Get some facts and come back and seebe. Get some facts and come back and Seebee. Don't throw out salaries or other things. Get some facts and come back and Seebee. You can't handle the true now told our players you need a bit more like a dog. We don't need a bunch of cats in here. Looking in the mirror, I look good. I got my extra bands on, I got my other shoes. Be a doll. We don't need no meals. We don't need no cats. We need more dogs. Were out a detain. Oh you're not That day we weren't good.
There's no sense of asking me things about the game. I'm telling you we laid an egg. So I'm not gonna break it down for you. He sucks. He sucked. He laid an egg. That's all I have to say. Guys, I'm sorry. I'm not going to break it down for you. Nothing went well for us. It's on us. We have to figure it out. And we went eight. Show dad. Every time I hear the coastal Carolina, we'll talk about waity mere dogs. I don't need
no cats in here. Me now, I smile. I hope it brings a similar expression for you on your way to work, or wherever you may be listening here across the Great State of Michigan, whether it be in Flint or Cadillac, Grand Rapids or Midland, Sagon off a City, Gray Link, Gaylord Potoski, Charlevoid, Traverse City. That's where we are on Axis and Bros. Across the Great State of Michigan, Monday through Friday, six until nine. Ben is our producer. I'm Matt Shephard. The Meyer hotline
is eight sixty six eight three, eight forty eight forty three. You could text the program sports Radio to twenty one thousand. James Edwards of the Athletical join us tomorrow at eight thirty five. Benjamin Raven, who is the writer for m Live covers the lines in the NFL, will join us at the bottom of this hour. We got some texts that we want to get to, but first let's go to the phone lines. Freddy is up next on this bright sunny Wednesday. Hey Freddy, what's going on? Good morning,
Chef. I wanted to kind of finish that text because half of it didn't come out, and as you know, a phone call versus text message is so much easier, so much better, The context is so much better. First of all, the the I did second guess that the second that happened, I absolutely hated it. But you know me, I hate that stuff.
I hate you know, I hate when managers management a piece of paper, meaning this is when he's most to take out a guy, This is when he's supposed to you know, the old sparky or those guys will tell you you gotta you gotta, you gotta manage by feel doesn't do that. A J. Hinch doesn't manage by a piece of paper. Don't. Don't. You can disagree with him all you want, and I don't. I'm not gonna blame you for that. I don't. But don't say that he
manages by a piece of paper, because he does not. He does not manage by paper or by analytics solely. It's part of his decision making, but he does not manage that way. Go ahead, Okay, that's fair and and but but anyways, I when he pulled me yesterday, what bothered me, what bothered me the most was the obvious reasons. You're dominating, you're dominating us, you're dominating a lineup, and and you're getting you're getting
pulled. And you know, I didn't hear this yesterday in the radio broadcast. But I've you know, I listened a lot, but I've heard this before from from other people or other teams or you know, you pull a guy like that because you'd hate to see him lose that game. You know that pisses me off because I'm like, I like to see him win that game. Why are we talking about losing? How do we know he's gonna lose? It's to me, it's like, it's like just in life.
That's the part of the texting come out. You know, you learn more through adversity than you do baby, and someone that I know that with my kids, my kids are so little. I'm always on on there, you know what you know, because I want them to understand and learn things on their own, figure it out on their own. And you know, you pull up pitchers dominating and and maybe their philosophy was, well, we don't want him to see the lineup the third time through? Well, how's he
ever going to get better if you keep doing that? That's what he did. He did see me, he did see the lineup three times through. Well. The thing is, I mean his last thinking about this, his last out was out, strike out, number fourteen, he strike out Paul gold Schmidt, and that's when Andrew Chafin came in. So I, okay, I don't and I'm and I'm with you one hundred percent on that. I really am. I I don't think. Let's not take it like they're
talking about losing. What they're just saying is they want that picture to have a chance to win. He still gave him a chance to win. He still was in line for the win. He just wasn't making the final de termination. Why you take him out with a man at first? Because he had walked Arnaudo, a chance for Burlison to hit a two run homer and suddenly you'd be behind two to one. That's part of his thinking. Yes, but I don't He and Chris Fetter and Robin Lund. Okay, part
of the pitching staff are constantly talking. Are they seeing something? Don't. I don't know the answers to this. I'm just asking the questions. Okay, these are some of the things that they're going on. What kind of batter is is he about to face? How does that batter face his types of pitching? How does he usually handle things? You know, a third or fourth time through the order when I've already had Chafin up warming just in case because he walked Arnaudo, and I got to make sure he's ready.
I don't want to waste him warming up for absolutely nothing. The other situation is he's talking to feder What kind of movement, what kind of bite on certain pitches does Jack Flaherty have. It's more than just you know what, I want to make sure I'm getting this guy a chance to win. That might be the simplistic explanation, but overall, there's a lot deeper dive into it than just what we're saying. Yeah, listen, I get it,
I get it one hundred percent. I just I think when the kid dominates like that, you give him a chance, you give a chance to work, do it and win it, and you lose it. You lose it. And that's just my philosophy. Am I right? No, Maybe I'm not right, Maybe I'm not wrong, but I will end it with this. You mentioned people have told you throw a less than the offseason. I always go back to the Nolan Ryan interview I saw ten fifteen years ago.
He said, these guys are just not pitching enough and they're not working out their arms enough. That's why we're having a lot of problems. And when he took over as president of the Texas Rangers, he had his minor leaguers pitching complete games. One of them. I don't I don't know, but I can't. I can't say. I can't say that. And I appreciate its phone call. It's great conversation. Thanks, Freddy. Always can use the things that you text or call into to expand our conversation. Look,
Nolan Ryan was a freak. These guys throw in the off season constantly. I don't know how much you need. You could talk to Nolan Ryan all you want, go talk to Mickey Lowls. She'll tell you just the opposite. Talk to Jack Morris, He'll tell you just the opposite. So there's a lot of different ways you can do that. To Freddy's point, though, Look, Jack Flaherty, that's the fewest pitches he's thrown since Opening Day
or the opening series. He threw eighty seven against Chicago after that, ninety four one hundo, ninety seven, ninety seven, and then ninety three yesterday. So I get it. I'm not saying you're wrong. All I'm telling you is that that's not how aj Hinch manages. Would Would I have liked to have seen him come in or stay in, Yes, but I don't. I don't have We don't have all the numbers and part of the you know, the analytics in front of us, and that doesn't steer his decisions,
but it's part of it. You're crazy to think that it's not part of it, and you're stupid to think that you wouldn't be doing it yourself. That's the reason you have the numbers. It's the reason so many managers are successful. You think Dave Roberts is a good manager, absolutely, does he use analytics? Absolutely? I think Aaron Boon's a good manager. Bad example. You think Kevin Cash is a good manager, absolutely, You think he uses analytics more than anybody, or as much as anybody. The world
series start by Blake Snell, famous people all over. Kevin Cash. He's a really good manager. He's a great manager. So I'm just saying, you gotta be careful on you want to see him in there, but we don't have all the information. That doesn't make the manager right all the time either, Because I would have liked to keep him in. Two. Here's what I would ask you boom to run Homer. You're down two to one? Are you saying Frey's Probably not? But some people might have said,
you get Chaffin warming up. You got a better matchup with Chaffin. Why not do that? At least Freddy's consistencid I said it at the time. He's not armchair quarterbacking. We have more texts on the other side. Don't forget. Benjamin Raven from m Life will join us at eight thirty five to talk Lions in NFL. Here on Exis and Bros. Across the Great State of Michigan in the Dam step up to the play with the Eagle Casino in Sports, the mobile sportsbook app that you can bet on all your favorites all
year round, including of course, our national past time. So download the app and start winning today at Eagle Casino in Sports Made in Michigan, Made for Michigan. Must be twenty one years or older and in Michigan to play. This is Matt Shepard. Matt Manning was used again in a Tiger's doubleheader as the twenty seventh man on Tuesday. He's now made more starts in Detroit
than in Toledo, where he's assigned to start the year. The twenty six year old and former ninth overall pick in twenty sixteen had to really impressive spring minus the six home runs allowed, but minor league options, the play of Casey Meisenries Olsen, and the signing of two veterans made it easy to send him to Triple A. A. J. Hinch admits he knows it's hard on Manning to bounce back and forth, but Manning hasn't complained. No complaints
for the Tigers either. Bringing up a guy like Manning only when you need him means you have organizational depth, and that's a bonus. We're teeing off our tenth year at the Meyer LPGA Classic for simply give. Get ready for the best who are yet to help neighbors in need while enjoying golf, food and family fun. Join us June thirteenth through the sixteenth at Blakefield Country Club for fabulous food, discovery land for kids, and of course, elite women
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minutes or so. Benjamin Raven of m Live will join us to talk Lions. In the meantime, we've got more texts that we want to get to. In case you missed it, though real quick. Tigers and Cardinals split a double dip Toronto maple Lea's with a really gutsy win. I mean, I bet you people in Toronto right now are going, where the hell was that effort in the previous games against Boston, they stay alive with a two to one overtime win over the Bruins. Carolina eliminates the Islanders beyond a six
to three win. Colorado does the same to Winnipeg with the same six to three final. In Nashville scores twice in the third of the edge Vancouver two one to keep their season alive. Sixers over the Knicks, really gutsy and impressive win. Tyrese Maxi had forty six. By the way, that ties Michael Jordan for the most ever by a visiting player in a playoff game at Madison Square Garden, Cavs edge the Magic by a point. They're up three
to two bucks. Stay alive beating the Pacers one fifteen ninety two without at top compo and without Lillard. All right, back to the text line, and you could do so. Just text sports Radio to twenty one thousand, Ben. What do we got? Yeah, it says, let me know when kid becomes a leader like Anthony Edwards, he's always hurt or maybe hurt when they're losing. Leaders lead teams through the tough times. But he has not always hurting with leg cramps. Dave Being nailed that pick on day one
when he said he was no leader. Boy, I don't remember Dave being saying that, but I'll take your word for it. I've always said this. I don't I'm not going to dispute the text. Okay, I haven't been a full disclosure. I haven't been around him enough to find out what kind of leader he is. Just because you're a team's best player doesn't mean you're that team's leader. Okay, I've said this for a long look. Not every Maybe it's maybe it's a poor example because it's hockey. Not every
team's best players their captain. Who's the best player on the Toronto mapleiefs Austin Matthews, not just because he had sixty nine goals, but he's their best offensive player for sure. But he's their best player. Their captain is John Tavares. Barry Sanders is the best running back I've ever seen. Wasn't a great leader that leader of that team, Chris Pielman, Robert Porchet. It wasn't Barry Sanders. Cad Cunningham is the Pistons' best player. How much is
that same for a team that won thirteen games fourteen games? Not much, I suppose. I don't know any really strong leader who's going to lead a team like the Pistons that just doesn't have that much talent. They just don't. Who's the guy you like on that team? Who's the guy you want you want to go to deep battle with? I really like Jalen Duran. I've said this numerous times. There was a couple of guys I'd keep for sure. Dare I say untouchable? That's a hard thing to say. With
the team that's that bad. But I'd keep Cunningham and I'd keep durn for sure. There are certain guys i'd like coming off the bench. Fontechio would be really good off the bench. Don't want him starting, not on a great team. What does that say about Keith Cunningham's leadership, Guys, I don't know what kind of leader he truly is. I just don't think any great lead. Look, Isaiah Thomas was an unbelievable player. He's the best Piston of all time. His team was terrible when he first got to the
Pistons. You gotta have players around you. Another text, go ahead, Ben yeah and says I watched the Milwaukee game, and yes, their stars were out, but they had no issues running up and down the court, high fiving players and jumping around in excitement. NBA players are week. I'm not going to go so far to say that they're weak. But it is interesting, isn't it. Onto te Coompo is he hasn't played the entire series, Okay, I was. I watched a lot of that game too.
I was amazed at how a team can be without its quote unquote two best players and yet look so in sync together like Patrick Beverly was a plus thirty six on the floor. He didn't score a ton thirteen. And I don't know how much you're into plus minus ratio in basketball. It's more of a hockey stat than anything. Some people don't like it that much. I believe in it. When you're on the floor and things are going well, you
have something to say about it. He was a plus thirty six. They had a way about them last night that I he hadn't seen with guys who are a little bit more dominant. I'm not going to say players a week like Joel Embiid's playing through some pretty tough situations right now. Give him a ton of credit. I see guys who are battling. Look, here's what I would ask you. I love all sports really, at least are big
four. Mitch Marner is a really gifted offensive player for Toronto. Three of the first four games, he looked like he had no interest being there. Looked like he had heavy legs, like he was skating in slash. It wasn't necessarily getting after it on a backcheck using one hand on the stick. A lot of times, he just didn't didn't look great. I'm not gonna call him weak, but he didn't look engaged. How's that? I think you know? In basketball? Yeah, it's going to happen like that sometimes
we see it all the time. Look, it's not just to TAKEMPO and Lillard where you think, oh, they're weak a little bit. Look what happen with Lebron James the other day with the Lakers. Walks off the floor. Doesn't he shake anybody's hand, walks off the floor. Right. We're gonna make excuses for him, though, because he's the greatest scorer of all time, more points than anybody else, over forty thousand this year. He reached over forty thousand. He reached that plateau this year earlier. But we're
gonna make an excuse because he's really good at what he did. He's arguably the greatest of all time. But we'll give him a pass when you see him give up on defense plenty. He missed plenty of games. I'm not buying that. I'm not going to say basketball players are the NBA their week. You can question if there is a problem with Milwaukee's culture. I'm not close enough to the Bucks to say there is. You can question that,
no problem. I agree with you. From that standpoint, I'm not going to paint the entire league with a broad brush because I would look at what tyreas Maxi did last night, and I would say that is anything butt Week to score forty six in a game on the road that your team was behind and had a five percent chance of winning, but ended up winning the hell of a test. I think that's pretty strong. I look at what Anthony Edwards has done or Karl Anthony Towns and what they've done pretty strong. Another
text, Ben go ahead, Oh that was it? Oh that was it. Oh, yes, that's good. Timing is fine because we get a chance to talk with Ben Raven. He's coming up here at the bottom of the hour to talk a little bit more about the Lions, not necessarily the draft, but where they're going from here, what happens next. Here's the only other thing I would say to the certain players are week or in a certain league, I would I hate the load management bull crap in the NBA.
It's just accepted now. People accept it like, oh it's okay, I mean it's all part of load management. Well, I give me a break. Baseball players play, you know, thirteen days in a row. Hockey players play the same number of games as basketball players. Stop with the load management. Excuse bull crap. Okay, I can't stand that. Magic Johnson came out and said that about the Lakers. He was wrong about it, but he came out instead about the Lakers. Here's the other thing I'd
say though, Mike Trout's one of my favorite athletes of all time. Absolute tough dude. He's missed a minimum of thirty games each the last three years injuries, right, I mean legitimate injuries. He's got to have surgery on a left in meniscus, now legitimate. Does that make him weak? I don't think so. I don't know what how severe the injury was Anteticompo and Lillard does. My hope is that guys like da who won a championship Lillard's
never won one. On the tempo has did they be playing if they could? All? Right? On the other side, Ben Raven joins us to talk football. This is Exies and Bros. On the Michigan Sports Network. Bill Simonson here from my good friend Josh Garvey. Now he's a managing shareholder at Dorn Mayhew's Grand Rapids office. Their world headquarters are in Troy, Michigan on the east side of the state, and they have locations all around the
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and no sugar additives. Look for it at your local Retaylor at Rose Dumber dot com thirty five after the hour here on Exes and Bros. Across the Great State of Michigan. We're on in Potoski and Potoski and Traverse City, I should say in Potoski and Charlotte. Boy, We're on in Midland and sagoinawn Bay City. We're on up in Grayling and Gaylord and Grand Rapids of course Cadillac Flint. Wherever it is you may be listening on our network throughout
the Great State of Michigan. We're glad you're with us on this Wednesday. Also glad to have Ben Raven on with us. He writes for M Live. You can follow him on x at Benjamin s Raven and he did a great job covering the NFL Draft and the Lions season with Kyle Minke, our friend on M live and Ben joins us here on Exes and Bros. Ben glad to have you. Man. Appreciate it very much because I know your time is value. I know you've been swamped with all the draft coverage you
wrote the other day the best move and the Lions' biggest risks. For those who don't subscribe to the M Live Paychase pay page, can you give us an idea of what you thought their best move was and where are their biggest risk life from the NFL Draft this year. Absolutely, thank you Matt for having me by the way. But the best move, you know, it starts at the top. It starts with getting carry On Arnold that picked twenty four, someone who I think was a widespread thought to be top fifteen pick.
I think heading into the draft every step of the way, it was kind of hard to see him getting past even fifteen. So the fact that Harry and Arnold the CB one A or one B of this draft, truly pick twenty four for a team that needs as much past defense help as they can get. I mean, you look back to that NFC title game that blown lead, I mean attacked the two or three score lead. Their pass
defense broke and broke and broke. It finished last season twenty ninth in the NFL, that passing yards for attempt, bad red zone marks again, and you go out. You get the nation's top run defending cornerback who was also just as sticky and coverage at Pig twenty four without mortgage in the future. That it's just that's that's a home run. That was a home run value and picked by Brad Holmes there and then the biggest risk is obviously the six
foot eight three and fifty pound offensive tackle from British Columbia. I mean, this is two years in a row where you mentioned Kyle Mikey when I turned to Kyle and we rotate picks when we're writing up the draft picks as they come in, and I'm like, hey, man, I can't find a photo of this guy for your stories. It's they see the trades, they see the athleticism, and it's a risk. But as I said the other day on Them Live, it's the Lions are positions with the Eagles. You
know, this kid gets compared to my lot though a lot. They are positioned like the Eagles to take a risk to develop a raw prospect like that with the guys they have in that room, and the fact that Hank Staley has proven himself to be one of the best developers of the offensive line in the NFL in a short time. Leaving that room in Detroit. As good as they were a year ago, reaching the NFC Championship Game be point just short in San Francisco, they will now have a different mindset and a different
expectation coming into this year. How will things change do you think for Dan Campbell and the Lions now that they're the hunted rather hunting You know, I think we know who Dan Campbell is. I think we've found out pretty quickly in twenty twenty one, and I think we've found out at the end of last season that he is. And as long as he's the head coach of the Detroit Lions, they will be among the biggest gamblers, the biggest risk
takers, the most aggressive teams in the league. And I don't think I mean he will adapt, he will evolve, but I don't think he's going to change from who he is is because both he and Brad Holmes have been very clear and upfront about who they are. You see it in Brad's draft classes, going back to back corners taking two risks in the fourth round like that, and I think you see Dan. They're going to go for it on forts down more than anyone in the league forever and forever, as long
as he's in that job. Ben Raven from Mlive joining us here on exis and Bros. You can fall him on x or on Twitter, Benjamin S. Raven. How much better is the NFC North? Because the prevailing thought is that Minnesota got a lot better, Chicago got a lot better. Of course they had a bigger room to grow as well, more so than the Lions. But how much better do you think the NFC North is? Yeah?
It is funny the Lions win their first division in thirty plus years, and all of a sudden, the NFC North starts to line up like it can be the best division in football, and much sooner than later. But yeah, the Bears, I mean, I know it's hard to thank on a rookie quarterback. It's hard to oh this guy's going to be amazing right off the bat. But my goodness, citizens really hard not to just see an amazing situation set up for both Caleb Williams or JJ McCarthy and Minnesota down
the road. I mean, just the receivers, the offensive line, the running backs in Chicago. I mean, we were talking about the Chicago receiving corps. I mean, if Romo Duze is a quality rookie, I mean he's going to be the third wide receiver this year. They got DJ Moore, they got Keenan Allen. I mean, these are proven pros who do a lot of things differently, and they I mean, I got to give it up to Chicago. It's not easy to recover from flunk in the first
round draft pick that quickly. Yeah, I mean, I'm not going to call Ustin Field to plunk that. They just didn't build around them. They have built a team for Caleb Williams to step into. I don't think they're going to compete for the division in year one, but the Bears are going to be. The Bears are coming and the Packers are coming to because they
just continue to throw premium picks at that defense. They continue to throw verstall offensive line picks at the inside their trenches, and they got a new defensive coordinator. So I mean they got to that Jordan Love is going to be better this year. And then I mean as long as if like he's got Addison, Hockinson and Jefferson and Darris all that that's going to be a tough group to stop right there too. And I mean they did pretty well to
get this. Yeah, I think get one of the top adusts that they're rookie at too. Yeah, I think a lot of people were disappointed at Jordan Morgan is their first round pick as the offensive tackle, but those same people probably oftentimes talk about needs. But overall, I think the Packers, especially with Jordan Love at the helmet another year under his belt, are pretty damn good. Where's your biggest concern for the Lions going into their camps.
It's hard to say right now because we have we don't even know what the fifty four man roster looks like, right but we're overall, when you look at it right now, where is the part where you're looking at and going this could be could be a little bit of an issue for the Lions.
Yeah, it feels weird. There's not a ton of glaring glaring hold I mean the developmental thick and man knew you could you could argue that there's a little lacking depth that offensive tackle because I don't think he's going to be anywhere near ready. I think you're looking at a pretty similar Robert Martin situation there where he's lucky to get ten snaps at best this first season. But uh yeah, there's a little depth that offensive tackle, just in the short term.
And you know, I like out of the people's Sjones. I love the idea of down to the people's Jones. He's done it in the NFL before. He's a local kid. We know what he's capable of, but it hasn't been there for a couple of years. Maybe a full off season with the team, maybe a full off season working with golf will help him
be that wide receiver three, one of those top death wise receivers. But I do there is a need for like a vertical outside wide receiver, somebody, somebody to kind of fill that Josh Mentals role, somebody to kind of fill that red zone role. Because while I expect Jamo to be the second wide receiver option and to be much better and much more involved in the offense
this year. They really do need another dependable outside guy. I mean, Jared Duff closed his eyes and know where Josh Reynolds was, I mean for three years now. So I really do think there's a short term need at wide receiver. There's some potential short term need for a little offensive line depth attack all of Mets. That's about it, because they've set themselves up well to have some options in the defensive backfield, and that was the main concern
for me coming into the draft. So, you know, it's a weird deal. You know, there's just not a lot of glary red marks. What's the expectation specifically for the first two picks Terry On, Arlold Arnold and inness Rakestraw. Where do you expect them to be when the season begins their roles specifically? I have a hard time not imagining Terry and Arnold won't be
starting almost immediately. I really do think he's out side the town. Obviously, he's got to go out there and earn it because the Lions have a little deeper situation at corner. So I think Arnold is going to be very much in this situation well Rigstaw. You know, you might not you might see him with the first couple of weeks, but his his ability in the slot, and they're they're kind of desire to move Brian Branch to safety.
Something certain looks could get rakester on the field. Obviously, he's probably going to be competing with Branch and uh Mee Roberts in the new corner from the Raiders there for some slot reps. But yeah, I expect to see a lot of Harrian Arnold pretty much from to get well ray Straw. You know, he might he might be have a little slower to come along. He might kind of follow the the tract of playing behind some guys and finding his
spot and maybe getting a taste of specialties here and there. But I mean he's not far off either. I mean, those other three cornerbacks they brought are all here on one year deals. Those those two are the future of the room. I mean, they really do feel like they've built the future of their cornerback room there, so they're going to find ways to plan. But I do think Arnold is going to be a He's going to eat a
ton of snaps. I really do. I think he's that good. I know you didn't think or you weren't surprised at how many quarterbacks were taken. You may have been a little bit surprised by the fact that Michael Pennix went eighth overall to Atlanta and then JJ McCarthy a couple picks later, but overall, you're not surprised there. What's from the NFL draft in general stunned you
a little bit. That's a good question, you know. I the Falcons definitely broke my brain a little bit with Michael poenixtick, and it's like not even about him, it's just the fact that they've pretty much signaled on day one that Kirk Cousins is a bridge quarterback after handing him at one hundred million dollar contract and kind of telling his teammates like, oh, he's not the set in stone future at the position. I mean, that was that was
the most shocking there, and got not a ton of surprises. I was a little surprised some of the other wide receivers didn't go in the draft. I know there were some reports out there about Ady Mitchell. I was really surprised he fell as far as he did. I was really surprised Race Cross all as far as he did, not to keep it just pure locally here, but pick sixty one for a guy that a lot of people thought could be in the mixed twenty nine to four already is pretty solid right there.
But yeah, that's h and I'd say just maybe the Vikings training up again. You know, they have gotten really to get Dallas Turner there around seventeen or eighteen. They have been really aggressive giving up future assets to move up and get guys that they want. I do think that that's a that's a big risk for a team like that, that's welcoming a rookie quarterback that might be starting Sam Darnold this year. You know, they kind of need to
keep as many assets as they can. So, yeah, those are the surprises, but yet not to I wasn't surprised by all the quarterbacks, but I was surprised that Atlantis at Phoenix, just because you thought they were just gonna focus on winning in this two to four year window with Kirk Cousins, and it was just a strange methods to send the Kirk. It was just a strange methods just end of that roster before he had even suited up as
their new quarterback. Yeah, you brought up a donnid Mitchell. I was a little surprised that Ricky Piersoll went ahead of like Lad McConkey, Jalen Polk for example. Definitely Keon Coleman. Coleman, big strong kid out of Florida State, So that was a mild surprise for me. We're talking NFL and alliance with Ben Raven mlive. You can follow on x at Benjamin s Raven. Back to the Lions. As we look at the depth of this team, we're starting to and I talked about this a little bit yesterday, but
we're starting to feel like Brad Holmes can do no wrong. I'll ask you the same thing I asked your friend Dave Brikette yesterday. When do you believe the trust in Brad Holmes was complete for Lions fans? Well, that's a good one. Honestly, I think it came home after that first season when I'm on Ross Saint Brown started to come on, when Panay's school was looking
like Honestly, I think it started with the pay School pick. I think that first season really sent it home, when you know you started to see those four round picks starting to contribute near the end of the season. But then it was just the culture setting pick of Aidan Hutchinson for that defense too. It was like there a lot of options that wasn't as easy as everyone
thought it was that picked to that year. I mean, obviously they love talks more than anyone, but there were a lot lot of good, good, elite premium position players in that draft. Getting Aidan Hudginson and just kind of that set the tone for that defense, I really do. But yeah, I have to look back to that first year. I want ended in that first year. A lot of people don't have growing memories about that first season, but when you came out of that year and you're like, nay
Suel isn't even like he's just turned twenty one years old? Are you kidding me? Just started the full season and looks like a that doing it. You see i'm na Saint Brown catching game when he touchdown passes, and it's like, all right, this is what this guy. This guy made his name in LA by hitting on these mid round picks, and he started to see it with some of those mid round picks even by the end of that first season. So I just think, and it's just kind of expounded since
then. I mean it's grown every season since then. I mean, you look at that first twenty twenty one draft class now and every single one of those guys is on the roster in some capacity at the end of last season. And I don't think people realize how rare that is. I mean, he really is top to bottom drafting guys that are on this roster in some capacity, and that's just that's his retention rate and his hit rate is among just the absolute best in the league. And I just love the fact that
he sticks to his guns. I mean it challenges the way I think about the game, It challenges what I think he should do and stuff. So I mean, I really mean he has really changed the way I look at the game and break things down. And just taking a first round running back last year too, just aggressive, aggressive, and it turns out to be one of the best sticks in the entire orders. So just it's a really
good point by you. It's a really good point by you because I never thought of it that way from the first year, just because the first year wasn't very good in terms of ones and wins and losses. But now that you bring it up, that all those draft picks are on that team. I thought it changed last year. Quite honestly, I thought it was with Jamior Gibbs. I mean, look, that was widely panned by national and
local fans and writers and broadcasters and analysts. Why are you taking a first round for he thought he knew exactly what he wanted, exactly what this team needed, and it was a special player. And I think we've been at least after one year, we've been proven we were wrong. He was right, and it's tough for us in the media to say that we were wrong. I think that's when people really said, Okay, I'm not going to question him. It's okay to wonder a little bit, but I don't think
we're going to question him like we did before that pick. Oh, absolutely right. And I'll be honest, I remember when that pick came in, and I'm like, wait, they've traded down, they didn't take the job, and they still took a running back. Like I will fully own that. That was my initial thought process for the first four months of that situation.
I mean, I just think it really shows the positive aspect of the Brad Holmes and Dan Campbell kind of fifty fifty roster decisions, share the ownership structure for this team, because you don't see general managers that at the finger of the pulse on their roster, on their depth chart top to bottom like he does. Like he truly that Jamiir Gibbs pick was knowing exactly what this offense needed without looking at the position. So it's just he's yeah, I
will never question him like that again. We will question him, we will disagree with stuff he does, but he has earned a lot of a lot of leeway because he truly understands this roster from top to bottom, and he don't make a pick like Jamiir Gibs at twelve overall, when you need a ton of more stuff without knowing, without knowing your team at a deep, deep level. Right, lastly, before I let you go, what happens with Jared goffin win. Yeah, I think it's coming. I really do
think it's coming before the start of the season. It just kind of sounds like they're getting their p's and q's around. I mean, we talked to Piney School yesterday and his deal took three or four months to come together. It's Saint Brown a very similar deal. It's gonna be some big money with
the quarterback deal. So I think there's some get that draft clas in there, get those on side free agents signed, get a better maybe make one more free agent addition, get a better idea where your roster at that Jerry Goff is going to be getting that new contract. Look, I think he'll
be here before the start of the regular season. That's the last thing you want is something like that hanging over a quarterback or any player, but especially a quarterback, because when you're in that locker room, it's the inevitable thing that has to be discussed. And and if it's not with him and he says, look, I'm not talking about it, people are gonna end up talking to other players about it. And it's not something you want hanging over.
So they want to get it done, and they should get it done. Ben great stuff is always really appreciate it. Give them a follow on X Benjamin s Raven great stuff with m Live He and Kyle Monikey tag teaming on a hell of a job regarding the Lions NFL Draft in the NFL in general. Have a great rest of your week, man, I appreciate your time very much. Yeah, thank you, Matt, thanks for having me calling me anytime. I appreciate that. Yeah, we will do that.
We'll take you up on that. Ben Raven joining us here to Exes and Bros. Very interesting stuff. Good. I love that perspective, you know. And you just talked with Penny Suel yesterday. See that's those Those are important conversations to have with a man like that. Who was there talking with Penney sol Hey, listen, how long did it take? These are not things that take a week. Okay, it's not you and your wife sitting down at the table figuring out a budget and getting it done the following week
or the following day. The teams, these things take time. So the Jared Goff maybe we'll talk more about that tomorrow. Ben, we can do that because how much do you want Jared Goff? And for how long? How long is the term? How much is too much? We'll definitely have that conversation tomorrow here on Exes and Bros. Are thanks to Ben, our producer, Our thanks to Ben Raven from m Live, and our thanks to you for your phone calls, really good phone calls this morning and your texts.
Keep them coming. Exes and Bros. Monday through Friday six until nine The Huge Show on most of the same Great Network stations. Later on this afternoon from three to six. We'll talk to you again Thursday morning. You're on Exus and Bros. Across the Great State of Michigan. Thanks for listening.
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