Episode description

Want people to comply with rules at work? Stop assuming that they are going to break the rules. The vast majority of people want to do the right thing. So if you’re finding that people aren’t complying, you’ve got a rule problem, not a people problem. 

Our expert guest and friend of the show, Christian Hunt turns compliance on its head in this episode: 

“I thought compliance was all about rules and regulations, which it is, but that is the organization's perspective on it. The organization needs to comply with these rules. That's the organization’s challenge. But to get that solved, you’ve got to be thinking about things from the perspective of the people that are going to deliver or not deliver that mission.”

Thinking about the people behind the rules is the crux of Christian’s new book “Humanizing Rules: Bringing Behavioural Science to Ethics and Compliance”, which we are thrilled to be discussing on this episode of Behavioral Grooves.

We’ve had the pleasure of recording with Christian a number of times. Most notably at  the Abbey Road Studios in London where we talked about the risks and benefits of cheating in episode 326. We have also delved into how to not outsource your critical thinking during in episode 122, as well as covering the 5 principles of human risk - in other words, the myths that humans cling to that don’t help us - way back in episode 86. And most recently, Christian joined in our conversation in episode 339, giving very practical tips on how to read a book quickly.

Christians is a fellow podcaster, hosting a fantastic show called The Human Risk Podcast (you should definitely take a listen) which explores the idea of human decision-making as a risk and what we can do to mitigate it. 

Unbelievably, despite this being the 5th time on Behavioral Grooves, this is the first time we get to hear Christian’s musical picks. And as always, this part of the discussion reveals a bit more about our guest that we didn’t know before.

(4:33) Welcome and speed round questions.

(7:02) Should rules be designed for bad people or good people?

(12:24) Why Compliance Officer is the worst job title!

(15:31) Christian’s journey into compliance.

(20:24) Don’t focus on what you'd like people to do, but focus on what people are likely to do.

(24:12) The difference between recoverable and irrecoverable issues.

(27:44) Just because you can, doesn’t mean you should.

(31:06) People problem or rule problem?

(34:27) Who the hell is Mr Logic?

(43:13) How to get people to pay attention to compliance.

(47:19) Learning about compliance from sexologists!

(53:01) What music would Christian take to a desert island?

(58:32) Grooving Session with Kurt and Tim on compliance.

© 2023 Behavioral Grooves

Human Risk Podcast: https://www.humanriskpodcast.com/ 

Christian’s book, “Humanizing Rules: Bringing Behavioural Science to Ethics and Compliance”: https://amzn.to/428gp8s 

Episode 326, Grooving on Cheating: Kurt, Tim, Christian Hunt, and Koen Smets: https://behavioralgrooves.com/episode/grooving-on-cheating/ 

Episode 122, Don’t Outsource Your Critical Thinking with Christian Hunt: https://behavioralgrooves.com/episode/c-19-dont-outsource-your-critical-thinking-with-christian-hunt/ 

Episode 86, Christian Hunt: Mitigating Human Risk and The Algorithmic Mind: https://behavioralgrooves.com/episode/christian-hunt-mitigating-human-risk-and-the-algorithmic-mind/ 

Episode 339, Top 2 Tips on How to Read a Book Quickly: https://behavioralgrooves.com/episode/how-to-read-a-book-quickly/  

Mr Logic: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ab6yslxLRyQ&ab_channel=ViolenceMatters 

Human Risk and the sexologist, Jill McDevitt: https://www.humanriskpodcast.com/sexologist-dr-jill-mcdevitt-on/

Herbert Grönemeyer: https://www.groenemeyer.de/

Happy 60th, Herbert Grönemeyer: https://www.dw.com/en/herbert-gr%C3%B6nemeyer-germanys-most-successful-musician-turns-60/a-19180054

Behavioral Grooves Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/behavioralgrooves

The Beatles “I Feel Fine”: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WrAV5EVI4tU 

Herbert Grönemeyer singt "Bochum" live im Stadion: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AFRQQCZglwI