A case that, at first glance, seems to be inspired by the horror franchise Saw One that would also inspire another Hollywood movie that would star Jesse Eisenberg and Danny McBride. Now you might be thinking that a case that has this sort of movie industry connection surely would have a crazy and wild story. Well you'd be right. Today we talk about a man who lived his last minutes with a bomb strapped to his body while surrounded by police.
A man who is in the middle of a scavenger hunt to save his own life as the seconds ticked by. Today we talk about a man whose death has people sitting behind bars, yet his case is still a mystery. This is the story of Brian Wells. My name's Ben, I'm Nicole, and this is wicked and grim.
Warning.
The following podcast material in more mature audience listener disction is how's it going?
Welcome back?
Did you guys like our new intro? We changed it up just a little bit.
We tweaked it ever so slightly.
We thought it might flow a little better, be a little bit, uh, a little bit I don't know, more professional sounding, I don't know, what do.
You think We're a pretty professional.
We're total pros as we sit here and drinking our rumen eggnog.
Maser in our tiny home. There you go, life.
We hope you guys are having the good holiday spirit finally catching up with you. It is officially October, so October wow, wow, Wow, it is December.
Holy shit, you're in Ben's still living in Halloween left.
This is Halloween. Okay, wow, that's that just hit me like a ton of bricks. Okay, clearly we know her mind. My mind's that I prefer Halloween than Christmas. But it is December. Christmas is coming around the corner. Hopefully you're getting into the holiday spirit.
It's pretty it's kind of almost hard not to, but it also gonna be annoying. I mean I was even just grocery shopping and everywhere just just has Halloween or fucks music playing right.
Halloween on the brain.
Yeah, everywhere you go, so they just kind of like, shove it, shove it down your throat. There you go.
Yeah. I mean, I don't get me wrong, I do enjoy Christmas. It's not by any means my favorite holiday. I like, you know, getting together and seeing family members that sort of stuff. But the whole consumers and part fucking hate.
Yeah, it's year. It gets a little worse in that sense. I feel, Yeah, it's just by the by this, by this, by this, no, and how much you spend is important and everything when really like if you just made someone say Christmas race, Rispy Squares or something that should be enough totally yeah.
Or if you sat down altogether and listened to a true crime podcast on Christmas Day even better? Right now, that is the true meaning of Christmas. Yeah, we got we got some patrons to thank, as you always do. So this past week we had Sophia Smith join us over on Patreon.
Thank you.
We had Eli thank you for messaging us and telling us how to pronounce your name totally would have got it wrong. And Heather Nonya join us awesome. So thank you so much for joining us over on Patreon. If you want to join us as well, link is in the description. If not, it's cool just being here regardless, So thank you for that.
Too, y'all.
Rock We've got some bombs to drop this week, two big bombs.
Two big bombs per USU.
First off, the Boy in the Box.
The Boy in the Box.
Has finally being identified, though they haven't released the identification of the individual.
I wonder if they will.
I believe they're going to. Oh really, I think it's just it's just such new information. There's things to go through and stuff, of course, so they haven't released the name yet. But finally the boy in the box has a name.
Because how many years is that? Well?
I think it was like the sixties or something, wasn't it.
I can't remember, but it was. I thought it was like twenty years, but it must have been longer then.
Oh, it's it's been a while. I'm pretty sure it was in the sixties. Oh, fifties fifty seven? Woween fifty seven.
You know that's interesting because people think, oh, it's been this many years ago, I want to get away with whatever. Oh yeah, they're always they always still have these cases kind of on the back burner where they're probably looking or have one person or two people assigned to them, right, and.
Lots of times in these sort of cases, they're retired individuals who are just still chugging away, who haven't given up.
Wow, which is so cool, that's really cool.
But yeah. They have also said that charges can still be filed if they have a perpetrator. So that is awesome, super looking forward to that. And also in true crime news, the Casey Anthony documentary has officially been released.
It sure was, and we watched, We watched the doozy.
We did a couple of things on this. First and foremost, we loudly and proudly did not pay any money towards her in this documentary because we powerated it. We want to make sure she got absolutely zero dollars from us watching watching this thing. So there, so shout out to my brother in law. He said that I had to actually shout him out and give him the props. Oh really, yes, so Darcy.
Along with the beer and along with the beer.
That I that I gave him. Yeah, so Darcy downloaded it for us, my brother in law and over our way and we got to watch it. So yeah, that's a whole thing we're going to be unpacking.
Yeah, we're going to be doing that, I think via a YouTube video.
Yea.
That will we'll let y'all know when it's out.
Yeah, And we will say this right now, we do not recommend you watch it because she is going to be earning money from this documentary.
Do you know that?
For a fact, let's put it this way with it. Peacock TV. Who ye, Yeah, they have not disclosed if she is earning or.
Not, and I just think which means she is. The way it was went about, I'm sure she is. Okar oh, that's disturbing.
So she is literally profiting off the death of her own three year old daughter. If you want to listen to her story, we did do a podcast episode on it, so you can go check that out, but we do not recommend you listen to or watch your documentary. We will talk about it in our YouTube and tell you everything on why coming soon, Because.
I mean, I was just gonna say people have profited from deaths and stuff, but lots of times it is a in a better way in the sense where they create a charity or something where they're raising money for something really good.
And not to say that like I'm not going maybe she.
Is, hopefully, but i't.
Well, I'm not going to say like we are are holier than thou because we do earn revenue from this podcast. We technically are earning from this these stories as well, So that is the case, But we didn't kill our own daughter, potentially kill our own daughter and go on to talk about it for money.
Yeah. So yeah, well, well we'll be chatting more about this. It will it needs more than just in the intro of a podcast.
Yeah, it's going to have at least a whole episode on its owns. Put it that way. Yeah, but it will be released on our YouTube, which we will be letting you guys know when it's released. Absolutely, so all that news and goodness and not so goodness aside. Are you ready to go into this today?
I'm ready.
So this is the story of Brian Wells. What do you know about the story of Brian Wells? Tell me.
Shit? Because you told me some things and now I'm like, fuck, was I not listening? I white kind of remember some things that you said? But then now I'm like, is that what? I always have too many cases in my head at once, but something to do about.
Well, I just read the intro to you. I know you forget it all already.
A bank robbery, Well, yes, someone was forced to do it, right, Is that right?
There's a bank robbery that occurs, Yes, there's an individual with a bomb strapped to them. Yes, this case. Some people argue there's actually a whole documentary that that claims that it potentially was inspired by the movie Saw, the franchise movie Saw, where you know, Jigsaw puts people in these traps and plays with their lives and toys with them.
I don't think I've watched that.
You've never seen Saw.
I don't think I.
Geez, you gotta watch that. But anyway, some argue this or Sauce series inspired these events. Really now, factually this inspired the movie Thirty Minutes or Less.
Okay, also, haven't watched that.
It's a Hollywood blockbuster movie that's a comedy starring Jesse Eisenberg and Danny McBride where Jesse Eisenberg, a pizza delivery man, gets a bomb forcefully strapped upon him and he has to follow certain steps and everything otherwise he will blow up and die. And to follow these steps bombs removed, and Danny McBride is the one who straps it to them. You go through their antics in the movie. Okay, so that case, or say that movie was inspired by this case.
Okay, so shitty, that's terrifying.
All that being said, let's get into the meat and potatoes, shall we.
Let's do it.
Okay. So on August twenty eighth, two thousand and three, a man with a cane casually strolled into a P and Z bank in Erie, Pennsylvania. He patiently waited for his turn to speak with the bank teller, and he walked up to the counter. The teller saw a middle aged man, white man standing in front of her with some gray hair glasses as he handed her a white envelope.
This wasn't exactly abnormal. White envelopes and envelopes of any shape and size and color get passed to the bank teller on a regular basis, often containing cash or checks that need to be deposited. However, when the woman behind the counter opened the envelope, there was instead a letter inside that had many pages, but a highlighted section that read, now, gather employees with access codes and work fast to fill
the bag with two hundred and fifty thousand dollars. You have only fifteen minutes.
Good, that's a lot of money.
That's a good chunk of change.
That's a lot of money.
I wouldn't mind earning two hundred and fifty thousand dollars and fifteen minutes, that's for sure.
No, but in a better way, I would.
Hope, So I would hope so maybe in a lottery fashion or shit.
There you go.
Yeah, so the bank teller read the letter in shock and confusion. She looked back at the man, who nods to her and pulls down the collar of his shirt to show her what's underneath his shirt. Now it was obvious there had been something under his shirt this entire time, but didn't really cause any reason for an alarm up until now, because now she realized the danger she was in. Underneath the man's shirt was a metal box a fixed
to a collar that locked tightly around his neck. She knew instantly it was a bomb and had no question in her mind as to if it was real or not.
Oh what does she do?
That?
Right there? Is terrifying.
Put yourself in that position pants you Yeah, just I'm peeing. I'm sorry, sir, Yeah, get your money on peeing.
That's just scary.
But what would you do? I'm sure there's procedures, I'm.
Sure there is. I mean you'd have to go to like a supervisor or a manager, and they, I think would be calling the shots.
I don't think you have the ability to just go to a supervisor manager to be like, excuse me, Sarah, can you and your bomb. Hold on for a second, I gotta find my manager. I don't know how to do it.
Well, yeah, but you wouldn't have I don't think that person would have the authority to ever withdraw two hundred and fifty grand.
Though I see where you go, and I see where you going.
She would need someone in more of an authority figure at the bank. I see right.
Well, to answer that question, let's continue on.
Okay.
So the letter also contained information regarding the bomb the shotgun the man was holding, which was also disguised as a cane.
Oh seriously, yeah, okay.
And it also contained information to not contact the police or it would of course not end well.
Yes, So the woman looked.
At the man, looked back down at the letter in her hand, and she wasn't going to be able to comply with his demands because, like you said, she doesn't have the authority. So the bank manager, who was the only one with an access code to the vault, wasn't currently on.
Site, oh my gosh.
And wasn't due back for about an hour.
Oh no, yeah, okay, that is not good.
Yeah, well yeah, yeah, So this bank teller quickly told another teller to go find Aubrey and then quickly came to a compromise with the man who was giving her, who was at the teller. The compromise was, sorry, the compromise was to give him all the cash available in her till, as well as the rest of the tills, because anything else just wasn't possible exactly. I mean he kind of like it wasn't immediately, like she's like, I'll
just give you this cash, and he's like okay. But I mean they did come to a compromise rather quickly, and I dosuing it.
They would all be assuming he's the bad guy, right regardless of the bomb being strapped to him. You would think he's the one with this demands right.
Well, he is the one with the demands right now.
I know, but you'd kind of question why he'd have a bomb on him.
Well, I did tell you earlier that there's an individual. I told you there's going to be an explosion, there's gonna be someone who's forced in the situations. But I never have yet said anything about this man if he is the man. So you're jumping a little bit ahead.
Well, I know, but I'm also just thinking that that wouldn't make sense if you're robbing a bank, You're not going to be putting a bomb on yourself. And I'm just curious if those people would realize that.
Why wouldn't he put a bomb on himself? Why would you to get leverage over the bank.
Yeah, but then you're just putting your own life at risk there.
You're questioning way too many things, way too soon. Let's put it that way.
Okay, shit, Okay, I'll buckle up here. Sorry.
Yeah, you are way too far ahead and have not near enough in I have.
No idea what's going on on, no clue.
You're like still on the tarmac of the airplane and you want to release your parachute.
Wow, that would actually be me pretty much.
So yeah, regardless, they came to a compromise, and she's going to start giving him the bank out of the till. Now. The other employees at the bank looked up when they heard this, and some of them whispered something back to other people, and they started walking some other individuals out the front of the bank, nice and calmly and slowly.
Good call.
So, once she had emptied her till, they were working on emptying all the remaining tills until a canvas bag the man was holding held everything that was available, which was approximately eight thousand dollars.
Oh man, that's not enough.
It's a far cris two hundred and fifty grand. So the entire time the man had a very calm demeanor about him, and once the transaction was done, this was further shown as he grabs a complimentary lollipop from the character with the bank, unwraps it and starts eat it before he walks out the front door.
I kind of love that. Wow, Okay, like I don't like this, any of this, but the fact that he just like gets a lollipop, you know, gets as an adult lollipop guild.
Sorry, now, I'm just I love that. As he was chouned down on the lollipop and walked out the front door, he drove in his He got in his car and drove.
Away, okay, with the eight grand.
With the eight grand. It was only after he left the premises the staff contacted authorities about the robbery. Also, it is noted that there was no employee at the bank called Aubrey. This was actually a code word that the bank tellers used that they could inform each other that they were being robbed without being too obvious.
Okay, I get it.
So that's pretty cool.
Okay, that is so.
It was only a short while later that authorities managed to track the man down near a McDonald's and pulled him over and arrested him for robbing the bank. This is where things took an unexpected turn. The manning question was forty six year old Brian Wells, and according to friends and family, Brian Douglas Wells was a man with just like anyone else, just a normal guy. He was a forty six year old pizza delivery man who lived alone in his apartment with his three cats. He was
known to be a fantastic employee where he worked. He never phoned in sick and had only ever called in to work late once in ten years. Wow, and he did this because his cat had died. His cat had died.
Oh my gosh, that's actually incredibly impressive. I don't think anyone else in the whole world would have that kind of track, I don't think, So that's amazing.
Yeah. Brian also loved puzzles. He waited anxiously every year for a local scavenger hunt contest, one that would have people searching the city for hidden keys, and clues that would eventually lead to opening a box at the end of the scavenger hunt that would have a cash prize of twenty five hundred dollars.
My gosh, Okay, this guy sounds as peer as they come.
He's not as, he's not pure, let's put it that way. He did have himself involved with some sex workers, so I wouldn't say pure.
Oh, he was a very good.
Guy, though, let's put it that way. Okay, pure might not be the proper word.
Okay, Well, the last few lines of description made him say peer. But he did also just like rop a bank kind of.
Maybe he was a normal guy. He was a good guy, Okay. Now people knew him and locals would see him out and about, grabbing his breakfast in the morning before heading out to work. Now, on this day, while Brian was at work, his shift was coming to an end. When the pizza shop got an order for two pepperoni pizzas around noon. It was to be delivered to the end of Peach Street. Brian offered to make the delivery. His shift was about to end and this would be the
last delivery for him for the day. But once Brian made the delivery, This is when things took a turn even worse. This is when Brian was next scene a little while later, entering the bank with the bomb. Now, according to Brian, when he delivered the pizzas at the address down the dead end dirt road, there was a TV transmission station right around there. It's kind of like not really a home address.
Okay.
Now, when he arrived there to deliver the pizza, there were three men waiting for him. He got out of the car to hand over the pizzas and was then that these three men, these three black men, held them up at gunpoint.
Wow.
He tried to run, but they fired warning shots and prevented his escape, and they forcefully attached the bomb.
Shit, holy, holy crap. That's terrifying. Yeah, there are some jobs that I think actually are more risky than others, and like delivery kind of seems like it could be sketchy.
I do think delivery is kind of a dangerous fucking job because you don't know the individuals you're marking into.
Not at all delivery. And I think we've mentioned it before, like realtor I think is real sketch too.
Realtor is real sketch.
Mm hmm. Yeah, like you're literally just going into houses and like closing the door and you have no idea with who.
Yeah, you don't have to do a background check on these people and you're just in their fucking home. Yes, it's like cool, this sounds like fun.
M m.
This is how I'm going to become an episode on Wicked and Grim today.
It's like, yeah, no, thanks, yeah, but I mean, honestly, every job could have some situations that could turn bad. Really, so.
He had this bomb fortuately put around his neck. Okay, they then armed the bomb, handed him a list of instructions and it said if Brian, and they said if Brian wanted to get out of the bomb, he'd have to follow the instructions, which would lead him across town in a series of locations, a job that almost seemed tailor made for Brian.
Exactly. I already have a question. I don't know if I'm allowed to ask it.
What's up?
My beginning to ahead of myself. But he was like, I remember a descriptive word you use while he was in the bank, and he was very like calm and chill. Yes, that to me is surprising.
Yes, okay, yes, okay, yes, yes, yes, one hundred percent. So Brian explained to the officers this encounter with three men who forced him into this contraption with a bomb and gave him these set of instructions that he had to follow and complete or the bomb would explode. The bomb was a serious issue. So at this time, officers had him out of his vehicle, they had him in handcuffs, and they had him sitting on the concrete in front of a vehicle. He's in a public road, so they
had to take this bomb quite seriously. But absolutely they needed to professional They needed to have professionals come in to deal with it.
Though.
They had no other option but to have him sit there and pavement and wait for the.
Bomb squad wait it out. Oh my goodness, and I'm sure he just chills a cucumber at that moment. Too.
Well, they couldn't. First of all, they couldn't risk anyone's safety. They couldn't have anyone transporting his potential bomb. They couldn't even be anywhere near it. Right, So Brian was, like I said, handcoff, put there and waiting for the bomb squad to right. And Brian's previous calm demeanor was still lingering. But it was kind of growing a little bit more anxious as time went on.
Well, because too, if he's caught and he's sitting there, then he's probably not following the directions of the list that they gave him, right, yes, now.
At one point he even shouted out, and this is recorded, by the way, because there were camera crews on the scene. Local news showed up pretty quick. Jeez, he shouted out, why isn't anyone trying to get this thing off me? And it wasn't long after that that you could start to hear a beeping sound. Oh my gosh, and that beeping quickly began to pick up. Fate pick up. Its pace started beating faster and faster and faster, and civilians
were looking on in the situation. News stations had their cameras locked on Brian as he sat helpless on the street. Police stood back, securing the area, and in a single instant, all the built up tension and pressure off, a loud boomed in the streets. Shit now, thankfully, thankfully this well, I'll say this first before I say the thankfully part. As the boom went off, Brian flopped backwards onto the pavement, lifeless.
It was only about three minutes after the explosion that the bomb squad arrived on scene.
Oh my gosh.
So the thankfully part I was going to say is the camera crews did not capture on live TV.
That would be very good. Yeah.
I didn't look into exactly the malfunction. I'm just going to leave it at that, but apparently there was some sort of malfunction with the technical difficulties or something. Cameras were not on him at that.
Moment, because at first I was like, did he live? Like, what do you mean? But there's no way, no, he did not. There's no way no.
Yeah. So a very short while after the bomb went off. It while it quite literally blew a hole in the side of his neck and face and leaving him to die nearly instantly, he basically only had enough time to take like one last labored breath and bleed out.
Oh my gosh.
Is it is easy to understand that only two hours later that this man who had a bomb strapped to him and robbing a bank would be surrounded by officers waiting for bomb squad to arrive. It's kind of understandable that someone who did these sort of things would be in this sort of situation.
Oh yeah, absolutely, but.
The events that got him to be in this situation and were baffling to say the least. Who were these men that sent him on this wild goose chase? And who else was involved in the notes that Brian claimed to be in possession of, who strapped the bomb to his neck, who was he talking about, who did he run into on the hair?
A lot of questions.
So the bomb squad, once they were ready, they moved in on the scene to investigate further regarding the bomb and Brian's lifeless body. Now, they were cautious as they didn't know if the bomb could go off a second time or if there was another one on scene.
Okay, I never even thought about that, but yeah, they'd still have to definitely approach with caution.
So after searching the car, they had a brief scare thinking there was a secondary explosive on site, but it turned out to be the homemade shotgun slash cane that was used in the robbery that was laying in the back seat. Now, along with that, they also found the notes with instructions that Brian had mentioned. The notes showed to go from location to location and Brian would either have to complete a task, solve a riddle, or follow
the instructions to another location. If he did everything correctly, he would eventually have all the combinations he needed to unlock the bomb, take it off, and save his life.
Okay, and so him getting caught by the police prevented him from doing this correct ugh.
The first set of instructions Brian was given was detailed a detailed plan on how to rob the bank. They also came with a warning. Brian was told that he was being watched and if at any point he strayed from the path or reached out to the authorities, then the people watching him would detonate the explosive. The letter also said that if Brian tried to remove the bomb without putting in the correct combination, or if the timer on the bomb ran out, then the bomb would go
off and kill him. The bomb was also attached to Brian's neck with a metal ring something similar to like a large pair of handcuffs, meaning it wasn't just something that Brian could cut his way out of.
H they really secured this Hey oh.
Yeah, Actually I didn't really talk about the engineering of the bomb, but later after investigation on it, there was a lot of crazy engineering on this thing. More so than just your average pipe bomb, which is relatively easy to make. There was quite quite in depth, let's put it that way. And there was a lot of red herrings in this as well. Basically means there was things to distract someone who is going to try and deactivate
this bomb. So if bomb squad did come in, for example, I think there was a ring of liquid that ran around the collar of this bomb, a blue liquid.
That was just nothing, really, yeah, just to throw.
You off, just to throw you off.
Holy. So I mean, who would have known? Even if they did arrive, it might have taken them some time yep to have gotten this off.
Yep.
Holy. I have so much going through my brain right now. But let's continue now.
After the bank, Brian followed the instructions and headed to a local McDonald's where he was told to look for the next set of instructions right in the flowerbed of the drive through, and there there would be a rock with the next steps. Okay, So he found the rock and underneath it wore the instructions. From there he was on his way to the next set of instructions, search for part of the combination, but it was then the
police caught up with him. One team of investigators decided they would actually follow these instructions, so they kept on going and they went to the next step, and sure enough there was a cash with some more instructions and pieces to the puzzle, and of course more to head onto the next location. And when they got to another location, within these instructions there was in fact another cash, but a cash that was supposed to give Brian his freedom from the explosion.
But it didn't.
It didn't really the cash was empty.
Holy oh my goodness. He would have gone all the way there and and just nothing in there.
Well, this means one of two things exactly that one that he could have got there and there was nothing in there, which means the individuals who strapped this on his neck were planning to kill Brian this entire time regardless. Or two it could have meant that there were individuals watching and it went ahead of the police, removed clues, or they didn't plant it because they knew police were on their way. Right, Okay, So one of those two situations.
Well, and I mean it, they would have been getting their way late, yes, right then when they seeple would have expected that Brian would have correct, so I kind of feel like they're probably watching potential.
Another team of investigators began retracing Brian's steps that day, looking for the address on Peach Street where he delivered the pizza and hopefully some of the men that Brian claimed held him at gunpoint and put the bomb on him. But the address on Peach Street only led them to
more questions. The address didn't actually belong to a home, as I mentioned, but this TV kind of transmission station, which was in the middle of like the forest, gave investigators nothing to work with, nothing to tie to an actual location. Didn't give them a lead on any sort of group of men either. It was just a cold trail.
Hmm. That's such a random I mean, gosh, I feel like if you were delivering pizza, it'd almost be like, good, I don't know if I want to go there.
Yeah, right, fair enough, But Brian willingly volunteered to go on this one too.
That's true, but he kind of seemed like he was that way.
Yeah. So, now, amazingly this case went cold, with the only witness who could tell the investigators anything substantial also
being the deceased victim. Right, but the authorities were desperate to solve this case, and they jumped at the chance to do whatever they could to answer anything, and answers started popping up in the most unlikely places, starting with a man named William Rostein, who would make a call to the police to talk about a house on Peach Street, just about a mile away from that transmission site that Brian was led to just about a month before the call.
William was a high school mechanics teacher who was also an engineer and spoke multiple languages, and the tip he gave authorities had everything to do with the homicide, just not Brian's homicide.
Another homicide on Peach Street.
Well, according to William, authorities, if they take a look, they would find a body in a freezer in the basement of the address on Peach Street. And he knew that because it was his house, his freezer.
Okay. See that's why I'm like, what is this guy doing, because he's like making himself look like he's up to no good here.
Yeah, but he was adamant that he had nothing to do with killing said.
Victim in the It's just in his fucking freezer.
Basically, he was calling to report the dead body in his own freezer.
Okay, yeah that makes sense.
Yeah, just your your average police report. Yeah, nothing, nothing weird.
Or I have a dead body my freezer that's been there for I don't know how long, and I didn't do it, but it's there.
Oops. I tripped.
Wow. Yeah to get that call, i'd be like, uh is your name Casey?
Oh shit? Wow?
Am I allowed to say that? Wow?
Just wow?
Okay, moving on, Hey, I don't I just got to defend myself. She is a liar. We everyone knows she's lies. I didn't just make that ship.
Up, does she though?
Yeah, she was a chronic liar.
Everyone knows that, You're right.
I'm just defending myself.
So well. The new documentary Casey Anthony, Where the Truth Lies, the Truth. Casey's trying to be telling her truth and it says it right in the title, Where the Truth Lies.
Yeah, I just need to defend myself. I don't need no hate mail.
No, we don't like Casey, that's for sure. Anyway. Moving on, William said that the body was in his freezer because he was only helping his ex fiance Marjorie dial Armstrong. She was helping her out after she killed her then boyfriend, good God, James Rodent, and needed a place to store his body.
Huh, that doesn't make any sense to me.
Well, William had agreed to let her use his freezer for the price of seventy thousand dollars.
Oh, okay, that makes more sense, yep.
But he had drawn the line when Marjorie had asked him to put James's body in an ice grinder. That's when he decided to call the police.
Oh gosh.
So the police arrested Marjorie right after this tip, and William went on to tell the authorities that he's been feeling incredibly guilty for his part in covering up James's murder and had even at one point been thinking about committing suicide.
I mean, that's a lot like it is. He could go to jail for that, easy.
Yeah, an accessory to murder, right. Yeah. Investigators searched his property, finding James and the freezer just as he was described. However, they also found William's suicide note that he wrote during that period when he was thinking of taking his own life. Okay, but what really grabbed their attention, aside from the frozen body, of course, was that the opening line of his suicide note read this has nothing to do with the Wells case aka Brian Wells.
Should have shredded that note buddy. Yeah, that's pretty incriminating right there, it is.
Why would you just like, there's no lines drawing between these two.
Yeah, no one would think that there ever had anything to do with each other.
The only line that police could draw is Peach Street the proximity sough. Yeah, it's kind of a line that started growing more interesting when all the coincidences really started piling up, and the more they looked into it.
This Peach Street's up to no good.
Yeah, it's not very Peachy's put that way.
Oh, that was a bad time. You can drink of water, not at all.
Yeah. So Brian had been called to an address on Peach Street where he was allegedly fitted with a bomb, just like we had discussed. Over a month later, a man had been discovered in a suicide suicidal mechanics house on Peach Street who had claimed that he had nothing to do with Brian's case. It just doesn't seem to fit, Like, what's going on? This is a little too coincidental. Now, perhaps William had a lot more to do with this coincidence.
Oh, because I just did a light bomb go on?
What's that?
Well, because this guy was like an engineer kind of person, right, Oh that's right, Yeah, I just did the light bulb go off. Here.
He was a mechanic and an engineer who could speak multiple languages with the now and the tools at home to maybe, I don't know, create a bomb like the one Brian was wearing.
Yeah, like he's smart dude, I'm assuming, and that bomb seemed like it was thought through and made in a way that would throw people off and such.
Right, Yes, he's a very smart dude, and it would take a very smart dude to make said bomb.
Thank God, you're looking at me right now.
I'm proud of you for thinking of that. You caught on like perfectly.
Did you see my light bomb?
They did?
It was it was a pretty big dang right there.
It's funny because where I'm sitting right now, there's actually a light bulb sitting over your head. So it works out.
Now.
The question is, though, what about Marjorie? If she could just get William to hide James's body, would be much of a stretch to think that she could ask him to build a bomb too.
Oh, like she's the one behind this. Maybe, yeah, but how stupid you have to be? Like, why is he helping his ax so much? I mean the seventy g's I guess you mentioned. Yeah, but he's a smart duty you're making us own money.
True. Now, As for Marjorie, she lived in Squalor, and she had a long history of mental illness, including bipolar disorder. Not to mention, James wasn't the first boyfriend she'd actually gotten rid of in a hurry either.
Oh.
She'd actually shot and killed one of her previous boyfriends, but he claimed to be the victim of domestic violence and wasn't charged with anything. She was actually acquitted of murder after her boyfriend was found laying on the couch shot six times.
Wow. Okay, that does not seem like something you get away with.
Yeah, I mean, I understand if it isn't self defense. I totally get that. I'm not gonna sit here and argue that you shouldn't defend yourself.
Oh no, but I mean someone just laying on the couch shot six that many times? Shot?
Yeah, a little suspicious. Now, Her husband and several other people in her social circle also died under suspicious circumstances, but Marjorie somehow managed to keep ahead of authorities and get away with people dropping dead around her like flies. That is, of course, until William made this call to authorities. But even if Marjorie was a serial killer, why would she want to kill Brian And what was her motive
to rob a bank? Well, Marjorie's father had quite a bit of money, and Marjorie was planning on of course, inheriting it, right, but she couldn't do that if her father had blown all his money on his own.
Though before he died, is that what he was doing?
Well, Marjorie's a sure seemed to think it was going to happen. Marjorie went back to her tried and true solution and planned to kill her father.
Oh my gosh, this woman seems horrid.
She's not pleasant. Let's put it out yeah now, to do this, she didn't want to be caught up in any sort of investigation this time. She's had some close calls in the past, right, so she wants to get away scott free. So she wanted to make sure that this death wouldn't be traced back to her. This ties into Brian Wells's death because a few months after his death, a man named Kenneth would become connected in all this
and provide vital information. Now, Kenneth Barnes comes into the picture as he was turned into authorities by his brother in law for bragging about being a part of the heist. When brought in for questioning, he admitted that Marjorie had asked him to kill her father, but she hadn't been able to pay him to do the job, so not wanting to do it for free. Of course, you don't want to work for free, right, Kenneth refused to do the job, and Marjorie had to find a way to
come up with the fee. Suddenly, Marjorie had more than enough motive for needing to get her hands on some money quickly, and she was what tied these two men together, excluding her dead boyfriend with the freezer.
Of course, my gosh. Okay, so Kenneth is in jail.
Kenneth came forward saying he was.
A part, right, he was ragging about it to someone.
Yes, okay, now he was involved, and he said that Marjorie wanted him to murder her father.
Okay, yeah, it's all making sense. Yes, sorry, it's a lot there. It's kind of was a lot of process.
There is a lot of process in this case. And I'm gonna be honest right now, I have skipped some information already.
Holy really, if you.
I'll tell you exactly where you can go get all the deeds. It's a bit of a deep dive, but I'll tell you that at the end of this episode, because it's.
Almost like, how on earth could you have skip shit like this is.
There's a lot a lot here. There is so much to this case. It's wild. But anyways, Yeah, so Marjorie needs money to pay Kenneth.
To do the job right, to kill her dad.
And how much do you think she needed to pay him?
Well, at least two hundred and fifty two.
And fifty grand, yeah, yeah, exactly. So how much were we robbing? Oh, write, two hundred and fifty grand from the bank?
They should have got a little bit more, like just in case you know, you needed something else something went wrong.
Come on, they didn't even get eight grand.
So yeah.
Now police began to wonder about James in the freezer and why Marjorie killed him in the first place. They wondered if she killed him, was it because he'd been on the heist too. What if he had possibly wanted out of the deal when he realized how serious it was getting. Maybe he was just in it for some money and didn't realize they planned on strapping I don't know, a live bomb to a man and killing someone.
That would make shit get real real quick.
Oh yeah, for sure. What if someone is just sitting here thinking, oh, I can make a quick couple extra bucks, rob a bank, no harm, no foul, and you realize you're basically involved in a murder plot.
Yeah, that you're now a murderer.
Yeah. That takes things from zero to sixty real fucking quick, real quick, and that turns you from just like a bank robber to a fucking douche canoe real quick like.
Yeah. Yeah, So then he wanted out, but he knew too much, so she murdered him.
That's what the police were thinking.
Makes sense.
Now. They also thought what if there was something else going on? According to another witness, Kenneth Barnes and Brian Wells knew each other quite well, and there were witnesses at the bank that claimed Brian had been incredibly calm for a man with a bomb attached to his chest.
Yeah, which I thought was odd too.
Yeah, you know, chilling out with a lollipop.
Just yeah, you were surprised with this bomb, Like, there's no way that you would be I mean, you might have to kind of fake it a little bit, but it would be seen, it would be noticeable that you were uncomfortable. Ye.
Now, even as a bomb ticked down the minutes, the seconds as he sat in the middle of the street, that beeping, Yeah, he never really got very agitated, only like kind of anxious nervous, right, Yeah, But I mean he is in front of police, surrounded by them, right, and probably make anyone nervous regardless. So I think anyone in their last absolute minutes, knowing or at least convinced they're going to die, is probably going to be a little more panicked. But he didn't really seem to.
Well, I mean, would anyone in that situation know that they were that what the beeping meant necessarily?
Well, what if you're sitting there with a bomb strapped to your chest and you have notes that says you're going to die unless you complete these things.
On a schedule, and you're not doing that.
And then it begins beeping.
And then beeping faster. Yeah, I would.
Shit, I think you'd put two and two together.
Yeah, yep, no, I really would.
What if you're in that situation and you thought the bomb was fake?
Oh oh no, oh no? What like Brian thought that it wasn't a real bomb.
What if that's what he thought?
Oh?
Man, what if Brian was just that easy going because he'd actually been on the whole heist himself as well, Maybe he didn't realize his life was actually on the line because the plan was to fix him with a fake bomb.
Wow, you got me there. That's gut wrenching really.
So what if James figured out that they actually planned on strapping a real bomb to Brian without him knowing?
But why would they.
For real effect, to really cover their tracks, to ensure that there actually is a victim, to get rid of evidence, to tie up loose ends. And what if James figured this out or learned of this and couldn't have this happen and he was going to tell Brian and James was killed for it.
So then there's two victims in this.
So then there could be two yep. Now, witnesses saw Brian coming in and out of William's house several times in the weeks leading up to the robbery, including the day before. Brian's family is very adamant that he'd have nothing to do with this and that he'd be telling the truth when he said that he'd been forced to wear a bomb and rob a bank. Law enforcement, however, disagrees, though they say that there are several witness reports that claim that Brian had discussed parts of the plot a
month before. Even and Marjorie later claimed that he had actually been a part of it as well.
Hmm. I mean people can surprise you. They can family lots of times they have no idea, Yeah, no idea. You may think someone is one way or you have it in their head that this is how they've always been. But people can change and get into sticky situations sometimes.
And it seems to fit just a little too perfect.
It kind of very because like, yeah, how Even said he was pretty much off work. I mean he did seem like he was slightly go good or maybe, but that he volunteered to go out there because it was like all part of the plan, you know, like and they did this right when he was about to get to work or get off work.
And now an important thing I do want to discuss is in his autopsy there was Well I should mention this first. There's a very unfortunate thing with with his autopsy that occurred with the bomb that blew up on his chest. The caller was still intact around his neck. So they couldn't remove the caller without tampering with evidence because they wanted to investigate it and like really get down to the details of this bomb, right, So they
couldn't remove the caller without ruining evidence. So to get it off Brian, they actually had to remove his head in the autopsy.
Okay, that's what I thought was You were going to say, is very unfortunate, which is very distressing, very controversial that that occurred. Well, yeah, I can see that, but also it's like they have to figure this out. Yeah, in a way, but I get it to be another way to get it off.
Well, the way I look at it is an autopsy, like they cut you wide open. There's the whole autopsy, like the why incision on your chest? We're fine with that, right, So I don't understand. I mean, I do understand, but I don't. At the same time, it's like to get the job done. I don't see why that can't be done as well. But I also have the respect for him, and I get it, like, I see both sides.
I can see both sides. Yes, I mean we're more familiar with that. We know about the cut on the chest, and that's just everyone knows it's happened. So the removing head is a little bit more. It's not common, right at all.
Exactly, but yeah, so that occurred. But in his autopsy they found zero defensive wounds to show that he was in any sort of a struggle that he described when they strap this collar to him, not in his hands, not in his neck, elbow's, knees, being pinned to the ground, nothing.
And if you're getting a bomb strapped to you would definitely be in the defense, that's for sure, if you weren't tying on it.
Yeah. Now, arguably he was a gunpoint too, So okay, maybe he just hands up and just let it happen. That is a possibility, but it is worth noting there were no defensive wounds found in his autopsy. Now, as for hold on, where am I here? Okay? As for the others, Kenneth claimed that Marjorie was the one behind it all and she was certainly the one who connected all of the men, which is as far as facts and all that goes aside from Brian can't prove any
of that. Unfortunately, with him being passed away, he can't really say.
Much, not at all.
But Marjorie claimed that William was the mastermind, apparently he was one behind the whole thing, and that her only part had apparently been to supply kitchen timers that.
Went unto the boll Oh my gosh, she's making herself sounds like an innocent page.
Just not, She's definitely not. William only ever admitted to helping Marjorie hide James's body, and that he had actually and he had actually later died of cancer before investigators could get anything else out of him as well, which really very unfortunate. That is, at this time, I believe he was terminal during this investigation. So okay, So both Marjorie and Kenneth were charged and sentenced as co conspirators in the whole scheme, with Kenneth receiving a little bit
of a lesser sentence. I believe Marjorie was around forty years and he was twenty two and a half years, and he received the lesser sentence for testifying against Marjorie.
I just have to point out too, with Kenneth having the terminal illness, yes, it would make sense that whatever he was saying was right because at that what point, I mean, well.
I guess it's his name necessarily.
Yeah, it's his name. Still, I was like, what does he have to hide? Like? But yeah, no.
So there's a documentary out there that covers this case and they connect it to the Saw movie, the one that I talked about at the beginning, and this documentary. Now, mind you, this is their perspective. This is the way they paint it. This is their reenactment. This is not how it really played out. This is just their thought process. They think of it as very much so him being like Jigsaw. Now, Jigsaw is the main antagonist in Saw.
He's the one who captures people, puts him into these devices and they have to fight for their life to escape, often giving up limbs and cutting off their own leg to escape from shackles and stuff sort of thing. Now, Jigsaw is terminal in the movies. He's going to die anyways.
So he is taking people out of these situations who are taking life for granted and putting them in these tough situations too, essentially repent for their past history and where they're living, them where they've been living, and then so when they do get out, maybe minus the leg or something, now they will have a newfound respect for the life that they have. Whereas Jigsaw, he's limited, He's going to be dying soon, right, So his perspective is also,
I don't care if please catch me. Everything dies with me, And they say in this documentary they painted as him saying this, the truth dies with me, Like he's laughing in the face of the cops, like you're not going to figure it out anyways, because I'm the mastermind pulling all the strings and you're not going to get to learned shit because I'm dead.
Oh my god.
So that's a perspective this documentary talks about, huhm, which is very possible.
Well yeah, I mean, like he could still be hiding it in a sense too, because like I said, it's his name. He doesn't want like this on his name, Like he wants to die like being known kind of like I'm a good person.
Yeah, And there's so many murderers out there who don't like to give all the information they like to hold that power even when they die. They like to die knowing that they held that power.
Yeah, that's not the first time we've heard of this.
Now, all this being said, even though there are two individuals behind bars being co conspirators in this, no one actually knows who orchestrated the events. Law enforcement believed that Marjorie was the actual mastermind behind all of it, and cite her many mental health issues as leading to the overly elaborate scheme.
Well, she had that motive too, she did, But was she.
Really the one to construct it? Was she the one to really put this plan together? Was it really her? Authorities believe so, but there's no proof to say she was the one who putting it all on the puppet master,
if you will. Authorities also officially announced that the then deceased William Rothstein Sorry and Brian Wells had both been involved in the case, and that they were named as co conspirators, somehow leaving Brian Wells's legacy to the man who pulled off the one of the most dangerous bank robberies of all time, being one of the strangest homicide victims to this day, so he has officially, according to authorities been named a co conspirator as well.
Okay, I was like, not, I don't know. This is a weird one.
Hey it is. And there is a Netflix documentary on this. They came out in twenty eighteen. It's called Evil Genius.
Okay, I don't have heard of that.
It's got some more information on this case. For example, I did mention that Brian Wells was involved with sex workers. There is I believe it was a sex worker that came forward. She came forward, and she was actually the one who kind of she claims she got Brian involved as the target of this, though she's not a very
good she's not a very reliable source of information. Though I believe this the way they were'd it okay, but she forward saying she feels bad, but she's the one who kind of put him up for the role because he's kind of a pushover type guy and yeah, he'd be good to do.
It, and then he agreed. Probably I'm assuming from the money as well, but that doesn't even make sense. Everything so okay with just leaving after only getting like eight grand.
Too, So everything about Brian being involved is pure speculation. However, authorities have named it official. He is an official co conspirator, but there is no evidence to point motive or nothing along those lines.
This one's got me here.
This one is a big, old tangled web of what the fuck is going on?
Yeah, so I just had one another question here that the Netflix thing. Is it just like a one episode or is it a few episodes?
If I recall correctly, it's a docuseries.
Okay, well I might have to watch that.
It is a good watch. There is a lot of information on it, and you might want to make sure you got a drink or two and some snacks ready because it's yeah, it's it's a ride.
We got some cheesies.
We got some cheesies. We got some cheesies, we got some eggnog, we got some true crime. It's a date.
There we go.
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