Yogurt Shop Murders

Hey, welcome back.

My name's Ben and I'm Nicole, and you're listening to Wicked and Grim, a true crime podcast.

We don't get to go this time because I've already opened my beer.

You already open your beer, and I'm apparently dry for some reason why. I don't know. It's been a busy day and I just I didn't get anything. I didn't grab alcohol.

There's always time to grab alcohol.

Though apparently not for me today. Well next time, next time the show.

I'll drink extra fast to compensate.

Okay, was that? Yeah, I don't even have water, Like, what the heck's going on here?

You're gonna be parched.

I know. I think it's because I have to go down a ladder. I get it that I'm being lazy, fair.

Fair, Okay. Our studio sound is awesome. I just got to point that out. We've had a couple of people talk to us about that and they're like, it sounds fucking dope in there.

Yeah, which is sweet because we were worried a little bit about that. Actually.

Yeah, and I just put down a little carpet today too. Yeah, that sound even.

More our fancy boho carpet, Boho carpet.

And bean bags. Ah, it's good. It's nice. I like it in this little studio loft.

It is good. It's like a little it's a little uncomfortable ish, but I just have to figure out, like we got have to figure out how to sit and how it's gonna work.

We've got to work ourselves into it and get the space kind of worked around us and figure out how it's how we're gonna make it come us.

We have to do that for the whole tiny home, because I think with tiny I'm living like you have to have a spot for everything. Yeah, like everything has to have its freaking spot. And we're not quite there yet. So it's like a little chaotic still. But it's going to get there.

It's fucking it has.

To get there. It's going to get there. It is positive thinking here.

Can Can you hear that in my voice though? Do I sound a little raspy?

Yeah?

I do. It's from yelling at fan con all weekend?

What is fan con? We should share that?

Tell you what fan con is. It's comic book convention. I was I was a guest.

You were a guest?

Yeah, and invited guests as a content because those who don't know. I'm actually a TikToker. I have over one hundred and fifty thousand followers on TikTok Toot that Horn too, and of course Wicked and Graham m but you weren't able to join for Wicked and Graham, So it was just me as a solo content creator.

Because I had a massive amount of photoshoots this weekend.

You will get in your photos on my professional talk.

Well it's fall. That season is just yeah, yeah, people want the pretty fall. Everyone wants fall photos.

But while I was actually at fan Con, there was another podcast that was guesting there, the Dairy Public Radio, and they were actually super awesome, So shout out to them everyone I got to meet. I did get a selfie, so I'll be posting that selfie on her Instagram.

Oh that's awesome. What was their podcast about.

Again, Well, let me tell you what it was.

Well, no, I actually can't remember. It wasn't it like Stephen King? Yes, okay, okay, I know you got to.

Listen to him because I I listened to The Long Walk because they talk about the Stephen King. Well it's a Stephen King book Club podcast, Okay, so they'll read a Stephen King book and they'll read a few chapters and they'll do an episode on the few chapters they read and they'll talk about it.

Oh that's kind of fun.

So I asked him which one they recommended, and I was recommended The Long Walk. I've never read the book before, but I'm one who spoilers. Don't bother me. It gives me something to look forward to my perspective. So anyways, I listened to I think it was three episodes for The Long Walk. I have to read this fucking book now, Oh my god, are you there? Their podcast is awesome. So if you guys are interested in Stephen King books or a book club podcast, definitely hit up The Dairy Public Radio.

That's kind of fun actually, because I don't know. Sometimes I feel like book clubs are kind of clicky and like if you're not invited to one, then it's like, oh, well, that's kind of sad. So it's like they're like inviting everyone.

Yeah, they're inviting everyone to read the book along with them and discussions, so it's really cool. Yeah, and me being damn near illiterate, it's it's nice that I can go at my own pace totally. I Can I can read the book when I want and then listen to the episode months later when I learn how to pronounce certain words.

Can we also have a correction? Dumb dun dumb.

Correction, Well, not big time, it's a little thing, but it's on, Gabby Potito, it's a big case currently. So little Brian is not thirty seven years old.

No, it's the same age as her right, twenty three.

Yeah, he was twenty three years old. Apparently they went to the same high school.

Yeah, so that was a nasty rumor that got out there.

Yeah, and we fell victim to when we were researching, the rumor was at its peak, at its height, and I found several websites that actually said thirty seven years old.

So when like wildfire, really it really did.

So correction, Gabby Patito. The whole case with that Brian was not thirty seven years old, It was twenty three.

And now twenty three, and now her body has been officially found and it's been officially confirmed and it's been a homicide, yes, which is really really shitty.

It is I haven't actually looked up, do you know if they're still looking for Brian?

As far as I know, because the last. Okay, well, hopefully this isn't a rumor. I don't think it is. But I saw a new thing about Dog the Bounty I.

Just googled it and it just came out. Okay, first thing that came on it.

I want to find him.

Fox News. Dog the Bounty Hunter joins Brian laundry Man Hunt says he's received more than one thousand leads. Yeah, that's that's the Fox.

I think I would be like actually shitting my pants if that guy was looking for me. I'm not gonna lie.

You know, I don't know, I would not. I'm sure he had his prime when he was good. I think he's past that now.

Does he? Is he? Because he had a TV show? Right? Does he still have a TV show? I don't even know much about it.

Does still?

But anyway, so he's gonna I feel like he has to be found. I'm slightly curious though. If he's alive, is my one thing, you might have.

Like made a bolt and has like gone to Mexico by now.

Yeah. But anyway, so that's our little little tidbits. But I think at this point we should move on to our case.

Let's move on to the case. Let's do it? What do you got?

I dropped it last week, So if you listened to last week, you know what's going on here. But it's we're doing a Texas case. Yeah, y'all, y'all, y'all, we're doing a Texas case. We actually have a ton of listeners from Texas showed out to all of them they're for and this case. Okay, Like researching it, I just like got a massive amount of goosebumps constantly.

Oh, do tell why?

Because like the victims in the story are so young. Then they're just like these beautiful girls and they had their whole life ahead of them, and it was just it was taking the fuck away from them, taking away I'm just like not okay with that. It's not cool.

Well, I mean, any murder or anything like that is never cool.

It's not.

But it just hits home a little harder when the victims are young, especially kids.

Yeah, young, and that there was four of them, so, oh, already here we go.

Story started.

This is the story of the nineteen ninety one Austin yogurt shop murders.

I have heard you talk about this a time or two.

And it's spoiler alert. I'm just doing a spoiler right off the fringing mat here. It's an unsolved case.

Yes, I love media unsolved.

I'm just landing on my laptop, which is really freaking weird.

Cool. We have French doors in the.

Time, we keep leaving them open, which is a problem.

It's awesome though, because we're just so nice living the outdoors a little bit, even though we don't have a deck yet.

Yeah, I feel like I am spending more time outside, which is sweep definitely. Okay. So the fact that this shit isn't solved yet is like just beyond me because it is such a brutal case and the fact that's an individual or individuals like they don't even know that, yeah wow got away with this is just wow. Like it's just wow, just wow, just just freaking wow.

Wow. I just heard Owen Wilson come in.

Wow.

Wow. I can't do one Wilson voice. I could do voices, but not Nolan Wilson. Oh, by the way, did I tell you that I got some voice acting tips and stuff while at fan Con?

Oh? Right, Actually you said that you were talking to someone, but I don't really know if you didn't know you got tips.

Well, I got like a whole spiel and information on how to put together a voice demo and all that jazz.

So huh yeah, we'll get that shit going here.

I will.

And I almost just interburped there again. And okay, the amount of people that also interburp, like hallelujah. Okay, this is a thing.

Record. I never said it wasn't a thing. I just think the term inner burp is really fucked up.

It's it describes it perfectly. Okay, holy shit. Okay, we're sidetracked here, my bad. Okay. So anyway, it was the evening of Friday, December sixth, nineteen ninety one. Fourteenage girls, seventeen year old Eliza Thomas, seventeen year old Jennifer Harbison, fifteen year old Sarah Harborson, Nipper's sister, and thirteen year old Amy Ayers, who was Sarah's friend, who were all at the shop called I can't believe it's yogurt? Which is is.

That next door to the I can't believe it's not butter shop?

I think so. So this is a chain store that serves soft served frozen yogurt.

Fro y'all ding dang, I like it.

We used to have a shop like a menschi It was called Menchies. I'm not sure if Minchi's is just a Canadian thing, but I was suprise.

I think it's just like a chain because I'm pretty they had like a wall of celebrities and there was a bunch of like American.

But anyway, our freaking its closed and that's kind of shitty. We obviously didn't support it enough.

Well, I'm not surprised because I mean, it wasn't in a very good location. And also, like an ice cream shop in Canada, people go there for like warm weather and.

Foraking half a year is cold here.

Like two to three months of summer, so that.

Would be hard for them.

Actually, yeah three months of summer tops well technically yeah, but you know what I mean.

Yeah, So this particular shop was part of the Hillside Strip Center in Austin. Jennifer and Eliza were employees of the store, while Sarah and Amy had ventured over from the mall, which was a few blocks away. And we're just in the back of the store hanging out and helping Eliza and Jennifer close. Basically, they're just waiting for Jennifer to give them a ride home, you know, A little sibling. Right, So the yogurt shop was set to

I could imagine. And also I in the back of my head was like, who's getting froyo at eleven pm? And then I also realized.

That we would.

Yeah, I'm pretty sure we did at Menchies multiple times do that, so I know, yeah, I can't knock that.

Yeah, I actually thought it was kind of a late time to be open, but I don't know, it obviously opened for a reason that late, right.

Yeah, there's obviously selling merchant stuff then, so.

And they're froo I didn't have this in here, But some people were like kind of against the fact that they it was that late and the girls were that young and closing, But I mean like seventeen years old. Yeah, I feel like that it's okay.

I think so too.

So obviously they were responsible, right, and there was like it wasn't just like it was one of them. Yeah, however, okay, so back to this, they're closing down shop. However, there was one table that didn't get put to other for the night, and that's because it was occupied by two men. There are a few people in and out of the yogurt shop shortly before clothes, and a few of them didn't get the best of vibes about these individuals that

Mind if I go off on a little bit of a tangent here, complete different story something I read on a Reddit thread today. Sure it's Kim. It was like this creepy stories thing, right, and so it's like you know, what's a real story that you'll never forget, something that actually happened to you, like creepy as fuck. So this person was like at a train station waiting for their like super late train, and they had like a couple

Oh my gosh, I feel like after that long time that you would like realize.

But they took there was cell phone video or photos of it, and like from a distance where they were sitting, it looked legit like a little girl standing there. And then as you get up close and then yeah, they took a photo. It's just like a bunch of these like giant lego blocks put into a little girl.

Oh my gosh. I know, like in this scenario, I was feeling like if she had this gut feeling she could even she was there so close to close, I guess she could have just like waited in the parking lot. But then still, like at some point you do have to just live your life. I guess then it at home. I don't know something like that is about to happen exactly exactly.

And also like if these little if these young women are seventeen years old and everything like that, would this have changed if they were twenty four, if they were a little bit older. Would this incident.

Oh, like you know, yeah, because people were saying maybe they're too young to not Probably not really so if anything, if they were that old, they wouldn't have probably had their little sibling and friend in the back.

I guess, right, so maybe probably. Oh yeah, I mean less victims then.

I guess technically probably.

Oh that's like, yeah, that was supposed to be helpful, but it wasn't. So thank you.

I'm sorry. I was just trying to like, oh my god, what I was trying to do.

Yeah, apparently I was not helping some of Yeah, that was not help I've been.

Talking lots anyways, so I'm zipping it.

Okay. So it wasn't until eleven forty seven pm that police officer Troy Gay, who was patrolling the area, reports a fire at the cat that I can't believe it's yogurt shop. The fire department showed up. They did their job. They put the fire out without even a thought that this could be any more than just a fire, don't don't.

Yeah, I know where this is going.

As they were doing their post fire walkthrough, you know, making sure the fire was completely out, they got a glimpse a glimpse of what appeared to be a human charred foot, which was their initial discovery of what would be three charred black bodies to the point of beyond recognition.

Oh shit, so three, you said, right?

Three? So at this point Detective John Jones was called to the scene and as he was en route, he got an update that a fourth body was found.

There's the fourth but also Detective John Jones. How badass of a detective name is that? Undetective John Jones.

It's pretty cool get these. It seemed like he did a good job all times. Yeah, yeah, he did a good good job. There's we'll get to that. But anyway, it's claimed that this was the day Austin lost its innocence.

Oh shit.

In nineteen ninety one, Austin was not the size of the town it is today. In the nineteen nineties, the population was about four hundred and fifty thousand, where today it's more than doubled in size. And back then they did not have like a lot of violent crimes. But I was also like, thinking back to like the nineties, I feel like shit's just gotten worse since then, Like and then back then worst was stuff as violent? Well, were there as many violent crimes.

There's oh, definitely. I think it was what I think the seventies and the eighties was like the height of like serial killers. Like I can't remember what they call it, but it's like literally the serial killer era. There's a name they've named it. But so definitely. Just nowadays, there's so much social media and worldwide like reach that people's stories are just all over the place. You wake up you see murder stories constantly because you're seeing it from

Well, I mean too, I guess said that age. I was just living my life, making my mud pies. Just sh it just seemed simpler than it does now. And I feel like the world's going to hell sometimes.

But it was chasing frogs.

Yeah, look at us go. It's good combo.

Yeah.

So, as Detective Jones entered the flooded scene, his initial response was, holy shit, holy shit. The bodies of the four girls were burnt so badly their melted bodies had become part of the floor. They were naked, bound and gagged with their own clothes, their legs spread, one girl having an ice cream scoop left inside of her shit. Each girl had been shot in the head.

That's fucking disgusting.

So that paints a little bit of a poor visual. I'm quite sorry.

I guarantee you that melted the butter next door that I can't believe it's not butter.

Yeah, that ship must have been definitely melted. Is that the still thing? I can't believe it's not butter.

Yeah, that was like the margins.

Yeah, but do they still make that even margin?

Yeah?

Well that kind of margin?

Oh? Probably? What kind was it? Was it? I don't know.

I'm like not into margarine where we've totally switched to butter in this all the way. You resisted, so don't even that.

Okay, I did resist for.

The longest time, and it was just like unbelievable that you kept resisting.

Okay, okay, to be fair, to be fair, I've always been pro butter for cooking. Yeah, but on toast.

Because margin is more convenient.

Yes, because the spreadability my gosh.

Okay, anyway, now that you know like our butter margin in preference, here, I'll describe the shop and seen a bit more. As you enter the shop, there's a row of booths on your left and you're right with some tables in the middle. The table that didn't get put together for the night, So where the two men were sitting was on the row of booths on the left, closest to the counter. Then you had the front counter and just under half the store, Like it seemed like

Maybe it was like a location that they came into and it was just like they just made what it was the lay it was work for them.

Yeah, it could be because I think like lots of times when you're serving food, like you almost legally have to have a bathroom or something. So all of the bodies were found in the back room area. Two of the bodies, Sarah and Eliza, were found stacked on top of each other, with Jennifer's body right next to them, and Amy was a little further away, closer to the entrance from the back room to like the main open area.

Oh really, Oh shit, that's very likely then.

So it could definitely have been a possibility.

Wow.

Yeah, which is really sad to kind of think about that.

Being that situation, Like, imagine trying to crawl away from that scene with a wound like that tear head. Oh my god, that poor girl, I know.

And that was here. Let me just I'm pretty sure Amy was the youngest one. Oh no, So where am I here? What are you doing to I'm so sorry? Okay, it's a very okay, I told you this case, like I literally conte it goosebumps because I just like felt so wrig and bad. Okay. So Amy's body also wasn't burnt to the extent the other girls were, so would be slightly helpful to the investigation. It was her body that gave Detective Jones and indication that sexual assault had occurred.

Ice creams gup didn't give that away.

Well, she was the one with the ice creamy, Okay, okay, So the other three girl's bodies were so burnt they were beyond recognition. It's unknown if the three girls were covered in like accelerant at the start of the fire. Oh sorry, holy heck, where am I here? Okay? It's unknown if the three girls were covered with accelerant and were like the start of the fire or if the storage shelf beside them was like the origin of the fire.

Well, either way, that's kind of I mean, do they just like splash gas all over sort of thing? Maybe? Is that a cat getting Is Kiwi doing some shit?

No, I can hear weird things going on down there.

I think he's I think he's being a dick. Kiwi, stop being a dick.

We can hear everything that's going on in earls now, which is so funny. Okay, well they're okay. I'm about to kind of go into something here because there was a few investigation errors in this case errors and the girls not being tested for that act yeah was one of them because when it came to questioning the accuse, it prevented the investigators from having all the facts basically right. So I mean, I don't like, it doesn't seem like

I was like, why does it matter where the fire was started the shelf for them? But when it comes down to actual questioning.

Yeah, questions, the small more, you know, the better, right, So a few other noteworthy errors made was the bathroom didn't get dusted for prints, and earlier that evening there had been unquestionable individual who went in the back to

John Jones, get on your shit with John Jones, right, Yeah, detective high expectations for him with that name.

But okay, I also, I mean okay, I also think it's human nature to later like question how you potentially handle the situation and is definitely twenty twenty if there was things that you could have done differently or better but I mean, I guess when it's like in a murder investigation, it's kind of a harder pill to swallow, right, Yeah, fair, there isn't a lot that can be done to help the parent's cope, especially like okay, not that one parent

There, Well, I mean, she was probably sitting there, like where are my daughters? Like she's probably she's not sleeping, She's waiting for her daughters to get home guaranteed.

Well, I don't know, because it depends if they were sleeping over at the I don't know they like or they came they were going to be home late. Like she could have already been sleeping, right, Like she might

Today, no kidding.

Wow, So anyway, I mean.

I don't have tissues the dishes because you're going to be a river today.

So what I was say something saying is like, there's not a lot to help the parents, but I feel like maybe knowing that the people responsible for the crime or locked up might be the tiniest of helpful, a little bit of yeah, knowing that they're not out there potentially like doing that to someone else. So a lot of evidence was also destroyed in the fire. The fire needed to be put out, but in doing so, forensic evidence also could have been washed away and destroyed.

Yep, especially with a high pressure.

And they didn't even know what there was a I know, they had no idea.

Just like I'm sure we're walking everywhere and like tearing shit down. Yeah.

So but then this brings me to say, like, I'm not entirely certain if there would have been a different way to put out a fire than having known that there was a crime scene inside, right, But it was mentioned had they known prior to the extent of the crime, they probably would have done things differently. Oh that Like anyway, there may have been different ways of gathering evidence, and a lack of evidence in this case could be why it's not potentially solved, right.

Yeah, and that's exactly why they lit the fire too, clearly to try and get rid of evidence, and clearly it fucking worked.

I feel like that. Yeah, that's probably why you would light a fire. I've heard of that in other cases. It gets I would imagine it gets rid of well, it gets rid of a lot of things, which yeah, kind of yeah, there you go. People even do that to the houses and shit. Insurance Like the fire is an interesting thing.

Although it's like investigators can get real specific unburned patterns and shit, and they can pretty much usually pinpoint.

Which is why yeah, I know, like even okay, even forest fires. Yeah, and they can like pinpoint where it started and if it was like started by a cigarette or something. That is just like my mind, fuck, how do you learn that shit? Like that's some smart ship?

Where is this school that you learned that this is the cigarette burn that burned this forest down like what I.

Know, I know, I wouldn't even know where to begin at the cigarette apparently apparently, or just find the person that knows. Yeah, okay, So a few more details I wanted to mention. About five hundred dollars was taken from the cash register at eleven oh three. There's record that Eliza hit the button on the cash register for no charge sale, indicating that there was a robbery aspect to

Yeah, I don't think so.

Like, I don't think so, right.

Unless you're like super desperate sort of thing. Yeah, but if you're super desperate, you probably don't have the means of having a firearm.

Yeah, most likely, I think it's probably like a sexual assault thing more so, Right, it just doesn't seem like it would be a robbery.

Yeah, they most likely probably went in with sexual assault in mind, and just like let's get cash while we're at it.

Because something I didn't even mention, or that I don't have written down in here, but some reports kind of said it could have been people following the young girls from the mall to this yogurt chop or something, right, I don't know. I don't know. So as I had mentioned, all the girls were shot in the head with a twenty two caliber gune, I meant to look that up.

Here's the twenty two calibar again. It's a twenty two caliber is really popular for like shooting people in the head. Definitely shows it could have been premeditated, okay, because twenty two's don't exit the skull, right, Well, it goes in and it doesn't exit. It goes in the skull, It bounces around a couple times, like scrambles your fucking brain and sure's you're dead usually and it's not messy, it's not blown out. And yeah, how cool and quiet is Finn?

How big is this gun?

Small?

Is it small?

Okay's super small?

I need to like research my guns here, but I also feel like my Google history is fucked up enough, and maybe I just won't.

Yeah, we might be getting on a knocking our door one these days.

Yeah, I feel like, oh, if anyone would look there, I'm just like, holy shit. Yeah, okay, but Amy was shot twice, as I had mentioned, and the second shot to her head was actually done with a different weapon, a larger caliber weapon nine millimeter. Oh gosh, I can't remember.

You did never reri down.

No. A three eighty. Is that larger? Maybe like a hunting rifle. I don't know. It said it was like a much bigger okay, weapon, which isn't super important which kind of weapon, But what is kind of important and interesting is that it indicates that there was probably more than one person, right, because would you be like packing both guns like I seem like it would indicate that there was more than one person.

Most likely, even if you are packing multiple guns, you're probably gonna use the same one that's in your fucking hand rather than swapping them out.

Yeah. So Amy also had a bruise under her chin, indicating that she had been struck, and also had showed signs of being strangled. These poor girls, so like they they really just went through hell. So once the autopsy reports.

I'm sorry, I just came up with a really and it's I know it's super dark, but I came up with a funny tagline.

Okay, because shop, he'll just froze over.

Oh my, I'm sorry. I'm sorry, but it just popped in there and I had to share it.

Sorry, here, you're just making everything way worse. Sorry, sorry, sorry, Oh my gosh, Okay, it was good.

You have to have me that.

Okay, yeah, I'll give you that. I'll give you that.

It was super fucking dark. It was good.

My gosh, Sorry, I digress. Continue Oh are we ready to continue? Like? I need a moment here. Okay. So, once the autopsy reports were finalized on the girls, the police decided to see I was gonna say steal, but that doesn't make any sense. Seal the reports, so like keep them to themselves, right, This was this way, once they received confession, they would be able to know if it was was a match to what actually had happened. And I didn't really think this was this would be

I new false confessions were a thing, but like many really.

Okay, this is this is wild? At one point the pool of suspects was three hundred and forty two people, holy shit, and they had dozens of false confessions. WHOA, Like what the fuck? Really? I was just like what? Why? Like why? So that's like just not normal. I mean, I think there's probably generally a pool of suspects, but it's not like three hundred and forty two. Yeah, and there aren't usually dozens of false confessions.

What if one of those confessions is legit?

I know, like it's almost like what they even know, Like it just it just takes some taking up all the resources of the investigators to have to deal with all this shit. Yeah, okay, well guess what. We just took a tiny break. So the dogs were being jerks.

One was pacing around and the other one was starting to get.

I guess what. I got a Drink's best break ever?

Right? My drinks almost empty. I should have got one from.

Yeah, you screwed up. And I'm like constantly just literally changing up lately. I'm drinking a twisted tea. Now, I've been drinking smear and offs, and I'm drinking local shit. It's just I'm all over the fricking place. Let's do Margarita's one day.

We have, but we need to again, Oh yeah.

We have? That was the best? Okay, Okay, who we're diving in here? So this is a bit of a side note. Okay, where the heck were we here? Okay, so this is a side note. I'm not going to go into many details of all the confessions that occurred, but one of them I am going to because it's just interesting. So it was Kenneth Alan McDuff, and some people may reckon that name because he was a serial killer, so suspected of at least fourteen murders and it could

I heard?

Oh okay, I hadn't heard of that, because one of the victims, necks, was broken with a broomstick after she was apparently repeatedly, repeatedly raped, which sounds absolutely brutal. Anyway, in nineteen eighty nine, and this I just can't even believe I'm able to read this. Due to prison overcrowding, Kenneth was paroled, but it is believed after he was released, he committed many more murders. Fuck, like because the prison was overcrowded. Is that like a joke?

Yeah, way to fail Like.

That is just not okay. He was taken back into custody and sent to death row, but the day of his execution, he confessed to the yogurt shop murders. Being such a last minute confession, it was believed this was a last straw of stopping his execution. Okay, but it did not. And either way, they looked into it and determined that he didn't commit the crime. Okay, Okay, So and I think that that just is probably a smart thing for criminals to do.

Yeah, just trying to tell the inevitable sort of thing. Oh actually I did this. Well, shit, now we got to look into it.

Because they feel like they may need him, yeah, for something or whatever. Right, Okay, So that was the little the little side note back to the main story. Eight days after the murders, investigators got a tip to look into a teenager named Maurice Pearce. This particular sixteen year old was apparently seen with a twenty two caliber gun at the same mall. Sarah and Amy were at before heading to the yogurt shop the night of the murders.

But so he's saying he knew his friend did it.

Yeah, this is what he was saying.

Okay, okay.

Forrest was then obviously brought in for questioning, but told investigators that he and Maurice and their friends Robert Springsteen and Michael Scott had stolen an SUV the knight of the murders and taken it on a joy ride to San And where was it? I think I spelled that wrong.

I'm still hung up on Michael Spoft.

I know I knew you would San Antinio, I think, but I think I spelt that really weird. Hopefully that was the right place. I don't know how close that.

Is to San Antonio.

Oh okay, yeah, okay, sorry, I butchered it and I guess I didn't anyway, It's underlined and I never fixed it, and I'm like, what the shit does that say?

Is it San Antonio?

Yes?

Okay?

Is that close to Houston?

I have no idea my geography is.

Oh my goodness, someone will tell us it probably is, hopefully anyway, if that's a joy they went on a joy, right, so I'm assuming that it's semi close anyway. This then put Robert and Michael Scott. I don't think all just have to always see Michael Scott on the police radar as well. After length lengthy questioning, Detective Jones and his team dismiss Maurice as a suspect, concluding that he was lying.

So why would he throw his friend under the bustle like that?

Though?

Like what a dick?

I know, I just thought that was kind of odd, but I don't know. He was young. He was probably like kind of intimidated and just like didn't want him. But like, if that's your friend, like.

I don't know, that makes me seriously suspicious of him, like trying to throw the heat elsewhere, you know.

Yeah, his gun was also tested though, and was not a match to the murder weapon.

So, like, would they test the rifling or what I'm assuming?

Yeah, Like, I don't know, I don't know what you test some guns. You're putting me on the rifling.

It's basically the fingerprint of the gun.

Yeah, they tested that and it didn't match.

Okay, Okay.

That was not the end of their story, though. I feel like you think, you think that, you're already thinking it's not but this is probably not gonna end the way you thought.

You think It's not gonna end the way I thought I think.

Yeah, okay, okay. So, although the case was never entirely abandoned, Detective Jones got promoted, and it wasn't until nineteen ninety nine, eight years after the crime, that a new team of investigators would target these four boys now men once again and bring them back in for questioning.

Okay, okay, okay.

So at this point two of them would confess to the killings. Really, Michael Scott confessed to the killings, and Robert Springsteen also confessed to killing the girls and raping one of them. The police at this point were convened that they had their killers. In October sixth, nineteen ninety nine, all four men were arrested, the theory being that the four boys had planned to rob the yolkret shop, with Michael, Robert and Maurice entering the shop while Forrest waited outside

So then you're telling me all four boys committed very horrific indecent acts on these girls' corpses.

I know, because this if you're going in there for robbery and shit didn't go right, and then you act, yeah accidentally I don't know, killed people, would you also accidentally rape them?

Right? And Cleary, shit did go right because they willingly opened the till to give the money, so they.

Got what they went in there for. Like, I don't think the girls would have opposed to just giving them the till money.

Eight four girls and four boys, and especially the boys having guns a learned and lock store, they're not gonna they're gonna.

Give them the money. Yeah, yeah, like guaranteed.

They may fight is when it comes to the sexual assault. Yeah, yeah, and they may not have because they may have had a gun to their fucking head.

So I should note though, that both Forrest and Maurice stayed true, saying that they were not involved. The authorities tried twice to accuse Forrest for the murders, but they lacked the evidence. There was actually no physical evidence linking any of the men to the scene, so all the charges against Forrest were dropped and charges against Maurice were also dropped due to a lack of evidence. So it was just Robert and Michael who went to trial.

So is Maurice changing his story then, because he originally said Forrest did it.

Yeah, but they at that point like it was just kids, like almost like making up shit, right. I just feel like then for them this long later to be like going through this again is just like wild.

I'm not sure. I'm convinced that well, I don't know. I'm almost convinced that the two they have weren't involved and the two that they don't have were.

Yeah, that's kind of where the ones, Okay, the ones that are just like keeping quiet, Yeah, the two that.

Are denying it. Forrest and Maurice, I'm convinced they are involved, and the two they you have aren't involved. I almost feel like there's some sort of like blackmail shit going on where they're taking the fall.

I don't know, We're gonna dive in here a little deeper.

I'm gonna buckle up.

Okay.

Fuck.

So Robert and Michael went to trial, and Robert and Michael were both found guilty of murder. Robert received the death penalty and Michael was sentenced to ninety nine years in prison. And I say Robert was sentenced to the death penalty. He hasn't like received the death penalty. But before we go off and celebrate these victories, this emotional

I think is his name Hector Polinko.

And this rugged interrogation is like kind of an understatement, and I'm going to give you some examples.

Shit, they like beat these kids.

I guess they were, they were at us. So Michael Scott was questioned for twelve.

Hours, holy shit, twelve hours.

On September ninth, nineteen ninety nine. He was questioned again the next day, and questioned again on September thirteen, this resulting in over twenty hours of videotaped interrogation. Like this is a long time to be questioned about something.

Yeah, I've heard like Terrrigos going like eight hours and stuff like that's that's a long time. But they're doing that on purpose to break you. Yeah, but like twelve hours and then back to back like the next day and shit like hold fuck.

But like in my opinion, like because yeah, some would say like you'd break, but like are you breaking because you're like just so fucking exhausted of this shit?

Pretty much that's what the trait do.

Like it's it's I just don't think it's I don't know, I don't know. I'm not in that position, but anyway, that's what happened. A photo also surfaced from Michael's interrogation room, with one of the investigation investigators bringing in a gun to the room and pointing it at Michael to help

Yeah, imagine it was actually like Michael Scott in the office, and.

You can't even just stop thinking about the office, My good lord. Michael had even asked for a lawyer at one point, to which his request was not granted. The detectives left the room, but then they came back in the room continued questioning him. He continued to answer, and they later just said that they thought he was just thinking about getting about getting a lawyer and not actually asking for one at that particular moment, like, I'm sorry, can I.

Get a lawyer? I thought he was just thinking.

I thought you were just like thinking about that ship like that's no. And interestingly enough, detective this Detective Palinko was later removed from the case. After he allegedly cohersed a confession in a different case. Yeah, so, like honest, just like that isn't helpful really, that kind of shit. It's like it's just not helpful. It's not getting anything.

All he's trying to do is get himself more recognition for quote unquote, so solving.

These cases, which I just think is just like it's just a waste of money and time. Now, there was another issue, and in two thousand and six, basically fifteen years after the murders, Robert's conviction was overturned and the following year so was Michael's. Basically, it was found that the courts violated both Robert and Michael's sixth Amendment right

Well, I mean it is possible.

It's freaking possible, I guess.

Or what if she had a boyfriend and just had a little visit with a boyfriend before going to.

Work, they probably would have known that.

Well maybe possible, I don't know, but I mean it is also possible. Yes, I'm just trying to play Devil's advocate and just say, like, just as it is possible, there's a fiftyude, this is also fucking possible. You know, yeah, grasping for fucking straws, might as well grasp but them all it.

However, was soon realized that the prosecution no longer had a case for now against them. Wait for now, it's something that could be revisited.

Oh, like we have more coming out.

No, no, it's totally something that could be always revisited. Oh yeah, yeah. In October twenty eight, two thousand and nine, all charges were dismissed. So basically, there you have it. I don't know, Okay, this is like a tough one for me, Like, do you believe that these individuals committed the crime? So the fact that the investigators were led to them initially and then again led to them ten

I do find it really fucking fishy that the one boy just so happened to have a twenty two at the mall where the girls so happened to be before work, and then when questioned, he suddenly passes, oh, I gave it to someone else and they did it.

It does seem really weird. Do you think he would just be like, no.

Yeah, oh, now I do have a gun, like I stole my dad or something. But him saying no, they did it makes me say he's worried about rifling or some sort of tie back to the gun. M M. That's that's the big trigger for me. He was there where the girls were prior to work, so he knew where they were going and what time all that shit, and he was worried about the gun. That is major to me.

Well, he was there at where the younger ones were, right, yeah, yeah, so I don't know, in a way, it's almost they because they I don't think they were the ones that were sitting at that booth though. So it's like those men that were sitting at the booth, Yeah, you're right, and that one man who you to the bathroom and

I'm it could just be coincidence. It could have just been just two dudes just sitting.

In it could it could have been.

However, there's also a highlightlihood that if it was just too dudes who had nothing to do with it, they very well could have come forward and like oh that was me, Like you know.

I true, Yeah, they they probably would have, really if they had nothing to hide.

Yeah, because I know if it was me and I had nothing to hide, I'd be like, yo, like can I help?

Like that was me there that night, and then just question your whole life of why you look like a shady person.

Yeah. I was just eating fro yo.

Well that's the thing. They weren't. They just were having pop. Oh I was just having But I mean, like, maybe there's thirsty and that was like a place, the main place in that area that was open or.

Something they could Hey, they could have been on a road trip and just like let's stop somewhere just like get something to some sugar in our system. Yeah you want not really? Maybe maybe you got.

Something they could maybe not even realize that that was like the same thing place they were or something really potentially right.

Who knows.

So anyway, yeah, I hope it does because it's it would be really nice for the families.

And fuck those guys who did it.

Because that's I could just brutal what they did in the shop now is a nail salon, is it?

Yeah?

So and there's like a plaque outside in the parking lot remembering because these girls and stuff, so like they're definitely not forgotten. But oh, it's just brutal. And on a side note, I just wanted to say we're behind on our messages on Instagram.

Very much, so behind the life.

We are just behind on life and we do, like we have said, we try to answer people for the most part, right, but we are behind. So just have patience.

Yeah, we will get to your message, we promise, just it might not be right away, yeah, but it will happen.

It will happen. So anyway, until then

Until we catch up and message you back, stay wicked.