E30 | Why everyday transitions are hard for AuDHDers

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Hello and welcome back to another episode of WTF is Audie HD with late diagnosed sisters Ellie and Paige. We were diagnosed late. And we're here to educate. Nice work bro. Thanks. Ellie gave me the chance to do an intro. I think you may have. I've just taken my role actually based on that.

I wonder if everyone knew that that was me to begin with. Or do we sound so similar? I don't know. Okay, you can take over now. What's the podcast about today? No, nice work. Hey, team. Thanks for coming back for another ep. First of all, I just want to say, we just want to say.

say thank you so much for all the support you've given us on our episodes with dr haram sadiq yeah um it's the feedback's been amazing and we thoroughly enjoyed those chats and i would love to get them back again um so we really hope you enjoyed those two hours of

literal gold that he gave us um we're very very grateful to him for um giving us so much of his time yeah um and let us know if you want us to try and get him back again for even like specific subjects if there was something that he said that like you wanted to hear more about. We could even ask him if he wanted to do specialized subjects every now and then. He hasn't said that he'll do that. I'm just going to show you. But we could put the request in. Exactly.

Sorry, that's just... Sorry. Yeah, we could ask him. Who knows? He might be open to it. Especially if we give him a strong, you know...

topic that he wants to talk about. Cause as you can tell, he's also very passionate about his work and what he does. So thanks again. This episode today is going to be all about transitions and that might sound really simple, but it's talking about the phenomenon of just getting. between states of being or getting between states of action. Basically the bit between doing a task and doing another task.

we'll go into it further, but we wanted to share our personal insights because just recently we've noticed it more in our lives personally. Now that we've sort of, we've all, it's always been there, but were you not?

consciously aware of it and we become more consciously aware of it's like oh my god that's what that is yeah so we go and then we're our brain picks up on other examples of when it's happening oh my god and then that's why yeah so we'll just share our personal insight on that and talk a little bit about what it actually means

for autism, ADHD and ADHD. But first of all, we have a giveaway to do from Dr. Haram Sardik's... book that we've had on Instagram the last two weeks. It's called Explaining ADHD. Hang on. Wait, what is that? Sorry, Ellie. You're on your floor and I'm like da-da-da-da. Wait, what is that? Hang on. You know. Yeah, it's Hagrid. introducing Buckbeak. Buckbeak, yeah. Sorry. Okay, okay. Sorry. Where was I? Oh, yeah, we had a giveaway. Bye.

You've just thrown me nuts. Sorry, bro. No, it's fine. It's funny. We had a giveaway of Dr. Haram Siddick's book, Explaining Audie HD. And thank you to those for entering. Thanks for tagging your mates and telling them about our podcast. It's going to be a signed copy of his book and we are happy to announce, where did I put it? Ah, there it is.

The winner of the book is Moniz Krog. Now I hope I'm saying your name right. It's probably not even pronounced like that, but we'll send you a DM on Instagram and you've got a signed copy of Haram Sardik's book coming your way. Woohoo! Yay. Thank you for entering that. And hopefully we can have more giveaways like that in future. Also let us know, is there any products, are there any products you like that you'd like us to like approach?

to do giveaways for or stuff like that. What do you mean products? Oh, you mean like the Loop, say for example, like the Loop Airplugs or maybe your favorite fidget toys or like, I don't know, if there's just products that you like and you'd like us to align with, let us know because we could start approaching.

approaching brands and seeing if they wanted to do like giveaways and collabs and stuff with us. So just let us know. Sorry, we have a bit of, is that like an echolalia thing we have? I don't know. We do it every day, but we're kind of taking the piss. I love the Kardashians just to preface, but. like the way they speak and so ellen i was like yeah yeah cam cam chloe

Jealous. Okay, okay, stop. Now on to today's episode, which is all about transitions. Now, the reason this came up was because... First of all, transitions are a phenomenon that we all do. We all go through transitions every single day, every single minute in some ways. But for neurodivergent people, especially autistic, I think in particular,

Transitions are really difficult. And so we're talking about like when you are in a task doing something and then you have to move your state of being to somewhere else. Or worse, you get interrupted. That's awful. But I think that also comes into it too, where you get interrupted and it can make you really angry. Oh, my skin crawls. My emotional regulation is out the window at that point. Yeah.

Because it's like with autism, inertia, which is one of Newton's three laws, I hated science, but inertia is the phenomenon of... When something, this is so bad, I'm so bad at physics, but it's basically the phenomenon in physics where something is, a force is moving in a direction and its inertia is going in that way. So it's hard to stop the inertia. Is that right?

Yeah. And I think like in like physics terms, how the inertia that's going forward needs the exact equal amount of inertia to slow down. Wait, no. I think that's the third Newton's law, right? Oh, is that more force? No, I think that one's everything has an equal and opposite reaction. Okay, sorry. Ignore me. No, but yeah, I'm pretty sure that's one of Newton's third laws. We've probably got like really good scientists and physics people listening to this going, what the...

Yeah, shut these bitches up. But it's actually a term used in science, but then also when it comes to being and when we're in an action. And then we want to continue that action. Basically, we want to stay in our inertia. We want to keep going until we're done with it, right? It's like the monotropism. Once you're in a task and you're deeply in it. Yeah.

You don't want to be interrupted. And so when someone comes in, so basically this is actually what it means. A property of matter by which it continues in its existing state of rest or uniform motion in a straight line unless that state is changed by an external force. So in this context. I'm doing my cooking or whatever. And then someone comes in and tells me I need to go unload the dishwasher or something.

ah, my inertia gets interrupted and I hate it. But that's actually a really common thing, especially in autism, because we're really good. Autism, autistic people, sorry, are very good at focusing as Dr. Haram. said last week, they're really good at focusing in on one subject at a time. And that's what makes us so great when it comes to like special interests or...

topics that we're interested in. We know everything because we're able to focus so hard, but that's why you might find an autistic kids really hard to interrupt. They might be drawing and you try and go, Hey.

come over here and they just do not move. And it's not because they're actually ignoring you. It's not because they're trying to defy you. They're actually just in their state of inertia and they want to keep going in that state. It's really hard. Like when my teacher tried to get me to stop drawing in SSR. Yeah.

And then I kept drawing it. Yeah. Yeah, it's also because you really didn't want to do the reading. Yeah, I know. But capitalize on every child's passion. Yeah, exactly. Because it's all to do with. executive function predominantly and being able to focus on that task, your executive function actually struggles to move tasks and transition to the next thing. So that's why in autism particularly, it's quite intense. So transitions can be...

anything from like just getting out of bed, which we talked about before, but it can also be change and like changing careers. Like it can be a big life thing that changes and that's a massive transition to your everyday life that.

is really tough sometimes, especially for the autistic people. And actually people are more like spontaneous at heart. So like the dopamine sometimes carries them. The excitement of the new novelty can carry them. And I think this is why audio HD is so funny because sometimes I don't mind.

transitions and then other times I hate them yeah I'm an anomaly like sometimes I'm like oh my god I need newness I need excitement and in that case that overrides the yeah you know but if it's like day-to-day tasks it's quite prevalent, my inertia with things. Yeah. If the task that we're having to switch to or the thing we're having to switch to has no novelty to it, then I'm going to stay in my state of what I'm doing now.

But yeah, basically it's cognitive inflexibility and hyper-focus inertia. So like ADHD, when you're hyper-focused on something, that inertia, and then... autistic people are a bit more inflexible and rigid when it comes to their state of being. And so the both, again, like Dr. Haram said last week.

They look similar, but they're still actually a little bit different deep down. And then when you've got the ADHD experience, it's the combination of both, which can be really confusing. Some people might say like, I can sit on the couch for three hours. No, I need to pee.

But, like, I just don't. You do that, right, when you're working? I'm doing that when I'm working and then I realise the last hour my bladder's about to burst and I – but then once you notice the pain, you can't unsee the pain. Yeah. You know, and you're like, well, how did I not – like, you don't register. Yeah.

Yeah, exactly. This is why as well what Dr. Haram said, and I agree, is that sometimes the state of being, like changing your state of being, I find difficult. But then another times, like you said, the novelty drives me to change jobs or go do.

like do a trip or something or book a flight somewhere, for example, whatever it is. This is why it can be confusing for ADHD is because it's like we don't feel like we fully belong to the autistic community and then we don't feel like we fully belong to the ADHD community.

So, you know. Yeah, it's very isolating. And it always feels like there's not as much support out there for us because, yeah, we don't need what autistic people need. We don't need what ADHD people need. We kind of need like a. a double pronged approach. Yeah, but then if you also don't really know that you are ADHD, you kind of go, oh, then I can't be autistic because I am good with people or I do this, which is such a stereotype, but just an example I threw out there.

But, you know. Yeah, definitely. Definitely. Yeah, so going back to the inertia thing, when it comes to autism, it's about cognitive inflexibility. So once you're engaged in a task or resting, it's mentally difficult to disengage and then re-engage with something else.

Because that's the other thing, when you get interrupted, it can be hard to go back to what you were doing. Oh, that's why. Yeah. It's just... It's like, oh, once I get out of this, I'm going to be stuffed. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think that's more ADHD, actually, but... The other thing with autism when it comes to this inertia and your state of being changing is just autistic people, as we've discussed, need the predictability in life. We need to know what's happening. We like to predict.

the future and what is expected of us. And when we get interrupted or have to transition somewhere else, it's all fear of the unknown. It's like, Oh, where am I going? What's the sensory experience going to be like? What's who's there? Like, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. And then just changing, I just actually mentioned that, yeah, changing your environmental state affects all your senses. So smells, yeah, every sense you know what they are.

ADHD has more to do with the hyper-focus and when you're deeply focused on something. You just can't see or hear anything else. That's why you can go hours not wanting to go toilet because you're so focused on that thing. We also have issues just initiating tasks in general. This is why with ADHD and autism is the combo. It's a real...

F up because you've got the lack of dopamine from the ADHD, which basically demotivates you in general. And then you've got the sort of like cognitive rigidity of the autism. So when they both come into play, they look like a paralysis, which is what I end up with often. Yeah. And then emotional resistance. So for ADHD is if the task or whatever you're about to be. doing or transitioning to isn't fun, then why would we do it? And then once you do manage to get into a role of doing it...

And you're like, okay, I've got to get this all done now because then I can't bear getting out of this and having to get back into it again. Then someone comes and interrupts you. That's just like, oh. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And then you've got the audio HD, which is what we've just kind of said. It's the double whammy.

ADHD makes it hard to start and then autism makes it hard to stop or switch. That's kind of the simplest way to say that inertia thing, the transitions for all DHDs and neurodivergent population just in general.

are really tough. This can result in freezing during transitions. So yeah, for me, like I just freeze and I have paralysis and I don't do anything. Shame spirals about doing nothing. So you're just like, oh, why am I so useless? And you just beat yourself up. Again, we've spoken about this so many times. The cost of ADHD and particularly undiagnosed ADHD is the beating up of yourself. And I think.

Thinking you're useless. I think this is partially to do with also why I'm an all or nothing person. Yeah. Because it's like when I'm in the zone and I'm doing it, I'm doing it all. Yeah. And then when I'm like burnt out, say. It's kind of a combination of a lot of things, but say I'm burnt out. I like, I'm nothing. Like I can't do anything. Yeah. Obviously that's in line with like maybe burnout as well, but it's like when I'm on a roll.

I'm doing everything at once. Yeah, yeah. No, I know what you mean. So the reason we kind of thought about this episode is, well,

First of all, we'd already come up with this episode. And then I saw a discussion happening in our Reddit this morning. And it was from about a week ago. About a week ago! You know that song? What's that song? No, no, no, no, no, no. You'll know. Other people will know. Anyway. Okay, hope so. Sorry, I found this post in our Reddit. If you want to come and join it.

Just click on our link tree in our Instagram bio and you can join it. It's private. So you have to request. And then once you get accepted, you have to press join again. So it's kind of a two pronged approach. Sorry about that. We have a really nice community growing in here. We've nearly got 500 members, I think.

Someone was asking about body doubling. Everyone always talks about body doubling really helping them to do tasks, but I low-key feel like it's the opposite. So for them, they have their own business and sometimes they try to get... their friends in to help them do things so I can actually get it done. But I feel like it just ends up making me more distracted, overwhelmed and stressed out than trying to do it on my own. Not sure if this would just be a component of, or possibly.

of possibly masking around my friends could be. It's exhausting because I do really need help with things because I can't make myself do it alone. But when someone else is there, I just can't do anything at all either. I can't win. Is that just classic audio HD? Like you're being pulled in like two different directions where like you want this.

but then you're not able to do it or. Yeah, potentially. Yeah. And I think the masking, I actually think they're onto it with the masking thing. I think when I get friends to help me with stuff.

yeah I'm not I'm not fully relaxed I think the body doubling for me I agree because the body doubling only works with certain people like you who I'm 100% comfortable with completely in silence yeah or when I go to a cafe and there's people around me that i don't know so i'm not obligated to talk or socialize with them and it's just having people around me yeah but if i had a friend that had come over that's like like you know like a good friend you know i wouldn't

be able to be focused I don't think because I'd be too worried about them having fun are they all good what are they doing what are they doing am I being perceived totally so yeah I think they've got it right there yeah yeah totally Why choose a Sleep Number smart bed? Can I make my sight softer? Can I make my sight firmer? Can we sleep cooler? Sleep Number does that. Cools up to eight times faster.

and lets you choose your ideal comfort on either side. Your sleep number setting. Enjoy personalized comfort for better sleep night after night. It's our Black Friday sale. Recharge this season with a bundle of cozy, soothing comfort. Now only $17.99 for our C2 mattress and base, plus free premium delivery. Prices higher in Alaska and Hawaii. Check it out at a Sleep Number store or sleepnumber.com today.

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Upfront payment of $45 for three month plan, $15 per month equivalent required. New customer offer first three months only. Then full price plan options available. Taxes and fees extra. See mintmobile.com. I also think in this context, I think they're talking about getting... people to assist them with their work. But body doubling doesn't necessarily mean that.

It's more about like, if you've got a friend over and they were doing their work, like completely separate from you, but they're just sitting in the room with you and it's, oh, they're doing their work and I'm doing my work. It sounds like you're actually trying to task share your own work, which I think is slightly going out of body doubling now.

That's more just like delegating tasks, which I can see why it's stressful. Yeah. Whereas body doubling is like you don't say a word to each other and you're just doing your different tasks. Like you could be doing arts and crafts in the corner and I could be editing my videos for my business. It's kind of like that. Like you have nothing really to do with each other. That's why the cafes are good for me.

Because it's not anything to do with these people, but it's simply they're sitting at these tables, eating their food or doing what they're doing. And I'm also doing that at my table. Yeah, exactly. Yes, exactly right. That's funny because the first comment is... I'm with you taking the time and making the transition to a cafe to work as a waste of time and energy for me. So some people are different from you. They find me again, transition to that cafe.

really tough. And then also the sensory overload affects them, which is totally fair. I take my noise cancelling headphones. It's quite a big... thing for me too so just bear that in mind if you have the ability to do that that might change it yeah yeah definitely and then

OP original post, I said, I so feel you're on the transition to leaving the house to go to work. It's such a struggle. So I saw that this morning and I was like, yes, this is kind of what we're talking about. So like you want to go and body double at the cafe, but you can't get to the cafe. Yeah. That's so frustrating. Do you know what? I...

I love the gym, right? And I love like training. I've realized that when I don't go to the gym, it's not because I don't want to be training. It's about that particular week. I'm just that extra bit tired or I'm in my. PMS or PMDD fucking like time. It's about. the getting there because i find 99 of the time if i happen to get the energy to go get there once i get to wherever i'm going it's sweet as yeah it's about

Like, oh, I'd have to go get changed and I have to put my shoes on and then I'd have to do this and do that. And then it's all too overwhelming. So then. I feel bad that I'm not training, but it's not because I don't love my training. No, exactly. And that's why it's so frustrating. And that's why I habit stack the gym and the cafe. Yeah, exactly right. And that's why sitting here right now, I'm already in my gym gear because Paige and I are going to go later. And I...

We had a shower this morning. Oh, aren't we? Didn't you say that yesterday? I suppose I may have. Yes. Okay. Continue. My life is just committing with things to Paige. Oh, sorry. Just committing to things with Paige. And then her going, are we? we say that? I'm like, yeah, it's in your diary. But then I'm actually quite good at remembering. I don't know. That's funny. Sam, I am. I'm going to the gym today, but I've had a shower this morning at 7am.

And I'm already in my gym gear. And your shoes on and stuff. I have everything on. Otherwise, I'm... It's just one little thing I'm doing to just try and make it more likely that I'll get there. Yeah. You're already in that state. Yeah, exactly. Kind of half there. Yeah, half there. I'll start to get in the car and fill my dry bottle. And drive two minutes. This is why as well we joined the gym.

Okay, this is going to sound rich. I don't love the gym we go to. That sounds mean. In terms of equipment, it's not great. It's pretty small. It's pretty small and there's not much there. And I would love to go to other gyms. The main reason why I go there is because it's literally two minutes from my house. Yeah, otherwise I don't think I'll get there. Otherwise I don't think I'll go. Nah.

Nah, I wouldn't get there. So yeah, we really struggle with transitions. And this is what I've noticed. We were thinking about this the other day. We basically had one of our best friends move over to Australia a couple of weeks ago. And on the same day, our neighbour... Also moved to Australia on the same day. And one of our best friends, huge part of our life, he left and it was like sad. And I was quite sad about it. And then also our neighbor, I said bye to her.

And we're not the best of friends necessarily, us neighbors, but every single day I see her in the driveway, we wave to each other, we have the odd chat every now and then. Like she's still part of my everyday and I really, really like her. And I was walking the dog after I sort of messaged her. friend and said bye and said bye to our neighbor and I just found myself starting to cry and

Look, may have been coming into the luteal phase, but no, I found it was quite, I had a real inward moment. I was like, why am I so sad about this when it doesn't even really affect you? Like we don't actually see them a lot in the big scheme of things. And like, it really doesn't affect us. But I realize for me, it's like the transition and the change of things as they are. Yeah. It's changing. Yeah. And I really find that hard to.

compute and approach and deal with. But then the funny thing is it's been a couple of weeks now and I'm over it. So I actually get over it really quickly, but it's the anticipation of it. And like, I thought, I thought, huh, that's actually. a transition, a form of a transition. I'm grieving what I know my life to be, even though it's really not that much of an effect on me, but I still get really sort of sentimental about it and think about what.

could have been and how life's gonna be different now and that is a form of transition it's a form of change in your life that people with autism particularly struggle with quite a lot yeah Yeah, I get that too. Yeah, I really do struggle with just things changing.

my everyday changing, even if it is just waving to my neighbor once a day. Even like my friend, he has a dog that I love and he was like rehoming him. And I found that really, really hard. We're in the big scheme of things. It doesn't. change my life at all really but I was like why am I so upset yeah and I was like I guess it's like as things as they are are now changing and if you go and see that friend the doll won't be there yeah I guess that's it um and it is sad I guess but like

But really in the big scheme of things, like has my life been any different since then? No. No. And I've been fine. But it was just like the, oh, oh, that's okay. I don't know. Okay, so that's different. Yeah, that's different. I have to reprogram my mind now to know that they don't have a dog, which sounds so weird. And that's actually how intricate our brains work. And then also adding in the emotional sort of like sensitivity, especially with the ADHD.

we really feel a lot and we're very empathetic. And I think a lot of my empathy was also going to our best friend who was moving overseas and thinking about... him leaving his family and like just all of it like it was just all affecting me and I was like why like it's not really even my life and I don't actually see him that much but um that was kind of kind of got me thinking like we need to talk about transitions because even that which seems kind of distant

affected me quite a lot and then I started realizing you know when you're younger and your parent asks you to do a task I have realised the reason Paige and I were so resistant to our parents, sorry mum and dad, whenever they ask us to do anything, we've already talked about this, we will get annoyed if we were already going to do it because it takes the dopamine away. But then...

We also don't want to do the task because who wants to unload the dishwasher? That's so boring. But what I've just realized recently is actually the biggest part of them asking me to do something is not about unloading the dishwasher. It's about me now not being able to do what I'm currently doing. Yeah. It's me changing.

out of whatever task or state I'm in and going, oh, right now. Or even simply just being in your room, like lying on your bed. Like you might not even be doing a task that's like. you've got to leave your room now and go downstairs. And it's, yeah, I've realised that too. Yeah. So I think it was more that than it was the actual task that they were asking us to do. Yeah, because I always had the intention of doing it. Me too.

And so I would snap at mum, sorry, mum, because I'd be like engrossed in a task and then the PDA, pathological demand avoidance, kicks in, which is another thing. But, yeah, like I would snap at her and it's not like I wasn't saying, no, I'm not going to do that. It was you've ruined my flow now. Yeah. And then I'd get in trouble because I snapped and then it would just turn into a bloody Barney. Yeah, I realize now that that was being like interrupted from what I was doing. Yeah.

Yeah, that's actually, I think, what the main friction was for us. Not really, like, having to do it, because I've always, like, planned on doing it. Not that it's the most fun task, but, like... Yeah, I just wanted to be able to put it into my roadmap.

yeah ahead of like my day yes yeah and be and someone else doesn't get to dictate my timeline yeah yeah even though we're the children but like it's like yeah i will do it i and that's why it's a joke now we always take the piss out of young page when And it's like, I am, because any time.

That mum would ask me to do something. Like, it's what I'll tell her. I am. I will. I will. And it's like, I felt like I wasn't believed that I would do it. But you would. You were going to do it. I was going to do it. And so now it's a joke. Like, we say it now. like I am ma it's funny how as kids how we like add that uh on the end but it's just like it's just oomph yeah just yeah so like I we both realized that recently that a lot of it

in our life has been more to do with the transitions, which I think is more our autistic side of things, plus the ADHD lack of dopamine. Yeah. And that's why the double whammy happens and the ADHD can be really like horrible for us. But then also our parents, like our parents must have been thinking.

These two are reacting really intensely for just me to unload the dishwasher. Yeah, yeah. And it's actually a triple whammy because it's those two things that you said, but then it's also the PDA, like being told to do something where I know that sitting the table is my job.

oh I've got PTSD you know sitting the table was my job although to be fair I still had to be told like what time dinner was coming but like there's like just being told in general it's like we're going to do an episode about PDA in the next few weeks because I think that's a big one too yeah But yeah, we realized that a lot of our issues with moving tasks is to do with the transition and the lack of dopamine. So autism and ADHD, therefore, ADHD and wanting to be just ending up paralyzed.

Another thing I've realised as well, so I love music. I love reading if I'm interested. I love, not really, I don't really love movies. I love TV series. But autistic people often go back to watching the same things they know all the time. I'm classic for this. I've watched the same thing so many bloody times because it's predictable for me. But there's so many series.

albums have been recommended. There's constantly new music coming, but all I do is I just go back to the music I already know. Me too. Yeah. And I always have this desire to like, I want to start reading books. I want to play more video games. want to learn about some new music because I do love it but I've realized again that even just starting a book or starting

a new bit of music or anything is not just the lack of motivation for me. It's the change in state. And also I'm, this sounds silly, but I'm anticipating ending it already. So I find once I do end up getting attached to a series, if I start a TV series or a book or whatever, I get really attached to it really quickly and very deeply to the point that I don't want to finish it now because I'm going to grieve.

And I'm regretting that transition. So for example, this is so stupid, but like Love Island's just finished, right? And I'm a bit of a sucker for Love Island just because I like, I don't agree with a lot of behavior on there, but I find it fascinating because of the human behavior on there. Human psychology, yeah. Yeah, I kind of see it as like a study. Every time Love Island comes on. Anyway, it's ended and I am like,

really weirdly empty inside and like grieving, not because I miss Love Island, but because my state of being and what I knew for the last six weeks, every night I'd have an episode to watch. Yeah, totally. And now I've got this gap in my life. I'm like, what do I do? Like, oh my God.

And even starting Love Island this season, I found it tough because I started late and I was like, oh, I'm like way behind. It takes a lot to get attached. It takes like a few episodes to get attached to it. But then once you're attached, it's like, boom. It's like way too attached. And therefore I sometimes want to avoid the grief altogether.

So I don't want to do anything at all. I remember, obviously this is just sad because you get attached to the characters and like TV series and stuff, but Vampire Diaries, I remember. I can't remember how old I was, but literally the last episode, no one was home, thank God. But I was on the lounge floor, screaming, crying, bawling, like, no!

I'm not going to mention what happened because if you haven't watched it and you want to watch it, but I was absolutely hysterical. One, because something sad happened. And I guess things as they are were different. Um, but also it was the last episode and obviously that's sad. That's to be fair. That could be sad for anyone, but I found it so. Traumatizing to deal with? Yeah. And I was like, my heart was sore. Like I was like, I felt like I was having a heartbreak. Yeah. Wow.

Yeah, wow. I think we do attach really heavily and that's why I almost preface and like predict the grief. Like I don't want to go through that, but then it's so nice when you do connect to these things. It's like getting a pet. We have so many good times with our pets. but I'm already kind of dreading like them not being in my life again. I love you Ruby. But no, exactly. We feel things really heavily, but I realized that a lot of the time I just struggled to even give another series or.

a new book, a go, even though when I'm actually reading a really good book, I actually really like it. And I'm quite a quick reader and I can get through books quite quickly, but to even start it, it's like, Oh, that's a bit, well, that's a change to my life. That's going to have to enter my life now somehow.

Especially because like for the first few chapters, you kind of have to push through to like get to the attachment part or get to the good part where you're like, okay, this is good. I don't very often get past that. I think my ADHD comes in and I get bored very easily.

Yeah. Yeah. So again, transitions are hard for anyone. especially autistic people but I think especially ADHD people because of the double whammy of that lack of dopamine and the executive function struggling in both ways. I find like obviously social situations for me in general there's a lot of factors playing at it so like

I find the atmosphere exhausting, depending on the person I'm with, this sounds bad, but I might find the energy tiring. That's just for anyone really, actually. Anyone that I... hang out with it exhausts me regardless of who they are but i find as well like i like the idea of going to a social event for example um

And yes, I know that it's exhausting in other ways, but I find that if I could teleport to the event, I would actually be like, oh yeah, I actually, that'd be cool. Because a lot of the time when I do get to places, I'm like, oh.

I'm actually enjoying this. And it's not till after I'm like, well, now I'm exhausted. But in the moment, I'm like, oh yeah, I don't mind this. And I'm actually enjoying it more than what I thought I would. I realize a lot of the time it's about like the getting ready, what to wear. Where is it? How far away is it? Have I got gas in my car? Do I have to stop and get gas? What's the parking situation like? Do I have to pay for a car park and therefore like...

Oh, yeah. So it's actually more so that. Yeah, me too. Even though getting into the car, it might be raining. for example. And now you're going to have to deal with slight dampness to your clothes for the night or whatever. There's so much riding on these transitions between things. Yeah, that's often what puts us off. And I think it's double whammy for the audio HD experience.

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or dhd or autistic or even adhd um and you notice this in them you see that they like resist change they resist tasks and that might be through like shutdowns or meltdowns or it might be through like um just resistance just like nope don't want to do it or not even engaging with you, like not even looking up from whatever they're doing. Some things you can do to help that is like being a little bit more preemptive. So like if you do want your kid to do something.

This is a bit more work for the parent, but like giving them some notice in the morning going, hey, today, at some point, I'm going to need you to help me with this or I'm going to need you to make your bed or I'm going to need you to. X, Y, Z, and actually have a set time. Instead of saying, I'm going to need you to, is it more like better to say, are you able to help me with this? Because it kind of gives them the authority.

Yeah, the autonomy. Which of course, if they like say like, no, then like you need, well, sorry, darling, I need you to help me. But I think even framing the question, like I need you to help me, that PDA comes in. I'm like, no, I'm not going to do that. If you...

treat if you like say like you would like to a colleague like treating them like an adult I mean I don't have kids so I this is rich coming from me but you have been a kid and I have been a kid and if someone came up to me and sort of said it as though they're in need of like what I'm uh instead of like demanding it on you yeah saying are you able to help me with this sweetie it's like oh i'm helping mum yeah like rather than being told

Exactly. So maybe reframing that could help. Definitely. You're right. It's all in the wording. Yeah. Could we do this together? I think often we helps as well. But yeah, making the goal, not doing the dishwasher, but helping mum. Yeah. Might, might make a difference. Um, but yeah, having like visual aids or like timers even like saying like, and that's going to, we're going to do that around lunchtime if that's okay. Um.

making their routines predictable also just helps. Like if they have a task that is a chore, trying to get into their routine where they do it at the same time every day helps because then they just know what to expect. Even like if you have to go out soon or in an hour. warning them going like hey remember we're going to be leaving at 12 o'clock today

And just doing that way in advance. I feel like mum tried that with me though, but then my ADHD would like forget anyway and then she'd be, you know, so I feel like for me that probably wasn't working. Yeah, maybe for an ADHD child it doesn't work. The old time blindness. Yeah, exactly.

Again, child-by-child basis, of course. But I think when you ask a kid, especially if you're an emergent kid, to do something then and there, it's really triggering and can be really tough. Yeah, yeah. Totes. And it's not...

anything personal or the fact that they don't necessarily want to do the task, but you've interrupted them and what they're doing. Even just if you have kids that come home from school and just melt down, maybe let them have that kind of hour after school to just like... do nothing decompress yeah don't tell them to do their homework don't tell just they've probably been overwhelmed all day overload sensory overload so letting them just have that space for an hour of like i'll just let them

Yeah. Until 4 p.m. until I ask them to maybe help me do this or blah, blah, blah. So often I think. advanced warning can help. And I know we're not parents. This is very easy for us to sit here and say, but I think we're just trying to say like, if your child's resisting demands from you, it's possibly just to do with how it's being framed. Like timing or like the way it's.

The way the question's asked. I don't know. Yeah. They're not actually being a little shit or they're not lazy. And I think this is what happened to all of us adults when we were younger. We internalised it as, oh, we're useless. Parents are annoyed at us. And I think that's why the millennial generation, we're very timid, generally speaking. We're very people-pleasing in general, I think, as a generation, I think. We really are.

Yeah, for sure. And that's no one's fault. It's just like the way it was. And now the Gen Zs are a lot more confident. And I think that's like the older millennials having children. No, that's probably not right. But some of them. Yeah. And then the younger Gen Xs like having children and kind of like. you know, just the generation becoming more knowledgeable and educational, educated. And so now we're getting, you know, a more confident self.

You know, like generation where they can stand up for themselves a bit more. Yeah. No, it's really inspiring to see some Gen Zs. Actually, I love them. Yeah, I actually admire it. Me too. I'm like, far out. I wish I had those balls at your age. Me too. I'm only just growing them now. Yeah, I'm still not really.

Yeah, I know. And then, yeah, if you're an adult and you need your own mechanisms, like I said before, I'm already dressed for the gym, which I'm literally dressed for the gym for like five hours ahead of time because I knew like.

changing outfits and like even that is a thing. Yeah. So I might as well just get into my gear now and then I just have to walk out the door whenever I'm ready. Yeah. But externalizing tasks are just planners, whiteboards is very basic. And I know that some people can't.

use these i don't really use these much i use my calendar my digital calendar a bit but i know that doesn't work for some people yeah it's not that great for me yeah clearly because you tell me every day like remember we've got that thing today i'm like oh do we and you're like yeah put in your calendar i'm like i don't really use

i've got a whiteboard which i pull out and put away at different times like if i've got a lot on i'll pull that out and i'll put map everything out i know that dad recently has got an actual physical clock like it's a big mother effing clock to help him like with that object permanence and like having that right in front of his face and he finds that to be very helpful. I find writing things down rather than digital stuff because it's not really there.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I agree. You end up ignoring them. They become white noise and you just end up like, yeah, not listening to them. So yeah, externalizing tasks and just having visual cues can be really helpful for some people. You might have like a transition object or ritual you do. So like if you've got work to do and then you need to go to the gym, say, you could try and have like a cup of tea in between. Like just go, I'm going to have a cup of tea.

just to get you through that like transition and basically give you a little bit of rest in between. A reset. Yeah, a reset. And it may not work for you, but that's one suggestion. There's also, you can use bridging activities to like going for a tiny walk. I actually go for walks with Ruby, my dog now, and I often find that's quite a good transition because it like gives me just fresh air. It gives me time to like think, hang out with her for 10 minutes.

not even a long walk, like 10 minutes. And then I come back and I'm ready to do something else. Yeah. And then body doubling, which we've kind of talked about, may not work for you, but it may. Just having someone do the task with you. And that's like kind of what guys want. back to what Paige was saying about the adult framing something in a, I need your help or can you help me or let's do something together.

Makes it a bit more desirable and less, like you say, less demanding. It gives the child their autonomy and makes them feel like an adult. Yeah. Which I think like, I mean, some parents might hear this and be like, ugh. But I do think it's important to treat your kids as though they're adults in ways. Yeah. Like in the way you communicate with them by a certain age, I think. I think they just.

they should have the same respect that you would show any other adult. Like another colleague at work. Yeah. Yeah. I feel like sometimes kids get disrespected just because they're younger. Yeah. And of course that's going to, that's going to pull out not very good defiant behavior probably. Yeah.

Exactly right. Yeah. We just want, you know, mutual respect. If we don't respect kids, then I kind of don't blame them for not respecting us back. But I know again, we're not parents. It's probably really rich. It's probably a lot harder than we're making it sound.

Especially when you add the exhaustion in and stuff, it's probably just you don't have time to think. Yeah, exactly. So those are just a few little tips. We'd love to hear from you, though. Do you have tips on how you transition from things? Have you found anything from this episode relatable? We just wanted to bring this up.

Because we had that kind of epiphany a couple of weeks ago of going, oh my gosh, one of our main issues is actually the transitions. Yeah, why is this upsetting me so much? Yeah, like it's not even about the actual task itself or the thing. It's to do with the thing changing on me. Yeah.

Has this kind of given you a light bulb moment? Because it has definitely helped me understand why I'm struggling to get to the gym. Yeah. Why I'm struggling to go and do that thing. Yes. I always thought that the gym thing was like, oh my God, do I not love my training as much? No, I actually do. I thrive once I'm there. It's the getting there. It's the getting there. Same with social events. Like you say, like I would love to be at a social event in a click. Yeah.

Do an hour of socialising, yeah, and then boom, back in bed. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Be out of ghost, like literally ghost. Oh, come on, Dumbledore, where you at? Can you teach us how to evaporate? Is it what it's called? No. Apparate. Apparate. I think, yeah.

So yeah, let us know in our Reddit or even on Instagram, like, do you struggle with transitions? Do you relate to what we've just been talking about? Is there any insight you have we've missed when it comes to this? And do you have any tips or tricks that you use when it comes to transitions? Because...

I think it's something that's not really talked about a lot. And it's actually something that happens every minute, every day. Every day, we're always transitioning from task to task. For some people getting in and out of the shower.

I know that that for me as a child was a huge thing. Mum would have to be like, you need a shower and I just wouldn't. Because again, that's a change in state in terms of sensory. Yes, and then because once you get in, it's actually really... thoroughly enjoyable once you're under that hot water and then when you have long hair it's like getting out is like and so mum would be banging on mum would be banging on the bathroom door because I'd been in the shower for 15 minutes like the hot water

Yeah, cylinder like draining. Oh, I remember that. Yeah, it was always an issue to get us in the shower and then out of the shower. And then out, she'd be banging on the doors. Oh my gosh, and Paige has her music blaring so loud that she can't even hear mum knocking. Omelette, omelette. I'll just hear her. Yeah, so Paige even has...

had like a speaker in the shower all the time. You still do actually. But you always listen to music in the shower. Yeah. And is that probably one to help with transitioning, but also just to stimulate your brain? Stimulation. Yeah. Yeah. That's interesting. And I sing at the top of my bloody lungs. Yeah. Bloody fun really. Yeah. Yeah. It was really fun living with that.

Let us know. Come join our Reddit and thanks for being here once again. We've been overwhelmed by like just the support of this podcast and the love and yeah, just thank you. And we know you message us and we do see most of them.

But we just don't have the capacity to reply to everyone. Look, it's quite ironic, really. It is rather overwhelming. Yeah. I will say. It is. But we really appreciate it. We really appreciate it. Yeah. I'm so busy that I barely reply to my friends and family. So just take... that is just know that it's not personal yeah same um also we are because we've got so many bloody lovely subscribers on youtube now and we've got lots of um

views or something. We're now eligible for some forms of monetization. Now we don't want to do this to just grab all your money, but I actually genuinely want to know, is there anything on YouTube, like you can get memberships for like, you know, $2 a month that gives you something like an emote or...

or whatever. Is there anything that you would want us to do that would be behind some sort of like little paywall like YouTube? Again, we're not talking big money. We're literally talking like cover the butt. But you get something in return. Yeah. Is there anything that you would like us to set up in the community?

maybe as a monthly like hangout session on Zoom. I don't know. I'm just, this is just me brainstorming. Are there things that you would want to, for us to implement for a small little monthly kind of fee or anything like that? Let us know. We also have super thanks.

eligible now, which is just, you can just comment on our videos now and donate. We, again, we don't need or want this money, but if you do want to shout us a coffee or you found some value in our, in our work, it would be, it is appreciated. Just because this is obviously.

This is my passion project and I love it, but it does take my time. And if I do end up getting a little bit more pocket money from this kind of stuff, I can give you more. We can invest it more and make it bigger and better. Exactly right. people on or yeah, exactly. Right. So it's, it's just about us. If we get more support that way, the actual podcast will be enhanced. Yeah. So let us know, like we, we don't have to monetize, but like.

there's the option there now because you've just supported us so heavily. So thank you. And like, can we do merch? Oh my gosh. Yeah, we'll definitely do merch. I really want to do merch. If you have ideas for merch or there's specific things you want, please tell us. Because obviously we've got one of the best designers in the world sitting right here in Paige. We have literally got such a talent here. We can make all sorts of merch. We can make merch. It'll be so much fun.

Have a little community and like a little, you know, a little jumper that we will wear or something. I don't know. Oh my God. Like a really soft, sensory loving jumper. Like it needs to be good. Yeah, it has to be good. We're real fussy with this. So don't worry. It'll be good. Like I love hoodies, but I like hoodies that have like a zip.

at the front because the neck, I'm always pulling it down or anyway, there's so many things about that. Yeah, so we're just open to ideas. We want this to be really community. like based and community driven and we want to hear from you guys more so than our own brains, you know, because we don't know what you want or what you need. So let us know. Have a great week and we'll catch you next week for another episode. Thanks for listening. thanks guys see you next time love y'all bye

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