The Texarkana Phantom

In the nineteen forties, Arkansas found themselves face to face with a terrifying figure, one that the press would go on to dub the Texarcana Phantom. This individual would seemingly seek out victims at random, often lurking in the dark shadows of secluded spots frequented by couples like their local lover's lane. But in each encounter, though, the unidentified man would be long gone before authorities ever arrived to the scene. This is the story of the Texarcano Phantom, also known

Nicole, and you're listening to Wicked and.

Grim, a true crime podcast. The following material. Listener, I feel like my voice is like extra dramatic this morning. I don't know if I just got like a dry throat or something, but it's like it's Texarkena moodlight murders. Like I don't know, I feel like an old detective in like a nineteen twenties film. It's just like smoking cigars or chain smoking at the scene.

Well, did you notice that it was like pretty smoky in town yesterday? It was it was, Yeah, so maybe that's affecting.

Maybe potentially, who knows. But did you also notice that it is September. We are officially in the bur months Cozy season exactly September, October, November.

Okay, I had no idea what you meant by that, but I'm just like, okay, yeah, the bur months, the bur months. Yeah, but January is also a bur month, and oh for.

That's a different burr. That's just burr. You know, have you ever heard of the Texo can of Phantom before?

No?

No you haven't.

Well, I don't know. Like we always say, I have the worst memory ever, So like I think I probably have, and you know, things will come back, as you understandable.

It is a fairly big case. It's a fairly well known one. Yeah, so we'll be hitting that today. It was an interesting one, uh to research. But before we hit the episode, before we get into the whole like what happened, who he was and dive back to the nineteen forties, we of course have to thank this week's patron subscribers for showing that support over on Patreon. So

So that's awesome.

Yeah, so thank you guys so much for showing that support. I keep looking over here. Sorry, just ignore that.

I was just going to say too, like, as you were kind of chatting there, I think it's I don't know when I like just enjoyed true crime, like yeah, personally, I guess I think I always mostly gravitated to Canadian cases.

Really.

Yeah. I was just thinking back to that because I'm like, there's like some big ones that we talk about and stuff. Then I'm like, I don't know, why do I not know about them? But then I was like, yeah, because usually if I had a free moment, I would kind of look for like a Canadian one. Fair enough, I guess makes sense.

I do know you have a bit more of an affinity to research the Canadian ones and present them on the show when you are doing them. Yeah, but if you were like, yeah, personally, I just enjoyed them or like more interested at home.

I don't know why you'd want to fucking enjoy well true crime. That's closered all.

I think anyone here who's listening to truth this podcast can relate to you in the fact of enjoying the true crime genre, not that you enjoy someone dying.

It's well no, I mean also like that's scary to enjoy something closer home. You know, you think you'd want to away more away from you. Does that make sense?

Yeah, it does, but but it also it's more relatable, more relatable, know the areas and stuff exactly. Yeah, it's like, oh, I I went to that that mall where that murderer used to work. I don't just pulling something out of my ass, but like the picked in Farment, it's like we've driven by where he used to live. Like you know what I mean.

Well, my friend just told me the other day she went to Wells Gray Provincial Park and I was like, did you know about the murders there? So I don't know. Yeah, she's probably was like, yeah I knew, but I don't want to talk about it.

Yeah, probably, But yeah, this is this is an interesting one. It is a mystery. It is unsolved. I will tell you guys that right out of the gate on this one, if it's not as obvious enough by the name being the text a kind of phantom.

Yeah, yeah, So you're ready, I'm ready.

Okay, let's get right into this. Let's do So we're going to go to Arkansas if you haven't figured that out by the intro as well, which is in the United States, and it's going to be during the nineteen forty So we are going back in time just a little bit here.

Now.

During this time, the economy was still recovering from the Great Depression, and it was largely dependent in this area on a lot of cotton, rice, and livestock farming for their economy. Right, it's an understatement to say the least that the state was marked by significant poverty at the time, especially in rural areas. It was also very racially segregated under laws that were strictly enforcing this as well, which

Oh ding dang, Yeah, yeah, they.

Were looking for a little bit of as I said, quote privacy. This was, of course an area referred to locals as Lover's Lane, and it was about three hundred feet from the last row of city homes which is now called now site of the Central Mall. But it was just on the outskirt of the town at the time. So they pulled up the car into Lover's Lane and parked in their spot. And you know, they had some privacy. And roughly ten minutes after they had parked in had

Oh gosh, yeah, I like how you're just so I don't preoccupied with each other like.

You like you got in there, thank you. I really danced around the fact that they were having sex in their car. So both Jimmy and Mary were then ordered out of the car. And I will say there is a very good chance they actually weren't having sex in the car, because you'll hear this next part that will kind.

Of maybe they were just enjoying each other's like company.

They most likely they most likely were just enjoying each other's company, maybe mac in a little bit, who knows. But once they were ordered out of the car, the assailant, you know, they were able to get a little bit of a glimpse of this man at this time, and they got a bit of a look at his face, or at least the mask covering his face, because over his face the man was wearing sort of white cloth mask resembling like a pillowcase with eyeholes cut out so he could see.

Oh god, that's so creepy.

Yeah, And to clarify, there was no point at the top. Very KKK asked, just not the point, okay, yep. So the man then ordered Jimmy to quote take his goddamn bridges off.

Oh no, yeah, oh no.

So at gunpoint, and that that's where I'm like, they probably yeah, you know, because yeah, but at gunpoint, Jimmy did as instructed, and as soon as he did, the man pistol whipped Jimmy and struck him to on the head with the gun. Reportedly, the blows to Jimmy's head were so intense that the sound made Mary think the gun was being fired and that Jimmy was being shot. Relly, Yes, that's how loud the noise was when he was cracked upon the head.

How could he like, I don't know. That seems crazy that you could make such have such force just by you know, yeah, with your arm like that.

Well depending on the gun where he hit him.

And I guess yeah yeah.

So Mary was terrified and in a panic, thinking it must be a robbery attempt, she showed them. She grabbed Jimmy's wallet and showed the man the wallet to prove that they had no money on them, but in response, the man hit her too and then ordered her to run.

Holy shit, Oh my gosh, it's so conflicting, hey, because you're your boyfriend, like you're oh my gosh.

Yeah, okay, but Jimmy now was laying on the ground unconscious, and Mary uh didn't hesitate and began running towards a ditch nearby, but the attacker stopped her and told her, no, run down the road.

Is he going to chase her?

Well, Mary did exactly as she was instructed. She ran down the road and quickly came upon a parked car, so she headed straight forward, hoping someone might be inside and might be able to help her. However, and was empty and was likely the car that the mass man drove to the location, so by the time she noticed that the car was empty and there was no one inside, the mass man was once again upon her. Oh no, and he asked her why are you running? Yeah, why

Yeah, you told me to, your piece of shit.

Yeah. He responded by calling her a liar and knocked her to the ground. Oh wow, this is where Mary would endure the worst of the encounter. Now laying in the dirt, the mass man began to assault her and raped Mary with the barrel of his gun.

Oh frick I was worried about this.

Luckily, the mass man was soon spooped off though he had seen a pair of headlights approaching, and he took off into the darkness. The headlights, though never saw Mary nor the man and never offered any help, but thankfully was enough to give her an opportunity to run for real. So she fled and ran about half a mile to a nearby house, where she woke the owners and got them to call the police. Meanwhile, Jimmy, still back of the scene where he was left laying on the ground, regained consciousness.

Okay, okay, good, and he too.

Was able to flag someone down a passing by car, who also called the authorities. So that's that's a bit of an encounter.

Hey, yeah, so they survived this. I was not thinking that's what was going to happen.

Thankfully the two both survived the attack.

Yes, okay, wow, what a freaking nightmare and a half though.

Yeah so, within thirty minutes, Bowie County Sheriff W. H. Bill Presley and three other officers arrived at the scene, but the assailant was unfortunately long gone. By this point, half an hour had passed.

Yeah.

So Mary was hospitalized overnight from minor head wounds, while on the other hand, Jimmy needed to remain in the hospital for several days to recover from multiple skull fractures that he had received from the pistol whipping.

Right.

Yeah.

Now.

During interviews with the authorities, both Jimmy and Mary provided slightly different descriptions of their attacker. Mary claimed that she could see under the mask a little bit and that he was a light skinned African American male. Jimmy, on the other hand, described the attacker as a tanned white man around thirty years old, but admitted that he couldn't make out the features due to being blinded by the flashlight.

Right, well, I mean it would be very hard to be able to tell. Oh yeah, I mean but also night Yeah, it's nighttime, like they're wearing something on their head, like one of the loves.

And not to mention, they were both hit in the head. Yeah, it's a traumatic experience totally. So the fact that they got any sort of description at all is kind of miraculous.

Yeah. I probably wouldn't have remembered shit. So yeah, that's good for them.

Yeah. Both did, however, agree that the assailant was about six feet tall.

Okay, yeah, I guess that's something more so that you could kind of remember.

Yeah.

Yeah, So this.

Description, though vague, helped narrow down the suspect list at least a little bit.

Yeah.

Regardless, the investigators reported Lee were apparently was a bit skeptical of their accounts, challenging them on their memories of it, and reportedly Mary a little bit more so. I don't know if it's because, hey, nineteen forties and she's a woman, or maybe it's because, hey, you know what, Jimmy's recovering from skull fractures. Let's just press Marry more. I don't know why, but they were apparently pressing her a bit more.

Well, she did have a bit more of an encounter with him though too, Right, that's true. I guess that's true.

So all in, although the police believed the incident was able to be attributed to a random act of violence, which is true, that's exactly what it was, but what they decided to do as a result, it's a little bit lackluster, as they did not pursue any follow up investigation.

Okay, that is an intense crime. Yeah, that needs to be like, that needs to have some attention to it.

Agreed, But also remember the time period that we're in where violence is kind of like the norm.

Well, and I guess to what are they going to do, Like what kind of evidence are they going to necessarily find?

Yeah, they don't have any. They have nothing on them, Like, they don't know who he is, nothing, they have no suspect or anything. So they're just kind of like, all right, that sucks. Hopefully it doesn't happen again.

Huh. Okay, meanwhile, these two have to live their life terrified exactly going forward.

Right, Oh definitely. So, I mean, this attack didn't get much attention from the police, but it also didn't get a lot of attention from public either, So to be fair, it's not just the authorities. Okay, So with a state of how everything was at the time, it was just kind of another incident mixed in with all the others. Basically, However,

Well, I mean this guy got away with it quite easily.

Yeah, he got away with it the first time.

Problem sometimes I feel like when you get away with something, you know, you just go now, I'm raspy, what are you doing? I don't know your next ones. I feel like, you know, oh I can get away with this. I'm gonna go a little further, a little further.

You push the envelope, right, and especially like there's a lot of serial killer cases where when people start pushing it, they begin to taunt the authorities. In fact, even like like giving them calling cards or sending letters and like giving them more information even telling them, yeah, I'm going to attack tomorrow with this, Yeah, like you know, daring them to touch them. Almost.

Yeah, I mean with certain kinds of people, it's like a game for them, right exactly.

And then they get they for lack of better terms, that get off on the idea of how close they are to being caught. But they're not gonna get me.

So yeah.

Now, Richard's car was parked once again on a secluded lover's lane area, and it was about one hundred yards south of US Highway sixty seven west in Bowie County. So Richard was found between the front seats, kneeling with his head resting on his crossed hands and his pockets turned inside out, while Polly was found face down in the back seat. Evidence suggested that Polly had been killed on a blanket outside the car before being placed back inside.

Huh yeah, Okay, that's interesting that well, I mean kind of hiding a little bit of evidence. I guess, maybe not to be found right away if you just put them back in the vehicle.

Yeah, who knows why. So Richard had been shot twice inside the car and Both he and Polly were each shot once in the back of the head. A thirty two caliber bullet cartridge casing was discovered at the scene, possibly from a pistol, and they believe the gun could have been wrapped in a blanket when fired to help muffle the sound of the shot. Another grizzly event would occur at around one thirty am on Sunday, April fourteenth, nineteen forty six.

Is it all like kind of a month apart? Ishu or even less? Really?

Yeah, they're not too far apart. Paul Martin seventeen picked up Betty Joe Booker fifteen after she had performed at a musical event at the VFW Club in Texarkana. Later that morning, at around six thirty am, Paul's body was discovered laying on his left side by the north edge of North Park Road, with blood found on the opposite side of the road near the fence. He had been shot four times through the nose, ribs, right hand, and

Oh okay, the fact, okay that this monster is just like telling them to run and then like chasing them is just so.

Fucked I agree. Now. Paul's car was discovered approximately three miles from Betty Joe's body and one point five to five miles from his own, parked outside of Spring Lake Park, with the keys still in the ignition.

Oh my goodness.

Now. Authorities were uncertain who had been shot first, but Sheriff W. H. Bill Presley and the Texas Ranger Manual T. Gonzalez indicated that both victims appeared to have been appeared to have put up a fierce struggle, which is very clearly evident from showing that Paul was shot through the hand. He was right putting up a fight or at least defensive in some sort.

Yeah.

Well, I mean good for them, right, Yeah, it's gosh, you kind of have to I don't even know what you would do in that kind of situation.

I mean, I can't say I agree with the you kind of have to because I mean, sometimes it's just hopeless, like what are you gonna do? Right? But even if it was hopeless for him, even if he wasn't, say, putting up a fight, maybe he was even just blocking his visual of the gun pointed in his face. Maybe he was just putting his hand up like fuck, I can't believe this is happening. And then he gets shot, Like who knows.

I know it's so hard, but I just in my mind, I'm like, well, if you're gonna die, you might as well go out fighting.

Yeah.

I don't know, but I feel you.

Yeah, but say, for example.

In some situations, though it might be smarter not to do that, I don't know.

Well, what if he's got you, like he's thirty feet away from me with a gun pointed in your face and you're laying on the ground, how are you going to fight back?

Yeah?

Yeah, you can't always no no now. Reportedly, both the young women in these two killings had been sexually assaulted before their deaths. Yeah.

Wow, what a monster.

And I could not find in which regard they were sexually assaulted. I could not determine if there was like DNA, yeah found for example, right, but I was just aware of the sexual assault. Now. On Friday, May third, nineteen forty six, sometime before nine pm, sorry, Virgil Starks, who is thirty seven years old, and his wife Katie, who was thirty six, were at home on their five hundred acre farm off Highway sixty seven east near Sorry, nearly ten miles northeast of Texarkana.

Okay, so they're at home here. I thought they were on like a lover's lane, and I was like, get it. They're like like not older, but like, you know, they're the same age as they are, but a married couple, you know, trying to spice things up. And I thought they were on lover's lamb at home.

Okay, Yeah, No, they're chilling at home.

Okay.

So Virgil was sitting in an armchair, relaxing and reading the local newspaper when all of a sudden, there was a shot that rang out. He was shot twice in the back of the head through a closed double window sitting behind him.

Holy shit.

The glass shattered as a shot rang out through the home. Hearing the sounds, Katie rushed into the room and saw Virgil stand up out of the chair, attempting to get to his feet, but before he could gain his balance, he collapsed backward into his chair once again dead.

Oh my gosh, and they were just he was just sitting in his home, yeah, for the evening.

Yeap.

Just that's terrifying. That's so terrifying, I agree, Like in his complete safe place, you know, Okay with.

What she just witnessed, Katie now rushed to the phone to call the police, but she was shot twice in the face from the very same window as Virgil.

Wow.

Despite being shot in the face, Katie somehow didn't even collapse to the floor. She managed to regain her footing and went to retrieve a pistol from another room in the home, but she was blinded by her own blood that was covering and pouring from her face, so she opted to run out the front door barefoot, and that she did that when she heard someone entering the home.

Holy shit, what a badass, though, Yeah, So she ran across the street to her sister's home, but no one was home, so she continued to a neighbor's where she screamed, quote Virgil's dead, before finally collapsing.

The neighbor grabbed a rifle and fired a shot in the air, both to serve as a warning to whoever this killer was and to smon help from the neighbor by the name of Elmer Taylor, who retrieved his car and helped transport Katie to the hospital.

Did she live? Please tell me she lived.

In total, three men and two women lost their lives to the killer. Katie survived.

Oh, okay, that's impressive shit right there? Yes, Holy heck, how did she even manage that?

I don't know, Oh my goodness.

Gracious, Sometimes peper are just capable so much.

I know, it's honestly baffling what some people are capable of, what they go through, and how they keep pushing. I don't know if these bullets grazed her face, just hit her nose, like hit her jaw, or if they did embed themselves somehow into her brain and she still survived. I don't know the extent of her injuries. But regardless, being shot in the face twice and you're still standing, yeah, and you still.

Live, and it would be painful as fox still, regardless of what was what it was, right, Like, you're fleeting that profusely, profusely profusely.

Yeah, so huh she she managed to survive, Oh.

But still, gosh, that's I mean, she lost her husband.

Just yeah. So with each new murder, the sense of panic in tensified residents arm themselves to avoid going or sorry and avoided going out after dark, you know, living in constant dread of nightfall. Right, law enforcement both from Arkansas and Texas, I keep wanting to say, ar Kansas. Why did I'm sorry, why do you guys spell it like that? Kansas? It's just ar in front of Kansas and it's Arkansas in Arkansas. Yeah, it should be ar Kansas.

Well, I think the English dictionary or vocabulary or whatever, it's interesting there can be like there, but you can spell it like three different ways. Like it's just there's this interesting things about it.

Anytime I like, if I'm not paying one hundred percent attention to exactly what I'm reading, my brain almost wants to kick in and say Arkansas ar Kansas. Yeah it makes sense, but yeah it's Arkansas. So law enforcement both from Arkansas and Texas collaborated on this investigation because I mean, this is taking place right on the border. So with Texas Texas Rangers joining the effort, the influx of reporters from across the nation only added to the growing chaos

Oh wow, that's always amazing to me that people.

Want they want that credibility, notoriety for that.

Yeah, I mean when they haven't done anything. I just it's hard for me to understand.

I think it's a very difficult situation to ever try and understand because like this, I mean, he's a student, so he's he's somewhat of a kid. Maybe he's even in his twenties. I don't know, that's still a kid to me.

But oh showed your freaking age.

Wow.

Okay, anyways, this is married to an old man.

This person, this person, he's at his life end because he's willing to commit this this act, right, He's willing to take his own life. Yeah, so maybe this may be the only way that he's thinking anyone will remember him. So he's willing to take and he's willing to take this notoriety, this terrible thing, and put it to himself so he's remembered, right.

I guess. I mean I feel like I'd rather not be remembered and be remembered in that way.

I agree. I just I don't think any of us would ever be able to understand unless we're in that position.

Yeah, right, So I mean I'm not like I'm not judging him, but I just it's hard to understand, I guess because it's just so it's like I feel like that would be worse, you know, being remembered that way than than how you actually were, because I'm assuming that he you know, he wasn't a terrible person.

Well, I am with you there, But the things that go through people's minds in that situation.

M h, Well, they're suffering too, I'm sure, from like you know, some mental health stuff.

Yeah, they're suffering in ways we could never even understand. So they're grasping for some way to probably be remembered or maybe he's just is a terrible person and idolize someone like that. I don't know.

Yeah, who knows.

But regardless of the fact it was a false lead, and throughout the investigation, in fact, nearly four hundred suspects were.

Examined four hundred, yeah, and.

Over two hundred people were even questioned during the investigation as well. With law enforcement chasing down just as many dead end leads in the case of Paul Martin and Betty Joe Booker, County investigators interrogated friends, acquaintances, and multiple suspects just around the clock. Just for one example, Texas ranger, Manual T. Gonzalez, as they already mentioned earlier, even tried to lure the killers by using teenagers as decoys in

Huh, that's kind of scary, though. Hey, imagine just sitting there waiting, imagine.

Seeing like imagine you're just another person going to lover's Lane and you pull up and you see someone sitting in a car with a mannequin.

Like awkward, wherever floats your both exactly.

It's just a little awkward, all right, you do you We're probably going to go find another spot to park. But yeah. In the wake of the whole Stark murders, the ones that occurred in the farm where Virgil was shot sitting in his armchair for example, With these Stark murder's, law enforcement from across the region were mobilized to assist the investigation. Blockades were set up on Highway sixty seven East.

That's so much work too. Oh definitely, But you do have to think that the couple are the married couple that he he'd attacked, You would think that he almost would know them. Hey, hard saying, Oh, that's sort of what I'm just thinking. I guess maybe he was driving by, watching and stuff.

Yeah, maybe he was just driving by and saw Virgil sit down in his armchair and was like, hey, that's a good shot. It could have been something like that.

Yeah. Yeah.

So by May fifth, a total of forty seven officers were actively working to solve the case. On May ninth, a mobile radio station was deployed, bringing with it twenty Arkansas State Police officers and ten patrol cars equipped with two A radios to help coordinate the increasingly complex investigation that was at hand. Additionally, on May eleventh, a teletype machine, which is like kind of like an early text messaging machine.

Okay, but I feel like with that one too, he wouldn't have had like a lot of time because it didn't go probably the way he wanted, right.

Yeah, for sure. So by March thirtieth, a reward of five hundred dollars was posted to encourage tips from the public, but this led to over one hundred false leads with no valuable clues. The reward fund quickly grew, surpassing seventeen hundred dollars shortly after the Booker Martin murders, and reached seven and twenty five dollars the night of the Stark murders. Within ten days of that, the reward had even exceeded

Okay, that makes sense, actually, yeah.

Though the case still remains a subject of debate among investigators and historians, today, the majority still attribute it to the Texarkana Phantom Killer. Okay, so it is up for debate whether it is even involved in the story or not, but it is mostly assumed to be.

It is so different, though, so different than the other ones.

It is, but then there was no other, like, there's no indication of who could have been. No one hated them or anything. Are you sure as far as investigators found there was no like it was a random act of violence. There were murders happening at the time, and this seemed to fit that random act of shootings. Yeah. So regardless though, because of the murders, hysteria grip tech Texarkana, the media extensively covered the increasingly police or say the

Yeah, so be afraid for your life. Yeah, and that ten thousand dollars I'm assuming was ten thousand dollars at that time, correct, which is a lot of money.

Correct. Okay, So the police were flooded with reports of prowlers and the community took drastic measures to secure their homes, locking doors, arming themselves, even nailing windows shut. Stores quickly sold out of locks, guns, ammunition, window shades, and many other items as a result. As the weeks passed without another murder, though, the intense fear that had Texarkana on edge began to subside a bit. Although the anxiety lingered

Okay, I thought you were just like there was to be another one.

There are no further deaths or attacked linked to the Phantom Killer. Despite extensive efforts to identify the killer, the remains of who this is? Who could be the guy stalking people in Lover's Lane. The identity is a mystery to this day.

Maybe they died, They could have, right, it could be.

It's possible. There are numerous theories. There's numerous suspects that have emerged over the years, but none have been definitively proven to be the perpetrator. One of the most frequently cited suspects is an individual by the name of Yule Sweeney. Now. Yule was a repeat offender with a criminal history that

Huh oh, that's interesting. Hey yeah.

Another suspect often mentioning this connection is an individual by the name of Earl mix Baden or mc spaden. On May seventh, nineteen forty six, Earl's body was found on the Arkansas City Southern Railway tracks sixteen miles north of Texarkana,

Huh, you know, or there could there could have been like people out there, like just what's the word vigilantes or whatever, yea out there trying to like also get this person. Yeah, and someone could like have thought they found him or whatever and killed him.

Yeah, that's true. There are countless other suspects and theories surrounding the identity of the phantom killer. I mean, each with her own different story, and it would honestly take me, like probably a couple hours to cover each of them on their own, But this podcast isn't that long, so I do encourage you guys all to kind of go and take a look at some of the suspects on your own. But these are the most two prevalent ones.

But okay, but that one was thinking that it was deemed that he didn't something, it was deemed to be a false sleeve.

Yes, okay, so despite all these efforts, the true identity of the Texarkana's Phantom remains one of the most mysterious events in American criminal history, and it is possible that we may never know who he's responsible for the terror that plagued Texarkana in nineteen forty six.

Huh.

And that is the story of the texar Kana Phantom, which is just like too bad.

Like I hate that you could be, you know, doing this kind of shit and get away with it. Generally you don't, you don't, but there are certain times that you do. And I just that just like crushes me.

I agree, I really, there was nothing I had to add to that. I agree.

Well, just that someone can do such terrible things and just continue living their life like.

Fuck, yeah, yeah, imagine that guy is still out there today. Well, I mean, I don't know how old he'd be. If it was in the forties, he's probably imagine him at least twenty at the time.

He's probably dead though, yeah, most likely. Yeah, And I mean back then, what kind of it's probably not going to get solved. I mean, it could, it could, but it's probably not because I mean, they didn't have the means they do today to solve things back then.

Yeah, there you go. Wow, I have no theory. Usually in mysteries and unsolved murders like this, I have a theory. I have nothing.

Huh.

I do think Yule is the most likely suspect, but I also think that there would be some evidence to also link him if he was, so I'm also not sold on it.

Well, yeah, the fact that his girlfriend knew things that weren't released, How the hell would she? You know?

That was all it takes is for one rumor to get out, one officer to have a drink with his wife and just say something he wasn't supposed to, and then her go to the I don't know, grocery store and run into a friend and oh, my husband told me this, And then that person is friends with this chick who's marrying you.

All I guess like, yeah, I mean, how many conversations don't tell anyone this? Or I'm not supposed to tell anyone this?

But yeah, things get leaked all the time. Yeah, so to say that it was not released information, are you certain it was not released information?

Well, that's an interesting one.

Yeah, I agree.

Also terrifying the thought of just like being chased to me is something I know.

And then he catches up with you and asks you, why are you running?

Oh gosh, yeah, because also like zombie stuff, when the zombies are like fast and chase you, I just can't, Like, I just can't. The chasing thing is just too much.

Yeah, I gotcha. No, I I'm right there with you, because especially I've gained weights in my thirties and I cannot run very good anymore.

I know. I'm like, I don't know even how far i'd make it, But then there's adrenaline. I'd be relying on that.

I guess probably I'd probably be very like Homer Simpson ask I'd take like two steps and I'd be like, okay, just hold that a second regreath. Oh boy, that's probably how it would play out for me.

Okay, well, I guess we you know, hope you guys have a good week. We'll see you again on Friday.

Are you gonna do the whole end spiel?

I wasn't planned. I don't know.

Are you gonna make me do it?

Yeah?

Okay, thank you guys for being here. We really appreciate it. As always, trust me, I really do mean it. Whenever I say it, I do this spiel at the end every episode, but I do it because, hey, we're serious. Without you guys listening to our show, we would not be doing the show. Still, we would not be here today, So thank you so much. In the bottom of our hearts. If you want to check out any of our links, they are below. I'm gonna leave it at that today,

Stay wicked exactly. Okay, until next time, stay wicked. H