Hey, guys, ready or not, twenty twenty four is here and we here at breaking points, are already thinking of ways we can up our game for this critical election.
We rely on our premium subs to expand coverage, upgrade the studio ad staff, give you, guys, the best independent coverage that is possible. If you like what we're all about, it just means the absolute world to have your support. But enough with that, let's get to the show. Good morning, everybody, Happy Thursday. We have an amazing show for everybody today. What do we have, Chris sal did we do?
There is a lot that is unfolding this week. So first of all, very dramatic Hunter Biden plea deal hearing yesterday. The whole thing is on the rocks. We will take you inside all of the chaos. There also quite a dramatic, scary moment with Mitch McConnelly seemed to freeze completely, was unable to continue speaking while answering questions. Came back, was able to speak after that, But we're trying to figure out what the heck is going on there in terms of his health.
Sager was on Capitol Hill.
Yesterday for the big UFO hearing. By the way, thanks to premium subscribers for making things like that happen, and we have additional coverage of those hearings, all the highlights today. We've also got some legal drama involving Rudy Giuliani. He's now admitted in a court of law that he was lying about some election workers down in Georgia. Will show his original comments and what he is saying now. We also have updates for you on situation involving the First
family's dogs. The youngest dog has been involved in a number of biting incidents that were not disclosed, so we'll.
Give you what is going on there.
Happy to have Freddy de Boor joining us this morning to talk about his latest column about how AOC is now just a regular Democrat, and I am taking a look at some comments from Abigail Disney. Disney airis going after their CEO, Bob Iger. So lots to get to this morning. But before we do any of that, as I alluded to you before, we just want to take a minute to thank you to all the Premium subscribers. We've been very busy this week. Yes, it was a
big week for US. Multiple presidential contenders really enjoy getting to do those interviews and press them on policy questions and see how they respond. Being able to send Zager over to Capitol Hill, all that is a really big deal for us.
I mean, look, there's no way any of that happens without any of you guys. I mean, because you guys helped us build the studio, we were able to compel these interviews, and every time we have these interviews, we hear from the candidate afterwards about how much they enjoyed it. Even the staff usually reaches out and they're like, hey, that was one of the best interviews that.
We've done so far.
We'd love to come back, and we've actually gotten commitments, i believe, from every single one of them to come back onto the show, which is amazing. It's really a testament to everything that you guys have helped us build here.
And then to the UFO point, I mean, I was like, hey, I want to go to this hearing, and you know, attending a hearing by itself is already kind of a rigormarole, but then to have a crew to be able to just last minute to spin it up to talk to my friend Jeremy Corbel, some of the other people who are involved in hearing and just be like, hey, we're gonna set up, we're gonna film it, we're gonna have it edited, we're going to have it.
Out on our channel.
That stuff costs actually quite a bit of money. So I just want to say again, like thank you to all of you guys who give us the confidence the
ability to do that. Not only do we provide I think, a good service to everyone there, but it's really helping grow I mean, we've gained crystal thousands of YouTube subscribers just because of these interview I've noticed, you know, on the or the snap coverage or whatever on the UFOs, and it's putting us, you know, not out of our comfort zone per se, but into a different I think
type of realm. And I think that you know, a lot of YouTube shows and all that it can feel stale, it can feel sterile, or it can feel like things aren't the things are exactly the same over the time. And I think one of the commitments we've made to everyone is that we're always going to use your hardened money to grow the show, both for your sake, for our sake, and for everybody else out there who's not the Watcher, and.
Of course if you are not already a premium subscriber, you can sign up at breakingpoints dot com and all of the you know, interviews, these special presidential interviews and things like soccer going to Capitol Hill or maybe I'll find some reason to go over to Capital Hill myself. Yeah, all of that stuff goes to the premium subscribers first as a thank you for being members. So thank you guys so much to all of that, and you know,
the presidential candidate interviews. One thing that I was realizing is in the cable news format, the time is so limited that you just they just even if they wanted to press them on a variety of policies, there's no ability to do it. So the fact that we have the time in the space to ask the questions, ask the follow ups, try to get real answers from them is really a privilegional luxury that we enjoy.
It's very true.
And my only employer, I only implore more comms directors out there stop just giving us thirty minutes. There's no reason that we own to do just thirty minutes. But I've noticed that thirty minutes to them is eternity. That's where they always try and cut it, yes around thirty year seven, because they're used.
To say, we can filib right, so exactly answer this question and get away with it.
And have a little back and forth. So, you know, just so everybody knows, they're always in the you know, the ears, the staff. They're like, hey, we got to cut this off. He's got to go, he's got to go do this. So I, once again, I'm just employing everybody.
Let's do an hour.
An hour is a nice solid period of time, and I think if you're confident enough and what you have to say, those people should speak for an hour. But okay, let's get to the Hunter Biden news.
This was shocking. So while I was.
On Capitol Hill all of this is going down, I'm getting caught up. Afterwards, I said, this is one of the wildest things that has unfolded in terms of like legal wrangling at the high level that we've seen in what years now, I think at the top level of politics. Hunter Biden and his lawyers, it appears, showed up to court with a completely different understanding crystal of a plea deal that they had reached with the Department of Justice.
In the minds of the Hunter Biden legal team, they believed that they were not only going to plead guilty to this sweetheart deal, but that they were going to receive they were going to receive immunity from all future charges and specifically related to foreign corruption. The Department of Justice was like, hold on a second, that's not really necessarily what we agree to, and it led to an extraordinary confrontation actually inside of the court room.
Here was a snap v of.
What that looked like that was actually covered live on television as was going down.
Let's take a listen.
And they said, okay, so you're asking me to accept a plea agreement, but does that cover any potential charges? And she referenced the work that Hunter Biden has done for entities in foreign countries, and she said, does this preclude you from being bringing Pharaoh charges in the future if I accept this plea agreement? And the government said no, we could bring those charges. The defense Chris Clark, acting on behalf of Hunter Biden, disagreed with that and said no,
that's not my understanding of the agreement. And then the federal prosecutor said, then there's no deal. That was at eleven thirty one, and Chris Clark, who represents Hunter Biden says, as far as I'm concerned, the plea agreement is null and void.
Just as I left the.
Court room itself, the judge determined that there should be a ten minute recess to try and figure out whether or not the two parties can quickly come to an agreement.
That was Tom Winters at NBC's an absolute pro in terms of covering these things crystals. So after in that
ten minute interim period, here's the most crazy part. It seems that the DOJ did actually agree to some of what Hunter's demands, because in that ten minute interim, the Department of Justice, of course, led by Merrick Garland, agreed effectively to some immunity at least in the future, to some of these charges to get Hunter to plead guilty on these tax charges, which would effectively absolve him and not having to serve any jail time, regardless of the
fact that he failed to pay lots of fact taxes, that it was all eventually paid back by donors, and there's a lot more that we can discuss and talk about there. But then the most shocking thing is not that the Department of Justice agreed to an even more frankly sweetheart deal.
It's that when they presented this to the judge that.
The judge threw out this hastily agreed to immunignize deal, effectively saying that it was too sweet, that she needs to take a lot more time, that they need to take a lot more time to actually look at it.
Here again is some of the live coverage.
The President of the United States has just pleaded not guilty. Not guilty is what he is pleaded to. The judge here says that she will not accept or reject the plea agreement. She wants more information. Basically, excuse me. What she's asking for is to determine whether or not it's appropriate for her to consider something in the diversion program.
This relates to the gun charge.
So as part of that agreement, effectively, what you have here is a provision which asks the court to weigh whether or not possibly Hunter Biden could be could have violated his pre trial diversion agreement as it relates to the gun charge. What would happen according to that agreement is that the defense and the prosecution, but they have the opportunity to bring the facts to the court and for the court to determine whether or not there was
a breach of that. If there is a breach, then the government could then move forward and prosecute Hunter Biden on the gun charge. What she says is, wait just a minute. I'm not somebody who normally has to consider those provisions. I normally don't see a pre trial diversion agreement. And now you're putting me in the position possibly of being the gatekeeper as to whether or not the Justice Department in the government files charges against Hunter Biden.
There you go, Crystal, I mean, in terms of the breakdown, extraordinary move by the judge, extortainary collapse live I mean, and you couldn't script a more of a drama in terms of corruption the president's son, how would really the tax charges, the money and all of this. So what did you make of everything as it was going down?
Well, again, just to set the context here, everyone was expecting this to be a very perfunctory, predictable hearing with zero drama, and instead from the get go we had chaos and drama unfolding in what was really a wild way. So there are two pieces here that are really bad for Hunter Biden and by extension for his dad, which is number one.
The government did.
Not agree to the idea that all of the potential Farah charges, that's all the foreign lobbying, unregistered lobbying stuff. They did not agree that that was part of this plea deal, and Biden and his team had to accept that. So this deal, the tentative deal that now the judge is considering whether she's even going to accept, includes immunity from a few drug charges, past drug charges, additional gun charges,
and tax. So those are the three areas that they're saying, okay, we'll put those pieces to the side, But that leads a gigantic swath of some of the most concerning legal trouble if you are you know, Hunter Biden, or again if you are his father, Joe Biden, which is all of these foreign entanglements that we've been hearing so much about. So that's one piece that is out now on a
disaster for him and his team. And the second piece is, you know, probably when the judge comes back in thirty days, she's going to figure out how to get to a yes on this plea deal. But it's not certain at all. She very uncomfortable with it, as Tom Witcher's articulated there there are pieces of it that she even went so far as to say, I'm.
Not even sure this is constitutional.
So the very status of the whole plea deal, which is a very good deal, a very sweetheart deal for Hunter Biden, I think you have to say that the whole status of that.
Is in jeopardy at this point.
And on the politics of it, obviously, this just drags out the messiness of all of this and opens it back up into the public eye and also makes it clear. And there were some questions about this going in. There were discrepancies over whether or not the DOJ's investigation into Hunter was continuing or not. One side said it was, the other side said no, no, no, we got assurance says it wasn't. It's very clear now that that investigation
does continue. It's very clear that it's possible that he's going to face additional charges.
So very very bad day if you are Hunter Bikeen.
I also think this absolutely validates the criticism by the career IRS officials who said this is not how a normal tax investigation would go under any other citizen. They said they were prevented from executing search warrants on the Biden residence. They said that this was treated with kid gloves, that this was treated in a political manner, that they never would have brought just misdemeanor, that they had a
full scale criminal investigation that they would have pursued. And clearly the judge here agrees at the very least in principle, they're like, hey, this is not how this normally would have gone. So I think at a very basic level, it validates the irs whistleblowers that spoke before Congress and actually does show that these are not partisan people are actually speaking from a place of conviction. And then again, on a basic level, we just have to return to
the facts of the matter here. Why is to Hunter in trouble at all? He received tens of millions of dollars from foreign governments for lobbying, which, by the way, he's on text proof subpoena saying I don't want to register as a foreign agent because he didn't register as a foreign agent while working with the Chinese government.
Okay, so that's actually illegal. That's number one.
Number two, he got all this money, which I guess is not illegal, belthough in my opinion it should be. Then he didn't pay taxes on that money. I mean, we're not talking about a paltry here. We're talking about one point five million dollars. That means that one point five million is app is like thirty seven percent of whatever the sum is after he included all of his insane ride offs for prostitutes and all this other stuff.
That is a colossal sum of money that we are talking about here for only a one to two year period, and then that money. Part of the reason they were able to justify the misdemeanor charge Crystal is because they said he was current on his tax obligations, when we know it's not because he used his personal money. He used a mega Democratic donor loaned him said money somehow, violating like federal gift tax laws, all kinds of other
stuff to pay his tax obligations. And then, I know it sounds crazy here, but then in just the last couple of days, we learned that a frequent guest of the Biden.
Whitehouse is paying eight hundred thousand dollars for.
This fool's paintings, as if that's somehow market value that's up and up. Exactly, how does he afford to live in this Malibu mansion, and why does any of this matter? Look, Hunter, I genuinely wish him best. He seems like a troubled guy. I actually know some people who know him. They say
he's actually fun, fun at parties. I guess, not shocking, but they were always like, look, you know, he took it really hard the death of his brother, and he actually was an athlete's been through his mom died that.
Yeah, So I have nothing against him on a personal level.
It's only that so much of its Shenanigan's expose the lies from the Biden administration about Biden's involvement here, and especially when he's getting all this backtacks and personal profit to the family, to the brother and somebody either from the actual.
Connections of the president of the United States.
That's when it becomes not only a scandal, but should venture into the territory of illegal, if it not already is.
So.
Some of it may be legal, I'm sure it is because Burnsane lost, But I mean he played so fast and loose. It's very easy to see here how he very likely violated the law in a number of places. And unfortunately, only because I think the Republicans are in charge to the House. They've been able to drag any of this stuff up through an official level.
Otherwise we would never heard about it.
So there's let me, let me give you what if you turn on MSNBC or stand that what their side is going to be.
Right.
Number one, she's a Trump appointed judge. Number two, this has nothing to do with Joe Biden. This is just a personal matter involving Hunter Biden and process should play out,
et cetera, et cetera. On the piece about her being a Trump judge, Listen, it would have been crazy for them to accept a deal where he's not going to face any scrutiny over all of these foreign entangled I mean that would it would be an abdication of any judge's duty to allow that to just go through and for the government to say, oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, that's
part of the deal. That would have been insane. So I think it's based on what I can tell, entirely appropriate that she's taking some time to scrutinize this deal, which, as she put it, rather mildly, has some atypical elements to it. And let's talk about those atypical elements, because that's where it goes from, oh, this is just a personal matter of involving Hunter Biden. He's not President. Joe Biden has nothing to do with this. This is Joe
Biden's Department of Justice we're talking about here. And so if his son is getting a deal that has quote unquote atypical elements, that very much does involve Joe Biden.
Not to mention, you know, all of.
The evidence suggestions that Joe knew a lot more about these business dealings than he has so far said, and we'll get to that in a moment. So, you know, for the White House to just try to say, oh, no, common and this is totally separate, et cetera, et cetera, just no one's going to buy that. I mean, the
public is certainly not going to buy that piece. And I'm certainly glad that the government and the judge were like, no, no, no, this is not take all of your troubles off of the table, because some of the most serious and most consequential in terms of the public trust elements still remain under investigation.
Apparently.
Oh absolutely, and actually let's get to that.
As I reference the House, Republicans have been calling many of these witnesses who, in my opinion, should have been deposed or at least pure before the DOJ and others for years ago.
I don't know why it's taken so long. Let's put this up there on the screen.
They say Hunter Biden put then Vice President Dad Joe Biden on the phone with business associates quote at least two dozen times. That is according to the ex business partner of Hunter Biden named Devin Archer. So Archer, who, by the way, just to be clear, is facing jail time for his role quote in a sixty million dollars bond fraud. So not exactly the most savory character. Although I guess you know this is Hunter we're talking about here, so it's not like he was in business with the best.
The thing is about Archer is that he says is that after dinner with the Barisma board at a very famous hotel in Dubai, he and Hunter then traveled six miles north to the Four Seasons Resort, Dubai to have a drink with one of Hunter's friends.
Quote.
While they were sitting outside at the bar, a senior Barisma executive phone to ask where they were because Bisma's owner needed to speak with Hunter urgently. Soon afterwards, two Ukrainians joined Hunter and Archer at the Four Seasons bar and they asked Hunter, quote, can you ring your dad?
Hunter then called his father, put him on speaker, placed the phone on the table, and introduced the Ukrainians to Joe Biden as the names of the two associates who there were actively with him at the bar at the Four Seasons hotel in Dubai. Also, I mean, just to give a little bit of more credence to this, Archer is actually pictured with Joe Biden and with Hunter Biden playing golf while he was the vice president of the United States, So it's undeniable that they actually had met
in the past. Now, look, of course, people play golf with a lot of people, especial when your vice president. Obviously you take photos probably with tens of thousands of people a year. So it's not like that proves anything. But more so, we know for a verifiable fact that Devin Archer was in a longtime business associate of Hunter Biden involved in many of these sketchy foreign deals. I've known his name for years, having done some reading investigation
and all this into the China business dealings. To the breeze and dealings and how he really was at the center of this. He was also there with John Carey's stepson.
The children of the elite really are amazing. I love they're all in business together. It's incredible.
But these people merit based.
It's very merit based, and their multi milik as if their parents' fortunes weren't enough, That's what always is interested me. So Devin Archer, like I said, is an unsavord character, certainly in his own right, certainly facing jail time and all of that right now that I alluded to. But he does have business, he has had passes, his deals
with Hunter Biden. He's testifying under oath here, and remember he's facing jail time, so it's not like he it's not like he isn't still under scrutiny about some of these past instances. And he's gonna say under oath that Vice President Biden spoke quote two dozen times with business
associates of Hunter. And this also backs up crystal numerous allegations that Hunter not only introduces Ukrainian business partners to his dad, his Chinese business partners, while remember he flew on Air Force too to Beijing and then was conducting business while he was there and according to them, had some sort of drive by meeting while Hunter was raising billions of dollars from the CEFC fund, which I've spoken
about here previously. It is now feeding Crystal into a lot more questions around did Biden lie about not.
Having those dealings with or with his son?
Right?
And are the current White House denials why have they started changing their language, right?
That's the key, That's why I really think he screwed himself on the initial denials, which went so far as to say I never even talked about the business deals with Hunter, which, by the way, if that's true, like you should have been talking to him about them, to be like, stop doing this strop writing number one number two, it's just hard to believe you never had a conversation
with your son about what he was up to. Come on, and so increasingly, you know, I mean, you got this guy out there who listening is not the most trustworthy, savory character. But also he's under oath and he has no apparent reason lie, at least no real motivation or whatever to lie.
Saying very directly that yeah, Joe.
Was on the speakerphone he was read in on some of these deals at the very least, so you do have in recent weeks and months instead of them leaning into the Joe never even talked to Hunter. Now the message hang is well, Joe wasn't involved in the business, which is you know a little bit of a subtle shift there, kaream jump here was asked about exactly this shift in messaging by reporter journalist Philip Wegman.
Let's take a listen to how that went.
The President has previously said that he has never discussed overseas business dealings with the son, but the White House now says that the President has never been in business. So why the updated language? Which statement is true or is the semantics?
And they're both true.
As I stated on Monday, when I was asked this question multiple times, nothing has changed, Nothing has changed on this Nothing has changed on this, and so he asked me a million different ways on this question.
Nothing has changed, nothing has changed, But the language has changed, and there is you know, increasing suggestion that in fact the initial language just a flat out lie.
Oh it is absolutely And we even have the video here. We can show everyone from the campaign trail whenever Peter Doocey.
Fox uses. Peter Doocey was the Biden.
Campaign embed and he repeatedly pressed Biden on many of these issues. This is also a good view into why it's important to get people on the record early when they are running, so years later if it does turn out that they're lying, that you can point to it and show this. So this is from the campaign trail twenty nineteen where Biden has confronted exactly over business dealings with Hunter. All of this was actually known, much of it within the public record.
Here's what Biden had to say.
I've never spoken by some love yet and so here's what I know. I know Trump.
Deserves to be investigated.
He is violating every face the norm of a president.
You should be asking him the question, why is he on the phone with a foreign leader trying to intimidate a foreign leader.
If that's what happened, that's Appure's what happened. You should be looking at Trump. Trump's doing this because he knows I'll beat him like a drum and he's using the abuse of power and every element of the presidency to try to do something to smear me. Everybody looked at this and everybody's looked at it and said, there's nothing there.
Ask the right question, Ask the right question, Grandpa Need. That's not the right question, Chris. The right question is not did you speak with your son business? And the funniest thing too, he's like, you should be asking Trump. Do you know how many times people ask Trump? You think Trump never got to ask that question about the Ukrainian phone call? The perfectly what do you even think
they call it the perfect phone call? Because he's been taught, he talked about it at nauseum all throughout his impeachment.
He just didn't want to be asked. And I always think, you know, it's a tragedy. Do see.
He really was the only one on that campaign trail who would ever ask him a damn thing about this. And it shows you once again why it is so important to press people on these things, even when it's uncomfortable, even when the media doesn't want.
You to do it.
Because he now said I never spoke to him. Now it's always never involved. Neither of both of those are incongruent, and it's very obvious to me that that's a flat
out lie. I also think not enough people pay enough attention to the very first debate when Trump was going after Hunter, Biden and they reference actually the congressional report that came out from Senator Ron Johnson, which lists many of the accusations against Hunter, which I've all been verified now specifically by the IRS, but who he's getting money from. And Biden says again that not a single one thing
in that report is true. I mean, the IRS is suing and prosecuting Hunter the Department of Justice for the exact business transactions that they validate inside of that report. That's another lie, you know, from the campaign trail. It's amazing to me the you know, the CNN, what is the Washington Post lie tracker or whatever? Where are you people now on this? He just disappears into the ether. I checked the CNN guy, the fact check guy. He's
still on Trump for some reason. I mean, sure, you know Trump is running, but dude, you've got to be able to show like some semblance of like actual fairness in terms of the coverage.
So yeah, I just think it's ridiculous.
Yeah, I mean, the one part of Biden's ran there that is fair is of course Box News in particular doesn't go after Trump in that way. But yeah, I find that clip, that whole SoundBite of him. It is like the perfect encapsulation of democratic politics and of like Biden era politics, where it's like, yeah, I'm not great, Yeah there might be problems there, but look at Trump.
Look at Trump, Look at Trump, Look at Trump.
That's the whole strategy. That's the whole thing right there, and that sound by that's the whole bit. So it is kind of amazing to watch it unfold.
But yeah, I mean said it. He used to say it very very clearly.
Never even spoke to Hunter about any of this, And I just, I mean, that was a lie. I just I just cannot believe that that is the case, and now we have increasing evidence that it was not the case.
At the same time, there is.
Some there are some machinations going on over within the House Republican Caucus about whether or not they want to move forward with impeachment against Joe Biden. Of course, you have put this up on the screen from Politico. You've got the more you know, sort of hard right part of the caucus very much in favor of it. You've got a number of moderates who are in Biden districts very uncomfortable with the idea of pushing forward with a
Biden impeachment. McCarthy is trying to sort of walk the line right now of saying basically like, well, we might do an investigation impeachment, investigation that's different than an actual impeachment. So they haven't exactly put together what all this would look like. And you know, I mean on the impeachment piece. It's interesting because the thing that they're contemplating going after
Biden on would be corruption. And there's a reason why Democrats didn't go after Trump on the many manifest incidences of corruption. Said they went did Russia and then you know, appropriately I think January six, but they didn't do corruption because they're all implicated in corruption. And so if the Republicans actually choose to go down this road of trying to impeach a president over actual corrupt dealings, that opens up a whole can of worms that frankly, I would.
Be very happy to see opened up and.
Applied across the board. But I'm not sure if they look at their own lives and their own sibling sons, daughters, cousins, brothers, aunts, whatever, business dealings, they might feel a little bit more uncomfortable with. So that's part of what to me is very intriguing about this prospect of the Biden impeachment.
Let me tell you, Christal, if they cell phone themselves into making corruption an impeachable fence, go for it. And I mean, listen, let's set the historical precedent, let's get the trial, let's get the impeachment thing going.
I'm loving it.
I think a hell of a lot more people should be impeached. So look, they impeached Trump twice. The first one, in my opinion, was the biggest load of bs that we have seen yet in terms of impeachment. And you know, in particular they a lot of us said, I recall, you know, covering it at the time is like, hey, guys, you shouldn't be you know, just ripping the band aid off for something like this because it can really come back.
So bite you.
And so again, if the Republicans, you know, want to continue to erode the norm around impeachment, open the door then, in the eyes of US history, to impeach people for actual corruption and not just let some ford you know, drama play out or you get pardoned after you leave office. Yeah, to resign and live in a multimillion dollar mansion in California.
I'm all for it. I think it's right.
So well, the other thing I will say is, and they even sort of acknowledge this, they don't exactly have the goods yet on Biden in terms of THEIRS suggestions, there's uncooperated evidence, there's this uncorroborated like intelligence report or whatever. They need to have more of a smoking gun direct tie in than what they have right now, I think on Biden in order for this to work out and for the American people to accept that this is a
sort of legitimate direction. And then the other thing, which we've said before is like you know, with the Hunter stuff, and if you're gonna impeach Joe, like leave the dick picks out of it, it's it does not help your costs, right, And this is what you see on both.
Sides of Aisle.
Honestly, they radically overreach, and then the pieces that are actually legitimate seem like such small ball in comparison to the wild overreaching accusations that are made that the public then just looks at it and they're like, oh, this is it, Like I'm this is not a big deal to me. So after the Grand Conspira. I mean, Russia gets a perfect example. Like we were told there were pe tapes and all of this stuff, and that there
was some like low level sketchiness. Is all that it amounts to, Like this is ultimately nothing based on what we were originally sold.
Yeah, I mean people may interpret what I said as saying that the first impeachment about the Zelenski phone call with Trump, you know, I said it was bs Yeah, as a matter of impeachment.
I didn't say it was a good phone call.
But like, you know, it's like you can judge things on their marriage, and we're like, yeah, you know, I don't think SIN should probably talk that way.
Do I think you should be in peace over it? Hell?
No, you know, And that's where you know, you it's just so good that they trying to sign historical gravity to things, and then they end up messing it up by really focusing on the most salacious for the worst parts of it.
And then when those end up don't becoming.
Sing outright making stuff up, rat.
Stuff making things up, and then when those don't end up be true, and then the underlying acausey which can be bad, you know, but there are gradations of bad. And that's one of the actually things that we've lost not only in media, but in political discourse as well around how all this stuff goes down. So anyway, I think it's interesting important. It was a crazy day absolutely
yesterday to watch all this full. I also got to say with the media too, they had no idea how to handle this, Like they would be like, you know, a slight hiccup or whatever it Hunter's legal proceed I'm like, it's not.
A slight hiccup. I'm like, this is crazy to see.
It's a disastrous day for him.
I mean, he thought this, this was going to be it for him, like this was a done and and even if the you know, the judge does decide ultimately to accept this plea deal, even with this atypical portions, the fact that Farah is still hanging out there, that's the foreign you know, unregistered agent, lobbyist, whatever of that stuff that that's still hanging out there, that's a disaster.
Is guilty as a sin on the Farah thing.
There is no and if you are going to prosecute man Afford and I don't even remember what the other guy's name is. And I mean it's kind of like the document's case. How can you look at that set of facts and not prosecute the person under You have to, no matter what the last name is. So if they don't, it's going to be absolutely outraged.
Yeah.
True.
There was another really I mean dramatic, wild, scary, frankly disturbing moment that was unfolding on Capitol Hill, which is Sara Mitch McConnell came out to give a statement to the press. It was all going sort of according to plan, and then he just freezes mid sentence, stops talking for a full fifteen seconds, just total blank look on his face.
Let's take a look at what that looked.
Like a garden cooperation and a string of uh, okay.
Anything else you want to say? I'm sure, let's go back to you. Do you want to say anything else.
To the press?
Come back, we'll take let's go back to so very difficult to watch, you know, he seems to be starting to slow down, He slurts his words, and then he just stops and just stares at the camera, and then Senator Barasso comes over. I don't know if you could hear what he said. He said basically like Mitch, do you have anything else you want to say to the press or do you want to go back to your office? And then after a pause, they sort of escort him out.
Now he was able to come back after that a few minutes later, and understandably the press was I think was CNN's Manu Rajia like, what has happened?
Are you okay? Let's take a listen to what he had to say.
We've got Could you address what happened here at the start the press conference and.
Was related to your injury from earlier this year when you suffered a concussion?
Is that No, I'm fine.
I'm fine.
You're fully able to do your job.
So he says, no, I'm fine, and me Mana Raja says, are you able to do your job?
He's like, yep.
So some of the context here, obviously, Mitch McConnell is eighty one years old.
That's number one.
Number two, there's reporting now that he's apparently been using a wheelchair quite a bit. Puts you around a wheelchair quite a bit to get around the Capitol, especially in crowded spaces.
Number three, he.
Suffered a concussion a while back that caused him to you know, be out of the Senate for a while. Number four, we're just learning this morning that apparently he suffered another fall just recently on July fourteenth, so you know, very in the past couple of weeks. He suffered a fall at Reagan National Airport. So I don't know what was going on with him health wise, And he's clearly not saying. He made some joke about it later that he got sandbagged in the same way that the President
of the United States did. He referring to when the President fell on stage. But you know, falling on stage, like we understood the cause and effect of what there was a sandbag, you tripped over it. We have no idea what's going on here. And this is an incredibly powerful individual.
Well, don't forget Cristel. He was also hospitalized not that long ago. It was actually in yeah, March ninth, twenty twenty three, he was hospitalized for a few days after a fall at Washington Hotel during a private dinner and was treated for a concussion.
And you know, you and I were talking about this this morning.
It's difficult to be able to cover these things and not appear as if you're trying.
To be mean. I am not trying to be mean in any of this.
I actually feel a tremendous amount of pain to watch a person who is elderly, you know, on the cameras in a job like this, freeze up like that. That sounds not only humiliating, But if I was a relative of his, or if this I almost look at it like a grandfather, I'd be like, I'd be like, please stop doing this.
Please.
I am begging you. I am absolutely begging you to step down, to not put yourself through this. But and then we have to reconcile that that's when you're a private citizen. You're the most important Republican in the entire chamber. And he pointedly ignored two major questions yesterday which reporters asked him. They said, what happened right, and all he says is, quote, I'm fine. Then they go did you see a doctor? And he ignores the question and walks off.
I'm sorry, but that's actually completely unacceptable. We cannot be having sceptaginearians like this be the leaders of the Republican Party in the Senate Chamber. It's really not fair to many of the people behind him, people like John Thune, who are number two in the Republican Party.
Corny.
I mean, these guys aren't spring chickens. They're like sixty, but they look like it compared to him. If you need to be, you know, rolled around in a wheelchair in private spaces, like should you really be in a vigorous job where you're flying back and forth between your home state and all this?
And I think a lot of it is ego.
They just cannot handle the idea that some people do need to step down, some people need to retire. Last time I checked, his wife is like a billionaire.
Go relax, man. I mean you've been to Kentucky.
I hear there's some nice places out there by one of those crazy estates on some hill somewhere, drink bourbon and sail off into the sun. It sounds like a great you know, last couple of years of your life. Why do you want to be doing this? And the answer is ego and power. And that's where we as a public have to demand that this does not become normalized for people who are in power.
It has never been more starked.
I have an eighty one year old president who regularly is tripping and can't find his word, this guy is having a full blown medical event. And then the crazy thing too, is, you know, do these people not care about his well being? Get his ass to a doc? Yeah, immediately, like why is he even coming? He doesn't get a say in those type things. We're like, no, the doc needs to come here right now because what's going on in his mind. He's like, oh my god, I gotta
shore things up with the press. That's the least your problems.
Man.
You could die, right Yeah, yeah, I mean that was the very first thing he said, is that it's basically criminal.
They didn't immediately take him to the hospital. I mean, imagine this.
Was your mother, father, grandfather, grandmother, beloved elderly person, whoever they are, and they just complete freeze for that long. And the slurring of the words, it's very it's very disturbing. And then the broader piece here is so many of these frickin' people are so old, and you know what, if you're able to do the job, fine, God bless you, no problem. But the complete lack of transparency and all the efforts to keep the public in the dark about
your actual capability of fulfilling the job. You know what if the public has total information and they're still like, all right, I still want this dude, you know, still would vote for this person. Then that's one thing, But we know the great lengths that they go to to hide any sign of aging and decline. We just covered yesterday Biden's aids having you know, he's having.
To take the shorter stairs on Air Force One. They're trying to figure out all.
Kinds of ways to shield from the public the realities of his age. And I think that that is incredibly wrong. Dianne Feinstein obviously, you know for years she has been declining mentally, and people have known it, and they have hidden it from the public, and she refused to debate, and you know, she's always being shepherded around and has someone right on her elbow to be able to tell her what she needs to say and even tell her you're.
Voting this way on this bill.
And still now it's gotten so bad that they can't possibly cover it up. I mean another thing that we actually paid attention to at the time, which I think is worth noting once again in terms of since we're having to read the tea leaves here and not get any actual information about Mitch McConnell's health. They passed in the Kentucky legislature back in twenty one. This is I think around the time when you know, Mitch McConnell was looking unwell and then he ultimately ends up being hospitalized.
That would change the plan.
The replacement plan if a United States Senator was to be was to pass away an office and have to have a replacement filled in. As it was previously, the governor would make that replacement with the governor of Kentucky is a Democrat, and so you know, Andy Basheer would very likely put a Democrat in that slot if that
was to happen. So they changed the law so that it would go to the Kentucky Legislature, which is Republican run and domestically you know in the state at the state level, and people who are in the know there really thought that that was Mitch McConnell pushed this legislation through and they really thought this was about Mitch McConnell's
declining health. So note worthy to put that out there now that we have this latest health incident, and you know the fact that they just stonewall, don't answer any questions, don't provide any transparency. It's really an affronted democracy. I mean, at bottom, that's what it is.
No, it's and that's what I mean. It's it's it's so hard because my anger. You know, I'll get these very snarky messages from people who work let's just say, in and around McConnell, we're like, oh, this is not fair, it's not nice. I mean, they have the gall to tell the press immediately after he he you know, had a moment, he was sharp afterwards.
Let me just say, that's not sharp.
Don't bullshit me like that is where I just I'm just like, just level with me, man, right.
Just let's just be real. Well, what's acknowledge reality?
They said he was lightheaded.
I've been light headed before, you know, get like low iron a little light headed. It doesn't look like that. Okay, it does not look like that. So stop bullshitting us, please.
It drives me nuts.
And the thing is is that they expect the public to just sit there and absorb it. And I will also say this, I was on Capitol Hill yesterday. There is far too chumming a relationship between the press and many of these these representatives. You can actually see we don't have the clip. There was a second clip that happened late last night whenever he went to them that he got sandbagged, How are you sir?
And all that.
Even typically you can tell that the guy feels bad. He's like, hey, did you see a doctor or anything? You should I mean, listen, I know this is uncomfortable. You need to be screaming in the man's face. You'd be like, listen, did you see a doctor or not? Are you gonna answer the question or he's gonna keep saying you're fine and get I understand it's a geriatric man. He just suffered a help event. It's super uncomfortable, but you have to put yourself out of that. You're the
only people in that position, you know. Press access to where he was the gallery or whatever is very very tightly controlled, and so you're the only opportunity the American people have to actually get an answer here. Otherwise we're relying on his aids on background saying he was super sharp as you can see whenever he I mean, it's just just insanity that they want you to imbibe and to believe this stuff. But that's that's what living in Washington is like, is that they literally your.
Face haunted gas lighting.
This party's well into the next piece we wanted to show you, which is Fox News Digital went out and asked a bunch of voters, Hey, do you think that maybe if you're running for president you should have to debate? And voters felt very strongly in the affirmative that that should be a requirement.
Take a listener a little bit of that. I think one hundred percent.
If you don't know how someone's going to speak in a public setting in front of millions of people on TV and with other people asking them questions, and how do you know how they're going to react to when they're answered questions for millions of people and they're trying to talk to you know, the whole United States of America. Of course, I always think so, I think you get more of their point of views on things.
Have you got?
If you can't stand up for what you believe in and have a debate with somebody, you're out. We need to be able to hear why people have to say it before they can just run to be in charge of the most powerful country in the world, you know.
So we have a lot of influence and we need someone who people can hear and be.
Confident of one hundred percent. You should be able to defend any and every policy that you have or any question about of an existing policy, in any kind of a public debate where you can be asked questions that are not you're not getting softball pitches. There are questions that you've been told ahead of time. You need to be able to clearly and accurately have the discussion about policies that are affecting the entire country that you are going to be the lead or rather, if you're elected.
Obviously voters are like, of course you should debate. And I have to say, Sager, if you call yourself a journalist and you aren't enraged and demanding out there just on the agenda of the people demanding that Trump and Biden subject themselves to public debates, neither.
One of whom is the spring chicken.
By the way, So it ties in very closely with the Mitch McConnell discussion that we just had.
I don't know how you call yourself.
A journalist if you just accept as like appropriate political strategy that of course they wouldn't debate.
Yeah, I obviously.
I mean it's actually probably the biggest disconnect between just being a normal person or people who interact with normal people, and then the actual political class where like, of course not we're not going to debate. Everyone knows and wants and needs that moment that for politicians. I mean, I think it's actually ingrained luckily in our historical lore. I mean, one of the most important things that ever happened in
modern American history were the Lincoln Douglas debates. Like when we think about these long drawn out questions that thousands of people would come to, such that the idea Lincoln Dougas even became its own event. I know some high schoolers who were watching this probably part I participated in. And it's a great format. And when you think back to how important those debates were. They were actually printed in pamphlets and they were distributed across the country and
millions of people at that time. Imagine you're a farmer, you know, have a lot of access technology, entertainment, TikTok, and all of this sudden stuff, and this comes in the mail. You know, it's several months later and you're reading this like, hey, this is some great arguments around slavery and about the most important debates that are within
the country. Luckily, that's kind of carried over. I think even to the most basic level if you go through somewhat of a Civics education and then you look at the current state and you're like, wait, this is this is all I got. I mean, you know, we had the first of all, we missed out on a debate last time because Trump got COVID, and then even on this one. You know, I've always loved the primary debates. I believe that Obama debated some night teen times before he.
Got the demo. Wow, which is incredible.
Actually, I mean, hey, it put him in fighting He's even said this, but I mean fighting shape for when I had to go up against McCain. Everyone remembers his disastrous first debate against Mitt Romney. And the reason why is because he's an arrogant prec who've been president four years, and it's like, turns out when you're in the bubble, it's like, when you're in the bubble, you have no idea what you're you know, how you really come off.
And then in the second debate, you could see he was much more approachable.
He took the time to like sit there and engage with you know, in terms of the audience member. Even though Candy Crowley put the what does it put the her finger on the scale for him, still have thought about that one I see I save governor crazy crazy crazy moment there still have I can't believe it's been more than decade.
I know it is wold. You know I was. I was singing on too.
It can seem like, oh, it's just sort of like entertainment these debates, you know, And I mean we do enjoy them in a sense like entertainment because we're weirdos and dorks. But it also does actually matter to get these people on the record. I mean, what do we show you earlier? Biden when he was on the campaign trip, getting pressed having to be put on the record specifically about Hunter Biden law and behold, that turns out to
matter now. Biden also, I mean, the whole reason that he was pushed into having to say anything about student debt cancelation was because he was on a primary stage versus other opponents. It matters to get people on the record. Nancy Pelosi getting that question about the stock trading ban and being really revealing how she actually thinks about things, which is like, oh, it's just free market people should
be able to participate. It matters getting people on the record, and as we have these super old men who are running for president and probably going to be the Republican and Democratic nominee, it also really matters to be able to see in some sort of a test of whether they're up to the rigors of the office as a piece of information to evaluate with all of the other pieces of information that exists. These things really do matter. So it is it is absolutely atrocious and such a
sign of just utter decline in the country. That is very likely the two top contenders do not debate in their primaries, don't feel that they have to go out there and actually prove themselves to the American people. It is such an incredibly sad.
State of effects.
I would also disagree with the idea that debates are just for nerds. I mean some of the you know, the seventeenth primary debate. Yeah, but you know, I just looked at this up. Eighty four million people watched Trump and Hillary debate, Yeah, the first of it.
And that's a major cultural event. People like Barbie right there.
Yeah, I mean that's wild.
That is half the US adult population, you know, and you think also about the first twenty sixteen campaign debate that Trump participated in it. I mean, I'll never forget only Rosio.
I literally will.
Never forget that moment. I think politics changed a why day that he took that stage. I am thinking also there are a lot of debate moments, you know that still resonate rate And after the Prey said that, you know, actually that presses Trump in a lot of ways when we attack John King.
And the media, I remember that one as well.
The moments we just talked about Candy Crowley, you know, the all of these different things that we can think about Americans.
Regular Americans do pay attention. You know, of the.
Top twenty most viewed live events in twenty twenty two, only one of them was political. Nineteen others were sports. But it was the State of the Union. And by the way, that Say of the Union was boring as hell, but forty.
Two million people watched it.
So I think we should put more faith in people that if you do give them a reason, they will show up.
You know, Americans are interested.
They're not all like you know, we have this thing about how like, oh, everyone's checked out, and some of that is true.
To a certain extent.
But when you give people the opportunity, they do show up to watch, they at least tune in for a little bit to try and figure out what's going on. So anyway, I think people should get that opportunity. I think it's important for the for the republic. As people often say, all right, let's go to the next part here. Wow, big day yesterday had to hold it all in. This was the super Bowl. We had the UFO hearings that happened on Congress. I was there live in person on
Capitol Hill. It was absolutely electric energy. I talked to some of the press people who were involved. They said they had rarely seen so many people who were interested. There were hundreds of people lined up outside, many of them breaking points fans. Shout out to all of you who I got to talk to a little bit yesterday. I think we should take this opportunity to just go through some of the most important events that happened during
the hearing, if you're interested. Jeremy Corbell and I did a live reaction right outside of the Capitol that I referenced earlier in our show that's available currently on our YouTube channel. But to me, this moment's going to stick out above everything. It's what all the news outlets picked up.
Backstory.
I was sitting at the press table with all the other reporters, and when Dave Grush said the words nonhuman biologics, there was an audible gasp, not only at the press table but throughout the entire room. The energy was just absolutely insane. Here's the moment that I'm talking about. Let's take a listen.
If you believe we have crashed craft stated earlier, do we have the bodies of the pilots who piloted this craft? As I've stated publicly already in my News Nation interview, biologics came with some of these recoveries.
Yeah, were they I guess human or non human?
Biologics?
Non human? And that was the assessment of people which recknowledge on the program I talk to that are currently still on the program.
So that's probably the biggest thing that came out of that crystal non human biologics. Now, okay, let's try and steal man the case, because I think that's always fun. That could mean anything, right, That could mean a rat,
that could mean a dog. But it was clearly implied in the way that Dave Grush stated that that as the UFO whistleblower, testifying under oath under penalty of perjury, having represented all of this not only to news nation, but also entering it into the congressional record and also going through the whistleblower process, to say that we have recovered alien craft here used to say the word alien, but or extraterrestrial.
He just says a non human origin.
That these not only crash there, not only was a crash retrievement program, but that quote biologics were recovered then at the time. I mean, that's just one of the most stunning things that you really could say under oath before Congress in the UFO context. Obviously salacious, it has a little bit of the gegal factor, it has a little bit of the movie factor, and seems so unbelievable, And of course, you know, extraordinary claims do also require
extraordinary evidence. But I'm curious what you made of that, or if any questions or anything.
I mean, it was just wild to watch members of Congress seriously asking these questions.
I mean, that was wild to see.
It is a remarkable development that this is being treated with the gravity that it is at this point, and I think obviously the turning point was when some of these videos were released. It just became undeniable, and Congress has clearly become increasingly frustrated at the stone walling that they feel like they are getting.
I mean, one.
Question I have for you, Sagre, maybe you can just set the context for people, is you know, he's making lots of allegations he wasn't directly involved in the program. This is based on what he's been told from people that are involved in the program.
Well, why won't any.
Of those people required to testify to be there so that we could have something more direct than secondhand testimony?
Excellent question.
Unfortunately, is a full blown cover up going on so effectively Dave Grush, as I said, is he will go to jail if he violates the terms of his disclosure agreements with the Department of Defense where he is going through the formal whistleblower process. So he will be prosecuted if he reveals any classified information. So they repeatedly were asking him exactly before you said, They're like, look are
who are these people? He said, I cannot give you those names in an unclassified setting, and so they said, oh, so you could give this to a c classified setting.
He said, I would be happy.
To give you the names, the specific names of both hostile and non hostile direct reports. I can give you the exact locations of crash UFOs where these programs are happening, the people involved, the dates when things are removed, et cetera. But I can only do that inside of a secure,
compartmentalized facility called a skiff. There are several skiffs inside of Congress, Congressman Tim Burchett, who I actually personally spoke to before the hearing, as well as other members Matt Gates, Anna Paulina Luna, and Jared Mosquitz, who is a Democrat. Let's be clear here, so this is a bipartisan thing. That were denied access to the skiffs inside of Congress to be able to debrief Dave Grush and to be provided these unclassified names. Grush repeatedly said under oath, I
am he's like I am dying. I would love to give you all this information, the names of the people to be called.
He is literally.
Unable to give them those names outside of an actual interview inside of a skiff. And those members of Congress who are actually pushing on this issue have been denied skiff access. So I think it's very important for me to explain that that there is a lot more. You know, Everyone's like, okay, well where is it. I'm like, well, he will literally break the law, and as we all know, like they are dying to throw him in jail. They want to shut this man up. They keep calling him
a liar. And I will get to that in terms of this statement that was released here, another of the absolutely extraordinary allegations that was made was under questioning from the congressman from Missouri about whether any US personnel had been physically injured while handling a crash UFO.
Here's what Dave Grush had to say.
At one point, you had said that there there has been harmful activity or aggressive activity. Has any of the activity been aggressive and hostile in your reports?
I know of multiple colleagues of mine that got physically injured, and uh the activity.
By by UAPs or by by people within the federal government. Okay, so there has been activity by by alien or non human technology and or beings that has caused harm to humans.
I can't get into the specifics in an open environment, but at least the activity that I personally witnessed, and not to be very careful here because you don't, you know, they tell you never to acknowledge trade craft, right, So what I personally witnessed myself and my wife was very disturbing.
Very disturbing. I mean, I understand why people are skeptical. I get it.
They're like, everyone talks about game. Where's the evidence here? He's made clear he can't actually talk about this in unclassified setting. I thought it was still extraordinary to get him on the record under oath, you know, and listen. I mean, I think it's also important for me to say, if this man is lying, no one is going to be more upset than me because he wasted a lot of my time.
He wasted your guys's money.
People will pay our bills from me going down there and for getting a camera crew from investing so much airtime and discussion to all of this. But he ticks enough box is for us to consider, at least me to be considered this credible enough, and not just me. I mean, this is the freaking House Oversight Committee here right, testifying under oath, bringing these guys in a setting where he could be able to actually face question. I mean face some hostile questions actually from a few people. And
he also revealed something pretty interesting about the actual timeline. Now, remember UFO lore really begins, at least in the American context, Roswell, New Mexico in nineteen forty seven. But Grush actually told us that things pre date Roswell by a pretty significant portion, all the way to the nineteen thirties.
Let's take a listen to what he said.
There as a US government become aware of actual evidence of extra terrestro otherwise unexplained forms of intelligence, and if so, when do you think this first occurred.
I like to use the term non human. I don't like to denote origin. Keeps the aperture open, both scientifically certainly, like I've discussed publicly previous nineteen.
Thirties, previously nineteen thirties. So there you go. That is there's actually some extraordinary backstory.
You and I were talking, Yeah, I mean, this is where I started to start to go, like, I'm definitely going to need some evidence because we're talking about cover up with the Vatican and Mussolini going back to the nineteen thirty I mean, there's just listen, it's a lot to swallow that's the bottom line.
It's a lot to swallow. You're talking about.
US personnel who are being injured by aliens and non human biologics and cover ups going back to the nineteen thirties, and we don't have more than like a few grainy images. We don't have more than someone who you know secondhand might have heard something but can't say exactly what it is in a public setting, which on the one hand you're like, cover up. On the other hand you're like, that's also very convenient. So I'm just going to need more soccer. Hopefully this is step one.
We'll just say that. I think it's the beginning of something.
And I again want to say, I want these people, if it's if they're lying, I want it to be speedily proved, to come out and just be like, this is bs. Everything that this man is saying is a lie. If he did lie, I want him to be prosecuted again for wasting my time, for wasting the entire community's time, for misleading people down this wild goose chase. I mean,
that's not only a moral but illegal. Now that he's actually testified under oath and gone through the DoD process, so listen, I mean, we don't know fully yet whether everything he said or not. We know that there's some breadcrumbs that have been scattered in terms of where if they're eventually given skiff access by these members of Congress, and I will I got to give these people a lot of credit. You can say a lot about Matt Gates, but he does seem genuinely very interested in this topic.
And part of the reason why Crystal is he shared a personal anecdote about how there was a UFO encounter at Elgin Air Force Base, of which one of his constituents contacted him and he was like, man, this is one of the craziest things that has ever happened to me. My radar went down, my fleer systems went down. I
was able to snap a manual photo. He showed Gates the photo in this classified setting, the dood won't allow him to release the photo, and He's like, I'm sitting there trying to get access to a military base as
a member of Congress with top secret clearance. He even served on the House Intelligence Committee, and the freaking United States military is telling me a congressman basically, screw off, We're not giving you any access He's like, that's an extraordinary, extraordinary situation for me to be in, you know, and these are one of my These constituents come to me in good faith because the pilot, this was a test pilot actually who encountered this told Gates the best thing
you can do for your career is shut up and forget that this ever happened, because when you start reporting this stuff up the chain, they're like, hey, this is We're not dealing with this because they don't want to, you know, they don't want records.
Yeah, but no records, You've got nothing to turn over to Congress.
Yeah. I mean, I look at it.
On the one hand, I'm like, this is a lot for me to swallow, as I just said. On the other hand, I'm like, but then I see the photos and the videos, and I'm like, they don't have.
Another explanation for it.
So give us some kind of explanation for what's going on that passes the sniff test, and.
You know, perhaps we can move.
This comes through also a Commander David Fraver's testimony. I thought it was so important, David Fravor is the only reason that I'm interested in UFOs. I thought it was bs frankly, and I read twenty seventeen article and I was like, yeah, maybe. Then I heard FRAVERR and I was like, man, this guy is unimpeachable. I mean, this is the like I've said this before, he was a commanding officer, led people into battle on an aircraft carrier, has a verified UFO incident. I mean, he himself called
it the most credible UFO siding in history. He said multiple times at the hearing, he said, I'm not a UFO guy. This, by the way, is not even you know, the craziest thing's ever happened in my life. I never wanted to be involved in this. I never wanted to come forward. I'm only doing so because I believe that what I saw that day did not come from human technology. I mean, he repeatedly referenced that a human being who was inside the craft that he saw with his own eyes would have died from.
The g forces that were inflicted and upon the way that it moved.
And David Fraber, again a multi year you know, pilot in charge of one hundreds of millions of dollars of aircraft, said, on a number of basis, who's also involved, I believe in the field, you know at this moment is like, look from a material science perspective, this does not exist, and not only now, it doesn't exist hundred years from now, it doesn't exist two hundred years from now in terms
of human capabilities. And then when you combine that with what Dave Grush said in many cases that many of these UFO crashtriable programs pre date you know, our own ability to fly at supersonic speed. I mean, we didn't even break the sound bearer. I believe Chucky Aeger did in like nineteen fifty something like that. So you know, farn post Roswell at the very list. Some people say
that's connected anyway. I think it's important, and I just want to end actually with the statement though that the Pentagon, to be clear, is still saying that he's lying. So guys see five, please let's put this up there on the screen. This was the full readout from Susan Gough, who works at the Pentagon, who gave this statement on
the who gave this statement on the testimony. She says, to date, the All Domain Anomaly Resolution Office has not discovered any verifiable information to substantiate claims any programs regarding the possession of reverse engineering of extraterrestrials may have existed in the past or exist currently. So again, this is actually very clear. The Pentagon says he's lying. Dave Grush says, the Pentagon is line, let's see if you can prove vice versa. One of those people lied with Congress. They
need to go to jail for what they did. And I actually love that it's so binary here because eventually act you can prove whether one or two of those people, or whether one of these individuals is telling the truth or not. They've both done now so in an open setting, and yeah, we'll see. I mean, either this is a colossal I mean a colossal not only just like Psio, but like you know, stage and all this. I mean to have this man who literally worked in the intelligence
community come forward. It's a decorated combat veteran served in Afghanistan Air Force cadet. So much of his military service. He referenced in his testimony. They're like, why are you doing this and he said he said, it's because he's like I took an oath, you know, eighteen years ago when I became an Air Force cadet. I followed that oath. I believe that there was a cover up going on.
I'll just end on this note. You know, he says that he's been doing this at tremendous risk to his own life fear of reprie.
Here's what you had to say.
It was very brutal and very unfortunate some of the tactics they use to hurt me, both professionally and personally. To be quite frank, yeah.
It's very unfortunate.
As they say, when you're ope the target, that's when they do the most fire and attion. Do you have any personal knowledge of people have been harmed or injured in efforts to cover up or conceal these extraterrestrial technology.
Yes, personally.
Have you have anyone been murdered that you would think that you know of or have heard of.
I guess I have to.
Be careful asking that question. I directed people with that knowledge to the appropriate authorities.
In the last couple of years.
Have you had incidences that have caused you to be in fear for your life for addressing these issues?
Yes, personally, So.
You could take that or any way that you want. I choose to take it actually pretty seriously.
If it's real it's the biggest story in the world, So keep pushing, guys, can't stop. Alright, let's turn to some more terrestrial affairs here. Rudy Giuliani facing charges over defamation. He's in broiled in a lawsuit. There overcomes that he made about two Georgia election workers. Let's put this up on the screen. So it's kind of an extraordinary admission that he just made in a court filing. This is
a Forbes tweet. They say, after about a year and a half of battling in the court room, Rudy Juliani stated Tuesday night that he lied about two Georgia election workers stuffing ballots committing election fraud, but did not say that he had caused any damages to them, despite harassment that the two had faced.
This from the New York Times report. They say that.
This concession by mister Giuliani came in court papers, and the basically he's admitting.
That what he said about these people was.
Completely wrong, but it was a complete lie that I mean, he smeared them and it happened multiple times, et cetera. But he's saying that he still has legal defenses because he doesn't believe that they suffered any damages, So that will be the major piece that they will be deciding in this lawsuit. So just so you get a sense of what allegations he was making about these two election
workers that led to this defamation suit. Here he is on basically a zoom call talking about what he thinks was going.
On in Georgia with these two election workers with stgalism.
Quite obviously surreptitiously passing around USB ports as if their vials of heroin or cocaine. I mean, it's obvious to anyone who's a criminal investigator or prosecutor they are engaged in surreptitious illegal activity again that day, and that's a week ago, they're still walking around Georgia.
Why so it's a bold accusation, basically comparing them to drug dealers. It was immediately debunked. They were passing mints back and forth to one another, nothing more nefarious than this. But nevertheless, he repeated it multiple times and it became a part of the whole litany of the case that
the election was stolen. And it was also repeated and really taken in by the President who apparently invoked one of these women's name eighteen times during that infamous phone call with Brad Rathensberger, Georgia Secretary of State on jeduy second.
Twenty twenty one.
That's the one where he asked for him to find the requisite number of votes for the former president to be able to win the state, which you know is leading to quite a bit of legal scrutiny for.
Him as well. So, you know, I think it's important because it just shows you what a little croc this was.
And it also shows you that many of the people involved Soccer knew it was a croc. Yes, and we're happy to ruin the lives of these women in pursuit of foisting a lie on the American people.
I think it's actually not only criminal, I think it's disgusting because how many you know, well meaning Republicans out there, average goes. They hear Trump be like, wow, that's horrible. They hear the freaking former mayor of New York, one of them at the time, was one of the most respected politicians in the entire country talking about people passing USB's back and forth. You know, if you're one of those people, you had no reason not to believe or
at least think, wow, that's a little bit crazy. How do you know whenever he's lying, or how many peoplere gonna watch this segment seeing that he admitted that he's a liar.
That's why I think it's so gross.
I mean, I know personally a lot of people, and I've had some crazy interactions. I remember a guy uber driver once he's like, do you really believe the election wasn't stolen? He's like, you just seem like a guy who would believe it. And I was like, well, I guess I could understand why you would think that, but I had laid out, you know, the cases they lost, every single one. He's like, yeah, but these judges, you know,
that's rigged. I'm like, really, it's rigged, and like across like all these Red states actually.
With all this.
Judges and whatever people have thrown it out.
It's like, well, that's kind of interesting, and then all of them, inevitably it comes back to Giuliani and it's like, no, but Rudy Giuliani said this stuff, So I don't think he could really, you know, underestimate how important Juliani was to the lore of stop the Steal in a lot of these people's minds. And that's why I think it's it's particularly discussing what he did.
Yeah, that's absolutely right.
He used the credibility that he built up as America's mayor not only to try to mislead the entire country. And let's be clear, some sixty to seventy percent of the Republican base still believes that the election was stolen based on things like this, him alleging that these two women, mother and daughter, were passing usb ports back and forth, when really they were passing mints back and forth. And again he knew that, he knew it, and he lied to you about it because it served his purposes at
the time. It is utterly and completely disgraceful, and it also enrages me. I mean, these are just two regular women who it is a genuine civic duty to show up and work the polls. You don't get paid for it. It's a pain in the ass. You got to deal with all kinds of you know, people who have whatever going on. It's a whole thing. And they were willing
to do it. They were there State Farm Arena, Fulton County, doing the thing late at night, et cetera, et cetera, and they were, you know, subjected according to what they have to say, and I completely believe it because I remember hearing this claim at the time. I mean, this was like one of the core things that was being circulated within the circles that were believing this stuff.
They say their.
Lives have been completely upended, you know, private citizens who now are being accused of this incredible, nefarious crime just casually by a very powerful individual. So it really is discussing that. The other piece of this is there's been a lot of conjecture about what exactly is going on with Giuliani right now, we of course are back on Trump indictment watch. Looks like the Jack Smith investigation into what happened on January sixth and fake elector scheme that
may be drawing to a close. We may get charges in that relatively soon. And Giuliani has been talking to the government about whatever he knows with regard to that, and there was some question over whether Giuliani may have flipped and maybe providing information the government may be working out his own deal. He denies it, to be clear, but I think there's still a bit of a question mark there.
And the other question mark on that front, as Mark meadows.
Oh yeah, well, Meadows in particular.
Actually, there was a video circulating yesterday where he was walking into his office and he was repeatedly asked, you know, whether he had like whether he had any comment about the case and the grand jury and all that. And you know, there were some federal prosecutors who said that given his level of non response, and he'd certainly seemed like somebody who could be cooperating with the government. Apparently Trump's own people think he's cooperated with the government.
So who the hell knows what's going on there?
And you know, as a reminder, as the former White House sheep of staff that we're talking about here, or it would have been extraord I mean, he was in the room like when a lot of that stuff was going on.
He was inte corol. I mean, he really was at the center of it. So we'll keep our eye on that one. We also have an extraordinary glimpse into whatever is going on inside the White House with regard to their dogs. So this is it's really it's honestly sad. So put this up on the screens from the New York Post. This was some records that were revealed through a Freedom of Information Act.
Request Biden's dog. This is the younger one.
Commander sent a Secret Service officer to the hospital and has been six others after replacing.
They say.
The first pooch Major Major had, I think was also German shepherd the same breed, and also had to be removed from the residence because of some aggressive incidents.
But what was revealed through this Freedom.
Of Information Act request was that Commander has been seven people in a four month span after Major was ousted over similar aggressive behavior. The shocking spate of incidents, none of them previously reported. Mirrors attacks involving Major, who the White House says was given to family friends after biting
Secret Service members in twenty twenty one. In the most serious of the incidents that were documented, the White House Physician's office on November third had to refer a Secret Service officer to a local hospital for treatment after Commander clampdown on their arm and i. According to emails released under that Foyer request, Commander broke the skin of a different Secret Service member's hand and arm weeks later after the President unleased him outside the White House following a
family movie night. Communications indicate in the following month, Commander bit the back of a security technician at Biden's Wilmington, Delaware home. So seven different bites in a four month span, so.
I have a lot.
First of all, for anybody who's accusing us, this is the fun block. Everybody knows that, so let's just keep putting on the end. But I did a little bit of research into this. I know people for.
These super service officers.
Yeah, yeah, well for the service and that's kind of what I want to talk about, which is I know a lot of people who own German shepherds, so I actually talk to them about it, and I was like, hey, what's going on here? Every single one of them pointed to this that when you have two successive dogs that are both involved in biding incidents under your ownership, yeah, something's wrong with you. These are not breeds which are
known for just being aggressive like this. Maybe they can go a little bit wild and they can get like this if they're untamed. But really what they all pointed to is like bees are and look, I don't have any inside knowledge, but based on people I know who own German shepherds, I know a lot of people with German shepherd This some of the sweetest dogs in the world.
They need a little bit of training. They need to kind of like you've got to force them, not but you need to be forcible I think in terms of your direction and all that you have. And sometimes actually the breeders who sell German shepherds or give German shepherds, they require you to put the dog through training specifically to avoid incidents like this because they know that if unchecked,
that this can happen. So unfortunately. I actually think it is clear that there's just a sheer carelessness going on in the Biden household where they appear just like not to want to spend the time or even this is the thing, you guys, people have a lot of money.
We all know that.
You know, thanks to the whole hunter situation, why don't you just spend the money that a normal middle class family buying a German shepherd or getting a German.
Shepherd would do.
This is just standard operating procedure here, or it could say this is another thing they all pointed to, that the dog is criminally under exercised and is not being taken care of properly. We know, for dog size, you probably gotta walk that thing five miles a day. I can forgive the president for not having the time to do that. But you have a lot of people who work for you who could go do it for you. So at the very least, it's more like a lack
of attention to that. And look, I can't help as a pet owner, and you know, I have a dog and I'm a cat and I can't help. But just think frankly less of people who don't do that. You know, it's like whenever you have I lived in an apartment at one time and I knew a guy who had one of those Alaskan huskies and he kept the husky in the house and I just remember being like, I'm like he was a nice guy, but I'll never forget that. I'm like, you put that freaking dog in an apartment
all day. That's not cool, man. This is like a vanity project. So you can get cool Instagram photos with an Alaska husky, and like you got to think about the dog's welfare, like he could walk this thing. It needs actual space and you willingly like brought it into this situation. If you don't have the time or the resources for it, then you shouldn't be handling that.
And Glenn Greenwalld has talked about this as well.
He's very involved in dog rescue and all that. There's unfortunately a massive spike of people who are returning dogs or giving up dogs, or abandoning dogs because they got them during the pandemic and then they didn't do you know, or they didn't want to do the actual work to take care of a dog, you know, in the long run. You know, this is supposedly supposed to be a lifelong commitment. It's like a blood contract in a way between.
You and this animal.
And so yeah, I mean that's just on a personal level. You can't help but observe here. Like you know that everyone always says like it's not the dog, it's the owner. I don't think that's always the case. But when you have two incidents like this that happened back to back, can't help us say there's something going on inside that house.
Put this next piece up on the screen, which was some reporting at the time about Major Biden being sent away for offsite private training. And by the way, they say that Commander is going to undergo additional training as well, and that they're setting up new dedicated exercise areas and new leashing protocols to try to keep Secret Service safe when they're around him. First of all, I liked this quote Biden's Major is sweet and loved by eighty five percent of the people he meets at.
Well, it was not a great proportion.
But what I found interesting in this article is they interviewed someone who was a professional trainer who number one took some issue with the type of training that they were getting for Major. They didn't think that it was the sort of you know, they thought that a different style.
Of training might be better. I don't know, but they.
Did say, this is a dog who, through genetics and early lack of good experience, because Major had been a shelter dog, has probably developed mistrust of certain.
Types of people. And German shepherds, they said.
And I didn't realize this are the number one biting breed in the country. Though they tend not to bite hard, most of the German shepherds that this trainer says they have seen over the past thirty years have anxious, suspicious dispositions.
So it may be the case that this is a particularly difficult dog breed to have in an environment that is like the White House, which is tons of people in and out and lots of different folks sense, you know, yeah, it does make sense that this may be a particularly difficult type of breed to have in this type of setting. So but then I don't know why after the first incident you choose this breed again.
Yeah, you have a responsibility not only to the dog first of all, you know, I mean.
This dog is imhouldna be happy in this type of environment. That don't bring them into this type of environment.
That's it.
And then also listen, I mean, and I hate to say this, but you know, if you are a normal person and your dog bites two people, that dog is going down.
I think everybody knows that.
I mean, after one.
It's really usually I think they usually give you I forget exactly. I think it's state by state and also in terms of localities as well, what the rules are. But like, if you have one reported incident, that's already bad, like bad, especially if you drop blood. But if you have two and you send somebody to the hospital at least here, Like I know this because I got bitten by a dog by somebody and actually they told me, they're like, hey, you need to go report.
I actually didn't do it because I felt I was like.
I can't be responded.
I can't flood on my.
Hands, like even those dog that pounced on me and bit into my leg, but they were like, hey, that dog, you know, like we really need to you know, you need to contact animal control. They're going to go and investigate this incident, and it will ultimately likely you know, result in being the dog being like forcibly put down.
So anyway, I'm just saying, you know, also in turns, it shows you that you know the special treatment I think that they're getting, which you know, a lot of people have to deal with this, and a lot of people take a lot more care apparently than the First family on this. And yeah, I mean I would just say on a personal level, I definitely think less of them for having two dogs now in this incident and
then not taking the care necessary for their employees. I mean, these people, like you think the circuit service guy wants to be there all day, you know, you think I know some of these guys from when I worked on the White House grounds. They're sitting there in full body armor in a hundred degree heat, sometimes like with a machine gun, sitting in a bush, just literally wasting away in the heat, Like, the last thing that guy needs to deal with is a.
Dog who's worrying about it.
He's worrying about the dog.
Seven people in four months.
And then, by the way, in the report, they do have text messages back and forth from you know, one of them saying, like, commander charged me very aggressively. I think it's only a matter of time before someone gets bitten. And yeah, so to me, that's maybe one of the bigger pieces here is how is it that we've had seven bites in a four month span and it had to be brought to the public before it's really dealt with.
Yeah, oh, there you go, Crystal, and take a look at wow.
In a brand new interview, Abigail Disney, granddaughter of Walt and heiress to the Disney fortune, had a pretty blunt message for current Disney CEO Bob Iger. Now Aiger has recently come under fire for some absolutely trash comments he made about striking actors and writers, saying their demands were quote unreasonable, all of this while he canoodled at the
Sun Valley, Idaho Billionaire Boys Club. Well additional context for Iiger's outrageous comments here, he earns sixty five million dollars per year paces work are such low wages that some have actually been forced into homelessness. Here's Abigail reacting to Aigre's comments and the fact that his pay is one four hundred and twenty four times the pay of the median Disney employee.
Quote.
If you have sixty five.
Million in your pocket and there are people in your company who are a struggling to put food on the table, that should not feel good to you. You shouldn't be able to sleep well at night. I woke up one day and realized that, just by virtue of being bored lucky, I had so much more than everyone else. And I don't think I've slept well since I figured that out. And to her credit, Abigail has increasingly used her visibility as a wealthy and connected person into more and more
radical activism. Actually been watching her trajectory for a while, and while many put away radical politics as they age, she has actually been pushing herself into more and more activism. She was recently arrested for the first time as part of a climate change protest against private jet travel.
She had a group of activists blocked.
The East Hampton Airport, where the nation's billionaire class boards and deeplanes from their private jets. A just cause, if ever there was one, given the number of stars and billionaires who wring their hands about climate change and then casually spew a million times more emissions into the air than the average human. I am not exaggerating here either, as Abigail actually points out and OXFAM study estimates that billionaires literally emit a million times more than the average person.
And guess what, guy.
She also walks the walk, or more accurately, flies the commercial flight, putting to shame the petty protestations of those who would have us believe it's just too much.
Of a burden for the rich to fly with the rest of us.
Chumps to Rolling Stone, she specifically calls out megastars Leonardo DiCaprio and who start and don't look up but still blast around on his private jet, and Taylor Swift, who apparently tops the list of private jet travelers. Abigail Disney's commitment to being a class trader is admirable. It also serves as an example for the many a less celebrities who have absented themselves from the class struggle that is
happening in their own industry. Because while Abigail's actions shouldn't matter any more than those of the young climate activists who organized the protests and who she was arrested alongside, this is America. The reality is people with wealdon status have a whole lot more power in Cloud than your average individual, and because of this, it's been disappointing to see how few of the top actors have shown up to stand in solidarity with their underpaid brothers and sisters.
A prominent sag after member told Variety, there's been a palpable lack of headliners. If our stars were all out there and forced advocating for us, we would know it in a sign of rank and file frustration in a union where your average member is pulling in about twenty six k annually. One picketter actually held up a sign that read where the f is ben Affleck, The normally politically outspokens love has yet to show up for any of the pickets.
Think of how much cultural cachet these people have.
Golden opportunity to advocate for not only their own industry but all workers. There have been some exceptions, though, in the power of the words of these recognizable figures shows just how important their active participation actually is, not to mention what it would mean to their union brothers and sisters. Here's Arian Loyd, the actor who played Stewie in Succession, absolutely ripping into the studio.
Bosses, take a listen.
We deserve a living wage, we deserve breaks, We deserve to work together to make beautiful arts so people can enjoy it. It's like these people haven't seen fucking succession.
Which about you.
The most important thing that we can do right now as a unit, as a group is to keep together. They're going to try to divide us.
They're going to try to tell us this, that.
And the other. All we can do right now is show up, care be here, picket post keep posting, make stories, tell people about this.
That's the only thing that we can do.
United, we will beat them. I am so proud to be an actor and so proud to be in this union.
Here we go show up and pick it now.
The reason I'm highlighting these class traders is not because they're more important than the active that's who are pushing for better at great sacrifice without the safety net of their wealth every single day, but frankly because I'm a little bit at my wits end of how change can
even really come. Since the financial crash, we've had a series of working class uprisings on a fairly regular basis, and the best we can really show for it is ten thousand dollars a student debt cancelation that got killed by the Supreme Court. You want to talk about failures of democracy, the fact that Washington, regardless of who is in power, systematically towards the consistently demonstrated.
Desires the people is that the top of that list.
If the actors strike can get wealthy and influential actors to care about labor, that would be amazing. If Abigail Disney can single handedly shame her fellow wealthy elite, may be a handful of committed class traders are the breakthrough We actually need to cut working people in on America's prosperity. Abigail told Rolling Stone, quote, we need to question this notion that capital only belongs to owners.
When we can't achieve anything without workers.
We're doing capitalism wrong, and we're going to kill ourselves in the process unless we rethink it. If even one percent of the one percent had that awakening, that could be a whole revolution, and it just struck me, Soger, how it shouldn't be this way. New piece in New York mag that caught our attention. Lists put this up on the screen. The headline here is AOC is just a regular old Democrat now charting her course from potential revolutionary to just another mon of the Democratic Caucus. And
author of that piece joins us now, Freddy Debor. He is a writer and also author and has a new book coming out we're very excited about titled how Elites eight the Social Justice Movement that is going to be dropping this fall.
Freddy, Great to see you, Good to see you man.
Thanks for having me.
Yeah, our pleasure.
So I think my first question for you is just, you know, we've sort of seen this trajectory from AOC for a while. Now, what was it that inspired you to write this piece right at this moment?
You know?
I think that.
For me in particular, as I try to sort of point out with the piece, people don't just sort of betray some sort of fundamental idea like one time. I mean, certainly there can be particular moments when you sort of go mask off and show who you are. But to me, it's a steady accumulation of things that I think don't sort of fit with the rhetoric about AOC in her
actual specific voting behavior. So one of the things I tried to do is just refer to very specific moments of things that she did on the floor of Congress as a legislator and say, these don't sort of comport with what she sort of just portrayed as and what
she has portrayed herself as. But also in a big part of the pieces, the piece is less intended to be sort of AOC is a trader, and it's more supposed to be sort of saying like, I don't know what the coherent sort of ideological perspective is that underlines her actual voting.
Behavior and the way that she acts in Congress.
If there's anything that I think for me represents the thing that really turned my own stomach about her, it's when she voted to forbid railway rikers workers.
Excuse me from the right to strike.
Because that is to me, you know of black letter socialist slash lefty slash radical stuff, is that you simply do not forbid about workers their right to strike. We just saw ups workers get a much better deal than what they had initially been offered because they had a credible right to strike that would have cost their company
billions of dollars. And so that to me, if there's any one thing, but for me, it's just more a steady sort of accumulation of noticing that there just aren't a lot of behaviors that reflect any kind of coherent plan going on, and then appearing on odd Save America to endorse Joe Biden.
Number one, you don't have to endorse at all.
Your endorsement is not going to change any votes. Probably, I mean the number of people who are saying, I'm going to vote for RFK, but then AOC endorse Biden, so I'm going to switch my.
Vote as minimal.
If you have to endorse, you can send out a one sentence.
Press release and do it that way.
Right, just a few days before AOC made that appearance, the pod Save America bros had a moment where they were actively laughing, I mean literally like convulsing in laughter at the idea that they should have to appeal to left voters, that persuasion with left voters is necessary. And so for me, that kind of crystallizes this sense that AOC is part of a perspective where, however benevolent, many of our impulses may be, the Left is owned by
the Democratic Party. The Democratic Party never has to offer us anything for our votes, and that if we don't vote for the Democratic Party it must be because we love Trump.
So, Freddie, what are some of the jump off points that you can point to, both in the piece and throughout the career where we started to see, like you said, mask off you reference to rail strike, does it pre date that?
What do you think? Yeah?
I mean for me, just in terms of just not knowing what she's doing. The vote about the Israeli Iron Dome funding, which is Israel's missile defense shield that the United States pays for, as the United States pays for a huge portion of Israel's military machine. To me, that's a problem, not just because she didn't vote the way that I wanted to, because I have just no idea what she's doing and with her vote.
So for those who don't know.
When that vote came up, there were a couple of people who have been talking about voting against it. She cried on the floor of Congress in solidarity with Palestinian people. And then when the upper down yes or no vote came up to vote for or against funding the Iron Dome, she voted present. Now for one thing, right, I don't like that because I want her to vote no, because I support the Palestinian solidarity and I don't want her to support the Israeli war machine. The fact that she
was going to lose that vote is irrelevant. You still vote that with your conscience. But let's suppose that she wanted to do it for some sort of strategic reason. The first thing to say is, anyone who's a hardcore supporter of Israel is never going to support Alexandria Casio Cortetes.
Right.
If she was doing this to try to court, you know, Zionist voters, that's very strange because I don't think they're ever going to be in her corner anywhere. But also, if you were going to do that, if you were just going to say, you know what, I just I want to stand for defending Israel against sort of Palestinian solidarity, then you vote yes. Right, Voting present is nothing. It is literally the worst of all worlds. We're not expressing
solidarity with the Palestinian people. You're also not getting whatever meat or political benefit you might have gotten up for voting in favor of Israel. It's just just sort of seems like a very aimless act. And so this is the point, sort of the broader point with this piece is that I'm not so much interested in like castigating an individual member of the sort of left Democrat caucus.
I am saying, you know, look the Bernie Sanders primary campaign, which is where so much of this coalesce and we started to get this momentum. It was seven years ago. I don't have the slightest idea what left Democrats think their approach to politics is some people sort of some of the critics of the piece were like, oh, you're expecting her to be able to will legislation out of nowhere.
I know she can't pass legislation on.
Her own, but what I would really love to see, right is like some coherent sense of what she thinks her role as a legislator is, and you know, a sense that these people are sort of working in tandem to say, Okay, the way that we grow is this, or the way we move forward in this And all I see in so many of the things that she's done is a complete lack of sort of direction.
Let me just ask you though, So, I mean, I understand why you focus on AOC, and I wrote a similar not a similar piece.
Yours was much better than mine.
But I also had some reflections after she endorsed byden the pod Save thing, because it's just like, ugh, really, this is how Lowe's stooped. But I don't think anyone is under the illusion now that AOC is going to
lead us to the socialist promised Land. However, do you think it's better that she be there than Joe Crowley or any of the many other myriad of democrats I'm thinking of Josh Koteimer, right, Gottenheimer runs around accusing everybody who you know, says anything critical ever of Israel being an anti semit you know, pushes these resolutions, which by the way, AOC voted against. That's like, we stand with
Israel always in forever, no matter what. He also pushes things that are also really odious economically, in terms of assault lifting the salt tax cap, which is basically giveaway to the wealthy. So no, they're not going to lead us to the Promised Land. But do you think it's still better to have AOC and the rest of the squad members than another set of more right wing Democrats.
If I was voting for the House of Representatives tomorrow and my choices were between Alexandria Casio.
Quartez or Joe Crowley, I would certainly choose AOC.
But I also think it's important to say, like I mean, one of the things I've been trying to put out into the universe with people is, Okay, what fundamentally would.
Have been different had Joe Crowley kept his seat? Right?
I think of major moments in the recent American political history, what has sort of happened because of AOC that would not have happened with Joe Crowley or vice versa. That something that Joe Crowley would have done that AOC would not have. And I think that it's much harder to sort of come up with a version of how that hypothetical America is different than you know, if Joe Crowley just kept his seat, the machine Democrat sort of kept
his seat. One thing I think people don't realize is AOC's district is notorious for bad turnout, So even though she's in the biggest city.
In the country.
In her first twenty eighteen primary, campaign against Joe Crowley. She won that primary with less than eighteen thousand votes, right Like, there are small towns in Connecticut where the mayor gets more than eighteen thousand votes for you know, to get that office.
Right.
So, you're talking about a figure.
Who's sort of been advanced into this national stage based on very little in the way of sort of public support. I would like for the sort of the vision of AOC to sort of match the reality. I mean, one of the things that I've been asking everybody to do is allow me to consider this person as a legislator like any other. I got some very sharp and interesting criticism about the piece, but the large majority of the response has been just really sort of irrational angry. How
could you portray this person sort of thing? And she's in Congress, right like, she is a representative of the people, and you criticize them when they aren't doing things that are consonant with your values. If I had written that piece about some backbench Democrat who had an identical voting record to AOC, the people who got so angry at me wouldn't have bad a denying. And I think if there's anything that's going to happen if she is going to be a long term politician. I'm asking people if
maybe we can dissolve the cult of AOC. Look at her as a legislator like any other, evaluate her votes, evaluate her endorsements, and make our judgments from there.
So let me ask you this on which dovetails with what you're saying. You close the piece saying Alexandria Cossio Court has was once a symbol of what American politics might become. Now she's a message to the rest of us. It's going to take more than symbols. Is the issue here with AOC personally? Or is it more of a structural critique, like was it always going to be impossible that, no matter her radical intention, we would end up in
the same place. Or do you think a different person or a different group of people might have been able to muster more power, Because I look, for example, at the you know, some examples in the Republican Caucus, the Tea Party was able to use a minority of the
caucus to great effect to get their wishes. You just had the House Freedom Caucus, which has used you know, a small group of legislators who were willing to band together and kind of be assholes and throw some sand in the gears, and they were able to also accomplish some key priorities. So is the problem with the strategy? Is the problem with individuals? And what is sort of your diagnosis of what a better direction would be.
I mean it's a little bit of both.
Look, I like again to respond to the most common criticism, I'm not unaware of how sort of structurally disadvantaged, you know, leftists and socialist politicians are in the United States. This is a country with I don't know, seventy years of red scare tactics when the Soviet Union exists a you know, now you know, just as long of an effort to crush labor unions, which is the heart of the left. And so I don't expect more from these people than
as possible. But you mentioned the Tea Party, and it's you know, I just think that any rational evaluation of the far left and the far right in this country, you would have to acknowledge that the far right gets more of what it wants, despite the fact that in many cases they themselves don't have anything like in numerical majorities. Then the far left gets and I think that this is structural and baked into the Democrat the nature of the Democratic Party.
It's simply a fact that.
I mean, this was the story of Obama right, which is you had congressional Republicans during his administration who just relentlessly moved the center, and Obama constantly chased that moved center to try to be the more sort of rational person, the more sort of adult in the room person, which again with some other big part response to this piece, which is this is not how politics actually is. Grown up politics is like this. Those definitions are exactly what
people on the far right have never done. So you know, I look at the end of Roe view Waid, which for me is a nightmare, But you look at the people who made that happen when Roe v. Wade, When that decision came down, even a large majority of Republicans supported a woman's right to choose.
It was one of the.
Things that made Roe Viewaid a landmark case was that it was public policy finally being brought into line with public opinion in terms of women's right to choose. Those people never stopped to say, those anti choice people, those anti a worship people, never said, let's get serious, let's be responsible. Well, we you know, politics is about compromise.
We need to we need to moderate our opinion. If you look at the history of their movement, all they did was ruthlessly pursue that out which they got, which is the end of Roady Wade over the course of decades.
And it's just a perpetual frustration of mine that you just have these examples of people on the right just sort of going to absolutely any lengths that they need to to get their agenda, while people on the left fret and worry and want to appear reasonable and need to sort of care about compromise when the other side isn't doing that and they're empowered because.
They don't do it.
I think that is all very well said, and you know, the piece is really really well written, and I think brings out some some key points that people who care about left progress need to pay attention to. Freddie has always great to chat with you. Thank you so much for spending some time with us.
Good to see you man, Thanks for having me. We'll see you guys later. Thank you so much for watching. It was a big week here. Thanks for all our premium subscribers Breakingpoints dot Com. If you can, and we'll see you next week.
Again in April.
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