Eat Like a Genius

were talking about gossip. Oh okay, I can't say who the person is because she's well known and we're kind of um, she's she's been a she's been a real leader and guide for me through my divorce last year and just you know, coming out of things, um and just you know, my healing work, and she's she's been a really big advocate in my life. And you know, she's kind of going through her own battles right now with divorce. And we were we had in like an hour call last night after I put the kids down.

And it's because so she's not a very um, she's very well known. She's you know, written, and she's she's she's she's very well known and and people picked up something like from her Instagram and it became this article and she's just like, why are people she's and she's not used to like she's unknown and she's known in like her world, but like not in like the gossipy world, and so she's never really experienced that and she's like,

why do people want to know the gossip? She's like, it's She's like and they picked up something from Instagram and I go, girl, I was like you. I was like, anything you write on Instagram like people can take and they're like, well, why do they want to know the details? And it was interesting because you know, that was the same day that like my one episode aired and then people were like upset that I didn't give details about the breakup. And I'm like, why do people want to

know certain details? It's like why, It's just and I started so we started to talk about, you know, gossip and why people want to to know that, like those certain pieces of it, you know, doesn't make any sense to me. Yeah, I know. I'm trying to think of my what I think about that I think and kind of what you're going through. I don't want to bring it up, but I'm saying, like, you know, me asking you know, questions around something that just tragically happened in

your life and wanting to know certain details. But it's like or to those details even why should they matter. I think when you know someone personally, I think you want to know details. I think that's just human nature. And I think what has happened with celebrities or people in the public eye. They're so accessible and people feel like they know them, so they feel they have a right to know all the details. But they don't know you personally, but it feels like they do, you know

what I mean. So I think, like, if it's me and you, you would have no question asking me personal details because we know each other very well. And I just think people feel like they know you through Instagram, through this, through the podcast, and they feel like they have a right to those details, whether they do or don't, which you may not. I mean, I may not have the right to those details either, you know. I mean it's like you get to keep those personal, those get

to stay close to you if you choose. Then why do some people say, well, you can't share. It's like, you know, because I did get some hate about not sharing certain details, and I'm like, what if I'm protecting someone? What if I'm protecting someone that doesn't doesn't want some of this knowledge out there and public stuff out there? You know, it's like you don't know what people are.

It's like, there could be someone that I I don't they're private and they don't want this information to be out, so I'm you know, or it could be whatever it's like, or it could just be something that it's like all the details. It's like, I don't know. It's just so me and my girlfriend we're talking about the last night. It's just like, that's that piece is hard, yeah, because you still want to be open and like honest and

stuff like that. But then when they think that they you know, the other side of that is hawd you open up and tell all the details. You're going to get hate for that too, oh for sure. But I'd also be hurting someone in the process exactly, So that's not worth it. So I think you just as hard as that is for those people saying that you have to know that you are doing what you feel is right and that that's okay, because you're gonna get hate

no matter how you how you play it. Yeah, and I hate that for your friend who also had that situation because they take everything off Instagram. Oh yeah, and I and I just but it really just kind of got me thinking about the wanting to know details that might really hurt people and to be reminded like oh why did It's like because it hurt and it broke and it sucked, you know, and like thank you for asking me. But but then also it's like when you put it out there, so it's like of course you're

gonna then be met with questions. So that's the thing too, where that's like, well, that's where the battle is, like it is. But also then I would ask those people, do you not want do you not want you to share? M That's what I would ask, Do you want me to not share anything? Would you prefer that? You know what I mean? Because it's like they want to know things, but then they want to. I mean, it's just this

this you know catch twenty two. So you could when everyone says this, just hold up and not tell anybody about any of your relationships about anything. But that doesn't that that won't make them happy. They just feel like they have a right to know all the details. Yeah. Interesting though, Yeah, I'm like such a long topic about that, but I was like, well, I was like I kind of fall into it, Like I'm like, when iach the I want to know what Tristan did Chloe and I

want to know the details? Yeah, No, I mean sometimes like but I do the same, Like I get upset about the same things that I want, and that's kind of hypocritical. It's I think it's just kind of human nature to want to know everything. I mean, I'm nosy, so I've always wanted to know everything. But I mean other people out there and knows you too. Yeah. I thought this was a really good assists from Kristen. She goes, um, I want to apologize. I follow you and started to

feel invest in your life, especially around your relationships. I listened to your new podcast today waiting to find out all the details and left feeling disappointed. But as I'm laying here thinking about it, I'm like, Wow, Janna is sharing her boundaries with her friends. Boundaries are so damn hard to establish for anyone, let alone a celebrity who has to defend their boundaries because their fans might feel

owned owed access into your life. So first, I'm sorry that I had that reaction, and second, thank you for sharing in enforcing your boundaries. You have so many fans who might need help establishing boundaries in their life, and you're modeling that for them on a side note, you're

killing it. And then she went on and I end up having a long DM conversation with Kristen because I was like, I just want you to say, like thank you for sharing that message and writing that to me and acknowledging that like you were frustrated, but that you also understood, and like we just had a really great back and forth banter about you know, just you know how hard it can be, but also you know, I'm I'm wanting to respect other people's privacy and you know,

and just moving on and that's okay, and um, but yeah, it was just it was a really good conversation and I love being able to have like dialogue like that as opposed to people and it is it's all about like certain boundaries. But it's like it's so hard to

have those boundaries. And I was also again going back to my girlfriend last night when we were talking, you know, I'm like, how do I have healthier boundaries the next time if I ever, if if and whenever I date again, Like I'm so scared to like stand by those boundaries and like what do I do? And like how it's just that new beginning that's like, I'm like, I don't even want Like, boundaries are so hard to live by because then you just have to be what are the

consequences of the boundary? Are you done? Is you random out? Does that help to kind of ride out your boundaries? Sure? But how many times did I say in my ex if you lie again, I'm out my boundary? Yeah, Like I'm gonna give anything like that. I don't know how And it's like I almost like I would love to get someone on the show. So if um producers are listening right now, somebody that can be really helpful with

defining boundaries and sticking to boundaries and how like. And I just would love to have a conversation around that because I think it's something that I know I struggle with and yeah, and so I would really really love to have someone on that can talk about that because it's interesting, it's can be bought boundaries around friendships and like, you know, all of it, and I just I would love to like get clearer and better with them and

actually stick by boundary for the first time. So if anyone was to you know, lie, get this or whatever, I could be like peace out instead of going well, because that's usually just one time. Yeah, he didn't mean it. She was so you didn't know how to tell me, you know, because he was afraid of my pad. The story right always. Um, but today we're going to go a little left field, left fields, out of field. Yeah,

side field. We've got Max Lugavier. Um, he's got a book called The Genius Kitchen out now, and I'm just really excited to talk to him about, um, everything that he does. He's a filmmaker's health and science journalist, author of the New York Times bestselling U bestseller g Foods Become smarter, happy, and more productive while protecting your brain for life. UM. So I'm pumped. Let's take a break and let's get them on. Hey, how are you? I'm good?

Are you good? I'm Janna. This is Catherine. Hey, how are you? Janna? Catherine. Nice to meet you guys too. I am so excited to have you on. This is a little left field for what left I'm going left field field. Usually we talk about like relationships and all that on the podcast. But I'm trying to get better with foods and just understanding things. And as I'm like going through the rundown today, I was like, do I tell Max that I gave my kids lucky charms for

for breakfast? I was like, should lean with that here? Like I grew up eating those, So it's fine. I mean I turned out I think fairly all right. So I still have all my limbs. Well that's good because I'm praying that my kids keep them too. Um. Okay, so let's tell us your background of how you got into this space of foods and healthy eating. Sure things. So I started, Um, I started college on a premed track. So I've always been interested in fitness and nutrition. I

was just a big nerd for it. Um. I wasn't an athlete. I was just really obsessed with the science of body composition of physical performance, something that I, for as long as I can remember, I had a passion for. But ultimately, halfway through college I realized that I was also creative. I was a storyteller, and I ended up making the pivot to a double major in film and psychology,

which sounds that's a massive pivot. It's a massive pivot. Yeah. Um. Well, the way that my brain works, it's sort of like a light switch. I'm either like obsessively interested in a topic, which I am for for health for example, um or I can't sit still in focus on it for even a second. And so what that led to in college was a g p A that just wasn't that great.

Like the classes that everybody in my college would take for the easy as, I would struggle to get a's, and because I just wasn't interested, I wouldn't even I wouldn't even go. But the biologies and the chemistry is I would get really good grades. And but ultimately I didn't think academically it was going to lead to me being all that competitive in that in that traditional sort

of med school path. Um, So I pivoted to film and psychology because I love cinema, I love music, I love art also, and I kind of kept one foot in the world of science. So I had a psychology double major, and that actually was a really fortuitous decision because it led to me getting an incredible job. When I graduated from college, I went to University of Miami in Florida. Is that where you're from. I'm from New York City, actually yeah. But um, I was never a

fan of cold weather. I always would find myself getting seasonal effect of disorder during the winter months. So fell the poll to the more southern states and landed in Miami, which is an amazing city and um and yees. So after college I ended up working for Al Gore. I was a journalist on a TV network that he had launched in the US called Current TV. Do you remember it? It was Yeah, it was like it was underwatched, but it was in a hundred million homes, so it was

like a legitimate TV network. Yeah. It launched in two thousand five and it ran until two thousand eleven or thereabouts. And so I was one of the main journalists, producers, hosts for the network. And I was in my early twenties, so I was like, you know, rolling out of bed wearing T shirts. But ultimately every day on TV talking about some pretty serious stuff. And my role there was very much as like a generalist, So I covered topics

you know that that really ran the gamut. But again, my passions that had always been health and nutrition science. And then in my personal life, I had left Current after my position there had sort of like what I was learning, the viewership, everything sort of had plateaued and I was out of work. And then simultaneously in my personal life, my mom, who is the person that I'm the closest with in the universe, started to show the earliest symptoms of what would ultimately be diagnosed as a

as a rare form of dementia. Yeah, so she was, you know, she had complained of brain fog and there was a change to her gates, which is the way, you know, her sort of walking pattern. And I was three thousand miles away in Los Angeles. She was in New York, and ultimately I decided I had to move home, and I started going with her to doctor's appointments, and in every instance I was met with what I've come

to call diagnose and audio. So it's just like a doctor would run some battery of of strange tests, often talking down on me and the patient right like, which is sort of unfortunate, but that's that's often the case, is like doctors, you know, there's like this sort of ego attached to that dential, which is not not always the case, but um can often be and UM. And ultimately it wasn't until it wasn't until a trip to

the Cleveland clinic. We literally we had to make an appointment at the Cleveland Clinic despite coming from New York city,

right where we have all these incredible cathedrals to work. Yeah, yeah, we had to go there because her case was so I guess, atypical, and it was there for the first time that she was prescribed drugs for both Parkinson's disease and Alzheimer's disease, and um, she had this she has she had a form of dementia called Louis body dementia, which is it's sort of like having both of those conditions. So it's not it's not it doesn't neatly fit into

either diagnosis. It's sort of a hybrid um. It affects one in five people. One of five people with dementia have Louis body dementia, and it's really difficult. The drugs

are minimally effective. And at that point, I mean it was there in Ohio that my like the world changed for me and I had a panic attack for the first time, and everything that I had been interested in previously sort of faded to the background, and I just became fixated on trying to understand everything I could about the ideology of these conditions, the role that my mom's diet and lifestyle would have, you know, could have potentially played in her in her developing this condition, and also

what could be done to prevent it from happening to myself? Because I realized even though doctors never address, you know, the family member that's in the room, like I realized for the first time, it was like a light bulb moment where I have a risk factor at this point. And so that began about ten years ago, and I've just been Yeah, it's just a constant question like why why my mom at such a young age developed this condition?

What what is the optimal path to take for optimizing brain health, cognitive health, mental health, because we live in a time where people are just sick, right, Like people are overweight by and large. Um, it's the first time in human history that they're more overweight people walking the earth and underweight. And my mom wasn't over eight. Um, so it's not this isn't a weight issue, but um. But generally the food supply, I've come to learn, is

toxic in many ways. And um, so my work really has been about identifying and describing how we might sort of live and eat differently for for better health, better better odds. How do we do that? How is your mom though? Like she she Okay, is she better? She no, I mean she she passed away three years ago. Yeah, no, it's okay. I mean she she had I mean it was mostly a good life that my mom had, but the last eight years of her life were mired in

this you know, this this chronic disease world. And and it was just like really sad because my mom was somebody who she was a high powered woman. She had a she was she was affluent. You know, she lived in New York City. She she was health conscious, but she and her generation were fed certain truths about what it meant to be healthy that I think are We're not all that rooted in in in the scientific literature, for example, And she didn't have access to the internet.

She wasn't I mean, she wasn't a very tech savvy person to begin with, but like, she was never on the internet. And so her you know what what she received about what it meant to eat healthily was was the messaging that she received from the food industry. So what do you think that messages? Then, like, what do

you think people where do you think people are being misled? Well, for the past few decades, it was, but it was we were we lived in a world where fat was demonized was very much demonized, right, fat made you fat, or fat clogged our arteries, and dietary cholesterol wasn't something that was healthy to eat, right, So I grew up in a in a household that was you know, we didn't use butter, we used margarine. I never saw my mom eating eggs, right because she was worried about the

cholesterol contained in egg yolks. An egg is literally one of nature's few multi vitamins. It's a cognitive multi vitamin. It contains a little bit of everything required to grow and and sustain a healthy brain. And this, you know, it's this kind of food that my mom avoided, like the plague, because she was worried about about heart health. What so, then what foods are great for the brain? Then? That you like, what, who do I need to be

have smarter down? What else? Well? Yeah, I mean the most the most protective dietary pattern for the brain is like a a sort of Mediterranean style diet. But like the vision that we and and like, and this is sort of promoted in the in the Western nutritional orthodoxy, like the picture of the Mediterranean diet that that is described in the medical literature is a lot different from the actual Mediterranean dietary pattern. The actual Mediterranean dietary dietary

pattern is a high fat diet. It's rich and extra virgin olive oil as the sole oil for the most part. I mean occasionally they'll use butter, but um. You know, in the Mediterrane, in the Mediterranean kitchen. Um, a traditional Mediterranean kitchen. You don't have any of these crappy grain and seed oils like canola oil, corn oil, soybean oil, oils that have to market themselves on TV. Right, Like chances are if there's an ad on TV for a food product, it's you're worth avoiding it. It's where it's

worth avoiding. Um. They use extra virgin olil is the primary fat. They're cooking with it. Even um they eat a blend. That's good extra vision. He's saying it's good. Oh it's good. Yeah, okay good. I was like, we're doing good. I mean yeah ideally yeah, yeah, no, it's great. I use it as a sauce. You know, you can use it to to dress vegetables with um, to to drizzle on on eggs, scrambled eggs, for example. Great great food option. It's actually extra virgin olive oil is medicine

for the brain. It's as anti inflammatory as a low dose ibprofen Like, yeah, we all it's a drug that we all have in our medicine cabinets. But chronic use of ibprofen um and other non steroidal anti inflammatory drugs is associated with cardiovascular events. Right There's they're not without side effects. But extra virgin olive oil you get the upside without any of the any of the downside, and so use it, use it liberally. It's awesome. Okay. I just wonder like if we were ever too good grocery

shopping together, you'd be like you can't. But like if are you the person that looks at all the labels like when you go shopping? Yeah, yeah, I do. I think it's important too, because we have a lot of compounds in modern foods that um that people tend to overeat and that aren't necessarily good for us, and the only way to really identify them is to look at look at labels. Take the added sugar phenomenon, right, So yeah, what do we look at? That's like I heard what

natural flavors? That's a lie. I'm not I'm not anti natural flavors, You're not. I'm not convinced that that there's something that we need to avoid. For me, it's about the low hanging fruit. And there's a lot of in the wellness world online. You have a lot of black and white thinking, you have a lot of fearmongering. There's a lot of misconceptions about you know, for example, is

organic more nutritious than conventional? Not necessarily? Um, you know, it's it's it's it's really like I think for most people, it's the low hanging fruit that are going to give them of the of the benefit right. And then if you're if you're, if you're doing all that right, then you can look to see where else you can optimize. But for me, it's about bringing in the foods that I call genius food. So my first book was about identifying the foods that are going to give your brain

the most bang for the buck. Extra virgin olive oil is one of them. Eggs is another one. I'm a huge fan of grass fed beef, grass fed grass finished beef. Um. I know it's a controversial, controversial one, but um, it's a pristine source of protein. Beef. I love to hear that no, I love to hear that. In the wellness world, there's this push towards plant based eating, right the the like the fake meats. It's cool with the human pet

food steak. I just give me a steak. I'm a Michigan girl and a potato like yes, yeah, yeah, you know. I mean, like, you know what, the only time every like a veggie burger. Everyone's aboud rather have a burger. Yeah, speaking of the burga, no burgers or burgers. I mean I tend to eat. I tend to eat like a wheat free gluten free um diets all skipped the bun. But grassfit uh, grass fed, grass finished ground beef is totally economical. You can now get it at cost go Walmart.

Butcher box. Yeah, I love vocher box. It's a health food. It's a highly bioavailable source of nutrients that we know people tend to under consume today, like vitamin B twelve,

which is crucially important for good mental health. UM. There was a study out of Deacon University in Australia that found that women who didn't eat the nationally recommended three to four servings of beef a week, or at twice the odds of developing a major mood disorder or of being of being diagnosed with a major mood disorder UM, and that association didn't hold up for any of the other proteins chicken, pork and anything like that was beef.

And we know that beef is like loaded with zinc creatine, which is important for brain energy metabolism. So how to create more energy? And iron too, right? Iron? Yeah, irons. Iron is a big issue. People uh under underappreciate the importance of iron. But um anemia affects one in four people globally and iron deficiency. I'm low and iron but

not technically anemic. But I do take like a slow like a release iron supple But and I eat a ton of beef, So I think it just is for some reason with me because I definitely give my amount of beef. I love beef. Yeah, it's great. I think that foods that taste good, with the exception of modern industrially created hyper palatable foods, like there is in innate intelligence in the body, And if it tastes good and it's a relatively natural food, like like single ingredient food,

then we should lean into that. You have genius kitchen out right now, right, So what's the then is it bringing what is what's the difference now with that? Is it bringing the genius foods into your kitchen and like how to make things? Or yeah? No, yeah, totally Genius

Kitchen is a is a cookbook. So it just came out and it basically makes the recommendations that I've made um ingenius foods and also it sort of highlights where my views have evolved um over the over the years, makes everything practical, um and and achievable because ultimately it's food. Food is where the rubber hits the road, right, And so it's a cookbook. I have over a hundred Are they your recipes? Yeah? So you're like, are you kind of like a chef then too? Like can you can

you say you're a chef? Yeah? I cook? Um, I wouldn't call myself a chef. I got called out a couple of years ago because I was doing a like an Instagram live and I and I've since learned, but the time, I didn't really know how to use a knife properly. Number one tell which separates people should learn how to use knives. It's really I mean, it's really easy. You just gotta keep your fingers like pointed down and I didn't know how to do it at the time, So you don't wanna you don't want to lose any

fingers in the cooking process. That's definitely did you lose a finger? No? No, he got called out for doing it incorrectly. Remember we remember we had a chef exactly. Remember like she like showed us like how um okay, well, like how how difficult are these recipes? Because like single mama here, she's got three kids, Like I'm not, I am like the worst cook ever I don't have It's just like so I feel bad for my kids because I'm like, so I grew up with my you know,

Midwest my mom. She cooked three meals. It was just the same thing. It was like chicken and rice. I didn't have fish until I moved to Los Angeles. Um I was when I was twenty And what is she made pancakes like spit getty and so now I'm like I didn't grow up with a mom that like cooked

these you know, well you know, nutritious foods. And now like single mom in it, I'm like, guys, you're gonna have Dino chicken nuggets or pizza like I don't like I'm fired, but it's like, is are there are things in there that like I can I can do and not be like overwhelmed by like the recipes and everything. Absolutely, yes, I definitely know of course. Well first of all, like a burger patty just look at it, Like a burger patty is one of the best foods. It's super easy

to make. Um. In fact, in the cookbook, I mean I have the recipes, but then I also have just simple instruction on how to make really basic things that I think that people should know how to make. Most people don't actually know how to make a burger patty, like properly. They'll mix spices and salt into the meat. Yeah, like put like a little salt and pepper in their

own egg. No no, no, no no, um you you basically you want to make the patty and they you want to just salt the top and the bottom just prior to putting it on the heat. If you mix salt into the meat, which a lot of people do, and spices and things like that, the salt actually natures the proteins and it causes it changes the texture and it it it will become more of like a sausage in terms of its texture, it binds the proteins together, which is not how you want a burger. That's not the

texture that a burger is supposed to have. Right, if you look, if you think about a sausage, it's like the meat molecules are essentially glued together, and that's because the sodium is added um into the into the sausage mix. But with a burger, you want it to you just want to coat the top and the bottom with salt prior to cooking it. That's it, and there shouldn't be

anything in the burger. You'll go sometimes you go to supermarkets and you find pre made like burger mixes and they have like raw vegetables in the middle of the burger. Those vegetables are not going to cook and caramelize in time, so that the but so that like in a way that syncd up with the burger being being properly prepared. Right, You're gonna overcook the meat and the vegetables on the inside of the meat are gonna be under looked. So it's just not a not a good not a good strategy. No,

I'm hungry burger patties. How to make a steak, like a really bomb steak. How to poach eggs. Most people don't know how to poach eggs, and it's one of my favorite ways to eat eggs. I've never had. I eat eggs almost every single morning, and I've never in my life how to poach egg wouldn't even I think it's like not once in my life, like I have, so I have two over medium eggs almost every morning once I drop the kids off, or like after I

work out or whatever. But I would never even know how to Like a poached egg is like what is it? I've seen it, but I don't know how to make it? Like do you boil it? It's so good? It's it's it's basically you take like a shallow um saucepan, you can use a saucepan. You fill it with water, and then you put about a tablespoon or two of white distilled vinegar in the water. And I'm sure you do

just vinegar, it's like basic. You put a little bit of that in the water and what and then what you do is you crack an egg into a into a shallow bowl and you gently like sift the egg into the water and the vinegar caused the egg white to coagulate basically on contact, so it holds it together. That's why you use the vinegar in the water. And it also adds like I think, a nice flavor, and you essentially boil it without a shell. So you're you're

boiling the egg mass in the water and um. And you want to make sure that the that the yolks stays like running and jammy. Last week, I can't do it, like that's like burns popcorn freaking microwave more faith in you than you have in you, and I just met you. I think you could do it. I think I think you practice. I don't think it's a great way to cook an egg because egg yolks, as I mentioned, there's a little bit of everything. You know that it's it's

a cognitive multivite, and that includes fats. They're very um damage prone. You've got d H a fat in an egg yolk. You've got um cholesterol which has the tendency to oxidize in an egg yolk. And so you want to make sure that if you're cooking eggs, that you leave the yolk a little bit more jammy or or runny. If if you like that um. But the other cool thing about poaching eggs that you don't require any oil to do it. So it's a really sort of healthy um way to get all the nutrients um in uh

in eggs, but without adding any additional fat calories. Interesting. I'm curious what your thoughts are. Well, actually, I have to ask you this first. What is the one thing that like you do go bad on or like that's your vice, like chips in guacamole or like or is it like Derrito's nacho cheese? Like with this, is there one thing that you just like you kind of rebel on and just don't tell anyone, Just tell us. I mean I've been lately. I've been. I've had a big

like sweet tooth for ice cream. Oh that's so bad. I mean no, it's like it's a very calorie dense food. No, I mean ice cream is great. I go. I was just in Austin. I just come back last night. Actually, and I love barbecue, so um, I'll go to town on like Austin barbecue, which like I don't know where the meat is coming from. I don't you know, the sauces are super sugary, um, so like yeah, I don't live like you're not like you don't yeah, no, no, I mean I'm not like, uh, I think. I think

my goal is to make recommendations practical for people. And you still have to like eating restaurants because that's one of the great things about living in the modern world. Right. You can't become like, I'm not into calorie counting, I'm not into macro counting because to me that that leads to it can lead to obsession, I think in some people. And it's like this, like we're applying this like modern artifact onto something that should be like innate in us,

like like you know, appetite and hunger. And I think the problem comes when we eat modern foods, like modern ultra processed foods, which short circuit our bodies hunger sensors and checkpoints and the like. So for me, I think it's it's really about prioritizing whole foods like minimally processed foods.

Um that to me is and and the research backs is that if you're able to do that, it doesn't really matter where the food comes from, organic or not organic, Like it's it's minimally processed whole foods that you get around the perimeter of the supermarket that really you are going to leave you in a much better place. Do you like the whole Do you like the whole thirty diet? Then no, I don't like that diet. Isn't that just

all whole foods out? Like? Yeah, it's very restrictive. I'm not And it's sort of like a cult mentality attached to that, which I'm not. I'm not super into. What about almond milk versus cow's milk? Okay, so this is such a fat to me. I just want to know. Yeah, Um, I use almond milk, unsweetened almond milk for for most things. I don't really I don't like in my fridge. I

don't have um typical cow's milk, but I do like dairy. Um, I just don't drink regular cow's milk because I think ancestrally, it's likely that um, we use dairy to create other sort of fermentation products like cheese, UM, like key for because dairy would just go bad so quickly, right and we didn't have we didn't always have refrigerators at our disposal, and dairy straight out of the cow you get a huge hit of lactose, which is problematic for a lot

of people. It can lead to like bloating and and g I distress. Um. So for me, I don't really do cow's milk, but I do do dairy in the form of heavy cream. For example, I love heavy cream in my coffee, which has a number of benefits. It's got heavy actually dairy fat. It's interesting because there's been we started out talking about how how fat has been this demonized macronutrient over the past couple of deck aids.

But if you actually look observationally, people who eat um more full fat dairy have better cardiovascular health, they have better metabolic health. So full fat dairy there's something sort of interesting about it. And when you actually break it apart and and and investigate what dairy is comprised of, there's a compound in dairy called milk fat globule membrane, which really can be beneficial from a cardiovascular standpoint. It's got a lot of compounds in it that are really

good for brain health. So I do like heavy cream, like heavy whipping cream essentially in my coffee every morning. It's so decadent and great. Um. I'll do key for occasionally, which is a good source of of of probiotics, um and postbiotics. So like metabolites that are created by bacteria, which which we think are are really beneficial. UM, heart cheese and things like that can be great sources of unique micro nutrients. So yeah, I'm I'm overall fan of dairy.

What about have you were done like the pin or test? No? What is that? So it's foods that inflame your body, so they prick yourself, get some blood and then they it's my trainer told me to do it, um, and it's um. It'll give you a list of all these foods that your body reacts bad too, So like mine was like tomatoes and onions, and so it's like any time that I'm so I was supposed to eliminate this from my diet, but it's like it was, I'm like,

is that really healthy? Didn't? I'm like I should? You know, I don't think you should eliminate anything. It's just moderation. It's kind of like how I've always like lived my life. No, I think that that those tests can be problematic. What they can sometimes expose is um intestinal permeability, Like it's called leaky gut. That's sort of the late way to

think about it. But um, but a lot of the compounds and tomatoes for example, aren't actually meant to enter circulation, and they don't enter circulation if you have a healthy gut. So exposing like a white blood cell in a Petrie dish to a compounding food that doesn't actually reflect what's going on in the body. So I don't I don't

necessarily trust those tests UH food sensitivity tests. Again, they you know, like you might have a sensitivity to UH for example, like an egg protein UM that's not fully getting broken down and is and is entering circulation in a only a partially digested state. But I don't think

that's indicative necessarily that you can't eat eggs ever. Again, I think it's maybe you you have some leaky gut going on, and like an elimination diet might temporarily or might help um by sort of helping to seal things up UM where that's concerned. But yeah, I'm not you know, I don't think that people are as sensitive to these individual foods as they think they are. That does sell a lot of tests, Yeah, they do. Is red wine on the Genius Foods list? Oh man, am I gonna

make friends or did I choose violence? So why I think wine in moderation can be okay, describe moderation. How many glasses a week? That's a it's one one serving a day for women, want to two for men. That doesn't mean that you can have seven servings in one day. So that doesn't no no binge drinking. But um, I think wine. So ethanol in wine is a neurotoxin. It's a carcinogen. That's like the bad that's the bad news. We want to get that out of the way first,

that it's really not it's not beneficial. Um, you know, people who are at risk for breast cancer, Like you want to do your best to minimize alcohol consumption, right, but there are some benefits associated with alcohol consumption. It's a social lubricant, it's a d stressor. So if if it plays that role for you and you're able to moderate, yeah, then it's fun or just to relax at the end

of the day. Do you drink? I do drink occasionally occasionally, not yeah, like to like maybe three or four drinks a month or something like. Moderation is not I like it. I like a good I like a good red one. You don't have to be like me, though. You know, if if you enjoy it and that like that's your the your quote unquote vice, then by all means, go

for it. I just you just want to be able to You just want to drink, do it as healthily as possible, so make sure that you're staying hydrated, including some electrolytes. Perhaps my general rule of thumb for when I do drink is to go to bed sober as you know, to try as hard, to try as best as I can to to enjoy the drink or drinks, but to make sure that by the time I go to sleep, I'm I'm relatively sober, so that the alcohol doesn't negatively interfere with my sleep, which we know that

it can do. I'm pretty pretty profoundly alcohol. It does help you get to sleep faster, but it negatively affects sleep quality, and both sleep duration and sleep quality are important. Yeah, all right, I had two more questions, and now I totally for just forgot one. But so Catherine goes on and off of this diet, and I was, but I just it's bothers that it bothers me. You have to do it works for you, and I'm not trying to like.

But I just think for me, like, I don't know if those diets really like Oh no, it's he would not like it for sure. It's just to lose weight. It's not like whole foods. So no, he wouldn't like it. That's fine. This is like a crash kind of I mean that's why I got off of it because I struggled off with Yeah, I've been off of it since

because that's my struggle. It's like, I want to lose weight, and you can lose weight quickly with it, but then you look at it and it's like, this isn't going to do me any good in the long run and the things that are in it are not going to be good for me in the long run. So I have to learn how to lose weight this way. So to jump start someone that wants to lose weight, is it just kind of again just looking at what you're eating and then aminating like is it one by one?

Is it just like what's the what do you think for that? Like to have? Um? I mean, I know you're not like you're more about like the foods and stuff. But I think when it comes down to it, it's it's my trainer always says, she's like you, She's like, you could do a million abs all day, but what you put in your body that's going to make you lean.

And Yeah, I mean I I have uh sympathy for people who regularly crash diet because I mean, I think, for one, there's this again, it's this sort of black and white thinking in the wellness world that if you're not doing everything perfectly all the time, then you might as well not even attempt right, And then there's all these different diet tribes arguing constantly the diet wars, right, like, my diet is best at the end of the day, the diet that's going to be the best for you

is the one that you can stick to, that's gonna that's gonna allow for a little bit of leeway so that you don't have to restrict yourself too much. Now you do have to there there does have to be some kind of uh, you know, restriction, whether we're talking about calories or whether whether we're talking about um, uh you know, certain food types. Um it's not really the food types. It's it's more about calories, right, Like if you want to lose weight, it's energy balance it's calories

and versus calories out. But you can you can achieve that with and with infinite different sort of permutations of dietary choices. At the end of the day, you just have to find the one that's going to be the most sustainable for you and that's not going to compromise

your relationship with food, because that's really important, right, um. Yeah, And honestly, like I can't talk at like I eat the same thing every day, Like it's not great the things like my bars that I eat probably aren't the greatest bars in the world to eat, you know, but I would like to actually, but it's just my excuse is I don't have time. I gotta get the kids of school or like, so I'm just gonna grab this

go macrobar or a group. You know. It's like because that's just and then at the end of the day, I'm like, oh, I've had two bars and you know, not meeting dinner, Like that's not enough food. Like it's not like right, So it's it's kind of retraining and like not making these not excuses, just being like all right,

it's just so hard to get on like a plan. Yeah, Well, the way that I like to think about it is you have to you have to achieve a calorie deficit, right if your goal is weight loss, and weight loss is not the goal for everybody, but if if it is your goal, um, you have to achieve a calorie deficit. Now, Um, if you think about a mile in terms of like distance, right, a mile is a mile whichever way you slice it.

But walking a mile downhill versus walking a mile uphill, they're too totally different experiences, right, So you want to figure out the diet that's going to get you to a mile right to your weight loss goal, but you want that trek to be predominantly downhill. You want to minimize the area under the curve for pain and stress.

And so my view is the way to do that is to focus predominantly on minimally processed foods, because research shows that when people do that, they end up coming in effortlessly at a calorie deficit of about it's the ultra processed foods, it's the it's the hyper palatable, shelf stable foods that you find in the aisles of the supermarket that actually drive you to over consume them to

the tune of about five additional calories. So that's right, there as an eight hundred calorie swing determined largely by the quality of the food that you're eating. Most people when they want to initiate a weight loss diet, they think about quantity, right, They gotta eat less, move more. And that's been the advice that we've gotten from the Western nutritional and medical establishment for decades at this point,

less move more. And it's also i'll add, echoed by the junk food industry, because the junk food industry doesn't like to acknowledge that there are foods that are implicitly fattening, right, foods that are that are implicitly prone to over consumption.

But the reality is that quality dictates quantity. And so for me, what I think is is um going to be the most helpful is to really look at the quality of the foods that you're eating and start there, like, don't even think about weight loss for the first two three weeks of your plans. Start to start to look at the foods that you're eating the quality, create healthier habits for yourself, um, because then you know, I think

that that the rest will sort itself out right. And if you do have to start tracking calories and doing that then you know that's another that's another way to go. But you want to be able to leave room for the foods that bring you joy, bring you pleasure, because that that whole like restrict binge cycle, that's no bueno. That's what leads to the ping pong. We had girls night Thursday, and there's going to be a lot of cheese dip consumed. Okay, so I need you like that.

We we cannot. I'm not starting it ourselves of anything. I mean, I do know that that would help me so much, just looking at the foods that I eat, three kids running around, the junk food that I just grab off the shell for the kids, whatever, that mac and you know, I know it's that. I know if I can just get better at what foods I eat, I will in turn lose weight. I just have to. I'm super picky and I just have to get there.

I mean, if you're thinking about foods on the go, I mean, just like take a granola bar for example, or one of these like kind bars. They're just loaded with added sugar right like the minute you're like, you're not even done with one until you by the time you start craving having a second one. Right, if you can swap that out for even I mean cheese, there's nothing I mean cheese has. Uh, it's a great source of protein. Protein we know is the most satiating of

the macronutrients. So prioritized protein. I think that's a really great tool for somebody. You You you can't overeat protein because it's so it's so self limiting because of the satiety inducing effect that it has. Right, So I would swap out the granola bar bar for two cheese sticks. Um, you're gonna get high pristine quality protein. Uh, ton of macron of micronutrients that are beneficial, calcium and what have you. Um, and they're gonna be less prone to over consumption the

factors that make a food satiating. Another way to look at this is we want to maximize satiety with the fewest amount of calories. So what are gonna be the foods that are gonna be the most satiating that's gonna make us feel the most full? Right, Protein buying buying far is the number one UM tool. So prioritize protein at every meal. It's the steak, it's the cheese, it's the eggs, the fish, chicken, what have you like. Make

that the centerpiece of every meal. Again, it's it's very difficult to over consume, so don't worry about over consuming it. Just eat it, fill, fill up on it. Um. The second factor that makes the food satiating I eat filling is um fiber fiber content. Fiber Mechanically, it stretches out

the stomach. The one caveat that I'll that I'll add is that dramatically increasing your fiber content UM can if you're not if you're not ready for it, if you haven't cultivated the gut flora to be able to contend with that sudden increase of fiber. Yeah, you're going to the bathroom, you're getting bloated, you're getting gas, and nobody likes that. Nobody likes that, so do it slowly. And then the third thing that makes a food satiating is

water content. Oftentimes, if we're thirsty, we the singles get crossed and we think that we're hungry. It's I think worth um recognizing that for a hunter gatherer, you know, water, water is one of these things. You can't go three to four days without water, You'll die, right, Food you can go without for you know, a couple of weeks, um many of us, right, and you'll be fine. But water is something that we we desperately need when it

ceases to be around. And for a hunter gatherer, when water seems to be available, the next the second best place to find water would be from food. So food that is that is that has water in it is satiating. Well, like fruits and vegetables are loaded with water, but even animal products like steak, is about water. What's not hydrating our shelf stable package process foods. And that's because water attracts mold, and so shelf stable package process foods are

deliberately dehydrated. They're deliberately yeah, devoid of fiber, and they tend to be diluted of their protein content because protein is expensive and we know that junk food manufacturers love big margins, so they tend to be protein depleted, fiber depleted, and dehydrated, that's why. And and they're hyper palatable, so theyre they you know, they're sweetened. They have these like insanely delectable mouth fields. But those are the reasons why it's not a moral failure. If you can't if you

can't moderate your consumption of these kinds of foods. They're literally designed to be over consumed. When you fill yourself up on a package processed food, you've already over consumed them. When you fill yourself up on chicken, fish beef salad, you're you you've you've yet to over consume them. That's what the research shows. You're you're still, despite being really full from them, likely in a calorie deficit. If those are the put a bunch of ranch dressing on the salad, right, well,

then how do you expect me to eat a salad? Well? You know what, No, actually, there are there are some good things about ranch. Yeah, there's some good I have no affiliation with Primal Kitchen, but they make a great love Primal Kitchen. Yeah, that's good. That's like they're they're the whole dirty dressing stuff. That's what I use, like the barbecue sauce primarily. Yeah, totally, that's really good. Is there a food? Um? The last question? Then we'll let

you go. But the can help with anxiety? Oh man? Um, I would say that two kid or your diet to anxiety, to reducing anxiety, it's it's more a process of elimination. So getting off the blood sugar roller coaster. UM. Minimizing your consumption of added sugar products products with added sugar, keep eliminating the sugar sweetened beverages, fruit juices, sodas, things like that, UM, Because what happens is it's not the sugar surge that can cause anxiety. It's when it's when

you're sugar dips. It's sort of like the rug being pulled out from beneath your feet. So making sure that you're minimizing what's called glycemic variability UM. And all the recommendations that I've made so far are going to help with that as well. So it's not like there's one diet for weight that's better for that's like, you know, not as good for the brain. It's all sort of aligned. I would also say caffeine is a big, big issue. Yeah,

I've stopped. I haven't had caffeine in like twenty years minus. And I was pregnant with my son and I had the only thing that didn't make me puke was a It was a slurpy from seven eleven. So I had coke for about nine months and that was but I still like after that, I haven't had any So yeah, Um, okay, well I'm getting Genius Foods Genius Kitchen, and so should everyone else that's listening because it sounds like mom and make some good recipes from the start Friday, Same seris.

But Max, thank you so much for coming on. Where can our listeners find you? You're the best? This was super fun. Great to meet you guys. Um So, I hosted my own podcast. It's called The Genius Life. So if you like podcasts, come out, come over and check that out. And what can listeners expect over there? Just everything about being genius and so smart. Yeah. So it's a it's a lot of like nutrition, women's health, hormone health, um reaper, active health, fitness, I mean environmental toxins, like

how to avoid endocrine disrupting compounds. That's a topic that I love talking about. Um it really runs a gamut. But it's like it's not it's not as nerdy as you would think, Like we have fun with it. There's like you know, it's like mental health. Um yeah, like we we try to like it's not the Spinach Show. In case people are wondering, it's like it's very much like an entered an entertainment kind of Vibe over there,

and I hosted. Sometimes I do solo episodes. Um oftentimes we have guests that that that really run the gamut, So I do that and then I'm pretty active on Instagram um at Max Luco here. So well, thank you, Max, appreciate you, Thanks for coming on wind Down. Thanks thanks. Okay, Well that was very um knowledgeable. Yeah, I think it like kind of makes me feel better, like the extra virgin olive oil and like the almond milk I was curious about, like it's it's possible. It's just and I

think it's one of those things too. It's like whatever works for you, like if the diet has to be what you do. I think in just the long run is don't hold yourself hostage to foods because that like for me, like when I hold myself back from like

eating something, I get depressed. So it's like and that kind of trigger like so it's like I don't want to ever hold myself like and I know, like, but I also I work out hard and so it's like, but I understand everyone's body types are different, and I have empathy for people that they have health issues or s thyroid stuff or and it's just but I would just say, don't deprive yourself and just be happy however you are, and just again consuming good foods. I think

it's something that I have to work on. I mean, like I was chowing down with again, like I shouldn't really probably be feeding my kid's lucky charms, Like I should be a little more mindful of what's in the oreos and like the you know fredos, I was letting them have, like I should know better, like with things that I've seen, the people that I followed by the same time, like I'm just stay in the bus second.

Every time you say lucky charms, it just takes me back to the first time we got Like I got lucky charms at the beat and you were so mad that I got lucky charms for the kids. I was so happy. I was so mad because it was like I was the first time mom and I was like, I will not let me eat kids. I will not let my kids eat processed foods. And I was like, and I'm like kids. Third, I was like, they had three homes this morning, Like I got that large family.

I have two bins. Like just makes me so happy, not that they're eating you know what, I mean, but I'm like, you know, it's just so much balance. Next week, I'll give them the organic ones from from then uncle back. You know they're not gonna want those after they only right now. I'm like, just, I just they just need to get food. Yeah, I'm with you on that. Again. People are gonna be like, well, you need to get

them out. I'm trying. My kid loves avocados. They don't just eat cereal for are people that just think that? But yeah, um but anyways, I love you guys. That was fun. I could like bye,