The Murder of Reena Virk

How's it going to everyone?

I'm Nicole and I'm Ben, and you're listening to Wicked and Grim.

A true crime podcast morning.

The following podcast materials.

Audience listener. That's good. We nailed that, nailed it, nailed that third times the charm right, this is our third podcast three.

So therefore, yes, the third post number three.

And I did the research for this one, so you did.

It's a cool episode.

It's in a cool episode. The research was intense, was it. Yeah, it just was a lot longer than I anticipated it to.

Well, you got that rabbit hole you crawl down, right?

Yeah?

Is that what happened?

Oh? Yeah, numerous times, Like the amount of articles and news pages I read was just a little bit much.

A little much. Well, like, how long do you think you're researching for?

Oh? I put a solid eight hours, really like a homework day.

Yeah, that's honestly, it's not surprising when I look back the research I'd done for the past too, So that's fair. I can see it. I can see it.

I think it will get easier though, because honestly, as you just learn easier and more efficient ways of doing it. So I think, like the fifth the one I do or whatever, it would be much easier.

Well, and there's a lot of descriptions out there when you're researching stuff and it's like you can omit this. It's like, Okay, the victim was wearing a blue hair tie. Do we really need to know that? Not necessarily?

No, I did already emit stuff like that. Yeah, so I'm doing good well and.

Even still in an hour long podcast, we can't fit everything. Oh no, so we're gonna do the best we can.

Oh if I fit everything, as you guys to have to listen to us for three hours, and who wants to do that?

I mean, I've listened to you over the past like fifteen years talk NonStop, so I'm pretty sure I've listened to more than just three hours NonStop.

Can we have two podcasts out? We do, and they're going really well.

They are like ridiculously well.

You have pumped.

I don't think I've actually told you yet, but I looked at the numbers. We are over two hundred listens on both episodes combined already, who Who? And they've only been released for like well at this time, like not even two weeks.

Yeah, I know, I'm so excited.

Thank you everyone, thank you, ya, thank You've had some incredible support from like friends and people online who were just finding us. I even had someone on TikTok on my personal account say that, like, hey, I literally haven't looked up your podcast yet, but Spotify recommended Wicked and Grim to me on my recommendation thing. So that's pretty dope that we're making the recommendation list.

That is awesome, right, Look at us moving up in the world.

People like us, I think, I hope.

Yeah, Well, time will tell.

If they stick around they like us. Yeah, if they don't, then clearly we've got we've got some issues.

Yeah, Okay, should we stop with the chit chat?

Sure, let's get right to it.

Let's dive into this case.

Boom and a cool episode present us the case. What do we got?

Well, yeah, I actually haven't really given any hints or anything. I think the only hint I gave that it was a BC case, which it is, and you kept a.

Lot of information for me. I know nothing about this case either.

I know I'm very secretive.

You aren't in good job on keeping it. Although in turn, just so you know, I'm making sure that I'm not telling you anything about my case and just you guys are aware. We're recording today's episode and next week's episode back to back. So I've got my case. Later writ in front of me and.

Nicolemost nothing about I know nothing.

I'm not telling her anything between now and then when we record.

Like, I don't even know if I know the name of the person.

Well, at the end of this episode, I'll tell you guys what the cases, But first we got to listen to it. Cales case, I'm pumped. What do you got?

Okay? So here we go. So I am diving deep into the murder of Rena ke rena Vert. Does that name sound familiar to you?

I would like to say yes, but no it doesn't. Okay, I'm really bad with names.

Over you are? And yeah, I for some reason remember this happening, and it's also been in the news very consistently over the years. So I feel like a lot of people are going to.

Know about this one then I should know it.

But probably, well it might maybe some bells will ring. Is that how you say that?

Maybe it'll ring some bells, ring some bells. I'm not a news person though, either. I try to avoid that stuff.

It's depressing a lot of times okay, So who is Rena Virk.

Let's hear it.

So, Rena Vike, at the time of her murder was only fourteen years old. I'm just going to throw that out there because that's really sad and that might trigger some people. So she was born on March tenth, nineteen eighty three. Her parents were suemn Urke and man Jeep Burke, and she was the oldest of three children, and they lived in Sanwich, BC. Do you know where that is?

That's south right Vancouver area or is it on the island.

It's on Vancouver Island, on the island. I love Vancouver Island.

My geography is also terrible. I'm just all around not an educated individual. I don't watch the news. Names don't stick with me and geography don't ask me math either.

Well, this is going to educate you more.

Yes.

So it's about two kilometers or two miles or so from Victoria, So it's pretty much like a suburb of Victoria. I mean, people that live there probably are not gonna be happy with me saying that, but I think it's a suburb of Victoria. So Rena's dad was a first generation immigrant from India of Sikh religion, and Rena's mom was born and raised in Victoria, also Indian, but of Jehovah Witness religion.

Oh okay, that's a different combination.

It is, isn't it. So Rena is described and this she was described with this numerous articles. I read as a minority within a minority because she's living in basically Victoria, Savage BC, in a South Asia community, but of Jehovah Witness religion when most of the people in that little community would be of Sikh religion.

Yeah, I could see sticking out like a sore thumb for sure.

So Rena was described as she loved life, She was a caregiver, liked caring for people, and loved babies, including her little siblings.

Ah, she sounds like a good person.

Her mom, uh said if she was alive today, she would have done something to help other people.

We need more people like that in our lives in the world, Like.

She probably would have been a nurse or something. And yeah, we need caring people in this world. I'm not gonna lie.

I don't want to know where this is going now. I mean I do, but I don't.

So at the time of the murder, like I said, Rena was only fourteen, which is just so young, Like fourteen years old, Oh my goodness.

You're still developing as a person then, Like you don't even know who you are.

I know you don't. Yeah, you're just very new to the world. Really well, like I think.

Back when you were fourteen, what were you like? Well, I know what you were like. We were dating then almost dat we knew each other.

I was going to say I was into teenye maybe, but I think maybe that out pays already went by hopefully.

I think I was fifteen, okay, so we're just starting to get to know each other. And yeah, you were weird.

I was odd. I feel like I was like young too long.

But we don't even know.

But that's okay. I feel like that's a good thing. Yeah, stay young as long as you can.

So.

Reno was described as also being a very self conscious teenager, which I mean as we were just kind of saying, like you're finding yourself and you're not too sure about what you're going to be yet.

Yeah, we're all like that when we're that age.

And she desperately sought the acceptance from her peers, which is like really sad just learning that. But I mean, yeah, you're just learning, learning everything about yourself, and you just want people to like you and make friends, And.

There's a lot of pressure at that age too, right, trying to fit in.

Yeah, so I just I just pretty much just described like a normal teenager.

Yeah, you just literally described my past.

So she was also going through a rebellion phase from her parents, which is also very common, but hers was a little bit more intense, and I feel like most people's rebellion phase would be from their parents, She figured. She thought her parents were very overprotective. For an example of that, they gave her a nine pm curfew. But I mean, at fourteen years old, I was not roam in the streets at nine pm. I'm not gonna lie.

I mean, I grew up on a dirt road. It was like when I go home from school at like four thirty, it was like, I'm not going out unless it's for a bike ride to the next door neighbor who is my buddy, and by then it's I'm back by dinner.

But I was also a perfect child.

Of course you were. You're a perfect human all around study much brand points to me today.

Saving you don't have to sleep on the couch tonight. Whooh, okay, So she so just kind of dive into how she was rebellious. She had ran away from home, she with her grandparents. She her her end goal basically of her rebellion was she wanted to live in like a foster care, in foster care. What that was. She didn't want to be living with her parents. I think she had friends that were in foster care group home situations, and it just that seemed more desirable to her.

So it was glorified because who aims to live.

In faster care?

I know, I know, unless you had like a really bad living situation, you know exactly.

And her parents are amazing. They're like, oh my goodness, you're going to learn about them and they're just phenomenal.

This is breaking my heart already.

So living with her grandparents wasn't going overly well. She and what she did next was she reported physical, mental, and sexual abuse at her home, which caused her father to be arrested.

Oh I thought you said that she was like an all around good person. That's not a cus.

She was a very good person, but she was kind of just out a phase where she was just like testing everything. I think, you know, and so okay, that did get withdrawn okay good at a later date. So she has also attempted suicide. She did end up in foster care that was not doing what she wanted it for her. So she that was at the time when she withdrew the allegations to her father because she wanted to go back home and they welcomed her back with

I remember that day very clearly.

Do you what were you doing?

I was no. Actually I was a PlayStation guy, but nineteen ninety seven, No, I didn't have PlayStation by then, probably playing StarCraft. In fact, I remember it well. It was a partly cloudy day, just got home from school playing StarCraft in the computer. My mom was yelling at me to do homework. Childhood, No, I wasn't.

Okay, So Rena was attending a party The party was in the back field of Shoreline Secondary, you know, pretty much the best place to have a party. Of course, there was reportedly about thirty kids there. Teenagers. I don't know, I guess you're still considered a kid. It got very rowdy, as you can imagine. The police were called. They arrived and at that point the teens scattered.

I could see it, like stomp them on nan Hill sort of thing.

Yep. So Rena ended up at the local convenience store that was very near and she notified her parents that she'd be coming home for the night because it was much closer than the group home that she was at at the time.

And her parents, I bet you they were totally cool if that weren't they Okay.

Yeah they were. I'd almost just like always seem like they're excited whenever she reached out and wanted to come home and stuff. So after the phone call with her parents, two girls which were allegedly she thought were friends, invited her down to Craig Flower Bridge, which was where the party. I don't know what you'd say, reconvened.

Yeah, sure, we're a.

Bunch of teenagers. Decided to keep it going and at that moment. At that moment, she should have just like not tried to fit in and just gone home.

Is this where it starts.

I hadn't mentioned this yet, but she was accused of spreading rumors herself about another girl and trying to steal that girl's boyfriend.

Okay, so classic high school stuff.

Yeah, very much so, And that, unfortunately, is basically how the attack started. The girl who was subject of the rumors spread by Rena started it all out by putting a burning cigarette out on Rea's forehead.

Oh okay, that's just a dick move all around.

Wow, that would actually like really hurt one.

Well yeah I would. You'd burn yourself, well, not yourself, but they would burn you.

Yeah. But that's just the start. So Rena was then swarmed by a group of seven girls and one boy, all of these people being under the age of sixteen, so they're all young, and oh very young. They repeatedly punch, kicked, hit Rena for reportedly up to three to five minutes. This went on like that is a long time to be.

So long, like three minutes, Like that's that's a full freaking song.

For yeah, for eight people to be just you know, attacking.

You right, I think how long is Bohemian Rhapsody that song? I think that's slightly over five minutes, isn't it?

Oh my god?

So basically think getting that your ass kicked for the entirety of Bohemian Rhapsody, I know that is just so long.

There was and there was a crowd around watching this. So there was the seven people or eight people sorry, attacking Rena and then a crowd watching, which I'm like, how on earth did you watch this? But someone in the crowd did kind of at one point was like, enough's enough and that did end it good. So it ended and at that point Rena was was left alive, so she she was still alive. She was definitely like not doing well of.

Course, as I could imagine.

So she was not in good shape, but she was going to make her way across the bridge, stumbling and trying as best she could to get home because her home was on the other side of the bridge. But uh, two teens did not leave, So we have we have Kelly Ellard and weren't glow out ski. I was have trouble pronouncing that we're Glowoutski. So and so they didn't leave. And apparently these two individuals didn't even know Rena personally, which I have trouble, like, what the heck, what are you doing?

So they they stayed behind. I'm assuming that they're about to like jump her or something like that. I already hate them. And they didn't even know her.

They just they didn't know her, and some reports said that they just wanted to make sure that she didn't rat anyone out, so they stayed back and like followed her. So but they didn't like, I mean, she was not moving fast. They did catch her on the bridge and they kind of brought her across the other bridge or sorry, to the other side of the bridge.

She brought her across well.

Like escorted her, but like not in a nice way. So they're like harassing and pushing it like she's just wanting like she's just telling them to fuck off constantly. So so they get to the other side of the bridge where the attack, an attack starts again, these two Kelly and Warren. So attack starts again. They're punching, punching Rina, and they end up smashing her head against a tree, which leaves her unconscious.

Oh no, yeah, do we know which one smashed their head against the tree?

No, at that point, I didn't say which one. I think it was like both Warren and Kelly were very active at that point, but one of them does get much worse here. So they dragged Rena's body to the water. Wait, unconscious, right, unconscious Kelly or sorry, Reena is not conscious, So Kelly

What yeah, oh my god.

Like, I don't know she thought that she was just being really cool or what.

I don't like, the fuck is that cool?

I know, like this is like a person.

I just I just uh, I'm sorry.

Uh she Wow, Yeah, you're not gonna like her, Ben.

She's already a seaon next Tuesday. Yeah, you're not gonna like her home Wow, okay continue Sorry.

So come Monday, rumors were flying, despite a pack that was made amongst everyone that no one was to say anything, of course, Like, I just feel like that's such a teenager to think no one's going to say anything. We're keeping this quiet. Grena's parents had reported her missing obviously

Waiting, following policy.

Yeah, but I mean that is unfortunate. So police conducted numerous interviews over the week while they were doing this. Apparently, Kelly reportedly was bragging, giving people tours of the crime she seen and showing what she did.

Of course she was wow, yeah, like she's a real win, trash person, real winner. She trash Kelly.

She was dubbed the nickname killer Kelly.

There's another word I can think she should be called.

Yeah, well, we're not going to go there. No, So on November twenty first, so never November twenty first, that's seven days after the attack, Kelly Warren and six girls were arrested, facing charges from assault to murder. So quite quickly, really, I feel like they figured out who was involved.

Well, I mean with all these rumors flying around with kids being like, oh yeah, I was totally doing this and Kelly being like, yeah, this is where I killed this chick.

I mean, oh yeah, she's not going to get called secret at all. And I just feel like at that age, I don't know. I mean even now, I'm terrible at keeping secrets. I would have probably told my parents instantly and then their you know, parents get involved. Yeah, it was the rumors were going through the school too, so teachers were were getting involved in such as well.

Well, I could imagine, well, yeah, you are terrible at keeping secret. It's even when it comes to like Christmas.

Time, something cool, I want to give it to you instantly.

Suret I'm wearing right now. I literally got for Christmas this past Christmas from you, and I knew about it like the month prior to.

Well, I had to make sure you tried it on to make sure it fits. Anyways, continue, Yes, Okay, so everyone's arrested at this point, but they still have not found the body. So the police put a lot of effort into that. On the following day, so eight days after the murder, Rena's body was found in the water about a kilometer from where she was last beaten.

Jeez, So she was she like pushed into the river then or what?

You know? I never never said anything, but I'm assuming like she was pretty much in the water already, so.

They probably just left her there. Yeah.

I never said if they pushed her down or whatever. But she also didn't end up that far from from where the attack happened, to kilometers and really that far. No, especially, I'm also really surprised no one found found her previously to that, I mean, yeah, but anyway, so I'm gonna I'm gonna dive into the autopsy here. This is not great, Okay,

Yeah, while she smokes a fucking cigarette thinking she's cool shit.

And she's like, yeah, queen Bee or whatever she wants to be.

Oh, she's a bee, that's for sure.

Severe bruising on pelvis, stomach, liver and pancreas Jesus, and pebble's lodge in the throat consistent with someone drowning face down in shallow water. So yeah, like she wasn't she was still alive, but she obviously was underwater, still trying to.

Breathe, right, yeah, Well, unconscious or not, your reflex is going to be to try and breathe.

Yeah.

Yeah, So she's being held down by Kelly and she's trying to breathe. Whether she's conscious, I don't, I mean, do you know didn't say like she was struggling at that point.

No, I don't think that she was struggling.

So yeah, so she's probably unconscious, just trying to breathe exactly graveling. Oh my god, that's horrible. Can you imagine?

Oh no, I couldn't imagine.

I can't hold my breath in the bathtub for like thirty seconds, let alone being forced down by something like how.

Long would it take to smoke a cigarette? I think it would take like a good three to five minutes when it depending on I've never actually.

Depending on how fast you're going. If you're in a coffee break, I'm sure you're trying to smoke that sucker pretty fast.

But if you're just casually out, oh yeah, she was probably just being as casual as she could be. So obviously Rena her the final doom was drownding, but she It was also reported that she most likely wouldn't have survived with the brain injury that she had.

So wow, I know, poor Rena, No kidding.

I just I don't know. Just I just it's so bad for her, like fourteen years old, and that's just like a tragic thing to happen to her parents and her family.

Like and you said this was like a major case, like that's been like all over the news and stuff before.

Oh yeah, well, because the freaking trial is just a complete shit show. Kelly is constantly in the news. I've never heard of this case, Like I means over person, but she's completely overshadowed, shadowed Rena just just because her freaking quirt. It's just like a disaster. I'm about to dive into that. Well, actually I'm diving into the other people so before Kelly, because I like the other people better. Not that I like them, but you.

Know what I mean in this case where you're saving the worst for life exactly.

So the following year trials begin February nineteen ninety eight six girls from the original attack. They were all charged with assault causing bodily harm, and it ranged from sixty to one year in youth custody. Of what they got so they're not named because they're under the Young Offenders Act.

Yeah, they're not adults.

So some of them have since come forward and opened up because I mean there's been like books written and documentaries and stuff, and so some of them have come forward with their their names, like Nicole Cook is one that I can remember offhand, but I think there was at least three or so that came forward.

Good on them. I mean, you're a shitty person at that age, but clearly you're you're grown out of something and you're becoming a better person. So good on them for that.

But then it's also, okay, this is just me being terrible. I think, I know, the guilt will just eat you away. But then you're also ruining your life two by coming forward.

Yeah, but they also ruined Riena's life. They did, so they're doing the right thing they are.

But they have this Young Offenders Act for reasons so that you can still kind of have a life going forward. Maybe, but no, no, honestly, it's the right thing to do. It's the right thing.

I know you're going to get to it, so you don't don't say anything response. But I really hope that Kelly didn't fall under this and that she gets like some serious shit here, So I just won't throw that out there.

Continue well, considering we already know her name, we know her name right that that's right there, saying that they faced much worse and their offense was so brutal that they were tried in adult court and that's why we know both of their names. So yeah, no, it was not good.

I didn't put that together. So you could have just left.

Me in suspense because he gave me a blank look like, what do you mean why? How is it obvious?

Yeah? But no, now I gotcha. Okay, Yeah, you're right.

Okay, So Warren Warren, I don't know he I feel like a little bit bad for him, which I just shouldn't, but I just do. So. His parents stayed together basically to raise him. They did end up getting a divorce at some point in time. His mom was an alcoholic, so he was living with his dad. But his dad ended up meeting someone when he was in vague and moved to California to be with this woman.

Classic love story right there.

But Warren didn't want to go because he wanted to stay behind with his girlfriend, and so the dad went anyway, and so at the time of the murder, like Warren was living alone.

Wow. Yeah, so he did not have like the greatest atmosphere as a young adult.

Not really. I mean, like you're sixteen years old and you're living alone. It did say that the dad sent him regular checks and that Warren's girlfriend's mom would make him meals and do his laundry and stuff. So I can't he had some support, but I just feel like that's a little bit young to be living on your own.

That's like minimal support. Though you have financial support and someone's doing your laundry and making meals, you don't have someone there when you need them. Oh no, hey dad, can you help me with my homework?

You don't have that, no, or someone even reminding you to do your homework kind of yeah.

Or you know, wash your sheets. Yeah, you might be doing laundry, but do you remember to wash your sheets? You know, Hey, it's nine o'clock, it's getting late. You gotta get up early. You don't have any sort of family support to you, support, nothing.

It's just too young to be living on your own.

So it's a bad situation. Yeah.

He was also part of a local gang and to be brought into this gang, he had to endure a brutal beating, so I almost feel like just the beating mentality or attacking mentality was just part of maybe his normal day to day life. And then for him being at the attack, he was basically at the wrong place

I mean, that's mistake right there. When you lady says no, don't worry about it, you worry about it, you.

Do it well. Yeah, honestly, something else would have ended happening that would have made the girlfriend mad, probably.

Right hashtag always hashtag always honey, Are you upset? No, I'm fine. Yeah, you follow through, you make sure you do the right thing. Whyse you're in the doghouse.

So Warren, yeh, fucked up. That was number one fuck up.

And that's why I'm trying to earn the Brandie point.

So okay. In April nineteen ninety nine was when his course court journey started. He pleaded not guilty. He admitted participation, but said he had no idea Kelly was planning to kill Rena. I mean, I also don't really know if Kelly went out planning to kill Rena, but he was definitely part of the situation, yeah, for sure. So in June he was found guilty. He was found guilty of second degree murder. He got life in prison without parole for at least seven years, which is the maximum.

I'm glad you got the max.

But you know, it's interesting if they had been so they are tried an adult court, but their age still help them because if they were say I think it was eighteen, that the maximum would have been life in prison with at least ten years. So like their age, them being young and stuff. Though they were tried as adults, it's still I guess help them.

It was a factor. It was a factor. But yeah, okay, yeah, so.

I got a lot of dates here.

Let's hear these dates.

In two thousand and one, he appealed, but he did lose, and they said, you know, you actively took part in this murder, which yeah you did, Yeah you did. In two thousand and four, he applied for day parol, which he was denied. Two thousand and six, he was granted unescorted temporary absences from prison.

Oh pancy, I know you know what?

Okay, this is like, I just find this all just doesn't make much sense because you're put like in life in prison, but then you end up getting I.

Don't know, there's a lot of cases like that, but it's like, Oh, you go into jail for life. Oh, by the way, would you like to go to the fair this weekend. We're gonna get you some cotton candy, have a dandy old time, play some games.

So I just life in prison. I just don't think is life in prison?

Yeah, it certainly isn't at this point.

So in two thousand and seven he was granted full day parole, and then oh I gotta flip my page here. Sorry. In twenty ten he was granted like full parole, So like done.

Basically, I like how we have laptops and phones and all this stuff, but we're still like going to old school and writing our notes on paper.

I know, I feel like one day maybe I'll do a tablet, but I don't know. It's kind of nice writing it out.

I definitely I love the field of paper.

I feel like you would actually probably fuck up more laptop.

I think it would take me a lot longer to like type it out too, probably with just a job.

Notes I did because my notes were just a freaking disaster. I probably rewrote these like one or two times. So I mean, if you did it on the computer, I would save you that that.

Amount of time, right plus plus post it notes take a look great there in my notes. I have post it notes everywhere for additional information. I that's not organized technically, it is because post it notes help you organize post it notes. There's an AD's.

Okay, so this is kind of cool because they feel like so weren't just like the poster child of what a person should be like in prison. I'm just gonna throw that out there. He put a lot of work into himself and others while in prison, Like he's he did good. He took rehabilitation courses. He discovered he was of METI heritage while in prison, and he did this

I mean, it's too little, too late, but I don't think that's kind of their mentality, which is very impressive. Good on them.

Yeah, so Sueman tells reporters, we would have hoped something would have or somebody would have learned something from this whole thing, basically meaning that Warren did.

Wow.

And then Warren telling Suman and man Jeet that he aspired to be as caring and selfless as they were, Like it was just seemed like they just got this all around good relationship. There were stories where they would shake hands, they give each other hugs, like they just like really helped him and Warren like he just accepted their help and they had. I mean, it was probably not the best rely relationship, but as good as it could have gotten.

I think like a Hallmark movie needs to be made about these parents, not necessarily surrounding this case, but like they need to be like characters in a Hallmark movie because they're just like wholesome as fuck. Right, shit, I.

Know they're distrected. I'm going to go on about them.

Let's hear it. I want to hear more good stuff.

I was gonna say this at the end, but you know what, let's dive in here. So Rena, as I said, they were just amazing. I mean they were amazing because they gave Rena so many chances I feel like when she did some not great things. Also with how they handled this Warren situation, and so they turned their grief into a national anti bullying campaign. They shared stories in schools across Canada and really turned their daughter's legacy into

I mean, you're you're letting your daughter live on that way too, right, which is incredible.

Oh yeah, and making it so that maybe something like this doesn't happen to someone else's kid.

Right, hopefully and ideally Yeah wow.

Okay, but and oh my goodness, I'm just gonna have to tell you people this and it's really shitty, but I just have to get off my chest, like for them being such awesome people, something else bad really happened. Oh so, Suman, which is the mom of Rena, I think it was twenty eighteen. I just came across in my research she died from choking in a restaurant. What I was, like, what the heck, We're so awesome, they've already been put through the frickin' ringer.

No kidding.

Can she maybe just go have a nice meal and not choke and not die?

Right? Oh wow? That's ah. Rena's father is probably just like he lost everything now No.

I mean he still does have two kids, Okay, okay, so hopefully they're close it. Actually it's interesting and all the research I never came across anything about the other two kids, so that's really.

Not necessarily a case about them.

So no, it's not.

I'm sure if you looked them up you could find maybe some stuff about them.

Totally, So that's it for Warren. I'm going to be jumping into the story of Kelly.

You're ready, I'm ready lay it on me.

Okay. So just to like give a little bit of back history about Kelly, she was definitely had a more stable, traditional family upbringing. She was of middle class. Her parents were divorced, but her mom did remarry to a really awesome guy, and she just all around seemed like she had a happy home life, which was unlike Warren. Really well, I mean, Warren didn't have a bad home life, but it just wasn't quite as traditional as Kelly's. Gotcha, she did hung out, hang out with a rougher crowd, and

So she's known to bully people, tries to light some kid's hair on fire. What did the school system or her parents do about this?

I don't know because also in the hair lighting incident, there was two others involved. They got something happened to them. I didn't dive too deeply into it, but she didn't get anything.

What how do you not get anything trying to light hair on fire?

Of what class she's in, you know, like she's I think she's hanging out with people in lower class, and then they're taking the brunt at the blame.

Maybe still her parents be like at home, at home.

She should Yeah, I don't know. And so yeah, her court, her court history is just like a shit show. Like I have eleven pages of notes and I'm only on page nine. So we get to spend a little bit of time talking about Kelly, which is so exciting.

Not really because she's a bitch.

So her or her court started much court incident history whatever, so much later it started March two thousand because initially they just appealed the decision to be have her tried as an an adult court h okay, like whatever, Like yeah, what are you appealing? She did a terrible thing like that just has to happen.

Yeah, she I mean, she should be tried in adult court, like, no problem, Like, look what she did. She did some very adult shit, and there's like stuff leading up to it. I one hundred percent agree that she should be tried an adult court. And in fact, they tried to appeal it. I mean I understand them trying to.

I mean that's good lawyers.

Right. Yeah, she did get tried an adult court though. Yeah, so I'm glad that they didn't go through the appeal.

So March two thousand, trial started convicted, and she was convicted of second degree murder. She got life sentenced with at least five years behind bars, which she can before she can apply for parole. But that's the minimum. Remember Warren got seven years ago. Yeah, so she honestly should

Something, so she should have the same answer eighteen different times.

Yeah, So basically a new trial was ordered, but she got to have bail, which I was like, what the freak why does this chicken to have bail? And it was the worst decision they ever could make because she was connected with a beating apparently her she was She

Are you serious?

Yeah? So, like she had, she just hasn't changed. She just hadn't changed at all. So two thousand and four, her second trial started. I just have a little quote here because she I don't know, I'm maybe being biased here, but she's mean. So this is just like a total mean girl quote. I'm obviously going to be convicted. You got what you wanted. My life is ruined.

Oh her life is ruined. Oh yeah, it's all about her life that's being ruined right now. Wow, Okay, we can definitely tell her attitude perspective.

So but guess what. That trial ended in a mistrial because the jury couldn't make a decision apparently, out of the twelve people in the jury, eleven were on one side and one was on the other. It didn't say what side they were on, but I'm assuming eleven thought that she was guilty, and I guess one person didn't.

Well, kind of douche Canoe can't realize that there's like, she's admitted this stuff.

I know that she.

I mean, she's killer Kelly. She went around saying and everything.

I mean and yeah, and there was tons of people like witnesses testifying.

And how do you not Okay, there's literal proof in front of my eyes. I'm not sure, you know.

I find that just weird, like that person fucked up.

No kidding anyway, and if there was like some bribery or some shit going on, I know, in the scenes.

And also, I mean, this is probably so wrong of me to say, but if I was in a situation where like eleven people were like so adamant of something that I would just probably be like, yeah.

Like, well, I mean that's not technically right, not.

Right, But like, especially in this case, obviously she's guilty, Like what are you thinking she's not?

Yeah, like she's full and admitted this. There's witnesses, there's evidence like wow.

Anyway, so that was a freaking disaster. So then she gets to have a third trial. Oh man, in two thousand and five, the third trial. So she was fifteen at the first charge. Now she's twenty two.

So and all this time, other than the one time when she beat the crap, I have an old lady in the park. She's been behind bars.

Oh yeah, because after she beat the crap at that it's fifty eight old. Come on, Ben, it's old to me.

I'm thirty.

After that beating, she did get put back into jail.

Good.

So this two thousand and five trial she gets the max she so she gets to she must serve seven years before she can see parole. So I mean, like, if she just stayed with this March two thousand thing, you know, you would have been better off. Yeah, no kidding, Okay, but that's not even it. What There was almost a fourth trial. It went through a lot of steps, but thankfully it was denied apparently the trial judge. It was stated the trial judged not properly instruct the jury. So

Do you need here, no kidding.

It was eleven years for the case to work through the legal system, which is just, and it was the parents I mean had talked about that too, because that it's just like such a long amount of time for them to not really have closed closure, because every time this is in the news or in the trial, there's reporters and stuff and newspeople wanting to contact the parents

Because Kelly's a big old c Next Tuesday.

Yeah, So she did waive her right for parole four times, which I guess is like a common thing to do if if you think that you're not ready, if you don't think you have a chance anyway, well.

She shouldn't have had a chance.

She could. She continued to proclaim, you bump the mic I did. She continued to proclaim her innocence throughout like numerous years. She never apologized to the family, and apparently she just I don't even understand how this works, but she like for a whole year especially, it was just like a druggie. I don't even understand how they get drugs in prison. But yeah, what the hell, Yeah, that's not even the worst and what she did in.

Prison system, maybe you might want to fucking look into that shit, especially if it's documented that she was a drug an, like a whole.

Year she was like addicted some serious drugs.

Shee wow.

So yeah so she yeah, just I mean, the opposite of Warren. Really. But in May of twenty sixteen, she finally did apply for day parol, which she was denied. But at that point it did seem like some progress was made for her accepting the responsibility of what she did.

Well, I would hope she should have made that progress long time ago.

Yeah, it took her quite a while. Really, Okay, but this, so this is just nuts because saying.

How can this is nuts? What do you mean we haven't heard anything yet?

Well, I mean, so how we were just talking about how she got drugs in prison. It was later announced in twenty sixteen that she had a baby. Kelly had a baby.

Oh my god, what, Kati, You.

Want to know how this happened?

So prior to so mommy and a daddy got together.

Well, okay, I think you know how that happened. But how she's in prison, how did she like have a baby. So she developed a pen pal relationship with a male inmate from a neighboring prison, which I just don't even quite understand how that happens. And it was approved for them to have a private conjugal visit when he was out on day parl And so these conjugal visits, they seem like a normal thing. But I seem it seemed like it was more so. I mean, you get together

A lot of situations of conjugal visits being like your your spouse is coming to visit you.

In like yeah, so they just have like a little rendezvous in a fancy little cabin, you.

Know, wow, some and good times.

I don't know, I just I just don't agree with that.

I don't either, but I mean it is what it is.

So the following year after she's a mom, she is approved day release for doctor's appointments. Parenting programs, et cetera. As her and her baby were living in the prison, there's this they have a little area where moms can basically raise their kids in prison. And actually there's some photos that actually clearly nice. So I mean, at least

You know, it's not the child dud's fault. It's been brought into this world there. So I mean they have a good environment for the kid. That's a good thing.

So it was reported that the baby had a very positive impact on Kelly's life. It was the best therapy that she could ask for, which I don't really know of having a kid should be like your therapy.

But you know, I mean as long as it worked.

Yeah, she I did. I forgot to say this. She did actually change her name from Kelly to Carrie sim She's had a second baby, yes, with the same of course, the same dad and as of right now, so she does a LIT. She LIT can live away from a residential facility for up to five days each week, so she's like pretty much out really, So for like two days of the week she is locked up or maybe

Although she's supposed to be behind bars. Yeah for life, Like, like you said, life in prison doesn't mean shit.

It's not life in prison. I feel like it's almost like the parole date is more so what you get. I don't know, okay, but this is a quote from the parole board, which I'm going to leave everyone at because it just like it kind of just hit me right in the fields. So the parole board said, the fact that the birth of your child has given you a purpose in life is tragically ironic, as you ended the life of another mother's child.

One hundred percent, Like that's hitting the nail on the head. Wow boom oh I know.

I mean, so it's good that she finally realized what she done and her having a kid made her realize that. I guess, like it was just good that it got realized.

But I was just like, but still, she took someone's life about it, thought it was cool didn't apologize for how long and then fought all this time.

And her being out there was some stipulation she had to follow. She couldn't contact Rena's family, which good, which right there shows that they don't have any relationship, not like Rena's family did with Warren. And she cauldn't be doing any drugs or having alcoholic.

I mean, that's an everyday person thing. Don't do drugs. They're illegal. That shouldn't be like a, hey, just so you know you're not supposed to do drugs. That's just a you should know that already.

So that's the story, the very tragic story of Rena passing away at fourteen years old.

Wow, all because of bullying.

I know. I mean, And it's kind of the story is good in a way that I'm just hoping it that. I feel like it's probably affected other people's decisions to maybe not bully. I hope so, especially the parents did so much work. And the really cool thing actually is so we're putting this out on gosh, what is the date of it going to be?

Well, on Tuesday?

Tuesday, I don't know. Is that the twenty third?

I think? So I have my calendar here just let me get it. Twenty third, Yeah, it's a twenty third.

And then the twenty fourth is pink shirt Day.

Funny how that works out?

Hey, I know, I oh, I'm slipping away from my microphone. I did not plan that onsoever.

It works out good though, So we should make sure that we get a photo of us in pink shirts up on Instagram.

So the story is still carrying on because we're putting out a podcast that's talking about this story. And don't bully, don't be a jerk. Just be a kind person.

Yeah, don't be asking too much my life motto. And don't be Kelly.

Yeah, be a person like her normal killer Kelly. Don't be a killer Kelly.

Another C word, Kelly.

So that's a wrap.

Yeah. Wow, that is a good I mean, not a good case, don't get me wrong. I ask something I meant to say. That was an interesting case. That was a harsh case, but a good episode. Wow.

Yeah, so yeah, I will. I'll definitely be putting a picture of Rena up on our Instagram.

And not Kelly. She can fuck off.

No, Kelly has just got enough. I feel like she's got too much attention. And it was like, no, I'm done with her, So we'll put up a photo of Rina so everyone can see her. And yeah, we'll put something up about Anti Bullying Day and get where can people find us? Ben, Oh, you.

Can find us at Wicked and Grim on Instagram. We gotta get a website. Don here pretty quick too.

Actually boom, Yeah, so go.

Head over, take a look at those Instagram posts and tell everyone, or tell Nicole how she did on her first episode. I think you did.

Awesome, perfect. So that's a wrap, and we'll finish it off with Oh.

Wait, hold on, I can't yet why I told him I was going to say what the next episode was at the beginning, didn't I? I think I did it the next episode. I had someone at work mentioned this to me and I was like, I'm diving into it one hundred percent. It's the Mad Trapper of rat River. I'm not going to say anything else until you get so.

I don't even know what that is.

But we're going to record this in about five minutes and you guys are going to hear it next week. So until then, stay Wicked, Stay Wicked,