Wind down with Janet Kramer, an Imheart Radio podcast.
On Today's Whine About It Thursday Therapy. We've got Greg Harden and he has a book out called Stay Sane and Insane World, how to Control the Controllables and Thrive. He actually has a forward by Tom Brady. Greg Harden is a peak performance coach. He's a motivational speaker. He has worked with seven time Super Bowl champion quarterback Tom Brady. He's also worked with Heisman Trophy winner and Super Bowl MVP Desmond Howard and twenty three time Olympic gold medalist
Michael Phelps. He's spent over thirty years building them at the University of Michigan whoop including four hundred future professional athletes, fifty NFL first round draft picks, and one hundred and twenty Olympians from over twenty countries. And he's gained national recognition when sixty Minutes Sports profiled him as Michigan's secret weapon. Let's get him on and hear all about how to stay Sane in an Insane World?
Hey, Greg, how are you?
Life is good?
Yeah, it looks good.
So I was reading your bio and I got really excited because I'm from Michigan.
Detroit, Michigan, Yes I am.
I mean I say Detroit when I'm like, you know, yeah, I'm from Detroit, but like really in my street cred is not that cool.
I was was I.
Was born in that area, but I was raised like forty five minutes northeast of Detroit.
I understood, but.
I'm still like, yeah, no, I'm from Detroit because I just I have a very like I even got I even got mad at. I remember Madonna said something really negative about Michigan, and I just have such a love for my home state. I have a love for Detroit. I have a love for just you know, the where I went to school. And I just think Michigan is just beautiful all around, and even Detroit like what they've
been able to do and rebuild. And I just am like I am the biggest, Like I love my like home state and the cities that fall in it.
Well, I'll tell you what, I'm excited to meet you. Your range is crazy. She does what she does what and what and a producer, don't forget the producer.
Listen, we hustle from Detroit, you know what I mean. So like we're we're bred that way. It's like, all right, you got to hustle, and that's just like, yeah, that's been my thing. But you're not are You're not from Michigan though, are you?
I'm from Detroit, Michigan.
You are from Detroit? Oh my guess? And are you still working at U of M?
I am? You know you finished the way you start. That was a client of mine one hundred years ago, and now they're a client again where I'm advising the athletic director and a couple of other folks. But I retired from the university in twenty twenty, okay, and talk about picking a perfect time to get away from a out yeah, yeah, and so so now I just do consulting and uh, I work only with people I like. And so I'm in a fool's paradise.
Who are the people that you like?
Like if you could put them in like a room together, like, who would be those people?
People like a few hockey players that I work with, a couple of NBA players, some lawyers, some attorneys. I'm working with a financial guru wizard in New York. And but there are people who I absolutely love and like and appreciate and and they understand what I'm trying to give them is more than you know success.
So what what do you give them?
Then? Like what is your first of all, like the qualities that they have that you like in them? And then what are you giving them?
Oh good question when we talk about look at this, what's the difference you've worked with all these high performance individuals. What's the difference between Tom Brady and Michael Phelps of Desmond Howard, Charles Woodson and the list goes on and you have to share with them. They're not only hungry, they're humble. So the people I work with, they have the ability to surrender their ego. They have the ability to be coachable. That's what the secret, the real secret sauces.
Are you coachable? It doesn't matter how good I Kramer, It don't matter how good we are, right, it doesn't matter how good I am. If the people don't receive it, if they don't want it, if they don't hunger for it, if they aren't passionate about being the best, I can't help.
What do you see as the biggest mental block for the people that like they want to be they want to be the best at it, But like there is what mental block do you think holds holds people back from going to that next step.
Being human? See, what happens is that no matter how we cut it, no matter who you are, you're going to turn into a human being over and over and over again. And what happens is that they have the same problems, issues, trials, and tribulations that the rest of us go through. To sit up and think that, well, you know, Jak, she's a superstar. J K is a human being trying to stay sane in an insane world. So some of us struggle mightily just with self acceptance
and self love. And that's if you want to know the secret. That's not a secret of love and self acceptance. You know, people who are some of the best friends you've ever had in your life treat you superior. You love the way that sort of a tension affection, the approval and acceptance they give you is spectacular. But how
they treat themselves saddens you. So the blocks are how people talk to themselves, how they treat themselves, how they are looking outside of themselves for acceptance and approval.
Yeah, I would say that.
I mean that's one hundred percent because whenever I kind of think back. I'm like, all right, what was the problem there? I always go back to I put myself either in the box or I am listening to old beliefs that maybe someone else said to me and that I believed as my own belief but it was never really mine to like hold, And I think those have been the hardest ones to like unbreak.
That's excellent. I mean, think about it. You've got you can't let a twelve year old run your life. That twelve year old remembers what they said about me and how I my nose. You got an eight year old in your head talking about your nose too big. Oh, you have to let go of yesterday's baggage, not being able to let go of yesterday, not understanding that yesterday. Wow, it's a canceled check. It's history tomorrow and future tripping is like a promisory note. It's a mystery. But what
we have on hand, the here and now. Being able to stay in the here and now is a secret to advancing and staying focused.
That's so true.
I love that check. Yeah, you can't use a check yesterday. Oh my god, I love that saying. That's that's so good. It's just so hard though, because I come from a very how do I say this, Like I have to like everything's on my shoulders, right, So it's hard for me to not control things because I'm like I have to. I have to run the ship. I have to do it.
And so when I don't know something that's going to happen, it's like this, I get this weird, anxious feeling, and it's hard for me just to be sane, especially in today's world, like you know, just with everything going on, and then all the pieces and the moving pieces and then like all right, well, is this is this career opportunity going to go through? Or is this idea going to fail? Or is this going to go through?
Forward?
And it's like I can't control really any of it. I can just do my part of it. But then I'm like, but then when it doesn't work out, then I go to well then I fail, Like I just go straight to like in or I failed. And then that's where I'm like, what could I have done better? How could I have controlled it better? And I think that's like my problem, So help.
Are you ready and just do it? What we need to be clear about is that your control freak. I'm one of the best I've ever met. But I had to learn over and over and over. I can only control me. I can't control all so many aspects of my life and what's going on around me and with other people thinking what they decide. But listen carefully, how I feel about me is not based on any of that.
My self extreme, my self esteem, and my self worth must not be based on external forces things around me, money, power, success, achievements. That's nice, But how I feel about me if I fail. I hate failing. But I ain't gonna stop liking myself because I'm not gonna beat myself up because it doesn't work. It's ineffective. So once you get into simple because you've heard it's all beating yourself up, that worrying doesn't work,
I'm telling you it's ineffective. Let's be clear. And it's a habit and a pattern, so you know secretly in your head that pattern has to be changed. And what we teach people to do is begin to become so sophisticated in becoming the world's greatest expert on you that you just begin to see what works and what doesn't work. What habits do I have that are building me up. What habits do I have that are tearing me down? Where relationships are building me up? And where relationships are
draining me? Do I have psychic vampires in my life? You've got to be so sophisticated that you don't just examine relationships when you're mad and upset and when it's falling apart. You periodically review it's working, what's not working? How are these people treating themselves? How are they treating me? But I You'll have a vision of what you really want to do, and you have this idea, and sometimes it's going to work, and sometimes it's not going to work,
but you will never stop. You have never stopped, And so you anticipate, You anticipate anxiety. Are you ready for this? I need you to be so clear that excitement and anxiety have some very similar characteristics, heart racing, sweating, you know, breathing, impaired their moments. Think about this. We just met with seven minutes ago. You're ready. Yeah, I guarantee you. There's some moments in your life, some of the most amazing adventures you've ever been on, some of the most stupendous,
spectacular moments of your life. You're about to crap your pants before they oh, for sure. And so what we have to begin to understand is it makes sense to be anxious. It makes sense to be able to be so clear about anxiety is going to show up that you predict it, you manage it, and you turn anxiety into excitement. You turn fear, you turn fear into passion because it's gonna come if you're human. And so here's here's the piece. Sometimes you're worried because fear and self
doubt attack. Fear and self doubt is the greatest enemy you have ever faced in your life. And you face some enemies, but the fear inside the self doubt, I mean you, the competition is between the ears. The greatest contest, the greatest challenge in your life is can you master your old man m That's what we're teach in that book.
What in your life have you had the hardest time kind of picking yourself up from? Because obviously, you know you're incredible with your words and your energy, and you know you motivate other people and to succeed to their fullest, Like where where do you kind of look at yourself and go, Okay, I this is this This piece is hard for me. I know you mentioned the control piece, but like, because there's something else that's under there that's like if you're having a moment. You know.
I'm a professional helper, right, I help people, and I tell people if you can't you find out what what you don't like in yourself, and if you don't like it, change and if you can't do it by yourself, ask for help. One of the toughest thing for me to do in life is to ask for help. I tell you this is how I was raised. My father and mother were from Georgia, and it came from Georgia to Detroit worked in the Big Three.
For Yeah, GM was my family.
I remember so clearly. I'm about eight nine years old and I run out into the yard and my father's in the garage doing something. I say, hey, can I help. My father looks at me and say, boy, let me tell you something. If you see me in a bear fight, if you see me in a bear fight, help the bear. JK. What is he telling me? You don't need help? A man don't need there's nothing you do it yourself. And so I was programmed at a tender young age not to ask for help. The society tells me and not
to ask for help. And if you want to be a successful, powerful woman, don't ask for help, go do it yourself. One of the biggest challenges for me is to let go of that that that whole idea that I can figure it all out. I can figure it out by myself, and to ask for advice, to ask for help. You have to turn it into an art form and see it as a strength instead of a weakness.
Well, I feel like every good mentor has a mentor, you know, like you you learn from the people you know in front of you and that have walked it too, so or that are walking it. So that's why I you know, that's why I think you know that everybody is human, everyone has their emotions and feelings. So it's like I always love to kind of dig under, you know, the mentor's hood to go all right, who what do
you lean on when you have those moments? And you know, obviously because it's like you again, you are so powerful in your own right and you give so much, you know, and help so many people, So that's got to be you have to have a place to land too.
Yeah, And I've had people special people, but I'm gonna tell you I got married and this is how it came to be. The woman I was dealing with my wife, Shaliah Ilmahrten. We're we're just kicking it, you know, and we both were clear with it. We're not looking to do anything other than, you know, have people in our lives that are meaningful and have in are coherent and capable of making good decisions. Okay, one day she looks at me and she says, and this is in the beginning.
She says, I've been watching you and you're there for everybody. She says, who's there for you? This woman looks at me and says, look, whether this works out or not, I got you.
Wow. Yeah.
All of a sudden, she shifts from being somebody I'm dating to somebody that I have to take this person seriously because they see a need for everyone to have someone to lean on, to trust, to believe in, you know. And so she made a crystal clear that she had my back and I desperately needed it and it wasn't even aware of how much I needed it until she looks at me dead now and say, I got you.
Oh, that's so sweet. I love that I'm gonna call my fiance up night and I'm like, I got you, babe, I got you.
He'll be overwhelmed.
Yeah, men feel like they have to handle take care of everything, and.
Sometimes they're thinking that, you know, you don't have time for them and don't want to be bothered because you are, Like why, I'm a singer, I'm a producer, I'm a mom, I'm and I'm I'm a shaker and a mover and my podcast everything and people and I've got all the no but I got time for you. That's what you're going to tell me.
Yeah. I love that.
So in your book, okay, so you talk about stop being afraid of being afraid. You control the control the controllables which you love that commit improve and maintain. Because
I love that as well. You basically now when you say learn to build better habits, making small improvements every day as a secret to a completely transformed life, Because isn't it, Like I read a quote one time it said, two degrees of of you know, a kind of redirection is like the start of everything, Like you just two degrees.
Look if you if you would improved by one percent every day, think about it? If you just try to improve because all this this overwhelming notion of that I've got to be, Well, how do you get there? One step at a time, by an inches a cinch?
Right?
And once you commit to being keeping it that simple and trusting, see what you've got a factor in that trust. You've got to trust and believe without question or pause, that you're doing the best that you can with what you've got, and that you're going to give everything you've got. Now, this is hard. Win, lose or draw. When I say give one hundred percent of the time, and people hear me say when they get it. When I say win, lose, or draw, they get confused.
I get the losing part because for me, I look at a loss as a lesson.
Yes, it's crucial.
But the other one, though, that's where I'm stuck.
Look, some things are gonna work, and they're gonna work fabulous. Sometimes it's gonna be it almost worked. Parts of it worked boom boom boom. So even if it's like it never reached what the dream sequence and where you wanted it to go, did it improve? Yes? Is it better than what it what it was when I got it? Did I make it a little bit better? Yes? You did, and I love what you just said. I mean, there are lessons and losings. If you're afraid to fail, you're afraid to succeed.
M m m hm.
The controlling though, that the other the other piece that you said about controlling the controllables helped me with that one. Give me something with that. That's that's the that's the tip in that in the book.
For that, I mean, just think about it. Imagine you're talking to Tom Brady as he wrote the forward in the book, and I'm grateful forever for his reinforcement and encouragement. Imagine a nineteen year old Tom Brady, not a superstar, not the goat, and not people love or hate, but just a kid who's trying to figure out his next move. And he's trying to make his next move his best move, and he's thinking about leaving, he's thinking about changing the venue that he's in. And he says, I don't think
the coach is like me. I don't think the coaches believe in me. I want to be the starter and I have to tell him, Son, you came into my office because you saw what I did with Desmond Howard and some other folks, and I need you to be real clear, I can't get you to be the starter, the starting quarterback at this school. But I can get you to believe, without questioning or pause, that if anyone's qualified to do it, it's you. And what I'm asking you to do is understand. You can't control how old
is your coach, Oh, forty fifty five years old. I say, what's the likelihood of your coach changing zero? So what can you change? I can change how I react, how I respond. You can control what myself. I can't control how everybody else is operating. I can control how the coach, what the coaches are thinking. What I can control is that they'll never question my commitment. They'll always see me to give percent of the time, win, lose a draw. If they don't start me and I don't fall apart.
I'm sending you a message. You can't break me. Eleanor Roosevelt. Eleanor Roosevelt says, no one can make you feel inferior without your permission. So I control how I see me. I control how I feel about me. It takes us back to my self worth and self esteem is not based on what anyone else thinks. I'm in control of at least one thing in my life, and that's my mind. That's my heart. You can't measure my heart. You can't measure my mind.
Amen. Did you also give Tom dating advice too?
Or was it just for it sports playing?
He's a data model.
This book is not about me, it's not about Tom Brady, it's not about the Superstars. Is about human beings trying to get the absolute most out of themselves. And everyone's running around now. I want to be the best version of myself. How do you do that by becoming the world's greatest expert on you, by becoming your own best friend. You've got friends that are amazing. I need you to be the best friend you have.
I mean, yes, And there's something where when I hear you talking, I'm like, I have a mental block with that piece. When with one of my aspects of work is when I'm auditioning for a show and I get the breakdown, I immediately go, I'm not right for this. I immediately say I am not right for it, and I essentially take my name off the list.
But I still audition.
But I sit there and I'm like, I'm not giving it probably my all because I've already written myself off that I can't do it, and then the second piece is like, well why am I doing this? And then that makes me want to cry because I'm like if I just believed in myself that I could do it. But then I'm like, well, why do I not believe that I can't do it? Because I can do it?
And then I just had this like mental warfare with myself, and then I'm in my mind, I'm like, well, I'm just going to show my agents and you know, managers that I still want to put things on self tape and make them happy. So I'm just going to send in a mediocre, frickin' tape that's really not as good as it should be. And I know that, but I'm gonna send it in any ways. Help me, help help me, please help help A go from Detroit out.
Think about it. Let's let's look at there are a lot of reasons you do it now, It's a habit, it's what you do.
Is I've been doing it for at least five years, Like saying I can't do it since I lost a really big role, I've like it was like it kind of just shot me and I was like, man, I can't do.
It so, which is also a way that you protect your ego by anticipating, well, I'm not going to get it anyway. So if if it doesn't work, I'm okay, No, this is where we're going to go. We're gonna go to a space where I'm gonna give you the best I've got, win, lose, or draw. That means even if you don't like me, I like myself so much food that nothing you can do, and I'm going to give you all I've got. And what you have to be willing to do is catch yourself when that thought shows up.
That thought is predictable, now therefore manageable. You know, that's a pattern. You know, that's your self talk, negative self talk. It's predictable. So now instead of saying saying, you know, well, I'm not good enough for this, and you say, oh, you catch yourself, I'm doing it again, and instead of being mad, you laugh, say, oh, I'm doing this crap again.
I told myself I'm gonna catch myself next time, and I did, and I refuse and I reject and I'm going to take it to the next though, not only did I automatically think, well, I'm not good enough of this part. I can't do this. I caught myself and I laughed because it's a pattern and it's a habit and it's bs. I'm just something trying to protect my ego. I'm gonna walk in here, I'm gonna kick button. I'm
gonna take names and them foods. If they don't have me, they stupid and I don't want to work with stupid people.
I'm channeling and all of it.
Okay, I'm just gonna like my next audition when this baby comes out, I'm gonna I'm gonna channel all of that. I'm gonna re listen to this episode and then i'm gonna read your books Stay Sane and Insane World, and I'm gonna get the part, and then i'm gonna call you up and be like, we did it.
Look, we did it.
You are prying. I mean, think about this podcast. What's the name of your podcast? Chill out, Calm yourself down. But sometimes you're a great teacher, but you don't listen to your own lessons. Just listen to yourself. Trust yourself, trust the instincts that say, you know, I'm in this business because I love it and I love doing it. And I'm going to keep loving it, and you don't let anyone turn that off. You got into this for a reason, not so that you can sit up and ponder.
Am I good enough? That's the chat. Oh my god, don't tell nobody told you this. That's the twelve thirteen year old running your life again. I need you to here's it. You ready for? This is your session. I need you to convince the twelve thirteen year old that you love her, win, lose or drawn, no matter what happens. You've got to convince her that if it doesn't work out, you're not gonna dog her. You're not gonna beat her up. You're gonna say hey with it. Without this part, you
never have to worry about me loving me. That's all we want from you, for to you to tap into that whole notion in the book that says the mission is to prioritize self love and self acceptance. You're one of the best friends anyone could have, but your suspect when it comes.
To you, Greg, I could talk to you all day. I love you. I want everyone to get your books. Stay sane in the saying world, how to control the controllables and thrive thank you so much for coming on wind Down, and I just I hope to run into you in Detroit. When I see you make it so okay, I would love that so much. It's so good to see you. Thank you so much.
Thank you for the opportunity to hang out with you.
It was all my pleasure. Thank you so much.