Kenyon Martin | Ep 159 | ALL THE SMOKE Full Episode | SHOWTIME Basketball

I'm trying to teach these junks and something. Y'all want to go always bottom in the spencer shades and y'all really be looking like y'all got on blue blockers, go right there, the ray bands, hunted ray bands to plug hunted dollars. You'll be flies hills. Okay, I guess yeah, don't put on don't put on the blue blocking stuff. Okay, I guess that's what it is that you want to interduce. Yesterday. Yeah, my mother sucking dog and had a shot already today.

So you're gonna really love all the smoke today because it's going down h for Jenia birthday, my brother rookie year. Two guys from Texas same Saul uh he saved me my rookie year. My brother Kenyan Martin. Okay, motherfucking Mark broad boy, straight jacket crazy. You know what it is? Yeah, Okay, up, what's up, bro? How's how's life these days? What's going on on a day to day for you? Right now? Life is good? Man, Life is good, father, the first

and foremost, I'm saying, faking life out in that manner. Um, I got a few business eventually working on manum and my wife brainstorming. Yeah, just staying out the way, man, just trying to figure it out. And I'm happy, man, good places. You already living in his dream, already your son in the league. Yeah, that's that's I'm watching him grow.

Why it's development. That's great man, you know it's it's like it's one of those things where you like I've been seeing it and now everybody else getting to see it, like what I've been telling him and telling the world. Man like that boy can go like and and and he shooting the laces off that thing. So it's not and he here's what it takes man to be special, and he wants it. And where they're giving their money out now listen, Jack, hey, man, get to it. It's

been dope to see it. Though, because you know, I used to come check his games out when he's in high school just to keep the development just keeps happening so fast. It's beautiful to see what he's doing. Stand in the lab man, like listening, Stand in that lab man, listening man, head down, blinders on what's in front of you, man. And I think that's hard for some kids to do today because there's so much given to him at an

early age. We got you know, m Now we got kids are getting money all over the place right now. So to be able to stay focused on what got you, I think kids lose vision of the reason why all this other shing around him is happening. You gotta make sure you stay fresh at what got you all this ship instead of doing that and then having basketball be second. Yeah, that's why they got guys like us as fathers and stuff like that. You know what I'm saying, They need that.

You need that honesty because they're getting a lot of bullshit from a lot of places. What I'm saying, they feed them a lot of bullshit and tell them they're better than they are. You know what I'm saying, You gotta bring him that down to earth. I'm saying, just being honest with him. Favorite part about fatherhood obviously that's Junior is not your only one. Yeah, it's six of them. He's the oldest. So favorite thing about fathers just watching them grow, man, and being able to put what I

didn't have into them. I'm saying what I would have wanted, and the father I'm saying to be there. What I'm saying, so always be present, to be there and what I'm saying, to be able to laugh and joke and knowing somebody got in my back no matter what what I'm saying. So you're just watching their development. Man, It's it's all over the place. Um, you know, my seventeen year old cameraon stretching out now, so he's starting to show signs that he wanted so trying to get in the fall

in love with the game. Now, I'm saying. My nineteen year old, my daughter, she's in college, um doing her thing, um fashion stuff. Man. So they they're growing. Man. Got the young ones I'm saying, just watching them grow and oh yeah, you know what I'm saying. So yeah, they got the older ones are leaning on and what I'm saying that we got built in babysitter. So up get to the we got six kids on the thirteen, the

twins or thirteen. So they're just getting to the point now where they can kind of watch over the whole tribe. That's a lot. Yeah, yeah, yeah, you know what I'm saying. Being able to have that and trust them. You know what I'm saying, Like now we like that's that's dope. But I'm say they're responsible. I'm the oldest woman smunking. They know. You know, Dad, they don't play the radio when they come to certain things. You know, when they come to a certain things. I let them be kids.

I let them. I'm saying, they got to give them the world. But you know, I just I just demand that they respect and I respect and I'm saying, just do things the right way. Man. So that's that's didn't us yet. Man. But I'm I'm ecstatic about him. Man, I'm saying, Yeah, you know what I'm saying, y'all great fathers as well. Man, y'all know, y'all know what it's like. Yeah, I'm he was born but Dallas and I'm talking about us.

You know what I'm saying, I'm talking about talk about your childhood you know, and of course we gotta talk about moms. How I feel about your mama, like my mom too soon talk about just being in Dallas, man, growing up in the projects, since all we knew, like we I never owned a car growing up, and to catch the bus to go to grocery stores and do a lot of things. So um, they said, no Dad, damn me and my older sister. But Mom tried. You know what I'm saying, she did with you had to do.

You know what I'm saying things things were rough for for a lot of reasons. You know. We we grew up in the era where certain things, people die within certain things, and de real the whole, the whole situation. Man. So yeah, so we failed victim of that. But now we I'm saying, we are stuck by no matter what what I'm saying, no matter what was going on, that was my lady, what I'm saying, So for me to be able to provide for her, to have things and

do things for her. When I got drafted, man, that was like yeah, absolutely man, Like people asked me, like the best time I had an NBA, I said, draft day, Like why, like be able to take care of Lydia like be able to give her things she ain't never had, man, but now it was it was dope, man, just to go back now and see where I come from, Like what what what I survived like that, Like a lot of people didn't still there, but yeah, you know what

I'm saying. And I was having a conversation with a gentleman yesterday in a lot of hotel He just yeah, like like, so, how did you make it out? I was like for when I'm blessed, gifted and all that, but like how it worked, man, noticing what was important what wasn't. Like I was mischievous as a kid, but I didn't cross the line of getting locked up because I was seeing it was taking an ass away, like absolutely, yeah. Yeah, I used to listen, hey, don't get don't get it.

Don't get it. Twice I did. Yes, I did a couple of things that probably could have done. They could have locked my little lass up if they wanted to. But by the good grace of God. And I'm saying literally and acted a damn food on the scenes or they like you know what, she gonna wear his ass out, so listen, he gonna learn his lesson from this one. But now I'm just seeing like I had partners. Man, They're disappeared for six, seven, eight, nine months at a time.

I'm like, yo, where are you being. They're like juvenile, Like is juven there? Like jail? Whoa because you twelve? You was in jail? Oh hell no. So they like kept me like you know what, I'm not so certain things like my partners stealing cars, selling dopey all that I beat there And when they get ready to that, I like, I go this way, like we're out, we're walking around the neighborhood and all that one partner, I'm still that car. I said, y'all have fun. I'm gonna

walk the rest of the world. I'm not getting in that car with y'all. Man, I'm saying that they doing their thing. They written renting the dopehing car for then I'm like, no, can You're not getting in that car, y'all when they nobody got no license in the car like fourteen, Like no, I'm not doing so now. It was situations man that I avoid it. Man, And by the good grace of God, I like had hooped to turn to and other sports man and my sister them

was on me. But no, it was. It wasn't from the environment that that that it could have went left like and in an instant what I'm saying because I was in it. I was in it, man, but I was looked up got the A U team. Did you play any other sports? Football on the baseball? Would you nice? I was a football defensive and tight end I saw in high school when my sophomore year, I was six six and like four sixty. Everything everything hit everything but

listen though, so when listen YoY. We in practice one day though, right, so I grew up with my partner, Drawers within you couldn't tell me Drawers wasn't going to the NFL either as a linebacker or running back one or the two. So We're in practice one day doing dummy what I'm saying. So so second he did nobody want to run the ball? My nutass? I run it back then though, we had the little shields, so people want door the shields, but we didn't have like the

things like the clamp of shields on. So you just put it up in your face, masks who are not to go listen, my nut at like run the ball, man. It's like everybody just got out the way he hit me so hard, dog fucking shield went for I was like, oh my god, you know what it was my actually playing football to be honestly my sophomore year. But now I mean I was, yeah, I was. I was rough.

You know what I'm saying. I didn't mind contact. Like as y'all know, the way I played the game man so and baseball first basing on picture a dad was playing picture a little bit um. I asked Hugs when I was sitting that if I could play baseball. He told me no, Like now you had a hoop dog like you come straight on this. Yeah, you know you'll be just just do this. Yeah, that's what it was though, so doing e see like during baseball season, we always had the gym to go to. Doing football season, we

had the gym to go to. So basketball was always staple. I always ad you watching uh the bad Boy Pistons. Absolutely, yeah, just sending me everything Pistons man like that was you know me being born and sagging all. You know, that was there, you know what I'm saying. Like she's a die hard to date sports fan, like that's she lay the landboards. No, she she understood what it was man like you played the way I'm saying, you played the way I played the game, man, and she loved that style,

you know what I'm saying. So she's to this day like that's all she do. She lay in her bed and it stays on either games or Sports Center and she does cross road puzzles like that's that's her. I'm saying, Yeah, you know what I'm saying. So she eight three, So you know that's all she do. Man, Like she's sitting there and but she's she used to send me everything pistons, So everybody else was the bulls fan. Um I was

basically like Mike bad. But Mike like, I'm over here with Zeke now and peep, So y'all like stories, get your story about my pistons. How wide I am? Right my second year, we're playing Utah, y'all, remember Carl Malone elbowed Isaiah Thompson split it open. Yeah, remember that z was leaking right way before he was way before I was ever in the league and never thought I was gonna be in the in the in the NBA to

begin with, But I remember he had him leaking. Right We're playing Utah, were in Jersey on the break John Stock and dropped that thing off to him. I go right upside carm going on fucking head boom, lay him out, and he didn't get up and do nothing. I was like, oh, these motherfucker's sofa here like in Jared Stone guy risked that man, so oh you motherfucker, I kick kill And I was like, he tried to take up for him,

like Car and Car didn't do nothing. I was like, but that was physique, you know what I'm saying, way later, wired from old cliff Man, like listen off bro like and that started that started what it like nuts way back there. See, I told you that it had nothing to do with him, nothing, And I told us the other story way after the like when it happened, like what I did do do you think but the pistons and all that? Does that? Did that influence your the

way you play? Absolutely? And in my environment that I grew up in, it was that, Like I'm seeing dudes fight over travel calls and get back to playing dog a double drip whatever. It was a game point. Listen, this is my environment and that's and I'm seeing this the way they play. Oh yeah that's acceptable, Yeah, yes, that's acceptable. They're at the highest level doing it. So when I'm doing in high school, dude, some of the ship that I did, Bro, I know, you nuts, man, nuts.

I think about it. Dog, if I one of my boys do that. Listen, Man, I'm gonna take in buy the game and I'm going in the bathroom, dog and I'm hand to him like he grown something s I did in high school. You know, I think about it, man, something I was whoa therapy therapy because I think about it, man, Like I'd be sitting up telling about like she she asked me, like, did you ever used the box? She like,

like you give me like that you fight? I say, I probably should have, Like but no, man, just some of the stuff I think Backman, I'm like some was yeah, just environment dogs didn't watching them dudes go upside people head man, That's why men. Rick got along so well when the Big Three started, like I was, but from just playing and all that, soon he got around each other. It was like this my guy like yeah, like and I told it like my you know, so he tried

to trade for me when I was with the Nuggets. Man, they wouldn't do it. Where was he in New York? This is before the mellow thing, all that way, before that went down, before he went there, Like Zeke was trying to get it done. I told him what I did. I saw him on vacation. Someone on vacation. I saw him, and I ran it down for him. Recruiting process, you end up going to Cincinnati. Who else was on your list for college? Should everybody? At first? And no grades?

What I'm saying, like, you couldn't tell me I wasn't going to Kentucky. Who was there? Who was there at the time was just Rippetino, man, Like I want to play Riptino content. I wasn't going to Kentucky. Typical Kenyon. They come to the school recruit one day, They're looking for me. I'm at the barber shop. Well, I'm supposed to be in class. Of course, coach got to do something. You just spent me for the first half of the game. I come out like Acarter in the second half what not?

Of course all dunks um But now yeah, man, So it came down to Temple was still there because I had no grades and hooks and true story done, Chaney guarress is. So they in my house, my sister's apartment and pitching temple and they said something about some five six am practices dog and I instantly lost entrance. Like my niece who just turned third, she was a baby at the time. I started playing with her dog like this, this is not going there. But I knew I wasn't going.

I couldn't go to junior college like Dad. I did know, like it wasn't because I would have to go somewhere in Texas because it's big. It's just too close to Dallas, just too close. And Hugs was like, man, we got away, Like if you don't get your grade, if you don't pass your tests before school start, we still have a way for you to be enrolled in school and still take your tests. I was like, oh, I didn't know that. I signed instantly listen, like I sagned before even going

to visit. He told me that I'm like, so, y'all still won't me. I ain't got no girl. He like, absolutely were the papers I signed him joined us. I graduated, man, and I was assisting that it. Two weeks after I graduated high school, bro I was out. I was preparing for the test and they had a guy who helped Danny get eligible, who helped like certain guys get eligible. Like with the test stuff, I'm giving this man helling them one on one sessions. Dog listen the Blues, but

he just he was come pick me up. Dog. Just a good abuse daily. But it worked. So school started and I took the test right before, like right when school I started in September. Well, but shortly after school I started. So I can't practice, but I can work out. I'm in school, going to class, but I can't practice with the team, can't play nothing. Season starts. I get there. I'm doing what I'm supposed to. They go to Puerto

Rico for a tournament. I get the news. I found out on my birthday my freshman year that I passed the tests. So Bob huggins Man like yeah, cruitment process him and John Lawyer who Scott for the Clippers now like my guy, like thorough as they come. A lot of stuff is going on that Cincinnati. He took the he took the the brunt of it for for for

the university for so shout out to jail. But but now with Bob huggins Man like that was he believed in me from day one, man, and that's my guy throwing through like hugs like he and they wasn't recruiting me. When they started recruiting me, they was coming to see somebody else. Yeah, guy from y'all, I believe when we were playing shake cotton then yeah, but I was looking for him. Yeah. I wanted all that huh huh huh what did not do? And wanted to fight? What's the

little guard they had? Kenny Bruner the guard. Absolutely, Yes, I'm from old Cliff play that going up whooping that

high school. Yeah, ship at the Pyramid Beach. But no, no, but hugs man, they saw me man, and he like he told he told kJ that like listen, like your dad played with a certain type of emotions that I didn't see how the kids like at the time, Like it was just it was different that I didn't see that, amen, like like and then like for me to catch catch a great hand at a b C D though two hours from Dallas to Jersey on the Greyhound at six eight on a grey haund for twenty two hours, Bro,

what did you do the abc D when you got there? Earned the flight home? Straight up? Talk the son of a Carroll A few weeks about a couple of years ago, may call him after blue search my number down and man, I remember you came there and you like, I ain't no nothing else what I'm saying, Like everybody was there. What I'm saying, Cope was there all the big names from our class and there you know I put foot to ask, man, I didn't know nothing else. I couldn't dribble,

couldn't shoot them. They're working on skill work, y'all. Keep doing that. Just working for y'all. I'm a ductor absolutely block shit, dunk shit, fight ship, listen in that order, like that's all it was, bro. And then Hugs Man when I got the Sencinnati, man, he just I fit him the way he coached, the way I play, and he let me be me in every aspect of the word. What else did you learned from him outside of basketball as a man? Just work ethic, man, like really how

to work and what matters what I'm saying. Like, So when I was in college, so my girlfriend at the time, she lived like her mom. She came for money. So her mom then lived in the neighborhood right across the street from Hugs. So I used to ride home with Hugs used to drop me off over our hour so I spent a lot of time with her dad, so he just drive me over there. So I used to ride home with him all the time. We're talk. It's talk talk, talk, man. So just just about what's important.

What I'm saying, how to how to get through in situation, to know where you come from. You made it this far, don't let nothing deter you. Like, just just the constant message, the constant message, man. So when it was time to get to it, like when nothing getting in the way. I'm saying so from my from my freshman o man, like one of my first few practices, you know, not probably shouldn't, but like I put my hands on somebody every year Sincinnati Doug. Not surprising at all, just set

the tone. But yeah, and that's what it was when I was a freshman, Like and we had Danny Forston on the team at the time, first team All American, all this number ten, picking the draft, you know, all kinds of jiu jitsu and of that type of business. So hugs and then told somebody when I got eligible, Like a reporter told me this that he asked Hugs about me getting eligible. He said, I just our best player just got eligible. Who not then shot thirty or

four percent from the first line. As a freshman, who who the best play here? No, not this one. You can't be talking about me though. He was like, yeah, but this has coming. Like I just I guess he saw it and my my freshman year, like I didn't play right away then end up starting towards the end of the year and the rest was tooke off after that. Man, I just every year, you gotta do this. Okay, you need to do this. Okay, you need to work on this. Okay,

all right, So it's grinding. Man. So senior year nineteen and ten, nearly four blocks the game AP Player of the Year. Um, you end up breaking your ankle. Um. How tough was that? Because this is going into the draft. He hearing where you're gonna go, what's going on? And you end up remember that? Uh yeah, it was so us come out there, you know I always get up

and I didn't get up. He came out there, and it was I was just like I looked at my Yeah, so I tore the legma my inkle and broke my leg mm hmm, and it was just flashed and I just was like he came out there, he was looking at me. It was. I was just like, man, not now, not now. That's all I kept telling him. I didn't say nothing else, Man, not now. Man came too far for this man, not now, Not right now. Man, It's

gonna be alright. I'm like, not right now, man, No, because where this is where it just had senior day, first game of the conference turn. We'll just be St. Louis about forty on Senior Day and Cincinnati playing in the first round. M hmm, now you have it that national championship. But I had put to work in all seasons. So but I mean, still, that's gotta drive it out. You're hearing you possibly could on number one. What was that process like from the day you broke your ankle

to the day you got drafted number one? Hey, it was only like six months right within that long ship. I got hurt much June in June, so I didn't work out. I couldn't work out. I wasn't like I had screws in my ankle. I'm saying none weight bearing. I was in a boot on crutches for two months. So I didn't do nothing but go to therapy. Why everybody was going to meet with teams and do all that,

and I didn't do none of it. Then when I was able to get the boot off and all that, it was right, okay, So how is it like, well, so we go to Chicago. They're like, well, the screws got to come out before we even think about picking them. Screws gotta come out of doctors got examining. So so we did that, and all these teams trying to so we let me there. Everybody ain't from the coming this damn room. Ain't no damn guinea pig. What number you got, I ain't gonna be there whenever we got I ain't go.

You can't come in the room. You can't come in the room. So you do that. But no, it was hell man mentally that now I didn't didn't know what, didn't know how to deal with it. Man, like they ain't never been through that always could hoot, could couldn't, couldn't do anything but sit there and wait and wait. And here they think about taking this person and isn't in that draft who remember the top I was thinking

about like they were gonna take Dres first. They was they the nets are gonna take him first, and they weren't thinking about taking Strom my Stromo was second, but they were thinking about taking Darres first. So no, there's the athletic, but he couldn't hear his ass with both hands. Boy couldn't shoot that thing. So they was thinking about taking him. And I was in the Orlando. He was working out division Land where I was down there together

said he couldn't hit hiss. So so I watched his workout right, and he couldn't shoot that bit at oh. So I was like, y'all think about taking him. I was like, okay, So Stewart told me so Stu Jackson, he was in Vancouver at the time, Jim and Stud told me, if the Nets do something stupid but I don't take not taking you number one, you won't get past us at too, so you're good. So I was like, ship all right. So from that point, from that conversation on,

it was like a relief. Of course I wanted to be number one, but him telling me that was a side relief, what I'm saying. So coming up to the draft all that it was still like they still was on the fence. A drafted there like it was still on the fence was what they was telling us. But yeah, Manlo Jamal Crawford, So you didn't know workout for NO teams and sort of so I just sort of a workout. Let me hear they wanted to say. They said, we

need to see if he can run and jump. I had been right before the draft, maybe a week before the draft. I go to Jersey. I ain't really can't really do much, but I had been doing rehab. I had been out to booting all that. Doing rehab for a little bit wasn't right all the way, but I had been running and stuff. Literally I ran down the floor, ran back, grabbed the basketball, dunked it, and when it took my shoes off. The draft exactly what y'all asked. Y'all saw me run, I jumped. What's it? What else

you want from me? Man? Was everything that I guarantee you, the history of NO sport. So they had a decision to make and they show you, Yeah, they made it, and they shows you it's a guy from Jersey. I medicine and told me thank you. I said, I was just doing my job. He's in this room the Jersey guying there to him. Thank you. So they made the right choice and then the wrong choice. So, uh, rookie season obviously you're you're coming off this injury, but you're

ready to play. Now, How was that first year? Jack was along with you? That's my guy, man, great for us, it was great. Was hooping was in the league, couldn't couldn't tell us nothing right Like thinking, then I'm saying, man, Jack was in it together. So I think we was. We was both averaging. I think at the at the rookie mark. So we're going to Rookie All Star Game.

We was averaging ten points, were at the top of the list, and all that ship and uh, I always tell a story about I didn't get I didn't get the rookie hazing because because of him, they wanted all that kicking the ball in the stadium and go get donuts. Nothing that ship kmar was not going. And I was a kie right there. So if he ain't got to do it, I ain't got to do it. Yeah, I said, we got to do that. I'll gonna take up that. I ain't gonna get no donuts. Said I ain't got

to do it. Y'all gonna take that ship. And I just had to mentality, man like, ain't no grown ain't no grown man gonna make me do nothing. But they're just I can't listen. I wasn't nineteen when I came in. I wasn't eighteen when I got drafted. I was twenty two strong as an ox ye three percent body fat. Nick. I was listening, dog, I'm not doing it. You ain't making me. If I want to buy donuts, but I'm

gonna do it on my own term. If I want to help the manager with the bags, I'm gonna help them because I'm out the kind of some of my fucking heart. Yeah, no, not at all. You're not gonna it was on this team, man, we was ready to squaw though, y'all know, and the fight coming, Yeah, I from the back back then. I told him to fight and a fight come with it, man, like I was dead as seriously kindle Gill, like we were really Johnny newhim Sherman Douglas uh Lucien. Yeah, it was a dude's

on the like real vests. But I told me I ain't doing Listen, man, I ain't doing nothing. He like I ain't. Y'all ain't gonna make him neither write like it was. So it was a situation I ain't gonna say to that name like It was a situation the dude wanted some shoes that Jack had trying to take my shoes. When the shower he comes trying to like Jack, what's hoping them shoes? Jack like, man, you can have him? He like should. I was gonna say, I was gonna

take him ventioning choice. It ain't he ain't even talking to me. I said, Man, you ain't taking ship from nobody here, ain't taking from nobody. Take him anyway? You gonna eat your core? Was that excit this? I was gonna take him anyway, get my safe. Man. Ain't going to take ship, not from nobody. Man, nobody going for that. Bro Kmart was like it was killer Gill and he

got a I was Killer Gilk but time out. But we both from text, you know, I was started down star Kmart was like the real big buff dog and he was a little dog running around talking ship with everybody. Ain't what it was kind of like that, but I was yeah, you know, I'm yeah, just have to He was number one pick, so I couldn't talk. My words really didn't have to weight, you know what I'm saying.

But once he's saying something, yeah, he said that, man, But I would do it because I could do that because the way I played the game, the way we played game, whatever, whatever I had to do or say, let's go in this man, let's get to it like no matter what to being done and not doing none of that whatever, then let's go hoot man. And we had to go to his training, so he was really with us too. It was absolutely so. It was now it was my first year. I'm badly making the league.

I just came overseas, going through all this ship, trying to get here and not getting mother, trying to devote my shoes. I couldn't believe that. Where are we? Yeah, man, I just I just like I said, I was twenty two. I was grown man at the time. You grown man. And where I came from. Yah, you ain't going no no, sir, I uh old Cliff Brother. I was trying to show

that side because I'm trying to thine. I'm trying to you know what, because like I said, where I came from, it out became like hugs, letting me be meet him for years Cincinnati, so I never had to have an off button. I didn't have an off button that Cincinnati. Don't listen something the ship I did and did listen to up fights and all this wing I got. There was no off button, man. So when I got to

the league, there was still no off button. So after looking like Christ, we already know this, I'm just saying that's what it was, bro Like. Like I said in the Bronum, I grew up in and watching the shout I saw and by the time I got that, man, it was it was acceptable. So stay in your ground, dog. I drew a line in the stand a long time ago, man, before the gun law, A long time ago man. So so after after Ricky Yell and Byrones got you know,

stopped playing me for some reason. Who knows. Uh you know politics politics, Now you know it and now you can see it politics, man, and I end up leaving Marbarry get traded. J kidding new coming to town. What you're thinking? What's your mindset? Honestly, you were happy? I know you were happy. Oh it's static. I know I was talking to you. Ill do you was a Oh my god, I don't was in doubts when J was and when he got drafted to the man, he wasn't happen.

I was gone, No, No, I would happen, my man, was going not at all like I want him to know with me, because what I'm saying Texas boy were thinking thing like we came in like but I listen nothing. I remember. I was at the ruck of watching the ruck and when I found out what I'm saying, my man walked up to me like, Yo, they just trade the stuff. I'm like, huh, like all right, Like I didn't. He like, no, they just trade the stuff. And I'm like for who He like Jay Kidd. I said, huh.

He said it straight up stuff for Jay Kidd And I said let's go, and I got in the car left like, oh wow, different ball game out here now from day women day one. Put in the arena, he just said, Yester, he just had to make sure to stay in the arena. That's it. I go, Yeah, he put me in some Sich way. I looked bad, Like, dude, really, you're just gonna throw He's standing You don't see that man standing right in front of me. It's grown ass man that's in the NBA, standing right in front of me.

You're just gonna throw it up to the rim and you know where you're gonna, Like, I trust you, it was gonna get right it was gonna get trust You're gonna come down with it if nothing else. So yeah, I mean I'll just click on both ends of the floor, man, like he just we played a certain way smartest. Hell just go. We're everywhere, both ends of the floor. Everywhere. You're playing power for the center this time before said I wait, nothing, man, You're still stronger strong, But don't

still like like no like I was. It was still them forward was way everybody was. Everybody still bigger than me? Like wait, why is everybody's still bigger than me? But no, don't matter. So as soon as you get that y'all back to back, easy'll run through the East like it was nothing. What some of you? But what's some of your favorite moments from that time? Because beat Indiana in five game series like the first year, like that was like that was real, Like that was like real playoff

basketball against him. Yeah, and Reggie, Like Reggie hit the three to go in overtime, we think the clock was expired. This is before all the replace you and all that, so going overtime that sweeping the Knicks in their listen on the floor to oh wow, and I showed my

whole ass. Oh I destroyed them people that series. Oh wow, oh game four in the game four on their home floor, thirty six fifteen like five, and then and the next goal is really eight and a half nine feet That ain't ten feet doing warm ups, see this high note. I played in all these arenas, but in warm ups in the in the next I'm dunking backwards and what else? Ain't none of that going on? The house house it like eight and a half about eight and a half ards.

So you're saying what I was doing was easy? It was too easy? Yeah, but that the balance and um oh, I'm saying just playing against Boston in the playoffs and like we like sweeping them. We were we bought that broom out. That's when they had twin to employee number eight. Yall was punishing and don't want no part of it. Huh. Like two thousand two finals. They came across that midpoint. They will happen. They came across the midpoint. Let's talk about that. We're gonna get to that. To shock Kobe.

Um you were you guys run through the east and you guys run into them? What was it like? There was the one picture I think and that finds where Shock was dunking on everybody on the team at one time. One video that is one of the best interest in sports history, in NBA history though, like steel shots, that's one of the best pictures. How tough were they though? Huh? How tough for they in their back though, it's but

you're someone you had to guard. You you're a rare person can guard Shack and you had to guard you had to guard. Yeah, I was the romer. I was the double guy because it fits like, wait, White, I can't do knowing that dude. If I did get caught on, all that have to do is try to front him, and he just pushed me up the lane. They throw the impossible to guard. Listen, man, So you pick your poison. Do you try to play him straight up? You know what he's gonna do? Do you double swing swings? Now

you got night. Now you got Dad Fisher going four for seven, Robert already going too for five, Devin George going to for It's just what so then what do you do? And then you got the other animal that one on one is destroying us. Everybody in the he ever Shack averaging thirty six, he averaging twenty six, whatever, liked it was impossible. But you know what I'm saying.

I I looked back at it, like I average twenty two against him, like me my second years against him, Like I posted on like somebody's like the number of points of East series. Somebody posted it was one of the apps. Seen that thing? You were up there, that's

right to remember, third on the list. Of course you had Shock, Shock and cove Co. And what I'm saying, so I ever finals my second year like game four and our home flowing like, man, we ain't getting swept like that, Like I'm not going home tonight, like we're going back to l A. You went home, that went home that night. It happens though we had seventeen in the first thirty five for the game. No, but what

respect it was. It was a different animal. It was just no, no machine, nothing you could put in front of Shock and Cobe. Around that time, it was it was nothing. You could do nothing. And then the next year that running these fellas came on down. Let's say in the Texas boy, oh spur boy, they ass got lucky. We split the first two games on eight floor. No,

we were scared, y'all should have been. I told ja ja kid was busting our ask we split if we go home and get to because it was the two three two six, they got home floor if we go boy listen, No, but Timmy was probably he took one. He went to uh and took one in Jersey A boy him damnself. Some of the numbers he put up in that series. Dog Yeah and my Tumbo were talking about don't double. All right, they stopped doubling. This is why they doubling My Tumbo? Hi, Hi, how you want it?

Hook crossover, fade away off the glass like Umbo, don't. Yeah, they need to come you can have it your away playing bro and blocking everything. He played offside on me and on the ball on me like now. He did his thing and they had to double. Yeoh what happened this one? That's that swing? Swing? What's that doing? That game? No serious, I'm saying it went six and I'm saying it went six. He they played, well, yeah, we have to make a sense, you know what I'm saying. But

I didn't listen. But one now, but one thing for show. Two things for certain. When Employees six was gardening, there was no double teams. No, it wasn't a double tim I'm saying, right, he might have scored it all. He did his thing, but you can go ask that man to date did he have to work for each in every one of them. I'm saying, like I figured out how to guard people because having to guard him, he's

a problem. Where to meet him and forced him to where I want him to go instead of letting him walking me straight down the lane and catching the ball where he wanted to and not letting him shoot the like he never shot that bank shot on me. Ever, I wouldn't allow. Yeah, I'm a crowding what I'm saying. So therefore I'm gonna take something away. You're gonna have to do something else, like that's the way you can go.

You gotta make him do something else. So therefore, now you like shout out to him and what I'm saying, he made me better, made me back in that series. Though he welcomed the double team, he waited on it. He waited. Yeah, no, no, he he made me a better basketball playing a better defender. Him and a couple of guys, but him was definitely So we was hearing the same things, and men he was together them after every game, so we was hearing the same things about

Jay Kidd possibly coming in San Antonio. What was you thinking about that when you was hearing that too? I adn't think none of it, to be honest what I'm saying. I know they had tone and all that. I was just I didn't if you were the winning you to win, I was hoping it was getting rid of Yeah, like if he would win you to win, you know what I'm saying. Yeah, like I would have changed everything. You know what I'm saying, of course, but but history has

you know what I'm saying. He stayed, then they got rid of me, so HM would pay me so and didn't work. Yeah, I say, they don't want to pay me so they had they made some bad moves. You make the All Star Game in two thousand four, uh, and then we're traded. What was that process of making the All Star team? Like, after all that hard work and then you're off to Denver. Honestly, I thought I should have made it the year before, But so make it. I got my I'm a point guard and All Star

game with me rocking my all start now. So the year going into my fourth year, they offered me six years for sixty six great money, more money if I've ever seen but power forwards. At the time, I always started all that, it was get like eighty. I'm like, okay, it was like eighty four something like. I'm like, I'm thinking I'm at least around eighty. So I turned it down. So I go into my fourth year. I make the All Star team. So now the price go up. I need to see them. I need to see that, not

the price go up. So we lose the Detroit Detroit going to win and oh four, free agency start in two I'm still waiting on the phone called from the nets to offer me a contract. Yeah no, So I called J Kid like yo, man, Like I waited free agent to start. Everybody else making moves all that. I'm like, I ain't got no we call it. Ain't nobody picking up. I'm like, I called J Kid, like yo, man, I ain't ain't heard nothing, like you know what's going on.

You're like, okay, I love you, but go get your money. M hm, that's not but I was expecting to here. But okay, So Denver, I was a few teams. I went to visit Atlanta Denver. I was on my way to Utah. They I was just going to you. I didn't think I was going to Utah. They had just signed Carlos Booze and they gave him the sixty six that I had turned down from them, so that's what they paid him. It was between Atlanta and Denver, and Denver had the highest, probably had the biggest number. So

I listened. So when I it was like, you can do a sign and trade and get something back for him, or you can lose him for nothing. I go to Denver man, Oh yeah it was yeah, it was nice. Oh yeah, it was. It was it you link up a young mellow, second year, mellow broker, playman like just so the year before I go, you know, you know, our guard him alone, so you know, of course I do what I do here rookie. So I'm I'm making it no who absolutely so now we So that's a

saw him. He knew I was afraid. He saw him an all start. He was like, what you're gonna do next year out so he kind of put the book. I just after the season and it happened. So I go out there that just made the playoffs and here rookie and make the playoffs. Come going to another playoff team in the West No, it was it was dope man saying the board development. He was still a kid, I'm saying, saying the development he was very very talented

man score right. Yeah, So like I I told somebody this and somebody that was like, wow, I never thought about that. I could have came to Denver when my chest poked out and demand at the ball, and like it didn't happen because they who I am as a basketball player, Like if I could have probably stunted some of Melow's growth if I wanted to, if I was selfish basketball player, I could have came in demanded the

ball from day one. I need this many touches, I need this no matter what's going on, I don't give I could have easily did that what I'm saying, but I let him be him, Like I didn't need the

ball for me to be me. I'm saying that ain't never who I was, Like I don't need to score a right that I'm gonna score it throughout the course of just how I played the game, saying so now I'm just saying the way he could split that ball in that basket, man effortlessly was and his work ethic man like he's like Jim Rack like always no matter what it was, and he always working on their craft. Man. So shout out to younger two thou nine gets to be too seed with mellow j Chauncey. I was that

playing with them boys, linking up with them nine. That was dope, man, that was coming. Like of course I'm saying that was right after we had Chuck. What I'm saying, of course, I hate to see Chuck go. You know how we feel about Chuck. What I'm saying. So, but we trail with some Chauncey come in and Chauncey was like a side relief, securative blanket because of who we had as a handicap as a coach. I'm saying, like, so Chauncey like didn't let him suck it up, basically

like I got this, So Chauncey new time score. Who need to do? What a right? He got everybody involved. First, of course, no go get his touches throughout the game. But that thing moving because big shot I gotta get his. But he making sure everybody else is getting there throughout the first three quarters. Of course he's gonna run something mellow and all that. But and then in the fourth

quarters like fifteen you take us home. So that was dope for him to be that And I'm saying to be that vocal in too and to run the show. And that's what was the difference, man, Like having him there and we were talented, like there was no doubt in our mind many going to Denver. Yeah, because you have to play these altitude Hey, we would beat the ship out of y'all with the finals. When y'all played

the Lakers, we knew we were gonna dog y'all. Hut Man, listen, bro but throw the ball away because we hand out of bounds plays when a zipper mellow up, they take it away. We throw the ball away twice against the Lakers, and the rest is here, so we lose. They I was at the next year when we lost the Boston in the Eastern That was when they still that team. The Orlando team came next year, so you weren't knowing

that next year. Had me to put you in harms away my bad by the party, hard, talk about hard, fallet each other come times would have been good. No, yeah, man, we was good and Denver Man, that squad was young, and we like Chauncey, made us yeah, what I'm saying what we needed to be And people think I'm crazy, but what No, But but people don't know. But for the statement I'm about to make, for the statement I'm

about to make. If they just trade Mellow to New York, right, and don't we take a couple of pieces back, But don't whatever we do and we keep Chauncey in Denver with him being away and what we had, I think we still could have did something. What I'm saying, like when they traded chances with Meller and I was pissed, I was hot, I checked out to check out. Man, whatever, Man, I ain't trying to win, Like, no disrespect the Raymond Felt and Gallinari and Wilson, Chad, y'all cool, But I

need big shot. What I'm saying, like, yeah, I would live it, you know what I mean. I'm not working out. What time do you need me? What're tying the bus? All right? What're tying the game? All right? I'll be there, I'll be there. I wouldn't. Man, know, I ain't trying to win, man, I'm so losing. Fifteen years, two finals appearances in All Star? When did you know it was time? The phone start bringing I want to be walking. I got cut signing ten days like walking just ain't for

the brothers I had. I would have stayed to play basketball. I would I went to China for three months to play basketball during the lockout, Like I don't want to who I'm saying, I would have stayed out there. I want to play on a hoop dog through and through I'm saying. And I offered to play on the Sun in the Summer League. We're in the summ League now,

were talking about something fifteen years in. I offered to play on the summer League, all to show people I can still play bro Yeah, I still wanted and the person who I asked told me couldn't do it and was in position to do it. All they had to do was say, okay, but I don't want to go calling nobody out. And I'm not gonna lie be scared. If I seen you or somemer, they just as a fan with you would have been doing some young kids. They might have took you to jail. I might be

punking him. I can't imagine what you would be doing. Like I just trying to hoop, like it wasn't about nothing else at that point what I'm saying, Yeah, but just the way you go by doing, just play a certain way. Man. I just ain't never had to play a different way. I'm saying, that's all we know. Yeah, I ain't never had to play any other way than the way I came up doing. And it worked, and it worked well to the point where dude, I come

from that. I remember we be in the room chill, and I'm like, I'm just thinking still with number one, crazy right, unbelievable right before the draft. Still, yeah, like I said, man, I looked hard work right in the face. Man. And when dude, I told somebody this, you knew of whatever you knew to put your name in the draft right in NT If somebody would have whispered in my ear but your name in the draft, I would have did it if they weren't doing it at that time though, really,

but it wasn't. I had no inclination though on that that was a possibility. I'm saying. Then I said, you do it. I'm like, I could have, but Lord knows where I would have ended up. I'm saying, because like I do, I couldn't. No skill set, no no crazy athlete, super all it was going to the black Top. You plus, who are you going with? Big fella shot? Yeah? Of course Shack was the motherfuckingmus man, you know. Black. His

mama name me Wardle, So I'm gonna call him war there. Yeah, Wardle, I'm gonna let me Wardal Okay, chef war the absolutely huh Mike saying, I put I play yea else? Who um this nigger team? Oh yeah, dog, one of somebody you'll get shot on the black Top. That's cheating, bro. You're gonna get Jodan shock and stuff on the black Top. And you want me to take something to take somebody somebody off. I'm just saying one somebody gonna get that. Somebody won't get whip because all let niggers can't fight,

I know, but you can't beat up everybody down. You gonna try Roscoe who your you hear what he just said? Just all the smoke, all of it. Uh uh. I'm a big fan of Clay Thompson. Man. Yeah, bring Clay with you. So just a couple of light skin guys man. Yeah, it's hard out of her for subtimes. We got still together. A couple of few light skin guys man and guys and two and two certified animals. I'm talking about. We

gotta gotta have some contrasts in that time. You know what I'm saying, nice swirld like like, we gotta like we gotta have some contrasts in that thing. Extra lighting. Yeah, but let's call him black Mike for a reason. Give me war there All Day Off ain't tough album you can listen to with no skips. Scar Face the Diary, Oh yeah, he knows what it is in here? What is that scar face? Oh yeah, diary? Come on, please, no skills? Uh. Give me some advice that you would

tell your younger self. I mean, like, let me, I got to change the question for him. Give me some advice from someone else that you would tell your younger self, because I wouldn't want you to tell your younger self all your older self nothing. Somebody else. Have to give your younger self advice. What would it be? Not from you? Not from you know? That's crazy on crazy. Probably listen more, listen more, you know what? Not out of ten people that said that, we asked questions say the same question

said yesterday, kids, probably listen more. I'm yeah, Stacks said it too. Yeah, probably listen more. A man I think we all would probably would say that though five dinner guests that are alive, U plus five people at your dinner table. Jack Johnson, m Hugh, A. P. Newton, Jerry Seinfeld, nice contrast, Dave Chappelle and Marl Luther King. Man, that's gonna go sick. Then slit it down. What guests would

you like to see on All the Smokes? And before you ask me, you have to help us get your asking on the show Bill Burr, Bill Burr, he's a contrastor Yeah, you like it. You got some gift. I'm gonna keep you swinging with Mom Smoke merch Ain't can they get it? Matt um Man all the h that's got to figure out which one of is excuse me, that's the limited edition. It says, is that Legends Legends dot com word, Yeah, that's all the store with that store.

Kmart Man, we appreciate you today, We're gonna we're gonna turn a couple of years stories. I'm just telling you now in the animations, Man, that's a rat with Kmart All the Smoke, Summer League Takeover, you can catch yourself Showtime Basketball YouTube and the I Heart platform Black Effects See you all next week. This is All a Smoke, a production of The Black Effect and Our Heart Radio in partnership with Showtime