Fighting Back Against Extremism

Trump on thirty seven felony counts. Now, one would think, right, call me crazy, but one would think that there would be a line, right that at some point Donald Trump would cross in order to have Republicans be like, hmm, maybe he's not the best candidate for our party. Maybe he's not the best representative of our values. Maybe maybe

we should look someplace else. Well, if you thought that, you would be one hundred and fifty five percent fucking wrong, because what we saw over the weekend and at the beginning of this week, as you guys will listen to this today, Donald Trump will be arraigned by three pm Eastern in Miami. And you know what is wild to me are the ways that I watch Jim Jordan fucking

Lindsey Graham. You had Andy Biggs tweet out talking about this is war and an eye for an eye and then he had to backtrack on that fucking violent threat

that he sent out via Twitter. You had Jim Jordan on CNN talking some crazy hot trash to Dana Bash, who was just like, so you think as they're showing the pictures of Trump's tackyass bathroom and all of the documents that were in there, all the boxes and stuff grown on the floor and on the stage and in all the pictures now that are infamous, do you think that this is secure? Do you think that this is okay? And Jim Jordan's response is like, well, he was the

president of the United States. He can do whatever the fuck he wants. And I just gotta say, folks, like if only Donald Trump wore a tan suit, maybe that would be crossing a line, you know, Like, I just don't know how these people still bring up Hillary Clinton's fucking emails that were investigated for a year and guess

what they found, not a fucking thing. And they seem to forget that Donald Trump was president for four fucking years, right, he had his hand picked attorney generals that could have right opened up investigations did in fact open up investigations into his political opponents for no other reason. Than the fact that they were his political opponents, and do you know what they came up with, Not a fucking thing that would stand for a grand jury's indictment. So you know,

I'm not saying, look, don't defend your boy. That's your boy. That's the fucking you know, Titanic. You wanna sail on by all means. But the way that they are attacking Jack Smith, attacking Merrit Garland, attacking Joe Biden, attacking our

judicial system is just absolutely bananas. But of course, instead of instead of cable news really digging into that fact and just how fucking unprecedented all of this is, they got camera and fucking drone footage of Donald Trump on a highway, Donald Trump on a tarmac, just giving the man, once again wall to wall coverage because we don't know how one gets from their home to the airport, We don't know what happens when the plane takes off. We gotta watch it take off, and we gotta watch it

fucking land. It's absurd. It is absurd that this media has learned absolutely nothing. And people will say like, it's you know, it's money, Donald Trump is ratings, and I'm just like, not really because people are tuning out and turning it off, right like, until there is something of substance to actually offer. But you know, Lindsey Graham saying that, you know, yeah, you know, Donald Trump may have done some things, you know that we're wrong, but he's not spy.

Well guess what, Lindsay Graham. Nobody said that he was a spy. What the indictment clearly reads, though, is that he violated the Espionage Act. What the indictment, forty nine page indictment clearly says is that he obstructed justice, right that he continually lied that this wasn't just a packing incident. This was moving boxes around so that his lawyers wouldn't find out and wouldn't give them over to the National

Archives or to the FBI. So again, Donald Trump wouldn't have been indicted if, when asked multiple fucking times over to return said boxes, if he just said, okay, here they are, come and get them. Much in the same way that classified material was found at for or Vice President Mike Pence's house, that classified material was found at Joe Biden's house. Did any of those two say, oh, these are documents and you can't have them. Were any of them caught on audio saying, oh look, look you

it's all secret stuff. You can't really see it. I couldn't declassified it, but I can't classify it now. Like I tell you, it's like Donald Trump is work. Like I don't even want to make light of the stupidity by comparing it to Scooby Doo, by comparing it to like, you know, some sitcom or show, but it is. It's like, it's wild. It's wild as fuck where we are as a country. It is wild to me that you have sitting members of Congress that are calling for people to

take up arms. It is wild to me that there is no line that Donald Trump can cross, There is no low that he can take them to where they won't continue to defend this man, even if they look like absolute fucking fools. It is, you know, it's insane. So you know, this case, it's going to be heard before Judge Aileen Cannon. And if her name sounds familiar, it's because she was the one that initially tried to

slow the document's case. She did not want the Department of Justice to be able to actually look through said documents, and then her decisions that she made in the initial quote unquote raid intomorrow Lago was overturned by a conservative three panel eleventh District Court circuit overturned her decision. And

not only, folks, not only did they overturn it. But the funny thing is, and not funny ha ha, is that they basically said that she's ridiculous, right like, they basically said that she quote, her decision was clearly violating the law. They said this, and this is according to

a Slate article that was written. That much maligned decision right was later reversed by a three judge panel of this US Court of Appeals for the Eleventh Circuit, consisting of three conservative judges, two Trump appointees, and a George W. Bush appointed judge, Judge William Pryor. They wrote that her decision violated quote clear law and that her approach quote would be a radical reordering of our case law, limiting the federal court's involvement in criminal investigations. They also went

on to say and quote violate bedrock separation of power limitations. Now, they go on to write in this Slate article now that the same investigation has resulted in an indictment against Trump. Judge Pannon's prior fundamentally erroneous approach casts a shadow over

the proceedings and what they are arguing. What is being argued in this piece that is up now at slate dot com is that she must recuse herself right, that there is no way that this woman, who her own colleagues who were appointed by Trump and Bush, so these are not Obama or Clinton federal judges, say basically, bitch

what you're doing. Do you actually know the law? And remind you that this is a judge that was pushed through by Mitch McConnell and Trump after he lost the election, so you know, knowing all of this, there is no way in hell that this judge, Aileen Cannon, is going

to be impartial. There is no way that she is going to allow the rule of law right to dictate her decisions, because she made it clear even the retrieval of the document she was trying a slow roll and ordered a special master where one was not needed to

look at the contents of this. So it is clear that she is a Trump lackeye and needs to recuse herself and that the DOJ should take the very necessary step right of getting her removed because there is absolute precedent of this, and I just want to read you this last part from slate. Federal law has a way to deal with this challenge. Under twenty eight USC. Section four five to five A, a judge shall disqualify himself or herself in any proceeding in which his or her impartiality

might reasonably be questioned. Judge Cannon's situation clearly fits the test, and she is obligated to recuse herself in Trump's case. So we will see how this plays out and whether or not the DOJ takes the step to even you know, to put her in the hot seat and let her show us that she isn't a lackey. So, folks, it is going to be a busy, busy week. We will

keep our eyes on everything. Coming up next my conversation, which is a deep conversation folks with Sarah Moore, who is affiliated with ADL and GLAD to talk about the rise in anti LGBTQ plus extremism. Folks, I am very happy to be joined on wok F daily by Sarah Moore, who is an anti LGBTQ plus extremism analyst for both the ADL the Anti Defamation League and works with Glad

double a Glad as well, Sarah. I want to start off one because you must get a lot of questions about your job title and exactly what it is that

you are analyzing and covering. But I want to jump right in because we are seeing both arise in attacks against the lgbt Q community, both violent and through online kind of attacks, and we're also seeing a set of policy measures that are couched in extremism, that are that are being essentially the rhetoric is fueling the policies that are then trying to erase right and vilify and oppress

the community. And so I want you to if you can part and parcel for us the difference between anti LGBTQ plus hate versus LGBTQ plus extremism, and if like, what is the nuance and the needle we're trying to thread there?

talking with you today. So, as you mentioned, I work with with both ADL and GLAD, and so one of the ways that we define anti LGBTQ plus extremism in ADL is we're talking specifically about this form of single issue extremism whose adherents are focused on demonizing, attacking, or otherwise targeting either the individuals, the communities, or the institutions that fall under this LGBTQ plus umbrella or that they

perceive to fall under that umbrella. Right, So, sometimes folks are passing as are presenting as queer, even if that's maybe not how they identified and or a targeted because of that clue, kind of that nuance into the definition as well. And then we have this like much broader bucket of ANTIOLOGBTQ plus hate. And so I think of this form of extremism as just a subset of that

broader form of hate. But when we're looking at ANTILOGBTQ plus hate, we aren't always seeing this same ideological commitment in the same way that we do with extremism. So a lot of times the folks that are dabbling in this form of hate are also following into you know,

other types of hate as well. You know, maybe they are on the anti critical race theory train, or maybe they are involved in like mass mandate protests or anti vax protests, and so, you know, they oftentimes have a lot of other issues that they care about and aren't really committed to this form of extremism in the same way, or maybe you know, they have some hateful beliefs but it's not a core part of their daily activities, or you know, something that they're trying to act out in

real life. So, you know, there's a lot of different ways that antology to kep us hate can manifest, but we are also specifically looking at the ways that this turns into extremes them as well.

over the last several decades. And so how do you kind of wrap your mind around what feels like for me at least, who is spent the last you know, ten to fifteen years of my career working on the

front lines of LGBTQ equality. And justice and watching that fifty in just my little section right that time frame now kind of descend into chaos where we're holding on by our fingernails, Like, how do you make sense of the erosion in acceptance that Republicans and their kind of campaign of hate against the community has been able to do.

discourse at different eras. So you know a lot of today's conversation, for instance, around this rhetoric around grooming actually has direct parallel back to campaigns in the nineteen eighties like anant Saved the Children campaign and all the same tropes that we saw back then. So we know that there are different resurgences of anti LGBTQ plus hate and extremists them at different periods of time. And I think this particular moment in time, and we've seen the ways

in which some of these extremist narratives. For instance, this one around grooming that I just referenced with the Nida Bryant campaign, you know, that really picked up in popularity in conversation around don't say gay back in twenty twenty one because we actually started having mainstream politicians labeling their bills anti grooming bills, or you know, following up on some trends and some of these tropes that only extremists

had previously been talking about. So we've seen that, you know, this stuff has always existed on the fringes, but now as folks are kind of turning their attention to this more from the mainstream side, it's getting picked up and

replayed in popular discourse. We've also seen that happen too with you know, other positions that the fire right has often taken, so I referenced before, like the anti COVID measures, some of the anti CRT measures, those have kind of lost traction as they've now switched this focus into the anti LGBTQ plus space, and so some of it is opportunistic, right, just making sure that they're keeping up like that extremes, they're keeping up with the popular talking points of the day.

For recruitment purposes, but it also, you know, belies this underlying hate that's always been there and has just kind of become the popular moment at this point in time.

exist in the country. And there is an entire campaign, an entire apparatus, an entire war being waged on a minority of a minority right, And so how do we articulate to the public through mainstream media? The fact is that this monster, this quote unquote boogeyman that's being created by the right is targeting a minority of a minority of people that at least seventy percent of the country has actually never come face to face or know somebody that identifies as trans.

right now as this wedge issue. Right. So, like as you discussed, we have seen increased acceptance for LGBTQ plus rights, and so a lot of times the veneer that some of these bigots or extremists will put on is saying like, well, I don't you know, I do support gay marriage, but I just don't support you know, these trans people right or or the rights that they have to healthcare. And so they're using it as this kind of wedge issue to try to break folks away and break apart the

LGBTQ plus community. We've unfortunately already seen that with some groups that actually themselves identify as gay and are going after trans or intersex or asexual people and saying, you know, we don't want you as part of the community because they think that, you know, that will allow them to hold on to the rights that we've worked so hard to achieve, or you know, maybe they don't see and you know, which is baffling to me, they don't see

the humanity in you know, our fellow trans folks. And in intersex folks and asexual folks in our community, you know, when we're all part of the same struggle. And and as you pointed out, like all of our rights are on the line here, it's not just trans rights. It's an issue facing all LGBTQ plus people right now.

protections right civil rights protections. And I remember being in offices where they said, we'll come back for the t like it's too hard for people even within the LGBTQ plus community to quote unquote understand, so we'll come back for those folks. And so, you know, you say that to me, and it's so triggering because I thought we had moved to a place where we had moved past that, right, Like, you know, when that bill was introduced, it was only LGBT, right, we weren't at the Q and the I and the

A and the plus part of the acronym. And so to hear that there are queer groups, gay groups that would be willing to sacrifice this marginalized targeted group in order to hold on to what they have, how do you even work with that? Like, how do we you know what I'm saying, Like, we're trying to convince cis straight people right to be our partners and ally and be vocal, and yet we're still having this kind of discourse inside of the community, right.

leaving folks behind in this conversation. I mean to me, it brings back parallels to like even the beginnings of let's say the suffragette movement movement, right, and the ways in which white women at the time we're willing to leave out are the women of color in the communities and saying, you know, I'm going to try to take this for me right now, and you can have it at some point in time, but it's not going to

be right now. And so I think we really need to remember these historical parallels and the ways in which we've left folks behind and make sure that we're not doing that in this current moment, because again, it's all of our rights on the line right now. You know, these folks aren't just going to stop when they've banned trans healthcare. We're they're also you know, pushing for provoking

you know, same sex marriage. They're also pushing for you know, we're moving like LGBTQ plus curricula in schools, and so these are things that affect all LGBTQ plus persons and frankly all persons, right And so because of that, you know, and not to mention the fact that you know, our trans brothers and sisters like they're humans too, why would we not want to fight for there?

we like, how do we connect or what? What? What do you like? Is there a connection to be made so that each group is not fighting on their own against the same perpetrator, do you know what? I like? The people that are harassing and harming Asian people are the same people that are targeting trans children. Are the same people that say black lives don't matter. Are the same people that are voting against bodily autonomy and abortion rights.

You know, So it's like, how do you work to make the connection you know in this space?

work for both ADL and GLAD. ADL is a Jewish organization and GLAD is an LGBTQ plus organization, and I'm part of a new program that we're launching that they're calling kind of the embed program, which means that they're taking researchers from organizations that serve different constituencies and putting them inside ADL Center on Extremism so that we can all sit together and work on the same issue, because, as you're pointing out, we're all fighting the same people,

you know, the same groups that are going to be anti Semitic, that are going to be racists, that are going to be against the Asian community, are also coming.

What do you make of that kind of report and what would have or should have been the proper reaction to that other than oh that was nice, Thanks so much for letting us know.

really a shock to anybody. So, you know, we're we're all kind of working on this particular issue, and I think that it's you know, frankly about time that the government recognizes that this is an issue that they need

to be working with too. And so that's why, you know, we do work with law enforcement through als law enforcement connections, and I do understand that there are you know, lots of tensions that go into that when you're working with groups that represent people of color, groups that represent the

LGBTQ plus community. But do think that those are important bridges to be able to have so that way, you know, these folks aren't in the dark about what we all know to be the reality of living as a queer person or a person of color in this country.

do come up and your communities. So we will actually be launching a report in a couple of weeks that's tracking incidents of ANTIOLOGBTQ plus hate and extremism in the US for the last eleven months, and a lot of the ways that we collect these incidents are through reports on ADL's reporting mechanism online, which connects folks with our regional offices and so they can get assistance that they need immediately, but also allows us to track the ways

that this hate is spreading in our communities, especially you know, with the issues that we recognize in reporting to law enforcement. So this can sometimes be an alternative for folks who maybe don't need that emergent help, but you know, want to make sure that somebody out there is aware of what they're experiencing. We also at ADL and Glass have a lot of different resources on ways that you can

combat hate online. So GLAD just recently dropped their LGBTQ Digital Safety Guide, So folks who are looking to better protect themselves or LGBTQ plus Commune New York's in their cities can look at that guide and take away some really practical steps on things that they can do to kind of preempt some of this type of hate and extremism that they might face. And then on kind the retroactively side, Adel has a cyber Safety Action Guide that

folks can use to report hate to platforms. It's not to say that the platforms are always going to listen, but a lot of times the first step is saying that, you know, we have to be able to show that we are reporting this hate and that it is an issue, and then we can put extra pressure on them to make those changes online and then kind of at the national level, you know, in at the state level too,

we really do need folks to stand out. Is to stand up against the anti LGBTQ plus legislation that we're seeing. I need to call in their lawmakers to stand strong in the face of the community, in the face of the hate that's being average against the community right now. And we are supporting some bills that are are really

helpful as well. So one that we're looking right now is FEMA's Nonprofit Security Grant program, which offers aid to local security local nonprofits that are trying to get better physical security systems for themselves.