Call It what It Is with Jessica Capshaw and Camille Luddington, an iHeartRadio podcast.
So everyone listening, I hope this is I'm gonna give it a whirl.
Okay, tell me what you think.
Hello, Hello, Hello, Call It Crew.
Was that good? That was pretty good?
You know what, It's got.
A little groove in it.
Yeah, it does.
I want to shake it up.
Yeah, I'm feeling kind of like sexy all of a sudden. Thanks for letting me try that on for size.
Oh my gosh, I think now it's it's imperative that we take turns.
Maybe we do. I don't know. It's hard, it's yours, it's yours. No, it's ours, it's yours. Well, this one, this episode, Call It Crew, I'm gonna talk about some thing that I actually have not really talked about before, definitely have not talked about in detail, and we wanted to make a special episode about it and have someone on that was an expert because I have since discovered that there are millions and millions and millions of people also diagnosed with this and it felt very lonely when
I first realized I had it. And it's okay, So we're just gonna we're gonna talk about Jess.
I was gonna say, they're gonna have a lot of guesses. It's gonna be really traumatic.
Yeah, no, it's not. Okay. Two ish three, maybe twoish years ago, I was watching Ghostbusters and there are a lot of silent parts in it. And I turned to Matt and I said, is the TV buzzing? I was very confused and he was like no. I'm like, do you hear that ringing in your ear? And he was like, no, I don't. And long story short, I realized that I I had something called Tonight's which is and I still have it to this day, which is a constant noise. Actually I don't have it. You can have it in
one ear or the other ear. I only have it in my right ear. I have it right now. I can always hear it. And it was very distressing to me because I realized, after a few days, oh, I still hear this constantly. I'm not sure this is something that's going to go away. And I have to say that I was really devastated over it. I heard it very loudly a lot. I found it very hard to parent.
I was so self conscious. I felt like I was going a little crazy, and I ended up doing a hearing test and finding out that I also had some hearing loss. Apparently I am have the hearing of someone who is more like sixty years old and found that news very distressing. And then I was told that Tonight's could be caused by some sort of hearing loss I don't need right now. I don't need a hearing aid, although I'm sure I may need one at some point, maybe in my forties, and I'm going to rock that,
by the way. Everyone but that it could also be caused by a tumor, so I had to go for an MRI. It was a whole thing where they had to make sure that I didn't have a tumor and I did not have a tumor on my scan, and then I had to learn that this was something that wasn't going to go away and I had to live with it. And it's taken me some time, and I've learned that after the pandemic especially, But I want to
ask our amazing expert on about this. That more and more young people quote unquote have come forward with saying that they have Tonightis and being diagnosed with it, and I want to talk about it, because honestly, it was not something that I knew a lot about and I kind of want to get into it and for anyone listen that has vertigo also can be another symptom of it. I just think it would be really nice to feel comforted by knowledge and stories.
This has never come up in our friendship, only when we started working on the podcast, and obviously multi layer aspects of who we are come to light. And another one of the producers on the show also has experienced this and it was incredibly interesting to hear you two talk about it the way that you reported how you felt, what you felt when you felt it, and then also obviously just the bigness of it that I had. I had no idea what was happening in your life. So
today we have an expert. Her name is Joey Ramenie and she is a trained vestibular audiologist and a national best selling author. She is also the founder and director of Seeking Balance International. She supports people from all over the world on how to change their brain body with the neuroplasticity recovery process. She is from Melbourne and she is here today with us to discuss all and I'm so excited to learn more this. I feel like this is a learning of journey.
Hi Joey, Hello Joey, Hi, Hi, welcome to the pod. Call it what it is. We are so excited to have you. I'm personally so excited to have you on.
I'm delighted to be invited. So sunny Australia, warm vibes.
So I want to dive in a little bit because when I was first diagnosed with tonight is what I was told was that the sound that I was hearing is not a sound that actually really exists and is something my brain. This is what I was told, but I don't know, was just something my brain was making up, basically imagining.
There's so many different ways to describe tinatus. It is it's a sound that is generated inside of our body that nobody else can hear. And it could be sounds and mechanically generated like if you think about just even popping your elbow or your knee, so it could be inside the ear. There's tiny little bones and muscles, so that is a type of tinatus, which is like a mechanical generated sound. But what you're referring to there is
there's other biological events happening. So every single moment of the day, there's a lot of neurons firing in terms of our thoughts, our emotions, just making sense of the world, you know, sensing the wind and the pressure of the chair or the clothes we're wearing. So all of that neurological activity also has the potential to create kind of sound in the brain, in the auditory cortex that we
become aware of. And that's why often when we're experiencing chronic stress, so we're just really busy, we can hear this white static in our head and it's like the brain is like fizzing and buzzing like a disco So it's real, it's happening. The question of whether we hear it or not I put down to this filter system, so the brain is actually looking for okay, is this
useful information? Is a boring not relevant? So if I hear the washing machine or the fridge whirring, often we filter that out because we just know it's not making our life better by noticing those sounds. I often think about the body sensations as like little messages from our soul. You know. The body is kind of the sacred filter as we're living through this cosmic life, and the body is essentially saying, hey, you might want to pause and
slow down. I've got some things to digest, you know, I've got some difficult conversations to have, or I've got this stock take I need to do in life. So sometimes I think the tinatus can actually be the body's way of drawing us inwards and asking us to pause and slow down a little bit for any myriad number of reasons. But it can also just be a false alarm. So the sound comes in, we get a shock, and then someone freaks us out and says, oh my god,
you can't cure it. You're gonna have it forever. And then that just generates its own little panic cycle, which means it slips through the filter. We keep noticing it, and we keep going, oh my god, is it there? Is it? There?
Is it there?
And it's kind of just a false alarm cycle that we have to unwind.
That's what I when I first had it, I was definitely looking for it all the time because I was hoping that it had gone. I was hoping that had gone. And a doctor told me that it really helped me. He said, listen at some point, you will hear it a lot less because it's like when you wear clothes, a sensation of clothes on your body. You don't feel it anymore, right, You're not looking for that sensation, and it will be something that your senses sort of filter out.
So I can hear it right now, but it's much much quieter, and through my day I can't really I don't pay attention to it anymore. However, I know for other people there are different versions of these sounds, right, So I've heard that sometimes it can sound like a worshing sound, and my tonights is it sounds like that. You know when you leave a concert and it's like that high kind of just you've probably had that feeling you leave a loud concert and there's like it. It almost sounds like yeah yeah.
So, as the person sort of on the outside of this for a second, I just want to catch myself up and maybe catch other people listening up. Can we just take a moment to go to the origin story of it, because obviously, Camilla, you had a life before it and then there was a recognition of its presence. So tell me about that.
This was very soon after the pandemic. I had a young child, and I, you know, we've talked on the pot about stress and anxiety and all those things. When I'm hearing you talk and it's about like a sign at your body, maybe like hey, stop, there's something going on. I think that I was diagnosed with some hearing loss right because I had to go have a I talked about how I had to go have a hearing test and I have the hearing of like a sixty year old.
So I understand that it could be purely from hearing loss. However, I do think that it was also triggered by stress for me. And I heard that more young people were diagnosed with tonight as after the pandemic. Is that true.
Yeah, there's so many factors at play, but yes, and also chronic dizziness, which is the other. So these are both invisible symptoms generated from the inner ear. So that's kind of my geeky realm. So chronic dizziness, chronic brain fog, even visual spotting and dotting like from using lots of screens, from lots of zoom. And yeah, all the stresses of the pandemic and the lockdowns and homeschooling and just the
compounding layers of life demands. I think it genuinely has impacted our sensory system and our brain's capacity to juggle everything.
I was told that it is not curable, and that is what was very maddening to me early on. What would you say about that?
Well, I can actually feel my blood boiling, like, this is why I have seeking balance and do what I do, because it's it's unfair to say that it's not true, it's inaccurate. As these beautiful biological beings that we are, we are constantly in dynamic change like no, like we literally have cells dying and replenishing on three seven ten day cycles. We are being remade all the time and reborn.
So nothing is static, nothing is forever. And the sounds that our body makes and the way we interpret them is such a dance. It is such a maneuverable, beautiful dance that we participate in. So if I concentrate on my tenetus all the time, if I worry about it, if I focus on it, if I pay attention to it, my brain actually says, Okay, Team Joey's really interested in this. She's studying it all the time, she's talking about it, she's thinking about it. So let's give her more neurological
attention to this sound. We'll give her more neurons, We'll give her more, and then she'll be able to better study it. So I'm actually participating in the tinatus sound by directing all of that focus and attention, and I get that biological dance. It responds to me and gives me more. I've had tinatus by the way, so I
get it. On the other hand, what I do with my rock steadic community and people who are using neuroplasticity and this holistic way of approaching it is that we understand that, Okay, the body is talking to me, but it's usually not about the tinatus itself. You can think about it like the smoke and the fire. So if your house is on fire and you're just obsessed about the smoke, you miss the fire. So underneath the tinatus there's usually a conversation, which could be am I actually
getting enough time to myself? Am I prioritizing everybody else's needs? And I'm falling way back second? You know, am I just the cook? Am I the taxi? Am I? Am I in the right job? Am I in the right marriage? So sometimes it's about really pausing and saying, am I actually getting my physical, mental, emotional, spiritual needs met? And even more importantly, do I know what brings me enjoyment and pleasure? Am I actually telling my brain, hey, focus
on all those moments I feel grounded? Because if I'm very much paying attention to my feet, am I pulvis and dropping into what feels nice and comfortable? I get more of that neurological activity. So I'm shaping my internal experience of the day by how I'm in communication with my body. So this mind body very intimate connection. On a side note, the mind body is essentially the one
thing there is no disconnect. So yeah, it's about really participating in how we are shaping and crafting the interior landscape of our mind body neurology. So building these sensory maps is exactly what I do for a living. So yes, it's changeable. I don't actually think tentatus needs a cure. I think it comes and goes at the perfect time for us in life. And it's not actually a disease or a diagnosis per se. I would say it's more of a healthy biological event that we participate in.
I have so many questions so when I first could hear it, I found it so distressing that if somebody had told me trying not to concentrate on that, it was all that I felt like a vicious cycle of like, don't concentrate on that. Now you're hearing it. Now you're making it worse your approach to it. I know, I'm sure it's you can't go through it all obviously on just a podcast. But what are some of the first things you do to help people with it?
Yeah? Well, first and foremost, honestly, I think it's important to freak out and focus on it and actually go through that rite of passage because in essence, we all do that, all of us, me too. So just to really acknowledge and honor that it's okay to focus on it, worry about it, all of that is a sign that I care about myself, that it's all coming back to well being in self care. So different people will spend
shorter or longer amounts of time in that phace. Some people will literally spend eight years, others are week and they move through that really quickly and they're like, Okay, what can I do? So the second bit would be actually get accurate information you know, don't necessarily believe your doctors. What they were teaching us in university twenty thirty forty years ago is different to what we know today. So there is there are myths.
What are some of those myths that you could that you can't cure it? Okay?
Is not necessarily associated with hearing loss. You can have tinatus and absolutely perfect hearing. You can have terrible hearing loss and no tinatus. They're independent events.
If I was if the tenatus is from or tonights is from hearing loss though, can it still be cured?
Yes? The tinatus itself is a neurological signal. So your neurons have got these little fingertips that are sending electro chemicals along these neural pathways literally through your body and brain. It's not just the brain, it's not just the years, it's the entire system. And one of those neural patterns or neural maps is generating a sound. And what happens is when we change our relationship to the sound, which
is part of the rock steady process. I walk people through and it's not straightforward, you know, it's the full package, physical, mental, emotional, spiritual. It takes time. It takes work, but as we change our relationship to that neural map, we can essentially make it louder or make it softer. And we're in the driver's seat. So right now I can actually tune into my tenetus and like if I want to hear it, I can or I cannot. So I begin to actually be the queen of my kingdom, and I'm choosing how
I shape the internal landscape. So a lot of it's about getting that accurate information about what is it, how am I participating in what's going on between my brain and body, and where do I have choice and where do I actually have to surrender because there's nothing I can do, so that the letting go and the surrender is certainly equally important. We can't control it all.
I know from reading that some people have it so loud. I've heard that people it sounds almost like a jet taking off. Yeah, So for the people that have it that loud, that extreme all the time, because it's not how mine has manifested, are you able to help people that have had it that extra Yes?
The answer is yes, And part of it is we need to get back into the body. Right If we focus heavily on whatever's going on between the ears, we do end up keeping ourselves in a nervous system state of flight freeze or fam so we end up in these trauma looping and from that place it's really hard to use neuroplasticity to disengage the tinator's signal and build a new map. So getting into the body and body
scanning is really really primal. We have to get back into our feet, into our legs, into our pulverse, and essentially move the attention and focus away from above the shoulders. So that can be really really nourishing and supportive, especially if people do have significant traumas, and the tinatus is like a byproduct of that. So getting back into the body is really important. So that was what we call bottom up therapies, sensing and feeling in the body itself.
Top down aspects is when we go okay. So I have a lived example of this at a really really busy day, I think it was pre Christmas shopping Da da da da dada. Came home, just crashed out on the couch and was like whoa super loud tenatus, like you know, nine out of ten, and it sounded like I was hiking in Tasmania in this incredible forest and I'd found a little tin shed and there was really really really strong rain, really heavy rain, and I'm in a tiny shed. The rain is pounding down on this
like corrugated tin iron roof and it's extremely loud. So the top down process there was rather than freak out, I lay on the couch and visualized hiking and being in the sanctuary of this little tin shed while there's a torrential downpour. So what that means is I had emotionally associated the sound with a nature hike and a sanctuary and a pause. And so with that emotional association with the actual sound, I'm not pushing it away. I'm
not trying to get rid of it. I'm actually welcoming it in and creating a creative imaginal space where my body has a place. So it's like it's bringing in that sense of Okay, this sound belongs here right now, and before you know it, you're rough daydreaming, you forget
about it, and it just fizzles into the background. So we have these skills and tools that we can start to employ and use once we're not really really lodged in that place between the ears and the midbrain where we're stuck in the fight flight freeze form trauma patterns. That's a really really difficult place to be and the you know, the longer we're there, the more we get.
I think the consequences of consequences through the chronic stress patterns and cycles, which actually goes beyond just poor digestion and sort of skin issues and into relationship breakdowns, difficulty with Korea, like not unable to attend work. You know, there really are so many debilitating consequences if these chronic and visible symptoms are not attended to with holistic care. You know, it's not just about is and people are
not making it up. They are real neural signals that need real neural support.
I love this conversation so much because one thing that really helped me is I was trying to describe the noise to my husband one time because I was like, I just wish you could hear it and just experience this for a second. And in trying to describe it, I said, you know what it sounds like when it's really loud, It sounds like there's crickets outside at night. Well, I actually love that sound in the evening, sitting on a porch when I, you know, go visit family in Kentucky,
and I love that sound. It's a very soothing sound to me. And the second I said that, I was like, Oh, it's actually no I can kind of work with that. And so sometimes when I'm stressed out and I hear it, I always I kind of think, how you thought, like, okay, the rain and the shed, I think to myself, Okay, I'm on the porch outside it's a crickets at night, and it changed my relationship a little bit with the sound itself. I have noticed, and I want to know
your opinion on this. I've noticed certain things that I feel like can make it worse, But I don't know if it's just in my head. For example, lack of sleep the next morning, if I drink too much alcohol the night before, and if I eat too much salt, And I don't know if those are things that you have heard people say before. I'm sure you probably have. But are there literal things that we're ingesting in our
body sleep? I can see how that relates to the stress, but are things that we're ingesting in our body that can make it worse or is that just me feeling that way imagined.
You're absolutely noticing things, and everybody is different, like no true human beings on the planet are wide in the same way. So it's really important that people are given this self authority and self permission to go. Actually, this is how my body is responding to that caffeine or you know that high process food, or you know this type of hydration and sleep needs. Like actually learning to
respond to the cues of the body and take ownership over. Okay, and maybe different to other people, but I am noticing I need nine hours sleep at night, or I function so much better if I just get up at six am every day and that becomes a consistent routine for me. So yes, what you're noticing is very real and true, and it will change, you know, as we go through different phases of life, some of those things won't have
effect anymore. So again, we're dynamic, we are changing, but learning to be and call and response between my inner world and what I'm sensing and feeling, which which you know, I'm a bit of a neural nerd, but everything really is a neural signal, whether it's an emotion, whether it's a memory and intuition, a sensation a thought. These are all neurons bouncing around through the body. That's our inner world,
that's our inner landscapes and inner architecture. And then the outer world is our conversations, our friends, whether the wind, the food, alcohol. We're actually learning to dance between the inner and outer world and become really fluent in that and to fully participate so that we're a feeling safe and robust and connected more often, and b we're noticing when okay, this is actually taking my energy. Okay, this is my boundaries. You know, we're starting to learn where
do I end and where do you begin? And I think in the modern day world, we are literally drowning in data. We're drowning in all of these outer world inputs. We're losing ourselves and we're merging with other people and other places and other politics, and it's really really frightening. And I think to survive, we numb ourselves go grab you know, more food, or more coffee, or more alcohol,
or go shopping. Like we really move to outer world distractions to cope, and the body samata sizes and that's when we get our tenetus in our dizziness and our brain fog and the chronic fatigue that you know, you just wake up Monday morning with dread because you've got to do the whole week again. So this idea of cleaning out our inner world outer world messiness and having those stronger boundaries that brings us into sovereignty, that brings
us into self authority, self permission. So yeah, the short answer is yes, what you're noticing is real, and just because it's real for you doesn't mean it's real for the next person. So again, really honoring uniqueness, individuality, and I think having sas you know, having a little bit of that badass, unapologetic this is my body, this is my life.
Oh she's got that.
Yeah, he's got that.
So I'm listening to you, and first of all, I'm it's like intoxicating. I'm like, I'm watching you and I'm listening to you dark and I'm like yes and yes and yes.
Well this is reminding me of when you had your eye twitch and you were talking. Yeah, this is what this is reminding me about. I think you have to repeat the story so that Joy can hear it.
Well, I mean I again, Kimila and I a joke or do we that we like to bring it back to how we've expect something. And since I'm on the outside of this little diad, I got an eye twitch. And it was during a time where I think that my body was saying.
Hold the fuck up, Yeah, you need.
To calm down, you need to chill out, you need well, actually, honestly, more than anything, I think, it was like I need your attention. You're not paying attention to me, and I wasn't. I was like, just keep swamming, just keep swamming. I've got this, We've got this, and to keep going. And I would stand there talking to someone while I was trying to get something done, and I would be holding my.
Eyelid and because it lasted a year for her, it lasted a year.
And people would be like, why are you holding your eye lid? And they're like, well, I just it's not you can't see it, but I can. So is that something?
I mean?
My guess is that all those neuropathways are obviously looking to different. We have a news that that's another form of it.
Yes, And like this trim twitching, jerking, they're actually like little ways the neural system is expelling and discharging a pent up neurological energy. So it's like, so the next book I'm writing is actually talking about how we digest and metabolize and excreet all the invisible data that we're taking in. So as we go about our day, we're
taking in like politics, judgments, assumptions, cultural nuance, thoughts. You know, even if like someone was to give you the evil eye and give you a bit of a smirk so that no words passed, but there is a message they're coming like in all of this human relating, and we
have to take that in and digest it. And so the body's literally riddled with all of these neurological traffic jams and undigested life experience where we haven't been able to biochemically complete what we've just experienced in the day. This is when people come to me because they're smaticizing, and I help them learn to integrate and excrete. So it's not actually all about tinatus and dizziness. It's the whole human experience.
So only because I'm trying to also be a person who I mean, who doesn't semat size? Will you please define?
That's the word we use when the symptomatology is coming up. So the soma, the sematics the body. So the physical body is beginning to say okay, shoulders tenching or eyelids twitching, and this is the body doing what it's yeah to complete its biochemical processes.
So in my experience, my body has told me things that my mind hasn't. So for me, a sematic response would be I've talked about this before. When I'm in a difficult conversation, when I'm nervous, when I'm just feeling challenged on some level, I can instantly feel my body temperature rise and I get armpit sweat super cute. I know, I know, it's charming. It's a really lovely part of me. You can all just imagine me with my armpit sweat
rings right now. But I instantly start sweating. And it's how I know, because sometimes my mind is like, again, just keep swimming, you've got this. I'm an opt I skew optimistic. I've dealt with a lot in my life. I've kept going. I know I can, or at least I believe I can. I think and there and therefore I am. But my body, it's it's it's it's actually a weird. Obviously, it's like an inverse of some people's challenge. Some people are like, I can't do it. I can't
do it. I can't do it. I'm like, I can do it, and then my body is like nope, nope, something's wrong.
It's just white knuckle to it. Make it happen. The body's giving us that feedback loop, the Bayo feedback loop. And you know, I just think you can't do life wrong. It's not even about you know, I don't know, tuning in and living perfectly. It's like when your body's really going to talk to you, the pain gets higher. Like pain is the body's most efficient form of communications. So we do what we can until we reach that threshold where we're like whoa, whoa, this is too much. And
that's usually when people come to me. But yeah, this trip tremoring, jerking, twitching, that can actually be the body's way of, in a healthy context, releasing neural excess energy that doesn't need to live in the body. And that's why actually shaking it out and dancing and physical activity is so important for our health to complete some of those biochemical processes.
And it's funny because we were talking about, you know, not that a tremor is painful but that there are these ways that our body experiences pain or discomfort and it's actually got purpose. It's a signal. Yeah, it's letting you know exactly.
I would say every single thought, sensation, story, intuition, image, all of it. I think all of it has its place. And I really encourage people and teach people to pause as often as they can, body scan and actually take notice of what's going on in my body and multiple times a day. And I call that collecting the warm data, Like inside your body is the warm data that is giving you that feedback. It's like the dashboard of your car. It's always available to you. And then the cold data
is from outside of us. That's the outside looking in. That's your test results, your blood tests, your MRI scans, that's all the cold data. The warm data is that intuitive data that's in the body, and we sense it and feel it, and we get better and better and better at that with practice and support, and in the beginning we're just like, oh my god, it's just overwhelming. I can't make sense of anything inside of me. But it does honestly become much more fluid and fluid.
One of the things I was told right at the very beginning was to have white noise on in every room so I could start to sort of tune it out. Is that something that you would recommend for people listening? What I'm just thinking, because why I'm asking is it would be easier, much easier for me now to go through a program that helps me. In the beginning, it was so distressing. My anxiety about it was so bad that it felt disoriented in you know, like I didn't
It's just I couldn't even hear my children. Even though I could they were talking and I could hear them, I couldn't that that's the only thing I could hear. What is something initially you would recommend to help someone sort of sender themselves that you've seen work.
Oh one hundred percent. Well, the body scan for sure, if they're capable of that. Getting out in nature also really really supportive and useful in so many levels, but out and about around the house. I mean, any kind of noise. If you want to use white noise, pink noise, whatever, go for it. But I wouldn't use it to drown out the sinatus because what that's doing is teaching the brain. Hey, brain, we have a problem, focus on it. Get rid of it.
I talk about this in my book rock Steady. The more we focus on the tinatus as a problem, the more we neurologically exacerbate it, which keeps the perpetuated symptom loop. So what I say to people is there's nothing wrong with using noise, but just think about what's my motivation if I put on my favorite playlist, like listening to your podcast or you know, all this fun music to match my mood. You know, maybe I'm sad and I
want to listen to blues music or Willie Nelson. Maybe I want to dance, so I put on some Latin music when I'm choosing the music, which is still going to drown out the tinatus. But when I'm choosing the playlist to get me in an emotional state that's coming from a place of desire, pleasure, moving, you know music took to cook to. Yeah, I'm actually achieving the same purpose of shifting the neural activity away from the tintus.
But it's not coming from getting rid of it. It's coming from moving toward the desire to feel my body dance and move, to be emotionally connected. So I think a lot of modern day therapies and tinatus retraining techniques, they kind of miss the juicy importance of bringing the emotional body along because we can't just look at the physical it's if you look at the whole person. Actually, you can't just look at the thoughts or just look
at the emotions, or just look at the sound. We have to look at the whole person and say, Okay, how can we best participate in these neural maps. And it's going to be everything from body position to the mindset and the thoughts to meaningfully addressing and meeting the fears that are alive in that moment. We have to digest and process the fears or the fears takeover. And then the missing piece, which I really talk about at length in my rock Steady book, is what do I
desire to feel? Because they're the neural pathways I need to start focusing on. And if I want to feel connected, juicy, playful, free, maybe I have a playlist that takes me on that journey and I can groove to the music and then I'm really firing the neurons and actually has nothing to do with the tinatus. So again that's the smoke, not the fire.
I love that analogy.
I think even the knowledge that something can be done about it, because when you have it and you go to a doctor and and you say this is so distressing, it feels very isolating. Initially, and I felt very lonely because I felt like I'm the only one that can hear this, Nobody else can it. Just I felt very alone.
I think just the knowl if someone had just said to me, Hey, there's actually a way to cure this is what you're saying to write, I think I would have felt gotten over hearing it so loudly a lot quicker. I think the hopelessness comes from people saying there's nothing to be done, and so that's why I feel like this is so exciting, and I hope anyone listening, because the more I said, oh I have this, I was shocked at how many people around me were like, oh yeah, I had that too.
It's one in three people, it's a lot. Not everybody has it to psychologically distressing levels, but some people are debilitated and suicidal. And there are so many people who literally their lives are saved when they enter the rock steady process because they get their life back.
It's that duck I found that distressing too. I found it very triggering to know that some people had ended their own lives over it, because I thought, God, what if it gets that bad one day? Because I understood that mine wasn't the worst that it could be. I've heard the sort of noises that other people hear sounds other people here, and it was unimaginable to me.
There's quite a few people that have written in, so I would love to read some of their questions. If that works for everyone, Yeah, I would love to.
And can I just add here if you are listening and you're really in that difficult alone place. On my website, there are heaps of case studies of people who have gone through it, and they've gone through the dark soul of the night. They're on the other side, and I think there's a lot of companionship gauging with real life stories where you're getting it. We want to recondition ourselves to believe in the body and to really participate in the process and not feel like we're just passive victims
and lives being thrown upon us. So, yeah, the case studies are powerful, and my book also, rock Steady, has a lot of mythbusting and useful supportive tricks and ideas and home practices that you can try straight away.
And also we will put make sure this is in all of our online for everybody. But can you just say what your website is.
It's seeking balance dot com dot au.
Okay, Anne wrote it, and she said, any quick and easy solutions for dizziness because I get dizzy very often.
My heart is with you, an I'm I'm gonna say the body scan. It's all about reorienting ourselves to understand, Okay, my shoulders are above my hips, I can feel both feet on the ground. Like we want to really build our neurological structures in the proprioceptive system, which is thirty percent of our balance function. So you have your ears, your eyes, and your proprioceptive system, which is a fancy word for how we orient ourselves, how we locate ourselves
and the sensation of touch. So when we're swaying side to side, our propriaceptive system is going okay, lifts and right, and we hone that we absolutely refine that function through practice, and my book Crop Steady has a lot of really simple practices that will help you with that.
Okay, yes, because I know that verdigo is part of this. And I wrote in and they said that there is constant itchy and cracking noises in the ear for months a cause of concern. My current doctor has been very dismissive and very agitated. Is that something that tonight's orus can sound like? Can it sound like that?
Yes? Oh? Absolutely?
Am I itching too?
Itching?
Not so much?
It's got no, it's just it's going a bit laterally. But honestly, you can get dermatitis and like exma in your ears. Oh and so you can medically soothe that, or you know, olive oil is very safe to try in the ears. Just a drop of olive oil and just allow that to have a little bit of a lubrication and moisturizing effect. But honestly, psoriasis treatments, all of those things are still relevant. And and you know, try a different doctor if you're feeling dismissed.
Always yes, advocating for yourself. So Kiki wrote in and said, for several years, if I sleep my any side besides my left, I get vertigo. Any suggestions on how to fix this?
Well? BEPPV Benign paroxysmal positional vertigo is the technical term for the most common form of vertigo. I've actually had it twice. One in four people get it, so very common and you can treat it. I talk about it in my book. You can google it, and there's basically little calcium carbonate odiconia molecules. They call them crystals, and they live in the ears. They're healthy, but they can fall out of their little bedroom and start rolling around
the ear. So if it's the right side that's getting dizzy, it might be the right ear that's affected. So what we do is we test and treat which ear where the crystals are, and then we literally just roll them back. It's like less than two minutes the treatment, and once you're treated, you're treated full life.
That's incredible, So it can come and go.
Like I said, I've had it twice, but you can test and treat it literally on the spot. And in my rock Steady program, I have a whole video tutorial where people do that themselves. Because it's so debilitating, you can be like, I never ever want to go traveling ever again because I need to have my physiotherapist around the corner nearby in case the crystals come out. So it's really debilitating. But once you have this education that Okay, I can test and treat myself. I can literally do
that in my hotel in Thailand. So really important to get that kind of basic stuff covered because you don't have to live with it, and many people do.
My friend also has has been diagnosed with to notice he wants to know if your treatment because this is what I would keep reading when I would google. It is part of it to do with listing to different frequencies, because I've heard that that's something that people sometimes they treat tonight us with that, although it doesn't necessarily sound like it's a curing it.
Yeah, look, I think we're really trained to look outside of ourselves for answers to distract, to numb, to ignore, to medicate, And I think some of these fancy devices I don't recommend them, but I also don't not recommend them. So it's like, you know yourself, if you love gadgets and devices that lights you up, it makes you excited, go for it in all that frequency matching.
Because you're getting that feeling internally, and that's really maybe what that is.
Yeah, it's an emotional yearning for like, ah, you know, I really want that inspector gadget watch and you know, this makes me feel like I'm an avatar. So it's like different strokes for different folks. But me, I would go music. I would go the full spectrum of frequencies. I would let myself be really flooded with music that I love, rather than trying to isolate a frequency and really overly obsess about something very linear. I always go
the nonlinear. I always go the complex. Human beings are complex, and I think we need to meet complexity with complexity, not try and make tenesis into some linear simple You know, I have a splinter. Get the Tweezers pulled the splinter out. This is not what we're talking about. It's going on LINEA.
I love what you've said repeatedly, which is the body scan, because I do think. I mean, there's a whole book about the body knows the score. Your body doesn't forget all the things that's been through. It actually doesn't. Your mind actually has a different and more sophisticated coping system, but your body actually is a little more raw and remembers it all. This has been so incredible.
Thank you so much, incredibly.
Informative for me. I mean, sitting on the outside I could watch you guys and hear and listen to you. But thank you so much for spend Thank you so much.
Yes, and I actually did not know that statistic of one in three, So I'm sure so many people listening will relate to this and be given hope. I really you're the first, literally the first person I've heard that could ever be like, wow, this is something that could fix I love this. You still have it right I can hear right now because we're talking about it.
I smell a part too between you two.
I will happily have you on in listeners. If you have more specific questions about this, please hit us in the comments, hit us in our DMS.
I really deliberately have a neurodiversity and complexity affirming community because we're all so different, and so many of my participants have not been believed. It's yes, it's heart wrenching and neurodivergences and all of these things matter, like we have to figure out what brain am I born with? What body am I born with? How are they communicating? And how can I fully participate? So I'm actually happy.
Thank you so much for being joy.
We will have you back on pleasure. Yes, thank you so much. This was so incredible. Thank you. Okay, bye bye.
Bye, have a great day you too.
I love that she joined us all the way from Australia. I want to end this podcast just by saying that Jess and I started this podcast to build community for people not to feel so alone. When I first had this, I felt so alon, I felt crazy, I felt like it was maddening. And I know this is a very specific topic that we are tackling today, but maybe you even know someone in your life that has it and you don't have it. Please please give this podcast to them.
It has meant so much to me just listening to this. It really felt hopeless for a long time. And this is very exciting, very exciting.
Yes, And obviously, I mean, you know when people when we bring on the professionals, and we bring on the doctors, and we bring on to the people who study these things with their whole beings every single day, they have a different set of vocabulary and there are always I always love when I'm in a conversation when I hear a new word.
Because I'm like, write it down, look.
It up, you know. So you know, she's clearly given us so many things to think about, and so many different words and ways of seeing things. And I'm so excited to take my notes from today's podcast and double click and look some words up and make sure that I understand all that she was talking about. And I have heard about body scans. It is definitely it's not an actual scan, by the way. You don't go get
it in a doctor's office. And I don't want to speak to it specifically because I don't know that I will describe it as it should be described. But it is definitely not a doctor's office visit. It is a body scan that you do with yourself, and I'm going to now go look it up so I re equate
myself with it. But it is something that I think everyone should look into if you're interested in this topic, and also please let us know what was interesting about this and what you would like to know more about if there's other subjects.
Because she's talking also about brain fog, and I know that a lot of people, a lot of people right now, I feel like they're suffering from that.
So, oh my gosh, as it pertains to long COVID, as it pertains to perimenopause, menopause, we're going to talk
about that, by the way. Yeah, there's going to be so many things that we're going to talk about, and often we're going to talk about the chit chat and the being together and all that, and then sometimes we're gonna pull in these moments and I would love to hear from you all and the crew, you know, how you respond to it, if it's interesting, if it's like what what would be what would be a topic that
you'd like to go do a deep dive into. And because it's we're so lucky we have, you know, incredible people that are really ready to come on and talk to us.
Yeah, and if we don't know what it is, we will find someone that does. We're all about those experts.
Let's go, let's go, let go.
I think that we we're gonna call it the end of the episode, but I think that we I'm gonna call it community because I think sharing all of this kind of shit that feels lonely sometimes is gonna be key to helping us all be so much happier. So quite simply just happier at the end of the day.
Yes, yes, and I will I will add to it. I would also call it you are not.
Alone yeah, absolutely all right guys, thanks for joining us and hit us up in the comments.
Thank you so much to Joey, Thank you Joey.
Bye.