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Whether we're dishing on the latest celebrity breakups, discussing our favorite guilty pleasure movies, or sharing embarrassing stories from our own lives, we promise to keep it real, keep it fun, and keep you coming back for more. I'm Judge Wethass. I just wouldn't give myself a break. At all, I really struggled to take time off, but that was definitely like connecting ADHD burnout to self-worth.
I'm not worthy of taking time off, and I think we always feel like we're on the back foot as an ADHD or anyways. These kind of tendencies can really create burnout. So many of us work really, really hard because we don't think we're good enough. We're trying to prove someone that we are. We overwork ourselves, probably more so than the neurotypical person because we've got something to prove.
Yeah. Because I was about to have journey with ADHD, how some very risky behaviour can manufacture a dopamine rush, while setting boundaries is vital to becoming a successful entrepreneur, and why people with ADHD make the best entrepreneurs. So I'm supposed to full stop on the text message, and you just think they hate you. Yeah, I'm like, oh my god, this is awful. Or the dreaded okay. Oh my god. Or just the okay. The okay, don't care. Yeah. I'm one kiss. Never see them again.
Like why one kiss, just send two, like an old woman being on another door late. Oh, and we find out why an oat biscuit is Amy's ADHD item. Do you have a structure that you've created which you think will improve the productivity of our ADHD listeners? Yeah, definitely 100%.
So there is something that I picked up from a book that I read and I can't remember the author now called The Rocks and the Pebbles analogy, and I found this really, really practical in my days because you often find that you've got, especially if you're an entrepreneur, you've got big projects that you like to work on or you aspire to have in your business.
And then you obviously have the pebbles which are the daily tasks that drive the business forwards, and I often find that you can either get caught on one or the other.
So if you create like a structure where the rock is like the main focus of the day, and then the pebbles are around that structure, then that tends to make sure that you're sort of holding yourself accountable to get these projects that, because you know what we're like, we're like serial starters of things, I want to start a podcast, I want to do this. But then actually making sure you put it into motion, I feel like you have to make sure that it's in your diary and scheduled for that.
Where does wellness come into this plan for productivity? The wellness comes into it from a term that a lot of people may find, it's a bit woo-woo called regulating your nervous system. The reason why I say that is because I used to have a therapist that used to say to me all the time, Amy, self-care is such a big thing with ADHD. I don't know, when somebody says something like that, I don't know whether it's my brain, I need quite a literal example of that.
So I used to think, if I'm going to be a successful businesswoman, I don't need self-care kind of thing. But the wellness side of it sort of emulates that where the more calm and relaxed you are and the more that you look after yourself, you're able to actually facilitate doing more in your day. If you were to describe how you look after yourself and how you maintain your wellness, what's an example of something you do? It's the classic ADHD thing.
I have a morning routine that I do and if something happens in that morning routine and I can't do that morning routine, I'll have a meltdown, I'm feeling I can't deal. But definitely for me, I've really started to focus on my journaling, waking up in the morning straight away before my brain even comes to fruition instead of grabbing for my phone and going on Instagram, writing in my journal. It's such good advice.
I saw an analogy where someone said, talking about why you shouldn't look at your phone first thing in the morning, you wouldn't let a thousand people into your bedroom first thing in the morning. So why are you letting a thousand people into your mind by looking at your phone straight away? That's such a great, see, this is why I like neurodifferentials because that analogy just sat really well with me. I definitely agree.
I think that it's hard, it does take a lot of willpower because for me, I definitely find that when I go to Chase, we don't mean I don't like the feature on Instagram that pops up with all the likes. That for me is very, it gives me sort of gambling vibes. Yeah, yeah, great advice. It just keeps that comparison as well at bay.
I don't think it's healthy to look at your phone immediately and to see other people, your competition, see what they're doing because instantly you're going to ignite that part of your brain that compares. You're going to use up so much energy on negative feelings and envy comparison when actually that could be directed at your purpose.
Comparison, especially as an entrepreneur, has to be something you have to control because you can easily go on Instagram and I think I feel like especially with that platform, it's a very, you can see people's lives with the stories and a lot of that. So it does kind of develop this toxic comparison. Whether you do have to be very careful what you consume. Why do you think ADHD entrepreneurs suffer from burnout? I'll give you an example of where I was last year.
So pretty much like all of my life, I have kind of been in a mentality that to be successful I need to struggle. Obviously, if you do have, you know, hyperactive tendencies with ADHD as well, you know, a lot of people can be quite highly strong, very erratic. So you can easily channel that sort of way of being into your business. And I think with hyperfocus as well, you can really get invested in that and push past that point.
And then that's when the burnout gets created because yeah, like I was to look at myself last year. I just wouldn't give myself a break at all. I really struggled to take time off. And that was definitely like connecting ADHD burnout to self-worth. I'm not worthy of taking time off. And I think then that loops into the whole. We always feel like we're on the back foot as an ADHD or anyways. We're always overcompensating from that.
And then I think these kind of tendencies, you know, can really create burnout. So many of us work really, really hard because we don't think we're good enough. We're trying to prove someone that we are. So we overwork ourselves, probably more so than a neurotypical person because we feel like we've got something to prove. Yeah. Are there any other tips you have that might help someone with ADHD overcome burnout? Yeah, definitely. So I think boundary setting is a huge one.
Not the easiest thing to do. I'm not great at it now. But just put, and this is something, I think all of these things, you know, they're not things that come naturally as humans. We don't like putting boundaries in place. Especially if you have people pleasing tendencies. So I think that you do have to kind of put yourself in discomfort to reap the rewards from boundaries. So I think that's a really good one.
If you are in a service-based industry with clients, then definitely try to, you know, stretch the time that you respond or, you know, giving yourself a bit of a window there where you're like, I'm not responding outside of these hours, sleep as well. So I used to sort of look at, you know, because this, you can get into this like, hustle culture, toxic mentality. I'll sleep when I'm dead kind of vibe.
And it's like absolutely not like sleep is something that you need to enhance your performance. So I think that that's something that has enabled me to avoid burnout. And I know that when I don't have good sleep, I feel way more dysregulated. And then I think the last one for me is definitely, it's going to sound quite woo-woo again, but doing things that like connect to my inner child. So, you know, doing things that give me like joy and fulfillment, that I can literally just be a kid.
And I don't have to think about being a responsible adult. And I think that gives me fulfillment. And then that helps me to not feel like I'm just constantly on this like hamster wheel. Hmm. That I think that sounds woo-woo at all. I mean, I've had a lot of people with ADHD and just generally, we are very childlike sometimes in a lot of areas.
And actually it's that masking and not admitting that and just trying to put ourselves in situations and use methods of strategy to organize ourselves that we think adults should be doing. That's where we fall down. Exactly. Because we don't embrace that in a child and do things that actually that in a child is screaming out for. Consistency. Do you think ADHD people struggle with that? Oh my god. Yes. 100%. Yes. I think consistency is really hard for somebody with ADHD.
I think a lot of people struggle with consistency though in society. I find that some people will start projects and not finish them because they'll have lack of confidence to get them over that hurdle. So I think consistency ties into self-esteem as well. Are there any tips you have on how people could improve their consistency? Taking the pressure off of yourself, it's like with a fitness routine for instance.
So many people start, they go to the gym, they start doing a gym program after a couple of weeks, they drop off. But that's because the expectation that they've got is that it's going to give them this big, I don't know what we think. We go into the gym, we think it's going to change our lives, right? But you don't get the best results from just going once and then it giving you that big boost and that's that.
So I think that to anybody that is listening and they have ADHD, if you can create consistency through low dopamine rituals and tasks, then you will start to get fulfillment in other areas. You'll start to find the enjoyment in it and then that will create the consistency moving forwards.
And I also think that it goes back to the rocks and pebbles analogy, making sure that you've got it in your weekly routine, your daily routine, so that you don't, because I think sometimes we forget and that's a big issue for us with our brains. So it needs to be actioned in order to create that consistency and you can build it up over time. It doesn't have to be a full thing to start with.
You know, it just starts small and then, you know, over the weeks and months, that's when it gets more consistent and you find the enjoyment in building on that. That's great. And that probably explains why my many attempts at being consistent in a gym membership haven't worked. Maybe we need to go with a different analogy. Where do you think people with ADHD are going wrong in their quest to be more consistent? I think that they're going into things too hard too soon.
And like we spoke about earlier, you know, with projects and starting things like, oh my God, going all in with this, loving it. And then all of a sudden it just sort of dwindles and you're just like, oh, I can't be asked for this anymore. Doesn't give me the same feeling. You think you've cracked the code for ADHD as to be more consistent? It depends on where we're looking for that consistency. Some areas, yes, some areas, no. I have so many things that I definitely still have barriers around.
I find that I often understand that when I've got a barrier around something that I'm trying to be consistent with, it's because my subconscious is telling me something and telling me not to do it.
So if I can clear that and do the inner work to understand where that's why that blocks in the way, it normally comes down to me having a self-esteem issue that it's going to fail and I'm not going to be good enough to this like 10 other ways, just have 10 things that are telling me not to be consistent. Or I'm over complicating the process or I don't understand step by step what needs to happen each time for me to be consistent.
Do you think there's a relationship between consistency and perfectionism? And do you think perfectionism is getting in the way of ADHD is reaching their goals? So much. It comes down to them perfectionism linking with procrastination. You know, it's that chicken and egg situation. It can be as perfect as you want, but if you're not actioning it, there's a lot of then what's the point?
You could have so much software, you could have all of the bells and whistles, but if you can't actually put one step in front of the other, then you're never going to get so far. I'll just reflect and I wonder if it's anything to do with our low self-esteem seems to be very common with ADHD is that linked to the many negative messages we've had throughout our lives, negative messages, corrective messages, us not feeling good enough.
So therefore we feel that everything we do has to be as extreme counter to that and therefore has to be perfect. But anything less than perfect is only going to be reinforcing those messages and their narrative that we've built into ourselves.
It goes back to that same thing of your upbringing has a big impact on that and you know, there's a lot of trauma created with, you know, certain things that are told in school, certain things that are all growing up and you know, like we said, your self-esteem gets knocked and that
carries with you to adulthood then and I think especially for a lot of ADHD females and I think you've done a few posts on this Alex before about, you know, being told that you're gifted as a child and as a female ADHD female, you know, and there's a lot of pressure put on somebody and then especially somebody that masks because then they feel like they have to keep this appearance up for the whole time and then I think like you said, anything less than that is not deemed as worthy.
And then when you start to understand that it's actually not deemed as worthy to nobody else but you and you like nobody else really cares as much as you do about it and I think that really helped me to take that pressure off a little bit too. What's your relationship like with masking? Oh, I masked my whole life. What's the difference between behind the scenes Aimee when you're in a safe environment home with your partner and public-facing Aimee?
I think growing up I was always a very bubbly person and I still am like that now and I enjoy being like that but I think then, you know, people copped onto that and then it was sort of, oh Aimee's the overachiever Aimee's this Aimee's that and then that sort of built
in this image and conquest for me to create this person and then that led me to sort of, you know, move to London, try and do pursue a performance career in the West End, do lots of different things and it was still sort of the version of me that was almost just
being a very hyperactive person and to the point where I remember I moved into a house with a few girls when I first moved to London, it's been about like nine years ago now and they used to say to me all the time, oh my gosh, you're like just so much and you were with Interruptus and all of these kind of things. I didn't realise at the time that that was because of my ADHD.
So I'd say yeah, that's what sort of masking Aimee looks like and then Aimee behind closed doors, it's actually really calm, really chill. I'm actually more of an introvert than I realised. I like my own company, I get very tired very easily when I over-socialise with people. I got to a point last year where I was in a bit of a scary place with burnout to the point where we moved out of London.
I think that I definitely took the extreme measures of doing what I could to create a life on myself that enabled me to be more authentically me. So yeah, and I still enjoy being bubbly and still enjoying outgoing, but on my terms now. That journey that you've been on with awareness and what has that taught you about mistakes that you might have made or misunderstandings that there might have been in previous romantic relationships?
That rejection sensitivity is something that I now understand wasn't, I used to blame myself a lot and in my relationships, especially when I went through breakups growing up, I'd be an absolute mess to the point where, and I know we all go through heartbreak when we're younger, but I remember my parents actually saying to me, which is another story, but sort of turning around and saying, you know, Aimee, what's wrong with you? This isn't normal and I just couldn't regulate my emotions.
So I think, you know, romantically in relationships, it taught me that also the people that I had romantic relationships with weren't bringing out the authentic side of me and making me feel safe, but then there was also the other side of it where I was, you know, carrying a lot of trauma and there was a lot of things in the relationships that enabled me to, yeah, act very impulsively. You mentioned RSD, rejection sensitivity dysphoria. It manifests, it appears very differently in everyone.
How would you describe it if someone asks you to explain the feeling? It can literally feel like somebody is stabbing you in the chest and you, it goes back to that in a child, you're in a child's like, oh my god, like this is horrible, like why is this person being mean to me? But they're projecting something that they haven't addressed themselves, but you just take that so personally that it can literally crush you and that's how I can describe it.
And then in other scenarios as well, I definitely find that I get, it depends on where I'm at, especially if I'm feeling more burnt out. My RSD will come through quite strong and with hormones as well, where I feel like people hate me and I start to take, I take what people say quite wrongly and my partner is very good at supporting me with this because I have a very, I sometimes take text messages the wrong way. So I'm supposed to full stop on the text message, and you just think they hate you.
Yeah, I'm like, oh my god, this is awful. Or the dreaded okay. Oh my god. Or just the okay, don't care, no, I'm one kiss. Never see them again. I'm like, yeah, like why one kiss? Just send two, like an all-even being or none at all. And this newfound knowledge of ADHD that's led to a successful relationship now?
Yeah, I feel like our relationship is good because we, he's very patient with me and there's been so many times where I've worried about judgements and there's never been anything that's off the cards. I've just been allowed to be authentically myself and he supports, he's a very aware person as well because he's also in the self-development space and I think that helps because he wanted to research how to sort of support me with ADHD.
If you're going into a new relationship, what do you think the other person, the non-ADHD partner, what do you think is the most important thing for that person to understand about ADHD? I would say that you need to understand that they need a lot of reassurance. They will often do things as a reflection of, you know, impulsivity and just how they've been treated their whole entire lives. They will often try and self-sabotage relationships.
I think if the other person can kind of understand not to take it personally, like the amount of times Jack goes to me, Amy, it's not you, it's your ADHD and that really helps me to kind of not shame myself.
Have as much patience as you can but also make sure that you protect yourself as well, like my partner sees a therapist, you know, he makes sure that he is supported and he has his support network as well because you are dealing with somebody that can be very unpredictable, that can be very up and down with their emotions and that can take its toll on the person in the relationship as well. Love language is an interesting topic in relationships. Do you associate with a love language?
Definitely and I think it's often quite challenging when you're in a relationship and you have a different love language to your partner because your partner's not necessarily going to see the value in doing the thing that gives you the most validation. That makes sense. Yeah, totally. So for me, having verses in cards is something that I'm very big on. Versus in cards. Yeah, so you know like a birthday card or a Valentine's card or something.
Don't know why, don't ask me why but I love a soppy verse in a card and if somebody can write me a poem and those kind of things and my partner is such a great person when I come across an act of service which is another love language of mine because I think you can have a few. His version of saying I love you is very different to my version and that can sometimes upset me but I've learnt that just because his version is different that's not necessarily wrong. What does his version look like?
So we're actually still exploring that which is really interesting because I feel like as some males, I've asked him in so many occasions I'm like you need to let me know what your needs are and this is something we're still pondering over because he's such a, he's an easily pleased guy. He's very, he's just very humble. You know, grew up on a farm in Devon, really chilled.
So for him to actually have to be like these are my needs then you know, it's quite challenging but I think for him he really values quality time. That was something I struggled with last year and it goes back to the whole you know, burn out and overworking. I really struggled to be in the present and my brain was always on work and I was so scared to let go of that. So I've had to learn for the sake of you know myself and my relationship that quality time together is really important to him.
I think it's so important to have a healthy content relationship especially if you're an entrepreneur. Because if there's an issue with your personal love life and I imagine that's going to significantly affect your ability to focus on your business. Another area I think is really important as well as your romantic life is probably your nutrition and your diet. Supplements, do you take ADHD supplements?
So yeah, I take ADHD supplements, don't take medication but yeah, I take Lines main Rachie mushroom, there's a supplement actually hopefully these guys may listen to this at some point called Gettopper which is like a new tropics supplement, Matt the guy that runs a company he's great. So I take those three and then I also take Vitamin D, Omega 3 so quite a wide range of supplements and magnesium too. Any foods that make your ADHD traits worse?
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It was again, my partner Jack has really brought out a lot of these sort of things. And he was like, I said Tim, I was like, I always need an afternoon nap. He was like, hey me, obviously it is normal for us to sort of need those fresh my periods. But he was like, it's not really, you know, we shouldn't really have an afternoon nap. It's like need them. And it was all to do with my nutrition. And just, you know, there is a link and this is beyond my scientific knowledge.
But a good friend of mine Sarah, she's a great nutritionist and she will tell you about the link between ADHD and intolerances and finding out about that and just clearing the gluten from my diet. It actually gave me less brain fog. And it gave me a clearer sort of head space to be able to focus. And I genuinely feel like if you can eliminate brain fog out of the mix when you've got ADHD, it's such a game changer. So that really helped. And then caffeine as well, I don't drink energy drinks.
I have one or two maximum caffeinated drinks a day before one o'clock. The only foods that you found help your ADHD. I'm very simple when it comes to nutrition, high protein diet, you know, getting good fats, good proteins in your diet, it's going to help with your omega-3 intake, going to stimulate your cognitive function, protein intake. We know that that's something that should be a priority in our diet as well. And also carbs that are not too heavy that cause a bit of a crash.
So I tend to be rice and those kind of carbs instead. I always found when I ate carbs, my brain fog just went through the roof. Really? I don't eat carbs now before dinner. Because I'm sat at my computer trying to focus on something. It's good. But then if I have like a heavy pasta lunch, then my ability to think just disappears. And I always wondered why that was.
And I've heard lots of people now say that carbs, I think someone told me because your energy goes from your brain to your stomach to digest, because carbs are a heavy and quite digestive intensive. So your body is literally diverting energy away from your cognitive system to your digestive system. It does sort of play a part when you've got something in your stomach that's creating a sluggish feeling that is going to connect with your brain and you are just going to feel like wanting to nap.
So I think foods that are easily digestible can really help. That leads us nicely on to the ADHD item. I ask every single guest to tell me an item that most represents ADHD in their life. You've said, a past is to nans, oat, biscuit, brakes. Nans if you're watching this. You've got great biscuits. You want a sponsor of the show? Yes. That would be great. Yes. So the one thing I do always say to any of my clients that have ADHD is snacks. Or shouldn't be shamed. Snacks are great.
Obviously, you know, varied snacks. We don't want to be in mini-ex every day even though they're great. I know. Damn it. What's it about egg covered chocolate? We're chocolate covered eggs anyways. So yeah, the oat biscuits, I absolutely love these and this is definitely when Alex asked me about an item that I can't live without.
This was probably it because there's four biscuits in a packet and I feel like if I'm on the go throughout the day, as long as I have a pack of these in my bag, I'm good to go. It's like an emergency snack. The danger is because the items always go on to the shows behind us. So we might need to replace these every week now. It's nothing I'm going to eat them. Yeah, and I see you guys eat them when we can just pop the box there or it's just an excuse to have them every week.
I put that on the table if you like to do it the way. That's fascinating. Yeah, and I tend to because something I do every morning, it's like a ritual is I go for a morning coffee walk with my other half before the day starts and I obviously know the health risks sometimes about having all the time about drinking coffee on an empty stomach. So they go in my pocket first thing in the morning. Fantastic. I'm going to do that. Do it. Do it. Washing machine of ways.
Okay. Every week I asked my Instagram community to give me their biggest ADHD was put them in a washing machine. Do you forget you're washing in the washing machine? Yes. I'm sort of banned from, I'm not banned, but the trust is not there because I put in like browns with blacks and something else the other day in my partner was like what what was going on? I've done that so many times. I hear my girlfriend shout Alex my t-shirt is no longer white. Yeah. I got a coffee trusted with white snow.
PTSD you say actually is quite a hostile conversation. What style? That makes so much sense. Right. So this week in the washing machine someone said RSD rejection sensitivity dysphoria stops me from going for opportunities. It stops me asking for a promotion, setting boundaries with my partner and generally just holds me back in so many areas any advice to overcome this please.
That's something that of course is not uncommon so I think whoever has written that I just want to let you know if you're listening to this that you're not alone in that and I think it's really important to understand that there's no shame in how you feel about this but there are definitely things that you can do to help get yourself over that hurdle because I think what it sounds like to me is that the fear of the RSD is stopping you from doing it not the actual RSD.
We often have bad experiences especially with the rejection sensitivity that is a thousand reasons why we shouldn't do something just in case that same feeling comes up.
So I think really working on clearing those limiting beliefs and just journaling about what's coming up for you and what the real fear is to you having these hurdles and then that can often help to sort of rewrite the story and I think if you can get yourself from a place of oh my gosh this is going to happen to what if it actually won't happen then that can help with those kind of things as well. Super useful, really useful.
Do you think there's also a connection between the RSD and the perfectionism and the reason why many of us are such perfectionists is because we's really deeply fear any feedback or criticism that might come about if what we do isn't perfect?
Definitely and I think I still struggle with the feedback and the criticism and I think even if and again I think it's to do with tonality too because I can take criticism if it's fed back in a certain way but if somebody is quite direct with their tone like my partner
can be quite direct and we've had to work on that because I've been in tears not because he's meant to offend me but just because he said it as it is so I think that comes into it as well and then also you're right I think you know we're so precious about the work
that we do because for us we need a lot of praise in order to succeed and we were very driven towards that so I think that that can make us feel it's almost like somebody is shattering your dreams it's so it's so extreme how our brains work. Definitely I think it can feel like a thing you said earlier punch in the stomach. Oh my god yeah. It's silly or small like a friend saying they're too busy to see you feels like your world's ending.
Yeah yeah yeah and I had to yeah that the friend thing I think it doesn't affect me as much as it used to but definitely the place that I've had to really work on my RSD is in business. Have you got any advice for an entrepreneur who's starting a business because rejection people saying no is a huge part of business and there's not really any getting around that. Do you have any tips for an entrepreneur for when they do encounter that in business?
So I think you know there are techniques that you can do like practical techniques so grounding techniques are really good for that so you know if you do work from home and you're an entrepreneur and you receive RSD then maybe just diverting your attention to something that makes you feel safe and grounded or going to a location in your house that makes you feel safe and grounded.
Breathwork can really help if you're feeling so triggered in the moment that you're literally like oh my god you know often just taking a moment and just taking some breaths deep breaths box breathing it's a really good technique for that.
If you can just take a moment to sort of rationalize your thoughts because I can guarantee that when you come back down off the ceiling it's not as bad as you thought it was going to be and then in terms of like actually managing RSD from a more holistic standpoint I would
definitely say that changing like for me changing how I've looked at things is really helped so instead of looking at something a rejection is oh my gosh you know it's the end of the world taking the pressure of myself and being like it's not to do with me it's them it's
not to do with me there's going to be a better opportunity coming this is just an opportunity for me and looking at it as more of a blessing but it's like layers upon layers because first for you have to be in a position where you're calm and collected to handle the triggers.
Putting space between the trigger and your reaction as well because like you said you always most of the time you do calm down and when you're able to look back at it in a more regulated state you can really see that they didn't mean the harm that you thought that they did and if you did say something when you were in that in that disregulated state you probably would have said something that you would have regretted later and caused yourself a lot of anxiety reliving it.
Oh I've had so this happened to me a couple of weeks ago I received a text message and it was interesting because it sort of caught me off guard wasn't something I was expecting I just automatically I tried to control my emotion I archived the message and I put it like
put my phone to the other side of the room and I was like right respond to that when you're in more of a calm and clear headspace to do so and like you said you know old me would have just gone back with fire straight away but I also think on that note too that
it's important to manage like process your emotions too because I never want to say to somebody oh let's go toxic positivity everything is an opportunity because sometimes we do just get angry and upset because that is a valid emotion it's just for us it's inflated 10,000 so the other day I really felt submit RSD come up so I went and punched my pillow I went into my bedroom and I was like pounding the shit on my pillow and then I came back and hit it actually help.
What was the trigger if you'd ever been asking? So I've had to really work through this I have so many amazing clients and I love love all of them to pieces but it's taken a while for that to get to that point and as we know in business there will be encounters with people that we don't gel with and people that
we do gel with but I think when you're a business that's kind of your face on the brand until you have a team of people like I don't have a team of people around me at the moment I don't have a HR department I am my own HR department so with that comes having to deal with
conflict sometimes you know getting people that owe you payments to you know pay you and you know there are sometimes people that come into a service based industry like anything you know it could be a restaurant could be a coaching business like myself but there
will be customers that aren't necessarily pleasant and it's quite tough sometimes to not take that personally especially when you know that you pull your heart and soul into your business and you are connected to that so I've had to work on kind of taking it
like the personal out of it but it still catches you sometimes and you're like oh especially because when you work with neurodivergent people I have had experiences in the past where there has been like we spoke about earlier with things going all in very quickly and then
that feeds my impulsivity as well and I'm like oh my god amazing this person is going to be really great and then when it turns out to be the different to that I can get quite scorned by that and I almost feel like it's a personal attack so that was a similar scenario to what had happened the other day I had to kind of manage that. Do you have any advice for a business person who has ADHD who really has to stand their ground when someone is stepping all over them?
Yeah definitely so number one just remember it's okay to be like that you're not going to upset anybody often we think the opposite effect we think that if we have authority then people are going to hate us and just remember that if you have to ask for money that
somebody owes you I think it's such a British thing in society where it's very hush around money very hush around things like this you know you are genuinely doing a service and somebody owes you for the work that you have done you are well within your right to ask
that and I think you can you don't have to be an asshole to put a boundary in place in a certain authority and I think especially for neurodivergent females in business as well I struggle with this and I have to like flip it on and off sometimes because I was so
in my like masculine energy last year in my business and I was very influenced by a lot of coaches in the space that were very like hustle yeah we're all like very aggressive and then I realized I actually like being a little bit more feminine in my business and
I think that's such an amazing thing to be able to do but then I need to understand that it's okay to be authoritative as well and ask for my worth you can just be direct and still polite remember that if you're asking something that somebody owes you that's
also valid and just really work on the self esteem to just realize you know what you worth yeah totally agree you don't need to be nasty and actually it's good for your self confidence as well because you you can show yourself that you can set a boundary and
actually the person isn't going to be they're going to respect you more and you're going to pick up on that which again it's going to feed into your self confidence what do you think makes ADHD is great entrepreneurs definitely our diversity we're so creative
it's absolutely amazing and I think you know we're able to have our fingers in many buyers at once and we're able to spin a lot of plates at once as well we're caring we're compassionate we are outside the box thinkers we are able to create things and
create innovation that people potentially wouldn't be able to and I think if you are really passionate entrepreneur and you can get through the boundaries or the barriers that are in the way that you place on yourself then you can actually be quite unstoppable
yeah totally agree I think impulsivity is often looked as a negative but I think it's a positive it's actually a business you have an idea and there's a slight contradiction here with the perfectionism but I think if you sometimes we have an idea and we just we
just do it because we have to do it we have that impulse we start something it's fair enough we might lose interest sometimes but we're starters we do stuff and I think that actually sets us apart from a lot of neurotypicals you might overthink and and be too afraid to
start a business yeah no I agree and I think you're right about the contradiction between the perfectionism and then starting and I think no matter where you are when you're starting something as an entrepreneur with ADHD the perfectionism will haunt you at some point
especially when it's growing and you sort of see where it can go you know there will be certain points so I think if you can like just stamp on the perfectionism and just think you know that will come and especially when you've got more people on board you can hire
people to create perfectionism in your business you know yeah well you got the resources then yeah find the bits you challenge the challenge you and delegate do you think shame is a big emotion within the ADHD community yeah it's really interesting because you know
if you were to not mask and you were to be authentically you I don't know where this fear comes in that we're not going to be accepted in society because people day to day life are so doing like so caught up in their own lives that if you being in the masking version of
you and you being used authentic probably unless you are a little bit eccentric which a lot of ADHD is our and we know when to tone that down but I can't imagine somebody would really reject you unless they are not a nice person so I think that the shame comes into it especially
I find that it happens now when I I struggle with a lot of things in my business especially when it comes to numbers because I also struggle with dyslexia and I find that I get embarrassed and I have shame around that and having to ask for help I think sometimes the hyperindependence
comes in you like I should be able to do this myself I think there's a lot of stuff that actually helps us that we might be embarrassed to admit that it helps us for example I have this whiteboard on my desk that's this huge like color coded magnet thing and it looks
childish but it without that this podcast wouldn't be operational because I need that for visual a visual calendar my guest booking is all sorts of things and I used to hold a great deal of shame associated with someone walking into my office and seeing that but
now I'm very proud about it yeah like all all all the stuff that I'm doing now would not be possible if it wasn't for that that childish thing on my desk and it completely removes the shame I think there's as long as whatever takes you to get from A to B without forgetting
things on the way because I know that's something we struggle with quite a lot I think that's great how do you personally take care of yourself when you're not working previously I had a very toxic relationship with exercise as some people with ADHD do with food and other
things alcohol that was something for me that I had to kind of you know really work my relationship with so I was saying now I enjoy going to the cinema I like doing things that I can fully disconnect I enjoy doing more mindfulness stuff so I really enjoy meditating now and I never used to before
but I found an app that I really like using and I relate to the woman quite a lot yoga having baths watching sex in the city like just things like that really not anything yeah every night every night so you know that's an interesting question next and I contemplate it sometimes myself do you ever wish that you didn't have ADHD yes and no because I I like to look at the positive side of ADHD and I never want to be like oh you you know you wish you didn't have it so it's become such an awareness
around it but of course there are times where I really do wish that my brain worked in a different way and I was able to focus and I didn't get as burnt out as easily because the way that my brain fires up my body can't keep keep up with that sometimes and I get very tired very easily so I have
to manage that within my business so well I like to call myself like an egg because I can not crack at any point you know there has been definitely frustration there and there's been situations throughout my teens and adulthood of things that I've done with ADHD that has caused some things
that I'm not proud of what does that look like what is what is what is what's something that you've done for example that you haven't been proud of we're getting deep oh my gosh um I mean I'm totally transparent and I think this is something that I think a lot of ADHDers should definitely or
neurodivergence I'm saying because obviously I speak on behalf of everyone but I think there's a lot of things that we do that are quite hush hush like for me throughout my my life I used to have like random impulse moments where I would like buy certain items in the shop and then not pay for
others and that would give me like a big dopamine hit to know that I could get caught but then if I did get caught I'd be like mortified so you know I was working with a psychotherapist last year and he's fantastic and he he was the one that was like he meets okay like this is normal behavior
for somebody with ADHD and that just made me feel so validated because I felt like a naughty child the mini shop lifts is very relatable to me so bloody reusable shopping bags I always forget I refuse to pay 10p for the for new ones because I've now I've got a cupboard in my kitchen full of
them yeah so I so I don't pay for it and I get a huge little rush of dopamine because I walk out knowing that I haven't paid for the 10p shopping bag yeah do you forget those reusable shopping bags all the time yeah all the time that's why they're in the boot of our car now just a little bit more
handy I actually heard someone a little hack they said they when they're in the supermarket car park they tell Google maps to send them a notification every time they're in that location to their phone pins when they drive into supermarket car park then it says grab us bag from your
back seat that's intense yeah if only if you remember to take the bags from your kitchen to the car the car that's the bit that I always full-shot on right so if anyone if anyone finds a solution to that then do please send me a message yeah I can't say I've got any advice on that I want more bags
via in the newspaper for shoplifting more bags who's misunderstood your ADHD in the past I would say that the memory that springs to mind for me is a childhood memory when I went to the dentist with my mum and she was the one having the treatment done and I remember being sat in the chair
and the dental nurse clearly did not like children she was very cold and I remember I was sort of swinging my legs and banging my leg on the side of the the table and she told me off on a number of occasions and got quite assertive with me and looking back in hindsight that was clearly because
I couldn't keep still and she didn't understand she thought I was just being like not very well behaved so I'd say that that's definitely a memory that stuck out for me and just through my education as well you know throughout I was put in private education because they thought it was going to help me academically and I didn't learn in the way that was deemed as you know acceptable. Do you have any really early memories of feeling different?
Yeah so I went through quite a lot of separation anxiety when I was a kid and if I couldn't see my parents anywhere or they were late picking me up I would think the inevitable had happened and I think that that would result in me having meltdowns like
hysterically screaming meltdowns in the school yard whereas you know I couldn't rationalise or maybe they're just late and you know looking back if that was clearly not being able to regulate my emotions so yeah that was definitely something now looking back I'm like okay that makes a lot of sense. Bit of a closing tradition on the podcast or I will ask all my guests what their most impulsive thing they've ever done is what's your most impulsive thing? What about a puppy? When did you
buy a puppy? Like two years ago. How much of a gap was there between the idea and buying the puppy? I went home to visit my parents and me and my partner just got together. We were literally like four months into our relationship. I went home to Wales to visit my parents for my mum's birthday and I came back with a dog and my Jack was like what the hell? He was this woman she just bought a dog back to London, didn't have a garden, I was still peating at the time
so I couldn't look after it but I bought back a puppy to London. Very similar very similar I bought a puppy about well my sister put the idea into my head to attach him a by dog and then that evening I was on gum tree looking at breeders and on the next day I was in the breeders house and I chose one and had to wait two weeks which I was furious about I had to wait two weeks to like a pick it up and have its vaccinations. Oh really? Yes they're very very very very relatable. Because you've got
a Frenchie haven't you? French Bulldog yeah that's what I bought. You got a French Bulldog too. I bought a French Bulldog puppy yeah he's with my parents now. Right. So I kind of was like guys please and now he's got a sister so they bought another one. What's his name? His name is Max. Max, Munt Mile. Oh cute. Mile and Max, straight from walk. Yeah dog walk. Yeah so unfortunately Max is not with me right now. Do you have any closing advice for people with ADHD entrepreneurs wanting
to start a business? Any closing advice you would like to give them? I would definitely say that you know number one if you're listening to this podcast and you do have ADHD and you're thought about starting a business that is for a reason so don't let that thought go. I would explore that idea. I would say that if you can go into it you know building up a very strong foundation for your boundaries and your self-care and all of the bits that I wish that I had you
know had a little bit stronger before I went into it. I would say that you know that would be a
really good starting point. I'd also say channel your channel your impulsivity and you know don't let the creative like if people are saying to you don't do something don't take the advice because you know how many crazy entrepreneurial people well amazingly crazy people have you know not taking people's advice and they've got so far with their businesses so I would say they're definitely the things that I would yeah I would advise somebody and it's okay to sort of
reach out to people that are in the space as well to find out how they did things too. Amazing incredibly useful thank you very much thanks. No please thank you so much for having me. ACAS powers the world's best podcast. Here's a show that we recommend. Welcome back to 2 Judgy Girls I'm Mary from the Bay and I'm Courtney from LA. TJG is the podcast where we spill all the tea on your favorite reality TV shows celebrity gossip and everything
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