The 5 Second Rule with Mel Robbins

What made it hard because Jolly is about to turn four, so I need the prep. I'll probably cry. It just seems big. It's like the last of the baby days. Look, and I get choked up. Who is a big age? I mean, I know, listen hashtag bless. She's healthy, she's great. It's just it just seems so big. And she's so like well spoken, and she just looks like a little person now not so baby, you know, but she's a

little human. Yeah. So she turned four on January five, and then she woke up January six and she was like guess what, And I go what And she's like, I'm five today. I was like, it doesn't quite work like that, but bless your heart, well, Leslie, I mean, how old are your kids? Oh god, I've got one getting ready to turn sixteen, So talk about big. I don't care how old I get. I'm slashing the tires for you with please so that I can say that I didn't do it. Yeah, and you can say that

with an honest heart because it was me. It's tough, it's really, that's big. I don't care how old I get, but my kids I still to this day can't see them happy birthday without crying. And I get choked up when I see them happy because you were there on the O G birthday. That's right. So sixteen, so sixteen and in thirteen, but sixteen is just that's rough. Hard,

it's rough, you know. When someone said to me it's the beginning of letting go, I was like, oh, stop, like stop, They're like, he's going to turn sixteen and then in two years he's going to be in college. I'm like, do you really want me to completely have a breakdown? Because they like you? Yeah? Right, whosi do you want here? Yeah? Say your friends and the beginning of letting go happen when I when they cut the cord for me, it really was a hard moment. I

was like, Okay, you're not inside me anymore. It's gonna get rough from here on out. Well, it's true, I feel like it's just sixteen age though, well, I feel like every single age or I don't know if I'm gonna yes, I'm going to be super sad at four, but at the same time, I love who Joel is coming into. I feel like I'm gonna have a hard time around the twelve. Are you do a bad twelve thirteen year old? Well, that's what my parents got divorced. Mm hmmm, So the flood of emotion. Yeah, Well twelve

thirteen with girls is also like puberty. Well, I didn't start my period until I was like fifteen, sixteen, sixteen and a half stick together twelve twelve, well my sixth grade year. So how are you in sixth grade year twelve? Right? Yeah? Yeah, And I feel like a lot, like I know a lot of kids are starting pot or younger too, because I think it's a lot of stuff. Obviously, I think it's the foods and everything that we're eating, the hormones that we don't disagree. Yes, but I mean I haven't

done the research, so I don't know. That's just my own naive thinking. People pick up on hates milk. I don't know, because my sixteen year old was a late bloomer, but my now thirteen year old not. So I don't and I don't know. Was the thirteen year old influenced by the sixteen year old? Does that have any role

in how quickly they developed? That he has an older brother and so maybe it moved him along because you know how if you're with your friends for an extended period of time, you can end up with your girlfriends. You end up on the same cycle. Yeah, Jan and I know because we have to talk each other off the ledge about every third week. So does that play a role? And why the thirteen year old is developing faster?

I don't know. I think so. I think it's a second kid things because Jason, I mean, he's he walked away faster than Jolie. He's already he already said his first word, weighed faster than Jolie. He because he's watching her. He's you know, just like and they want in on the action. Yeah, they want to play. I mean it is legend, legends like put me in coach. Yeah, he's like on a kitchen table. What are you doing? Bro right?

I mean just words, all the words sixteen though. I think it's gonna be hard because you're watching them drive. I can't you, guys, I'm emotional today. I don't know. I think it's just they seem big already. Is that it? Yeah? And if I put her in a what else is going on? Uh? Well, my husband's been on the USO tour, so that's not helpful either. But he comes home today. So it's been an emotional like I've had this empathetic like how do soldier wives do this kind of week two?

Where I just don't know how because that so dangerous and right now it's especially dangerous. Yeah, and he's like protected, but he's also not trained. I hate to say it, you know, like he's red neck trained. They handed out rifles and there was a terrace with antlers on his head. We could probably take them down fast, but I don't

know if he would make it otherwise. Anyways, No, I do think like the thought of like her getting in a car and going away, you know, it's so hard to It's just hard to let go anyways, Well, then you have to trust the other that's the thing, to trust other drivers. Anyone else saying anything else, because it's like that's where I'm like, just right here, staying my

little my, my little section of safety. I've been pretty honest about the fact that I think legends never moving out, and that I hate his wife and he's seventeen months. So yeah, it's gonna be hard to let go. Have any of the boys had girls yet, Like, what about girlfriends? You have boys only I have two boys. Yeah, so you're gonna have two women possibly unless one of them end up. You know, I don't. I think we're safe there. I think we're not. That not being safe is not

because we got to be real political, that's true. I think that we know which which gender my children prefer. But either way, you would be supportive. Absolutely absolutely. Yeah. Now as far as girlfriends, again, I told you my sixteen year old is a late bloomer. The thirteen year old so quick, funny story. We were in the car the other day and I was asking the thirteen year

old on the way home from school. I said, so, you know, buddy, anyone at school that you think is cute because like, I need fair, fair heads up right, because I like you, Kristen. I'm gonna hate whoever he did. I don't even know your boys, and I hate these girls that are with your boys. And if they if they break this heart, careful, it's real hard for me not to get involved in their lives. So we're on

the way home. Anyone cute, right, because I need four warning and he's my kid that will tell me anything. And he goes, no, not so much. And I said, are you sure it was really nobody, because it's the same girls as last year and last year there were some girls that you thought were cute. He's like, oh, they're just friends now. I said, okay, so really nobody goes no, but I'm sure they're girls who have a

crush on me, all right. He goes, well, last year there was like ten true wait, so tell me okay, wait, wait, time out though, Sorry, that's hilarious. And Drew bees adorable and he knows it, and he knows it. That's the problem. I looked him, I said, Drew. He goes think I married the adult version of Drew. He goes, well, you asked, He goes well, you asked me, Mom, and I told you. He was like, did you want me to lie? I was like, no, but I'm glad to see you're not

short on confidence. Yeah, which is great. But here's here's the flip side to that conversation. Let me just play Devil's advocate. Oh boy, No, I'm just saying because you guys say that you're going to hate the women, and I have also said that. But here's the flip side of that. What if the women are just like you, strong, confident, loving, caring, why would you then hate them because they're going to be good for your son? Hater? Then yeah, I come at it from a little different angle. I would be

I would be happy for them, you know. I want someone strong and and don't they say that you end up marrying someone like your mom or someone like your dad. So I would want them to be strong. But at the same time, I'll still hate her a little bit, you know, because because you again, I'm the o G right. Yeah, so now there's someone who who's coming into his life and is going to take him away from me. But at the same time I know that that's the way it's supposed to be. Rip them out of my hand.

I mean she'd probably cut the umbilical cord and I just didn't know it. But you know, I mean, I want him in my life, so I'll have to cut it out. It's hard. I think I have this theory that boy moms are harder to work your way in with that if they have one of each, Like I don't fear for Jason's wife as much as I would fear well, but at least we'll have each other so I can talk you off the ledge and you can

talk me after it. To your point, With just boy moms, I feel like, I mean, that is two women taking your sons away, and you've always thinking I'm sorry. I mean, I know we all feel like, but it's also like you've always been the only woman, Like you're the queen of the household, the only female. I don't I wonder how it's probably not gonna go. Well, have you had? I wanted to ask about the sex talk, but let me know if we needed what sex talk? Like has

she had? They when you? Because I'm like, I feel like it's happening early. You want to talk to a four year old? No, No, but I know it's like happening early and earlier for people and that kind of stresses me out. Like my neighbors have a ten year old little boy and they had to like kind of have a like a topical conversation. Yeah, yeah, yeah, No,

absolutely we've had the conversation. Listen, I've had to have I no, I've had to have conversations with my when my fifteen year old soon to be sixteen year old was thirteen that were not anything that I really wanted to have, like about No, I don't know. I love that it's under the breath. I don't know. I'll talk to him about that, about about rape and like him being raped. Oh there's there where there were headlines here, yeah at a school. Um, I don't I don't know.

If it was alleged, I'll let's just say that alleged that some stuff went down in the locker room, in the boys locker room. And so I felt like, you know, it was all over the place. The kids were talking about it. So I felt like I had to sit my kid down and say, listen, this is what happened. It's not okay, but this this could happen to you too. It's not just a girl thing. It could happen to

you too. And talk about uncomfortable conversation, and then we had to have a conversation about oral sex, also very uncomfortable. I need like like that. Look, I loved what I was Wait are you eight grade? How are you asking question? Okay, that's what I learned about an eighth grade A jill? Where are you now? From your little status report? Little

check out? And I was like, what the good? I like that actually as opposed to Jerry being over there, that's like, can't talk right now about the hell when like when do kids know about I guess I know oral sex? When do they know about now? I don't know. I don't know, I don't want to know. I'm getting sweaty and I know about that. I just explain to him what it was, and I said, let me tell you something right now. It's a very intimate act. So you better make sure that you really like the girl

who's but what about it was servicing you? That? Just you know, it's it's like the same song pretty Woman just went through my head. It's just what about sex though? What about sex? Like? What about that conversation the birds and the bees? I made Chris have that conversation? Enough? Throw something over to the other side. I did. I was like, in the car now with your kid, we're

going to the lake. We're driving separate cars, um taking meaking drough you're taking Sean, and you're gonna have the conversation. And if you haven't by the time we get to the lake, I'm shoving you in a room and you're having it until you know you're not coming out a conversation. I wonder what like a dad would say, like just use a condom, like what they say. I don't I don't know what he said. I don't want to know.

I just when he came in, he just kind of gave me the he walked to the door and gave me the little nod. I was like, Okay, we're done. Good and conversation and I had to have the other awkward conversation with the papers rocks for that next time and maybe get yourself out of the how would you say it to ledge or love? Don't like this question? So many years, I don't know, it's just probably going to have to even come sooner for our kids. Well,

so here's what's probably gonna happen. First on I'll never forget this. On Mother's Day when My oldest was like six. He comes and he goes, Mommy, how did babies get in your belly? I'm like, oh my god, this mother's dame and you're six? Do we really have to talk about this? And I remember I looked and I was like, do you really want to know? He was like yeah. I was like, are you sure you want to know? Like I'm just trying to get out of it, he

was like, yeah, I really want to know. Like I default and toss it up, I'm like, God, put him there? What do you want for lunch? I would say, like when mommy and daddy, when a mommy and a daddy love each other, or like when a husband and wife love each other. A baby appears. I don't even go there. Would you say? I just said cows whales? It's like, yeah, he's at school and they're like, do you know how babies are? Maybe He's like, yeah, cows and whales. Put

him there, gets all turned around. It's like they just they get in there, and they get in there is one way of putting it, and they all have to come out through this same tunnel. Man. Well, I'm I hope you guys all enjoyed the first fifteen minutes of sway educational. We're gonna take a quick ache, and then I got some excitingness. Casper is a sleep brand that makes expertly designed products to help you get your best rest one night at a time. You spend one third

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and using wine at checkout. Terms and conditions obviously apply. Again, get a hundred dollars towards select mattresses by visiting Casper dot com, slash wine and using wine at checkout. Terms and conditions apply. Okay, So I'm really excited because today's episode we have Mel Robbins on the podcast. Today. She's a motivational speaker, which I just I love motivational speakers. I'm a big fan of like Rachel Hollis Um. But Mel Robbins is actually one of the biggest all time

motivational speakers. And how she's been able to basically go from nothing to you know, selling out big arenas and she has that five second rule, which I'm really excited to talk about, but I think a lot of it is just that motivating. And I'm curious, like, for you girls, what is one thing for you that like you want to get motivated about? Like what is holding you back? What's making you feel stuck? Is it their relationship is

at work? Is if your own thing? Like, what what is it for you that just because I mean I have I'll just say I'll start like when I'm in bed, it's I have things that I want to do, but I don't know how to like get there, and then I doubt myself. I'm like, well, I can never happen. I can't do that, or very similar so and then I just sit in bed and then I then go on Instagram and then obviously I've talked about this before, but I'm just like, oh, let's see they're doing it,

and they're doing it, which is funny. Like from my point of view, I feel like you're one of the most motivated humans right now. Like you're a hustler. You and my husband have the same business manager. Whenever I talked to our business manager, he's always like refers to you. He's just like she's hustler. Jana's hustler. And I do feel like I doubt myself, so I would like to hustle without the doubt. There's my thing, doubtless hustle, A

doubtless hustle. What about you lost? I think I need to I want I'm stuck in figuring out what's next for me. You know, as my kids get older and require less of me and less day to day, and pretty soon I'm gonna have a driver, so that means I'm not even a taxi much anymore. You're not an uber. So now I'm like, what what do I do next?

And with you know, with all that I've been through in the last year, I want to do something with that um and figure out But and like you, I'm like, Okay, I see you on Instagram, all these people doing what I want to do, and I'm like, but how do I get there? Because well, she was a she was a TV reporter before she did that, so she's got connection is that I don't have, you know, so I've and so then I do nothing. M hm, So I don't.

I don't. I don't know. I think fear it really is just what makes me just kind of paralyzes me. I'm like, well, I don't doubt that I could do something someone else is already doing and do it differently because I just really feel like we're a pretty christ centered household. So for me, I'm just like, God, there's a path and that's what you do, and anything that's meant for you will always find you. That's kind of like our go to slogan in our house, like what's

meant for you always find you? So but it is I just have this I sometimes this is one thing I actually one of the questions I wanted to ask Miles, like how do you not let what other people say? Because you can be as tough as you want to be, But and you know, like Bernie will say, like the famous quote when you're in the arena and you play in the arena, and and I get all of that, and like I get really hyped up, but then there's like one really hard comment and that I just I'm

not made. I don't think to be in the spotlight. So that's what's always kind of kept me from doing what I've always wanted to do because I can't take like I could never do what Janna does. Ever, Yeah, I agree with that. I just don't know how because you're still human, right, and no matter how ridiculous the comment, it would be hard for me to get past it. And that would for me, it would be very unmotivating.

It would take all the wind out of my sales, and I don't know that I would recover, probably just bag it in. And I think because I know there is a lot of stuff out there right now, you know,

I think, Um, I would say this. It's hard because I've put myself in that situation too, have criticism, but also too because we have been so open, like for example, when I had mentioned the rule um last episode that got slaughtered in the media because you know, it's like, so you're saying someone can lie, and but I wasn't you know what I was even saying. And that is when someone has a character defect of lying all the time, sometimes they just need a space to be like, oh crap,

that was a lot. I need to go back and fix it so that they're not scared and they don't hold on to and they don't justify. So that is just something that works for us. But anything that I ever say or do, it just it just becomes But I've also put that out there to be criticized, right, So that's something that I have to But I do think on the scale of what you guys have put out and how much you've helped, Like, I think you're

you're helping people. I mean, there was I know you and Mike well, I mean we've done a lot of life together, all of us, and I still listen to some of those episodes and I like get choked up, you know, because it's all there's just so much that I can identify in my own marriage or my own life. And so I think when you guys put out what you put out, you're helping people out weighs the people that have an opinion no matter what, you know, there's

just always going to be that group. And I know that, and I can say that to you, but if they did that to me, I would just be like, really, you know, it's something interesting. UM. I had a therapy session a couple of weeks ago or no, this was it was this week. It was like yesterday, um, from Welcome ar it was yesterday, UM. And you know she's like, we sit in this room and we talked. We're talking about so many different things, whether it be my relationship

or or this person or that person. And she's like, you don't you need to talk about you and in

your stuff and what you know, who you are. And so she made me do this exercise I am me and I had to like write out like I am this, I am that, and it was so hard for me to do because we don't ever focus on the positive stuff of our I was like, well, because everything I was writing at first it was like negative, like I can quick to talk, I can be quick to be you know, um uh you know, say nasty things if I'm hurt and I and she's like, you we leave

off the stuff that's actually like I'm kind and I'm good to those that you know, I trust the people, I give people chances. I you know I. So it's like we we we don't focus on the positive of ourselves. And that was like so telling. And she's like, would you like me to write down what I see in you? And then I was just like no, no, I know, I got so uncomfortable. She's like, why are you so uncomfortable.

I was like, because I don't believe it. And then she's like, well that's a problem, Like it's just so interesting that we just focus on the negative of ourselves and not the positives, which I think those negatives focusing on that as what was pulling us down. I also think I feel like it's easier to focus on the negative.

Do you know what I mean. It's sort of like it's it's easier to focus on the negative and anything, you know, criticizing your husband or what you don't like about you know, your house or your I just feel like that comes easier because I don't I don't know. I feel like when you pump yourself up, but we just have to because I'll have to. But yeah, because no one else is going too right. But I also I don't know what it feels very um, I don't know, I'm a great friend, feels like I know. I'm like,

I'm just gonna write that down. Yeah. I was like, well, what about the times that I haven't been a great friend? And she's just like, oh my god. I do like if I say anything to Jane, I'm like, Jane, I'm really proud of your friend. I feel like you're doing a really your job friend. I feel like a really brave friend. Like she's like, yeah, okay, so where do you want to go to lunch tomorrow, and I'm like,

up there, go squatted away. We sqatted away. I do think being a mom, though, does start to change that a little bit, because I know the ways I talk about myself or the way I used to talk about myself I've had to change because I love our daughter is like literally soaking in everything I say. So when I have a hard time putting on my spanks because it's like my spanks lanes and I'm like it's been a rough holiday season, I now say, wow, this is

mama's healthy body. I'm having a hard time getting these pants on instead of you know, whant you say? Like I feel like a badass. You know, just the way I talk about myself is also the way she is going to learn what I think of myself and what she should think about herself. And so that filter has been really good for me to kind of like put it through her eyes because she thinks I'm like stunning. I mean she really she thinks I'm pretty. But and where do you want to go for lunch tomorrow? Well,

I'm excited to talk to her. She's going to be you know, she's going to be an awesome guest. To have on the show to help us get out of our It's like for me that it's like a January funk. Does anyone else have that hype stuck in January? I

love January. I was born in it, though, I do think it's like a funk though, because you everything, the hype is over, you know, like the New Year's here and they're us to be some like magic switch in your body or your brain where you just do everything so much better and different and like yolo, and it's like that's not realistic. Really, Christmas is over, the decorations are down, so Leslie, Yeah, I'm going to give you the floor for the mama's out there that or the ladies.

You don't have to just be a mom um and you can be young, you can be old, you can be in the middle. Yeah, you can be any forgers. So I don't I think we talked about this the last time we were together, Um about me finding out that I was brack of positive. Yeah. Yeah, So I found out that I'm brack of TUO positive, which means that that puts me in an increased risk for breast

and a varying cancer. So one of the preventative measures to hopefully not get breast cancer, because that's what I'm at greatest risk for, is to have your ovaries and Philippian tubes removed and then consider a double miss actonmy So I felt like ovaries and Philippian tubes were given, I was done having kids, done with my family. But what it does is it throws you into instant menopause. Like you wake up from surgery and bam, you're in menou young and I am not of menopausal age yet.

Now was I headed that direction? Absolutely? What we all are Essentially, I'm yesterday. I'm closer than you guys. But um, with instant menopause comes all sorts of really not fun things. Um, you know, the hot flashes. So I woke up last night d wrenched, like, change my shirt, pe the bed. I didn't pee the bed, but it felt that with pillow was wet, my shirt was wet, my sheets were wet. I threw the sheets off, I changed my shirt, I got back in bed because the sheets are still wet.

Now I'm cold, and then I'm hot again, and then I'm cold. But I used, you know, I had your train of thought. I was like, okay, hot flash. I burned extra caloriexactly trying to go off. But what I learned today was my breast surgeon wanted to check my estrogen level to see how far off the cliff I've fallen. And let's just say that I'm fully on the floor. But like, have you been because you haven't had the mood swings? Have you? You would have to ask Chris.

I don't know, but I mean, has it been? There? Definitely were a little you were really afraid of that part right well that and honestly, Chris would not appreciate me talking about this, but obviously, but I'm going to anyway. So but your muffs gris the way we go. Um, but our sex life, like, one of the things that happens in menopause is dryness, and it's it's a real thing.

Like to the point where I looked him the other day, I was like, your penis may as well be made of tiny shards of glass, because that is exactly what it feels like, Chris. There is medicine apparently for that. There is, which is why I had my estrogen check. He can put me on estrogen as a low dose estrogen to just kind of get me over the hump and to help with and get you hump and to help with things. And so he wanted to see how far, how how low with my estrogen before he put me

on the estrogen. Um. So the good news is is even if even if he puts me on the estrogen, it doesn't undo what was done by removing my ovrace, but it will hopefully get me over the hump. But yeah, some days I don't know if I'm coming or going. I don't know which end is up. For the women that are you know, Bracco, or wanna find out if they are, what is your best advice for them? Is it? Because I mean, obviously you made the decision and you're

making the decision to get your breast removed this year. Yeah, so I'll have the double mostecto me this summer. UM. If you are worried about being brack of positive, you can you can take a test. You can take a genetic test. I mine was done by my gnecologist. But because your mother had because my mother had ovaryan cancer. I lost my m to a varying cancer. She's the only one in my family that we did not have a deep story of a variant a breast cancer. So when I took the test, I was a giant apple

and was like, yeah, take the test. It's going to be negative. I'm not even worried about it. So when it came back positive, I was stunned. Yeah, that's overwhelming. It's really overwhelming because I never even worried about it, not even for a second. Even after the test was done, I wasn't even worried about getting the results back to the point where when my doctor called me and said you're positive, I was like positive for what I was, I was such an all I thought it was going

to be nothing. But you can take a genetic test. From what I understand, you can do the I think twenty three and me has a box that you can check when you send your sample and as to whether or not you want to be tested for brecca. So that's the way you can do it. They're all kinds of ways, kind of dad or a relative. You can find out that my dad, by the way, keeps he's like it's your dad, and I'm like, Dad, please go about twenty three and me like I get it here.

My dad like we're cool. Yeah, So you can do it that way, but I would just be I would caution anyone don't just go Willie nearly do it because you can't unsee those results. So just know that you're ready to hear whatever comes back, because it might not be Bracca. It might come back and say, hey, you are at risk for rectal cancer. Wait, you can't live without your recton, So you gotta know. You gotta know

that you're ready to hear. I don't know if you were comfortable saying this though, but how old are you? Because you look so young to me. I am forty seven. Wow, yeah, looking good, thank you, And I have guessed. Yeah, I'm still young. It's still young, and I still wasn't in menopause. Um, what's the average age we and my mom was thirty four when she went through menopause. Yeah, that is really

the average age is fifty two. Okay, I thought I thought it was closer to fifty, but I couldn't remember. That's the average age. Yeah, so I was definitely headed that direction. I'm terrified a menopause because my anxiety is already through the roof. My emotions already like I'm gonna be there to hold you, It's gonna be great, We're gonna get through it. We get through it all, Yeah, we sure are. And every twenty one days I'll remind you until you get to menopause, and then I'll remind

you every four months. It's gonna be awesome. I'll love you. Let's take a break. Okay, I how do I say? It's not being mean? I've I was gonna say, I've never been more excited to have this guest in studio. But I am so so freaking excited to have Mel Robbins in studio. Wow, never been more excited. You have very low standards, you know. I just I was there guest before. No, I just have so much to ask you. I just feel so stuck and I just need your help.

I cry, No, but I just will. First of all, Mel Robbins, isn't like you're the biggest freaking motivational speaker out there. You've completely changed your life, and I feel like for me and maybe some other listeners out there who scroll on Instagram and see that, and it's like, oh, it's that tinge of not jealousy, But I like, how do I how do I do that? How do I how do I get unstuck? And I know you have your five second Rule Book, which is you know it was.

It was the name the number one audiobook in the world and the fifth most read book of the year on Amazon. So that's incredible. Um, but how do I start, Well, it started at the beginning, where are you stuck? Well, I don't know how honest, I don't really like, Well,

I'm gonna warn you right now. You don't know if you want me to come back or well, I'm gonna warn you right now that, um, there's no halfway with me, and that I believe that everything happens for a reason, and that there's a reason why you're talking to me today, and that it's gonna come out in terms of whether or not you want to just start talking about how you're stuck or whether or not I drag it out of you, because either way, either way it's coming out,

because that's well, that's the only way that I rolled. Because I think that we talk about the things that we're comfortable talking about, and that means that we don't talk about the things that we need to talk about

that are uncomfortable. And one of the things that you said that already jumped out at me is that you use the word jealousy and you used it in terms of scrolling through social media, and you know, maybe you land on one of the videos that we put out every single day to the millions of our followers, and what strikes you is, well, here's a woman who eleven years ago was at rocking bottom, drinking too much, marriage and crisis, eight thousand dollars in dead, three kids, the

definition of stuck, the definition of self loathing, and somehow she pulled her together and she changed her life, and now she is helping other people do that, and I'm jealous of the fact that she did that. Jealousy is a really interesting thing because it's very powerful. There is the jealousy that is destructive, that is the negative jealousy when you look at what somebody has and you're envious

and you believe they don't deserve it. But then there's the jealousy that I think is really positive, that's tied into your intuition and your intelligence, and jealousy that's positive shows up as a huge like ding ding ding ding ding signal from your soul that there's something in that thing that you're seeing that the other person is doing that's calling you forward. And so your jealousy of the fact that I hit this moment and somehow figured out

how to get unstuck. That means that your soul is trying to tell you, I feel so stuck and I need you two make a decision to change your life. That's what is at the heart of the jealousy comment

that you just said. And it's a very positive thing. Wow, yeah, I mean and and I do like because I am a I I hustle, like I really do hustle, and I you know, because I provide for my family and my kids and um, you know, and and a lot of times when I do look at that, it's like I want to be able to you know, which is why I like I had we have this podcast, and I'm trying to help others and trying to you know, use my experiences to um guide others and help others

that what what I've been through. But also when you get stuck in your own it's like how you know, the for example, like you said you had crippling anxiety, Like sometimes I feel like my anxiety takes over so much of my life and the things that I want to do in my life because I'm too afraid to go and enjoy I'm too afraid to go to um fly a couple hours away to enjoy myself with some friends because I'm too afraid of X, Y and Z or my kids or or I'm going to have an

anxiety attack and I and what if I pass out? And it's like, I live my life so fear based that it's holding me back from so many things that I could be enjoying or I could be growing. Yes, okay, so a couple of things. Let's go deep. You just said that you provide for your kids. So are you the primary breadwinner in your marriage? Yes? Welcome to the new reality. Were the women who work are the primary breadwinners of their household? And welcome to something that I

call breadwinner resentment rage. And what that is is it's a dynamic that's that's happening in primarily heterosexual relationships. It happened in my relationship. When you start out earning your partner, there is this whole up passive aggressive thing that happens because and I'm not saying that this is what's going on in your marriage. I know nothing about your marriage. I'm saying this is what happened in my marriage, and this is what happens for almost every single woman that

then hits that moment where you become the provider. When it comes to you earning more money, there is a direct attack psychologically that your partner undergoes because just like women, this is so dupp that it's this way. But forever women have been told to be good girls and to look good, and you know, we're so hard on ourselves and on our bodies because society is prioritized youth, being thin, looking good when it comes to being a woman. For dudes,

it's about being successful in providing. And so the second that you're in a relationship, were now, according to culture, you're the one that's providing for the family, your husband, your partner. This happened in my relationship too when I

started out earning my husband. They go through an identity crisis where they're saying that they're proud of you, but they actually resent you because they don't feel successful anymore and they don't feel, uh, you know, like they're the ones that's providing, and it ty and it creates tremendous

turmoil in your relationship. I would echo this is kristin himel amazing um I am on my second marriage, Um, I would say, I would echo, that's completely accurate because in my first marriage I felt like I raised him a bit. And that's not a slam. It's just like I'm a go get her, I'm a hard worker and I just handled and he was hanging on, you know. And the resentment, I'm like, dude, do something, you know anything spinning a circle, put the dishes away. It is

It's a really there's a lot of resentment there. I've never heard it phrase the way you did, and it's so well put because that's a real thing. And I think especially in the industry that Janna and I are in my husband's and country music, my forever husband, if you will, UM is in country music, and he is now he is the breadwinner. And and there's something in in my brain that's having a hard time accepting that,

you know. And I'm gonna stay at home mom now with a degree and a kick gas resume and a career that I hug up, hung up, and and so now I'm going how do I get back in? And when you said stuck, it like instantly brought tears my eyes from why my crain because it's that stuck feeling like what do what do you do? Now? You know I have this, I gotta lock my ship up, mel Um. Now you don't like locking it up is not working? Yeah,

I know. It's just like you're saying, oh, mom for four years, but there's so much more, so much more so, here's the thing And then there's some sort of guilt's associated with that too, is if being a mother isn't enough because I'm obsessed with these human beings, probably to like a really creepy degree that I've am raising, you know, So let me reframe this for you. You're ready, Yeah, you're not. Said you're here for a reason. Today, I like instantly had tears and I was like, I'm probably

gonna cry. Well, I'm here for a reason because where you're at in terms of the way that you're thinking about things, is causing you a lot of emotional pain. And it doesn't have to be that way. What you're feeling is what every single woman on the planet feels, which is the real conflict between caretaking and ambition and being ambitious somehow having the ambition being conflict with your role as a mother and as a wife. And what I want you to know is that you're not stuck.

What's happening is that you're really present to your ambition. That's it, and there's nothing wrong. And you had the greatest gift on the planet, which is you've been able to stay home with your kids. That's incredible. And now what you need to know is that it's time to listen to that ambition. You're not stuck at all. And here's something else I want to tell you, because I I've been married. Jeez, I don't even want what year in twenty four years? Yep, So I've been married twenty

four years. And I'll go back to the breadman winner resentment rage and talk to you about like what Chris and I worked through, because what happened in my marriage is when we were about fifteen years and probably like twelve years in. He had always been the primary breadwinner, but his uh, he had gone into the restaurant business and we had put our entire life savings into it and it went under or was going under, and we were eight hundred thousand dollars in debt. We had three

young kids. Leans hit the house, the bankruptcy letters started to arrive. I ended up getting fired from my job. This was two thousand eight lousy year for everybody, huge housing recession. And I did what any functioning adult would do when your life starts to go down the toilet. I started drinking like it was my job. And uh, because it's easier, to, of course, numb your pain than

it is to face it. And um, I for six months straight would drink myself to sleep every night, and then I would hit the snooze button five times in the morning, and the kids would miss the bus and Chris was already left the house because he didn't want to be in the house when I woke up, because I was a raging bitch, because it's easier to scream at them than to get your own life together. And I never thought at the age of forty one this

would be my life. That I would be on the verge of losing everything, that I would be in the gutter, that I would feel like the world's worst mother, that I would not know how to pay for groceries, that I was scared of the cars getting repossessed, and UM, I made a decision in that moment. That's when I

invented the five second rule. Um. The story is kind of crazy, but I basically one night was giving myself one of those pep talks that the two of you have, probably in this moment of your life, were giving you like, Okay, I gotta make a change. I got to do something different. I got like, this isn't working, but you don't know what to do. You're stuck. But I was saying to myself, I gotta get out of bed. I gotta get out

of bed. And then I see this rocket launch across the television screen, and all of a sudden, I go, holy cow, that's the answer to getting out of bed. Because you know, Janna, you talk about crippling anxiety. That's why I wasn't getting out of bed. The alarm would ring. The first thing that I would feel was anxiety, and then the depression, and then it was like one of those weighted blankets of emotion, burying me alive in the bed,

and I'd hit the snooze button. I didn't have the resolve of the confidence to get up and face my problem, so it was easier just to hit the snooze button. But I see this rocket launch and I go, WHOA, What if I launched myself out of bed so fast? Tomorrow morning? I moved before the anxiety kicks in. What if I'm out of bed before that weight of emotion and all of the fears trapped me there. And so the next morning I just counted when the alarm went off like a rocket, so stupid, five three two one,

and I stood up. And that's the that's the five second roule. That's all that it is. You count backwards five three two one when you're doubting yourself, when you're procrastinating, when you have anxiety. It's the little push and it's actually a brain trick that it turns out to have a ton of science behind it that you can use to change any thinking pattern, any behavior pattern, any aspect

of your life. And so how I used it to deal with the resentment that my husband had, the deal with the the resentment I had from my husband at that point, and how I continued to use it to change my marriage and to change where my life was at when I felt so stuck, is that any time there was something I needed to do, whether it was not snap at Chris, I'd go five four three to one, and just counting backwards switched gears in my brain, settled my body and allowed me to talk to him from

a place of my values instead of snapping at him all the time. And five three two one, I'm picking up the phone, I'm looking for a job to one. If I'm feeling guilty, I say, this is not serving me. I'm not going to feel guilty, And I literally five seconds at a time. Decision by decision by decision changed the way I was thinking and changed what I was doing in the entire trajectory of my life changed. Chris started using it in the restaurant business. Five three two one.

They're going back in to talk to their landlords five or three two one. They're laying people off five three two one. They're meeting with investors and having the embarrassing conversations about where things are going with their business, even though they want to tell a different story. And slowly but surely everything changes now. I ended up sharing the five second rule in a ted X talk. I don't know how long ago was like a ten years ago,

eight years and whatever. It's got twenty million views now, and that's what led to my speaking career. People started right to me. That's what led to me writing a book about it, even though I'm dyslexic as hell. And that was a whole another story. But as my career took off, you two and Chris stepped away from the restaurant business and I became the primary breadwinner. There was this totally up dynamic in our relationship where I could

tell he secretly resented me. And what we have unpacked in our marriage is that for men, the pressure to succeed the profession, the pressure to be professionally successful, the pressure to provide the professor, the pressure to make money,

that is NonStop for dudes. And when you start to out earn them and they're the ones in the pickup line at school, or they're the ones that are watching you on television, or they're the ones that are being asked, oh wow, mel Mel is doing dynamond you know jan is killing it. You know, there's something that happens for their self confidence that they don't know how to resolve, and they secretly no longer see you as their partner. They see you as a person that's making them feel demasculated.

And then when you come home because you've been working all day and there's freaking dishes in the sink and the laundry is piled up, and you're like, what are you even doing all day that makes it even worse, and so they start to spiral. And so that's the dynamic I'm talking about. And what we had to do in our marriage is talk about, Okay, we're fifteen years in, what are the roles we want to play in this

next chapter. And as it turns out, this was the greatest gift on the planet for me and Chris, because Chris is the primary provider in our household for emotional stability, spirituality, love, consistency. He is a way better parent than I am, um, no question. And you know I used to be so piste off because my ambitions I was channeling it into him. And when looking back, every fight he and I ever had was me driving my ambitions at a guy that's

not motivated by money. And the second I started making money, I learned something about myself. I'm ambitious as hell and I love that, and I love business and I love the game of making money, and I love making a difference, and I love building and that's amazing. And I am at my highest when I'm out there building something and making an impact. And Chris is at his highest purpose right now in his life when he is caring for

our kids and caring for our community. And he had to do a lot of work to realize that that kind of providing is way more valuable and successful than any amount of money in a bank account. And that's the kind of work that you need to do in your marriage. If that resentment piece around your success versus his success, your role in business, business versus his opinion that you should be home more and he shouldn't be the one Like that's all that that's got to get

worked out if there's resentment in your marriage. Now, I want to talk about the guilt that you feel having been a stay at home mom. The number one thing you could do for your children is to follow your dreams. Mhm. What is it that you want most for your children? Tell me just freedom? What does that mean? Really? Trying not to be emotional? Don't stop that what looks like

hardcore freedom? I mean part of the reason I keep trying to build a brand on this side is mm hmm, sorry, guys, um is to like provide this idea to our daughter. Because I grew up with two working parents, so I've always just been an ass kicker. I mean I have had I've had so many jobs since I was like fourteen, cleaning out many refrigerators from my uncle's business at University of Michigan. I mean, let's talk about you know um and I just want her. Her name is Love. I

want love to see what a strong woman looks like. Yeah, and who's going to show as as I crabb, Who's gonna show my running well? And so it's I've been building this like little bitty brand, you know. Okay, So first of all, you're doing what every woman does. You are diminishing your ambition, and you are diminishing what you're up to. Who am I I am doing? I launched my podcast this Saturday, which is pretty exciting for me. Congratulations things Now it's all good. It's just you know,

like there's that guilt factory. Talk to me about the guilt. Why do you feel guilty? Because it feels distracting from them and I'm the primary parent. It has been gone so much. Okay, So it's me. We don't like have nannies or babysitters on the regular really, so okay. So you're at the point in this pursuit of building something that's your own where you need help. That's what's happened. And the guilt is coming from the fact that you don't feel deserving of having somebody come in to watch

the kids. Well, you pursue this thing for you, Yeah, because right now it's not monetarily bringing in anything makes money? Right, But like what I'm doing, so what bringing in money? Really good point? But so what does it? Does it have to bring in money to make you happy? And just I love it. I mean I've had a blog.

I had a blog for like twelve years and no one read it until Janna posted that I had written a piece on miscarriage and it just went crazy viral and I was like, oh, like, my sweet little web nest finally is getting some attention. You know, I don't do it to make money, Honestly, I'm not. I'm not super motivated by money. I just always have had to make the money, like in the previous marriage and my whole life to provide for myself, and I didn't have a lot of help from parents or you know. So

so here here's what I just here. You're ready, Okay, you're ready, A kind of salt water happening over You're good, get it out of there. So um here, let's strap on your seatbelt because here's the real issue. So the real issue is that you have a pattern of behavior and belief that no longer serves you. For anybody on the planet that feels stuck. If you're listening to us talk right now and you feel stuck, here's the good news.

The good news is all that's happening is there's a pattern of behavior or a pattern of thinking that somebody else trained you in that comes from the past that you're repeating right now and it no longer works. And the pattern of behavior that you have is I got to do it on my own, nobody's here to help. Yeah, that's really accurate. And so the simple way to change this, and it's a brand new skill that you need to develop for yourself, is you have to ask for specific help.

That's it, because if you don't break this pattern, I can tell you what's going to happen. You're going to sit at home and have aspirations and continue to diminish your dreams, and you're going to continue to tell yourself a lie, which is you don't deserve help unless you

can pay for it yourself. And then you're going to also secretly wish that your partner would notice and offer it up, and the resentment in your side, in you keeping this need silent, is going to build and build and build, because we women love to pretend that our partners can read our minds, and then we punish people

when they can't. And so all you need to do this is a really simple thing to change, and it will change everything because you want love your daughter to know that she doesn't have to do everything on her own. You want your daughter to know that she can ask for help, and the only way she's going to learn how to do that is by watching her mom do the same. We were all raised by mothers who didn't ask for help, which is why none of us do it. You can break that pattern and that cycle by going

to your husband with a very specific request. There are three days a week that I need five hours out of the house and what I want to do on those five hours are X, Y, and Z, and he is offering that too. You won't accept it, no, So I feel like I don't know where to send my copay to you for this session, but you really are so enlightening. You can send it to the universe because here's the thing, like I feel like all human beings can be explained by one simple concept. Our brains love

to learn patterns. And so if you think that you're unworthy, if you think you're not good enough, if you think you're unlovable, if you feel guilt, if you procrastinate, those are just patterns and it's somebody else's bullet that they put in your mind a long time ago. And when you identify that they were thinking patterns or behavior patterns like the one you have, I don't ask for help. I gotta do it myself. When you identify a pattern, once you see it, you can change it. And so

your husband's already offered to help. Come up with here's the here's the coaching, come up with a very specific um, ask about how you're going to structure your week, and then go to your husband say this is how it's gonna go, this is what I'm gonna do. And now you're in partnership around your dreams, yes, instead of you secretly building this big emotional distance. And then how old is love? For awesome? She's old enough to understand that

mommy has things that mommy wants to do. And the way that you deal with your guilt is you know what you do you thank your kids. Love Today Mommy gets to go and work on her her podcast. I want to thank you so much for hanging out with so and so today because mommy, you know, is going to go get to do something mommy loves. And I love that you support me and then she feels a part of it. Yeah. I love that, and I love how yeah, and I love how you're saying, like schedule out,

like what you want? You know, So you know what, five three to one, you got this, Kristen, You're my soul mate, all right, So, Kristen, I want to make sure this landed, So repeat, repeat back for me and everybody listening, Mel for president. God. No, I'm just kidding, um, you know what, because any functioning human being would be great, and I don't happen to be one, so that would be amazing. So I want you to, first of all, tell me the big takeaway, the big aha that you've

got out of our conversation. I need to ask for help, and I've known us and I am not good at it, but I'm going to become better at it great, And asking for help is a skill, it is, and it's one you just need to develop. That's it. There's no two on angiogram. You know, if anybody follows that, I'm like a solid, gouty girl, but I don't do enough for myself and people want to help you, Like, it's it's actually very selfish not to ask for help. Now, how do you get unstuck in a like? How did

you and Chris get unstuck in your marriage? It was not easy for Chris and I to go through the three or four years of turmoil where I hated him for being a failure and then where he hated me for being the one that was successful. Like it might as well have been an affair, because emotionally we were so devastating to one another and mean and just awful. Yeah, so how did you stop that behavior? How did you stop the resentment? Just the five four three three two one? Well,

because that takes lots of practice. It's like it's like a hundred and seventy five times a day, is what you gotta You gotta use it um because you know your instincts are gonna want to kill somebody or use that tone of voice or cut them off at the knees. And so when the emotions rise up, you five you count five or three two one to yourself, and it gives you a moment of control to control what you

do next. And for me, it would be tough to remember to do that because that's not the normal response, right, The normal response is to pop off, right, Yeah, And I think I think I struggle with that too in our relationship as well, Like when I am triggered, it's I want my I I don't take that minute to pause with five seconds five seconds because because then it's definitely like you're trying what you're trying. It's so hard to Can you count like five four three two? Yes,

you can? And you don't even have to say it out loud. You can. You It is a moment where you're taking control. And what happens in your mind is when you're about to pop off, you're using the interior part of your brain where you're driven by automatic behavior, by emotion, by anger, by patterns. When you count backwards five four three two one, you interrupt those habit loops

and you awaken your prefrontal cortex. That's the part of your brain that you're using when you're taking a test or learning new behavior, when you're acting with courage, when you're in control. And so it's a cheat code that gives you immediate control over the part of the brain that you need um in order to fix this situation.

And so you know Kristen is going to need to do it three two one to ask for help and to break that pattern of beating herself up and feeling guilty and trying to do it all on her own. And by asking for help, you will improve your marriage because you are creating into intimacy and partnership and you're letting your partner in on your dreams and you're allowing your partner to do what your partner wants to do,

which is to support you in a way that's really empowering. Yeah, and said for Leslie, and it's the biting our tongue when we're quick to Okay, I know you have to leave melt I could live here. Let me talk about biting your tongue. You're ready. Here's the thing about biting your tongue. Three to one your tongue. Now, it's never edit the content of what you need to say that's true for you and your values. Edit the tone. Oh, I like that. The hardest thing that I ever said

to my husband was, I don't believe in you. Oh wow, I don't believe that you will ever be successful or be able to provide for this family. And it scares the hell out of me, and I'm freaking angry. I think I even said I should have married some guy in finance to really like dig it in there. And he turned to me and you know what he said it I know, oh, I know. It was the turning point in our marriage because it was the most honest

thing I had ever said to him. And when you get to that level of honesty, that's when you can start to rebuild. Because we have a habit in our most important relationships of lying, of withholding, of acting out of anger instead of having the hard, truthful conversations. And for you, the hard truthful conversation is I thought I could do this. I want to try to do this. But these are the these are the ten commandments, and

if they're broken, what's changed is I'm out. And we need to work together as we work on ourselves on how we are going to create that new reality. And that working together pieces super important because whether the relationship goes the distance or it doesn't, you have kids together. So you're gonna be together forever anyway, and so working on honesty and working on respect and communication, which is all driven by the courage to be honest. That's the

foundation that you need to work on. You deserve to have somebody that is honest with you. You deserve to have somebody that respects you. You deserve to have somebody that, even though they might be struggling, still has the courage and the respect and the love for you to be honest with you the moment they start struggling. I'm I one thousand percent agree with you, and I just I

appreciate all of your insight. I'm obsessed with you, and I just I cannot wait to come to you know, come to one of your speaking engagements and come to the talk second. Please. I would love to talk. I love that, I would love that. I would love to be a guest. I love you, Mel. I love you too so much for coming on the show. You means more to me than you know. Well. I'll come back any time you want. Thank you, Mel. You're welcome to Okay,

bye bye, Hey, this is Mel. If you're in the Los Angeles area, you can watch my new daytime talk show, The Mel Robin Show every single weekday on k t l A at four pm, or if you're in the rest of the country, check your local listings at the melt Robin Show dot com. Obsessed with Mel I want to be a better person. I'm just every morning, I'm gonna go five three. Let's I gotta go buy your book right away? Amazon that stuff. Hey, I got an email,

um to leave with us. It's from anonymous wedding parties. I recently got engaged and has been amazing. My fiance has a larger wedding party that he's thinking of asking to stand up with him eight um, and I can definitely think of that many wonderful and supportive women that are so close to my heart to stand up with me. However, I feel like I may be getting in my own head about it all. I don't want to hurt feelings.

Where do you draw the line? How can I be sure these people will be in our life when we are fifty sixty, etcetera. Oh that's a big one, isn't Yeah, I mean it's hard. I guess I don't understand. I don't understand the hang up? What is her hang up? Hang up? Planning went for you guys, like, that's a hard one. I don't want anyone's feeling. Why no, because for me it's like, you know, I didn't I had to kind of um stretched to get some more girls on my side. Mike Code could have had a lot

more a football team, yeah, um. So for me, I I wanted to keep it like smaller. Um, but you know he wanted to have more, and so I I what I would think nowadays, I like what people do they have opposite numbers, yeah, and I think that's really cool. But looking back, just so you know, Anonymous, like, there is one person in my wedding party that I don't speak to anymore, that is has done some awful things to me, but it doesn't take away from the memory

of that day. Other things take away from the memory of that day, but nothing takes away from the memory of that day. Um, because of that person in the photo. Do we know how old Anonymous is? Young? Yeah, because I do think younger. The only reason I say that is when so I have been married twice on my second final forever marriage, but the first time I have felt like a need to have a lot of people, and I was younger, and then the second time, I was like, yeah, good with you three, you know, or

two and felt good about it. It's hard to I think when you're in an age where everybody else is getting married that if they put you in your wedding and their wedding, you kind of feel obligated a bit to put them in yours, even though you shouldn't. You know, there's there's a lot of layers there. I don't think the numbers have to be even, and I don't. I also don't think that the guy has to have every

guy stand up for him. There are other things that you could have those guys do there equally as important, right, Like you could have ushers. I bet there's a lot of ushers that would disagree with you. A lot of Bible readers, Bible verse readers at weddings that are like, well, the person who read our Bible Verse is actually a dear, dear, very close friend who was just here. So so yeah, so I interesting about that I did something in their

day that I shouldn't have done. I was a little angry with the message at church, okay, so I took it a bottom myself bro to d m R. Pastora, I kind of like this know this is this is where like in my note in my therapy, I don't really think before I say certain things. What did you

send it immediately? Okay? Do you need the five second role for a different reasons, but for some you know, I just felt angry and I don't know if it's because I'm angry angry period, uh sure, or you know, And I've always had you know, God and I have had a um we're or having a We've always had a working relationship that makes sense and not a working relationship. We've had a like that we're betting heads right now. Well yes, but not. And I'm always going to believe,

but I question a lot of things sometimes. And I so I remember just sitting in church and being like like I felt like I got he was healing everybody else. But then I walk away with while I'm I don't know, I just I just got angry. And so I wrote out, reached out to him um and he, you know, he responded back and was like really sorry that you feel this way, and I'm like, oh my god, I'm so sorry. I'm so embarrassed, and I have to find a new church troll. Now, I was like, I am so sorry.

I was like, I'm just angry, and I'm I thought that maybe I could just try to find clarity because they always say go to go to God, go to you know, I'm trying to find clarity, and you know, he's like, I'd love to sit down with you. Well, this goes back to the wedding party email because the pastor that married us also had indiscretions with his wife m and so how do I So it's like that was when I was really like trusting God and everything, and then I'm like, but then he lies to He

didn't have to tell me anything like he had. He didn't have to say anything to us, like that's not But I confided in him when things went down in my relationship with Mike at the time, and he just sat there and I just remember being like why you know, of course because your marriage, you know, And again he doesn't have to say anything that I just so it's always just kind of like, oh, I'm just like scared

to have that. I don't even know why I'm saying all this, but I just encourage you to not let the humans get in the way of your God relationship, because ultimately it's the human nous of those people like pastors and preachers and every you know, those people want to be an example of, and they've signed up for a really big job because I don't know that I could ever do that and try to live biblically like they do. They would come out of the woodwork. But

it's the humanness of people gets in the way. So we can't idolize anyone here. We can only confide in and have a relationship with the one with a capital oh that we know is the constant. So were you mad at the pastor? Or were you mad at God? Can we know what the message was that really want? Like? God? That's okay too, Yeah, he can take it. I was

more mad at like they were. He was talking about repenting and how people should you know, the people that um have hurt others and have these addictions or these character defects that they need to let go of, they can be healed, and then I'm like more hopeful for the addict. So they're hopeful for them for the but then not hopeful for the Well, then what do we do right the ones that continue to be hurt in

led to what happens there? I don't know addictions. Not trying to play a victim, No, No, I'm just like in that moment, I was just feeling like there's so much grace for one side, and you're like, where's the grace for the other right? Where the strength? Really? Yeah, maybe that's next week, but well maybe after my d M it will be He's like, well, I gotta sharpen up something. I do think, like those hopeful messages, there's so much like grace that goes out to the people.

We're all broken, So I don't know a way to frame it, but like I'll say, like in this case, the people that have the addiction, and then there's the people on the other side that are trying to support the people with the addiction that are going to church to be like Okay, I gotta like, you know, gear up and feel good. And and I do think when you're angry, that's the humanness part that I was talking about, Like when you're angry with with your people, it's hard.

We don't have like we can try to extend God's grace, but I don't know that we really have the full ability to do what God has done for us. I mean gave us the son, you know, so I don't. I think we just kind of have to like know it's okay to be frustrated and know it's okay to just not be okay sometimes. I mean I've I've left feeling. I leave a lot of relationships in my life feeling. Just as you're saying right now, addiction is a beast.

I'm just talking about addiction, no, but I mean like broken, So that's where it resonates with me. The addictions aren't the same, but like, so what do you do with it? Then? With everyone you know? Like, how do you? How do you leave then? Because and I think it's just And I said this to my to Catherine, who was on last week. I told her, I go, I don't know why it is every single time I'm in church, I want to cry, but I don't because I don't want to look weak. Oh cry it out. But it's like

it's like I won't let him. And he's like, well, that's God trying to get into you. But I'm like, I I won't. I won't like do it, I won't like release anything. And like, and there was even a prayer group that like was in front of church and I wanted to go up there and like asked for some certain prayers. But I was embarrassed and I walked away and I ran and I just went and cry in the car. I actually did go this week to

the front. You did, cried like a baby, went up and said one sentence and just cried and just let him pray over me. See, I find I just I don't know why I get uncomfortable. I'm not your style to know, but I want it to be. I just get uncomfortable. Like I'm so jealous of the people in church that have their hands up been praising me. I look at them and I'm like, I wish I could

do that one time. No rip off the band aid one too, Like I like even saying it like makes me want to cry because I'm like I want to, but I'm afraid too, because then I'm like, well then if I give that, then I'm like, then it's you know, it's a little loss of control. Well, it's a loss of control. But also like, is he going to be there for me because everyone else hasn't been there? Who he the big guy? The big guys always there. But that's my thing. When it starts with like abandonment from

early childhood wounds. You don't think that man is going to be there for you because that man wasn't. Yeah, but that was the human man. That's the human nous. Don't let the humans ruin your relationship with the one, the one real guy. You know, this just got real deep. I just encourage you, Like I used to not put my hands up, I used to not go to the front for prayer. But I also just got to a point where I was like, just get so defeated that you're like, what can it hurt? I guess is where

I went to, like I'm only up from here. And last Sunday was one of those Sundays where I was like just a real hard Sunday. It was a hard fight with my husband. It was you know, I battle sometimes even with the church right now, with like the amount of violence that goes on in a church, Like I do want to go, but now do I feel safe?

It's like there's we're all have so many layers, but I don't know, you just feel closer and better and cry and release and it's like I just even if the people that are standing next to you are there for the right reasons, they'd be the ones that would put a hand on your back or pray for you before they'd ever judge you. And if they're there for the wrong reasons, then that's their own demon to fight.

You know what, if you just stay there and you don't say a word, you don't have to speak, you can just stayd there, you go with me, then then that's what you do. I don't think you have to say anything. I just you can just go up there and just be And they wouldn't know that too. It's

just because I even noticed. I just I noticed that every time I'm in church, I just get so eyes well and I'm like no, no, And then to like someone you know, dm me and was like, I saw you at church, and I'm like, yeah, well that's the other yea. You know. So I'm like, well, I gotta you know, I can't even I don't know, but you but you can, I know. And I wonder too if it will become a point where you feel the pool

so strongly. I had never cried in church, and I remember the exact sermon where I just let it out. I couldn't help it. It didn't hit anything on the way out, it just came out. It was like this person. This pastor was telling the story and it literally lined up so identical with my childhood that like, I had no choice and I just lost it. And I wonder if that will be what happened where you can't where

your humanness doesn't get in the way. Yeah, I mean I would just I you know, I didn't grow up in a We went every Easter, every Christmas, I didn't, you know, And we started to go, Um, we didn't really go in l A. And we've made it a pack to go every Sunday. Um. But it's just it's a journey. Yeah, and I'm on it. It's interesting. But I'm gonna start volunteering to watch the kiddos for the first service. And then I thought about doing that too. I'm pumped about that, and then I get nervous about

term good episode. Ladies, I love you, I love you, Jesus loves you, of God loves you. Let's you're a good friend. Don't talk about lunch tomorrow. I love you so much. You're a good friend. By next week. Bye bye,