Weird things, weird weird.
Welcome, Welcome.
We have a very special episode today. I don't know that this has ever happened. You could film me in on this. I don't know that anyone has ever had a Monroe Institute trainer come and do their show. I don't know if it happens or not ever, but I'm very honored to have Archie with us here today from the Institute. Yeah, I don't know. I'm just shocked that we're even here.
You know, like.
You so much, And to be honest, I never thought of it, and could very well be that it's the first. But well, there must have been someone, you know, it's been so many years. Yeah, if there was one, I haven't seen it.
I don't know. I just like doing the gateway. So we'll get into a little bit of like how we came connected, and then, you know, we have so many things that we want to learn about you. But for the listener, when we did the Monroe series in July and I went to the Creator Program, Arkie was my trainer and we've been going back and forth about having
him come out and do the show. So for months now we've been sort of making this happen, and it's just like an amazing opportunity for us to fulfill my end of the bargain being invited to Monroe to make content. So I was just like, well, you know what, maybe I could bring them to me, you know. So I don't know, it's like such an honor to have you guys here. And the next we have Emily, which is one of the other trainers that was there with us, but she wasn't training us, but you know, we'll get
into all that stuff. So we're very happy to have you here.
Archie. Thank you, and I'm so happy to be here, so thank you for having me. Yeah, I've been quite a journey and it took a while, you know, to figure things out and to be able to And also thank you guys. I want to say these publicly too, for accommodating to do this summer Sunday, and you know, because it was the only time that we could do it. No brainer come here and everything.
It was a no brainer. I'm very very excited. It's just such a spectacular thing that you guys do over at Monroe. It's so incredible and singular and unique, and I just want to learn everything that I can about it. It's really fascinating. It truly is How long have you been.
Involved with since two thousand and six or seven?
I think, yeah, Oh wow, I didn't How long has the Monroe Institute been around.
Like fifty years? Yeah, since the seventies. I think it's like seventy one or two. I can't remember.
Yeah, wow, I had no idea. I thought it was relatively I mean I thought maybe maybe twenty or thirty.
They've never promoted. That's the new wave that they're on, right, I Meanroe's never really promoted before. It's all been kind of like my family, and it's just that like people came to them and things developed, and I think now they're like, Okay, maybe we should promote.
Yeah, it's just been like a word of mouth is kind of.
Yeah, mostly, And I don't know where this came from. I remember Bob mon grow back in that they used to say he had to believe or he was vocal about it. He used to say, whomever is supposed to be here is going to end up showing up here. And so I guess he had a believe like he didn't really need to promote it like people would be drawn to it. Sure, those who needed to be there, or maybe he didn't want to have too wide of an audience not to dilute the thing. I don't know.
I really don't know what his rasianal was. But yeah, yeah, we never really did much of advertising in a big way.
So speak Yeah, so obviously because I was saying, you never got a meat buban row right, No, because you know, died in the nineties.
I think he died in nineteen ninety five.
I think, yeah, what was it cancer? I can't remember. I don't know. It doesn't matter, but yeah, so Monroe had spend Basically it's been this powerful force in a field of consciousness that literally like never even needed to be promoted, and yet they have helped and changed the lives of millions of people. So they got together and they're like, whose ideal was it? Are we allowed to say that? For the Creator Program?
I'm not sure who it was. I don't know if it was Natalie or was Jennifer or marketing director. I really don't know how it all started. All I know is that at some point I was thrown into it. Someone called me and said, hey, Arkie, would you be interested in training this and to be honest at the beginning, I was like, well, I don't know, I've never We've never done this. We never had a gateway with cameras
and microphones and the whole lot. And I was a little concerned, to be honest, I was thinking, how is this going to play out? What do we do with privacy? What do we do with because we always say that the space we create a gateway or any other programs his saycred space, Well, first thing we trainders need to do is create create this real safety that you can feel so you can let go and you can let your experiences unfold. And I was like, how is this
going to work if we have cameras on people? Yeah, so it was a little tricky, but it worked out beautifully.
Yeah. And I think on the other hand, on our side, we were feeling similar concerns. Not exactly what you're describing, you know, from Monroe's perspective, but like, at least I could say for me, I felt like an imposter being there.
Now.
Maya is obviously not here with us today, but she was the other trainer, and she's also just a wonderful human being. She did my intake, my interview, right, I remember meeting you after like the last person showed up and we had to go to the first event, and I like passed you in a doorway and You're like, oh, hi, I'm Rkie. I look forward to, you know, getting to know you. I was like, oh cool, and just kind of passed you, you know. But with Maya, I sat with her and I had like this long one on
one and I just remember telling her. She said something to the effect of like, what are what do you expect to get out of this? And I literally told her I was like, I don't know. To be honest with you, I don't even believe I can go out of body. Seriously, I felt like an imposter being there, like I don't know. And she was like, well, it's okay to have no expectation, but maybe try setting an intention. And I was like, hm, I never thought of that.
You know, she was right, so amazing week. We've already done a whole three part series talking about that week. If you would be comfortable with it, I'd like to get a little bit of your h maybe take of like some of the things that happened there that stood out to you about that week, you know, what it was like I guess. But then otherwise there's so much stuff about you and other questions about programs you've done that I think we and the listener would like to know more about.
So yeah, and so for me it was a great experience because, as I said before, I had these concerns. We never did this before, and there was all of these back and forth behind the court and how are we going to do this? Where are the limits, how much they can film, how much is private? And we came to some compromise that it turned out to be good. But still I was, you know, a little nervous, to
be honest. And then on day one when I met all of you guys, you and Chrease and Hannah and everybody else, was like, oh, this is gonna be fine. I just knew because of the quality of the people involved. And then I just thought, Okay, I'm just gonna run it like any other gateway. I'm just gonna go on auto pilot and do my thing and then let them do their thing, you know, let the creators do their
creator thing. And it was beautiful and it all blended really nicely, and it was very special, and you guys were having amazing experiences and I was thinking, we're having a conversation about this before. I think that when there's going to be a larger audience, when they impact to a larger amount of people, it's gonna be there. Then things happen because of that, so the message can be widely if that makes any sense.
Yeah, we were talking about that before you guys showed up today. We were just kind of having this general conversation that is said, okay, if I kind of go into what you're saying. Yeah, so he was telling the story. You guys aren't aware of this yet. It's in the gateway, which I'm hoping that someday we'll, you know, maybe be able to work that out for you guys.
Right.
But yeah, So when when Robert Monroe was getting started with the early days of the institute, and please step in and correct me when I get this wrong, because I'm still learning, you know why you know about the
history of the institute. But in the early days, he had this group called the Explorers, right, and they were like the original people that he trained to like do this to go out of body, and the Explorers would go and they would they explored, right, they explored, you could call it whatever you want, the spirit world or whatever.
So they explored as real.
Yes, they explored out of body, and there were many cases where they actually spoke to non huge intelligences.
Right.
So what Archie was explaining to me was like he was like, I can just imagine that when Robert Monroe was doing this in the early days, and he was facilitating this environment where there's exploration and they're talking to these non human intelligences that maybe from the other side, these beings are like, well, they are facilitating an environment
of safe and I guess effective contact between us and them. Right, So he was saying like, maybe they're trying to orchestrate events to where it's allowed to get out in a bigger way.
Uh huh, Yeah, that's kind of could read the intention of the people exploring and the say exploring, yeah, and yeah, wow, that's that's really fascinating.
Yeah, I just wanted you guys have context for you know, what we were.
So that was prior to the institute.
Yeah, that was on the early days. And the thing is very briefly, Bob Monro was this regular businessman. He had no religious inclinations or esoteric or any kind. He was a very successful radio, unprofessional, and he was working in Manhattan for I think he was at the time vice president of NBC Radio. And then out of the blue, he just started popping out of body and he had no context for it. He was freaking out. No one could tell him anything about it. There were no books
back in the day, or very few. In his mind. He was only contemplating two possibilities, one that he had a brain. Two more too, that he was losing his mind.
Wow, So they just started happening to him.
Yeah, he was speaking taneously and then being the way he was, you know, so left brain and so rational and so stubborn too, he thought, okay, no one can give me any answers. He had a lot of faith in uh or a lot of trust in science, and he thought that science could explain everything.
But then they could, yeah, I can't explain Yeah.
And he had many friends who were psychologists and psychiatrists and medical doctors. He went to all of them and they all said, Bob, you're fine, and he was like, well, I'm not.
Something's going on.
Something's going on. And then he said, Okay, if no one can provide the answers for me, I'll find them and he was kind of wealthy, so he put a lab together with you know where they would measure anything that could possibly be measured. They didn't know what to do, so he recruited a couple of scientists who volunteer to do this. So they were measuring things like Alvanik skin response and heartbeats, brain waves while doing these meditations to
see if they could replicate it. That That was another one of his dreams, if he could replicate that, And that's how they started because he was some professional. He was a radio professional. So then they started using their expertise, see if we can use sound to facilitate these states. So in the early days, he had this team of people that he called the Explorers and they would just
go to his place once in a while. He put like lab in his basement and he put it together and people would just go there and lay on a bed, put on a pair of headphones, and he would be recording everything. So there was just so you get an idea of how it was. There was two way communication,
you know, like here the microphone headphones. So you would be in a dark room and you would be listening to his voice and he would be listening to you, and he would be feeding sounds on your headphones and he would be recording everything that you would say, and then eventually he published all those recordings. And those people there were normally making contact with non physical beings, but
the contact was ongoing. But the same being would come like every week, like if you would be coming for your session on Tuesday evenings, that being would come to you on Tuesday evening and say something, Okay, like we said last week, now.
Like a therapy session with the beyond.
And it was like so they could have they could really get very very detailed and ask them any question about the nature of the universe, the nature of reality, what have you. And all of those are there there on YouTube, yeah, and also on the Internet archive you can find them. So again back to your point, I think since these guys up there, whomever they are, they say, oh, look look at what this human did. You know he's got all these recording equipment and we know that he's
going to publish this to a larger audience. Okay, let's make something. Let's this is a window for us to communicate with humans. Yeah, so probably the same happened during your gateway. Okay, this is going to be brought to a larger audience, So let's make something special.
It was definitely special. It was I think I could probably confidently speak for all of us that it was life changing. I mean, just for the simple fact alone that you guys are sitting here with me and we're doing this and we're having fun, and you know, we're these lifelong bonds that have formed and we're all kind of pushing out out of our ordinary routines, and like, I feel like the collaboration that's come from this and
is going to continue to come from this. Like when Amy was here a month or two ago, illuminating joy. For those who've heard the show, she's you know, obviously been. She was there at the gateway. She told me something. She was like, I don't think any of us realize how big that week really was, you know, the change that it's going to leave on all of us, And like that week was just the beginning of what is to come right And I totally feel that, but you know,
they know all about what happened. We did a whole three part series. So I want to shift to you, Archie. So you've been with Monroe since like two thousand and six, or seven. Right, Yeah, So something that I would really love to know is like, how did you align with Monroe? How did you how did you shift your path to be a part of the institute. What was happening?
Well, so this was something totally unexpected. I mean, it wasn't my radar all. Actually, I knew nothing about the Montroe Institute. I knew nothing about Robert Monroe. I knew nothing about the sounds that we use. I heard of it by innural baits in relation to meditation, but that
was all. So basically what happened to me. I was working in logistics back in the day, and I was doing these specialty course on something they called short sea shipping, which is basically, yeah, moving trucks and containers across an
Aditerranean on boats and all the logistics about that. And during a break during that class and the actually the class took place on a boat, on a favorite boat, and during a break, this guy who was also in my class sat with me and we started talking about meditation and things like that, and that's something I always
had an interest on from a very early age. So all those things and UFOs and you know, all those things were like fascinating stay and he said have you do you know about binoral baits and I said, well, I heard of it but never really used them. I said, okay, I have some of that. I can share it with you. And then he said, do you know about Boumont prov I said no, oh, you don't. I said, well no, and I said, okay, we got his books, you know.
And I got the books from him, and so I go back home and then I started reading the books and I was fascinated, like never before. Wow, something really hit me and I thought, wow, but this man did was really astounding. So I think I read all three books in like five days and nights. He was like, I couldn't put them down, you know. I would read all lie Wow, and then and then as much during the day as I could. And then he was like, wow, that was so great. And then he mentions the Gateway
voyage in the books. And then I was like, well, that would be great, but that's pretty far away because I was living in Spain at the time, and I was like, I don't have the time or the money to go to Virginia now. And this I thought, well whatever, And then a few years on the road, I'm looking up something on the Internet and I see Gateway boy Spain,
Like what and like is this real? And there was a phone number, so I called and there was this American lady living in Spain and she was a mon road trainer and she was the only one or one of the very few that was actually doing any Montro stuff outside of the US. And I said, so, do you have a Gateway and she said yeah. In November, I said, okay, booked me up and so yeah. I never looked back. I mean, I did a Gateway. It was fascinating to me, literally life changing, like you said,
and it made so much sense. And it was such a no nonsense, no dogma, no no fluffy things I wanted things to be because I knew these things were real, you know, other places of the realities. But that approach that we use, that it's so so matter of fact.
It's a scientific approach. Yeah, data, it's all based on exactly.
Yeah. And also the technique for you know, for tuning into those realities through sound, it's also simple and so but the elegance of it, on the simplicity of it, it's efficient, yeah, exactly, it's just efficiently just walks. Yeah, and it doesn't have all the candles and incense.
That's like what Maya told me when I did my first interview with her. She was like, you know, I lived in India for two years and doing like transcendental meditation. And she said, but then I came to the Monroe Institute and I got more out of it in one week than I did living in India for two years. And I thought about that deeply. I'm like, wow, that's
really powerful. And I think like, based off of what you're saying, it's it's amazing, Like the Minrosa two is so amazing because it is like you said, it's no nonsense. There's no rituals, there's no creed. There's one creed. It's literally like, no, you don't have to believe anything except you are more than your physical body.
Yeah, and even that we invite that's the only little piece of dogma that we have, that you are more than your physical body. But even that one we invite everyone to challenge it. If this is true, I might really more than my physical body. And then we give you the tools and it's like here now you can try. Now you can really figure out whether you are or not more than your physical body.
Yeah, that's incredible. It gives people the opportunity to find the answer for themselves.
So yeah, don't believe anything. Yeah, we try to keep the teaching or whatever. We don't even consider ourselves to teach anything. Just facilitate experiences and if you have questions, it's like, Okay, here's the tools. Now you go out there you find them for yourself. That's that's the way we like doing.
Yeah, And I think efficient is the right word. I remember maybe a couple of years ago, a year or two ago, Ryan started telling me about like data wave stay and earth Theda states and binoralbeats and this kind of stuff, and he's like, dude, this stuff is like a fast track to get you into that Theda state, Like there are Tibetan monks that train their entire lives to get into this state and this thing can get you there immediately. And I was like what, Like really?
And then I start doing it for myself and I'm like, Okay, there's something to this. And then hearing his stories and his sister Emily's stories, and hearing all these stories of people that have really dedicated themselves to this process, and I think it really is something profound and kind of uncharted territory. It's also just incredible that this sort of
thing is happening. I remember being a kid, and ever since I was little, I've always had an intuitive feeling like energy that comes from the body is real, and the spirit is real and consciousness is real. And I always had this fantasy as a kid, I would always think, why aren't they like Hogwarts style institutions that are studying this stuff, Like you know, we're studying like the atom bomb and like stuff in space and like all this how to make food cheaper and like all this this
kind of stuff, which is important stuff. But ever since I was little, I remember thinking I wish there was some kind of a place that just focuses on figuring this anomaly out, this this strength because I knew, I always knew that we're more than our physical body. I just didn't know the specifics. And I'm really glad that this institution is a thing that exists.
It's it's really incredible, and I think it's the po where first time I found out it was like oh someone, yeah, yeah, yeah, It's like thank god, somebody's doing it, Like somebody has to do it. I always thought that, and so I'm just I find myself really fascinated with the Monroe Institute right now.
Yeah. And also when you were mentioned about the effectiveness of it to me on the early days, because I had experience with meditation, but then when I tried the Montro I thought, I was like, oh wow. And I always used to say that to me, the difference was like between riding a bicycle and riding a motorcycle. It's just you know, kind of that comparison.
Yeah.
Yeah, And funny story, I don't know if you probably told it on one of the previous episodes. Back in the nineties, there was this sand monk. He was ninety something. He went to the Gateway. He was taking Gateway and I think it was Wednesday when they were trying focus fifteen or something. He got all agitated and he said,
I need to talk to Bob Montreux. And they were like, well, Bob is not here, Well I need to talk to him, and he insisted, and he insisted, and eventually they called Bob and said, Bob, can't you because he lived up in the mountain, can you come down to the institute because this gentleman wants to talk to you. And so Bob went there, and the sand monk said, do you have any idea what you're doing here? And he was like, well, I've been doing it for like forty years. I think I do.
Yeah, that kind of thing.
And then the monk said, these people in my group here, they're riching states of consciousness just a few days. It takes us decades of siten. And then the story was I think it was on the Wall Street Journal or something, but it's that kind of thing. Yeah, you know, yes, you can gether by your own means and without guidance and without a framework, without anything, but it's way more difficult. Wow.
So was he agitated in a way like he was concerned, No, but he was like surprised more than anything.
And he was saying things like, oh, you Americans, you always have to do anything fast.
Let's get it moving, Let's get it moving. We ain't got time for this.
Well, it brings up the question right, like, and I don't mean this in a bad way, but the first thing that comes to my mind is like, did I just waste my whole life trying to master this thing that I inherently can do? If you know, shown a simpler way.
Yeah, he's ninety, he's spent ninety years trying to get there and then boom.
And it's not his fault because, right, this is relatively new territory, right, Like Tibetan monks have been doing this for hundreds, if not, I guess it's hundreds of years. I don't know. You could argue in India they've been doing it for thousands. But then it's like, we always find a newer, better way to do something. So it's nobody's fault that they haven't found this method. And you know, it's like I guess technically, nobody's wasted their life. There
are some people out there. I've seen comments on previous videos of ours. There are some people who are like, well, this method is ancient and sacred and it's better because xyz. And it's like that's good for you. My life is short, my time is valuable. I really appreciate this efficient method. Thank you.
They didn't have headphones a thousand years ago, so yeah, we've evolved a bit.
Yeah, and they always if you think of it, they always use sound for reaching altered states of consciousness, like drumming.
Bowls.
So this technology is not like new, but we just refined it. As you said, there were no headphones. Now we have them, so now we can do that.
Yeah, it's evolution.
Yeah, and also a very good point. I'm not going to leave forever. You know, I often tell people participants. You know, it's not like we can live for like fifteen hundred years here. You just have this lifetime. Maybe other lifetimes, but for now you have this one. So you know, you may want to think of what you want to do with it and be efficient about it.
Yeah.
Yeah, that's awesome. So I have to ask, what's it like going on a body.
Well, at the beginning, the first time is shocking. The first thing that most people experience is fear. It's usually the first reaction is fear, and it's a very primal fear, like real terror. It's like very in your body. And then once you get used to it, then curiosity kicks in. And they often said you cannot be curious and fearful at the same time. I'm not sure I fully agree, but yeah, that you shift from being fearful to okay,
now what's out there and you start sniffing around. So usually a lot of people start there, oh, is this thing real. Is the out of body state real? If it's really when I try it and when I go there. That's how I started too, and I spent hundreds and hundreds of hours trying to go out of body and I did succeed. Now, in hindsight, it's like, was that
worth it? And I think it was. Maybe it would have done things differently now I wouldn't focus so much on the phenomenology of the out of body state, but more on the content.
What do you do with it?
Yeah, because yeah, going out of body gave me something unvaluable, which I think it's I mean the actual knowledge like one hundred percent in every cell of your I was gonna say your body, but guess.
What, right, Yeah, it's about it fear about it, and so there's no way that you cannot know that that's real.
I mean it's so real that it's like overwhelmingly real. So it's not a belief anymore. You jump in a split second from believing or considering it as a posibility to just know it, and then you also know, at least in my case, I knew that I was immortal. That's huge. I mean, like I knew I wouldn't die, did I die, and that alone for me, it was like it was worth all the hours I spent doing it. Now, once having done that, would I continue investing hundreds of
hours in trying to go bod? It was maybe not. Maybe I would focus on more on the content, like what I want to get out of it. And we also have at Montro something that we call the facing model, which is you don't necessarily need to leave your body. It's like you face your consciousness out into different frequency, so to speak. So you start perceiving, your attention shifts from this really physical reality into other realities, and then
you start getting signal getting data from there. And that's way way easier than going out about it. That's much more reliable, much more efficient, and it's repeatable. You can do it anytime, and you don't necessarily need to fill the vibrations and leave your body and all of that.
That's very interesting you say that, And I hope it's okay that I repeat the story. Right when you got here a few hours ago, we were talking about this and something I haven't really told much to you guys. It's just kind of like hard to talk about because it's like, man, are people going to believe me. But ever since coming back from the Gateway experience, there have now been four occasions where I've spontaneously popped out a
body laying in bed at night. And I know I already told you the story, but you know, for the listener's sake, maybe I could get your take because what I've experienced two nights ago is similar to what you just described. So I'll just start over and tell you again. Right, So, I'm laying in bed and I'm wide awake, and I start transitioning into another place where there's something communicating to me. I couldn't see it face on. It looked kind of like a glowing being, which I mean you know what
that means to me? Right, And there's like stars all around me, and I swear to you I was like moving my hand and the camera can see me. Right. So, all right, So if my hand is right here by my side and I'm laying on my back trying to go to sleep, I'm gonna swap hands here so you can see my little illustration. This is my right hand,
even though it's my physical left hand. It's right here, and I try to move my hand and it feels like it's way over here and my physical hand doesn't move, and I'm like, ohh, I'm out of body and this information starts coming to me. Is that kind of like what you're describing the phasing model?
U mm, not really, but it's very similar what I think that was happening to you. And again I really have no way of really knowing what was happening. But what often happens. You sort of reach this estate where you could break loose. You're really loose from your physical body. The thing is you stay there within reach of your body. You're not floating away. You could if you intend to, and that's why you could move your hand away from
your non physical hand, away from your physical hand. And then so you could do this intentionally by meditation or by breathing or whatever, shifting to data state, or to some people, it just happen to naturally. And then what happens. You still in your bedroom, You still feel your bed, and you still feel your body, but your consciousness is already shifting into another place, but not fully. So you're still hear and you're also there, so that both realities
kind of overlap and things super imposed. It's not unusual to maybe look at the ceiling and see the stars in the sky, or to see other beings coming through your wall or talking to you or whatever. So that can be a little spooky, but yeah, yeah, it kind of is. You were shifting perspectives. You were shifting your attention maybe intentionally, maybe you know, from this reality into the other reality to a point where both were overlapping.
Since leaving on Road, it's all been spontaneous, like I haven't been trying to to do it. It just like sort of happens when I'm laying in bed at night and I do use the expand app and listen to the sleep frequencies, which I mean, I guess maybe that gets me to a certain relaxed state, but then it just starts happening. It's it's always like kind of caught me by surprise. The first time it scared me, but then I remembered my experiences at Gateway and I was like, no, no, no, no,
it's nothing to be afraid of. I repeated the you know, the affirmation, and I was like, it's totally fine. But yeah, I just wanted your take on that, like, it's is this something that you guys hear reports of commonly?
Well, yeah, of course, and that's the result of all the world you did you in your gateway. You know, you invested all these hours into going into these states and you see the techniques, and you've been practicing ever since you came back, So now it's paying off.
Interesting on the subject of sleep, has the Monroans done very much study in the way of sleep paralysis?
Not really? Sleep aaralysis is something very very I know this is scary for a lot of people, and naturally so because it can be very uncomfortable, especially if you don't know what it is. But think of this. Sleep aaralysis is something that happens to all of us every night. The only thing is that we're usually not aware of it. And it's actually a good thing. It's like a safety mechanism. If you didn't have a sleep paralysis, you would be
enacting your dreams. You would be sleepwalking. You could follo off a window or something.
Yeah.
Yeah, And the reason why your body gets paralyzed is so you don't enact your dreams. Now, what happens the moment you wake up during the sleep paralysis you freak out because your body is totally paralyzed and look, oh my god, I cannot move. And not only that, Usually when you're instead of sleep paralys like like Ryan was experiencing, experiencing,
usually part of your consciousness is somewhere else. Yeah, so it's very common for people to report, Okay, I wake up in the middle of the night, I opened my eyes, I cannot move, I'm totally paralyzed, and now there's people in my room.
Yeah.
Yeah, It's probably the closest thing that I've experienced to being out of body. I've never experienced explicitly being out of body, but I have probably a couple of hundred of experiences with sleep per Elms.
Well that's a lot.
Yeah, it It hasn't happened a ton in the last few years, interestingly, like around the time that we started doing the podcast, But yeah, since I was eleven or twelve, it would happen at least a couple of times a month, and it was it was usually pretty scary, But then the more times I had it, the more kind of interesting they got. I did start to see some into he's in the room with me, which that was very scary at first, but then I quickly realized they can't
really interact with me directly. They can't seem to. They can get close to me. There have been a couple times where they got very close to me, but nothing, you know, nothing ever.
Nothing happens. And usually the sleeperaralys is something that people start fearing when they experience it, and then people who want to go out of body they usually seek them. They usually look for them because the sleep analysis for them is like a gateway into the out of body state. Once you experience in the sleep analysis, just just to step away from being out of body, yeah, all you need is an intention to be somewhere else.
Yeah.
There were a few times where the sleep paralysis would start and then I don't know if it's sort of like being out of body or whatever, but I would think that my actual body was getting up and walking down the hallway, and then in a snap, I'm back in the bed and I'm like there was this one particular instance where that happened. I don't know, ten or twenty times in a row. I would get up, walk down the hallway, and then I'm back in bed. And
then I was like, Okay, that's weird. Let me actually get up this time, and I would think I was awake, and again I'm back in bed, and it would happen over and over and over and over, and then eventually I finally woke up, not knowing if I was still asleep or awake or whatever. There were a couple of times like that, and so I've always had this thought that maybe there's gotta be some kind of relation.
Yeah, of course. And to me, it sounds like you were really going out of body, not far away, just sounds the whole way, and then snapping back as it usually happens, but it sounds like you really did go to bod it many times.
Yeah, and it felt completely real.
It is real, Yeah, yeah, I mean it felt like my body, you know, my physical Body's been a very long time since something like that has happened, and so I've always been really fascinated about and having an out of body experience. And I'd like to chase that at some point. But it'll it'll happens when it'll happen, when it happens. I'm that's kind of how I let things come to me. I don't I'm not much of like a seeker go out and get it and find it.
I'm like, when it happens, I'll I'll just take the experience in and enjoy it.
Yeah, And I guess it should be easier for you because you have all these background, all this previous experience of experience in the sleeperalysis and actually seeing yourself walking down the hallway and then snapping back.
Yeah.
Yeah, probably you're not going to be scared about it anymore, right, Yeah, I think so there thing is going for you. Yeah.
I think I think I'll be I think I'll be a little less scared than if it had never happened at all.
Yeah. Yea.
So it's it's intriguing, it's really intriguing, and I'm excited to have my first out of body experience. I'm man of it. It's gonna happen at some point. I'll just when it happens, I'll be very well.
You have the intention.
Yeah.
See I didn't even have the intention. Yeah, you know, and it happened, so like I can only imagine having the intention and the knowing that it is possible, not only possible, but available for everyone. And that's another thing I wanted to add to your story. Like we would be kids, we've known each other since we were eleven
and twelve. You know, he'd be like staying at my house on a Friday, and like I don't know, me and my brother would be playing Halo or something and he's asleep behind us on the floor because we would sit on the floor. I had like a twin bed, and we would all sit in my room sometimes on the floor and we'd just be playing Xbox or whatever, and he'd be asleep, right and I'd turn around and he would just suddenly sit up. I'm like, you're good, dude, and he's like just kind of stunned, and he's like
he'd be like, I just have sleep proud. I mean, it happened a lot, like really a lot, like I would see it happen over the years.
You know.
Crazy.
When it's happening, you're like tensing your body, like trying to force yourself to get up, and then when you finally do wake up, it's like it all catches up.
To you would like pop your arms like, oh my god, like I can move my arms.
They would pop.
You were so tight and so like tense.
It was a little scary.
You look like you've been through it. But that's what I like about the Monroe experience, right is like I'll tell you this man at least in my experience, it is kind of a little bit scary going out of body in the first or for the first time, but it's not because something is trying to scare you.
It's because it's bizarre.
It's bizarre. Imagine your first time riding a roller coaster. It's like, ah, you know, and you know what it's like writing a roller coaster. You know, you're dropping and you're going fast, and it's a different sensation that you're used to feeling. And if I could add a little context, it's like that. It's like it's it's scary in the sense that it's exciting and it feels a little foreign, but it's it's pretty it's pretty awesome.
Yeah.
I don't have any fear at all associated with the thought of going out of body, probably just because of the sleep paralysis stuff. To me, it just sounds really cool and exciting and magical. So it'd be really cool and I would be appreciative of the experience.
Yeah, I'm pretty sure you just to step away if you Brian said, if you just put your intention, you know, and spend some time rying.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Then one thing, for some reason, as we're talking here, these ideas come into my mind like say this, say this, say this. I don't know what it's coming from. And it's just gonna say. One question for all of you out there who want to go out of body, and a question that I should have asked myself back in the day. I feel like I should have asked myself. And I often ask people when they tell me, oh, I want to go out of body, and my question is what for? Maybe you want you, guys, want to
ask yourself what for? What are you going to do out there? Or how is that going to benefit your life? What anything of value are you willing to bring back for you? Like here now? Yeah, just going out of body for the sake of going out of body or you want something out of it you want. I think that's a good question, open question to ask people. And then once you answer that question, is and the way you need to go to body in order to achieve that? Or can I do that by other way? Easier means?
So again, I don't want to discourage anyone, but I say, oh no, no, just don't go out of body. It's a fascinating thing and I love it, But don't get what I would say is don't get too caught up on the tools. Yeah, sure, you know, focus on what you want to builds. Yeah, if that makes any sense, No, I love that.
Yeah. It's like when I went to Monroe for this Creator Program thing. I'm telling you, I didn't even think that it was possible for me to go out of body. I didn't go there because of that. I went there because my dad and my sister came back to me and they were changed as people. They were changed in a way, especially my sister, and I wanted to go because I told this on the last day of the
Creator Program. I said, for years, I've wanted a teacher, and I've wanted somebody who can you know, because things have spontaneously been happening to us our whole lives, my family or whatever. I wanted to find somebody who could help me develop these things so that they were no longer unconscious. And everybody out there is like, yeah, out of body, this out of body that that's great, But Monroe is so much more than that. It's a place where you can develop. I think about it like this.
There are a lot of people in this world I believe who are psychic potential, right have abilities but are not aware of it or are not conscious of how to make contact with it and use it in a meaningful, beneficial way in their lives. And I think Monroe is the place where you go to develop that. It's so much more than going out of body. It's like you said, what are you seeking from this experience?
Yeah? And I think you put it beautifully. And one thing that Monroe gives to a lot of people, it is a framework which things get normalized. Yeah, And that's probably a good point to talk about. You know, this has been this kind of psychic phenomena has been happening since the inception of humankind. And it's always like, oh, this is so special and it's been validated because here here's the evidence. Okay, all of that is great, but when are we going to normalize it like this happens
or is accessible to any human being? Now? Can we please move on? Can we all accept that this is a fact, that the autobode experience is a reality, that there are other realities, There are entities out there. Now what do we do with it? And I think one thing that Montro gives a lot of people is normalcy about these things, because you can't imagine how many people come freaking out like things like you were experiencing, Like, Oh, I wake up in the middle of the night and
I can't move. I'm so scared. I don't know what to do. Nobody understands anything. People think I'm crazy. Or I see that people at night and they ask for my help and I don't know what to do with that. That happen a lot. Or I see lights in the sky and nobody else is them. Everyone thinks I'm crazy. You go to Monro and say, well, yeah, that's what we do here on.
Normal stuff.
Yeah, and so it gives people a framework in which that's normal, and that that in itself, that thing alone, you know, puts a lot of people at is Okay, this is normal. Now what's next? Now what do I I guess the next question would we now, what do I do with this? Now that I'm sort of normalizing this thing, how do I integrate it into my life? How do I integrate into this physical human life? The fact that there's other realities out there, the fact that
you don't die when you die. And if you ask me, what is the main thing that we do what Monro is allow the people to turn beliefs into nones because you can't believe that there is an afterlife but you don't know do it?
Right?
And having one of those experiences is like an autobot experience or something similar, can prove to yourself that is actually real, right. Yeah, But again, the gap between believing and knowing it's massive, it's huge, Yeah.
Yeah, because belief is almost active, whereas knowing is passive. Yeah, it's subconscious. You don't have to try at all, you just know.
Ye.
Belief feels maybe like it requires some effort act.
Yeah, it's like I don't know for sure, but I you know, I get it.
I actively believe it's active.
Yeah, And if you think of it ultimately, why would you even have any belief at all? Why would you believe anything at all? Why just not suspend judgment until you really know or don't know? That's interesting. That's something we put a lot of emphasis onto. Huh, Like beliefs just get in the way basically. That's really interesting, And some beliefs can be very useful. For instance, if you believe yourself to be all capable. I'm just a hard worker,
you know, I can handle anything. Well, that's gonna be positive maybe you're gonna burn yourself out eventually. But you know, some beliefs can really take you really far, but most of them are just limitations that we have. Yeah, and why not? Why not say something like, Okay, I don't know one way or another. I don't know if this is true or not, so I just don't believe anything. I just suspend my belief until I have a chance to find out and then I know or I don't.
I tried and I felt, well, I still don't know.
Yeah, I relate to that a lot. I feel that's kind of how I accept information. I just i'd stay, I stay somewhat agnostic to a lot of ideas until I fully and firmly know for myself.
That's the healthiest thing to do. Sad thing is most people don't do that. People usually very quickly jump into oh, I don't believe that, or I do believe it. Now, I'm a believing You don't feed me anything. I'll swallow anything you give me. Yeah or no, No, I just don't believe it. That's not true.
Yeah. They grasp to those beliefs, and it's like an attachment. It's a very strong attachment.
Yeah, or even the opposite, and being an skeptic is very healthy. But some people take skepticism to a level of foremost religion. Oh, I just don't believe it, and that's my religion. I just don't believe anything.
Yeah.
Well, and some people say, oh, there's no afterlife, and they believe that so strongly that guess what happens to them when they die? They find themselves alive, and they in their minds there's only one reality and it's this one. So if they see themselves alive, they believe they're still alive in the human body because that's all there is. And then this guy is turning to ghosts.
Wow, can we die that?
Yeah?
I was actually gonna ask because I'm very interesting in the lifeline. Well, that brings me to my next question then, because I was waiting for the right moment to inject this, and now it has presented itself. I was going to ask, based on your pretty much lifetime almost lifetime of you know, your experiences with Monroe and being a trainer, my question was, what's your take on life after death? We've already naturally gotten there, but I had to say the question so well.
My take based on my experience and the experiences of hundreds and hundreds of people that have come to our class, especially Lifeline, which is a graduate program that you can take after Gateway focused specifically on life after life. And so based on my experience and other people's, I know you see again, I don't believe now, I know that you simply don't die. You cannot die. I mean, you are an immortal being. And when you die here, you
pop up somewhere else. Basically that's what happens. Or are you going to pop up? That's kind of tricky that it's not like this place where everyone goes. You would mainly depend on what your state of consciousness is. So if you die in a state of bliss and very high frequency whatever, you're probably going to find yourself in a place that matches that. And see angelic beans and this, and and if you die in a state of twenty year or horror, probably you're gonna show up in a
preagly place. Then again, you're not going to stay there forever. You know, everybody moves on eventually, some people stay in one given place for longer or shorter whatever. And we have done so much work on life after that you wouldn't believe. I mean when Bob Montreux came up with Lifeline at the beginning, it was like a research experiment, really like everything at Montrovo, so he would give participants.
We don't do that anymore for several reasons, but up until quite recently, we would give participants in Lifeline contact sheets what we call contact sheets, which is like a form and every time you find someone on the other side, you write their name, where they lived, how they died, and enough data that you could verify that that was actually real. And then we would look up the cases and yes, this John Smith really lived in Minnesota and his wife was Nancy, and he was an architect and
he died in a car crush. This actually happened. And we validated hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of cases, and then it's like, okay, what's the point on validating any of these amore? Once you know it's real. It's like what I said before, Okay, it's real, we know it's really.
Let's get to work.
What's next?
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Do you remember in our in our creator group when we were watching that documentary on TV. I can't remember the Yes, I think it was.
I think it was a biography channel, Yeah, it was. It was.
It was one of those big channels that I can't remember.
They shoot that piece in twenty eleven. It was back there the Institute back in the day, and that was a lifeline class and they send the TV crew to take lifeline.
Actually, yeah, and do you remember that the first name of the person that it was, but we guessed.
Yeah.
I looked at you and you were like, and you told me after you were like, I've seen this hundreds of times and I never thought about it. It was just it was weird. It was totally weird.
He totally you know, went over my rather it was like.
Daniel Bledsoe or something was the first name on the the you know, the documentary thing. And I thought that was so peculiar because the second time ever to my knowledge, that the Monroe Institute will ever be on TV, is going to be because of the History Channel thing, which we haven't gone into much detail about, but we have been authorized to at least talk about it.
Right.
I just thought that was weird that both times that that I think it was Life, Lifetime or whatever, and then we have an upcoming History Channel appearance with them in row. Both of them have a blood cell. So I was like, this is weird.
It's weird.
It is.
And one thing that happened on that documentary that we didn't know because these guys came and they shoot the piece. They spend the whole week there and then they left and they told us, Okay, we'll let you know when this comes in the air, and so then they told us, okay, it's going to be this Tuesday whatever. So everyone's there
watching Biography Channel. What we didn't know is that they actually afterwards they hired a professional investigator to validate the cases, and they did, and they show it in the documentary.
They were real people, like they found their graves and everything, and they even need to.
Read their families, their descendants and everything.
So now they show it at Gateway as like educational material like that.
I'd love to see that it's out there.
To find it for you. It's really cool, dude. Wow, Yeah, it's it's awesome stuff. And the first the first name was blood, so that's that's just the dead person. That's just too much of a coincidence. Your first time being there, you hear your last name. It's not a common name. I don't know I just thought it was weird. I don't want to read too much into it, but I did find it a killer that both TV appearances, which again the second one is not out yet, it was delayed,
both of them have a blood set. I was like, huh, maybe I'm in the right place. I don't know who you are.
Sure it was reaffirming.
So did you have a question I didn't mean to come.
Well, something I'm a little curious about is something that you said earlier, which is that you know, we as in Monroe, know this information and it's it's not it's not a spectacular thing. We're not we're not all wondering if we know this or if we believe it. And then you you mentioned that the world doesn't necessarily always match up with these beliefs or this knowledge, even though it feels like, don't we all know this by now? What I'm curious on your take of, like, what is
holding the world back from knowing this stuff? Why is there so much pushback and rejection?
I think it's probably the Western approach that we have to science. Yeah, it has taken us really really far, Like it has taken us even out of the planet and into space and everything, but this hyper rationalization of everything and this thing, this way of looking at things. Oh, if my tools cannot measure it, then it doesn't exist. Yeah, which is funny if you think of it. But if there's something out there that your tools cannot measure, it happens all the time. There is I mean, it happened
with brain waves before. You didn't have gama brain waves cause why because the electrodes were not sensitive enough, so gamma waves didn't exist. Bacteria, yeah, bacteria didn't exist. The guy who invented who mainted, the guy who discovered microbes and you know, germs, he ended up in a psychiatric hospital. Everybody made fun of him. Oh the guy who's his little creatures.
Yeah yeah, yeah, the water and the water and.
They couldn't measure it. Therefore it didn't exist. And it you know, it's always like that. And if you go to other cultures, cultures that we often label as primitive who live in the Amazon jungle or whatever, they have it fully integrated in their lives. You know, like even for even more developed cultures like India, well, the afterlife is a fact for all of them. They don't even question it or the ability to contact the spirits or you know, in many cultures that's a given. They even
have a shaman who's the professional guy who does that. Yeah, yeah, and when you need it, you just go to the shaman and he does it for you. He opens a door for you and then you look into it or whatever. So why cannot we do the same thing. And then the thing is, we usually don't acknowledge this publicly, maybe out of shame or because we don't want to ruin our careers or disrespected scientists. I don't want to say that I believe in an afterlife, then I'm going to
be ostracized. But it's like, you know, in the privacy of our lives, we all sort of know or believe that this is a thing. But then like we're not quite there yet. We just like mainstream is like there's consensus in society, Yes, this is real.
Yeah, yeah, I think you're I think it is somewhat that like hyper rationalization of the of Western culture. And yeah, I mean even a more recent example of something we have no idea what it is. It's like dark energy, dark matter. These scientists are like, it's everywhere. We know, it's everywhere. We have no idea what it is.
It's ninety four the entire universe, the universe.
We're surrounded by it right now. We have no clue what it is. And it's like, I find it fascinating that these brilliant scientific minds, it's like they have zero imagination, that they have no willingness to say maybe, like to have that agnosticism of saying, maybe.
There you go, that's mentality. What if these were real? What would it be like? Yeah, And some brilliant scientists, and most brilliant ones were actually the ones who had imagination, Like Einstein the way he came up with his theory of relativity, it was like he asked himself, what would it be like to be traveling faster than light? What would that feel like? Oh, it would spend time and space. And also Nicola Tesla when he was twelve he went to Niagara Fault and he was like, oh my god,
that's so much energy. What would it be like to harness that energy? And he created the first ever, you know, hydroelectric plants in the world. Yeah, but you know, most scientists are not like that.
Yeah, it's true.
And as soon as they like Einstein and Tesla, as soon as they have a theory or something that's a little weird. Everybody's like, ah, lock him up, lock him up, he's lost his mind. He's a weirdo.
So yeah, the man train science generally is don't rock the bout. Yeah, but why don't get out of the consensus comfortable reality.
Yeah, let's rocket, Well, let's rock in the boat. Seriously.
It's something that my dad and I have talked about for a long time because you know, we've had our own history of you know, seeing the beings and all that stuff that's been going on for almost twenty years.
It'll be eighteen in January, right, So that's something that we've come to understand, is like I I for starters, having a supernatural experience that you're viewing externally, seeing a ghost or you know, a being or a UFO or whatever, to me, in my opinion, is very very very finely separated. Like it's a very close phenomenon to going out of body and what happens at Monroe. It's just a little different, right, it's inner versus outer, But to me, it's like the
same thing. There's a connection. So anyway, so my dad and I've been talking about this for like eighteen years. Well, if they were to come out and finally acknowledge in a broad sense that like, okay, consciousness is a thing in life after death, you know, you're immortal all the stuff we've been talking about. The opinion we've come to is like, well, there'd be a lot of people out
of a job. There'll be a lot of people who have to rewrite their textbooks and would have to admit, Okay, I've been wrong ostracizing people, you know, my whole career. So it's like it's just it's a it's a tough not to crack.
Yeah, you know what happens. It really challenges the whole statugu of things, and it opens so many questions that nobody wants to go there. And sometimes science does look into these things, like at Princeton, doctor Nelson, and I think it was Barbaradon. They spent three years collecting data in the lab with protocols that were, you know, way way more solid than in any other experiments because they knew they were going to be scrutinized very heavily. They
were proving for thirty years that mine effects matter. Mm hm yeah, And guess what. And I remember being in Portugal watching her Barbaradon giving a presentation on their work. Three decades of collecting data, very solid data, and she said, we were expecting that finally the scientific community would look into it. Well guess what did never happened, No one ever occurred, And then they stopped doing the experiments because what was the point of accumulating more and more data
if no one's gonna look at it. So there is scientific evidence that mind effects matter. There's scientific evidence of psychokinesis, there's scientific evidence of telepathy, and it's been proven again and again and again and again. But guess what people keep on saying, Oh, no, there's no evidence. Well guess what there is?
Yeah, a lot of it. Actually.
Ye.
I don't know if any of you guys have heard of this yet. This just happened days ago, literally like breaking news, the first ever recorded evidence of genuine dream communication. How just happened like literally last week that they as an experiment and I don't know the name of the scientist, but it'll be very Just google it, Alex if you don't mind.
Uh.
Dream communication and they like set it up in laboratory conditions and they developed their own dream language and they had two people with these headphones that are measuring like brain waves and they communicated with the dream language in their sleep. Just happened.
I want to do that.
Yeah, well, al for us, but I also have it in a d M. I could find it real quick if you just want me to. That's really yeah, dude, it's I've been seeing it all over my feed lately.
Yeah.
It's funny because we've talked about quite a few of these experiments over the years. I've always been really fascinated in science. With science as well, I feel I have an equal fascination with science and spirit. Go like this they are The reality is they are married.
Yeah.
We actually have a little segment we do sometimes called spirit science where we you know, kind of talk about how they relate.
Data of spiritual things. We should do an out of body one.
Oh, let's do it. That would be stat Yeah. But I mean we talk about these studies and they're so profound and mind blowing and uh and concise and definite, and then it's like, whatever came of this? Nothing? We just do nothing with this talking about it. Yes, just like a couple of dorky dudes on a podcast talking about it, and it's like, whoa, why are really.
What happened with the revelation by the Pentagon about a year ago? Pentagon's saying publicly in all mainstream media, Hey, UFO supt real And everyone's like okay, whatever.
Okay, cool, Like what what? What's happening? Am I crazy? Like why aren't we talking?
You're the one that's not crazy?
I know?
Why are we talking about this stuff more? Yeah, it's shocking, honestly.
I think Alex found it.
Yeah, I found the article. So it's a it's a startup from the Bay Area, but they developed two way communication between people in dreams. So recently, on September twenty fourth, they linked to people in a lucid dream state achieved communication, and then they did that again in October.
How how is this not every every headline in every news publication?
And you see that's something that doesn't surprise me because that happens at Montroe.
Yeah.
The thing is, we don't have a means to prove it to other people. Sure, but like in Gateway or it was happening all the time. Oh so you in my meditation always so you too? You were behind that tree? Yes, there I was, Yeah, and you were doing this and yes, I was doing. That happens all the time.
Yeah, it's just funny that people normally they need this, They need the headline and the article and the guys and the coats and like exactly you need a movie too. Yes, they need all of that stuff to believe it. It's like, it's right there. Why is that not on every TV? Why aren't we telling everybody? Because I feel that the moment that everybody in this world can at least get on the same page with that, we are more than our bodies, we would be in a better place.
Well, of course, that's the whole purpose of you know, the exploration of human consciousness, to get to know that these things are real. And then said, before you move on, you do something about it.
You do something with it. Yeah, let's move forward.
This brings me to a good point. I've been waiting also for the right moment to ask this question. I wanted to get your take, and it perfectly aligned with all the stuff we're talking about about Monroe's mission and purpose.
Well, the monro Cities mission and purpose if to to to allow people to explore consciousness. That's what we do, and the exploration of consciousness and to provide these tools to as many people as possible. You know, our mission goal right now, it's very ambitious. I don't know if we're gonna get there.
You're gonna get it is.
To get these tools available to one percent of the world population. That's eight million people. That's quite eighty million, well eight million, yeah, you're right.
Eighty million out of eight billion, one percent.
Yeah, And guess what. But once we decided that was the goal, then people like you started showing up. Is it not funny? It is people with large audiences and who can really spread the message out there. So yeah, set up an invention related I guess.
And so here's the thing, like specifically, what the like if you go to Monrositute. Is it a dot org? I guess that's Monroe I don't know the Monrositute dot org and you go click on the about page and it says, like I think it says about right, our mission and purpose to advance the global awakening of human consciousness. So the belief, actually we could maybe talk about M five thousand. When Robert Monroe's alive, he believed that if he could just put five thousand people through that it
would change the world. That it would like impact the consciousness of the whole world. And as we know, that five thousand number filled up very quickly, and he's like, okay, maybe it's a bigger number. You know, so they've arrived at one percent. But you know, what we've been talking about kind of like goes along with that, like what would happen if the whole world was to get on
same page. That's actual Monroe's mission is to try to literally shift the entire collective consciousness by seeking that one percent number of the total population, hoping that, you know, putting so many people through the Gateway and altering their understanding about reality and things that it could have like a tidal wave effect on all of consciousness.
Oh yeah, I tend to think that it absolutely.
I would personally very aligned with that mission. Yeah, I think I told you this, both of you.
This.
I keep pointing off cameras because Emily, you guys will see Emily next week. But yeah, so I told you guys this at Gateway. But like my dad and I have been kind of on a similar mission to get people to like see the lights, you know, the things that we see. And I've always had it in my head. It has to be fifty one percent. For some reason, I'm like, if we could get fifty one percent of the world to see this, then it would be a change.
And then I went to Monroe and I heard one percent, and I was like, honestly, I like that better.
Modest number.
It's a little less pressures, not four big, yeah versus eighty. You know, it's ambitious, but you.
Know, usually a critical mass doesn't need to be that big universe a tipping point at some stages like that experiment, a hundred monkey experiment, like you probably all know about it. You know, like some monkeys started using some rocks to crack nuts or something, and once a number of monkeys learned how to do that, then all monkeys in isolated areas which had no contact with those monkeys started doing the same thing.
It's a morphogenetic resonance. Yeah, is that what it's called?
Aproper shelled rakes right right?
Yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely.
So I guess we could do the same thing, right if enough of us put this thing out there, then eventually it would be like like a tipping point where all of a sudden, Yeah, first gradually and then you know.
Yeah, the snowball causes the avalanche. You just need a little snowball.
Yeah, well, we get there in this lifetime of ours.
I feel a surge. Yeah, I feel a big there's a big pull to this conversation in the world, I feel, you know.
And over the years, I've seen this change because you always had people interested in this kind of thing, but before it was like very fringe, very out there. I know, it's a lot more normalized.
You know.
You hear people talking about channeling, you hear people talking about the UFOs like it's a more normal thing, and it actually is. So I think we get in there.
Yeah.
The thing is, it always seems slow to us, again because we see things from the perspective of this lifetime. But if you think of it, don't know why the respect frum probably three four, five generations on the road. Maybe it's completely normalized and we will be dead, yeah, of course, but maybe maybe it's what it takes. I don't know.
Yeah, yeah, it's an admirable goal. I think it's important.
Yeah, for sure. I definitely feel a surge too. I feel a change. I didn't talk much to you about this, and we've recorded a whole other episode about this, but just two weekends ago, we were on the beach with two hundred people. We had a little mass sighting going on, and we saw like basically one hundred and fifty orbs with two hundred people, and we saw orbs appear, and we all saw it from different perspectives because we were
all looking at different times. Like I was looking first, I got everybody's attention on it, and then Alex, Alex and Nick and the rest of the crowd saw it from different angles, so it looked a little different to everybody. But there were these glowing golden beings that just appeared and they had wings and they were flapping their wings,
and everybody was freaking out. And I'm telling you guys that for days, because you know, we have a discord community on our Patreon with like six hundred people in there, and for days, people were sending me reports, not just me, but the whole community, right, and they're explaining like how they were, how they're like people were, you know, your typical on the end of the Gateway experience. Last day, You're talking about grounding and all of these things that
are happening to people. That was happening to these people. I feel like there was a genuine expansion of consciousness, and I just kept thinking, like, wow, that's exactly what it was like being at Monroe, And I feel like this kind of expansion of consciousness is rapidly spreading. I think that we are now at a point where I think we're kind of past the belief point, and I think now we're at the point where people are just ready to have the experience, you know what I mean.
Now it's like it's time to open the door, come in, like, get the people in. Like I really do feel like the tide has shifted and it's time now to.
Really I think you're making a really good point. I'm saying that, you know, people need to have the experience, because what is the point of trying to make people believe this or that, telling oh, you know, this is real, please just believe me, Yeah, believe me, bro. Well, how well we just give them the tools so they can, you know, find out that it is actually real.
Yeah yeah, yeah, find out for themselves.
Yeah exactly.
So that brings me to another point. I just, you know, for giggles, I feel like there could be a possibility of people out there being really curious about grounding techniques after an expansion of consciousness. So if you wouldn't mind elaborating on that, that could be helpful to a lot of people.
Yeah, what happens sometimes if you spend maybe too long on meditation. I've had people in it with saying, well, I meditate like four times a day or five times a day, and then I listen to these sounds and then I do this and do that, and you seem like totally like not here obviously, but I'm doing that kind of thing. It's fine, But you also need to be functional here in your physical body in this pretty reality. So it's generally very simple things that you can do
to bring yourself back into your body. Move your body actually, like do physical exercise, go run, go out there, touch some grass. How do you treat things like that? Swim swim, especially if you have access to a large body of water, like the ocean next to here or a lake. Goes swimming on a lake, maybe heavier foods unusual. Also, splashing some water on your face if you come back from a meditation and you're like all spaced out or whatever, maybe splash some cold water on your face, on the
back of your neck, on your wrists. Sex is grounding too.
Good to know. I'm just thinking what they're thinking.
Yeah, I mean it is.
And it's also physical activity. You get your body moving, Yeah, a lot of sensations, a lot of bodies.
It really brings you in your body.
Yeah, no, I fully imagine. So I'm somebody who kind of I've talked about this a few times, but I kind of always feel a little bit ungrounded. Uh And here in the last like months or two, I'm like getting really into back into exercise, and I feel so much more grounded than I have felt in years years, And I'm like appreciative of this feeling of I'm just always I feel like I'm always just spaced out and I don't really feel like I'm here, and not even
like actively doing anything that would facilitate that state. It's just kind of my natural way of being, and it's not always comfortable, you know, it doesn't always feel very comfortable. But yeah, I've been trying things lately to ground, like grounding outside, touching grass.
Yeah. Another thing that works well is doing something with your hands, if you like working with with or you like working with clay or kniting or mechanics or whatever. Tearing up an engine and putting it back. That kind of thing gets you very very focused here in the here and now and on the physical aspect of things.
Yeah.
Also if you play an instrument, yeah, playing a guitar, playing piano, whatever, it gets you very very focused here. And it's also a great means of expression for things that are kind of obstruct maybe you kind of put into wards. If you come back from a meditation and you're like, I have this knowledge, but I can't even put it into wards, Well how about you just play it or sing it? Yeah?
Absolutely. I love to play music that's very grounding for me. Cooking it's something with my hands that's very grounding for me, and they do both also feel very expressive. I kind of feel my emotions flow out of me much better than I could do with words, you know.
So Yeah, I noticed a big difference in playing music after Gayway, Like how I am able to focus on it and think about it is different than before the Gateway. Like, I can't explain it, but I did notice a big change.
Yeah.
I've got a question.
So Nick and I are about to go through our creation station in about two months, shout out Ignaussio, So what would you tell me a next. So we've never done anything Monroe Institute. So I guess advice for us going into our first.
My advice for you would be and be open minded and be very curious. That's all you need to take with you.
Yeah, that's the biggest I'm I'm I'm very curious. I'm so that's what's pulling me is just the pure curiosity. And earlier when you were talking about people who want to go out of body and the why, for me, the why is just a strong curiosity nothing else. I think that's reasonable.
Yeah.
Yeah, is a good thing. Yeah, it feels exciting. It's very curious.
And that's a very good question because a lot of people ask do I need to do anything in preparation for Gateway or this or that, and it's like, no, just you know, put your expectations in a box. If you can just be curious and open minded, be open to be surprised, I would say, yeah, yeah, awesome.
Yeah, well, I mean, gosh, it's it's such an honor and a privilege that you came all the way out here to be on our show.
Hey, thank you for the invitation.
I mean it just it just kind of happened organically, and and I think it's it's just like so amazing that we you know, developed a friendship out of this, and you know, it's it's not over here.
You know that, I know it.
Yeah, but you know, so just thank you so much. And this is really special to me that you guys would come here and do.
This very thank you for having.
Of course, it's our pleasure and honor. Yeah, certainly and privilege.
Is there anything left on your heart that you got to get offered? Do you feel like you're pretty content?
I'm pretty content?
All right.
Well, we have a exit ritual, although it's not that serious, but I mean, you know, I got to explain it, but we yeah, we like to say bye guys at the same time. It's just something we started doing like hundreds of episodes ago. And I don't know where it came from.
I don't either. We said it in the first episode and we just never stand.
But now we're locked in. No. I think it was like the second or third episode. You just said it and you cut it short. But anyway, you ready? Yeah, al hi guys, Hi guys, what up?
Bmies?
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