Get a Peter Hell, are you here? Welcome to You ain't seen nothing yet?
The movie Podcast, where I chat to a movie lover about a classic or beloved movie they haven't quite got around to watching until now. And today's guest singer, songwriter, musician, podcaster, broadcaster, author, entrepreneur mate Claire Bowditch.
The first rule of fake club is you do not talk about fake.
Club now always. You're afraid of you broke my heart.
I admire your luck, mister Bond, James.
Bond, they couldn't have at any right now, you ain't seen nothing yet.
If the keys to a happy, healthy life is to surround yourself with positive, creative people, than everyone to try to become mates with Claire Bontage. Now, understandably, not everyone is able to make that happen for a.
Variety of reasons geography, access, etc.
But what you should do is attempt to devour the creativity of Claire Bontage anyway you can. And the great news is, due to the prolific and neglecting nature of Claire's work, there is more opportunities than with most people.
Firstly, there is Claire's music.
From her debut release Autumn Bone to what was left, featuring her breakout hit Divorcee at twenty three. It's still such a stunning song. The moon looked on the Winter. I chose Happiness Incredible albums for me. My favorite and for many is her seminal album Modern Day Addiction, with which is a true masterpiece in my top five of all time. I revisit it quite often, and if you haven't listened to it, I urge you to do so. I have been guilty of forcing people to listen to.
Songs from this album.
At a post Logi's function, I made a group of people listen to Claire's song Your Own kind of Girl, and I said, if you have daughters, you need to listen to this song and make them listen to it. I don't have daughters, so I'll just force other people with daughters to listen to that song. It's such an incredible song, so many incredible songs on that album. Please listen to it if you haven't already, and I'm sure
you will love it. Using the title of that song, Claire released her raw, honest and life affirming memoir Your Own Kind of Girl, which again I have passed on to many many people.
It is a stunning piece of world work.
Claire is also a social entrepreneur, founding The Big Heart of Business, which exists to teach creative people about business and business people about creativity in ways that makes sense. Claire was in Offspring. She hosted ABC Radio. She's a podcaster. Claire is honest, believes in the power of positivity, but he's not afraid to speak about her own demons and self doubts. Claire is incredibly talented, compassionate, funny, and I'm bloody stoked to be hanging with her today.
Hello, I'm Claiboditch. My three favorite films are as follows one, car Wise in the Mood for Love, I'm all I'm going to take?
Which one?
Have the Sound of Music? By the Sound of music, Oh ray Me Do Rainy? And lastly Black Balloon by Alissa Down Why Hello Helloul. But the truth is there's now another contender in the mix. Until last night, I've never seen the movie Rocky.
Surely this is one movie that barely needs a synopsis provided Is there anyone on this planet Earth who doesn't know what Rocky is about? On November twenty five, nineteen seventy five, we find a small time boxer getting heckled and ged, and the rams shackled about in a dodgy gym. Despite being declared the winner, the Italian Stallion claims forty four dollars fifty five cents after locker, shower and twel
charges are deducted. If this isn't rock Bottom, it's pretty close for Rocky Balboa, played of course by Sylvester Stallone, who also wrote the screenplay.
Living in a.
Shithole, working for a loan shark, barely able to get the attention of local pet store worker Adrian, played beautifully by Talia Shaier, but things eventually are on the way up. Heavyweight champion of the World Apollo Creed Carl Weathers show boats into town talking a big game, but that talk gets curtailed when his opponent is injured. Determined not to miss out on the chance for another payday, Apollo has the idea to give an unknown fighter the chance of a lifetime.
Directed by John g. Elvedson said it in a fever.
The Crawati Kids stand by Me an iconic score by Bill Conti, the highest grossing film of nineteen seventy six, It won three Oscars for Best Film, Best Director, and best editing.
Rocky is the.
Ultimate underdog Rags the Riches movie Claire Boatage. Are you inspired enough to run up the steps of Parliament House.
In Spring Street here in Melbourne?
Not only am I inspired enough, I already did it alone. That's why I was laid.
Welcome to you, wanting nothing yet absolute treat.
This is one of my favorite podcasts.
Oh well, you're very kind, and I had the treat last night because I watched it last night as you did.
And I know you watched it because you sent me love the little videos throughout throughout you. You were set up, you had popcorn, we did. Did you watch it by yourself? As the family?
Myself, my cat, my dog, my husband Marty, and one of my sons, Oscar. So the other kids were out, that's the only reason they weren't watching. Yeah, I said to them, guys, I was not allowed to watch this when I was a child. I'm giving you the opportunity now now they're fifteen, fifteen, and nineteen. So they were so two of them left the house and with the other one stayed and we got to watch it together.
Who There's a lot to talk about and we'll get to it soon. So this is something you weren't allowed to watch. And we spoke about as I do most guests. There's a couple of films that we I ask you that you haven't seen. There were I think Aaron Brockovich may have been one that was tantalizing to chat to you about. That would have been amazing. But I feel like Rocky is such an iconic film and I we've
been close to maybe getting it done. Luke McGregor nominated but then told me it's three months earlier.
They're not the rules, Luke.
No, Luke. I mean, look, he's an artist, so he's always pushing the boundaries. No, that's not the rules. And I'm so grateful that they are the rules and that you've stuck to them. Like, I appreciate this disciplinary sort of streaking you because I've benefited greatly from it.
Well, I cannot wait to get stuck in talking about Rocky. There's so much to talk about. Let's talk about your three favorite films. Great now, I thought the first one, I have no idea what this film is. I thought you were about to say Willy Wonk and my Mind with the Chocolate Factory. Yeah, yeah, yeah, My apologies.
Not at all, not at all. It was actually Jelly in the Chocolate Factory. The original was one of my favorite films as a child, but one. Ka Wai is an incredible Shanghai based director whose beauty and ability to play with light just broke my heart when the first time I saw in the Mood for Love, which is essentially a story, you know, a story about two people
who are engaging in falling in love. It was made in two thousand, but the first time I saw it, I just felt that I had seen something that would stay with me for life, something that was beautiful and true. Now the world felt the same way, you know. It's one of the few films and few filmmakers from Asia who was able to crack through into a Western market. His movies are all subtitled, so they're all in original language. But it's just a beautiful, contemplative story. And as always,
it's the soundtrack. Who I don't know who wrote the soundtrack. Actually that's ridiculous, I'm making a note here, but the soundtrack, the way it all worked to and the gentleness of the movie was just so beautiful. So it's stuck in my.
Heart all of these years, and what's the film about.
It's really essentially about two people, two people who are living quite small lives and find each other within that life. They engage on what could be called an affair of sorts or the contemplation of an affair for a lot of it. So I won't spoil that for you, but that's part of its beauty. It's about real people in real life and the emotional struggle of trying to find truth and connection in an environment where it's not encouraged.
You spoke about light, then we're actually having a conversation about light the recording and you think about light a lot like you have a relationship with light, and that obviously you when you perform, whether it be in a video or on stage, you must be thinking about light a lot.
Did did this inform that? Were you? Were you aware of your relationship with light? You watch us all? Did this begin that relationship?
Let's just let's just go back to track a bit and explain this. When I say relationship with light, light, I guess what Pete's referring to is, you know, previous conversation we've had based on a renovation that we're doing, where myself and my lovely electrician. You know, we were learning from each other. He was fascinated by the strength of feeling that I had around the color, the warmth,
and the choice of light. So I'll explain it. We all have our own sensitivities, things that sort of You know, you might smell jackfruit and not like the smell. It's very You know, your sense of smell is really strong. One is too, But one of my strongest emotional reactions and senses is sight and light. So if we're in a room and there's white light, and I realized this as a kid, I just don't feel great. I feel
cold and scared. If there is warm light, I feel open and able to It's sort of like I feel like I belong. Now call it synthase easier or something else if you like, that's fine, but I think it's not uncommon. I'm not sure if Wi's ability to play with light, it probably did inform me. But I think what it did was I responded to it because I saw that he saw light in the same way, or he felt the emotional quality of light in the same way I do. It sounds ridiculous, but if I can.
It doesn't seem ridiculous at all.
And the reason I wanted to mention it because I just maybe think we don't often take in. Everyone's so busy, we don't often take in. We might go, oh, I like this, I like the way that smells, or I love the way you know that that thing looks, but we don't then go, Okay, well, how do I make those choices in my life to have these things surrounding me more often?
And I think what happens is some of us who are sensitive to certain things, it really affects our life. So that's why we're forced to sort of consider it. And that's probably what happened with me. I just realize I'm a performer, and I would reflect back on performances. Why was that useful? Well like why did I kill it that night and not another night? And so often it had to do with the sensitivity the lighting in the room. And it goes back to probably a basic
human or maybe mammalian impulse. Let's say cats don't give birth in full light. Women prefer to give birth in modest light as well, just because it's one less thing to think about, you know, cats go to the back of the cupboard where it's dark and they do their thing.
So anytime I'm vulnerable if the lights are bright. And this is an interrogation technique, you know, it's been used freeans to the lights are bright, you're overwhelmed and you're probably not responding to whatever that is that you want to the nuance of whatever it is, the subtlety of whatever it is that's going on.
But it's why restaurants often use handles, yes, you know, as opposed to your spotlights.
It probably goes all the way back there. You know, we were people around the campfire once. We were people who didn't actually have any exposure to electric light until the very first person who could call himself an electrician, Edison. Yeah, what luck he invented. Edison was the first electrician. We think of it as a normal, you know, everyday trade and very important trade. But it didn't exist until that dude made it exists. Isn't that wild?
It's crazy?
And the same too with podcasters, pech. I mean, they didn't exist until quite recently exactly, and.
We've taken the will by storm, both of us. Claire, go see that movie.
That's all I'm saying is beautiful.
Yes, when was it made? Two thousand and two, two thousands great.
I think The Sound of Music is a movie that we covered recently with the wonderful Judith Flucy.
I can't believe that Juda had not seen.
It more than any other. I mean, I'm shock that you haven't seen Rocky, but I understand it. Jude seemed to be raised Catholic. I think you actually considered becoming a nun like a movie buff. None of it made sense, and I had seen it. I'd seen the Sound of Music. Not as many times I've seen Star Wars, but kind of in the vicinity.
Do you like the movie?
I love the movie?
Correct, Yeah, that's right, because that's the right answer. Now, I don't trust people who tell me they don't like the Sound of Music. I'm sorry if that's you. But what's going on there? What? How can you not love that movie?
Well, I mean you might have to jack with dude, that's.
Right, you know why? Because I think you had to be indoctrinated early, you know, maybe that's it.
I think there are a lot of movies like that. I think this really.
This is one of those movies, because I think Jude made some reasonable, reasonably good points about the lack of plot in.
The movie and the extended plot and that you know, yeah, look, she's not wrong, and.
It doesn't after the Nazis invade. It kind of doesn't become about Maria after that, after the wedding doesn't really become about Maria become kind of Captain von Trap's movie.
And yeah, but.
The music and la costumes as well, but also the spirit of the thing, which is again this story of someone who is doggedly intent on being who she is within the confines of society at that time. You know, Maria v She's she should never have been a nun like we knew that from seeing her that was that was not her fate. She was there to sing and share songs. It is the ease with which she says shares songs and the normalcy of that that I think I love as an adults as well as a costume.
So we mentioned the costumes. I've actually got a dress that I bought recently in the style of the Maria von Trapp playsuits made out of the curtains. I wore that at a show recently, great response. It's sort of white with greed.
Have you ever sung any Sun music live? Like thrown in the.
Little Yeah, I did a sort of is this one called it quite a spooky enchanting improv of you know, the song farewell alvidazain adue to. I can't remember the name of the action, but yeah, on the stairs. Recently at a show it was responded too strongly, I think positively. I'm not sure, but.
I did carry up the stairs.
It was at the forensics four room and the stick there was a staircase, so that was all part of it. And I was wearing the bond trap dress. But it was in the spirit of a random creative adventure. You know, sometimes we've got to try stuff that's a bit scary and it makes us feel alive again. So that's why I did that. But that that story of what creativity can bring to her life, now, that was really important for me as a little kid. We watched this. We
watched that movie with my family. I think it might have been at Rye camping ground, local town hall. I remember Albi Mangele's Adventures being there on there and also the sound of music, and it was just a sort of a show that was always on every time it came on TV. But we'd all sit down and watch it together, but we'd be sent to bed before the Nazis came, you know, so we would usually watch the first half of the second half. It was shocking as an adult to watch it.
I did learn, maybe unsurprisingly that when I was researching for the Dudes episode, that in Germany, like a lot of the German executives and film industry, they wanted basically to end at the wedding, so that was where it swissed to end.
So you basically saw the German version of the elm.
I saw the German version, the thought that it is actually based on a true story, The thought that that von Trapp family did run away and find shelter in the hills in some canton. You know, that's all extraordinary, and.
They left behind that they left behind that house like they left with very little money.
Eventually got to America.
And what was one of the fascinating things I learned was the real Maria von Trapp had like I think, her parents died.
When she was very young.
She was raised by an uncle who was not very nice. And it was when she actually when the kids showed her love that was and they gave her a kiss. That was the first time she'd ever actually been kissed any in any way, shape or form. And she fell in love with the kids before she fell in love with Captain von Trapp.
Wow, I mean, wouldn't be the first time a woman has I mean maybe Von Trapp was a bit of a pain in the a And you know, having.
That whistle like the whistle was whizzle was too much. And the use of.
Soft lens in that movie too, I don't know, Look, it just it blew my mind. Yeah, I didn't know there was soft lens. All I knew is I was looking at the screen suddenly everything was soft and sweet. Yeah, but I think it was the sweetness perhaps of the film, her rebellious nature within the strict confines of the time, and also the frugality of it. So there they are these you know, brilliant he's a millionaire, but she's using what they have curtains and so on. Now, my mum
was brought up. I was born in Melbourne. Mom was born in Amsterdam in forty two, in the middle of occupied Amsterdam, one of eleven and she grew up through the First World War and the aftermath of that, and she often speaks about the cleverness with which people were able to repurpose things. You know, they didn't have much food, so sometimes people would because everything was on ration, so sometimes people would just make soup out of potato peels.
So to see her making costumes out of the curtains, I just love that. It was so deeply creative. But anyway, so that's the sound of music, my gosh.
And another fun fact if you haven't listened to For those who have didn't listened to the episodes, this live too lives at this stage our only live performance. Will do some more soon. But one of my favorite facts was the money that the von Trap's got. The reason they got so much money is not because of Captain von Trapp, because his late wife and her great grandfather I think, invented the torpedo.
It was torpedo money.
That is fascinating. The other thing to mention about that movie and why it's so deeply affecting still, it's like all a lot of the stories that we see set in that time, which is you see the courage of people who stood up to what was clearly wrong and the sacrifice that they made, and I just you know, I just think when you can combine that with song and dance, because you know, Rocky didn't have song and
danced Didy. We'll talk about that later, but when you can combine that in that way, it's no wonder the world fell in love with that movie. Yeah, I respect you, but that's it. That's one of my favorites.
Yeah, I agree, I agree, Black Balloon.
It's hard for me to choose a favorite movie. There are so many wonderful Australian directors and movies. A couple of years back, I had the pleasure of working with a crew on a television show, got Offspring. Now I'm not an actor, but you'll be great work, Thanks Buddy. During a COVID Offspring came on a streaming service for the first time and it's created bit of renaissance in my own recognizability at the supermarket shallow stades. The point being I had a very minor role is the truth of it.
But I had the.
Pleasure there of understanding more about how films are made and filmmakers create their work and also directors. Black Balloon was made by one of the incredible directors I got to work with on Offspring. Her name is Alissa Down. She wrote and directed this film. It was based on her life, really and to understand the enormous effort it takes to create a film. You know, that was my first insight into all of that. But that's not why
I love the film. When I watched it, it's a powerful, beautiful story featuring a family who were different yet again set I think in the seventies, late seventies, early eighties. It star a number of unusual stars. Tony Collet's in there, but also Jim A Ward who was a model at the time. But the story itself is about it's sold through the perspective of a brother whose brother is severely autistic in a time where we really didn't understand what that meant to live, what it meant within a family
to live with that kind of incredible difference. I'll just say that it's a beautifully told film because it's true film. It talks about the concepts of the time, the toughness of the time, those Australian ideas of you know, you're weak if you don't take care of your own but the effect that having a sibling who's different in your family can have on a family in both a difficult way also in a really profoundly beautiful way. So there's a depth to this story. As I said, it is
based somewhat on Melissa's own experience. I just thought it was gorgeously executed. It's a comedy drama.
Yeah, it's a beautiful film. I did see it when it came out.
I don't think I could add anything that as any more than what you've said, but I remember being blown away by all the performances, by the craft of the film, and then the power of it.
It's a beautiful film.
Even as I'm talking about I'm sort of stumbling over it because I haven't seen it for a few years now, but it's one that sat with me. One of the things I really was delighted by was the performance of Jem Award. We don't expect much from you know, if you don't know who she is. She's a person who is very famous for being a model as a teenager, I don't know what, and she's sort of gone quite quiet.
She's living quite a private life. Kate Bush style, you know, had a lot of success, prefers a privacy, and he's unusual in that way too, so I find that all quite fascinating. But her performance was so true. I don't know that. It stretched her terribly, and I've always wondered what else she might have to offer to acting if she wanted to. But it was a beautiful surprise. There's a tenderness to that film. It's a beauty.
It's a great nomination. Great three films.
Now let's move on and let's talk about the film we are here to talk about nineteen seventy six. The highest grocing film in nineteen seventy six won the Oscar written amazingly. When people find out, I think people forget who wrote this film. The star of the film wrote it. So it'sisterlone. It's set up eight movies spanning over five decades.
Eight. Yeah, there you go.
I've got so much ahead of me.
Oh, you'll be coming back. Claire an incredible film, iconic Claire Boatage. Did you enjoy Rocky?
I can't tell you how much I enjoyed Rocky.
Yes, I'm so glad.
I mean when you came in, you know you were making some motions towards enjoying it, and you did send me a video last night of you pubbing the air when Rocky goes up the stairs.
I am surprised by how much I loved it. I thought that i'd watched it, actually, And when I look down a sort of list of movies that of the era that I hadn't watched it, I thought to myself, No, I've never seen Rocky. What I'd seen a few of the iconic images yep, of course, Rocky pumping and pumping fists in the air, running down the streets of Philly, maybe smashing a clump of meat. I might have seen that clip at some point. And of course I knew
the music extremely well, but not so well. I actually thought I have the Tiger as part of Rocky One.
It's not it's so funny because I sent Derek here at Cassaway Studios. I sent him either Tigers who played at the start, and he goes, it's actually Rocky too, mate.
Oh bloody hell, it is too. Because I said him before I watched it last night.
It's Bill CONTI was the music maker of this Rocky soundtrack, and you know, you know all the songs, you think you know the movie. I'd never seen it. I just didn't realize that there was a story there that was beyond two like spashion each other and us getting sort of inspo and I always sort of knew that it had some effect on dress code. You know, there's a common dress code that i'd seen and spotted in the eighties of men with fedoras on and leather jackets. I
didn't you know. Now I know where that came from. You still see it around from time to time, and.
I like that he came in bouncing your squash ball this morning too. Exactly did it reshape how you and you just saw it last night? And this podcast?
I always remind people you're you're still processing what you saw last night, So did it reshape in your mind? Sylvester Stallone, It sure did.
You can hear that. I'm slightly speechless here because, of course, after watching the movie, I haven't slept. I've been up all night really finding out more about Sylvester his contribution. I underrated him, is what I'm.
Going to say.
I thought he was someone who got lucky. Somewhere along the line, someone funded a field film and spawned you know, it was really the beginning of spawning second, third, fourth, fifth, et cetera. Serials of movies. None of that is true. Sylvester Stallone was a kid who was maybe in his thirties when this film finally got up. He wrote the film himself after failing and failing and failing in his career as an attempted actor in America in the seventies,
and this was his last chance Texico. You know, this was a script that he wrote based on, you know, some thoughts that he had, possibly even I think there was a court case later on about who was actually based on and so on. But he's telling a biographical story and he put everything into it. And the same way Rocky did. He refused to allow anyone to buy the film the script of the film without him being
attached to it. He was offered an enormous amount of money to sell it someone else would play it, and he said no. So there was all that sort of really interesting stuff about Sylvesterterlone.
He said no with one hundred and six dollars in the bank. Wow, And he was offered three hundred and forty thousand dollars in nineteen seventy six.
What's that like, fifteen million?
Yeah, it's it's something huge. I just do a calculator, Yeah, yeah, fifteen million dollars.
She had one, yeah, one, three, three.
But it is incredible because he also was playing these roles where he was he was the mugger. So I told them Stephen Colbert, because I was always a mugger. I mugged you know Kojack Jack Kojack and Edward Woodwood and you know all these other guys in these TV.
Shows, and couldn't get a break, could Yeah?
And then he thought, well, what happens if I can obviously people ask how people see me? What if I create a character where I'm still like a mugger, but I've got I've got more going on than people realize. I've got something else that's worth, something that people can't quite see.
And that's a classic Joseph Campbell hero's journey, but told in the context of its time, with the language of its time. We will talk about language maybe a little later, or some of some of the perceptions that we would now find questionable, which were really really interesting because there it all was out in the open. That skill of working with what you've got. I think that again, we talked about it before the sound of Music, but that
again is really interesting to me. So not only was Sylvester salone unable to find a break, had the clever realization as an artist that this is how I'm seeing, so I'm going to work within that field. There's something else about Sylvester's face that I found out that I found really really fascinating. I always thought he was affecting, trying to affect a look on his face, like James dean Or. But the truth is I found out last night that when he was born, it was a traumatic berth.
There was an obstetrician. The doctor had to use two pairs of forceps to get that kid, Sylvester out and in the course of that, one of the nerves in Sylvester's face was was seve it. The reason he looks and has the that look that we recognize him for is because he's partially paralyzed in the bottom of his face. He used again what that look said to the world and told a story within the context of who he was. I just I just love that. Yeah, things before that movie weren't going that well.
For No, he did a movie called Death Race two thousand. He wasn't the lead, he was a smaller part, and executives were watching that and I think they're even watching the wrong person. Though there was a blonde had boken there and they said, hang on isn't his space to be attained. He's blonde, and they're like, oh, well, he'll make it work, and they actually almost cast the wrong the wrong I'm not sure how that happens, and that might that might be a bit of bullshit anyway.
But there was another career he was he was going with.
He had made some some adults films otherwise akaography.
Soft porn. I haven't seen them myself, so I can't really I can't say.
Next week's eisode and you ain't seen nothing yet.
But he spoke about that later, didn't he? Do you know anything about what it was revealed at the time or was it something he got secret that came up as a shame?
I thought it came later. Funnily enough, I haven't. I haven't gone down the rabbit hole of the flies a career.
Fair enough, fair enough. What we know just from you know, it's a basic overview is yeah, he had to. He was desperate to pay the rent. He had no way of paying the rent. He was offered a role in a soft porn film before a couple of years before Rocky came out. It was either that or he mugged someone and stole the rent. Money, he said, so he
chose the soft porn film. Now, the fact that in those times, if a woman had done that, they wouldn't have been able to have a career, even you know, in today's day and age, we know everything about everyone. But he would have thought to himself, I'll do this, no one will ever see it, I'll pay my rent, and I'll keep trying to sell my brilliant screenplay. He did what he had to do to make the art. I just got on him.
Yeah, I, like I said, I.
Haven't seen the film, not sure the quality of the work done there. But again, it's a story within a story. It's a story of someone who's constantly being given limited opportunity by the world and still is carrying this little secret idea of victory in his heart that maybe there's something more.
Yeah, and what this means is with this context, it makes Rocky. We think of Rockies. This boxing movie. Now, I would argue that it's not a boxing movie.
Well, yeah, maybe not. It did spawn the genre of what do we call it, sport drama?
Sport drama.
Yeah, it's not a boxing film. Is that wild?
It's amazing, Like, there's so much non boxing going on in this but when we know the story that you so beautifully this line sly story. It's a much more personal film than I think people remember it or give it credit for being this really this.
Is why because he.
Yeah, absolutely, and that's why he knocks back, you know, fifteen point when I think you did the calcination before cli million dollars, when he has just over one hundred bucks in the bank to play this role they wanted. The budget they offered was two million dollars, which at the time was a pretty decent budget. But it had to be played by James Kahn or Burt Reynolds or
Ryan O'Neill. And so I said, no, it has to be me, and big, big call, good, great call for him, a great call on the producers, and so they slashed a budget in half. They had one million dollars to do it after that, and they did it. Yeah, they did it, and he, you know, the commitment was that he would play the part.
It's so interesting our raw. I mean, I don't know if that added to the rawness of the settings, but a lot of it's filmed in darkened rooms. A lot of the lighting is natural. There's quite a few scenes that are at night or early in the morning, so they've used a lot of natural light in the way that they filmed it too, because of probably the stock that they use in those days. It looks beautiful. I watched it in filmaker mode on my TV, so there's
that beautiful look too. But it's a capsule. It's a time capsule, you know, the language of the time, the obsessions of people in the time, and that idea of trying to make a name for yourself yet again was sort of played out by every single character. You know. It wasn't I don't know if we're at that stage yet, but it wasn't just him. It was his trainer, it
was his best mate, it was his girlfriend. And it was also in the context of the times, you know, this moment in time where there was all this American pride around these discussions about what it is to be in this great land of America, the land of opportunity, you know. But because it was a fresh perspective, it wasn't written by I don't think by committee. It was written by a singular lens of singular original focus. This is one of the reasons it's so fascinating.
And it's great you mentioned the American Dream, which kind of Rocky doesn't really think he's he's invited to the American Dream. Does he like he's just living this life?
He doesn't. He's got so much self doubt, you know.
And and it's only when you had the lawyers and the promoters and the polo come to him and kind of dangle the American Dream in front of him, even though they didn't think it's really like. There's a great line in it during the fight with a polo where his trainer says, you know, once Rocky knocks him out and gives him a bit of hope, and all of a sudden, they've got to fight in their hands, And the trainer says to him, you know, you think this is a show.
He thinks this is a fight. And I love that line.
It's beautiful line. Yeah, it's always tempting to count ourselves out and ford to bitterness when things don't go right. I don't know about you, Pete, You've had a pretty successful career. You seem to work a bit, but there there are a lot of ups and down.
I want.
A lot of ups and downs in life, you see. And Rocky had this key moment in. It seems that the character had this key moment in his youth where he did have that touch of self belief and it wasn't matched by his coach. At the time. He felt that he wasn't seen, he wasn't given opportunity, and he sort of settled, you know, he started working for I Hope we don't spoil it for you guys, Spoil Heavy podcast,
Spoil Heavy. Then he took a job as a medium heavy, collecting debt for someone who may or may have worked in the mob. You know, he said, he settled that was the best he could do. He was making the best of the life that he could. He was taking small risks in the way that was safe enough for him to exist within the society he was in. But then there's this beautiful scene where he's offered the chance to fight Apollo and he says no, and someone reminds him.
The promoter reminds him, you know, this is your time to shine. He says, yeah, okay, And then is it Vinny who is the coach? Micky? Excuse me. Micky's a seventy six year old man who has canceled Rocky's locker recently. He's just looked at him and said, mate, you made your choices when you started working for the Heavy. I don't believe in your work anymore. If you're not going to pick yourself and you have the potential for greatness, you're out of the band. You know, you don't get
a locker at the gym anymore. But Micky then revises his own point of view. When this opportunity comes up, he has the vulnerability to knock on on. He's knocking on rocky door and he says, you know what you need. You need a manager, and I can do it. I'm seventy six, I've got so much to give, and Rocky says, get out, mate. He's bitter. He says, get out.
But let's have you want to listen to that scene please, I've organized this scene. We'll listen to it in two parts. So this is Mickey offering his management skills through Rocky, who eventually goes into a room and locks him out.
I want to be your manager.
You follow that to you, Fods said, I don't need no merch, but you can't lie what I'm going to give you.
I mean, I got pain and I got experienced.
I got pain, I got experienced too.
Listen, kid, here you go, he make what I need your help about ten years ago?
Right ten years ago, you never helped me. You didn't care.
Well, if you wanted help, I say, if you wanted help, why didn't you ask?
Why didn't you just ask me?
King?
Look, I asked, but you never heard nothing.
Well, I uh, I'm seventy.
Six years old.
And so Meredith burgesses Mikey. And there's so much we could play so much more about that scene. It's a beautiful moment earlier when he says, Mickey says something like you've got art, and he says, I may have heart, but I don't have my locker.
And I think the locker is You could argue that that is the thing.
That actually is what we would you would call the inciting incident that because it's it's a strangely kind of formulated film in a way, it's kind of genius.
But that the locker scene, it.
Gets his it gets they take his locker and he can't understand it, and then he and then what happens after that, It says he spied. It's the first time he gets really angry. He goes in the Mickey and that they have a screaming match, and then he tells he's still on the Adrien and the pestor and he can't quite get her attention or and she's kind of busy and he's talking about the locker and then the street kid. He takes his street kid.
Home, the young girl home, creeper.
Creeper, and she calls him a and he calls him a creeper, and then he says, how do you know what you're talking about?
Creeper?
And then he kind of mumbles it back to himself he had, So he's starting to believe his confidence has just been being and he's self worth has has been completely eroded. And then it's a whole you go. Paulie invites him to Thanksgiving and he's still.
Did you tell it? I'm coming? Did you tell her? Because he just.
Can't believe that Adrian would actually be excited about him being there. And then when he kind of finally believes that this, you know, okay, I'm here for dinner, Paulie stuffed at the moment and throws the turkey out of the house.
In a very weird move. Weird and violent, moved weird and very violent.
Not a forgiveness for him has to be yes.
And there's a lot to talk about, Paulie, there's no doubt about that.
And then he kind of reluctantly in the end, kind of through the door, and he had you know, he's got these wonderful little lines. I never spoke to a door before. And then it's important though, I think that Adrian at this point opens.
The door and she's ready to go out with him.
Spot on. He had to ask first. So and that's what Mickey is saying, and that's what life keeps saying to him, and that's what life keeps saying to us. You can count yourself out anytime, but your nexus of control, you know, the circumstances of your life you cannot control, but you can keep showing up. You can talk to a bloody door, feel like a full risk something. When Rocky Is changes his mind and does yell out after Mickey, wait, wait, wait, you know, okay, I admit I need help, I need
a manager. So he's sort of making the best choices for the potential of possibility. But like all great acts of courage, it is courageous not because we're not scared, because we don't know what's going to happen. He doesn't know if he's going to win. He doesn't know if it's whether his leg's hurt, his knees hurt. Adrian won't talk to him. But what we find inspiring and why we still love this film is that he keeps showing up.
He keeps showing up, and he keeps making that little tiny choice where he can.
Let's have him listen to the at the second part of that scene, I did take us away from it. You be beautifully brought us back to it. Claire.
This is Rocky yelling as Mickey has already left the apartment, so he's yelling down the stairs now. And this is all improvised by svisister line.
Enough forget.
Two years are going to my house, my house, my house, stink. Try it sticks. I have from don't fall around me your oh my bright mack. At least you have pride. I know brid lot legs are going. Everything that's going, no one's getting them. Knock. This guy comes up off with me a fight. Do you want to fight the fight? Yeah, I'll fight the big fight. I wouldn't want to fight that big fight that was gonna have. I get that I already get that. You want to be excited. See
you are helping me. How do you make it like late day working? Nothing working? They got God take the check, ol batas.
You come around here, you want to move in here and they come a here my.
House, real life, come in and no steps.
To play steps I mean Swiss sillone is.
So it's such a beautiful, heartfelt, naturalistic moment, like that's an outburst, and he has a couple of outbursts, but it's it's juxtaposed.
With these moments of tenderness throughout the whole film.
The way he was speaking there. So we listened to it last night. I was watching it. Obviously, I had to put on the.
Subtitles.
Subtitles actually, and again you know we can sort of laugh about it. We always did laugh about it. I previ thought that that was a choice that Sylvestis alone was making. You know, I met I became aware of him when I was a kid, and he was already by then. You know, his movies ran by Rocky, they were huge. He was a cliche. I discern him with some sort of lucky lucky dude. But he because of that injury in his youth, parts of his tongue and lip is paralyzed. He has found a way to communicate
that is feel you know, it was Philly. He's a Philly boy using language from the time that chinks. But when you hear him really talk, even if I didn't have the subtitles on, I know what he's saying, you know, I know the I know the spirit of what he's saying. And that emotional quality huge rare in an actor, rare to sustain over a lifetime. But again, the fact that it's all based in the originality of who he is and work within the limitations that life gave him. I just find it bloody fascinating.
And then he takes a moment which we don't even see on camera, and he just he you know, but you can imagine it playing out where he's got Okay, I do need a manager, and Micky's good.
He has come to me.
At least I won't forward to bitterness.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. He chooses, he chooses to fight, and he chooses literally Jesus to fight, and.
He goes to Mickey and it's it's shot long lens and it's beautiful.
You know.
At the start of the film, he goes into the pet shop where Adrian works. Adrian doesn't talk very much. Adrian is his love interest. But there's this one little image that stuck with me. In there, he's buying a turtle terrapin, you know, a domestic turtle. He's just buying whatever he can to have a chance to chat with with Adrian. Really, but in there, there's this huge dog in a very small cage within the pet shop, and I keep thinking about this image that you know, that
was him. He's huge dog in a small cage, and this is him realizing he wants more freedom, he wants more choice. He you know, the cage is comfortable, but he needs a way out. Throughout the watching of this film, my husband kept saying the words Adrian, and I'm like, what are you doing? Why do you say that? What do you say? Are you giving me a clue? What are you saying? And I couldn't work out why he kept saying that, and I wanted him to shush because I wanted to make up my own idea about the
film and so on. But anyway, we'll get to that later. But there are a couple of times where he's admitting he needs Adrian and he needs love and he needs tenderness that she's been denied by her life as well. That's beautifully paid.
Well, it's about two people actually seeing each other, you know, like.
Adrian feels invisible and worthless, and we know that we can understand me through Paul's relationship. And you know how
Volatiley he is a brother, guys, you know that. But yeah, who was In the original script, it was supposed to be Adrian was Jewish, and that was going to be a Jewish mother, like an overbearing Jewish mother, and then they for whatever reason, they changed it to her brother and an overpowering I see kind brother who Funnily enough, as the sequels go on with that and they said, too much becomes more of almost a comical must soften a character.
But I think it's about two people being seen.
Like Rocky feels worthless, feels like a bum them in the mint of times, you have a bum.
Stink creeper, you know all those like screw you, I'm a bomb, Like, yeah, just the language of the time so beautiful. We've got to bring those things back.
And the only thing he's got to talk about really is boxing. And there's a beautiful scene they go on this date. It was supposed to be shot at a restaurant, but they couldn't afford extras. So they can have the idea of doing it. How about we do it at someplace where it's it's t I closed, I shrink. Yeah, let's have a listened to that.
You know, I got started fighting?
Huh? No, am I talking too loud?
Three minutes? My father, he's a oh man, it was never too smart. He says to me. You weren't born much of a brain, you.
Know, so, uh, you better start using your body right, so I've become.
A fighter, you know what I mean? While you why you.
Left my mother?
She said the opposite thing.
What she said?
What you said the opposite?
So you weren't born much of your body, so you better develop your brain, so she said.
You time, I asked you a question? Absolutely, why do you want to fight? Because I can't sting a dance?
You?
Hey, that was durrific.
I'm pretty good at this. He's very sweet.
It's super sweet. I can't see her dance. I love that all those beautiful classics have playfulness that he has. What we hear is like his battle with his own inner critic and his own idea of an inner champion. Yeah, and hers too, and how when they see each other things shift for them. They're able to see each other through each other's eyes, but it took uts on both of their behalf. I can't imagine how that would have how that the play would have been without that love interest element.
Yeah, yeah, well they probably would have had to lean into more boxing, I would imagine and make it this more of a boxing movie than it actually actually is. When I was watching it last night, and I always think about the person watching the film, I thought, I really hope you were really enjoy it, but I didn't think.
I was quite surprised. I really did love it.
Yeah, And the more I watched it and the more I thought about, I thought, I think you're going to relate to rock.
You know.
Let you you've written your beautiful memoir, your Own kind of Girl, which I mentioned at the start, like.
I followed your career, you know when you know, since Divorce.
By twenty three came out a long time ago, a long time ago, and I continue to follow and I went for new music.
Clearly we'll get to that.
And you just assume people come out fully formed and you know, ready for the bright lights and that with all the abilities and experience in the world, but it takes, and you did it so beautiful in your book to talk about the anxiety and how the courage it takes to kind of make, you know, the get to a stage and to stand on stage. So when I I was thinking about that as I was watching Rocky last night, I thought, I think you might connect with this character.
Yeah, I didn't. I think in a way, the reason we all do is because we all have these limitations, you know, these things that happened to us and our role in life. You know, we're lucky, We're eighty six billion yurons who somehow got to live life. But we are wired for survival, and survival is you know, it's right there, and the most basic rung of Maslow's the hierarchy of needs, and life keeps throwing all this stuff at us, and to choose survival is wise. It's what
we all do. But we long for more as well. So life and our brains are constantly telling us to play more. And yet there's this other part of us
that's telling us to make courageous choices. We all are fighting with those two forces and trying to find our best way in for me writing a book talking about the most difficult things that have happened in my life and trying to bring the light out from them and work out why, you know, why I had the brain that I had and why I felt the ways that I did to work out what to do with those things. That's why I have the privilege of being a creative person. Now.
If I could have done things differently, I might have. If Rocky could have had a different kind of job, he might have too. But we all see a little bit of that curry. We all have to call in that courage right throughout our lives. That's a creative process. As why I always say everyone's creative because we're all working within limitations and we're finding the best way to mush them together and make stuff that's interesting and meaningful and playfully comic and allows us to connect. So loved
I loved that. I love that that story became has become a part of our popular culture now. Like I said, I was always laughing about the music, and sometimes we'd play Rocky. We play Rocky in the Rocky theme songs, and I have the target from Rocky too in the back room before a show to pep us up, you know. But now I said, of no, right, So it's based in something that was significant, you know. It was a significant story told in a simple context, with limitations and
done masterfully. I would say, if you're a vegan, you might want to be a little bit aware of you might feel sensitive while watching this movie. I just want to give that heads up. Why am I saying that? Why am I saying that?
Pete tell me, well, there's a lot of meat.
There's a lot of meat. That's right now, there's the throwing of the turkey. What a waste. You know, we've spoken about that. But again, working with what you've got in the spirit of frugality, which is something that we were all frigging force through in the last Maybe that's part of it too. We've gone through here in this state of victory six very limiting, weird lockdowns in the past two years, and we've learnt, you know, we laugh about why sour dough became so important to us. Again,
it was within our nexcess of control. We could do something we could explore with sour dough. Rocky doesn't have access to the kind of gym that Sylvester sallone, Now does you know? Or Chris Hemsworth might, So what's he doing, Pete? What does he do?
Well?
He gets access to a butcher's and just pounds pounds downs very dead cows.
Yeah that's right. He hall his mate poorly horn meat and he practices cracking ribs on these animals who've already passed, so that could be. It was confronting for Rocky at first himself, what with all this mew who killed these animals? And then he goes, okay, right, so they're already one. How can I use this?
It's all running and it's it's I mean, and I loved last night knowing where it goes in the future movies.
Like the first montage was him like having the you know, the yolk eggs.
And and that's where that came from.
Yeah, yeah, and then and then like going out and his first run and he's almost like he looks sore already when he's crawling down the stairs.
And the music they played during that is so good.
That it's more like a slower version because it's the first one. It's like it's like really like a tired version of what we're going to hear later on.
There are all refrains of the same kind of motifs and idioms that done with different lyrics. Sometimes like that that same song was played at the beginning with as a song on the radio with a romantic theme. Again, this might have been within the limitations of their budget. They just would just reuse the same film.
And they were just running around shooting gorilla style, like when the guy throws an orange at Rocky that he had no idea what was going He saw it as a camera and that was just like that wasn't a plan. There's no thing in the script that says man throws orange at Rocky Bilboa and Rocky catches it. They were just driving around, going let's shoot something here, let's shoot
something here. Is I do think only the third movie in the world that you steady cam really yeah, which is for those at home, it's when you see often using when there's a lot of movement. Aaron Sorkin famously uses a lot of steady cam with those walking shots. It's a lovely they use it when he goes up the stairs at the I think it's a state library. And for the running shots they use a lot of steady Cam I reckon.
It's probably one of the first movies I've ever mentioned the word prostrate as well prostate. Do you remember that when I said prostrate And I'm going to say it's not correct because it's prostate. So you remember when Buddy's in bad mood. Buddy was the driver of the big shot you know who, he was, the heavy who was working for And again we're realizing, like, this is a tough environment, this is a tough world. Not everyone's going to like you. Buddies decided that he likes he does
not like Rocky r. He hates Rocky. He gives him a hard time all the time. There are all these challenges Rockies responding to and it's like Buddy's in a bad mood. It's this prostrate, it's prostrate, prostrate, prostrate. Buddies in bad moods is prostate. I was like, wow, you know again, the rawness. Someone would have probably written that, maybe written that out of the script if it had been in a writer's room for years and years, which I don't think it was. But there's a rawness too.
There's you know, fluff on the camera, there's filth on the floor, the apartment, nothing's perfect in this world. And that's why I think again, we respond to it because it mirrors the real world, which is not everyone's going to like us, and we've got to choose his opinion we're going to believe in.
And also, what's good about that driver or the driver of the loan shark. Not even the loan shark, he's quite nice to it.
It's quite nice. He keeps giving him five fifty bucks.
Five bucks.
Yeah, he's got support him, but it's it's the driver that's giving Rocky shit like that. That's how rock bottom they want to and that's the reason they want to make him rock bottom. Even when the loan Shark is saying, well, you've got to break his thumb next time, break his thumb, which is a lovely Again, he's because Rocky is not trying. We want our characters to be good, have a sense of decency and goodness, and then we want to see
him try. And Rocky takes a while before he believes enough of himself to try, so we need to see him be good. And he doesn't break the thumb. So there's all these little things, and he's just generally kind to everyone. But even when the loan Shark is and you need to break his thumb. He's got an asthma pump.
But it's just a lovely this guy. The guy's one day going to be the heavyweight the world.
We don't know that yet, but like the guy he's telling him off with the masthma part, it's just a lovely little touch.
You know what else I really love is probably worth a much bigger conversation. But again, the fact that Apollo is a man of color, that the champion as portrayed, you know, the dominant champion in the world is a person of color with power and choice. It's good to have an historical movie in which there are people of different ethnicities, people of different skin colors, different genders, playing
power roles in different ways as well. Now how that plays itself out over the course of Rocky or you know, the final victory or so on, is also worthy of conversation. But I enjoyed that because it showed again a reflection of real life as opposed to so many of the stories that we saw a victory, which ever included a story of the victory of people who were different, you know, people with a like Rocky himself being different but also
people who came from different backgrounds. People who it came from had different skin colors, people who had different ways of thinking and so on. So that is another reason why this is interesting. And we didn't often see intelligence matched with boxing as well. I didn't even know, for example, but I learned from this film that there's a word pulism. Do you know what pugilism is? So it means the professional hobby of boxing. It's a great word. Never heard
of it. I thought it meant something completely different. Learned a lot from this film.
People learned a lot. And there's not a polo played beautify by Carl Weathers.
Incredibly complex and beautiful role.
Yeah, and it's beautifully written and realized because he is a mirror image of Rocky. Now that goes beyond color. It's that he is articulate and Rocky is a mumbler, you know. It's that he's cocky, and Rocky is wrapped through self doubt. He's technically proficient in the ring, where Rocky is more of a brawler. He's a businessman. Rocky does not have a cent to his name.
Get a leather briefcase. Kids don't get into sport says Apolo, don't get into it, stinks, don't be a stinker, got a leather brewcase.
And he's a businessman. I like it. Also, there wasn't strings possibility.
It's a it's a Polo's idea to you know, fight Rocky or to find this this challenger is this one shot the American dream.
Without a rand contender. What this fighter is going to need is a novelty. This is the land of opportunity rate.
So Apollo Creed on January first, gives a local underdog fighter an opportunity, a snow white underdog, and I'm going to put his face on his poster with me, and I'll tell you why, because I'm sentimental, and a lot of other people in this country are justice sentimental, and there's nothing they'd like better than the Apollo Creed give a local Philadelphia boy a shot at the greatest title
in the world on this country's biggest birthday. Now, that's the way I see it, and that's the way it's gonna be.
Apollo. I like it.
It's very American, no Jergins, It's very smart.
Some more coffee, mister Creed, what.
Do you think about Billy snow How about the big Chucksmith's too old and dull.
And then when we get Paolo, who gives him this chance at the American Dream, that's really interesting.
Too, and I love saying him is like the businessman.
And then he's he comes out of George Washington and it's like and then and Rocky comes out and he's got shamrock meets that. You know, Paulie's going to force this. You know that Pauli's making more money out of it than Rocky.
You can make money out of my name, you do it. You go ahead, Polly, Yeah, you know, generosity.
And they realize apparently that that's that little money. They realized that they had the wrong shorts to match the poster, and then so so they wrote something just the handle of that little moment where he says, you got the wrong shorts and my shorts.
So this is Rocky going into the arena the night before to have a look, you know I was seeing. I texted, actually made of money, who works at the ABC? If you walk into the ABC officers in any city, there are these huge posters of the presenters. And I wrote to my mate Zen last night, I said, when you walk into the ABC's how you feel you walk, you know you walking. He's a huge post of yourself. But Rocky, yet again, is choosing truth. He walks into the arena and I didn't know about that fact. He
walks into the arena, empty arena the night before. He looks up at the poster and instead of going, Wow, there's me on a poster, he goes, the shots are wrong. You know, he's saying he's not falling for the story of it. He knows the risk. He wants things to be right.
And the promoter, the promoter basically says it doesn't matter matter, which again reminds the audience and reminds Rocky that he's no chance.
Yeah.
And then also the robe was too big for him. It was all big and gold, yeah, which which was apparently a mistake. And then so they wrote that the.
Little conversations he has with agent just before he goes out is so lovely, like the fact that he almost seems a bit maybe you'd be worried that he's unfocused. You know, if you were his coach or manager, he'd be going to come on focus on the ring. Agent probably shouldn't be here, get it, you know, like just focus but he is always charming throughout this.
He keeps saying to it, doesn't he He keeps saying, don't leave town, don't leave town. I'm sorry about my terrible accent. I keep coming in, going into it unconsciously. I don't I don't mean to be doing that. But he's saying to her, you know, is it too baggy? And he keeps saying to it, you're looking great today. He's doing the opposite of what Apollo's doing, which is,
you know, focusing, breathing deep and so on. The stakes are so high that he actually can't engage that He's been playful, and he's keeping that playfulness and that openness to possibility, and I think it's delightful. He's not willing to acknowledge how much is writing on it consciously, but he knows within himself.
There is that beautiful moment, though, when Apollo brings him into the press conference and he's watching with Adrian and Apollo is going to make a few jobs and you have nothing too over the top, but you know enough that he's making fun a little bit of making light of Rocky and Rocky you know, he says, it doesn't matter, it doesn't matter. And then when he leaves, he actually says,
you know what Apollo said, it did bother me. And that's that's almost a first little thing of oh, hang on, there's maybe more fighting than we think to.
Thine self be true. I love the energy that he gets and that we see him get, and it was there right from the beginning in that very first fight. God, you know that very first fight. I can't remember. The contender was a Spider or something. Spider, that's right. So it opens, you know, the movie opens with this picture of Jesus and from there were to the ring, you know, the ultimate fight, and then he beats Spider, smokes a ciggy,
Spider has a beer there in the back room. The reason he beat Spiders because Spider challenged him at a certain point, or you know, there was some energy that he gets every time someone doesn't believe in him. I love the way he uses that, and that's used right throughout until this point at the end, which we were just talking about.
Let's hut about the end.
Did you did you expect You've probably been groomed now to expect the protagonists to win at the end.
Yeah, Look, a lot of people had won already throughout the film. So you know you've got Adrian there with a content of her time being told by her brother that she's broken because you know she's not a virgin and she's one. She's chosen victory and moved out in the meantime.
It is a great scene.
Talia Shai a great performance and just takes it. I do love that stallone well as a writer, and Rockie is the character allows her to have that victory like, does not try to She's he recognizes that she's in control of this now and this is her fight. I'm here, but you take it up to him. Yeah, I think that's really good until he goes too far when she's left the room and he goes too far, and he just goes over and says, enough.
Enough now.
It's cool. That's so poorly.
I don't want you missing hull, and I don't raise you to go with this scumbu.
Yeah, come on, hitlp me.
Come on, I'll break both arms so they don't work for you.
No, am I good enough to meet with Kazo through That's.
Like to a Kaso. Now you're a big shot fighter on the way up. You don't even draw a clump toy of friend, Paulie, when I gonna get your meet every morning, you forgot that night. I even give you white sister, Dude, I'm a pink. Pink gets you the best lose out. I don't get married because of you. You can't look by yourself.
I put your to get on.
You can't you all me?
You owe me. You're supposed to be good to me? Who You're fine? Hell yeah, I'm just good. I feel idea. I didn't care you Pollie, I don't know you know that, and you made me feel like a loader. You're busted.
Just over. There's quite a few opportunities for victory and quite a few victories throughout it. And there's also Poorly. You know, we don't get a clean victory for him because he's a broken character, but he keeps getting included even though he's broken, and he eventually, you know, makes him cash gets a different job. So there are all
those victories along the way. Did I expect Rocky to win, Yes, except for the fact that I knew that there were all these other movies that came afterwards, and I wondered, how can you end it? I was press paused at about five minutes before the end, and I went, I wonder, what's going to happen here? Normally we're indoctrinated to have more of a round up at the end or so, and so I liked I actually really enjoyed how one.
And I think it was right too, that, you know Apollo in that context, Rocky got his nose broken for the first time, Apollo got sort of the life in it. He got terrified of losing for the first time. Neither of them wanted to rematch. I'm left curious what happens now.
Well, what happens now is you need to go and watch every other version. Do you take on the challenge and the invitation to watch Rocky too, and then one day come back.
To us I do.
I'm a bit scared, though, Pete, because I've really you know, it's hell't We've gone pretty deep, like we didn't have many laughs during this year, and I and I realized that, you know, but I think with the amount of coffee I've drunk this morning, the lack of sleep that we both had, and the effect that this movie had on us, it's been quite somber. I've enjoyed it. If I go and watch the next Rockies are the highs and lows.
Yes, and I think they get Listen, Rocky is the best of the lot of them.
Okay, number one?
Yeah, right, so and then and then two. They're very good and they get they get.
There's there's some you know, decreasing value as it goes along, but it's certainly the Apollo and the Rocky story continues into In fact, it kind of takes place pretty almost there's not much space between this movie and what happens. It almost flows straight on right for memory. Watched for a while, but I think it's I think it's certainly watching you watch two.
All right, all right, I'll tell you what. My life is definitely richer. For one. You know, I've got I've got new sayings in my heart, like you know, like colon people a coconut or a yo yo. I mean they've fallen from public culture. It's also, of course, you know, mix saying things like you're going to crap thunder. You know, I've got all these wonderful sayings in my head. I'm
newly inspired as a person. And it did make sense at the end, of course, when Rocky is yelling Adrian and I looked at MARNI when is that what you were talking about? He goes, right, good on you for spoiling it for me.
Thank you telling me the last scene of the film.
Thank you so much.
I that even that moment Talia Shi Adrian, like when Rocky says to her, you Adrian at the press cont she's a little bit embarrassed.
By what did you think of that? She goes, why did you do that?
I'm not sure about that? And then she finds the carriage. She ever comes to a shyness to run into a boxing ring is kind of incredible.
Rocky's let's recreate it. I'll be I'll be Rocky and Uba Adrian Rocky a Rocky amazing, amazing. Well I got shivers.
So really, if there's a Rocky nine or Apollo three, because that's what happens down the track is that the recent reboots have been about a polo, which is a polo's son.
What's the best?
Surprisingly good?
Yeah, good, okay, yeah, maybe I'll go. I mean, do I go?
I think it one by one the next step as we go along.
What I've learned from this is just a reminder of all the things seemed to matter, originality and courage when combined can create great work. We must have the courage to keep counting ourselves in when nobody else sees us. That requires a commitment on our own behalf to do the difficult work of not knowing how the outcome is going to be. But we've got to keep showing up. Love's worth fighting for. The meat that you're eating may have been punched by someone. It was an original training
method that he votes, which is now normal. But I think I found myself quite inspired by the whole thing, and I'm really really glad that you made me watch it.
Mate.
Well that is a beautiful sentiment in summation, and thank you.
Clear vote please before we quickly go any news anytime soon?
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I got.
So much new stuff.
Yeah, what can you tell? What can you tell us?
Now?
It should be out literally very slightly in a week or so.
Well, yeah, you're not going to get the music by then.
Beat, I'll tell you that much better throw to a track.
What I do want to tell you is that I am out there doing the jog in the morning, punching the meat and climbing up and down those stairs, and I'm wearing loose tracksuits and I'm yelling Adrian all the time. Yeah, I got some new stuff, and I tell you what, you'll be the first to know, I promise. But thank you for the encouragement and saying that you actually care and want to hear new stuff. That means a lot to me.
I completely and I said in the intro that all your albums are incredible, but modern day Adiction in particular is in my top five and I go back to it so often as I do. What was left and the window I chose happiness. But thanks, we just need some new clearvotus music.
I'm going to bring it to you. I promise, I promise. I just need a Is there a Mickey out there who would like to.
There was a seventy eight year old.
Give me seventy six.
Sorry Mickey, love a bit of wisdom.
Good love you lots, hie everyone. Thanks for having me.
Well, that was a fun way to finish this season. Oh you ain't seen nothing yet. I'm so glad Claire loved Rocky and not only just loved it, but it had so much to offer and to reflect on, so articulate, so thoughtful. I really really loved that chat about the film that I hadn't seen for a little while. I've seen it in my adult life, but not for a few years. So it was great watching it last night knowing that I was going to be chatting to Claire about it. So thank you so much Claire again for
doing that. Podcast comes with homework, it also comes with a production and the man behind that is Derek Meyer some castaway Studios, Gido.
Derek, good mate.
It's our final ride before we rude out to the sunset, before we take a little break, before we come back with season five.
Can you believe it?
It's hard to believe four seasons is now. That's epic.
That's amazing.
I mean, the exciting thing about season five is it's going to have our one hundred episode in it, So we'll see if we can come up with something special, maybe a live event.
Can we have a banner?
Definitely a banner. We're gonna run to a banner. Yeah, yeah, we're both going to run it. I'm not sure he's gonna hold it. That's the only thing. Somebody two guests to hold the banner. Hey, let's talk about Rocky before we head off. You'd be a Rocky fan, wouldn't you.
Yeah?
Definitely, Yeah, most Definitely.
It wasn't the most convincing, but I feel there's a caveat coming a bit of.
A Rocky two.
Okay, Rocky two, three and four.
Wow, that's interesting because it's out a clear I was going to watch Rocky two, so we'll take it one by one. I won't commit you to watching you know, all of them, but I said, I said, listen, Rocky is probably the best of them. But with that said, they do become more soap oper operatic as they go along. But Rocky, too, I think is very good. And I remember as a kid loving Rocky three and loving Rocky four. I just got a feeling when I go back and watch them as an adult, I'm probably gonna.
Enjoy Rocky as a movie. Definitely, definitely more than that.
It's more clarify, it gets more more popcorns involved as we go along.
Yeah, Definitely, Rocky is a way better movie than the rest. Yeah, but to me, that was my era, and it was just like they were coming out while I.
Was, yeah a young man, and of course Club of Land.
And it was topical two with the whole jigo.
Yeah, very typical. Now up and that cand of words. Hey, a few little facts that I've got to get to. Claire mentioned earlier in the podcast that there was some
conjecture about about where the story came from. It certainly obviously did come from slice the loan's own experiences and his own thoughts as far as where his acting was and the way he was feeling that an event inspired it was a guy called Chuck Wetner who was like a middleweight kind of out of the boxer, who was, you know, I'm not sure how to describe it, like
a solid boxer, average boxer. But he got the chance to fight Muhammad Ali and he knocked Ali down once and he didn't win, but he knocked him down so that you could kind of see that, imagine that inspiring Sevestillone to write the way he did and the climact in particular. Funnily enough, Chuck Witner then goes on the fight, has it like an exhibition fight against Andre the Giant, which you know what happens in Rockie three. Paul Cogan, Yes,
hold thunderlips, and they actually Chuck Wender did sue. He did a suit stallone a couple of times. Eventually they privately settled in two thousand and three we mentioned if you don't Stallone knocking back a pretty big offer to sell the rights to United Artists. He refused, he wanted to be in the film. The right call was made. Also, the good news is he wasn't. He was paid twenty thousand for the script and a sag that's a screen act. This good minimum of three hundred and fifty dollars per
week to make the movie. But he did have some back end on it, and I think he ended up making around about twenty two million from the film.
So pretty pretty cool.
Some choices to play Adrian were also Susan Sarandon Cher and Bett Midler was offered the role, she said no. Stallone wins Oscars for Best Screenplay, nominated for writing the screenplay and acting, and up until a few years ago, the only other two people who had done that, I believe was Charlie Chaplin and Awson Wells.
Not bad company to be in.
I haven't gone back and looked at who's won since, but I know Bradley Cooper comes to mind with the Star is Born as far as writing and acting and being nominated. So in one final fact that actually blew me away a little bit. In the first draft. Stalone writes the draft, the first draft over three days, and there's a lot of rewrites goes on. In fact, Mickey was quite racist in the first draft. Adrian was Jewish, Pauli was his Jewish step mather. I mentioned that during
the podcast. I got to say, Mickey's a little bit racist in this one. But in the end, what was supposed to happen in the end was Rocky was going to throw the fight and then use the money to open a pet store with Adrian.
Can you believe that? Can you believe that being the ending of Rocky.
I don't think you get Rocky two, Rocky three, Rocky four or the Apollos. If frock is opening a pet store, that sounds more like a Pixar film to me. That was great, That was great fun. I really enjoyed that so much. Thank you Claiboutich. Once again, thank you Derek for all your work throughout this season. We're going to take a shorter break. I know the last time we took like it was almost a three close to a three month break. It's would be close to a bit
of a three week break. The suits of iHeartRadio. I want me to get back quicker than I did last time. We are with iHeartRadio now still being produced by Castways Studios and recording here, but it'll be a shorter break. We're going to record some episodes to get ahead of the pack, and we'll come back with some great guests
and some great movies. Please send your emails to yasny podcast at gmail dot com, or you can jump on our speak pipe if you follow the links and leave a voice message for us, and you're going to hear your own voice on our podcast. We do have an email that we wanted to read to court our attention, Derek. Who's that front before we before we wrap up?
This one's from Mark in Queensland. Beauty. Hi, Pete, love the podcast for damn you Hellier. You have plunged me into financial ruin.
Haven't done that?
Because every time you review a movie or talk up one of the reviewers top three, I have to sign up to another streaming. I'm with Mark and that one happens to me.
Well, if you're working entertainment, you can claim it on tax.
Mark.
That's just you need. You need to work out how to work in the industry and then you disclaim it all.
On tax.
I didn't know that, but you should be doing that. You should be doing that just in time.
I also can't believe that nobody has done pulp fiction.
Mm hmm.
There is so much to discuss and unravel in this classic.
It's funny.
We had somebody recently talk about, you know, requesting more Tarantino films. I do when I put out the list to any potential guests, I kind of sometimes say, you know, we're keen to do you know, some Tarantino or some Hitchcock or some foreign language films. There have been some of the stuff that's been requested, so it's just a matter of finding that right person.
So certainly a classic film.
And you know, I would love to talk polp fiction with someone I know, Peter and Peter Gat one of our most fervent listeners, I have to say, loves the podcast. It often reminds me that the podcast has come out each week on Twitter. For some reason, he hates pulp fiction. So we may actually lose one of our most passionate followers for one week if we do pop fiction. But I think at some point we will have to do it.
So polp fiction, I'm sure we'll get to it. At some point, and of course Reservoir Dogs absolutely, And.
Here comes a good bit talking of classics. I had a laugh when you were discussing with Luke McGregor whether you can include Harry Potter as it might not be a classic. Well, if that's fair enough, here's the band. But you did have weird Science classic really regards Mark.
Oh, Mark, Well, I mean I take your point. I take your point, but we'd science does. There's different genres and.
Yeah, I mean we may have.
We may have scraped the one that I the other one is Ronnie Chang doing made in Manhattan, but I would still argue that, you know, as a romantic comedy, it's up there. Yeah, I take your point.
I take you.
Sometimes we scrape, we we we shoehorn them in because it's it's about developing, you know, covering genres as well, and and different kinds of films, which is fun. Maybe you should have been Porky, so maybe would have been happy with Porky's or zapp All great films, all great films. I want to thank listeners really sincerely, I'm blown away.
This started as a labor of love, really, just the filling the gaps in my own filmography, and I have loved watching these films and having these conversations and feedback I've received both through the yasny podcast, a Gmail, and just you know, on my Instagram and Twitter feeds. People come up to me personally and then saying how much after gigs. Yeah, it's been really really touching. I'm so glad we're building this community, and that was always the dream that we could build this, you know.
A community of film lovers who love talking about films. There'll be more live events.
I would love to get one hundred episode live event going and one or two more. We might aim to do maybe three live events in season five. That would be amazing, So thank you. Thanks to all the amazing guests in season. In season four, we start with Osha Ginsburg doing Roman Holiday. You know, it seems like a while ago now in Kate Lambrook with Fight Club and everyone who's just been on it for the twenty odd episodes. We have done some big names. I've been talking to
visit us in season five, some big movies. What I might do next time is maybe release in advance who we have coming up so people can actually watch the movies. Have requested that a little bit of time to be able to get the movies watched before the episodes come out, so we might try to put out a little calendar of what might be coming up. Sometimes, you know, we can't always do that. Sometimes that we do record it literally days before you hear it. Sometimes they are more
in advance. So thank you so much, thanks for listening. Thank you Derek, and we will see you in a few weeks for season five of you Ain't seeing nothing yet until then, take care, And so we leave all Pete save Van Sult, and to our friends of the radio audience, we've been a pleasant good name.