Peacemaker with Chukwudi Iwuji

is jasonce Upchiana. Welcome to x ray Vision The Crooked Podcast, where for twenty five episodes we have doven deep into your favorite shows, movies, comics, and pop culture. In today's episode, on previously on some casting News, Paul Dano's full immersion into the meat Suit of the Riddler, of some Thor Love and Thunder Lego news, and some other stuff about Marvel in the Airlock, we will be talking about HBO

Max's Peacemaker, the finale of which aired last week. In the high Mind, we are joined by Peacemaker star Chuck Woody Woujie, who plays Mern on Peacemaker and is a wonderful human being, and we had a great conversation underd out. A listener tells us why we should care about the legend of Vox Makina on Amazon and in the endgame. Who is our favorite villain turned hero and joining me today to talk about everything is the brilliant, the talented, the hilarious, the only one who could be here today

for the twenty fifth episode of X ray Vision. It is a great Rosie night, Rosie. How are you today?

his various comics adventures. He will be joined by Fred Heckinger, who you might remember from White Lotus if you watch White Lotus. He is the younger brother who has to sleep in the closet because his sister and sister's friend find him annoying. He is coming on to play a role that we don't know what the role is yet, but there's a lot of scuttle bout out there that it could be a Chameleon who is of course Craven's brother. Any thoughts of this, Rosie, It is.

I mean, this is great casting, like Fred is really great, so go for it. But I think it's really interesting that the rumor around Russell Crowe, who was also reportedly cast, is that he's going to be Craven's dad. So I'm interested in this weird like family, interesting legacy kind of villain movie.

percent Hawkeye's fault. One unquestionably million, hundred billion, trillion percent. Hawkeye gave up. If you go back and watch I know, if you go back and watch that scene, Hawkeye grabs the kid and then the gun starts shooting towards him, and then Hawkeye could he could dive out of the way, He could dive left, or he could dive right. Instead, He's like, you know what, I'm gassed out. I'm just going to turn my back and not watch us both

get shot. And that necessitated Quicksilver having to come in and save the day, and of course Quicksilver dies, And again I blame Hawkeye for.

do you think this means? Who does this mean?

is a guy and he's older. A lot of the rumors about the Blade movie for a long time, whether it was going to be about Blade's daughter, which was based on a comic that never came out. That doesn't seem to be the case. I think it has to be a character who's going to be in multiple MCU things.

like Vampire X or something like that. But I guess that's I wonder if Vampire X is too close to Blade, Like if that's too much, Like so Vampire X is an ultimate Marvel vampire character, extremely well trained like Daredevil level fighting, a martial arts ability, and can really go toe to toe with Blade in that regard, but that's not I do like I like Dracula better. I wonder I like your pick better. I think Dracula is a great pick.

before we see him in Blade? Is he Could it potentially be that he's going to be in that Halloween special that we all are pretty sure is a were Wolf by Night kind of secret back door something that we talked about in pre pro is Like, could it be that they were potentially casting a character from one of the Blade movies who they're going to like recast, which I do.

which will give us hints of it real. Blade will be our real fora into horror Marvel. Very very exciting Batman news. Batman of Course. The Batman, directed by Matt Reeves, is scheduled to come out on March fourth. Get your

tickets now if you can. Paul Dano, who is playing the Riddler, was quoted recently saying that he got so deep into the Riddler that he just basically couldn't get those Z's quote, there were some nights around that I probably didn't sleep as well as I would have wanted to, just because it was a little hard to come down from this character. It takes a lot of energy to get there, and so you almost have to sustain it once you're there, because going up and down is kind

of hard. He continues another quote about being wrapped in plastic wrap for a scene in the movie. I almost couldn't sleep because I was scared of what was happening to my head. It was like compressed from the sweat and the heat of lack of oxygen. It was a crazy feeling. All of which is to say, there will be a lot more X ray vision coverage of The Batman as we near The Batman, which is very exciting. But Paul Danel, please take care of yourself anything.

was a tweet by this guy, Casey Lawrence. He said he ain't even in costume and look like someone that tell Hella riddles for no re And I just think all the time about that, where I'm like, you cost the guy who legitimately just looks like he would tell riddles and you cover his face like yeah, but no, I think it sounds good and scary and I'm into it.

getting some sleep now. Finally, our continuing coverage of Legos potentially potentially spoiling movies spoiler sports, spoiler alert, potentially some Lego news about four, Love and Thunder. A Lego set titled The Goat Boat.

The Necro Sword, of course, being forged from the same symbiote material as the original symbiote that would become Venom, would become Cartage, would become a whole suite of symbiote creatures. Now as Chris our producer Chris super producer Chris raised in pre pro Lego has been known to throw a few headfakes and pump fakes into the mix to try and throw people off. They really sets in the past

that don't correspond to anything from the movies. They are occasionally using the verbiage inspired by to denote that it's not direct from the movie. But any thoughts on this listen, We've been waiting for the goat. Yeah you need the goats to be in a Thorn movie, shouts to my two Snatcher people out there.

way that they posed it. They hid Gore and Cork, but it reflected in the bottom of the table, and I think that ended up being why they released it properly. So I think that to me says, you know, we know Gore is in the movie. That's yeah, you know. And I think that it's really cool that we're getting to see the necro sword. I like the way that these toy reveals and Lego stuff kind of bring you back to that kid of comics. So like seeing the

neck resort in like Lego is really fun. It's kind of like, you know, thinking of action figures when you're a kid, and that being the first space that you see these things. So I think it looks really fun. I love Tiker's Thor.

a lot of time with Jane as Thor. There are a lot of reveals in that run about really kind of like quietly revolutionary canon updating reveals about the nature of Mulnir and how it works where Thor gets their powers from. Do you think we'll see Nellie Portman in multiple movies as Thor?

it first really started, Jane Foster was Thor. She was the Mighty Thor, and they were in an Avengers team together, and that team also included some young heroes.

You know, you could even have like an A four style team, like a female We're.

And also the cool thing is we have the TV shows now maybe Mighty Thor j Foster will be in a romantic relationship with Sam Wilson and we'll see that in a secondary series of that show, or we'll see it in the potential Captain America for movie, because that's something from the comics. I think there's so much fun stuff, especially because we know Thor is going to be in a kind of as Guardians of the Galaxy cosmic hero situation, which means mid God aka Earth needs a Thor, needs a hero.

Is going to be like the last scene in some movie is going to be Mighty thil Or Jane Foster, Yeah, Monica Rambo, I'm not sure who, Sam Wilson Captain America. All gathering in the celestial for like the first official meeting of like the new Avengers. Yes, do you think that happens like officially? And when do you think we see it?

all these different people. So I think at some point, basically, whether or not the Eternals are involved, it will be a response to another celestial or cosmic threat and they'll be like, well, guess what, there's a celestial on this Earth that was turned to stone by someone more powerful than a celestial So that's probably a safe place to just hang out.

so maybe that can happen work. But what gets us to siege is the fallout from Civil War and other superhero calamities is the Dark Reign when Norman Osbourne and a coterie of similarly minded supercriminals and various other B and C and D and E list super criminals rise to take control of the you know, world security apparatus because basically world governments are like, you know what, the superheroes are fucking up all the time. Norman Osborne made a good pitch, let's let him run it. It wasn't

an event, so to speak. It was kind of just like an all around paradigm shift all the way through the Marvel Universe of every book. But man, there was some good stuff to come out of that.

actually crack down. Let's give control to couldn't be Norman Osborne unless they got him as a variant from some other place, but some other person like that, and let's really let's do Dark Ring. Do you think we see it?

we have a multiverse now would be easy. People love Willem Dafoe, but like I love Willem Dafoe, but like, it would be really easy to have a puppet master pulling the strings of this US agent, you know, kind of new version of whatever the Dark Avengers we know abominations being trained by the sort of the new source or supreme woe. So I think that we're very, very close. And I also think this links back to one of our big conversation points, how do you introduce the X

Men when people with powers are not being oppressed? If you set up a Dark Rain situation where people with powers who are in quotes good are being legislated against and it becomes this kind of one percent evil corporation, then you immediately have a situation where mutants and heroes would have to come together to fight against this kind

of bigger threat. And I think that that, in some way, shape or form is going to be really relevant, especially because a lot of times when I write about this stuff or we're researching stuff, you go back to Dark Rain a lot that eral it's just like, oh, where did this character come from? Oh it was Dark Rain?

Where did this think? Oh? Oh it's Dark Rain? And we know that the next big official which is so great actually because I have a lot of thoughts about how this links into Peacemaker, but like the next big thing, that event comic adaptation that we know is happening. We've got Secret Invasion, you know, as well as Armor Wars, which I'm stoked for because I love already, but like Secret Invasion that is confirmed, and again that kind of

brings in this idea of the distrust of superheroes. Who is really a superhero?

about this? So and that caused a significant erosion of trust, and then of course you had to have Norman Osborne and a bunch of dark Illuminati figures get together and make a plan very very casually, but it feels like we're gonna go there. I do wonder if so we're doing the multiverse right now, this is the phase we're in.

I wonder if once we're through Quantumania, right, if they will close the door, so to speak, on this particular chapter of multiverse stuff, like whether it's incursion or whatever device they use to kind of like close the door on that. If we then move to a more grounded Okay, let's let the bad guys run it, because when we let the good guys run it, basically all we get are destroyed cities, alien invasions, and et cetera.

We're not talking about Peter Parker, the friendly neighborhood spider man stopped like rescuing a cat and stopping people from getting mugged, and even then like that's its whole own sociopolitical conversation. But like we're talking about a teenager with weld ending nuclear weapons. We're talking about Scarlet Witch, you know, accidentally blowing up this building in Lagos. Like this is this stuff that people get excited brillionaire to talk about.

let's go to the airlock and talk about Peacemaker. All right, We're stepping out of the airlock and into Evergreen, Washington, home of HBO Max's series Dear.

DC universe. Folks. It was a fun season one. Excited for season two. Let's do the Lightning style recap Episode seven, stop dragging my heart around? Are you ready, Orsy, I'm ready, Let's do it. Okay, So the sounds of Motley Cruz nineteen eighty five power Bell It hit Home, Sweet Home. We flash back to Peacemaker's childhood and we see a really, really troubling moment in which Chris and his older brother Keith, you know, they are hanging out listening to heavy metal music.

Keith is showing Chris how to do the devil horns, and then they are called outside by their father, Augie. Their father would like his sons to bare knuckle brawl in a not even like in an arena or squared, just literally in a pit, in a hole in the ground. Chris punches his brother Keith. Keith suffers a serious brain injury and dies, and Augie immediately blames Chris for Keith's death. I've been wondering, you know, how they were going to

bring in Peacemaker's mental illness. You know, it's funny because we've been talking about like Marvel's foray into a mental illness storyline with Moonnight here is DC getting there first with a character who is right out on Front Street, like very very ill in his debut limited series from the mid eighties. And here is kind of like the origin story of Chris's really extreme trauma right here, we're watching it happen.

Master has escaped, which is like barely mentioned. He's just like out of there. There's too much going on. We can't look for Judomaster right now. Judo Master has escaped. He is back on the street. Peacemaker plans to take Vigilante with him to go find the cow, the source of the butterfly's food on Earth, and big spoiler, kill it. That's gonna be the you know, listen, that's the plan to hammer. Everything looks like a nail. Gotta go kill

the cow. So they head off with John Ecconomos. Meanwhile, at a Bio is racked by guilt for her role in framing Peacemaker. Harcourt, realizing that Auto Bio planted the diary in Peacemaker's trailer. At Amanda Waller's Behes confronts out of Bio for portraying her teammates. Ads is like, listen, I'm not cut out for this mercenary life. I'm just like a normal person, you know, Like I was running a dog shelter. She doesn't say this now, but she's

like that was her life. She you know, lost her job and then her mother, Amanda Waller, came to her and was like, well, you need money, so why don't you do this mern shows up. He knows that out of Bio is Waller's daughter. Harcourt is still amazed at this, and he says, listen, we need to get out of here because the police and the police chief they're all butterflies. They have access to their human bodies memories. Therefore they know where all our locations are. Flash over to Juda Master,

what's he doing? He's hanging outside the easyps Mart, where he quickly bushwax two assholes who were making fun of him, and he steals their car. Little note for the for the denizens of any superhero laden reality, if you see someone in costume hanging out somewhere, don't just make fun of them. Like you live in a world in which multiple costumed people beat like people up all the time, So just like, don't fuck around. Why are you doing that?

Harcourt calls Chris, but Peacemaker doesn't want to answer because he is too busy sitting hair metal while driving with John and the Vigilande to kill the cow. Meanwhile, Augie, Chris's father, is in his white dragon power suit. He is with his Arian Empire gang. They are homing in on Chris's location because every one of Peacemaker's helmets has

a GPS locator in it. They waylay our hero's delivery van and a big fight ensuits with Vigilante unloads his submachine gun into the White Dragon, and then as the coup de grass to finally take out Augie, he throws a grenade midway between himself and the White Dragon. Unfortunately they're standing about nine feet apart, and so Vigilandi, who is in the less the less sturdy suit, takes the absolute worst of the explosion. Chris and John look on

in horror they flee the scene. Peacemaker realizes at that moment that his dad can track him through the helmet, and so John Economos has the brilliant idea to tie the helmet to a raccoon and they escape. The Vigilanti, meanwhile, has managed to steal a car from one of the Arian Empire, but he passes out like after driving a quarter of a mile because again his body has been shredded by shrapnel from the grenade they threw four feet

away from himself. The Butterflies close in in their cop you know meat suits close in on Hardcourt Mernon out of bio Mirn is killed by goth after revealing his true nature as a butterfly and his name is Ichnoblock is revealed to his fellow alien insects, Goth crushes him to death. Harcourt and out of bio or like hiding, like right there, they're like hiding. They're like hiding literally like around the corner. Nobody sees them. That's fine.

take all that electricity passes. Peacemaker and John find Vigilante passed out on the car. They get in as eagerly pecks it, John Economos's asshole and they escape. Peacemaker realizes that Vigilante has a bag full of elements that he stole from his dad's headquarters, meaning that one hundred percent. His dad knows exactly where there are because of the GPS inside of all of them. They pull over. Peacemaker

goes off to throw this bag into a field. Why do you need to throw it into Just leave it at the side of the road and drive away.

with his butt fully exposed. Here's the thing about peace Regular that I love. Right, you get so much really fun character lore that is now part of the history. Like Vigilante is a real DC character, absolute psychopath. But nowhere in this character's like lore history was it known that he could not urinate if any kind of fact, was touching his buttocks, but here we learned that about him. Meanwhile,

White Dragon is smacked eagerly to the concrete. Peacemaker charges at his father and White Dragon unleashes like a unbelievable racist, homophobic, nationalistic and just generally like means screed upon his son. And it's only the quick thinking of Vigilante and John Economos that managed to save Peacemaker's life. Chris then shoots his father in the head after Augie is like, what are you gonna do? Shoot me in the head? He

asked for He asked for it, and Chris weeps. Now in the comics spoiler, Peacemaker's dad is already dead has it also was shot in the head, but by his own hand, commits suicide, and Peacemaker's dad is like a flat out like an actual Nazi, like real real life member of the Nazi party in the Waffen ss the whole thing and mold his son to following and his footsteps for various reasons that I'm not gonna spoil because

maybe they'll delve into it. That programming was like disrupted, and Peacemaker's role and character arc like as a hero was unbeknownst to him, steered by shadowy forces who were just like trying to keep his like fragile, semi destroyed psyche together. So here we see Chris weep after shooting his father, but then not too soon after, in various

other episodes, we see that Aggie continues to appear to Chris. Yes, I think we're gonna get that this it clearly we're gonna delve into this kind of broken psyche of Chris Smith the Peacemaker through this. And I wonder, Rosie, do you think we're gonna learn that Peacemaker's own history with Keith the things that he remembers maybe aren't quite the things that he remembers. Do you think that we're gonna go there?

more superheroic. Right, But the one thing that really stands out to me that doesn't really fit into the world and feels purposeful is the fact that Augie is like this inventor genius who has a secret lay.

for him. So I think that you could be really right about there being some kind of manipulation that harks a little bit back more to the comics, especially with the ghost stuff, because the notion of Peacemaker being haunted by his father is like very much comics based, even if it's not always as literal as they put it in to the show. As we kind of go forward.

things from their life with each other. Ads talks about her previous job managing a dog shelter, talks about her relationship such that it is with her mother, Amanda Waller, the extremely ruthless, loveless Amanda Waller, who apparently wanted her daughter to transition directly from helping animals in need to like active counterintelligence and assassination work, which is like, okay. Ads also not tell this is a notable. Did not tell her mother that Mern was a butterfly, which is important.

Harror Court and Ads catch up with Peacemaker, Vigilante and John at the local vets office, where Peacemaker is, of course trying to heal eagerly. Harcourt talks Vigilante out of like executing the veterinary stuff. He really really wants to do it, but Harcourt manages it's really in a hilarious fashion talking out of it.

I am. Eagerly then rises and he and Peacemaker embrace, and we flash back to that earlier scene from earlier in the season when Peacemaker is telling at a bio about how he hugged Eagerly at one point and out of bio just dismissing it and being like, you're crazy, I don't believe you. At a bio is emotional that this is kind of freaking out, calls Kia, her wife, and suddenly is dedicated to this group of individuals. We see the team now forming. She realizes she has to

help kill this cow. So the plan is to hit the cow where it is and the cavern under the barn before the butterflies have a chance to assemble their teleportration equipment and get the cow out to a new location. The team has come together, we could do the hilarious

moment we're Vigilante. Hardcourt asks them all if they are in, if they're part of this team that is going to take down the cow, and they're all like, you know, piece workers, like yeah, I'm gonna do it, and then Vigilante is like hashtag me.

so good because like he is a sociopath. Vidch is a sociopath, but like throughout the show, he has in the episode before this, he has this incredible moment where he goes into the prison to try and to try and like basically kill Peacemaker's dad and he does this great speech where he asks all these neo Nazis what their favorite contributions like black people have made to culture art and he does this brilliant speech and like throughout this they make him like very likable. So in the end,

like when he's the one making that joke. You're like, he's just a pure kid who thinks he's shouting out me too, Like he is that weird, Like this is hilarious, and Freddy Stromer is an icon. I love him.

Peacemaker responds with a series of fart sounds, which is like various fart sounds lifting the leg, et cetera, like each each kind of like building on the other, until finally Vigilante joins in and Chris is like, duber off it now, it's all now, like you got into it too late. Chris ultimately does not accept the apology. He is still I think, you know, rightfully hurt that out of.

up here. You have the Justice League out here. We're facing like a full scale alien invasion and a cow of unknown size. We need some help. Unfortunately, Amanda Waller says, there's no time for the Justice League heavy hitters to arrive on the scene. Yes, they have two team members that can travel at superhuman speed, one who can run at mach levin and who can travel through time because you can run so fast. But they won't make it there in time. Sorry, They're just.

different location. Harcourt and Peacemaker scout the barn. Meanwhile, Peacemaker is explaining all his various helmets, all the cool things that the helmets that his dad made him, his White supremacists father made him, and all the things they can do underwater breathing. Maybe not super useful right now, but it's cool. Sonic boom will be useful very soon. Human

torpedo will be useful very soon, and more now. Right after this, a very funny scene at of Bio accidentally activates the anti gravity helmet, which goes flying off into the air. And now our heroes need a new way

to get the sonic boom helmet to the barn. Somehow Green Arrow's name comes up, and the Peacemaker is like as he has done in hilarious fashion all throughout the series, drops some probably not correct like information slash rumors about the various superpowered individuals and super costumed individuals in the DC universe, and he lets everybody know that Green Arrow goes to Berny conventions and wears a costume with a four inch wide butthole which is not as Vigilante asks

used for breathing, and it's probably not true, but John.

of bio Peacemaker and his dad. Wait what his dad? Sorry, this is a fossilarm Augie is only there as a very very realistic hallucination, a manifestation of Chris's extreme trauma. So don't worry. Everything is fine and chill Peacemaker is just having extremely realistic hallucinations of his white supremacist father. This definitely will not play into season two of The Peacemaker,

don't worry about it. Meanwhile, Harcourt has just wandered up and has witnessed Peacemaker shooting a poisoned dart into a tree while screaming at his dad. Are we troubled by this? We don't have time to be troubled by this, because Harcourt finds the helmet buried under some leaves. Chris takes out a butterfly sheriff steals his uniform. We flash forward

a few hours. They convince Economos to put on the butterfly sheriff uniform, despite the fact that it was very recently covered in shit, and Economist goes in, carrying the helmet in a toolbox. On the way into the barn, officer fitz Gibbon, of course, who is one of the butterflies, stops h questions him briefly, but then allows Economists to continue in, at which point John gets a look at the cow and it is fucking horrifying, rosy.

I'm out of here. He flips out, He's leaving, and on his way out, Fitzgibbon stops him again, and in his response to fitzgibbons questions about why his beard looks so weird, John, in a wonderful character full circle moment, very emotionally admits that, yes, as Peacemaker has inferred all season, he does die his beard, and he does so because he just feels out of place, feels out of place

in the world. He feels maybe not good enough. He feels he's not young enough, he feels that he's not in shape enough, and he wants to feel like a different person, and he's the pathetic person. Feels like he's a pathetic person, and that's why he dies his beard. And the entire team hears this exchange over the radio. Fitzgibbon is like, fine, I buy this, you can go away.

But then another of the butterflies finds the helmet that John left in the barn, and they chase John, and all hell breaks loose and here we go, We're going to get the big fight. At a bio triggers the helmet, which starts to cave the barn in on the cow. The big fight is now fully engage. Peacemaker, Harcourt and Vigilante run to the barn. They're shooting, punching, hacking their way through the various butterflies. Chris sees GoF Duck into

a stairway, heading underground. He chases after a Meanwhile, Vigilante and Hardcourt shot like multiple times out in the battle in front of the barn. They fall to the ground with serious wounds. But before a butterfly can fully take over Hardcore's body, it is climbing into her mouth. At a Bio, showing that maybe her mom, Amanda Waller, knew what she was doing. Maybe maybe at a Bio was wasting her talents as the lowly And it's a noble calling, so I don't mean to say lowly, but as a

mere manager of a dog shelter. Because at a Bayou goes full John Wick on these butterflies like double guns John Wu style, kicking, punching, shooting, fighting her way to her friend Harcourt, who she saves, pulling the butterfly out of her mouth moments before it can burrow all the way in. At A Bio, now wearing the human Torpedo helmet, follows the stairway down. As this is happening, Peacemaker has managed to extract himself from the rubble, is immediately attacked

by golf. At A Bio appears, thinking I'm going to save my friend activate Humor Torpedo. She goes cannonballing into a wall and is knocked out koted. Golf is then like, you know what, we need a third hand here, and also I need to do an evil villain monologue because that's what happens in these stories. So here's the deal. Okay, it's me and Walker and we need a third set of hands to throw that lever over there so we can teleport this cow out of here. And here's the pitch. Okay. Actually,

your planet is on the road to ruin. It's on the road to destruction. Same thing happened on our planet. Okay, you politicians are not serving the people. The people are divided, environmental collapse, military incursions, all of these things are happening just in the exact same way that happened on our planet. So let us invade. It's actually a good thing because we are going to use our wisdom and our experience to help the human race not fall into the trap

that we fell into. What do you think? And peacemakers like activate human torpedo, sending at a baio, flying into the cow's belly, killing it in absolutely fucking disgusting fashion. He then kills Walker and kills Gough. Victory. We have saved the day. Our team is walking away from the ruins of the barn which hide below it the massive,

disgusting corpse of the cow. Chris is carrying the wounded Harcourt in his arms, and just as they are walking off, who should arrive but the Justice League minus Batman and Cyborg, who again, somehow, despite the fact that they have two speedsters in the group. I'm calling Superman a speedster. He can go at superhuman speeds. Yeah, they have arrived too late. Somehow. Peacemaker gives some hey, I know you fucked a fish humor to Aquaman, who, believe me, has heard it many, many,

many many times before. This old hat for Ackman has been dealing with this. Later, at the hospital, Chris and out of Bio makeup, Peacemaker is a little bit worried that per the Butterfly pitch from GoF that maybe he's just doomed the world to the fate of the butterfly planet. He's unsure about it. Out of Bio gets to address

the media. She clears Peacemaker's name and reveals that he and VIGILANCEI were working under a program that was greenlit by Task Force X, a Task Force X affiliated program it, thus revealing publicly the existence of Task Force X, run out of the Bell Reef Prison by her mother, Amanda Waller, and which is a program that uses superpowered criminals to send on suicide missions to basically save the world over and over again.

at Peacemaker's RV, a butterfly shows up. Chris feeds it some wonderful amber juice that apparently he had been saving up. Then his dad appears on the and talks to him in a very realistic way, even though we know that this is a hallucination and we are off into season two of The Peacemaker. Whenever that happens, let's talk about it, Rosie.

I think, as we talked about previously, it seems like we are heading directly into the real comics lore of the Peacemaker, as this person who is constantly bedeviled by the voice and image of his father, who as he is doing, you know, in the middle of fights in the comics, Peacemaker will hear the voice of his father being like, you need to be more brutal. You're not, You're too weak. Why are you saving lives? You should be exterminating lives. Clearly, we're going to be going to

this place. We talked about the parallels with Marvel's Moonnight. How do you feel about this part of the Peacemaker story now clearly going to be part of season two and Christmas story going forward.

possible choice for the best reasons. So for the first time, he puts his friends, yeah, and his connections before this idea of peace and doing anything for peace, right, So I think it's really interesting that we have this character who's done the most abhorrent things, who is like the most gnarly war criminal sociopath, but wants to be better, and then you end this season knowing that while he's on that quest for a better life, maybe some kind

of absolution or just caring about people, for the first time, he's going to be haunted by this kind of dark passenger Dad, who is going to be a counterpoint to that. And I think that goes intertwining kind of aspects of Chris are going to be like the major point and kind of conflict of season two as he tries to do bat Yeah.

in his life. We should add that. Uh that over the Green Arrow tweet, Steven Emmel shot back on Twitter. He said, of that moment, haven't seen it of the show, haven't seen it too busy showing scene of what professional wrestling should actually look like on TV. I think this was actually a joke. I don't think he's like actually mad. I don't know.

James Gunn is clearly really interested in. I mean, to me, that's one of the most powerful things about Suicide Squad is looking at how all these people have been shaped by the violence that they had to do. You know, Idris Elba, his character has a lot of that Rat Catcher Hers is an opposite version. So James Gunn obviously cares about this, and like you said, it preempts the version that we're going to see of that in Moonnight.

We already saw it in Legion, the Fox show kind of loosely based on the X Men character.

respect her, or he is very subconsciously. I know that he is subconsciously influenced by every kind of comic because the Suicide Squad, there is an argument that that isn't every character in that is analogous to a character in

The Avengers, So here is obviously influenced. But the thing that makes me think this is specific is that there is a very specific part of Secret Invasion more that ties into the Scrolls, which is the idea that in the very first appearance of the Scrolls, some of them get stuck as cows and is the Scroll Kill Crew comic, which I feel like James Dun's probably a huge fan of. There is a storyline about the cows alien meat becoming a part of the the kind of the wider American

food stuff. Yeah, this whole thing, it's just secret invasion.

their own spins on it. They are doing this constantly, whether it's you go back to you know, Fanos and Dark Soidles like their classic like you could go to Moonnight and Batman, like there's a million of these, and so I think viewing it from that perspective, and of course, like whether it's you know, George Perez or Brian Michael Bendis, there's been any number of creators who have gone between both companies and have had wonderful, happy creative careers at

both companies and have no problem whatsoever going from DC to Marvel, DC to marveling back. So I think viewed it from this perspective, this is like another one of.

of a two way street. And I actually really kind of love your angle on it too, because their imaginary does somebody at Corporate Disney not like this, perhaps, But the real truth is this once again actually does something truly brilliant that a lot of these stories rely on, just like Marvel introducing the multiverse, people need to have an understanding and a cultural recognition of what that means.

And DC's TV shows had been doing multiverse for ten years, so if people kind of had an idea, oh, something that exists in the DC Animated universe can also exist on the CW, Like that's a multiverse. So in a way, this actually just because it's not going to be anything like Secret Invasion. This is James Gun's own vision, but the analog of the story is there. And I think that in a way, like I love your perspective, because what this really does is it just gets people familiar

with this kind of storytelling. It gets people familiar with these wider, broader ideas that can then be reimagined because like, yeah, it's invasion of the body snatches. It's not like this was some incredibly.

got our answer. Right, the Justice League came. They came at the behest of Amanda Waller, whose daughter was you know, working with Peacemakers, so we know that this is all taking place in the universe. Notably, Cyborg and Batman Bruce Wayne were not there. What do you think they were doing because they could have done it right like they I mean they you know, they have Superman and Wonder Woman there, but just like in shadow so you don't really see their faces. We got the full moa moa

action with Aquaman. We got to see Barry Allen full face, and we know that the actor was there, but they clearly could have done like a Batman in Shadow, Cyborg and Shadow if they wanted to. Where do you think they are and what are they doing?

I love. That's like, I love Aquaman, am Aquaman, stand, Barry Alan Ezramila, Like, so this is that DCEU world, right, So I think to me, if I was gonna creatively guess, I would say, like, it's a struggle to decide which Batman would be there. And in Batman with Superman, he has a very archetypical shadow. It's just a it's a flying even though I think his proportions were a bit off.

I think he's a bit chunkier but sure, but like Batman people Alex, but like Batman for example, I feel like if he had been there and he'd had the little short ears, you'd be like, oh, that's Ben Affleck Batman, but Robert Pins and Batman, do we know if he's in that same world, we don't like, is that going to still be that kind of Earth two thing that Warner Brothers had kind of mentioned, Like, so, I think the problem is the bat suit is so iconic that

by putting any Batman there, you like make a statement, right, And I kind of I can't even a silhouette. I kind of like the idea narratively that like Batman and Cyborg would be on a mission together, you know, doing if we're talking narratively, Like, I really love that idea that that could kind of be the explanation, like they

were doing something that was more important. You know, this is not the first alien invasion for that Justice League, right is Like, so you send your like it's kind of cruel as well, But I love it because, like I'm a big Aquaman fan, and but the Flash and that Acuaman are not like the A list DC heroes, So I kind of love that. I like this, Superman and wonder Woman obviously that's part of the trinity, but I kind of love that the ones we see are like the the B Team.

or a gun. So I would love to see the reality of the Green Lantern power and the power of will Walk to life more visually. But I would also like to see Guy Gardner Green Lantern like. I just think he's got such a good attitude and I believe that he might be one of the leads of the Green Lantern Show, which makes me think that John Stewart as the movie Green Lanton would make the most sense. Question.

but you gotta put it out there reasonable. The Batman is coming out soon, It's possible.

been there. He was busy. But also I think corporately that's not a word. Yeah, you know, I think in a corporate sense, I actually think that is the spot on thing. I think DC is about to commit to a brand new iteration of Batman that we are unsure of how connected it will be or how standalone it will be. And I think that in that way, to have this episode coming out like a couple of weeks before Batman having Batman in any way is a statement, you know.

movie November fourth, File by Acuaman and Lost Kingdom. I'm super excited about continuing Jason Moulmolvers Batgirl twenty twenty two Sandman TV series, which is not going to be connected to anything, but I am very good. Yeah, very very excited that it's coming. But it is not going to benected to any of this.

Quinn season one and two, whoa, it's so funny. Fix it, fix it because it's so so so funny. Watch it season three come in twenty twenty two. Titans season four. I haven't watched any Titans, but I need to watch it. Titans teen. Titans is like, I actually think, theoretically my first comic book because we got a say noted drugs comic like in elementary school, and it was The Teen Titans.

HBO Max would exist. But I feel like it has found its place on that I love any teen team, and while we do not have an Exavier's School for Gifted Youngster show, I continue to watch Titans. It is also good as a kind of potted history of famous Batman back family kind of stories in a way that like X Men ninety two, one of the reasons I think people love it so much is you get to see all these different stories. You know, Phoenix Saga, right, the Day's a future past.

He cares about social justice, he puts his money where his mouth is, and I've always been a fan of the comics Green Arrow, Shazam, Fury the Gods, and second twenty twenty three Blue Beetle, which is going to be super fun for the fans of Blue Beetle, And then Peacemaker season two likely twenty twenty three, oh of course, and then Wonder Woman three, which is somewhere in development who knows where. Lots of stuff to think about. How in the future do you think Peacemaker could possibly tie

back to Justice? We now have seen Justice League in a Peacemaker a show. I wonder if we get any mentions in upcoming DCEU movies of like whether it's Doom, Patrol, Titans, whatever, just like a mention like, Oh, there's this team working over here. Oh there's that guy with the bow and arrow over at Star City.

this show is a HBO Max original. Maybe they're building some kind of HBO Max televisual DC universe that is going to continue that line on while they continue this kind of more autor driven visionary, different kind of film universes. And obviously we know Aquaman is still going to have a movie, so that's somewhere I could imagine him making like a funny joke about Peacemaker or John Cena kind of on the meta meta level, you know, so I

could see it. But I actually think we might be seeing a world where the DCEU and the kind of snide of US era stuff continues more in these TV shows than necessarily anywhere. Also, that would that would fit in with there were kind of rumors around the idea that the Batgirl movie would connect to the Flash movie. Yeah, you know so, I think maybe that era and those two heroes, specifically Aquaman and the Flash might be that world connected between the movies and TV that we were waiting for.

I'll ask you later if if that's to stay, but let's see what brought you to this project.

I've told this story a hundred times. Is like, and I just said to my wife, why am I wasting my time? They're gonna cast you know, Lance Reddick. You know what I mean, He's perfect for this. I mean I would cast him, you know. But then I read the material and it was so funny. I mean it was I think the scene I got was the first scene where he comes in and meets Peacemaker his trailer, you know, in episode one, and I'm reading that and I said, to my this is so hilarious. You know what,

let's just tape it. I'm not going to get it, but I owe it to this material to give it a go. And we did it. We did one take actually, and sent it out. And as it happens, as I've heard over is that James saw it and was like, who the hell is this guy? I want him? And that's sort of like how it happened. You know.

You know, your You're led the writers great writers, And I think James is a phenomenal writer, because the really good writers are very good at directing the actors with what they say, how they say stuff. So I look for clues on the page and I just don't know how else to approach the work. Then the way I would approach. I approached Hamlet, I approached Othello, and I

approached man, there's this stuff in front of me. You learn the lines, you get the clues from the writer what you feel, your instincts tell you he wants, and then you the whole process is it getting deeper and settling into you settling and settling, and your imagination goes well, you dream on it, you wake up, you run the lines. I always believe I the first thing I do is learn the lines, because those are where all my clues

are in the language. So, going back to what you say about the BBC, yeah, it's we're very lucky in certainly the British system and a lot of European systems, is that when you leave drama school, that's just the beginning. You know, you don't assume you're an actor after drama school.

But we have the luck sury of things like where I came up, the roy Shakespeare Company, the National Theater, Bristol, Ulvic, all these places where you can be an apprentice, so you can spend literally ten years learning, growing, growing in that confidence of doing, doing, doing, doing tiny roles and the roles grow and stuff. So we have a whole culture of just being given time and space to grow, you know. And I feel very lucky about that because

it builds a confidence in you. Work begets work, and experience grows. Doing all these sort of shows, there were seasons I would have about twenty roles in my head in a season, you know, and each one has to be distinct, you know. So we're steeped in the culture of characterization and building characters and letting it go and going on to the next thing and stuff. You know.

by doing that. I genuinely believe in this is what the scene is saying. James has written it in a certain way where we have a reveal, So why spoil the surprise as it were? So I'm always interested in playing moment and moments and letting the arc take care of itself. I really feel if there were any clues about who Myrn was, it was in the writing, and I certainly wasn't going to let it be in my performance because if you're a good actor, as in if Mern as a butterfly is a good actor as Mern,

he would hide it. He wouldn't be saying, hey, wink wink, am I a butterfly or not? You know, that just isn't real For me. I wanted the audience to have a genuine surprise, and I wanted to let myself have that surprise when it happened.

know what I'm doing and be given it. But in that group, in that setting, I did improvise. We all did, and James encourages it, and it's such a safe atmosphere to do it in and such a fun atmosphere that you're never really gonna fall flat on your face. It's always just gonna Some things are gonna work better than others, but you're never gonna be You're not gonna fall flat on your face because it's encouraged and James likes to let the camera run on and on. But that said,

I was the straight man. That mern is is very reflective of who I was amongst that cast, because they're naturals. I mean, John can improvise from now till eternity. Steve ag stand up, I mean, just Hilarius, Danielle, you know. I mean it's so natural to them. I had to play catch up, and often I'd be the kid at the back of the class that reluctantly put up my hand to improvise. I let the experts get on with it. You know.

and drill it and drill it. So I think from I want to say, we had maybe about five or six weeks between the first rehearsal and when we actually did it. And we worked with her two or three times, and then we were there it was time to shoot it. So I drove my wife crazy practicing at home. I mean she was just like, what are you doing. I was like, I have to get this down. I have to get this down because I don't want to look like a right idiot.

and all this. It's hard not to want to just grin. Also, the music is just so damn good because of playing it full blast the light. It was like being on an MTV music you know soundstage, you know, in the old days of those music videos, and it was exciting. So yes, it was a challenge not to get carried away. But you know, it's like acting a role. The role we were given that day. The direction from the director

was like straight face, let's get it done. And then there were lots of us you'd see in the blue per reel and stuff. I don't know if there's one just for the dance there's lots of breaking up right after, you know.

you know. But in the middle of shooting that dance sequence, James came up to me and said, can I have a word with you? And I was like, you know, and I joked, is this when you tell me you actually were looking to hire a chutel agr fun got our names mixed up? And he says, no, no, no, it's not, it's not. Actually is quite the opposite. I want you to play X in Guardians of the Galaxy three.

So it was on that day we were filming it he told me that, and for me, as a fan, of comics, as a fan of James Gunn as an actor who's like sort of making my way more and more into film and TV. For that day to be already doing Filmmaker then asked to go on to this incredible next project. Was it's selfishly my favorite moment of the whole thing in what was a lot of amazing moments in Vancouver, you know, I.

I could quote the people talking. I would just that was my my imagination games weren't imaginary friends popping out of my imagination. Games were movies and TV shows that scene re enacting them, literally playing different roles from them on a given day. So I was always drawn to it. So, but I never consciously I didn't know what I wanted to be. It wasn't until years later when I was

trying to convince my dad. My dad wanted me to go to Oxbridge, Oxford or Cambridge, and I knew that if I did that, I would have to make a decision on my career straight away, very early on, and I wasn't ready to. I didn't know what I wanted to do. So I said, if I go to America, at least I have a couple of years in the liberal arts system to mess around with different things and decide what I want to be. Somewhere in the back of my mind was probably the knowledge that if I'm

ever going to act, I have to start there. Do you know what I mean? Maybe? But I hadn't codified it. And then so my dad made a bet with me. He said, Okay, fine, if you want to go to America, the only way you'll go to America is if you get into an Ivy League. Then I'll let you go. It was the most expensive bet of his life because I got into Yale. You know, my dad's first and so I got into Yale. I did economics there, but

while I was there, I started doing drama. And the head of the undergraduate program, James de Paul, who to this day i'm very grateful for, saw me doing a production. And this is where it's weird. I'm sorry, I'm taking a long time to explain, because this is where life, this is where life meets art. When I was ten, we were living in Ethiopia. My parents worked for the United Nations, and we went Adis Ababa and we didn't much.

The TV was awful, you know, so we had this black market amongst the expats and diplomats and stuff of

VHS videos. We would exchange them, pass them around, and one day a copy of Beckett is a movie from nineteen sixty four, I believe, with Richard Burton and Peter O'Toole, The Murder in the Cathedral written by Jean an Ui and a. As a ten year old, I'm watching this thing set in like the fourteenth century, and I can't get over how good these guys are like, I'm watching Richard and just going that's what I want to be. But then I forgot about it. That happened when I

was ten. Fast forward to Yale and I'm twenty and I finally decided I want to start acting and doing it more. And one of the first posters I see my girlfriend. I am walking with my girlfriend at the time, and she she goes, oh, look at that post of my friends directing that, and I look at it and it's Beckett. That is the play of that movie. And of course I know it. I know both roles or whatever. I went into it and I got the role of Beckett.

The head of undergraduate drama saw the play because he had to go grade it, saw me play Beckett, and offered me a full scholarship to drama school. And that's how my acting started because of this movie i'd seen when I was ten in Ethiopia that I was so drawn, so I watched it over and over again. So that's how the acting thing happened. Because when I actually started acting as an adult, because there was a whole period when I was in high school, I didn't act. I

did sports. Back then, you either did sports or you did arts. You know, I did sport, but when I came back to it, I knew for a fact, this is exactly what I have to do, you know. And that's sort of how that drama school and on was what propelled me onwards.

possible opportunities and education. You've done that, You're at Yale, you're doing this. Now go live your life as you want to live it after that and if this is what you choose, we support you and thank God for that because so it wasn't that they thought, oh, he can make a living. They supported me from the start that this is the first time since they've known me as a kid. One minute, I wanted to be a firefighter, the next a vet, the next, the wrestler, the next

to whatever like that. This is the first time that I had something that I was like, it's not just because I can do it, but this is what I want to do. And they supported me from the start, the believing that I can support myself with it. I just believed it would come, you know what I mean. There was no point that they thought, oh he's safe now. They knew it was a struggle. They knew it was hard. They helped when they can thank God for their support.

I owe so much to them. I got my first apartment in London with their help, do you know what I mean? After I finally got my first big job and they helped pay for part of the deposit. They were just there for me the whole time. But I think it's only my mom passed away, you know, in two thousand and nine sadly, and I would say, it's it's I wish she could see this stage of it. You know, she saw the stage of the RC and the National She knew I could do it, and she

could see things growing. I just really wish she could see this stage where she could literally go to the movies and watch me. Do you know what I mean? But I'm sure she's watching from up top somewhere. My dad's still around. My Dad's still around, loving everything. He became overnight a movie buff from never remembering my dad

ever watching a movie to the end without falling asleep. Overnight, when I said I wanted to be an actor, suddenly my dad's calling me, asking me a James Cagney, Humphrey Bogat. Have I seen this film? Kauza Black is his favorite movie. He just became a film buff and watches everything. It's crazy, you know.

cast of incredible voice actors. Critical Role is credited with being one of the things that made D and D quote unquote cool again and is certainly one of the reasons why I've fallen down the rabbit hole and now have a dedicated group I play with every Tuesday. I need to take a moment to shout out my DM Gary and our party members Alyssa, Maddie, Kyle, Christian, Julie, Ulysses, Libby and Charlotte for making a very difficult time in all of our lives brighter and helping each other get

into this wonderful hobby. After the completion of Critical roles first campaign, which stars the titular Voxmachin Adventuring Party and their adorable bear trinket, the company set up a Kickstarter for a single animated special that ballooned into one of

the largest Crown funding projects of all time. In a preliminary two season partnership with Amazon Prime Video, Mercer, along with players and animation veterans Sam Regal and Travis Willingham were given the opportunity to bring their world to life on a scale they could not have imagined. The result was this the Legend of Vox Machina, a powerful, creative and surprisingly raunchy retelling of a beloved story that hits every single mark fans of the series could have hoped for.

The first episode opens with the grizzly deaths of a different adventuring party hired to defeat a great evil in the realm of Taldori. Meanwhile, the down on their luck Box Machina find themselves in a brutally animated tavern brawl, except for their bard, Scalen Shorthault, who is in bed with the innkeeper's daughter that results in them being thrown out on the streets and forced to take the dead party's contract as Sovereign Uriel's last ditch effort to save

his kingdom. While the adult bits are turned up to eleven, the series still manages to create a touching and compelling story, with each member of the party beginning their own personal journey in this first season, and the creators do an incredible job of showing what it really means to be

in a D and D party. Not only are your friend's characters your lifelines within the game, but it's such a comforting thought, especially in times like this, to know that there are people who you can rely on to have your back week after week while you create your

story together. The show also does a fascinating job of weaving standard D and D game situations into the story without being too obvious about it, whether it be the ranger of Exalia's primeval awareness, the druid Kilith using her wild shape to transform into animals, Grog, the barbarian and during a frenzied rage, or the Cleric Pike running out of spell slots and being unable to heal an ally

at a crucial moment. For all its adult humor, the show has so much heart and is not afraid to put its characters of vulnerable positions to serve its beautiful narrative. You can find hundreds of hours of critical roles. First Too Completed a care Pans on their YouTube channel. Following the Party is Voxmachina and the Mighty Nine, while episodes of their third campaign currently air every Thursday night on

their Twitch channel. The Legend of Vox Machina is currently in its first season with three episodes releasing every Friday on Prime Video, and season two is already in the pipeline.

picking who our favorite villain turned hero is. Favorite villain turned hero in any kind of story, sci fi, fantasy, comic book story, whatever the case may be. I will

go first. There's so many. I mean, Jamie Lanister from a Song of Ice and Fire slash Game of Thrones, although like obviously in the books, has not fully had the chance to turn into a hero as of yet, but in the in the show had what I think is one of the most miraculous turnarounds from guy who pushes a child out of a window to guy who you're like, I want him to hook up with briannatarth which is like an amazing art, ultimate, many many other examples.

But I'm gonna pick and then of course, like you could say Darth Vader, even though like he kind of goes opposite, but I'm gonna go, I'm gonna go Magneto.

of bad shit. But round about the eighties suddenly he started coming around, decided that you know what, I've done a lot of bad stuff and I want to take responsibility for it. He went on trial at the at the fucking un and ever since then, which I want to say, he's like X men about two hundred the trial of Magneto, he has been like basically a good guy. He's been a good guy for like thirty years now, right.

A Holocaust survivor notably, I think that one detail forever shifted the way we think about Magneto, and so I am going to say Magneto.

has come. Okay, I'm gonna go for I was gonna also pick Magneo because it's like such a classic choice, but I'm gonna go for another X Men character, which is like I'm gonna go for Rogue because forget like early on, like she was like, you know, Mystique in the raised my Mystique in the Brotherhood of Evil Mutants.

She is you know, contesting and fighting with Carol Danvers, which ends up changing her powers and she just has this wonderful arc and I love that in her case, it's this choice of nature versus nurture, and actually Destiny and Mystique who raised her were not bad people. They were just in a tough situation, and it's kind of that it's a continuation of the Magneto thing, which is like who is really the villain and who is really

the hero in these kind of rebellion situations. And I like that as a young person she gets to choose her own journey and become a hero. You know, she has one of the best character designs of all time.

like the ultimate outcast. She was dart of mystique former Brotherhood of e Mutants took Carol Danvers powers, so people didn't really trust her and she couldn't even like hold hands with it. She couldn't touch anyone. She was physically isolated from people, which you know, I've said this before and it's an embarrassing thing about me, but I was extremely invested in the in the romance between Gambit and Rogue, and a lot of that was because of this dynam

like near and love. She couldn't touch him, they could, they could even kiss. So that's a great pic. Love Rogue Love.

much everyone here loves comics. So I read this brilliant comic from this wonderful press that I love called Black Josey Press, which is it's like a collection of erotic indie comics. Buy this wonderful cartoonist called Trinidad Escobar. It's called Arrive in My Hands. So that's kind of like my personal plug because that comic has just brought me so much joy. And yeah, just appreciate everyone being here and obviously here you can always hear us here talking about the X Men.

Lord and Saul Rumin. It is executive produced by myself and Sandy Gerard, Caroline Ruston and Carlton Gillespie. Are consulting producers, and our editing and sound design is by Fascilla's Phatopoulos. Thank you to Brian Vasquez for our theme music, Goodbye