Today we discuss part two of Jorge Aliva Torres. If you haven't yet listened to part one, we've gone over much of the backstory regarding how it led up to his arrest, and today, in part two, we're going to go over much more of what police learned about him afterwards.
My name's Ben, I'm Nicole, and you're listening to Wicked and.
Grim, a true crime podcast.
Warning.
The following podcast and material intended more mature audience listener discretion. He's advised, got your drink ready?
Kind of yeah?
Kind of yeah? What's kind of yeah?
Well, I just have like hydration and pre workout. I'm going to the gym after this. Well that's not very exciting. That's a drink though, I guess. Yeah. I wonder if anyone would have been able to hear my ankle crack in that intro.
Oh really did you hear it? I didn't. I was so focused on because I'll be honest on that one. I didn't write a script, so I was just like off the cuffing it, so I was too focused on, uh, does this make sense? What should I say?
It probably would have been very faint, but I'm like, oh my gosh, I'm so old.
Go back and take a look. See if you can.
I don't know if it will show up, but I'm like, dang, fair enough.
Well that's like I got up off the couch. Was it last night and you heard my like your heat?
I thought it was like your back or something, your damn hip.
It was my hip and my knee. Yeah, I was like there was a twofer in there. I'm not sure which one you heard, but they both rad.
Oh my gosh. I don't know if I've ever like had my hip crack.
No, I don't know.
Huh, that's interesting.
Well I clearly have.
Yeah. I'm sitting here looking at your Mickey shirt.
Oh, Mickey is so fun. Yeah, I'm wearing a Mickey most shirt today.
Red Bubble has done me a dirty I've ordered too, and they're not coming in.
Yeah it sucks, but we are getting ready to go to Disneyland here, so disney World, a disney World sorry over in Orlando, my bad. So yeah, I'm I'm just getting the Disney love flowing with my Mickey shirt this point.
You love it.
It's a good shirt. I like it. I like it a lot. Do you remember part one of this case. Do you remember what happened at all?
Bits and pieces for sure? Yeah?
You remember bits and pieces for sure?
I do.
Do you want me to give you a little bit of a rundown? I love that, Okay. I just got to find my place here. Hold on, okay, So let me see.
Well.
It started off with Officer Clifford patrolling a certain area where he always patrols at night, right, and he noticed a suspicious Dodge Durango silver suv just kind of parking, idling, lights turned off, and pulling away, and he made note of that license plate. He saw it a couple times. Eventually there were abductions happening in the area of women being abducted by a light colored suv. I mean, it's
a traumatic event. They didn't exactly remember all the details, but they remembered a light colored suv, and eventually, thankfully, with Officer Clifford writing down that license plate, they were able to link those abductions where they all thankfully survived, to the person that Officer Clifford had saw. So Officer
Clifford submitted the license plate, they ran it. They got a hit on a person by the name of Jorge Aliva Torres, who were calling George, So they approach his vehicle, see some stuff inside this a little suspicious linking to the crime. And eventually George comes up to the vehicle as they're scoping it and they make an arrest on him. Now, they also get DNA from one of the assaults, the sexual assault, and they put it in National Data Bank and it comes up as a hit from a murder
from five years ago, an unsolved murder. Well, we'll get into exactly the solved unsolvedness of the murder. But the DNA comes back saying, this is a match on the DNA found on that crime scene, and that is on two young little girls by the name of Laura Hobbes and Crystal to Bias. And that's where we left off.
Oh yeah, okay, yeah, okay.
Does that ring any bells?
Oh? It totally does. But yeah, let's hear hear these these gals story, the poor things.
Yeah, is there anything else you want to specifically talk about before we dive into this. Did you remember anything specific that you want to mention or anything about the case or about Yeah, like about I mean, we could go into some philosophical stuff if you really want, but I'm thinking the case, like, are you like, well, this happened, right, or do you have a question or something you really want to bring up or point like, you know, put an exclamation on or starbuy or anything.
No, No, oh, okay, I remember. I guess One thing that came back is that I thought that I was like questioning whether he actually like did this shit, you know, because he the way I remember you did like a bit of an introduction on him and stuff. Then he actually comes across as like seeming a good person. He was.
He was kind of like a nice kind of guy, and everyone described him as someone like don't give you the shirt off his back kind of thing, right, But he wasn't. But he wasn't.
He really really wasn't.
And at the time he was twenty two years old, so he's relatively young. And yeah, it just it didn't seem like he would do it. But unfortunately the evidence points too otherwise. And I'm not saying it in that manner because hey, there's room for error. No, like the DNA DNA from a rape kit came back to that is him. Yeah, so it is him.
And I remember, oh my gosh, that one quote too. I'm not stupid as you like put on a condom or whatever. Yeah, oh my gosh, this sky is just filled.
Well I know.
Okay, let's hear it.
Okay, let's go. So we're going to start off with Laura Gail Hobbs, who was born on September twenty fifth, nineteen ninety six, in Wichita Falls, Texas. She was a bright and imaginative second grader at Bellula Park Elementary School. Her mother, Sheila and father Jerry adored her, and by two thousand and five, Laura had developed a deep love for reading, often bringing her stories to life with puppets.
When she wasn't immersed in books, she was outside riding her bike full of energy, often in the company of her best friend and neighbor, Crystal Tobias. Now Crystal Tobias was born on October twenty sixth, nineteen ninety five in Wacougan, Illinois, and lived with her older brother Alberto. Like Laura, she loved being outside, playing dress up and picking dandelion flowers. Together, Laura and Crystal were inseparable, always exploring, laughing, and enjoying
the adventures of outdoors and childhood all around. On Mother's Day on eight, two thousand and five, the two girls told their families they were heading to a nearby park. Both girls climbed onto Laura's bike, pedaling away with carefree spirits. At their typical age, it was a familiar routine, one that neither family had any reason to worry about. But as dinner time came and went with no sign of the girls coming home, worry quickly set in.
Oh my heart, Okay, there are like three things that you just said there that just like destroyed me already.
Yeah. Why, well, the whole like the.
One little girl with her puppets and the other one picking dandelion flowers, and the fact that this is Mother's Day? Are you shitting me right now?
No? Dead serious?
Oh gosh, Okay, Okay, we're in for it here.
Okay, you're gonna be able to hold it together? Are you gonna just rage?
Probably? I'll probably rage. Yeah, I'm not gonna make any promises right now, all right.
Well, when the families realized that their kids weren't just late for dinner and that something else must seriously be wrong, they immediately contacted the authorities. A massive search was launched that night, with law enforcement and the community members scouring the area, hoping to find any trace of the girls Laura and Crystal. As dawn broke on May ninth, there was still no sign of the two of them, but
hope remained strong and the search efforts intensified. The search continued and Laura's father with Laura's grandfather were searching for the two girls on a bike path in a wooded area of Bellula Park nature area, which was very close to Laura's home, when all of a sudden, down by a ravine, they spotted Laura's bike in the bushes. The two men immediately ran down the ravine and that's when they made the gruesome discovery. There they were both girls
laying dead side by side. They had been beaten and stabbed to death.
Oh my gosh.
I can't imagine making that discovery as a father or grandfather or a parent or at all.
I know, you'd almost like hope that it would be the authorities that would come across that, because that is just like gut wrenching. Yeah, oh man, And here you okay, you see their bike. So I'm like, at first you're probably thinking, oh, like they just fell down this or whatever, like they're just probably hurt. Like you gotta go help them.
Yeah, there's that twinge of hope.
Hope, yeah, and then it just like gets just smashed.
Yeah. Autopsies would later reveal that their killer was ruthless. In the attack on the girls, Laura had been stabbed a total of eleven times and Crystal a total of twenty. Though Laura was stabbed less, she was unfortunately the one to be raped by the perpetrator as well, which is how the DNA was ultimately collected at the scene.
Good God, holy shit, what kind of absolute like piece of shit like these The girls are in grade two. This is unreal, like unreal.
I know, it's super fucked up now. Witness soon came forward and told the authorities that they remembered seeing both Laura and Crystal riding bikes with someone else that evening. It was a local sixteen year old boy by the name of Jorge Eliva Torres or George. Authorities quickly followed up with that lead and they were given or sorry with the lead that they were given, and they questioned George about it. George was familiar with Laura. He was
actually friends with her older brother. In fact, according to him, he considered her to be like kind of like a little sister. But when investigators questioned him, George simply denied knowing anything about the girl's disappearance or what happened to them.
It seems like due to his young age his connection to Laura's family, authorities didn't really view him as a likely suspect or someone who was capable of committing such a crime, so they quickly brushed his name off and his name was cleared of any involvement.
Wow.
Instead, investigators began focusing on Laura's father. Oh, thirty four year old Jerry Hobbes.
No, I was not expecting this. Holy shit.
See, Jerry had a criminal past which included convictions for assaults and resisting arrest dating back to the nineteen nineties in Texas. In two thousand and one, he was arrested again after threatening and chasing a neighbor with a chainsaw, which led to a two year prison sentence.
That's fine, Maybe the neighbor was a dick.
Maybe maybe he deserved it right. Yeah, but Jerry had only been out of prison for about a month before his daughter was murdered.
Oh no, okay, and sorry, is he the one that found them?
I believe so? Yes?
Oh, which also is like, you know, not great, no, oh no, okay.
So imagine fine, your daughter in that state.
And then literally being accused of that. M hmm. Wow. This is a doozy, Ben Well, doozy one.
Buckle up for this because after the discovery of the two girls, after the discovery of Jerry's daughter, Jerry was immediately brought in for questioning, and over the next twenty four hours of questioning, he was subject to intense interrogation and as a result of all the pressure he endured, by the end, Jerry confessed to the murders and signed a police statement. Oh no, which shifted the focus even farther away from George.
Uh huh huh okay. And the fact that, like George was friends with the brother is very very disturbing to me.
Yeah, and I don't know to what degree on how much he was friends because he was a little bit of a an odd ball described when he was younger, like he's like he didn't quite fit in with everyone, but he was friends enough to at least be acquainted with with his younger sister, right and say, it's like she's like a little sister to meet.
And she would have like trusted him.
Yeah, especially considering they were it was seen that they were riding bikes with him that evening.
Yeah, and also like you hear about that with interrogation, hey after I mean, because I can only imagine just like how I don't know, just fucked up you are after twenty four hours of that, right?
Yeah.
Oh so the fact that he actually just signed it, though, that is something they obviously really did something to him.
Hey, definitely.
Now.
The story of a convicted felon murdering his daughter and her friend outraged the community, and the prosecutor was quick to announce plans to seek the death penalty against Jerry Hobbes. Jerry did try to recant his confession, but it was too too late. His sentence had already been recorded and the legal wheels were in motion.
Ben, does he get does he get killed? I have like literally like goosebumps right now? Can you see that? Yeah? I can Holy shit, you're not gonna say yet.
I can't say yet.
Oh my gosh, Okay, this is too much. This is too much for first thing in the fucking morning.
Well, authorities took the semen sample that was found at the crime scene for analysis, and in two thousand and eight three years later. Not sure why it took so fucking long, but the DNA results came back and the DNA did not match Jerry. Despite this revelation, though Jerry
was not released. Authorities argued that while the DNA wasn't his, it didn't necessity didn't necessity that didn't nessess, I can't say the word necessarily didn't necessarily exclude him from participating in the crime or murdering the girl.
So just saying that he had an accomplished or.
Something, yeah, saying that he hasn't accomplished or someone else did that part, which is fucked up though because it as fucked they don't have a single shred of evidence.
No what I mean, Like he did admit it though, kind of.
Right, other than the confession, you're right, yere, Yeah. So Jerry remained behind bars for five long years awaiting his death penalty trial. His legal team fought fiercely to appeal the case, but little progress was made, so he was imprisoned in two thousand and five. He was imprisoned for five years. This leads us to twenty ten, when George's DNA was entered into the national database after his arrest for the string of violence and the assaults in Arlington, Virginia.
Investigators were stunned when his DNA matched the sample found at the scene of Laura and Crystal's murder. M h. It was a shocking breakthrough, to say the least, especially when they realized that George had already been questioned back in two thousand and five regarding it originally and was in fact the last person seen with the girls before they had vanished.
Like, they could have easily got a DNA sample from him at that time, right, Like.
I don't maybe they would have to probably get a warrant for it, and.
I'm not sure how that they would have had enough, Yeah.
And I'm not sure the process of getting it, Like, you know, I don't know they would have had to get a warrant to get his DNA, But did they have enough? Yeah, Now, I mean he was the last one seen, so maybe that would be enough. Now, his authorities dug deeper into George's past, they uncovered another troubling detail. In two thousand and five, at just sixteen years old, same year that these two girls were murdered. They found that George had tied up and held a female friend
captive in his home, though she managed to escape. With this new information, police began to realize just how deep George's violent tendencies.
Ran, and there was no consequences for him tying up someone.
No, I don't believe any charges were pressed or anything like that.
Goodness, gracious, was that before or after this? Like a little girl murder?
I'm actually unsure.
Huh, Okay, this is just a gut wrenching that the father had to stay in jail for five years. Well, I mean, I don't know. You haven't said if he's out yet, so I'll keep listening. But goodness.
Well. On June twenty seventh, investigators brought Georgie in for questioning about the murders of Laura and Crystal. As expected, he denied any involvement, maintaining that he's innocent, right, But with the DNA match, his denials were honestly futile. He was caught at this point, and George now sat in jail awaiting trial for the brutal killings.
Oh, the rage I have towards this person.
Yeah. Now, I'm unsure exactly when Jerry was let out of prison for these crimes. But I'll save you the suspense he was let out of prison. He was, he did have his name cleared, but we will touch on that at the end. Okay, However, George's crimes didn't actually stop there. While in custody, sitting behind bars, he tried to orchestrate a plan to have the Arlington, Virginia victims that he previously attacked murdered.
What the shit, Yeah, this case, it just keeps going.
Oh, it keeps going, trust me.
Like I'm literally like, there can't be anything else and it just keeps going.
Oh, it keeps going, trust me. So, while in prison, George found a connection willing to carry out his twisted plan to silence his victims. His goal was to eliminate them. That way, they couldn't testify against him, right, they couldn't appear in court. So George even went as far as to draw this individual that he connected to a detailed map of one of the victims houses, the one that he had already been in from memory from the night
of his attack. So he drew him a map, being like, yeah, here's a layout of their house, Like you can go in and do this or this or whatever you want.
But he is actually dumb though, Oh.
He yes, he is as dumb as the Just like you said, this case keeps going. Yeah, his dumbness level keeps going to It's impressive actually, because there's just.
I don't know, Okay, so say, I don't know if this plan works or whatever, but each victim is killed, Like I'm sorry, but it's you're not gonna look innocent in that, right, There's just no way I know.
Now, the identity of the person that George initially planned the murders with remains unclear, but the police did get wind of his scheme, so in response, they planted a jail house informant won by the name of Osama el Atari. Now this was a man serving time for defrauding banks of allegedly fifty three million dollars.
Wow.
Yeah, So now, according to reports, Osama was eager to do anything to reduce his sentence in prison, making him the perfect candidate to get close to George. And you know, hey, maybe where wire?
Oh they actually used Okay for some reason, I just thought you were telling us the story of like an undercover, but he's actually a criminal.
No, they're like, if you like, if you're in prison, you're an actual criminal. If you inform for us. If you like work with us, we'll reduce your sentence.
Okay, okay, yeah.
So in August of twenty ten, Osama befriended George, and, wearing a wire, he secretly recorded their conversations. Over time, George opened up confessing in chilling detail to the murders of Laura and Crystal. His accounts of the crime matched the autopsy findings precisely, although he stopped short of admitting that the sexual assault, which isn't exactly surprising, as we all know what happens to people like that in prison regardless.
During the recorded conversations, George also revealed his reaction to the wrongful imprisonment of Laura's father, Jerry Hobbes for the murders. He said, and I quote, damn, I'm clean, I'm good. I ain't got shit to worry about.
Oh my gosh, wow like that. I don't know the fact that you would just have like, no, well, no, it's not surprising actually that he has no remorse over that at all.
Oh, you want to talk about the remorse part. Because George's reasons for committing the murders, I mean they varied a bit. He claimed it was random and other times he suggested the girls had seen him delivering drugs or whatever, but regardless. Asama asked him if he ever actually felt remorse, and George responded, quote, does a lion feel remorse when it kills a hyena?
Like?
What a fucking piece of sh wow that is.
And this is years later, So you would think that, I mean, if you were in a complete disgusting dirt bag, that you would. Yeah, holy shit, this is just that's unreal to me. That is unreal.
On May twelfth, twenty twelve, George was officially charged in Illinois with the murders of Crystal Tobias and Laura Hobbes. It seemed as though he would finally face justice for all of his horrific actions, but but authorities also managed to uncover more truths regarding George. See The women George attacked in Illinois were not his last victims. During his taped confessions with Osama, George admitted to another crime he
called quote the perfect crime. He revealed that he was responsible for the murder of a woman in the military barracks by the name of Amanda Snell. Oh Man, I told you it keeps going.
A holy man Okay, the perfect murder, except that now he's just like confessing this to some person that he thinks he can trust. I guess. And he's known for.
What like a day I told you his stupid in this level like keeps going. I don't know if that's.
Honestly, Like I'm glad for that. Oh same, because you know he needs to be held accountable for all of this shit.
Yeah, so George is a serial killer.
Oh yeah, Yeah, as you take.
A seem your coffee, I'm letting you soak in that.
Yeah he is. I mean I already thought he can't go much worse than my books, really like serial killer or not, Like he already is just disgusting.
Yeah.
So.
Amanda Snell was born on January nineteenth, nineteen eighty nine, in Palms, California. She was a daughter of her mate sorry, daughter of a marine mother, and followed in her footsteps by enlisting in the Navy in August of two thousand and seven. She was a graduate of Chaperol High School in Las Vegas, Nevada, and Amanda was active in Junior ROTC and devoted to her community service. She was known
for her loyalty, honesty, and relentless work ethic. By two thousand and nine, Amanda had settled into her Navy career, stationed at the Pentagon. She had a bright future ahead of her, but it was magically cut short. On July nineteenth, two thousand and nine, Amanda failed to report to work, a very highly unusual occurrence for someone as dependable as she was. Concerned her supervisor her story. Her supervisor went
back to check on her. Amanda was never late, but in this case she was so When she arrived there, Amanda's door was unlocked, which was odd. They opened the door and inside the room, it was neat. It was tidy, but something wasn't quite right. The bed was made, but the pillows were missing. Sorry, the pillowcases were missing, and the top sheet of the bed was also gone. After searching the room a bit further, they opened up Amanda's
closet and made a horrific discovery. Amanda was dead. Her body was crammed into a locker in a disturbingly unnatural position. She was found with her knees pressed into her torso, her feet against a drawer, and her head covered by a pillowcase pushed down into her chest. An autopsy revealed Amanda died approximately thirty six to forty eight hours before
her body was discovered. There was no obvious signs of sexual assault or over trauma beyond some small visible petikia, which is like those like tiny little pinhead blood spots that occur from exphyxiation.
Okay.
However, they couldn't determine whether it was exphyxiation that caused those or not.
Huh.
It's usually caused by that, but it's not always. And they couldn't.
This and she just like would have Oh my goodness, just been like a force to be reckoned with. Yeah, she sounded like she just her future was like unbelievably bright.
Yeah. Oh no, she was a full on fucking badass. So, despite the strange circumstances surrounding her death and how she was found, her cause of death death was ruled undetermined.
Oh okay. I thought for sec that the second they are you gonna say suicide.
No, it was undetermined determined, okay. George's confession to Asama revealed that what authorities had already been able to unprove that Amanda had been murdered, and as it turns out, George was the one responsible what he had considered the quote perfect crime had finally come to light, all because he couldn't help but brag. On May sixth, sorry May twenty six, twenty eleven, a federal grand jury indicted George
of first degree murder of Amanda Snow. His first trial took place in October twenty ten, though eight months after the initial arrest for the assaults in Arlington.
Now.
During the trial, all three of his victims testified against him, the three that he assaulted but all survived, that.
He was wanting to murder yes, well, well try for someone to murder them or whatever.
Yes, And in the actual assaults, like he was trying to push one in the suv and they managed to get away and run, and then the other two girls he left behind at the home tied up and then took the other one off and then eventually dumped her, left her for dead, but she did still survive.
Oh okay, So like he kind of tried to murder them twice.
Really, he tried to murder at least one of them twice for sure. Yeah, but all three victims testified in court. They're standing there looking him in the fucking eye, and George just continued to deny any involvement in the attacks.
That would not be easy for them.
No, despite the claims, the evidence was just too overwhelming, and he was found guilty of rape and kidnapping. In twenty ten of December, George was sentenced to five consecutive life sentences along with an additional one hundred and sixty eight years, and was sent to Red Onion State Prison in Virginia.
Red Onion red.
Onion State Prison in Virginia. The place is apparently a bit of a rougher prison.
That's like quite a name, yeah it is.
In February of twenty twenty twelve, George faced the federal charges for the murder of Amanda Snell. Although he initially considered representing himself, he ultimately opted for legal counsel council after being deemed competent to stand trial. His trial began on March thirty first of twenty fourteen, and over four days, the prosecution presented extensive evidence, including DNA from the crime scenes, his jailhouse confessions, and details of his previous violent behavior.
On April eighth of twenty fourteen, George was convicted of Amanda Snell's murder and a few weeks later, the jury sentenced him to death.
I was wondering if that is going to happen.
Yeah. In twenty eighteen, George was transferred to Illinois to stand trial for the two thousand and five murders of Laura Hobbes and Crystal to Bias. With DNA evidence firmly linking him to that crime, George would accept a plea deal, pleading guilty to both murders in exchange for transfer out of Red Onion Prison. He received two fifty year sentences. During sentencing, the judge called his actions quote cruel, cold blooded, and devoid of mercy.
He should not have had the option for plea whatsoever, Like why should he get anything at this point? He doesn't like that prison, So what.
I know, I agree, especially because it's like you're already in prison for life, You're already sentenced to death.
And now we're giving you like grace or whatever.
So his sentence doesn't even matter. Yeah, all that is is ensuring that the family gets some sort of comfort in knowing that, you know what, he went to trial and he is serving time for what he did and they're giving him a plea.
Yeah, that doesn't make any sense to me.
Yeah, like you said, they're just all they're doing is giving him some grace, that's it.
Yeah, that he does not deserve.
Yeah, So George remains incarcerated to this day while he awaits his sentence of death. Meanwhile, as I mentioned, we would touch on this at the end. In twenty thirteen, Jerry Hobbes, who was wrongfully accused of killing his own daughter and spent five years in prison, received a six million dollars settlement from Lake County and had his name cleared, but ultimately lost much of his reputation as a father and his daughter in the process.
M M. Yeah, there's not like, I mean, no winning with that. I mean, grant you he's set for life, I guess now. But oh that I just that's so brutal.
Yeah, And that is the story of Jorge Aliva Torres and what he did to the three unnamed victims he assaulted Laura Hobbes, Crystal Tobias, and Amanda Snell.
He would have just kept going, oh yeah, guaranteed, like he wasn't planning to stop.
No, And there was some even there was some stuff I kind of omitted, which I just I thought maybe a chat about it here at the end, while he was in prison, like there was he was caught with like a shank, he was he was threatening guards like he's like man, he wrote a letter to his sister saying that he's going to kill one of the prison guard's kids. Like yeah, like there was some fucked up shit.
He was even trying to do an orchestra behind bars. Wow, hey, yeah, No, this guy was a fucking psycho like he and serial killer cold blooded, Like I can't even think of the things to call this guy, and.
Yet he he's able to just be transferred to a like a not so rough prison like that doesn't make any sense to me, I know. Huh yeah, Wow, this case, I feel like I just got off like a terrible roller coaster that I didn't want to be on that just kept getting shittier and shittier and I kept getting sicker and sicker or something.
That's pretty much what this case was. Now. Do you understand was having such a hard time writing this case last night? Yeah, because it's it doesn't.
Make it's all over the place too.
Yeah it is. It's all over the place, it doesn't end, and it's just like what the fuck?
Yeah, it's Yeah, it's almost unbelievable. Hmm. And the fact that he just had no remorse for like those I don't know, I mean.
I know, sweet little girls, And does a lion feel remorse when it kills a hyena? Like, are you fucking kidding me? Get off your fucking stupid high horseyp piece of shit.
Well yeah, yeah.
No one feels remorse about you sitting on death row. I can tell you that.
No, no, no, I almost spat my coffee yet you with that last No, There's just nothing else to say about that.
There's nothing else there is, so and I can't believe like he would have gone away with every single fucking one of these if it wasn't for Officer Clifford writing down the yeah license plate and trusting his gut.
Yeah, good for him. Gosh, that's that's a good police officer right there. I like it. I agree, Yeah, good, Like I hope that he goes to bed at night being like yeah.
Yeah, well allegedly allegedly he's he's I can't remember if it was George she hangs a photo of or the girl he hangs a photo from. It might be George hangs a photo. I think it was his locker, hangs a photo in his locker as a reminder with like a little colt like trust your.
Gut, oh man.
Yeah, so because of this case, like he's he's got this reminder, this daily reminder that trust your gut.
That's good, right, that's real good.
So shout out to Officer Clifford because that gut feeling. Yeah, you put this fucker behind bars.
Well it's hard to trust your gut lots of times, right, well, because yeah, your mind just makes excuses.
Well, and everyone else makes excuses for you too, like they they know they brushed things off, and they did for Officer Clifford at first too, because he was like, hey, you know what. The very first incident, he's like, you know what, there was this silver suv that are seeing the other day was suspicious and like, ah, that's nothing,
you're being over zealous or whatever. Yeah, and then he listened to them, and then the attack happened again, and then he's finally like okay, I know, like there's something with this, and he brings the license plate forward. They search it and they get a hit on George, and then it led into all of this, which actually it's funny because this is totally it's not comparable, but it kind of is. I remember I was thinking about this just the other day. As a kid my Pokemon card collection.
I listened to like those people around me, like my parents, my sisters, and like all my family and stuff, being like all those aren't gonna be worth anything one day and like I was a kid, right, and then I was transitioning into like, oh, Pokemon's not quite as cool anymore, what am I doing with these cards? I don't collect them. I threw them in the garbage because what everyone else said, I probably threw away like ten to twenty grand worth of cards today. Oh jeez, right, because I listened to
other people. Yeah, but I was like, no, they got to be worth something.
And then I was like, no, well, why didn't that happen with my beanie babies that I didn't throw in the garbage?
Maybe those ones? Yeah? Have you seen that photo of like the beanie babies being separated in court in like nineteen ninety something or whatever. No, no, there's a photo of a couple on the floor of a courtroom separating, Like who's going through?
Oh my gosh, are you serious? I didn't know what you meant by that?
But what Yeah, I'm looking this up right now.
Oh man, what this is recently?
Sorry, No, it's like the nineties, like in the height of it.
I mean yeah, when I was collecting them, I went to like I was pretty in depth.
There's holy shit, they're literally on the courtroom floor in front of a judge and they're separating the pile into two because they're divorcing.
Oh, that is amazing. That's some of the best shit I've ever seen. Right there, I'd do that.
But it is funny how how so many people will just they'll brush you off on your thoughts and your gut feeling.
Yep.
So you need to have that that gotten, trust it and and learn that hey, just because someone else doesn't think so, it's not their gut feeling, it's my gut.
Stick to your guns kind of thing.
So Officer Clifford shout out to you. I'm going to call Officer Clifford the badass of the day on that one alone.
Ye, So yeah, well.
Well done, Thank you. I appreciate it. This is a Patreon case that was recommended in our in our chat on Patreon, So if you want to be a part of Patreon, you can go ahead sign up and link is down below. You get the all behind the scenes stuff, you get the exclusive content, exclusive episodes, and of course you can have the chance to be like, hey, check out this case and we might do it.
So yeah, totally.
All the links in the description. We appreciate you guys being here. We are just an indie podcast, sorry, not just We are an indie podcast, produced, created, researched, recorded, edited, all that stuff in our tiny home by us two. We have no one up that we're answering to. It's us in our show and you guys here listening, and because of you guys supporting us, we get to keep doing this. So thank you so much. It means the world.
It sure does. It's awesome. So until next time.
Until next time, stay wicked.