Cryfest

year in December for UM one of the Lifetime movies. UM. And it was such a fun experience, and I think coming back from that world has been a harder transition than I thought it was going to be. Like I knew amazing. Hillary just popped down, So this is awesome. UM. I texted my UH producer and was like, I need a therapist and I need a stat like stat So thank you Hillary for for for coming on and joining.

I was just kind of saying like, obviously I talked to you when I was in Connecticut, and I knew like it was gonna be weird kind of coming home, but it today it just hit me like a ton of bricks and was like and I don't know if it was because I was in a world where it was just this bubble of like positive energy and um, you know, positive people around me, and I was working

and I didn't. I wasn't in that reality. Even when you know, um, the divorce was finalized, I still had to I I cried about it, but then I had to go, Okay, I have to walk into work now. So now I have to button up really fast and go to work and then coming home and obviously I'm so happy to be back with the kids. But it's just like, oh crap, like this is my reality, not the reality of like being in this amazing movie with really positive energy. So how do I walk through that?

Because I feel like I'm like, I mean, I just had a total cry fast about thirty minutes ago. Just like it's just it's weird. I don't I don't even know how to like put it. Does it even make

sense what I'm saying? Yeah, I mean to me, you're talking about this like very painful but very authentic kind of coexistence of these two truths I mean, which is that you're in the middle of this terrible deep grief and mourning, which is going to keep evolving, and evolution doesn't just mean it gets better and more positive and easier.

It also means that you have dark knights of the soul where it feels unbearable, and there's certain moments or seasons or events or circumstances that will kind of bring that to bear. And I just want to offer that, like, even though obviously the movie set can't be your literal reality and it has some you know, low the aspects to it that aren't like, um, you know, scalable on

a day to day basis, both are true. You know that you have this lovely, amazing professional life and these wonderful, supportive group of friends, um that lift you up, and in their presence you fly, you know, and you you get a glimpse of yourself like sort of in this other new way. And that's as true as the grief that you experienced when you came home, I'm sure and felt the emptiness of the house in a profound way and the change in your lifestyle in a really deep way.

And and so I don't know if if we're in a position where we can just make the grief get better, but at least to widen the perspective around that just like both are true deep grief, deep grief and like deep precious growth. You know that just both are true. Yeah, and I love that and I hear that, and I also we're fat being said, how do I like, I'm like, will I get to a place where this doesn't affect me as much? Because it's like I would love to

get out of the space. I was reading some comments and people were like, I'm so sick of hearing about and I'm like, well, I'm sick of feeling it, you know, like uh so, And that's where you know, I got upset earlier today because I'm just like I don't even know what to talk about anymore, because I'm like, I obviously want to be authentic and I want to be open and I want to share, but I can only share certain things because I don't want my kids to

read certain things. I don't want the press to pick up you know, how I really feel about my ex or like, you know, it's like there's so many things that I don't you know, I'm trying to keep everything kosher, but I'm inside I'm like battling all these things that have been really hard to battle that it feels like I think it's tough because I have have been so open and honest about everything, and even when my ex and I were talking about infidelity, I didn't feel alone.

But now I feel probably the most alone I've ever felt because I'm actually not being able to authentically share everything that's like on my heart. And I think that's like it's been the hardest thing because it's like it's like two different um spaces where I'm like, I want to be so authentic, but then like I can only be so authentic without hurting people or having that energy out there or causing more chaos with my ax or

you know. So it's like I don't know like who to be or how to be, or what to say or like. And it's such a weird reality when the last five years of my life I've been so open and so honest in those trials and things that most people would never talk about. So now I'm supposed to like not say anything, and and I don't know like how to like walk that path. Help me well that pain and grief that comes from what you're having to embody in this sort of let me let me stay back.

I think every marriage that ends in a divorce has what I like to call like an after marriage and after marriage, right, which is the new season of what your relationship is and what all the feelings are around this new quote relationship that has its own season, and in my experience as a clinician, that season last for a year or two, depending on the circumstances, depending on if kids are involved, and so to kind of start

where you started. The idea that you would be in a different place than you are now that is being proffered by I don't know, fans or people who follow you, etcetera, is not the norm. I would not only would I not expect to see it. If I did see it, I would be concerned that there was suppression of the grief, that there was suppression of the trauma. There's an entirely new relationship you have to build with your after marriage

that is just to its infancy stages. And I know that's not like amazing, great news, but I think it's just a truth and the answer to the question will you feel better? Will you not always feel like this? Absolutely? Of course and no no doubt, like that's an unequivocal yes. From my standpoint and my experience, it's just not not now. This is pretty brand new, even though I know it feels like you've been doing a bunch of heavy lifting

for a lot of days now. In kind of terms of marriage with children that's ended, and um, your public profile and all the hurt that we see and don't see. It's it's pretty early on. And I think in terms of the actual question like how do I manage that?

How do I manage that? There's I'm sure in evolving acceptance of the truth and what you're dealing with, Like you're having to embody this pretty heroic role right where you're holding the line, you're holding that boundary I suppose on behalf of your kids for the most part, right, And I guess that that is in these like dark at moments, I think the thing that you have to most lean into is like this boundary is for them

and them only. That's it, and um, that's it and that's everything right and and that's like I always call it, like heroes work. You know, this is heroes work. That that is the motivation, that is the inspiration, And it couldn't be harder because of course, in a lot of ways it would be better if you could just feel more integrated. You know that you weren't having to separate out your feelings in different contexts of your life, and and so I think that's part of why you're suffering

so much. It's really really difficult, and having to accept at least that current truth is really really hard. You feel a bit split and right and not totally authentic and not totally supported and seen in all the ways that you deserve to be supported and seeing. Because of all this, Yeah, like I would love to be able to express and share certain things just like I did with the past stuff, so that way I don't feels

alone in certain situations. But yeah, I mean, I I think I'm just I don't know who Like I guess I had this, UM. I called a friend, yeah, about thirty minutes ago and was just like started crying. I was like, I don't even know, like who I am? Like who am I? Like? What's my story? Like? What am I? Like? You know what? Why do I? Like?

I just I just feel lost. And I think it is because I had shared so much previously that now I just and yes, I've shared, but like there's still so many things that like I've would love to um, you know, Um, let out, and I guess it's and I've just never done it like privately, like you know, I've always just been sharing, like sharing, and like, okay, this is like what I'm going through. But now that, yeah,

I have you know, kids to protect. And then also, I mean I think it's I think there's something too to be said where I just don't want any more conflict with my ax. So I'm like, well, if I shut up, then you know he won't be mad at me, even though he has no reason to be mad at me,

right you know. So I mean, sure, I've of course played my parts in the marriage, like I've said before, but with the ending of it, it's like and he even knows, like he even said, he's like, you could run me over with the bus if you wanted to, um, but I don't. I don't want I just like I don't want that that anymore. But I also want to share my experiences and and share all that. But then it's like, but I don't want the flak from from that,

and I want that to go away. But then I'm like, okay, then, and then what am I sharing? Like? Who am I? Like? Is it just I don't know, it's just confusing. I get that there's a there's an identity loss here, right, I mean both kind of personally and publicly. I really I'm really taking that in and that that is I'm sure totally disorienting, which prompted that call like, well, who

am I if I'm not this? And he boxed in and not kind of free and spontaneous like and theoretically you hope to in the aftermath of of this kind of shift, you know that you start to feel like more rather than like expansive rather than narrow, right, And I guess you're feeling narrowed right now, which is a

very difficult, painful place to be. I would I would offer that I imagine this will be evolving, meaning that there might be another time in space where your story is able to be delivered in a way that isn't so current and isn't so conflictual and um, where your kids are a bit older and can hold all the sides. Um, so this might not be like the ending to the story,

you know, and um. The word that keeps coming to mind is you're talking about it is grace, you know, grace and being able to ground yourself in the grace of what you're doing. You know, what I'd love to talk about is gaslighting because I feel like the term is is used a lot, and I've h I didn't honestly know what it was. So can you just kind of give a broad spectrum of what gas lighting is and and um in all of its traits and where

it comes from. Yeah. So the idea of gaslighting, which is actually a super old concept, is the idea of sort of using kind of emotional manipulation to make the receiver of that energy or that dynamic kind of question their own reality or emotional experience. And yeah, I feel like in those types of relationships to the person that's gaslighting doesn't know, doesn't won't like say that they're gaslighting, like,

they'll continue to still make you feel crazy. And I think that's like the part where I've I've been stuck for you in my past relationships. Yeah, that's the key element of gas lighting. That that that's that that's the core of it. The pain of it is that the person doing the gas lighting is committed to denying that the dynamic is occurring. And that is because there's sort of a protection of their own wound, their own vulnerability,

their own responsibility, their own accountability. So it's sort of like a almost like a like there's a frenetic energy around denying your reality in the service of protecting their's, which is, I did nothing wrong, I have nothing to be accountable for, I have nothing to look at, I have nothing to deal with. I'm not responsible here. So when you know that that person is doing it, how

can you not let that gaslighting person affect you? Because I think that's where I struggle with have had struggled with the most in the past, is like they make you question your craziness so good that you're like, maybe I am crazy, but then really comes to find out that you're not, and it's you know, here's the proof of A through Z. But even when you're out of that situation, how do you not let that still creep in? Two?

Not um letting them affect you in that way? Yeah, well you kind of started where I was going to start, which is that how one doesn't let intense pathological gaslighting impact them is uh is sort of an unanswerable question, meaning the only way to not have an impact you is to leave. If it's toxic and pathological, right, there's no matter how psychologically savvy and sturdy, you are one cannot be um not impacted by having that kind of

toxicity sort of put upon them. So my general advice is if you find yourself in that kind of situation, to find support help in exiting the situation. But where you're talking about is the aftermath, because there's collateral damage that happens. Right you start questioning yourself and feeling um a sense of disorientation that what your experience tells you might not be correct, and can feel a lack of

groundedness and connectedness. So I think it's it's it's critical to regard that as as a trauma of sorts, and to do some trauma work to deal with the grief, to deal with the depression, to deal with the anxiety in a very slow and deliberate way, and ideally in a professional setting. And then as you start to re emerge in kind of the aftermath of that trauma, to be surrounding yourself with people who are available for a

sort of vulnerable, supportive, messy discussions and reflections. So I think it's about the inside work and then about what your life looks like and feels like as you kind of re emerge from that trauma. Yeah, for sure. I was going to say too that I think when you find yourself going down that path, you know to be very deliberate about that moment of sort of questioning yourself or doubting yourself, to really be like very deliberate about how you talk to yourself in that moment to kind

of have enough mindfulness that you step outside yourself. It might sound um um overly simplified, but even picturing like a red stop sign stop, you know that you're literally interrupting the dynamic, the like neural pathway that goes from like, oh this happened to like I'm wrong, I'm bad, because

that's what we do. We developed like an automatic, uh sort of a path to like something bad happens, and you're all the way to like I'm bad, I'm wrong, I'm not valuable, and being able to interrupt that and stop it and talk yourself through it, like wait a minute, what's happening here? What is my intuition telling me, what part of that feels right? What part of that is resonating with me? And to be able to kind of reparent yourself back to trusting your own voice and to

kind of tolerate moments. Maybe you don't get it right, maybe do get it right. Sometimes that's what um um. Relying on our own intuition looks like. Right, we never get right all the time. But being able to build like a new relationship with ourselves around listening to ourselves, because gas lighting takes us outside of ourselves, we have to go back in. It's that's like it's just so hard to do though, I mean because it's like, you know, even when people like, oh, you're strong, I'm like, no,

I'm not. I'm weak and I'm miss and then it's like the negative voices that we feed into ourselves. And then even like you know, the other night, when I had just gotten home from Connecticut and I was home alone, I was like, oh I miss you know, I miss my my family. And then I'm like, okay, what do I What do I miss? Am I missing? Am I actually missing Mike? Or am I missing? And it's like that when you start to really break it down and you're like okay, and then you can get back into,

you know, um, a healthier mind frame around it. But it is very hard when you start telling yourself certain things that when you really separate it out and you're in your right and it's like, okay, no, this is what I miss. I just missed that, you know, I hate that this happened. Then I miss my kids upstairs. But like, if I was to do this again, I wouldn't go through it again, you know, I wouldn't. And

it's good to sit that down. But in those moments, it's very hard because am like I miss him, and I'm like, wait a minute, let's take it. Take a beat. What do you miss And then you're like, okay, yeah, it couldn't be harder, and you won't do it every time, right, Sometimes our emotions just take over and they get the best of us. You're right, it's emotional heavy lifting in

the middle of brief It couldn't be harder. So it's good that you're saying that out loud, both to like validate it for yourself for your listeners that like that is the most difficult thing to do, is like to stand up against those voices. But I had a thought that you know, when you have those moments where you're thinking people say to you you're so strong, and your head you're thinking like, I'm that's not true, I'm weak. You know all that and that sort of conflict about

how people see you, how you really feel inside. I think it's so important. I was talking at the beginning about like feelings coexisting and how important is to lean into that truth if you can feel like strong and weak at the same time, like both can be so true. And to be careful not to exile those parts of you. They're like super useful that are have a lot of

important information to tell us. Like the part of you that's quote weak, which I'm putting in quotes, is really important to heap close to us, not to exile it and kind of call it bad and try to make it not a part of us, but to bring it close. Like what are you trying to tell me? Like kind of what you just we're talking about? What's the weak

quote week voice trying to tell me? Oh, I'm sad I'm missing this part of this dream, this narrative I had about what my life is supposed to be is is different now has fallen apart, and how that makes me feel so like not so quickly exiling those sort of quote bad parts of yourself. They're good, They're like super important for us to get closer to, not get

far away. So maybe that helps in this like darker part of where you are right now, to like invite those pieces in so you can learn more from them rather than feel like, oh, they're so bad, I just want them to go away. Yeah. No, I love that. I do appreciate that a lot. And thanks for happening on. I know you. I know you have a very busy day, so I appreciate the time that you do give us here at one down. We we appreciate you very much. So good to see you YouTube Maney. I'll talk to

you soon on my next breakdown. UM. You know what's interesting about that is I actually have, UM, I've got this. I've got so many notes on my phone. One of the things that I said, you know, I I write, UM instead of saying negative things to my ex. I've got a I literally a full notepad of just everything I want to say when I'm having a bad day. UM, and I just I Sometimes we will even put an

email form but I click, you know delete. Just getting it out sometimes very helpful because there's a lot of emotions that come with um, you know, being in this this season. UM. And then yeah, when I do miss you know, because there's times when of course I miss my ex and to be able to sit down and go, okay, yes there was good moments here, but I go back here, here's what I don't miss, and then it's like, okay, yeah,

I don't. I don't want to go back to that, Like this is this is a healthier, but it's still it's still hard. And so if you're struggling with that, like it's it's okay to still have those feelings. I do too, It's normal, I think. But UM, but with the negative things I have realized, you know, just write them down because they feel really good to get out. Just don't send them because it's not going to get

you anywhere. UM. Let's take a break and then I'm going to go through a few of the things that you guys wanted me to talk about, UM from my instagram the other day. So we were talking about different kind of co hosts to have on the show, UM and different guests that we can have on and Uh, one of the topics that you brought up, which I think is really interesting, is about UM, good guys, my favorite topic, your favorite topic, but do they really finish last?

You know? UM? And I thought that was a interesting um topic that we can talk about. But also if you guys want, if you have any guest co host ideas or other topics that you want us to talk about. What's the email again? Because I never remember wind down I Heart radio dot com wind down at heart radio dot com. But we started. We talked about nice nice guys. Because have you watched this show f Boy Island on HBO Max? I have not watched anything, like I haven't

watched sex life. I'm like, I'm so far behind, so I need to like start. First of all, sex life is amazing. Sex life is literally amazing, not just because of the like sex is it like Britain? Yeah, it's it's pretty, it's pretty aggressively softcore, like it's not further than that. But that wasn't what I loved. What I loved about it was like the topics that it made me think about, is there someone for everyone? Is the good guy? The one that you actually want? And it

really goes into that, just like f Boy Island. Yeah, that would be interesting. Yeah, do you think you would like a good guy? Like an all around good guy? I mean, I think that's like what we all want and deserve. You know, and I think that's Um. I mean, I definitely think that that's what we deserve. I I have had not I've had a very bad picker. Um. And do you think you're more attracted? Like could you be attracted to the good guy or do you lose

attraction quickly? Okay? So I mean, how do I like? I think it's one of those things where you or I. I have had good guys in my past that I could easily walk all over and that's not good because they got hurt in the end. I hurt them. I didn't feel good about myself. But I can't have the guys that are just like, yes, whatever you want. Janna. Like that to me is like I need some like push and pull. I need the good guy, but that also has a backbone, and that's what I'm looking for.

I think we have to teach ourselves. And I'm not an expert, but you sort of have to teach yourself to like the good guy because for whatever reason, you're chemistry, your makeup is attracted to to not that the good guy might seem boring to you. Yeah, no for sure. And it's like the fights, might you know. I'm I'm used to explosive and finding the awful things. But I don't want that anymore. But at the same time, like that's been the drama in my life for the past

you know, ten plus a year. So it's like, I would love to just be comfortable with someone that respects me. And you know, and I have talked about this, because there is a chemical release that happens really when you fight, because you and I've talked about it, but sometimes you almost want to go back to the bad guy just to make yourself feel better for a minute, which does work, but it only works for a minute. It doesn't feel

good in the end. I would rather And that's like sometimes when I look at my mom and her relationship, it's like, he's such a good guy, and yeah, he probably like drives her crazy, but at the end of the day, she's just like, you know, he's just such a good guy, and I'm like, I just I'm like I want that. I want just a good guy and like where the fights can be over, you know, um being a little passive in text versus oh you cheated on me, or like but how long how old was

your mom when she started that relationship? Yeah, I mean five years ago. She was divorced for fifteen plus years. I think, and this is just the journey for you as you're getting older. I think you are going to enjoy that good guy more. I definitely, I mean, like, I definitely hear you on that. Um, I mean obviously I know some good guys right now. I mean, you know, yeah, I mean, look, tell me a little bit about that. What Okay, so pretend we don't know who you're talking about,

but you're talking about a good guy. He's a good guy. Yeah, you're working hard to have a great friendship with with the potential of more. What makes you nervous because he's a good guy, Like, what is your what goes on in your head or body that freaks you out? I think for me, it's like outside noise number one too, my kids, and just like not not being ready and then and then because I'm not here here honestly it's me. I'm I'm because I'm not ready to accept the good

guy yet. I don't think I deserve it. And that's where my issue is. And that's where I'm like, if I were to date this person right now, I would probably end up sabotaging it and ruining it. And and not being and and ruining something that I could see

be a potential forever relationship. Um And I'm like, I have to get to a place where I actually feel like I deserve the good guy because I'm so used to hearing the last seven years negative things thrown at me about who I am and what I am and how I It's like, we're so now I'm like, okay, that's so, that's who I am. So I'm trying to break that narrative so that way I can be open

to that good guy. It's just, you know, I mean, I was abused when I was nineteen, you know, so it's like, okay, no, I'm I'm I'm meant to be grabbed and I'm meant to be hit. And it's like now I know, now, I know like that I don't deserve that anymore. And I would never allow a guy to hurt me. Having said that, I've had twenty plus years of trauma of abusive relationships that I'm like, I still, somehow, in small part of me, still thinks inside of me

that maybe I do deserve that. And that's the part that I have to break or I will. And I even hate to say that because like, nobody deserves that, and I know that it's so normal because we get so used to what we know. I want to go backwards. When you said outside voices, we explain what that means. What is outside voices? It's like media, it's people. It's like, oh, you can't move on too fast. You can like Amanda Clutes, Okay.

I actually was talking to my friend Caitlin Crosby about this because she's friends with her, and I go, you know what, tell her, I love her and I appreciate her just sharing her story and her authenticity because obviously her husband died from covid um last year and she had mentioned that she's I don't know if she's dating or she says she's open to dating, and people were like, how could you date? Like when your husband just died

a year ago? It's like, why can't you just let people grieve how they want to grieve, date when they want to date and be happy. And that's like, but for me, because I have I don't know what it is about me. I don't know if it's because I'm a people pleaser, if it's because I I'm just so worried what people think or they make assumptions because of my past, because I always feel like I'm like climbing up a ladder trying to be like, but I was

nineteen but he tried to kill me. But I we were only married for a week, but he cheated on me. It's like, but I'm like always trying to like astric my past that I'm like, Okay, people will just see this and then go, oh, well, of course she's moving on fast with Graham or whoever, because you know, she's you know, blah blah blah. And I'm like, why should I can care? What? Well, thank you? Why can't I

just be happy? Why can't Amanda be happy? But you know, like, come on, yeah, it's hard not to you should read this. So there's this comedian Patton Oswald and he had let's get him on the show. Yeah no, wait till you hear is so amazing. So he had this beautiful marriage and wonderful family, and his wife tragically died like it

was out of nowhere. And soon thereafter he married Meredith Salinger, who's this actress like from the kind of nineties ish eighties nineties, and the same thing happened to them, where the whether it's the press or the noise or Instagram followers had a lot of judgment, and I remember someone else wrote this beautiful Facebook post explaining why you really need to let people do things when they feel they need to do them. And I'll find it for you

because it summed it up so amazingly. And now he God has this amazing marriage with married to Salinger, whether or not somebody else thought it was too soon. Drowning out the noise is so hard, Like are you able to be better about it at all? Now? You know?

What is like the worst of it is I still think that I still think that I care what my ex thinks about me, where I'm like why I don't want him to think that I'm like, you know, because because of past conversations like oh yeah, you're just you know, doing what you do, and I'm like, no, that's not who I am. Like it's like where I still feel like I have to like prove that like I'm worthy and that I'm lovable and that I'm enough and like that I'm you know, that I'm not repeating patterns or so.

I think it's just I want to get to a place where I don't care what anyone thinks, my ex the people, the and I'm getting there. But it's just a hard um. You know, have you ever studied the Hoffsman method? No, but I'm here for whatever. Okay, so we should get all of our Hudson on you know, Kate Hudson's brother, because he has a lot of people, don't I think it's sort of like maybe like a I don't want to speak out of school where you it's very anonymous, but he I don't feel bad saying

it because he's publicly talked about it. But I think you have to go away for a week though, no cell phone? Yeah Hoffman, Yeah, yeah, no, no, no, I I know exactly. Um, yes, I know exactly what that. I've looked into it. I want to do it, yes, all of that. Yeah, you just need to find a week. But it's hard, Like do you think you could give up your cell phone? No cell phone, no books, no TV, no anything for a week and you kind of immerse yourself in this method? So I did. For there's a

place called on Site. It's very similar and that's where I've kind of, um, I have not followed through completely with the Hoffman like for the week process, of it because I'm like, well, I feel like I did that at on site, which is the same thing I gave my cell phone, Like I did all of that. So yeah, no, I definitely could, and honestly, it would be really nice to not have my phone on me. From what I understand is, they don't necessarily deal with like your marriage

breaking up. They go back further to figure out why you became attracted to people that maybe don't treat you. We'll feel like, I feel like I already know that because that's you know, my childhood traumas and the wounds and like the now it's just breaking the pattern, you know. Yeah, but I think, okay, clocks chicken, time to do it.

But I already have my babies, So like that's where I'm like, like, but but now it's time to do you like, time to not repeat these patterns that you've been doing, because what you have to do is be attracted to the good guy. Uh do you? Like? Okay, so with the good guy? And I don't want to get into it, but we will. Do you are you sexually attracted to the good guy or does that get messed up by that push pull thing that you've had

in the past. I definitely think that if you have chemistry doesn't matter whether it's the good or the bad, because I will say I've had I've I've felt the sexiest and like have had you know, like I just I since like I feel super sexy now. So like, I don't think that plays a role in like the good guy aspect of it, because here's the thing. But if it's not like the same kind of chemistry, then that would be really hard. But I don't think that. I don't think it really matters on so we can

check attraction isn't the problem. Okay, what about this, like when the good guy texts you, do you get a flutter? Or what happened? I think where people I think in the beginning, there's always that, right, like when you start something and you get on a nap or you meet someone new, you're like, Okay, you get that flutter, you get that instant like adrenaline endorphin hit like it's it's a great feeling, and then it's just like any other thing,

that starts to fade. So you have to be like, Okay, that's that's where it's like when that fades, do you still want to be with this person and still talk to them and still text with them and stuff. Yeah, I think you get attracted. Okay, tell me if I'm way off the mark with this. I think you get attracted to the Oh it's going wrong, Let me do this, Let me do this to get it back good again. Let it And then that becomes kind of the challenge

to you. And then it's like, then the relationships better and it's cruising for a minute, and then it hits a speed bump and you're like, Okay, let me work to get this back again. And it's just that up down that you get so addicted to. Yeah, and that's what I don't want anymore, Just like I just wanted to like be chill and like not the up and down because I can't. I can't emotionally handle that anymore.

Like that's just something that I don't want anymore. Like there's and obviously I have things that I have to work on for the next relationship, but I just want to just not have that. And I I can only ask for the good because the good guys have a chance with you, right Wow? Does the good guy have a chance with you right now in this moment? No? Because I need like I need time to like accept

the goodness? Is that just b s Jannah? What if you just say I want the good guy and I'm gonna do this when I when I feel like I deserve that, I will. I just am not there yet. I know, but I'm not there yet. I need more therapy. I don't. But what if maybe you don't. What if you say I'm gonna try this with the good guy. What if you just I don't know, forced yourself you're strong, and then in six months see how it is. Yeah,

maybe I don't know. I just I think it's different because like kids, and honestly, like I don't want I don't want to fail. I just I feel like a relationship failure. So I just I'm like, I just it's easier just to just to heal. And then I don't think. So you have you're very like a serial monogamous. You've had these long, what I consider successful relationships. They just weren't perfect. Well, nothing's perfect, but those they were just destructive. So there will be with a good guy or not

a good guy. There will never be a perfect relationship. It just don't be aking bomb going off every two minutes. Okay, like, that's that's the difference. You can't do worse. Yeah, I'm like, don't hit me, don't cheat on me, and please don't say mean words to me. Like the bar is very low. People like and that's very sad. You just had a good time. Now, Okay, I have another question, because I get this. Do you think you could date data around? I'm not a dator, I'm not like I just I

don't do well at that. I'm like, like, I don't know how to date. I don't like games, like I don't like to Texas, but like, I just don't like it. I'm like, yeah, it's not my thing. Seems kind of bananas to me. But like, is that what you're supposed to try? Are you supposed to try that dating multiple people? I mean that sounds miserable and one of the reasons why I didn't want to get divorced. Yeah, I was like, I don't want to date. It sounds awful. Would you

ever be the Bachelor? Would you ever be the Bachelorette? Oh? My okay, First of all, I'd be like the grandma of the bachelorettes, like so old thirty because thirty eight in December, So I don't think they would ever ever, um pretend? Who cares? Would you do it? And do you think that you would thrive in that situation? Could you pull that off? I could never be a bachelorette, like, you know, I can never be like on the Bachelor, like with a bunch of other girls, Like it would

just be too hard for me. Like, but I could actually, I take that back. It'd be fun to like form relationships and not care about the guy. But no, I would do the bachelorette. Yeah, I would do it. Yeah. I think that's sort of like conducive to you. Well, that's okay. I have so many questions could you do apps? Like could you go on apps? Well? I said a few weeks ago that I've like, I've been on and off of a dating app because I'm like this, I

hate that thing. And then because my friend Caitlin was like, you know, you're not getting any connections because you have photo of your kids up and I'm like, well, there, I'm a mom, Like I'm gonna put a picture of my kids like and so I just kind of go I just I'm not like, what about just the old, good old set up? How do you feel about that? Like somebody just set you up, Like I could do a set up for you, Like you don't even know really lining up. I've got guys that are begging me,

that is, but would you do it? I just I don't know. I don't know, like who, well, I mean now I need to really put my mind to it. She's like, no, one, no, no, no, I do have a few, and it's like I think I can't. Set ups are tricky, but I think they could work for you because you have to turn it over to somebody else going this person knows, this guy is an all around good guy. That's okay. Well, let's just what's your age range? And well, can they be out of Nashville.

Let's just do this, let's just play with it. Oh my gosh, um no, I'm good. I'm just gonna focus on me. No no, no, no, no no. What would be the ultimate age range? And can they be in California? They can be wherever they want? Um, thirties six too? Can we lower it to like thirty two that I had that last time didn't work? Okay, but you know what's a positive And I have other friends in very similar situations to you. You're laughing, and you're open to it.

I think that that is a step in the right direction. Like you might not be able to really feel better yet, but the light is sort of out there, like I won't even say it's quite at the end of the tunnel, but it's like soon it will be. It's like you're you're I know you had Like I knew because when we texted earlier today, I literally was like, I need to be really steady for Janna right now because she's bummed.

Like you, it's pretty easy for your friends to know, like, oh, yeah, my I wear my emotions like, yeah, like my friend because I'm like Janna having an s H I T T y day. We gotta have her back. And so my thing is like you work through it, and I know you're in pain, but you're also like laughing and open to these things we're talking about it. Yeah. I mean, before I would date anyone, though, I would, I would, I would um, I would try out the good guy first.

I think you have to be good guys only, and if they're a little bit boring, you need to give them ten more tries. Well, Amy, how's that going for you in your relationship? That is that going good? For you, Janna, those who cannot do teach so like everything you experience, I fully understand because it's hard to be for some reason. I use attraction to be attracted to the dull nice guy. We're gonna get a lot of emails from the nice guys going f you. But it's like, sometimes you girls

are attracted to that bad boy. Yeah, I explain that to me. Well, we'll have to get Dr Hillary back on for that, but yeah, um, but we will do that some other time. Maybe we'll bring Graham on and he can he can talk about the good guys and when when uh, and you know, how they're doing out there.

We definitely should because I would love to hear his perspective of dealing with women like you who are attracted when he's like, I'm great, yeah, And I love his confidence to like he's like, you know, I'm not gonna wait around, but I'm also, you know, gonna And he's so handsome. Did you look at his Instagram last week? Because he posted a picture like in the back of a truck and I was like, dude, he's very handsome, right, so why can't you just throw caution to the wind

and try it? Amy I have healing to do. Stop trying to make the betch happen. It's not gonna happen. I'm sorry, I'm interrupting your knee time. Jesus all right, dying, We'll keep working through it. I love you so much. Thanks for making me last. I went from following my eyes out to laughing. So I appreciate y'all. I love you, and I hope you see yourself the way everyone else sees you, that you're just trying to figure this crap

out exactly. And I'm and I'm sorry that, um, you all just heard this UM one on one conversation with me and Amy on my producer. But hopefully we all know that we deserve the good guy and UM, but you have to do your work. You're healing and you need to know that you're enough. And just like me, I tattooed it on so one day, you know, I don't know. We'll figure it out. Stay tuned for next week