The Murder of Tim Bosma

The story of Tim Bosma, a hard working husband and father, is a haunting tale of an ordinary man whose life was cut short during what should have been a simple transaction, reminding us all of the importance of personal safety in an increasingly interconnected world.

I'm Nicole, I'm Ben, and this is Wicked and Grim, a.

True crime podcast.

Semial listener just question that.

Oh yeah, we're back, We're back.

Vacation is over.

Bright eyed and bushy tailed, We're back.

I don't know if i'd say that. I'm not too sure if I'd say I'm bright eyed and bushy eyed or whatever you said.

Right now detailed? Is that? How what the saying is?

I don't know.

Now, Shoot, did I just get it wrong? Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised.

I don't really care anyways.

And bushy tailed?

Yeah, okay, right, bright eye and bushy tailed, okay, like a cunning fox or a hyperactive squirrel perhaps maybe?

Yeah, yeah, thank you for allowing us to have a little bit of a break.

Yeah, it was much needed. Could have been way longer, if I'm being honest, But I am so happy to be back doing this. Miss missed this, missed you guys. I missed researching. I missed, well, I didn't miss hearing about people dying constantly, but you know what I mean.

Yeah, actually it was kind of It was nice having a break from that.

There was something missing in her life.

But there was something missing, Yeah, there really was. So it's gonna be good. It's gonna be good being back now. And October is wild.

Yeah, Halloween Week is coming up quick. We sat down the other day and we had a one on one meeting on our kitchen counter and our tiny home yep, and for it was probably almost two hours.

We had a two and a half hour meeting. It was two and a half.

We had a two and a half.

Only one hour was in regards to Wicket and Gram.

The other hour and a half I thought it was longer than that. We talked about wicket Ingrim like an hour and a half maybe, I don't know. Anyway, I don't know.

It was a long ass meeting.

But we talked about like a lot of wicked and grim and there was a big chunk of that that was like dedicated to how we're approaching Halloween Week this year.

M h.

So there's some plans, there's some cool shit gonna happen. We're stoked.

Yeah, it's gonna be good.

It gonna be good. You can quote that from Nicole right now, you've heard it here first. It going to be good.

Yeah, I mean it's kind of awesome in the sense that we'll be having a episode coming on the Tuesday, like the normal episode, and then Halloween Week just carries on from that. Yep, and then.

It lands on the Tuesday, doesn't it.

I think so? And then there's also gonna be like a Patreon episode, So it's just gonna be like a shit ton of Wicked and Grim.

And not only is there gonna be a shit ton of Wicked and Grim, but the day Halloween Week starts, guess what else? What Fearful? Yes, season two baby, Yeah.

Yeah, we are overdoing an update on that.

We are. We've had a lot of people requesting Fearful come back and being like, when's it coming back. It's coming back for Halloween Week, Okay, so get ready for that drop. It's gonna be a massive Halloween Week this year.

Yeah, And Fearful is a little bit different than Wicked and Grim in the sense that it's not gonna be really there's not gonna be a new episode every week. It's going to be more seasons and like a binge binge amount dropped at one time.

So with like us, what we do is every Tuesday we release an episode with Fearful. It's basically a project where on the side, when we find the time, we are researching extra episodes and Jacko, being as awesome as he is, he presents those episodes and we get several episodes at once and just basically boom drop it. Here's a season, just like Netflix does to you, and you just binge the whole season and then you wait for season whatever to come out whenever.

Honestly, not healthy, it's.

Totally not It's like an abusive relationship.

Really yeah, So yeah, we have a good case today. Well it's not a good case, but it's a good case, and we have some patrons to thank before.

That though, we do. I'm just gonna pull up the list here, So first and foremost, I do want to thank you guys who are coming back to listen to us right now after our month long hiatus, over one hundred and forty episodes and we never took like a of real break, So thank you for coming back, and thank you to our patrons who stuck around during that, and thank you to those who still signed up even though we weren't rolling out with episode that whole month.

Yeah. So well they're getting two episodes. Okay, so they're getting our normal episode dropped today Tuesday, ye, and then two Patreon episodes. Yeah, that's a big deal.

Two Patreon exclusive episodes are getting dropped this same day, so they're gonna be uh rocking three Wicked and Grims today.

Yeah.

So the list of individuals who are oh so awesome over on Patreon that we got to thank We have Bethany, we have Maya, Gwyneth Douglas, Mercedes Parrot, Kristin Lehman, Scarlett Ross, Charlotte Patrick, Melissa Leva, and Kay Smith. All those amazing people signed up over on Patreon and are supporting us there. So thank you so much.

That's a good list of people.

It is some awesome people over there.

Yeah.

I don't know about you, but I'm ready to dive into this case. Like now I'm excited.

Oh yeah, and I'm presenting today you are holy shit.

Yeah, that that time off got us some availability for Nicole. Yeah, some episode research done, so.

So we're back. I'm back, let's go. This might be like a freakin slippery slope because I haven't done this in a while, so you know, it could be a Donnelly repeat if you know, you know. So, yeah, this is a Canadian story. This I'm going back to my roots of you know what. The beginning, I was like, I'm gonna do mostly Canadian stories. Yeah, and so I'm doing a Canadian story.

I'm stoked for this one because this is one of those stories where it's like it needs to be a staple in the true crime world. Oh yeah, the more that we talk about this case, I think the better. It's not only good for, of course, the victims, but it's good awareness for everyone out there listening.

Mm hmm. It was covered pretty extensively nationally, like within Canada. I'm not sure how much it was. It was covered internationally, so it could be a new case, but it's also a newer case in comparison to some of the cases we've covered. I feel like any case over two thousand is new ish, And I don't know if that dates me, but that's what I feel.

I think it dates you because I mean, that's twenty that's a twenty three year time period.

Too, sha, So to sche that's young.

Like some people with like a twenty five LIFs like a life sentence or whatever, like they're they're almost like it.

Oh you know that's disturbing. Yeah, okay, So we're talking about Tim Bosma today. So Tim Bosma was a hard working self employed contractor. He was a husband and a father who lived in Ancaster, Ontario. He grew up in Hamilton in the Hamilton area of Ontario and was born on July twenty third, nineteen eighty. He was known for his strong family ties and as I feel like you have to when you're an entrepreneur because the hours ain't short. Had a passion for his work.

That's good.

He was also passionate about his hobbies, which included motorcycles. Tim married his lovely wife, Charlene, in February of twenty ten. Oh that's actually the same year we got married, isn't it It is? Yeah, wow, And the happy couple welcomed their first child, a daughter, later that year in December.

That is not us no, thankfully.

Tim's role as a husband and father was central to his life. His wife Charlene has spoken about their closer relationship and the joy they found in parenthood. They shared the responsibilities of caring for their daughter and building a life together, as many people do. The family, though they lived paycheck to paycheck, if you will. They were a young family and at the time money was a bit tight. I feel like now that's even more relatable now because

Yeah, it seems like it's just gone up exponentially while everyone's pay has stayed basically stagnant.

Yes, So it's actually a bit disgusting, it really is. So them living paycheck to paycheck led them to decide to list their two thousand and seven black Dodge Ram pickup truck in twenty thirteen, as the repair bills were getting to be a bit costly. They hoped to find a buyer who would appreciate the vehicle and ensure that it went to a good home. I feel like you,

Yeah. I can respect that.

Yeah. An online ad was placed on Kajiji listing the truck for twenty four grand, which would help the family immensely so when they got a bite. On May sixth, Tim rushed home from work to meet the Perspective buyer, who wanted to see the truck. By the time the Perspective buyer arrived at the Bosma residence, it was quite late, like just after nine to twenty pm. Late.

Yeah, see, that's that's it's a little too late for my liking. I'm not sure if I would accept someone coming over, a stranger coming over my house at that time.

But then they also had like twenty four grand on the line, right, so they're like, true, I want to be accomminating and maybe this will just be like an easy cell and then we get our paycheck.

Yeah, it's easier to say in hindsight. Yeah in my seat. So yeah, you're right.

But I know if it was dark, I'd be like, hell no, which it probably will. I hate the dark. I like run around in the dark because I'm like, I don't want to be out here.

You're the type of person to like be in the basement and turn the light off and run up the stairs.

Really quick one hundred and ten percent.

See, I'm the type to turn the lights off and walk slowly up the stairs. But panicking inside, being like, no, it's okay, okay, just walks over, you got it. There's no one, there's no one that you know what I mean.

No, I would get out of that situation as fast as possible.

I act calm on the outside, but I'm screaming inside.

So this perspective buyer. He strolled up the driveway. He wasn't alone though, he had a friend, and he told Charlene that they had been dropped off down the street. So they just kind of like walked up the street and then were there. And it's kind of weird, right, like that's that's fucking yeah.

Well I think weren't they supposed to be dropped off by a friend and the friend was going to grab them coffee or something like that.

I don't know all I'm not sure about the coffee part, but all I knew is I mean there was no vehicle, Like generally, when you're going to test her have something, you'd show up in another vehicle. Yeah, you'd park it in the driveway and then yeah, I.

Do remember there being a vague excuse on why their friend dropped him off like a few blocks away or something, and they walked over and it seems to me that he was going to coffee. He was coffee, He's going to Timmy's. I literally was going to say, I'm pretty sure he was headed to Tim Horton instagrab him coffee or or something like that. Boy, But it was such a minute and weird detail. I don't think MANYEAHO will talk about it.

Yeah, well, it makes sense though if it was Timmy's. So it all seemed a bit weird. But Tim and Charlene had chatted prior to their arrival that if they wanted to do a test drive that Tim would go with them. They had a lot of money to be lost if the truck, say, didn't return from said test drive. Yeah, and of course, although it was late the perspective buyers did request to take it for a spin.

Well, I mean understandable. Have you sort of used vehicle? Makes sense?

Well, I mean yeah, it was like I mean, that's it was a bit of a it was a bit of a penny, So it makes sense that they'd want to kind of take it for a spin before they decided if they want to invest in it or not.

Right, Yeah, totally.

So at some point though, Charlene realized they'd been gone for longer than she expected. At most, how long would a test drive take? Like, what fifteen minutes? Maybe half an hour?

Yep, yeah, something like that.

But Charlene also couldn't get a hold Tim on his cell phone. So when she couldn't shake the feeling that something was wrong any longer, I think it was about an hour or so, she decided to contact the police. Minutes turned into hours, and hours turned into days, with Tim still not returning home from the test drive. This was very unlikely behavior from him to not stay in touch with his family. He was super family oriented and connected to them. Tim was declared officially missing by a

I can't imagine not only how that wife feels, but how the daughter is feeling too, in the whole family.

Well, the daughter, Yeah, she's two, two.

Years old, she's probably like she's at that point where she's able to communicate. Oh yeah, she's probably wondering where daddy is.

Yeah, Like that's really young.

Yeah.

The initial steps in the investigation involved interviews with family, friends, and witnesses, all aimed at piecing together Tim's last known moments. They wanted to establish a timeline of events and any potential motives for his disappearance. They examined Tim's phone and communication records to determine if there were any calls or messages that could provide clues about his whereabouts or contacts

This is one of my favorite part of any true crime case is when the community fucking rallies up like this. It's absolutely incredible because if I'm being honest, researching so many of these cases, I lose faith in humanity so fucking easy, Yeah, because there is such fucking scum out there.

Yeah.

But then that again, that little bit of like fucking ray of sunshine shining through is when stuff like this happens, it's like the community is behind it, they want to help, they want to find them.

It's like because that's when the support really shows through. Right, So, like Charlene, I'm sure would have just had she would have been just completely devastated but then been able to to move forward because she knew, like all these people were helping her and yeah, and you know, 'rall raw, like let's find Tim.

Right, Like I even picture like everyone doing what they can, Like the little old lady down the street who can't join a search party or anything, but coming over with like a cast role she made for her and stuff to like, at least you don't have to cook dinner tonight, and I made this for you.

I'm sorry for well, yeah, because she also has to think about their daughter, right, Yeah, exactly, So I mean she needs to be strong for that. So that's tough. That's like an added level. Yeah. On May tenth, twenty thirteen, police announced they had located Tim's cellphone while searching an industrial area and released updated descriptions of the two suspects. The following day, they arrested their first suspect. Fuck yeah, Dylan Millard. Fucking Dylan fucking Dylan is right, this asshole.

So I wasn't gonna say much about my thoughts on Dylan because I didn't want to give.

Away hearing like he's an asshole.

I didn't want to give too much of the story away yet because it was like, oh, maybe he's you know, a roung culprit or something, but no, no, yeah, he's a fucking douche commy, oh.

So big time. And you know, I'm not going to say that. We'll get there. So he was charged with forcible confinement and theft over five thousand late Saturday morning on May twelfth, twenty thirteen. Tim's truck is finally found. This kind of gave everyone a sense of, i'll call it false hope that maybe Tim, you know, would be found next. The truck was found inside a trailer in the driveway of Madeline Millard's house. This is Dylan Millard's mother.

Yeah, this part sucks.

It wasn't out in the open for all to see, but it was rather tucked away in the trees as if it was hidden. What it was was an animal incinerator with the words the eliminator displayed across the side.

Yeah. I can't actually being those officers discovering this because you know right away in this you know, you're like, there's there's.

No question, you fucking know, you know, like you just your heart would just sink.

Yeah to quote you three seconds ago, you know.

So the incinerator had the capacity to burn not only a at like animal remains, but also other evidence and potentially human remains. Yeah.

Those things burn an extreme fucking temperature. Yeah, you put something in there, it's gone.

And it's uh it's a pretty price too. Those things are not cheap. So upon further inspection of the incinerator, that's exactly what they found. Traces of bone fragments and ash which were sent off for forensic analysis, and sure enough, the remains belonged to Tim. All hope was lost. Yeah yeah, Millard's previous charge was officially changed to first degree murder. On May twenty second, the day of Tim's memorial, police announced they had arrest is a second suspect, twenty five

Mark Pizza Schmidt's Smick.

I think it was Smith.

He's a piece of Schmidt's smick.

So Mark Smick formally where the fuck am I? Okay and formally charged? Sorry, oh okay, fuck. They arrested him, and the following day he was formally charged with the first degree murder, good God.

And being a piece of schmich Smick Smitch.

Unlike Millard, Smick came from a middle class family. He'd a criminal record involving petty offenses such as drug possession, driving, impaired mischief, failure to appear, and breach of conditions. He sold drugs and cigarettes for a living and occasionally worked odd jobs in Millard's aircraft hanger. I don't really want to spend a lot of time talking about these two assholes, but to cover the case properly, we need to admit. Unfortunately.

Just keep laughing at his last name?

Did I just do something wrong again?

No, I've just worn out bad joke and I'm trying not to say the case missed. I'm still finding it funny.

Oh, You're gonna probably for the end. So he kind of idolized Millard, and it was probably because I'm assuming like Millard's money.

I'm most likely.

Because I don't think Smick is a very smart dude.

He doesn't sound like it.

By twenty eleven, the pair had grown closer, with Smick and his girlfriend moving into the basements suite of the Millard's family house. In twenty twelve, Mallard, as you probably thought, is a bad egg. He would arrange for Smick and other friends to accompany him on in quotation missions, basically night excursions to steal shit that Millard could have easily just purchased, but he liked the thrill of it.

Did he really call them missions?

Missions? It was? They were missions?

What is he? Eight years old? I singing Mission impossible? Creeping through the dark.

Oh and it's so it's like so it's it's almost more maddening in a sense because he could afford these things, and he's going and stealing stuff from people that A probably don't have near as much money as him, b who like worked really fucking hard to probably buy said things.

Yep.

So like see, you're just an asshole. Like I'm pissed with this these people.

He's doing it just simply for the thrill and enjoyment of taking from someone else. Yeah, someone else who's earned it.

Like that is not okay. That is not okay. The disappearance and discovery of Tim's fate was met with shock and grief by the community and really the nation large, and was obviously a critical turning point in the investigation. The forensic analysis conducted on Tim's remains would later confirm the cause of death to be a gunshot, a gunshot wound, and provide valuable evidence for the prosecution's case against Millard

Well, I'm not too sure. I do want to stop on one detail that I don't think it was his remains that identified the gunshot wound because most of.

It was in the truck.

Yeah, his remains were, like I think, the DNA was pretty much almost completely gone too, burned away. But it was the truck, the DNA within the truck that proved that it was a gunshot.

Because to be honest, some of the articles say that an incinerator, like it wasn't even for sure Tim's, but it was kind of like assumed.

Yeah, so well, I do remember them also talking about with the truck because they, like you said, it was partially stripped and stuff. It was also pressure washed.

Right, and there was even remains of Tim's I think like underneath the undercarriage.

That's where they found most of DNA because they pressure washed a bunch of the inside and all the blood and stuff ran down underneath the truck and was dripping off, yeah, and dried underneath.

Yeah, it's really disturbing. Yeah, if you didn't realize, Ben actually knows a lot about this case too, because I mean it's not that old. It's Canadian. Yeah, I mean we remember it happening. So it was now time to get justice for Tim and his family. The trial didn't begin until February twenty sixteen, and it was a high

Right right, that's what they specifically said.

Okay, so they knew that this that his body was at the farm.

Yeah. I forgot about that part because wasn't the toolbox like part of the trailer or something that housed the burner? I think, oh, I'm not sure. I can't remember it. Don't quote me on that, but I think that might be part of it there, Okay.

They also had video evident showing Tim leaving with the two suspects on the night of his disappearance, as well as footage of the suspects driving Tim's truck, along with evidence from the incinerator and witness testimonies. Because something I didn't even put in there, because there's some like to cover a case in one episode is sometimes kind of hard.

Yeah, because after I think they shot him or whatever the they went, Yeah, that's where they went. So you then told his employees to basically fuck off for a day while he dealt with it.

Yeah, Yeah, like unbelievable. Yeah, while the exact motivation, whoa was that? Even English, the exact motivations of the accused can be challenging to prove. The prosecution argued the following motives during the trial. So there's a couple theft of the truck. So one of the primary motives presented by

Which kind of makes makes me sick to my stomach when you really analyze that situation. Yeah, how much was it that they were selling the truck for? Was it twenty five or twenty four four grand? Twenty four thousand dollars? So basically they valued Tim's life at twenty four thousand dollars.

Oh my gosh, and he was a dad and a husband and right a son.

They're like, instead of instead of me spending twenty four grand, I'm just going to kill you instead because I want to keep my twenty four Yeah, so his life isn't even worth that to them, Like how fucking disgusting is that?

It's disgusting? So theft of truck financial gain, I guess you could say criminal lifestyle.

They just enjoyed this being pieces of schmidch.

Control and manipulation, opportunistic crime. Kind I feel like that's kind of the same as, uh, criminal lifestyle, right, the opportunity just presented itself and then preventing identification being that Tim could potentially later identify them, Right, So they kind of got into thick at this point, like what are they going to do? This? Guy like really knows what they look like.

Yeah, we're taking your truck. Get out he's just going to report us.

Yeah. The defense teams countered these arguments and maintained that their clients were innocent. Both Millard and Smick maintain their innocence throughout the trial, denying any involvement in Tim's murder. Their defense teams argued that they were unaware of any criminal activity and were simply just on a test drive with Tim. They challenged the reliability of the evidence presented and questioned the integrity of the forensic evidence, suggesting possible

Yeah, just because there's not eyewitnesses though, it doesn't when is there, right, But evidence still says shit, Yeah, you put your boot in the mud and then you stand next to the mud. Someone's gonna be like, oh, you stepped in the mud. You didn't see me, do that? Dude? That's your bootprint. There's mud on your shoe right there, Like I can see your tracks leading over to where you're standing. Yeah, but you didn't see it.

I know. I would. I feel like you could say nine out of ten, like, would the person actually have ever been seeing murdering someone?

Nine out of ten dentists recommend that these guys.

Shit. Okay, I wonder if that's even I use his booking name, but it is one.

It's just funny.

So ultimately, is this where I am? Yep? Ultimately, the jury found Millard and Smidt guilty of first degree murder in June of twenty sixteen, accepting the prosecution's case that the motive behind Tim's Tim Bosma's murder was rooted in criminal intent, particularly the theft of his truck. They were sentenced to life in prison without the possibility of parole for twenty five years. The arrest, trial, and convictions of Millard and Smith provided a sense of closure and justice

There's more? Do tell hum?

And again, I'm only going to touch on these things because this is Tim's story. But there were additional sentences added for additional crimes that these two assholes committed. Oh, Tim's life was not the only life that they took.

Really, really, really, I did not know this part. Holy fuck. Okay, I don't think so, okay bell.

In December of twenty seventeen, both Millard and Smith were convicted of the murder of Laura Babcock.

That name rings about.

Laura and Mallard dated for a time. She was lasting alive in July twenty twelve, so before Tim's murder. Her remains were never found, but it's believed they had also seen the incinerator as Tim's had.

Fuck.

Millard and Smitch were again sentenced to life in prison and the parole oh with the eligibility period of twenty five years and to be served consecutively. So that means that the previous sentence they were like adding twenty five years onto that, so they would both have fifty years and not be released prior to twenty sixty three. On December, weird, I was just.

Kind of like Matthew in my head and like thinking, I was like, is there a bot or something coming? But no, okay.

On December eighteenth, twenty eighteen, Millard was said sentence to life in prison for a third time. This time he was found guilty of taking his very own father's life. Wayne Millard.

Okay, I did hear about this one.

Yes, Wayne was found dead on November twenty ninth, twenty twelve, from a gunshot through the eye, with his death initially ruled as a suicide. This third life sentence was also to be served consecutively along with the other life sentences handed to him, meaning that Millard would serve a minimum seventy five years in prison before he would be eligible to apply for parole. He would be one hundred and three years old.

At the time, so he's gonna rot.

Just a minute, though, I wanted to talk about his dad for a sec because it's interesting. Something I read is that if someone's like committing suicide, that they generally wouldn't have pulled the trigger like with it facing them in the eye.

Because in their looking at it.

Yeah.

Yeah.

And then also something I'd read is that the gun that was used was actually like in like a Lulu lemon bag tucked away like behind the bed, which would make no sense that it would be suicide at all.

I want to know another really interesting fact about suicide. The reason why I knew that he wouldn't have shot himself in the eye because he's looking at it. Yeah. People who jump off buildings or jump off bridges or anything. They'll take their glasses off first.

Oh okay, so.

Usually where they jump, their glasses are laying there because they don't want to watch. They don't want to see themselves fall.

Oh that's so sad.

They take the glasses off, put them down, and they jump and they close their eyes.

I've also, I mean, there was something in town that had happened at some point too where someone they they had committed they were committing suicide, and right before they did it, they like put their coffee down. Yep, just like, oh my gosh.

Yeah I heard about that too.

Okay, so one hundred and three year three when he was able to apply for parole. But that's obviously far too good to be true, is it not. This is going to piss you off.

Back, No, here we go, all right, okay, cold one and.

There's like nothing you can do about Wait.

Wait, I'm mentally preparing myself. I need to take a sip here.

I might backlash, backlash for saying this, but this is like, this is this is Canada. I feel like being real soft. A Supreme Court of Canada decision in twenty twenty two struck down consecutive parole ineligibility periods as unconstitutional. What meaning that Millard and Smith respective seventy five and fifteen years that they had have now been reduced to more than no more than twenty five years before they can apply for parole. They will now be eligible for parole in

Lay.

Fuck yeah. The ruling said consecutive parole ineligibility period shook the foundation of criminal law and in and were incompatible with human dignity. But the decision was criticized by victims' families, and rightfully so. In my opinion, victims' families feel it denies individual justice to each person killed by a multiple murderer.

It does, and it also promotes a murderer if say they do murder once, maybe just had a panic or something, Well, I did it once, Some might as well keep going now if I get caught, I'm going to serve.

Yeah, and like, also, because how much money did they did we as taxpayers or whatever have to pay for those other freaking trials When it was just like, oh that doesn't matter, Like that's bullshit.

Okay, I have one fucking thing to say to Canada the Canadian government right now, and I'm going to say it as a fucking Canadian to Canadians.

Come on, I know, well, that's why I was like, that's a bit soft, like that's that's it's not okay.

So that was like the most polite.

That was really. I was actually a bit worried about what you were going to say.

That's why I did it. Some Canadian the Canadian arguing I didn't.

Look at you when you were saying that, because I was like, what's he gonna say? Okay? So, Laura bab Cock's mother said in a statement, these judges believe that it is cruel and unusual punishment to give a person a sentence that leaves them no hope for the future. We have no hope. Our family and friends have suffered the loss of our dear daughter Laura for over a decade. The grief and heartache are no less now than when

Good.

Yeah. Tim Bosma was portrayed in the media as a loving husband and father which generated empathy from the public. His family's emotional pleas for his safe return resonated with many many people, and his story was relatable because the majority of us, at some point in time have met with a stranger to sell an item. The case prompted discussions about personal safety, particularly in the context of online transactions.

Yeah. Well, do you remember with our home that we had before we bought the tiny home. Yeah, it was a relatively new build.

Oh god, oh god, and.

There was a lot beside us where the builder was going to build another home. Yep, these people knocked on our door.

It's actually a shock that Ben is alive right now, just saying.

These people knocked in our door. It was a nice couple and they're just like asking some questions about the builder and you know, the house and what we think. And I just like, you guys want to come in and take a look around. You can like see the house, go in the basement, cross space, whatever the fuck you want. I'll tell you all about the house. So it calls off at work and I'm at home with these strangers just coming into the house looking.

Around, and I think I came home and was like, what the actual fuck did you?

They were super nice though.

Yeah, but also they were just like case in the joint probably, and we're like, we're gonna break in and steal this and this, and they didn't. Well frick even even this morning, I woke up like half an hour before the alarm to a fucking doorbell ringing and we don't even have a fucking doorbell. So like this was in my dream and I was like, oh my gosh, I it's six thirty in the morning, Like who is ringing our doorbell? And then I was like I'm not answering it, Like that's what goes in my head.

Yeah, fair enough to be, to be faul fair. That was before the podcast, in my start of prime research and stuff too, so I had become a lot more cautious since.

So would you do that again?

Probably?

Are you serious?

We already did. In the tiny home, we had someone else to come look at our tiny home because they were curious about tiny home. Yeah, that was only like a year ago.

Okay, moving on. This newfound awareness transcended the low community and reached a national level. It led to discussions on national safety guidelines for online transactions, inspired educational initiatives, and spurred policy changes amid or aimed at enhancing security and digital transactions. Sorry, you keep looking at me funny.

And I was just like you're telling me a story.

The murder of Tim is a haunting tale of an ordinary but extraordinary man whose life was cut far too short during what should have been a simple transaction. It's a story of profound loss and resilience, and it showed, like Tim's family in the community's true colors as they stood together. As Charlene said, it was just a truck, a stupid truck. Charlene founded a charity in memory of

It was just a truck.

It was just a truck.

And do you remember why he wanted that truck?

In the first place. Yeah, no, I never came across that.

Why the dude was actually after the truck, Oh Millard? Yeah, Why Millard was after the truck because he wasn't for parts or something. Wasn't for parts. Well, he was like rebuilding another one or something like that. But he basically wanted this specific truck because it's like gas mile race

Right, Okay that part rings a.

Bell, yes, And this Dodge pickup truck was the truck he decided he needed. So he just wanted this truck so he could haul his race car so he can go race.

Wow, And so he.

Decided to steal one instead of buy one. Yeah, and yeah, there were I think there were parts and stuff because he was gonna like mash some different ones together, like build like basically build the truck up again, make it, make sure it was good for the road, right.

Yeah.

But yeah, he basically just like, yeah, I'm just gonna I'm gonna go on a race and I don't want to steal someone's truck and kill them so I can go race my race car with Daddy's money.

And I don't have the name of the person that they had the test drive with before, but they were within the test drive, like these two assholes found out something about him, like I think he's like ex military or something, and so they had they that scared them off because if it wasn't for that, they probably would have done this to him.

Yep.

So, which this story is just it's fucking haunting to be honest.

Oh yeah no, this this ship is bananas.

Yeah.

Anas.

This is literally one of like the reasons why I just like have trust issues is this story. It's probably the start of it. Honestly, this was kind of a big deal because it was like holy shit, like people might not even nest I mean they would have thought about it, but not to this extent before they went to like sell a vehicle.

Yeah, fair enough, because I mean, like we all grew up with like, hey, don't meet strangers, don't get in a stranger's car, like all this sort of stuff. It was like almost like hypothetical at a point, and then all of a sudden, it's all across the news. This dude got into a vehicle with a stranger, his own vehicle, but a stranger was in his vehicle with him, and he fucking killed you.

Like, is what what you even do? Like I don't even know how people go boat sounding vehicles nowadays then, because how would you do it without having to go on a test drive with them?

I would honestly probably just let them go on a test drive solo. If they sell the vehicles insured, and yeah if they if they steal the car, they steal the car, you report them. Whatever.

Well, we saw the vehicle like what two years ago.

Yeah, I remember you.

I think were at work, but they came over to look at it and they like went in, and I thought they were just like trying it out and then al sudden they just like drove off and I was like shit, yeah, like okay, but they just went like a tiny bit down the road, but they didn't say anything, and so it is. It's bizarre, but I would prefer that then, like me also being in there and them just like going, you.

Know, yeah, no fair enough. And when because they decided another day, they're like oh they called back like okay, yeah, we'll buy it. Can you like deliver it to the house, right, Yeah, So then yeah, I think I took time off work to drive with you, to be at the house their house with you.

Yeah, because yeah, because yeah, they were also giving us money and stuff, and so yeah, it's interesting. Selling stuff is interesting.

You had to bring muscle with you, is what we're saying.

Yeah, which honestly is probably It's never a bad idea to be overcautious in my opinion.

It's definitely not. Nope, safety first.

Right from the from the ex safety guy.

Yep, well, good job in this episode. It was nice to actually be back and have you do an episode.

While it has been a lot been while since, so you sorry, wow, keep going.

I don't think anyone wants gon to keep singing. I am not a good singer.

So, oh my goodness. Okay, well now we're gonna we're gonna log off of this and we're going to record to Patreon episodes. What she said, thanks so much for being here and for allowing us. So many of you were just so kind when it came to us having a break for like our mental health and just a little bit of a reboot. So we really appreciated that.

Yeah, that mental lots. We had some kind messages and comments and all that sort of stuff, and it was really nice to see that you guys are not only here to be like, hey, crack the whip and give us episodes. It's like, no, you're you're here kind of like as a community with us, and you're backing us and you're here for what we need too. So that meant a lot. Thank you.

It was really nice. Yeah, okay, go on your spiel. Do you remember what it is? We haven't insta Facebook, website, YouTube.

Patreon, keep going. You got the spiel? Apparently, go for it.

I don't even know, but check out our website. Everything is probably linked on there. I don't even know what it is. Wicked and Grim podcast dot com.

I think it's just Wickedangrim dot com. Our emails Wicking and Grim podcast, but I'm Wicked Grim dot com.

Is it gonna come up? Okay, well, oh it comes up Wickedangrim dot com.

There you go. I'll give this spiel. Then you can go ahead and check our website Wicked Andgrim dot com. We got social media's like Facebook, Instagram. We do have Twitter that we don't really use it. To get back on that. We are going to be humping out YouTube here starting this month. So I know we've said it before, but we are hammering down. It is happening. You got patron down below. If you don't want to do any of those things, you don't want to leave the platform.