Sound On: Trump Subpoena Response, Midterm Debates

to smear. Bloomberg Sound On with Joe Matthew on Bloomberg Radio. Donald Trump response, Welcome to the fastest hour in politics, as the former president sends an angry letter to the January six committee following the vote to subpoena Trump for testimony. We're joined on this Friday edition by Trump biographer and

Bloomberg Opinion Senior Executive of editor Tim O'Brien. Later sparks flying debates for Wisconsin Senate, head of Tonight's Brawl and Georgia will get the score from Bloomberg National Politics reporter Ryan Teague beckwith, and we'll talk out another wild week with our signature panel Bloomberg Politics contributors Rick Davis, Genie Chanzano or here for the hour we've heard from Donald Trump following yesterday's January six Committee hearing, and we're joined

today in Washington by Tim O'Brien, Bloomberg Opinion, Senior executive editor and author of Trump Nation, The Art of Being the Donald. Tim, welcome to sound on. It's a pleasure to be here. I know that you were watching and writing about this week's January six Committee hearing. You were deep in this yesterday. You've got a column up on it. Donald Trump has responded with a fourteen page letter, if I can call it, a letter to the committee chair,

Benny Thompson. It's headlined in all caps, the presidential election of was rigged and stole an exclamation point. This was after the Committee of Worse went to great lengths to prove yesterday that Donald Trump knew he had lost the election long before anything happened on January six. Here's Congresswoman Liz Cheney. Claims that President Trump actually thought the election was stolen are not supported by a fact and are not a defense. There is no defense that Donald Trump

was duped or irrational. No president can defy the rule of law and act this way in a constitutional republic period. You know him as well as any journalists, as Donald Trump convinced himself that the election was stolen. No, I think in his heart of hearts, he absolutely doesn't believe it was stolen. But he understands the uses and abuses of perpetuating the big lie, which is I think it's one of the reasons he hangs onto it so closely. He gets enormous traction out of this in different venues.

It keeps him center stage as a political figure. You know, he's a media addict, so I think just remaining in the blic eyes important to him. He fundraises off of his political presence. I think he learned in the White House the amount of money you could make is that as a political figure. I don't think that was something he was completely tuned into before he got into the White House. And and lastly, it leaves him as a kingmaker going into the election and into the mid terms.

There's a number of election deniers in the Republican Party who are running. There was swarming the you know, both the state houses. Was he looking that far ahead at that period of time though, where he was just looking for self reservation at John January six. Oh, I don't think he was looking that far ahead. I think I think he understood, he's always understood natively how conspiracy theories can be used to promote his own needs or his

own worldview. He did that as a businessman in New York. Um. You know, famously he got into these epic brawls with Ed Cotch, then Mayor Ed Cotch of New York in which you know, Coch was out to get him, and that's why he wasn't getting zoned or Atlantic city regulators hated him, and that's why his casinos were failing, and the New York real estate community had it out for him, and that's why he wasn't able to build bigger projects. And and he just brought that into his political life,

and he brought that into uh uh, The Apprentice. There's not a venue he's been in where he hasn't used the idea of a conspiracy, conspiracy theory to self promote. You know, most of Donald Trump's actions can either be understood through two lenses, either self aggrandizement or self preservation. And he uses conspiracy theories when it involves both of those things, self preservation and self aggrandizement. I think January six offered him in a way to avoid saying he lost.

It offered him a way to pollute people's faith in the electoral process, and it kept him on stage for longer than the otherwise would have been. He closes the letter by defending the people who attack the capital on the six, calling them great American patriots. Do you feel like this whole exercise, and I know you've been watching it very closely, All the time spent the worked on with these committee hearings really didn't change much in American politics.

I don't know that they changed much in American politics. I think there's very little right now. I think both sides of the aisle are so ossified in their view of one another that I don't think you'll see any big electoral shifts from a hearing like this. But I also don't think that's the most important outcome. I think the letter that Donald Trump wrote today as yet another admission of guilt. He is repeating the lie. He's praising

the insurrectionists on January six. He's showing no remorse. The January six Committee has has presented mountains of evidence, video, audio, witness testimony, witness testimony from Republicans, witness testimony from members of Trump's own White House, all of which is substantiated. Um the fact that he uh fomented the insurrection, he helped orchestrate some of the events around it, and he put members of Congress in danger as part of a process to a corupt an electoral process. And I think

he needs to be held accountable for that. And um, you know, when he's the most desperate and he's cornered, he tends to make really egregious mistakes. In this letter today is a big mistake because it's an admissible piece of evidence. I think should he be prosecuted. Speaking of some of the video and testimony, I want to ask you about Roger Stone, who I know, you know well. We heard from him repeatedly yesterday, in one case spelling

out the plan ahead of the election. Of course, I had to bleep all of these cuts before we did this. I suspect it will be I really just suspect it will still be up in the air when that happens. The key thing to do is to claim victory becaus action is nine tenths of the law. No, we want him. Sorry, you're wrong. Since yesterday's hearing, there is new video and I'm sorry to pull you into this. A very angry Roger Stone on Joe Biden's what was Joe Biden's inauguration day.

He's in the car and Fort Lauderdale talking to someone we don't know whom after Donald Trump refused to give him a second pardon. The Danish filmmaker Christopher Gulbranson, who's given a lot of video to the Committee, posted this from his upcoming documentary. He says it was one of the few videos the Committee specifically requested but never used. I will warn everyone this is not for the faint of heart. Listen again to Rogerstone. Jared Kushner has an

i Q of seventy. He's coming to Miami. We will object him from Miami very quickly. He'll believe they very click, very quickly, very quickly. He has a hundred security guards. I'll have five thousand security guards. You want to fight, let's fight THQ, you and your abortion his daughter. Shocking statement referring to Ivanka Trump. There tim is this damaging

to Donald Trump or only to Rogerstone? I think it's only damaging to Roger Stone and that small beer, because at the end of the day rod or Stone will be a witness and a possible prosecutorial target as part of of an indictment um. But I think the larger thing it reflects is how transactional. I think everyone in Trump's world is it the orbit of people around him are transactional. Because he's transactional. There's not much loyalty and and and there's generally of what have you done for

me lately? Mentality, and if you don't do enough, either by delivering money or favors um, they turn on one another. And I actually think at the end of the day that could end up being a valuable tool for prosecutors to exploit if they need to start getting testimony and witnesses from people closer and closer to the concentric circles that surround Donald Trump. Do you believe Roger Stone was the dot connecting the White House in groups like the Proud Boys and Oath Keepers. I think he was. I

think he was a inc for sure. I think Steve Bannon was. You know, we know that we're there were meetings in the Willard Hotel in the days prior to the insurrection. We know that there was communication between Stone and those militia groups, those militant groups. UM. So of course he's an important part of the fact pattern. And again I think it it's it's about putting clothing on the larger picture of what occurred, UM, which was there was a siege. The people who led the siege were armed.

It wasn't accidental. They weren't tourists, as some members of the GOP have said they were. They were deadly. I think certain about trying to achieve an outcome in Roger Stone played a role in that Trump Nation came out in two thousand five. A new edition was published in sixteen. When you look at him now, how does he appear different to you? His personality, his posture, his temperament. You know,

I don't think he has changed a bit. I think that, you know, I think he's a more dangerous person by virtue of the office he is held in this way he holds over the electorate. Um. You know, he certainly has a consequential presidency that puts him in the history books in a way he wouldn't have been prior to

his presidency. And you know, one of his strengths as a candidate with the people who support him is is this sense that he's authentic, that he speaks um from the heart about what he believes, and he's unfiltered, and he's always been the same old guy. And he's really been that way for a long time. You know, the

old New York Daily News gossip columnst. Liz Smith once said to Meliz was from Texas, and she said to me, she said, you know, honey, the only thing you ever need to know about Donald Trump is that he's a seven year old grown old and and basically, you know, she knew him well, and she watched how he rolled in New York and and he has been the same person his whole life because he's never really had to

course correct. He was protected from the consequences of his own mistakes when he was young by his family's well and then as an adult by the celebrity that came along with his media exposure, and then the Apprentice, and now he's got this third sort of ring of fire around him, the legal protections that come with political protections that come with the presidency, and the Donald Trump you've see now is an older version, you know, he's going to be a seventy seven year old version of that

seven year old boy. Uh, come next June. But he's pretty much the same guy. He does not have complex urges. He you know, if you give him a sporting event, a cheeseburger, and a dirty joke, he's pretty comfortable and everything else is ancillary. Happy to see you in Washington. It's a pleasure to be here. As always. I hope you'll talk to us against soon on Bloomberg Sound Off.

Thank you. Tim O'Brien, Bloomberg's senior executive producer for Bloomberg Opinion and of course Trump biographer the the book again, Trump Nation, The Art of Being the Donald, which feels as relevant as ever in two Let's assemble the panel next. Are both with us today, Rick and Jennie. I'm Joe Matthew. This is Bloomberg. This is Bloomberg Son on with Joe Matthew on Bloomberg Radio, the fastest hour in politics. This

day we hear from Donald Trump himself. Took less than twenty four hours and a fourteen page letter in which he says he's writing to quote express our anger, disappointment and complaint that with all the hundreds of millions of dollars spent on what many considered to be a charade in which Hunt We assemble the panel now, Rick Davis and Jeannie Schanzano, Bloomberg Politics contributors, Rick, welcome back. We obviously spent some time yesterday on the January six committee

that concluded with this vote to subpoena Donald Trump. His response today was referred to by Tim O'Brien as a letter of admission. Do you see it the same way? Uh? Yeah, could be. I think that this concept of admission of guilt, when he continues to spread the big lie and double down on what he knows to be a false narrative,

is uh is an admission of guilt. I'm not sure that changes anything, but I think you could have said that, you know, a year half, a year and a half ago, you know, on on January seven, And so it is who Donald Trump is. I thought, you know, Tim Olbrine did a great job of characterizing Donald Trump as a guy who can't take the blame, can't apologize, can't admit defeat. I mean, it's just not in his d n A. So he is who we've always known him to be, and this is just an addition to the stack of

falsehoods that he claims to be who he is. Fourteen pages out today, Genie, we also got more footage today, Uh, some extended clips from what we saw yesterday and the hearing something that we didn't see or hear at all like that uh piece I played from Roger Stone a bit year and I can only imagine the phone calls

that he's getting today. More from Nancy Pelosi though, as you as you likely heard, uh, she was ready to punch Donald Trump and said so as we all understand now, he was had every intention to go to the Capitol that day. Wait for this for trust passing on the Capitol ground. Punch him out. I'm gonna go to jail. I'm gonna be happy, gonna punch him out, Go to jail and be happy. She's seen in another clip, Jeannie talking to Vice President Mike Pants and they're at Fort McNair.

This is where they were hiding. Her daughter's taking footage of this whole conversation as they're working the phones. She's got the mask and pulls the mass down and eats a slim jim. She not really a slim jim. She actually takes the wrapper off with her teeth while she's talking to Mike pants listen to okay, and that calls back, Okay, I worry about you being in that Capital room. Don't let anybody know where you are. Really to Trump to punch Trump, Genie, and and was was really looking out

from Mike Pence in that moment. It's a remarkable moment in time that's captured here on video. Yeah, how long before Slim Jim puts that out as a commercial. That's a darn good commercial that should come out. You know, I was struck because you know, I had to read this letter thoroughly so I could talk to you. Um

the fourteen pages that Donald Trump put out. The one thing that really, you know, stuck with me and struck me about it was he seemed bothered by the footage you were talking about about Nancy Pelosi and Chuck Schumer and the you know, this bipartisan group of congressional leaders requesting help from law enforcement officials. Because in his letter, one of the things he claims over and over again is I did fully authorized National Guard troops. There's no

record of this. This is what he says. And he says that I did take this action, and Nancy Pelosi refused to allow it. So, you know, it reminded me of Ronald Reagan say saying, you know, they don't listen to what you say, but they certainly look at the pictures. And Donald Trump seems stuck on this video that Alexandra Pelosi took and these other filmmakers and the fact that it was shown in the Committee has done such a good job with this footage is what really seems to

have stuck in his crass, if you will. Yeah, we heard from this, uh, this moment yesterday as she's on the phone calling for help, calling for the police. I have something to say, Mr Secretary. Well, I'm gonna call the mayor of Washington, d C. Right now and see what other outs on the phone with the Secretary of Defense. He was on the phone with the Attorney general. Does that blunt the Republican argument that we've been here quite often rick from a leadership, that that Nancy Pelosi did

not fulfill her duty to call for help. Yeah, I think this sort of lays to rest the other big lie, which is somehow you know, Nancy Pelosi was complicit in letting you know, these uh marauders into the Capitol and not willing to uh to fortify it. So again, I mean, we're just we're just picking around the edges. Um. You know,

there's there's seditious conspiracy trials already happening. I think the looms off the rose as to what actually occurred that day and who was trying to return the capital to a stable place and who was actually trying to disrupt the election count. So um, you know, I think I think the committee did a really good job of keeping all our interests all the way to the last um minute.

And uh, frankly, I think that the report will be consequential, and whether they refer it to the Justice Department for prosecution is going to be I think the last remaining question left on the on the committee. But the reality is they've done a great job of laying down what the facts are of what occurred on January six, the lead up to it, and and a little bit about you know, what's been the impact sinceon Rick. You have

unique history with Roger Stone. You've worked around him, uh and with him in another life he has uh, he's certainly taken on a new persona at this point of his career. You heard that clip of him to a the anger that you heard on the phone. Uh, what happens to Roger Stone? And what does Donald Trump think of this? First, I would have to say, that's the Roger Stone I met when he became the head of the Young Republicans in the nineties seventies, right. So, actually,

Roger Stone hasn't changed a bit. This is this is exactly the m oh. You know, he gets the temporary rolling, he talks himself into a tirade. You know, he uses enormous amounts of profanity and and sort of this machine gun style of screaming and uh and so it just actually was a little bit convulsive to me that you know, I've been in a room when I've seen that, and it's not pretty. Uh So, so this is who he is and and and frankly, you know, the American public

has already made the judgment about him. Trump's not going to testify, is he, Jennie, No, he's not. And let's not forget Roger Stone's big Nixon tattoo on his back, the smiling Nixon is there that that's that's right, and the big pot leaf as well. We need to hear a lot more from Jennie and Rick, and we will

that you're all our our signature panel. This is Bloomberg broadcasting live from our nation's capital, Bloomberg to New York, Bloomberg eleven Frio to Boston, Bloomberg one oh six one to San Francisco, Bloomberg nine sixty to the Country Serious x M General one nine and around the globe the Bloomberg Business app and Bloomberg Radio dot Com. This is Bloomberg Sound On with Joe Matthew. They say the Herschel Walker Raphael Warnock debate tonight could set a ratings record.

It's one to pop the corn for. It's amazing what a scandal can do for a political program. And this follows to chippy debates last night in which denying of the election and activities on January six were looming large. We'll talk about that Wisconsin Senate debate and the Michigan gubernatorial debate. Coming up with Ryan Ti with First, you Couldn't escape last night, the references to Trump to January six, to election denying in Wisconsin. It was the second round

for Ron Johnson Mandela Barnes. The Senate debate in January six, was at hand. You'll hear Johnson followed by Barnes here immediately and forcefully and repeatedly condemned the violence from January six. Unlike my opponent, it has to be said that he called those folks patriots. He called them tourists, the people who were beating up police officers in the United States Capital, the people that were there to protect him. And it wasn't just in that debate, it was top of mine

in a gubernatorial debate. But that's where we are with Trump picked candidates out there. Look no further than Tutor Dixon, who was of course debating last night with Governor Gretchen Whitmer in Michigan. I think it's really ironic when Mrs Dixon stands here and says that she will accept the vote the will of the people. This is a candidate who will denies the outcome of the election. This is a candidate who will not pledge to accept the outcome

of the November eighth election. Never mind, and what might follow? Ryan take back with his Bloomberg's National Politics Reporter, and he's done a great job covering the sort of election deny your aspect to this mid term race in fact, he's been following them very closely. And I know you wrote a recent one, UH fourteen Republican candidates actively fought

to overturn the twenty election, Ryan Welcome. Ron Johnson was not one of those fourteen, But if you watch that debate last night, you might have wondered, how important has this election denying UH storyline, ben when we see some candidates run away from it and others embrace it. Johnson's in a weird position because he was a senator who said ahead of January six that he would object a certification. After the violence broke out, he actually reversed course and

to certify. And so where he's getting hit here is some of his remarks where he's, you know, not totally condemned it and is a little loose. But we actually didn't include him on our list because at the end of the day he did certify the election. Understood, Tutor Dixon is is a different UH type of candidate and

one that much more fits the Maga moles. She's embraced that, right yeah, as she is a During the election, like right after the election, she was on social media tweeting heavily about how this was a fraud and whatnot UM in the primary. She was embracing that. When it looked like she was going to win the primary, shortly before the primary was over, she came out and tried to start backpedaling it before she'd actually got the nomination. She took a hit from the right on that UM. But

she's also been in kind of an awkward position. They're not fully able to walk away from it because it's a really hard thing to walk away from UM. And so so whitmer is is, you know, using that as a cudgel against her. That said, it's not a huge issue in these two races as much as it is in some other races. Well, that's fair enough. We haven't talked about the Doug Mastriano's of the world in this conversation,

but you've been looking down ballot as well. And I don't know if that's what you're you're leading as to, Ryan, but it's pretty important when you consider the Secretary of State races, uh that we're gonna watch unfold in a couple of weeks here, where we could have MAGA and election denying that goes way beyond a guy named Donald Trump, where we could have actual officials running the electoral system inside states who believe that the twenty election was stolen, right,

and that will be the Those are the ones that I'm the most closely watching. The governor is race in Wisconsin, and the secretary of state races in Nevada and Arizona, and UH in Minnesota, and then um the governor offense Lvania obviously appoints the Secretary estate there, but Mastriano appears to be losing, so he's not one of the ones that I'm watching super closely at the moment. Pretty incredible. What do you expect tonight in Georgia? Is it possible

to predict what's going to happen on that stage? Herschel Walker and the Reverend This is as close to like when Trump was on the debate stage and you really just didn't know. This is not a professional politician, as he reminds us on a near daily basis. Uh, And so really anything could happen. He is it is. It is definitely going to be a contrast debate because I mean literally a revel boy, somebody got in the way

of what Ryan was saying. Come on back, Ryan, I wanted to hear you finish that because I'm pretty sure I know where you're going there. Although, if you have been listening to this program recently, Republican leadership by way of Senator Rick Scott has been ready to roll with the bow on Reverend Warnock. They say that he abused his wife and there's been a lot of stuff out there.

Whether herschel Walker goes there is another question, and whether Raphael Warnock goes on the offense is another one as well. Uh did we lose Ryan? I guess we're not getting him back. Rick and Junior with us our signature panel, and I was looking forward to talking about this with them. Yeah, bring Ryan back if we can, because we've got the

debate here. We'll be we'll be uh dissecting the herschel Walker Raphael Warnock debate on Monday, and Uh, you know we're all gonna pop the corn, like I said, later and watch it. Uh, Rick, what do you think of this race in Wisconsin? I don't know if you had a chance to see Ron Johnson and Mandela Barnes go at it. Um. Ron Johnson was being laughed at, uh from time to time. Listen to him talk about the FBI set up as he said and listen to the crowd.

In response to the wild charge of we'll try, Governor Barnes, the FBI set me up with a corrupt with a corrupt briefing and then lead back to smear me. I am sorry, I'm sorry. He is referring to corruption with the m f FBI, which I've been trying to uncover and expose. So do we have time for please? Audience places after Bandella, Barnes accused him of of essentially being a Russian agent. He was, Uh, the FBI sat down with him to talk about peddling misinformation from Russia. Did

Ron Johnson do himself any favors last night, Rick? Uh? No. In fact, I think the crowd reaction is exactly what you wanted to play there, because, first of all, this was a crazy, wild crowd at the debate. If there is a argument for studio debates with no audience, this was that was it. Uh. It was really out of control. But the fact that he would try to make a serious point about this and defend himself and people laughed out loud. I think it was amazing. Uh talk about

self correcting. Yeah, boy, it was really something. It was like there was a laugh track it was like watching the Honeymooners, but it was a political debate. We're gonna keep with the panel and I'll let you know what he was reacting to when he said that to Mandela Barnes last night. Also, Senator Mike Lee sends out a cry for help, and his name is Mitt Romney. We'll have more on it next on The Fastest Hour in Politics.

This is Bloomberg Sound On with Joe Matthew on Bloomberg Radio. So, yeah, when you're having a prime time US Senate debate and it sounds like there's a sitcom laugh track in the room, something isn't going the way you planned it. Welcome to the Fastest Hour in Politics. Rick Davis and Jeanie Schanzino are signature panel here on a Friday. I'm Joe Matthew and Washington. Awfully glad you came along as we wait for the next round of debates. Tonight, we're spending some

time in Wisconsin. We're Mandela Barnes, the Democratic nominee Lieutenant governor, went after Senator Ron Johnson on what he saw as spreading disinformation about Russia and in fact cozying up to Vladimir Putin. Here's how it started. We have someone Senator Johnson, who wants praise Putin as a smart guy. Now, if Putin is successful in Ukraine, he's going to encroach a more Tiretory'd also be a green light to other autocratic leaders.

There was also an instance where Senator Johnson had to be set down by the FBI and warned that he may be a Russian asset. We can't trust. We cannot trust Senator Johnson to protect democracy abroad because we can't even trust Senator Johnson to protect democracy here at home. Well, Senator Johnson wasn't having any of it. As you hear in response to the wild charge of Lieutenant Governor Barnes, the FBI set me up with a corrupt with a corrupt briefing and then lead back to mirror me. I am,

I'm sorry, I'm sorry. He is preferring to corruption with the MPI, which I've been trying to uncover and expose. So do we have time for please? Audience, please, please audience please. I mean you could say you could say anything with a laugh track like that and it'll sound funny. You know, I think I'm having a heart attack. Let's reassemble the panel. Rick and Genie are with us here. Rick, to your point, this thing got a bit out of control. Genie. Was it a win for Mandela Barnes. I think the

point was scored there. I would like a laugh track by the way, Joe Matthew please anytime you want, thank you. No, you know, I think in that particular instance, you know, Barnes obviously got the upper hand. I think all in all for the debate, um, I think it was an even split. I don't think uh, you know, either one of them changed the trajectory of the race. And and

you know it's a race that's very very tight. It should not be, but it is, and we should you know, be clear, this is not the first time Ron Johnson has made slips. Whether this was a slip or not. I mean, this is a guy who last month on Fox said he condoned white supremacy and then quickly said I meant condemned. So you know he has done this over and over and over again, and he did it in the debate last night. So it's not a surprise. Rick. You've been through enough debates. You know, you get to

the end and they want you to say something nice. Right, we did that last night, says kiddy. Is something nice about each other? Something you appreciate about one another. Listen to how this unfolded. And I'm gonna ask you next, rick if likability really is a quality in a race like this, the Barnes you go first. What do you find admirable about your opponent? Well, no, no, seriously, I do think. You know, the senator has proven to be a family man, and I think that's that's admirable. Um,

you know, that's absolutely to be respected. He speaks about his family, He's done a lot to provide for them, the family. That's that's Johnson. I mean likewise, I appreciate the fact that govern Barnes had loving parents, school teacher, father, word, third shift, so he had he had, you know, good upbringing. I guess what puzzles me about that is, with that upbringing, why is he turned against America? I mean what, why why does he find that we did not? I said

we said something admirable. It wasn't just laughing. Rickett was bowing last night. Yeah, they call that a contrast. Ad I mean, like, you can't say something nice about someone and then close with the smack in the face. I mean, I actually credit to the moderator. Uh. You know, you don't see that asked very often. I think it was a wonderful question. And and and yet they couldn't hold it together, right, They couldn't actually say nice things about

one another. I mean, Barnes got away with it and did a good job, but like he says, Johnson could not force himself to close positive and uh, and and look, I think those are the kinds of things that you saw the reaction to the audience. You want to come out of a debate where people say, you know what, he's he's kind of like me. He's got my values, he's he's got my interests in mind. He's he's not like the strange dude in Washington or lieutenant governor who

you know, doesn't share my values. And so I do think that Johnson had a problem connecting with that audience, which means he probably had a problem connecting with the audience on television and on radio, and and and and that is a problem for him because you know, when you're an incumbent and you're only leading by you know, margin of error, and you're nowhere near fifty percent, you have a problem going into election day. Yeah, well, the poll of polls, it real clear has Johnson up by

almost three points. That's the spread here. Uh does does he keep the seat? Rick? Look, I think it's really problematic because in addition to being up by three, he's nowhere near fifty right, And so when you look at an incumbent, he should be at fifty percent or fifty one percent or going into the stage of the election. If he's up, that means there's a pretty healthy number of people if he's only in the mid forties who can vote on election day and say you're out of here. Yeah, Genie,

can Democrats flip this? They can? You know. I think if I had advised, um, you know, Johnson, I would have told him to focus a lot more on the issue of crime. He did some of that, but a lot more on the issue of crime and inflation. Um. Then he seemed to be able to do because I think that's where Mandela Barnes has become vulnerable and we have seen Johnson take up. But to Rick's point, he's in within the margin. Vera Barnes has a very good shot.

And Barnes is the lieutenant governor. He's been elected statewide. He's somebody they know, and so that has played to his advantage, although again he's still a little bit behind at this point. I want to ask you both about the Utah Senate race, which hasn't really gotten a lot of coverage, nothing like Georgia, Pennsylvania, Ohio. UH Senator Mike Lee is you know, he's getting worried. This is a pretty close race and there isn't a heck of a

lot of polling around it. Maybe we'll get into that in a second here, but now he's he's concerned about Evan McMullan, the Independent, and he's looking for help from the other senator, this guy named Mitt Romney, who has decided to stay neutral in this race because he says he's friends with both of them. Will Mike Lee went on Fox News to tell Tucker Carlson that he needed to help. You put the cry out on national television.

If you'd like to protect the Republican majority, give us any chance of seizing the Republican majority once again, getting it away from the Democrats who were facilitating this massive spending spree and a massive inflationary binge. Please get on board. Help me win re election. Help us do that and you can get your entire family to donate to me. Uh rick, is that a strategy? That is not a

strategy that is a tactic. I think the strategy would have been to coalesced the Republican Party around him along time him ago. Now it's a you know, throw me a throw me, throw me a ring of safety. But um, you know, look, I mean he's in trouble. I mean Trump won the state by twenty one points, and the most I've seen is he's at two percent uhent for an incumbent in a state where Trump won by marginal twenty one points is like a really troubling thing thirty

days out. So uh, look, I think there's zero chance at Mitt Romney helps the guy. They've been uh not very close Uh colleagues uh in in Utah in the Senate and Evan McMullan is a friend of Mits, And uh, I think that's the kind of thing that's gonna be troubling for Mike Lee down the stretch. So could he also hurt himself by by making himself look desperate here Jeannie? Or or is he gonna get a lot of five

dollar donations from Late night Fox viewers. I don't know that desperation is a great campaigning, you know, and that's exactly what this sounds like. You know, Please Mitch, please help me. Um ermt um, you know. And I think the problem here with his argument is that he's not running against a Democrat. He's running against an independent in McMullan.

And so, you know, while he wants to talk about democratic spending and he's got a point there, the reality is this is an independent versus a Republican and that makes this call in this plea that much harder. And he has also does his closeness to Donald Trump, which is not something that meant Romney has been responsive to. How do you read into this Republican versus independent I know, Utah is it's Utah here, Rick, but this is not

a Republican versus democratic race. How does that complicate the strategy for a Republican who's seeking independent votes. I think it's a little complicated because Mike Lee has been a pretty good defender lately. Uh, not so much early in the Trump administration, but certainly lately he's been a big defender of Donald Trump and and and I think that has divorced him from some of these independent voters. It's the reason why Mike uh Evan McMullen has been able

to pile them on and be as competitive as he is. Uh. That being said, he's got another problem is he actually voted for Mike Lee. Voted for Evan McMullen for president in his home state against Donald Trump and six. I mean, there's a lot of splaining to do with this guy. I mean to say he's a little inconsistent is probably the understatement of the decade. So his messaging has been

all over the map. Mike Lee, he should he hasn't focused on the primary issues that you should in a state like that, which is, you know right now, the economy, the economy, the economy and uh. And so unless he has a very strong finish, this thing is not about money. Money is not going to determine the outcome of this race. Mike Lee has to find a coalition it's willing to get him closer to Alright, seven pm Eastern time, Friday night,

fight in Savannah. In our remaining minute, here predictions for the fight. Jeanie Schanzano, Oh, it's going to be a throwdown. This has got to be the most consequential debate. We've seen this cycle, if not in several years. I am so excited. I'm going to make my popcorn right when this is over. And I think it is all about Walker in this case, you know, can he prove people wrong that he does have the chops to pull it off? And let's not forget it's his first time debating. He's

had some preparation, but it's his first time. That's a tough task. Predictions for the fight, Rick Davis, I'm not staying up late. There's a better baseball game on on the West coast, all right. Well, to quote Mr t I'll say pain great panel and great to have Rick and Genie back together as always. That's why you're here, right, have a great weekend, enjoy the debate. Will do this again on Monday on the fastest hour in politics. I'm Joe Matthew. This is Bloomberg