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I'm going to be a single day countdown.
Yes, please soon enough, let's speed up silly season. I think we can say with some of the stuff that we're chewing on here, but that's the way this goes. We know it's like that in the final throes. They're just more outlets. There are more podcasts, there are more interviews, it seems than ever.
Yeah, and we certainly saw that on full display yesterday with Kamala Harris sitting down for an interview on NBC as well as on Telemundo, and then of course on Friday, we're expecting Donald Trump to sit down with Joe Rogan for his podcast not the only podcast, Kamala.
Harris to do the same. She's supposed to talk.
With them very well.
Might though I don't think call her Daddy, which Kamala Harris did, has been drawn out or Trump has been drawn towards in the aftermath. They're not necessarily one for wanning each other on these podcasts, but it's something we want to discuss with someone who is an expert on the media. Jane Hall is with us. She is American University Associate Professor of Journalism and Media Studies and also author of Politics and the Media, Intersections and New Directions. Jane,
Welcome back to Bloomberg TV and Radio. As we look at the media strategy here in these final weeks of the race, trying to reach out to, in some ways very targeted groups of voters, how would you rate each campaign's success on that front.
Well, you know, I think they've had their successes. Each of them has had a success I mean, I think it's striking that the GOP is coming out early voting. I mean that to me potentially shows how much loyalty Donald Trump has because he's now saying, oh, no, go ahead and come out and vote. I mean, it's very hard to know how this is all going to end up, but I personally think that Harris has done some very interesting things by going on Brett Bayer. People who might
have doubted her, she stood her ground. You know, she might even go do Joe Rogan. Trump is not going into hostile territory. You know, he had a town hall which was pretty much packed with people that were his supporters and saying he was, you know, the protector of women. I think that they are not that. The Trump campaign. He is doubling down on the bro culture and on immigration and on the language around that. I think more than trying to go and convince people who are not
already with him, that would be my estimation. She is going and I believe trying to show that she can be the person that can overcome whatever doubts people have about the first woman president, and also doubts about whether they understand or know her well enough. These are things that have come up over and over. I think that her strategy probably is a stronger media strategy. How that all plays out, We're really just going to have to see.
Jen. You're an expert on politics and the media, and I'm struck by how in this campaign. Remember in two thousand and eight it was the Internet election because the internets were new. This is being called, I think David Gora earlier in the broadcast called this the podcast election. Donald Trump didn't do sixty minutes, and it might turn
out that he didn't need to. But this Joe Rogan interview, for instance, could have a major impact on mobilizing bros as you call them, in other young voters he's trying to reach. Are we resetting the deck on the must haves? The must do is when it comes to media in a presidential campaign.
Oh, you know, I think that's such a great point. I think this could be the podcast election. You know, Kamala Harris going on on Call her Daddy got a bigger audience that she might have gotten in many of the so called legacy media. I will say that. At the same time, you know, one of the things that is happening is that the sixty Men MIT's interview Trump didn't show up for, and he's been out there saying and convincing a lot of people that somehow it's wrong
that they edited it. You know, she's trying, I think, to say that she's the one out there doing things. But to your point, I believe very strongly that podcasts are definitely playing a huge role. People are going to partisan podcasts, They're going to places where they are reaching out beyond their normal audience. I mean, that's why I think it was very smart for Kamala Harris to even consider and then go on with Brett Mayer. You know
that's cable. But the podcast audience is huge. They've been courting them, they've been trying to you know, if you go to the spin Alley, the podcasts are definitely a factor in a way that they have not been before. And they tend to be partisan, not all of them, but many of them reach an audience of like minded people, and I think they've been a huge factor this time.
Well, that's a really important pointing. This isn't necessarily journalists conducting non partisan interviews in many of these instances. And when we consider the way in which podcasts, which are often audio clipped, many of them have a video component now just parts of them are circulating on the Internet's, as Joe calls it, across social media, many of these
things are being consolidated, not necessarily put into context. How concerned are you are by what you're seeing around media consumption behavior in this election and whether or not people are getting access to the factual information that they need to inform their vote.
I think that this is the biggest question we face in media and politics. I mean, I will say don't count out the legacy media. I mean the fact that the New York Times put out their interview with Kelly immediately, the fact that NBC put out their interview immediately with Callie Jackson says to me that they also want to in any way answer the question of you edited it, you did something, you know that is something that Trump has been promoting it. Really, I think that it is
an issue. It is an issue as to what kind of information are people getting. I think asking people to sort this out is more than we should be asking. I think these you know, it's a very complicated question. We should have fact checking, but it's very hard in real time right now when you have when you have Donald Trump saying that you know, what he said previously isn't true anymore, and you have to go back and say no, no, the media, you have to say no, no, he actually did want to overturn Roe v.
Wade.
I mean, we're we're in a fast, fast moving environment. I think maybe after the election we can try to look back at this and see what can be done to try to help people. And also, frankly on the internet, check and fact check, I mean, under Elon Musk, you know, fact checking is going away in many ways, and that is not a good thing.
Well, the meantime, to quote Terry Haynes at Pangaea Policy, we're all drunks leaning on lamp posts. Jane, there's a great note that Terry is out with today and he's quoting, of course, the late Hall of Fame Dodgers announcer Vin Scully. Quote, statistics are used much as a drunk uses a lamp post for support, not illumination. And he calls out three examples, pushing the betty markets as we've seen as somehow accurate,
pushing Harris's economic plan benefits the reality. Picking between he says, Harris and Trump is like picking which terminal cancer you want, and Harris supporters seeking to spook markets on Trump Terris. When the analysis is siloed and admittedly speculative, it brings us back to the impact of media and personality, the use of celebrity, When in fact, if we're all drunks leaning on lamp posts, we don't have a lot of data here to count on.
Jane Dewey, Well, you know, I hope we can sober up after November fifth, and frankly, we're not going to be done after November fifth, you know, this is going to go on for a while. I think that this election has been exciting in many ways and also something we want to reflect on because you do need to have some consensus about what the facts are, and frankly, that has been undermined pretty dramatically, and we're gonna have
to see how they saw plays out. I hate to say we're gonna have to see, but it's pretty true. I think in the you know, I think that we're gonna have to look back and say, should we have more regulation? Should we have you know, what should how should this all look? Because right now we're in the midst of I'll use another analogy, a car going down the road one thousand miles an hour. It's very hard to fix the car when you're running down the road.
And I think we're gonna have to get through this and then see what the impact of this environment has been. Nobody particularly likes the environment that we're in, and that's that's something maybe we can go forward on.
It's great to have you back with us. Jane Hall, American University Professor of Journalism, Media Studies through Politics in the Media, Intersections and new directions. I think we're finding a couple of them right now. Jane, Thank you and great to have you with us once again on Bloomberg TV and Radio. I'm Joe Matthew alongside Kaylee Lines in Washington. If you're just joining us, welcome to the fastest show
in politics. We are less than two weeks out in Kaylee, impressive early voting numbers driving the conversation today from the likes of Georgia and Nevada, where Republicans are snapping to attention here.
Yeah, breaking from the norm at least compared to what we saw in twenty twenty. In Georgia, more than a quarter of the voting population has already cast their ballots. So for all of our conversation about the media tour of the Swing state Blitz in these final days, a lot of people have already made up their minds and have already acted on that thinking.
Twenty seven percent in the bag in the swing state of Georgia. We'll assemble our panel next. Rick Davis and Kristen Hahn with us today on Bloomberg TV and Radio.
You're listening to the Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast kens just Live weekdays at noon Eastern on Applecarplay and then Roo with the Bloomberg Business at You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our flagship New York station Just Say Alexa playing Bloomberg eleven.
Thirty thirteen days to go until election Day. We spent a lot of time talking about the closing arguments we have heard or will hear in these next thirteen days. Kamala Harris focusing in part on Donald Trump's character and what she describes as his unfitness for office, in addition to abortion rates, which will be spotlighted by a visit to Texas on Friday. Whereas Donald Trump has a bit more mixed messaging, shall we say when it comes to
Kamala Harris, but one thing he has focused on. Frankly, both of these candidates do seem to be putting emphasis on is the economy. We heard from both of them on that issue in an interview in a rally, respectively yesterday.
My plans are focused on working people, the middle class, and what we must do to strengthen hardworking people to be able to do what they dream and aspire to be able to do. His plan are about giving tax cuts, massive tax cuts to billionaires in big corporations.
With four more years of Kamala Harris, North Carolina will be an economic wasteland.
That's what's going to happen.
The rest of your companies are going to move out. Everybody knows that smart people now, we don't need another.
For No country could take that. And of course now Kamala Harris is pushing a federal minimum wage of at least fifteen dollars an hour in answer to Donald Trump's foray at the McDonald's in Pennsylvania with optics that are still resonating on the campaign trail. Let's assemble our political panel with us today Rick Davis, Bloomberg Politics contributor, Republican strategist and partner at Stone Court Capital, alongside Democratic strategist
Kristin Hahn, partner at Rock Solutions. Great to see you both. This is quite a contrast, Rick Davis, when you have Donald Trump and what you I think already described on the air as very effective optics. We're in the apron handing out the frat restaurant open or closed, people pre selected or not, and Kamala Harris answering that with a fifteen dollars minimum wage. James squarely at those McDonald's workers, which is a more effective pitch in this eleventh hour.
You know, look, I think they both work. Certainly, the optics around being in a McDonald's and showing support for people who are earning a living doing that, you know, as I said earlier, has been an effective tool, and frankly, the Democrats reacted so badly to it, it's actually probably hard for the Harris campaign to get back into talking about it because everyone panned so badly on the Democratic side.
The reality is she should have been visiting a McDonald's and announcing this minimum wage policy in order to create
the optics that would get her more attention. We're talking about it today because on Bloomberg we care about minimum wage issues, but her ability to convert a lot of talk about Wall Street issues, taxes, trade policy, all that stuff that's been going on to a main street issue, like you know, working at a McDonald's and earn in seven bucks an hour is something that requires optics, not just a press release.
Well, I was also struck Kristen by how she immediately hedged her remark on a fifteen dollars federal minimum wage by saying we'll work with Congress on that we got to work it out, acknowledging that for something like that it will require congressional action. This is not just up to the power of the president. When the same acknowledgment isn't necessarily being made for other economic proposals from both candidates sprinkly when it comes to taxes or anything else.
So where is the realism element here?
I mean, I think she's right. I mean for any big policy change, whether it's minimum wage or the taxes that are going to sunset and that we all know that we're going to have to deal with at the end of twenty twenty five, it's gonna first president of United States is going to have to work with both
chambers and likely both parties to get it done. You know, I do think I agree with rick On on the optics of Trump, even though it was a total sham and they shut the restaurant down, But the optics are are you know, are are important and probably were a net positive for him. You know, people criticize Kamla for not being more substive. What she did was very substive, but you know, like Rick said, sometimes it requires more than just a press release. But the reality is that.
You know, anybody who's president is going to have to work with both sides on these on any issue.
Really, I'm compelled by gas prices when you add that to the story of a rising minimum wage at least being proposed, and falling gas prices. Here Rick triple A has the average price down eleven percent from this time last year, and in fact, average gas prices are now below three dollars a gallon in nineteen states, including the swing states of Georgia, Carolina, and Wisconsin. I know that a lot of Harris critics try to tie her to the Biden administration. She's, of course a big part of
it when it comes to issues like the border. Does she get the benefits of incumbency on a story like this when it comes to gas prices.
She could if she spent more time demagoguing it. I mean, and I mean that in a positive way. Donald Trump, you know, demogogue's anything positive that happens if the if the if the stock market goes up, it's because, according to Donald Trump, they know he's going to win. If it goes down, it's because they're worried that Biden or
the Harris campaign is getting successful. I think this is a lesson that at White House and the Harris campaign have never quite understood, is at some point you actually have to take credit for something positive. You can't just sort of assume that's your day job. And so the policies of the Biden, you know, Harris administration, you know, to bring down prices to cost you know, cutting costs
of living. You know, like that's still the number one thing that voters are thinking about when they go to the polls. And the fact that that isn't on the lips of the candidate for president, Kamala Harris every single day just stuns me because they have a story to tell, but they just refuse.
To tell it.
Well, the story she seems to be telling, at least in part today, as we just heard her speaking outside the Naval Observatory her residence, is about the reported remarks in the New York Times and The Atlantic of John Kelly, Trump's former chief of staff, what he said about Hitler, what he said about Trump qualifying in the definition of
a fascist. And we understand, based on New Washington Post reporting that just hit the wire Rick that on Tuesday next week, Kamala Harris is planning to deliver a closing argument speech on the National Mall, where, according to sources familiar, at least in part, she'll mention Trump's role in the January sixth attack on the US capital. What do you make of the focus on the threat of Donald Trump toward democracy? It's feeling very Joe Biden esk the final stretch of the race here.
Yeah, it is. It's such a drug to criticize Trump and to call him a threat to democracy. And when someone with such credibility as General Kelly comes out and goes on the record something that nobody would have really expected him to do because of his patriotism, you know, it's just you want to grasp you want to hold that in. And yet this has been a major portion of the Harris closing argument, is swinging away from issues like the economy and going back into direct attacks on
Trump as being non democratic. And look, they've got pulling data, they're making a judgment call. You know, they're seeing something there that I haven't seen that somehow voters that still haven't cast ballots or made up their minds are going to be motivated by that. It's just amazing to me that, you know, she would make her closing arguments in Washington, d C. Washington used to kryptonite. You know, if a canon for president came to Washington, they immediately fell into polls.
And so good luck to you with that mall rally, because I'll be darned if I ever thought that would work.
Love to hear from you on this, Kristen. This is a remarkable story that Kayleie mentions. The Washington Post is pointing to the permit application that would put this between fourth and seventh Streets on the mall. So imagine Kamala Harris on what appears to be here a forty foot stage with the Capital behind her right. This would be right on the mall where tourists would otherwise be milling around here about seven thousand people. A thousand chares the
full treatment. Here are these the right optics, which will be one week before the election.
I mean, I think I don't think it necessarily hurts her, as you're saying that as a Washington DC resident, I'm just thinking about the traffic that I'm gonna have to do with around then. But you know, I think that you can have an event like that, you know, look very presidential and and you know, She's been all over the country and still be in all of these swing states and where she needs to be, and in Georgia and you know, in Arizona and all these places, and
so I don't think it's one or the other. I think that, you know, there there's some optics there, and then she can also be in a diner in Wisconsin, you know, you know, talking with voters in Michigan. So I think, you know, it just goes to show that this campaign, like Rick said, you know there, it's not that they're doing this in a vacuum. They've got data
that's telling them, you know, that's informing these decisions. So I would be loath to second guess those, but I think that you know, you can do all of the above.
Well, Kristin, If it in part is going to be a speech about democracy democracy she stands on the National Mall as Joe paints the picture, or with the capital behind her, does she need to make it about something more broad than that? What do you think, based on your deep knowledge of democratic politics, her closing argument needs to be beyond that? Is there something she could be better spending her words on, not just her physical presence?
Yeah, I mean I think clearly with the capital in the background, you know, drawing them those memories of January sixth and democracy. And we see some national polls where democracy maybe makes the top list or the top five, but at the end of the day, it's really the economy, healthcare, women's healthcare, those types of issues. So I would like to see her weave some of those concepts in, and
she has been doing it about looking forward. You know, there's kind of on a dual messaging track where we're talking about this man over here is a danger to democracy and for you Republicans, maybe he'd be able to hold your nose and vote for me, you know, but also reminding people that she has a path forward on these issues that really hit close to home to them, including like them being able to put food on their table.
And I will go back to the gas prices. I was just in Texas and gas prices are about like two thirty eight gallons. So I agree with Rick, you know, really taking advantage and like holding onto that and reminding people that some things have gone well. All right.
Kristin Han Rock Solutions partner and Rick Davis, partner at Stone Court Capital, thank you both so much for joining us our political panel on this Wednesday edition of Balance of Power, and we still have much more coming up. We're going to head to the swing state of Wisconsin next show. Congressman Bryan's Style, the Republican, will be joining us. Have a lot of questions for him, so stay with us right here on Bloomberg TV and Radio.
You're listening to the Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast Ketch just live weekdays at noon Eastern on EPO car Play and then Droud Auto with the Bloomberg Business app demand wherever you get your podcasts, or watch us live on YouTube.
A very loud argument that's underway between free trade, what some call fair trade, and what others call isolationism.
Yeah, and you're seeing this reflected not just in terms of actual outright tariff policy when we're talking about where goods are made and if they're brought into the United States, but increasingly on the part of Donald Trump, you're seeing it reflected in things like tax policy. He already had proposed a lower corporate tax, right to fifteen percent for
companies that manufacture goods in America. Then yesterday in North Carolina, he was talking specifically about offering a tax break on auto purchases, but only if it's an American made vehicle, not necessarily European or Asian models, all kind of focusing on America's manufacturing economy in the final stretches.
That's right, which would a ligne I suppose with Donald Trump's prior proposals. But a lot of this just brings us back to the argument, which in many ways is not so much an argument. It's a bipartisan look at our relationship with China. It's just a question about which campaign in which administration will be carrying the ball on that.
Yeah, And of course if anyone wants to be able to form an administration, the path runs few, just through just to select few states, one of them being part of the Blue Wall, the state of Wisconsin. And that's where we go next, where we're joined by Republican Congressman from Wisconsin, Brian Style. He's chair of the House Administration Committee and member of the House Financial Services Committee. Welcome back to Balance of Power, sir, Always great to have you.
If we could just begin with a wide view at your state somewhere where yesterday we saw Tim Walls and former President Obama spending time. How close is the race in Wisconsin. Wisconsin right now, from your view the presidential race.
It feels like every two years the state of Wisconsin is always close. It's going to be once again. And at the end of the day, this is going to be a decision based on turnout. And this is where making sure conservatives and Republicans utilize early voting in the state of Wisconsin to turn out the vote. That's what former President Obama, Governor Walls was in town doing. I myself voted in person early in my hometown of Janesville.
This is the opportunity to make sure that every voice is heard, and I think now to the end it's going to be a push to make sure our voters get out.
Well, glad you mentioned that, Congressman, welcome back. It's good to see at least ninety seven thousand people, according to the Associated Press cast absentee ballots in person the first day they could in Wisconsin. But we saw some very long lines and there were reports of overwhelmed computer systems that clerks used to process ballots. Is this just par for the course or is there any concern that you have about the way this is being conducted overall?
I think yesterday went well in an environment where a large number of people showed up to vote in a reasonably new system in the state of Wisconsin. I think most of the challenges were navigated through reasonably quickly. There's a small line in my polling location, but overall, I think most people were satisfied with our first day of in person early voting, and we continue to encourage folks to utilize that tool to make sure that they get
out and vote. While the weather's nice this week in Wisconsin, well.
It's nice here in Washington too, Sir. I have to have to admit that it's not feeling like Halloween is around the corner, or an election for that matter. But we are just thirteen days away, and I do wonder what you make, sir, of the closing arguments we're getting from both candidates. If Donald Trump is becoming specific enough in his messaging to win those voters in Wisconsin that may yet be undecided, what is the winning message that he needs to drive home.
I think President Trump has done a good job and will continue to talk about the two key policies that everyone is discussing in Wisconsin, and that's the impact of inflation and the cost of living in the second being border security. In the contrast between the Biden Harris administration and the President Trump administration on these two issues could
not be more clear. If we're focused in bringing cost down for families that can afford the things that they need, and we're focused in on the importance of securing the US Mexico border, which is having a direct impact here in the state of Wisconsin, we have an opportunity to be successful this election.
Kamala Harris is also making a democracy argument here. Congressman, you might have heard that next Tuesday, there's going to be a rally or a speech on the National Mall, and Kamala Harris has pulled a permit to straddle the mall with the Capitol behind her to talk about the threat to democracy that she sees Donald Trump posing here and will recall the events of January sixth. We're hearing a lot about retired General John Kelly's remarks today, Donald
Trump invoking Adolf Hitler. He too talking about the quest for absolute power, and I wonder what the Republican answer may be. Your answer in a state like Wisconsin is when you hear questions about this.
The rhetoric over the last two weeks will most likely continue to increase. That said, I think we're best served when we're focused in and having a conversation on the policy differences between these two candidates. And I think when you have that conversation, you ask people, were you better off on your four years under President Trump or four years under the Biden Harris administration. The answer is clear, people are better off when President Trump was in office.
And so this is a unique election where we effectively have two previous incumbents. There are going to be a lot of attempts to distract from the economic policies of the Trump administration, in large part because they were so successful. And so I think at the end of the day, this is going to come down to a discussion about policies, and the two policies that are front and center is the impact that inflation is having on families and the importance of securing the US Mexico border.
What about securing the capital. Congressman is Joe mentioned that Kamala Harris maybe calling back to January sixth in her speech next week. We did learn yesterday that fencing around the US Capitol will be in place here in Washington from January fifth through the twenty first, can you tell us anything, given your seat on the Administration Committee as to what exactly is planned around the security of the actual certification of the vote and of the inauguration itself.
As chairman of the Canyon House Administration, we oversee US Capitol Police and other security apparatus in the Capital. What is key here is that what we are doing is reacting to any threats that we see, and we make sure that our law enforcement agencies have the resources they need to keep the capital open and to keep visitors,
staff in members safe. In my conversations with US Capitol Police, with the House Sergeant at Arms and others, I do believe that we're acting to make sure that they have the resources, that they will have the resources, and that we will be able to make sure that the public as well as staff and members are able to be safe here on Capitol Hill.
That's important, Congressman, and I appreciate your talking about that to the benefit of our listeners and viewers who are concerned about this. There have been still so many questions about what law enforcement should have been and could have been doing that day. Have you heard of any threats are we talking about the Proud Boys again. Is this going to be a peaceful day in the Capitol?
It needs to be peaceful and safe in the United States Capital, as it should be every day. That said, the security teams here in Washington, d C. And at the United States Capital are actively monitoring for any threats from anyone, whether or not that's domestic or foreign, from the left or from the right, or somewhere in between. My role as the policymaker is to make sure that we have the resources we need to keep the US Capital safe and to do that while we keep it
open and accessible to the American public. That can be done. I feel confident that we are well positioned to make sure that that's the case well.
And before we can get to those days in January, we do have to get through the election. And I know in this cycle you have been paying close attention to campaign finance, looking specifically at Act Blue, but there's been a lot of questions around campaign finance raised just within the last week Congressman surrounding Elon Musk giving a million dollars to a registered voter in a sweepstakes if they sign a petition regarding the right to free speech
and bear arms. Do you share campaign finance concerns about the activity of mister Musk.
I don't have full visibility into exactly how that sweep stakes operates. Obviously it's incumbent upon everyone to follow campaign finance law. I think broadly we should be encouraging people to vote, obviously only doing that under the guise of law. I would trust that somebody is smart as Elon Musk, as a series of attorneys who've explored that I don't know the inner workings of the sweep stakes, but I trust that his attorneys are determined it.
To be legal.
That said, I just broadly encourage everyone to make sure that their voice is heard this November and that they take advantage of the opportunity to vote in in an absolutely essential November election.
Congress from Brian's style, Republican from Wisconsin's first district Congressman, it's good to have you back. We still taste the cheese kurds from you singers in Milwaukee. It's good to see you here. On Balance of Power, I'm Joe Matthew alongside Kaylee Lines in Washington. Just think every day we come on the air here and we add more events to the schedule in real time. Now, We've got a national address on the Mall, the National Mall Tuesday from
Kamala Harris. Donald Trump's putting together Madison Square Garden, and we've got two weeks to go.
Yeah, and there's still concerts that will be in play. Bruce Springsteen's going to be in Pennsylvania with Obama. We may have more musical appearances as well. Podcast to look forward to Joe Rogan on Friday with Donald Trump. It is going to be a lot of information and sound by what will be coming at us.
That's true. We're watching and listening, so you don't have to.
You're listening to The Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast can just live weekdays at noon Eastern on Applecarplay and then ron Oro with the Bloomberg Business app. You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our flagship New York station, Just say Alexa play Bloomberg eleven thirty.
I'm Joe, Matthew and Washington as we zero in on Georgia specifically. Now, we just have new numbers and this is truly fascinating. Here, brand new numbers that I got my hands on here from producer James This is from the Secretary of State's Election Data Hub Georgia now early voting as of ten thirty two am today, these numbers are something million, eight hundred and fifty nine eight hundred
thirty early voting ballots accepted. That puts turnout close to two million already in Georgia, twenty seven percent of registered voters. When you start looking down the list here beyond Georgia, we can do this North Carolina, Wisconsin, Nevada. This is arguably the most important part of the story right now,
two weeks election day. Yes, but people are voting now, and in some of the states where we get to see the actual party registration adjacent to the ballot, we're seeing Republicans do a much better job than they have in the past of getting out early, if you at least consider that to be a good strategy. And that's where we start with Andre Gillespie, Emory University, Associate professor
of the Department of Political Science. Professors back with us on Bloomberg and it's great to see you, Andre, give us your take on what's happening on the ground right now in Georgia where this election is already being decided.
Yes, well, at voters and Georgia are choosing early voting in record numbers, and I think that that says something about the debate about whether or not there should be in early voter seizing, or whether or not election day should only be one day. Georgia voters, regardless of party, regardless of region, are choosing to exercise their right to early vote, and so that seems as a policy discussion, we shouldn't be talking about trying to eliminate early voting.
I think that there would be a lot of people on both sides of the isle who would be really upset with this. The other thing that I think is really important.
Please, The other thing.
That's really important from this debate is that people have made up their minds already, and people knew this already. I think this reinforces the idea that this is a base election and the candidate who wins is the one who has the best ground game.
Tell me what that means for the rnc's effort then to get Republican voters out early. U is some of the mixed messaging that we've heard from Donald Trump, who was calling this idea stupid as recently as a week ago.
Well, we'll still be testing this after the fact, but this does kind of lend credence to the efficacy of early voting and some of the efforts that the RNC was making quietly. You know, we'll see whether or not people change their mind because Donald Trump actually said early voting was okay a couple of weeks ago. But I think we have to acknowledge the fact that the RNC had actually quietly been encouraging people to use early in
absentee balloting. The other thing I think is also important to keep in mind is that before twenty twenty, absentee and early voting had been the province of Democrats or older white voters in particular. And so if we think about why older people would be more likely to engage in early and absentee voting because of their age, because they can do so, they have flexibility during workdays to go out early, or because it might be easier from a health standpoint to go out and vote early or
to mail in a ballot. I think what we're seeing as a return to the equilibrium where early voting it tends to be something that older, whier voters do because our older population is less racially diverse.
Returning to the equilibrium, consider the balance then in Georgia between Tucker Carlson and Bruce Springsteen. You've got some real choices. Tonight, Professor Tucker Carlson with Donald Trump in Georgia. They're going to have an event a little bit later on that apparently is going to be part of a Tucker Carlson program, will be in the Atlanta suburbs at an arena in Duluth, Georgia, as Bruce Springsteen meantime gets on a stage with Barack Obama.
Who are the audiences for these two very different presentations?
So I don't think that the audience members are going to be conflicted about where they're going to go. People are not going to be showing up to these events specifically for Bruce Springsteen or Tucker Carlson. They're also there for Kamala Harris and for Donald trum And I think the other thing that's important about celebrity endorsements, the literature in political science is actually somewhat dubious about whether or not celebrity endorsements matter in terms of persuading people to
change their minds. The types of people who are going to show up to these events are already committed partisans who are already committed to Trump or Harris before they knew who was going to headline this particular rally. There's new data out of Harvard that suggests a celebrity endorsements do matter from a mobilization standpoint, particularly with respect to
voter registration. Now, in Georgia, the voter registration deadline is a month before the election, so nobody knew was going to register to vote as a result of seeing these headliners at these events. But imagine what that impact could be in a state that has same day voter registration like Wisconsin. So if you're in a state where the voter registration deadline is either zero to seven days ahead of an election, having celebrity endorsements could actually help get
some new people to the polls. But I think most important thing about rallies, and the most important thing about celebrity headliners is the earned media. So we're talking about them, we're giving free advertising to both the Trump and the Harris campaigns because of the facts that they got cool people to show up for them at a campaign. Depending on what your definition.
Of cool is earned media. Although I let I guess if you're Donald Trump, You're still spending one million dollars to appear on stage at Madison Square Garden on Sunday night. A lot of people are compelled by this because he's not really running to win the state of New York.
He might help a couple of Republican House members, but this is really seizing on the idea that this is a national election, right and he's going to get a heck of a lot of earned media coverage, a lot of free media that's probably worth more than a million dollars for a night at Madison Square Garden. Professor, how do you see it?
So?
I mean that certainly could be part of the strategy. To the extent that there is a strategy, I mean, there are things that I question about Donald Trump's decision making, you know, in general about this. If he is coupling this appearance with a major fundraiser in New York, then I would argue that that is a pretty sound strategy. And so the only reason for candidates to go to decidedly red or decidedly blue states and cities if they have lots of donors in those areas who can actually
help build up the coffers of that campaign. But Donald Trump's four ray is into places where it's clear he's either going to win them hands down or he's going to lose them decidedly. Doesn't make sense unless you're thinking about other aspects of the campaign, like earned media and like fundraising capabilities.
Yeah, it's difficult to gauge the strategy in some of these states. Of course, he was at Coachella about a week ago as well. Ore where are you specifically in Georgia when it comes to the middle, the undecideds or the deciders as the New York Times I believe was calling them in their most recent poll. You talked about the get out the vote effort and the ground game. Here are we beyond turning non voters into voters or
d's into ours or whatever. This is people who are uncommitted one way or the other and simply going with the names and phone numbers that the campaigns have to get people out. That is what is going to decide the selection.
Well, that small sliver of undecided voters doesn't matter unless the base turns out to vote at expected rates. If you have lackluster turnout amongst your base, you're not going to be able to make it up with a small sliver of undecided voters. So that's the important thing. The base always matter, The base still matters. As to these undecided voters, some of them may be KOI in terms
of what they're reporting to polsters. Some of them may be truly undecided, and I think the bigger risk here is that they don't show up to vote at all, and then there'll be a question of, well, how are these people breaking One of the things that was really interesting is that the Atlanta Journal Constitution released a poll in Georgia last week or yesterday, and it suggested that
eight percent of respondents were undecided in the race. If we break it down by race, it was a higher percentage of African American voters who were saying that they were undecided. Again, the coynesses quession, you know, I think is certainly on the table with this. But this may also suggest, you know, that the campaigns need to do more outreach in these communities and that there are people who might be withholding their vote until they feel that they've been properly contacted.
Right, yeah, Well, this is in many ways an endangerous species, the undecided voter. Lastly, Professor, interesting move by the Georgia Supreme Court rejecting this push by the Republican Party to reinstate election rules that would have required hand counting of all ballots. So meet you back here in six months to see who won Georgia again rejected. But there's a challenge to that most recent ruling. How is this going to end for Georgia by November fifth?
So I am only a casual observer of courts.
I'm not a lawyer.
I think it's a question of the timetable whether or not with thirteen days out from an election, there's enough time to follow the briefs and have a judge issue a ruling before election day.
It's great to have you back under. Let's talk again before everyone gets to voting. Under Gillespie, with record levels of early voting around her in Georgia, Emery University, Professor in the Department of Political Science, always break to spend some time together. Thanks for listening to the Balance of
Power podcast. Make sure to subscribe if you haven't already, at Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts, and you can find us live every weekday from Washington, DC at noontime Eastern at bloomberg dot com,