Ep. 858: How to Save Your Hunting Season Before It’s Too Late with Scott Bestul

and their Camel for Conservation initiative. Today we are going to discuss how to save your hunting season, how to make the most of these final weeks of the year, especially if your hunting season has not been going the way you wanted to. If you have been struggling to fill a tag, or kill mature buck, or kill that one target buck, or if you have been burnout, stressed out, frustrated with the season. You are who we're talking to here today, because I guess I am you. I am

that person. I have had a hunting season that has frustrated me, befuddled me, confused me, stressed me out. And you know, it's interesting timing because a new film of mine came out just a week or two ago on the Mediator YouTube channel, and the kind of underlying theme of that episode was this epiphany that I had a couple of years back that if you're a longtime listener of the podcast, you've heard me talk about but a few years ago. This was after the twenty twenty one season.

I kind of realized that I had been getting burned out on this stuff. I was going too hard, I was putting too much pressure on myself. I was doing a bunch of things that were kind of taking the fun out of hunting because I was so obsessed with killing a mature buck or so obsessed with quote unquote success. And I tried to kind of right the ship after that, and in many ways I have. In many ways I've

learned from that, I've gotten better at certain things. But on the flip side, I also have, you know, at times fallen back into those old ruts.

guess tough on myself. All those things can be recipes for some adversity, recipes for you know, not always stuff being rainbows and butterflies. But I have also realized that, and this is something I realized a few years ago and continue to remind myself of, is the fact that it is a shame to ever let hunting bring you down.

This stuff doesn't matter that much. That's been my big thing over the last five years is working through this because I love deer hunting, but sometimes I'm so obsessed with hunting deer that I lose that and that's a mistake. And that's what today's episode is all about. It's about how we can have success as deer hunters but also don't lose the fun and the joy in them. My guess today is someone who's dealt with this himself, mister

Scott Bestel. He has been a long time columnist for Field and Stream magazine, a very experienced and as he put it, proficient whitetail deer hunter, and someone who can share with us both tactical ideas, so some specific tactics and hunting strategies that can help us here to make the most of these final weeks of the hunting season. So we do discuss some late season ideas to help you fill a tag here in these last weeks or

month of the year. But then also we spend time discussing, you know, how to get back to the fun of it. How to make sure that we end this hunting season on a high note, not stressed out because we didn't kill enough deer or the biggest deer or the mature

buck we're after. How to remember to focus on the important stuff and how to release some of that pressure, release some of that stress, and get back to the good stuff, because it'd be a real shame to end the year upset it yourself or bummed out or frustrated because it wasn't as good as somebody else's season that you saw on instagramm or it didn't kill as many bucks as you saw some guy on their YouTube channel.

That kind of thing just is like a I don't know, it's like siphoning the energy and the fun and the good vibes out of you as a hunter.

low deer densities. It was a two plus mile hike into this area, then we sat all day long, and then a two plus mile hike out. We did this for several days in a row. We were wore out from that. On day three or four, I moved to a different area of public land and I was going to scout my way into this spot and try to You know, at first, I'd never seen this place ever,

brand new to this area. I was going to slip in at first light and hopefully be able to navigate this dry creek bed and set up on an area that looked good on the map. Long story short, as I slipped in along this creek bed, I spooked deer after deer after deer. There was way more deer in this area than I realized, which is good. The bad news is that they were all on this creek and even though I was slipping very quietly in a great access route way, it just seemed like it just seemed

like it was a disaster. Kept on educating deer, and when I got to the area I wanted to hunt, the wind was not doing what it was supposed to do.

Now I'm freaked out that the wind's wrong. I've educated all this deer as I've walked in there, so I finally, you know, sit there and I'm thinking and trying to figure out what to do and can't figure out anything that I think is gonna work. And it's quiet now, so every step I take is loud and noisy, and I decide, all right, I need to this isn't gonna work. I need to, you know, find something that actually will work.

I hate this so much, is what I said. And then looking back on that a few days later, it's just like, what a shame I keep saying that, But what a shame that I'm out there hunting in what was a beautiful place with a bunch of deer and I hated it. I don't want that to be the case.

And I know I've got other friends, and there's other people listening who have probably been in some kind of situation like that, who have felt that way before because of the pressure they put on themselves or because of how they compare themselves to others, or because of whatever

it is. We've lumped so much onto this hunting thing that at times, if we're not careful, we're too obsessed with a specific goal or a specific deer, or what other people think about what we do or how we do it, or quote unquote success.

mindset perspective. Making sure we're having fun, making sure we're making the most of this hunting season, and just sucking every last ounce out of it in a positive, super fun way. That's the plan for today's conversation. I think we should not be there on the bush anymore. Let's get right to it. I hope you guys enjoy this one.

and that I imagine a lot of other folks have felt at some point during the season, especially as we're edging here, you know, towards that last third of the year, or maybe even less than that for some people, right because

it's it's so funny. We go through you know, January, February, March, and we're dreaming about hunting season, and then April, May, June, July, it's getting closer it's getting closer, and we're planning and we're plotting, and we're excited and the anticipation is high, and then all of a sudden, it's here, it's going, and then it's gone. It just always seems to go so fast, doesn't it.

I mean, here he is, and I don't. I don't know. I just didn't. I wasn't in the zone, and I let them walk. I remember walking back to the truck and I call my hunting buddy. I go, You're gonna remind me this day when it's December fifteenth and I'm freezing my butt off all there, and You're gonna go, why did we not kill that deer? So anyway, but I mean I really looked at it as a I mean it's kind of like catch and release trout fishing. You know, you get the victory without without having to

deal with the dead animal and all that good stuff. Yeah, but anyway, so I've had a lot of fun, but I've not tagged anything yet. But I'm not giving up either. So yeah, this is actually my one of my favorite parts of the season. I've always loved late. I can't explain it. Well, maybe we'll talk about it more. But yeah, I like this phase of the season.

are maybe starting to sweat it a little bit. You know, as you and I talked about before we started recording, you know, we kind of want to cover two sides of this coin, one being how to deal with maybe some of the mental.

things not going the way you wanted. But then there's also just the practical side of things, like what can I do now if I still don't have a deer killed, or if I still don't have the target buck I'm after killed, or if I don't have meat in the freezer, whatever the goal is, what are some of those first few ideas that come to mind to you if someone is in this situation and they came to you saying, hey, Scott, I'm down to the last two, three, four weeks of

the season and I haven't achieved my goal yet. What are some of those first couple ideas you might give someone on that front?

out there scouting. You know, we don't. We had just a tremendous acorn crop last year, probably the most prolific one I've ever seen, and this year consequently, it's not quite as good. But those few oaks that are dropping are gonna be huge here in the next few weeks and so yeah, you know, I'm putting my scouting boots back on and looking around and trying to identify those food sources. And uh so, yeah, I mean that's kind of it's almost like you're you've got a season reset now.

It's almost like going back into early season again, finding finding where the groceries are and you know, getting some scouting done and formulating new game plans. I get excited about it. It.

I look, you know, I look for good browse sources self facing slopes where there's you know, woody brows and grasses and forbes for him. You know, in the colder we get in Minnesota here, both self facing slopes. Really they play a huge role and you know, giving to your place to bed and hang out for the day where they're you know, ambient temperatures are a lot a lot higher, and you know, they just like the lolligig

on those spots. So anyway, I'm doing a little shifting around now and you know, looking for looking for new food sources.

so the warmer, the relative tempts are. I tend to go into the timber more and kind of approach it like a rud hunt, where I want to be a little bit tighter to bed. I'd rather have a food source in the timber. Whereas if it's if it's cold and we got snow on the ground, they're gonna go for the easiest groceries. In my experience anyway, they're gonna go for the easiest groceries they can get, and they you know, they don't care if it's daylight or whatever.

I've seen some of the best bucks of the season on those super cold days, you know, just I mean out there in a you know, corn stubble or rye field or I mean just any you know, no brain or food source, and they're you know, they're out there in the middle of the day, you know, trying to trying to scarf up some calories.

it's and then it's done. So I'm curious, when you're down to the last few days of your late season trip or late season opportunity, whatever it is in your case, and you're kind of getting desperate, do you have any

Hail Mary type ideas for late season deer? Is there anything that you'll pull out of the bag of the tricks when you're down to your last couple chances it's now or never and you don't have, you know, the the absolute perfect, no brain or easy situation where it's you know, perfectly cold and you've got the one amazing food source, Like that's an obvious one. But what if the obvious one isn't available any other tricks of your sleeve?

might as well push your luck. And yeah, if it involves, you know, even still hunt through some of that heavier cover or along the edge of it, or you know, sometimes you know, especially if there aren't working in your favor that are going to put the deer on their feet, then you got to kind of you know, as Thelensil brothers either always say, you know, the tactics either wait for the deer or go to the deer. And so

sometimes you got to go to the deer. And when you got you know, when you're down to the wire and you got nothing to lose, you might as well might as well push it. And it's you know, it's fun, kind of fun to get out of tree stand once in a while and you know, go after them and see what you can do. So anyway, yeah, those I'm not sure if that's a hardy enough fodder for your answer, but you know, I do push it. I don't mind.

I used to be I used to be a little more timid about it, you know, but you know when you're when you're kind of down to the wire and at the end you might as well push because it's going to be a long it's going to be a long season. Until they you don't have time to respond to any pressure you put on them.

the last two years. And Joe showed up a few times throughout the year, and then since November ninth, he's been gone. So I'm in a situation now where I've thought, I just don't know if I have a deer to hunt,

and so I've been monitoring. I've been scouting, I've been moving cameras and keep on I've been hoping and waiting and hoping and waiting that eventually the cold weather would push them into this kind of sanctuary I've created by not overhunting it because I've been kind of waiting and waiting, like eventually the pressure everywhere else has got to push them back into my place and start moving, or eventually the fact that all the other fields have been harvested.

But I have some plots on in my zone and there's a cover crop field in the neighbors, Like there's got to be deer coming in. Eventually a big boy is going to show up, and it just hasn't happened yet. Yeah, So it's been a weird, a weird deal where it's

been waiting and watching and nothing has arrived yet. But I'm at the point now where I think I just need to start taking some swings at the fences and just hope that maybe something's happening that I haven't been aware of, that I haven't been able to see, that I haven't been able to observe or catch on camera, and at least be out there and push it the last couple of times.

that camera. You just you know, you can you don't. They don't have to be very far away for you to miss them, you know. So it's uh, yeah, I'm I'm with you, man. I would push it. And if you've got it, sounds like you've got sanctuary and you got food. I mean, those are those are two pretty big deals this time of year.

You know, all of that can lead to stress, frustration, burnout, all that kind of stuff. And it's not unique to me, because I've talked to a whole lot of different people who feel this way, people who don't have you know, you and I are a little bit unique in that our careers are wrapped up in this. But there's a whole lot of folks who just do this for fun,

who tell me the exact same things. I've got a group text with a bunch of hunting buddies, and every year you can hear them and see them getting stressed out, burnout, frustrated, upset, And it always is kind of silly because we do this because we love it. We do it's because it's fun. But then somehow we let ourselves get so worked up in it that we sometimes get lost. I guess, does any of that ever happen to you? Has that resonated with you in any what kind of way?

kill any buck that you saw. And it's morphed into this thing that's completely different, you know, and it's you know, when you when you approached me with the idea for the show, I was I was thinking about my dad, who's ninety five and still deer hunting, still killing him got one with his crossbowl this fall, and so anyway, he's seen this whole gamut of you know, the early

deer seasons in central Wisconsin. And you know, we did a lot of We sat for a little bit, did a lot of driving, but you know, we didn't we didn't know any deer. You know, every big any big deer that we stumbled into was just it was just that it was stumbling into you know, getting struck by lightning. It was we didn't we didn't know what we were doing half the time. But anyway, so then we then we started like, well, you know, maybe we should sit

more and start passing deer and blah blah blah. And that came with its own learning curve and and you know, most of us were on board. And my dad made a comment about five or ten years into that process and he said, you know, our hunting is in many ways better, and he said it's definitely safer, you know, without without the gang drives that we used to do. But he said it's interesting because he says, in a

lot of cases, it's not as much fun. And I was like, ouch, but true, you know, I mean we had a gang of guys, you know, my old Norwegian uncles and and us tag along kids that were just trying, you know, not to fall in the swamp and drown.

I mean it was it was kind of a gregarious, goofy fun time that was really social and you know, uh and you know we weren't as I mean, we were serious and that we pushed hard, and you know, we shot a lot of deer, but we weren't I don't know, we weren't this laser focus like we are today. Like you said, I mean, you we turned you know, we start we started in spring with you know, shed hunting and spring scouting and summer trail cams, and all

of a sudden we're building this campaign. You know, it's it's almost like a surgical We're trying to make a surgical strike on a deer or two that we you know, were really after and and that just is a different experience entirely, so I think and obviously, you know, in my opinion, deer a lot better at surviving that we are killing them, especially a mature buck. And you know, we we tend to forget, you know, sometimes what we're

what we're up against. I mean, we're especially in you know, places like Michigan where you are, in Minnesota where I'm at. I mean, these are naive deer. These are deers you know, they've been shot at and chased by predators since they were spots. So they're you know, they get three four years old, they're pretty darn smart. And we're just doing

this part time. So yeah, it's it's easy to kind of get your expectations way up here and your hopes, you know, way up there, and you know they and they can kind of, you know, handy your butt pretty easily, and it's easy to get disappointed in that. You know, I know that you're I mean, you don't get where you got in your profession without setting goal and working hard, and I mean it's kind of hardwired into your personality and a lot of modern deer hunters are that same way.

And so yeah, when you when some of those goals aren't met, I think it's real easy to get frustrated and discoura then you know, kind of pull your hair out. So yeah, yeah, my long winded answer to your question is yes, I've been.

flip side. We also have then widened our social circles, and like our our our group of people we can compare ourselves against, has grown dramatically as so many folks have gotten on social media, and we've gone from just discussing our hunting exploits with our small group of friends to now maybe sharing it with hundreds or thousands of

other people. And I think there's a little bit of a comparison culture going on that I think adds to that stress too, and and and and then I guess you know, there's also it's all like I mean, with you, maybe Scott again this is a little bit unique, but

you talk to hundreds of hunters. I think given in a given year or two, interviewing folks for articles and all these different feature pieces and all this different stuff, and you're looked at as someone who's who's supposed to share with us how to get this stuff done, how to do this stuff. You're an expert, you know. You know the answer is, Scott, right, does that pressure? Does that pressure ever get to you?

And I'm like, yeah, that kind of makes sense. You know. I know a lot of the stuff, and you know, and I'm fortunate enough like you to be able to talk to some of the country's very best and uh, you know, soak up a lot of their knowledge like a sponge. But I've always considered myself as more of a reporter in what I do. I like to cover what's happening with deer hunting and deer management and deer biology.

So I'm more of a conduit from the true experts to you know, the general public that you know, the garden variety deer hunter that I conclude myself in that number. So anyway, Yeah, it's really funny though. My daughter when she entered high school, she was, you know, like all young teenage girls, she was worried about fitting in and are people gonna like me and talk to me? And anyway, this nice looking high school boy walked up to around It's like the first week of school and he said,

are you Brooke Besteal? And Brooke goes, yeah, yep, that's me, and she goes, you're He goes, your dad is Scott Besteal right? And she goes, yep, that's my dad. She goes, wow, he hunts deer for a living. Just launch and she's like, yeah, that's what he does for a loving. We'd all be starving right now.

and I think that leads to more stress. And maybe what you just described there, the fact that you're okay being a proficient deer hunter but not being the best deer hunter in the world.

the expert or whatever it is. Is that something that you ever had to kind of work on, as you know, as you were a younger hunter, kind of figure out your identity, what you're trying to be here or who you are, or was that always just kind of obvious.

both were great, biggest bucks I'd ever shot. And you know, you kind of get this little, you know, warm gush of feeling like I'm I'm pretty good at this right And it didn't take me long, really, you know, for the deer to teach me that, yeah, you really don't know very much. And you know, this is another thing

that I'm going to sidetrack. It's just momentarily a lot of you know, the we've given rise in this in this hunting culture to the you know, the the role of a quote unquote expert, you know, a guy that really has this stuff together. And there definitely there are those people. You and I both know them, you know, just really really good deer hunters that have the time to do it. But what a lot of us don't

like to talk about. And I've actually heard a guy say, get kind of testy about this and maybe you have to that the role of luck and deer hunting, it's it's definitely a factor you can't you know, I've I've told a lot of people if you don't believe that there's luck involved in deer hunting, you're just not paying attention. You know, you can know a whole lot about a

buck and even an individual deer. And like I was talking to Tom Inderbrol, one of the better guys in the Midwest, and he said, you know, we were talking about early season deer hunting, and he said, you know, we're talking about you know, patterning, patterning deer on their bed to feed, you know. And he said, you know, it's really it's really easy to get misled on something like this because he said, you know, I know the general area a lot of bucks bed. I don't know

the bed that they lay in every night. I know their general area. Yep. He kind of kind of likes to hang on this hill side and he said, I can have that pin down right when archery season opens, and he said, but here's the thing. He says, I can I can get him in a bean field one night and think, oh, I've got no where general betting area is. Now I got his I saw him in a beanfield, so I think he's on a pattern. He says, total hogwash. He says that deer gets out of his

bed at night. He's got eight or ten different places he can go, and it's just do we know why he picks what he does most of the Time's not. We can make educated guesses. But you know, you you could go sit that beanfield seven nights in a row and that's not his pit that night. So you just weren't lucky, you know. I mean, this is just my opinion. There are some guys that will get real prickly and go, oh, well, you know, if it's the northwest wind, he'll do it,

and if it's southeast wind, he won't do it. And some of that is definitely true, but you know, you you definitely have to. You got to have some luck on your side, like I did that first year that I was dedicated to shooting big deer. You know, I mean, I I rolled the dice and I got I came up double sevens, you know, and it doesn't happen very often. So anyway, luck is definitely a part of it. So that helps to me, that helps take some pressure off.

You know, I can do everything I can do, then the deer still has got to do what he's got to do. But yeah, anyway I did, I did kind of derail us there. But yeah, I think it was we all have to kind of make a conscious decision about, you know, why are we doing this? And like you, I've been lucky enough to kill a couple you know,

pretty nice bucks. And it was really interesting because I mean a couple of times I knew the deer, I knew, you know, kind of knew where they're hanging out, went in there with a hope that I would shoot that particular deer, and a couple of times I got lucky and did that, and it was It's really funny. So, yeah, I found a mature buck, you know, did some sniffing around, use my knowledge, and I you know, set up a

stand and I was able to get them. And I tell you what, the next day, my world hadn't changed a whole lot. I mean, I was the same guy, my kids just like, yeah, I just boring old dad. You know. My friends were like congratulatory, but you know it's like everybody else two days later they're like, did Scott get that? Dear? This year? Was that last year? So you know, it's really easy to put all heap all is pressure on yourself and it's like, really, you're

the only one that's worrying about it. And so I did make a conscious decision that you know, I'm I'm doing this because it's fun. I mean, I want to enjoy it. And what taught me that, what helped helped me kind of laser focus on that, was I'm I'm not only a deer hunter, you know, like you, I'm a trout fisherman. I love chasing the rough grouse with my dog and pheasants, waterfowl, and uh, it's it's really interesting when I go out there and do those those activities.

I don't have those high goals for myself. I catch a few brown trout on a dry f line, I'm like, what I'm you know, Yeah, I didn't know any of those trout. I didn't you know, I didn't go out there to target home yet.

I don't know exactly why. But part of it might be the fact that I and so many other people have have attached goals to ambitious goals, and I don't, you know, I don't know. I think there's probably pros and cons to that, to having these ambitious goals, to targeting mature bucks, or to targeting the e buck, or to try to you know, fill a tag in this state and that state, or whatever it is. But so many of us have all of these we come into every year with all these hit lists and all that

kind of stuff. Absolutely, ye, is there something to be said for if someone's experiencing what we're discussing, which is this stress, that burnout sometimes losing the fun in it, might it be a good idea to re examine those goals. Because that's something I've started doing and started thinking about more seriously, is is maybe I need to change that those goals and rethink that.

go out there and push it. But it's pretty easy for those goals, in my opinion, to get out of hand in a hurry. I know one of my cousins was, you know, like he so he wanted to shoot a pop and young buck. So you know he got a one twenty five or one thirty beautiful buck and then oh, you know, then then then it needed to be you know, one forty or one fifty, and you know, you start climbing that ladder and it's like when when does that stop?

Because it better stop pretty quick because I mean, like you, I've hunted some pretty good places in my life, and I tell you what, one hundred and fifty inch deer is a pretty dog on good deer no matter where you go anywhere. Yeah, yeah, yeah, So you know, you can go to Ohio and you know, recognize all of the two hundred engineer that come out of Ohio. But you walk in there and if you've got your you know, if your hope is to shoot a two hundred inch deeer,

I can almost guarantee you disappointment. So anyway, yeah, you know, I think I think you got it. Would you have to adjust and figure out if your goals healthy ones? You know? Anyway, I look at my dad and you know, he's happy with any He's happy with any buck, which is great. You know, sometimes sometimes I'd like him to hold out and The only reason I want him to hold out is so I can hunt with him more. But I tell you what, the first like this year, he shot a nice, nice, you know, two and a

half year old eight pointer with no brow tines. And they're definitely better deer on that farm that we hunt together, you know. And I would have liked to have seen him hold out a little bit longer, just because I want to. I like to hunt with him. And once he shoots his buck, he's done, you know. But anyway, he's happy as a clam and he's ninety four, and I got to go, wait a minute, not my goal. He met his goal and he was just you know,

he's ecstatic. I mean, we found that deer and you can running up to me and bear hug me, you know, And that was you know, gold met happiness achieved. And that's that's the way it's supposed to be. So yeah, it's it's easy to let those things get out of control. And yeah, I mean I think you just need to As we discussed, my personal philosophy is deer hunting is it's got to be fun. I mean, why do it.

None of us are doing this for a living. We don't need the meat to survive, you know, although I live, you know, I quote unquote live on venison by very little beat. But you know, if I don't kill my deer, I'm still gonna not gonna starve to death, not getting paid for any deer that I kill. You know, I'm not getting celebrity endorsements or anything. So by golly, I better enjoy it. And so then you have to look in the mirror and go, well, what what are the

things about deer hunting that makes me happy? You know? And I saw you had a great picture in one of your articles about you with you and two of your buddies. You mentioned about, you know, coming out of the woods and taking a lunch break with your friends, and like that's the kind of stuff. It's so much fun. You sit there and share a few stories and recharge your battery and back out in the woods you go, you know, and like you noted in a couple of

those pieces, and I've done this too. It's like, man, I'd get out there at the crack of dawn, grind it out in a tree stand all day long, come back home, and you know, of course you're disappointed. You spent ten hours in the woods on a clausterphobic little hang on freezon and probably a little bit hungry, and you didn't kill a deer and sometimes you might not even see a deer for all that effort. So yeah,

you're gonna go home. You might be a little bit drumpy around your kids, you know, and they don't always appreciate the goal that you'd set here.

or whatever it is. And so then because of that, you feel the pressure to hunt thirteen hours straight every day all day during the rut, or when you don't feel like getting up in the morning because you've done it seven days in a row you gotta go still, Or when you're out there and you're sitting in the tree stand and it's one o'clock in the afternoon and you haven't seen what you've been looking for the last

three days. You're sitting there beating yourself up in your mind like you should have done this, or you should have moved there, or you should have or what do you do next? Or how do you fix this? Or what's going wrong? And you're just beating yourself up. And because of all of that, you are not doing the things that actually are fun, which is the going out and having lunch with your buddies, or the taking your

kids to hunt with you, or whatever. It might be doing something that's a little bit different the tactic, like walking around still hunting, or something that maybe doesn't give you the very best chance to kill the deer. After but it actually would be a fun change of pace. I constantly find myself waffling between those things and intellectually recognizing, oh, yes,

that would be the more fun thing to do. But on the flip side saying, you know, the other side of me say, well, you got to give it your all. You have to be the hardest worker, you have to be X y and Z. How have you How have you dealt with that or do you deal with that?

snow out, I'm going running. Yeah, and uh and then after a while it is funny though, because you know, I mean, I see a lot of comparisons between athlo and hunting. They're both really physical, you know, outdoor pursuits, at least for me, they were, and uh, you know, I just got to a point with running where it's like, you know, I'm kind of tired of competing because no matter how hard you work, there's there's always somebody better than you, and and it takes a toll on other

parts of your life. And yeah, the competition is it's great, you know, it's joyous and fun and when you know you have some success, it's so Anyway, I think that was a good prep for me for hunting where I realize, I mean, I realized that at some point with running it's like, you know what, I'm not doing this to compete anymore. I'm just doing it because I love it.

I want to I like to stay in shape, I like to feel like gravel crunching under my shoes and the wind in my face, and you know, that's what I love about running. And and uh so I reverted. I quit the competing part and just ran because I loved it. And so I think I reached a point in my deering career it was kind of like the same. It's like, hey, you know, you moron, and you know you're not. You know, your your personal worth is not

judged by the number of bucks on your wall. Your kids and your wife don't care about that that much. They want you happy, but they don't you know, oh Dad, it was only a one forty. You know, you never heard things like that, you know, So I mean I just kind of did a little reset, and it's like, you know, what, what what are the things about this

sport that I that bring me joy? And a lot of it was going back to my roots where you know, I killed my first buck with a bow when I was a senior in high school and it was a little basket rack eight pointer I shot on public land in Iowa. Man, I tell you what, I rode that for years. I mean, it was just it's just such a great hunt. And it was, you know, just about everything wrong, including missing my first shot at the deer

at ten yards. But anyway, it was just such a great experience and it just one of those things that hooked you on the sport, hooked me on the sport. And you know, I start kind of reflecting on those things, like what are the happiest moments that you've had and what about that kind of cat for to you and trying to focus on those things and my Dad's I keep going back to my dad, but I get such

a kick out of him. You know, we'll go come meet back at the truck after hunting together, and I'm like, seeing you deer, nobody said I had a chicken he land on my crossbow. And he was just you know, like a little fourteen year old kid, and it's like, well, it's not the first time he's seen that, but tonight it was a really big deal, you know, And I'm like,

that's the kind of stuff that you know. We were just talking the other day he said, I remember this was and honestly, goodness, this was thirty five years ago. He's like, I remember that night I saw three otters run past my deer stand. I mean, this is on the open timber, you know, a mile from the nearest water,

and he remembers that. So anyway, it's you know, if you don't appreciate the woods and can't see the beauty of things happening around, if all you're worried about is getting an arrow or a bullet into that big buck, it might be I'm not telling you it is. It might be time for a little recharge, a little reset. Because I've been there. I know that feeling. You know, you get crustbrated, you get you know, I'm not like you said, but I'm not working one hundred and ten percent.

You know, why did I go peasant hunting with my dog? You know, instead of grinding on another four hours in that tree stand? Well, you know what SPS hunt when my dog is pretty dog on fun?

hunting to pursue like solo success. And oftentimes not always, but oftentimes when you are like single mindedly focused on trying to kill a buck, the best way to do it is to, you know, do it on your own, get your own permission, or find your own spots or hog that special place just to yourself, because you know, if there's more people in there, it's gonna be harder for you to kill that big old buck. Or because you're after this one deer, it's just.

my kids. And oftentimes that falls by the wayside if you were just focused on the kill or just the big deer and so and so I've recognized that as something that I personally have been trying to change and trying to get better and try to get back to. But I'm curious if that's something that you have any thoughts on or have seen in your own experience too.

pick your hunting buddies carefully. I mean, some of them don't appreciate the privilege that you're offering them by letting him you hunt, letting them hunt your spots. But I knew this guy was good as gold. He's a wonderful friend. And we were there for you know, on hundred and six days, and it was just great. I mean we would text each other from the stand, what are you

seeing blah blah blah. You know, meet at lunch, go do some Scotland, hang another set together, and at night you had somebody to kind of bounce things off with in it. I truly, you know, I didn't realize until about two days into the trip, but EHD had hit that area and there were basically no deer. I sat for four four days and never saw a deer from stand. It took me that long and then we finally realized what was happening. But it was honestly, it was so

much fun. I mean, if I'd been out there by myself with that limited success, I'd be like, man, best of you really suck at this. I thought you knew something. But it was so great to have somebody to you know, you shore each other up and you know, he missed a nice bock and you know I patted him on the back and said, well, next time you'll get him.

And you know it was Uh, I don't know, It's just there is something about that camaraderie, camaraderie that's really for a lot of us, it's an important part of hunting.

shooting the deer. It's like when your buddies come with you to help track it and you recover and you celebrate that night, or when you have your son or your dad or your family members with you, or all these other things that we do. But the best memories often are with other people, and that is It's something that I think has gotten lost in the last ten, fifteen to twenty years for a lot of the serious deer hunters and I think I think we're missing out.

And at least I can speak for myself. I have been missing out sometimes on that.

it was. It was great. So yeah, it's pretty it's pretty easy, and we do and you know, I don't feel like I mean, I'm sure you feel this way too. I'm not speaking for everybody. There are people who are perfectly happy to hunt solo all fall. They don't need that, and that's great. I mean, you've got to My biggest thing is, you know, you've got to find out what makes you happy, what brings you joy in that process.

And if it's you know, if it's going out there by yourself, you know, grinding away you know, day after day and you are truly enjoying it, man, awesome, I'm I'm happy for you. I wish I could learn from it, you could rub it off on me a little.

Facebook comments or whatever it is. Everyone's a content creator now on TikTok or YouTube or whatever. Everybody wants the most views, likes, whatever for their big giant buck.

to get a free bow? Are you going to pay me for this? And I was just like, oh man, you know, this isn't the reason we should be deer hunting, you know, And I got I got, you know, kind of disgusted with it, and and voice out to my editors. I'm like, you know, I'm kind of getting to the end of my rope with this thing, because they'd want and you know, to our discredit sometimes we did pay

for a big deer. I thought it was a mistake, you know, but if it was a really big deer, sometimes they'd you know, give them a little bit of money. And anyway, we've gotten away from that. But an interesting shift has happened within the last couple of years, and uh,

it's been really refreshing. And there have been some world class or you know, I've I've talked to four or five guys just this fall that have killed deer over two hundred inches and they're like, to a guy or a gal, they're just like, I mean, I am so lucky, you know, I've been so blessed to be in the woods with this critter and get a chance, and and I didn't screw it up. I got a clean kill, and blah blah blah. I'm just like, allelujah. You know,

this is how we should feel, you know. And it didn't matter, you know, I mean most of them would know the score, but it wasn't like, well, yeah, but you know that guy got a bigger one, or you know, I was really disappointed because he broke off ten inches. You know, I don't know, it just it really gets to the point, in my opinion, where it gets kind of silly after a while, you know, because it didn't it wasn't that long ago where it wasn't that way.

You know, we didn't have this as you call comparison culture and that. Yeah, it's it's really kind of It just strikes me as a little bit say, maybe I'm just an old fart and I don't but anyway, yeah, I don't like it. Yeah I have advice, I'm not I'm not quite sure. I'm not really sure how to deal with it, except that, you know, if if you drop the hammer or trip the release on a deer, you should be proud of that critter, no matter what

his score, his body weight is. You know, if you harvested that animal cleanly and ethically, then man, you should you should be proud, because it's not especially you know, especially if it's a mature bucket's you know, it's it's not that easy, as as we both know, and for most of us it takes a lot of work.

I'm the only one losing sleep over it. And if I did end up miraculously still killing one later this year, people will notice for a half a second and then move on with their lives. Like you said, Like my sons and my wife, they're not going to look at a buck I shoot, Oh geez, should have been bigger. Yeah, they don't care. And I think we probably all need a little reminder like, really, this doesn't matter that much. It's not life or death. It should if it's not.

And when it comes down to it, if you are not enjoying the process, if you're not enjoying this moment, then you're missing the point because nobody else is forcing you to do this.

And a week later, you know, I mean if somebody off the street said, did best of them get a buck this year, and I'd be like, huh was that this year? Was that last year?

a ten pointer walking right to my tree. Wasn't the biggest buck in the world, a nice solid, probably a three year old, you know, but just a pretty deer made my heart jump and I'm like, I want him, you know. So anyway he walked in. I shot, my god him, made a nice bow shot on him. And anyway, I didn't even post it on Facebook or anything. I just sent, you know, sent to a few friends. Hey waled out on this tempointer and one guy said it was really fascinating to me. I just blew me away.

It took him about a day and he finally got back to me and he goes, I've been looking at your buck picture, and I realized that someone in your position, he knew I was an outdoor writer sometimes has to kill kill a deer to give himself credibility. And I was like, really, wow, I took an animal so that I could look good for my readers. I'm sorry. I

don't do that. You know, when i'm when I see a buck coming, the last thing on my mind is what are people going to think of me if I if I tagged this deer, if I passed this deer anyway, some anyway. That is the only time I've ever I've ever encountered that, and I so I took a deep breath, I let it rest for a minute, and then I got back to him later and I'm like, I think

you did I think you misunderstand me. I said, I shot that buck because I'm super proud of it, and he made me really excited, and I think he might have apologized later. I don't know, but anyway, I thought it was important point out that I don't do that. I don't look at deer hunting that way. And I you know, I learned. I mean, like every young hunter, I went through a period where I was just stacking them up you know, my teens and early twenties, it was important to you know, tag and we we grew

bagged unashamedly. I mean that it was legal, and we drove deer. So you know, man the deer. If you were tagged out and a buck walked in front of you on a deer drive and you had open tags, you shot it. I mean that's just what we did, you know. And so anyway, there was a time, you know, when it was important for me to get my buck.

But it's interesting, I can't remember. I don't know if I remember the specific deer, but I remember I was in my mid mid to late twenties and I shot a buck and I think I didn't I think my tag was filled and I had shot it because I knew somebody was looking for me. And anyway, I shot that deer and I walked up to it, and I'm like, you just killed this thing for a that even kill his own deer, you know, I mean, this is I don't know it. It kind of hit me then that

it was like, this is kind of serious business. I mean, you're taking a life, you know. And I have a lot of love and respect for white tail deer and killing them is not something that I do lightly. You know, it's a it's a fairly big deal to me, even if it's a dough, you know, just a dough. I'm very grateful and humbled by that experience. You know, I'm super I'm super happy. I know I'm gonna have meat. I achieved a goal. You know, I sat out there in the cold or whatever, and I got my deer.

But you know, I mean, I killed something, and I think we need to I think we need to be honorable about that. It's a big deal.

I shoot a deer, and if I choose to share that with a world, or if I you know, uniquely have like a video showcasing what happens. In the back of my mind, I know they are going to be people with opinions who are going to share them and who will talk badly about me or my decisions or

what I did or how I did it. And so it's in this in this weird world we live in now, and it's a really unfortunate side effect that we almost can't avoid that if you choose to share this stuff with the world, you're going to have negativity out there. And so what I've what I'm getting, what I'm learning is that I need to more and more dissociate myself and like my self worth and who I am from

you know, hunting success quote unquote success. And the more I have for too long in my early years, I attached like my own value to my hunting success, so like I wasn't good enough, if I wasn't killing as many deer as this guy or that guy, or big enough deer or whatever.

But it's a constant kind of seesaw or something that I'm on as I that's huge.

I've tried to avoid the one buck mission and the you know, uh, targeting a specific deer, although I have done that and it can be exciting. But I think I think when you set yourself again. Goals are great, but I think you you know, you just gotta you gotta temper them, and and and your ability to say, wait a minute, I'm feeling kind of funky here, do I need to step back and kind of re evaluate how I'm approaching this or thinking about that. I think

that's a huge step. That's you know, we we all need to be able to do that, because, as you said, you know, I mean, it's supposed to be fun. We gotta have fun. And I remember I was hunting a property, a pretty exclusive property in southern Iowa, you know, fairly large, managed intensively, and you know, and the standards were pretty high. I mean it was like a one fifty or one sixty minimum, you know. So anyway, you know, you go out in the woods and you're just terrified you're gonna

shoot the wrong deer. And I remember describing that to my wife and she's like, why are you hunting there? It doesn't sound like you're having very much fun. And I'm like, you know, that's it. I didn't say it, but I'm like, it's kind of a good point. Am I really having fun? I Mean, I'm on this place that most guys would just kill the hunt, you know, just three thousand acres or whatever. I mean, it's just you know, probably one of the best hunting properties in

the North America, you know. And anyway, Yeah, so.

your wind direction. Make sure you're thinking about where these deer are going to travel, how will the mature buck move through, or how will you evade, you know, the noses in the eyes of every single dough And make sure you don't crack that twig when you're walking in, and make sure that when you're up in the trees and you do this, this, that and the other. There's so much stuff, right, yeah, And I find myself constantly tense.

It's it's it's a very tense experience. And so the stakes seems so high, and the pressure is on everything. As soon as I flip the switch to not targeting mature buck instead just trying to shoot, does everything changes? And all of a sudden, it's like, oh man, this is fun, this is the fun hunting.

hunting for does. And how can I apply that feeling or that level of just having fun with it to the rest of my year or do I need to change my goals to feel that way the whole year. I'm not sure what the takeaway there is, but there's something there. When I have a totally different hunting experience and one of them is largely more fun than the other, there's something there to learn.

smartest deer in the herd is a mature dough. She has spent her entire life doing nothing but raising babies and getting them through, you know, this gauntlet of predators and hunters and cars and all kinds of things. And when she steps out onto a field or a food plot man, her radar is on. And I've seen mature bucks act like complete dopes this time of year, like I'm just doing homery. I'm just gonna go out through

me and I don't care what what's happening. So it's it's fascinating, isn't it that you know, we're just we're just hunting a dough. Well, I tell you what, that big old nanny with a head like a burrow. You know, she's a pretty tough customer. You put an arrow in her this time of year, you've done something, I mean, that's you know, you may not get your your your picture on the cover of a magazine, or you know, be an Instagram hero. But man, I tell you what

I shot one a couple couple falls or a couple winners. Back. Was the coldest night of the season, and I actually I couldn't believe it. I bumped that deer and three other There was two other doughs and a couple fawns. They were all on the food plot. When I got there, it wasn't a food plot, it was it was a stubble field. Anyway, they trotted off. They saw me coming from half a mile away, and I'm like, oh, the night is done. But I'm like, well, I've walked this far.

I actually snowshoot into this place. It was that far off the so I'm like, well, I'm just gonna crawl up in the tree and you know, whiddle away. The rest of the afternoon was the last night of the season, you know. And I crawled up my tree and I

couldn't believe it. Twenty minutes before dark, here they come back out, and that big nanny Doe was leading the way, and she stuck her head out of the woods and she just sat there looking while all the other deer held out into this corn stubble and she finally walked out there. I shot her. She made like a little thirty yard loop and collapsed in the field. And I don't know, I must be getting old and sappy, but I walked up to that deer and I knelt in the snow and I cried. I mean, I was so

proud of that. You know, it was just like that was the deer. I don't know, I would have been cool. She was wearing one hundred and fifty inch ten point rack that she wasn't but she's probably seven years old. I'm like, what is that old gal scene in her lifetime? You know? And uh, that was was a heck of

a trophy. Yeah, anyway, special and it was interesting. I did post that picture of that deer on Facebook and I had three different guys go, that's a shed buck, and I'm like, trust me them, I feel dressed her. There was plumbing to be a doll was there. But she was huge, you know, so I'd hate to guess how old she was. You know. That's pretty special anyway. So yeah, the old just a dole thing. That's that's interesting because I mean I do the same thing. I

think exactly the same way. Well, let's just go out and have some fun shoot those you know.

all the time. Now, I guess I'm not sure, but was the decision to start using a recurve something related to all of this in some kind of way, because I've started thinking, maybe that's maybe that's something I should try, because all of a sudden, you know, any deal with the recurve would be really a heck of an accomplishment and something super exciting and might be very different and a fun new thing for me to do rather than obsess over you know, the one hundred and forty inch

four year old that's within five spare miles of me.

was sometimes frustrating. Yeah, you know, you pass some shots a deer that you probably would have get taken with a compound. But so anyway, then then my kids were born, and for me, anyway, it takes a lot of practice to be professional with a recurve. I have to shoot every day just to burn that into my muscle memory and really stay sharp. And so anyway, when my kids, I have boy girl twins, and all of a sudden, life got really really busy and practicing was not as

easy it was. And so and plus I was writing more and more about bowl hunting and testing bows, and I'm like, I really gotta I gotta be So I hadn't shot a compound bowl in ten years, so they'd obviously changed quite Yeah. When I picked up the new ones, I was like, holy God, these things are really good.

many bucks anymore anyway, so why do you care? And then I started thinking about it, and I'm like, you know, my maximum range with a recurve, you know, fifteen yards is like ideal. I can do twenty if the situation is right. And then I thought, you know, bestil, how many of the deer that you shot with a compound were further than twenty yards away? And I could think of like three, you know, almost all of them are just they're just right there. And that's one of the

to me. You know, you talk about goal settings, One of my greatest goals and challenges as the bowl hunter is where do I set my stand to get that super killing shot. I'm not interested in killing a deer at fifty yards, zero interest in it. I won't. I just won't shoot that. I don't care if I can do it on a target course. This is just me, not talking about people who like to shoot long range.

This is just my thing. My joy is setting a tree stand or a ground blind or whatever so that I can get a close range shot at a mature buck. And that I'm like, why can't I use a recurve for that? And I can? So yeah. So anyway, I started getting serious about it last summer and shooting and yeah, I've hunted with one off all this fall, and yeah, it's just it's funny. I've got a little Judo point.

I got an arrow with a Judo point on it, and when I walk out after a morning hunt, I'm shooting at leaves and stumps and sticks and it's just a blast. I enjoy it. There's just something about So, Yeah, it's brought some joy into my life. I like it. Yeah, I'd recommend it so.

of the hunting season. What final words of wisdom would you give folks to help them, you know, make the very most of these final weeks.

of honor. It might be a minor one for some people, but yeah, and and for one thing, I know how long it's going to be till that next hunting season comes around. So I want to milk everything I can out of these last few weeks and enjoy it. You know, the sunsets and sunrises of winter to me, are the most spectacular and beautiful I love every minute of that

part of it. And to me, I don't know. The other thing that I mean it's a little bit selfish too, is that I mean I hunt a lot during the rut, and I see as many mature bucks now from now till the end of December. We close December thirty first. I typically, if we get the right weather and I can find the food, I'll see as many mature bucks in the next three weeks as I will the entire month of November. And that's just my area. I'm just lucky, you know, I've got some farms that don't get pressured

very hard in December. So anyway, yeah, I just I don't know. I think you just got to keep the faith and recharge sometimes, you know, it feels good to take a couple of days off, like today, it's going to be forty five around here, so I'm not going deer hunting. It's like the deer, you know, I need. I need a couple of days of you know, reset and recharge my batteries. Is I don't think the deer

are gonna move that great tonight. But anyway, when when the weather flips and it's gone in two days, I'm gonna be out there and I'm gonna keep plugging away to the bitter end just because I love it. I don't I want to say goodbye to the season in a proper way, which to me is in a tree stand.

I mean, yeah, it's I can't remember. It used to be a huge deal when you know, for the magazine we'd find it out angle two hundred deer in the fall, you know, And now, I mean, good lord just raining on us. You know, there's just some tremendous deer out there, and hunters, I tell you what, hunters are just better now than they've ever been. I mean, the average the average twenty five year old white tail hunter in America right now and knows way more than I knew before

I was forty. I mean, you know, they just they just know, you know, they got good spots and they know how to hunt them. So anyway, but yeah, go go to fieldstream dot com. You might find some good stuff. And I'm really honored to be on this show. And I appreciate your approach and you're you know, you're really really a smart and sensitive and uh really sharp deer hunter, and I appreciate it. Your presences is greatly appreciated on the on the deer hunting landscape for me.