Asleep at the Wheel

yet and actually are experiencing our fourth wave. You know, it's really interesting to me sometimes when I have the opportunity to be watching what is happening across the country when I'm not usually at home right and so right now, I am in um. I am in a place where I came to San Francisco for a retreat. Everyone is testing every single day to make sure that we are all safe and we can be together. What is a parent right now about Omicron is that it is Hella

Hella contagious. It is making Alpha look like, oh, I don't know, the Christmas fairy. It is incredible how fast this is spreading. There are countless people that I know who have been vaccinated, who have been boosted, who have now been infected. And what I will say about this is that my hope is that the death toll does

not begin to skyrocket. But we also have to understand that twenty five percent of the fucking population still is not vaccinated, and so if they are not vaccinated, right and we have more virus that is in the air that is spreading faster than we had ever seen before. I mean, what do we think is going to happen? How far down in the Greek alphabet are we looking to get? And right now I look at the news and I'm seeing lines at city mds, at health centers

in New York that are wrapped around the corner. And I'm having PTSD from twenty twenty when I was standing out in line for six hours in order to get tested. It's insane. What is happening right now? There is a lack of home testing kits, right, So that's number one. That's something that we've never seen in mass production at this particular point. Right now, we are the Governor of New York is as saying that these health clinics need to stay open for longer hours to make up now

for the demand that we are seeing once again. And it is incredibly troubling. I cannot, folks, for the life of me, wrap my mind and try and make sense of the fact that if the right measures had been

taken from the jump. If we had encouraged people to take care of themselves, to wear masks, to social distance as a patriotic act, as a neighborly act, if you are a religious person, as a religious act, like whatever the fuck it was that we needed to do, that the Trump administration needed to do as opposed to lying to the public, as opposed to telling them that it was a hoax and continuing to do so. I would

need to read you this thing. I pulled it up, and I gotta tell you, I'm just so fucking sick and tired of Republicans, of this white supremacist party, of these anti fucking vaxers, of the fact that the FCC won't shut down Fox News for spreading misinformation and causing

mass death, Like I'm just so tired of it. But Robert F. Kennedy Junior, one of the biggest fucking anti vaccine conspiracy theorists, who of course is a fucking grifter right, has an anti vaccine group called Children's Health Defense, which, by the way, according to the Politico, doubled its revenue in twenty twenty to six point eight million dollars. Listen

to this piece of shit. He was having a holiday party at his home in California, and this anti vaxer sends out a virtual invite that ask people his guests coming in to either get tested or get vaccinated. So it's okay, right to make sure that his little circle of friends is safe and good to come and spend

spread holiday cheer and not COVID at his home. But when he has a microphone in front of him, when he is on any news station, he says the complete and total opposite, And of course, when called out on his hypocrisy, he of course blames it on his wife and says, oh, I guess I'm always the boss at my own house, you asshole. When are these people going to ever be held accountable for the fact that they've

caused over eight hundred thousand deaths? And yes, I'm saying that they have caused over eight hundred thousand deaths because as if millions of Americans weren't under the hypnotism of Fox News and the right wing, then we wouldn't have this pro this pro COVID movement right there wouldn't be people saying that it's my liberty to spread disease right

in the same way. It's just I, folks, I'm outdone, and I'm outdone because I'm watching friends of mine right contract COVID who have done all of the right things. But because now we have a variant that is evading vaccines,

we have a variant that is aggressive. Now. It may not be aggressive as of right now in terms of the symptoms that you are getting because you are vaccinated and boosted, but that doesn't mean that it's not going to mutate, because, as I keep saying, and as we keep learning through the doctors that we have on bokay f that that's what viruses do, and that the more virus that is in the air, the more likely that it will mutate. Right. I just want people to be

held responsible when they commit crimes. That's it. I want them to be held responsible when it is crimes against the nation the way I want. I want us to handle white men the same way we do every other fucking race, particularly black people, who are fucking innocent, who are just trying to exist on this planet, in this country, and who are not afforded the right to do so. But these people, these arch villains, who are responsible for

spreading lines that have literally cost people their lives. Nothing is happening to them, So why wouldn't they stop? Why would they stop? They're able to grift off of it, They're able to get fame off of it. What would compel them to do anything? Why? Like, in the most litigious society, why the fuck aren't these people being sued? This is the question that I keep asking every single

day with no answer. You know, later in the show, Glenn Kirshner rejoins us after being absent for a week or so, And you know, I got to tell you that Glenn over damn near now the past two years has really been a beacon and a voice for justice and hope. And Glenn, you will be able to hear the frustration, the exasperation in his voice right as he is like, I do not know what my former colleagues at the Department of Justice are doing. I do not know.

He's like, I want to have blind faith right that they are organizing and getting ready to do the right thing. But folks, we've been sitting around for almost a year. We are coming up on the year anniversary of the insurrection, and there are only a handful of people that are in jail right now, only a handful of people that are in jail for a collection of a couple of

years for trying to overthrow the government. But those that were the architects, the masterminds that created the blueprints and the text chains and did all of the work, created war rooms. They're selling books, they're selling shows, they're getting anointed by CNN to take plumb positions. So tell me again how it is that we're a nation that tells little kids as we're raising them, be good, right, do the right thing for what? Because in this country you're

rewarded for being bad. And the more that we see that happen, the more that we see bad people be rewarded and get to continually move up for doing the wrong things right, then why would anybody else decide to do the right thing? What? Just to pack themselves on the back. You're not rewarded in this country for following the rules. You're not rewarded for uplifting the constitution. You're not celebrated for wanting to create more equity and justice. No,

you get a target on your back. You have colleagues in Congress trying to literally kill each other, not each other. Excuse me, Republicans in Congress, bragging and putting targets on the backs of their Democratic colleagues because they don't like their religion, they don't like their complexion, they don't like their melanin. You know, I'll ask Glenn, which is this? The fact is that you have Runda Santis, who everyone wants to kind of shrug off, and I call him

death Santis. But it's not because I'm being dismissed above him. It's because I I think that the man is a murderer. Be of Ronda santists, who a couple of weeks ago talked about wanting to create his own militia. You have hundreds of electors that have been removed around the country and replaced with Trumpers. You have secretaries of states right that have been removed or their teeth have been taken

out because their politics don't aligned with Trumpism. These people are waging a war, and Ronda Santis, to me, is one of the most dangerous because he is smarter than Donald Trump. He is a lot more politically savvy than Donald Trump was, and the moves that he is making are going to be copycatted by other red state governors. So to me, what he is saying out loud. And what I said last week is that Rhonda Santis is preparing for war and he is signaling to his buddies

what it is that they need to do. And you know Glenn will say, well, I don't know if he'll be able to do it. Well, why not If Rhonda Santis decided to say that I want a volunteer Florida militia, we will do training, you will get some type of badge. Honestly, what is to stop him? Because let me tell you something, the Biden administration, in my humble opinion, is asleep at the fucking wheel. I have seen na'er a press conference, na'er an oval office meeting that is about the urgency

of the preservation of our democracy. We have seen nothing come out of any real leaders in that administration that are telling us that they are taking the threats that are being waged publicly and vocally seriously. We don't even hear the media following up and asking the right questions. Mister President. Governor DeSantis says that he wants to create his own militia. What do you think about that? What is your response to that? It is not enough to

continue to shrug these people off. It is not enough for us to pretend that they are not as dangerous as they are. And the more time that passes, and the farther that we are from the insurrection and no one behind it is in jail, the less likely we are to have faith in our institutions, the less likely that we are to show up for the next selection. And Glenn said something that really has made me concerned

as I'm letting it marinate. He said that twenty twenty two will be a less fair and a less free election, and if we do nothing in twenty twenty two, then twenty twenty four will just be a performance. Let that sit with you. We are still at a moment in time that is fleeting. The window is closing where we are able to reverse what has been done to repair the damage that has been created, to hold those accountable for trying to undermine and destroy our democracy. But we

are running out of time. And the fact is is that there is no one that is raising the alarm, that is pulling up the red flags, that is sending up flares to let the American people know that they can continue on believing that their government has their back and is protecting them that these agencies and these departments aren't just for show. We have a virus that is raging and is signaling a fourth wave. We have Republicans that are wayward and running a muck over our country

and doing everything that they can to undermine it. We have climate change that is raging out of control. This is a perfect storm for destruction. I believe that if we make it, historians decades from now will look at pivotal moments that we have been talking about on WOGAYF and say, why didn't they react when they saw the first signs? Why didn't they allow history to be their guide? Why was everybody caught off guard when they knew what

was coming? And I feel like they're going to be asking that question over the crumbling buildings and agencies in this country. I don't know who America is going to be in twenty twenty four. I don't know if it will be America because what I am seeing is a very rapid move to states rights and states operating as their own fiefdoms, their own armies, their own little mini

presidents that are not united under anything. Republicans are united, They're united under destruction and power by any means necessary. Democrats can't get in line to pass the fucking human Infrastructure Bill. Oh, we're switching gears now so that we can focus on voting rights, which you should have never switched gears away from. We are in trouble. The country

is under threat. Domestic terrorism is not just on the rise, it is in our Congress, and the apathy and the dismissiveness of this administration is going to be our ruin, Folks. Coming up next is my conversation with our dear friend MSNBC Legal Analysts and the host of Justice Matters, Glenn Kirshner. Folks. I am very excited to be back with Glenn Kirshner,

MSNBC Legal Analysts and the host of Justice. This matter is to break down the latest news regarding the insurrection and the one six Commission and whether or not we're actually, at some point in the near future coming up on the year anniversary of the insurrection, going to see severe arrests, going to see purple walks of the people who were

the masterminds, the architects behind the insurrection. Glenn, you know the one six Commission has issued subpoenas they have requested or voted on Mark Meadows being held in criminal contempt. But again, the only people that we've seen get jumpsuits on and guilty verdicts are the low level people that broke into the Capitol building, beat up Capitol police and DC Metropolitan Police. But none of the major voices and architects behind this have been arrested. They were all walking

around Scott free. What are we waiting on? I don't know what we're waiting on. It feels unfair, It feels unjust that the low level foot soldiers of the insurrection are being held accountable, sum are being imprisoned, and the people who organize the insurrection organize the foot soldiers and the folks who launched the attack by telling the foot soldiers go down there, stop the certification, and if you don't fight like hell, you won't have a country anymore.

They are walking around, as you say, scott free, and it feels wrong. It feels unfair, it feels unjust, it feels dangerous. So what are we waiting for? I can't begin to understand what we're waiting for, other than I do know as a former federal prosecutor, it takes a long time to build a huge conspiracy case. But what we ordinarily do, Danielle, is we try to protect the safety of the community first by making early arrests, by bringing early charges. And then once we have secured the community,

we begin to build in the grand jury. We return superseding indictment, subsequent indictments where we add bigger charges, we add more defendants. It ultimately culminates in the in the largest, most significant criminal charge we can bring. In this case, it might be a seditious conspiracy. It might be a conspiracy to commit crimes against the United States. It might be it might be a Rico conspiracy. You know, it's beginning to look a lot like Rico this so I

know how much time that takes. But it all starts with a first modest indictment. We haven't even seen them first modest indictment of anybody other than Donald Trump's supporters who were told by Donald Trump to go attack the Capitol. That feels unfair, it feels unjust, and it feels dangerous. Okay, Let's let's talk about Mark Meadow and the position that

he is in right now. So initially Donald Trump's chief of staff, Mark Meadows, and by the way, he was the fourth chief of staff right in the Trump administration over four years. Mark Meadows originally was cooperating with the Commission, provided thousands of documents, including all of the text messages

that have now begun to be public. Right. We saw this week Laura Ingram and others pushing back and you know, wanting to sue the Commission for the release of their text messages because what we are now aware of the fact that they are liars and hypocrites, right and are endangering the public and knowingly doing so. Why then, do you think that Meadows decided to make this pivot and allow himself to be in a position where he is going to be the first person since Watergate, right in

an administration that can be convicted. Right, I just don't understand why you would start here, are all my documents and now oh no, no, I'm not going to come and testify. Yeah, I understand it, or I would explain

it this way. He is tissue paper week and all he wants to do is sell books at this point, and he needs Donald Trump's blessing or at least not his condemnation to be able to sell books to the gullible, to Donald Trump's base, and when he angers Donald Trump by beginning the process of cooperating with the House Select Committee, Donald Trump erupts. What is Mark Meadows tissue paper? You know? Week that he is? What does he do? He backs

up and he stops cooperating. He really he's more willing to be criminally convicted and perhaps spend time in prison than he is to alienate Donald Trump and apparently not sell his book. That's what you know. You And it's so funny, Danielle, because we struggle to try to make sense this, and I feel the way I felt in court for thirty years when I was prosecuting criminal cases.

The jury wanted to make sense of it, and I would say, folks, please don't fall into the trap of trying to make sense of the senseless, because it's not going to make sense to you. It's not going to make sense to us. And if we were required to make sense of crime in order to convict people for

having committed crime, we would never convict anybody. So you can't rationally explain a Mark Meadows, the behavior of a Mark Meadows coming from a place where honesty, decency, integrity, law abiding, this and a love of democracy motivates us and drives us and informs our understanding of the world. It doesn't inform Mark meadows understanding of the world or Jim Jordan's or Donald Trump. So we can't make sense

of it, you know. But here's the thing. What I'm trying to make sense of is not the crimes that they committed. I'm trying to make sense of why Department of Justice, Why the FBI aren't the ones doing the investigation.

Why it is as our friend Ellie miss Stalad said, you know on MSNBC the other day, you know, it should have signaled to us when Joe Biden chose Merritt Garland, he could have chosen anybody with a backbone with teeth right that was going to go after not just the low level folks that broke into the Capitol, but the architects of the insurrection, those that drafted the blueprint that created a war room. So what I'm trying to make sense of, and I need your help with, is to

understand where the hell is the Justice Department. And we can continue to tell ourselves that we think, oh well, we would never really know if they were, you know, doing the work. But at this point, the American people have lost complete and total faith in our institutions and agencies.

And I think that having a signal, sending up a flare, that would let us know that our Justice Department is actually working to preserve, you know, the institution, not not just in name only, but in the fact that no one is about the law. Sending up a flare is exactly what we need. First of all, I can't conceive of living in a country. I can't conceive of a Department of Justice that was my professional home for nearly quarter of a century not investigating these crimes. I can't

accept that. Yes, I'm taking it on largely blind faith that they are, but I believe they are because there's so much criminal conduct in the harsh light of day that's been committed by Trump and company. So but we don't see any public manifestation of it. And more importantly, they haven't sent up a flare. All they need to do, Danielle, they could put Garland and Ray shoulder to shoulder, or do it with somebody else, because neither of those two

men are the strongest communicators. I'm not making fun or making light of them to say, folks, friends, citizens, Americans, your Department of Justice saw what went on on January sixth, just like you did with our own eyes. And we've seen everything that went on before January sixth and what's gone on after January sixth. Please understand that your Department of Justice, the law firm for the American people, is hard at work attacking and investigating all crimes, all crimes

that we have any hint have been committed. Please understand it takes time, but we're on top of it. But Daniel, I didn't disclose a single investigative effect. I didn't compromise a single investigation. I did no damage to the integrity of ongoing investigations. But I think America would feel better if we knew that our Department of Justice took this seriously, was working for us, and was not going to turn a blind eye to the high politicians of this very

sad chapter in our nation's history. I mean, you know, Glenn, you know I wanted to initially think that it was a chapter. I'm beginning to think that it's a volume, right, I'm beginning to think that this is just volume one, because as we move closer to twenty twenty two, and again,

only a handful of insurrectionists have been held accountable. And I mean again, these people broadcasted on their own social media platforms right with glee, where they were and what they did, and it took months and months and months for those people to be picked up. I just I don't understand what our Justice Department, what our intelligence agencies, what they think that they what message that they are

sending to the American public. And you know, frankly, I would be remiss if I didn't, if I didn't mention right as people know that I believe that race has everything to do with this race and power and privilege have everything to do with why these people are still walking around through free I mean we have okay, so Phil Waldron right, it's subpoenaed. Now, this is big news.

So finally subpoena. But we knew that this man was, wrote a thirty six page memo, wrote a slide deck, put together a PowerPoint presentation from how long have we known that? And he's just being subpoenaed now and we're supposed to be what placated by that? And he did this this power point on you know, how to coup for fun and profit? He did it after Bill Barr Donald Trump's own attorney general said there was no fraud

undermining Joe Biden's win. He did it after Chris Krebbs said this was the most secure election in US history. The Department of Homeland Security issued a press release saying the same thing, most secure and safe election in US history. And yet the Phil Waldron's and the Jim Jordan's basically ignored all of that, and in a very real sense, excuse me, but they said, f the vo they don't count, they don't matter, we don't care. We're going to corruptly

install Donald Trump for a second term. I don't understand how these people haven't been charged. It erodes confidence in our institutions. It erodes any respect for the rule of law that people might have. To see these folks prancing around out there giving talks and lectures and presentations, and Donald Trump potentially recruiting a new batch of foot soldiers for the next insurrection. It's doing real damage to our

democracy every day. And you know, I again can't conceive of us not criminally investigating this and not criminally indicting these folks, because if we don't, we're done. If we don't, Donald Trump will announce in his campaign for twenty twenty four. Let's be clear, the Department of Justice co signed everything I did, stamped everything I did with its stamp of approval. Because you know what, if I had committed crimes, the Department Justice have charged me, and then we're done. Then

we're done. Twenty twenty four is the last presidential election will ever have because whether Donald Trump wins or loses, he'll lose both the popular and the electoral College vote, but he will declare himself the winner. And this time

there's no recovering from that. You know, Glenn, I have to ask this, how much confidence, honestly do you have that our last free and fair election was in twenty twenty right, Because you know, as as I'm thinking, and we're getting ready to prepare for the midterm election season, whatever we've seen. We have, you know, hundreds of federal

judges that were appointed by Mitch McConnell. We have a Republican Party that has cleaned house as it pertains to their secretaries of States, as it pertains to their electoral boards, as their electors, we have seen them replaced with Trumpers. Right, so we already know. I mean this is I continue to say that one six was the warm up. It

was Act one right. Act two is mid term elections, which again we are still waiting on Congress, waiting on this administration to put forth any type of serious voting rights legislation, which we know isn't going to pass, not because of Republican opposition, but because of opposition within their

own ranks. And so how is it that we're supposed to believe that at this late date that action, serious action is going to be taken by these agencies to ensure that twenty twenty wasn't our last free and fair election. So I will say, in my opinion, twenty twenty two the midterms will be less free end fare than were the twenty twenty elections. And if we don't seriously reverse course, twenty twenty four will be a show election because the vote won't matter, not the popular vote, not the electoral

College count. It won't matter if we don't remedy this now and attack the state legislation that is not only suppressing the vote but is putting the ability to change the electors in the hands of Republican state legislatures and legislators and election officials. Even if the Democrat wins the

popular vote running away. The states are passing laws saying, well, you know what, if we don't like the way it looks, if it smells funny, We're just going to appoint our own electors, send them to Washington to cast votes for the Republican period. So I don't know that we've seen the last free and fair election, but I think twenty twenty two will be less free and fair than was

twenty twenty. You know, I want to ask you this because I feel like these two things are very connected, and while the media continues to, you know, make light of it or make jokes. Ron de Santis, governor in Florida. A couple of weeks ago, I'm losing time in this

wormhole that we're living in. But a couple of weeks ago, he decided in a press conference to say that he wanted to create his own essentially community army right the Florida State whatever army, that he alone would control, that he alone, that they would have no oversight from the federal government, from the President, from the actual army, right from the Pentagon. He declared that in full in full

view of everyone, and everybody's been shrugging their shoulders. Ronda Santis is down in Florida, instituting laws, rolling out things as if he is the president, not the governor of Florida. Why do you think that we are not trying to connect these dots, that what is happening on the electoral front, what is being said out in public with regard to the creation of my own private army, that this isn't

going to be a copy. We're not going to see this copycatted, right, Like, I don't just think that this is about elections. I think that it is about more. Am I am I being hyperbolic? Am I am I looking for more trouble than what exists? You know? Um, yeah, if you can't join them, beat them, and if elections suppression and you know, the sort of corrupt endeavor to throw out the true electors in favor of the bogus

electors doesn't work. What I saw DeSantis's move to you know, have his own private army to be was like the first step on the road to secessions. That's how I read that. And if you can't join them, beat them, And if we can't win by cheating and lying and stealing elections, we'll take our ball and go home and guess what, I have my own Florida Army. So y'all better not come down to the Sunshine State because we will kick your butt. That's the way I see De

Santis's move. I don't know whether it has any hope of succeeding actually creating a Florida Army. I hope it doesn't, but it feels like something even worse and more ominous. Ten voter suppression, if if that's imaginable, because everybody says voting as foundational, and if we don't have voting, we have nothing else. So we better get to work. We better connect the dots. Glenn, you know, final question for

you today. If you were the attorney general, as our as our friend, as our an elements still enjoyed, some white Vans said on MSNBC, you could have picked anybody. You could have picked actual patriots and fighters. Your name was among those that were listed, and I, my goodness, I would sleep better at night if I could essentially uh copy you and put you in every state, put

you in every place overseeing our our justice department. If it was up to you, what would the steps be that you would take over the next couple as we're moving towards this anniversary to ensure aside from the press conference, but what with the evidence that is in front of us that we know, what would what would you do? What would what would be happening? So first of all, um, yeah, in no rational universe will I be Attorney general given the way I run my mouth, because I'm going to

speak the truth. Political consequences be damned. I don't care, which is why I'll never get elected and they'll never run for office. But the first thing I would have done was used Volume two of the Muller Report to apply for an arrestoirant for Donald Trump for as many as ten federal felony obstruction of justice crimes. Because you don't let that slide. You just don't let that slide, because when you do, you slide right into January sixth.

What I would be doing right now is I would be going gangbusters with you know, and I have to say, Danielle, the people down at the DCUs Attorney's office or investigating the insurrection, those are my friends, my former colleagues. I tried homicide cases with some of them, I supervised many of them. They're good people. They're doing the right thing. Maybe not quickly enough, maybe not reaching high enough in the criminal organization, and yet but they're doing the right

thing as best they can in my opinion. But I would be going gangbusters in a way that frankly, if it became public, all the better. I would be putting everybody before the grand jury. Everybody before the grand jury, and if they wanted to invoke they could invoke their Fifth Amendment right against self incrimination. Then I would decide whether to grant them immunity or not. And there's a calculation that goes into it. If you think you can get some truth out of them, you grant them immunity.

Like Jeffrey Clark, what did Donald Trump tell you when he was trying to corruptly install you as attorney general to have you weaponize the Department of Justice and use it as a tool to nullify the votes in the sixth battleground states? Like that letter you wrote to the Georgia's state election officials? What did Donald Trump say to you? And if Jeffrey Clark wanted to invoke his Fifth I would probably consider immunizing him and trying to compel the

truth out of him. Roger Stone, he invokes the Fifth I'm moving on because you're a stone cold clown. I guess there's a pun in there, because you've already been convicted of seven federal felonies obstruction of a congressional preceding five counts of lying to Congress and one of witness tampering. I'm not getting any truth out of Roger Stone if

I immunize him. So you make thoughtful principal decisions. But Danielle Man, they would be lined up around the block at the Federal courthouse waiting for their turn to go into the grand jury, and the minute we had probable cause to begin returning indictments based on what the grand jury heard, Boom boom boom, You're indicted, one after another. Line them up. We're going to do it honestly, fairly, independently, and ethically. But you're all getting indicted for your crimes

against the United States. That's how I would operate. Is there any I mean, just Devil's advocate, which I don't ever like to play. Is there any reasonable path that this Department of Justice is saying we're waiting for this, that we don't want to move quickly. We don't we're not ready yet. But this is, but we have really good reason for dragging our feet for an entire year.

You know, the federal prosecutorial practice is a very slow measured practice because unlike the prosecutors in the fifty States, where when a crime is committed, they make an arrest and they're on the clock and they move out, in the federal system, that's not how we operate because we don't have a lot of arrests generated federal cases. We investigate sometimes too long, sometimes add nauseum, sometimes forever, and then if we decide we have enough to bring a charge,

you know what we typically do. We try to wrap it up with a pre indictment plea offer, so we never end up on the court clock. We control everything. If the case is not sufficiently strong, it's not to our liking. And there are some prosecutors, federal prosecutors who have a real aversion, maybe even an allergy to running the risk of losing the trial. God forbid, then we don't bring a charge at all, and that I think

does a disservice to the American people. I've been preaching this for as long as I was a federal prosecutor, and even since I've retired, so it's such a different mindset that unfortunately, even though our democracy is on fire, they are operating the way the federal prosecutorial practice ordinarily operates. They're taking their sweet old time. And I wish they would have the same sense of urgency that hundreds of millions of Americans every day, because we're living this anxiety

and this desperation and this unquenchable thirst for justice. And you know, DJ is just not offering us a drink at this point. Do you think that Merrick Garland should be replaced? No, you don't, not yet, not yet. And I think Danielle I struggle every day regarding where I should draw the line in the justice sand. But you know, listen, right now, the House Select Committee is doing bang up work. Liz Chaney is talking like a prosecutor. She's using the

precise language of the federal statue eighteen Usc. Fifteen twelve that prohibits interfering or obstructing or impeding an official proceeding. That's a charge that's being brought successfully against the insurrectionists, the foot soldiers. She's using that precise language to describe the evidence that they're collecting of what Donald Trump did and arguably continues to do. So. They are absolutely, in my opinion, going to make criminal referrals for all of

the crimes they develop evidence of. I don't think that's what the Justice Department is waiting for. I think unfortunately, they are so cautious in the way they investigate and indict crimes. And this is the biggest crime potentially in the history of our nation, a conspiracy to overthrow our government led by the President and all of his lackeys.

It doesn't get any bigger than that. So I think Merrick Garland and the leadership at the Department of Justice wants to get it not just right, but they want to get it perfect. But sometimes the perfect is the enemy of the good. And that is my fear, because when the evidence is good enough, when you've got probable cause, you need to move out. You need to protect the community. You need to reassure the American people that you know,

we're on top of this. You know, well, we will continue to watch, will continue to be in conversation with you, Glenn, because you know, I got to tell you as the as the time moves and we get closer to that anniversary, I'm worried. I don't know if there is an anniversary special that is being planned by Donald Trump and company that we're not paying attention to, that we're going to

be caught off guard with. But I am I am desperately worried that if action is not taken, more more violence like we have never seen before is going to break out in this country. We do have to worry about how how Donald Trump will celebrate the one year anniversary of his attack on our democracy by people that he said quote, I love we love you. Remember that was the statement he made to them as they were attempting to kill police officers and hunting down president elected

public officials. We love you. So yeah, I worry about how Donald Trump plans to celebrate the anniversary of his attack on democracy. Oh my goodness, Well, we'll keep our eyes and ears open. Glenn Kirshner, as always, thank you so much for making the time to try and make sense of what does not make sense in this country and our democracy right now. We appreciate you. My pleasure, Daniell, I'll see you next week, God willing. That is it for me today. Folks on woke a f as always,

Power to the people and to all the people. Power get woke and stay woke as fun and safe as fun. See you tomorrow.