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The Reality Check we begin with on the terminal, the headline, last minute US shutdown deal unlikely as McCarthy lacks leverage. And if you've been listening to this program at all lately, none of this should come as a surprise. We're going to bring you up to date on the most recent wrinkles here. But Congressman Matt Gates is still a major sticking point. ABC News caught up with him on the idea of warming up to a stopgap, a continuing resolution
that is emerging, at least from the US Senate. They're also talking about one in the House. Maybe we'll see it today, but the gentleman from Florida is a no go right now.
We're were going to get these individuals single subject spending those pass.
That's my principal goal.
Are you still you're still firm now on this short term spending bill?
Yeah, I'm not for a continuing resolution.
Not for a continuing resolution perplexing evermore. Mitch McConnell, of course, the Republican leader in the Senate next door, has been working on a continuing resolution and brought his case to the floor.
So, mister President, of vote against a standard short term funding measure is a vote against paying over a billion dollars in salary for border patrol and ice agents working to truck down lethal fentinyl and tame are open borders. Letting femi's disaster relief on dry up is not a productive way to advocate for victims of disasters. Letting small businesses loan applications collect dust, it's not a productive way to help working Americans contend with Washington Democrats historic inflation.
Shutting down the government isn't an effective way to make a point.
Not an effective way to make a point. But of course a few are making that point, and we get to talk about it now with Dusty Johnson, the Congressman from South Dakotas at large district, the Republican who is in the throes of the debt ceiling debate, is back with us now, in the throes of a potential shutdown. Here, Congressman, welcome back. I've got some specific questions for you about what you're hearing about what mechanism might be worth investing in where your head is. But I just wonder if
you've kind of given up the ghost on this. The government going to shut down this weekend.
Well, the government should not shut down. That would be an exceptionally stupid thing for us to do. Listen, things look a little bleak. I'm not going to try to put to smiley a face on it, but I'm not giving up. We still have time. Cooler heads need to prevail. Let's get our work done.
Are we going to see a continuing resolution in the House today or when.
I expect that tomorrow we will vote on a continuing resolution. It is something that I authored along with five of my colleagues, generally Conservatives, three members of the Freedom Caucus, and three members including myself, of the Conservative Main Street Caucus. It would be it would be a stop gap funding measure for another thirty days. At the same time, though, I would secure the border with policies that we know work.
Your role on the Republican Main Street Caucus as chair is vital here. There are a lot of folks waiting for the noise to die down. So the Center can come to the rescue here. I wonder your view on that and what your message is for those members holding things up, like Matt Gates that we just heard from.
I do think Matt's involvement, particularly regarding a stop gap funding measure is Listen, it's been really problematic. It's not been helpful. No one, including Matt Gates, thinks that we're going to get all of our work done in the House and in the Senate by the day after tomorrow and then magically, under that same timeline to meet with the Senate who wants to spend in general, more money and a House that, in general, including me, wants to spend a lot less money. It's gonna take some time
to work that out. So the only question is whether or not we will do that work while federal employees continue to get paid and while federal taxpayers continue to be able to access services at the IRS and Indian Health and the Farm Service Agency and others, or whether or not we will demand that those agencies shut down while we continue our work. Listen, I think shutdowns are stupid.
Once it happens, we could be looking at a weekend, a blip on the radar, some including Golden Sacks, are saying two to three weeks. Congressman, I'm sure you don't want to go there because you're holding out.
Hope for a solution.
But what should people be bracing for here? This looks like a full shutdown, not a partial one, and it could take some time if it actually happens to reopen.
Well, I'm glad you mentioned the partial versus full shutdown, because I do think that really matters. The shutdown during twenty eighteen and in twenty nineteen was a partial shutdown. Sometimes sometimes people will say, as they're beating their chest, shut it all down. Government doesn't really do anything anyway,
shut it all down. And I would just tell you that if this thing goes on for two weeks, you're going to have soldiers, sailors, airmen, marines who will have worked during that time, and then we're going to refuse to pay them. We will have TSA agents who will be reporting to duty even though they're not getting paid. We are going to have these frontline men and women keeping us safe who will be absolutely let down by
their government. And anybody who wants to be cavalier about that, anybody want who want to act like act like that doesn't matter. The government doesn't add any value in anybody's life. They're playing games. I have a constitutional duty to get my work done. All of my colleagues do too. I wish they took that utional duty as seriously as I think they should.
That said, I'd like to talk to you about some of the sticking points here, including funding for Ukraine. Interesting to see members vote on an amendment to remove Ukraine aid from the Defense spending bill yesterday. Most Republicans supported leaving that in, and I wonder your thoughts on this, and if the leadership is at odds with the rank and file on helping to fund the war effort in Ukraine.
You're right insofar as a majority of Republicans and a majority of Democrats continue to be supportive in both chambers of helping Ukraine, making sure that not that American men and women die on Ukrainian battlefields, but that the Ukrainians have the ammunition and the supplies they need to hold the line against this illegal invasion by Vladimir Putin. I just to me, it's a little hard to imagine the Party of Ronald Reagan no longer interested in pushing back
against communism and tyranny and dictatorships. Ukraine is trying to hold the line. We should continue to help them. Now that doesn't mean there should be blank checks. We do need additional accountability, but a majority of the House and the Senate are supportive of that. But this gets back to all these red lines everybody's got. Nobody ever gets
everything they want in a negotiation. So when you have people who say Republicans or Democrats need to hold out until they get every single thing they demand, that is a profoundly unseerious person. That's a person who has never apparently actually had a successful marriage or business or been on a nonprofit board. Nobody gets everything they want. Ever, there's some give and take, and so maybe the Ukrainian package might not look exactly like I would design it.
Maybe a stopgap funding measure might not look exactly like I would design it. But we have got to stop letting perfect be the enemy of the good.
Let's boy, you just set a lot there, Congressman. I wonder from your perch at the helm of the Main Street Republican Caucus what your thought is as you look around and see a lot of people in your conference who might be described as not serious.
I understand where they're coming from. One underreported fact is the extent to which the Republican Conference is really and truly unified on big picture questions of governance. We're thirty three trillion dollars in debt, and we've been talking about debt for so long that I think a lot of us assume that it's only as bad today as it ever was. It's much worse. We're reaching a tipping point.
That's why Fitch downgraded us. In the next ten years, we won't spend three trillion dollars just on interest on the debt as we did in the last decade. We'll spend ten trillion. That is going to crowd out all of the other virtuous spending. Now, the reason I mentioned that is I understand why some of my colleagues believe that this is a battle we're fighting for. It absolutely positively is. We should not agree to appropriations measures that
continue business as usual. It is totally unacceptable. And yet you've got to be able to fight and win with smart strategy and with a tactical plan that moves us in the right direction. The people who are screaming that we should shut the whole thing down. Do not have a plan for victory.
You were one of the folks who helped to craft the debt ceiling deal, a deal that was made to avoid all of the drama that we're experiencing right now. How do you trust Speaker McCarthy to shake hands on the next deal as we relitigate the last one.
I don't think it's a re litigation. The debt ceiling deal was really about our country avoiding default and setting some top line numbers for spending. It didn't go into specifics. It didn't say how much was going to be in that appropriation's bill versus this appropriation's bill. It didn't say how much money was going to go for order security or for Ukraine.
But even those top line numbers didn't hold.
No, that's true. The Senate wants to go above the top lines, and the House wants to go below. And I think I think Kevin McCarthy understands that at some point when we get into conference, when the House and the Senate come together, we're going to spend, unfortunately more money than the House wants, and we will probably spend
a little less money than the Senate wants. I still think that debt ceiling deal was really important though, because it gave us those top line numbers that were centering around and those top line numbers are a two trillion dollar spending cut in the next five years. That is a larger victory than Conservatives have ever been able to deliver in any other spending package in modern history. And I think that's a pretty big win, on top of the welfare reform wins and the energy site that we got.
Well, you helped us avoid a default, Congressman, and that's a big deal. I know you're out of time here. Will we avoid a downgrade from Moody's after getting that warning?
Well, of the three Standard and Poors, Moodies and Fitch, two of the three have already downgraded us one years ago, months ago. And we have got to get our act together. We have an opportunity in the next four days to show the world that American debt instruments are indeed zero risk. That it may be messy, it may be noisy, but in the end of the day, America will have its financial house and order. We fail to do that, there will be negative repercussions.
I appreciate your coming back to talk to US Congressman. I appreciate your candor, Dusty Johnson, Republican from South Dakota, chairs the Republican Main Street Caucus.
Good luck in the fight here.
We'll be following, of course, all of this as we assimilar panel Now for their take. Jeanie Shanzano is with this Democratic analyst, of course, a member of the family Bloomberg Politics contributor, joined today by Chapin Fay, the Republican strategist, is back with his former Press secretary for Governor George Pataki.
Great to have you both with us here.
Chapin, what do you think from what we just heard from the chair of the Main Street Caucus trying to salvage a continuing resolution here at odds with members of his own Republican conference girding for a shutdown. Will the Dusty Johnson's of the House be the ones to save this?
You know, he certainly sounded like he had some clear thoughts, But I'm not sure we have a clear answer on whether the Dusty Johnson's or the others will will will loan out here.
We do have sort of an.
Unruly Republican caucus these days, but the reason for that, and I've said this before. Is a lot of you know, his colleagues further to the right of him, feel like they were sent to Congress to you know, rain and spending and try and control some of the out of control Biden administration agencies and actions by you know, through the House, which of course their power is the power
of the purse. So it's going to be very hard to placate them when we're talking about you know, billions upon billions of dollars.
You know, I was struck by the way he described.
Making sure that Ukrainian soldiers had all the resources they need to stave off of the invasion. I mean, municipalities in the United States don't have the resources they need to to stave off you know, the incoming migrants into the into their areas. You know, social services under strain, you know. So you know, I think the priorities are a little out of whack, and I think the the more right word leading members of Congress, you know, those are the kinds of things they're thinking about.
Well, we're going to have more time for this, genie. We've got less than a minute. Dusty Johnson says shutdowns are stupid.
Are we going to have one?
Anyway, we are going to have one anyway. He is absolutely right. They are stupid, and he is absolutely right the announ pologies he gave about marriages and business. You don't get everything you want. You won't get it in this It's about negotiation and everybody should listen to that. And I folk conservative Republicans and the Caucus do.
Isn't that something?
Is this why people want their candidates to be married? I never thought about it that way before, But there's a lesson in there. Genie, Shanzy, no Chape and Fay. We've got a lot to cover with our panel on the fastest show in politics.
Much more. Next, this is Bloomberg.
You're listening to the Bloomberg Sound on podcast. Catch the program live weekdays at one Eastern on Bloomberg Radio, the tune in app, Bloomberg dot Com, and the Bloomberg Business App. You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our flagship New York station. Just say Alexa play Bloomberg eleven thirty.
I want to invite you to join us for an important conversation a bit later on in the broadcast. A global simulcast of our conversation with former Vice President Mike Pence, of course, just hours off of the big debate in see Me Valley. Pence is going to be here roughly an hour from now. Anne Marie Hordurn will join and we'll bring that to you live here on Bloomberg. Of course, conversations that you won't hear anywhere else, not the way
we do them. As we reassemble our panel, Genie Schanzy, no Bloomberg Politics contributor, Democratic analyst, is here along with Chapin Fay, Republican strategist, former press secretary for Governor George Pateke. Remembering the night it was, I'm not even sure how to describe it. But before we indulge our panel here, did you actually watch this thing? I don't know what the ratings are going to look like. Course, Donald Trump was counterprogramming. It was on Fox Business out at the
Reagan Library. See Me Valley seven on the stage again Donald Trump not one of them. And things went off the rails pretty quickly here. I mean, you talk about interrupting, I'll just drop a needle on this.
The fact Ramaswami.
Talking with Ron DeSantis, Uh, Tim Scott, and it got pretty wacky here. Let me just find this for you give you a little taste like these are good people who are tainted by a broken system, and it's not the fault of anybody who's a thank you for speaking. While I'm interrupting, gentlemen.
You'll have your turn one. We haven't focused. Everybody knows that.
If I may address on holding Joe by accountable, Okay, I could keep going, but I'd like to hear from Genie and chapin, uh, Chape and Fay to what extent was this conversation last night, this exercise in the spirit of Ronald Reagan. It was at the Reagan Library. His name was invoked repeatedly. Was this a good look for the Republican Party?
Never mind who won or lost.
I don't think so. I think Ronald Reagan's turning over his grave.
We are a long ways away, generations from when Ronald Reagan was running.
And was president.
You know the clip you played, but some of the gloves are off, so to a certain extent, it was probably always going to devolve at some point. But you know, like you sort of alluded to, you know, the big winner.
Is always Donald Trump. I mean, you know, you have a bunch of.
People failing to separate themselves from the crowd, and even worse.
Just all talking at the same time, right, So.
You know, meanwhile, Donald Trump is laughing all the way to you know, having better pull numbers than all of them combined. So you know, I don't know if any of them moved the needle forward, and I think some of them probably moved the needle backwards.
I'll ask you about Donald Trump's visit to Detroit. In a moment, Jeanie, Chris Christy really tried to go out after Trump as we all expected, to call him out for not being there.
Here's what he said.
You're not here tonight because you're afraid of being on the stage and defending your record. You're ducking these things. And let me tell you what's going to happen you keep doing that. No one appears going to call you Donald Trump anymore. We're going to call you Donald Duck.
Donald Duck.
So we got a nickname, Genie. Is it gonna stick?
No?
It was one of the very bad one liners, and we heard a few of them last night. From Chris Christy. What started out as a potentially strong statement just fell flat. Nobody in the audience responded. Mike Pence obviously had a very strange comment that you know, Dame, you know you heard they sort of tried the moderators to chuckle a little bit after that one, but it was so bizarre and nobody really responded, and that really epitomized the night
last night. It was not substantive and it wasn't entertaining. I mean, you know, it was like, not only to Nicki Haley's point, did you feel dumber, but you just wanted to turn off the TV because it wasn't even entertaining. So bad, bad night for Republicans. The winners clearly Donald Trump and also by extension, Joe Biden, who fear is running against anybody but Donald Trump, so God bless the two of them. The American public has to be very unhappy at this point.
Well Ginny refers to a moment that Nicki Haley was clearly preparing for as she faced off with the aforementioned vive Cramaswami.
This is infuriating because TikTok is one of the most dangerous social media acces that we could have, and what you've got. Honestly, every time I hear you, I feel a little bit dumber for what.
You say, okay. But you know, then there was the approach from the network and the moderator's chapin when we got to this point, when Dana Perino decided to turn this into a reality TV show. I mean, I don't know, maybe everybody deserved that, maybe that's actually what it was, but this seemed like, well, just a different level.
Than you might expect in a presidential debate.
Here we go, which one of you on stage tonight should be voted off the island? Please use your marker to write your choice on the no pad in front of you fifteen seconds starting out of the people on the stage, you should be I'm absolutely serious, all.
Due respect, I mean we're here like, well, you know, we're happy to debate.
I think that that's disrespectful to my fellow competitive questions.
It's talk about the future.
Of the pet Okay, yeah, so kind of like the Show of Hands, I guess last time. But I mean, Chapin, are you kidding me?
I don't.
I don't try to criticize other media organizations, but if we've cheapened this to the point of being an episode of Survivor, I mean, what's the point.
Well, to be fair to uh, to data and the moderators and the organizers. I mean, I think the people on the stage, you know, brought it to that point. I mean I wasn't shocked at all to hear her say something like that. I mean, they're all out there, and they're all out there trying to out Donald Trump. And you know, I want to revisit that about the Donald Trump comment. I think Genie's is one hundred percent right about it being a bad one liner among many
one liners. But this is what always happens when people try and fight Donald Trump.
They try and be Donald Trump to fight him. It has never worked in history. He has an innate.
Ability to be himself and be successful at you know, campaigns and elections and reality TV and everything.
When candidates try and mimic him or try and use his own tactics against him, it always fails. Just like Donald Duck. That true, right, And that's what you're seeing on stage. I think.
Donald Duck. Well, Donald Trump.
Was in Michigan, of course, this is what he did instead of attending the debate, went to Michigan to speak to UA Double D members in the throes of an historic auto strike at a non union shop and he told them. Essentially, he kind of knows more than they do about this.
Massive percentages of your industry went to other countries like Mexico, like China, like South Korea, like Japan. In other words, your current negotiations don't mean as much as you think. I mean, I'll watch you out there with the pickets, but I don't think you're picketing for the right thing.
You're picketing the wrong thing. Your protest isn't worth what you think it is, Genie. Is that how you get an endorsement from the UAW.
Yeah, it was another part of the very bizarre night which the debate was half of. And then these statements. I mean, essentially, what Donald Trump told these at this non union shop, as you mentioned these workers, was forget the picketing, not worth, the protests, not work the strike. All you have to do is vote for me and convince your leadership to endorse me, and all will be great. You know, that's his argument, and it is head scratching,
it is mind numbing. I mean, one big question to ask Donald Trump, among many, is what about the ed plants unionizing? Why is that such a bad idea?
Right?
Why do we have to stop producing ed cars. Why can't we unionize those plants. I mean, there's so many substance questions to be asked. But of course all he wanted to do was attack Joe Biden, because for Biden and Trump, we are now in a general He was, you know, just dismissed the debate as people trying to run for secretary. And I can't say he's wrong about that, and said, you know, look at vote for me and
all will be good. Forget this picck a line, go home and wait until I'm in the White House, and I will restore whatever you need.
In terms of.
Money, We're going to talk a lot more about the UA double d because we have news. If you haven't heard about this, it's important actually, and we have a headline on the terminal that the UA doub is targeting thirty percent wage increases, a thirty percent pay raise by the time this negotiation is done, remembering they came down to thirty six percent most recently, and the Big three are still bulking. But we're gonna get into this now that Donald Trump and Joe Biden have visited UA doubled
members in two very different events. We'll get into this coming up next with our panel, Genie and Chape and Faith.
You're listening to the Bloomberg Sound on podcast. Catch us live weekdays at one Eastern on Bloomberg dot com, the iHeartRadio app, and the Bloomberg Business App, or listen on demand wherever you get your podcasts.
A day after Donald Trump visits Michigan to court unionized auto workers at non union shop, and two days after President Biden actually joins the picket line megaphone in hand making history. All the while, we do have news from the uaw This is according to people familiar with the matter. This is why, of course you listen to watch and read Bloomberg. The UAUW wants to emerge from its strike against the Big three with at least a thirty percent pay raise. This is what is on the back of
the napkin in Sean Fain's office here. Of course, you know they came in above forty percent, they've come down to thirty six. And we're getting maybe a sense here of where this negotiation might end, whether the automakers feel on this about this the same way stocks in all three are rising today. For what it's worth, Let's reassemble
the panel to get into this for a bit. Jeanie Shanzo, Democratic analyst and Bloomberg Politics contributors here with Jape and Fay, republican strategist former press secretary to George Pataki.
What do you think here, Genie.
I don't know if we're going to formally hear something like this from the Union anytime soon, but do we see light at the end of the tunnel with a headline like this?
Yeah?
I think it is good news all around. I mean, as your first guest talked about the representative, when you're negotiating, you have to be willing to compromise. And if this headline holds true and this is what the Union is indeed saying, it is a good sign.
You know.
I think for many people, myself included, forty percent was probably not a realistic number, but a number to start off with. To hear that they are down to ten, you know, down to thirty rather down ten makes sense and they're going to have to find some middle ground. So I think it is good news. Although I'm not sure we're going to see a light at the end of the tunnel very soon, it is the right direction, for sure.
A lot of questions about what this might mean for other workers already emboldened by the UPS deal, this would be another one chapin. You can weigh in on this latest update. But I wonder if you think the visits by Donald Trump and Joe Biden actually might help to unlock some progress here to lead to a breakthrough.
I don't know if those particular visits will lead to a breakthrough. I'm sure where.
I hope the President's team President Biden's team is you know, involved or at least helping the two sides come to an agreement. But but I have to say, you know, the labor movement, you know, the momentum of the labor movement over recent months and years.
Has been incredible.
I mean, you know, the Writers Guild out in Hollywood just got everything they have for, or at least claim claim that they got everything they asked for. It looks like the UAW is going to get some pretty significant salary increases and other benefits regardless of you know, where.
Management comes down on. So I do think labor is Labor is becoming. It's always been.
A force to reckon with, but I think it's I think it's having its second moment.
Here over the past couple of decades. With the momentum that they're making.
That they're getting quite a contrast between the two presidential visits, if I can call them that. Of course, Donald Trump is a former president genie, but we've never seen anything quite like this, and the amount of attention that was thrown on the uau W here because of those two it is noteworthy. Here's what Trump said last night in Michigan.
I side with the auto workers of American with those who want to make America great again, and I always will.
And I don't get one thing.
I don't get why Ford and GM, why these car makers aren't fighting for to make cars that are going to sell, to make cars that are going to be able to.
Go on long distances, they immediately give up. I see it with the oil companies too.
They're promoting windmills, which don't work, by the way, but they don't work.
They want windmills all over the place.
As much as I'd love to go into the whole windmills thing right now, Chapin, it does say something about the current state of the Republican Party. When Donald Trump stands there and says I side with the auto workers. I know he was at a non union shop, but he's effectively endorsing a unionized labor action, right, Yeah, I.
Think, you know, he is the leader of the current populist movement. I mean, is sort of you know, I wouldn't say it rises the level of a civil war, but there's certainly some tension within the Republican Party amongst sort of the establishments, the ideological conservatives, and the populace, which I think Donald Trump represents here. There are new demographics and types of people in America that feel that
Donald Trump is speaking for them. If you look at you know, just a New York City sort of the young, up and coming Republican is very populist, right, very populism driven, and are supporting things like unions of all things in
twenty twenty three. So you know, politics is cyclical, of course, and I think you're seeing, you know, Donald Trump and Republicans, at least his wing of the Republican Party, you know, looking out and at least paying lip service to some of these people in America who feel like they've been left behind. So I do think it's a little stunning, but you know, it has been building, and I think that's what Donald Trump represents currently.
I don't know how many eyeballs he got last night.
Genie.
We made the point yesterday that this was not a Tucker Carlson interview, and it wasn't a novelty act to the point that it was the first time, because well it's not the first time, even though he plans to skip all of these primary debates. And I guess counter program to some extent, you said earlier that Joe Biden and Donald Trump essentially won the debate last night, those two men who were not there, who won the visit to Detroit.
You know, I think it's you know, still probably an even draw. I have to say, I think substantively it was the president. But we cannot deny that Donald Trump has a lot of support among people on the line. And while the leadership has tended towards the Democrats, and Joe Biden has been a you know, union stallgart, he has been the president of Labor, many people on the line feel that they have been forgotten by the Democratic Party. You know, this has been a long problem, long term
problem for the Democrats. That's why Michigan is going to be so much up for grabs when we get to twenty twenty four. But Joe, if you talk to Donald Trump, he's going to tell you it was the biggest event last night. He got tons of eyeballs. Don't you worry, nothing, nothing. This is probably Super Bowl big. So you know the number is you can just count on him to say they were bigly.
They were bigly that he said ten thousand people were stuck outside chapin. Are we going to really do this crowd sized thing again for another year?
Boy? I hope not. But you know, it's Donald Trump.
But he's you know, he's a marketer.
I mean, I wouldn't call them lines, but certainly, you know New York real estate developer. Embellishments, you know, is his style. And I think Genie was right about the state of labor. You know, it has long been discussed among you know, publican circles that union leadership is democratic solidly, but the rank and file is starting to you know, vote.
Their Poto books.
Yeah, this is something that we've been watching very closely and will continue to. It really plays into this presidential election cycle in a unique way.
You're listening to The Bloomberg Sound on podcast. Catch the program live weekdays at one Eastern on Bloomberg Radio, the tune in app, Bloomberg dot Com, and the Bloomberg Business App. You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our flagship New York station, Just say Alexa play Bloomberg eleven thirty.
I want to welcome everyone our TV and radio audiences worldwide for a special conversation with the former Vice president Mike Pence. I'm Joe Matthew in Washington here on Bloomberg alongside Anne Marie. Hor Dern and Anne Marie were just hours off of the Republican debate. As we've been discussing in SeeMe Valley last evening. That was a debate that could end up being critical for the future of any campaign, including Mike Pences.
Yep, that's absolutely right. Our Vice president was at that debate and we'll see what comes next for him. Right, there's a few people who are saying, potentially, with his poll numbers, he might have to drop out.
That's right, well, he joins us from California. Now, mister Vice President, it's great to have you back on Bloomberg. We welcome you, and I wonder your thoughts about that exercise. Last night, we were just playing clips of three, four people talking over each other for minutes on end, a lot of zingers, a lot of one liners. One of the moderators even wanted to play a game of Survivor
with you. I just wonder with to the extent that Ronald Reagan's legacy was invoked last evening in Seame Valley, did Republicans live up to the standard set by Ronald Reagan and that exercise last night?
Well, I'm standing here at the Reagan Library still, and you know, it was very special for me to be a part of the debate last night in here, because Reagan is the reason I became a Republican, and it was his conservative agenda, it was his optimism, and it was his civility that really defined the man and defined
his administration. And last night's debate was at times chaotic, but I really welcomed the opportunity to make my case that I believe that, while while the former president and some others who were on that stage are steering our party away from Ronald Reagan's agenda of American leadership in the world, fiscal responsibility, even the right to life, that I'm the most consistent and tested conservative in this field.
The opportunity to make that case here at the Reagan Library to the American people was a great privilege for me.
Mister Vice President, you spoke a lot about what you're speaking about now, the fact that populism has taken control of the Republican Party. But if you look back to what Trump was saying in twenty fifteen when he announced his campaign to become president, it reeked of populism. He was calling polic dumb. In his first speech, he was talking about draining this swamp. He was talking about the United States not beating anyone ever. He said, when was
the last time we beat Japan? Do you feel responsible for giving credibility to populism in this Republican Party that we're seeing today.
You know, when Donald Trump came down that escalator, he told the American people he was going to make America great again. The first person to say make America great
again was Ronald Reagan. And in that campaign, whether it was a commitment to conservatives on our courts, a commitment to cut taxes, a commitment to rebuild our military, Donald Trump promised to govern as a conservative, and I believe when he chose me to be his running mate, there was evidence of his seriousness about that, and for four years we did govern as conservatives. We kept our word
on the world stage. We stood with our allies, we stood up to our enemies, We advanced the largest tax cuts in American history, and of course appointed conservatives to our courts at every level, including three of the justices that gave us a new beginning for life. But what I want people to understand is that Donald Trump makes no such promise today. Whatever his rhetoric was back in
the day, and his rhetoric has remained the same. The policies that he's advancing now, which included a ten percent tax on all imports into the United States that the Tax Foundation said would cost five hundred thousand jobs, is directly opposite of our administration and the Reagan legacy of cutting taxes for individuals and businesses.
The way the.
President is joining a chorus in the Party of embracing appeasement and isolationism from supporting Ukraine in their battle against the unconscionable Russian invasion, that's not consistent with the way that we stood strong with our allies, we stood up to our enemies, turned our armed forces loose to take down isis we actually armed forces. The United States took out one hundred Wagner Group Russian military personnel in twenty eighteen in Syria. We stood strong in the world stage,
embraced our role as leader of the free world. Of course, lastly, just on the right to life. Just in recent days, the American people have heard the President literally criticize states that enacted strong pro life protections from the moment that an unborn child experiences a heartbeat, and he's made no commitment to support protections for the unborn at the national level. That coming from the leader of the most pro life
administration in history. That's what I mean when I talk about the President and some of his imitators walking away from that timeless conservative agenda. But if I'm president of the United States, the American people can be confident I'll lead as America on the world stage, being the leader through the world, will lead presidents and policies, and will balance our budget and stand for life.
Your former running mate was, of course not there last night, and some believe that he will win the Republican nomination without answering a single question in a forum like the one that you endured last evening. What should Donald Trump answer to would it be the trillions in debt that he added to the nation and left behind? Would it be his legal challenges right now?
What is it?
Well, Look, I think he ought to be there. He should have been there last night, He should have been there at the first debate. Look, no one is entitled the nomination of their party. And frankly, Donald Trump continues to campaign as though he were the incumbent president. But think about this, he's campaigning as an incumbent, but he has less than fifty percent support of Republicans. That means
half of Republicans are looking somewhere else. I think he owes it to our party to step forward and answer the questions that they can be on those issues. But for my part, for my part, I think the president ought to explain while having passed that's the largest tax cuts and tax reform in history, he now advocates what would be the largest proposal of tariffs, a ten percent tariff on all imports, literally since the Herbert Hoover administration.
And why the president, after we rebuild our military stood strong on the world stage, is now joining a courus of isolationists in the party, saying that support for the Ukrainian military is not sustainable and joining others who were on that stage last night, who would be fully prepared just to let Vladimir Putin overrun Ukraine. And of course, as I said last night, I think if Putin grabs Ukraine, that just gives a green light to Jijiingping to move
against Taiwan. So I think we achieve peace through strength. And I think the President ought to be willing to step up and explain why he's changed his mind about America's obligations but leader of the free world, and why he's changed his mind on such a fundamental issue as taxation.
Well, you've talked a lot. What about your commitment to strong defense. We had on Senator Tommy Tuberville on this week who said this, This was his quote. He said, the US military is not an equal opportunity employer. You are the father, you are the stepfather of men who have given their lives to this country, to our military. What do you have to does this have to say about the state of the Republican Party.
Well, I don't know the context of that remark.
I think.
The armed forces of the United States, throughout our history, from the founding of the country have been an incredible meeting ground for people of every race and every background who put on the uniform and served.
Mister Vice President, I feel like we should put a finer point on that. We were asking him about his decision to vote against C. Q. Brown, the new chairman of the Joint Chiefs. He called and woke and said he wants to mix race into the military and made that comment that Anne Marie just referred to. Is that wrong view for this country?
Well, look, I believe, and look, I have great respect for General Brown, but I'm very frustrated when I see the political correctness in the woke politics that's taken hold of the Pentagon under the Biden administration. But I do know how it works. I've worked in a White House. I know how Pentagon works.
I mean that.
We have civilian control of the military. I'm confident that this woke politics is emanating out of the Biden administration. But look that Senator Tubberville has every right to vote to confirm or not to confirm. But for my part, I've made it very clear that if I'm President of the United States, We're going to build a military fitted
to the widening challenges in the twenty first century. We're going to get this woke politics out of the Pentagon on day one, and that includes we're going to reinstitute the ban on transgender personnel in the United States military. I truly do believe that that is not in the interest of having a military that reflects unit cohesion, preparedness, is deployable. We'll put that common sense back into effect.
Vice President Mike Pence, thank you so much for joining us. It's all the time we have today.
Thank you again.
We hope you come back soon.
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