Terri Cole: Stop Trying to Fix Everyone. Signs You’re a High-Functioning Codependent and How to Break the Cycle

a space for raw, unfiltered conversations that celebrate vulnerability and allow you to tune in to learn, connect and find comfort together. Thank you so much for being here. I am honestly so honored to have you here. I when I first heard about you, I got your book and I honestly read it NonStop like my team, the whole pretty much the whole day I was sat there. You can see my book. I've got notes, I've got a highlighted bits in there, so many questions that came from it.

So thank you for putting out this message because I think it's very much needed. But also I felt a little bit targeted, to be honest, because I felt like you'd written the book.

back and then take a ten thirty pm train. So I'm on the train done with therapy, and I see this kid in my mind now I'm about twenty two, when he's about nineteen, and I'm like, immediately my helper PingER goes off. He's got like a metal T shirt on, He's holding a little blanket. I was like, where the hell is this kid going at ten thirty at night in this desolate station. So we get on and I started talking to him on the train and I'm like, oh,

where are you going? He was like, oh, I was supposed to, you know, I got hired to drive a car back to Indiana and they just canceled it. So I go, where are you going? He's like, I guess I'm just going to sleep in the station. I was like, what station and he said Penn Station. Now this was the late eighties, and I was like, you can't sleep in Penn Station, dude, You're gonna get mogged. Literally, it's so dangerous. And he's like, well, I don't know anyone

in New York. I was like, yeah, you do? You know me? And he was like. I was like, it's settled, you're coming home to my house, Billy. So I was living in a studio apartment nine one hundred and fourth Street between West End Riverside, and I didn't even call

my roommate. I literally just brought this kid to my house and he slept in our studio apartment with me and my female roommate, simply because I felt overly responsible for what would happen to him if I didn't save him. Now, you know, people listening watching, they may be like, oh, that's crazy, But here's the thing. Everyone has their own Billy.

Everyone has their own Billy stories where you somehow felt overly responsible and not just for a stranger, for people in your life, for your friends, for your family members, for you, whoever. It is where you literally feel like it is suddenly your responsibility to make sure that the right thing happens for that person.

in that you talk about high functioning codependency. Now, I would love if you could just describe to everybody what is one what is high functioning codependency, but also what's the difference between codependency and high functioning codependency.

There's a tipping point that we hit where we take it on rather than just feeling compassion or sympathy for we feel like we have to fix it. So that's the definition. The why Why did I need that definition? Because in my therapy practice, I had incredibly capable women very much like me, very successful business wise, you know,

living their best life. And if I would say to them, Hey, what you're describing, this is a codependent behavioral pattern you're describing in your relationship, they would immediately reject the notion of codependency as if I said a dirty word. And they're like, hello, I'm making all the money, I'm making all the moves, everything that happens is because I'm doing it. Everyone comes to me. I'm the rock in my family, I'm the rock in my friends group. Who am I?

I'm not dependent on shit? Everyone's dependent on me, lady. And I've realized my clients don't know what codependency is because they are they still have the myth of codependency being melody baby codependent. No more, you have to be

enabling an alcoholic to be a codependent. I can't tell you how many clients that I'm not involved with an addict, I'm like, okay, So they don't see themselves in the problem, which, of course, for me as a therapist was a problem because how can I help you if you don't identify And as soon as I added high functioning, all of my clients not to quote Taylor, but were like me,

I'm the problem. It's made with no shame though they were like, you're right, I am doing all the things for all the people, or I am overly invested in this and I'm exhausted. But part of the irony with high functioning codependency is that the more capable you are, the less codependency looks like codependency, but it still is. So we're still suffering and we're still getting burnt out.

but you're never going to be cured. I was at a hair salon in Manhattan and I was getting something on my hair where it's like a mask where I'm laying in a sink but nothing's happening because I'm just laying there, and all of a sudden, now the sink traffic is backing up and each person that comes in

is standing. I'm becoming more and more anxious, Like I wonder if they think I'm an idiot because I'm using a sink but I'm not even using it and I could sit somewhere else, and maybe I should tell somebody. Literally becoming until I get to a tipping point where

I have to raise my hand have the assistant come over. I say to her, Hey, I could sit somewhere else. She's like, no, shit, lady, And we're fine. We do this every saturdaysterry Like we're fine. And I realized what is the cost? Sight who cares?

person genuinely. But can they not be both? So I guess my question is where is the boundary between Oh, I'm helping somebody because I genuinely have love and care for them, to it being something that becomes from what I'm hearing from you, a selfish notion of helping.

feel underappreciated. We're like, and you didn't throw me a parade for the thing I did for you that you didn't ask me to do and maybe didn't even brig and want me to do. So I think that consent and instead of making the assumptions right when we're auto advice giving, we're assuming that's what people need or want or it's really we just want to fix their problem. One of the central stories in the book is something

that happened with one of my sisters. And this was the beginning for me really honestly, I was in my mid to late twenties. It was when I really started to understand what high functioning codependency was, and I didn't know until then. So my sister was in an abusive relationship living with this guy in the woods without running water and no electricity. She was an alcoholic and he was doing crack and abusive, so it's just an hfc's nightmare, right. I love her to death. Can you imagine and think

about one of your siblings in that situation. You're like, all hands on deck until we get her out of there, Like what do we need to do? So I was failing to get her out of there, and I was crying to my therapist for god knows probably the fiftieth time, saying what am I going to do? I've done everything? And she said, Terry, let me ask you something. What makes you think you know what your sister needs to learn in this lifetime and the way she needs to learn it? And I was like so mad, and I said,

I think we can agree she doesn't need to do it with a crackhet in the middle of the woods without reading water. And she said, you know, terror, I actually can't agree to that because I'm not God. I can't agree because I'm not God, and neither or you. But do you know what's happening for you? And I was like, obviously not, so please clue me in. What

is happening? For me, And she said, you have worked hard to create a pretty harmonious life because I stopped drinking when I was twenty one, Like, I've been on a spiritual and mental health path for many, many years. And she said, and your sisters dumps your fire of a life. I mean, I'm paraphrasing, but that's what she was saying, is messing with your peace. So you want to fix her so your pain can end.

did they even ask for that? Did they even ask for my help? They've told me all these things. I'm observing all these things that they're doing. But my problem is, like my problem is when I experience that, whether it's friends, family members' relationships, how do you stop yourself from because if I'm picking up the phone to them, I can't not say something. I can't not say I need like you need to stop this. We need to figure this out.

Let's figure out a solution. How can I create a way that I can have a relationship with someone who is going down a terrible path.

have scripts galore? So what you can say when your friend calls and she's got a disastrous, terrible idea and you want to talk her out of it so badly? Instead, when she's telling you, you're going to say, okay, so tell me, tell me about this idea. What do you think you should do? Tell me about why now? Why now? With this? Tell me stop talking more listening, create expansion. That's holding space is when your friend's like, I don't

know what to do. I'm gonna quit my job, or I'm gonna bring up with my husband or whatever it is, and you go and they go, I want to know what you think. And even though that's like just so seductive that you want to just tell them all the things, instead you're going to say, okay, before I say anything, I want to know what you think you should do.

them in their discomfort is making you uncomfortable. It may not even be making them uncomfortable, correct, And I've noticed that where I'm like, oh no, but I want my parents to be as comfortable as possible, Or my sister's upset, how can I make her not be upset? And so then I'm thinking of every single post thing she tells

me one thing, Oh I've got a cough for a cull or there's something wrong with my health, and I'm like looking up every possible thing she can go to. And for me, I think it started a lot more became exacerbated when I moved away from home, where I was like, I have to be helpful in some way. I need to be useful. I need to make sure that if I'm not there physically, I will do all the planning. I will make sure that I am constantly on alert and there for them whenever they need it.

And so it was definitely, you know, on reflection after reading your book, I was saying, thinking to myself, I was like, actually, it's for me. It's for me to feel like I am useful. It's for me to feel like I can look after them, and I'm finding a way any way possible to insert myself into their life so they know that I am looking after them and that I'm here totally.

it easier. And you think that's a sign that you need to be helping them, but really it's a sign that you need to be helping them open up to their own ideas. Yeah.

very successful. But I always felt like I needed to protect, you know, and I was, of course making it worse, inadvertently making him feel worse. And then finally, like I was talking about in therapy, and I got it like I need to not be doing what I'm doing and that it's not being supportive, it's just helping my ego

feel better. And so I said to him, Babe, how can I best support you with this situation? And he just flat out and said, Terror, you can have faith that I'm going to get it done and I'm going to do it my way.

And he was a better person than me.

when I was young in relationships. I would overfunction my ass off in some relationship because I thought then the person couldn't ditch me or reject me. I'll make myself so replaceable that they wouldn't be able to But of course that's not accurate, and that's not how it goes. So anyway, back to what we were saying about the qualities. One is also hyperindependence, where it's hard to let other people do things for us, or it's hard to ask

people to do things, which of course leads to burnout and resentment in all of these things. And there is a phenomenon though, which I think is interesting, and I think you and Jay have it, and I think my husband and I have it as well. If you marry someone who's even more of an HFC than you, which you did and so did I, because I don't even need to know more about him than I already do to know that that is that's a good union because they're the one person, or at least that person you

allow to do things for you. Is that accurate?

can do it by myself. But then, you know, I was thinking about the capacity, you know, when you were talking about resentment earlier, and I always thought about how you know, Jay would always say to me, why do you do all these things for people if you feel a certain way about it? And I was like, because I always want to be able to want want people to know that I am here to do things for them.

And what I realized was it's either if I feel resentment a good sign for me has always been and if I do something for someone and I'm expecting it back in the same way, or if I feel irritated by afterwards, it's either a sign that I have gone past my own boundaries and limits and my capacity, or it's a sign that I need to learn how to feel myself to be able to expand my capacity. So it can iv one or the other. But staying in that zone means that I would keep over exerting myself,

keep overgiving to my detriment. They weren't asking for it, I did it myself. I would always offer that help. But then if I'm coming away saying, well, I did this, this, and this, calculating what they owe me back, that's a sign that I have gone past my capacity and boundary. But I do believe that there are ways that you can replenish yourself if you have this practice of constant replenishment where you can probably keep expanding the ability to give,

where you then don't feel that resentment. You then don't feel that calculative how am I going to receive back from this person? But it takes so much inward work and so much giving back to yourself to be able to feel like you can give more and more.

Like there is something so important. So I don't know that it's about giving more, right because I'm pretty sure you're giving plenty because there's no HFC I know who's not. But again, there could be there could be a spiritual angle to that, because that is also praised and well thought of, as you said, like being of service. But I think the real importance in your close relationships in

particular is the mutuality and all of us being better listeners. Yes, and not meaning let's let people you know, toxically dump on us talking about the same bad situation they're in, never changing. I'm not talking about that. I'm talking about our addiction to auto advice giving and knowing the answer

kind of. And here's the thing with the HFC is we're good problem solveers and we're smart, and we're very capable, and you want to be like I have an idea, I have a thought, I know what you should do, like the resources exactly, let's do it. We're already like I'm already texting someone, I'm googling, I'm underlining the book for you. I can't can't how many people can I buy this book?

want to do it? He does, but I will. He'll be telling me a story about something like that, and I will be like, let's get some food, let's sit down, like I want to hear the whole thing from beginning to end. No co opting of that story. There's no

need for me to say, oh, yeah, I know what you mean, because one day when I did blah blah blah, just you, babe, just you telling me everything about those six weeks that you were in the couple or wherever the hell he was, you know what I mean. And letting him know that what he thinks his experiences, especially when I'm out with him, are important because it's not

like we're not together. We've been together so long. It's not like I'm talking to for an hour while I'm in New York where I'm wherever, and when I'm in LA while he's in New York. You know, I'm texting like, hey, babe, good night. I love you to say to Mark, you know what I mean. But if it's something that's important that I feel like I'm missing, I want to make sure he gets like, here's my full attention all the time, because he's literally still the most interesting person I've ever met.

You know.

is torturous. So I call my sister, and she helped me come up with a script, set a boundary and just said, hey, I can't talk about this, and I love you and if and when you ever want to get out, I'm so your person always.

but they're not. And less than nine months later, she called me and she was like, Hi, are you still my person? And I was like, getting in my car, she got out, she got sober, she went back to school. She never was in another abusive relationship. But here's the most important part. Instead of her littlest sister being the hero of her story, she is the hero of her own story. And so her sobriety could stick, her transformation

could stick because she chose it. It's humiliating to I have your youngest sister quote unquote save you, even if

you're grateful for like a minute, but ultimately you just feel like a loser. And so I didn't rob her of that experience. And my therapist said, Terry, listen to me. I'm not saying you shouldn't save your sister. I'm saying you can't. It is an impossibility. So what you're doing, you're just throwing shit at the wall trying to see

what will stick. But the bottom line is that it is not your situation to fix, and it is presumptuous even if she's in a rough spot, it's presumptuous for you to think you know exactly what she should be doing, because you don't know. And you have to respect her sovereignty and her right to be self determined even if it feels like a disaster, which it did, and she.

bit too much. What you said, it takes away their power and it takes away their ability to do it. And so what is a way that we can create help in someone's life And where do you start knowing the boundaries of where to stop helping? Because they say someone's happy to take the help, because there are some instances where they'll say no, but there will be instances where they want to be a bit lazy and they

don't necessarily want to put in the work themselves. So how do you know when it is time to stop helping if that person is still taking the help.

overgiving to someone. What I really took away from that situation is my therapist was also saying, hey, when you're throwing money at this or when you were helping her temporarily, you're also robbing her of the impetus to change her situation, like the drive. It's the same way that I always say with my clients, like, don't have sex with your ex.

When people are like, it's just sex, I'm like, but it's not because energetically, you were dispersing the energy that would help you, you know, because energetically we're like, you know, your energy comes out and it's like these little hooks that go out and hook things. But when you're dispersing it, even if you say it's just sex, you're not going to your person who's looking for you is not going to find you because your light is dimmed every time

you have sex with your ex. According to me, listen, that's not factual. That's just me. Yeah, And this is the same thing that she needed to get to exactly what you said, a certain bottom where she had had it, not that I had had it for her, She had to have had it, and only then would she be ready to go and have it stayed, because you know she had left and gone back before, but when she was ready to go, she left and never.

going to change. And I would always be so disappointed because I was like, but I've done but I've given you what you need to stay on your feet. I've given you what you need to support you. Why can't you stick to this for yourself? Like, why cant I'm not asking for me? And my I would always say, I'm not asking for it for me I'm saying, all I want in reciprocation is for you to do it for.

They would do anything possible to make sure I got that done, to make sure I got that great, to make sure whatever it was.

insert themselves into the center of their child's life. I had a client who her husband's mother insisted that all of the five siblings and their family is they had a big, huge house come home every Christmas for Christmas. Finally, years of therapy later, she was like, here's the thing. I don't want our kids. I want to be home and my house Christmas morning. I'm over revolving our life around your mother as the matriarch. And it's so selfish

to expect that raising kids. I'm married, a widower, I have three you know, I'm a bonus mom to three amazing sons. I have seven grandbabes. My feeling is who once they were married I was like, your wife is your first family. Now we're your family of origin. So whoever had the youngest baby, I was like, for the holidays, we'll go there, because I don't expect you with a three month old to travel to New York. And they live all over the place because they went far and

it's like we continue to have our life. I love them. I'm not saying that you can't be close to your family, but there is an appropriateness of like phases of our lives. When you have adult children and they're having children of their own, you want them to be able to be focused on their family. And I love being a Grandparent's the best right, but I also don't expect them to revolve their life around mine and this travel schedule or what we're doing.

As a woman, you have to stay protected and so your parents look after you, and then you get in inverted comments given to your husband to look after you, and everything is like you are being ushered from one place to another, and I think for mothers in my culture, including my own mother, who I love, if you're listening, but she finds it really difficult to let us be adults. So everything is like, are you sure you want to spend money on this? And are you sure you want

to do that? I don't think it's a good idea. And me and my sister are both getting to a point where we're saying, Mum, we love you so much. We appreciate that you have an opinion on this. We really do, and I understand it may be different to ours, but it's our life and you have to let us make that decision. And now that you're saying it, what it triggers in me every time she gives her opinion is you think I don't know what's best for you. You think I can't do it. You think I'm not making

financial decisions that are good for myself. You think I'm not making a friend decisions. Still telling me that these friends may not be telling me that I am not making wise decisions for myself, second guessing my own decisions for myself when I've tried really hard to create a system where I believe in what I'm doing is the right way to do it, but.

until I finally said her. I was like, Mom, listen, if you can't just compassionately listen to what I'm saying give me advice that I'm not going to take that I do not want, then I will not call you when I'm in pain.

is you? Guys? If you're listening, man, this is the easiest line. Just say it. How can I best support you right now? Sometimes I'm like, do you want to fool around? Do you want to make me a cup of tea? Do you want to go take a ride in the truck? Like yeah, I will tell you what I need if you ask, and if you treat me like a problem to be solved, Which is kind of ironic because as an HFC, that's how we treat everyone else,

like people who are just about projects. Right, We're like I have thoughts about all the things that you can change, and I will help you change them, but nobody likes that. It is the same way that you feel about your mom and how I felt about my mind.

what do you think you should do? But then what do you think might happen.

It's like this creates more internal space, and then think about the people who do you auto advice give the most, because certain people will trigger for sure these hfc's behaviors more than other people for whatever reason and so and each of us has a different story as to why that is. But when you start thinking about them, then make a plan and say, the next time Betty, if she's someone who's very provoking for you, comes to me, I'm going to say, what do you think you should do?

it to them. I'm going to get into fix it mode.

are you open? I actually had a client with the same thing that you had, and she did something and maybe it'd be helpful to you or you hope it open to hearing it, And some people will say, well, that sounds so weird. You're going to ask the people in your life if they're open to hearing it. Yeah, you are, because that's called having respect for their sovereignty.

It sounds hard and I want to tell them what to do so bad, but I don't because he and listen, you can't be perfect to mean, we spend tons of time together. Obviously sometimes I do, but it's funny. The last time I was in LA we have a puppy and we lit all these things going on at the house.

We like live on this little farm, and so I was texting him all these things, being like, do you know that Charlie needs to get her flee thing? And you know, I'm just texting from Afar And he was like, babe, I got it. And I was like, all right, I'm being super controlling, right and I just said up a video. I was like, I'm really sorry, am I being an HFC. He was like, you are, and I love you, but have faith. I got it. Keep in mind I met

this guy. He was widowed and divorced and had three teenage sons and had a super successful career as an artists. I don't know. I think he was fine for the whole forty years he lived without me. I'm like, oh, he really needs me to figure out when the lawnmowers are coming. He's like, yeah, he texted me, babe, I got it. But anyway, it's.

what's happening there. Like, okay, she's in treatment right now, she's doing there's nothing I can do there. Okay, But who else can I find to fix? Because I can't fix you right now? That's out of my reach. That God's going to have to handle because I can't treat you. But that friend over there looks like she needs help.

for you, my husband's head over heels for me. It's like it would have to be to such an extreme that I was so positive he was never going to screw me over, do you know what I mean? And that took a long time.

by something. I'm just anxious about something. And then eventually and he's patient enough to keep asking I'm like, I'm just really worried about this person, or I'm just really struggling with this, and I'll have a breakdown once in

a well often and when it gets too much. But I really have to practice being vulnerable on a regular basis, because I think I've gotten so used to other people being vulnerable to me that when people are messaging me telling me about their things, I'm like, oh, no, I'm fine, I'm doing great, yep. And I'm like, oh, but it's just because I process it by myself. Like that's what I always tell myself. I'm good at processing things by myself, so I actually don't need to tell anybody.

not so much. I'm not that interested in that. And my mother in the beginning with my relationship with Vick, actually it said to me, because vic would he would want to drive from New Jersey to pick me up for Manhattan, just to drive me back to New Jersey, and I'd be like, I could just go to pen station and take the train. It's so much faster. And my mother was like her, why are you depriving him the joy that he gets out of doing love it? He wants to come scoop you up. Let him come in and.

me on this situation. But it's blocking all these people from having a more deeper, meaningful relationship with me, because that is what human interaction in love is, right, Like, it's reciprocal. It's you, and it doesn't have to be helping in that way. But you do something for me out of love, and I'll do something. And the actual receiving of the gift is just as important as the giving of the gift.

back into being an active HFC. So just know that someone being sick can just make you go off the rails and feel like you want to control everything. So it's okay. You can have a little relapse and you can come back. But the things we have to get used to is Serrol Richardson has this great book called let Me Disappoint You, So we need to realize that sometimes we have to disappoint others to not abandon ourselves. And any relationship that is built on your self abandonment

is not a healthy relationship. And most people who really love us don't want that we're doing it voluntarily, So realize it's okay. And even if your friend wants you to do something but you have an important thing the next and you can't go, it's okay that she's disappointed. She can love you and be disappointed. You can love her and be disappointed, like it's all right. And the other thing is that we really have to allow, as you were saying, we have to surrender to what is

Maybe your friend isn't ready to change. Breathe in that expansion of just surrendering to what is true. You think about when you're an active HFC, it's like you're swimming

upstream and like you're just you're laboring so hard, you're looking there's that tree, and then you're like that same tree, like how am I not any further up this river? And when you're in recovery, it's like you flip over and float and now you can see right. It's like you're going with the flow. You're allowing the chips to fall where they may. When they're not your chips, people feel so much less judged and controlled by you, So

your relationships get better. But you have so much more bandwidth when you're not bleeding it left and right, because what it ends up happening really is that we have a glass ceiling of our own making. When we're actively HFC, your relationships will only be so deep and you will only be so successful because you're bleeding bandwidth everywhere.

we talk about now? Like, how do I create a new method of communication? How do I find a new value in our relationship beyond me helping you?

which is our inherent worth. So there's that. And then if ninety percent of your conversation is helping, now at least half of that is going to be you getting to know the people that you love, asking expansive questions, allowing there to be silence, letting people here's the thing. People have a right to succeed and fail. People have the right to thrive and to flail, to not know,

to be like I'm a hot mess. And then instead of saying but you can change it, or but it won't always be like this, or it could be worse like hfc's can be the most annoying silver lining detectives on the planet.

can I do? It's amazing. Just be with me. Let's go for a ride, or just allow me to be hurt and don't try to fix it. But we can tell the people in our lives how to love us by saying, hey, I want to talk about this, but I'm actually not looking for any input. I don't need any solutions. What I would love if you could just be a compassionate ear. It really helps me to know

that you know I'm in pain. I don't know why, but it just makes me feel better to Yes, we're together and I'm in pain, and you're witnessing me truthfully, authentically, and you love me anyway.

And so if you can't talk to someone, put it onto paper. But if you can talk to someone, it's that idea of letting it go. Every layer is being shed the more that you think about it, the more you process it. And I feel like that would probably help get rid of those feelings a lot faster.

wasn't ready. And it was a ship show of a situation, but it wasn't my shit show.

this way. You may not understand it, but I need you to not worry because I'm going to be fine. And so we really had to get into this routine of her not frantically worrying because I'm crying. I'm a cryer. I need you to know that too. You don't know this because you've not seen me cry a lot, but I cry a lot, and I need you to know

that that is my release. So if I come to you and I'm crying, it may be really serious or it may not be serious at all, but I just need you to see me cry, and I need you to tell me. That's literally all I need right now.

to be in the VIP section, right. These are people we really have to vet them from an emotional standpoint. And so I care what those people think. Yes I do, I do, but not all of them and not about everything. So even with I love my mother, I care what she thinks. I'm not taking career from my mother obviously, yeah right, like I'm not because that wouldn't be the person I would do it with, because that wouldn't make

any sense. But I care that she thinks I'm a kind, decent human because that is who she raised me to be, and those are her values and my values as well. So she's always like, it makes me so proud everyone tells me how nice you guys are, because I have three older sisters, and that's her biggest compliment is that we're kind and considerate and we help those who are less fortunate. That that was the way that I was raised. Right, She doesn't care about a best selling book. She wants

to know who did I help lately? You know what I mean?

invested with. But how can you stop worrying or what is the mindset behind caring so much about what people that you don't even know think about you? Well?

be clear. I am very clear in my comment section that if there are any like real pot stirs, any people who are just looking to you know, what is it. There's this woman who was on the who was on Glennon Doyle Show, and she forgot her name, but she wrote a book and she talks about entrepreneurs of conflict, like people who are just looking to mix it up. They're just bored. They're just saying provocative shit just to

be provocative, I will. If your heart isn't in the right place, you are blocked and kicked out of my community immediately. Now people can disagree with me, I have no problem with that as long as it's respectful. The moment people are bringing in any kind of disrespect, you're out. And I don't owe you any explanation you don't want because this shit is free. Yes, are you paying me

to watch me on Instagram? You are not, And I'm giving I mean, I have six hundred and fifty videos on YouTube that are free. If somebody had no money, you could literally have mental health by going to my YouTube channel. Because I wanted to even the playing field that was like, it shouldn't just be people with money can have therapy that doesn't seem correct. So I'm always putting out like the highest quality free stuff that I possibly can because I want everyone to be able to

do it. And even there, my team knows, and everyone knows. I've got rules of engagement everywhere where we're not giving each other advice. I'm the only therapist here, yes, And what's giving advice? It's just me. It's that one way stream right now that is correct. This is not a democracy. This is a benevolent dictatorship, and I'm a dictator.

That is when I care much less about what other people are saying. But as soon as and so really I see it more as a reflection of how my internal state is to how much I am taking on someone else's negative view of me. Because as soon as I'm showing up inauthentically when someone else tells me I am, I'm like, oh, that doesn't sound nice. Why are people saying that about me? How can they say that about me?

And then I realize, actually, even just within this conversation, that a lot of it comes from when I feel like I'm at my best and I'm speaking words that I believe and I'm sharing things that mean so much to me. Yeah, I don't look at how many comments there are. I don't look at how many likes that I do not care. I've said this. I've put this out into the world because I feel it and I want to share it, which is a super healthy way to do it.

said something that was insensitive, that's different. Right, I'll handle that. I will apologize for that if I believe that I did it or whatever the thing is. But there's something about having all these eyes on us as influencers, and I you know, it's not even like I'm not even that influential, but more and more and more as it grows, and I think that we have to be solid internally because fame itself. You know, I used to be a talent agent before I became a therapist, and so I,

you know, used to represent supermodels and celebrities. That was what my sort of niche was, and so I was always fascinated by the psychology of fame, what happens to people when they become famous. Then it became a psychotherapist, so then I it just I naturally just started having clients who are very highly visible. Just made sense, and it's unbelievable, Like what a head trip it can be to have hundreds of millions of eyes on you, and

how self conscious it can make you. And so I've got lots of rules and regulations from my clients, so like not being you really have to have that fifteen minute timer no longer than that every day ten minutes is even better. Wow, of just keeping it real. You can't get in there. They cannot climb into those kind of sections.

beauty influencer doing makeup stuff. But for me, what really helps is if I show up and I'm just no filter, putting no makeup, speaking certain words that I know means something to me, then I'm so much less anxious when I'm going into the public world where I'm actually meeting people, Like I always used to think when I would meet people, they would feel like they meet a different version of me,

because I'm actually quite an introvert. When I meet people for the first time, I'm really comfortable behind the screen. I'm really comfortable with my core friends and the people. But if I'm in larger environments, you might get a shyer version of me that they're not expecting. And so sometimes just being able to show up in the same way online as you would as to a person when

you meet them allows it to be less discrepancy. I feel like there's just this duality that you end up having, yeah, that keeps fighting one another when you show up as something else, and then you'll you end up having to keep up with all these different versions of yourself, and it's so draining.

And actually she was the first person whoever really encouraged me.

You sat down here and you are who you are, and it creates less discrepancy for you, but also for the person that's experiencing you. It is literally the same person that walked in the door, that sat on this chair and is speaking in the mic. So I appreciate you doing that so much. It was really great to experience that from the moment I met.

will be able to say anything about me. So I will keep myself safe by being perfect. And the thing is, obviously there is no perfection, and life is messy as hell. Yeah, love is messy. Success is messy, right. Success includes failure, which, if you're a perfectionist, is like death where you can't even deal. And a lot of times perfectionists will not do things outside of their comfort zone if they're not masterful at it. So your life gets small if you're

not good at it. And the thing is adventures and learning new skills and learning a new language, all the things that make life juicy and amazing. It's like you don't do them because you're not good at them.

that I'd created for myself. But I wanted to say yes to things, and I wanted to try new things out, and I wanted that excitement in my life of trying something new and failing and experiencing and getting things wrong. But it was literally like I'd built this little cage around me and like, no, this is your safe zone. This is what you're good at.

really bad for your nervous system. If there's a whole entire chapter on nervous system stuff. What we're doing when we are always thinking about what this person should do and going into the future and being like, is this you know? Because anticipatory planning is another behavior that hfc's will employ, which is making sure if you're going to be with someone who's difficult, you make sure you think

of everything that could go wrong. You know, Uncle Bob likes this kind of booze and he's a pain, and as I'm going to make sure I have that kind of booze and he has like gymis, so I won't put them together, and I'll like, I'm going to twist myself up in a pretzel and let myself on fire so all these people can be warm.

that we're really sacrificing the depth of the life that we're meant to live.

because I'm constantly living in someone else is mine. And he says that even about the perception that someone has of you, if you're constantly thinking about how they're seeing it, who even are you? Are you experiencing who you are. Right, But yeah, thank you for hitting that, because that's a great point to make.

So I had to distinguish between what type of rest it was I needed. Is it social rest? But sometimes all I need is no planning, no nothing, no keeping to time, just being and allowing myself to physically be and mentally be present in whatever I am doing. And that for me felt like rest.

course we're in relationships with other people. Obviously we're going to compromise in our relationships, but a lot of times we're just auto yesing it up to please other people and it's really really exhausting. And if you want a little guide, I created something for you. Oh amazing Terry Coole dot com forward slash HFC can't forget it. It's just an HFC toolkit that's useful to be Like, where do I start?

Let others be with us even when we're not good company. For Francess, I won't be a good company. I was like, your job is not to entertain me as your friend. I just want to be with you, and if you're feeling low, I'm happy to just be with you.