Block the Tok, Debt Warning, Title 42 Criticism

see people on these committees, but Pelosi did it. Many Americans believe they said things about COVID, like about Jewish space lasers, which should keep them off of a committee like that. Bloomberg Sound On with Joe Matthew on Bloomberg Radio. More members of Congress want to block the Talk. Welcome to the fastest hour in politics. As a movement to band, tick Talk gains momentum a nationwide band. We'll talk about

it with Congress. But Rusty Johnson, who helped write to build to ban the platform on government devices, see how he feels about the next move here. President Biden means I'm trumping economic data showing continued growth, but issues another warning over the debt ceiling. Will have the latest from the Capitol and discuss it with White House Economic Advisor

Jene Sperling. And as the White House faces new criticism from the president's own party on immigration policy, will have analysis from our panel, Bloomberg Politics contributor Republican strategist Rick Davis,

along with Democratic strategist Jim Kessler of Third Wave. The move to band TikTok here in Washington is gaining momentum, at least on Capitol Hill, as Republican Senator Josh Holly introduces legislation to prohibit the app on all devices nationwide and as similar measure, as Bloomberg reports, is now cooking in the House, seizing on concerns about the way the Chinese owned app handles our personal data. It's owned by a company called byte Dance. We've talked about it many

times here, but this move is not new. In fact, springs from an effort last year to band TikTok on government devices. The Congressman from South Dakota, Republican Dusty Johnson, helps to write the legislation that became long Well, the name of the bill is block the Talk. Now. I know some of your viewers are curious. They just some I'm some cranky old man who wants to take away

their TikTok. And there are some prominent voices out in the public square, like a Federal Communications Commissioner Brennan Carr, who would advocate for just that, say hey, we should not have this app. This app is such a national security threat that it shouldn't even be available on some of the purchasing platform. That was Congressman Johnson talking with a starting point back in September when this whole idea took hold, and he's with us right now, fresh off

votes on the House floor. Congressman Dusty Johnson, welcome back to Bloomberg. We appreciate the time. So I have to ask you, after what you just said, are you just a cranky old man? Well, I am a bit of a cranky old man. I feel a lot better about the fact that we got our bill pass in December. Now we have as we speak, we continue to have a TikTok pulled off government devices. They should never have been on those gush darns used to begin with. And I would just know it for your listeners, I mean,

this is not this is not some idle threat. I'm not howling at the moon here TikTok has been fined a hundred million dollars by our government for privacy concerns. We have employee whistleblowers from within the company that have told us that China, the Chinese Communist Party quote, sees everything, all of the data people are using and uploading on that app. This thing is a real problem. I can't get my kid off TikTok. Is there a file on

my kid in Beijing? There is absolutely a file on your kid that TikTok, and almost certainly by dance and almost certainly the Chinese government have I know people think TikTok is just about fun dance videos, but the reality is that this thing has been designed as a trojan horse to be able to scrape up wild amounts of American information. And I think that's why you saw the move to ban TikTok from government devices as such a broad based bipartisan push. I was just named the Select

Committee on China. This is also going to be a broad based bipartisan move because the threat from the Chinese Communist Party is multidimensional and it's not going away. You're concerned about data collection, are you also concerned about the algorithm? Because we don't exactly know how this thing works or or just how exactly they have managed to create such an addictive product. Congressman, it is really interesting that you bring that up, because that is a developing part of

this story. As people have monitored the thieves that young people in China get from their version of TikTok and the content that American children get from their feet of TikTok is wildly different. The Chinese kids are getting productive, supportive, educational content. The Americans are getting garbage. The Chinese are trying to do what they can to slow down America

while they're speeding up their own country. You mentioned in that interview, and by the way, the director of the f UH the the FBI, Chris Ray, mentioned that one of the one of the f c C commissioners is actually behind this as well. If there's a concerted effort in the House, support in both chambers actually the Senate now as well. You've got uh the FCC on board. Will there be a national band? Would you support that? I want to get a little more information before I

support a national band. I'm a freedom guy. I've taken TikTok off my phone. I don't think anyone should have it on their own phone. But before I start telling people that they don't have that control over their own phone, I want to make sure that this is indeed a legitimate national security threat, that that imposes such a problem that we need to take that kind of action. But but the China Committee is going to be talking about

things like that starting very very soon. Uh is breaking news, Congressman, I have to ask you about and you probably saw this coming. Bloomberg is reporting that House Republican leaders are considering now extending the debt limit to September thirty. And it's a way for me to ask you about this because it's obviously been a very a very big deal. Is something that President Biden spoke about today in Northern Virginia.

List they're actually threatening to have us to fault on American debt and debt that's been accumulated over two hundred and thirty years, okay, and the interest on that that we've never ever done that. So we have a retour aventary total question, what in God's name with the Americans give up the progress we've made for the chaos they're suggesting.

I don't know if you want to attempt to answer the president here, but does buying time through the end of September increase the odds of resolving this without a problem here? Congressman, that's a tactic that there is not consensus around yet. But there is consensus around, uh, certainly among Republicans and also among an increasing number of Democrats, is that it is irresponsible for the president to not

negotiate on the debt ceiling. The last eight major fiscal reforms that our country has enacted came about as part of a negotiation over a debt ceiling. And it makes sense. What we're getting is a credit card bill, and it is a whopper, and I get it. We have to pay the credit card bill. We absolutely should not default on our debt. But when a company gets that credit card bill show up in the mail, it is exactly

the right time for that. I'm to sit down and have a family conversation about how do they get the spending under control. This White House says they should be two separate conversations. That default and spending they're not going to deal with in in one stop. Here, we've got a staring contest. It seems like going on between President Biden and your new Speaker Kevin McCarthy, both ends of Pennsylvania Avenue. You must enjoy the idea of getting them

in the same room. Are we gonna make that happen soon? You're saying it exactly right. Step one has to be to get the President United States and Speaker of the House in the same room. They have got to have an adult conversation, and for the President to refuse to do so is infuriating. The only thing that any of us should want is a reasonable, sensible, and responsible resolution to this issue. And we can we can get this done. We have to raise the Dutch chilling, and we have

to enact real and substantial fiscal reforms. We're going to get it done. Getting back to TikTok for a moment here, Congressman, we understand that Marco Rubio, Josh Holly on the Senate side, there's actually a Democrat from Illinois in your House of Representatives that are are all raising their hands to team up with the idea of a national TikTok ban. When will you make up your mind if you're on board? What? What would make up my mind? What? What would get

me on board? Yeah? Or when do you think you would you like to make up your mind to see if you want to be part of this. Oh, sure, absolutely, I think what we need to let the China Committee do a little work. I think you can get a lot of political mileage out of introducing a bill like that or to get on board with it. But to me, before we really decide to pass a bill, we better make sure that if we're gonna erode Americans freedom like that, that we're doing it for the right reasons and that

it is legitimately that big a threat. I think TikTok is that biggest threat. But I want to make sure before I get on on board a nationwide ban. I'm told that you're running back for votes. Congressman, will let you do that, and I appreciate your time on the phone. Congressman Dusty Johnson, Republican from South Dakota, getting things started here on the fastest hour in politics. I mentioned Chris Ray, FBI director. He did talk about this, Uh, it was

in a recent speech. He said the same words essentially in congressional testimony as well, favoring a national ban at least Tacitly, he talked about this in the University of Michigan. Listen to the director, it's parent company isn trolled by the Chinese government, UH, and it gives them the potential to leverage the app in ways that I think should

concern us. The idea of entrusting that much data, that much ability to shape content and engage in influence operations that much access to people's devices in effect to that government is something they concern national security concerns. Let's assemble the panel for their thoughts on this. Rick Davis's back Bloomberg Politics contributor and Republican strategists joined the day by Jim Kessler, co founder, a Third Way Democratic strategist and

former legislative policy director for Senator Chuck Schumer. Gentlemen, great to have both of you here. Rick. We talked about the government ban the end of last year. Is the National Band next? Yeah? I think extending blocked the talk to uh national Band is going to generate quite a bit of Graham swell. Um. You know, people are still waking up to the fact that China is listening in to so many aspects of American life and making conclusions

on how to compete with us by doing that. Uh that Um, I still think like like Congressman Johnson said, there needs to be more advocacy, there needs to be more understanding. But I think as people understand what they're into, uh, they're going to realize that, uh, it doesn't supply our culture, our society, our economy, our politics with anything positive that

why not just get rid of it? And so uh you can certainly replace it with other social media apps in the United States that don't create a foreign threat. So yeah, I think this is this is gonna find its way into the public domain in a big way. People you know, did a double take Jim Kessler when Donald Trump threatened to do the very same thing. Remember he filed an executive order citing the International Emergency Economic Powers Act and and threatened to ban TikTok. TikTok sued

the government back. That was three years ago. Is this a bipartisan issue now? I think it is. Of China is a surveillance state, and she Jimping believes that if you control the cyber sphere, you control really the world. Um TikTok, I believe is a piece of that. I

think it's it's got to be on the table. Whether there's a TikTok band in the United States, there are you know, some efforts to see if TikTok can be separated from the Chinese parent company and enough safeguards being put up, um, you know, so that people will not be surveilled. I'm open to looking at that. But you know, also, as a parent of a seventeen year old, I'd love to see TikTok on for other reasons. Thanks the tablet fifteen in my house, Jim, And it's like the only

thing that matters. Kids don't even watch TV anymore because they want to just say they're glued to the TikTok rick. It's it's it's addictive. I use that word intentionally because of the way this algorithm works. I don't know if you heard what the congressman said. This thing is written of to work in a certain way, in a way that YouTube never never managed. That that that keeps people

from putting the phone down. It's it's basically a digital drug. Yeah, and look, I mean we see that in other social media applications that aren't owned by the Chinese Red Army. And so the reality is, um, we've got to come to grips with how social media has has really affected

our culture, you know, especially teenagers. We know that there's a lot of data out there on the impact on young people with what they see and and watch on these on these uh you know, social media outlets, and we know how uh negative it can be to our politics, right, I mean, you know, the Russian meddling in in in our politics by and large was to divide people. And of course we find out algorithms that are written by

our own uh countries outlets, uh exacerbate the negative. And so I think I think this is a much broader issue. But I'm so glad that we're starting to come to grips with the fact that Chinese is you know, really a pernicious influence in our in our in our social media, and we've we've got to start doing something about it.

So are we all cranky old men here? Jim? I mean, I know my kid doesn't listen to the show, but if if if he and his friends were listening, that's exactly what they would say, out of touch, old and cranky? What what? What are we missing? Yes, we are cranky

old men. But the reason why we're cranky old men, and I want to echo with Rick Davis just said, we have a social media atmosphere out there in which the algorithms are set to that so that anger sells, you know, and so the economic consentatives for a lot of social media is to get us upset, or get us angry, or to get us jealous. And I just feel like it's the air pollution around us that is affecting this country. And put the red Chinese Army aside,

like this is a problem in America everywhere. I think it's Jim. Government officials are on this, major media outlets are on this. I've been told I need to be on this because I'm an on air uh personality or whatever, even a journalist, that you have to be there because that's where the eyeballs are. Jim, that's a very difficult thing for a lot of people to say no to

what happens though, to the official accounts. When you consider government officials, like I said on TikTok in the middle of this conversation, well you know, I'm on Twitter all the time. I'm not on TikTok, but I don't on Twitter all the time. And look, it is an angry cess pool there, and I think it affects the country, and I think it is part of the polarization here,

TikTok did a surveillance scheme. They're masquerading as entertainment. And look, Rick Davis is right, there'll be another social media platform that will predict kids that might not have the surveillance aspect to it, but it all have the other negative mental health aspects to it that I just think we've got a dress suit. So let's say they pass a bill here they banned TikTok. Rick, what keeps the Chinese from just inventing another app, another trojan horse with a

similar algorithm. Well, I do think that the federal government is certainly getting a smart to the tactics of China. You know, you saw during the Trump administration a full fledge, all of government approach to try and ban Huawei, which was just another trojan horse, uh to steal our data in the form of a cheap cell phone. Um, but we've got some real challenges here, right. This is an

emerging issue that luckily right now is bipartisan. Right, there's nobody out there saying, you know, being soft on China tech is somehow a partisan issue, and so so I think that that this is something I know that previous Rick Davis and Jim Kessler, this is Bloomberg. This is Bloomberg, So no. With Joe Matthew on Bloomberg Radio. White House remains consistent, no negotating on the debt ceiling. You've certainly heard that here before, even as Republicans ask for budget

cuts before in agreement. White House Press Secretary Karine Sean Pierre, when it comes to default, we see this as a separate matter. We see this a very differently, and it should be done without conditions. Had a chance to talk about all of this earlier today with one of the President's closest economic advisors, Gene Sperling, who brought up the topic actually on his own while we were discussing this morning.

Is better than expected g d P report. Positive data makes the White House feel like the policies are working and that we will achieve a soft landing. But the administration is warning that the good times won't last if we default or even get close to a default. Remembering that Spurling was there in the Obama White House when

the whole fiscal cliff thing happened. In listen, I think what is really the most concerning uh for really, I think almost any responsible economic leader in the private sector or public sector. Is the idea that that they would return to to what happened in twenty eleven, where you actually saw a political party say hey, if I don't get our way on our fiscal priorities, we will default the United States for the first time in its history and risk national and even global recession. You know, I

really thought we'd all learned our lesson. Really, Democrats and Republicans since tyn have not gone there. Democrats didn't not to pay bass Well. I want to ask you about that because people should know that you were there for the fiscal cliff. You were you were actually the head of the National Economic Council in a different administration. Is it different this time or are you using the lessons

you learned then to figure out a solution here? You know, the point I want to make is that virtually everybody, I think virtually everybody has learned the lessons from twenty eleven. I think we were President Obama and Vice Bread and in Biden at the time, we're very willing to engage

in in a good faith fiscal negotiation. UH with Republican leadership of the House in twentyn over, what combination of measures should be done to uh, you know, put the put put our fiscal situation on on a stronger path. And then but we tried to keep that separate from the debt limit. They started to merge together over time, and people you know would say, it doesn't matter, you know, if they feel they need to use that as a hub for negotiations, why should it bother anyone? And then

we thought what happened. We saw that even when the uh you know, Speaker of the House, John Bayner, wanted to take a more responsible position, he could not control his members. And we got into a situation at a critical time of the economy where we came with consumer confidence. We significantly hurt our economy. We had our first downgrade by a major credit agency. Ever, all of that as

a self inflicted wound. We've already dealt with external shocks from the Arab spring to the Fukushima meltdown in Japan. This was a self inflicted and after that, I feel like, not just Joe Biden and Barack Obama, but I feel Nancy Pelosi, Mitch McConnell, Chuck Schumer, they all said we shouldn't go there. So we've had ten debt limit increases over twelve years, three of them were under President Trump.

Nobody Democrats didn't do payback. They didn't say, okay, you either give us paid family leave or worked in a defaulty economy. So when so, yes, I don't think it's just we who have learned that lesson. I think every responsible economic leader in the public and private sector would say, go, have a strong negotiation. You know that you usually do. Uh. They control a house, they have leverage, we have the veto pen, we have leveraged. That's normal political democracy over budget.

But what we're not doing is a negotiation in which people threatened to default the US economy if they don't get their way. And let me be clear, it's not right when Republicans do it for, you know, to try to jam in Medicare or Social Security cuts. That would be unpopular and it wouldn't be the right thing for progressives to do to try to promote any of their agenda. Nobody should threatened that the United States full faith and

credit as a bargaining ship in a negotiation. Well, Gene, it's in part because of that experience you have that your name keeps popping up on the Bloomberg terminal here that that you're on a shortlist they say, to possibly replace Brian Deese as head of the National Economic Council. You're the only person who have ever held that job twice.

Would you do it again? Um? You know. One of the reasons that I've been able to be in three different White Houses that you learn never comment on any personnel question, so uh, you know better if you're asking, you'll respect me uh not not going there, And truthfully, I wouldn't do that. I wouldn't go there on a question about any job or or anyone. It's the president and the president alone who speaks and makes those announcements. Many thanks for the insights, Jene Spirling, thanks for being

back with us as ever on Bloomberg. Thank you so much, really appreciate it. So I'm not going near the NBC position, but he had a lot to say about the death ceiling, and as the standoff continues, I would point you to the breakfast Club. You've heard about this group of Republican senators in the breakfast club, they include Senator Ted Cruz. Well, they meet, I guess every Tuesday at breakfast, even though

they don't eat breakfast. It's confusing but he says he knows how this is going to happen, not that we will never raise the death ceiling. It is not my position that we will never raise the debt ceiling. Rather, what the rules say is we will use the debt ceiling as leverage to force real and meaningful structural reforms to fix the underlying problem. Doesn't have to be a total solution for everything. Okay, so let's bring the panel

in on this. Rick Davis and Jim Kessler, uh, Rick, Ted Cruz and and it seems like just about everybody seem to know how this is going to end. It's about using the time that we have here, I guess too, to try to enact some reforms. But it doesn't sound like Republicans, aside from some folks like Andy Biggs, actually see this going into default or want to see a default. Yeah. I think this is where everybody agrees with the outcome, but nobody, I mean nobody agrees with how to get there. Uh.

The White House has one point of view. I just want to clean debt ceiling. Uh. Moderates in the Republican Party are willing to look at different things to connect it to whether it's the GDP or the debt or inflation. Uh. Then there's others who want massive spending cuts in the domestic side in order to do the trade off with that UM. At some point in time, most of these things are gonna peel off and and you're gonna get

down to some real horse trading. But I think it's just naive to think that you can't use anything in Washington as leveraged to get what you want. This is a town of leverage. Every issue has another side to it, and boats that you need for something else you're doing. So, I think the administration needs to join forces in the Senate,

in the House uh to get something done. I think this idea of leaving it up to Kevin McCarthy is wrought with problems because on his own he hasn't proven it he can get much done unless it's on the sixteenth ballot. Wow, Jim, you know Senator Chuck Schumer as well as anyone he doesn't want Kevin McCarthy can figure

this out. What role will the Senate actually play in crafting a deal if if they can in the end, on some day, Chuck Schumer, Mitch McConnell, and Joe Biden will come up with something and Kevin McCarthy will have to eat it. And as for the Tuesday Club, I think the reason why they don't need breakfast is they don't trust each other. They think they one of them put poison in it. You don't believe that kind of

a group, that is not real trustworthy. Just on on these structural changes such as security checks, Department of Defense interest on the day, federal pensions and veterans pensions. That's forty eight cents of every dollar that the federal government spends, and half of what's left is healthcare. Like, I don't know what these people are. They better put something on the table because you know, these structural changes are really going to mean something for people. Listen to Ran Paul.

He's in the breakfast club, and he's got a solution for this whole thing to be fixed. He spoke at the same time Ted Crew a hundred billion dollar cut and free spending. We would balance our budget in just four years. This is amazing. We have an opportunity here. It could be done, but it would take compromise between

both Paul parties. Republicans would have to give up the sacred cow that says we will never touch a dollar in military, and the Democrats would have to give up the sacred cow that they will never touch a dollar in welfare. I guess it's easy for him to say that, Rick, What is he right? Uh? Well, I mean, you know, certainly, and there's some component to that, right, you can always

improve spending at the defense department. There is waste and fraud and abuse at the Defense Department and fifty billion dollars a lot of money, so you got to clean that up. And he's right about spending. Um. That being said, I mean, Rand Paul's a libertarian, right, he likes to go everybody's box, and it's just not a practical, practical approach when trying to solve a really important economic issue, you know, like that ceiling. So I think he's a

gad fly on this issue. I mean, he's not actually proposing a specific outcome. He's basically saying, pox on all your houses, let's throw everything us And the reality is that that nobody's prepared to do that. So his voice is singular. I would say the Breakfast Club Keen Coming of Age movie, why in the world would you want to be associated with that? This is a great question with apologies to Richard Vernon, young man, you'll get the horns.

That's right. Don't mess with the principle. This is Bloomberg Son On with Joe Matthew on Bloomberg Radio. President Biden gets another letter. He gets a lot of letters, you know, this time about immigration, and not from Republicans. It's from Democrats, seventy seven of them criticizing the administration's policies but essentially

restrict the asylum process at our southern border. Referring to the president's new policies we talked about when he rolled him out earlier this month before his trip to the summit in Mexico City, was that all this month? Wow? Among the seventies seven Democrats signing the letters some pretty big names, beginning with Congresswoman Alexandria Costio Quartet. Last year, President Biden promised to end Title forty two. Instead, he

is now expanding restrictions on asylum seekers. She was joined at a news briefing outside the Capitol this morning by a couple other lawmakers on that list, including Senator Bob Menendez, the chair of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee. Anyone who tells you that the only way to secure our border is to punish asylum seekers is lying. It's why we are appalled to see President Biden replicate President Trump's immigration strategy.

As elected officials, we are duty bound to propose legal solutions, one that protects asylum seekers while also securing the safe removal of migrants who have no legal claim to stay in the United States. Let's sell the panel for more on this. Rick Davis is here, Republican strategist of course, Bloomberg Politics contributed along with Jim Kessler, the co founder of Third Way Democratic strategist. Uh Jim, this is not looking great for the president. Is he losing his own

party on this issue. We know republic are angry at him about immigration, but these were some pretty bold faced Democrats well on this issue. I think President Biden is wise to move to the center on this. I think that's where he always was in the debates. In he was the only one who raised his hand when he said that, you know, there should acrossing the border legally. Is is a criminal act. Voters, A lot of voters feel that Democrats are not paying attention to the border.

I know there's seventy seven Democrats on that letter, but there are a lot more Democrats who were not on that letter as well. There does need to be some reform of asylum. I think the President is in the right place. Well, I'll tell you it's never easy here, Rick. We've talked about immigration policy a lot Title forty two, specifically recently, Democrats want Title forty two gone. They don't like the president's most recent move to restrict asylum. Republicans

say he's destroyed the southern border. What's Joe Biden do here? Yeah, I would say some Democrats don't like his policy on Title forty two. There are there are some Democrats, including Kristen Cinema from a border state, who actually see some merit in the approach. So um, the reality is that I understand no. Well, yeah, she was when he put it into place. But the bottom line is that these

are all patchwork. Um uh. Nobody's coming out with a workable solution of a comprehensive plan like have been passed in the Reagaan administration, offered in the Bush administration and promoted through John McCain's candascy for present, where we would actually address all the issues that are vexing our country around illegal immigration on the border, and until that's done, you're really only just putting a band aid on it. I would say the politics on this thing, I'm more

optimistic than I was a year ago. UM you know. Uh. The aforementioned Senator Cinema, Independent from Arizona, UM, you know, has had very productive conversations with UH Senator Tillis, Republican from North Carolina at the end of the last session over a little bit more of a comprehensive bill on border security and and and has just come back from the border with another Republican, Senator Cornin from Texas, another border state where I mean, I think they're making some

progress on coming up with ideas that can be some kind of a bridge between what the Biden administration is doing and what other issues need to be resolved. It's far from being comprehensive, but it's the first signs of bipartisanship on this issue that I've seen in a long time.

Rick makes a great point there, Jim. That trip to the border, which was overshadowed by the president's summit in Mexico City, also included a Democrat from Delaware, guy named Chris Coons is pretty close to Joe Biden, so who was the audience for AOC Menendez, Corey Booker and others today at that briefing. Was it the president or they're just talking to people at home? Well, I think they are trying to talk to the president, but but they're also talking to the groups. You know, there are a

lot of immigration advocacy groups. Some of them are taking, you know, a pretty left wing position on this, not all of them, And you know that I do think that in the end, I agree with Rick, there is a better chance of bipartisan action on immigration now than

there has been in a while. You know, there are some promising talks, but there's gonna be somebody's going to be unhappy on the left and somebody's going to be unhappy on on the right if if something gets done, and something desperately needs to get done, are there numbers for this in the House? Rick, you take the twenty maybe away who wanted to block Speaker Kevin McCarthy in his fifteen rounds or whatever. We got to uh that they're not going to sign onto any kind of compromise

here on the boarder that involves Democrats. How do you get a bipartisan bill a comprey hands of Bille through this House. Yeah, well, as Jim says, you're never gonna make everybody happy with this, and so you've got in this case. I mean, I can't imagine a scenario where you're not gonna have to have, you know, Republicans and Democrats in the House voting on the same built together.

I know that's heresy these days, because it's either all Republicans voting against something or voting for it, and vice versa.

And and yet I do think there are enough people who are sick and tired of this issue and realize the US is the loser on this by not doing anything about it, and and and and it may be the time where people are willing to cross the aisle on both sides and say, you know what, we can't go into the election cycle in four with another year where we're just going to beat each other up over immigration and get nothing done for the country. Where's Chuck

Schumer on this, Jim, your former bosson colleague. Can he get the menendez Is and the Bookers on board with something comprehensive. You know, he has been involved in immigration comprom mises in the past, and a bill you know, passed the Senate, and it looked like it was going to pass the House until Eric Cantor, the Republican Um majority leader, lost his primary and and and the bill

got shelved. I do believe, you know, he would like to see a compromise agreement there and if something comes together, you know, Look, he had blessed what Kirsten Cinema was doing with Tom Tillis, and I think that's an indication of where he is. He wants to see something happen. The fact that it's quiet, that group is quiet Rick is encouraging, isn't it. It is because this is a

harder one to prosecute in the open right. I mean, as as Jim made mention, there are lots of outside groups, invested interests, they want to meddle in this, and they all, you know, they all have their own point of view, and that's very hard to knit something together if you have to do it in public and in private. So I'm hopeful u uh. And I think the Biden administration is keeping their head down, not getting in the way of this. Uh. And by extending Title forty two, they

bought time to let Congress work its will. So I do think that you know maybe this was just for show, uh these Democratic members, but it actually isn't productive, and so I think someone needs to go back to them and say, like, what are we doing to actually be productive with a solution rather than grandstandard. Rick and Jim final thoughts. Next, this is Bloomberg, So Nong with Joe Matthew on Bloomberg Radio. Bloomberg Sound Once brought to you

by Innovation Refunds. This is your daily reminder here Innovation Refunds. Time to take advantage of the newly extended employee retention credit. Innovation Refunds has helped small and medium sized business is impacted by COVID claim over three billion dollars in refunds. Standing by to help your business get back the money it may be eligible to receive. Learn more at get refunds dot com. So if you don't already feel old,

I'm going to help you out right now. It was twenty five years ago today, a quarter of a century, when the President of the United States said this to the American people. Now, I have to go back to work on my State of the Union speech, and I worked on until pretty late last night, but I want to say one thing to the American people. I want you to listen to me. I'm gonna say this again. I did not have sexual relations for that woman, Miss Lewinsky.

I never told anybody to lie, not a single time never. These allegations are false, and I need to go back to work for the American people. Thank you, friendly Crows. It was not for another seven months the nation watched as President Bill Clinton spoke to them again in a deposition in January, I was asked questions about my relationship with Monica Lewinsky. While my answers were legally accurate, I did not volunteer information. Indeed, I did have a relationship

with Ms. Lewinsky that was not appropriate. In fact, it was wrong. It constituted a critical lapse in judgment and a personal failure on my part, for which I am solely and completely responsible. This, of course, all broke out with the help of then Independent Council of the Late Ken's Star and a little help from Matt Drudge helps

to redefine the idea of an independent council. Now Here we have another sitting president being investigated by a special counsel, and the most previous president also under investigation by a special counsel. Some thoughts from our panel on this. Jim Kessler and Rick Davis are with us. Rick, when you look back on this twenty five years ago, my goodness. First of all, an incredible period of time has passed as we sort of figure out exactly what happened and

whether it was worth it. How does it inform our idea of an independent council or a special council with what's happening now today. Well, I think the Star investigation was a precursor to what we've seen since then, and that was high profile, uh prosecuted in the open, lots of leagues, lots of information floating around, and then no real outcome, right, two years of taxpayer dollars spent investigating

this issue and and nothing really happened. Subsequent to that, we've seen other special councils who have chewed up two years or more in an investigation and nothing really happened. So I'm hopeful that the Justice Department has learned its lessons through the last twenty five years, especially when investigating presidents or former presidents, and will not actually spend two years of a taxpayer money to come up with nothing, and and and and that doesn't mean you have to

predetermine the outcome. You just have to predetermine how much money in time you're gonna be willing to expend on the taxpayers. I have to do, Jim Kestler, were the lessons of twenty five years ago prevent mission creep from these current investigations? I don't think so. Look, the first thing I want to say is we should all owe an apology to Monica Lewinsky, who was treated horribly during that period by the political system and the media and

was blamed and she really wasn't her fault. So I just want to note that the years ago she was raped through the coals. Yeah, you're right. I also believe that in politics like there is a tip for tat, and you know, the Star investigation really was not legitimate in my viewpoint. But what it means is then there's gonna be another investigation, and then another investigation, and then

another investigation. Here we are in twenty three with two simultaneous special counsels, which we had more time with Jim Kessler and Rick Davis. By the way, Monica Olinsky, writing this week in Vanity Fair twenty five years later, quote, as the years pass one's taste in partners gets better. This is Bloomberg.