Michael Hing and Infernal Affairs

Gid A, Peter Helly here, Welcome to you.

Ain't Seen Nothing Yet the movie podcast, where I chat to a movie lover about a classic or beloved movie they haven't quite got around to watching until now.

Today's guests comedian broadcaster Michael Hing.

All below.

I want to stay here with you.

Gay to the jobble.

My hate snake sucked him. Couldn't happening right, So An't seen nothing yet.

In Michael Hing's word, he is in a inspiring washed up comedian. Sadly for Michael, he has a long time to wait, because right now Michael Hing is hot as he is a panel member on the Sunday Project. Despite the fact that he's worked on the project for about a year or so, this section the first time we've met he works on the Sunday Project. I worked on the weekly project on Monday to Thursdays. The Sunday Project's

Of course. He does drive on tiple Jay. He does a great job on the Jays.

He's worked on the feeder over at SBS and Viceland. He studied improv at UCB in both Los Angeles and New York City. He appeared with Madow Kaine and the other Guy. The other thing you should know about Mark and only can you se him on screen. I'm listening to him on the radio, but you can see him on stage. He's a fantastic sound up comedian and his show my favorite title of this festival season, Long Live the Hing.

It's worth going just to reward him for that title. From watching Michael on TV and listening to.

Him on radio, you can tell that he's smart, he's funny, he's generous, he's empathetic. He definitely has his finger in many pies and on the pulse. And I'm bloody stoked to be hanging with Hingers today.

Hey O, Michael Hing and my three favorite films Spider Man into the spider Verse.

That's all it is, Males, a leap of faith.

Today.

What's up?

Danger, Lie?

What's up Danger? The prestige? Now you're looking for the secret, but you won't find it because of course you're not really looking.

You don't really want to know.

I want to be fooled and the big Lebowski twenty grand man, And of course I still get to keep the rugs from making a handle.

Yeah, they gave to the beeper.

Also, whenever these guys call a game, oh, I told him, if it was during league play, what's turning?

Lead play?

Life does not stop and start at your convenience, piece of shit.

And up until eleven thirty last night, I hadn't seen Infernal Affairs.

The brilliantly titled Infernal Affairs has a simple but ridiculously great premise. There is a mole in the police force and a mole working within the Chinese mafia commonly known as the Triads. Yes, if Hong Kong ever felt like they needed a homegrown version of Michael Mann's Heat, this surely is it, as you follow both the cops and the crims. But this Infernal Affairs has the deliciously tantalizing

As both the police and triads begin to suspect they have been infiltrated.

The stakes could not be higher for both Detective Lao and Chan, and when Police Captain Wog is thrown from a building to his violent death, everything goes up several notches. Of course, if this plotline sounds familiar, you may have Martin Scorsese to thank, as he remade Infernal Affairs in two thousand and eight, rebadging it that departed with one of the old time great casts, including Leonardo DiCaprio, Matt Damon, Vera Famiga, Mark Wahlberg, Alec Bordwin Ray Winston, Martin Sheen.

This movie.

It twists and it turns, and it bends your mind. It is so dense and it comes home in stunning fashion. Michael King, be honest, are you a mole?

I'll never tell, Pete, I'll never tell.

I mean, you've done it very well, because I've reached out to you to come onto this podcast, so you work.

In very mysterious ways.

Michael Heat, thanks for coming on. I'm excited to talk about Infernal Affairs. I've had this as a box set. There's there's obviously three of these films and they're unwrapped, so he gave me an opportunity to unwrap them.

And yeah, we'll obviously talk more about it. But why did you choose this one?

Well, ever since I saw The Departed first time I saw it, I loved it. I loved it, and then I found out that this was the original film that that was based on, and growing up in a Chinese family. Sorry for people who cant see me, I am Chinese. If you didn't know the name, you know, like there was always Michael.

It's a very Chinese name.

But growing up there was always like my grandparents or like you know, cousins or you know, family friends would always be watching like Hong Kong films and Hong Kong cinema. Now, my family is not We all grew up in Australia, so we're not particularly Chinese. We don't speak Canto or Mandarina or anything. But just through family friends, I knew about Hong Kong Cinner and I've seen a lot of stuff,

I can't wait to chat about it. There's so much to take in.

In Famal Affairs from two thousand and two, Let's talk about your three favorite films I went and saw into the Spider Verse.

I like the Marvel films. You know, sometimes I'm into a more than you know other times.

This one I probably wouldn't have seen if it wasn't for the constant acclaim that I kept on reading about and hearing from people.

So this is in a way an unlikely film for me to go see. But I loved it. It was amazing.

It's yeah, it's such a great It's probably my favorite of the Marvel It's definitely my favorite of the Marble films. It's one of my favorite films of full time.

It is.

People haven't seen it. It's like a it's an anime Marvel film.

It's not.

I don't think it's like properly linked to like the rest of the Marvel universe or whatever. But the animation is some of the most incredible I've ever seen. The storyline is great. It's like multiple universes coming together. It's like complex, it's like fun, and it also has that

Yeah. I mean, certainly.

That was the first Avengers film where it all basically takes place in New York. Certainly felt linked to nine to eleven. Certainly even Nolan's Dark Knight at DC felt like that was living in a post nine to eleven world. And it's interesting, you say, I hadn't really thought of it as you know, most of those films existing in that shadow.

Yeah, I guess, like I mean, obviously like some more than others, like these, you know, like The Gutting to the Galaxy less so perhaps, but like like Iron Man and a lot of those films, it's all about like you know, it's it's an unknown threat, which is like classic Supero stuff, but it's like it's very much influenced by the politics and the culture of the time, you know.

You know.

I don't necessarily, you know, get go into all that and stuff, but you know, I can understand at least the arguments for it.

I think.

I guess the other thing that I find not frustrating, but like I feel like I've read stuff and I kind of agree with it about like the Dialogue and Marvel films, how it's kind of like they let Robert Danny Junior kind of like improv a bit, and that just became like the cultural norm for film dialogue for action films for twenty years, you know, that kind of undermining quips that Joss Whedon sort of stuff, and I feel like this had some of that, but again, because

That makes sense. Yeah, it's really interesting.

So I've thought a lot about the bubblesinomatic.

You know, obviously, what's interesting about Spider Man is he was kind of always and my friend justin Hamilton that kind of I think drove this point. Spider Man was always quippy, like, he was always kind of like he would always more so than most of the other characters. But I think some of the depictions of Spider Man haven't been like that. I think Tom Holand has done a really good job of kind of bringing that back.

Well, that was the that was sort of the start of the superho Stuffy. It was one of the first ones again yeah, yeah, that was in.

Pre Iron Man. But it's not really connected.

No.

I think that they tried later on with the you know, yeah, it's always about which which film houses own which properties and how they.

Which does detract a little bit when you know that, it's like, yeah, this is just a deal they did.

This is.

Excellent.

If you haven't seen into the Spider verse, it is absolutely worth it with your time. The prestige has come up, I'm sure a couple of times on this podcast as somebody his favorite films, Hugh Jackman, Christian Bale.

It is not one too, isn't it. Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's a good one. Yeah, I've said it. Yeah.

The only thing about the prestige I have is, and I'm not somebody who looks for twists, sure, but I saw this one was almost like.

You saw the basement full of dead bodies, and but I.

Saw like that he was and I think I've only seen it the ones.

But because the idea is that is a bail he's dressed up as an old man or something, or is that there is so this is so.

This is one of my favorite films because it is so complex.

It is skip ahead if you haven't seen it, and that you don't want to spoilers here.

But it is the unraveling of a magician's trick with science, and it is the most tragic unraveling of a trick because you think that the trick is on the audience, but the reality is the trick is on him and the suffering he has to go through in order to play for the audience. Now, I don't know, as a comedian, for some reason we relate to that. But this is a film that I have watched maybe a dozen times with my friend Ben, who yeah, my mom, not my

Must go back and watch it again because because it's quite possible that even the twist that I thought was a twist probably wasn't even a twist. There is a moment earlier in the film where he's dressed up as somebody.

So there's an old magician. There's there's a magician who pretends to be old, and that's the that's so the trick is not that the old man is strong, but it's a young man pretending to be old, if that makes sense, yes, And so there's that that sets up and then it obviously that is a recurring theme through The trick is not the trick is kind of a recurring theme in the thing, and you know that sets up for the for the end again based for four of demigicians.

Yeah yeah, playing Nikola Tesla insane really really really recommend it the Prestige. Check it out, And of course The Big Lebowski has featured here.

What I mean, we've all been nineteen, you know, we've all loved this film. I feel like I should have grown out of it at some point, but every time I watch it, I'm just like, it's still really funny. It's still really really really funny. Yeah, I just I love all the like there's just so many great performances, so many great actors and people who you don't expect to be as funny as they are just crashing it

The Big About Like it's it's you know, now, one of the great comedies of all time, but with somebody who's you know. Jeff Bridges is is an awesome actor, not not necessarily known for comedic roles, but just it's It's probably one of the.

As far as great comedies go.

Usually there is a comedy like comedic actor at the forefront of that, but this is this is one. Probably Sideways is another one, which is one of my favorite films with Jim Marty and Thomas Haden Church. Thomas aden Church is a comedic actor and gm Marty is more than capable. But yeah, usually there is a comedic actor, you know, up front, and Jeff Bridges is not known as that, but that this it's kind.

Of the reverse of like the you know, Adams Adam Sandler Punch Shrunk Love kind of style film where a comedian does the series roll. In this instance, it's yeah, but yeah, no, I love The Big Labowski. You know, I think I've probably watched this one. I was like, I don't know, fifteen or sixteen or something like that, I can't remember, and just like immediately was like annoyingly quoting it to all my friends. You got to watch

Yeah, you own your own multiverse opened up. Okay, let's get let's get stuck into it. This is a fascinating film to talk about today. Infirmal Affairs two thousand and two, directed by Andrew Lao, not Andy Lao, who's one of the actors, different people, and Alan Mack. It is one almost all the awards in Hong Kong when it was released. All the actors are massive superstars over there. Often I think most of us singers as well, like the stars

I loved it. I loved it. I think there will I mean, I mean for me, and I know this is a character flaw. Watching a non English or a foreign film will always there will always be like a cultural and linguistic barrier that like will always exist there because like you know, again acknowledge that it's a character flaw. But I was enthralled by it. I was captivated by it. I loved it.

It's funny when you mentioned the subtitles, and I'm fine with subtitles, but I found the first fifteen minutes or so here I had almost whiplash because there was so much going on and you're trying to follow.

I think if I hadn't seen The Departed like a dozen times, Yeah, I think I probably would have struggled to follow They're right. I think I would have struggled to follow the plot because I knew vaguely what was happening, because I was like, oh, I've seen the Western version of this film, but which again, again I say this acknowledging character flaw. But watching this, I agree with you. In the first fifteen minutes, I was a bit like a bit like, oh, this guy is the is the

This was which I admired that, but there was a point in that, you know, in that first fifteen minutes it's like this, maybe you had to hold my hand, but it's a guide my elbow or something like this just just helped me, just helped me a little bit. It was because because and this where the subtitles can be tri because it was quite fast paced. There's a lot, there's a lot going on, and so you're reading the subtitles.

But it is tricky. It was trick.

You missed, you miss I find personally when I watched subtitle films, especially something like this, you're focusing on reading it, and so you miss some of the faces, you miss some of the express you know it does. It does take a lot more brain activity, and that's that's in short supply with me, you know.

Yeah, So I felt like you know, I've spoken sometimes when you watch a film and you feel immediately in safe hands, And like when I watched Busch, Cassidy and the Sundance skip for the first time the opening shot, I just thought, I'm gonna love this movie.

I'm pretty sure I'm gonna love this movie. This one.

I was a little bit worried until the stakeout, that first stakeout. It went from there, I was like, this is brilliant, And in my mind, I was like, I know, this is a great film. Of course people love this film. Yeah that departed, you know, so I knew it was going to get there, but I was, like I was, I was a little bit worried. And also because there are some very different kind of production techniques going on there.

So I wasn't sure, I guess because I don't know a lot about Hong Kong cinema. I wasn't sure if that is like was and stuff in the early two thousands. That's sort of like slow there was a lot of like freeze slow mo and then like for emotional effect like flashback in black and white kind of thing, or like a yeah, like you said, cross fades like slow fades out, you know, transitions, And I was like, looking at that in twenty twenty three, like this is pretty cheesy.

I think, yeah, yeah, I agree. I made reference some of the actors.

Andy Lau is like one of the hardest working actors and he's also he's won like a ridiculous amount of awards over there. He's been a ridiculous amount of movies and he's also like a he sings. I think one of the songs in the in the film, so you know, huge, huge star.

And the.

His counterpart, he's the mole working for the tryads. He is also like a massive star as well all the women in the film. We'll get to the women, you know, because there's there's something to be said for the women in this in this movie, in the roles they're given, but lack of roles.

But he's also a star.

And I thought I'd love the two performances. I thought they were. I was in on them, I was I felt for both of them. I thought they were great.

Yeah, I feel like, how can I put this again? I'm gonna keep reverencing The Departed, just because I think that's the film everyone will have seen. In The Departed, there's like a huge all star cast. If you know, ten twelve people have all won, you know, Academy Awards, will been nominated. You know, this huge it's you know, this film was about just basically two people, you know

I think I read something, and sometimes I get a little bit suspicious of stories that come out of the production that just don't seem to quite add up. What I read was that Andy Laud took on this role he was given basically almost a fake script where he didn't have the twist at the end. So he thought he was playing like the good comp. You know, he's just playing a good comp. There's part of me that

You know, on the phone, he's text messaging. You know, like, what did you think was going on there?

So unless they told him that it was like a double crossing situation, that he or something like that, and that he was But that's really fascinating because the whole movie the theme of who is a cop? And you know, who is the good guy or who is you know, those lines being blurred constantly throughout the film. As a director, I think that would be a really I'm not that,

Hear of people maybe not being you know, given the ending, so people is being left in the day. I have heard of that technique before, but just in regards to this, I'm curious to what Andy Laud then thought the film was about or and maybe there was a you know, I read a few sentences and I'm sure the director directors had an approach if that if that was if

Yeah, well you're got to looking for this stuff and it's all there.

Yeah, I mean I guess that's like maybe there's a whole bunch of stuff on the cutting room floor where he's like, you know, doing charity work, like helping out the local community, and he's like saving an orphan from a burning building and stuff, and that's all just cut up and he's like, wait, why did we shoot on that? Well, that's something that makes people got a good guy? Wait can we put that in?

There's my eight minute monologue. I learned that word for word. I mean, I think this is a brilliant film and it deserves all the credit. If you love The Departed, you need to acknowledge this film, you know. Weirdly, Martin Scorsese said he wasn't even aware that this was The Departed was based on this film. I find that what Martin Scorsese is like the walking encyclopedia of cinema.

So wait, what do you mean he just made The Departed being like ah, yeah, this is yeah, Like, I mean.

Obviously he didn't write it, but surely in preparing it somebody would have mentioned even on the script. I imagine on the cover page it said based on the movie Infernal Affairs, it should have it's so funny.

I don't believe that I'm calling bullshit on that. I reckon, I reckon. He this wants the kind of our own.

Some of the space there's like shot for shot, there's.

Shot for shot stuff going on. I just find it impossible, Like it's so funny. Yeah, oh my good knowledge.

Give the credit.

Yeah, I mean who also who cares? Like you gotta ask her for it?

More people, you know, possibly more people was into the part of than than well maybe not actually, oh no, I reckon they would have yeaheah, But there is. So this is a brilliant film, but there are some things like some of the production things which you know, may just be dated, maybe be more of a cultural thing of you know, that's how they because I think they do lean more into the sentimental sure in this film even even we might listen to it soon that a

She's an author, and it's it's a bit on the nose.

She's basically writing a book and it's about she can't finish it because she doesn't know if the character's good or bad. It's it's very much on the nose. And they've done such good work. We don't need any of this. We like, we know what's going on. It's not like, you know, this explained it one more time that we didn't need it.

It was, yeah, that was a bit.

Yeah, it's on the nose. And then you've got Chan who's got his psychologist.

Yeah, the psychologist who he go who he's been sent to, but the police. So he's working as a as a mole in the triads and his police contact sends him to a psychologist, and he basically spends a lot of the movie refusing to talk to the psychologists and going there and just having a nap. But he has to do it because it's you know or whatever, and she's going to give it up on him just playing solitary.

It's two thousand and two.

Everybody, So that's and then the part of so they've got to merge those two roles. I think with Via Famiga, who's amazing. I think they the part of that's one thing. They definitely do better that role. And then there's a third in My Carriage, which is maybe the most bewildering thing.

And I'm not sure. I hope I haven't seen two or three. Yeah, apparently two is a prequel, yeah, right, and then three is a bit of both.

It's a bit of a seque, but it's a bit a bit prequel. So the same actors are involved. What I'm hoping is those characters they knew what they were doing, and those female characters are underwritten, sure in this one, but they have going they have bigger roles in the next one. Because there's one character, the ex girlfriend, where it's so where Chance says, I'm gonna I'm gonna got a massage. Yeah, So he goes off, but then bumps

It's his because she because in the conversation she asks how long it's been, he says seven years. He asks how the daughter is she says five years. And then as he walks away. The daughter says to the mother, I'm six years old. Like you know, it's very much like do the math and you know, and it's and you don't know. I don't even know if we know this person's name or we know anything about their backstory.

There's no payoff like this.

No, like because one of the happens, I thought, Okay, this is potentially is interesting, like he has he has a daughter.

Yeah, but he never finds out you know, you know, I think in the well, I mean spoiler alert. I think in the funeral scene, the daughter's there. Yeah, right at the end.

Maybe, but I am but still unawares. I don't think. I don't think.

Yeah, I don't think she knows. But again yeah, again, maybe they're setting stuff up for the for the other movies, but you know, I mean, we don't have ti give them the benefit of that. Who knows, it's just maybe it's just classic you know, cinematic misogony. Who knows it is?

It is so bizarre. Let's have a listen. We're going to do some comparison work here. This is the way, I guess pointing out some of that sentimentality that The Infernal Affairs has maybe competed.

The part of this is this is Wang sobrittinent, Wang falling.

To his death in you know, pretty tragic circumstances and this just will play it out a bit and they have listened to how they handle it.

Y do you know what leans to me? God?

I passing? Show me about.

Okay, so you got some swelling music there. I'm pretty sure there's some cross fraighting going on the flashbacks. Yeah, yeah, black and white flashbacks, Yeah, like really leaning heavily into the sentimental.

Yeah.

So I also when this because he dies by being thrown off a building, which the same way that Martin Sheen's characterized in that Departed And then both times it is so surprising. I didn't I totally watching this, even knowing that it happened in the department, totally forgot that it was going to happen. And then was like just a body falling off a building and just hitting a

Because Martin School says he handles it in a pretty different way. We have you so Martin Sheen's sullivan, I think it is falls off, was pushed off, and he quite quite fell. Of course Martin School he's never seen in Federal affairs, but very similar. But actually he does handle it quite differently, so he falls. There's no there's no car. We don't see. We actually hear that that awful sound of body hitting the pavement right right in

What the fuck?

What was that?

Ship?

Shah? Something just kid off the building?

Fuck?

What do you mean? Something came off the building?

Go again with that different.

Shot came off the roof?

Body sides.

We can't get a visual.

Do you want us to get out of the car. We're gonna get on foot if you want me to get up on this thing.

Where the funk were you? What the fuck?

Cap you're fucking wake Get in the barn.

What do you mean something came off the roof? What's going on?

I came on?

What?

Get off the bar, get in the barn.

I don't know, side put like a four round men, right, I'll funk.

You want us to pursue, No, do not pursue, stay in the car, no fucking pasult some information?

What came off the roofe?

No pursuit fu.

Yeah, so Scorsese's gone with no soundtrack there it's it's it's not sentimental. And then it's it's a lot of a lot of cursing, a lot of Boston f bombs and yeah, so it's I think they then they they even't run over the body on the way out, so he is he's turned to Scorsese up to eleven. But it's it's I don't know, it's it's fascinating that the

Yeah, yeah, I think there is a and again I could be speaking abut to turn here, but this is

Maybe, I think, isn't it one of the one of the they've got these lists of grave sins that if you commit these kinds of sins you will end up in like the worst level of how the VICI I think it is and so and one of the mother though is knowingly killing your father, knowingly killing your mother, or and knowingly killing somebody who is like a senior kind of you know, yeah officer.

Yeah yeah yeah. So And and obviously Wang is that's in your policeman is seen as kind of a father figure to both of these characters, both of these moles. Weirdly, I think that in the departed that father figure is probably more Jack Nicholson, the way he kind of takes the way that character from the very start of that film Departed takes Matt Damon in and raises him and kind of not you know, is looking out for him.

And and yeah, yeah, yeah, I think absolutely right. And I think one thing I'll give the part of points On. I think Nicholson is far more menacing and feels even though I felt like the stakes were still high. Then of course these are the tryads, you know, so we know we hear about the people, he's about people. But I didn't find Sam as anywhere near as threatening as as Nicholson in the party.

Have you heard that story about Matt Damon tells about Jack Nicholson working with him on The Departed. He basically tells this story about like how there's a scene where Jack Nicholson has to he has to execute someone and it just says like he and there was like a one line description in the script, and then Nicholson just improvises this like really fucked up monologue where he's like where with every line he is making his character more and more of a psycho, And Matt Damon's like talking

Yeah, yeah, I certainly, and I quite enjoyed. I said I was still there for Infernal Affairs and I felt the tension and it's interesting. It's just two very different ways of playing it. Yeah, Sam is played he's softer. You can see that he you know, he could get shited done. There's no doubt about that. So he knew if Chan got busted, he was in a world of hurt. But I remember watching it the part of and really feeling the tension that if the Capria got found out that he was properly fucked.

Yeah, yeah, it wasn't.

It wasn't just going to It's it's like Sam would have put a bullet in the Chan's head if.

He got caught. I think Nicholson would have tortured.

DiCaprio be slowly moving tones or whatever. Yeah, although like there are the scene where they're talking in the bar and this is in internal affairs, an he's saying to you, any saying to chant like I you know you're the only one I can trust. You can still see the threatening, menacing nature of it. And yeah, it's it's just I don't know, there's just so much there's just so much

What was did you ever read on the stereo scene. I think quite so. The stereo scene.

It's just that's right at the start of the film, and that's neither of them realize that that's just their paths crossing incidentally, but neither of them knowing. So this is the police mole who works in the triads also has a second job at a stereo at like a Kenwood stereo shop or something.

JB High five.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, and so and the the triad mole who's working in the police he comes into buy a stereo and yeah, then there's the discussion about cables, and you know, I think it's just meant to show that they because they knew each other at the academy, but then ten years later, I think it's just so that they couldn't recognize each other maybe even though they'd met. Yeah, maybe that's what the point of it was.

I was really confused by it. And it's kind of like a like a reference to it later on. I think because he because the stereo is how he is found out, that's right, yes, yeah, because he sends a CD. Oh man, remember CDs.

He sends a CD with the carrier with the song that they played, yes, so he maybe he must have remembered once he so, once he realized that he was the the other guy was the mole. Sorry trying this, This is what I mean. The plot is so deep so once so so hang on, there's Chan, there's Lao, right, yeah, and is the low is the mole in the police force, and Chan is the mole with the triads. Yes, So from the start Chan is established as a character who

We don't see him working there again, no, because I.

Think he's there to enforce some sort of protection racket or something as well. And in the in the in the stereos system, in the stereoste. So then so he must then have remembered the song that they played out of the stereo to test the speakers, and he uses it and he records the first bit of that song and then mixes it with like tapes he's stolen from the Triad boss's desk because he's been taping everything Nixon style, and then sends that CD to his to to Low's house for his wife to fight.

Yeah.

Yeah, yeah, anyway, Yeah, there's so much.

It's so complicated trying to I feel like I'm you know, here's me trying to do a plot summary of this film. It is, you know that meme of a guy just with red string on a board, that's me trying to explain this film like no because hate you the whole time.

With subtitles.

Yeah, there's also something else going on which I was unning up about it, which which kind of is in the same way the I'm not sure you've seen the banshes of intersh and that it takes place while there's a civil war going across on the mainland. Yeah, I think there's something they're playing with the idea of this of people in Hong Kong having this almost identity crisis, almost this schizophrenia of you know, the what do you call it, the one country two system.

Yeah, So this movie is released in two thousand and two. In the late nineties, Hong Kong was handed back from the British after one hundred years of rule or whatever it was, to China, and so there is a lot of like dual identity feeling going on, I think in Hong Kong at the time. My uncle, because as my uncle lives in Hong Kong, so we spent a lot of time there growing up, you know, just as tourists. Nothing nothing too intense, but just as tourists and.

Didn't work at the local stereos trying to get a job.

It's all right about a mathia would and so, but there was definitely over there a rising tension because you feel people felt a lot of different things, a wide

This.

I think the ending that they have now is kind of tragic and emotionally real, but it's satisfying ending to see the person who you're rooting against maybe you know, have their come up. And that's kind of what happens to the part of as well. So I thought it was kind of interesting that Martin Scorsese decided to have that. They also have that. What I'm saying is Martin Scorsese's working for the Chinese companist, buddy.

That's my there's a clickbait. Thank you very much. Yeah, it it's funny.

I agree that sometimes when you hear yeah, when I heard the Chinese government had an alternative ending, comment or they shot one for the you know, for those reasons you think in what way did they suck up the film? But to be honest that if they had a been yeah, it's almost like nobody wins.

Yeah, yeah, having to obviously, you know, I don't want to be on records. Off the side artistically, the Chinese community.

All we're saying is that China's Communist Party has some people who know about film, but they got some you know, some cinophiles working in their midst.

And then I'm curious, sense I think film sense ships are great. Idea.

No, no, no, the the original ending is a perfect and it is a really it's a brilliant. It's funny because I you know, I go into this knowing I've seen it the part of a few times.

I really enjoyed.

I got to say, when I first watched it, I was a bit underwhelmed at the part of the each subsequent viewing, I've really enjoyed it a lot more.

But watching I just completely forgot about it.

And I was watching from the you know when the third act and completely forgetting the twists and turns of of what happened.

I guess that's that's just how fantastic the plot is. That's just a new every ten minutes and you're like, oh my goodness, this is happening. Now. I love plot, you know, I love plot beat, I love I love new plot. I think maybe that's just my brain unable to focus on things. But I love I love twists,

Yes, so when they got into the elevator, I was like, oh, yeah, yeah, that's right.

Yeah. But I but what this film does, because I've been thinking about this a bit recently, is that plot's obviously really important, particularly in these kinds of films, you know, you know less so I mean, you know, we mentioned the benches in the sharing before.

I mean, that's got.

It's such a scant little plot ba but obviously two very different films. But what's more important, and I think in Femo Affairs does it even better, is the reaction to plot. A character's reaction to plot is actually what drives films more so than plot, and it's it's it's beautifully depicted in it's a it's a best case example.

But having the character react to that, see that that drives.

The emotion of the film. That that that makes it a much bigger thing.

Even though it's still tragic that somebody has been pushed to death of a roof, but for that to happen in front of chan that's that's a great example of like, it's not just a plot of him falling off a roof, it's and dying.

It's actually what it means to another one of our protagonists.

Totally, and like you're so right that that is like plot is just things happening, But you don't invest in that unless it's happening to people you care about. You know, it's like dreams, you know, hearing about someone's stream. I don't care unlet bad people. I know about.

That rooftop scene, apparently there was no no gunfire allowed on that rooftop, so so I'm not sure if they had to tweak the script as a result, but I think it's all the better for it. I think it's such a brilliance. It's so tense, it's so tense, and maybe let's have a listen and we'll do a comparison to the departed. The difference between the way your family affairs uses that rooftop and and the moment I guess of capturing Lao.

You guns it didn't know you?

Okay? Are you a year.

Or you ye?

Come sent? Sorry? Sad? How a young?

I mean, what's interesting there is is that they use that the building that the mirrored kind of windows really quite well. It's amazing that chance could creep up on like he's like, yeah, you got this, almost like a drone or a helicopter shot. Maybe it was back then of him on the rift by himself, and he's looking around. There's nobody there, and he looks into the building the reflection, there's nobody there, and then all of a sudden there's a gun in his back.

It's I had it that happens. I'm not sure, but it's great. It is great. It's tense. There's a little bit of a dialogue, you know, back and forth.

And it's it's it's it's it's great, it's it's and then the other other cup comes and he takes him with his gun in his back into the building, and all the elevator stuff happens. Let's have listen to how Martin Scorsese handled it, and I think you'll see a pretty stark difference.

Right, put the fucking gun down. Put the gun, Put the gun down, all right. I came in, had to talk some all right, just act professional. I can get you your money. Just to say I can get you your money. You didn't come here to talk, now, you came here to get arrested. You got fucking tapes of what Costello was my informant. I was a rat.

Fuck you proven he was working for me. He was my informant, not your fucking mouth.

Come on, get up, well, what is this?

Citizens arrest?

Blow me?

All right? Only one of us is a copyre bill? You want to stand that bill?

No one knows when you're a fuck homicides in the Massachusetts State Police.

Who the fuck are you? I arrased you?

He erased me.

Huh, go ahead, shoot a cop.

Einstein.

He could not get any more Fox into that saty. He tried, he tried. I mean, it's it almost is a great example of American cinema versus you know, you know, Johnny cinema, or even even any kind of foreign language. It's not that the the subtlety is another thing the Americans have ever really learned to.

Do and by themselves. In subtlety, they're just like, here's what's happening, and it's happening as loud and as action based as possible.

Which is kind of funny because there are some things, like we say, maybe they do the emotion more subtle, because we've spoken a bit in this episode about there are times when the handling of some of the sentimental stuff is a bit heavy handed in Infernal affairs, So maybe it is they do something subtle they.

Do, you know, and vice versa. But yeah, yeah, it's incredible. What do you think thematically?

The like this is obviously starts with the Buddhism, you know, and the emotional hell, which is a great because these both these characters are in emotional hell.

They're sort of stuck in limbo. They're both trying to quit and get out of their various games, but they can't. They keep get they keep getting drawn back in. They're both looking for a way out to escape. Yeah, I felt that really clearly. One of the early rooftop scenes when Chan is talking to Wong and he says, I've been doing this for ten years, and you're like, you've been doing it for what.

Tys of your life?

Living undercover a constantly, you know, the thread of your life hanging by a thread. Only only two people in the world know that you're you know, it's just like the stress. And I felt like, yeah, absolutely, that is emotional hell. That is a that is an eternal hell you're stuck in.

There's a great line where he says when they're on the rooftops, where he says, there all cops there, all undercover cops like rooftops.

I think.

Because as I was watching it, I was thinking exactly that. I thought, geez, the only people got to rooftops in movies, it seems, are either undercover cops or you know, a romantic scene overlooking, you know, when they've ducked out from.

The from the work function.

I guess because it's like, what's the word. Visually, It's like the rooftop is above everything. You know, you're rising above it all. So if you're an undercover cop, suddenly this is the moment, you're alone, you're above everything. You have perspective on stuff, right, I guess you know that's obviously film one. I want stuff, but I don't frankly effective.

When he shot when it wasn't in the rift of when I almost gasped when he actually shot in the in the car park, when Laud took Sam down, I was like, oh, fuck, what happens?

What happens? That I was so I was so engrossed that that that was surprising to me that he took him down. I was like, what happens now? What's yeah?

And that whole the whole secrets of going into the elevator and then when and then when Chang gets taken down, you are like, fuck, what's happening?

Happens now? Yeah, we're running out of characters.

Oh you do forget how high that body count is in the part of them and yeah, here it's it's yeah the elevator, you know, coming out of the elevator with the idea it's yeah, great.

And it's a mirror of the earlier scene when that moment where Wang is trying to escape, he has sent Chan to the window washing crane to get out of a building. They're trying to scap down the building, and.

Which, by the way, I would have no idea how.

It's like, I don't know. Next thing, he falls, he dies, and the whole movie is up now. And like elevator dramas, so like Wong is walking into the elevator, passed some criminals who are trying to find him and kill him, and he's pretending like he's organizing an apartment purchase or something,

Yeah, I thought he I thought one could have done a I don't know, like, considering all he had to do was hide, stay away from these criminals, I thought he could have done.

A better job, like a bathroom, find another space.

Did he put a hat on the bail or No, I don't think you put a hat on basically got on the phone.

It was like he was talking to his wife about it. He had a brochure and I realized that brochure. It's like, yeah, he could have. You can tell you're not under cover. That's not your thing.

He's an admin cop, you know.

Yeah, mate, thank you so much.

One other thing I did love It reminded me and I'm not sure if you've ever done this in Hong Kong, but I love the idea of hitting golf balls off rooftops into water.

I mean, let's get Australia, whoever the development place.

You can do that in Penrith in Sydney. Well, I don't know if you still could, but twenty years ago. So I went when I was in high school. I went and there's like three stories high of driving range and can just whack him into water. I think they were sort of like I collected somehow by a boat. I think. I don't know, but if you want to go to Penrith in Sydney.

Because I remember when golf kind of really exploded in Asia around around this time. I might have even been like, you know, a bit earlier, like in the nineties or in late eighties, and I remember hearing about these kind of like crazy kind of things that where they would actually get golf rangers, and I was just like, that is that is amazing?

Well, apparently there's a there's a tower in Saudi Arabia. Maybe that's like, you know, one of those one hundred and fifty story buildings, and Tiger Woods has gone there to whack golf balls off the top of that as well. It's like golf is a crazy sport.

Yeah. Yeah.

And one of moment I did love was when Lao actually takes down Sam and the classic slow clap when he gets back into the office.

It was great.

I'm glad that exists, not just in Western cinema. The slow clap is alive, and well.

It's a universal trope slow clap.

He walks in, he's not sure how that's going to be handled, and then everyone's looking a bit kind of you know, a bit of side eye going on, and then it's all of a sudden. Thank you very much, mate, Thank you for watching this. This movie, this podcast comes with homework, and I'm so rap that you did it.

No, thanks for having me. The plot is so complex, I had such a I had to take notes while I was watching it to remember it all. I've struggled throughout the moments of this podcast remember at all. But yeah, it was a thank you for giving me an excuse to finally watch this film pet my pleasure.

Mate. Are you interested in watching them now? The sequels?

I think so, Yeah, I think so. I think I'm on I'm on tour now and I think there'll be moments of emotional vulnerability where I'll need something to like sit down, sitch my brain off too. I will probably watch the sequels and prequels to this I have during those moments.

Brilliant mate, Thank you so much, and yeah, we'll catch you soon.

Thanks me.

Hey, there we go.

Michael hing Hingers is during his show Long Live the Hing. It's a great title. It's worth the ticket price just for the title alone. Long Live the Hing is playing around the nation, So if you get a chance, please catch Michael hing That's a great one.

Really enjoyed that.

Like I said, I've had the box set for over a decade unwrapped, so it was nice to clear the plastic on that one and have a listen have a watch of Infernal Affairs.

Really enjoyed it.

We'll be diving back into the sequels down the track. We may not cover it as the podcast.

I'm not sure.

Are they classics? Is Infernal Affairs two and three classics? I don't know, I don't know. I know I've heard of Infernal Affairs.

I knew that. Yeah, maybe I'll watch them and then decide.

But thank you everyone listening to the podcast really and loving doing this again, particularly when I get to watch movies that I've never seen before and I can tick off the old bucket list like Infernal. You can reach out to us at yasny podcast at gmail dot com, or you can follow the links in a page.

You can jump on the old speak pipe.

We call it the speak pipe, and it's like an answer machine message and you can leave a message and we'll play it.

And we just love hearing your voices. We love hearing your voices.

Marty Middlebrook has gone on to me at the Gmail account and he has another Annette funa Cello update. For some reason, people, we did the grease with Mark Humphrey's great episode, really fun, and I mentioned that I wasn't really sure who a net funa Cello was, and we've got more emails about that than anything else people wanted me to know that, and that Funa Cello was from the Mickey Mouse Club.

She was quite a buxom woman.

Yeah, that's where the reference comes from, so Marty says, Hi, Peter, I love the podcast, just catching up on a few. Listen to the episode with Sushi Mango. So that one with the boys and Napoleon Dynamite and the reference to a net and jags reminded me that she gets referenced in stand by Me in a similar way. Okay, we'll have to check that out stand by Me, and these include the little meme and one of the characters is

He's fantastic in it. It's a sex comedy movie, but it's so much more.

I think it's closer to it sits in between the Graduate and Ferrish Bueler's Day Off. It's a much smarter film than since some people remember it for it's Tom Cruise, Rebecca did Risky Business. That is next week with Ross and I record Live at the Adelaide French Festival. Until then, take care and so we leave all Pete Saint Mansal and to our friends of the radio audience.

We've been a pleasant over time