A Seismic Shift

has returned. He has spent some time in London, he has spent some time back in Israel and comes back to join us and give us some insight into how people are feeling and talking about the US, talking about gun control, talking about a lot of different issues that overlap with what is happening here, folks. I'm getting ready to take a couple of days off, I know, shocking, but leaving you with some really great interviews that I

have done over the past couple of days. I will be back live, you know, as it's a podcast, but you know what I mean, in a couple of days. But for all of the good things, you know, follow me on social because I never truly take off. So coming up next, our conversation with our in house doctor, doctor Jonathan Metzel. Folks, it has been weeks, weeks I think, since we have had our in house doctor, doctor Jonathan

Metzel on with us. He left the country to go and travel and talk about racial justice, to go talk about gun reform, hop in from continent to continent. Jonathan, welcome back. Hey, it is so it is so great to see you. Tell us about your trip and tell us about where you were, what the vibe was, the conversation, etc.

but beautiful. And then I was in London and I gave a number of talks in museums about guns in America and what the lessons are for the world about guns and democracy, and of course that happened while that assassination happened, a time to happen on Trump and so I was giving all these talks and people it's just interesting how people around the world like They're like, isn't this a wake up call? And people are going to come together?

to shut that thing down. We don't let that coming here, and so it just, you know, it was it was interesting what you could see when you're talking about the United States about guns. People's mouths just drop open. They're like, what is what is going on there? So that was the UK part, and I have to say, go to London. It is really adorable right now. This is the city

was really nice. And then I flew to the Middle East and so the second part of the trip I've done Physicians for Human Rights Israel Palestine for I think fifty teen years now, and it's an incredible coalition and I had a number of just like honestly life changing experiences, even though I am in that region all the time that it's just you can't really tell from here how

complicated and nuanced and intermixed things are. I started in Beersheva, in this kind of Southernish part of Israel, but I spoke to a group of Jewish and Bedouin Arab doctors who were part of this coalition for Social Justice, and I said, what do you guys want me to talk about? And they were really interested in how can we learn about structural racism and address it? Which is just crazy that there's like a war going on the whole world is it's such an intense time. But they were really

concerned about social justice and health equity. So just incredible testimonials about you know, really it's not even part of the story here, but what does it mean to be Bedouin in Israel right now? What kind of clu operations are happening, what kind of injustices are happening? And it was really really honest, And there are a number of places I toured and interviewed people and things like that.

You know, there are companies that are half Jewish, half Bedouin across that area, and so that part was just incredibly powerful. That I was in the West Bank interviewing people for a while, and then I was in Tel Aviv as part of one of the huge anti Nittanya Who protests, which was I'll send you the pictures and the views. It was just just the bravery of people. People were speaking out, people whose families are still hostages.

And another thing we don't hear here very often is that there are a number of Bedouin hostages also being held at Arab hostages being held by Hamas, and so their families spoke also, and it's just I don't know, it's crazy to go from there to like Nittanya Who speaking in Washington today, But I think, you know, it's just interesting. I mean, part of my frustration always when I do that work is there are such strong natural alliances between many parts of the American left and the

broadly speaking Israeli left. I was on a panel on Sunday. The panel was about guns and gun violence because Israel's having like an NRA deal kind of peop they're handing out guns and so my panel was myself, someone who was a conservative who was very pro gun, and then two guns safety people, one of whom was Palestinian Israeli, and really took the state to task for colonialism and

apartheid and all these things. And so I don't know, it's interesting that there are these kind of conversations in depth, in nuance, in ways that have been happening for a while there. But I don't know. It's just as you know, as I've said a million times here, my frustration is that the American left and the Israeli left have much more and then they realized, but not if the premise is we have nothing to say to each other. And so I don't know hopefully that we work backward from that.

But it was really a powerful trip and it left me. I mean, there were some terrifying parts. So this is the last thing I'll say, which is I was fast asleep in my hotel and then a drone strike happened five blocks for me in Tel Aviv. The Houti drone strike from Yemen obliterated a building. And it was four am, and my entire bed shook and I fell out of bed, and I called the front desk of the hotel and I said, you got to fix this air conditioner, man,

This thing is like so loud. I didn't know what it was when it turned out it was a massive building flattening wow thing. So I got a little taste of everything on this trip. And I'm sorry to ramble on, but it was just it was so powerful to see what was happening.

takes over. You're protesting against the kind of government monolith that you feel doesn't represent you, even if that's your identity. And I think that's the case. People have been literally protesting every week for over a year now, and this protest was still massive, and so people are just trying to figure out what they can do.

are not representative of all the people in Yemen. Iron is a huge player all these things. So I don't know, it feels like something's coming to a head to me. But I would just say people are exhausted and demoralized. I think if there was a viable piece plan that promised security, it would transform everything. And so hopefully that's where we're heading. But you know, I don't know, I don't want to. There's many, many, many, as I was saying,

many different opinions in Israel. But I think ultimately people are traumatized and exhausted and looking for some kind of hope.

So switching gears. As you had mentioned at the top, Netanyahu is on American soil right now, and Biden is not going to see him. As a matter of fact, Biden has decided to pretty much not give a fuck that he is speaking and is addressing the nation tonight at eight o'clock. Kamala Harris, who you know is now our Democratic nominee after I mean, I cannot believe that it's only been a couple of days since Sunday when

this seismic shift happened. So first, let me ask you about the seismic shift and your reaction to that, and then the fact that the Vice President is not going to be overseeing this session, she will meet with Netan Yahoo in private and your reactions to that. But first, this seismic shift in our politics while you were still gone, I.

that what this means is TVD still. I mean, the ship has not hit yet, but it's incredible, this kind of energy that I think we were kind of looking for in a week. So I just think that that shift where change is terrifying. And there was a sad story of Biden who had done many good things, some

not good things, and so that was hard. But I just think that I do think that there was a narrative of the people who are pushing out Biden are the ones who have the least to lose, and I have to say I don't think that was the case in retrospect. I think it was a really brave decision. I think, you know, I just think that we had we had to change the channel. We were going to get our ask kicked, and I feel like now we

have a fighting chance. You know, a lot of things are going to happen, and the gates of wrath have not happened. But I yet, but I would say that in a way, this is I think for me, I just agree that we're in a much stronger position now

than we were a week ago. And and so for me, there are a lot of questions about how she runs the campaign, about all the decisions she makes about how they respond to the Montel Williams montage that's coming and all these other things, and so but I think that in a way, you're kind of feeling energy and optimism, which I think we weren't feeling a week ago. So in general, I think this is great. I think I wish it would have happened weeks earlier to even cement

it more. I'm curious to see what Biden says tonight, But in general, I'm inspired by other places. Right there were other countries like France and England that were looking into the real Abyss and then said, screw it, we're gonna do something brave. And I didn't know we had it in us, And now I think we did something brave, and so you know, let's keep it going.

it feels like it happened months ago. Do you know what I'm saying, Meaning that like so much has happened in the last three days that it has been so energizing and I'll say, you know, to the comment about you know, my social media before before Sunday, I was happing, and everybody that listens to the show knows that, like I had pretty much bottomed out. There was zero hope,

there was zero faith, there was zero anything. And I was in a very like depressed state, and you know, my friends and my family and folks are just like, we'll get through this, and I was just like, I don't think that you understand what is like what is in front of us, Like we're not going to get through this like I was. It was really bad. I

didn't realize Jonathan, how powerful hope is. And I think that because it is something that literally was the engine of the Obama campaign, and that feels like it was so many decades ago that when you and I would have these conversations and we'd keep saying like, people need to feel energized, people need to feel x Y and Z, I was just like, well, isn't fear energizing enough, right,

and recognizing that it's not. It really is not that hopelessness, that anxiety, that fear was making people feel despondent, disconnected and just none of this matters. And to see the way that so many I mean, the organizing that I am seeing happen, that I am being pulled into in just three days is nothing short of extraordinary. And I think that people are so in this in a way that it took them a long time to get invested in Obama. This is a completely different and energy shift,

seismic shift. And because the stakes are so high that you're seeing people organize in a way that they have not organized before.

And so somehow the circumstances, you know, everything is timing, and the timing among other things could not have been better. And I'm really encouraged also that her message so far. I just think that people were starting to tune out about the We're ending democracy. It was way too abstract, and it's true for people who are already going to vote, who would have voted for Job of the Hut as

a Democrat or anybody. So I think the fact that she's concretely saying here's what my vision of the future looks like and being really material about it, I think is a really good move because it's not just demonizing Donald Trump. I mean, you're trying to also appeal to some people who were thinking they were going to vote for Donald Trump. And so I think the more of that she can do, which is tied to what you're saying about Hope, I think it's important. I'll tell you

and we can talk about this more. I wish I could talk to people about her messaging about guns, you know, as one issue. I don't know what role it's going to play, maybe not a huge one. But I do think that the message of my work repeatedly is that if you're trying to appeal to like centrist voters who are gun owners, just saying I'm going to regulate guns without talking about why people own guns. You know, the people who believe in gun control already do so they're

already voting Democrat. But if you're trying to appeal to like Purple state undecided voters. I just I wish I could help with the messaging about guns, because that's the one area where just coming in and saying we're going to do background checks and rifle bands and all these kind of things. I want all that stuff, but it just it doesn't speak to the reality of kind of acknowledging why people own guns, which I feel like is such an easy message shift that she could also make.

So we'll see about that.

hope they choose you know, the Mona Lisa. You feel like she's looking at you no matter where in the room you're you're standing, somebody who can like kind of appeal broadly. I don't know. I have been a fan of Shapiro. I think he's terrific on that, but I think, again, just to be clear, I want to pick whoever is going to help us win the allection. So yeah, but what I was going to say is, I can see how Shapiro would be a non starter for many younger people.

So I think it'll probably be Mark Kelly. That would be my guest as to who they're gonna choose, because he kind of doesn't piss anybody off. But I don't know, So I didn't answer who I want.

that I think need to hold down their states. Yeah, and so in looking at the larger picture and looking at how we believe that this election is going to be as contentious as twenty twenty, I think that there are people that need to stay in their governor roles to hold down their states, right, And so that's the only reason and Andrew just text and said, you know, Shapiro is not even popular in Pennsylvania, like wildly, wildly in terms of like you know, oh, this would be

a progressive and this would be like a rocking type of ticket. A lot of people have talked about Andy Basheer. I like Andy Basheer a lot, but I also think that you don't really get anything. You're not gonna necessarily you're not turning the state of Kentucky, Like Kentucky's not going to turn blue. So I like him as a person though.

So to me, I think that the calculus is looking like Mark Kelly, and I think that for a number of reasons, I think that that could be a very good move to combat the veteran astronaut husband of Gabby Giffords, like you know, gun Refort, like all of these things. Like I think that he brings a lot to that ticket and he's you know, senator. But again, democratic governor will appoint a Democrat to fill his seat, so it's less of a risk as opposed to everybody else.