Well, Hello, I'm Nicole and I'm Ben, and you are listening to Wicked.
And Grim, which is a true time podcast party following post.
Hey what's up guys? Yo, cheers you cheers, sippity sip the whole nine yards with the.
Grim chairs, I'm actually drinking tazzo Calm the fuck down.
Ty, Calm the fuck downty. Is that what it's actually called? No, I really hope it is. They should put that on the label.
It's just called Calm the fuck down. But I think if it was called what you just said, like, they would actually sell more.
Probably. Yeah, I'm just drinking coffee with a higher percent of alcohol than normal. Probably it may or may not be spiked.
Do you ever have coffee that's not spiked? Oh?
I do? Oh yeah, I actually I really enjoy black coffee.
Yeah you do.
I do, like no cream, no sugar that hits home.
But you'd enjoy it more when there's some what is it Caroline Carolins in there?
Yeah, but not all the time. If I do it too much, I get sick of it and I'm like, I don't want this for a while. Like I haven't had Carolins in my coffee for over a week. I think. Wow, other than.
Other than iced coffee, the bougie ice coffee, the ice coffees. Yes, we're all about those. Love it Okay, so fun packed, fun, major funds, super fun.
You ready for this?
This is the last podcast we're going to be recording in our house.
Yes, next episode is officially going to be in our tiny home because we are moving in in like five days Saturday, So it's Monday right now as we're recording, and Saturday we are going to be moving in.
Which is wild. So it's gonna be like a teeny tiny.
Podcast, a teeny tiny podcast, Oh god, I mean it'll still be. We can gree it.
Will be exactly the same, but well, we'll have to see it. Might I don't know if it will sound different. We're gonna be sitting in bean bag chairs, which is kind of sod.
Yeah, in a little tiny loft up in our podcast or up in our tiny home little podcast studio we made.
Yeah, I'm actually really excited.
You guys will get a tour of that real soon. Don't worry. We've just been so far behind we haven't really been able to show much of that yet. Yeah, it looks that we will and inside's a bit of a disaster right now because we're just trying to move stuff in. So once it's a little more organized it looks better, then we'll show you.
We still actually have a lot of things in the house, so we have a busy week.
Yeah we do. We're still making shelves. And I wrecked one wall. Yeah yeah, putting up shells. The nails went through the wall because it's just like a little like covered sort of thickness area.
Anyways, nails garready wreck and shit, so well now I.
Got to fix the other side.
Fun Okay, I actually have something Oaks super fun to they do.
Okay, what's up?
Okay, So I did like our Monday sneak peek or what are what do we call, like guests the podcast or whatever. Yeah, and it's been over an hour. No one's guessed it.
Yes, so hopefully no one gets this case and we can officially say we fooled you guys.
It's so funny because I actually thought people would get this right away. But it is like a bit of a random photo. It doesn't have a lot to do with the case, but I was like thinking.
It's a pretty synonymous photo with this case that you said.
Right, well, I thought so.
Well, either way, we'll see if we fool them.
I think it'd be sweet if I fooled them, because I told you the other day I'm gonna be the one that does it, and there.
It might be. Well, that's totally fine with me.
So far, I'm winning.
We we What are you talking about?
You? Okay? Now, so it's a competition between see you if they'll get it, and between us apparently.
Well yeah, before we dive into the case, can I say one more thing? Of course, I want to wish a happy belated birthday to Chili Bob, who is one of our listeners who's been there from the start and has actually been supporting me as a creator before the podcast even totally. Her birthday was actually on last Tuesday when last episode dropped. I didn't even know.
That, how rude.
I knew her birthday was like coming up, but I didn't know when, and then I figured it out and it was too late. So happy belated birthday out there to Chili Bob. We appreciate you. Hope your birthday was amazing, and hopefully the rest of the month continues to be amazing. Birth month for you.
Happy Birthday. Boom boom done. Okay, are you ready?
I'm ready.
My hands are freezing. So we're going to see how this goes here.
Okay, it'll work. Maybe it's because there's like ghosts in the room.
I think there are.
It's spooky season.
Ever since the last episodes, I just have not been the same. I just haven't been the same. Shit's just just yeah.
She's been creeping me out to a little bit more than normal.
It is getting better, Like I'm like, it took a week though, apparently, like oh, Ben, like just he's off on us.
Please Here, we're only diving into this spooky shit, especially when October hits, and then you know we're going headlong into that. And there's one case that I've been wanting to cover since day one that I've been saving specifically for Halloween.
Sounds intriguing, you know what it is? Yeah, but you know me, I forget things really easy.
Should I tell? Should I tell them what it is? Or should I make them wait?
Tell?
Okay, because there's going to be a bunch of stuff we drop in October.
Yeah, October is going to be a sweet month.
You guys can look forward to this case at least this is going to be a case of Robert the Doll. I love this case.
Okay, I didn't know this.
Yeah, And Robert the Doll was the inspiration for the Child's play movies. He was the inspiration for Chucky. Oh, okay in October.
Oh I love that.
Yeah.
Okay, Well, I'm going to start this and do it. Let's see, like, okay, if it didn't come out on Facebook or on Instagram, on Facebook too, we have both. It's Marcus Wesson and that's about all I know about the case. So Marcus was born on August twenty second, nineteen forty six, in Kansas, to parents of Benjamin and Carrie Wesson. He was the oldest of four children, and he was raised as a member of the Seventh Day Adventist Church, which is like a Protestant Christian denomination.
Okay, gotcha.
He himself claiming that his mother was a religious fanatic and his father was an alcoholic, was an alcoholic and a child abuser, including sexual abuse. Oh shit, who abandoned the family when Marcus was just a young boy.
I mean, being abandon it's never a good thing. But if he was a a father like that, that's good. That they're now out of their lives.
Yeah. Really I never looked at it like that. The mother would also physically abuse the children, of course, So I don't know. And it's interesting because it's like so many, so many cases is that we cover, right, like or just cases out there like the vic or the I don't know what the bad person, the perpetrator. Yeah, there you go, has like kind of a shitty upbringing and that just sucks.
It seems like that's that's very what's the now, I'm forgetting words prominent, very prominent. Yeah, their upbringing. Yeah, it's it's something that occurs often.
I know. Well, now I'm like one of I mean, I'm sure we've covered some cases where they've had Yeah, we have where they've had a perfect upbringing.
I'm sure we have.
Well is there ever a nothing's perfect? There's no perfect upbringing.
A normal a good.
Upbringing, Yeah, what you would classify as normal. Yeah, So the family would relocate to San Bernardino, California. I hope him saying that right in the early nineteen sixties. Marcus would eventually drop out of high school and join the army, serving from nineteen sixty six to nineteen sixty eight as a medical care provider cool. He was given an honorable discharge at the end of his service. After this time in the in the army, Marcus would meet his future lover named Rosemary made Darnina.
Okay, like that that Rosemary over the top name that I actually kind of fucking love the whole name. Yes, the whole name, just as a whole Like if I were to meet someone like named Rosemary or something like that, it's like, that's kind of an old fashioned name. But like Rosemary, what was it, ma Darnina or something?
They may don't may Oh, I said it right for the beginning and now made yeah, may don't near. I don't know. Good Lord, don't ask me if I pronounced something right the beginning. Don't ask me to pronounce it again.
Okay. Well, regardless, that whole name.
Love it, love it. It actually sounds quite nice.
Yeah.
So Rosemary was actually married at the time, though, okay, and a mother to eight children.
To eight kids. Oh, she's a busy lady.
M hmm. But this didn't deter Marcus, which it may deter some, I must, but it rather thrilled him. He was thrilled by the idea claiming they needed a shepherd.
They needed a.
Shepherd, like someone to guide them.
Yeah, well I know what a shepherd is.
Oh, it sounds like you didn't. So I was helping out.
Well, I appreciate the help, but I know what the shepherd was.
And Casey didn't know what a shepherd was. It's basically someone to help God you. So Rosemary would quickly break it off with her husband, and Marcus moved in with Rosemary and her children in their San Jose, California home. In nineteen seventy one, they welcomed their first son together. Doesn't seem all that crazy so.
Far, right, Well, I have some predictions going on in the back of my head.
Here do you do? You don't know anything about this, really do you know?
But you've already said that the father of this dude of Marcus was an abuser and sexually assaulted past some of the siblings, and the mother was an abuser. So I'm assuming he is now looking at these kids like potential victims for a sexual assault. Let's put that way, okay.
So, well, where am i? And now? Oh I'm a pulling to you. You're okay? So shit would basically take a turn in nineteen seventy four, Marcus would become fixated with one of Rosemary's.
Daughters, called it, fucking called that shit.
Little Elizabeth, who was eight years old at the time.
Oh fuck what Oh, this guy's greasy as fuck. She's eight, She's eight, God damn it.
We're going to go into more detail about this soon. But Marcus was basically like a master manipulator. He took on a godlike role in the family, which is why I believe the following like was even able to happen. Both Elizabeth and Rosemary were brainwashed by Marcus's ideas, and he was able to convince them and when I say them like, I'm more so made Rosemary, being that she was the adult because Elizabeth was eight years old, that this was God's plan.
Oh fuck, of course. It seems like a lot of people in this sort of mindset use that excuse so much. It's God's plan. Was old. Yeah. I understand that you might be religious, but I do not understand the fact that you think just because you have a point of view or feeling one way does not give you an excuse to say, well, God's making me do it. No.
Well, yeah, it's almost like these peop are just using that as an excuse for them to do terrible things.
Yeah. Well, which, in that same argument, if you are a religious individual and you say you do have these visions from God and God wants you to do these things, shouldn't you question it and say, Okay, the devil is a master manipulator. Maybe it's not God wants me to do these Maybe the devil is showing me false visions, impersonating Jesus or God or whoever you are envisioning, and you should question the validity of these and question how good these things that you're being told to do are.
Because, like we should know the difference between right and wrong.
Right, So if you're being told to do bad things by God, maybe you should question is this really God telling me this?
That's a good point. Have you had a question that?
Yeah? I have many times. Should I slap this person I work with?
No?
I really want to?
Okay, So, performing an at home marriage ceremony, Marcus would declare little Elizabeth at the age of eight his wife. Once Elizabeth was twelve years old, Marcus would begin to sexually assault her.
Okay, at the age of eight, he declared her his wife.
Yes, not, but this was just like an at home ceremony.
That's that's still really fucked up because there's there's the whole things of like fathers going and dates their daughters. You know, it's a cute see little thing.
Oh that's okay though, when you see those photos, that's the cutest shit scene.
There's cutesy little fake ceremonies you do. You know your yeah, playdates and stuff with your child. I understand that. But he fucking married his daughter, yeah, unofficially.
Yeah, and then a few years later started sexually assaulting her, and at fourteen years old, she would become pregnant. Fuck. And at fifteen years old, Marcus would legally because apparently at that point in time that was legal age. I don't know. Mary Elizabeth and she would give birth to the first of what would be eleven children. And these eleven children were all birthed before Elizabeth reached the age
of twenty six. You're a hot shit, yeah, Like I feel like that in itself is almost like using and abusing like that point. Wow, No, woman didn't get a freaking break, She.
Didn't get a fuck. She had everything taken from her at that point.
Yeah, everything everything, Wow, because like, that's just a lot of kids in a very short amount of time.
Yeah, and very young, and I'm assuming forced upon her.
Yeah, and then he I don't know if she, like she knew no other way, right, and he was manipulating her to believe that this was like the right way of life, this kind of thing. So I don't know if she was, like, I mean, he it was bad what he was doing, one hundred percent, but like, I don't know if she like knew it was bad. There was one article that said something about like that she liked the attention.
But you grow up learning that things from these figures. Oh it's right, it's right, it's right. That's false information.
Yeah, we will talk about that more too.
So this is a whole fuck up situation.
Wow, Oh this is just the fucking start. Man, like cam your titties like this, this just goes down.
I Am not going to calm my titties. I'm going to start flapping them everywhere. And if you get hit in the face, it's your own.
My own fault. Okay, Okay. So at one point in time, okay, and this is where one thing that I couldn't fully find. I think it was Elizabeth's sister, but it could also have been Rosemary's oldest daughter. But it doesn't super matter. One of these people suffered Okay, it doesn't matter because of this, it's because something else. It sucks that she suffered from a drug addiction, like not saying that's not a good thing.
But the different differentiating between the individuals isn't necessary. Okay.
So one of them was unable to care for their children so left them in the care of Elizabeth and Marcus. And that individual had seven children. So this household was just like a massive a massive amount of kids.
It's a colony at this point.
Like crazy, so basically a lot of mouse to feed.
Right, yeah, so and get this right. So far we have Rosemary having eight kids, and of those eight kids, two of them have had.
Okay, but no, we've jumped ahead. Now we're basically like Elizabeth is now with Marcus.
Okay, so Rosemary's not in the house anymore. Rosemary's gone. He left her for Elizabeth.
I don't know if she's still in the house, but like Elizabeth, it's now we're moving on to Elizabeth's and Marcus's story, right, Okay, he was never married to Rosemary.
Okay. See, I assumed like he was like married to Rosemary and married to her daughter Elizabeth.
At the same time. I don't think he was ever actually married to Rosemary. Okay, yeah, so no, we're just like we jumped ahead a little bit here to where she's had like twenty six or and now she's the twenty six children, I mean eleven children before the age of twenty six, and then now they also have like these additional kids. So it's just like a house full. I mean, that's like eighteen children, is it.
Outs that's a lot of kids.
Yeah, Like, that's a shit ton of kids.
I can't handle two huskies.
Yeah, I just think that we would be drowning. Okay, where was I hear? Do Do do doo? Okay. So Marcus was also not able to really keep a steady, steady job, receiving most of the family's income from welfare. This caused the family to kind of drift from place to place with some rather unique living arrangements. I don't know if we'll find them that unique, but some people might.
So.
At one point in time, the family lived in a twenty six foot boat, and their dinner would sometimes be scavenged hamburgers from a McDonald's dumpster, which I'm like, kind of breaks my heart. And this boat would, however, get Marcus in some trouble. He failed to disclose it as an asset when collecting welfare, which is fraud. So in nineteen ninety Marcus would actually serve some time in jail. Oh shit, I think it was only like about a year. I could never find exactly how much, but it wasn't
like a shit ton amount of time. So in the mid mid in late nineteen nineties, the family lived in a trailer and a large army tent in the Santa Cruz Mountains with no running water. They also at one point lived in a decaying sixty three foot tug boat and a school bus. Wow. So basically, I wouldn't say like life was super easy for the Wesson children.
No kidding. They definitely have it hard.
Yeah, but they don't know it right. So, However, by the late nineteen nineties, some of the children were old enough to get jobs, to which Marcus used their money to buy an old office building in Fresno, Fresno, California, Resne. I always want to say freshca like I had to like practice early, but no, it's Fresno. So though some of the living room remainement, like I said, were unique, it was also Marcus's way of keeping the family out
of site from others. None of the kids attended school because Marcus distrusted the public education system and if you lived in a neighborhood and you had seen like numerous children around midday, like you might get some questions.
Right, yeah, that's fair.
Okay, So now to dive in a bit deeper into the story, as it's been a bit fluffy, that's that's.
Fluffy fluffy so far.
That's fluffy.
That's the fluff on the top. That's ther foam la.
There go extra phone place. Okay. So unfortunately, Elizabeth was not the only girl Marcus would take an interest in.
I figured that was coming.
At an early age. He would go on to molest and have children with other young girls in his life, other girls being his daughters and his nieces. Marcus sexually us two of his daughters and three of his nieces, all beginning at the age of eight years old, which is very interesting to think that he would wait till they were like eight, Like, what what's with the eight you know? Like to me, that's still like fretting young at.
Shit, that's stupid young. But Tim, he's like eight legal, fuck, maybe you need to add teen at the end of that.
Yeah, he's like a sick monster, like so inappropriate, Like, oh my gosh, I even.
Have left trouble picturing like people with eighteen when it's like, oh, this is a forty something year old dude and she's eighteen. I'm just like just because don't mean, it's not fucking nasty.
Issue now, I know. Oh, let's just not like, let's just not go there with our minds. So each of these five girls would go on to have Marcus's children. It's believed he fathered at least seventeen children, and I say at least because I don't know, people don't know for sure with seven different women. So because that's including one with Rosemary and eleven with Elizabeth, right, so we're assuming that he had one with each of these five other girls, but other reports said there was more, so
I don't know. So, as I mentioned earlier, Marcus was a master manipulator, and his time leading and controlling the family was often compared to be like cult like. He was fascinated with David Kerr Carress, who was a famous American cult leader, which, yeah, I'll just leave it at that. Maybe we'll have to do his story.
One day or some do we at least know what cult he led?
What was it? I don't know if I, oh, shoot, I did look at the name.
You did, you don't have written down, That's okay, But it was.
What I did have written down that he played a central role in the Waco Sea siege or massacre or whatever of nineteen ninety three.
Okay.
Interesting, So I don't know. And Marcus was fascinated by him, which is like probably someone you should not be fascinated by or look up to, right, Yeah, uh so Marcus made his family his own little personal cult. He described himself as Jesus Christ and police officers as Satan.
I would describe him as many other things, many things.
He also believed that Jesus was a vampire, interesting choice, which is very interesting. He had a fascination with the undead and seeing similarities between undead creatures and Jesus.
Well, I mean technically Jesus rising from the grave.
I mean, I know, I guess, I guess you could go.
There, But that parallel has been drawn a few times pop culture and stuff. I mean zombie Easter. Once in a while will say happy zombie Jesus Day.
Oh I never heard that actually, Okay, anyway, I was just reading a loud I was like, that's fuck.
Well, Jesus' resurrection.
I know it makes sense, it will ish. I'm just not even gonna go there because like we might get in trouble from people just kidding.
We are not saying Jesus is a zombie, no, but we can understand how some people might think of it.
Yeah, so I guess we can get the correlation between him, but I still think it's weird as fuck.
Yeah.
So this led him to collect coffins, which she found at antique stores.
Hey, coffins aren't cheap. This motherfucker is supposed to be broke as shit.
Yeah, but they're I think they're like he thrifted them, so maybe they're.
Still How do you thrift a coffin? It's like, oh, this one's slightly used. Did you get a question that?
Yeah, because he stored them in his house and he had like ten, so I don't know where the oh yeah, oh what Maybe I'm assuming they were knew but maybe not.
You I don't. I would assume so as well, but I don't know.
No, my brain's going a wild here.
So I didn't realize thrifting coffins was.
A thing, yeah, because generally it's you shit.
Surplus coffins, you know, yeah, or like.
Or maybe it's that someone bought them and then could make the final payment.
I guess, yeah, what is that called?
People do that on houses, So I can't remember. I don't know. But anyway, he collected coffins, he thought they were sweet, and he even went as far as naming and giving some of his children vampire names, one being Jieva, which is a combination of Jesus and vampire. Interesting, which it's like, not a terrible name, but then if you know, if you know the background of it, you're like, oh, I mean it's interesting.
Honestly, I'm not going to knock that because, like you say, Jeeva is not a terrible name. I've heard much worse. Yeah, and I don't mind that name particularly. And if he wants to combine Jesus and vampire, I mean, it's.
Two of his interests.
I guess it's an odd choice, but go for it. Yeah, there's nothing wrong with unique names.
Yeah, there we go, Jieva. Maybe that will start a trend. Let's name the kids Jeeva. So the children were homeschooled, and I'm like not really sure to what extent. I never found any reports of him teaching them subjects of like math and science, but.
You never sex said, you never know.
But he he would do Bible studies with them.
Well at least he did that, so.
Numerous times a day Marcus would get to become the preacher. And he always dreamed, apparently of being a preacher teaching hit them from his own handwritten Bible that focuses on Jesus being a vampire. So he put his own spin on it, and it was his interpretations of the Bible and Seventh day Adventist beliefs. So he just kind of like made his own religion in a sense.
Really, this is a cult. This is not a quasi cult. This is just a small thing, but it's a cult.
I guess it's a cult. But then I also I guess the way I sort of view cults more so is like he's forcing everyone in his family to just be part of his cult. But it's still not like bringing in outsiders or anything like what I feel like most cults kind of do attract.
Well, I mean, he's sheltering his following from the outside world and others. Oh yeah, he is claiming he is a messiah and he is falsifying information. However he gets said followers is kind of irrelevant. He just as followers, shelters them and claims to be said messiah. That that's a fucking cult.
I know it well because what was his what's one of his nicknames? Oh, my gosh, douche Canoe, vampire, king of of douches. What's the town Freshco? Freshco? I was gonna say it wrong, an Fresco.
Yeah, vampire king of douches. I like that better though. Okay, we just took a really quick pause break because we're pretty sure we're saying that name of the city wrong.
No, No, I'm like, what was I saying this whole time? It's Fresno, Californias.
Yeah, we've got Fresca in her mind, messing us up. So it's Fred's No, I'm gonna literally write this on my hand, fres No.
So we apologize. We're tired, and I'm actually like, we'll probably go back and listen and maybe we were saying it right. I don't know now, I can't even remember how I was pronouncing it, but it's Fresnel, California. So anyway, he had the nickname of the Vampire King of fres Snow was like nickname that he had. I didn't really even throw that in there, but I was like, but you seem to really be onto this that he's cult. But I'm like, he's just like forcing people to be in there.
So I'm like, still a cult?
Is it?
It is? He has followers, right, his family is following him and worshiping him and following his word, believing.
Him, like the cult. I didn't want to give him that much credit, but okay, here we go. So he would tell his children that he was God and have them because he would have them refer to him as master or lord. So okay, he because he had David, that guy like he looked up to him, which was a cult person. But I'm just like he wanted to have a cult, but like he's just using his own family. But okay, okay, still a cult. I didn't want to
give him that much credit. But we're doing it, I guess, and I don't love that.
So he also that's not credit. That's just showing how much of a fucking douchebag this guy is. That's not credit. That's that's us credits. It's good credit.
That makes them just go down even more.
Oh definitely.
Okay. So he also taught them to be prepared for armageddon, which was very interesting. So like that was like their studies. I think, how to be prepared for armageddon and listening to this MOBOs fake bible that he.
Created, Well, there's nothing wrong with being a prepper.
Okay. There, that's probably actually good things that should be taught in school, but we don't know how he taught them. They should also be taught how to study math, maybe end times, but you never know the.
Fact that he's obsessed with the undead and he's preparing them for armageddon. I guarantee you he's probably preparing him for the zombie apocalypse. So I saw, like, we're gonna rob Costco. Get your shotguns, boys and girls, let's go out and practice or shoot.
Does cost go down there have guns and stuff?
I don't know. I'm just people.
I think the Costcos have booze and ourses and have booze.
Yeah, Canada kind of sucks well, we just have.
We finally have a liquor store, one liquor store in the whole city that has wine. But that's it.
No, we have a grocery store that has wine.
Oh sorry, what did I say? Okay, sorry, I already said I was tired. Okay, we have one grocery store. Finally. Hold, we have a lot of all of them wine. We live in it are down is a down of five thousand. We have one liquor store.
No, we're definitely large.
Okay, no, but it was sweet because our one grocery store. Okay, we have more than one. We have more than one grocery store. I'm like, I just need to shut the hell up here. But we finally got like it has wine. So it's kind of one one stop shop ish for me anyway, because I like wine. Geez, I don't know.
That was a whole train wreck, really was I hope you guys are still listening. Oh my gosh.
Okay, I'm gonna share photos of of Marcus too on our Instagram because I'm like, not super intimidated by a lot of people, but like he's scarce shit out of me, Like he's like scary, So I don't know, he also has that intimidation factor I think with his family, like he probably scared them a little, right, Okay, So all the girls were raised and groomed to believe that they
were destined to be Marcus's future wives. Of course, from the time that they were basically born, the marriage ceremonies would consist of the couple putting their hands on a Bible and reciting marriage vows. Seems legit, right, Oh totally so. As I mentioned earlier, he married two of his daughters and three nieces, all which would have his children. Along with isolating the children from the real world, Marcus also
isolated them amongst the group themselves. Being particularly possessive of the females, The girls were not allowed to talk to their male siblings. This was apparently to prevent further incest, which at least okay. Initially I thought like, that's disgusting, but like the family maybe thought that was okay, right, so it could have Yeah, more of that could have happened. Who knows.
Yeah, well, I'm pretty sure it's more so Marcus not preventing further incests, it's preventing anyone else from getting the daughters he wanted. To keep for himself, not to prevent incest, but to prevent him not getting other daughters.
Well, and then to maybe one of those brothers could have like maybe the brothers didn't even know it was happening, which I think could definitely be, and then they would be like what the heck or whatever? Right, and then there was like a whole little war. So he would tell his daughters and his nieces this was how a father showed his love. It was a normal father daughter relationship.
Of course, that's what he said.
Oh like that just makes me want a.
Bar fight and under isolation like that, you don't know any different.
Yeah, Like, it actually makes me nauseous. I feel like a lot of times when we're talking about cases, I feel mauxious. That's just the thing. They were also not allowed to speak to their mother, Elizabeth. Marcus prevented her from participating in the children's upbringing. Really Yeah, so I don't know exactly how he did this, but he had a way of doing this other than having the girl's weight on marcus hand and foot. This mofo was also abusive.
Of course, he would which I'm sure.
Doesn't surprise anyone here. He would use brutal force to keep the children in line, hitting them with electrical cords. Well, I guess whipping them with electrical cords baseball bats.
And his fists baseball bats. Jesus fuck.
And like he was not a small man, so a spoiler alert at the end. At the time of his arrest, he weighed over three hundred pounds. Apparently the man really liked fast food.
That's a big boy.
Yeah. There was even some that said four hundred, but most said three hundred, so it was like three hundred and four hundred pounds.
Like that's a big dude, right, Yeah, no kidding, So.
A punch from him would definitely sting a bit. One child was beaten for thirty days because he ate a spoonful of peanut butter without permission. Wow, so you and me would be like getting beaten daily.
Yeah, peanut butter is loud, glad that holds us together. So I don't know, first spoonful peanut butter, it might be worth thirty days of torture.
Well just wait, that was a joke. Just well, I'm just gonna say, like, it's not just like a little beating like some of the So how the beatings would work was it You got hit sixty three times a day, twenty one hits in the morning, twenty one hits in the afternoon, and twenty one hits in the evening for however many days your punishment was and it was up to you to remind Marcus it was time for your spa, as the kids would call it. Wow, like that's disgusting,
like gross. He also didn't discriminate on age, oh my gosh, which we kind of already knew. But he beat one of his one month old infants what until his legs bled because he wouldn't stop crying, And when the mom, Marcus's niece and wife, tried to leave, he stabbed her in the chest.
What the fuck?
Like a one month old baby was just crying.
Oh, I didn't think this dude could get any worse.
And he just fucking scum. He's just scum.
Holy shit, Fuck this guy.
He makes me uncomfortable. So now is mentioned earlier, everyone in the household was expected to do hard work, and you were if you were of age to get a job that was expected of you, with all of your earnings going to Marcus of course, yah, which okay, allowing the children to attend jobs. Seem like it could have been kind of risky, right, but he had them under such control, and I think like the control was basically fear based that no one shared their dirty laundry, not
to police or anyone that they were working with. So his income came from his kids and welfare. Wow. Yeah, like just crazy. At one point in time, two of the girls, well I guess they were be women at this point, decided this lifestyle wasn't for them, Ruby and Sophia, so they were the nieces of Marcus and his wives. Like, it's just fucked up. Like I just like I think I keep explaining that, but you guys get it.
Yeah, we know it's fucked. We know it's really fucked.
They had attempted to run away before but were never successful, but this time they begged Marcus to let them go, which he ultimately did, but under the condition that they would leave their sons behind. This left them no choice, so they left, and they left their sons behind.
That's a difficult choice.
Wow, I know, Like that's just oh. I just couldn't imagine. They tried to move on with their lives, but the trauma they had from the previous lifestyle was a lot to deal with. Like in two thousand and four, they
decided to go back for their sons. It was also mentioned that Marcus may have intentions to move the family to Washington State, as this was where his parents lived, which could have been another reason why, like the parents were or those women were coming back for their children right because he was taking them out of state basically, So they connected with family outside of the family cult to help them, and all together showed up at the
home of Marcus. Marcus handled the situation quite calmly, but the family inside the house was screaming at the women because in their brainwashed minds, they were traders, right. Yeah, So the police were then called. When the officers arrived, both Ruby and Sophia told them that Marcus was going to hurt the kids. I guess there was a suicide pack that was regularly discussed. Oh shit in the household.
Shit if anyone in law enforcement showed up, the women were ordered to kill their children and themselves.
Holy fuck.
When the officers spoke to Marcus, he did agree to let the kids go, but asked if he could say goodbye first.
Oh shit.
The officers agreed. Marcus shut the door, and the officers waited an hour and a half for Marcus to return. Once he were turned he was covered in blood. Now, this part is beyond fucked up, and I like cannot comprehend it.
This part's beyond fucked up.
The part I'm just to say is neighbors say they heard gunshots during the period that Marcus was inside saying his goodbyes, but none of the officers claimed they heard anything, So like that just doesn't make any sense, Like I don't get that, like they were outside.
Waiting, yeah, but also why would they wait that long? I know, like it's literally a hostage situation.
Well not necessarily because they didn't really have any grounds to like barge in. I guess like they didn't have the warrants and shit that they need it. But I mean people were in danger technically in there, So I don't know. The whole thing just seems fucked up. But he got that extra time to go in there, so ready.
I'm just wondering if anyone survived, or if anyone left, So would you walk out or anything? You know.
Marcus was obviously immediately arrested as he was covered in blood, and the officers entered the building. What was inside was absolutely heartbreaking. A pile of bodies in the back room, all intertwined. The bodies were so entangled that it took hours for police to confirm the number of dead bodies. It was thought there may have been some kind of ritual involved. I don't know exactly what the suicide pack entailed,
but this was the aftermath. Nine were dead, ranging in age from twenty five to one years old, and each person had a gunshot wound through the eye, So everyone in the house.
Ye, I find it hard to believe that officers didn't hear gunshots.
Oh yeah, See, that just makes no sense, does it. Yeah, I don't know. But then other because other people reported hearing the gunshots, so I don't know. Basically, there was nine dead. The victims were uh Sapirrina, who you'll hear more about. She was age twenty five, Elizabeth age seventeen, Illabel age eight, av Aviv Sorry I might be pronouncing that wrong, age seven, Jonathan age seven, Ethan age four, Marshi age one, Jieva age one, and Sedona age one.
Wow.
M hm. The first and older two victims were Marcus's daughters, and the other seven were children. Of his daughters or nieces, so I guess some of them would be his children and his grandchildren, which is really yucky.
Just wow, Like I'm fucking speechless right now. Holy shit.
Yeah, well you're about to get even more speechless. Some other weird shit happens.
Okay, Wow, it just keeps getting We're going like down this major spiral. I keep thinking, like we've hit the fucking mother load of like disaster.
That was the main spiral. There's just one tiny other one. So it was the largest mass killing in the history of Freshnel. Okay, so fresh No. I was like, did I say their own noise in it? Which is the city? Which is a city of about half a million, so it's on a small city. I've never heard of the city. Actually, no, I have, Oh have you? Oh it's about three hours from San Francisco.
Been to San France.
I've been to San fran But yeah, I'm like, I've never heard of the city. It's like it seems like a large city, but I don't know if is that a large city in the US.
Well, compared to San Francisco, it's definitely not.
A I guess, yeah, Like in I don't even know we don't have a ship ton of large cities in Canada. I feel like, well, we.
Do have a couple, like we got Toronto, Toronto, well like.
Vancouver and saftly, I feel like each province has like a large city.
Yeah Calgary, Calgary, gosh.
What are you doing over there? And people could only see how you were trying to pronounce these words?
Just too much Calgary, I know, I know. But anyway, but like for us though, like you drive hours to try and reach a large city, the closest one for us is Vancouver, and that's over eight hundred klometers away, and we are in the province as far as Northern British Columbia, we are the largest city in Northern BC and Prince George of the eighty thousand people, I.
Think it's about that. So yeah, yeah, so I don't know, it's just different. Okay. So, as I said, Marcus was arrested and he was held in the Freshnel count Each jail on a nine million dollar bail, which I'm like, that's working a lot. He's not gonna have any friends that can do that things.
I really hope not.
He was charged with nine murders and fourteen counts of rape. When he appeared at his trial a year later, he looked like a different person, though he had his dreadlocks, which were described at the time of his arrest. Arrest as looking like one greasy long dreadlock were so they were cut short, and he was nearly half the size.
Oh wow.
Yeah, So I don't know. You could say jail wasn't agreeing with him, but maybe it was agreeing with him, even with the many Even with this, many potential jurors were excused from the trial after claiming to be terrified to be in the same room as Marcus. So even after like kind of cleaned up his appearance slightly, I guess the dude was just like a scary mofo. Wow, Like, I don't know, he's scary.
I mean, I don't mind the fact that some people left because they were terrified with him, because that only means the fact that we are getting jurors who are not intimidated by this fucker. Try. Yeah, so that that would be like a bonus.
A dream dur job. I feel like, if I'm ever going to be an injury, I want the case to just be fucked, just fucked, because I would end up if you end up be in there and it's a real boring one, like I'd fall asleep.
I want you here because Judy Marie Santiago did not paid her parking ticket on the date of January fourth, nineteen seventy three.
Yeah, I would just like fall asleep. So I need it to be really interesting.
I really hope that Judy is listening and it's like, hey, that's me.
That's me, and I did get a parking ticket. Okay, So Marcus, Marcus, he actually pleaded not guilty to the charges. Do you want to know why why? The defense was that his twenty four or twenty five year old daughter, Sabrina, had been the one to kill them all and then she killed herself, which is stupid. Yeah I should add that. And I hope her name is actually Sabrina, but it seems like it is, but I, like, I don't know,
I'm pretty sure it is. She also in everyone that was like dead, her eighteen month old son was one of them, so she would have had to kill her own son. The murder weapon was a zero point twenty two caliber handgun.
Okay, Okay, now keep going. I'm going to touch on that in a minute.
Okay, Well, I'll break here in a second was found with her body. Her DNA was present on the gun, but there was mixed reports whether her fingerprints were also found on the weapon. But even if there were, you know, damn well, it was Marcus who was one hundred percent behind this. It was his brainwashing that led to the incident to happen. The whole suicide pack was not something that Sabrina would have come up with her.
Also, the fact that clearly he came out covered in blood. He was present, Yeah, he was present, so he allowed it to happen. He definitely tampered with a crime scene. Even if Sabrina was the one pulling the trigger, he would have been piling the bodies or whatever he did, right, So he's covered in blood, so there's something there. Second of all, it was a twenty two caliber bullet. You said, twenty two's are really small guns. They do not make a lot of noise, do they not? They do not.
Oh so, if you have someone firing a twenty two caliber handgun inside a residence, okay, and you have officers waiting over the course of an hour, I'm pretty sure they're not standing at the front door. They very well might be sitting in the squad car with maybe even the radio playing to kill the time. If that's a scenario, which is unlikely scenario, I guarantee you they would not have.
Heard that twenty Seriously, it's that quiet.
It's a very small caliber gun.
But it's enough that if one shot through the head would kill you.
It's enough that the bullet will enter the head, but the bullet will not exit the head. It was actually used in mafia because the twenty two caliber will not exit the head, so when they execute someone, the bullet will actually bounce around inside the skull. Oh god, I'm sure is killing someone and it does not leave a mess for cleanup because you have no exit wound.
Okay, so how would he have gotten this blood? Okay? So would there have been like spray when these people were shot?
Well, like they're shot to the eye, so they're bleeding out.
The eye, so there would be some blood that way.
Yeah, and I mean going through the eye. Actually it's going through the orbits. There's not much bone tissue it's going through. So there very well could have been exit wounds in this case because the bone entry wound is what prevents the bullet from continuing through the outside, so in this case there might be exit wounds, so it might be why it's so messy. But still, a twenty two caliber bullet did not make much noise.
Oh my gosh.
Okay, to put it into perspective, twenty two calibers are used for hunting things like grouse and rabbit.
Hmmm. So wow, that's very interesting. Thank you for that. The more you know, because I didn't research if that gun made much noise, which I guess I should have had.
Oh and if you have a neighbor sitting nearby who's maybe sitting down reading a book.
Or even if they were just like having conversations the police officers, they may not have heard it. Ah, so huh eh okay with that.
Sorry.
So there were some members of the cult family. I just hate saying that cult. I don't know. I okay, it's a cult. We've accepted that, who initially still believed and trusted Marcus and would like defend him in court. They were just so brainwashed, right, Like I mean, like
just so brainwashed. The jury, which took more than two weeks to deliberate, declined to find that Marcus fired the fatal shots, but found him guilty anyway, finding that he had persuaded his children to enter into a suicide pack. So guilty on nine counts of first degree murder and fourteen counts of raping and molesting seven of his daughters and nieces. He was sentenced to death on June twenty seventh, two thousand and five. Jeez it, however, is now twenty twenty one.
Of course, of course I know where you're going, yep.
And Marcus is still alive, sitting on death row. Yeah, just waiting, I guess, and costing us money. It might be not aust he's American, well, but costing I guess that would be to I'm assuming taxpayers down there, yeah, to their money. Right.
Well, he's taken up facility rooms, he's taken up resources such as you know, food, medical, And why does it take so long for someone sitting on death row to receive their sentence received the penalty?
I guess it seems like sometimes the criminals wanted But like I couldn't find anything about him doing appeal or anything, so like for this, I don't know.
You know, Well, because most people end up sitting on death row, they generally end up passing away of natural causes or that's.
Medical expenses too, right there.
I wonder why that is.
I would like to know. Actually, how can we find that out?
We should research that. You'd think that being podcasts hosts of true crime, we might know that.
But well, yeah, because okay, so it was two thousand and five, so that's like sixteen years.
Wow, that's like a long time, no kidding.
Okay. So it took his children years and I mean years of deprogramming and separation from Marcus to finally understand the horrors they lived through. While Marcus was going through court, a few of the boys had said that he was such a great dad and that he would never hurt his kids.
Unless it was with a baseball bat.
Or if you had peanut butter.
Oh. Snap.
Today they are finally able to say that their father was psychotic, narcissistic, and deluded.
Wow that's some progress there.
Well, progress that needed to be made. So I'm glad they're getting the help or whatever they d As disturbing as all of this is, most of the children were born into the family cult and not having a lot of access to the outside world, they had no clue that their lives could be any different.
Yeah, well, how do you know otherwise you're sheltered from everything else. That's literally all you know.
That's their normal.
Well, the individual who's causing all this abuse in their life is the one who taught them growing up that it's okay and the way the world is and you don't see anything.
Else, the nasty mofo.
He is you nasty nasty.
Two of the girls were interviewed about his lovings. Yeah, which is s barb really at the discuss at the age of eight, and one girl admitted that when Marcus started she thought it was okay, with the other girl saying when it was happening to her, she felt it was wrong. So that's basically this story.
Oh, I feel so bad for these kids.
If you want to dive a bit deeper, which for this one, like I actually think I will. There's a book called Deadly Devotion. It was originally published as Where Hope Begins. It was written by Alicia Sophias, who was a reporter and covered the case at the time, and she ultimately welcomed the family into her home to like help them. So she got like some serious first hand knowledge and wrote this book. So I meant, I mean
it's probably super interesting. It's a shame we always when I found out about the book, I was like, oh, should I postpone this case? But I was already like pretty deep into it, and we always find out too late.
Well, that's kind of a one of the downsides of us right now doing podcasting on the side is we only have about a week or so to research each case. We don't have time to really dive in ahead of schedule, so we just research one case like mad for an entire week and then post it out there. So when we do find that there's a book, it's like, it's almost too late. Yeah, we have like two days to get this out, this episode out. We got to find the book, read the book, and then work it into
our research in two days. It's just not manageable. So with a new life coming up, we're doing our own gigs and leaving the nine to fives and sitting in the tiny home podcasting more often.
There you go, hint, hint, this.
Might be something that we can start diving into and do it more of getting these books read before podcasting.
I actually used to have like reading as a hobby when I was younger, but then I started university and my reading of became just textbooks, and I think it was ruined it for me. So it is only I want to get back into. So there we go. We'll have time.
We're going to do it, because I know there's I can't remember the name of the individual, but the little girl who was lost at sea for like three days. There's a book on that one as well, and I want to read that one.
Stay so that those would be both good books. They would maybe THO should be our next books.
Maybe let's do it.
And this is the last podcast in the house.
Last one we're doing in this house. The rest of your run out is going to be in the tiny home.
So until then, my friends
Make sure you guys stay wicked.