talking? And all of a sudden, somebody will ask him a question. You know what I mean? Like, for example, Hey, one of the guys. Gringo. How come you always had that? You know, you sit on those drums, you know,
way, way up here? Well, it's like, all of a sudden, you hear somebody asked me real quick. Everybody stops talking. And you go. Yeah, well, I got to be seen. I don't know. You know, yeah, he commands respect for all of them. I mean, it just feel it. You know, this is a friggin beetle. Man. You're sitting right next to you look over there in the middle of this, obviously. Oh, my God is that appeal of? Well, wait a minute, man, you know, and he's over there talking like this.
This is surreal. You know, it's just that's how it is. Man. You respect respect? Respect?
Yeah, well, yeah. And there's not egos because I mean, all you guys, you really are all stars. I mean, the drummer of The Who? Mark Farner yourself. I mean, so there's not any sort of like ego clashing going on when you have all those? You
know, it's interesting, because, of course, there is, you know, but what happened is, I kind of helped a fellow come aboard, who's a was named Mark Rivera, he's, he's a Billy Joel's kind of sax player, you know, okay, but he's, he also was able to conduct without ruffling anybody's feathers, you know, because he wasn't an in quote, All Star, but you need guidance. So you can't have you gotta have, you gotta have a captain of the ship, you know? And so Mark did that. And he did
a great job. I don't know if he's still with them. But you know, bottom line is, he, um, I tell you, it's a great story. Because, you know, my songs, you know, you're talking about grooving and, you know, beautiful morning and stuff like that they use they use conga, you know, and they're kind of Latin. And John Entwistle rest his soul. He says, You know, I can't play this. Feel to say, he says, I feel like I'm skipping to that play that says, oh, boy, I better get me a Puerto Rican
was up my PA. So, Mark came into Congress, and, you know, was able to be musical. I needed some help. Come on, man. You know, yeah. Me a Latino here, you know?
Yeah, no, that's really cool.
Wow. It's great. It's great. And it's a great, great guy, super talented guy. So he worked with Ringo, you hit it right on the nose. You have to have a coordinator. That's not one of the old stars to do the coordination. You know? He's got to be capable of course. Yeah,
absolutely. Yeah. So and also to the throughout the 90s. And even till today, I mean, your music is is in so many movies and TV shows. Now, like I said, I want to have the drummer of Creedence on. He was saying that for him. He's just like, say yes to everything. We just want to check. We don't care. Is that your main philosophy? Or is it more like?
No, no, no, no, no. I remember, you know, see about, oh, God, about 20 years ago, sampling was a big deal. They would sample the hip hop artists would sample yours. Well, they have to get your permission. Because sometimes I mean, it first of all, especially if they're going to change anything such as lyrics that that's definitely a no, no, you got to change. Well, I mean, you know, they came out with a thing where this guy was beating the crap out of his wife. I said, Wait a minute. I don't
want to be in next. You know, no, thanks. You can't say yes to everything. You know, now on the other hand, you got you got stories, like what's his name, the lock on Iraq? You know, who I mean? He didn't want to be that.
Yeah. Oh, he didn't
know how much money he made from that, like Iraq commercial. We could all retire. All of us. He didn't want to do it. But his manager said, you got to do this. You got to do this man. Because she you feel like you know, wow, that's my soul. It's about my you know, whatever. And you want to put it in a truck. How many millions of dollars you made on that song? Look it up.
That's a that's a big one. I hear those kind of stories all the time, but you guys get pretty good payment for those songs. And like in the movies, I feel like it's pretty cool because a lot of times, they don't it's not you know, it's exploiting it in any way. They're just showing it in the background. And usually like, I'm you know, patch comes in Apollo 13. You know, my favorite one is, I don't know if you remember this one but Kingpin. When and it's, it's so funny, because they play it's a
beautiful morning. And it's just like, I mean, this guy's like an alcoholic. He's just going through all this shit. And they play. It's a beautiful morning. It's like, ironic, but it's really hilarious.
I've heard some really good things. Well, let me ask you a question for you used to make more money than you make? You know, our industry is really, I will say the word brutal, because it's the nicest word I can say. But I mean, they know where the money is. And they have figured out, you know, it's the same thing, like, you know, when you when you look at legislation, you know, they have figured out how to get the Senate, the house to do what
they want. So you used to make a lot more money than you make now on those things. And they've changed the way it's like, for example, like it used to be where you did a commercial and if they played it on a network and so many times, you know, a month, you got a big nice check. Now they just buy it. You buy it, you want it. Okay, we're gonna give you 1x 1000, you know, so they got you covered. I mean, they got you covered. Yeah, it's just the way it is.
It's just our business is a very, very interesting business. Because as I say, many times I had a dear friend who wrote the song is called, it's not the money, it's the money. The point, I'm sorry to say, you know, it's the money is how, that's how it works. You know, as I say, if you don't know this, read Tommy James Book, you'll get a picture, not the whole picture. But surely a 1960s picture.
Okay, yeah, I'll definitely check that out. So let's talk about your book then. So it's called it's gonna be called Life of a rascal. Is that right? memoir of arrest? Yes. memo of arrest. Okay. And that's coming out. When do we have a date for that?
Yes, march 22. And what we've done, we've done pre orders on a Felix capillary music.com. And it's good, because we're doing quite well, you know, basically, what happened is we being the original guys, we did a Broadway show musical. CO Once Upon a Dream with Steve Van Zandt in 2013. And I think you were born for that, I think. A lot anyway.
Yeah, I'm sure right. Yeah. But anyway, what happened was, we would do press conferences, at the press conferences, everybody had a different answer for the same question. And I said, Wow, I really thought I was there. Maybe, maybe. That's not what I that's not what I remember. Oh, you know, so I decided, well, let me let me write a book. You know, I mean, to at least put my customers last Stan story. on record, because Did he Did he really win or lose that? I don't
know. You know, cuz last person standing wrote the book, you know. So that's what started it. And then and then I got involved in it. And, you know, I find like, wow, you know, okay, I really don't want to talk about the rascals, you know, as far as like, it's only five years of my life, you know, five or six years of my life. I want to talk about my life. Because certain people, you know, said, Well, hey, we're interested, we have this whole thing happen, you know, because a lot of people
approached me. You know, I used to do like seminars at Berkeley and those places about well, how did you make it? How did it happen? You know what I mean? And they look to me, What can I do to you know, so I tell them at least what happened to me.
Yeah, how did you make it? I mean, it's just such a it's because the odds are so stacked. Yeah, you must have a pretty good brain though. If you're pre med, you're not dumb. So you You're pretty smart guy to know what you were doing?
Well, you know, I mean, it's in the book, but basically, you know, it's kind of like did I have any idea seriously that I was going to be in the music business when I became a freshman at Syracuse University pre med. I had absolutely no idea. So I mean, without getting like really philosophical, you have to have talent number one, you know, yeah, you the doors open for you. Whether you open them or not they open and if you're tuned in enough to see that door that took me to Europe with Joey
D opened I didn't open it. You know, I'm saying somebody up there opened it. Well, you better go in it. Because it opened Yeah, just go and and I really, this is kind of my advice is like, don't fight it, man. You know, feeling you know what I mean? Don't Don't fight it because How do you know I mean, how many people go into college with one major come out with another complete career?
You know, I mean, you don't know, when you're 1718 years old, what you're going to do, you know, look for the doors, look for the opportunities, you know, and God help the people that don't open go through that door, when that door opens, I feel so sorry for that, because it may never open again, you know, going and give it a shot. That's one of the nice things about growing up, you know, is how should I put it safe and secure, you know what I mean?
You're not afraid of life, you know, a lot of people, they don't have that, you know, that flexibility, they can't go out to change, they got to make sure that you know, they can feed themselves and, you know, put a roof over their head. Gotta have confidence, you know, that you're being watched? And, you know, like, when the door opens, go, go give it a shot.
Did you have because I know, you started playing music at five years old, and you so you're gonna play music for like, 15 years, when this opportunity came? During that 15 year time of playing music? Did you have dreams of doing it professionally? Or? Or, you know, making records or being on The Ed Sullivan Show? Or any of those things?
Well, you know, I mean, a lot of that started, you know, because of guys, people like Elvis Presley, and you see this guy on television, this gets pretty cool, man, check this out, you know, you know, and a lot of it happens for many different reasons. You know, I mean, you know, like, many of us are driven by the opposite sex. Sorry to say, you know, I mean, when my friends were like, you know, I wasn't even heavy enough to get make
the football team. I mean, you know, more my buddies did giants For God's sake, you know, how, what, how I tell you what I play, and I say, I like that. You know, I mean, there's a lot of reasons, but there's no, there's no, I don't think there's a common thread here in anybody. I mean, sure. There's nobody that I know, that doesn't love making music. Now making a career out of it. That's a big decision. It's a really huge
decision. You know, especially in those days, because prior to Led Zeppelin, there weren't a lot of zeros in your career. After that number, when Zeppelin came along, now, we had international sales, to a huge degree platinum albums, you know, now you, you can say, oh, I can make some money doing this. Prior to that you are not making a lot of money. You're making decent money. Not like
that, you know. And the reason for that is, is because the record world opened up internationally when people like Warner Brothers became international. Right, right. Prior to Atlantic becoming part of Warner Brothers, we had a different record company in every country. Oh, I didn't know that about an accounting nightmare. At this time,
but you really weren't is driven by money, because you would have made probably a lot more as a doctor at the time thinking I mean, touring with God versus being a doctor probably doctor would have paid more than than being a sideman, right. Yeah. Yeah, but it just something about music. I mean, it must have felt magical, especially to play with these guys.
Know anybody that that's that's doing, you know, this, like, you know, we go out with the kinks, you know, we go out to zombies and people like that. They won't do it. They're all insane about playing on stage. They will, it's in Yeah, and you know, the younger people, they have the same thing. They love it. He just gets into you. It's dangerous. You know what I'm saying? Because, you know, I mean, it's, it's, it's kind of ecstatic you know what I mean? Is it Oh, I love you. I love LG, I don't
want to do this anymore. I'd rather go and work in a box. You know, look at a computer screen. No, no, no, no, it's fun out there. And and, you know, it's if you don't have that kind of Joe Devi or what they call it a don't go. You know, I mean, because any my partner, ex partner, he didn't. He didn't really want to go out in the road for a number of reasons. He didn't really want to do it. But most of the guys, they can't stick in wait to get Ringel for God's sake. You got to hold him
off the stage. You got to drag him off.
That's great. That's the way
they love to play. It's it's it's in your soul, you know? And, you know, thank God, I'm still able to do it, you know?
Yeah, absolutely. Well, I know we got to get going here. I want to wrap this up. But I did I have to ask this just because it's such a big news story right now with the whole Neil Young and Joni Mitchell. Music on Spotify. Are you are you in salt? Are you taking a stance on that? Are you just staying out of it? Well,
unfortunately, I don't own you know, the music for me to stop. Yet I've already joined Apple Music. So maybe that'll explain, you know, what I mean? Is especially when it comes to something like you know, health. If I'm not going to tell you that and coming from a medical family if I if I'm not going to tell you the truth. I could kill you You know what I mean? And that's, I mean, how many friends have we lost with this? COVID? You know, man, so if I tell you the wrong thing,
man, shame, shame. Shame on me. And if I allow, you know, I mean, I understand what you know, this first amendment stuff. Yeah, guess what man? Lies. You know, in the old days, we used to have three television stations. CBS, ABC, NBC. Now you remember when Dan Rather got in trouble because he said something that was incorrect about George Bush. Remember that? I don't know if I remember that. What he said basically, what he did is he's told a statement that wasn't correct.
And he got fired. Now he was a major, major player on CBS. You know, yeah, he was not true. Well, along comes the cable channels and all that stuff. They don't have such an ordinance. They say whatever the hell they want. You know, there's no lie, truth. meter, show whatever they want. Dangerous.
It is getting it's getting confusing to know what's true. And what's, in some ways, it's nice, because maybe there was things that we didn't know that maybe we should know, and that we're learning now. But then how do you sort it all out? That's good. It's a mess. Oh, that's
a good question, isn't it? And I think that is the question of the ages right here. And let's just say I'm a foreign government that really wants to screw up a democracy. What's the best way to me to do it? How about if I sow seeds of discontent, all? Well, that might work? Right? Like I say, if you can, if you can go on and have millions of people listening to non truths, we have problem. Let me tell you
something. As somebody I was watching the show this morning, I was in the gym, you know, they had the view on. I'm proud of the 60s guys in the 70s. Guys, ladies men, because we stood for something that we weren't afraid to lose our damn audience. I don't want I don't want to work list as a black person on the show. They wouldn't do that. Today. They want to lose their audience. You know, Taylor Swift comes out, she started a lot of
this man. She says, hey, you know what, man, you guys got to pay us or I'm pulling my music off. See, we need more people that got ba ELLs, we need people afraid to do that. I do a song in my show, you know. And it was a song that was written way back when it's called a ray of hope. And I announced it like this. I remember when you can write a song without pissing everybody off. Now, look, look, look at the Dixie Chicks. They make a statement about a war. You know,
that was so wrong. You know? I mean, the entire world is changing. They will play their music anymore. Come on what's happening to us? You know, so yeah, I have switched already. Okay, all I can do I can't stop the I can't stop the rascal stuff over there.
Yeah, yeah, that's okay. That makes sense. Well, thank you so much for doing this. I liked any charity is there? Is there a charity or a cause that that you want people to donate to after they've ordered your book? Of course, if they have a little extra money leftovers or somewhere they should throw that?
Well, you know, I've always been a Salvation Army guy. Okay, you know, they really take care of people, you know, and it may be old fashioned, but it's still doing it. And St. Jude people are actually to, you know, yeah,
those are good. Okay, I'll put both those in there. And you know, you have a website or somewhere people can preorder the book.
Felix capillary music.com.
Okay, I'll put that in the show notes as well. So people just click that and order the book. And thank you so much. It's been a blast. I really appreciate it. Thank
you. Great speaking to you and take care of yourself. All right, you too. Bye. Bye. Be safe.
Thank you for taking the time to listen to the show. Thank you to Felix and his publicist and to a DECA from coffee talk for helping to set this up. So many great stories from Felix. So make sure to get his book so you can read more, you can preorder the book on his website now. The link is in the show notes. And if you enjoyed this episode, check out some of
my other episodes. I have one with Doug Cosmo Clifford of CCR Mark Farner from Grand Funk Railroad and Don McLean, who wrote the song American Pie, some great interviews there. And make sure to subscribe to the show or follow us on social media so that you don't miss any future episodes. Thanks again for listening all the way through. Have a great rest of your day and remember to shoot for the moon.