Creatine Induced Onlinitis [“engagement I just with him! to whom?”]

because I can remember I always wanted I'm sure the audio quality is good, but how do I sa- You sound like a Georgia piece. You know what I mean? I'm on the first day of being sick. So I'm in that window of time where my mind's getting kind of delirious. I'm just really stuffed up. It hasn't really hit me. That'll be tomorrow. So I'm really trying to get under the line. Did you eat like a whole bunch of raw?

To get sick or to cure sickness? I mean, either. Either, I guess. I could. Right now, I've got a bunch of Gatorade and coffee and water surrounded by fluid. And a whole fucking, you know what, maybe it was that cheese. Of cheese that came in from parts unknown. A friend of the show, Kalthura, he mailed us a king's ransom of cheese. Crate. Pretty much. When I picked it up, he sent it to our special P.O. box. And if people want that address, contact me directly. I'm not about to broadcast.

He had sent, and, you know, he contacted your wife first, then you. I was the last guy to get contacted. How do I, like, he's begging me to get this cheese off his head suspiciously. And every half hour to 45 minutes I'm giving you updates on the cheese. Where is it in transit? I got lots of updates. It became more of a burden. He got the cheese while traveling in France and then while sending

he was arrested for like a knife crime. So he was dealing with the police while also dealing with the customs for our cheese. It's really, this is the things that our fans go through to get us. He fought to get us this cheese and it was very important to him because I had said, I like cheese. And a box, like a heavy box. Yes. And it actually seemed heavier once I took it out of the box. Once you're holding it all there.

You say, God damn, this is a lot of cheap. It's like a crate of Nazi gold. And it re- it smells so strong and he was worried he's like did it go bad i'm worried it took too long in transit i'm like i don't i think the thing about cheese is it doesn't go bad It's moldy. You can cut off the mold. But I think the odor that's ripping my face off right now, that's a feature, not a bug. I'm pretty sure. but i have it in our dry room over here so This weekend, I'm gonna give you, I guess, just half.

We're doing this like the fucking blood diamond guys in Lord of Wars. I'm not going to weigh the diamonds. Here's a pile and I'm putting a machete in the half. Here's half. I'll bring my good machete. thank you kel thanks buddy yeah so maybe but in opening that box maybe some fucking french virus wafted into my face and infected my family Catch the gay.

so it's me speaking it's kind of like i can only imagine this like a video game thing where my stamina is running down as the sentence goes on and the moment i stop it refills so we're gonna see how this goes if i'm going on a long tear in this because i might be blowing my nose a lot Yeah, so there's a couple pieces of news off the top. One is that I found evidence... of a real man who lived and died in American history.

I fought in the Civil War. His name was Christ Hitler. Amazing! Yes, I heard about this. Now try this one on Forsyth. He fought for the North. That's rough. Christ, Hitler fought for the fucking libs. When I found that out, I... I wish I hadn't read it. Once I found that out, I wish I hadn't found that out. Yeah, essentially. There's another thing that happened in the chat that just reminded me. Someone was talking about, maybe you had said about playing Liar's Dice.

Who was talking about playing Liar's Dice? That wasn't me. Fucking Liar's Dice. I don't know, someone in the chat is just bringing up. It was, I think it was either Ocean or Mitt or somebody who'd been ice fishing and he was talking about playing Liar's Dice with your buddy.

in the ice hut. And I couldn't get a read or an explanation of what Liar's Dice was, and I kept asking him, is that like when you're with your buddies and you're shaking the dice, and you go to act like you throw them, but you don't? Like faking out a dog. Yeah, the golden retriever's worth. We're the dice! We're the dice! Me and my buddies back in high school used to play psych dice. For hours.

It's either whacking off or playing psych dice. Those are the only two things you could do in the early 2000s. Yeah, that's right. It's true. Also, I don't know where to go with this, but it wouldn't be Blood Satellite if we didn't address this. This is almost news that's tailor-made for this show. Did you see that Tom McDonald did a rap with Ben Shapiro? I couldn't actually watch the entire thing. It was too troubling.

Can I say this? Ben Shapiro's rap was the least cringy part of it. Well, I find him pretty cringy to begin with Tom McDonald. I don't know much about him, but I went and looked at some of his other stuff.

This is very like you're like ten years to like yeah first of all ben shapiro shows up just dressed like nick fuentes he's got an america first look he's got his hoodie up he's rapping and then but he raps like a guy who doesn't rap he's like i've never rapped before here's my rap as far as that goes like okay it's a serviceable rap I've got the back You're blowing money. are and then there's Tom McDonald on either side of them and that's what I want to like Tom McDonald so

I really do. Why? Well, first of all, he's a Canadian guy. Yeah, but he's a fucking wigger. But he's... He's such an extreme of wigger. He's as close as I think we can get to having a Canadian Florida. but he gives out the vibes of like a florida guy right he's got like precisely four long braids on his hair just going down and they bother me every time i see him because every time i see him

you want to see it ripped off in an escalator or something. Yes, I agree with that. Yeah, it's precarious. Canadian white man desperately wants to be black. works together with the Jewish fellow who is hyper-orthodox and trying to co-opt the right. Like what's to like?

Let me just say that. I'm going to cancel you right there. Okay. I'm giving you a sexual harassment suit. The yellow card. Because I think we are at such an advanced stage of wiggerdom that pretending to be black has nothing to do with it. I think he is such a hyper-evolved winger, like post-Juggalo. There's almost nothing black within Juggalo culture. It's like this perfect white trash thing.

and then Tom McDonald's on top of that, where now it's also face tattoos, and you're tattooing the inside of your lip, and you're doing MAGA.

um and also like i've heard a bunch of his songs and i'm like okay he can rap and he does have a good flow and a good style but the thing is it's all not even conscious rap because conscious rap is kind of nerdy this is like heroin politics rap you know where it's like trashy but it's MAGA stuff it's all about the culture war and cancel culture and stuff and to me that gets old

He cut an entire album with Mad Child from Swollen Members, which is actually a band that I like, a rap group. I listened to them when I was in high school. Whenever I hear music like his, i'm at an age where it's always very contextual so and this is why i had to get out of a lot of horror

because i'm like is this a song i would play in the car not really is it a song i play at the gym not really is it a song i would like play for like a girl or something no so like i don't know where i would listen to the ben shapiro cancel culture rap. Ben Shapiro, it's called a yarmulke motherfucker, that sort of rap. Where does that fit in my life? I don't know whose life. It's a fucking cultural product. It's not any... And to be frank, I don't know much about him. I'm just reviewing him.

And it's like, I agree with what you're saying. He's enough of a trashy, degenerate piece of shit that he's mutated enough that he's accepted in the mainstream. So he can creep up to these issues, never really touch them to be honest, but he can creep up to these issues without getting cancelled. But like...

If that's the limit of what you can do, I'm just going to throw them away. Because you've, first of all, you've ruined yourself. You've normalized face tattoos, septum piercing, being a degenerate, disgusting fucking mutant. you've done all of that and ruined yourself and now you're trying to be a fucking role model for our for our movement fuck off man seriously honestly get out of here with that shit and of course who would you expect him to partner with

Ben Shapiro, another fucking kike who's trying to co-opt our movement for his own purposes. So it fits perfectly. This is the exact type of quote-unquote white artist that I despise. And of course, of course... he's allied with with ben shapiro like it's it's just perfect you couldn't even write it it is like it's funny like ben shapiro now would not be the guy i would Like the heat of Ben Shapiro would have been many, many years ago, right?

That'd be like getting Steven Crowder now. Steven Crowder now is not at his peak culturally, at his peak of like cultural cool. Ben Shapiro, this might be the worst time to drop a diss track with Ben Shapiro. He's taken all the heat from that Israeli Gaza shit. I also don't think, just me, again, I'm not a cultural. a guy, but from my read of our sphere, rap is not the top, you know, genre that really has an influence in terms of, like, people actually digging deep into artists.

You're a bit of an exception just because you're such a fucking music head. and you've been around there's look there's other guys but i mean if you want to try to start finding this quote unquote dissonant right guys who like rap you're starting to get over into the impossibly controlled op gay op type guys like america first our actual what I call actual right-wingers, you know, who actually believe in, you know, anyway. We don't like rap. We like electronic music. We like metal.

You know, but I don't I can't think of anybody aside from you who has like a fascination with it as an art form who actually just listen to fucking rap all the time, especially new stuff. You know, I guess my point is anything that's produced now, even if it's got a white face on. If they're claiming it's right-wing, it's co-opt. If people are looking for an artist that hits a lot of the same cultural notes as Tom McDonald,

but is kind of not doing what anything you had just mentioned is actually way, way better. I would recommend yellow. Yellow Wolf, I would put, for someone who really goes deep with this stuff, I'd say he's one of the top five rappers right now. maybe, ever. Like, I actually think he's... And he cuts it across with rock music and country in a way that no one else really does. And it's not gimmicky. And, like, he kind of even looks very similar to him.

Two bricks, through the window. Two hits, two bricks. I'm going to prison. When I didn't And I'm just looking for the... in any way and then also insane clown posse like if you want to go down the road just get into like psychopathic records at that point get go to the gathering of the juggalos there's tom mcdonald's everywhere there

There's a couple things I wanted to get to, and I'm trying to figure out which order to do these in. Because you have a fascinating story that I want to hear. Live reporting from the ground on how manufacturing... getting hollowed out but I also had sort of a dad cord

thought i wanted to ask you and this will be once again may divide the audience may divide even the hosts of this show but i want to hear because you once again for folks at home I'm a recent father, Nichols, 10 months old, you've got two daughters, very mature and advanced age. I'm not going to call them hags, but in baby years, we would call them, you know, toddlers of a certain age.

Now, as we mentioned before, you know and this is for the new dads or people who are thinking about being a dad uh one interesting thing about kids is that you have to introduce food and the whole feeding thing is something that I guess it really never gets easier until they're teenagers. Even then, it's not even that much easier. But you're always trying to introduce them to see what they like. And then early on...

You're always trying to figure out if they're allergic to something. And allergies are pretty rare, but you never know. And we've tested him with everything. He's not allergic to peanuts. He loves peanut butter. He loves meat. He eats all kinds of food. one type of food that he can't have right now

And that's dairy. By dairy, I mean milk. I mean yogurt and cheese. And we tested them with yogurt. Now here's, I'm going to tell you the story so you get the background. And I'm going to tell you what my thoughts are. When we started introducing food to him, like mushes and whatnot, he would get like rashes all over his face, right? But he also has eczema. And he's very, very young when he did this. And we thought, oh my God, is he allergic to everything? Well, that doesn't make any fun.

So we're like, okay, we'll keep an eye on it. Eventually, the rashes stopped happening, right? So it was just some kind of skin reaction to introducing new food. And then you just keep at it and it goes.

And I think what happened- and you hear this from other parents is they overreact to that they say oh my guy's got a rash so he or she can't eat that food at all so you get it in your head that they're allergic to all these foods and eventually You can develop an allergy because if you do have a slight reaction to something and then you keep the kids away from it, an allergy kind of builds over time. But that's almost environmental. Whereas if you're just introducing it and kind of bit by bit.

Or it can reverse. Like my wife used to eat peanut butter all the time and then as an adult started getting rashes when she had peanut butter. So I don't know what the fuck that's about. Anyway. But Derry, it was a more extreme reaction. And so we went to like an allergist at one point to test for other foods. Everything's fine. And they went and did a prick test on his arm for dairy. And he's still allergic to it. Not only is he still allergic to it.

The reaction to me seemed wor- And we hadn't given them any dairy in the month's intervening. And my wife is like, well, you know, this sort of thing goes away after a year. And that's the other thing. Like, a lot of times, kids, dairy allergies are pretty common, and then they just go away after one year, right? So that's what we're keeping in the back of our minds. However, my thinking was, and this is just, you know,

Maybe I'm getting too conspiratorial or I've been reading too many websites. But I'm also like, you know, I think this allergist is full of shit. I think she's useless. And I think if we just kept giving him bits of yogurt or dairy, whatever, maybe he would just toughen up and plow. And maybe by us keeping it from him, it's made it worse. I don't know. But that was my thinking. And I voiced that to my wife. And we're kind of on the fence. Because what do you do, right? You don't want me wrong.

But I'm just wondering what your thoughts are on that. Did you encounter anything like this? Or based on what I've said, what do you think? I haven't because neither of our kids... And I don't mean like we got them out of it. I mean, not from the very beginning. They've just never had... My question would be less about the milk if it were my kid. And I'd be like...

What? What are we talking- a rash like is this a rash i'm not i'm not asking i'm saying rhetorically like is this a rash that lasts for three days and he's excruciating is a rash that lasts for three hours and he seems grumpy. It's a rash that he gets for a couple hours and he doesn't seem particularly affected. Right. So if that was the case, if it were me,

I would keep introducing it to him maybe every couple of weeks, maybe once a month, just keep doing it like on a schedule and see if it changes, if it gets worse, if it gets better over time. Obviously, you don't want to put it. Like, of course, a food, because you don't want to be walking around with a fucking rash. But yeah, if all it is is like almost just an aesthetic kind of rash, I would just run with it because I think there's a probability that you're right, that it will go away.

Because we do know that these things change. Anecdotally, you and I, we know. They could get better or they could get worse, but they do change. And then the other thing you're saying about the nutritionist could also be full of shit. You just don't know anymore, do you? I'm sure there's such a thing as a good nutritionist, but I mean, do you try?

Also, just to clarify, this is an allergist. But a nutritionist might be a bit more professional. I don't know how much school you need to go to to be an allergist. Yeah, I mean... I'm happy to be corrected on any of this because obviously for me, my kids' safety and health is the highest priority. But generally, it's my belief that exposure... not just to things related to allergy, but

discipline and for a lot of others. It's the concept of how you teach your kid to swim by throwing them off the dock.

like you're there to grab them and pull them back out they're not going to drown but like giving them putting them in a situation where it maybe is actually outside of their limits but you are the training wheels this probably it's all right and if you know that the reaction it's not affecting their health it might just be making them uncomfortable it's worth it because look on the other the long run thing is do you want to have a son who at 25 cannot drink milk

That is a fucking heavy... I have to tell her, I'm like, look, we all, her and I, we all went to see the band Health. A great band. Do you want our son to be like the lead singer of Health? who is like a skinny, pasty, nihilistic. He looks like Morty from Rick and Morty grew up. So I'm like, do you want him to be that? No. Because he's a boy. She grew up a girl, so she's used to girls. But a boy, he's going to run into a lot of walls.

That's just what they do. That's another good example of this. I do this all the time. My wife will sometimes, I mean, she's good with it too, but she is a little more careful. My say my my parents are much. brother when he watches them it's like oh my god get down from there you're gonna kill yourself if i can look at it and be like if she fell from there

That's going to leave a mark. But it's going to be okay. And she's going to cry for the rest of the day. But again, going to be fine. I'll just let her do it. Because... It's good, you know, because it's better for that to happen. Better to climb a tree and fall out of it and break your arm even with dad standing right there than to be put up to it.

with your friends when you're 16 for the first time, and then you weigh, what, 45 kilo, and there's nobody around because you're down at the gravel pit, and then it's a fucking hospital trip. So, like, I think it's better to go. you know, with a lot of this stuff, to be exposed to it in a controlled environment. I know this is the same argument that's used for a lot of more degenerate shit, but I think this is the source of it, is, in my opinion, good parenting is allowing for exposure.

controlled environment. Yeah, like for me, my job as a father is I'm going to childproof the outlet. Because if people are unaware, if you haven't had young kids, especially young boys, i never experienced this until i had one they have this uncanny ability to find like the most destructive weapon They will find knives in your sock drawer. They'll find guns in the drywall. Kids just have this fucking ability to find just...

It's like they're magnets for suicide in a way. So my job is to childproof the outlet. My job is to make sure the bookshelf is anchored to the wall. Anything short of that, if they want to fall off the bookshelf by climbing it, okay. But I fail as a father if the bookshelf tips over and crushes them. That's me.

Now, I want to get into this because we might be able to spend quite a bit of time on this. And we're going to try and... do some surgery on the story so you don't get in trouble but i i guess i'll just tee you up with this is about manufacturing in canada and to me this sounds like um anyway there you go

so this was i think i just told you about this yesterday i told you about it as it was happening so i work um i'm management in a company which is a manufacturing company, and I was sitting in my office with the door open, and I heard the CEO in a boardroom meeting with the two CEOs of two others. that deal. I don't want to be too specific, but they deal in certain types of equipment, which is critical to not only manufacturing, but the manufacturing of other equipment.

Heavy machinery, generally. Heavy machinery. So, heavy machinery like shop floor. So one of these guys owns a company, both of them own companies that do different parts of this process, but they both own companies that... I should say distribute this equipment, because anybody who knows about the Canadian industrial economy, it's been gutted for a long time, and it's getting... hearing about

the glee that these guys are around. And if you had time for the folks at home, including myself, because I am in a home, you said this is sort of a link in a chain of a larger process. um what what else you said this is if anyone's familiar with the industry what where have you heard this before happening well what i oh it's kind of it's okay so i've been i've been in in hong kong for i had been until recently. And I'm dealing with

I guess what I'm saying is I've been over there and I know how that works. And I know from talking to the exporters of similar equipment because we're buying that equipment for our factory in China. I know from those exporters, I knew what their story was. I knew that they would always pitch me like, oh, well, we just got bigger and we're selling this now to the U.S. We're selling this to Germany. And look, we've got this machine that can overtake that machine. And I felt at the time.

Like, either... you know, the watchman is asleep in the West, or else these Chinese sales guys are just fucking lying to me. They're pitching it as if it's actually better, but it's not. Both could have been equally plausible. And you know what, there's probably a little bit of truth.

Coming back now, I'm sitting here and I'm listening to these two guys, not that old, probably in their late 30s, who are like a sales exec. One of them was a sales exec, and the other one was the owner of the company. It was a smaller company. And but they were both in like their late 30s, maybe early 40s. And they were talking about it. They're essentially saying the same thing that I'd heard from the Chinese salespeople over the past 10 years, which is for the longest time.

They had been importing this type of equipment, sections of it, from Europe. like there's a lot of some specific type of part that was always made in Italy and another couple types that were always made in Germany and they would import them and some of the basic like millwork and assembly was done in Canada and then they were labeling them and selling.

within Canada under their brand names and they were all kind of competing with each other but they're saying over the past few years the Chinese have been Buying up as to the Chinese model has been to buy up the best equipment in Europe that they can afford

Copy it and then use it to build more of it. So now they're building Chinese knockoffs of the best Equipment in Europe and here's the thing the scope or rat like the the range of quality That's coming out of China as of now the last few years and this is something I had noticed before I left You can still get You know, dime a dozen garbage in China that will fall apart.

but you can actually get chinese equipment which is more or less the same quality the highest end European equipment for half of the price not for 5% of the price but for half of the price and that That's huge. Is that a larger trend in your opinion? Sorry to interrupt you. This is what I'm seeing. China has reached a point now where they're doing this across sectors and this is this cuts to the core thing which again I don't have a side from these few anecdotes

in China and from this conversation that I overheard yesterday. I don't have a lot of other data because it just happened I haven't researched all of it but this is a pattern that I've noticed is over time it used to be that China had two things going for it that allowed it to undercut the web. One of them was extremely lax labor regulation. health regulations, environmental regulations, low taxes. slave labor.

The other thing that they had was the quality for their stuff is absolute dog shit because their people are stupid and untrained because they've never built this before. This was the case maybe 15 years ago. So the stuff was literally 5% of the cost of the of the European or Western equivalent What's happened now is they've been doing it for so long

They've spent so long copying Western technology, and in many cases, they actually have hired Westburn expertise to come over and help them. I knew a guy who was commissioning factories. was a South African. So this is happening a lot now, or rather it's been happening for over a decade. now you've got equipment where it is technologically equivalent to the best stuff in the west but it's still dirt cheap and why is it dirt cheap because they still have

slave labor and no environmental or labor regulations or health regulations, safety regulations. Fuck all. So they're acting in terms of the way that they treat labor and their economy. They're acting like late industrial America. You know, they're like the Carnegie's or something, right? But in terms of the quality of the product, it's the same. And the problem with this is, and this comes back to the conversation I overheard yesterday, These guys, they've realized...

And they had brought a new pitch deck of their new equipment. They said this stuff won't be available for about another year. But they've been back and forth to the factory. The one guy's going back to the factory in March to check the progress of it. But this equipment is not only better equipment...

than China's ever made it's equivalent to the best stuff in Europe and again if anybody knows about the industrial state of Canada we have had falling industrial investment in productivity for a long long time probably because of NAFTA of other reasons partly because of liberal liberal governance and how impossible it is to invest.

But you've got equipment that it's just, it's literally never even been in Canada. Like you've got types of machines with the level of technology that have never even been on.

soil and the first time that they touch down here they aren't going to be made in hamburg they're going to be made in right they're going to be imported from China even though they're German designs and all of that money is going to China so right away there's this breakdown of trade between us and Europe but then the other part of it is and this is the key thing that I took away

The way that they arranged to have these machines made, there's one major company, and it's not in Guangzhou, I think it's in Taiwan, which is the major part. They've arranged, they've created a conglomerate, all of these heavy equipment companies in Canada. They've created a conglomerate and they have gone to the company in China. And together, they have arranged what kind of equipment they all want. They've bought in together so that they can get a better price.

And then when this equipment arrives, it's just going to be private labeled with each of their brands. So all of these heavy equipment companies, which up until last year were competing, they're still going to be giving the appearance of competition, but they've essentially cut up the Canadian national market for this equipment. And all of it is literally the same equipment made by the same Chinese factory.

And there's a huge impetus for everybody to switch over to it because it's cheaper and also better. So it's like a Canadian heavy machinery cartel dealing with a sole Chinese supplier. And I want to be specific. It is a specific type of machinery. It's not all heavy machinery. It's a specific type of machine. I just don't want to document it.

But it's a specific type of machinery. And my point is, from having been in China and dealt with other types of unrelated machinery, I've seen the same pattern happening. And I've been told by the Chinese builders or the Chinese manufacturers that it's happening. And now I've seen the other end of it. I've seen the demand side of it. And I realize it wasn't a lie. It wasn't a sales pitch. It's fucking real.

So, and the problem that I identified to you immediately when I was telling you about this was, can you imagine if we went to war with China or something happened to the Chinese economy or global shipping? That's it. Like prior to that, these people, these companies were first of all competing with each other. Second of all, had had very complex.

but distributed supply chains. They were getting different pieces from different manufacturers all over the world, and they were doing a lot of assembly themselves. Now these things are being made by a single manufacturer in a single country.

And the same manufacturer in the same country is making it for every single competing company. So if that company goes down, every one of these companies in the Canadian conglomerate immediately has no stock. Not only that, but because it's equipment, they have no service. like it's it's insane it like the the folly of this is wild but you could look at these guys and the thing is i was hearing these guys kind of riff on

politics, they're moderately right-wing guys. They hate Trudeau. They hate the level of taxation we have. I'm convinced that these guys, given the alternative, if they had the alternative to... in a western or even better a canadian company that was building this equipment they'd absolutely do it but the way it stands right now these guys were almost destroyed by the covid mandates they're barely hanging on and this is an opportunity for them to recover all of the lock

2020 and 2021. They're going to make a killing selling these machines now. So to them, it's like it's it's manna from heaven. But what it actually is, is you're selling the last remaining independence of Canadian industry. to the fucking Chinese for your your pound of self. So it does not bode well for the Canadian industrial economy. Well, you know, this is specific to your experience, but it wouldn't surprise me if this was happening elsewhere.

just knowing and we covered this in detail when we were discussing we did a couple episodes on the Chinese Communist Party's relationship with Canada both through the triads and organized crime networks, but then also through migration. real estate and other official channels.

so like this is just one prong of the most insanely pronged fork you can imagine I'm very sick people you're going to hear a lot of dumb shit come out of my mouth right now you're going to hear a lot of metaphors that sound delirious but it's just stick with. It's a fork you would see in a knife. And a fucking...

But yeah, to me, this would be happening everywhere. And if China is doing it, it's putting so much money behind it. Because what do you use slaves for? You use slaves to build something big. So this push that China's making is just part of a larger push to own Canadian manufacturing. That's my prediction. And I don't think anyone who's been paying attention would think that's an extreme prediction.

they have us by the balls and to me the thing that like the takeaways that I had from this experience one of them is it it reinforces the importance of deregulating the way in Canada, and I know there's a lot of people that are like, oh, that's a libertarian right wing take, whatever. But the truth of it is we are, whether you like it or not, competing with China. We're competing with the global economy.

You can complain about it all you fucking want, but so long as it's legal to import this equipment, you're competing with the people making it, and the people making it are slaves in, like, hellish smokestack junk- So you can either... find a way to compete with them, or you can close all trade with this side of the world and precipitate a war. I'm actually okay with either option.

Either is okay. But what we're currently doing, option C, is import all of this shit, and now your whole industrial economy relies on them. So that can't happen. Polyab isn't going to fix a fucking thing. So either we find a politician who will actually change the laws, and that sounds unlikely. I think the, and I'm going to just propose a crime here, but it's a white collar. I propose that people who know how begin projects. To restore.

Canadian manufacturing, and you can say, oh, that's so difficult because of the tax regime and the regulatory regime. And I say, fuck the taxes, fuck the regulations. I'm talking about black market illegal. Rum Runner manufacturing of which- You see what I'm saying? I don't think the labor cost is the important thing to worry about. I think the thing to worry about is the fact that to get all of your ducks in a row legally to even run some of these companies.

You're paying so much in taxes and fees and licensing and on and on. I worked at a company 15 years ago where we manufactured power supplies for hydroponic lighting. And these were literally like rinky-dink little tin boxes assembled by high school students that were, you know, retail for 75 bucks.

And we had to monthly let the government regulators come in and waste more than a day of the entire floor's time going through every stage of our fucking process, which was a bunch of 2x4 benches and guys with shitty hand tools, because it's Canada, we don't have real technology, right? And they're like, oh, you need to install a fume hood over here because you have a drill and all of this shit. And it's like, that's the reason we can't have manufacturing anymore. Right? We're fucking...

We have to get past this. I know I'm ranting at this point, but aside from finding a politician who will fix this for us, it's up to us, who know how to build things and run businesses, to recreate this industry and damn the man. I was thinking about this because the book we'll get into later actually touches on this. But he makes a comment in it that, you know, when we talk about there's no political solution here,

That's almost like a code word for violence. If you actually think about it, it's like you want to elect someone to run the country. drastically change and it's like well that would be like a company hiring a ceo to like completely rework the company that almost never happens yeah usually you get someone to run the company to make like a tiny incremental change they're just making

They're just maintenance workers. Most of the time, they only get hired to accelerate whatever it is they're doing, even if they're promising change. It's usually change in a certain direction. And I'm reminded of this quote that's been going around a lot lately, and I had heard it covered by David Green, Dave the distributist. The quote is, a system is what it does. And he didn't come up with it. He was borrowing it from engineering and tech development.

And it's this, they call it a theory. I don't know if it's a theory. I think it's just a bunch of words that make sense. So when you deal with a complex system like a machine or an assembly line, there are so many moving parts and there are so many ways that... that if this turns into a question about the ultimate source or the intention of what something was designed to do, you'll never get to the bottom of what actually is going on.

and forth like you see in politics. So one of the things that engineers particularly in my field that's impressed upon us is the idea that the system you put into operation, it does what it... And it doesn't matter what you intended it to do. It doesn't matter how many different complex things there are and which one went wrong. The total effect is what you're always trying to address. And anything else is kind of a way to skirt ownership over.

ultimately delivers. It sounds very simple. System is what it does. So don't talk about what a system is designed or what it ideally should do, it isn't what it does. So I was also reminded of another post I saw somewhere, it might have been on Twitter. The tweet was, you know, leftism is basically what it does. Like, what is leftism? Well, look at what you can get away with saying or what you can't get away with saying. a progressive politically.

It has nothing to do with economics. You can be a leftist and advocate for a wide array of economic theories. You can probably even be a leftist monarchist. I wouldn't surprise. But you got guys like Hassan Piker, who's a socialist, but lives in a mansion and dresses in designer clothes. No one actually gives a shit. No one really gives a shit about anything economically on the left, but look about what you can't complain about.

or what you need to fall in line with. It's essentially black and brown people worship. It's gay stuff and tranny. you can't be ambivalent or agnostic on those. And because of that, that is what leftism is. That's it. It isn't even political. Yeah. Yep. And so when you look at a system like what we've got here, you know, like the system that you're describing right now, what is this system? This system is only created to persecute manufacturers.

It's like, well, it's designed to actually, no, no, no, no. What does it actually do? What it's doing, it isn't really helping anyone. It's not supporting anyone. It's just making it harder for manufacturers, which are usually white guys, if we're being honest. Engineers and manufacturers are usually white men. So that's all this system does.

It's to restrict them from operating, but funneling money at everything else, literally everything else. You know what I just saw? And I'm jumping all over the place. Again, I'm sick. a sicko tonight it was one of those guys like a blank age blank you know like one of those i'm a Silicon Age herbalists, whatever those, you know, those kind of crap adjacent things. Whatever the fuck it is. But they were saying that, um, If you actually look at the...

COVID benefits in the US, non-Canada. Here we had CERB. In the America, it was something else. If you look at the amount of money that was given out to companies, because you can look up whoever received this money, right? Whoever received like business grants and loans, loans specifically. They found that what he did was went to the database and just did a test. because he goes up the names of individuals. He just typed his name Shaniqua.

Right? You found 20,000 hits for Shaniqua. Just that name alone. All official quote-unquote businesses, all sole proprietorships that employ one person, they employ Shaniqua, no evidence of what they do or what they build or what the service is, but the names would be like... free money LLC or Wakanda Enterprises LLC and getting more or Hellcat Yeah, 20 grand, 30 grand, 40 grand. And then every single one of them forgives.

And then if you go on black Twitter, they're talking about this. I saw a bunch of tweets of black people getting... all wispy eye and talking about man that was the best time to vibe everyone was getting free money if you're in miami there wasn't a crab leg in the sea everyone just chilling and vibing and i'm like

Sorry, Kadeer. I was going to say, if you ever needed proof, that block... that they we literally they got reparations they got billions of dollars in in payroll protection and they spent it all in like a couple of months of liquor and now they're all broke. so like don't stop giving them money yeah but also they can't because that's what the system is now i don't know about you but i got some certain payments i had to pay a lot of it back

And there's countless people I know who actually ran businesses who had to pay this money back because it wasn't a grant. It wasn't a bursary. It was just a loan. They loaned you to keep your business running.

For a lockdown that they made everyone do, and then they made the most productive people pay back all these individuals, open scam artists, none of them had to do it because... what is a system the system is what it does the system is to give free money to black morons yeah that's all that's what it does it doesn't do anything else and just like i'm looking at here's another example pull from the headline

You've seen in the news that President Biden has been trying to respond to the fracas occurring at the Texas-Mexico border, where Texas is being the lone gunslinger and putting up. just irresponsible amounts of barbed wire as a barbed wire respecter it's like they're trying trying to win a barbed wire putting up contest

And to keep out all these illegal Mexicans because the government, the federal government, isn't doing this. They said, fuck it, we'll do it ourselves. And all these, and they try to crack down on them and all these other states. like sided with Texas. We have a catastrophe. It is because the border has been deliberately opened wide

that we see the terrific horrors that are taking place across our country right now. Here's a short list. From Texas to New York, waves of illegal immigrants are now overwhelming our community. Just since the time I was elected speaker, less than 100 days ago, more than 700,000 illegals have been welcomed into our country illegally by the Biden administration.

American school children have been forced into virtual schools. Why? So migrants can sleep in their school buildings. Korean War veterans of the U.S. have been booted from nursing homes that were sold to house migrants. Our streets are being flooded with And the Democratic mayor of Eagle Pass, Texas, says migrants are overrunning his city. This is Texas Governor Greg Abbott holds the line at Shelby Park, where the Biden administration wants to cut through razor wire placed by state authorities.

The cross-country take our border back convoy is waking up in Louisiana this morning, getting ready to hit the road toward Texas, all in an effort to raise awareness about the crisis at the southern border and what is going on there. Side note. If you look at the map of the states that were siding with Texas, They form a diagonal line across America. For those who are followers of Jeremy McKenzie, who we interviewed on the show, this is the diagonal movement. It was kind of a meme that...

America and Canada can be kind of split in a diagonal line with the base states forming this one just by happenstance. It turns out that like a lot of the red states and most conservative states form a diagonal line across North America. the map of those who are supporting Texas is almost exactly that map So that's just a funny thing. It is funny. Anyway, but Biden, of course, he does what every politician does, and it's the only thing.

that I cannot tolerate from politicians. I can get used to lying, but the one thing that sits at the apex of my range is when politicians say, I would love to do something, but no one lets me. What am I supposed to do? So Biden's like, I would love to secure the border. Congress needs to pass it. That bill or the law today, I'd shut down the border right now and fix it quickly. Congress needs to get...

He's obviously losing his mind, but he's sane enough to spit in my face with that shit. Don't they have a Democrat? Am I confused? It's just bullshit. Yeah, it doesn't make sense. Also, you've been the president for almost four years. And also saying, like, what am I supposed to do? Secure the border? We need to vote on that. Why do you need to vote on that? Why do you need any vote at all to do? You got all the stuff. There's a lot of stuff there already. But anyway, so here's a tweet.

It says, Breaking. This is by Bill Malugan. It kind of summarizes some of the news concerning this. The Senate border deal details per source familiar I just had a call with. So basically, Biden wants to have what he calls a mandatory shutdown. It's like, I'm going to have the power to shut down the border. if need be, if it gets overwhelmed, right? And you're supposed to hear that in class.

But let's look at the details. A mandatory shutdown of border once an average daily migrant encounters hits 5,000. Wow. So the point is, you're allowed to have 5,000 people cross the American border per day. And only once he passes that will he install any sort of shutdown.

Some family units will be released with ATD, meaning alternatives to detention, ankle monitors and whatnot. Well, like how many ankle monitors do you have? You're just going to do what you're doing now. Nothing has changed, right? So you have... In short, what I'm trying to say is you have Texas taking the law in its own hands, doing what it should do, but the system isn't designed to secure the border.

that's not what this system does the system is what it does this current system is to let in as many illegal immigrants as humanly possible with causing the least amount of stress to those at the border. It's not to secure the border, it's to make the border as porous as possible while causing the fewest amount of headaches to the federal government. That is what the system does.

There's no way to look at this response because the response should be, I hear you. I hear that you want the border shut down. I'm going to do that. It's not like, okay, well, we got to let 5,000. And that is let them in, by the way. That's not, you know, we're going to direct them to the proper channels. No, we're literally just going to let 5,000 illegal immigrants in a day. That's what's tolerable to us. That is the system. And so that's to me, that's why.

when you consider what these systems are, don't get caught up in the idealism or the self-reported purpose of the system. It is what it does, the manufacturing, the system in Canada. is to prohibit people like you from starting a fucking business. If it wasn't set up like that, it wouldn't be doing that, right?

So the point is, is it doesn't matter who gets elected, there is no political solution. And that doesn't mean violence, but it does mean that if you want to achieve what we're talking about, like if you want to run a competitive industrial concern... cannot obey federal

They are designed specifically to prevent you from building partially because they are influenced by the Chinese partially because they make a lot of money import tariffs partially because they're influenced by the Americans who do actually build a You know, like the whole thing with our oil and our wheat and a lot of our primary resources get shipped at a discount to the U.S. to be processed and sold back to us at a huge market.

And this is going on all over. Who's doing that? It's our fucking politicians. Like, again, we've said so many times, I think it was John Carter or somebody had said this a while back, but Canada is not a country. It's a country. You know, we're all just workers here, and we're here to keep the lights on while the rest of the world rapes the natural resources that exist within our borders. So, I mean, and that is the way it's been for at least...

And the only way it's ever going to change is if we as Canadians but you're never going to elect your way up. Yeah, because you can only elect people to maintain that system or in all likelihood accelerate it in a similar direction but maybe change slightly. I am at a loss for what Pierre Polyev could do. to reverse course on this um even marine le pen here's a great example so we've been talking about the afd And we've been talking about this sort of uprising of far right.

maybe even populist, I hesitate to use the word populist, but movements. And Marine Le Pen, famous for many years for being an anti-immigration advocate, was denouncing the AfD. because AFD advocates for not only stopping mass migration, but doing mass deportations. Remigration. Remig, yes. Remigration.

Of course, the far-right anti-migration would be like, that's too far. Well, why is that too far? It actually logically follows that if you want to address the problem, the problem isn't just mass migration.

migrants being there en masse, right? That is the problem. If you could have immigration without actually having migrants in the city, there'd be no problem. The problem isn't the migrants coming. The problem is the migrants... being here yes you know so you have to get rid of them it's like we want to stop them but what do you want to send them away like yeah What were you talking about? Yeah. But what is your system is like we can never get rid of these people.

I want a system, and I don't think a Polyam, I don't even think a Maxime Bernier is capable of introducing that sort of system. They will only maintain the system because they're still engaging in sort of what Tom McDonald does. which is calling out hypocr- when you call it hypocrisy it's like oh isn't it interesting how you treat black people better than white people hmm funny how that is like it's not funny that's how the system is set up the system is set up to be anti-white

You're not going to embarrass them. You call people out when you want to embarrass them because they made a whoopsie daze. They know they're being hypocrites. They don't fucking care. And you've been calling them out of hypocrisy for like a decade now. And nothing's really changed. Because it wasn't a mistake. It wasn't an oversight that black people got free money.

with the laziest company names possible because the system is set up to give free money to black people. That is what the system is. and to to address that system you can't call hypocrisy on it because they know you you need to strike at the source which is i want to stop giving money to black people period like what part of that are you pissed off at because they'll say i we should let anyone get from it no no no no

Because that's not what the system is. The system doesn't just give money to lazy people. It gives money to black people specifically because it's set up. So if you want to address that, you have to address the specific... Right. Unless you're willing to say that, nothing's gonna fucking change.

No. No half measures. No half measures. The time has passed for that kind of bullshit. Pick a fucking side. And it's one of these funny things where, like, if you're not willing, especially if you consider yourself on our side, if you're not willing, even a non- to agree that this is what it is. then what the fuck are you doing? Like, just pipe down and go home and just retire.

Like, you have to be able to at least identify that it, like you said, the system is what it does. If it is supporting and building and breeding a brown mass to replace you, don't make it about laziness. What the fuck is that? Like, you know what this is. Every time you see a white person was sent to jail for 7,000 years, for some thought crime. while a brown mass murderer. You know, one example is like James Fields getting like 400 years in prison.

for running over Heather Heyer in the car during the Charlottesville rally. Then there was that guy, the fat black guy in New York, who did the exact same thing, but did it purposefully to kill white people. The trial is set to begin today for the driver who barreled through crowds in Times Square. This happened five years ago, you may remember. Opening statements are expected in the murder and attempted murder trial of Richard Rojas.

An 18-year-old from Michigan was killed and 22 others injured. The 31-year-old from the Bronx told police he had been smoking marijuana with the hallucinogenic drug PCP. before plowing through tourists this happened back in 2017 he's gonna get this treatment that he so desperately needs litigation attorney andrew lieb explains unlike jail which we look at as a retribution something to Punish someone the purpose here is to rehabilitate someone and give him the things he needs

10 years, 20 years, whatever it could take, he could be a functioning member of society, and that's what the jury decided. He literally, he literally was, he's a black supremacist who said, I want to kill. and then in prison in the interviews he's laughing And he's not in a mental asylum. He's in a normal prison and now he's free, right? He's walking free. Yeah, so that is by design. There's no error there. The reason is because the system is designed by, you know, black judges.

and black lawyers like black female judges are probably so what the problem is is you get black people out of being fucking judge like to to you need to gut this system because the system again is designed to uniquely persecute white people. And you're dealing with a whole group of people who deny that reality. You're never going to convince them. The reality is staring them in the face. They think it's funny. They're laughing at you because you're a complainant.

But really, this system is, it's not an error. This system is designed to be anti-war. And that's funny. He's like, we need somebody who can fix this. He's like, you're not looking at fixing it. You're looking at getting rid of it. Because it's not broken. It is what it does. The thing it's doing to you right now, it was purpose-built for that. It's working perfectly.

It's working overtime, actually. They're feeding it, and they're thrilled at how well it's working, because this is the whole fucking point, is to persecute you. So why are you talking about fixing it? Stop talking. It's not broken. And that circles right back to your issue with China. There is manufacturing in Canada. There's going to be lots of manufacturing in Canada. It's going to be Chinese manufacturing.

Because that is what the system is going to be set up to be. Because you're asking, why is it so hard? for manufacturers in Canada. Well, it's going to be hard for just you. It won't be hard for China. It won't be hard for... You will be amazed at how this system makes allowances for these other groups and not you. It's a little tangent, and I know we brought this up in a previous episode, and that's kind of why I wanted to touch on it again, but there was a...

And there was a big fracas about it that it turned out most of the money is going to the South Korean firm. And not only that, but their brain. So for the first three years, all of the ground floor staff, the fucking truck drivers, and the janitors will all be quote-unquote Canadians, which you know in that... And then the actual high paid staff, the engineers, the programmers, the CNC operators, they're all going to be South Korean.

And the argument from the federal government was, well, look, we don't have enough expertise and skill in Canada to build this on our own. And so we need to bring those other people in. And the fucking conservative... BOT V- You know, I don't mean the conservative government, but like the conservative... Line tower in like Rebel News and Globe and Mail.

We're all like, well, you know, that's fair, but I wish there was another way. No, it's not fucking fair. Yeah, it's not true. It's not fair. Well, first of all, it's a little bit true. It is a little bit true. Like, they do have the expertise in building this stuff. It's the same thing with the Chinese equipment. Canada's industry has been gutted for decades because of our regulatory regime, right? The point is, if we don't have enough engineers,

then maybe we should be resolving that before we solve a non-existent problem, which is we don't have enough EV batteries. No, we don't have enough fucking engineers. We need engineers. Why don't you train some Canadian engineers? Why don't you create a regulatory environment that allows for tech startups For Canadians with money and intelligence and skill to start their own EV companies. How do you think the South Koreans fucking got it? Because the South Korean government...

was careful to take care of South Korean industry. I don't like the South Koreans. I actually hate South Koreans, and I think their government is quite off. But they do a few things right. They, to me anyways, they enshrined a lot of the industries in South Korea that made it great. And it became a local industrial superpower because the government made sure to always protect those industries. And companies like Daewoo that used to build ships transitioned into cars easily.

because of the way that the government made that easy for them in terms of taxation and regulation. It's incestuous and corrupt, but at the end of the day, Now that country is an industrial power locally. In fact, it's an industrial power to the extent that Canada is hiring South Korean engineers because we don't have enough of them for our... So, this is the fucking thing. Why can't we, why can't you just let us fucking do it? And the reason is, it's not because it's broken.

The conservatives and the liberals are of one mind on this. This is just the way it has to be, but it doesn't have to be that way. You, you listener, can go and start your own EV company. You can do it in your garage. It's not complicated. Just don't fucking tell the government.

Just don't tell them and do not file your taxes. And this is just to keep beating this point. I think I might have mentioned this on that Twitter space I was on recently. But when I apply for a job in my field, which is marketing, at any agency, for the government and for a lot of the big clients. Part of the application process is to ask me if I'm gay or if I'm a non-white. Check a box.

And they have the audacity to say that this will not be used in weighting your application for or against me. Then why ask? Of course. But what they're doing is they don't want me. They've communicated that they don't want white men. And that's by design. Now, a lot of people are taking it upon themselves. you know valiantly to sue these organizations and make them hurt hand them where it hurts and i applaud them

However, the only issue I could see is that that won't stop them hating me and not wanting to hire me. They'll just find another way to do. The problem I'm trying to address is that there are people who hate me running things.

who don't look like me and and they are diametrically opposed to everything i represent with my existence you know i mean like this this is just one part of the larger system to keep us out there and you're describing one of the manufacturers you know it's like and because my entire life from high school up until now

I've been hearing that Canada is desperate to bring manufacturing back to Canada. And we have all these loans, all these grants that we give out for anyone who's willing to start a manufacturing company. And yet, there is no... Where is it?

Because the way the grants are structured, they just want to say that they are, but they're actually not because the system is designed to not let you, you listeners, start a manufacturing company. The system is designed to keep you busy while they bring in the... global manufacturers, which is what they really want. It's going to take a huge, a great rain has to come to wash this shit.

Because they're just too brazen about it otherwise. It's almost the ship of Theseus thing where it's like you could change it incrementally until it's fixed, but if the end goal is changing everything... how is that different from just rebuilding it from scratch? I mean, it's a distinction without a difference, isn't it? Yeah, like my solution, I have to be careful about this, I am sick of it.

Like we can sue them. We can take this to the Canadian Supreme Court. What I want is every HR professional to commit suicide. as a start i mean that is an unlicensed meta Look, at worst, that's an unlicensical opinion in this country. As I say, I think you should take painkillers. Well, this is a painkiller. It's killing the pain in my ass. I wish every single person in any political party who has ever worked at Parliament Hill, I wish they signed up for me.

suicide the company the company the country would be I want every HR professional to get licensed medical help. The help they deserve. the help they deserve and i want us to not have hr people for a couple years and then there has to emerge after that time one person who has to re-pitch hr as a profession to the rest of canada because all of them are gone so there has to be like a the one person who wants to do it again and they need to explain to the rest of us what hr is

and sell us on it. And I bet they fucking can't. I bet if there was no HR and there was one salesperson for what the HR profession is, no one would buy that. No one would want to install that in their organization. Can I say, because we did litigate a lot of this HR stuff in the chat, which was really interesting to me the other day.

By the way, make sure you're close to the mic if you can. Oh, sorry. We litigated the HR problem in the chat the other day. A whole bunch of guys came in. A whole bunch of different opinions. Opinions I'd never heard before. I actually ended up having to research a bunch of this. It was really interesting.

The history of HR, you know, it used to be called personnel, and there's all these different elements of it that kind of got melted together. But there's one thing we didn't talk about in that chat, which I was thinking about now. It is the government relationship to HR and how it's been built up over the years. Because, like, for example, DEI initiatives, right? That doesn't come from your HR department. Your HR department exists as a reaction to that.

Which is to say, if you have, like in Canada, we have the Human Rights Tribunal or whatever the fuck it's called. If you have an issue with a hire, It's a racial issue. Now there's a human rights tribunal. You gotta be careful. They'll fucking wreck That's what you need the HR for.

You have HR because you actually do, especially in a high-paid corporate environment, you need to make sure that you don't have all of these things happening because your company can fucking sink because of the Human Rights Tribunal. This is just one example. But again, you wouldn't... a lot of the ostensible functions of HR would be moot if we didn't have a regulatory environment that literally had set up

you know laws and threats it's the sword of damocles hanging over your head right like you have to have defense against this at all times so yeah if we get rid of the of all of you know this regulatory regime that allows people to sue you for the tiniest slice You wouldn't need most HR to begin with. You'd need somebody for scheduling, somebody for personnel, maybe for hiring. There's a whole bunch of features, right? But yeah, I mean...

It all goes back to the government. I'm sorry I'm too libertarian, but a lot of this just goes back to the government. I do need to maybe walk a couple of these things back because it just occurred to me that Some news dropped just within the past little while. When this matters, it might be a couple days. I don't know if you've heard about this individual named Justin Moan.

This is a man who made a YouTube video denouncing and decrying the... I'm just going to read what it says here. I'm looking at it. piece of news police said that the more than 15 minute long youtube video titled modes militia called to arms for american page showed Justin Mohn picking up his father's decapitated head and identifying my name. Police said it appeared Mohn was reading from a script as he railed about the government.

Moen referred himself as a militia leader and called his father a traitor to the country for being a federal employee. The nearly unspeakable event happened at 7pm. Tuesday, when Middletown Township Police were called to the 100 block of Upper Orchard Drive in the Levittown section to find the victim, 68-year-old Michael Mohn, decapitated. in the downstairs bedroom. According to court documents, in a nearby bedroom, the victim's head was found in a clear plastic bag set in a coat.

It just makes you aware of the issues that are prevalent in our society. That's totally an op, though. I mean, this is happening literally a week after they... Florida bill in US Congress, like an anti-militia bill. But no, like, they did actually table a bill. And you know, like, it's the same thing with the, uh, with the gun rights. Like every time that they want to put gun legislation through, there's a shooting or three, you know, like right before or during.

And sure enough, this bill was already in the news cycle. I was reading this in the end of December or early January, where they're talking about it. It just got tabled, I think, this week. And then today... A guy out of nowhere nobody's ever heard of.

Holds up a decapitated head and says, I am a militia leader. I killed my father because I hate federal employees. I will destroy the federal government. Uses the word militia frequently, you know. Like multiple times and again is reading from a script like. this is honestly not only is this an op this has got to be one of the lowest budget laziest ops in a long time like the Las Vegas killer the Las Vegas shooter that was a fucking off that was wild right but this

Like, plastic head in a bag, using all of the keywords cut right from the bill. Like, come on, Chuck. Chuck Schumer. I can see you. I see you in the closet there, you old Jew. Come on. Could this be the first government op that was written by an AI? Maybe. You know what it is? This is what happens when government ops are written by like tranny Somali wheelchair diversity hires. This is the six-fingered hand. I can tell the words it's using are unnatural here.

Yeah, so anyway, I just wanted to, we got a bit of an HR tangent there. But yeah, just to wrap that up. Yeah, the argument was actually made by Paul Fahrenheit. He was looking carefully at this. He was like, well, HR does a lot of things. My argument was, Prior to HR, the jobs of HR were delegated to the department head. Or you were saying, well, HR takes care of people's checks. I'm like, finance department.

When I worked in small organizations, we just had an old lady as an accountant. I worked in several agencies where there was just a woman who cut checks. She dealt with payroll. That was all she did.

because it's a full job deal with all that but it's like you weren't also she had nothing with hiring and firing she just handled the money and then so you have that and then the hiring firing would be other people but the idea They have one person who handles all that shit that used to be divided between five different departments and handled more efficiently.

Like, we've done this before, was my point. Right. If you go back in time, like you said, not only were these much simpler, but they were often divided up. roles and there were fewer roles being done because the economy itself was less complex but I think there's no discrete line between like small business SME mega corporation like there's a sliding scale and obviously people in this So there's always going to be a 10. if somebody has come from a larger company or smaller.

They're going to pick up traits from each. So if they came from a company where it was all combined, they're going to kind of drag that into their department at a smaller or a larger company. It's always going to blend.

And I don't think that's a problem. I think what we went through in the chat, what we're talking about now, where you say you get rid of it completely, level it, start from the beginning. And you as the owner, as the stakeholder who knows better and really is invested in the success of the firm. You can say, here are the list of tasks and we can decide now and live with the decision. We can decide now.

whether or not these tasks are all done by the same person or whether they're done by different departments, it's fine. Maybe it won't work out. But the point is, a lot of that toxic shit is not getting included. I don't think it's a, it's not a big deal if the person who cuts the check is also the same person who hires and fires. That's not the end of the world.

But what's at the end of the world is if the person who hires and fires also cuts the checks and also does like a quarterly performance report. and also arranges staff birthday parties and also writes up DEI script. staff training for sensitivity and also attends global conferences for the WF. Like, hold on a second. Where is this going? Like, if we were the ones in control of it and there was no outside impetus for us to corrupt... then you would have a much cleaner

Yeah. Speaking of cleaning systems, before we move on to this book I wanted to cover, I did want to have a brief movie corner. IT'S MOVIE CORNER! SHUT UP SHUT UP SHUT UP I saw a movie recently like I said I've been going through a lot of older movies Finally saw the original Death Wish. Nice. You ever seen that one? Yeah, yeah, I saw that a while ago. My name is Paul Kersey. How's my life? I'm sorry. She died a few minutes ago, Mr. Kersey.

Any chance of catching these men? There's a chance, sure. Just a chance. I'd be less than honest if I gave you more hope, Mr. Kersey. Mrs. Paul Kersey. This is the story of a man who decided to clean up the most violent town in the world. I said, turn around. You hear me the party? He begins where all the super cops leave off. Money has gone down by how much, sir? 950 a week.

You understand, not too many people know that. And you want to keep it that way, huh? Oh, no, we have to keep it that way. Do you remember it? Is it fresh in your mind? Not really. I think I saw it maybe seven or eight years ago.

well that's good because i know some people who watched it as like a kid and maybe this is the mandela effect but i noticed a lot of people remembered it incorrectly Because a lot of people were saying that you can't make a movie like that these days, even though they did do a reboot with Bruce Willis, and that would be part of it.

but I can't make a movie like this. And it said, you know, it was like the last time you saw like just shooting black criminals. And like, I watch it right now and it's 75% white. Even the criminals early on, the one... who commit the, what was it, the rape of his daughter and the murder of his wife. Well, and one of them is actually Jeff Goldblum. So it's Jews and whites. So, like, not that far off from what you would do now. But this was a movie made in the 70s, the original one, 1974.

Charles Broad said, who I don't even know what his character's name is, and he's just Charles Bronson throughout the movie. When I watched the movie, it's pretty good. It's not outstanding. And then there was actually some things I didn't like about it. I think what people like about it is the premise more so than the acting, because Charles Bronson gives one of the all-time great, awful performances in his film.

um and i like you know nothing nothing wrong with that but you know there's a lot of he just heard that his wife died and he's just standing there with his hands on it because ah christ His reaction to his wife dying was the exact same as him on the beach frolicking with her at the beginning of the movie. Just, like, kind of grimacing. Just grimacing throughout. He doesn't have a second emotion the entire movie, really. And in a way, that's great. Because in a way, like, the story is that...

It's a cool story. It's a story that might have been done a bit better in the reboot. There's a lot I don't like about the Bruce Willis death wish, but the one thing I think it got right, if I remember... was that Charles Bronson He plays a lifelong lib, a bleeding heart liberal living in New York City.

and hates guns hates all that and he wants to help the poor and all that shit and then his life is flipped turned upside down when A bunch of home invaders randomly invade his apartment, rape his daughter who was with her mother, his wife, and then kill her after beating them up. just want an act of And then he rediscovers his violent streak. He decides to start taking revenge to clean up the streets. Very much a taxi driver thing. Very much a 1970s type of move.

You know, it seemed like American cinema was possessed with the fear that New York City would remain New York City. That's what the Warriors was. The Warriors was like, what if this is just the future too? And it's just like, you know, gangs and headdresses, like raping and shit. Thank God Rudy Giuliani showed

They're also obsessed with pretending that it wasn't mostly black people doing the crime. Also, there's no Asians in any of these movies. Even in New York City, there's a fair amount of Asian people in New York City, but it's just black and white. and like 50 50 and all these movies even like the warriors where it's like But then even like the police department in this is half black and they go out of the way to show one of the guys smoking a pipe because that means you're smart, right?

But the entire thrust of the movie is that Charles Bronson kind of rediscovers his violent streak, goes out in the streets, and just starts randomly killing. which is cool. And one thing I liked about the movie is he never catches the people who did these atrocious things to his wife and daughter. They're just not in the movie anymore. So everyone he kills in the movie is just a random criminal. And then it just ends.

But you couldn't do a movie like that now. You can't make a movie. And that's what the reboot did with Bruce Willis. At the end of the movie, he has to find the same guys who did the first thing, and he needs to take them out. But in this, like, you know, the 70s were a time when you could tell a story with, yeah, the bad guys got away and it sucked. And then he turns into a violent madman and everything's better.

like the whole point of the movie is like Charles Bronson stops being a bleeding heart lip just chooses violence gives war a chance goes in the streets and his life gets immediately better he just he starts smiling again like there's this great scene in it where his uh his son-in-law

the son-in-law comes over to visit him and this was the visit him in the apartment that was covered in blood and debris from all the the horrible crime because his daughter is now catatonic his daughter having been gang won't leave the bed is unresponsive and he's got that hanging over his head and then the son-in-law comes over and Charles Bronson is like wearing new bell-bottom jeans and he's repainted the place he's got like a nice record on

And then the son-in-law's like, what's going on? He's like, what, do you want me to be sad forever? Like he gets over it fast and he gets over it by just shooting black people in the back. Right in the spotlight. There's so many times in this movie where he shoots a man as he's fleeing. Like he shoots one guy the other guy's trying to get away and just goes out of it chases him to shoot him in the spine

And that's what I love about the movie. I love that it's just unashamed violence. And the story is that he did nothing wrong. And it's cool that he did that. It's cool that he went out and just started shooting guys with switchblades and guys with... There's two elements about it that I like compared to the new one, which you already mentioned.

the fact that he does seem like and this is something that's missing from not just the modern version of it but all all modern films that have like a renegade anti-hero vigilante right like a vigilante and the modern films is usually like tortured and i'll always be a ghost of shadow of my former self

least i could do like no no he's cool this actually makes up for it i'm good now i'm going to cabo it's awesome but uh also i'm just killing guys in the street and i'm laughing And so it's like, it's, My life rules now. Yeah, it's like, damn, my wife is dead, and that sucked, but also, cleaned up the streets, I feel a lot better. Shot a bunch of thugs in the back, they're dead.

Honestly, I feel great. Never felt better. I mean, I love that. Like, that's the thing that you don't do anymore. Not that they can't, but that's almost a moral thing where it's like, well, you can take revenge. it's never going to make up for your loss. Well, I don't know. Do you know? Have you tried? Let's try. Let's see, because maybe it does. I don't fucking know. Here's what the big disconnect between the original...

And the more recent remake was, which was directed, I believe, by Eli Roth, starring Bruce Willis and a bunch of... So I think Bruce Willis might sell that character more. Because there's one thing I didn't like in this movie. Only one that stands out. It's that Charles Bronson. He has a backstory where he used to be really good with a gun. He used to go hunting with his dad, and his dad died, and so he gave up. But they had to explain why he's such a good, like, marksman level shooter.

And I kind of wish he never had that backstory. I wish he was just a lifelong lib and progressive and had to get good at it because you see him build up through the movie. he doesn't start off shooting he starts off with like a sock full of quarters to defend himself and then he kind of builds up to get

And he's in situations where he doesn't need to shoot people across the street. He's, like, up close and personal. So, like, I would have liked it if we didn't need a story where he's already a badass, you know, shooter. He knows how to shoot. i think that's what the bruce willis one kind of had where he seemed more uncertain but here's where it goes wrong is that bruce willis He had to be sort of a hero of the people.

because there are these scenes where he would watch a news story or hear someone talking about a bad guy that everyone would say. I'm going to go take care of them like Batman or something. Like he becomes a superhero. Whereas Charles Bronson, he's not doing it for anyone else except for himself. He's not trying to avenge anyone in particular. Arguably, he's not even trying to avenge his wife.

He's not actually hunting down the people who got them. He's just finding criminals and taking it out on them. which is more real, which is probably a deeper and grimmer story. But it's not like I'm going to be, and then, you know, in the Bruce Willis one, like the news is celebrating him because he's taken down the right kinds of bad guys. Like, no, he's just finding them and shooting them for himself. And that's something that I think was captured pretty well by that Joker.

Because you used to see movies like that in the 70s, and they correctly pointed out that Joker was an homage to a lot of older movies, but the story of Joker... just being in it for himself and becoming a populist hero, but at the end of the day, he doesn't give a shit.

that just kind of formed around him and he's just on his own selfish journey that's what Charles Bronson is on and the tv saying like oh we got a vigilante in the streets and he hears the news he kind of likes that but he's not taking order He's not trying to you didn't overhear a black child say like oh my brother was killed by this drug dealer then he goes and finds

he would he's more like the punisher because the punisher would shoot a gang leader or a shoplifter equally you know sort of like a dirty harry like he's a dirty harry another character like that You're meeting crime with violence, and the violence is portrayed as being not only acceptable, but exciting and cool. And like I said, that's the story I wish we had.

and I haven't seen any other Death Wish so I bet it gets more extreme as we go but just this first i thought but like the one thing i liked about it also that made it a bit of a more complex movie was his relationship to the western like there's this theme of like old westerns in there like he he goes to like this old western town One of the last scenes is him wounded and confronting just a random criminal he was chasing.

trying to like do a gunslinger duel so like there's like cool themes and within that if you wanted to dissect the movie it's like the modern 1970s man trying to reclaim an earlier Whereas now we're almost trying to reclaim a 1970s vigilante America. He was trying to reclaim like an 1800s America of like the man in the white hat.

So our relationship with Charles Bronson now is like his character is undergoing the same nostalgia and callback to an earlier time. Like I said, it's been a long time since I saw it, but I remember watching it.

It's fucking cool. I didn't even know at the time that there were more than one. I don't think I've seen the new one or any of the original sequels, because I think there's a whole bunch of them. But I think the reason I watched it the first time was because... I think it was supposed to be the first Hollywood film he was in, and he's a crazy rapist.

I love the idea that you watched the movie because of Jeff Goldblum. You know what it was? Because I went through a kick, it's probably close to 10 years ago now that I'm thinking about it. I went through two kicks. One of them was watching old classic sci-fi, and the other one was watching old goofy... B movies like this and well they're not B movies but like this type like Dirty Harry and Bullet and stuff like that I'm watching a whole bunch of those

And I was just going through and trying to get like the Coles notes, who watches these and what's like the story. And that was the thing I came back with on this one was like, oh, this is the first film Jeff Goldblum was ever in in Hollywood. I'm like, oh. I like Jurassic Park. Let's watch this. That's so fucking funny. Another funny thing is I'm doing the exact same thing every single one of our guys did. Maybe this is the exact same thing our parents did.

We remember our grandparents when they saw this movie for the first time, because they've all seen it. They're looking at the screen going, So is he, like, Mexican? Or Portuguese? Or... He looks maybe half Asian. Like, what is Charles Bronson? I could... The entire movie, like, in different scenes, I'm like... Kinda looks like half Japanese. He's very wrinkled and leathery. But I think that's not, a lot of that's not genetic. It's like the style of dudes in that period.

Well, also, I'm looking at, like, younger Charles Bronson. I'm like, oh, he looks like a completely different guy. Yeah, yeah, exactly. That's what I mean. Like, he aged like a fucking... pear out in the sun like he's he's fucking grizzled even in his early 40s yeah he was born in 1921 so i think every guy just ended up looking hispanic by the time they died

Part of it is the mustache. The pattern of his mustache makes him look like a Mexican gunslinger. But yeah, young Charles Bronson looks like John Cena. Hey, hey, I took a second to look him up. His real name is Charles Bukinski, and he's a Lithuanian Roman Catholic, so he's a Slav, or he's a Baltic, that's what...

If you think about it, he does, he looks like almost Russian, eh? He does, but also, I like that Roman Catholic used to be a race. And he's from, he's like, he was the 11th of 15 children. And he was up in the mountains of Pennsylvania. So he's like a... That's not a hillbilly. What do you call that? You call them like hill people. He's a hill person. So he is the guy. He is the 11th of 15 children.

square fucking jaw shooting from the hip and he's in a whole bunch of like I'm just looking at the filmography this guy pretty much just did cop movies war movies western And yeah, the stuff he did in the early 60s, he did just look like kind of a 1960s Josh Broderick. But that's a good lead into our next topic. It's a book I read recently, and it's from the era that this movie was filmed and takes place. I'm not going to spend too, too long on it because I've mentioned it.

very frequently recently. I mentioned it when I was on the last Prudentialist episode, which I believe will be in this episode as well. I mentioned it when I was on an interview with MetaPrime, which I believe is just airing. right around now. That'll be included in our next episode. But it's this book, just to get ahead of it, it's called Decadence by Jim Haugen.

And this book was mailed to us similar to the, you know, king's ransom worth of cheese we received from another friend of the show. This was sent hard copy, hard cover copy to RPO. by our friend of the show, Pan-European. um great guy uh his avatar is a pan um and he really wanted us to review this book because he had said this book he read it a while ago and it meant a lot to him and it was high praise And I didn't know what to expect going into it, but I just found the topic so fast.

And I think it's really not only illuminating of the time it was written in, but also of everything we're going through politically. So this is a book written by Jim Haugen, who is an investigative reporter who talks a lot about the counterculture movement of the 70s and the 60s and hippie culture and just that era of America. which we talk about a lot we've talked about in some respects in the past

with Days of Rage by Brian Burroughs, and everyone kind of has an idea of what the 60s and the 70s were like, the counterculture movement. This would have been the boomers' social revolution. So this book was about that counterculture, what happened to it, why it did or did not succeed. Hunter S. Thompson spoke of something very similar. We talked about Fear and Loathing a lot.

The high watermark of the hippie movement, the moment it stopped being cool and turned into this ugly, decrepit thing. People will kind of talk about that transition from peace and love into... cocaine, and some people say the Manson murders had something to do with it. There's all these theories about why that social revolution fell apart.

And I've talked to a lot of people. Some people have heard what we've said about the book and they push back on it because everyone has their idea of what the counterculture was. And this reframes the counterculture movement as something that I don't think a lot of people have heard of. I read it. So he starts off by saying that the counterculture of the 60s was a manifestation in the most divided generation the world had seen based on social anxiety.

The counterculture itself was a myth of liberal intellectuals. However, the basis of the belief, of the counterculture belief, was that the world is about to end or that a massive paradigm shift is about to occur. And this is sort of that age. This belief survived the counterculture as the generation became cynical.

So he actually compares that generation struggle to the beat generation. The previous social phenomenon, the social revolution, would have been the beat generation. You know, the Allen Ginsberg. and he said this didn't grow out of that. The beat generation was a very distinct thing. And he said the fear of the Beats and the Wahemians was that America would kind of stay the same forever. They were very cynical. They were very nihilistic.

Whereas the counterculture revolutionaries that follow them, they believe that everything was about to change. There was some massive paradigm shift on the horizon that is up to the youth to shepherd in, right? And that actually took a form in a lot of different social evolutions. So the real... The core of the book is about how when a lot of people think about this revolution of the counterculture, they think leftism. They think communism. They think the protests against the Vietnam.

What he says is the counter-cultural revolution was actually a massive decentralized movement of a lot of different sort of sub-groups and sub- So what was the counterculture revolution? Well, on one hand, it was like this interest in Eastern mysticism with the I Ching and other, we talked about that when we discussed Seraphim Road. Orthodoxy and the religion of the future about how like around this time you saw a massive importing of

Eastern religions and shamans and gurus and yoga, and that's where all that stuff came from. So there's a fascination with that. But then there's also Ellis. That's completely unrelated, but the LSD generation was percolating up and LSD was a mind-bending new way of looking at the world. And then also there's the music. But then also... There seemed to be just a general youth rebellion against technology. Because what he noticed was...

The same sort of counter-revolution was happening all over the world. It was happening in Japan, it was happening in South America, it was happening in Europe, it was happening in a lot of places, and it wasn't just because they were copying America. It seemed that the same sort of generational angst and anxiety was bubbling up, but in different forms. And then what the left did later on is what the left always does. It sees this cornucopia of marginal groups and trying to sweep them into it.

And it's the same thing the left is doing now. And that is one of the reasons why it died eventually. The best parallel I can give, and I always forget to give this example, an example of the left doing this would be the Occupy Wall Street.

Think back to what that was. There's a lot of people listening who probably remember how that started and how that ended. If you're too young, maybe you don't. But I'll refresh your memory. So the Occupy Wall Street movement was a decentralized sort of populist. It cut through a lot of different political groups. Like you saw leftists in there. You saw anarchists in there. You saw a lot of right-wing guys in there protesting.

Banks responsible for the Great Recession, you know the financial in the early 2000s And it was singularly focused. What it started off with was people camping out on Wall Street and trying to hold these bankers to account because no one was going to jail. Everyone was bailed out. They wanted heads on sticks. Maybe not literally, but also maybe literally. But then over time, and I watched this happen, a lot of us did, over the course of months.

You saw the leftists get involved. And all of a sudden, it became about the progressive stack. All of a sudden, it became about gay rights. It became about... you know the precursor to black lives matter it became about everything you're familiar with the left is doing what they always do which is put fat black women at the front and make that the main

It stopped being about economics. It stopped being about what it was. And that's how it died. That's why Occupy Wall Street never really went anywhere. So one of the big things that happens is the left co-ops all these movements. and just grabs a hold of it and tries to hold them all together and kills them in the process. But the argument was that the counter-revolution, counter-culture, was just this populist upheaval that took a lot of different forms, and it wasn't just allowed to mature.

What he points out, I'm kind of getting ahead of myself here, but what he points out is The counterculture revolution of the 60s is almost beat for beat and line for line. What we're doing right now in this thing called the dissident. up to and including getting into weird esoteric literature and how that movement sort of progressed from mysticism and esoteric stuff to practical technique.

and how if you look at how the hippie movement was starting to evolve into, not fall apart yet, but evolve into was they were all talking about getting compounds and going into the woods and building parallel society. And they talked about LSD the same way we talk about DMT now. Almost the exact same evolution was happening in opportunity including creating parallel societies. So it was very interesting to me to look at this. Okay, where do they go wrong? What can we learn from?

and i'll get to that in a second but that's something that when people think of the counterculture they don't really think of that like we're doing something different well what we're doing isn't entirely different um and the boomers at that time they too saw themselves as an extremely angst-ridden, anxious, young, vibrant generation trying to reclaim something through nostalgia. Because nostalgia is... He makes a claim in the book that...

Nostalgia is the inverse of... He uses a weird word here. It's like millennarianism, which is like millennial stuff. Is it? Yeah, it's a millenniarian. But not Arian like you're thinking it's spelled. But millenniarian. And it's like the belief of sort of we're leading, we're on a destination for collapse. But also you're intensely nostalgic about the...

And he makes a point, it's like, you know, all that is is a fixation on every time except the present. Is it a fixation on a coming fundamental transformation of society? Yeah. Is that the idea? Okay. It is, and it's so weird the way it's spelled. It's millenarian. millenarianism at such like it

millennial, millennium, because I want to call it millennialism. It's got the mill in there because it's meant to, containing a thousand, like the source of it is it's like a thousand years or a thousand. Ages or something. It's supposed to be like the end of a thousand ages or something. It's like the end of everything. So it's a millenarian

Fuck English. And just to build the base here of what he's talking about with millenniarism, he says, formerly millennarian doomsaying was the province of priests. but they've become replaced by scientists who explain a myriad of ways that the world will end. The priests of this kind emerged in the Middle Ages, and that's one of the points he makes in the book, that we've seen this phenomenon before going back through at least Europe.

The priests of this kind emerged in the Middle Ages after the mass movement of serfs to the city under mercantilism, thrusting them into a new highly competitive and atomized world. Cultures are forced together, families shattered. This caused a rise in fringe religious sects selling spiritual anarchism and revolutionary millenniarism, which has duplicated presence. So he's saying that this is a phenomena of gurus and saviors.

crazy ideologies usually in response to some kind of social upheaval driven by either politics or technology or some kind of mass migration something that's oftentimes the shattering of kin networks. He tries to explain what the cause of this modern anxiety and angst is, and he describes it in a way that I think a lot of people will like, but I'll just kind of quote him here.

He says, the popularity of technique over sub... in the mechanical age means that deeper questions are made into simple glitches in the march of inevitable progress. This gives birth to a new sort of managerial class, the blue and white collars merging into a gray neckerchief.

where employment is all created by the proliferation of complex technique instead of the tasks themselves. So this would be the managerial class. This would also be living in an advanced society and increased specialization of tasks. idea that you need to master more legalese, you need to master more bureaucracy just to exist in this system. And the more you master these techniques of existing, the more you separate yourself from them.

the actual task you want to be doing and you kind of lose control you move you lose the essence of why you're doing what you're doing and people probably feel this if they work in a white-collar job and you sit back and realize wow My entire job is just sending emails and going to meetings. There's a lot of people who have that experience. It's hard for them to play.

what it is that they do that has a measurable impact on society. They just know they're a cog in this great machine, a machine of such a scale that you can't even see the edges.

he says techniques have a long memory and never go away on their own increasing in complexity and symbiotic and we were just talking about hr like hr that the creation of that role creates increasing complexity in every organization and complexity breeds more complex So the conflict between technique in a rational secular society versus substance of a more traditional society is, it grows exponentially.

And that's why when people exist in that system, they feel so separate from the real meaning of what it is they're doing. And he says, techniques are actually capital itself. You can forego them purposefully, but society is based around their master. It is the desire for increased efficiency and progress without an endpoint, which results in increasing specialization and increasing complexity.

Because technique is rational in nature, it is never created or controlled by anyone in particular. They only seem to give birth to it as midwives. So it's meaningless to speak of human control when technological or technical innovation is concerned. I read that and it reminded me of when we discussed... the recent book, Neurotechnology and National Security and Defense. We're talking about any technological development. When I hear people talk...

about developing neurotechnology or any sort of technology or even dangerous diseases. There's this idea that, well, if we don't develop it, someone else will. Well, if we don't develop these and get ahead of these viruses and master these viruses, any concoction that our minds can come up with, then the Chinese will do it, the Russians will do it, someone will do it. So we, almost as if it is going to be just, the idea that something will be discovered no matter what. I think even...

Nassim Taleb, Nicholas Nassim Taleb, he talks about sort of black box technologies. He kind of spatialized.

the whole field of discovery like there's certain technologies that are bound to be discovered eventually no matter what but that almost removes human agency from like you can't choose not to discover something because it will just get discovered you just need to be one that discovers But that's an interesting phenomenon because that means that everything's out of your control and he's talking about how that feeling right there, the feeling that you have zero control over the course of society.

is what makes humans feel this sort of existential angst. And he was making the case that this is what people were feeling in the 60s and 70s. It was dawning on them post-Industrial Revolution.

We've gotten used to living in a mechanized, specialized society, but we got the sense... suddenly like McLuhan would describe this like we've extended our senses and we've numbed ourselves but we just got like a flash of awareness like oh my god I have no control I don't know where this is going I have no control how the fuck did I get And that inspired this generation, and it's very distinct, this generation, this counterculture.

that's what inspired them to get hyper nostalgic get into obsessed with old america old teachings old anything esoteric very similar to what we're feeling now if anyone here's echoes in here that's because it's the exact same shit we're talking about right now except it's internet except it's hyper reality except it's that times 10 and just kept going right yeah um He says here an example of this would be the automobile which revolutionized society.

from annihilating the relationship of the farmer with the land to creating the suburbs and essentially destroying urban living and how technical innovation breaks from control of the creator immediately.

so we neither create nor control innovation like you know once no the man who invented the car had no idea how the car would be used how it used to like disrupt so much of society it was just taken on this wave out of his control and it wouldn't really matter who invented the car it wouldn't matter because they couldn't They couldn't have stopped the development of eight-lane highways completely severing where people used to live.

He says, as techniques multiply, humans are presented with a multitude of decisions rather than choices. They lose control over their means and ends. Our possibilities increase, but not our freedom. We're at the mercy of machine and technique itself, the same way an Indian is at the mercy of nature. Division of labor and specialization grants an individual as much power as a tribesman has against his environment.

boomers embracing the counterculture were returning to primitivism and rural handicrafts. That was big. These attempts to stand outside of or reject modern technique eventually fail, which is what we talk about all the time. Like, you know, if you're just retreating into the woods to live in your shack, that's not going to stop anything. That's not going to help.

They're having those exact same conversations back then. The only way out is to completely isolate oneself and remove themselves from competition. And so you can't even interface with the culture. The only way to live outside of this is to make it. but you can't rebel against it by removing yourself. He says, here's a coin, I like this. A technician is a man whose mind has been raped by rationality and cannot identify problems existing outside of the technique.

but it cannot address any of the current problems manifest in society. He actually goes back in time here. I'm dealing with a hardcover book so you have to give me a second. He's got a line here showing the history. He says, as I indicated in chapter one, the counterculture factions of the 1960s conform in extraordinary detail with the criteria which historians use to identify revolutionary millennia. those sex emerge in areas and situations whose characteristics were virtually uniform.

When overpopulation occurred in conjunction with rapid economic and social change, the foundations for millennarian upheaval were laid. In Europe, the plague served as just such a catalyst. It struck indiscriminately, and its nature was such that as fact or threat, nothing could be done about it. When the social and economic turbulence of an age is italicized by such a catastrophe, people of all classes gravitate towards membership in millennarian groups.

Those groups whose task is nothing less than the transformation of the world have always tended to be hierarchical elites. with a holy figure, prophet, or deity at the top and the initiates gathered at his feet. There's little doctrinal variation. Almost all hold that after a period of blood and slaughter, war, plague, and famine, an egalitarian utopia will be established to last a thousand years or more.

He points to the end of the counterculture as the end of the military draft. A lot of people would put it around after the protests and the political upheavals ended the draft during the Vietnam War. That's the end point. He argues that the decay actually set in long before that, and he credits that to the left hijacking it. But also, there's another reason he talks about, there's two main reasons why the counterculture

fail I don't even want to say fail because I'll get to that in a second but why it just went away and a lot of people gave their reasons like because I talked to a lot of people about this because I like this book like what happened to the counterculture and they would say well they all got jobs Maybe that has something to do with it, but I don't think employment had much to do with it. You could say maybe they aged out of it, but they'll be like, oh, they sold out. I don't know about that.

say well they got everything they wanted you know they got the end of the draft yeah that was that only came in at the end this was a big social upheaval and it there's no one cause Part of it was the left hijacking and just ruining that organic nature. Another one, and this is why I think it's still relevant, because the left is still doing this. We haven't really dealt with that very well.

The second is that it found itself almost immediately adopted by the mainstream culture as well. So as a counterculture is occurring, you start seeing it represented in movies and in music and in magazines. And in so many ways, people kind of got sick of seeing themselves.

They just got sick of hearing their own words said back to them, almost just looking in the mirror constantly. And that's actually something I think we still deal with now, that whatever counterculture movement we have going on right now. we're not really prepared for being adopted by the mainstream in any way or taking an interest in us and feeding it back to us. That just kills our interest in it. And we see this happen.

even in a more accelerated fashion. Now, like the moment one of our talking points is even adopted by a mainstream talking hat or pundit, we abandon it immediately. We're just sick of seeing ourselves. It feels narcissistic. So that almost kills it because I'm also reminded of... The idea of the super strong. And we discovered this when we talked about Luis Althusser in his book On Ideology. And it's a very Marxist book.

But I think there's a lot of truth in it when he had said that the superstructure is what we might know as the system. Some people might even know it as the Overton window. It is the entire... like a scaffolding of what is acceptable in society. Basically he's saying that anything that truly threatens society or the status quo

is stamped out. And so if there is a rebellion in society, if there is any sort of revolutionary act, it is because it's permitted by society like black lives matter that's a great example that's a total social people why is that permitted by the government by the cops by the media because for whatever reason, they actually didn't see it as an existential threat to theirs.

However, you can tell when it does see an existential threat to the system because it stamps it out with great efficiency, or at least moderate efficiency. They're trying to do that to the January 6th people, but they're not doing a very good job.

But there is like an acceptable level of counterculture in society. And so it's not really revolutionary if it is co-opted by the system itself. And there's a lot to be said that maybe that's... um and i don't think we've really solved for that we don't we don't know what that will make us inert very fast those two things

he says right here what also killed the counterculture was the narcissism imposed by the media forcing the upheaval to behold and copy itself thereby becoming a simulacra immediately it was forced into commoditization This will tenfold affect future What happened here, in my opinion, of the counterculture isn't even necessarily that it failed or went away.

And this is perhaps a more, when I explained this to Pan-European, the man who gave me this book, he said this was probably the most blackpilling interpretation, but it ties into the superstructure theory that I was just saying was that. None of the social subgroups or the movements within the counterculture actually did go away. They were all just absorbed by the mainstream culture.

Acid didn't go away. LSD was supposed to unlock consciousness. We talk about it the same way we talk about DMT now. It's a mind-bending experience that exposes you to machine elves and other dimensions of being. And now that is just something that tech CEOs micro-dosed to attend meetings. Did bell-bottom jeans go away? Not really. Did the music go away? Not really. Did our interest in Eastern religions go away? Not really. Now yoga is just something moms do.

you know my thing is the counterculture didn't actually go away it was it's still with us every single aspect of it in fact that is how you get a Steve job That is how you get jeans in the office and sneakers. Those are the same people. That's that exact same generation. They took it and won, and it was just adopted in the system. Watered down and co-opted and integrated back. folded back.

That is how you get Steve Jobs wearing denim and sneakers and a turtleneck as a CEO and founder, giving a PowerPoint presentation where each slide is Gandhi.

Martin Luther King, Nelson Mandela, all these heroes of the counterculture, it's there. And I think that is, we're not prepared for that. We're not prepared for the commoditization of our... i i really don't think we are i don't think they're we're ready for like when the matron just takes all of our talking points and takes like the great replacement and commoditizes that and just removes it of all its teeth and it and we quote unquote win

we actually get into the mainstream society and then nothing really changes. And again, I don't know what specifically to do about that. He kind of goes into it, and this is where he gets in the title of the book, Decadence. What does he mean by decadence? Because when you hear decadence, you probably think of... Spoiled boy prince eating chocolate upon chocolate, right? Ordering slaves to fight each other. That's not decadence. Decadence is our response to cultural decline.

Decadence is a self-consciousness taken to a pathological extreme, a narcissistic awareness that shakes the relationship with self. Now, for younger listeners, you might know this as being meta. You know, you see this a lot in our spaces where everything is analyzed and analyzed again and repackaged. Every meme is dissected and compared to history and esoteric teachings. Like we are our self-awareness.

in Western society is to such a degree that we don't know how to exist unless we're also standing outside of ourselves. And I'm just as blamed for this as anyone, as are you. I'm going to recount the story he told us. I said this on other interviews, so people forgive me. They're tired of hearing it. But the author, Jim Haugen, he mentioned an anecdote where he was tired of living in America. So he goes to Ibiza. He goes to an island. And back in the 70s, Ibiza wasn't just a place where

Saudi princes spend a million dollars to pee on, you know, whatever it is they want to pee on. This was just like an island paradise. And he went there and he was like, no one has phones here. There's no technology here. It's a real getaway. And you would think that without technology or a connection to the outside world or global events, it would be boring, but no. Everyone is crackling with electricity. and discussions and interaction. And at night, you can see the stars, all that.

they said you know as a western man i felt at odds with this whole experience like i i was raised in decadence i was raised i don't know how to exist in a culture that is not always analyzed and if you think about our news media like how much of our news media is talking about the news media itself How much of our culture is cultural analysis?

we live in a meta culture we live in a culture that's always it's too self-aware and what's worse is when you're raised up on that you don't know how to exist without doing that you don't even know how to be a person without psychoanalyzing yourself. He says that's what decadence says. He says, once a culture declines and collapses, this is what happens when a culture declines and collapses, as does our shared consciousness.

He says, and this is what I was talking about, an American expatriate in another land feels tense after a lifetime of accumulating tactics of decadence like a soldier in between wars. And here's just a line here that kind of summarizes it. It says, totalitarianism will arrive in America through a delegation granted to the administrative state through a succession of crises. that result in permanent meta-crisis rather than arrived at through deliberation or willed by the

It will be seen as a logical response to extreme circumstances each time. Think COVID. All politics can affect is a change in management. It can never solve or reverse the problem. Like Frankenstein's monster taking over the laboratory, he can reproduce the problem to his benefit, but never address the deeper problem of his own creation and existence.

And that was like a fucking thunderbolt in my head. I'm like, Jesus Christ. Just even that imagery was like, yeah, I can take over the controls of the machine that produce this existential malaise, but... I can't really, unless I tear it down. he says a revolutionary must become an enemy of the people an accelerationist that attempts to destroy or weaken the economic system that keeps people so docile this will allow the real

that we did, of making technology subservient to the people rather than the other way around. So this isn't an anarcho-permit. This isn't a Ted Kaczynski guy. This isn't like we need to smash the machines and go back. He's just saying we need to make the machines subservient to us, whereas right now it's the complete inverse. We are just...

We are reproductive organs of machines. And if you remember, when I spoke to Jeff Gareppi, and we discussed his book, The Revolutionary Phenodeon, That's a really extreme example of where the human body, the human reproductive system can become simply a reproductive system for some other greater entity. It's not just a

That's what people are thinking. So I would recommend people go listen to our review of the revolutionary phenotype if you want to hear a worst case scenario of how this can go, but to go into more detail about how this... He says neither revolutionaries nor intellectuals will lead people to the sort of broader counter-revolution that people experienced in the 1960s.

You need a mass refusal and it need to be organic in nature and a broad rejection of the system from the people rather than just an acute rebellion or a reform movement cloaking itself as a revolution, which is what I think we're seeing. And that's pretty much the last part.

Again, this was written in the 70s. There's subsequent books that he wrote that I think might have addressed more modern problems, but I think a lot of what he was talking about is extremely relevant right now. Now, what do you think about it? It's the sort of stuff I kind of suspected. but had put all the pieces together it's really it's really suck

It is, and I don't know what to do about it. And it might sound defeatist or black villain, but I do think he offers some suggestions near the end of what to do. But his solution really is decadence, which is echoed by some other people. Well, they'll look at what we have going for us, which is irony, which is being so cynical that nothing can get to us. A lot of the things that people would think that our weaknesses in our side might very well be our strengths, he would say run towards that.

that's that meta self analysis because that's the only thing we really have going for us he's basically saying that that that decadence can be what shields I had two ideas because you had mentioned this before. One of them, and somebody, I forget the guy, but somebody had been talking about this a lot lately, pointing out that already our movement is being co-opted by outsiders, especially the last couple of months with a lot of the anti-Semitism.

the outside. One of the things is we should not really platforming and allowing in people who are just joining The cutoff point is coming up very soon. It may have already passed where anybody who's been in the movement and has been involved up to this point, they're trustworthy. Anybody who joins... It doesn't matter what their priors are. Ignore them. There's no such thing as a good guy.

in 2025 everybody who's worthwhile joined last year or before that's the end of it no argument okay because it's there's too much opportunity for corrupt Another part of it is the thing that I've noticed over the last few years, the distinction between having principles and beliefs and like a concept of morality and having actual goals. Because it's easy to co-opt principles and beliefs and sell it as a narrative or as a culture, as something that people can be involved in.

But to actually have a goal, you know, like, I mean, I'm talking about a real goal. Like this is a law that we want to have changed. This is a building we want to build. We want people to talk about creating communities, for example. Sometimes they're talking about the idea of. We should have a Discord server where we all are comfortable talking about anti-Semitism. No, how about an actual community? When I say community, I mean I want to have a corner.

within a three-minute walk from my house that's run by a guy who I know and our kids play together. That's what I'm talking about. That's an actual physical goal that takes money and physical... You can't co-opt that, or at least you can't co-opt it from me because it's what I want and I'm going to do it. And maybe that's how you get into these guys who always wind up going into the woods. But I don't think it has to be going into the woods. You know, it could be...

I don't know. I don't know, but I have to hold on to it. You made a good point there of, like, I want a community. Okay, what's your community? Well, I want a district. a telegram chat where i can say whatever i want to say okay well what do you really want to say i want to say slurs like okay but why do you actually want to say Is it because they're a tool you use for something else because you believe in it? Or do you just like the idea of being a guy?

you know what i mean like are you just a is this a fandom or a scene like and that's what we see a lot of a lot of people getting another right right now it's like i'm just a fan of edgy things i want to be edgy adjacent There's people who say politically incorrect things because they believe them and want to action them in the real world. Then there's some people who just like dissident stuff.

are they like edgy things and that's why they're there so for them their end goal is to just be standing beside edgy people i'm like yeah i don't know what to do with you but that's a different sort of community that's a fan Yeah, like if I could live, physically live, like locate myself geographically in a community that was isolated. that maybe wasn't rural, maybe it had 10,000. But those people were all my brothers in terms of faith and culture and race.

And we all got along. I don't think I'd ever say another slur in my life. I think I would be the perfect white picket neighbor. And that's who I want to be. And I wasn't this guy. 15 years ago. I don't want to be a mean guy. I don't want to I don't want to be a pariah Right. I want to be happy and be around people who I love and who love me

You know, so, and that's, that's the goal. And it's never going to, and I said that ironically, it's never going to be discord, right? It has to be, it has to be real. It has to.

in physical space so yeah also it's like i want to my goal is to live in a world where i don't know any of this gay shit but then there's some people who just want to like complain about gay people my perfect world is i don't know any of this gay terminology that they've implanted in my head i don't want to know like i had a a former co-worker who is a very meek but flamboyant. And, you know, he just... The entire office had each other.

and so I got to see i don't go on instagram that much on my personal account but every so often i'd see him and it's like him with his partner was like 600 pounds but every photo they took together it's like hashtag barren Hashtag fetish shit. For them, like, on the beach. Walking on the stones. At a store. At a fucking totem pole. I don't want to know what the fuck that means.

I don't want to know what, like, fag animal shit you've hashtagged. I want to live in a world where that sounds so surreal to me. Like, it sounds random. But I actually know what he means by that. I know that anthropomorphic nonsense. And I want to live in a world where I don't know that. That's my goal.

It's not to be, you know, there's people who want to start a real life community. Then there's those who want to hang out with the people who want to start in real life communities. Those are kind of the people we're talking about, the NG&J. the people who are in it because the Overton window has just shifted, that they got dragged along.

you know i don't i you know those people can be around i just don't need them because those people probably stab me in the back and you can hear these people when they talk I was doing something I shouldn't do. I was listening to Destiny. Every so often a clip comes across my desk and he was actually complaining about a type of person that I've seen before, but I didn't know that other people had noticed him. The question was like, who are the people you hate to debate against?

and he's describing this sort of like leftist progressive person who is like you know coming at him and taking a position of being like pro you know trans rights or something is like why are you pro trans rights and they speak in this sort of like vocal fry aloof raising your sense at the end kind of like um because i'm person i don't like why do you like okay so why do you believe this um why do you not i mean i just like good things and I guess like it's a combination of

Morgoth's hatchling thing, where you're always acting confused, but also acting like it's absurd that you would believe that, and the naked simplicity of your position should be apparent, but you want to debate people. There's that personality. that guy i hate that guy but there's like there's our version of that too um anyway this has gone on a bit too long i know we gotta get going so anyway that's a great book it's called decadence by jim haugen i promise i'll stop bringing it up in every

At this point, I want to borrow it from you when you're done with it. When you come up this week, I can give it to you. It's actually a nice quality book. It's not the easiest book to find. This is a used copy. You can find it on Archive, but it's hard to find this on Amazon. It's even hard to find it on the Library Genesis stuff if you're hunting a town. You can find his other stuff, but not this one. But anyway, that's great. I'll let you go. Good talk. Hey, man, for real. I'll see you.

to comment. Welcome back, everyone. I hope that you're all doing well. Joining me today is one of my favorite people to talk to, really in the entire space, just because he and I get along so well. He has a tendency to send long voice messages in my Telegram chat that are always bangers. But before I get any further, I'm talking today with none other than Dimes, the co-host of the Blood Satellite podcast.

i'm doing very very well thank you so much for having me similarly you're you leave long voice messages too and they're always a treat and you're one of the few guys that i can talk to about the thing that we're going to talk about on the show because it's really weird and very few people have like the mind to like so hopefully we can get a few other people on our way.

Yes. I don't want people to think that we're just blowing smoke and sending smoke signals up our rear ends like this is some sort of Indian circle jerk. But what I do want to make people understand is that this is going to be a rather meta-heavy conversation. in that if the title I keep with today's recording, which we're recording on January 22nd, 2024, it is 7.40 p.m. my time when this is being recorded, the title for it is going to be Time and Technology.

And this is a meta-conversation because Dimes has recently tuned me in to a great Canadian scholar by the name... He wrote quite a few books. One of the ones that I am reading is The Bias of Communication. And you had recently gone over on your show, I believe it was called Communication and Empire.

That's right, yeah, Empire Communication. That's the one I read. Like you said, he's an author of a great many, but yeah, that was the one I like, and I just want to get to the rest of his stuff, too. Yeah, and alongside Ennis, we're also probably...

on the late and great Marshall McLuhan. So it's really going to be a Canadian-heavy focused discussion this evening. But the reason why we're doing this is because... I think Dimes and I, and I think everyone is to some extent fundamentally aware that our sort of online policy

where we all become critics and we're all screaming into this void of screams as i like to call it or we're all taking sort of a digital ayahuasca or dmt i'm just throwing everything out that i like to use with uh describing this Definitely has neurochemical effects, neuroplasticity impact alongside totally altering our perception of time.

sargon of akkad like either delisted or or hid away his vast video backlog of him as sargon uh he had this great video up from 2017 called you know what happened at vidcon 2017 and it had the ben garrett commercial or comic of him being yelled at as a garbage human being by Anita Sarkeesian. And every time I look at it, I just feel like that much older. I'm like, this happened 6,000 years ago. This is like reading the pictogram.

hieroglyphs in ancient egypt in the valley of the kings and you're like what is this ancient lore and the reason why you feel that way is because you know 2017 is only a little over it's been seven years and and but in our online space it feels like six or seven thousand because of how

plugged in and how fast the quote-unquote discourse changes topics like does you know for instance I think it was a little over a year and a half ago that and this is no insult to the guy I just know that he had this big meltdown of sorts on Twitter, C.A. Bond sort of just talking about, you know, who's taking teal? like that and it's just like if you're not plugged into these things you don't have a complete historiographic picture of what

And that totally alters your perception of time in a way that I don't think a pre-social media world was completely aware of. Even in the early internet days of Usenet or Dial-up. So this is a very meta-heavy conversation, but how do you see yourself, Dimes, perceiving time, or how much do you think it's changed?

compared to your to your real life or your your real job working in marketing advertising yes thank you that's a big question and i got a couple things i want to say that the first is anecdotal um my wife is five And we had a conversation not long. Or she just made some comments like, you remember MySpace? oh my god and of course myspace was was within her lifetime but it wasn't within her frame of reverence it was like just a couple years older but the fact that i remembered myspace

There's a lot of listeners right now that might not know what the fuck that is, and that's kind of the point. The idea that that was a demarcation point, even though that was just a type of social network. it was kind of mind-blowing or like there's some people who can remember 9-11 and those who don't um but a couple of phenomena i found were interesting so the first is that marshall mccluhan in his book i'm not getting

I'm going to keep this one short. Marshall McLuhan, in his book, which we'll discuss, Understanding Media, Extensions of Man, he talks about the creation of utility time, that up until the Industrial Revolution and up until clocks... um which is pre-industrial revolution but around the same time we started conceptualizing the recording of time differently now we always recorded time understood, noon and things like that with sundials. But there was a shift that occurred.

Around the time when we started measuring time with clocks, that clocks seemed to be each second or minute or hour was like a container and it contained work and it contained labor. And so you saw a different. spatialization of time, like time is going to have things you can do or your day, and it kept breaking down smaller and smaller and smaller.

And what I've noticed over time as well is that the way we measure generations is becoming more smaller and more discreet. So even the idea of measuring a generation previously, like the boomers, Gen X. i think that's around like 20 years uh we put a lot of focus on that to the point where we treat generations like they're different teams that we're a part of even though we're just links on the exact same chain it's like it's millennials versus boom

or boomers versus gen x it's a strange way of looking at it um and i don't really like that but putting that aside what i found is as the generations have progressed We've introduced this idea of an early millennial. I'm a late millennial. This person's an early millennial. We've started fragmenting the generations themselves into thirds or half. because the profundity in which we're measuring the time is getting smaller and smaller and smaller.

And it seems that that's going to keep continuing. And so that's how it's changed over my lifetime. And that's anecdotally with me and my wife. But I think that's a lot of people's. shared experience that even within our scene we talk about how the past five years have been radical and i think part of that's cultural part of that's technology there's a lot of factors at play for why I think that's probably as good an answer as anybody think about that.

well like we said before we decided to record it we we also i think understood that this is somewhat of a very western conversation to be having i mean this is very meta this is a very meta textual discussion that i think we're going to try and dive into as well which makes you wonder how many other people are sort of thinking the sort of same stuff But when I hear how you describe it, you're absolutely right. Our perception of generation has radically, you know, it's become more.

I had a conversation not too long ago because my cousin, who was born in 2000, she just recently got married and she's having a... And my mother was helping out, just sort of helping get the baby shower. she was just like there's no gratefulness and she was now she's gen x and she's complaining about sort of zoomer you know lack of gratefulness and she's like are all young people like this and i said well most young people in my own perception are

view things as transactional. There's no understanding of charity or doing something out of the goodness of your heart without people expecting for you to pay them back somewhere down the line. And I said, that definitely warps your ability to understand human relations that way. And I said, I don't know when that really starts.

but i can tell you that that's what i see and what i know and then she's like well are you like that and i said well no but i was also raised differently but also there's a big five and a half between her and I so I can't even tell you what her or how she is, like she's on Snapchat. on all these other social media apps that I'm not on. And I make it an effort to not really be on a lot outside of what's necessary to run this weird little world that I am.

amphibious reactionary individual. But outside of that, I try not to be on it with my real name or anything. I have no. outside of the Prudentialist. And even then when I'm on here. You know, we talk about things.

in a manner of character arcs. We talk about lore. That's partially, I think, due to sort of like the gamification of our vocabulary, like video games have inferred a sort of linguistic... circumlocution understanding of how we talk about things like oh he's on his like you know like i remember dating somebody and she was like oh i'm on an x kick like oh she's gonna do something for a little bit and then lose interest or whatever because people do that

But, you know, when people say they're on an ex-kick now on Twitter or whatever, it's like, no, they're on a character arc. They're on this, like, you know, episode. They treat their shows like television.

or episodes of certain things like a DLC or a video game expansion pack. And it's just very strange to see how we... allowed our our mediums to radically transform our perception of time but also our sense of self-identification and what we do and I mean everyone likes to make instance, that, oh, there are numerous studies that illustrate that pornography usage, especially online pornography.

has that sort of like cocaine addicts habit. It totally warps your neuroplasticity. It hardens it. It makes it very hard to break the habit to the point of where like guys can't get it up with real life. and so you know if that's true for like porn usage then god only knows that it's going to be that way for you know enhanced twitter usage or online doom scroll

And I think as McLuhan says, it can be an extension or it can be a self-amputation. And I think one of the things that McLuhan doesn't talk about in Understanding Media, I think he mentions it in the Gutenberg Galaxy. But it's not so much that it's an amputation, but in a postmodern sense, it's just de-territorializing. from the real space into an existing sort of

newosphere, meme flex or whatever. We're all in these different spaces mentally. Like, oh, I know that there are like X number of factions in this little space of mine. And I know that if you name one or two of them, they're all going to get up. try and mass report your account or whatever and so then you have to be very careful about how you navigate

And then you let that language slip in real life. Like good luck explaining to somebody why like taking a Lindy walk is something that you do every Saturday afternoon, right? Like good luck with that. And that's the way that people are in this space, which I find to be particularly interesting because you see it. elsewhere in other online communities. It's just that we're so cut off from one another in doing that. And I'll give one anecdote.

in that I turned off, I accidentally clicked Going Cognito on my YouTube trying to go click my settings and one of the videos that came up when i was incognito one was a whole just a bunch of tick tock because I pay for YouTube premium, sue me. But it was this documentary about the history of quote-unquote object games, which is this whole sub-genre of YouTube.

where they basically take random inanimate objects and they treat them like they're real anthropomorphic and that they're in like a survivor style game show and then the audience interacts and votes off who's who's to leave the eye and how certain things have these metanarr- critique of the whole genre and these things get millions and millions and millions of views. I'm talking like 22 to like 60 million views for some.

And it was blowing me away that such a thing exists. And I had no idea that it was even a thing. It was like, you know, just finding this random civilization out in the middle of nowhere, like in the Atlantic Ocean. And you're just like, what? And then I just quickly turned. I watched the whole doc.

just blown away that this whole subgenre entertainment for children and preteens or zoomers or whatever so is this new or is this like an old type of me because this is blowing my mind too I don't know that was the thing because it's like this started in like 2015 or 2014 and it's been going on and I was like I had no idea it existed but then again I wasn't growing up during that time I was already going to college.

just like this is new to me and I felt like I was just uncovering some uncontacted civilization that had not been entirely politicized and it was like oh there's like a refuge for political innocence and then I quickly turned off my incognito and went back to watching a more goth video because I have problems, you know. So that's my spiel.

Morgoth is one of the more soothing creators in our scene, even though he can be somewhat cynical. But who doesn't like Morgoth? You can put that on TV right now and he'd make a million fucking dollars. There's a lot of guys in our scene where I'm like, if they went... He could actually have. You mentioned a lot of really interesting things there. One thing I'm going to circle back to is the kind of dimension about lore and you talk things like that.

The phenomena, even on a lower strata than that, is the idea of the rabbit hole. The idea that you can decide to just be extremely, let's just say autistic or do a deep dive on one topic and within one evening know everything there is to know about that one specific topic. And that's almost like seeking out information overload. And what's interesting is you see that replicated in a lot of different areas of society.

Binge watching would be another. And I could think of maybe even just one or two generations ago, the idea of watching like seven hours of one thing would give people migraines that they'd want to blow. It doesn't take long to go back in time to find someone who cannot consume media and information the same way we do right now. The idea of like, I'm just going to listen to nine hours of this podcast while I'm watching.

Or I'm going to watch an entire season of a show in one day. That's insane. But we do that all the time. mid-girls do that all the time. And that used to be the purview of, like, of fucking Nash from A Beautiful Mind. So that's the culture we live in of persistent information overload. And we become acclimated to it. And the real question is, can we ever step back from that? And people talk about, you know, everyone's got low attention spans right now. Yes.

The trade-off is that you can parse through more information faster. Whether that's good or bad depends on the information being blasted at you. But it's interesting that people seek that out. And in fact, you mentioned there also... McLuhan discussed the idea of auto amputation. So he mentioned this in the book. So people don't know, this is kind of, it's an interesting idea. I'm going to try and explain this as simple.

And this is probably the best place today to explain it. So what McLuhan talks about is that media, and he uses media in a very specific way, media are extensions of ourselves. So the subtitle of the book is Understanding the Media, the Extensions of... So what media does is it extends our immediate human. So language is a media that we use and the written word is an extension of that.

Now he can get into the weeds on that a bit where he says clothing is like an extension of the skin. You can see what he means, but sometimes he also says like wheels are a media extension. Sometimes I quibble over that, but the general idea is that we extend our senses outward into the world, which opens up the possibility for information overload. And he basically says that anytime you extend your sense, you almost auto amputated. So it becomes.

anytime you make information communication or information retrieval easier you almost need to numb yourself like opening up like severing a limb like you need to numb it otherwise you'll go into shock and you'll pass out you don't know what to do with that much sensation So he mentions that the age, the electrical age of communication is also the age of app. It's the age.

of the depression. It's the age of total information, submersion, but also you feel nothing. We feel less than we've ever felt before. And like another phenomenon would be, you know, you can make as many friends as ever before. There's people over a thousand friends of social media. Are those true, vibrant friendships? Of course they're not. They're kind of numb, but that means you can have more of them in a sense. So there's a numbing that goes along.

And interestingly, this was occurring to me as I was getting ready for the show, just coming back to Kierkegaard. Kierkegaard and his description. angst and angst is an idea that people they think they know but they don't really angst like oh i'm angsty i'm uncomfortable but what angst is it's the incongruity between what you feel like right now and what you think you can achieve. It's like this tension. You feel like I'm not where I should be. I can conceptualize very vividly where

should be, but I'm not there. And that gives me this really, really rotten feeling. And so you could say that that comes with awareness, that comes with self. And so that comes with information too. It's all part of the same information overload and awareness building that's taken place over the past few hundred years, the past few centuries. And that's so when people say, why do I feel like there's no reason I should feel depressed. There's no reason I should feel.

this numb because on paper materially technologically this should be utopia but it's not This is now what utopia feels like. And so this, I think, at least begins to understand why you're living in kind of an insane paradigm. Now you're in a paradigm where as a human being, your senses are extended so much in every direction in instantaneous media that you kind of have to become numb to everything.

Yeah, and McLuhan talks about this, and for those who want to understand the book that we're referring to here, Understanding Media, if you are a patron channel member or Substack subscriber, you will get access to a lengthy discussion with myself and my patrons. this book when we talk about it this Saturday on the 27th so by all means reasons to support the channel and the work but in the chapter chapter 4 the gadget lover, narcissist is narcosis. I'm just going to give some quotes here.

particularly important to that discussion Our language has expressions that indicate the self-amputation that is imposed by various pressures. We speak of wanting to jump out of my skin or of going out of my mind, being, quote, driven batty or flipping my lid. We often create artificial situations that rival the irritations and stresses of real.

under controlled conditions of sport and play. And for starters, you can already think of something like people who like to play high stress games or do challenges.

uh speed runners or or video game players like those who like to do dark souls uh you know uh soul level one challenges that i i have done because i think it's fun but at the same time it's insanely frustrating something wrong, but we create these sort of pressures with deadlines or our ability to keep up the cloud chasing or just to be in quote the. but later on in the chapter he has a particularly interesting point here about electronic technology and again this was written

or our form of computers or the internet or anything like that. But I'm going to read this here. a live model of the central nervous system itself to the degree that it is so it is a development that suggests a desperate and suicidal auto amputation as if the central nervous system could no longer depend on the physical or protective buffers against the slings and arrows of the outrage

It could well be that the success of mechanicalizations of various physical organs since the invention of printing have made too violent and super stimulated a social experience for the central nervous system to endure. And I'll stop there in part because I think that hits two key factors. One. is that I think auto amputation can also serve as an effective form of de-territorialization. We literally uproot ourselves and our culture and our understanding. This is what I call digital deracination.

and we re-implant and we re-territorialize. uh these new sort of subcultures these languages these ideas these perceptive worldviews this is why even normie large account youtubers right they talk about burnout they talk about psychological stress

Some very close viewers of my channel will know that I like some of those long hour video essays critiquing video games because I can put that on in the background while I work or whatever. So like Patricia T. he works with a guy named private sessions and then all of a sudden private sessions has a mental breakdown and thank god he's better but like you know he did the work that he was doing kind of like messed with him and it gave him anxiety

And so we can be overstimulated by what we do, by the notifications or balancing things out or just muting every tweet that we send out on the air. But at the same time, especially what I find... a Christian is that when I hear outside of itself, I hear the word discarnate. We are no longer living physically.

we're living as an extension of the incarnate world and not focusing on incarnate things, i.e. the incarnate word of God, the Logos, the Black Man. And now we're living in a space outside of... Sort of this weird sort of mechanical thaumaturgy that tells me, you know, I can exist in this space outside of space and I can conduct conversation and be exposed. that I shouldn't have been able to communicate

more recently. We can see machine elves or whatever when we take these drugs, but when I take the digital drug, yeah, I see machine elves and demons all the time. I see people signing up for Ayala's birthday orgy on my timeline, and I get really depressed. Well, you mentioned a lot of good things there. And one thing, just a quote from the book again, and to maybe circle back so people really understand what we're talking about.

Electricity is a central theme of the book, and it's easy to overlook electricity and the importance of electricity because we live our lives surrounded.

the time but um i think mcclellan would have lived in an era where computers were coming up like he would have passed away before we know it but i think he he saw what was coming with computers um and i always would love But in terms of electricity, what electricity did, and this really hasn't, what he says in the book is no one has really stopped to really apprehend the importance of electricity on our minds. information. So what does it mean by that? Well, prior to like

You still had the industrial revolution. You still had the mechanization. And the Industrial Revolution was another pair. in mind where we started everyone started to think more logically we were very very process driven but also very linear so we could think in very complex processes and we the the average citizen was demanded to, you know...

absorb this new way of thinking of process-driven stuff into their everyday lives. However, what electricity did was it destroyed that process entirely, made everything instantaneous. so the idea that everything can be operating all at once was like another paradigm shift that really changed and like younger generations kind of get this

It's less A, B, C, D, and more of an interconnected complex matrix. Like you even mentioned there, like, you know, electronic machine elves in parallel dimensions. The average person can apprehend really the idea of interdimensional communication from entities is something even like your mom. There was a time when no one would understand that, but the average person could actually comprehend the concept of a multiverse and play around with that even in Marvel.

And it's not just A, B, C, D. It's like this interconnected, some things change other things, but you can keep a lot of those plates spinning in the air. So electricity... I don't think that's McLuhan was like one of the first guys to really say that changed how we do.

And a lot of ideologies were birthed by Marxism, fascism. A lot of these emerged from the Industrial Revolution. I don't think there's really been an ideology or any sort of... system that's emerged from the information We're still playing with 19th and 20th century ideas that don't really work in this new instantaneous paradigm, this de-territorialized paradigm. And there's a quote here. There's another quote from the book. I'll just read it quickly if you don't mind. He says,

The greatest of all reversals occurred with the electricity that ended sequence by making things instant. With instant speed the causes of things began to emerge to awareness. Just before an airplane breaks the sound barrier, sound waves become visible in the wings of the plane.

The sudden visibility of sound, just as sound ends, is an apt instance of the great pattern of being that reveals new and opposite forms just as earlier forms reach their- he says in the electric age this is what you're saying before in the electric age when our central nervous system is technologically extended to the whole of mankind and to incorporate the whole of mankind in

we necessarily participate in depth in the consequences of our every action. It's no longer possible to adopt the aloof and disassociated role of the literary. So I really like those two lines that shows like the sea change of the electric age that I still don't think most people have really appreciated. And what do you think about that? I think the point that you make about playing around with 19... 20th century ideas in the midst of this new technology.

true. I mean, there's a certain class of, I don't want to say class, probably the wrong word, there are certain, I guess, group or faction or individuals that are more focused on things about, you know, complex systems or how do we adapt to a constant changing level of institutions, ideas, technologies that mean that things are not abiding by.

20th or 19th century models of government or communication or propaganda, which I think is innately true. I mean, the question that was posed one time in a more goth video to reference him again, my comment earlier wasn't to. to uh to denigrate i just listened to a lot of his old content for and sometimes to try and get on the editor's block but it was uh he was having this conversation about the idea of posing

What would happen if a place like Google, the company, wanted to declare war on a country? And, you know, we have that sort of played out in this sort of science fiction world a lot. Cyberpunk or of, I don't know, that one Call of Duty game with Kevin Spacey, I guess Advanced Warfare or something like that, where it's played in the near future.

i played that one you know i i didn't play it i really stopped playing call of duty i think after black ops but that's a whole other conversation for another time but you know i i know that uh the u.s military works very closely with them i'm sure closely with them so that's a fun way to look at where that game might have been predictive programming but uh you know it was a fun question that he posed because that's kind of a reality to some extent

like Microsoft or Google doing, but taking advantage of various nation states tax havens that those nations governments put up to have them there. Right. And to have the benefit. While at the same time, they're constantly going to war with places like the European Union, who loves to regulate these things. And how well do they hold up in court versus how easy it might be to take advantage of America's leadership? you know, find ways to screw over the consumer, your meta.

I think that that's very true is that we don't have the capability of being aware of what kind of world we live in. Or we just take it for granted. We just say, oh, it is what it is.

find it absolutely mind-blowing and i mean my twitter engagement is shit because i always uninstall the app and i don't think very much during the weekends and i do that very deliberately it's a form of a be on it 24 7 but you know and this isn't a humble brag or anything it's like 24 000 people fall that's an insane number orders of magnitude higher than dunbar's My brain has these compartmentalized spaces where I can recognize

regular members of chat or someone, or I even met this person in real life at a conference once. He's like, oh, I'm so-and-so. I'm alien robot anthropologist. And I'm like, I remember you because you're one of the first people that ever commented on my channel like three. That's a crazy thing that my brain should not know in comparison to the fact that I know doesn't.

dozens more people in real life trying to make it sound really hard like I have a thriving social life I mean I do but it's like it's crazy that my brain has this dualism to it where I can like turn off online brain or try to turn and then turn on offline in real life brain because we work very closely to not tell people too much about our like real life personal details. Like I say, I live in the middle of nowhere.

And I also try to make sure that people don't know exactly where I'm at because you don't want your online life crossing too over much into your real life. So I think unless you're part of it, or you take the time to seriously think about it, I think McLuhan is right, even 60 plus years ago, that we take for granted this awareness. And some people are just blissfully.

because either they were raised in it or that's just the culture and they've been programmed and conditioned psychologically to just accept the terms of how it is. Some people I've noticed kind of fit very naturally as just passive consumer. Whereas others want to be the reply guy. They want to be the thread guy. They want to be the... I'm going to find a specific weird niche. And that's going to be my thing. And it will be my...

Because I want to conquer this intangible digital space. Because it is mine. Because to some extent I think the Bronze Age pervert is very right man. And where other place to do that in the 21st century. In part because no one's doing like rebellion. or we're not joining the French Foreign Legion to go kill Algerians or whatever. Instead, we're trying to ratio the Sunday Times, or we're trying to ratio Trudeau, or there's this guy called Middle Earth Mixer on Twitter that always puts a picture.

or ripping a Peter to ratio news journalists and such. That's the space. And because our social media stuff, to reference the book one more time, is so gamified, our awareness... These things affect us so McLuhan says and this is in the chapter on Games, then, are contrived in a controlled situation extensions of group awareness that permit a respite from customary patterns.

They are a kind of talking to itself on the part of society as a whole. On the talking to oneself is a recognized form of play that is indispensable to any growth of self-consciousness. The British and the Americans have enjoyed during recent times an enormous self-confidence born of the playful spirit and the fun of games. When they sense an absence of this spirit in their rivals, it causes embarrassment.

To take mere worldly things in dead earnest betokens a defect of awareness that is pitiful. Again, it's a very Anglo sense of, like, oh, we like games. I think the only other group that really enjoy games as much as we do may be the Japanese and the Koreans.

But we love our organized sport. We love our cricket. We love our football. We love our American football. We love our golf, our hockey, etc. Because it's a way to identify with another group that isn't necessarily ours, like my dad's side of the family. and they all live there. So everyone, by nature of my own birth, I am innately a Green Bay Packers fan, even though I'm not really a big NFL guy. And the fact that our digital world is incredibly gamified and they're designed on purpose.

We're in these contrived but very controlled situations. We have a TOS that we like to often skirt the line of what kind of weird stuff can we say on Twitter. You can't say, well, you can't.

now advocate for something like i don't know traditional neighborhood development but you know you also know that you maybe can't say that somewhere else in the same way that depending on what we say you know that can get us banned but it's not these respite from customary worldly patterns because it's not it's not a respite and in fact this other space these controlled and contrived actually affect the real world in a very linguistic and very spatial sense of where discourse and ideas are

That's why it was such a big deal for right-wing Twitter to have their tweets read off on air when Tucker Carlson was still working. And so I think that that's a big thing that I don't think we've even talked about. Not just the right in general, but I mean people. outside of a few papers written by the Atlantic Council or the Santa Fe Institute, where we do live in a very gamified world.

and that's something that i don't think people realize outside of i think well i mean i think frody kind of gets into it when he talks about like nationalist narnia because he kind of knows how actually the stuff is the real world but when you're on the internet you know like oh i can like tell some tranny on twitter like you'll or whatever, and they're like, yeah, yeah, I did the thing. I owned the libs. And then, well, you really did. like your country's still being invaded by third world.

if you don't mind me asking what's the nationalist narnia concept if it's the same frody that i'm because i interviewed you just talked to him um no i uh the whole nationalist narnia is the the idea and i'm going to butcher it because i haven't talked to But his nationalist Narnia was just like, we use the internet to sort of like propagate our ideas.

And then we don't do anything in the real world and that we think what we do online, like that's all that we have to do. And so people can be very unserious. and live in a world where oh yes like starting tomorrow this account at you know like iron iron griper

It's like, I'm going to deport all of the migrants. And it's just like, but you're not, right? And you're going to log off and you're going to go to your shitty wage cage. Or you're going to tweet on company time. And that's sort of his criticism. And I think that that's the acknowledgement. but I've been rambling for far too long. You can't interrupt. CAN'T INTERRUPT.

Okay, because you said so many good things, and I don't want, whenever I interrupt or anyone interrupts, they lose their training, and they got like seven things I wanted to comment on. But I think I'll comment on the last part because I know I'm going to forget this and I don't know where I'll fit this part in. So now's the best time. There's this book I was reading recently. that I'm just about finished. I'm going to talk about it on my show. Blood Saddle.

It's called Decadence by Jim Haugen. This was written in the 70s. And a fan of the show, a friend of the show, sent me a hardcover copy. It's not the easiest book. But this guy was a journalist and he was writing on the counterculture of the 60s. So this would have been the boomer.

um people think they know what that was it was hippies maybe they heard huntress thompson talk about that time but it's a lot more complex than people think i'm not going to explain the entire thing right now but The one part he was talking about was the concept of cultural Because what had happened was, I'll just say this, the dissident right... the broad milieu that we're in right now is almost line for line and beat for beat.

what the counterculture movement in the 60s was, including where it ended up right before it fizzled out, which was people saying, we need to create a parallel society. We need to go off grid. We got to start building compounds. There was an anarcho-primitivism. There was a fascination with reading old books and mysticism and essence.

there was a lot that was very very similar and of course the interest is well how did that fail because that seemed into this now there's a couple reasons why it failed but One thing he had mentioned was And. They fail for the same reason we're probably going to fail because we're stuck in this sort of cultural decadence because we understand. that the society is too big and too powerful to really affect with any sort of internal revolution, barring a total collapse.

So we enter into this meta-life. We become, every single one of us, sort of pathologize our self-awareness. that the life of a Westerner right now, and he gives a great anecdote. Later in the book, he says, you know, I was fed up with America. I had to get out. You have to do what every white guy wants to do. You got to get out of your homeland and just go where the natives are. So he goes to Ibiza.

Or as they call it, Ibiza. But I don't like pronouncing it like that. So it's Ibiza. And it goes there. And again, this is in the 70s. He goes there, and he's fascinated that that entire island, no one's got a phone. They don't really give a shit about what's going on in the outside world. And you would think that would make them culturally dead. Quite the opposite. It's crackling with energy and gossip and communication and people are lively. There's a different sort of energy.

that he falls in love with for a minute and then he realizes he's like i i can't exist in this culture because this culture doesn't know how to stand outside of itself. He, being a Western man, a white American, he can only understand culture as something you stand outside of, like we all do. And I'm sure, you know, in Gio Pinochetti's... she should be. He would understand, like, everything is a metacom...

Every meme, we have to remove it. What does this mean in relation to something else? We overanalyze everything because that's all we really have left. And that's what became of the boomers and the counterrevolution. It became commoditized. and commodified too fast. And that barring any sort of collapse, you're saying that the only thing we can really bring to the table is intense sort of meta-analysis of the culture itself. And that becomes the only culture.

And that's fascinating when you consider like, what is the cable news? Within my lifetime, cable news media became a giant cultural organism to talk about the news media itself. Isn't that weird? Isn't it weird how much the news media talks about? all the time and meta analyzes what the pundits are doing like it's it's pathological it's it's an insane way to live but we actually wouldn't know how to live if we were deposited in any

previous culture. And part of that goes along with the development of psychoanalysis in the West that we keep also psychoanalysis. You can't just be. Everyone has to have some kind of mental illness. But that's almost a different tangent entirely. Before I go on, what do you think about that? Because I have a couple other points based on what you said. What do you think about that?

I think that there's a point where even this space itself has people that are offering commentary. I mean, what is e-drama, right? We love to talk about drama. We love to talk about fights. It's just, like, it's quasi-theatrical, right, to borrow the pro wrestling kayfabe stuff. But, like, also, you know, why is it that people, like, this isn't a shit on them or anything. I just find that the whole thing... Why is it that people like PPP and Andy Worski on the Kino Casino?

thousands of dollars a stream. talking about drama and talking about and talking about the people who talk about drama yes yes in the same way that the news media talks about the people who talk about the news media which happens to be like rachel maddow who works like three blocks down the street in the same like

whatever at MSNBC's office or whatever right like that's a very we're replicating the same phenomenon also I think that you're very much right that we are a lot like new age old left progressive hippies from like the new left of the 50s that was, listen, we're not communists, we don't like them, but we're also not right-

uh to some extent but also we know that communists ended up winning um both world war ii and the cold war so like and also let me just pause you there and one of the things he points on the book again not to spoil it listen to blood satellite But the point of the book is like the countercultural movement was actually this really complex social upheaval. It was like an ecosystem of a lot of different things that was in effect hijacked by the new.

said it really the conflagration for them was vietnam and they tried to put their stamp on everything but he's like if you look at how counter revolution like what was it it was like an interest in eastern mysticism it was a rejection of a lot of the news media it was a lot of just things that seemed to spontaneously happen that if you ask people now, it's like, oh yeah, that was a leftist thing. Not really. They just have a tendency, as all communists do.

to try and put their stamp on the shit people are doing themselves and corral it into the same space. And that's one of the things that killed it, essentially. They tried to politicize what was a genuine and decentralized populist reaction to the modern American post-war lifestyle. Well, I'm sort of creeping. first person to make that point. Maybe if he's gotten it from the same book, I don't know. This is the reason why I tell people to read people like William.

who would be part of that movement. And if you read him nowadays, you're like, oh, he kind of reads like a leftist. But no, he is reacting to the American way of life. Although, and also America's foreign policy. He's got two great books.

empire's a way of life where he totally shuts down like the boomer con cause you know we don't want foreign wars and it's like no america's always been like this like really cool swashbuckling white man filibustering like his neighbors and it's like awesome but at the same time like that isolationism is a total myth Our good friend Clossington has a lot to say on that. Yes, he does. His history article on the history of...

Not only would I recommend that, I would say that's one of the more important geopolitical sub-stats. some people might think that's too grandiose but there's a lot that's bound up in that sub stack over let's just say a lot of people that might be getting more play not you but some other people If I won't name them, why did I even say it? I don't know. Anyway, continue. Go ahead.

No, well, the reason why I say that Williams is actually someone I think really important to read on this quote-unquote dissident right, and the question is, is, like, those guys were somewhat of an organic reaction. Whereas how much of ourselves, right, are perhaps byproducts? prior to the shutdown. that quote unquote pipeline. The one thing that the liberal in 2017 State and Society report was is that there was a pipeline from.

libertarian atheist skepticism stuff to what at the time was called the alt-right. Like they were correct about that. I don't think anyone would tell you that that isn't the case because when I see people in the comments talking about where they started versus where they are now. I see a confirmation. there was a quote-unquote pipeline. I do see a lot of people who get upset and they fight with all these other groups that are sort of reacting.

say the spirit of the age or or what jimmy carter would have called the great malaise or what the southern agrarians would have criticized our sort of consumer capitalist cultures and i'll take my stand which i think even non-southern should read and even non-Americans as well. I think you would find it fascinating.

But when you look at those guys and even ourselves, like you see these all these little disparate groups sort of coming to conclusions where the path that we're currently on sucks. But we also sound like progress. You know, 20 years ago, the whole raw milk thing was definitely a hipster, like new age wine. right? Pacific Northwest. But nowadays it's just a bunch of like hulked out six foot three white guys that are like, yeah, I sun my balls and I drink.

screw the system and we do have this counter-cultural thing to it all which is funny when you hear that the national review for like the last 30 years has been saying like oh yeah conservatism is the new punk rock and it's like your brand of concern like Petty Lincola meets Ted Kaczynski, but meets Nick Lange. weird, mishmash, mind-bending.

oh absolutely and because we're we're simultaneously uh amputating our our sense of self away from say and to some extent this is kind of we say blood like some people on the right will be like very hardcore identitarian and they'll be like very much blood and soil but at the same time the conceptualization of blood and soil in 2024 to some extent not all um before i get a whole bunch

A lot of it is, though, online, which is de-territorialized from the actual land that you're on. And so this is where you end up, like, scratching, quote-unquote, like, base... you know, 15, 18 or whatever. And then all of a sudden, like you look behind the account and you realize that some guy from Columbia talking about how we need to save the West. And it's a strange place to be in because that amputation that McLuhan talks about also is a great signifying tool of amputation.

Because I had this conversation with Conscious Karakoff. over at AFRI Forum. And he had told me... that he says i found it really weird one time i was walking downtown and i saw someone south african boar looks like me you know probably has we probably know each other some way somehow but he's speaking into his phone and perfect america And, you know, referring to things with American manners.

and i was like that's a really impressive like way to like of imperial hegemony in terms of like cultural soft power type deal like language and tools media. And that's sort of America's greatest export is it's soft power cultural stuff, which has its own. If you want to, if you want to talk about some three letter acronyms for what that could be, by all means, be my guest. But like when you're exporting like gay.

the global you know like or the american race system as curtis jarvin likes to call it you can call it something else if you want but it does illustrate i think to me and i'll finish your point here is just that Even how you said it, Ibiza, right? And they call it Ibithia, right? Like, who do we have to blame for that? Well, we can blame that songwriter and singer, Mike Posner, right? He took a pill in Ibiza. The only reason why I know of that place's existence initially until I read off.

And because we are the... people who enjoy games. We live in sort of gamified systems. We have this sort of self pride. and we look at other people differently like before we went on the air we were like well who else thinks in such a meta textual kind of way who thinks in this this metaphysical understanding of the world outside of like the very technological the Asiatic countries that were westernized after World War II.

And that, to me, there's people that want to return. And there is sort of a techno-skeptical undercurrent to a lot of people in the dissident right. Some are techno-optimists. But the technoskeptics kind of want to go back to some kind of Abithya-style culture where they have something they can talk about it. In the same way, I think people are desperate.

because they they feel unhappy right like we were saying but when they try and go somewhere else that maybe hasn't experienced that quote-unquote first contact with electricity or first contact with the digital they're still strangers even in that world that they tried to achieve and not to not to crap on some people.

religious spaces. But I mean, it's very interesting, especially as myself, I'm Eastern Orthodoxy, but listening to other people who are in the online spaces of that religion, which I avoid with some rare acceptance. And to see people who are walking into a religion that never experienced the Renaissance or the Enlightenment.

try and make sense of their own Western Anglo identities that are a product of the Enlightenment and are a product of the Renaissance and the Reformation, and then try and force themselves theologically. It's very interesting and we see that with all sorts of things, not just in religion. Yeah, no, if anyone needs help translating that, Jay Dyer, you're dating.

You have one ear. You mentioned a lot of really fascinating things there and one of the things you had mentioned was sort of wanting to go back and there's this this thread that's been woven through a lot of things I've been reading recently, which is that nostalgia and advocating for nostalgia can be the most politically expedient. It's easy to put on a placard. It's easy to make a slogan out of.

but it might be the least relevant and the least achievable to actually go back to a previous time, even if it's like America. in the 1950s however that's very emotionally potent so ironically that's the stuff that's easier to advocate for twitter times nostalgia

Exactly. Well, this is the space you now live in because this is what I always try and say. Now, you mentioned sort of the idea of blood and soil, and I want to just recontextualize that for people because a lot of alarm bells run when they say that, but I'm like, well, it's not. It is a more fascist adjacent, but it really is just, you can explain this if it came from the mouth of a black

They would say, well, my lineage and my family and my kinfolk are important to me. That's the blood. And I have a tie to the location that they fought and died. And I am birthed from that environment. And if you take me out of that environment, I'm less comfortable. Like an African person is less comfortable in Canada.

Canada is full of Indians right now. They're all fucking miserable. It's not a good environment for them unless you have a lot of money to insulate yourself from the sort of environment that we walk around in a t-shirt in, right? But there's an interesting idea in there, and I'm going to mention another book. So I got something in my throat. There's this book I read speaking.

This book is titled The Network State. Unforgivably Indian name. I'm going to try and read it. Balaji Srinivasan. Anyway, very smart guy. Very great book. The Network State. It kind of addresses what you were just talking about, about de-territorialization. and sort of retribalization in an online space. It's a book I would recommend people read because you can read it for free. If you look up the network, so you can find this PDF or read it on the website.

It's a very NRX styled book. It's very much, I don't know if he's associated with Yarvin and Bap and all them, but it seems using a lot of the same terminology. he uses the word larping in a serious way which always bothered me anyway he's talking about how moving forward You can have groups that exist in an online space essentially create a new nation.

and it's trying to figure out how do we leverage this reality that we are all de-territorialized and there still exists this concept of blood and soil this traditional nationalistic stuff in this sort of digital diaspora. You know, and you had mentioned earlier the phenomena of meeting people.

in real life. And that's an interesting thing because I do want to clarify before I think people make it sound like you're like pushing back or I know you said recontextualizing. I'm not saying that the blood and soil

is purely online. I am saying though it has a sense of where it is spread out to where it's not just like into one location. It's totally real. I just ranted about it on the last episode of the Digital Archangelica where I'm walking through you know the historical sites of philadelphia and i'm like my answer

like that's what i i believe in it you know in that sense that it's real and it's in there i hold those sensibilities oh and that's what i'm saying for people it's like it is real to people because people hear blunt so like oh you mean your online stuff no but it is real that is a real phenomenon Yeah. And also there is, you're kind of anchoring yourself in this understanding of blood and soil, but you are living in a digital diaspora trying to figure out a way to reclaim that.

And you had mentioned the phenomenon. I should stop saying the word phenomenon, but like meeting people in real life that you met online.

now there was an older form of social media this was like original twitter which is like i'm an individual and i can broadcast my thoughts to the world that is not enticing to young people now or even me as a um the idea of just i want the world to hear my opinions no one wants to do that what they do is create online communities and this has been trending from a marketing perspective this has been the trend for the past couple generations more closed communities and closed systems

so what you're finding is the traditional idea of oh you've got internet friends strangers you met online people are brokering real friendships and connections online and translating that to the real world. On one hand, that's Tinder, obviously. There's the dating hookup site. But then there's also like... these kinship networks that are emerging, and they might start with, let's say, ethnic-based, they might also be ideology-based, they might be religious-based.

for people that are geographically disparate but can kind of come together and that's as real as anything and that's grounded in an old blend soil idea. but they do know how to exist very very strongly as an online diaspora furthermore they know how to translate that to the real world

And that's something that I've seen emerge over my lifetime that I think is really exciting. And that's kind of what the Network State book is about. It's like, how can you create these online communities and make them real to the extent of actually... creating sort of a constitution buying land so now you're a community that owns you're a tribe this is how you re-tribalize in an online space

There is a schematic for people to do that. When I spoke to Frode, this is what he was always talking about, retribalism. You hear that a lot. You also hear that in McLuhan when he says that the electricity and the electronic world has retribalized the Western mind. We were a very solitary literate.

type of people, now we're forced to retribalize. We're forced into this communal awareness, but still with the memory of being illiterate people. So it's not like you're devolving into an oral tradition. No, it's the Oriolentalization. This was the great fusion that McLuhan was talking about. Yeah, we would be exposed to oriental, symbolic, pictographic, not as literate with oral traditions.

the tribalization or communities. And now those two things are coming together and have come together because YouTube, if you remember the early days of YouTube, the motto that came when you went to youtube.com was broadcast yourself.

And if you were to Google the word YouTube today, it just says share your videos with friends, family, and the world. There is no motto anymore. It is just about... have a place to join even the youtubers themselves said you know join the community i have a discord link in the description You can talk about whatever there is, right? And even when there's drama, to make reference, for instance, like when that H-Bomber guy, this norwooding leftist, gives this long video about plagiarism.

and blah blah blah blah blah and people hop on that train about plagiarism although it was it was wonderfully timed because little did h bomber just like three days later, Claudine Gay would be accused of plagiarism by a bunch of disaffected rich Jews who are concerned about the state of anti-Semitic protesting and pro-Hamas. campuses, but it does.

How people reacted to it was talking about my community would call me out for that. My fans would call me out for that. And people who get in these fights would say things like, don't leverage. you know your ability to block commenters because my community wants to defend itself from your And so, yeah, we are retribalizing. in a very gamified way where like, oh, if I ratio you on the internet, you know, like that means I won.

or the meme that people like to say it's too late i've depicted you as the soy jack and myself as the giga chat right like we're using these very uh mythopoetic pictographic of self that are extensions of who we think that we actually are. And this is why people love to just quote tweet ugly liberal academics on Twitter with their profile.

We can just look at them, see a physically unattractive person, and know that I can disregard that person's opinion because they are ugly. And so we have these...

I don't want to say that they're pre-Christian or that they're ancient. I think that these are just long-standing things that as enlightenment... post-enlightenment men in the west we kind of try and do that whole argument for ideas type to be like oh it's the ideas that matter it doesn't matter that like milton friedman or murray rothbard look like caricatures

an ethnic group that would even have like gerbils being like come on man i can't print that and but you listen to their ideas then you find them interesting whereas nowadays we just like can totally disregard their ideas that the counter signal us based on their views. And I mean, you see this in ancient literature. I mean, you see this in even the work of numerous church fathers where they'll describe their opponents.

spiritually and physically ugly and we do that still now right we've returned to the tribalized world and for some people i think that freaks them out to a degree that whatever came before the sort of Western idea of what man is, is under attack, not just in the demographic sense of the word, but also in sort of the metaphysical.

that we've lost track of who we are. And there are, I think, three pathways that people have sort of generated answers to that question, although they're all inherently tribal. i think that you see this in sort of three groups in the metaphysical level you see sort of like the vitalist you know new kind of technology new gods new return to old energy you know like be strong be sexy you know the the rate must increase And then on the other hand, you have like the Neo.

Like clearly, like Nietzsche was right, the genealogy of morals. Like if we hold on to these stronger, like ethno-religious conceptualizations of ourselves and our belief systems. like we can lose, you know, become something that is going to survive in ways that will not survive, like the post-Reformation, post-Enlightenment, or even the post-circa-0AD world.

and will manage, right? And then, of course, you have the Christians that are like, clearly have answers. They're referring back to scripture. They're referring back to church tradition and are fighting the pause inside.

and churches. And I think because these things are all happening both in the real world and in the digital spaces, you're realizing that you know even though yes some of these ideas or some of these uh belief systems are thousands and thousands of years old they feel new despite the fact that You know, they do have a very tangible timeline where we can trace their history, their entomology, the development of doctrines, etc.

We're in a world where, as you had said, we're trying to just survive this position. So like, oh, yeah, the network state. Can we like, you know, startups are cool, but can we start up a country? And that's trying to challenge 19th and 20th century concepts of what the nation state is, despite the fact that, honest to God, America doesn't have sovereignty.

I mean, we can talk about, oh yeah, the US government can collect taxes and has the military, but if America wanted to go to war with Mexico, it would have to be. conscientious and aware of the fact and just accept it that you know half your service members are probably going to end up like cartel beheading videos from like live weeks 2012 because they're all over the border towns and they're all over in the major metropolitan areas and all it takes is for one libtard to dox a u.s drone

And that U.S. drone operator's family has just been executed by the Sinola cartel because America decided to go commit a special military operation on the southern border. And to make a long story short with this whole point, this is that we're in a position where. We're trying to find ways in this age of both awareness and unconscious.

where we're both de-territorialized but aware of things like blood and soil and how do we adapt them for the mediums and how do we adapt the ideas and beliefs in a world where You know, I think there was a famous insult that Foucault had used on someone like you're a 19th century philosopher living in the 20th. And that's where we're at. We're trying to take these old ideas and we're trying to hurryingly carry them onto Noah's Ark.

Like, here's the floodgates. They're opening. God has said you are going to die. Try and take everything that you can and take it onto the ditch. Yeah, and one thing that is, the reason we're doing that is because people are scrambling to find a solution that isn't just accelerationism, which is the ideology of let's just speed towards collapse because the only thing I see is collapse.

There's a lot of people in our space, they're toying around the edges of how can we create something new that doesn't involve total fucking... And you just mentioned something that I wanted to note about, you know, showing people's profile pictures and everyone, everyone in the world doing a physiology. Once again, it is the convergence of far-right schizos and mean girls.

And I've commented before that if you look at your average sort of dissident right chat, it's almost indistinguishable from a bunch of fucking broads. Because like, what are we talking about? The importance of having a lot of kids. We're trading recipes and it's fitness tech. We're just a bunch of fucking girls sometimes. But it's like, yeah, are you ugly? Then I'm not listening to you. You're weird. You're ick. We have the guy version of the ick every time we look at a philosopher who's fat.

Um, but there is, there's something there. There actually is something, you know, the idea that the enlightenment idea of like all that matters is the idea is it doesn't matter where they're coming from. And I was reading, uh, Michael Jones recently had this really great book called Logos Rising. I know he's a Catholic, but I think you could forgive him for that.

And he talked about, he was talking more about a lot of the Marxist thinkers and a lot of the sort of deconstructuralists. You know, their ideologies emerge from their lives. You know, if you live sort of a degenerate lifestyle, you will propose. degenerate ideology to explain the world. And you can see that in people like, you know, Foucault and others. I think there is some truth to that. So a lot of us are asking like, okay, this idea is good. Does it map onto reality?

like you've got a nice ideology you know this i was talking about this with um I think it was Disgraced Propagandist on the episode we recorded. Like, I know BAP and Soul Bra, they kind of doxed themselves recently. And I'm like, you know what? Like, their entire ideologies would have been thrown in the trash if they were short facts.

but the fact that they actually are you know tall and they look like they work out and like then people take them seriously but the fact of the matter is if you're short fat and ugly most people will say oh this is Your ideology, your worldview has not resulted in anything for you. Either you're a hypocrite or you don't take it seriously, or it leads to...

It's in some way associated with where it generated from, and so we don't take it seriously. It sounds unfair, but I think there's more people broadly interested in like, okay, how does this idea map onto reality? Because that's all we're interested in.

And especially on our side of things where it's like, yes, we talk about retribalization. Yes, we talk about the importance of community. What does that mean? Give me the schematic. Step one, two, three, four. What the fuck do you mean? And that's the project that even I'm engaged in. Like, okay, we need to retribalize. What does that look like? Does that involve like a pastoral? Do we need to return to the 15th fucking century? Like, tell me this. Tell me your plan. Do you have a plan?

to create a parallel society and not a lot of people do a few do i've heard a few guys even like christopher can't well came up with one where it's like here's how you take over a small town with you and your guys who are your guys maybe people you've met online whatever system you gathered like 10 to 15 people and this is sort of what we were talking about before like how you create these communities how do you create these online diasporas well that's up to you

And what's interesting is that in a lot of ways, especially younger people, where these kaleidoscopes of identities that all seem to be leveled right now, what we're trying to do is rank the importance of them. Like your ethnicity is one part of your identity. then your race as well those two are different but also your religion

Also, you know, your homeland, like the idea of like you're an Irish American. Do you feel also at home in Ireland, which is your homeland? You need to negotiate that, right? Same thing with any other Arab, Asian, whatever it might be. Then there's your ideology on top of that. Then there's all these, we might call them fandoms. Some people would dismiss them as fandoms, but these are the very distinct and profound ways we kind of...

identify ourselves and their multitude in us more than any time in the past. So if you're making a community, you got to figure out which people you align with. But once you do that, you can actually come together and work on a project. And that's what we're talking about right now. It's more real world ideas and maybe a lot of the ideological stuff.

gets left in the past. However, what we're talking about right now is how will these communities actually work and function because they won't work and function like the 19th and 20th centuries. We're living in unprecedented times, and you need to affix that word to the fucking cerebral cortex, unprecedented. There's things you can take from the past. I have a lot of pagans who listen to our show, a lot of Christians, a lot of atheists. a lot of different ethnicities and they they're trying to

figure out how to take these anchors that are important to them, but adapt them to where they need to be in the future. And it involves asking some hard questions, but it doesn't involve recreating the past. And the ones who are paying attention, they're the ones who know that. Yeah, I would agree with that wholeheartedly. Everyone is trying to adapt what they think is true, good, and beautiful to an age where...

I can go on Twitter and I can say something and some jerk off from Brazil will say that that's dumb and here's why. And this is also why I tell people time and time again that I think your whole soul bra thing was a very good point like and if he like had like an ugly face or he was he was not That no one would take his schtick seriously.

they would call him a larper because on his instagram he posted a picture of like an eagle with a son and rat it's like everyone knows what you look like now bro like everyone's gonna call you a And that's why I tell people all the time, I said, listen, when you turn your phone off at night and you look at the reflection of your face in the screen and you don't like what you see, this is time for you to wake up and to do something.

St. Seraphim Monroe says, it is later than you think, therefore hasten to do the work of God. Like, you know, it is later than you think, you know, you don't have to be a fat, ugly, you know, piece of garbage to live your life. And again, this is why there has been such a renewed emphasis. I don't know if it's entirely feminine or maybe it's the consequences of living in a more feminized society, but I think that it is good that people are.

health tips or focusing on civilizational questions like children and child rearing. I mean, the fact is that there was a great book that was published in 2019 called And he was basically saying that most human predictions about global population size are wrong. And we're actually going to see by the mid-21st century, so like the 2060s.

that we're going to see a huge drop off in birth rates and we're also going to see a huge decrease in global populations and that the world is going to struggle to how to ram you know square that peg into the round hole yeah and just just to reiterate that for people who always gloss over that point this is a global

It's not just the West. It ain't just white people. They're probably going to shrink significantly and they're our global minority. But like you're seeing the population start to crater in places that you wouldn't even think. Yeah, absolutely. And I mean, this is even something that more mainstream writers and pundits and commentators

Zyhan, for example, in his, I want to say it was 2022 book, his newest book that just came out, The End of the World is Just Beginning. Although I think, again, he's got that sort of liberal I'm trying really nice not to be mean to the man. He has these presuppositions where he's just like, don't worry, America. We can import infinity migrants and we're going to survive the population. Despite the fact that even progressives like Philip Koforo are like, no, that'll actually kill any like-

national identity that's left in this country and good luck making that work. And I mean, you already see the consequences of it now in America and especially in Canada as Trudeau's government has just decided. I guess tape a lead pipe to the accelerator and not let go. The way in which we perceive, to also bring this back to time, we do perceive time differently than I think our non-European, our non-Anglo-American. and that we're fundamentally aware that there is

what used to be called the information superhighway. I mean, it's still a highway. It does move faster than your real life. And I'm reminded, and this is the funny thing, is that Marshall McLuhan was a devout Catholic. And when you read Understanding Media, you see him speak very reverently. like any good Christian should. So when he refers to King David, you know, Hebrew says the psalmist says in Psalm 115 or 116, depending on your translation.

you know about certain things and i think of that too as you know they describe uh i don't remember which psalm it is off the top of my head but you know a thousand years to you oh lord as is yesterday as is a walk you know, a comparison to how God or perceives time in human terms that we can understand. And we're aware of the fact that a thousand years on the internet, as is like three years in real life.

like we're still I think dealing with the ramifications of a 24-hour news cycle with cable news and But because everyone now is in this self. correcting self-referential feedback loop where it's not just broad It's become part of a community, be a community leader, be a janny in someone's community, right? You got to earn that little blue wrench if you're a good pay piggy or if you're a good janny or you're a good chatter in someone's YouTube community or whatever. and you are now not brought...

You are a critic of the community that you are in. You are now a self-referential feedback loop. ideas and commentary about who we are as a thing. I mean, this is why you see all these questions saying like, oh, the DR is dead. Long live the DR. How things used to be like, oh, far right, fringe right, new right, old right, alternative right. all sorts of things of these like fringe I guess right wing positions on X, Y and Z issues. And because our sense of time and history.

is so warped. I mean, this is why people make fun of what they would call old heads or old troons on Twitter. But those people are actually really important because they're the ones who have any semblance of history of what time was like back then. And for instance, I had the chance to find, and someone had posted it on Twitter through the Internet Archive, the old archived webpages of Thermador.

And they had one. I know. And they had the host of the Thermador Magazine podcast in CampBot literally talk about the immediate aftermath of... What happened in Charlotte? and to listen to them talk about these issues and listen to them talk about optics or appearances and how the media is going to like take advantage And again, to refer back to the Psalter, you know, or not, no, I wasn't in the Psalter. It's in Ecclesi. Yeah, I think it's in Ecclesi.

nothing new is under the sun what has been shall be you know there's nothing new under the sun and it's like and that's also true in the sense that it also sort of illustrates how we're still dealing with old issues in the 21st century. One of the things that came up on my YouTube feed, because I like Norm MacDonald. A lot of people do. I think he's a funny...

God rest it all. But I started getting clips from old late night television shows. And so the Johnny Carson show has a YouTube channel with all these clips and archives. And so it has a Johnny Carson episode interviewing Ronald Reagan from 1970. And I said, okay. And I listened to it, and I'm listening to Ronald Reagan talk about the size of government. the balancing between states, right? how do we deal with the rising Soviet Union in terms of military power in the world stage?

but also how we need to decrease the size of government because there are too many people that work inside for the government. that will work against anyone running for office who becomes president, but also because those voter bases are now getting so big that if you were to try and do anything to reform the government, they will always shut up. So what I'm hearing is foreign policy, civil rights ramifications, immigration, military foreign policy, and the administrative state.

And I'm like, wow, nothing has changed in like 60 years. And that goes back to that Jim Hogan book where it's like the counterculture of the 60s, like how it's almost line for line, beat for beat, what we've been going through over the past five to ten years.

and then you're like we've done this before then what what what happened and then but you're not even aware that that happened everyone thinks their thing is exactly i was reading bob whitaker's the new And I don't know how many people know who Bob Whitaker is besides being close friends with...

and quite a few others. I mean, people who are like pro-white and do the whole anti-white stuff, like the no white guilt guys and all that. Anyone who's been sort of advocating that there's a distinct ideological, biological, and systematic hatred of... white europeans or ethnic or european descended peoples in in the west uh bob would occur is a big part of that i mean he's got his own lovely little

But in this book, he was talking about all these people that helped get Reagan elected, this new right coalition after years of Democrat control. And one of the things that he was talking about...

was the use of mailers, direct mailers. And he's like, yeah, we bypassed the media by just mailing tens of thousands of people so they got a hold of the real facts and the real issues and it made immediately made me think of nick land in his you know where he's talking about disintermediation is inherently a bad thing for the cathedral.

It bypasses their forms of standard control. And even then, right, you're like, damn, we've been doing the same things with different technologies for a very long time. So it really does reiterate that. Maybe we haven't adapted to the system fully. I think maybe the closest adaptation or maybe rejigging it to make it work for the 21st century was 2016.

and making it work with like the whole Twitter and Trump movement and the maggots stuff on Reddit and so on. And that's why everyone is chasing the high. of 2016 because everyone could viscerally jack themselves in neuromancer style and be part of the quote unquote movement which is also why we're literally reliving that entire thing right now again almost line for line i'm like i'm seeing them talk about trump

the exact same way as the first time he was running. I'm like, I've seen this before. This entire thing, I've seen it, right? Am I wrong? sit and trump beat the guy he beat the guy he wasn't supposed to be desantis dropped out who could have seen it i'm like well i mean we kind of saw it before i think with desantis as well like okay we're doing trump again

You know, you had mentioned, I know you just talked about that, the word McIntyre. We don't need to go down the whole Trump thing, but there's a lot you talked about right there. I just want to just put a pin in a couple of things. And this could be a way we lead into Empowering Communications. I don't know how long you have to talk.

cover a lot of stuff very quickly. I want to point out, thank you very much for mentioning McLuhan is a Catholic. However, I will point out that if he was a real Catholic, he wouldn't have quoted the Bible. He wouldn't even be reading the Bible. uh contrary to popular belief is high church tradition types they read the bible But you mentioned also Seraphim Rose, who we covered on our show before, and time is shorter than you think. or something

very interesting that occurred with the advent of Christianity, but also the Western mind that broke us out of the idea of cyclical time, which is a more ancient view of time. And that's what makes Christianity so distinct compared to a lot of the more ancient myths. It's that it creates linear time.

the death and resurrection of Christ was a one-time event. It's not a cyclical thing that keeps happening, and it's not so far back in history that it's in the ether. Here's the specific date it happened. There's a before that and an after. And so in the Western mind, we've always had a very, I would say, historically unique conceptualization of the.

And that's not to say only Christians conceptualize that because the Vikings also had Ragnarok, of course. There's other cultures that had a sort of a concept of the end times, of course. But within the Western mind, we always have like the ultimate final. that doesn't restart once again. It's not like the Bhagavad Gita. It's not the Kali Yuga, the Yuga cycle or anything like that. There can't be a final and that's why we don't believe in reincarnation.

But what's interesting is that going back to Decadence by Jim Haugen, He talks about the counterculture revolution in contrast to the... The beats were the previous counterculture. And their existential dread was that the America that they despised would last forever. Whereas with the counterculture, they conceptualized a sort of permanent change that was on the horizon.

discombobulation. This is where the age of Aquarius stuff comes in. This is where like there's a giant change coming and we're here to shepherd this society. to the glorious future of some kind. So there was an apocalyptic vision coded in to that conceptualization of the future. And what's interesting in our society is we have not only remained with and just evolved that apocalyptic vision, we've just multiplied. And so every year we're living. within like 20 apocalyptic visions right now.

from climate change to trump destroying democracy to plastics in your blood like your average citizen is so keenly aware that things are about to end and you know even in the past the boomers like that nuclear annihilation we've already accepted Zoomer now has factored that in. Yeah, it could be nuclear annihilation or it could be, you know, another COVID. There's so many ways the world could end that we just accept. And they keep fragmenting in shorter and shorter timelines.

That's an interesting modern phenomenon to the multiplication of apocalyptic vision. And this is very funny to me as someone I don't understand it because I grew up with, you know, sort of like church on Christmas and Easter. But I mean, as a military brat, I didn't really experience Christianity very well unless I went to my grandmother.

Baptist church services when we were back in the United States. And even then I found it profoundly just foreign because I didn't grow up with it. I wasn't enculturated with it. But America especially. due to its founding and due to the various forms of Christianity that was brought over.

is like the most eschatological country on earth. And so there are so many competing visions of the apocalypse, where it even affects people on the right. You know, Charles Haywood is an excellent example of this, where he has an essay about the regime fragility. everyone's got their timeline for collapse. And it reminds me of like the Millerites and the Seventh-day Adventists about when the world is going to end. And of course, you have even non-Christian ideas of the apocalypse.

and so forth, and with technology, too, and the Heaven's Gate website, et cetera. Have fun with that, YouTube algorithm, and looking for shit to put on Wikipedia debunking notes. video but I bring that up because to me it's so interesting because when I hear those portions of the gospel being read in church or I read them, everyone sort of skips out on the parable of the servants, you know, where they're talking about when the servant's going to come.

The master wants to see you working. You know, Christ can come back like a thief in the night, you know, as it's said. And we don't know when he's going to come back to refer back to the Psalms. is yesterday's a wash in the night. You don't know when he's gonna come. And when people say, oh, there's rumors of wars, and there will be wars, what does Jesus say right afterwards? That is not the end. And it's frustrating.

Listen, when that stuff hits the fan, you're going to know it. Trust me. Any preliminary reading of Revelation from John is going to tell you real quick, you know it when it's coming. So don't worry about it. And you're told explicitly as Christians, therefore do not worry about tomorrow. You know, tomorrow will worry unto itself. Sufficient is the day. But because of how for a variety of reasons.

has its issues, it does have its issues, but also it these different interpretations like America because of its very Protestant nature. is very eschatological. Even our atheist libtards are so focused on their own versions of Revelation. Like you had said, there's climate change, there's population collapse, there's the... the deforestation, there's industrial farms.

microplastics in the balls, right? And I had this conversation. I said this to Meta Prime. I recorded a show with him. I said, listen, the guy that invents the technology that gets the microplastics out of the testicles of every American like whoever that guy's gonna make a ton of money and he's gonna be really rich and people are gonna like you know kiss the ground he walks on that's a whole other side

But because we're so eschatologically focused in these Western discourses, because the center of discourse, at least for now, is America. You know, everyone's got their time. and I've said this, I said, your whole, like, Weltanschauung, politically speaking, is entirely, is primal, not entirely, but it is certainly predicated on what your view of collapse is.

And that's the biggest thing that I think messes with our perception of time because we can see something in the news, right? That like becomes enough. You know, there were there were people who were thinking and with good reason, right? Like the war in Ukraine is an excellent example. You know, John Mearsheimer, who is a baby boomer and a liberal in a lot of ways, you know, like he was pro Bernie Sanders.

But he was like, listen, there are real ways in which this war can escalate that could lead to limit- and of course if you're someone who grew up in the Cold War, that's the end of the world. And we, I mean, thank God, nothing has escalated to the point in that war, although there's a few flashpoints where we may have gotten close, where no one's decided to turn the keys and press the buttons. But those sort of framings for a... Added on to our.

bias in time of communication radically alters our ability I think to act good political actors or even brash- you know how can you be rational if you think that the world is ending or you know that you've got to be prepping and doing more that we're going to do x y and z like we don't we don't know and so it's i think very hard in these digital spaces to navigate and to listen to people

uh often like i listen to people like future conflict or uh gray zone intelligence and stuff like that because i think that those guys are right like the brazilification of america is happening right before my eyes so i should heed their word Whereas others are, you know, and la la. in some respect. They're in their own version of Digital Elysium.

we're going to effectively accelerate and we're going to build the rockets that leave you swarthoids behind and it's like better hurry you know like good luck you know before the uh fd for the american government sues elon again for not being uh You mentioned something funny there about the Ukraine war. And I know you, like me, are very, very friendly to the neorealists.

School of Geopolitics, one thing I noticed is every single person I listened to called the Ukraine war wrong. I didn't hear a correct prediction for a year. but people are saying russia is going to win in a couple weeks or ukraine's going to win a couple weeks everyone's feeling wrong on our side and no one has analyzed why that might is everyone just keep

cranking out the takes. And you had mentioned something, a reason there is because, and this is where we might get into the book we mentioned first, but we haven't even really gotten to yet, which is Harold Innes' either of his books, but one of them that I reviewed was Empire and Communicate. And you talked about the dissident right and the way we communicate or the all right or this sort of decentralized right we have.

I say dissident right because that's the most accepted term, but it also kind of imprisons us on the fringes. I don't know if that's on purpose, but it kind of works in our favor. I think people like to identify as being the outsider because we have... we don't want to be normies, right? There's this, it's that tribal. Yeah.

I always say, if you're on the dissident right, you have to ask, do I want to permanently be a dissident? Do I permanently want to be on the fringe of society? A lot of people would say no. A lot of people are just here temporarily embarrassed leaders. who think that they can achieve status by the levers of power eventually. There's a lot of exiled academics in the space that think they're going to be let back in eventually. But then my argument is that there is a case to be made that...

people could permanently want to exist on the fringes and not gain that status. Now, the reason is going to Innes' Empire Communications, he talks about the relationship between communication methods and how Empire functions. And the way I explain this is for anyone who listens to The Prudentialist, or especially anyone who listens to you on Oren McIntyre's show, you're probably familiar with the concept of elite theory. You're probably familiar with the concept of the managerial state.

So when I draw a schematic of what this looks like or spatialize it, I'm like, OK, you got your center of power at the middle. That's the administrative state. Then you got the next concentric circle around that, which is sort of the intermediate power. These might be administrators, but that's historically the priest class. This is the whole middle area of power, the press and things like that. And then on the periphery, it's the people.

And there was always a conflict between the periphery and the center. And every civilization or any advanced state, you're always going to have this. That's just the form it takes. It's not going to be so evenly split like the way I'm painting it right now. But there are these... zones of influence and what he was saying going back to samaria going back to egypt going back to ancient greece what he found was that

There's two types of communication. There's communication that is optimized for time and communication that's optimized for space. And this is reflected in the media. So going back, back to the advent of Hapyrus, you have the... before, you know, there was the oral cultures before that, then there was literate culture. So this is usually what we're talking about. like the centers of power, they loved carving, they loved statues, they loved, you know, writing, etching things in stone.

But on the periphery, the people, where all this spontaneous stuff was happening, they... preferred media that was not optimized for time. So optimized for time means it'll last. You write things down in ways that have permanence, whereas the people, they communicate in a way that can spread over a long distance and it degrades faster, but it's a bit more fluid and a bit more electric. So that's why they would communicate in papyrus or paper.

papyrus later and then paper and whatever was originated on the fringes the periphery was eventually adopted by the center which demanded that the periphery create a new form of communication now A modern example would be look at The evolution of publishing, because there was a time when paper was the purview of the people, the intelligence.

even the bourgeoisie that was further on the outside, to communicate very, very fast new ideas. Yes, and it radically altered the media landscape. I know you haven't read this book by Ennis, but he talks about this and the bias of communication. where he talks about how the cheap metropolitan newspapers, and there were hundreds and dozens of newspapers in one major city alone, whereas nowadays they're all owned by six or seven different digital conglomerates.

uh when it came to the invention of the telegraph and the wire you know we talk about the ap newswire we're still referring to the tele but he says quote the cheap metropolitan press took full advantage of the invention and extension of the telegraph a rapid prompt supply of news was available and accurate information was provided to meet the demands of the stock and Greeley said, Horace Greeley, that the telegraphic dispatch is the great point, and the editorials have left...

The Telegraph compelled newspapers to pull their efforts into collecting and transmitting A cooperative service was worked out in 1848 between the Courier, the Inquirer, Tribune, Sun, Herald, Express, Journal of Commerce, which became the basis as we know it today as the Associates. The news was sold to the Philadelphia Public Ledger and to the Baltimore Sun, and additional subscribers lowered the cost of operation to New York.

The extension of the telegraph and an increase of news accentuated the demand for faster presses, the prerequisite of large sales at low prices. In 1852, the New York Tribune installed a six-cylinder press with a capacity of 15,000. per hour. Other plants installed presses up to 10 cylinders with capacities of 25,000 sheets, but the number of presses meant cost of duplication and setting up the type and loss.

Papers with the larger circulation were compelled to start earlier, omit the latest news, to lose the earliest sales, and to suffer an out-of-town Now, how does that not just totally apply if we put that in the digital sense where we are now faster, faster, faster to where now things are mediated? That's exactly it. so now it's now it's not just this and to go back to um innocent his book about empire and control this is about um space bias

So let me quickly tell people what that means. You have two types of forms of bias. you have space biased and time biased forms communication and this is in um the bias communication but it's also So time-biased media includes clay or stone tablets, manuscripts, papyrus or parchment, and oral sources and oral traditions.

and messages that last for many generations but reach limited audiences, which is why I think you have such an interest in the written word, trying to reclaim that because there is sort of an ethnic bias or just an in-group preference. And a desire for legacy. We want things that last a long time. That's why everyone wants to publish a book. It seems more real to us.

And I'm just as biased of this. I will wholly admit that. I think that's why I still buy physical media, but also because, you know, censorship reasons. But anyways, that's what those are. And then there's space bias. This is more modern media, radio, television, mass circulation of newspapers and the telegraph that convey information to many people over long distances, short exposure. Time biased media favors stability, community.

religion, but space-biased media can facilitate rapid change, materialism, secularism, and empire. And he says this in Empire Communications, quote, the concepts of time and space reflect the significance of media to civilization. media that emphasize time or those durable in character such as part. The heavy materials are suited to the development of architecture and sculpture. Media that emphasize space are apt to be less durable and light in character such as papyrus and paper.

The latter are suited to wide areas of administration and trade. The conquest of Egypt by Rome gave access to supplies of papyrus, which became the basis of a large administration. Materials that emphasize time favor decentralization and hierarchical types of institutions, which those that emphasize space favor centralization and systems of government less hierarchical. Less hierarchical in character in favor of centralization. The administrative state, we have the internet.

tweets this is why trump was so good at twitter right like he was the president of the united states he got ahead of the game with the media because he was the main character in that respect and so And this is why I think it's also funny that because we're retribalized.

McLuhan points out and I think everyone can look at our Twitter spaces and see that we're a bunch of tribes you know we're like monkeys throwing shit at each other across the digital space in our own respective cages that or utilizing space-biased forms of communication while still creating communities and tribes with their own oral traditions and lore that have that time-biased form.

So we want people to buy our books. We want people to buy physical, tangible things of ours. Go buy my mug that you can find at the merch link down below. It was really cool that Disgrace... picture of it and tweeted it out. I was like, oh, it's neat. Someone's got like a real thing.

And so our lore, our character arcs, they're not just televised video game versions of characters and stories for these people who are real people, flesh and blood, or I would hope that they are. If not, the bots are really good. But instead, they are trying to be tribal and have an oral tradition that can be conveyed in their videos and who they are and their content. But they're utilizing a form of communication.

tries to get rid of hierarchy it's very centralized like even though we're dissidents and some people argue in favor of tele You know, you still want to be on Twitter. You still want to be on YouTube because those are the centralized platforms. that get the most. views and that's where the interesting stuff has happened and something that kind of gets lost in these discussions is

While there's communication bias towards time and space, you kind of need both for an effective empire civilization. There's a quote here from Empire Communication.

um since we're doing quotes it's all right no no no no but i actually have all these quotes and it's it's done very well with what i had it says concentration on a medium of communication implies a bio the cultural development of the civilization concerned either towards an emphasis on space and political organization or towards emphasis on time and religion.

introduction of a second medium tends to check the bias of the first and create conditions suited to the growth of empire. And the modern example that you kind of touched on that I was going to talk about before was... If you look at the publishing industry, the publishing industry used to be this exciting periphery thing. Now, if you think of the publishing industry now, what do you think of it? static, ossified, masked with giant walls around it. I think the same thing about 30 years ago.

Jared Taylor, Ariana Huffington, and, like, you know, E. Michael Jones could have, like, respectable conversations about their worldview on C-SPAN. Nowadays, I don't think you ever... Exactly, but where's the new stuff coming from? It's coming in meme culture, and it takes a while for the centers of power to understand that, but it eventually tries to absorb it, and that's what we've been seeing.

over the past 10 years or so is a center of power trying to get its arms around this digital space and adopt the technology you're kind of seeing that with crypto too that they it took them a while to figure it out but now they're trying to get their arms around and now For us, since the discussion is what the future is, we need to figure out what's the next exciting way to communicate.

And I know what some people are going to say. They're going to say urban. Sure, fine, I hear you. But we need to... Our digital space where we could exist is rapidly becoming hostile. And we need to find the next space that we can even have these conversations. And everyone here feels the walls closing in on them right now. Everyone who's got a sub stack is feeling that now, even though I've been calling that for a year or two. Don't get comfortable in sub stack.

the love of god don't get comfortable on the most journalist friendly platform that has ever existed they're going to kick the cool exciting people off eventually but then we that that's the level we need to figure out that the digital space is being co-opted entirely social media is gone but like what what's a new space and i don't know if we have that answer yet

I think, honestly, I see more people breaking out into the real world and doing IRL meetups and stuff. That seems to be a more exciting space where new things are happening because I think the online space... It's going to be progressive. It's going to be dead soon enough. It's going to be completely co-opted and no one's going to want it. We're kind of getting a last gasp right now with people, you know, being able to say edgy things on Twitter. But even that, that seems kind of performing.

Where's the real stuff happening? It's actually not online anymore, I don't think. And I'm curious to hear what you think about that. I mean, that's the thing about trying to evolve with the times, right? Like I remember several years ago for... crypto. I remember when Facebook, before it even changed its name to Meta, Zuckerberg was thinking about creating its own Facebook coin or currency. It was going to have the backing of all these companies with MasterCard, Visa.

Chase Bank and like Congress was like ah no and not because they weren't okay with the idea but I think it's because they wanted to do it for themselves and that's where we started really seeing central bank digital currency stuff really emerged i mean there's white papers that go back decades prior to that but still i think that there's a point to be made that People are trying to synthesize the digital and the real, but also in a way that doesn't explicitly make them target.

to the the regime right because they know that if they're trying to do something we're like Excuse me, like a bunch of quirked up white... like trying to start a business or whatever like they know that like quirked up white boy energy is a bad thing for the regime even if you're just trying to be like we're a competent business of like white males like trying to do an airline service and they're like yeah none of that you know you must

anytime there's like five to ten white guys doing a thing like wait what do you what is this what are you up to yeah i know um Are you making a new thing that's going to break the paradigm over here?

that's my startup culture like i understand why like the the gentleman who's behind the startup state or why like even curtis yarvin like their worldview is the 1990s california ideology or this like quasi left libertarian techno optimism that like we can create the solutions to the 21st like that's a very powerful drug if you're if you're a believer into that right like you talk to uh a lot of tech guys in the sector or you read the andreas and horowitz

techno-optimist manifesto. It reads like 90s, end-of-the-millennium optimism. I love that manifesto on our paywall show. I go line by line through that. breakdown. Spoiler alert, I'm not a fan. The techno-optimist manifesto cites Nick Land. I'm not sure you read him, Carrie. It's like when Nick Land replied to that one person, avid fan of your work, clearly a sign. and it's just like you're citing me in a techno-optimist manifesto clear sign you didn't read my

And one thing just so people are aware of this, the book I mentioned called The Network State, it's written by that type of guy. I understand the intoxication with that worldview because I miss the old internet too. I miss when it was just fucking free.

out here i get it but you know he'll say he's the type of guy who says every problem can be solved by the blockchain and i just think there's some things that the block we don't need a constitution we'll just figure it out with the blockchain and nfts heard about nfts that could be you know i'm skeptical of a lot of these easy solutions to ancient problems and i think that's where a lot of the startup guys have it's easy tech solutions to problems that have not really been resolved for 2000

um but like i kind of see there is kind of a quirky excitement you know a lot of people don't like yarvin i actually do even though i vehemently disagree with him things I'm like you know if I if I see him on the Tim Dillon show that's worlds colliding for me that's an exciting fucking get you know like I'll listen to him talk I like how Curtis just takes any podcast

Like, he'll take interviews with, like, 500-plus channels, or 500-plus subchannels, and then he'll be on Ethan Ralph's killstream. Well, someone should tell him that he should respond to my fucking emails then. Oh, he'll go on every podcast. Well, I'm going to try not to take that personally because he won't come on Blood Satellite. And, you know, it's not like I think about it.

It sounds like you think about it. I'm fine. Everything's fine. Yeah, yeah, yeah. If I hear it when someone says they're fine. That's how I feel when John Mearsheimer doesn't reply to my fucking emails. So I feel you. Here's the answer. Him not responding to mine makes sense. It doesn't make sense that he would. It kills me because he's been on the Duran more than once, and I'm like, just talk to me. Talk to me, you old bastard. I'm fine. I'm fine. The same way I wish Sean McMeekin would reply.

If there's one thing I want people to leave this very inspiring and illuminating podcast with, it's we're fine. I might make the title of... when i upload this tomorrow i might just call this i'm fine um with dimes we're fine everything's fine that's that's it that's it it's funny because we've talked about doing a show together like once a month where we would

Isn't just the news, but it would be like a something like this, right? Where it has staying power. That's what we should call That is, and one of the things I wanted to prove, because I wanted to prove that I can clean up well, because the last time we met, it was six hours on a very contentious topic.

And I want to be like, you know, I am able to talk about things without bringing... I don't even want to mention it here. I don't want to get you in trouble if I mention it here, but it's an Odyssey exclusive. It's an Odyssey exclusive talking about the relationship. Dimes and I read a very fascinating book called What Went Wrong?

Friedman. I will link those in the description if you are also interested and you've made it this far into our talk but maybe to move things back towards the Empire direction with Harold Innes and maybe this could be a good way to wrap up our discussion I think is that We are in this weird sort of impure. I mean, we live under an empire and I wish that.

I wish that both parties would admit that we live under an empire. And I don't mean to like say that in the sort of like third world anti-imperialists. It's just that after reading William Appleman Williams, and everyone should, and I've got like two or three streams on Williams with like George Bagby and reviewing his books by myself, that you should listen to.

And he'll tell you, like, America has been fundamentally an empire since the beginning. And the physical frontier of empire, you know, when the frontier closed in America with Frederick Jackson Turner's theme. That was so important to the Americanization of the world that we just looked outward. And then we started doing a lot of our... Non, you know our colonialism and say like the

in Latin and Central America or in East Asia, right? The open door policy, expanding and keeping the door open to China and the Boxer Rebellion, yada, yada, yada. And I'm oversimplifying it because I want people to read those books and to listen to the shows that I've done on them.

Now that we live in an empire that is digital, it is electric, it is instantaneous, you're sort of in this electric state of mind where the government at any time... either announce something by tweet or can you know accidentally play their hand too much because they do things in tweets but they also do things in person like the state is trying to figure out how does it exist in the 21st century in the midst of disintermediation.

in the midst of these semi-permeable online communities that you don't really know for sure what they're doing in real life until you put confidential informants or human intelligence in there, like the Gretchen Whitmer thing. or that 18-year-old TradCath guy that got in trouble with the FBI a few months ago, that even Rod Dreher was like, I can't support this, because he said nasty things on the internet, and so did his dad.

It's a good Rod Dreher impression. Well, I just think he's... You know what, I will try really hard not to say what I personally think about Mr. Dreher. This isn't the first time he's called people shitty human beings and helped dox people. But he's got a terrible track record and he can go make more international incidents in Hungary. He's not my problem. That's up to God. That's a guy who's hungry for a certain type of appendage, if you catch my drift.

Yes, he likes black dick, Mr. Dime. Whoa, whoa! Oh, hey, hey, oh. i'm not wrong but anyways um i'll take the heat for that one but to to focus back on empire it's just that We're all under a decentralized system, despite the fact that it's centralized. This is the thing why everyone wants to get over Yarvin. They want to move on from him, but they haven't taken a few things from Yarvin that I think are pretty good observations. Yes, there is the media plus the academy plus government.

And then you have the castle and the military, etc. Red government versus blue government. Outer party versus inner party. But the thing about that is that we know there's collusion. We know that they coordinate. It's not... And that because they collude and they have, and we saw this with COVID and we're seeing it now with Fannie Willis, I think one of the prosecutors or district attorneys that's going after Trump in one of these cases communicating with the Biden white.

and so like open collusion and it's it's it's not just centralized to one institution but the ideology is centralizing like this is why i think intersectionality is one of the greatest political Because it doesn't matter if you are a single issue voter about like veganism or like ending animal cruelty. Like that's your deal. So you're going to vote for the Democrat because they're like pro animal rights. It doesn't matter that you're a single issue pro animal rights voter.

Because you're on that team, and because you've bought into this ideology, you are now part of this ideology. that says, yes, I'm a single issue voter on this issue, but... I now have to bow down to the Great Zimbabwe five times a day. I now have to support transgender people. and so on and so forth. So I think that that's an important thing to consider with how powerful the centralized ideology is in this digital era.

There we are. So yeah, I mean, this is why I find the space-biased communication of Empire works so very well with respects to ideology, or what might be called like technique by Jacques Ellul.

is that you know you don't have one institution right it used to be like the king it used to be the state the government the magistrate the magisterium now it's in sort of all-encompassing ideology where you have a factions of people that may not agree on every because they're on Team Progress or Team X, they now have to support Y and Z or Z for you Canadians and acknowledge that this is where we're at and this is how Empire is going.

you know you can talk about gay race communism or call it whatever you want right like all of a sudden It doesn't matter that, like, you know, Alyssa, a nice white liberal woman who probably wants to have children one day, is now like a raging, rabid leftist who hates men when she used to just be a single issue voter on, say, like, stop. What's interesting is I'm reminded of to the point of sort of centralization and a more sort of higher amorphous strata. I'm reminded of Samuel Huntington.

his book The End of Civilization. basically talking about how the 21st century you're seeing and this is something that even like richard spencer's talking about

this sort of pan-Europeanism and East versus West in a broader civilizational sense, kind of represented here as NATO versus the BRICS countries. But you're seeing national... independent states start to coalesce or these larger civilizational identities and that's what you're like they're drawn into a different center of gravity just like you're talking about with your single issue you're drawn into the center of gravity

of some sort of ideology and i think when we talk about like retribalization and like we're trying to figure out how to exist in that same space in the same way that nations are trying to act and super national ways like we talk about Davos culture which is really just shorthand for like the higher end of western

They're talking about how the world is run by the nation state model is still important and the geopolitical rules are still in play. But there's this whole higher strata of decision making. that's decoupled from the nation state while still kind of acting in service broadly. And we're trying to figure out how to exist in that upper strata as well to try and decouple ourselves from.

of the 19th and 20th century models, but not fall into the center of gravity of some other ideology. I think that's what, in a lot of ways, we're seeing right now. What do you think about that? I think that there's a lot of truth to that. I mean, well... Yes, in the sense that I'm thinking of Samuel P. Huntington's Clash of Civilizations. Clash of Civilizations. That's what I was thinking of as you were talking about. This sounds like Huntington's thesis back in...

And I just find myself returning to that book more than I thought I would. I don't agree with everything in the book, but I do see something. conglomerations that are kind of fueled by diaspora. you know, extending out. And that's the globalization part, right, with the immigration, too. I mean, this was something... There's like a 19, I want to say 77, 72 interview that Marshall McLuhan did. And he was talking, it's the broadcaster. And I cite it in one of my...

I think it's the one about the Ireland protests. The medium is the weapon. And McLuhan is asking like, well, you know, someone I guess maybe it was like a softball question where McLuhan could elaborate. But he says, you know. This global village likes you really think that you know Maybe we could bring get to know each other better and come to a better understanding like no You know McLuhan is like no we all get closer together. We realize how different we are and we hate you

That interview is so good because you can tell the crowd was against him for a lot of it. Like he was getting booze during, I think it's the same interview we're talking about. a stadium of people just going up. No, this one was a new...

I remember an old black and white one where they talked about the Global Village, and he was basically saying the same thing, and it was like the crowd was turning on him, but he didn't give a shit. Good on him for not giving a shit. But no, this one was on a television show. Because they were talking about the Quebec Wall.

desire to leave or at least have their own sort of separatist movement and such. But I found that so fascinating because he's talking about this back in, of course, the late 70s. before he died and it was like phenomenal to hear because it's just like well this is why like twitter can be really interesting right like everyone remembers the you know it smell crazy in there

where black Twitter and Indian Twitter had a digital race war and the Indians won. In part because every 30 seconds or 90 seconds an Indian logs into the internet. Also because there's just more Indians than there are black people on black Twitter. But this happens every couple of months, right? We're like, oh, yeah, it turns out we all really don't like it. We're all part of this. The global village isn't the global village. It's like.

global uh as some people have described it and i kind of like this way of describing it as well as is that twitter and those kinds of social media is a giant clout base pvp Where instead of like, you know, the winner winner chicken dinner like it's Fortnite, you're here to, you know, ratio the other race.

and so on. And so, yeah, now there's this fight for identity, which can be achieved through violence. But because our systems are gamified, that kind of quote-unquote violence is digitized. It's about ratios. It's about getting someone to lock their... It's about doxing them, which can then lead to actual... and swatting them and so on and getting these people killed so like the but because we're so far removed from actually like

choking each other out in the streets or beating each other with lead pipes or firing weapons at each other. We feel the sense of distance in our warfare because it is in these gamified digital realms. And so, yeah, like these civilizations will emerge, right? Like, but also the real world civilizations emerge too with like the third world notion of like based and trad China, but also in the real world, geopolitically speaking.

This stuff was also being leveraged by like the Soviet Union against the United States when it came to like civil rights or the treatment of blacks, et cetera, et cetera. And even now in the 21st century, because. this new technology of the internet and social media and so on is still being used effectively against the state, then it doesn't matter what Ben Shapiro tweets out. You know, Jackson Hinkle, who I'm not a fan of.

can do like the whole like alert alarm emoji and then say whatever the hell he wants which can be probably bullshit or maybe Who knows? And then like ratio Ben Shapiro every day. And it's just like, this is kind of a weapon and it wouldn't surprise me.

ex-wife or whatever is Russian, that maybe he was a paid agent. I'm not going to make that accusation. I'm just saying it's a possibility that that could be the case. And again, you're seeing these civilizational... utilizing deracinated, deterritorialized individual. to wage weird fifth-generation warfare on the internet. I mean, this is what the Chinese talked about in unrestricted warfare. They're like, at a certain point, people are complicit in war.

that they don't know that they're even enemy combatants of and i mean that book is cool because they call george soros But they also are pointing out the fact that there may come a point in time in the war, in the future, somewhere down the line, that it might be acceptable to assassinate a Wall Street banker or a venture capitalist.

Because they're, whether they know it or not, a combatant in a war against their country and their people. That's where we're at now. Yeah, absolutely. And maybe we could even end on this. It seemed that war historically was fought between warriors, which then evolved to warriors can be lurking amongst the population. um that was asymmetrical warfare and then the final evolution now is that every single individual is a war

And then there's this book we covered on the show is about neurotechnology. And it was a collection of essays written by academics. who are affiliated in some sense with the government or the military. It was very, very straightforward. It was saying like there's neurotechnology, which means and neurotoxins, which are devices that can enhance or impede human cognitive ability.

brain chips we're also talking toxins we're talking any form of technology that can boost almost like a mentat from dune you know making can we make a human being into a computer for one specific and then realizing that the entire populations can be weaponized with this technology. So not to get all conspiratorial, but something like COVID, you don't need a weapon that kills.

a huge segment of the population like a nuke. You just need everyone, everyone there to get a little bit sicker. Everyone can get three to 10% worse at their job. It's actually way easier to take over or subvert that country. And once you start viewing it from that perspective, you realize, oh, Every individual, it doesn't care how unplugged you want to be, is subject to the system. And that is where it connects with McLuhan.

When he talks about electricity, the extension of our nervous system puts us in contact with everyone simultaneously. And that's why something like this can happen. That's why you can have a thing like a PSYOP. You can have a cognitive... or you could have a mind virus because you, in a multitude of different ways, can be weaponized in the favor of whatever political center of gravity we're talking about.

And a great example is the Soviet Union, which you gave. But the Soviet Union is just one example. Imagine how worse it's got. As we've talked about before, the centers of power have pulled in all these digital techniques and weapons. So that's maybe blackpilling. That's scary. But I think those are the questions and concerns we have as we make use of our de-territorialized space. We figure out what the next step is, which is really what...

Where do we go from here? Well, we're involved in a war. Oh, you're involved in a mind war. I'm like, yes, but really, with actual algorithms and toxins that can... literally smarter or dumber or more passive or whatever. and and we covered this on the show a long time ago about like this isn't an alien concept in the real world if you look at governments like they love this because it means you don't have

There's no limit to what scientists will develop if it means we can cure war. We can fight a war where nobody dies. There's people who put their entire lives behind that goal. That means hijacking your mind. That means giving you strange chemicals that might... But you know what? It's not a nuke. It doesn't involve women and children being burned in a pit. So it's worth...

So there's no limit that they will go to, no limit that they won't go to in the interest of not having dead babies. But that includes using your mind as some like fifth generational node and a larger, weird fucking ideological. That's a weird way to end this conversation, but I think... I know I would agree with that wholeheartedly because we are combatants and conflicts that are both state-sponsored by our own respective governments, but also by foreign aid.

And I mean, this all, and this isn't just connected to like the digital stuff, but it's also back to the real world. Like if I recall correctly, and I'm going to now quickly double check as I, as I, as I Google this. That, uh... Someone like Alejandro Mayork- born in Havana, Cuba, who is the seventh secretary of Homeland Security, had, if I recall correctly, sat on the board of a particular...

immigration group. I'm trying to make sure that I know exactly what I'm talking about. Immigration board that he sat on. that he was part of, I want to say like the... What is the one that is the Israeli immigration group that everyone likes to point out? Just one? Well, I know, right?

Or maybe it's going to bother the crap out of me. I'm looking for it right now. I am. I'm literally typing it up and I'm ruining this whole flow of conversation because it's going to bug the shit out of me unless I figure out what it is. For the folks at home, Israel is a nation state in the Middle East. That is the... There we go. HIAS. HIAS. The Humanitarian Aid and Advocacy Organization.

a refugee protection program and highest, if I recall correctly, once had my confirming that right now uh highest their slogan is welcome the stranger protect the refugee it doesn't sound very nice does it yeah i know uh yeah highest congratulates board member alejandro So there you go. So I wasn't completely going off schizophrenia here. But anyways, it's like those guys last Halloween.

this was sort of funny where people were shitting on them they were like passing out copies of like Europa the last battle with like popcorn and candy and they were all like shitting It's like, well, if you're going to do that, give them a full-size candy bar or whatever. It's like a four-hour video or whatever. Which I've never seen, by the way. And I've been told that it's not that great. But I'm not going to subject myself to watch it.

like there are groups out there that are more heterogeneity inside the population because that civic trust civic participation makes it harder to govern i mean this is why like the chinese will openly just talk about like well we can sit back and watch america destroy itself with diversity Because it is a weapon. And again, this goes back to the postmodern world that we're in.

where bio power is very much on the table and that there is psychopolitics and psychosecurity that you have to consider because as Dimes was saying there are there are cognito there are meme plexes and mind viruses and weapons via communications technologies that once you know them it's very hard to try and think coherently and this is why certain quote unquote Wreck your brain very quickly and we saw this for like regular liberals on the left Trump broke

They could not believe that a 90s Democrat... from the you know who helped with roger stone trash um the 2000 uh political campaign run of pat buchanan for president with his little like reform party stints rumors in 2000 is now the reincarnation of Adolf Hitler. They can't believe it, but he was president. And they did everything they could to stop him. And their minds are still broken.

And so now Trump is very much the we have Pat B. Cannon at home sort of candidate. He is. We have Pat B. Cannon at home. I'd rather have the actual. God has told us that we get what we deserve. I guess we deserve Trump. Demetra was right. A people gets the government. For me, it just tells me that maybe someone needs to be like Jonah the prophet and tell us Ninevites to repent because I'm really tired of this stuff.

but please, please, please get me out of this fake and gay world. But as you were saying, and to wrap up here, we are in a world where these things affect real life just as much as they do the digital. but we are in gamified communication systems that have amputated ourselves from the real world while simultaneously plugging us into a much larger environment.

we're now in war and unlike the anime or manga or whatever it is like sword art online where people are in like a video game and if they die like they're dead for real unlike that kind of stuff we're plugged into a world where Every day there are casualties, both psychological but very... and nations are at risk and civilizations are. And because we're evolving, the challenge that has been laid down before us as regular people, as groups, as ethnos, as whatever you want to identify with is...

What of my traditions, my language, my canon, my beliefs, my values, my genes, my name carries on to the next generation, and will it survive? the retribalization of the West in an age where, you know, most of the people we know outside of this online space are functionally illiterate and just want to have a That's where we're at. Yeah. We covered a lot of ground on this episode. I hope we gave people a lot. There's a lot we didn't get to cover as well. We only scratched.

a clue and we only scratched the surface. Anna Herald-Innes, and I would encourage people. to really pick up and read the books we discussed. You can have a great time reading McLuhan. It's very easy to read. It gets to know really kooky metaphysical stuff. It'll give you a lot to think about. You don't need to agree with all of it, but it'll recontextualize a lot of, you know, your understanding of what media is.

because what We're so adept at looking backwards and trying to contextualize ourselves in our ancestors. in previous lifestyles and live in nostalgia. And I don't think a lot of the people who like to think about where we should go next really appreciate how different our minds are and the mindscape.

now. And I think once we do that, we can actually strategize better because we'll keep putting a round peg in a square hole and say, why isn't this fitting? We keep trying things and they're not working. And I think that frustration leads people to burnout. And I'm not saying, you know, give up on some people say there's no political solution. You know, I'm not one of those. I think every every strategy helps, you know, but. There's some really mind-bending things that are occurring.

It's easy to sound schizophrenic too, but it's real. It's the first step of fixing a problem is admitting you have a problem. The first thing about acknowledging that we live in the hands of an angsty communist. computer god is acknowledging the existence of an angry gangster communist computer god. To rip from Mr. Deck there real quick. I think it's true. It does sound crazy.

Like, anyone that you know as a personality, right? How quickly some of them have risen to prominence and have crashed into weird, like, psychological bra- resentful, angry people or they're just part of these really self-imposed ghettos of existence. And that's kind of what we have to deal with in our own world, which is why talking about the stuff's important and and yes we'll probably maybe i'll come over again on the on blood satellite to talk more about

But I do think that you are right that this is just this is where we live. This is where we're at. It does sound skit, so it's easy to fall into rabbit holes. Do read the books that we've recommended. If you are a patron or a backer of my work, financially speaking, you will get access to my thoughts and readings on McLuhan's Understanding Media. And as I already said on Substack, my plan for 2024 is to examine this stuff closer because.

It sounds meta. It sounds like we've been engaging in sort of a circle jerk, but it's really important to know what kind of world we live in. And if we're not acknowledging the basic reality that... our media influences us, the medium is the message, and that we have changed our entire identity onto digital selves. What are we even doing if we're not even aware of the impact that...

Let me just say some people might think this is a circle jerk, but if you're listening, let me tell you this. You're just a jerk in the circle, baby. Dimes, where can people find your work and your... I'd say bloodsatellite.ca would be the main hub to find all the show-related stuff. I also publish long-form writing on a publication I run called the Vanguardist Journal. That's vanguardistjournal.com. And we also sell merchandise.

from Bloods Allite and also some other people that we've partnered with, including Z-Man, Jay Burden, Censoredon, many people from our space. on a store called the Good Suffer store. That's goodsuffer.com. T-shirts, mugs, stickers, all kinds of things, including a book that I wrote of short stories. called the Colossal Corpus of Sirius Gulag.

We can find that there. Anyway, that's all the plugs. I'm not going to avalanche you with that. But I also want to say thank you so much for having me. This has been, once again, one of my favorite talks that I've had. Hey, baby, I'm here. But I got your pack.