In the winter of nineteen ninety three, the quiet Melbourne suburb of Frankston became the focus of one of Australia's most chilling serial murder cases. Over the span of just seven weeks, three young women were brutally killed, each attack seemingly random but carried out with escalating violence. The man responsible twenty one year old Paul Denier, who would later confess not only to the murders but to a deep rooted hatred for women that had been building four years.
This is the story of the Frankston murders.
My name's Ben, I'm Nicole, and you're listening to Wicked and Grim.
A true crime podcast. The following podcast I have material more audience listeners.
Haven't had that sound for a while.
Havelf We we haven't. And honestly, don't judge me for this one. This is a breakfast beer, so it's like eleven still, it's technically a breakfast beer five o'clock somewhere exactly. Sometimes you gotta do what you gotta do, yep. And that might be have a beer in the morning, and that might be have a coffee with dinner. Hey, just don't judge, right, you do you exactly. This is an
interesting case and it actually comes from our patron. So I just want to give you a little quick shout out to everyone over on Patreon because we did a live recently and I think we mentioned that last episode.
And was this put on the live? It was okay, right on.
So we were chatting with them and there's a couple of suggestions thrown around and this was one of the ones that was suggested.
Okay, I know if you recommendations came on that live, but yeah, there you.
Go, Well this is one of those recommendations and now you know, yeah, and now you're about to learn all about it.
Sorry, if my voice sounds a bit off, I think it's a slightly off, but not much.
You sound a little bit nasally today.
Nasally I have a yeah woo woo, woot woot before we're about to go to town.
Right, and my throat hurts a little bit too, So yeah, I have just passed it.
On to me. Thanks, Sorry, but you know what is to come?
Are you really sorry? Though?
Slightly? But also last year you gave me COVID So.
Was that last year or the year before?
What that was last year? Was it not even like that? Long ago.
What are you What are you talking about then at.
The when we were in Georgia.
Oh well, I mean, we don't know for sure that was COVID. We're just assuming pretty sure.
So anyway, I got a pass for life because that was a terrible illness to pass on. This ain't that bad.
I don't know if that was COVID. That was a bad case of COVID. I think it was just a really bad fluke. Because there's vomiting and stuff about, we don't need to talk about this. Oh my gosh, we were sick.
Yeah, people get sick. Yeah, it happens.
It do happen like that sometimes. But are you ready for this case?
I am.
Okay, let's stop talking about our our well being and stuff. Let's just get into the story. Okay. So in the early nineteen nineties, the bayside suburb of Frankston, about forty minutes outside of Melbourne, Australia, was just like any other quiet Australian community. Had the beach, you know, the bush and the kind of low key suburb charm that made it an easy place to live, especially for families and young people starting out. But in nineteen ninety three, all
of that changed. For seven terrifying weeks in winter, something or rather some one, turned Frankston into a hunting ground. Three women were murdered in broad daylight or early evening, all young, all targeted seemingly at random. Another woman was attacked but managed to escape. By the end of July, the entire city was on edge. Women stopped walking alone, parents started picking up their kids from school. People double checked locked doors and looked over their shoulders wherever they went.
The killer didn't leave taunting letters or called police. They didn't have to the brutality of the crimes they spoken of for themselves. Eventually police would find him. He wasn't a shadowy figure hiding in the hills or some criminal mastermind. Instead, he was a twenty one year old guy named Paul Denyer, someone who lived in the area, worked odd jobs, and
blended in like any other face in the crowd. But what Paul was hiding beneath that average exterior was a violent hatred of women and a chilling desire to kill now. Paul was born in April fourteenth of nineteen seventy two, the third of six kids in a working class family that immigrated to Australia from the UK in the nineteen sixties.
His parents, Anthony and Marine, had just settled into New South Wales at first, but by the early eighties, a new job opportunity moved them into Victoria, specifically an outer suburb of Melbourne, and that's where things started to unravel. By all accounts, Paul didn't adjust well to the move. He struggled to make friends and never really found his footing in school. His confidence plummeted, his school performance tanked, and he began gaining weight rapidly, all of which isolated
him further and further. But where most kids might act out in a bit of rebellious, you know, teenage type behavior, Paul veered into much darker territory, going right beyond that into something else completely. When he was just ten, he cut the throat of his sister's stuffed bare Oh and not long after that, he even killed the family cat in the very same way, and then he strung its body up in a tree for.
The family to probably see and find. Yeah, oh my gosh, could you imagine if your child did something like that, right.
And you're talking a ten year old, Oh.
Man, I feel like I would just like run for the freaking hills. No kidding, my kid, Like that's terrified.
Yeah, well, these aren't things you can just chalk up to, like, hey, it's just a phase or boys will be boys. Some people use that as an excuse this stuff.
He maybe because it could have just been like being rude to their sibling.
Fair enough, and you know what, Like, honestly, kids at age, you know, they act out a lot of like different things on pillows or stuffed animals. I remember me when I was a kid, I watched like wrestling. I would have like full on wrestling matches with my stuff animals, you know what I mean. So it's like doing some stuff with your stuffed animals and like, hey, you know, tearing its head off because he saw a Rambo movie
and like that sort of thing. It's understandable. But when it crosses the line, it's not a stuffed animal anymore. And you literally cut the throat of your family cat and string it up in a tree, that's fucked.
Well, yeah, because it's not even like a neighbor's cat. It's your like your family cat. That is real mess.
Yeah. Oh, actually that's a good point because theoretically he should have some attachment to this animal.
Yeah, like he should love the animal, it's a part of his daily life.
Yeah, so these kind of moments were I mean, I have in my script in hindsight alarm bells, but honestly, they should have just been alarmed. It's not hindsight. Those are alarms that you ignored. It's not a hindsight.
Yeah that if your kid is killing your cat and hanging it in a tree, you gotta maybe look at some help or something.
Yeah, but not much was being done.
Oh shit.
Now, by thirteen, Paul had actually already been arrested, once for stealing a car and later for assaulting a classmate in a rather disturbing way. So the incident is h well, Paul was around fifteen at this time. He was attending high school and he assaulted a classmate. It's not just physically aggressive, let's put it that way. It was deliberate and it was dehumanizing. Now, according to reports and court records, they referenced what he did, Paul forced another student to
publicly masturbate. Yeah, a little bit humiliad.
How do you even do that?
Well, I mean, maybe it's a knife point again, maybe you're going to beat him up. Who knows what he did to threaten this individual, but they he forced them to public master. Yeah, so it's not just assault, it's forced public humiliation and it stood out later to psych psychologists and investigators as an early indicator of sadistic tendencies. Okay, yeah, this was impulsive. Sorry, it wasn't impulsive violence. It was domination, humiliation, and a desire to degrade another person in a sexually
charged and controlling way. Now, for context, this was the mid late nineteen eighties, so despite how serious this act was, it didn't seem to lead to any meaningful intervention by any means. He was arrested for this, yes, but there was little in the way of long term mental health evaluation or reform. So he was formally charged and arrested. But due to his age at around fifteen, he was treated at a juvenile level, right, so in a juvenile matter.
So the specific consequences haven't been made publicly made public because you know, hey, they deal with that sort of stuff behind closed doors and it's not public thing because hey, juvenile and that's basically that.
So they're just like chalking all this stuff up to that he's a kid. Figuring out his way, like he's going to get better, like all this is going to get better essentially. Yeah.
Yeah, And because of all that, there's no record of long term detention, rehabilitation programs, different like psychological treatments that maybe they could be doing. There's none of that. It was basically like, oh, you did a stupid thing, kid, Yeah, just go home. You learned your lesson?
Yeah, I learn from this.
Yeah, That's basically all it really was. They arrested him for a short time. He was in probably some sort of detention center for a bit, and then just went right back to.
Living at home, which isn't great because the poor kid that he did that too, that's going to affect his life.
Oh most likely for sure brutal. So yeah, meanwhile he's just allowed to just Paul's just going home and is hey, violent behavior, It's only going to escalate from there. And that's exactly what happened. So after that, things at home got worse. His parents' marriage that fell apart, and Paul
seemed to drift even further off the rails. He dropped out of school, bounced between jobs that he couldn't keep, and failed to get into the police force, something that he claimed he was passionate about, though no one really understands why because it doesn't reflect who he is. Then there were knives. While working at a boat building company in Seaford in the early nineteen ninety three, Paul started crafting makeshift knives and weapons during his shifts. And he
didn't just do this and hide it. He was open about it, and he even showed coworkers and stuff. One of his bosses even pulled him aside to say it was making people uncomfortable and he needed to stop.
Okay, but he wasn't supposed to be doing this. No, unlike company time and share right.
No, it's like you're supposed to be doing your job. You're making a fucking knife, like, stop it, and it's weirding people out, I guess.
But yeah, it's also like get to work.
Exactly a few months later, he was reportedly fired for underperforming at that job. Not surprising because he's not doing his job like you say, yeah, yeah, dinking around. So it was around the same time that the strange, disturbing incidents in Frankston and Seaford began. Things that back then seemed like random acts of cruelty and violence, but would later be recognized as Paul's first serious step towards murder.
One of the earliest signs was in February of nineteen ninety three, when he broke into a woman's house someone he didn't know, and completely vandalized the place. Now, when I say he didn't know them, clearly he does know who they are, but doesn't know them personally. You know what I mean? Now, this person was someone by the name of Donna. Donna was a young mother living in a unit on Claude Street in Seaford, a bayside suburb
of Melbourne. She had recently given birth and was home alone much of the time while her partner worked delivering pizzas. Around the time of the incident, Donna had received threatening, anonymous phone calls. They unnerved her to the point that she asked her partner if she could actually tag along during his delivery shifts, bringing their newborn baby with them, to feel safe. It turned out that decision would save her life.
Oh seriously, I just love when people like listen to their guts because it's hard to it is.
So, while Donna and her partner headed off to go deliver some pizzas, for his job. They were gone for less than an hour, and in that time Paul broke into their home. The level of destruction and psychological cruelty he inflicted to their empty home is hard to overstate. So to start with, though he killed their pet cat. He slashed the pet's throat and dissected its body, and the cat's body was then posed on the kitchen floor and written in the animal's blood above the stove were
the words quote, Donna, You're dead. He also murdered two kittens, again cutting their throat and placing them in the bathtub.
Oh my gosh, this guy is a piece of shit.
There were also pornographic images that were slashed and pasted on mirrors and the wardrobe, and most disturbingly, inside the crib where they baby actually slept.
Wow.
Shaving cream was sprayed all over the bathroom mirror, furniture was slashed and cut open. Rooms were trashed. I cannot describe what he did in there enough now. When Donna and her partner returned and saw the blood on the floor, they immediately called police and what they found was, Yeah, this deliberate, hateful scene of psychological warfare.
Basically, you almost would have wondered, you know, she might not have been safe, but I also think, like her baby, he might have killed the baby too, very much.
So possible. Yeah, now terrified, Donna understandably refused to return to that unit. She and her family moved out that very same night and moved in ironically with her sister who lived right next door to Paul.
Oh yeah, cool. And they had no idea who it was.
They had no idea it was. They had no idea who was responsible. And it wasn't until months later, after Paul was actually arrested for many other things that we'll be getting into that it actually came to light. And at that time, you know, after the fact, when he was arrested, he was asked, well, I guess no, he asked. He just admitted on his own about what would happen if Donna was home that night. Huh. And he, quote verbatim,
said I would have killed her. So yes, going out on that pizza delivery with her her hobby saved her life.
Dang.
So it was clear now that Paul was testing his limits at this time. He didn't just want to scare someone. He wanted to control, hurt and terrorize them. It was honestly, almost a dry run for what he would soon do next. It was the kind of night you stay indoors, cold, wet and blistery, even by Melbourne's winter standards, but eighteen
year old Elizabeth Stevens had plans. On the evening of June eleventh, nineteen ninety three, she left a note for her aunt and uncle, the relatives she was living with in Langwarren. She said she was headed to the taff Tafe Cafe library and would be home by eight p m. Elizabeth had only been in Melbourne for a few months, having moved from Tasmania to study. She wanted to join the armed forces and saw education as her ticket in now. She was smart, driven and independent, the kind of person
who didn't mind walking home alone. Langworin was familiar and it felt safe to her. She caught the bus as usual and got off near Patterson Avenue. From there it was a short walk home, five minutes maybe less. However, the distance didn't matter because she would never make it home. As Elizabeth turned onto her street, Paul spotted her. He hadn't been following her, at least not intentionally, but he did see this opportunity and for Paul. That was all
he needed. It was enough. He approached her from behind, pulled out a makeshift fake pistol he'd crafted from scrap materials, and told her not to scream. Then he took her by the hand, and quite literally took her by the hand and walked her down the street as if there were just two people headed home together. At least one other passerby saw them, and because of the fear overwhelming Elizabeth, that person didn't think twice. They just seemed like two
regular people holding hands. Paul continued and led Elizabeth to Lloyd Park. Lloyd Park Reserve, a stretch of open land and trees not far from where she lived with her aunt and her uncle. The area itself wasn't isolated, but on a cold, windy, rainsoaked night like this, it may have well been in the middle of nowhere, because no one was around and no one would hear her scream
if she had. Once they reached a more secluded area, away from the path and hidden by trees, Paul stopped walking, and it was here he began to talk to her, not like someone who was about to kill her, but almost like he was trying to play some twisted fantasy. He told her she didn't have to be scared. Then, out of nowhere, he asked if she wanted to have sex.
It was a genuine It wasn't a genuine question. It was a power move, a moment designed to confuse her, to disarm her, maybe to make her think this was about something else entirely, according to his later confession, he claimed he had only made this question about sex to test her reaction, as if this entire counter was encounter with some sort of game he was playing, and when she didn't respond or give him the answer he wanted,
he followed up with a bizarre reassurance. He told her he wasn't a sexual threat and she didn't have anything to worry about. But of course the truth was she most certainly did. Elizabeth never ran, She didn't scream. She allegedly screamed once, but that was about it, and some believe she may have sensed that it would only escalate
things if she did again. Others think she froze, still trying to figure out if this was robbery, a mugging, or something worse, But Paul later admitted that she stayed relatively calm, which only made what happen next even more disturbing because Paul then attacked. He choked her until she passed out, and then he drug her deeper into the park, and when he was sure she couldn't fight back, he pulled out a knife. You know those makeshift ones that
he fashioned himself. Yeah, possibly at the boathouse or whatever, right, but he used that knife and he stabbed her multiple times in the throat, causing her to bleed out. The autopsy later confirmed that the actual cause of death was aspiration of blood and hemorrhaging from stab wounds to the neck combined with the effects of the strangulation. So essentially, she died from choking on her.
Own blood, and she was just in the wrong place at the wrong time, really exactly.
However, though the attack didn't stop here after she was already dead, Paul inflicted additional wounds to Elizabeth's body, and these included stab wounds and deep slashes across her torso and her chests. A criss cross pattern kind of carved into her skin, akin to like potentially a sort of signature that baffled investigators at the time. Her face was also stomped on, breaking several facial bones, which showed the
intent not just to kill, but to brutalize her remains. Still, there was no evidence of sexual assault, either during, before or after the attack, which highlights anger towards.
Yeah, what the actual shit? So he was just like playing.
With her after, yes, basically.
Exploring basically like what he could do with this knife, and like, I don't.
Know, I think he was. I think you're right. He was kind of like playing with her in a certain sense. But I think it was not a happy like, oh, I'm enjoying playing with this. I think it was a strict power thing. He hated women, which we'll get into. He hated women, and he was using that as a means of like, I'm gonna stomp on your face. I'm gonna do whatever the fuck I want with you, and I carve you up sort of thing.
You know, she's already dead and he's stomping on her face. Yes, Oh, this is so disturbing.
Now. Once he was done, he drugged her body into a culvert nearby, where he dumped tree branches on top of her and left her. Her body was found the next day by a man who is collecting pine branches in the park. She was located just two hundred and fifty meters from her home.
I bet he didn't expect to find that.
No, the community was shocked, but still thought it might be an isolated case, a one off, a tragedy, yes, but not a pattern, at least not right now. But that illusion wouldn't last long. Just under a month after Elizabeth's murder, things in Frankston took yet another dark turn, and this time the pace picked up fast. Pace pickened, picked picked up, fast, picked up, picked up, it picked
up fast. It was Thursday, July eighth, nineteen ninety three, still midwinter, and yes, if you're curious, because Australia, their winter is our summer, and vice versa. Just before six pm, Rosa Toth, a forty one year old woman, got off the train and see at the Seaford station and started
walking home along her usual route. Was then she noticed a man lingering near the public toilets along the path, but she didn't really think of it much of it until moments later, when she felt herself being grabbed from behind the man. Of course, Paul held what looked like
a gun to her head and told her not to scream. Rosa, however, wasn't going down without a fight, She realized the gun was fake and managed to break free bold towards a road, and a passing by vehicle stopped and the driver helped her get away safely and get home.
Oh yeah, okay good.
She was shaken a little bit bruised from the physical encounter, but she was more than alive and happy to be so. And if Rosa hadn't fought like hell, she'd likely be a footnote in Paul's growing list of victims.
Yeah, it would have been like she would have died for sure.
Yeap. That same night, just a few kilometers away, Deborah Freme vanished. Now. Deborah was twenty two. She was a new mom and had just left her twelve day old baby at home with a friend so she could quickly grab some milk for dinner. She got in the car and drove to the local store. You know, you get some milk and get what she needed. However, she just never came back.
No.
Now, her partner and friend were immediately worried. She only planned to be gone like ten minutes is what it would take her, and she wasn't the kind of person to disappear without a word. They called police, They called the hospital, there was nothing, No one knew anything. Deborah was officially reported missing within hours. Four days later, a farmer in Karum Downs made a grim discovery. Debora's body had been dumped near a wire fence along Taylor's Road.
Like Elizabeth, She'd been strangled and had her throat cut. There's no signs of sexual assault, just a frenzied, rage fueled attack, brutal.
You know, that could have even been the first time she had left her baby, could just to get out quick or whatever.
Yep.
Oh, no, this guy is such a piece of shit.
You're gonna get through this, I am.
But that's like thatun's so sad that it's like a twelve day old baby.
Well honestly, and it's so unfortunate that that kid's only going to know it's mom from you know, photos or stories what other people tell them.
Yep.
Forensic investigators also found her car abandoned in a nearby street, with a fresh dint in the front. The driver's seat was pushed all the way back, and traces of Dever's blood were found in the front seat and interior. Paul later admitted that he hid in the back seat while she was at the store. So she ran inside real quick to grab the milk. He took advantage of an
unlocked car and climbed in the back seat. When she returned and started driving, he threatened her with that same fake gun and forced her to drive past her house straight out to where he would eventually kill her. By now two women were dead, a third had narrowly escaped, and for police, the pieces were starting to come together that he still didn't have a name, but someone was attacking in a string of incidents.
Yeah, they have to take this more seriously now.
By late July, the Frankston area was on edge. People were locking the doors, looking over their shoulders, and for the first time, women in the community were being told not to walk alone. It wasn't official yet, but the whispers had started that there was a serial killer on the loose. And then it happened again. Natalie Russell was seventeen. She was bright, kind and very well liked. She went to John Paul College, not far from where Elizabeth and
Deborah had lived. On Friday, July thirtieth, she had her usual school day, said goodbye to her friends, and left early to head home. Now normally she rode her bike, but had been raining that morning, so her mum dropped her off that morning instead. She was going to take the bus or as so the plan was. But for whatever reason, reasons that are unclear, she didn't take the bus and she walked home her usual route. Instead. She took her regular shortcut, a footpath that squeezed between two
golf courses, shielded by a long chain link fence. That path now is renamed NAT's Track. It was familiar to her. She walked it all the time. Paul had been there early that day. He pre cut holes on the fence at three different points, and he parked nearby and waited, crouched in his yellow Toyota Corona, slouched down low, binoculars in hand, just waiting for the right person to pass. When Natalie did pass, he followed quietly at first, then he moved in. He approached him behind and grabbed her
through one of the cut holes in the fence. He wrapped his left arm around her neck and pulled her backwards through this hole. But Natalie wasn't just like his previous victims. She fought back, and she gave it her all. She fought hard, She kicked, she scratched, she screamed. She struggled, and the scene that was left behind that investigators would eventually find it showed a large area of grass flattened
out where the struggle would have occurred. Her struggle left behind a trail of blood, skin, hair, some of which was hers, some of which wasn't. It was that evidence that would later tie Paul to this mark.
Okay, so she was She at least was given the police something they could use.
Once he had her pinned in that bushed area, Paul used a leather strap to try and strangle her. That strap, though, snapped under the force that he used to try and choke her. He was using such force that the leather strap snapped, so he used his hands instead and then the knife. Natalie was strangled and stabbed multiple times in the throat and upper chest in what forensic experts later
described as a frenzied attack. Her injuries were brutal. Paul left her body there where she died in the undergrowth and walked away casually. Now, what he didn't know was that he was spotted as he was waiting for his victim. There was a postal worker who saw him sitting in his car crouched and looking a little bit suspicious. This postal worker reported what they saw to the police, and as Paul walked away, heading back to his car, he passed the very same police officers who'd responded to that
post to workers call. His hands were still bloodied. As he saw them approaching, he shoved them into his pockets and walked right past. Natalie's parents grew worried when she didn't get off the bus and get home as usual. Yep, but still they were waiting, thinking that she'd walk through that front door of the home at any minute. However,
she never did. Eventually, she was reported missing that evening, and when she didn't come home, everyone was worried and police were sent out, and by eleven pm police would find her body, just meters off the track that she routinely walked.
You would just be hoping that, oh, man, like you would know that this friggin psychotic person is out there, and you would just be hoping, like, oh my goodness, that she is got caugh or to a friend's house or something.
Or maybe after school work with a teacher, or who knows what. All the reasons would be flooding in your head. Yeah, but there's that one thing that would just be eating at you. No red yeah, knowing that there's a string of violent crimes that are occurring now. This time, though, after this attack, things would come crashing down because Paul had made a mistake during the attack. There was a small piece of skin, not Natalie's, that was found inside
one of her neck wounds. And of course this was due to Natalie fighting back as much as she did. Paul picked the wrong victim. He may have got her, but trust me when I say Natalie got him back. Okay.
Good.
DNA testing would later confirm that it came from the killer. Police now had their physical evidence, and just hours before Natalie was murdered, as I mentioned, there was a postal worker who spotted something strange, this yellow car, this man inside. There was no plates on the vehicle or anything, but there were some identifying factors and they were able to identify the car and eventually get the registration, and that registration came back to Paul Dnyer.
Oh okay, shit's going down. Good.
When police arrived at his place the next day, he answered the door. He was calm. He even invited the police in and he chatted like there was no big deal. He had scratches on his hands and a few cuts, and when they asked where he'd been, he had answers. In fact, he had too many answers. Actually, he could recall every single hour of every single day for like
the last month, with perfect clarity. Where were you on this day, Where were you on this day when each victim was killed, and he knew exactly where he was, where he was, what time. It was weird, it was almost rehearsed.
Yeah, like that is not normal.
Yeah. They did bring him in back to the station and they started a formal interview. For the first few hours, Paul stuck to his story. He had car trouble, that's why you saw him park there. Oh, he was bad luck, he's wrong placed at the wrong time, and all these sort of things. He had reasons and answers for everything. But what he didn't know was that detectives were already working overtime behind the scenes. His car was being forensically combed,
his home was being searched. Officers found binoculars, ones that did not have a leather strap on them anymore, knives, and a pair of pliers the exact kind that you could use to snip through chainling fences, like the chainling fence that was snipped right at Napstrack. And remember that piece of skin that they found during Natalie's autopsy, That DNA was about to be matched right to Paul. It
was all adding up and Paul knew it. During a break in questioning, one of the detectives, Darren O'Laughlin sat with him was wearing a visible Christian cross under his shirt, something that caught Paul's attention. He leaned in and he asked Darren if he believes in God. Darren said yes. Paul replied with something that chilled Darren to the core. He told him, you can lie to me, but you can't lie to God. And just like that, the damn broke.
Paul admitted to everything, the murder of Elizabeth, Deborah, Natalie, the attack on Rosa, and even the break in at Donna's apartment months earlier, the one where he mutilated the pets left, the grotesque violent messages and everything. He didn't stumble, he didn't hesitate. Once he started, it poured out in a disturbing, matter of fact detail, almost as if he was like doing a PowerPoint presentation, and he knew how to deliver this story.
He just said it all that gives me goosebumps, just being that investigator sitting there and starting this off with that bizarre question like.
You can lie to God but you can't, So you can lie to me, but you can't light to God.
Yeah, and just like unleashes all the shit that he's done.
Oh. He walked investigators through the murders step by step. He even took them to key locations, showed them where he had hidden Deborah's purse that was missing, described how he watched Natalie before ambushing her. He talked about the fake gun, the stalking, how he'd quote just had the feeling, you know, just the urge to kill. It wasn't rage, it wasn't impulsive. This was clearly deliberate and planned, and
worst of all, it was void of any emotion. Detective sat and listened as Paul described the final moments of three innocent women like he was talking about just changing a tire on the side of the road. After the confession, there wasn't much left for the courts really to figure out in terms of guilt. Paul had laid it all out, the timeline, methods, you name it all, of it his motives,
even or at least what he passed his motives. But the legal system still had to go through the motions and maybe more importantly, try to understand what kind of person would commit crimes like this in such a cold detachment. Paul was charged with three counts of murder and one of abduction. He didn't fight it. There was no trial by jury because he poleted guilty across the board, and within a month he was standing before the Supreme Court
of Victoria waiting to be sentenced. But before that happened, a team of forensic psychologists had a crack at trying to figure him out, and what they found was chilling. Paul was not delusional, He wasn't hearing voices, suffering from psychosis, nothing like that. He knew what he was doing and he enjoyed it. What he was eventually diagnosed with was sadistic personality disorder. Now it's not a condition you hear about very often, and it's not even officially recognized in
modern diagnostic manuals anymore. But in Paul's case, it fit like a glove. Sadistic personality disorder is exactly what it sounds like, a deep seated pleasure in inflicting pain, fear, and suffering onto others. It's not about losing control or snapping in the heat of the moment. Instead, it's about power, control and gratification through torment. And as one psychologist put it, quote,
the more aggressive he became, the more powerful he felt. Okay, Paul said he wanted to kill since he was fourteen years old. He'd been stalking women for years, long before the murders. The mutilation of animals, you know, that wasn't just a warning sign. It was part of the pattern one we kind of honestly discuss all too often in this podcast, and one that, for whatever reason, people still just don't see as a red flag. There was also
a deep misogynistic thread running through it all. Paul didn't just kill. He targeted women exclusively, and he admitted to hating them. He was never sexually motivated by the crimes. Not a single one of his victims were sexually abused or any sort of evidence of that found. But he repeated expressed anger and disgust towards women, saying he wanted to quote take it out on them.
Okay, do we know why he hated women? Like was there something from his like upbringing or childhood or something that just made him be like.
This, not as far as we're aware of, No, what the shit? Hey, now there was like during interviews he did cite a movie. This movie was called The Stepfather. It's something that you know, it seems to have influenced, sorry, influenced him a bit. It's a thriller about a man who murders families and reinvents himself like over and over. It's disturbing in itself, but it explains Paul's actions, like about how him maybe being impression. So maybe he got
this like hatred for women from somewhere. Maybe it's from movies. Maybe it's like other serial killers we talked about where they target sex workers, and you know, maybe it's linked to that. It's just speculation. But what we do know is, hey, he inspired from a movie in certain aspects, so he may be influential. He's influenced relatively easy.
Yeah.
On December twentieth, nineteen ninety three, Paul was sentenced to three consecutive life sentences with no chance of parole. The court recognized the sheer brutality of his crimes his lack of remorse and the public risk he posed. It seemed like the end of the story. But eleven days later, Paul appealed it.
Okay. I was just like, okay, we're wrapping up here, and then you just stared at me.
Yeah, Paul won his appeal.
What shit, Yeah, there's no way, there's no way.
In July nineteen ninety four, a higher court granted him a non parole period of thirty years. It meant that despite everything, Paul Denier could in theory, walk free as early as twenty twenty three. That's two years ago.
Okay, but why, like this was solid they had, like he admitted to shit like d in detail, there's no way.
Well, what they're granting him is early, is that he can in fact get parole. It still has these three consecutive life sentences, but they're saying, okay, he can get parole after thirty years.
Okay, that's just seems so ridiculous to me. I what a fuck of a bunch of shit.
I agree? Can I continue though? You good?
Yeah?
Okay. So over Over the course of the next little bit, Paul began to settle into prison life, and things honestly get a little weirder from here. See Paul during his time in prison. It wasn't He wasn't exactly quiet. After his sentencing, he bounced around from a couple facilities, starting at Melbourne Assessment Prison, then moving to HM Prison Bowern and later to Port Philip Prison. Inmates like Paul usually end up in maximum security for obvious reasons, and that's
where he stayed. But the story didn't end with you know, prison gate slamming. Around two thousand and three, ten years into his sentence, Paul announced he was now transgendered and wanted to transition to living as a woman. He asked to be known as PAULA, requested makeup, female clothing, hormone therapy, and even gender reassignment surgery, all while serving a sentence for violent murders of three young women.
Well yeah, because he hated women.
Yeah, So to say that there's these these requests sparked some outrage. It's a bit of an understatement. But before we discuss anything further on this topic, I want to say, like, all the power to all any trans gendered individuals out there, Like there are reasons I'm still referring to Paul with his name Paul and with male pronouns and not paula and female pronouns like he's requesting. There's reasons while people are a bit upset with it, and trust me, reasons
that I'll explain. Whether you agree with me or not right now, you will agree with me at the end, and there's reasons. I got you, okay, so just bear with me. Hear this out fully.
So.
Victims' families were horrified. They saw it as an attention attention seeking stunt and basically a big old slap in the face. The mother of one of the victims described it as sickening, and many others agreed because the idea of someone who had brutally murdered women when they openly showed disgust towards them and citing it as motivation for their acts, and then turning around and would want to become one just didn't sit right. And not just morally
but logist logistically too. Moving Paul into a women prison and giving him access to female spaces after crimes that were so explicitly rooted in violence against women, it was hard for it was hard for authorities, and it was honestly like, you're putting other people at serious risk, putting them in that facility as well.
Yeah, that's a bit scary, isn't it.
Yeah, still not done fully explaining. So if you're still on the edge and angry with me, just bear with me. I'll get there. So this was taken seriously. Authorities didn't just scoff at the idea and assume it was bogus. Psychiatrists were brought in to assess the request, and after evaluation, his requests for gender reassignment surgery was denied. Officials ruled that Paul did not meet the criteria for genuine, long
standing gender dysphoria diagnosis. They didn't see the transition as legitimate, at least not enough to justify the risk or the cost. Still, for a while, Paul continued identifying as paula within within the prison walls. He wore women's clothes, attempted to present as feminine, and pushed hard for legal name changes and
gender recognition. None of those were approved. And this is where I'm really gonna solidify why I'm saying Paul and he him still because eventually, according to a twenty twenty two documentary called No Mercy nor Morse, Paul reverted to identifying as Paul once again, Paul is now Paul, he him, which is exactly why I'm referring to Paul as Paul and he him. Paul is no longer Paula. Paula and she her are is a dead identity to Paul. Paul is Paul now.
So it was kind of a short, short time span that he came up with this plan.
Correct, And like to be clear, like, gender identity is complex and it's very deep, a very deeply personal matter, and we do understand that, but when it comes to violent offenders, particularly those with documented hatred towards women, it just hit everyone a little bit differently. Yeah, and that's why Paul's transition it remains such a lightning rod for debate, especially in Australia's criminal justice system where he resides.
Right, but you can respect that they gave him the opportunity, like they did take it somewhat seriously, right, they did.
They did. They brought in psychiatrists, they evaluated, and they're like, we believe this is just basically a move for you to get like some better treatment of some sort, some more attention potentially, And the idea that Paul came right back to being Paul once again, it doesn't confirm that, but it supports that idea.
Well, imagine him going into like this if say this was like some sick game or something, right, and then then him moving into a woman's facility and then like murdering right, someone else in there. Oh, just the thought of that, it's fucking terrifying.
Exactly. So there's a whole like you can argue so much on both sides of the fence in this, and trust me, I get many of the the aspects, but I personally firmly believe whatever he identified as, whether it was PAULA and different pronouns or whether it was still Paul and his current pronouns, regardless, there is no way that that individual should be sharing the walls with other females because that is the people they hate and the
people they target. Yeah, if you have someone who just hates women and they are a woman, and they go into a women's prison, they're probably going to continue hurting women because that's their target demographic on who they injure and who they harm and who they want to take out.
So, because even if there was some like rehibitbilitation going on, and maybe he didn't necessarily hate women like the chances of it coming back too are there when he's like within the walls of like and being surrounded by a whole bunch of women like, I don't, Yeah, it just seems kind of scary.
Oh for sure. And like for the victims' families and like the focus on like, the focus remained unchanged. Like they wanted to keep Paul in prison. What ever, name, hughes, whatever identity they claimed, like, that's fine, but to them it was it's still the person who stole their daughters, like their sisters, their partner, And they were not happy with the idea of others being at risk too. So it's a matter of safety of others. It was the idea.
But as a clock ticked towards twenty twenty three, another storm was coming. By twenty twenty three, three decades had passed and Paul was hey. He was locked up for murder. Right. The public might have moved on, but families never did. And suddenly that whole past came roaring back. Because twenty twenty three marked that thirty year mark, and thanks to a successful previous appeal back in nineteen ninety four, it
meant one thing. He was officially eligible for parole. Now, let's be clear, parole eligibility doesn't guarantee release, but just the possibility sent shockwaves through the community. The idea that the man who once wanted to kill since he was fourteen could just walk free, that he could be out there riding the bus next to someone's daughter. That's scary. Uh huh.
Yeah, Well, because it wasn't just like one like he was like a serial killer.
He was a serial killer. Yes. Natalie Russell's parents, Brian and Carmel, they were among the loudest voices fighting to keep Paul behind bars. Their daughter had been just seventeen years old when her life was stolen, and they weren't about to let another killer, sorry, let a killer walk free without a fight and potentially steal another life. Her brother, Darren, now a doctor and expert in transgendered health, publicly questioned
Paul's sincerity about transitioning. So you even have a transgendered health professional questioning his genuine intent and spoke out against his release. His words carried weight, calm, rational, and they were, of course deeply personal. Former homicide detective journalist lawyer, sorry, detectives journalist lawyer. There was commas in there. I just didn't say that when I was reading it, and even
politicians state started speaking out. Some were shocked to learn Paul had even been given a non parole period in the first place. One of these people leading the charge was David Limbrick, a member of Victoria's parliament and, perhaps most heartbreakingly, Natalie Russell's boyfriend at the time she was murdered.
Dang, look at Natalie's family and friends just killing it, eh, I know, right, like they just became I don't like these individuals that are have some power to like stop this shit from going on.
Yeah. Now, David became a powerful advocate in the campaign to change Victoria's parole laws to permanently ban Paul from ever being released. David even received a letter directly from Paul himself, sent via a loophole in prison communication laws that allow inmates to write mpeace. In the letter, Paul insisted he's rehabilitated, that he no longer is a danger, that he wouldn't return to Frankfort or lang Warren. He even suggested David might want to advocate on his behalf.
Oh okay, As.
You can imagine, that letter didn't go over well. Yeah, In fact, it only added fuel to the fire. It was seen as arrogant, manipulative, and above all dangerous. Paul had spent thirty years writing letters, filing appeals and attempting to reinvent himself. But never once, not once, in those thirty years behind bars, did he ever show any real remorse what he did. He's simply I'm better now, I'm a different person. Now I'm safe, now where I'm good. It was all about Paul, Okay.
I was gonna ask that if there was any like sincerity or apology or remorse or anything that he was showing. But it doesn't seem so not really.
His parole was formerly denied in twenty twenty three, but that wasn't enough to stop the calls of change. Public pressure mounted for what's known as Australia Sorry, known in Australia as a no bud parole law, basically a law that says some criminals are so horrific, so irreversible, that
no amount of time served is enough. Similar laws have already been passing for other violent offenders like Russell Street, the Rest Sorry, the Russell Street bomber, Craig Minogue, the Little Street mass shooter, Julian Knight, but for some reason, Paul wasn't included in those ones, and it still stings for many. So now it's become a cause not just to keep Paul behind bars, but to make sure that he never even gets to ask for parole again. The
fear is an abstract. Paul himself said he wanted to kill again at one point, right he admitted to stalking women for years, even before the first murder. He thrived on power and control and clinical consensus. People like Paul just they don't change. That's kind of what it seems like. So that fight still continues to this day to ensure Paul stays behind bars. Now, all that being said, it's really easy sometimes and stories like this to focus on
the killer rather than the victims. You have the headlines, documentary, the twisted psychology behind it all, and it can feel like a person who caused all this harm gets most of the attention. And here on our podcast we try to tell the victim's story more often than not than the perpetrator, though sometimes it is hard to always do that. But Paul didn't create his own legacy. In my opinion, Paul stole it from Elizabeth Deborah and Natalie. These weren't
names in a case file. They were women, real people with full lives, plans and potential. Elizabeth had moved from Tasmanian to Melbourne with dreams of joining armed forces. She was just eighteen, quiet, determined and kind hearted and brave even in her final moments. Deborah had just become a mother. Her baby was only twelve days old when she left to buy milk for dinner. She was twenty two, deeply in love with her partner, excited about the next chapter
in their life. She never even got to hold her son again. Natalie was seventeen, in her final year of school. She was smart, strong, funny, someone who didn't just accept the world but questioned it, the kind of person who probably would have gone on to do something amazing. What connects these women, besides the cruelty of how they died, is the strength they gave others. Their families never stopped fighting, their communities didn't forget, and their names are still spoken
with love and with respect. There's now a memorial pathway that I kind of already alluded to, that's named NAT's Track, where Natalie was attack and killed. It's a simple beautiful walking trail with flowers, a bench and seventeen daisies carved into a bronze sculpture, one for every year of her life. It's peaceful and powerful. Deborah's son, Jake, grew up without a mother, but he's he said, her memory lives with the people who keep speaking her name, who fight for
justice on her behalf. Same for Elizabeth. Her family never let her story fade even across the decades. There's also been a lasting change at the legal level. The Paul Denier case brought renewed focus on how parole works in Victoria, how repeat offenders are handled, and how communities respond to the threat of serial violence. While Paul himself has for now been denied paroled, Push continues to ensure others like
him are never released. His crimes helped change policies, but the real power came from the people who refuse to let the justice system forget who it was built to protect. And that is the story of the Frankston murders.
Oh that's a doozy, Yeah it is.
Wow. So you can blame Patreon for that one because they brought it to my attention and dang and heavy.
Yeah it is I also, I don't know, just to like very lightly touch on this, the whole appeal process just sucks for like the victims' families. It has to just like bring like you're just opening all those wounds again. I feel like, and you have to you have to do something or else these monsters are gonna just walk free. Yeah, So I hope that they don't really have to go through this, like I don't know if it's like every
five years or what. I hope that he just they just make a decision or something changes where he just stays in there, and that's that because he deserves to stay in there. There's no way that man should get out.
Of there, agreed, Because I'm almost certain if he gets out, he will hurt someone again.
Yeah, because even in there, it seems like he's still just playing these fucking.
Games pretty much pretty much.
Yeah, And and honestly not not. It hasn't like I don't think it's going to ever sink in for him or just like what he did and how he destroyed people's lives. It's it's, yeah, it's not. He hasn't realized that, I don't think, and I don't think he will.
He may have I just don't think he cares.
Well, yeah, he maybe realizes, but like, yeah, he doesn't give a shit. Yeah, like there's no remorse. Nope, And that's not okay.
It's not. But that's situation. That's where they're sitting at. And honestly, I mean, I don't know exactly how many times he can proll or how many like what's the waiting period in between? But yeah, honestly, give it a couple of years. He could be on the streets.
And to think that he did all of this brutal shit too when he was like twenty one day. Yeah, that is so young to be turning into a complete monster. And he had prior to like at fourteen or even like ten or whatever, Like, Oh, I.
Honestly, now, mind you, I'm not a legal individual. I don't know like how it all works and stuff. So there could be rules that prevent this or reason or rules that like kind of align with what I'm saying. I'm unaware, but am my opinion. I believe if someone is able to be granted parole, I think it should stack according to just like their sentences. He has three life sentences, so he should be able to get parole. Stacked. I mean, maybe after a life sentences he can get
parole in ten years, and maybe that's what happened. They stacked it up to thirty. I don't know, yeah, but I think whatever the parole is, it should be stacked, just like the sentence.
Yeah, fair enough, you know. Yeah. You have to also wonder. I would almost like want to speak to his parents. Dude, are they just you know, like, wow, okay, yeah, like we we realize that we like we're raising the serial killer, you know, yeah? Or is it just there? It's their kid and they're kind of blind to things and they didn't really see it coming at all.
Could you imagine that conversation though, in hindsight be like, yeah, you know what, No, I think about it when he was like ten and he gutted the family cat and yeah, I guess I don't know.
Just yeah, the thought though, like they they're honestly, I'm if this has affected them beyond words. I'm sure too, like the fact that they this is their son, like they birth this person that did terrible things. Gosh, not that I'm blaming them in any way, but frick, can you imagine.
It would have some repercussions on your mental health most likely.
Yeah, the siblings and stuff like, holy shit, like my my brother is a fucking serial killer.
Yeah, I'm sure they probably disown him in all honesty.
Yeah, but sometimes families don't. That's true, so they're like in it thicker thin I guess.
Anyways, that was the Yeah, the Frankston murders of the Paul danyon Den your case. Wow, he's a piece of shit. I hope he rots. I hope he never gets parole. He deserves to rot.
Oh, he does not deserve to get out of there.
No, If you guys have a case you'd like to send into us, shoot us a message or an email or something like that. We get a lot of requests, so I'm not saying it's going to happen, but we can definitely, you know, maybe add it to our list and take a look and see what we got. We appreciate you being here, being here. We got a list of stuff in the description of the podcast. If you want to give us a rating, that is honestly the best way you can help the show. It's what keeps
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Well well done as usual and until next time, stay wicked.