Orlando Bloom Opens Up About His Buddhist Practice: Staying Grounded, Facing Fears and Living Fully

SGI USA, I'm Cassidy Bradford, and this is Bootability. The weekly series where I talk with Buddhist from Yeah. This week we have a special edition of the show. We got the chance to sit down with Orlando Bloom for an open conversation about his boot.

We filmed this interview, so it's also available to watch on our YouTube channel. You can find the link to the video in our For those who haven't listened before, Bootability is a show about believing in yourself and changing the world for the better. Each week, I speak with Buddhists across the U.S. about the ways Buddhist practice has helped them become wiser, more compassionate, and more.

In my talk with Orlando, we use some Buddhist lingo that might not always be clear for a new listener, so I want to break down a few things so that you can easily follow up. We talk about the Gohonzin, which is a mandala or scroll that SGI Nitrim Buddhists. It's a depiction of the life state of Buddhahood within us. That's why the Buddhist teacher Nietrun Daishonen often described the Gohonsen as a mirror. So rather than chanting to something outside.

We chant to the Gohanzen to see our Buddhahood and bring it out of our lives. If you're curious about the Gohan Zhen, you can get connected to a local Buddha. You'll hear us mention the Buddhist mantra Nam Myoho Renge Kyo, which we chant in the morning and evening, and chanting is a core part of our Buddhist practice. Orlando shares about the Buddhist philosopher Disokloceda, and he refers to him often as sensei, which affectionately means teacher.

If you're curious and you want to learn more, we have plenty of articles on bootability.org and over 150 podcast episodes. You can also reach out to us to get connected in your local community. I hope you all enjoyed the episode. All right. Thank you so much for joining Orlando, being a guest on the Bootability Podcast. Thank you for having me. Yeah, it's such a joy to like have you here and just chatting a little bit. You're just so warm.

You know, the same sense that I get from anybody that practices this Buddhism. Yeah. I'm really looking forward to a conversation. Really too. Yeah. What kind of kid were you growing up? What was your childhood like? Good question. Um, yeah, I was I was a very sort of uh

adventurous child, I would say. Um I struggled with learning Like I had uh dyslexia which was diagnosed when I was about um maybe nine or ten. And um so I struggled a little bit in school but I had a really high IQ. So it was it was interesting. Frustration you know, I would um I would understand so much more than I was able to um like get on the page.

Um I actually like part of my uh education once we deciphered that I was determined that I was dyslexic was to to learn to write cursive and joined up and stuff. And that was something that really helped when it came to like But um but but basically I was a sort of really happy kind of happy go-lucky adventurous, loved to ride my bike, loved to kind of um be outdoors, quite sporty. I was a bit of a risk taker. Um I think I took more risks than my mother felt um was um was ever now.

I was quite accident prone, I would say, at a but it but interestingly from a very early age. So I I uh my mum was like, you know, um my mum was like, well

I'm not sure, you know, if if like you know,'cause I I I was in and out of hospital a few times'cause I had like head injuries and stuff'cause I I was like cracking my head, falling off a stool, climbing out of a tree. I mean crazy stuff. But um But it was but it was also like, you know, um, I would say part of my uh joie de vive, part of my excitement and enthusiasm. I had a very I had a I had a sort of inner feeling that like anything was possible, you know?

and uh that I could could do sort of anything. Um that was something that I think over time and certainly when I met Buddhism became a little more better. Um at least. before prior yeah that uh I broke many, many bones in in in in in my life and and it was when I broke my back that I think everything sorta shifted'cause it was a sort of quite a close

And that was a wake-up call. And uh whilst I had been chanting and had the practice, um it was something that like I think was, you know, whilst it was at that time probably one of the biggest challenges. uh I faced in my life, I think it was pr it's probably been one of the greatest benefits

Um when you say one of the greatest benefits somebody listening might be like, What? Like this, you know, almost like a near death kind of moment. Like is to me that sounds so Buddhist, but I'd love to hear more. Yeah, I think I think that at a young age to have experienced s uh so much physical And the prospect of of you know, perhaps not walking and for a few da four four for f for about four days.

The conversation and I think um that you know the wiring in my brain and the way that I was looking at the world like immediately shifted. I don't think I Um I was in hospital and I was like, Yeah, that's not my life path. I was I think in my mind. Um but I think like I remember a teacher. I had a s quite a miraculous recovery. Um I walked

Or surgery and stuff. But one of the teachers at my drama school said to me, He said, This will be the making of you because finally, in the space And because And in a way it like I think it centered it centered me and my energy and then you know and then in my life it's been something that, you know, like I you know, I kind of constantly work on, you know.

and not you know and not get you know not over indulge in things that maybe I could have you know and take care of my health and wellness in in ways that maybe I wouldn't have. Um so I look at it

as a bonus. And I think, you know, at such a young age you know, those those experiences, you know, I I remember um thinking of my life and and I and I remember speaking to to a to a member about, you know, and I think sensei may You know, and in a way like the deeper, richer colours come from the experiences that we overcome and and the way that we evolve and and how we turn that poison of our life into the medical Um so the poison.

you know, I'm sort of, you know, at this age in my life, I'm sort of, well, I I take better care of myself than maybe I would have otherwise. Yeah, yeah. And um so so yeah, I think that's how it Yeah, absolutely. I mean it's so like I said, like such a kind of Buddhist way. And of course, you know, non Buddhists maybe have this kind

But this is Buddhability, so we're gonna say it's a Buddhist way. Only talking about the Buddhist perspective here. Um Yeah, but I mean that like any kind of like you said, poison, like something that seemingly is like wow, something instrumental. Yeah. Um but I mean of course like speaking about Buddhism, I I wanna know more about like how you encountered Buddhism and what made you say like

I'm gonna do this because I I know you were quite young. And I think if I were to encounter Buddhism honestly at that age. I would have been like, Yeah, I don't know, it seems a little weird, you know? Yeah, uh it's a good question. So I was actually confirmed in the Cathedral of Canterbury by the Archbishop of Canterbury at the age of the year. I grew up at a school in Canterbury's and um I would go to church in the morning, we would go to chapel in the morning and sing hymns and psalms.

And I remember looking at Jesus and you can't knock Jesus, he was a remarkable philosopher and I would never do that um as a Buddhist. Um but I would say I did wonder, you know, about the feeling of like I the responsibility of him being on a cross and that being somehow mine and I was like conflicted. And then um however when I moved

I moved to London at the age of sixteen and I sort of left my home. Um I'd been in boarding school at eleven, so I was really sort of out of my home environment at eleven and I moved to London. and at sixteen I was living in London and I didn't have chat. So I wasn't connected to a spiritual kind of dimension in that way. And that was something that I always appreciated actually.

And so I was um studying in London and my for my sculpture exam I had to study um I had a I found out kind of close that I had a a uh for my sculpture exam I had a fifteen hour oil painting, a fifteen hour

um a fifteen hour, you know, m sculpture making kind of clas uh exam and also paintings and drawings to back up all of the coursework that I'd done. And I and I was very good at just sitting in front of A piece of wood, some clay, some wire and just creating something from my imagination that would work and with give given a

But the drawing piece had was something that I just didn't think about and do. And you know you needed so my teacher was like, Well, you realise, you know, you've got these and I was like, Well So actually it was my best friend Mark who had met an artist in our hometown who um introduced who he introduced me to and I would travel down to Folkestone and Kent to meet. to learn to paint and draw so that I would be, you know, um capable during the exam.

And it was it was David um who uh David Mars who shakabuku me who was um uh teaching me and I would hear him in the other room, he would set me up with a needle and I'd hear him going, Nanny. like what are you doing? And one day I went in there and I was like, what are you doing? And he said, Well I'm chancing that you're gonna do really well in your exams, you're gonna have a really successful life and I was like, Well will it help? And he goes, Yeah.

I just got down on my knees with him and I started to chant to his Gehanson. He explained to me what the Gehanson was, and he kind of, as an artist, he sort of allowed To um, I would say embrace that practice because I think you make a good point, which is like at 16, how do you encourage somebody? chanting Buddhism or even look at the philosophy. And then he would slowly, you know, um and then over the over the you know he would he would give me guidance, things, pieces of guidance.

And it was all made very logistical, lo like logical and practical sense. Yeah. You know, in a way that was very accessible and I was like, Wow And I think and I think actually the real the what really kinda landed it for me is is that in a way, I think the magazine in the UK is called The Art of Living. And

I was looking for that, you know. I was looking for a roadmap in life. I was looking for like something You know, um wanting to be an Um not knowing how to start that, although I moved to London in the kind of like get into theatre or drama school and I did join the National Youth Theatre and I did all the things that like people would do to sort of at that time in my life and in the world

Like embark on a career in acting. But I really wanted some kind of like I guess philosophical kind of road. And and I think that, you know, it was just very apparent to me almost immediately. That like chanting Nam Yorengekyo and and studying the guidance and getting to a place where I could talk about.

getting comfortable with that was the roadmap that felt And it was um in a sense this idea that when I chanted to my Gehanson, as we disc as as many people dis say, we're polishing the mirror of our life, you know. I'm chanting to my con and I'm and I'm revealing to my And in a way, the idea that this is within me and that it's my responsibility in this lifetime to overcome the obstacles in my life, that was something

An aha moment. You know, it's like oh wait, I'm not gonna pray to somebody for forgiveness or you know, I'm going to realize that the law of cause and effect which we know is strict and is something that, you know, is is in our life. Um and I think that idea by the way runs very concurrent with any other religious practice. Absolutely. Read what you sew, do good, get you know.

So that was an easy kind of handle for me to kind of get hold of. But then I liked the idea that it was it was my responsibility. to being to be the best I could be. And that I wasn't asking somebody to help me be better. And at sixteen to have words like integrity or wisdom or courage or compassion just which was basically everyday dialogue for sensei to give out, right? Is like, you know, I mean I I don't think I even considered

In some ways, you know. Um not not to say that the the teachings of the Bible that I had learned weren't in some ways, you know, also, you know, accurate in their thinking, but there was just the way that Sensei presented. was was was made um sort of palatable for my young mind. I think each of us has our own path. You know, you were we were discussing earlier when you were saying that you were you were born into this practice and you know that's amazing.

And for me it was like I really feel like in some way I I sort of owned my connection to both sensei Daisaki to the practice and to the thinking of practice in a way that was just really authentic and and you know and that that worked. I really love that like that you shared you were really looking for like a a roadmap or like a framework or like how do I You know, of course I I know that maybe these are my goals, but like what kind of life? What quality of life?

And I think for so many people that's what Buddhism like really provides and And and I'd say it's it's as hard if not harder today. Yeah. You know, to continue. to stay on point with what's important, mm-hmm, not to get, you know, distracted by the you know, the the the the th you know, the distractions or the devilish thinking that can come into our lives. Yeah, absolutely. So In a way, um, it's been an an incredible, you know, an incredible blessing. And I You know, I have used my practice and

It is it has supported my thinking on pretty much everything. And the only you know, like Yeah, I just I just ch you know, when it's not clear I chant. And even sometimes that's challenging and I have fortunately I have Enchanted. Uh Oh I love this. So relatable. It's like it's like oh oh god. Oh god. Oh do I really I thought we were I thought I've gotten to the place. Yeah, like oh I'd rather just like can I just Just sit down.

You don't stop until Oh the moon over um Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So it's uh twelve days the journey and on the eleventh day if you stop you'll never see the moon over the capital. Yeah. And that that is Key for me right now, you know, because you know, with so much good fortune in my life. with so many opportunities um you know and so many it's like No, right? You don't stop before you see the moon over the capital. Because because sensei never stopped, right? Yeah. And um and that's somet

It's so interesting. I was thinking before we came together t about that,'cause it's like it's a it's a real it's you know, it's the honest truth, isn't it? You know, it's like

Yeah. Just get down and do it. Just do it. Just get it out. Even if it's hard. Yeah, I mean it's definitely uh uh it's like definitely a a daily practice of like action, you know, taking responsibility always which sometimes is hard, you know, sometimes it's incredibly joyful but sometimes it's like, wow, I really have to like do this hard work of like you said, like polishing

your life, you know. Yeah. Um, and I was just gonna say like uh, you know, for folks listening that haven't heard like any of these Buddhist kind of terms before Um I just wanted to share like the the Gohanzin is like a mandala that we chant to. So all Buddhists um that practice this form of Buddhism, S Gi Nitrian Buddhism, we have this in our home. To it, but it's not like something that has these kind of magical powers, right? But it's got um, you know, this inscription on it of Nam Yohoding.

So um yeah, I just wanted to share that for people that are like, what is that word that Orlando is saying? Thank you, thank you for thank you for pointing that out. Yeah, receiving it was it yeah, yeah. I I actually love the the the uh You know it was something that to begin with it was like oh so so when we chant to our gehonza Um we it it's inside our Butsadam which is a wooden box and

and um and then you know, lighting a little bit of incense, having some greenery, some fruit or some flowers and and and having like a few words of encouragement in the form of like, you know you know, Sensei's books and writings. But it's like it kind of it's it's a nice moment to take pause for self, you know, and that can be hard. But it's also the opportun you know, it's it's a nice it would it's a it's a it's a really nice reinforcement.

in in our in the home as well. I f I definitely feel it's protection too. Yeah. You know, in a way like I almost think of it like like I've I've referenced this before, but uh like it like it's my superhero cape. Do you know what I mean? Yeah yeah. And I don't want that to sound um, you know, insincere, but i like in some ways I do find chance to to be a form of protection.

Um that that is that is unique to me as it is to each individual who chants and and and yet something that is so easy to share and and protect, you know. And I I love that.

Yeah, I mean I think like, you know, we do our best to chant every day and yeah, when I chant, like, you know, chanting Nam Yoho Dengaikyo is like tapping into your own enlightenment, your Buddhahood, your bootability. Um And yeah, like when I chant, you know, I might start the morning being do or I'm like just had a fight with my partner, whatever, you know, and then I'm chant about it and I'm able to like

um, you know, really bring out my life force of like, oh okay, I can do this. I can bring wisdom out, you know, okay, I know how to go back to my partner and like, you know. Isn't it interesting because I think in a way like without

It can just become this slog. But it's almost like it's going to be challenging. Yeah. Right. And when I chant, I'm I'm engaging the capacity to overcome those, see those obstacles. as as the opportunity for me to grow. Just like when I broke my back it was been an opportunity.

That maybe I wouldn't have done. Who knows? I don't know. I could have become like, you know, I could have just, you know, you know overindulged, you know, in different things in life and not not taking care. So and I think, yeah, like I you know Absolutely. And I I'm wondering like timeline, you know, you were I think in drama school when you injured And then like pretty shortly after you landed like huge career like defining moment.

Like were you chanting about your career? Like and what was that like how were you chanting? H what was that experience? I mean, it must have been like pinch me. Yeah, it was wild. It was a wild pinch me moment in more than pinch me.

Um wow. I think um I was most definitely chanting and and very um you know, I think there are waves of waves of practice and you know and and certainly when you embark on this practice, you know, um and especially if you're blessed to be a young person then you have this ISO enthusiasm and and discipline and and dedication and and and I would say need for this path and a need for um you know um in my heart this sense of of

understanding and and almost like a sign, you know? Like I think like people say, you know, you can earthly desires lead to enlightenment, right? So that idea that you may chance A car because you need to get to work. Great, but you may chant if you're just starting off because you want to see actual proof benefit in your life. So it's not a some kind of magical wish one, but you can chant. And then you know, I remember somebody saying, Well, you may not get

But you may find somebody saying, Well actually I drive past your house every day. I'll pick you up and then I'll drop you home. So then you're getting a ride to work, you're not paying insurance or tax, there's no response, you know, and it's like It can be conspicuous benefit as well as, you know. And so, in a way, at my tender age and with the circumstances that I had grown out.

I needed, I think, some kind of I felt or at least I I I had the sincerity of heart Yeah to to realise things, d to realise um um And I certainly chance. And in without I would say indirectly,'cause in a way I was sort of I would chant for this like light around the world. You know, it was like can I do can I be a light in a way? And it was like and somebody had uh again, one of David

um when when David i somebody who David knew had had sort of suggested that idea to me and I was like, oh wow, yeah, okay, I could be a light like that. Anyhow, um but also like yeah, I was auditioning Um I was at drama school, I was I was performing, I was dealing with all of the anxieties and of stage.

Can I do this? Am I good enough? Am I capable? Do I can I retain this dialogue? Am I gonna dry on stage? Am I gonna forget my lines? Am I gonna you know, there were a plethora of things going on and, you know, and I and and learning lines.

you know, is something that now is very accustomed to me and I'm very good at. But I was learning a way to learn in a sense at drama school. Mm-hmm. And but I chanted, yeah, I mean I I chanted, you know, to To I guess we talk about fulfilling our mission for Koz and Rufu and what we mean by that is fulfilling our mission, Koz and Rufu be being to create value. So like if I'm creating value, so like if it's if it's meant for me, then I'll I'll have the opportunity.

So that was I think, you know, how and with the sincerity Partly, you know, I mean I played Legolas, who, you know, is an elf, who is like a very like cool but like, you know, the elves are like ethereal and they're like, you know, they're immortal and there's so much about

was like kind of concurrent with almost like a lot of my Buddhist thinking. Although I I didn't want him to be like um you know let us I didn't want to be like um some kind of like uh ethereal other world that I wanted to be like flesh and blood.

And I knew that he came from a realm of Merkwood and that they were kinda like militant elves. So I kinda had this idea of him kind of came through and and I was like studying Kurosawa's I was looking at Kurosawa movies again a Japanese director and and that was because Buddhism

Japan so there's a lot of swirling things that and um you know um so so I would I would I was absolutely um chanting you know to fulfill my mission and I I I there's there's no shadow of a doubt in my mind that that you know it it enabled me to to navigate that that that those times in my life.

I was sixteen. I I didn't have parents around. I was living in London. Plenty of distractions, plenty of things to get like, you know, off course with. But in a way, coming back to practice and the discipline of that. I mean definitely like I think we often talk about a unique purpose for our lives, you know, and when we say peace through each individual person's happiness and like fulfillment of their life.

And yeah, I often find that like when I can really chant about, you know, whatever kind of goals I have in my life or whatever problems I'm encountering, when I really think about like how can I like also It makes it so much more enjoyable too, you know, like because it gives so much more purpose and meaning to like, oh, it's not just like, oh, I landed this, but like, wow, this is really like part of my purpose.

Yeah, and I think that you know the the fundamental principle of this practice for me that I think is is is that is of value creation that we that that if you selfishly do anything you know I think

if you are somebody I think we as humans we feel better when we're doing things for other people. Absolutely. You know, when you get the opportunity to do something for somebody.

you know, it feels good, right? And so that's just part of this practice that's built in, which is that you're constantly I used to think, well if I can take care of my side of the street good enough yw'n yw'n yw'n yw'n yw'n yw'n yw'n yw'n yw'n yw'n yw'n yw'n yw'n yw'n yw'n yw'n yw'n yw'n yw'n yw'n yw'n yw'n yw'n yw'n mynd.

We're trying to, you know, work as a as a as a global, you know, um you know, citizen citizens doing our best and certainly within the SGI. Totally. And it makes my life just so much more Right. You know, like I find that I'm when I'm just really absorbed in like whatever's Life, my whatever suffering I have, my life is just kind of small, right? And then when I can start like, okay, thinking about

Yeah. My life feels so much like, oh wow. Okay. You know curious about somebody else. Yeah. It's amazing how much something just like curiosity about someone can really like create this life. And even momentarily, right? But that can shift so much in someone's life in our own life too. Yeah. And it's and it and we talk about the Tem worlds, right? Yeah. Because we fluctuate through the Tem worlds.

Moment to moment. So sometimes it's like, no, I'm not, I'm definitely not in the mood to help somebody else right now. I'm just trying to survive this moment. But you know, but then we kind of the more that The more that we get we get become capable and the more that we become, you know, um open to the idea of you know how do we you know how do we maintain a curiosity for others and and then and therefore you know help

Yeah, I mean that's also like kind of an another way to describe when we talk about human revolution or like transforming our lives is you know, these ten worlds are all different life states that we in any one moment, right? Fluctuate in like one moment I'm joyful, other I'm and the ten worlds being the lowest to the highest. Yes. Yes, yes, great. And we live in that, I think like that, you know, the lower worlds are the ones that we can easily inhabit.

Yes. And then we can get into trans you know, into like the higher worlds. But I can't even remember how. How to name the higher worlds because I'm like I'm like butt. Buddha hood is the height. That's the most important thing. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And tap into it any moment, right? When we chant, right, it's bringing out this butt. Yeah.

But yeah, like you said, like you know, throughout our lives as we continue to practice, it gets easier to access sort of those higher life And understand I think, right? It's like the the the the one thing that But o years of just continuing to check in.

through practicing and chanting is that that it's like like it's like little aha moments all the time. Like that's what that means. Okay. You know what I mean? And in a way like because I have continued It's like i you know, I think like Buddha Buddhahood is is is is you know, is not gonna happen tomorrow necessarily. Yeah, wonderfully could. But like but it's a lifelong path, right? And and that's the the on that's the joy, you know, because it's sort of like that's the opportunity and Yeah.

Yes. Oh my gosh. This one again. Yeah. Okay. It's amazing when you can have a moment where like you go, Oh, almost immediately, oh this really sucks, but okay. I know that this is opportunity. Yeah. Um and I'm sure you probably Didn't always like have that initial like gut reaction, like, oh, okay, this is like this obstacle is great for me. Um, so like

When you then like broke out into, you know, new career and you were young, thrust into a whole heap of other obstacles. Yeah. Like thrust into the spotlight. I mean That I could never have seen coming. Or even So like where did your Buddhist practice like come into play during that like really just I imagine very intense? I'd say where didn't it? Uh in a way.'Cause it was like

You know, I think um well I know it was an anchor for me. I know that it was very grounding. I know that the practice was an anchor and felt very grounding. I know that the like when I was in like in a sense the eye of the storm of my career in in in my life in in mid to late twenties into my early thirties it was like, you know, It there was so much to to to knock me off sands.

Um but I kind of just chanted through all of that and you know um you know people having opinions about you and you know while whilst you're like learning and growing. you know, n figuring it out and not having a clue and, you know, f feeling judged or feeling ridiculed or you know, or even dealing with um, you know,

the idea that you're the second coming and that you're some you're like the you know, and you're like, but wait, what? I I haven't done anything to what do I you know, I'm still fi I'm just figuring this out in here, you know. So like

you know, there was like uh the eight winds was a was a really great kind of um, you know piece of guidance that somebody had shared with me and that was that was a real kind of like like, you know, a wise man isn't isn't isn't swayed by the eight winds of praise and censure on a Yeah. But you get the point, right? Which was which was like, Oh, okay, so I wanna be a wise man and not be you know like not be just tossed around by other people's opinions of me.

Now I'm not saying I wasn't because I think I was at different times I was definitely tossed around. But I think that fortunately I could keep coming back to these these ideas and these And you know, it felt a little bit like being in a human experiment and the medicine for any of that, any of that kind of

Onslaught was always like just chanting. Um you know, I mean it and it's and it is in a weird way the uh the the the ongoing opportunity for my for my to keep kind of like, you know, not to uh not to get swayed by, you know prosperity and decline or uh you know, whatever, praise and censure. I mean

you know, pleasure and suffering and you know, all of these you know, it's like it they they are in a way, you know, the things that, you know, we can easily kind of get get distracted by. Um So yeah, it's um it yeah, I would say there isn't anything that that didn't, you know, have an aspect of Daimoku behind it, you know, from I don't know like presenting at an award ceremony, I'd be chanting on the way to the ceremony, I was chanted in the morning, I'd be all you know

You know, going to an audition or meeting with a director or, you know, like if this is for me, you know, it's like I mean there was there was sort of Daimoku, especially through that period as well, that was backing up all of that. I mean I like I truly can't even fathom that experience'cause I can't either. Honestly. I I literally I I'm uh like the i i it's almost like, you know, you know, of course I remember things but like there is a part of it which is just like Yeah.

It was it's it's almost like it just it it's hard to it was like so much was happening at such a quick such a rapid pace that it's almost like I didn't you know, I was you know it's like I mean I mean it i it's interesting like

I mean, that leads me to meeting Sensei, because I was, I remember, I was in Japan, and I was at the Fuji Rocks. I would have been asked to go to Fuji. It's a music festival, but here's me, right? And they were like, we just want you to go out and This environmental global green company uh organization, I think it was Global Green or anyway, an environmental and said we want you to go out and just say, look, the environment

Yep. Didn't really have a script. I'm getting ego, Hey, let's protect the environment. I mean, you know, um and uh But it was actually while I was there that um like um one of one of the members here had sort of thought, wait, he's in Japan, sensei's in Japan, how do we get him?

Like as if that was something that should happen. That would never have occurred to me. And I think there was some kind of conversation and and I often sort of wonder why that actually happened or why Sensei thought it was a good idea to meet me. Like you know what I mean, in some ways. And I'll never forget meeting him. And and f first of all, like, I got a phone

You could you could meet sensei and I was like, wait, what? Um yeah, you're gonna get picked up from this from from the the Fuji Rock Festival and and and we're gonna we're arranging a a um um um uh a meeting with uh Daisaki Vikeda with Sensei and I was

Uh well okay, I'm not ready for this. Yeah. Uh, you know, am I ready for this? No, I mean what does that even you know? Yeah. So then it was like and it was sort of amazing I remember these members um Them uh uh you've probably been to Japan and I'm sure some other members have been to Japan, but the members in Japan

I mean they're just like levitating somehow. You know, it's like, it's just like I'd never seen joy like it. You know, joy is like, so like I'm suddenly like, it was like as if I was suddenly taken on this magic carpet. And I was on a on a wave of Dymocky and And then I remember like I was just like chanting and we would and I talking and I was being given like those delicious finger sandwiches and writing like what am I gonna say

I've gotta I've gotta write a poem. I've gotta give him something of what have I gotta say, what have I gotta do? You know, it was one of those So did you know before you got to Japan? No. Oh wow, no, yeah. So, you know, so then I remember we like got to you know, we were in these in a mini bus heading to the Nagano Training Centre, which was um where Sensei was um studying and give and doing uh and working in this beautiful region and and and center.

And um I'll never forgot, I got off the bus and And and I literally I saw Sensei and I was like, it was as if um uh it was like a lightning bolt or something hit my brain. Oh I've done this before, like somehow. Like I felt like I knew this person. Like and I don't mean and of course I know Sensei. Yeah. Because Sensei is in my heart and I've studied and everything else. But it was almost like, wow, I think we've walked lives.

Th if there are if there are many lives, this is one of them. And I'm like and we've done this before somehow. And I'm like, this is wow, this is wilds. I ran over to him and I gave him a massive hug. I was like and and he went And he went boom on one side of my cheek, boom on the other, and then he went and then he looked at me and he went and he sort of smiled. And I was like, and then he just like, you know, he sort of looked at me and sort of laughed and smiled.

and like and like and then it was like a dream. I mean I mean it was like He was driving this gu I was in this golf buggy golf car and he was driving this car and it felt like we were flying around these little paws in the Nagano training centre and I'm like and we get to this room and there's like and he goes, And these are the orchids that we put here for you and they're be they're so beautiful and the members are all like it's like it was like it was almost like being

you know, in a in a in a Disney movie in some way, you know, like I tryna like like in some kind of like Otherworldly existence, you know, of like, is it possible that there's this much sincerity, joy, consideration, care, attention to detail, thought. The first thing he mentioned was my mind. Um which was like because I love my mother, but my mother is the greatest opportunity for my development and growth. Yeah. You know, historically.

you know, and it's not b because she doesn't love me,'cause she loves me you know, like impossibly. But there's you know, but the but the but the process of my my upbringing and and aspects of it were super conflicting and challenging in some ways, but also, as we say, the opportunities for my evol you know, for me to grow and develop. And he kind of like So he just he sort of just like nailed pretty much everything

It was as almost like there wasn't there was this amazing translator. So of course he's speaking in Japanese but like it was as if he was speaking English. You know, it was like the the translator. Like the way that she was like expressing and then He um I remember he gave me that that like um he expressed those those thoughts around my mother which was sort of like like it was like wow And then I read this poem which I had written on the bus and and he was sort of like wait

Those sound like my words. And I was like, Well they probably are. I'd like literally like I read your guidance every day and I'm sure it's like I've it's an amalgamation of all your thinking, but it's like a version of my and then we went, I remember we we were in this beautiful

room to discuss all of these things and there was um somebody explaining who I was and why I was here and, you know, that I'd been in these movies and that I was in why I was in Japan and um you know and who my friends were and why they were there and my sister was there as well.

Which is great. And so and then um and then we we got back on the the golf buggies and we went back out into this like beautiful landscape of the the Ghana Training Centre and like landed at this other like kind of s place where we chanted, where it was like a it was a room that was with a with a beautiful

Sensei sort of I remember he s he chanted and I was like it was so different because it wasn't like he has this he has this amazing he had this amazing rich voice, you know, but it was like it was like it was just like other world you know, it wasn't like like like I thought, you know, it was like it was like something else. And um but he chanted and and then I remember he gave me an award to give to my mother. He gave me an award for the art.

Um he you know And I think like when I think back on it now, what was sort of amazing is that it's so like transferable because long after I'm gone, hopefully

for any young member. It can be like, oh, that could have been you. You know what I mean?'Cause it's not me. I mean it is me, but it was i uh the the circumstances could be so different for anyone. But like in a way it's like It's like he was talking to as as my d as my mentor and my mentor a a he being as sensei was my mentor, he was talking to me as a disciple as if he would be talking to any of us.

Yeah. And it's sort of like and I realized like later that that's sort of what it was. It wasn't it was sort of like It it wasn't it was about the members, it was about, you know,

It was about a dis a mentor talking to a disciple and you know and kind of passing the torch in his own way without, you know, passing the torch. When I saw him on on on on two other occasions um in Japan because I at meetings that he was he was at, you know, it was always um, you know The thing that struck me was how important the members were, but mostly how important it was that the members understood their value, that the members understood their Each member understood their values.

That there was nobody above them. That the the thing that's amazing. is that we don't that we are we have to be Buddhas and we have the Buddhahood inside of us and Sensei gave us that. He gave us the the that you know this practice is the vehicle for us, right? And the opportunity for us. But we're the ones that our lives and we can use this amazing tool as which is what I sort of almost think of it as to transform our lives on a daily basis even when we're

you know, anger or you know, anger or suffering to to uh to to kind of like lift ourselves out of that. But but it was really that was something that just really you know, because he was never you know he was never lauding it, you know, he was never like you know it was like

He was us. We he was the mirror or you know, he was our mirror, just as we should be mirrors and just as, you know, you know what I mean? Yeah. Does that make sense? Yeah, absolutely. I really love to like it sounds like, you know Felt like just really that he's connecting to you as a person, you know, not like Orlando Bloom, this, this, and that, right? But just like who you

And um I think that kind of like quality is something that you know all of us really strive for. And I think that was bit apparent because he didn't see himself as above anyone. Yeah. Like you can't really speak to somebody on the level unless you're on the level. Yeah. Do you know what I mean? Absolutely. Like and he never he didn't there wasn't a sense that he was

I think he almost didn't like that, you know what I mean? Yeah. Like if ever. Yeah. That was my sense. Yeah, I mean I think absolutely, like we i in this Buddhism and like historically in Buddhism, there's mentorship, right? Mentor is not someone above you, right? Somebody that's actually just showing you this is like the path, this is the way that you can live your life so that you can, you know, how to achieve, you know, this kind of happiness. And thank you for clarifying mentor.

Well I'm wondering like maybe you can share a little bit too like I know that you consider Disacola Cato your mentor and and sensei means mentor, like it's kind of a term of um Yeah, like admiration, but not like, you know, above, right? But um, what is it meant for you to like have a mentor for your life? And why Disocloceta? Well I I think I sort of answered it, but in a sense You know, to have met the practice at such a tender age, and or not even that it was a tender age, but an influential.

you know um and looking for that roadmap and then the simplicity of the guidance that he um you know would would would put into the world and what was shared from Japan or you know the the magazines that we it was it was or the books that you could read. It was just it was like It was like it was it was sort of Common sense? Yeah. It was sort of almost scientific.

Of course, you know, as a philosophy I almost think of it as a bit scientific. Yeah. You know, it's really a bit like, well, it's sort of like gravity, what goes up must come down. And and I think that like the practicality is something that I found so useful. Yeah. Because you know, I can be at home and chant and raise my life condition. Now, if I take that life condition into the world, I can really have into a a Buddhist meeting that is just the the foundational aspect of this practice.

Which is like the members and being a part of that. And of course, the nature of my scheduled life is that I'm everywhere. So finding, you know, myself, you know. um in in in meetings is sometimes harder than I'd like but it's but just that w it's like it's almost like it's like water over a drought, you know

Because it's sort of like only when you know you you are with other members that you see the things that you can work on, you know? Because everybody shares you know, in a meeting, not everybody, but people will share their But then you you get these little glimpses of like oh okay this is what Because I can continue to listen to the same book or like study or read and stuff, but if I'm in a in a void of just self.

then it's sort of like it's self-oriented and then I'm not, you know, I'm not like doing my part. I'm not, I'm not, you know, because we need to be. We need to be in We need to be functioning. We need to have a voice in our community. To have an inf

And to have a positive impact, right? And it's something that you can forget about when, you know, we've been through a covet crisis and we're like we all just want to be indoors and just like, you know, get lost on our phones or like, I don't know, just avoid people or to actually but continue to to involve yourself and engage the way that sensei did, you know? Like that's certainly one man you can't say didn't didn't do it didn't do the most. Yeah. I know this is like

kind of a pivot, but I'm really dying to talk about your show. Oh yeah. Because uh when I was watching it so we can you know, the pivot is, you know Sensei Daisaku Keda traveled the world, expanded his capacity. I will say that um When I when I saw Sensei I talked about climbing a mountain, I think it I've got to climb Mount Everest for you kind of thing. Yeah, I mean there's a Q.

And you know it's like it if anything, everyone needs to stop climbing Mount Everest. And um and probably like clean Mount Everest or you know, figure out how to do that. But

Um, because of like what what part of my ego was attached to the idea of climbing Mount Everest, right? As opposed to like, you know, um you know, as opposed to the sincerity of my heart. And I was in covid when I was really challenged and I think we can all agree that COVID was a very challenging time for everyone on the planet. by the fear that I was surrounded by and was feeling impalpable, you know. And I don't like

Um I don't think that fear serves me. Um I don't think that fear um helps me to um, you know, overcome things. So I was like And and I remember at the time I just started um you know working with a couple of people on on developing projects and I had this thought, I was like, well, if I come out of this, what am I gonna do that's like really gonna challenge me?

And actually initially what I wanted to do was like talk about blue zones and maybe highlighting the the idea of what it meant for certain people to live long and profitable.

Right? You know, and there are many communities around the world. But it it turns out there's already a blue zone trial. And I and honestly, nobody, you know, I was like, could I meet other Buddhists in different parts of the world and talk about what they but like nobody wanted to finance that. It was like but like we will throw you out of a plane and see if you can swim to the bottom of the ocean and or climb this. And I was like,

Okay. Okay. Well, I mean I did say I was gonna climb something to sensei and and this would be over. I mean, so the show is about me overcoming my fears, is about me becoming capable. is about me using my practice. And I I was I was I was I was very um I I I thought long and hard about how I would um chant on the show, you know, because I was like I don't want

to seem trite. I don't want to you know I don't want to I don't want to turn people off, you know, because I respect that other people have a different, you know, practice in their or or way of doing things. So I was very conscious of like how to how to how to broach that. And I really kind of got a lot of guidance from people about whether or not, you know, um and how to how how the authenticity of how that would land.

But I do chant in the show because it because the practice, you know, because chanting is a big part of obviously huge part of my life and also something that does help me to overcome So, um but yeah, I basically learnt to skydive and then in in twenty Pretty attaining. anyone. I did it on a very short trajectory. But what's maybe not so attainable and and something that's been done is I learnt to wing suit um like right after that. And the wing suiting aspect is really

Really it's it's I was I was working with um Luke Akin's who's like an amazing um I mean he's he's the guy, he's the head of the like skydiving federation and stuff. So he had a certain he had a series of checklists that like

I and I was right in it. So I was definitely like, you know, I was switched on and doing it. So that was huge. And then the free diving was was huge and and proposed all of its own challenges and I swam And that was pretty, pretty, pretty, pretty big, quite a big achievement. been working on my breath prior to that. And then I climbed, you know, which was wonderful to climb um while Sensei was alive, this peak.

stand and I stood, you know, on this pinnacle at the top of this um the Moab and I was like I was like num you know for sensei and it was like um terrifying. I mean it was like possibly, you know, physically and you know mentally and emotionally one of the most on my brain. But but but it was it was so that was you know and that was something that, you know, I'm I'm you know, it wasn't you know, I I hadn't planned to do an unscripted show.

or documentary. I hadn't you know but I but I think that like You know, I'm really glad that I did it. Um I'm glad that, you know, I I I think that the the way that um you know the practice is sort of broached and touched upon is not too heavy handed and it doesn't you know, it's not banging anyone over the head, which is really important to me because I don't want that

Um it's lovely to be able to talk about Buddhism on Buddhaability because obviously, you know, the audience is set for that and you know that's great. But you know, I think we we all do need we all do recognize that we're talking to people of the time, right? Like Sensei always in guidance would say you need to you need to talk to people at the ti of the times, you know, recognize the times that we're living through. And so it's like, you know, having the wisdom to do that correctly.

you know, shakabuku or you know, for create you know, have some curiosity for people and if people are interested, you know, and um you know and it's nice it in that sense. Yeah. I mean honestly, like I am somebody that's like really a risk taker at all. Risk adverse? Yeah, I am very risk averse. Um and so like when I saw the promotions for it, I was like, huh, I don't know, but he's chanting, so I'm gonna check it out. And I I have to say like

Honestly, I was really struck by like how vulnerable of a show. Like it felt very intimate. And I like honestly even going into this interview, I felt like, oh, I already kind of like I have a sense, you know, of who he is. And so much of it I feel like in a way shows of course it's in the setting of like, you know, really pushing kind of adventure limits, but you know, in our day.

We have all kinds of limitations and it it seemed like I don't know, like a perfect illustration, honestly, of like what it's like to engage In this Buddhist practice when you're facing it. I I really, really love it, honestly. Um Yeah, yeah, of course. I think it's I I I'll thank you. That means so much to me. I think the thing that I really hoped was that because of course

I'm me, and I'm not whoever's watching the show. And whoever's watching the show, like you, might be completely risk averse. But what is the version of Like it could be like I'm going to make Sunday roast for my family. Uh that's that would terrify me probably more than jumping out of a plane, quite frankly. Or you know what I mean? Like or it could be like I'm going to learn to public speak or I'm going to learn to

You know, I I don't know, but I I know that through COVID we all chat we were all challenged and and and like even for some people just getting out of the house into society. So I hoped and I hope through the show that people would watch it would get that because it's not It's really not, you know

it you know, it's really not about me doing wild and crazy things and and I think there was like you know I think you know if you if you don't have like the vision for that then that Or if you're very fear adverse. And you might like to take that the wrong way, but it wasn't, I wasn't taking unnecessary risks. And I think the thing that I learned was about becoming capable. Because I think there's this term about like adrenaline junkies. And I think actually everybody that I met that taught

They were supreme athletes, and they were about as far from an adrenaline junkie as I could get. Like they had an appetite. for stepping out of their company. They had an epit appetite for pushing their edge and going past what some people would think s is reasonable or capa you know, a a good idea. But they were doing it in incredibly measured, incredibly well thought out detail.

Way more than somebody else. I mean, that I've ever come across. Do you know what I'm saying? So in a way it was like for me, the takeaway was also about becoming a capable. Like learning something so well that I could be capable enough to do it and or at least push my limit or take it to that limit. And that was something So you can say what you like. If you're a mother of like if if you're if you're a middle aged woman with a with a mother

with like three kids or two kids or even one child and you're like, I don't want them to watch this and be like getting any ideas that Orlando Bloom thinks this is a good idea, then you're missing the point. Yeah. You know,'cause this is not like, you know Try this at home. No. It's the opposite. It's like it's it's like what's your end?

Push your edge. Don't you know, like for me, yeah, I'm a little bit unhinged. So jumping out of a plane in a wingsuit was a good idea. That's your edge. But you know It could easily have been learning to cook. Yeah. Or public speaking in a way that, you know, I hadn't thought about, or stand up comedy. I mean, I don't know. There's a ton of things. Yeah. But I think that, you know,

Like or going to a meeting. Let's take it back to bulla bullability. You know what I mean? Like let's not be afraid to go to a meeting, let's not be afraid to meet you know, let's do what it need do do what you need to like, you know, take care of your health. You know, Sensei was always like he I remember him talking about my health a lot. Um

And, you know, the members were always taking care of like, you know, making sure that everybody felt safe and so on. But I think, you know, if you bring it back to your daily life then yeah, what is it? It's like going going to a meeting, call you know, stepping out of that comfort zone, get out from

computer or your phone or your whatever it is and go into you know into you know um the meetings or you know make that effort and and and y there's always something to get from it, right? And that's the gift, you know, it's sort of crazy. It's like that we have this as members, that we have the opportunity to um mix with strangers sometimes but who have this philosophy. Like you how can you not learn?

Unless you're just like like just been living in hell for a long time, and in which case you're still gonna learn something. You know, so it's like It's i yeah, it's just a win win. It's a win-win. Yeah. I mean, I was just recently chanting about like, I just want to like expand my You know and of course. When you do that then you're meeting the edge, right? Like And you're asking for it. Yes. You're gonna ask for it. I knew like, okay, I wanna

be even more like capable, even more joyful in my life. And so of course you're bumping up it against th the fear, right? Yeah, and I and I think the other thing is like what are you waiting for? Like I I think that what I realized and there's that analogy of like when you're chanting your T there's a there's a somebody gave me this analogy.

You have to forgive me'cause I got s plenty of plenty of analogies. No, it's great. But they've all come they've all come from the right source, I promise you. But I can't tell you which one but a source. Um but a source and it was definitely connected to to to to to this practice and the SGI and Buddhism.

You know, is this idea of like a a glass of tea, you know, in Japan and you would stir the leaves, right? And the leaves through stirring would come to the surface and through chancing you're scooping them off the surface. My thing is, it's like that's such a beautiful analogy for life because if you don't

Then this the tea just sours and it's too strong and it's gonna, you know. And over the course of your life, it's just gonna build up all this sediment. So you wanna keep stirring it, you wanna keep chanting to scoop it off, because otherwise, when you're in your six. Or whatever you whatever age you like.

It could be just at any time in your life, it's gonna clap you, right? It's gonna be like, wait, and you're not prepared. Whereas if you're just constantly doing it, then you're sort of constantly prepared. And almost constantly preparing for the fact that, you know, okay, we're going to leave this body and then you know, and that's something that I think is

really challenging for people. The fear of death or the idea that we won't ever be h we're not here for you know, th it isn't an a an a a life bend lifelong I mean it is a lifelong but it isn't an at but but I believe through my practice that it is eternal, you know, and that that, you know, that that's the thing that I think, you know, is so reassuring as well, you know.

Because if you're constantly avoiding the idea of death or not thinking, but like just because you chant Nam Yoningic, you're sort of aware. Right. I think that's something that I find super encouraging as well. You know, it's like because I'm not going to be suddenly surprised.

I've gotten sick, you know. Oh yeah, well I'm well the right age. I'm gonna get sick around about now. What am I gonna do? I'm gonna chant through that and then I'm gonna overcome that and then maybe I'll probably drop this body but hopefully not before I'm time and you know but it's like I'm chanting for that and I'm protected through my chanting for that. You know what I'm saying? Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. I had just like one more question that I wanted to ask you about like

Of course, we're having this like great dialogue now. Um, but I I in the show I found like you really engaged with like the experts you were so like life to life, you know, like I I felt like the kind of relationships you were building with them was definitely palpable. And um in the first episode, the wing suiting one, you have this like sit down conversation and the reality of death is like very present. You know, you're talking about like I think his

father passed away? Like I'm curious like what made you have that conversation and you know, did your Buddhist practice like inform any part of that? dialogue or those kind of interactions with people? I think that As somebody who is curious about other people and especially somebody who, you know, has been handpicked to teach me something that is

about essentially taking my own life and my own hands in a very physical, meaningful way that, you know, is very real. Um you know, I think, you know, I was I was I was I was fascinated about, you know

He is the same guy, by the way, who jumped from like twenty five thousand feet without a parachute, right? So like which by the way turns out is again something that like with real expertise and methodical practice and his certain ske set of skills is not something that's unattainable, it's just something that's really like

like mind blowing, but actually when he taught me through what was necessary, I was like, Oh I see, it was it's like it is a stunt, but it's also very methodical and accurate. So I just was curious about You know, I just I think it was you know i I'm just interested. And I think that you know, if if we're if we're practicing correctly and sometimes again we're not

Sometimes we're surviving life and sometimes we're thriving in life. But like you know, when we're thriving and and and connected, then yeah, I mean I'm always interested in

in in who, you know, the what, who, where and how of it all. Because I think, you know, seek first to understand then to be understood, right? Like that idea of like who what well what's what's making him tick? How why is it So that's um I think a lot of where, you know, that came from and and I think it was a really important part of the show because yeah in a way it was like also something that like, you know, just showed that

You know, he is he's he's a vulnerable and real you know,'cause he's somebody who's like about as you know gung ho masculine and date daredevil kind of thing is but he's also this teddy Like a real you know, like we all are. Like we can all present how we like, but actually you know, we're all getting up in the morning and figuring out how to get through the day and what we're gonna do to survive this one and

you know, how we're gonna navigate the relationship with the partner or the child or the mother or the whoever, the father or the you know, or the boss or the friend or the you know, and it's just like You know, in a way it's like just by chanting your you know, it's like pouring more love on it.

And it's like having gratitude for it and going, Okay, Nam y'a don't gonna go, nam y'a I'm gonna I'm gonna and have give me the wisdom. to deal with this, give me the courage and the confidence to articulate it and and you know and and I think like we're we're we're supposed to make mistakes, right? Like that's like I think in my youth I was so visible, I was so terrified.

actually like Mm I mean it's we don't really learn if we don't make mistakes. Um and you know you know I mean I'm definitely you know, I've learnt l I I've like from the show and everything else is that, you know, it you know, you're not going You know, so if you if you have a challenge if that's a challenge. And you know you know, you can you with a with with with a philosophy You can have the wisdom to overcome them.

Right? You can have the the wisdom and the courage, but like you can't avoid that. You know what I mean? You can't you sort of can't avoid it, just like you can't avoid death in a sense. Do you know what I mean? It's like it's like if you were trying to avoid if you're trying to be perfect.

Then you're on the wrong path. Yeah. Because like that's not what this is about. You know what I mean? Like it's about making mistakes and then figuring out and getting up, right? Yeah. That's what I'm that's my You know what I mean? You know, my son will tell you. Yeah, I was like, My partner will tell you I make mistakes. My you know, my mum will tell I mean every anyone can tell you, you know, and if I in my head think well I'm not I'm Buddhist, I'm not making mistakes, then I'm wrong.

You know, and that's my ego, because no, I'm fully, you know, I'm definitely evolving on this one. You know. So and that's but I am so grateful to have Nam Yoarding. To take me through that and to give me the wisdom to overcome the obstacles of you know, whatever Or because that's the thing, you know. And you know, as time goes by, you know, you kind of the mistakes of maybe are I don't know actually.

I don't think that's true. I think I think you just get better at dealing with them, right? Yeah. Less hard on yourself perhaps. Yeah, so I'm wondering like in terms of like being a father especially, like how does Buddhism inform being a parent. Like you mentioned being okay with being a bit of a chance to do it. I wish you informed it more sometimes.

It's the process. We're learning. We're learning. I really do. Like I've had some ring uh sorry, some like rip roaring arguments with my son that I'm like wait. Am I thirteen too? No, I'm not thirteen. What's going on? Why am I so triggered? Yeah. Yeah. So but but I think create value. Namiongyo. Create value. Like in sometimes It's gonna be hard to do that. And sometimes they're not gonna see that, but I'm gonna keep chanting.

And if I keep doing that for everyone involved, then hopefully that will be the winning ticket. Um and uh I'll make damn sure that I It not always you know, not you can't influence other people necessarily. I mean you can try but you can't really, you can only show up so that And like I said, sometimes I'm like, wait, what? Yeah. I've been chanting since I'm sixteen and now I'm thirteen? As I stand before my son and Yeah. Yeah. Um but

Yeah, I mean I relationships are like Yeah. They're a reflection of every every part of ourselves. But the truth is y there isn't a truth. It's just just keep doing it. You know? And I think if you just keep showing up um You know, it's it's it's it's it's showing up, right? But in in in terms of like in front of your gehons and you know, studying more and just getting to meetings, you know. Um like we've got the tool

Do we use it? So like honestly, like I was looking for a roadmap. This is the roadmap. Yeah. Now do I want to get in my own way sometimes? Yeah. Do I ever self-sabotage? Like, you know, almost sometimes I'm like, like, you know, if I'm not chanting, I'm like, I know I'm just sabotaging. Or if I'm not studying, I'm like, I know I'm just creating obstacles for myself. Oh. Why are I doing this? Like you're not like there aren't enough. But I don't want to hear this. But I guess you're right.

Like but it's like so we have the tools. Yeah. You know, and you just and we've seen sense. Hmm. Achieve it in our lifetime. That's phenomenal. If you've been a member, you know, if you've been a member since before Sensei passed, then you know, and even if you haven't, to be honest, it doesn't matter because all of the writings in this life We have this remarkable, you know, mentor and we have the teaching, we have the practice, we have the strategy of

You know, you just gotta like get on with it. One foot in front of the other. And sometimes that's what it is. You know, it's like I'm not like at this time in my life, I'm not like It isn't beyond me to realise that it's like just getting one foot in front of the other sometimes, you know? Um but I think When I tap into my Buddha nature, when I sit in front of my Gohans and chant, when I show up to a meeting, when I study.

Yeah. I remember that there's something way more important than the trivia that I might be navigating in my this moment. And that none of these things can come with me. Mm-hmm. And that none of the stuff that I think I'm accumulating, the treasure of the storehouse can go anywhere. But you know, just through chanting you get the wisdom.

You get the you get the in you know, just through chanting when you re when you are, you know, reflecting those things and that's really hard sometimes, right? Depending on the and the individual and for me certainly at times. Oh my god. Oh God, do I really? Do I really have to see the reality? Yeah. Whatever. I mean I mean I'm But in some ways I am but you know, I mean can I not just go back to like ignorance

You know,'cause ignorance is bliss. You know, can I just you know, bury my hand bury my head again? I mean I think sometimes when I chant like I've heard many people say this to me like it feels like you're kind of like returning to yourself, you know, like your most authentic part of you, your true nature, really seeing like life and it's so easy like in my day to day life to really like lose that but yeah but when I chant it's like ah oh there

Um and so yeah, I I I want to kind of conclude maybe just with a piece of advice. Um Well, you've already given me all kinds of advice, but this is for um, you know, folks listening that

are like kind of curious about Buddhism, they're listening and they think like, oh this might be for me, but they're not totally sure if they wanna like really test it out, try chanting. Right. What would you say to them? I would say um There's z there's nothing to lose and everything to gain. You know, like just try it. I mean, you know, like what have you got to lose? Yeah. What have you got to do? And I do think, you know, you test it.

So I do think that if you if there is something that is um a challenge in your life that you seem to be unable to overcome in the way that you're living your life or thinking about the the challenge. I think you can you can create that. You can take as the earthly desire. that you wish to transform and

you've got nothing to lose by trying. You know you know, you chant and if it's not for you, if it doesn't do if it doesn't impact that situation, maybe find another situation. Like some people might have some impossible situation. But maybe if you're capable, if it's not like as I said, you may not get the car if you're chanting for a car, but you may get a ride to work. And that may be something that you hadn't considered. Or

Inconspicuous benefit. Inconspicuous and you know, inconspicuous but so i I think there's no harm in you know, I think there's there's nothing to lose and and everything to gain and as somebody that, you know, has really put this practice through its paces and and and is still doing that. Like if there is an art to living then I think this is it. I think this practice is the art to living and it gives us a tool and uh a philosophy.

and a and a discipline that like I think we need now more than ever, you know? Distractions. Whether it be the internet, social media, the onset of like what is AI gonna do to us, I think the discipline. for mental health and and the benefit of chanting and the discipline of just, you know, the practice, the really basic

you know, faith, chant, study, read a book, learn about it, and and then, you know, share it, being able to share it in meetings and so on. Those those are fundamental things for humanity, for human beings. And as we go through life now with this new age of I mean, my daughter's not gonna know a world without superintelligence. You know?

I had a mobile phone when I was twenty, but I didn't you know, like the internet is super intelligent. The algorithms that so like this as a practice is just very tangible. It's very and that I think, you know, if you If you want the message, if you want something as a bedrock of just you know, that then I think much Orlando. This is like yeah, I honestly I feel like such an honor that I get to have this.

Me too, thank you. Um yeah, I mean just thank you so much for being just like really so sincere and authentic and I felt kind of like nervous going into this. How's it gonna go? But like immediately I felt so at ease and um I just really appreciated. Trust me, thank you for coming all the way from New York. I really appreciate it. It's awesome. Please. This is great for me. This is great. Well I hope I hope um uh look look, I'll look forward to seeing you again. And uh

We'll have to check in another time. Yes, we'll do, you know, down the road outdate. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So how did that go? Oh I wanted to say thank you to everyone who made this incredible interview. And if you'd like to get connected to a local bootability community, you can always reach out to us at connect at bootability.org. Until next time.