In the last episode of Wicked and Grim, we discussed part one of Ruby Rich. Today we expand further and dive into part two.
My name's Ben and I'm Nicole, and you're listening to Wicked and Grim, a true crime podcast. Warning.
The following podcast and material intended for a mature audience listener discription. I want to start off and just let everyone know there may be some noises from our MIC's today. We have a new micro our phone stands and are trying to get used to them. So if you hear things like this, we're sorry. We are very sorry. We're trying to get used to them. We will do our best to make absolutely no noise with them.
I feel like, well they're tabletop MIC's, so they're I feel like a little bit more sensitive too.
They are. Yeah, So where we got these so we can actually get ready to record the episodes for video and put them up on YouTube. So this way our MIC's are out of our face.
Pretty exciting.
So yeah, so yeah, that we're we're getting really close. We're gonna be recording some episodes here and we'll let you know when it's available over on YouTube. If you want to go subscribe early feel free to check it out. It's Wicked Life link down below. We're doing blogs and stuff over there too. So yeah, we also got to thank some patrons.
We do.
We have two to thank, we do so we have Joe Burrow and Julia Schroeder.
Awesome, Thank you guys, Thank you so much.
We both signed up and are getting that extra behind the scenes content. We just did a little pre show that we uploaded over on Patreon.
It wasn't really that little. It was like thirteen minutes, fair enough.
When we do a pre show, our target is about like ten minutes, just like a little warm up, you know, checking the mic levels and just bullshit and shooting the shit.
We had a lot to say.
I guess, so, I guess so, so you want to go check that out. You could check it out over on Patreon. But I know Nicole is really antsy.
I know the day has come four part two of shit. I forget what's it called, like the Ruby Ridge incident? Okay, I probably would not have remembered that, but anyway, we left kind of like at quite the scene, and this has been all my mind all week.
We did leave it quite the scene, and apparently I got in shit a few times from Nicole because this has been not an easy one for her to get through.
Apparently I had to resist the urge to look up anything.
Did you were you contemplating it maybe.
For like a brief second? Wow, I didn't know.
Well, I'm glad you didn't. I'm gonna do a little quick recap, just like a like a twenty second little like in your face. Here's what happened last episode. Uh So, in part one, we discussed Randy Weaver and his family. We talked about how he and his wife, Vicki, had moved to an isolated ridge which is now dubbed Ruby Ridge,
to live off grid and raise a family together. However, despite a dispute with neighbors and an undercover FBI agent who managed to course Randy into selling illegal firearms, had him in quite a tough spot who was facing charges and refused to work out a deal with the FBI as an informant. This unfortunately led Randy to missing his
trial and seeking refuge in his secluded property. Authorities knew Randy could be ready to fight at any moment and tried to apprehend him, so by doing so, they began intense surveillance and even sent a military reconnaissance team with N sixteen rifles. Fully kitted up in Gillie suits. The team closed in in the home a cabin perched in the middle of their property, and attempted to gain the
family dog, Striker's attention by throwing a rock. The plan worked, and they got Striker's attention and now the dog along with Randy, Sun, Sammy, and a family friend, Kevin, who was living with them, and they were headed out of the house and headed straight towards the concealed men with rifles in hand.
Gosh, okay, and just so that when he missed his court hearing, that was because the parole officer had told him the wrong date though too right correct. Yeah. So see, there's there's so many pieces to this that just seems so almost unfair.
I guess, oh, it's it's a big case. Yeah, and like you say, it is very unfair to say.
Yes, okay, so frig I oh, now that we're here, I'm.
Almost just like, shit, you're just nervous.
I don't know if I want to know what happens. Well, I don't feel like it's going to be good.
No, no, okay, Well, well I'm gonna divulge what happened, and I'm going to tell you if it was good or bad. Well, I'm sure you can hear that for yourself. But here we go. You ready, Yeah, okay, let's do this. So, as the two boys and the dog were headed in the direction of the reconnaissance team, the Marshalls hutting in the bush. They initially the reconnaissance team initially withdrew the
defense into the woods. So the boys were coming out of the cabin with guns and hands and the dog coming as well, and they kind of backed up and headed back towards the bush. So they hadn't been seen yet, but they managed to reach a pivotal wide junction on a trail, and this was positioned about five hundred yards west of their cabin. However, the dog striker was now sniffing about and knowing something was going going wrong or someone was around, so Sammy and Kevin trailed behind him
through this thick foliage. Now, the following events are debated to this day, with conflicting accounts from the agents and the weavers on what exactly led the unfolding events. But we're going to go with the events that are most recognized as truth.
Okay, yes, sir so.
According to the agents, one scout claimed to have doubted quote back off US Marshal upon seeing Sammy Weaver approaching, while another asserted to have shouted stop us Marshal as they approached. Whatever the case, it was roughly a minute later when Sammy and Striker emerged from the trees near one of the marshals, with the dog Striker approaching one of the concealed marshals who is hiding in a bush.
In this critical moment, that very marshal opened fire upon the dog from his concealed position, as he apparently feared Striker was going to attack him, and he fatally shot him all on a whim. No, yes, he opened fired and killed Striker.
Just like that, just like that. Oh my gosh, I'm pissed.
Yeah, the dog, the dog. If anyone knows, Nicole it all you never hurt the animals.
Well no, And they were the ones that provoked the dog.
They were They were the ones who threw the rock at a cabin to get the dog's attention. Yeah, so now the dog is, hey, you have my attention, what's up?
And they shot him and the dog literally has no idea what is going on with anything? Correct, hole just knows that someone's on the prom Okay, oh yeah, I'll keep well.
And not only this, Sammy is standing right there and watched his dog get shot.
Oh, I would actually probably lose my mofal mind.
Striker got shot right in front of his eyes by something that was just hiding in a bush. So Sammy didn't even know who or what shot his dog.
Shit.
He did yell out, quote, you've killed my dog, you son of a bitch, and then he aimed his rifle into the underbrush in the direction from the concealed shot, and he pulled the trigger.
Oh my gosh, okay, that is it's getting wild here. But honestly, like, okay, maybe I shouldn't keep talking. But if I was armed and in situation, I would lose my shit too.
Well, and put it this way, you're probably only assuming that you're next. You don't know who's in the bush. You don't see them. This is a kid who watched his dog get shot and is now in his self defense position because he had no idea who's in there.
Well, yeah, and that dog is like a family member.
Yeah. Now, as I mentioned earlier, the Marshals did allege that one of them shouted back off us Marshall and the other one shouted stop us Marshall, but no one can clarify. It's just these two just saying, yeah, I said something.
Well and to a kid, what does that mean?
Even even if they did, Yeah, even if they did, how do they know if he heard them?
Yeah?
Clearly, probably not because the kid kept pursuing.
But would a ten year old kid also even know what that means?
I don't know.
Like, I don't know. If I would have it ten, i'd be it cool.
I don't know if Sammy's ten. I'm not sure of his.
Age, to be fair, Oh okay, I don't know why I thought ten.
Well, I do know he is. He is a younger kid about that age, but I don't know if he is ten per s. He might could be around fifteen or something, for all I am sure of. I didn't actually look up his age. But with the shots now being fired from two different directions, Kevin quickly dove to find cover behind a tree stump, and he retaliated with a single unaimed shot into the bush. Kind of, there's firing happening over here. I'm just returning fire because they are,
I mean, under siege. We just went over this with Hey, some strange person in the bush is shooting at us. And when Kevin shot into the bush, he hit one of the marshals and killed Deputy US Marshall William Francis aka Bill Degan.
Oh man, is that the one that killed the dog? Or is that a different one?
I wonder, Hey, I'm not too sure.
Okay, but geez, it's dark out. They're like disguised. This is a freaking disaster.
Yeah. So, now, responding to the gunfire upon them, the marshals once again shot in the direction of the boys, and Sammy Weaver was shot in the arm. Now being shot himself, he quickly turned and attempted to flee up the hill towards the house where he'd come from. However, another shot wrung out from the marshals and hit Sammy square in the back and looked him to the ground dead. Seriously, yes, they shot him in the back.
Oh my gosh. Okay, and this is the actual sun right?
Not correct?
Okay, this has just gotten real out of hand here. I don't think this should be okay at all.
No subsequent ballistic analysts later on revealed that a total of nineteen rounds were discharged during the intense confrontation.
WHOA, I mean, I knew something kind of like this maybe would have gone down, but this is brutal.
It's intense. I can't imagine being in that situation, let alone a child or a kid or a teen being in that situation. Kevin understandably is now like scared shitless, so he brought to his feet and he managed to run back to the cabin in the whole aftermath of the firefight, and when he got to the cabin, apparently the cries and screams of the whole Weaver family were like echoing through the woods as Kevin actually told them the events of what happened and the fact that Sammy was now dead.
Gosh.
Randy was apparently so overwhelmed with grief he was rolling on the floor, pounding his fists and even went outside and was firing his gun into the air in a fit of rage. Vicky, his wife, who's kind of like the being the pillar of family strength in that moment, did her best to console her distraught husband and the rest of the family as well.
Wow, well, I mean, they just they literally just killed two of their family members.
They did, Oh my gosh. Okay, So the Weaver family soon managed to actually make their way out of the home and retrieve Sammy's lifeless body. Meanwhile, the agents called for reinforcements and asserted that they were quote pinned down
gunfire and urgently needed assistance. I mean, strangely, despite their heightened surveillance around the property and also being right there apparently pinned down or that's important because if you're pinned down the same spot, you'd probably see you're down, victim, you just shot right. The agents claimed they had no idea Sammy Weaver had died.
Oh, they would have known where they were shooting. I feel like because they would have had I don't know, technology or or whatever to be of a see in the dark and like see their target.
No, this is this is not like in the They did have like night vision and stuff like that that they were equipped with, but it was more so like through the trees and the bush and that sort of stuff was more so the problem. But the problem, a big thing here is they claimed they were pinned down by gunfire. Pinned down means you can't move, You're in this spot, you can't go anywhere, hence why you need backup. However, they did not. No, Sammy died and the family was
actually able to come to retrieve his body. So they did not see the family come up, because they would have shot at them too, and they didn't see his dead body. They were not pinned.
Down, No, and they weren't. No one was armed at that towards them at that moment. Really.
Oh they probably were, But if there was a firefight in the bush and your kid was just killed, I'm pretty sure you're walking out.
But it's not like they're like hunkered down and just like you know.
No, they weren't being pinned down. Yeah, but they claimed they were chase. So the reports of casualties and the Weavers perceived as armed and dangerous. Additional snipers and special agents were dispatched to the tents standoff, in a marked departure from the standoff rules of engagement, which typically mandates firing only when agents face imminent danger, which arguably that one Marshall who shot the dog claims because he feared
the dog could have attacked him. We'll just assume he's right on that, okay, because that's completely up for debate. But we'll just assume, we'll give him the benefit of the doubt, so assume that you can only fire when faced with imminent danger. However, the FBI decided to alter the rules in this scenario. Now now agents and snipers were authorized to shoot quote, any adult male with a weapon if the shot can be taken without endangering children.
That's regardless of any immediate threat to the agents whatsoever. The approval of legitimacy to this charge remains subject of debate. There's some paperwork that says it was never approved, but they did it anyways, And someone some saying that this guy is the one who told us to but he's then going back and saying I didn't. It's a whole convoluted thing. But regardless, that was the situation at the.
Time, and that one boy should never have been shot. Really no, there's no way that that would have been a proved I don't see. I can't see that in it.
There was no immediate threat. His back was turned, he was running.
Yet, Oh my gosh, that just gave me a visual. That's actually sad as well.
It really is.
Oh.
Now, the family was preparing to pray over Sammy's body before they buried him, and they currently had him in the berthing shed, the one that we had talked about in the last episode. So Randy, Sarah, and Kevin were armed as they needed to be, and unfortunately now they became the focus of the waiting snipers who were called
in as backup. So these three were leaving the house to head out to the shed to where Sammy's body was, and as the three approached the shed to morn, a shot rang off through the air and Randy was hit near his armpit by a sniper's bullet. Sarah quickly leapt leapt into action and shielded her father from another shot as they rushed back towards the house, where Vicki, his wife, held the door wide open with her ten month old
Elisabeth in her arms. Now Randy and Sarah made it inside, but as Kevin entered, sniper lown Rouchie fired again towards the open door of the house. While he claims he was aiming for Kevin, the bullet tragically hit another target. First. Heartbreakingly, the shot tore through Vicky Weaver's face, killing her instantly, before it followed through and hit Kevin in the chest.
Okay, so sorry, who's Vicky? Is that the mom?
That's Randy's wife? Yes, okay, as she is holding their ten month old child in her arms.
Holy shit, and it hit her where in the face, so she's gone dead. And then hit Kevin in the chest. And isn't Kevin also a kid? Technically I think would he be considered an ask?
Probably an adult because a little bit of a spoiler alert here, he was tried later as an adult. Okay, so I'm not too certain on it age, but he is not. He is definitely of an adult age, but he's still certainly young.
Oh my gosh, this this does not seem okay, this does not seem.
Okay, No, it's not.
So now the dog's dead, the kid's dead, and now the wife's dead as well.
Yep, and Randy and Sarah were now forced to drag Vicki's lifeless body into the house with her arms still wrapped around and cradling the infant.
Good okay, wow, goodness gracious.
So they laid her down in the kitchen, and due to the family now being pinned down by military snipers in their home, this is where she would remain for several days.
Okay, oh, this just keeps getting worse.
Yeah, they couldn't leave the house.
And literally, oh my gosh, she's just like in front of the family just having this. It's like she's, you know, decome decomposing. Oh. I can't even say it, like I just okay. Oh that's so so bad, it's horrible. Mm hmm. And then they weren't able to lay Zam to rest like they wanted either.
He's currently laying in the shed.
Okay.
So, Kevin, though, was now gravely injured. He had a shot to the chest, and over the course of the following days while he was tended to, he pleaded with Randy to end his pain and misery. Randy, however, refused to give up on him.
Well, yeah, he needed medical attention, I guess he did.
But they couldn't get it. They were pinned down. The only way they could do this was by handing themselves over to the FBI. And who knows what's going to go on. Yeah, yep, now get this though, this is really fucked up. You're going to hate this. After the second confrontation, federal agents armed with radio equipment because remember they had like speakers under this home. They had shit going.
All over right, Oh, so they would know the dire situation in there, Oh they would holy fuck.
Okay, but get this armed with all this equipment, they taunted the besieged Weavers by probing into their daily lives. The following morning, they took to the radio and speakers by saying very loudly to them, quote, we had pancakes for breakfast today. How about you, VICKI, What did you eat today? How did you sleep last night? Vicky? Oh my gosh, isn't that beyond fucked?
That is just almost inhumane? This is this is now. The FBI claimed they didn't know about Vicky's death, but again, they had the surveillance. They had a sniper who shot her in the face. They would have saw it.
Bull shit.
Yeah they would have heard. Yeah, there's no way that they wouldn't have heard.
There's no way.
Absolutely, that is disgusting. I am so fucking disgusted right now.
This is so you're telling me a trained sniper wouldn't know he hit a target, a trained military sniper.
A target that was literally holding a baby.
Yeah, and one that the family had to drag into the house and probably before they closed the door.
Mm hmm man, this is so. I don't know why I was wanting to hear more of this.
This is fucked now. In another odd turn, the agents actually deployed a robot to go up and try and connect with the family. However, the robot was carrying a phone, you know, to talk as well. It was armed with a gun to establish communication. And why the fuck does a robot have a gun?
Well, who's supposed to go out to greet the robot? Because anyone that would, unless it's a child who could still probably be hurt, Like, they're not going to go out.
There, exactly like the whole we were. Everyone inside the house was extremely skeptical of this, Like this is a fucking trap. Even the agents aren't going to shoot us. Why the fuck does the robot have a gun? If I go out there and try and grab the phone, it's gonna shoot me, yeah, or someone.
Like it's because in their mind too, the kids wouldn't weren't even safe.
No, so yeah, uh so, Like they're skeptical because there's even radio reports now going out and like this is news radio reports, right, Like so the news knows about this, and they are saying how Randy had killed a federal agent. But I mean it was Kevin who had shot into the bush in retaliation and self defense and did kill one. So one agent is dead, but they are blaming it on Randy purposely killing an agent.
Yeah, and they did not also probably state that one of the agents killed the kid no who was running away no fear.
Or the mother who was holding a ten month old child. Yeah. So yeah, they're basically suspecting this is a whole trap, and they're like, if we take any anything, it's probably going to lead to our downfall or even a potential death right. And of course, how are they going to paint that in the public's eye. It's just they knew they were fucked. They knew they were screwed. They didn't
know what else to do. But eventually the standoff saw an individual by the name of Bo Gritz who was a former renowned Green Beret, and if you remember from last episode, Randy went through Green Beret training, so Bo was called in to negotiate with Randy. Over three intense days, Bo succeeded in persuading Randy to come down from the mountain home. The breakthrough came when Bo assured Randy of
assistance in obtaining a complete and fair trial. That's what he wanted because he knew if he just gives up, He's like, I'm going to be shot killed. Who knows what they're going to paint me as, I'm just going to be locked away? What about my family? What about my home? All these questions? Right, So BO assisted and ensuring no, you're going to get a fair trial, the evidence, everything, you name it.
Well, I mean I can't imagine that this just amplified for him too, because now his kids there's no one else. Yeah, they don't have a mom.
Correct. So BO did succeed in getting Randy to come down, and Kevin was also safely brought down from the mountain for medical treatment and survived as injuries.
That's good.
On the second day of negotiations, Bo actually contacted an attorney whose name is Jerry Spence, who expressed a serious interest in taking Randy's case. And I'm sure that would have been part of the negotiations of a fair trial as well. Yeah, is I have this individual who's willing to potentially defend you, right, Yeah. So on the day Randy surrendered to law enforcement, he met with Jerry Spence, who Jerry, by the way, is known for his western
courtroom attire, which I absolutely fucking love. I just see him in like in my head, I picture a cowboy hat and a bolo tie and he's just loving life. But more importantly, he's also known for it never losing a criminal jury trial.
Oh okay, so got a good lawyer?
Yes, so Jerry began the meeting. He's not. I mean, he did actually represent him in court, but as of right now, they're just talking about the representing, Like, can I represent you?
Are?
We're going to take this right, okay. So Jerry began the meeting by expressing his disagreement with how the Weaver's political and religious beliefs were. However, he emphasized his commitment to Randy's right to a fair trial, and after listening to Randy's story, he agreed to defend him in court for free.
Okay. So he obviously if he thought that this was a lose in battle, he probably wouldn't have offered to do it.
Probably not.
Yeah, he knew that he had a strong case.
But not even necessarily a strong case though is I mean, I'm sure that was part of it, but a bigger part here, which I'm going to talk about here. I'll do it right now. So this next paragraph I have says in a letter to a Jewish friend attempting to dissuade him from that she's taking the case. The friend
was like, don't fucking take this case. Jerry actually asserted that the defense goes beyond what he's talking about, because he didn't want him to take this case because hey, Randy's a potential racist and all these groups he's a part of and stuff and very radical. Yeah, so Jerry's like, this is beyond the whole radical and racial separatism and everything that it may represent. This was about a whole greater concern of a government losing respect for an individual's rights.
So it wasn't that he was defending him because he's like, we can win this. He's defending him because it's the right fucking thing to do.
Wow, which, honestly, with everything that Randy has gone through, like, thank goodness that he got this big time.
Oh definitely, And for that alone, I want to make Jerry our badass of the day because that is fucking badass.
Yeah.
Not only is he taking this case, he's fighting against the government, he's doing it for free. He also stood up to a peer who's like, don't do this because hey, he's racist against our people. He's like, it's not about that, bitch.
Yeah. I feel like a lot of the lawyers too, probably would have just ran for the hills probably this kind of case.
Yeah. So, the trial of Randy Weaver and Kevin Harris, because Kevin was also being brought to court because hey, he shot someone, right, began on April twelfth, nineteen ninety three, in a heavily attended courtroom in Boys, Idaho. The courtroom had heightened security measures, including metal detectors, X ray machines
and federal marshals who were armed and ready. It was all in anticipated because it was a very potentially heated trial, right, so there could be potential issues, so they wanted to make sure that they were ready for anything that could occur. So the jury okay, but I do have to say, and that's kind of also bullshit because at the same time, it's like, oh, federal marshals are on the stand, so we're gonna have federal marshals defend the court. Now, that's kind of bias, But.
Hey, I did think that, But I was like, I'll just keep listening.
Yeah, so regardless. The jury was comprised of seven women and five men who are arranging from age of thirty one to seventy two years old, including individuals with varied educational backgrounds from high school dropouts to MBAs, so they had quite the diverse jury at hand.
That's good.
In the prosecution's opening statement, attorney Howen and Lindquist portrayed Randy as a racist planning to wage war against the government since nineteen eighty two. They also painted him as a hate filled extremist, emphasizing the threat of violence that he posed to the people around him. Representing Kevin Harris, David Nevin presented a very good self defense theory in his opening statement. He's like, hey, self defense, It's basically it, right.
Jerry Spence, the one that we were talking about, who is our badass of the day, concluded the opening statements and personalized Randy to the jury, seeking to invoke empathy and painted a very compelling picture of Randy as a loving and devoted family man striving to protect his family to lead a peaceful life.
Yeah, okay, good.
Where do you think this is going to go? How do you think it's gonna end?
Up. Oh my gosh. Honestly, I don't have the faintest clue.
Okay, understandable, you're up. I mean, we're up up against such a interesting foe in the courtroom here, the government, right, So.
Yeah, like I feel I mean, I know the way I want it to go, but I feel like it probably won't go that way. I mean, I want Randy to to be acquitted, yeah, like not guilty or whatever, but I feel like that it would be way too good to be true.
Yeah, well, there is a whole lot surrounding this case. One of the things that was happening quite frequent was the government was actually hiding evidence and only bringing it up when it benefited them, and all the stuff needs to be on the fucking table, right.
Yeah.
They would frequently be like, actually this thing and then they're like, what the fuck is this? Like, we need to have all this out in the open. So that was a very uh FRA's dirty it is. It was a very frequent and dirty thing that they were doing in the court. But the government actually started this case by calling us Marshal Larry Cooper a witness to the death of Agent Degan and Sammy Weaver, which also tells me right there. He was a witness to the death
of Sammy Weaver. He saw, he saw, they didn't know he was dead, like, you know, are you fucking kidding me? Clearly you did. Anyways, Cooper testified that Kevin Harris shot Degan first, triggering the subsequent exchange of gunfire. He was the first to pull the trigger.
Oh my gosh, he's just up there lying yep, like under oath. Still yep. Okay, that is not all right.
Now, get this though, in response to a defense request, Cooper appeared in court the second day dressed in the same camouflage uniform that he wore in August twenty first, the night of the shootout, and carried the same gun he had that day. So the whole defense was aimed to make the jurors experience what Kevin and Sammy would have experienced and witnessed. These kids out in the bush see this. Yeah, you're telling me they're not gonna try and fight for their life.
Mm hmm. Well, and the fact that one of them just killed their dog yep, right, which honestly to anyone is a big deal, but especially a kid, I feel for.
Sure, And I mean the dog plays such a big part of this. Like even during cross examination, Cooper struggled he had a silencer on his gun, and he struggled to explain like why the silencer actually had been on the gun at all. But he did admit to having orders orders to lure the dogs away from the Weaver's home and shoot them, removing them from quote the outside of the picture.
Oh my gosh.
So Jerry Spence, our defending attorney, underscored Striker's role by asking this question quote Now, the dog dog's biggest crime was that he was following you. Isn't that true?
Yeah, he didn't do anything. He didn't do a single thing. No, we don't even know if he would have attacked them.
No, we don't.
Yeah, no idea.
No, he provoked the dog to come here, and when a dog comes here, you're like, oh shit, I'm gonna shoot it. Fucking kidding me, Oh my gosh. Another crucial prosecution witness was Agent Faidley, who was an undercover or sorry, the undercover operative who solicited Randy to modify the shotguns illegal and seldom to him that we talked about in the first episode. So under cross examination, Faidley acknowledged the difficulty in persuading Randy into breaking the law. He's like, yeah,
it was fuck. It was hard as fuck, Like I really had to like get him to do this. Damn, you're begging him, I'm sure. And in a pivotal exchange, Chuck Peterson, Jerry Spence's co council, prompted fed Faidley to admit that he received no payment for his undercome. He would receive no payment for his undercover work unless there was a conviction.
Oh are you serious.
Yeah, ultimately, only like really incentivizing him to persuade Randy by any means necessary. And I mean that honestly sounds a lot like fucking bribery to me.
In my opinion, that doesn't seem right at all.
If you convince him to sell you some shit and we get a conviction out of it, we'll give you some money.
Well, it just doesn't make any sense either, because Randy thought that they were friends, right, Yeah, And like anyone in that situation where you have a friend someone you care about, like begging you for something and like repeatedly, repeatedly, repeatedly, like you're probably gonna cave at some point, and like help your fucking.
Friend so that there are certain morals that question here is what to what degree did they go to really coerce Randy into doing this?
That almost makes me, this, this whole case almost makes me like emotional because it just doesn't seem.
Oh, it's a roller coaster. Yeah, it's everywhere up, down, and it's it's just nothing but bullshit on the end of the government. Now. Closing arguments began on June fifteenth, nineteen ninety three, and Kim Lindquist, who was leading for the prosecution, outlined the case's theme for reasons of conviction, asserting that Kevin Harris had murdered Bill Deacan and portraying Vicky Weaver's death as a tragic accident. So he attributed the deaths of Vicky and Sammy to Randy and Kevin
and their desire to attack the government. So to quote him, quote, this whole thing is a tragedy, but the cause of the tragedy was the resolve of the Weaver family, and that translates into murder. So he's basically saying Randy and Kevin are the ones who murdered Sammy and VICKI Wow, Yeah, he's saying they're responsible for their deaths.
And it doesn't make any sense though, because the other people are like highly trained, yes, but yet it was just like an act accident. Yes, that is so messed up, Yes, beyond messed up, beyond.
Like you said, these people are supposed to be highly trained, yet they didn't know two targets were downed. They were unable to actually coerce these people in a manner that's appropriate. For example, they set a robot with a fucking gun.
They lied on them.
They changed regulations in order to fire as they please, and they're lying on trial in under oath on the stand. Manipulative I think so disgusting. Yeah. So the jury deliberations commenced on Wednesday, June sixteenth, with jurors sequestering in a room with green walls. Institutional green walls, very boring and bland, I'm sure, very standard, and they were shielded from, of course, the outside world, in any sort of forces or anything
like that. I'm trying to think of a word. Just wa persuasion, Yeah, there would go any persuasion on one way or another. Television trucks were filling the parking lots and reporters anxiously awaited any updates and were ready to go at any moment. Thirteen tension filled days later, on June twenty ninth, a juror suffering from post traumatic stress disorder and a chronic heart condition would no longer be able to continue serving the jury, which led to their
replacement by an alternate. And now the jury needed to start from the beginning with their deliberations, and they promptly requested to review the entrapment evidence once again. So finally, that leads us to July eighth, where the jury had finally reached their verdict. The pact and silent courtroom witnessed an emotional moment as the verdicts were read. Randy Weaver and Kevin Harris, overwhelmed with emotion, embraced each other upon
hearing the findings. Randy Weaver was acquitted of all charges except for faar to appear in court and committing a crime while on bail release. Kevin Harris was completely acquitted of all charges. When a deputy mentioned taking Kevin back to jail for processing, his attorney, Nevin firmly stated, the hell you will. He's going out the front door with me, and that's exactly what happened. Kevin Harris left that courtroom that day holding his mother's hand out the front door.
Oh my gosh, that literally gave me goose bumps. I'm shocked. Yeah, because I don't know, I feel like what I was worried is that the jury would almost worry about saying that they weren't guilty.
The repercussions.
Yeah, like, because it's the government. What the fuck are they gonna like they could attack them or like I thought some of them might be afraid kind of thing.
No, that's a very reasonable response. Yeah, I mean, it's not like people haven't been claiming to have been stalked or harassed by the government before.
Yeah, so whoa, Hey, I mean I'm shocked, but in the best of ways.
But that's what you were after we talked about it at the very beginning. You're like, yeah, you want to be acquitted of all charges, not guilty, and I mean he's not acquitted at all. But yeah, so, like his whole acquittal, of course, is relief, but the conviction was bittersweet because he did actually have to return to jail. Judge Lodge dismissed the second conviction ultimately, as it had
been proven that Randy committed no crime. During the siege, but he was sentenced to be between eighteen and twenty four months for failure to appear in court, which is well he had that thing earlier in last episode, so having already served fourteen months, he was now set to be released sometime before Christmas, and indeed, in December twenty I'm sorry, December of nineteen ninety three, he finally regained his freedom, and he promptly flew to Iowa to be
with his daughters and spend their heartfelt Christmas together goodness. In the aftermath of the trial, in August of nineteen ninety four, Randy Weaver filed a lawsuit for wrongful deaths of Sammy and Vicki Weaver. The case settled before trial, so it didn't even go to court for three point two million dollars in August of nineteen ninety five. However, the government refuses to acknowledge any wrongdoing in the event whatsoever.
But they paid out three point five before trial. Yeah, I'm pretty sure they know they did some shit wrong. So Kevin Harris also filed a lawsuit, which was settled for four hundred and thirty eight thousand dollars. Gary Spence, who represented Randy, as I mentioned, free of charge, was granted exclusive rights by the Weavers to tell his story.
Okay, wow.
After the trial, the US Senate appointed a special commission to investigate the incident at Ruby Ridge, and what followed was a very comprehensive five hundred page document reporting the government agent during during wrongdoing, sorry, during the siege. So I mean they say they did no wrongdoing, but there's a document from the government saying, yeah, you fucked up. Now. Lastly, astonishingly enough, Lonnie Harochi, the sniper responsible for Vicki Weaver's death,
faced no punishment in the aftermath. Although he was initially charged with involuntary manslaughter and was being brought to trial, a new prosecutor elected to fire a special prosecutor and dismissed the case against them entirely. So he never spent a day in jail, he retained his job, and he did not lose a single day's pay for murdering a woman holding her ten month child as she tried to hold the door open for her family who was fleeing
from a barrage of bullets. That is the Ruby Ridge incident.
Wow. Way to end on a shit note.
There, I know right, it was a rough case. It was a rough one to research, but it was I don't know, it was very different and it it made my stomach churn. It wasn't like it was uh, I don't know what. There's some grotesque, disgusting shit that happens in this world, especially when it comes to murders and a lot of these trials and convictions that we go through,
but this one, it's just, I don't know. It's different in a lot of ways because the government is supposed to be there to help you and they did everything but help them.
It's scary, it is, yeah, because I feel, oh my gosh, I mean, you could get yourself in that situation and there's like there was almost no way out for him.
There wasn't no he was surrounded, he was pinned down, he was shot at, he was just screwed.
Well. They were just eating pancakes for breakfast.
Like, could god, could you imagine being sitting there grieving the death of your life who you cannot even take outside the death of a loved one is just the person's laying there on the floor, as you said, decomposing, Uh huh. And there's speakers under your house being like, Hey, we have pancakes for breakfast today. What'd you eat? What'd you eat?
VICKI you know, honestly, I am sometimes like a little bit hot headed, and I sometimes you don't say.
Not a lot of people know that, but I'm married to you, trust me.
I know I would actually have handled things a lot differently than Randy. So I honestly feel like he did a very good job. Oh he did, because I would have lost my motherfucking mind.
I could see you going like full fucking Rambo, tying a like bandana around your head, war paint, knifing your teeth, crawling through the fucking oh yeah.
And it would still be because of my dog. Yeah, I mean, but they're the dog and then now the sun and like the wife and stuff. But it's just like, I feel like I would have just gone on a fucking.
Rampage, understandably, but I think a lot of people would have.
You're also it's hard to say too, because you're like really mourning deaks and stuff too. And then you have your own like your family. He was the only parent figure at that moment, right.
I think a lot of the reason why Randy kept as cool of a head as he did. Was he knew that if he gave in, if he shot at them, if he went out there, he knew it would have been used against him. And they were already trying to use things against him. The radio was already saying how he murdered a US marshal.
And he wanted to be there for his family because like, yeah, I mean.
Yeah, anything he did would have just given him more ammunition against him and his family.
Like you're saying he's smart, he is. Yeah, he was thinking, yeah, two steps ahead. Yeah, Wow, what a story. This is just like bizarre.
Yeah, you can thank Joe Rogan for me hearing this story. Actually, I was cruising Instagram and there was a clip of him on his podcast talking to someone about the Ruby Ridge incident, and I was like, the what now? And I gave it a quick Google and I was like the fuck.
Yeah, I know, I don't. I don't necessarily feel satisfied right now.
Well, I think there should be some satisfaction in knowing that there was charges that were acquitted, and there was lawsuits filed, and they did get some money in return, though I'm not saying money is in any way, shape or form a retribution for the lives that were lost, but it's something to help you move on. And not only that, it's so fucking good knowing that they didn't try fighting it because they know the fucking wrong. Well, yeah, they know what they fucking did.
When something doesn't go to court and like gets paid up beforehand, there's reasons, yeah.
Very big reasons.
Yeah.
So anyways, hopefully you guys enjoyed this two parter. We got some more one part is coming for you soon. We did a two parter recently and now this one, so we're going to stick to some one parties here for a little bit before we do another one, So give you guys a bit of a breather with that. But if you want to check out some of our socials, all the links are down below. We're very active on YouTube now we've got Patreon. We're doing some stuff over there.
Get the exclusive behind the scenes and extra content like the extra episode at the end of the month every time, so you can go check all that out.
Good job, thank you job on this one. You did really good.
It was interesting. I know when I say that about so many cases, but it's like interesting is such a word that can describe so many of these in so many different ways, and that's exactly what this is. Very interesting, intriguing, and fucking sad, so sad. Anyways, my emotions are beside the point. We'll talk to you guys next time, and until then, stay wicked.