The Truth Behind the Tutu

I was like, you know who we have to have on tomorrow, right, because like she's obsessed. I mean, she's so obsessed that she's dressed like Carrie Bradshaw today. It's a way of life, I like to think. But that's fine. It's not creepy. It's just supportive. Do you like the new season? I needed them back. I just needed them in my life. It feels like cozy and good and so for that, I love the new season. It's hard

to watch some of it in which sense. Well, I mean, if anybody has been under a rock, they know that Big is no longer with us. In a lot of ways, yikes, but Big dying was really hard for me. We made us all a widow, right, But where did you think the season was going to go if Big didn't die? I don't know, but some of plays happier I waited, like ten years or something. Yeah, I mean, I totally hear you. But at the same time, it's like the

whole show is about like Carrie's love life. Okay, she's happy, great? Right? Who looks happily ever after? Apparently no one? And now you're all caught up on you. Oh lord, Um, it was funny. I was Can you shut that door? By the way, I hear the cuckoo clock? Just like, do you guys hear how loud that cucko clock? Is? No, not at all, but it's loud, right, I think it's just existing. But what are we shutting? This is? This is a good metaphor. Here we go. What are we

shutting the door to right now? In our life? Oh? We just took a turn, we did. I love the turns. Thank you a little bit of fancy. What are you shutting the door on? Um, I'm shutting the door on control. I know it's a big one that just came to me. This week actually control freak, and I love my own plan, so I'm just releasing control. Were you in my therapy session yesterday or mine today? By the way, fun fact we all have the same therapist. Hi, Amy shout out

to Refuge Center of Counseling in wrinkled Dennessey. I was just like I was because I was telling you that I had therapy yesterday, and I said, when do you see Amy next? So I just saw her yesterday and she was, oh, Catherine seeing her today? And I have a Friday for a sweet Amy. I wonder if sometimes she really does want to talk more about each other.

Like I say things and I can see her face like make a twitch, and I'm like, well, Janna, and she's like and I was like, I know you can't confirm or deny that you have Janna Kramer is your impation. She gives you this look like stop pushing the hip

hop policy, like get out of my life. I'm always like my friend, oh, I always say, I'm like, well, Catherine said yeah, and then I was like and then I talked about Nick a little bit because we were how did I why I talk about because I said, like I appreciate um, like he's like a brother to me and so like because she was asking about Ian because she's very protecting. Yeah, and so she was just asking like that, I wanted to talk about you an end today, but I didn't. Why would you talk about

us and your therapy ses? You talked about how we had a double the angle date the Angle, but did not know I pressed about the Angle. I was also like, the same reason you're talking about her husband and your therapy is the same reason she wanted to talk about your boyfriend and her therapy. But like, why I was talking about how we had like a double date and she's like, oh, you'll do that often. And then I was like, wanted to like, but I didn't. I came back.

I came back. It was good. It was like talking about how it was fun, and it was what did you want to say, Catherine? I just wanted to talk about it. I wanted to like, what do you think? I didn't. Oh, I would like for you guys do she would never she want to give me anything. But going back to control. It's interesting because I was in therapy yesterday and I just started that was what I'm so in church, we talked about fasting and I'm like, okay, get out of here, stop, this is okay, Like I

could cry because I know this is divine timing. The fasting is control. Fasting is feasting. I can't handle you. I cannot handle it. This is what I'm fasting from me too. Well, we better hunker down together. One of us are good talk the fan. I can't inspect. I'm controlled too. I get it. But it's interesting because when I was sitting in church, I was like, you know where they were talking about fasting, how fasting is feasting, and I'm like, I can't fast food because I already

have a bad relationship with food generally. So I can't skip a meal because I already skip probably more than I should. I shouldn't say that, but you know what I'm saying, like, I don't have the greatest relationship to use God as my crutch for another reason not to eat food. And it's it's cool if you do, like you know people do, like a pastor. Kevin was saying, like he doesn't have to be food. It can be

in social media. And because some people don't have great relationships with food, right, so fasting doesn't have to be just on food. So I was, you know, we had the moment of like song and then prayer. It's like, think about what you need to fast, and I'm like, all right, I'm like I had wine. I'm like, oh no, I'm like I haven't drink in a week, you know. So I know everyone's like, wow, great job, thank youre longer than that before. Yeah, you're doing nine months. I

was trying to give you a week. I tried. So I was just sitting there and I was just like and I started to cry, and I was like, where's

the cry from? And it obviously involves Mike, but it's the control of that, Like, it's the control around all of it, trying to control his emotions, trying to control how he feels about me, trying to control my outcome of my relationship, trying to control and it was just like control, like I have to, like And so I brought that to Amy yesterday and I had like this mental breakdown with her because I was just like, I am terrified when I don't have control because I've never

felt in control. Because it's like when my relationship, I never felt control because I'm like, who knew when Mike was gonna cheat on me? You know, would would not and not. Catherine, Sorry, are we winding down every week? I didn't say it. So yeah, So it's like, you know, I was always like and I had to and I did. I became controlling in that relationship because I was so king terrified. Of course you were of him cheating again, and you know, of course, and so that that meet

my stronghold on him, of course made him cheat more. Well, I wouldn't say that that made him cheat. I'm not gonna let you do that. It was probably a portion of it. Oh that's not a fair Yeah, I think that's the fair thing to say. Now, you might have tried to deal with that with control. You tried to deal with him cheating with control, but that didn't cause him to do anything. He already did it. He makes his own choices. I still struggle with that piece. I

just want to keep on mind. Yeah, thank you for thank you. I'm not going to let I'm not going to let that be about something you did. But if I didn't do what you're right, you're right, and then he just like a period at the end of the time period and we're done commas. Yeah, okay, so that's and so then the next relationship now with you know,

or just anything in general. I'm just like and then we start talking about food because eating is always on my case, like you need to eat, you need to eat, And then I'm like no, and I'm like, oh my god. The last time I was controlling food was when I was so terrified about the mic stuff. And so then I'm now controlling what I eat because that's what I

can control. We are best friends for a reason. Okay, Okay, so yeah, so it's like I won't eat so for example, I won't eat what he says to eat because I'm like, I get to control what I eat. I didn't know. That's interesting. So that's what like sat in with me, but put your foot down with the cheeseburger, like healthy or not HEALTHI or whatever it is, or if it's just unhealthy, no anything as Yeah, okay, that's what I was energy. But unfortunately it's very unhealthy habits that I

have right now with food. So I'm learning because like he wants me to eat healthier, you know, not healthier. He wants me to not eat bars my entire meals. Yeah, well, yeah, you do feed yourself like a hamster to pet store. I mean there's eat. I don't want people to think thank you. Definitely eat and you eat often, you eat every two hours or whatever. But I think what he's trying to get you to do is eat. Okay, well lately I haven't been doing that, and that's the problem.

Okay he used to, so I used to. Yeah, and so now that's somewhere and so now because I've lost control of got it, got it Mike and the marriage and new situations that I've gone back to, like not being healthy. Is that more recent or since the divorce, because I think I'm now out of control, Like I can't control. I don't know what's going to happen in a new relationship. So it's like a so I kind of had that like breakthrough and then with the church thing and then so yeah, it's but it's like I'm

trying to fast control. Well, we're going to do it. How do we do it? So every time I approach, we have I know, someone to pray. Someone needs to know what that sounds when you're trying to because okay, I have to at least have my protein after I run there we go, Yeah, no, it's good. You need your protein shape so when you're trying to control a situation, you are to stop and pray because we're not in control.

But I do that too, and then I get exhausted, like a different kind of tired, because I it's exhausting trying to control things, and it's it's tiring. I can't do it. So every time now I just go I say out loud, like I trust you God. Mm hmm. So what Amy told me, what might she might tell you to is to write it, start like combined sessions and save a little or a little like I know what a bogo is, but is there like or something, because is the problem sermon and getting one twenty every

three times a week. Amy's like, yeah, actually I've heard this one before. Oh bless her. Okay, I want to I want to get back on this topic. Said She basically said, write it like I have it, basically like how you feel now and how you feel at the end of the month when you have released some of

that control. So it's like situations with like Mike, like today, like I had a situation with him when he came to the door, and it's like I wanted to say something, but it's like I just prayed, and like, I can't control his reactions, nor can I control how he speaks. So I'm just gonna good for you and I and I felt it, I prayed, I released it, and now I'm going to write about it because by the end of it, hopefully it's not going to have that start like that hold on us, the heaviness. And I want

to go to your control in your session. But first I'm going to take a break because we've got to talk sex, and we've got to talk the city, Sex in the City. You're back, I all right. So we're gonna have Candice Bushnell on. UM. She basically is the Carrie Bradshaw she has. She's the one who wrote Sex in the City, she had the column, um, and so we're going to have her on to talk about all things sexy city, how it started and um, let's get her on him on. Now are you got hi love?

How are you good? How are you? I'm good? I'm Janna. This is Catherine, This is Kristen, or I should say like she's you. She dressed like Carrie. It's intense. Is it too soon, Candice? Is it too soon to show you? My God? That's crazy? She's showing, although I don't think I've ever actually worn it to too. No, No, yeah, plenty of times. Yeah, I don't think I have ever worn one. Well, great, I've got bike shorts under have you ever heard those? Because I can take this right

off and we can just start over. My short time were all the time? Great, So let me just reintroduce myself and I kidding, Oh my god. I did wear a two two once to one of the one of the premiers. I can't remember which one. Maybe it was the third, maybe it was the third season. I love it gave permission. I've never been coordinated like some of my friends on this couch. I mean, I'm in I just ran and I'm in sweatpants and running shoes. I'm just saying, like you're coordinated. You used to do figure

skating that color coordinating. I was like no, no, like as a runner. It was this gave me the permission. That was the permission slip I needed to wear a two two that I would have another I would have not otherwise been in ever in my life because I'm not a ballerina. So okay, we have to talk sex in the city because obviously, I mean, it's a show I am obsessed with. Um, continue to watch. I mean when I was on the road, my band guys would hear like the open credits and nearly up there she

goes like she's watching Sex in the City again. Um, but for you, like where like you started? When did you start writing your columns? Probably before you were born? Um? No, girl thirty eight? Like it's a thing, which is why when I went out for The Carry Diaries, because I'm also an actress, I was like, I'm way too old, Like I can't take that. I love The Carry Diaries so good. It was such a cute show. I don't understand, like why it didn't continue on did you watch it?

I did watch it, and it didn't continue. I know why. I don't know. We need to know. Do you want to bring it back? I know a great carry right all you know. I think they've all grown up now, so whatever. But your auditioned for the Carry Diaries, that's great. I did it was it was quite a long time ago. But yeah, I mean I was I was too old. It's it's all good, no no hard feelings, It's totally fine. But this is like, this is a good time for me to tell you I wasn't actively participating in the cast.

Remember if I was, I was a lot in Lipstick Jungle. It just depends. Yeah, I had so Rob. I was on on One Tree Hill, and so Rob who was on Lipstick Jungle. And I loved that show. And I guess I was so angry that that one didn't continue on too. Do you say, oh, that was just so. It was steamy, it was fun, it was like sexy. I loved all of it. And I love those actresses, I love the stories. I think it was weirdly, it was a little bit ahead of its time because mhm.

It was a little too feminist in a way, because that was the time when when you know, it was all about getting married and marrying Mr Big and remember all these actresses were saying like, I'm not a feminist, So it was a little ahead of its time. The idea of you know, the girl Boss women Boss people were still like, oh they must be bitches night, bitches night, Welcome to Line podcast. I love my agent. My agents always like if I had five cents for every time

someone called me a bitch, I'd be rich. I that's always like so annoying because it's like I remember My ex used to be like, you know, you're you're too hard like but you can talk that it same way and it's fine for you. But yet I'm bitchy like I just it just doesn't I don't. I don't like that at all. But who reached out to you to have sex in the City like actually become a show from your column? A lot of people? Really, yes, a lot of people. HBO was always after me and New

Line and Fine Line and ABC. So there were probably there were at least three movie companies that wanted to buy it. And I did go out to l A. But you know, they really did. They didn't have a clue. Like at that time New York and l A. The sensibilities were so different. Like sex in the City, it could never ever come out of a writer's room. There's no way, like writers could ever come up with that. TV writers could never ever come up with sex in

the City. HBO was interested and ABC was interested. And in that time I had also met Darren Starr. How did you guys meet? We met because I did a story about him for No magazine because he was doing Central Park West. I don't know if you guys from over that show I remember it. I didn't want it lasted for one season and it was Mariel Yeah, Mariel hemy white um. And and then he decided to do so I met him and and then he said he wanted to do Sex in the City. And I Darren

was somebody who I knew. I've been hanging out with him a bit. I'd shown him New York and he did Melrose Place in nine O two one oh, which were huge, and we just had a really good time and Darren had a great sense of humor and we were laughing about everything. So I thought, well, I'll sell it to Darren Starr, which was actually a really smart thing to do now that I looked back, because you know, when you sell something to TV, you still have to find that producer m hm. You know, it's like a

whole deal making a TV show. You know, there's like the showrunner and the producer. That's the person who wants to be on the set every day. I don't want to be on the set every day. Did you want to be in the writing room at all? Like, did you did you feel like Territorial was in the writing room for the first two seasons A bit. It's not you know, it's like I was a novelist. Being a TV writer was not considered. And I mean, first of all, it was something that I never even knew that that

was a job when I was younger. Um, and you know, it's not as it wasn't quite as cool as you know, being a novelist. I still don't think it is. So there's my two cents where you can't us. I still think you're the o G. So I read and I do have like some sort of mom dementia at this point because I have two little kids and so really I don't have any of my together. But I do

have this question. I thought I read somewhere that when it started, you were I hope I'm not just just love me through this, but were you with Cary Bradshaw, your alter ego, Like you wrote it as a carry Bradshaw, like that's you. But no, I when I was writing the column my parents, I think I'd written like one or two columns. I went to a sex club and I just did a one woman show which was called is There Still Sex in the City? And this is one of the stories I tell how I created sex

in the City. Um, why I invented Carrie Bradshaw. And the reason is that I went to a sex club and then my parents called up and said, oh, we're gonna read. We've taken a subscription to the New York Observer, and my parents are really conservative. They were really conservative, So I was like, you know, I always have to worry about what my parents think. I mean, I feel like there's so much more I probably would have done and written, if you know, not for my parents, who

were very judgy. So I didn't know what to do. So I just came up with this name, Carrie Bradshaw. That was my alter ego. So I I was basically the narrator and Carrie Bradshaw was my alter ego, so and I made her kind of I don't know, I just I had sort of fun with the character. I felt like the character didn't necessarily have to be nice. So were the girls then, like Charlotte, Miranda, Samantha not your They were like, were they also loosely based off

of just the friends around you? Is what I have? Yes, but I had a lot of friends, so in the book there are they're like way more women. But when you make a TV show, the first thing you do is well, we have to we can't have more than four characters. We can't have put more than four women because the audience won't keep track of them. And obviously they have more women on Real Housewives. But you know

that's just a sort of standard TV formula. Sure, And did some of the characters kind of fold into each other then, like some of your book characters kind of get adopted by the four main Yes. And in the book, one friend would say a couple of different things to me, and I would make them into two people to describe people's identity, et cetera. So I'm curious, are you watching the news the New And just like that, are you

watching the New I've watched a couple of episodes. How do you feel about I think it's very Sarah Jessica Parker and Michael Patrick King, and I think it's very very in line with their creativity, their idea of what's good. And I feel like my sensibility is the TV show Sex in the City. It's like that sensibility of you know, women of life, of the absurdism of life is something, you know, the social observation, the very detailed social observation

where and I've been compared to Jane Austen many times. Um, you know, that's what I do. And I feel like that's in all of my books. It's in Lipstick Jungle somewhat. I would have liked to have it more and the Carry Diaries. So I feel like that's my sensibility and that's what I'm going to bring to everything that I do. It's the sensibility of there're still sex in the city. Candice. You you created a freedom that you don't even it's

gonna long outlive anything else. Like, it's really you've You've created a legacy. It's your observations really paved the way in every character and just the empowerment that we all could have. I mean, I know you probably hear that and it sounds cliche or whatever, but it does matter. From tinytown girls in Selene, Michigan watching your show going like I want to do that. Yeah, I mean, I know, I think that's really important. That's really what it's about,

is giving women a different way to look at their lives. Like, yeah, I know it seems crazy, but thirty years ago, even twenty years ago, we were really saying go to college, don't get married, and have kids and maybe you know, but you can't really be independent. You don't get that sex in the city time in your life to figure out who you are, what you're about, who you want to be with, and what you want to pursue and

make friends. And I feel like now you do and now you have that Yes, yeah, like this, you know I love that. Well, thank you so much, Candice. I appreciate you. Thank you guys. Bye bye. There's something to be said to about what you just said. Um, I was sweating? Are you good? Sweating? Feeling good? How's that control? Are you controlling your sweating? I had to control a lot of things. I felt like a buddy the alph and he's like, I'm in love with you and I

don't care, knows it? Like I just really had to calm it down. It's fine, everything's fine. And also the fifty pounds of tool doesn't help the heat. Well, you got those biker shorts on. Not to breathe both fabric. Let's take a break and we'll go back with some control. Okay, So about your therapy session, how to go cat It was good. It was pretty light today. We discovered that I was I thought I was the wrong indiogram number. What do you mean did you redo a test? I did? Office, No,

I had done it. I needed to read before I went, and then we read through a lot of the books. What did you think you were? A five? Which it's very rare, but I think it's like basically like they're like hermits, but they like a lot of information, and since I like to be alone, I think that that's where that kind of came from. But I'm actually an eight the challenge, yes, but I have like little things that no, no, no, A healthy aid is good? Oh is Mike Kate? If you think back, there are things

that were similar about us. I mean, I'll admit that, but you're a healthy version because I could I could understand him when he wanted to be alone or when he needed I could understand that part of him, but I couldn't understand there's choices, and there's ways to be healthy, and there's ways to you know, there's a lot of positives to eight. Unhalthy dates are they're they're a racissists? Yeah,

well it's literally yeah, unhealthy. I mean they had so there's like the healthy version of any number, and then like the okay version of every number, and then the unhealthy, and then below that's the personality disorders, and I think borderline personality disorder and narcissism are its eights what they go to when they're at like the lowest lowe Well, what Amy told me today is it's not a bad thing.

So thanks guys. Well, healthy as make the world go around because you challenge and you don't just accept information for the way it comes, and you are like you're like a pathmaker. Yeah. It was like she had me read things and she was like, you know, call out the ones that feel true to you, and I would say a majority of them did, but some of them didn't too, So I still feel like I'm a mix.

But anyway, so that was good. That's good. Yeah, sorry to mean to trigger you, but that doesn't I'm just saying, like in a funny way. Yeah, what are you? I'm a two? I know right now, I'm an unhealthy to know you're a healthy too, I mean, but I'm also like to a detriment. Oh yeah, well I codependency. Yeah, I'm a Wing one, rules matter, I think I'm Wing three. What's three? You're definitely wing three? Yeah? The achiever? Okay, yeah, yeah, okay, yeah,

so great. It's like what makes everybody everybody? I'm sorry, I didn't mean to say anything bad about your right, I just I just I just think about I just I just I just shed an eight. It's actually perfect. So but you know, underneath its are actually very loving. It's just hard for people to see it. Maybe not. You're right. I actually have always hugged you aggressively every time I see you, so it probably is a lot for you. But I don't think you're like an unapproachable

I think you're a very healthy eight. Thank you. I love I think I think a healthy it is actually hot. It's the unhealthies. Well, they're like boss babes. They're like kind of make sure happen. I wonder what what's Preston A nine? What's that peacekeeper? Oh m hm, huh what's She asked me that today and I couldn't remember. What is three? Achiever? No? Two is like a helper, Yeah,

like a helper, like I'm gonna help you. Remember she actually just emailed me before and said, have Nick take this and then go to this website and see how you'll work together. I need to I need Ian to take it. Okay, so I bet he's going to be If he's an eight, I have to break up with him. No, no, no, I feel so triggered right now to Okay, maybe that's why we worked, Janna. Maybe I'm a challenger, but I

also challenge you know it's good. I'm not just a yes person for you, Janna, I contured to who thinks he's a curious person. Oh, we had a We had one that said that I just have yes people are on me. I'm like the guy I do your challenger like people are like, I got this one challenging my ass all the time. Definitely in a tough like, in a loving but not loving like, in a like she's loving You're in like a like I got your like? Can I give you something that? Can I tell you something? Yeah? God,

what am I doing? I'm sorry. I actually talked about this in therapy. I didn't say your name, but actually talked this about this in therapy because it triggered me majorly. The other day. It was it was myself. You were talking about your friends, and you said, I have the one that is that is tough love, and then I have the loving ones. And so I went to Amy and I was like people don't see me as loving, and she was like, I know, I know, but that's

been one of my things. Yeah, I think you're extra loving. She doesn't. But in a relationship though, like I, you don't have to do that for me, probably like tough love. I'm tough. I'm hard enough on myself time out. There's a but you know the difference, right First of all, I'm sorry, no, no, no, no, no, I feel so bad. You know that's on that's on me, Like that's my like, well that's what we're working through. Yeah, m hmm. But I'm just there. But maybe I can say it in

a different way. But like I I just go to the like that day of the next day after I filed for divorce, that's the day that I go to Are you getting I'm sorry right now? No, I mean this is my well, see in my mind, in my mind, the day after the divorce, that's what you needed I did. But it's clearly not yeah I did, she needed you. Oh, this is like maybe I don't want to talk about actually good because that friendships. I think that people tune into you a lot of times for your friendships. I mean,

I know when you pay something about me. People will write to me right away and they're like, I wish I had this. I wish that I had what you all have. There's this thing you guys have and we m bring different things. It's a very real sense of like life. Like we're not sugarcoating, We're not I mean, I just I think this is a good thing. Like the way you work with your friends and the way we're all honest with each other. Like if you say things that are tough to me, it's hard for me.

That's why you don't say those things, don't You Guys are like Kristen, Like Janna has spoken over me about my marriage at times and been like a very truth teller for me, and times where now I'll get emotional, He's like, what have I not done better than this? It's just like watching your kids perform at competition and anyways, it just is like the realness is what we all need. That's why I feel like I mean I when I said to you it was time with Mike, which I

felt like I really was an advocate from Mike. I felt like I really tried to graciously assume and was very pro team marriage for you guys. But like when I was like, it's time, Like I like when you texted me it's time, that's when I go, oh, like because you've never said that. You've always been like I got your back, no matter what you can and put him in the back. Yeah, like I got you, like no either way. But like when you said it's time, that's all you said. I mean that, Like that was

my like, oh we are or here. But then Catherine's teamwork and all that is. So there's a conversation happening with you on a group text, and then there's a conversation happening without you on a group text, and all four you're good and all things we would say in front of you, but we're not going to flood you. You know, nothing was bad. But it was like Catherine

going like I've seen this. I don't want her to I don't want her to back out, like we have to keep moving forward, and we're all like you have to keep moving forward. And Catherine also had that side of her, which was the business side, so she could say like listen, we've got to we've got things to do. But without Catherine, I mean, I know, I just would have been like, Okay, we're going back in again. I mean, that's why you're critical, is what I'm saying, honest, And

I shouldn't and I apologize. I should apologie. I shouldn't separate. You just give me more tough love. And I do need that though, and so but it's not but you're not not loving right again? Yeah, no, I it was. It was a good thing for me to hear because then I could take it in because she has said that to me before, in a sense that like, you don't feel like people see you as loving. And so then that happened and I was like, oh my god, you're right. I don't anyway. So oh good, do you

have any emotions when I share it? Because I love it when you cry? Get over here, good, let me hold you too much therapy. You're so loving, You're so loving, a very healthy because there's no you're any tough loving yourself out of having loving yourself, Gavil. And now I feel bad because I hate it on your number, I called like now I just feel like now, no, I just know I'm Candice told me straight up she's never

working duels. I think there's no one want to talk about what I'm going to talk to Amy about on Friday because I just feel like I was like, Wow, I'm the girl. I just I am sorry. I think you have I love that you're innate to the new podcast. He appreciate it is where I could though, even though I wanted you to leave Mike, I could understand him at times, not with cheating, but I could understand him, and I do think that helped it times a lot of times. Yeah, but and you are loving, very loving,

but I think you block. Which No, that's an eight. That's what I'm saying. That's an eight. It's like underneath they have a very loving and if they're passionate about something, they will go to war for it. But it's hard to kind of show that what blocks it. I'd love to understand that. Listen to my next couple of years of therapy. Just come with us. I'll let you know. I mean we all have. You know I've got blocks of why, Well, you've got blocks. I'm just like from

from like showing that, showing it. I will say, from my experience, tell me, if this resonates with you at all, I block because growing up I could not. My feelings were not honored. So to have a feeling didn't mean much, so I would pick a second or third feeling that could fit into this really dysfunctional family system. So yeah, I was like, oh, the mike went down, and I was like, gosh, yeah, for sure. But I feel like eye blocked because I'm like, well, what I have to

say ultimately doesn't feel very important. I think it's a mix of that and I think I learned today with an eight too. It's it seems weak and so like we pride ourselves on being strong and independent and it makes us feel weak. There's another part of it, but yes, childhood stuff for sure. That's interesting. That makes you feel weak very eight. Yeah, you're such a leader. I feel

like leaders are eight. They are for sure. I mean two s, which is over here trying to help each other out so much we can get out of the house. So that's why the eights really happen. A yeah, I don't know if there's such another come to the podcast, and I love everything you're doing. Insane and she's just helpful. She's just so like I even said to my friend Heather on the way here, I was like, Janna just makes me feel like I'm a person, a whole person,

like I don't have to. Well, on another note, I think Amy would be very proud of us because we're all therapy therapy, therapy being everybody we should have ever listen to this episode? Um, I have a question? Can I ask a question? Before we leave? I need to figure out what Ian's number is? Though, Yeah, okay, if he isn't eight, you cannot just take that and let that be. I need him to read the thing. Don't take the test. I've taken three works on the book

today and it was great. It's so good. We don't have to read the whole thing. But the road back to use the best way to figure out your own number, and then the path between us is the best book for how to iniogram each other. Okay, yeah, I I just I need him to He's guys, he's great. Can I ask a question? I was actually thinking this yesterday. I just wonder, like, do you and Ian ever fight? Are we just and shirtless make out? Gosh? Like I want to know for real, because I haven't heard about

any fight. I mean, you're around more than I am. I haven't. I haven't, but I'm like, we haven't fought with him and him he's like really great. Um, no, I mean it's just me, honestly, story of our lives. Like I just I still um I read this quote or actually I think I put it up on my Instagram the other day. I put it up there yesterday and it was I'm gonna tell it to you right now. It is. Um. Yes, toxic relationships are hard, but do you know what else is hard? Your first healthy relationship

after a toxic one. No One talks about how hard it is to unlearn all the toxic behaviors you adapted as a coping mechanism. How hard is it to convince yourself that you're safe now? And like even just like the other night, we were talking about something and I just like immediately shut off because he said something and it made me feel stupid. He wasn't trying to make me feel stupid, but like Mike always made me feel stupid because he'd be like, what don't you understand about that?

And like the irony of that sentence is really something to me. And I'm not trying to hate on him, but Mike making you feel stupid is really ironic to me. Continue but I just immediately shut off and he was like WHOA, Like what, like you know what's the change, and I was just like nothing. So it's like me trying to like like it's just like and bless and he's just like he just sits there and then I and I feel like his like he's like, I'm trying so hard to not say anything that's going to trigger

you or you know. He's like, I'm trying to say all the right things and I'm trying to you know, you know, not say it like this, or say it like this or not trigger this. And he's like, it's just really hard. And I'm just like, I like felt his like he's like exhausted and he's tired. And then I feel bad Preston is gonna want to tune into this part of the butt. It is hard, though you

have someone that actually like cares. You're so used to the bottom falling out that you're like, well, let me guess when the bomb's gonna fall it next to I can just get ahead of it. And I was like, why don't you just leave? I just just you know, just just leave, you know what I want to leave? Anyways, boy, you say that to him? I did. It was really mean. I had to stopped saying that. Um, how does he handle that like a seal like a seal? No. It was one time and I told Amy about it, and

I was like, I was so upset. It was so hard, and I was like, I was just because I was just I was seeing how far I can push, because I'm like, when I've done this before, I was either abused physically and mentally emotionally or they leave or whatever. So I'm gonna see what I can say or do and see, like I'm going to test him because I know he's going to leave. I know he's gonna walk

out that door. And I mean I said some really like not nice things to the point where I still like we'll cry about And I was like bawling telling Amy it, and I go, what hurt the worst is how he responded, and she goes, what do you mean? She's like, he put his head down, he looked at at me, and he goes, you're the most beautiful, loving person I've ever met. He goes, but your words really hurt you, guys, and I and I literally started like wailing balling because I was like, that was not what

I thought he was going to say. I thought I was gonna be like, yeah, you you you know or whatever or like lash back out at me. And that was like and not for me was the switch to like and I was just like, oh, you're not Mike and you're not like but like and and Amy she goes,

you know, she's like, it's so interesting. She's like when I go to abuse shelters or women that have been in like those situations or narcissism or whatever, She's like, those girls are tough and they're mean and they say things because that's like that is there, That's the protection. She's like, And I'm like, and then yeah, and then me, I'm like, well, I don't know when that's gonna anyways, I get to talk about this forever. But control, yeah,

I think we all have. I've learned one thing in my life and then my two marriages, boys leave in men's day, So um, I love Ian. And I was saying though in therapy about the whole control thing with Amy or is just like, but when is it going to be Like I'm thinking, like, I'm sure he's talking to someone in his dam so I'm sure like he's because they lie, but that's what I've known, so I'm like,

of course he's going to your brain. I mean, you're so used to looking for that for thinking that's happening, and it's it's always been like ten out of ten times. Yeah, I mean that's where I'm at. It's like I'll just guess where the boom is gonna fall because it's easier or or I do it. That's that's what I'm trying. That's what I was trying to do that night, like a month ago. I was literally saying the nastiest things.

I'm like, I know he's gonna come back at me and like start yelling or be defensive and like he's going to walk out and slam the door. Yeah, so I'm like, let me just get it over with, let me just end this real fast. And then he said that, and I was just like sweet, So I'm just so afraid, but like, yeah, but that was a good response for you. I mean, I know that was hard. I'm saying, I know that was hard to hear, but then that allowed you to then break down and see that versus then

just going back and forth. And I just like how he sees you, Like he really sees you as a person, and it really just matters. I mean, he's not but again I'm like, I go to this place. Well, I don't know, but he here's the thing, here's the thing. I'm fasting. I can't control no matter what. I trust you God. I trust you God. And if it's not the one I know, I'm not going to die because I did. I die from my divorce. Nope, I'm still here. We're laughing, we're loving. So God, that was a good fast.

I'm not going to control it. Well, you can't and we won't because we're gonna be tired. So i'd rather be what's our chance. I feel like we can't, we won't. Er. Yes, I watched it. I fast forward to the end. I had to know. Did you cry? I was? I cried at the end. I cried in five and um and I they're exchange. I got me. Oh with Darius Bald's That's that's what I'm talking about. Bald Exchanged just killed me. But I was like, he he got so upset about

this is like totally going on. Sorry, guys, like we're like just like having around. This is like welcome to our girl chat time. This is this is the most like real lifetime right now. We're running a little late. Sorry, but no with cheer Ladarius like he was so upset about her doing Dance with the Stars, like she abandoned him. But it was like she he thinks that's his mom, that's his childhood trauma. Man, And I was just dress. Oh my god, lailed me. I can't. I can't even think.

I'm just so happy that they had that. And I loved how she said, I think this doesn't have to be on camera. Oh there's still fighting. I don't know. I'm trying to figure it out. If somebody wants to let me know, that'd be great because I'm like trying to figure it out. Please. Um, but like her crying and then oh, just I can't. But I will say to the whole I don't understand how Trinity one. Sorry

spoiler alert major spoiler alert. Um, I mean either because I'm like the guy literally like they only had one drop she didn't touch the floor, and the other one had like a massive mistake too on the first day, though not the second day the first It doesn't matter, it matters less. I think it was. Maybe I can't remember it's percentage. Yeah, No, Cheers a really good show anyway. Wow, that was a lot of ups and down girls ups and downs. I'm sorry about the eights. Love eight now now.

I love eights and I love people in June and you know with great So that's a Christie. She also talking me up right now. I can tell me very loving. Just because you're working on hugs doesn't mean that you That's what I'm trying to like, and I know that you are lovable. You are some people are the huggers and some people get hugged. And I think we know who we are. And I think that Catherine wants about please report every now and again. This is why we work.

Queendom works because everyone has a different personality. There's not a two. Julie is not a two. She's not a dude. She might be an a I think so so like it's good, it's just me. I know, it's just because it was just like, no, I knew, I knew when you said that. I was like, I'm pretty sure Mike and I are probably the same. Yeah, well but I love you. I love you really and secure right now. I just gotta I've never worn one. But then she was like, I want to do a premiere and I'm like, well,

that seems like a big deal to me. All right, so whatever, I know, we're going to stop because if anyone this is this is what happens when part of the queendom comes together. Um, let's talk next week. Shy Ivy, you know, sometimes I feel like he's a little like he's too shy. He's so shy. He's a little shy. But so I mean, so am I I feel like we should trick him. I feel like you should Recordina sudn't know and then he'd be because at some point we have to set these up when people don't know

and just let it just roll. Would be so funny after just so you know, we've been oh yeah, he'll wear a shirt. Someone's you know, I will say time time out really fast. Someone the other day like it's like body shaming my boyfriend because they were saying, like your boyfriends so full of himself, and I was like why yeah, and he was because he never wears a shirt. And I was just like, so if someone just wears like a sports braw all day, are they full of themselves?

Like Janna, if I look like you, I'd be naked. Men's response, He's just like he just happens to have a shirt off a lot I didn't wonder if the analogy to shirts at first, but not really confident in your body and not full of yourself too. By the way, you could also just be a badass and like and and he's very like shy, like eating my stories and people. He comes off arrogant and like, but he's just very shy like again, not arrogant. Everyone's personalities are different. Yeah,

so don't judge what you see. Any girls were going to shake his ass down. It's friends, He's not arrogant. Trust we already have that. Okay, alright, talk to you guys next week. By