The Gun Industry's Big Lie

White House Correspondence dinner over the weekend. I had the lovely opportunity to be on air with my friend Amen Mohedeen with a panel of just fantastic folks to talk about, you know, the President's agenda, but then be able to give live reactions following the set by President Biden and then by comedian Roywood Junior.

I thought that he showed grit in terms of laying out both the seriousness of bringing back Brittany Griner, the seriousness of the protection of the First Amendment, and then being able to weave in and out of jokes and then kind of kid and joke around with the audience, you know, off script. He really showed his nimbleness. And I hope that we see that Joe Biden on the campaign trail because of I think that if that Joe Biden, you know, dark Brandon Frankly is on the campaign trail,

I don't think that Republicans stand a fucking chance. I don't think that Donald Trump or Ron DeSantis stand a fucking chance because he is a real person and not some fucking culture war zombie. And I loved every moment of it. And I was pleasantly as I have been throughout this entire administration, pleasantly, pleasantly surprised in all the

right ways. I want to transition now, folks. Coming up next is going to be our guest return guest, Kaivin Shroff, who is a political influencer an attorney, talking about in a lot of ways, one the rise in gun violence, to the rise in violence against LGBTQ plus people, also

touching upon the dominion case. And just a note that we pre recorded this interview before we knew how the dominion case was going to turn out, so obviously you all know now about the seven hundred and eighty seven million dollar you know, settlement, as well as as the continued fallout with regard to the firing of white supremacist

handmaid in Tucker Carlson. But I want to talk for a moment about the attacks on the LGBTQ community, particularly the attacks that we are seeing specifically targeted at trans youth. And I came across the most disgusting politician to date, and that is, you know, really that it is. It is a deep barrel to go in, you know, to find and pick somebody out that is absolutely abhorrent. But I got to tell you that Carrie Seekins Crow, Republican

outa Montana, takes the fucking cake. She is the sponsor of a bill that would deny trans youth gender firming care right. And what is gender firming care? It is the ability to begin to take hormone blockers so that you can fully be able to live within your own skin, right that you can be who you are. And I just want folks, even if you are not a medical professional, if you you know, oh, I don't understand this quote

unquote trans thing. The only thing that you have to understand is that when people tell you who they are, how they would like to be addressed, how they want to show up in the world, and it is not causing you harm, it is not causing your family harm. It doesn't present any ill will whatsoever except for you to provide them with the dignity and the respect that

you would provide anybody else. And if you can't do that, then just you know, get the fuck out of their way and allow trans people to be able to live free in this quote unquote democracy. That's the only thing that you really have to understand. Kerry Seekins Crow doesn't

understand that. Not only does she not understand it, but when presented with the very real statistics that show that trans people who are unable to receive that kind of medical intervention, the rates of suicide skyrocket well above what is the national norm. And when presented with that information and also having lived with a daughter who apparently had suicide ideations, she said this quote, I prefer my transgender

daughter commits suicide rather then allow her to transition. That is, a city member of an elected body wishing death are not only her daughter, but the entire trans population, rather than allowing them to transition. No one should have the authority and the power to stop people from becoming who they fully are. She is not God, and even if

you are an atheist, who the fuck is she? When I saw because here's a full video, folks, this is just this is just one of the quotes of many that she gave in a speech on the floor of the Montana House. And I gotta say, what a absolute piece of fucking garbage. These are people that call themselves pro life. You are a pro death, hateful, immoral, fucking party. And it isn't just this woman. It is people that vote for this woman. It is people that stand by

this party because they believe this toxic shit. This goes along with fucking Greg Abbot, who was root the entire time that the country is reeling from yet another mass shooting story that when Greg Abbot finally says something about the family that was gunned down, including a nine year old fucking kid in their home, then he didn't refer to those people by their name, He didn't refer to them as neighbors, he didn't refer to them as humans at all. He said that they were five I legal

immigrants that were killed. Fuck you, Greg Abbott. Fuck the entire Republican Party. Fuck this woman, Kerry Seekins Crow. They are waging war and we keep pretending that they can be reasoned with. You cannot reason with somebody who wishes death on their own fucking child. It makes me sick. It makes me ill. The kind of America that we are living inside of right now because of their dark, twisted, fucking white evangelical Christian fantasy that they want the rest

of us to live in. It is a nightmare. But this is who they are, So leave them. You cannot change the hearts and minds of people that have no heart. Coming up next, my conversation with Kaivan Schroff, Folks, I am so excited to welcome back to wok F a daily Kaivon Schroff, who is a progressive influencer, New York City based public interest attorney, Congrats UH and former Clinton

campaign alum. Kaivon, You're you're everywhere, and you're doing everything, but you just also recently finished a fellowship with every Town, the gun right, the gun reform advocates, and so I wanted to give you an opportunity to just share with folks about what you were working on with them.

for industry accountability. Unfortunately, there's sort of a roadblock to this model because, unlike any other industry, the gun industry is accorded special immunity by federal law. So these are new laws that basically are workarounds and carve outs that you can still sue retailers, sellers, manufacturers who you know are targeting children or engaging in other reckless behaviors that

contribute to gun violence. Now, the main problem with this idea is that we don't have a supply a pipeline of talent to become the next generation of gun violence prevention litigators. So, as sus mentioned that I just graduated law school last year and recently became an attorney, you know,

there was no clinic on gun violence. You know, you have an immigration clinic, women's rights clinics, really important clinics, but this is also a really important issue, and particularly an issue that gen Z now of law school age is incredibly passionate about. So I think it's a real missed opportunity, and you know, perhaps we're harshly a dereliction of duty to not have a class, a clinic, some resources for students to plug in learn how they can be part of this movement in a major way using

the law as a tool. And you know, beyond law schools, of course, you know, we need big law firms to jump in on this and give pro bono time and hours, and you know every lawyer has to do what we call cle continuing legal education, and you know we need programming on that so state bars across the country understand these issues, these new tools, and that they can be part of the solution.

active shooter drills their whole life. But when you bring up big tobacco, you know, at one time, we thought that tobacco would never be sued, right, We thought that, you know, they're that this is just it's a too

it's too big of an industry to take on. So can you talk about some of the similarities that you see in how UH legal outlets were able to pursue over many decades, right, able to pursue accountability on big tobacco, and how you can see some similarities in how that kind of strategy can be used UH with with guns.

agreement to bring that industry into better compliance. And with the gun industry, the challenge is this betteral law called PLACA, the Protection of Lawful Commerce and Arms Act, and this gives a lot of protection even to behaviors that I think a lot of people would consider pretty irresponsible. And so the new approach, this is where we sort of divert from that tobacco model, is these new laws like New York's past and other sort of civil avenues towards accountability.

And you know, it really is sort of a moment of like throw everything at the wall and see what sticks. Because these are new laws. Obviously they happened, you know, around the timeline of the Supreme Court's Bruin decision, which was a major blow to you know, progressive gun reforms. A really reckless decision, hard to justify or defend, but

of course that's the court we have today. So warriors need to be really creative about you know, not only pushing back on that decision and sort of I think boxing really the Supreme Court into you know, a position where they can't reconcile that opinion with some future cases that are coming down the pipeline. But also see what these state laws and what state courts are willing to do and how they're willing to interpret and sort of take action on this issue. So it'll be kind of

something to be watching very closely in coming years. At the same time, you know, once we find out that it works, will want to charge ahead. And as I sort of started, you know, we need law students and others to be engaged in this new legal space.

How would you think about not only the manufacturers, not only the sellers, but how you would be able to sue to litigate against the NRA for what many have seen over decades as pressure campaigns, open threats that they have had. I mean they have been sued on or investigated over their tax filings and their business entities, but in their political lobbying and there and the stances that they had they have really changed strategies. So what would it look like to go after an NRA as a whole.

they just called that Tennessee longmaker. They also I just saw, you know, at their recent convention of sorts, you know, said let me remind you the power that we have over you in your careers. Basically a thread, I mean a blatant threat, and frankly, you know, knowing what the NRA is all about, perhaps a violent threat, you know if you read between the lines, and you don't have to read that closely. So it's a scary organization. I think the issue is really the manufacturers here are really

the focus the NRA. Yeah, they are sort of this umbrella. Yes, they do wheel this political influence and power. At the same time, I'm not sure that they're moving the needle much on their end. In fact, they're kind of dying to some extent. I think the other thing, though, to be wary of, is also ghost guns are now a new phenomenon and a new problem that we have to regulate where that is very hard to get data on to hold those people accountable because they're hard to trace.

And it's hard enough actually to bring these lawsuits as is with traditional guns, because the data and access to where the guns came from, who sold them, how the person that used them in a prime got them is very hard to access. Oftentimes law enforcement isn't forthcoming with that information. So it's a concern. And I think the other thing to think about is the extent that other states are responsible for damages caused in states with good

gun laws. Right Like I know actually that there was a recent DC shooting, and of course I tweeted something about it, you know, got all the sort of right wingers to comment, you know, well, DC has such strong gun laws, you're an idiot. This proves that they don't work. Actually, Virginia has incredibly weak gun laws. Yes, and they did.

We know the gun came from there. But you know, at least in New York, most crime guns come from out of state from state or gun laws, and so those states are, you know, causing crimes to happen in our state. We shouldn't accept that, and I think that should be sort of an issue that gets focused on more.

mean more death, more dangerous scenarios, more violence. So we need to debunk and unpack that big lie in a major way. Even with COVID, we saw with COVID major spike in gun sales because every time there's this sort of crisis where there is a shooting, you know, people run out and buy more guns because they think that's

the solution, and it's absolutely not. And of course we've see now unfortunately, an example after example where there is a school security guard or there are sort of armed people on campus that do nothing to you know, protect students or help the situation at all. So that's the only solution that Republicans have offered, and it certainly, you know,

is not an appropriate one. And I won't say the only one I saw on your TikTok you posted a video of this teacher kind of pulling out a sort of divider in the classroom.

the drug wars and all of these things. And I think to myself, well, you can be in Texas, Tennessee, Florida and there are concealed weapons everywhere. What and those are destinations for you know, for a lot of travelers. And I wonder if that if a hit, if you know, let me ask you this, if a hit to our tourism, if a hit to our true public image, you know, would be the thing that you would say, Oh, maybe this is when we make a pivot.

how that's impacted travel. Like I absolutely know at least five plus people that would have gone to Florida a couple of years ago that will no longer go there on vacation because they just are concerned about what might happen to them in that state. And I'm sure that's true of many other states where these sort of new, really reckless laws where the idea is to have guns literally everywhere is scary. Who wants to be around that. Who wants to go vacation with a million guns around them? Nobody?

And just recently, without citing a reason, according to the AP, the Delaware judge that is overseeing the voting machine case that is a one point six billion dollar defamation lawsuit, has announced that he's delaying, uh the start of the trial until Tuesday. What do you make of the delay and what do you make of what we have learned thus far? The public has learned, I mean the public that doesn't watch Fox because we know they ain't covering it.

But what do you make of what we've learned thus far?

And I think, I think what I make of this delay is it does seem like, you know, the judge wouldn't allow for this delay if there wasn't some sort of real or credible, you know, sign from both sides that perhaps settlement negotiations were progressing in a positive way, but at the same time, you know, and you're seeing online already a lot of people and this is sort of the double edged swort, A unique example double edged

sort of winning the court of public opinion. Is that so many people are excited about this case as an avenue to hold Dominion sorry, Fox News accountable and really don't want to see a settlement here, even though, of course you know often that is the case that we'll see a big case like this settle just before trials about to start. Now, to think about why dominion might

settle and sort of the leverage they have here. They're suing for both economic damages and then punitive damages, and the distinction there is that you can really only recover your actual value lost under economic damages, but there's no capped punitive damages, so they could really settle for very high dollar amount and so obviously that's on the table now.

I think what people like me are hoping to see in others who do want to see Fox held accountable is that if they were to settle, it would come with some sort of you know, ology requirements or statement or my personal preference that you know Tucker Carlson and all these other hosts have to get fired, that would be amazing. But so I think, you know, we might see some sort of creative settlement if we do see one.

a lobbying effort over years and years and years. And I've said, why can't viewers of Fox. I'm not telling you what to watch, but you should know that what you're watching isn't news. And right before any Tucker Carlson show, any of these people's shows start, it should say right warning, this is for entertainment purposes only.

Who does MSNBC have on and say this is a legitimate reporter, who's part of our profession? You can trust them? And I think for far too long, other reporters established a mainstream institution and sort of under the guise of civility or professionalism from sort of misguided approach, have really embraced Fox News as colleagues, as you know, people they're gonna kind of go grab a beer with after covering a story. It's totally unacceptable and they're really betraying the

American people by doing that. I understand you want to be nice to the guy sitting next to you at the press briefing, but you are betraying your duty as the fourth of State if you're going to pretend and tell people and legitimize this as a news organization. And let's be clear, there are no quote unquote real journalists

at Fox News. I mean, as we've seen, right, Brett Beyers implicated in this lawsuit, that's their guy, that's their one example of a legitimate reporter that everyone always cites. He's a total hack. Why did we see Jake Tapper defending Fox News during the Obama administration?

the future. So what do you see as it? Do you see hopefulness in this generation that they're going to be able to write the ship that has been so wrong?

think our country will be in extreme peril. And I think one of the things that concerns me is there was all this urgency in twenty twenty when you still had Trump in the White House, and I think that was really in people's minds and in their face every single day. I think some people kind of feel there's been this sort of exhale moment where Joe Biden's been in office for a couple of years, you don't have sort of a tyrant in the White House, you know,

destroying democracy from within day after day. But at the same time, you look across at what's happening at Tennessee, or you look at Republicans rallying behind a Black Lives Matter murderer, a guy that killed a Black Lives Matter protester, and now the governor of Texas just wants to pardon him because white supremacist Tuger Carlson demanded it, and that is psychotic. So I think I hope people understand that democracy is still in decline. We need so much more time.

We absolutely not only need four for more years, We need, you know, probably a decade at least to course correct all of these issues, and not even just the issues, the policy issues and the laws that have been passed and the rulings that have been unethical, but to re educate our society because they've been poisoned by Fox News. They've been poisoned by Donald Trump over and over and that will be very hard work to undo.